Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
S5.E5 - Bookshops, Booksellers and Launch Parties
115 Plays25 days ago
We chat about the realities of doing events, launch parties and just walking into bookshops and asking to sign your books. A great episode for authors who are in the process of publishing and aren't sure how interfacing with booksellers works.
- Naomi Gibson, author of Every Line of You, Game Over Girl, Man Muse Monster
- Melissa Welliver, author of The Undying Tower, My Love Life and the Apocalypse, Soulmates and Other Ways to Die, To the Death
- Jamie Greenwood, creator & host of The Write and Wrong Podcast
Recommended
Transcript
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello, we would love to hear from
Listener Engagement and Feedback Invitation
00:00:02
Speaker
you. If you have any stories or anecdotes about publishing, good or bad, we would love to hear about them and we'll talk about them. Or if you just have any questions or if you think it's anything we missed in in this episode or any of the previous episodes, reach out to us. You can find all of us on social media, on Instagram, or wherever it might be, or you can head it to the Right and Wrong podcast website. Yeah, all our DMs are open. Send us messages, let us know you know what what you've been up to in publishing. We'd love to talk about it and and hear about it.
Humor and Fictional Characters Discussion
00:00:29
Speaker
Shrek and Christian Grey are different characters. You heard it here first. I'm finished it. After every episode was like, oh my gosh, I'm so angry at these toxic characters. Like, shove more food in my mouth across next episode. Because I loved it, but obviously I hate it. This is so much fun. Because this is this my Malfoy-Himayali family.
Book Synopsis Guessing Game
00:00:50
Speaker
She shouldn't have done that. I'm trying to make Neville happen. It's too
00:00:57
Speaker
too wholesome so oh yeah we i was gonna do a review one star review but i came across this uh synopsis for a for a book that i thought was really funny so i thought instead of doing a review we can do a synopsis this week so i'm gonna read you as a synopsis and you have to try and guess. ah It should be pretty, i don't know, maybe to me it was quite obvious, but I guess when you know it's easy, when you wouldn't know the answer, it's easy. um So here's the synopsis and you guys try and guess what the what the book is.
00:01:35
Speaker
Imagine your uncle goes missing after his birthday party and his old stoner friend from out of town tells you the souvenir he brought back from Vegas from a Vegas trip to 80 years ago is actually Satan's mood ring. And now zombie assassins are coming to burn down your town unless you and your lawn guy meet up with medieval hosier in a dark gastropub. Lord of the Rings. It's Lord the Rings. It's Lord of the Rings.
00:01:57
Speaker
That's amazing. That is so funny. Wow. I want to watch that version. you i'm not off ah It's so easy to forget that Sam is just Frodo's gardener. Yeah. Yeah.
00:02:13
Speaker
What do you mean just? Sorry. It was pride month just last month, Jamie. How dare you say that he's just the gardener? Yeah. Okay.
00:02:25
Speaker
A fun little one. Lord of the Rings. So on this episode, we are talking
Roles of Booksellers: Independent vs. Chain
00:02:30
Speaker
about... um bookshops and booksellers, which is, i realize, a very broad title.
00:02:39
Speaker
For the purposes of this podcast, I think we're going to focus on the relationship of booksellers and bookshops to the author, so the author's perspective and the author's experience while encountering those on the publishing journey, let's say.
00:02:53
Speaker
ah The first thing I wanted to do was check in with you guys because I'm pretty sure I know what a i know what a bookshop is, thankfully. And I'm pretty sure I know what a bookseller is, but for just for clarification, what what, how do you guys define what a bookseller is and what a bookseller does?
00:03:11
Speaker
I think it depends. Well, actually, in lot of ways, I'd say they're all um obviously doing the same job. But in some ways, it changes slightly depending on what kind of bookshop they're working in. So for instance, it would be different if it's somebody who owns an independent bookshop would be different to say somebody who is a bookseller at Waterstones at Christmas, and then somebody who is head of a department at a large bookstore, such as Waterstones.
00:03:35
Speaker
would have like slightly different roles and like different um authority over sort of what books are being prominently displayed, for instance. But I would say all booksellers in person, brick and mortar bookshops are people who, um,
00:03:53
Speaker
curate a shop experience for the reader as opposed to just shoving stuff on shelves is what I'm thinking of when I think of a bookseller. Okay. since Yeah. Yeah. they're They're choosing which books they're going to buy into the shop.
00:04:09
Speaker
Yes. And, and, and kind of what's being presented and things like that. And obviously like you touched on, if it's an independent bookshop, a lot of the time the bookseller will maybe be the owner or be, have you know be close with the owner.
00:04:22
Speaker
And that's a bit more like carte blanche. They have the freedom to kind of do whatever they want. yeah If it's part of a big chain, like a Foils or a Waterstones, whatever it may be, the bookseller will be working probably much more on ah on a directive. Like if the you know the whole company is trying to lean into a certain genre or a certain style, they have a specific layout that all the shops need to be doing.
00:04:47
Speaker
that's the The job is a little bit different there. that They're working within some parameters. Yeah, that's what I would think. But ultimately the the job is the same. Yeah. I think the independent bookstore is probably um maybe like a little bit more passionate about it they get shot they get more They get more leeway as in like they get to do exactly what they want to do.
00:05:10
Speaker
Yeah. And I think there's probably like a good chance where, so there's an independent bookstore near me and whenever you go in, um bless her heart, like Ollie doesn't read and she's always like, she always says to him like, so, so what, what do you like? What subjects do you like? Like, do you like nonfiction? I can recommend you some nonfiction books. And like, she just, she can drop up like 20 titles in like a minute and he's just like nodding along going, yeah, yeah. Okay. And he doesn't buy one and I feel so bad.
00:05:41
Speaker
So I don't know. I think ah the independent bookseller is probably going to be, I don't know, like a bit maybe like a bit more invested. Is that harsh to say?
00:05:52
Speaker
but don't think so. That makes sense. Like, I think also a lot of Waterstones booksellers I meet, their ultimate dream is often to open their own bookshop.
00:06:03
Speaker
Yeah, that's true. I know quite a few independent. There's one called Beef Butterfly Books, and which is localish to me. And I know she had sort of a stall and now she has her own shop. I know she worked at Waterstones. So, you know, that I think it's often a pathway as well. So there are definitely very enthusiastic booksellers at, say, a large shop. The reason I'm saying Waterstones is because, honestly, a lot of the other large chain brick and mortar stores for books have shut down, let's be real. So we're mostly talking about Waterstones. They are very passionate about books, but often they do have a dream to open a bookshop. So often there's like a crossover of those people.
00:06:40
Speaker
Yeah, that's true.
Building Author-Bookseller Relationships
00:06:41
Speaker
And on a, on a, just a, you know, a simple financial level, the, the person working in an independent shop, it's either their shop or they're probably working for like a family run business and they'll know the owners and things like that. It's much closer to them.
00:06:54
Speaker
if you're working at a big chain, you're, you're driving shareholder value. Yeah. So it's yeah it's there it's harder to be as attached to that. um Just ah on a simple level of that. Okay. So we've established what a bookseller is. um When it comes to, and you guys have done this couple of times and you're in you're in the process of doing it again at some point in the not so distant future. uh what is the author's relationship with a bookseller like at what point in the process does that become something that you are engaging with for me it was when i had proofs um and I did a proof drop around all of the bookshops in Glasgow um was that for every line of view yes sorry yeah for my first YA book yeah and I did actually do it for Game of Girl as well but um
00:07:50
Speaker
actually sorry I'll correct I didn't have proofs I just had early copies and so I took a bunch out to all the Waterstones I i did try and get in touch with them online beforehand and I said hey got this book coming out would you like a copy to read like your YA bookseller person would they like to read it and then I went in and I asked for that person who I'd inquired about online and usually they came and met me and we talked about it a little bit together um there was one bookshop that comes to mind um where I went in um I wasn't able to get in touch with them via Twitter or whatever because they hadn't accepted my message and so I went in blind and the person behind the till thought I was trying to buy my book and I was like no no it's for you it's for you to read yeah and they were like oh well um and they started trying to write a name down for a book buyer in the head in HQ and I was like no like it's for you to read you've already bought it it's already gonna be stuck it's like a really horrible awkwardly conversation um but yeah so that's usually when you try and get in touch with with um book salads and then what i've done is i have stayed in touch with ah a few that i met just um like a little handful of people um and now that my
00:09:08
Speaker
adult debut is coming out i've got back in touch with them and i'm like hey would really love to send you a copy like remember me um and so it's it's kind of like it's really awkward over but it's kind of like about building relationships with people yes and then you can sort of bring those relationships into play again um when you have another book coming out, if you haven't stayed in touch, but usually they remember you. So, cause you've made an effort in the first place. If you're local, they do really like pushing. mean, even my local Waterstones likes to push local books.
Support for Local Authors and Book Signings
00:09:41
Speaker
I was very pleased when Undying Tower came out and I went in to ask them about it and they said, Oh yeah. And it was tucked away on the sci-fi shelf and they went, Oh, and they just picked up a pile of random books off the table and shove mine on they were like thank you god knows if they will get in trouble sometimes i won't mention which one it was but it was quite funny and i was like yeah because local author um yeah and you're right when you're a debut it's really when you go around with your advanced copies you might be sent around with like a publicist or they might organize a list of books that they've spoken to for you but once you're not a debut just the other day was um i was on one of the social media sites can't remember which one feel like you all of them. And Wonderland Bookshop, feel like I'm just going to name drop a bunch really cool bookshops. They've been around for a while. They're children's specialist and they've done so much for me, even when I was basically self-publishing and with a smaller publisher. And they were saying, we love doing pre-order campaigns. Do remember us authors if you love it. Now I've never even been, I think they're in Retford, so I've never even visited. I've only spoke to them online, but they're so lovely. And so I said, oh, I'd love to do something with you guys. I'll chat my publisher. And they were like, Yeah, great. So think they also, they're quite happy to hear from you. And if you keep a good relationship, you don't have to wait until the book's out. You can chat to them beforehand. I think as you were saying, Naomi, like it's about making a relationship, not being like, listen, you, you need to stop my book. You don't need to go in heavy. It's fine. They're pleased to talk to you. Please don't upset the booksellers. You don't need to be an aggressive. It's not like selling a car to somebody. have a nice book coming out. Would you like to hear about it? And, you know, sometimes you might not hear or they might have their Twitter DMs open and sometimes they do. So, yeah. Yeah.
00:11:24
Speaker
Because booksellers love, I think it's it's a prerequisite for the job of being a bookseller is that they love books. They love reading. So yeah they're going to be excited to hear about a new thing. And if they're going to get to read it early ahead of everyone else, and then maybe they can be like, oh, I now I can like stock this or like get this in or something, you know, whatever it may be.
00:11:43
Speaker
Yeah. And they are just like such a font of knowledge because of that. Oh my gosh. They remind me of like librarians are like this as well. I do editing for people who are looking for comp titles for querying agents. And if you're a writer looking for a comp title, go into your independent bookshop and tell them about your book and they will be able to list like Naomi was saying with like poor Ollie. Yeah. And they're so poor when trying to list all these books, they, they know so many books. They will be able to tell you, Oh my God, they'll be able to pile up five or six books. You've supported your local bookshop and you will have such great comp titles because they read everything. They don't want to put something on their shelves. They've not read.
00:12:17
Speaker
So they read like everything so and they can give you such good recommendations. Yeah. Especially if it's an independent one. Cause yeah, even like a hundred percent of the books on the shelves are ones that they have like probably read vetted and are like passionate about. Exactly. Yeah.
00:12:32
Speaker
Yeah. within a team, I would imagine that. um So you touched on it there. the The debut novel with the publisher kind of pushes for it and like will kind of guide you through it. But then with your follow up novels, it was more on your own initiative.
00:12:47
Speaker
Yeah, I'd say that's fair. What if, if there's anyone listening who's an author, who's like book is maybe about to come out, um, or it's just come out and that they're kind of doing this phase, uh, where they're meeting with, um, booksellers and stuff of that. What, what advice, what would what would you tell them? Maybe something that you wish you'd known going when it wasn't that long ago, but all those years ago when you guys both had your debut novels come out. Don't be shy. yeah I think it's really easy to be shy because don't get me wrong. I've i've been into like dozens of bookshops whenever I'm in it. Like if I'm on holiday and and another part of the country, i will, if I see a bookshop, go in, see if they've got a copy of my book. I always have like bookmarks with me that I can drop off and say, you know, this is my book if you're ever interested and in stocking it and have a chat. But, and I've only ever had, I think out of like dozens and dozens of interactions. I had one where I think I caught bookseller on a really bad day. Oh, Which I don't want to spook people with, but yeah, they were just like,
00:13:46
Speaker
They said, well, we need to take a picture for the website, but you know, it probably won't be on because we are very busy. It's very awkward. Not naming and shaming, but yeah. So I've had one, don't get me wrong, everyone else has a bad day. And to be fair, the next time went, it was a different person. They were very nice.
00:14:01
Speaker
and they got up i buy think yeah because I made a complaint. I did not make a complaint. I would never do that. like god and Yeah. But I think, I think it can be really easy to, oh God, the first thing now is find it really easy.
00:14:14
Speaker
I just go in, I literally go and collect the books. So I was lucky to have my books on tables. ah The two from chicken house were on quite few tables in say water stones, So if I was in a big shopping center and there was Wardstones, I will just walk up to the table. I pick up the pile of books. I go to the till. They're obviously thinking we're about to make a huge sale. And I'm like, no, no. And and I put them down and I say, I am the author. Can I sign these? And then they usually go in the back to check for more. And they always say, yeah. And I have my own pen and I make it really easy. Back in the day, I used to be really, really shy about it and panicky.
00:14:47
Speaker
And I'd be like, they just don't want to speak to me. Or I'd like hang around by the till until it was quiet. Yeah. feeling really awkward oh I was so awkward about of course every time they're just yeah that's fine I find anywhere up north and outside of London are like thrilled to see you because I don't think they get awkward visits yeah true So true. And then in London, they're not rude at all. Perfectly nice. But when I went round in London, I was down for a conference or something and I went and just had a book come out. So i went round to sign a bunch. It's you go to the till and you I'm an author. Can I sign my book? And they go, sure.
00:15:18
Speaker
Would you like to join the queue? And there's queue of 20 authors all signing their book or something. Melva, I had the exact same experience in London. That's so funny. I thought it was just me. Yeah. But like, no, no, probably in the same. Yeah. So like I went to one bookshop and then and so my, my PR person had, had emailed everybody ahead or she called or whatever. And she was like, name is coming. She's going to sign books. It's beyond this day around this time. and Can you have some copies ready for her? And usually they would be like, yeah, yeah, sure. No problem.
00:15:49
Speaker
I went into this one. It was major, right? A major bookshop. And I went in and then the bookseller was like, oh, we weren't expecting you. And I was like, okay, I'm so sorry to be a problem. And then she was like, you know, you really should get in touch. And Ollie got really defensive and he was like, they did get in touch. You said you would have copies ready for her. And it was just like, okay. and But in up north... Like I went round Glasgow and Edinburgh and they were so, so excited to see, to see me. And it made me feel like so famous walking in. They were like, Oh, we've got this big pilot book for you. We're so happy you've come here. And it was just, it's such a different experience. It was really funny.
00:16:27
Speaker
It is really, really different. And like I went, and I go on holiday a lot to St. Andrews and they have loads of bookshops and they do get some big names because it's quite a famous town. ah But I've got, there's a bookseller at the Waterstones there called Jack, shout out. And he is so nice and he reaches out and he, like, I remember I looked on the Instagram and they'd had like Reverend Richard Coles in the week before. But when I went in, after having a pub lunch with my dog, um they were just like, yeah, oh my God, we're so excited to see you. They took a picture with my book. They went and checked in the back for more. like And they've like emailed me since and said, oh, if you want to do anything for the To The Death ah release, we'd love to work with you again if you're up here. It's quite far away for me, but it's just where I go quite often. Yeah, so you can also just get really like happy people who just want to see you, even if they see loads of like celebrity authors. Not that we're celebrity authors. We are celebrity authors.
00:17:20
Speaker
ah but yeah there is a there is sometimes a difference but my tip would be don't be shy like 99% of the time they're really thrilled to see you yeah sounds like uh bring your dog as well and you get a special treatment yeah yes apart from if your dog um does number two on the floor of the waterstones which has obviously never happened to me obviously not especially not at the old string and waterstones no ah Luckily I always bring supplies so I cleaned up very quickly and they were very very nice. Yeah it seems like my dog doesn't like reading either so maybe Zelda and Ollie can hang out and next time they don't have to come to the bookshop. They will go in they can hang out outside. yes
00:18:04
Speaker
Okay so what we can take away from this is that if you want to feel special go to a bookshop outside of London. yeah I do feel like they get a bit of author fatigue in London. They were very nice, very polite. were, But yeah.
00:18:19
Speaker
Just not quite as excited. It's just a much higher density of people and thus a higher density of authors. And a lot of those London yeah Waterstones and like other bookshops are are massive. So yeah. Yeah.
00:18:31
Speaker
like Yeah, yeah i've been to ah I've been to book launches and the difference between going to a book launch in like ah a bookshop in London versus like, let's say Manchester or Birmingham or something, it's it's a stark contrast.
00:18:42
Speaker
Yeah, they're just so busy, I think, all the time. And there's always limited space and there's always too many people for the limited space. Yeah, definitely. But I mean, go wherever you can. Don't be shy, right?
00:18:53
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. Don't be sure. Just go in everywhere. Even if they're not st stocking a book, chat to them about it. Like, but as I say, don't, don't be rude. Don't like accuse them. Why you not got my book? I do hear stories apparently about people doing this. I don't know anyone that's done it. Um, but yeah, i have gone in seeing that my book isn't stocked, but mentioned maybe I'm local and I could come and sign some if they wanted to stock them. And then yeah, always good to have something like bookmarks or something that has the name is your book yeah and maybe a QR code to like your link tree. That's a good tip. So they can see you're a real person. Is that instead of you don't carry business cards, you just carry bookmarks? Yeah, honestly, yeah. I give them out all the time. found out that my most useful, i bought them all myself. They are less than 20 quid delivered to my house for a few hundred. I just designed it on Canva and they all have QR codes that go to my link tree, which if anyone doesn't know is just like a load of links. It's so useful. And then they can just find you if they need to find you. It's just so much easier. You want to make it as easy as possible for people to buy your book.
00:19:51
Speaker
And I have a really long name. So I'm not expecting anyone to remember how to spell it. You have a long name, but it's easy spell. And have long titles, think it's cool name. Yeah, you don't want long title, you don't want a long name.
00:20:02
Speaker
And I have both, so I have bookmarks. There's so much tactics in terms of names when it comes to being an author. i but I've spoken to people on the podcast about choosing their nom de plume, their pseudonym. yeah And like some of them it's just like, oh, I thought it was a fun name. Or i it's like, oh, it was my like, you know, dog's name or my childhood's like nickname or something like that.
00:20:23
Speaker
And then I've had a couple on where they're like, they're like, well, I went into the, I write crime. So I went into the crime section of of like all my local bookshops and I looked at where the like prime placement was on the wall on average based on where you come in the alphabet and then I picked my name based on which letter would have given me the best spot and which and I was like that is excellent I would never think of anything well I'm a W I tell you what, if I'm looking for your book, I can find it easily though. Cause I'm just like, well, I was just about to say the same. Yeah, that's so true. I do find it easy. As I say, making things easy for booksellers. If you want, if you are shy, it's not as cringe as it sounds, just picking up all your books and take them to the desk. Cause they're just, ah oh I just noticed whenever I would go in and ask, that's what they go off and do. And I felt like they were being a dog's body. I was like, I'll be the dog's body. that's true. Yeah. that job for them. Yeah. I'll just bring them to the desk. Good plan.
00:21:18
Speaker
good plan yeah I think as well, these people, it's their job to kind of help you So <unk> it's horrible asking and it's so awkward, particularly because a lot of writers are quite introverted and they totally understand talking to a stranger is horrible. But and I think a lot of the time these people people do want to help you. And so, you know, they're working, they're in that kind of zone. So they're like, yes, how can I help you? And you just talk to them as a, you know, and they'll they'll probably be quite open to it. So yeah, don't be shy. That's the top tip. Yeah.
00:21:46
Speaker
Yeah. Have they all just taken you guys at your word and when you're like, I'm this person, they're not asked for ID or anything. I feel like they should ask for ID. I have friends that's happened to you, but i it's never happened to me. I know someone that has, was asked for mean, it makes sense. Like, yeah. Like otherwise I could just go in and be like, I'm Naomi Gibson.
00:22:07
Speaker
I'd like to sign my books, please. Give it a go. I've been curious if it works. Yeah. There are people that do it. Like there are friends who are author friends and they tag each other's books in airports and stuff. I see that quite often. Like as a joke. Yeah. but And they wouldn't sign a whole stack either. Famous do it. there's one singular copy, yeah, then they'll sign each other's books. And obviously then those are worth quite lot of money. Insane amounts of money, yeah. Brandon Sanderson does it with someone and I can't quite think who it is. Is it Jo Abercrombie?
00:22:35
Speaker
I think it's Jo Abercrombie. It could be, yeah. And they tag each other's books and that'll be worth probably even more money. Way more money, yeah. Because they only do like one or two every time they fly. Exactly. And it's just like a little joke, but no, I don't. And I also don't necessarily sign. I know some authors that just and usually authors are also booksellers, which is quite common. and They'll just sign their book and not bother mentioning. Now I like to mention because there's usually a nice sticker you get that says like an author has signed this. And sometimes you'll get face out as well. So people can see the sticker. And because obviously and they like to say a signed book is a sold book. which is like double meaning because on the one hand it can't be sent back to the publisher and on the other hand it obviously is worth more. People do look at the ones are signed. I know that when I go to bookshop, if there's a signed copy of a book I was thinking of reading, I'm more likely to actually buy it and than maybe think about it again and or I might buy it later. So I do think um I'd like i like to mention, I don't like to secretly, but I know there are some people who booksellers that say, oh, it' you know I just sign it and then pop it back.
00:23:36
Speaker
which I don't know if I would be brave enough to do. Maybe when I'm, well, this is the thing you were saying about ID. I'm like, it must be nice to be famous enough to have like a nice glossy color photograph in the back of the book. yes open it up face Like, it is this enough ID for you? My face. I don't usually look very made up in real life though. So they probably like, no, who's this goblin? It's obviously me. They're like, oh God, at the years have not been kind to you.
00:24:04
Speaker
Well, you better let me sign up the song now. What if you've got a pseudonym, though, and you don't have ID matching that name? Oh, yeah. I don't know. That's awkward, isn't it? suppose you could find something with your picture online, a of people have a pseudonym because they don't want their picture online, which is fair enough. A lot of people have a pseudonym and have their picture in the book, which is confusing. True, yeah. But the pseudonym... That would be confusing. Similar interviews, like what was saying before about people choosing their name, a lot of the pseudonym stuff is to do with...
00:24:33
Speaker
readership audience and genre for the yeah the example i think i use most of the time is i had a crime writer on and she was saying that she picked the student and a lot of crime writers you'll see this if you go in the crime section it's uh it'll be two initials and then a surname yeah And that's very standard for the genre. And um generally people do that because it removes gender from it. And apparently there is a bias yes where the readership in that genre generally doesn't like to read things if if they think it's written by a woman.
00:25:04
Speaker
which is yeah ridiculous, but that's just the way it is. So a lot a lot of people just have initial initial surname. um So it's not necessarily because they're trying to protect their and that. And that it could well be just their name, but they've just done it, initialized it.
00:25:17
Speaker
um And it's not necessarily because they're trying to protect their identities because there's a certain stigma in the genre, which they need to do that as a necessity to give their book a better chance of making sales.
00:25:30
Speaker
A sad truth. Mm-hmm. Yeah. You've got to think about it because this is the thing we're talking about bookshops now. So we're not talking about people going on an online bookshop, mentioning no names and searching for a specific book. We're talking about people in bookshops. You are maybe talking to the books. If you're a buyer, you are maybe talking to the bookseller to ask for recommendation. You are browsing by cover and you're looking at the names, right? So even if it's unconscious, yeah you want your book to be as saleable as possible, even though it sucks.
00:25:59
Speaker
Yes. And yeah, some people pick names also just to do with the the genre itself. There's some names which just sound like, like a fantasy writer or a name that sounds like crime is always like a very, it feels quite official when it's just like RL Jameson or something, you know, there's something clinical about it. Yeah. Which kind of fits with the genre.
00:26:22
Speaker
Yeah. And the marketing essentially it's part of the marketing, right? Yeah, yeah, I guess so. But ah yeah, I, to be honest, ah I'm surprised that they don't ask for ID when you guys go in.
00:26:33
Speaker
Because essentially it's like you could just be defacing some of their product. Yeah, yeah, you could. Yeah, yeah. That's why they can't send it back because you have defaced it. Yeah, basically. Yeah, yeah.
00:26:45
Speaker
Oh, wait, so do you guys just write your name or do you ever write messages and stuff and and when you sign copies and in bookshops? I used to write a little message for every line of you. I'd put Henry sees you.
00:26:58
Speaker
creepy and then That took way too long. So I stopped doing it. Yeah, that's true. Actually, like if it's a signing queue, always pop a little message or something. But if it's just in a shop, I just sign my name.
00:27:09
Speaker
when this is a tangent but like whilst we're here when you guys do signing queues like if you're at events or whatever um do you do you ask do you like write something on your own kind of cognition or do you ask the person it's like oh do you want me to like write a message to someone or is like is you know is this for anyone I ask them because I'm always worried. Sometimes you like very, very rarely you do get someone that's like, no, i just want it signed, which I kind of get because, you know, i have books that are just signed and they feel like a bit more as part of my collection of books as opposed to like a personal item that's important to me. So I do understand why people might not want something dedicated, for instance. So, yeah, I always ask.
00:27:53
Speaker
the thing with that is that so a family member did that to me they were like don't dedicate it to me just sign it because it'll be worth more and i'm like great thanks for your support what is your relationship with me worth yeah it's so glad to know that you're invested well they are invested they're investing in your futures yeah in themselves it's like okay so let's say that it's worth 500 pounds i'm never going to see any of that money thanks for my book and also wow optimistic i know yeah i say when kids say at schools lots of kids at schools will say like oh my god can you also sign a bookmark i could sell it on ebay and i'm like yeah with that bro so could dry you could
00:28:39
Speaker
not going to stop you I would thought it'd be worth more if you wrote something ah like, not not a personal dedication, but like if you wrote something beyond just your name, because if you, let's say you became the the most famous author in the world and like people were trying to buy signed things of yours.
00:28:59
Speaker
if if lots of people would have something that just had your name on it if you had your name and then something else that would be worth more money if people were actually collecting that yeah so i'm like i mean i do like to think kind of a little message like i'm on um love life and the apocalypse i used to cross out so it's my love life and the apocalypse i'll cross out my and put the person's name it'd be like naomi's love life and the apocalypse and then i'd sign it And that yeah, that was quite fun. So sometimes there's something on the title page that might be fun or on one of them it has a heart just before the title page. obviously had to add in an extra page to make it work for like binding. And and that I used to like draw little doodles around the heart and stuff.
00:29:35
Speaker
So I do sometimes... do a message what i quite like the idea of is having a stamp so a lot of authors have a stamp and using it only if i'm in person with the person so um like i know that cynthia murphy has a stamp with her school crest on for her win lose kill die and um that's cool the new one yeah yeah so it's morton academy crest which i think was designed in-house and might have been in one of the books or something like that but she's got the design and she she has a stamp of it And it's, I like the idea that if you've met that person in person, you get the stamp.
00:30:09
Speaker
I think that's quite fun. Yeah. yeah i can pay attention When it comes to, to, this is the the bookshops booksellers episode. Uh, so I guess when it comes to doing signings and things like that, um, I've seen, I've been at, uh, we went to and NYA a couple years ago.
00:30:26
Speaker
ah you guys did, one of you did a signing. one of you did two of you did signing um have you have you also done signings at bookshops how does that work who organizes that um is that for so for like a launch you do a signing after it but i think some people do turn up to waterstones or or wherever for like a set period and then they just sit next to a pile of their books and people can come and get them signed if they want.
00:30:56
Speaker
Yes. Have you guys done that no No, because that looks awful. It does look scary because what if no one comes? I went to a lit fest in France. My French publisher invited me to one over there. And I was literally sat in front of a pile of my books for two days and people were just walking past. And it was the most depressing thing I have ever done in my life. I came back home and I rang my agent and I was like, don't ever let me go there again. I'm not doing that again. It was just depressing. And it's like, let alone there's a language barrier. Like I can order, i don't know, steak frites in a restaurant or something, but like I can't.
00:31:37
Speaker
um hold a conversation about ai in my in another language um so it was really tricky from that perspective but also it was just so demoralizing like just sitting in front of your books and waiting for somebody to come and yeah talk to you or try and talk to you or like and then if they had a look and they didn't buy it it was like oh oh that's always really grim actually when you look at your book and not buy it so it's like if if If someone ever said, if a Warstones or or whoever ever invited me to do a signing session, I would probably say no, because it's just, unless i would unless I guaranteed that there would be lots of people there. And even then, i don't know if I would.
00:32:13
Speaker
Yeah, it depends it depends how it's run, I guess. Because, yeah, I've definitely done events at Wardstones where I've done a signing afterwards, not just launches, but I've done like an in conversation. I did one at Liverpool with Josh Silver and Danielle Juwando. And that was lovely. And actually, really, because I was chairing, everyone came for Danielle and Josh. ah But I did get a few people afterwards that came up to me as well and said, like oh, yeah, I've enjoyed the chat. so I've picked up your book as well, which is always really nice because i think that feels lower pressure. because they're not there for you. So I didn't really mind if no one was at my table. And I would just chat to them about the other two books and they were chatting to me. And it was fine because sat three of us behind a table. So it's not lonely either. um And then it's just quite nice if you manage to get a few sales.
00:32:54
Speaker
But um yeah, for instance, you know, I've been, as I say, someone reached out and from a St. Andrew's shop to ask me to go up. Now, I don't know what sort of thing I would do. It's the first time bookshops have started reaching out. a few books in which is nice I think otherwise some of my friends that have done it have reached out to their local bookshop and said can I come in and do a signing and they've gone and then also there's this thing on um on social media where people do that and then they get someone to take a photo of them looking sad with like no one in the queue and then they post it and they say no one came and then they have people like Stephen King replying saying no one came to my first one either and then they go viral and I'm like yeah was this a setup? It probably wasn't. I'm probably really awful. But they always seem to, you know, maybe they'll do better off the back of nobody coming. So maybe maybe it's worth doing, Naomi. We'll just take a picture and say no one came. But it is awful if no one comes. I'm obviously joking. Like, I do understand. I don't know if I'd be able to put it on social media. if not Because I've done events where...
00:33:49
Speaker
the only person there was sat on my little stool and i look out and they were actually streaming it on um twitch so they they couldn't see how many people were not in the audience uh but yeah in the audience i think was that there were four of us on the panel i think um everyone's partner was there apart from mine and my agent had come to see me That was it in the audience. That was it. It's horrendous. I hate yeah but That was the one where um I was asked who my favourite book boyfriend was and I mentioned someone else's book boyfriend in their book on the panel and she then told me it was based entirely on her real-life boyfriend who she then waved to and was sat right in front of me on the front row of the... yeah that was That was not awkward at all.
00:34:34
Speaker
It was great. So, yeah, that was... That's always fun. And it was live streamed to Twitch. That was really good. really enjoyed that. I had a good time. so yeah, I think they can be awkward. um to Sorry, to bring back around to Butchershoff, went off on a massive tangent. I think they can be awkward, but they're fine in a group and I have not done one on my own.
00:34:52
Speaker
yeah Yeah, I think if if you're going to do one, the way to do it is to like, and if you're the only author like doing it, let's say, I would say just make sure that you either like some friends or family are just there and and like they're just going to hang out with you all day. if If no one comes, it's just, you know, you're just chatting and like hanging out in a bookshop.
00:35:08
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Because that was actually a similar experience to NYA Lit Fest a few years ago when I was there for every line of you And there was like a few of us all doing signings and like I had, i think it was like a half hour period and I had like a good number of people come up to me, but there were times when I didn't have anybody. And so you just chat to the author next to you and that's, that kind of makes um it go much quicker and it's much. Yeah, it does.
00:35:31
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. it It is rough, though. When you go to an event like that, though, and like one person has a massive line and then no one else has a line and it's like, eesh.
00:35:42
Speaker
It's awkward. Shout out to love, guys. know, I know. It's like, I'll sign a bookmark for you. It's free. yeah yeah yeah um so booksellers we've we've kind of talked about a lot when it comes to and with indies this is a much more um one in the same kind of thing when it comes to specific bookshops do you guys have a relationship with specific like bookshops that yeah we touched on earlier you know you've got new books coming out you reach out and you say hey uh
00:36:20
Speaker
I'd be interested in like sending you guys some copies or like coming in and doing a signing or, or like maybe even like when the launch is out you know, do you guys have like a go-to bookshop that you'd call up and be like, I want to do a launch event.
00:36:31
Speaker
And you know, would it be cool if I did it at your place? That's a good question. Cause I think Naomi, you live on the edge of a city, don't you? But you are out a bit. Yeah. And I also live in a more rural area. So there's not a local, local bookshop, but there is one in Manchester, which actually does not have a lot of independent bookshops. And it's called House of Books and Friends. And a lot of people have their launches there. And they're always excited to see people. And it's very casual, lovely staff.
00:37:01
Speaker
So that's the sort of place I would call probably there. But it's not actually that local to me. have to get on the train for 40 minutes. so Yeah. So I...
00:37:11
Speaker
I've only ever had one launch party because every line of you came out in ah the pandemic and we weren't doing them at the time. but and And then in my debut group, in our debut debut group, and we got friendly with Cynthia Murphy and me and her both had a book coming out in the same month and and she suggested doing a joint launch for me and her. So I think her book was um Signed, Sealed, Debt. Oh no, wait, it was the...
00:37:41
Speaker
you're the other one, that the the demon-y one with the candle. Midnight game. Midnight game. And mine was Game Over Girl. And so, and I think because she was popping off at that time, Waterstones, Deansgate in Manchester got in touch with her and said, hey, do you want to do a launch party with us? And she was very kind and she said, yes, but um can Naomi come too? um because we'd already sort of talked about it before she got famous so I was like woohoo quidding um so um we did a launch joint launch together Waterstones Deansgate so that but so obviously living in Glasgow and then doing a launch in Manchester and that actually worked out quite well for me because a lot of my friends and family are around the northwest anyway so if I ever did a launch again i'm really really unsure where I would do it because i'm
00:38:33
Speaker
I don't have like a good number of people in Glasgow or Edinburgh that I know would come to a launch. So yeah, that's tough. Yeah. It's like, you you've got to, if you approach a bookshop,
00:38:46
Speaker
and say can I do a launch party with you they'll probably ticket it and so if you don't have a lot of friends and family to make up the numbers and then they put it online and nobody buys a ticket because nobody knows who you are um it's probably likely to get cancelled so i don't know yeah it's a tricky one for um yeah that's a battle it's hard outside London Like I had for my love life and apocalypse, I had two because I'm a spoiled brat. And I had one in Manchester at House of Books and Friends, which was really good. And it was really mostly friends and family. And then had one down in London that the um publisher sort of helped organize. and And I pretty much for the London one was so panicked because even though
00:39:29
Speaker
but you know, generally speaking, a lot of authors live in London. So I knew there were lots of people that could come and it was Waterstones that a lot of people have launches at. And so I knew that would all be fine. I just kind of put out a general, please come to all of my group chats. That must have been like 80 people there. So it was really good, but there were way more people than at the Manchester one. And that had like friends and family and stuff. And this was yeah a load of authors I'd never met in real life who are lovely and I'm friendly with and are in my group. So it wasn't like random people came or anything like that. It was really, really good. But yeah, it was mostly authors I didn't know massively well who just come to a support the book and be, I don't know, drink warm white wine in a warm bookshop. ah But it was very nice. but it was so much easier because it felt like there was just an obvious guest list and people were like, yeah, sure. I can pop in after work. Yeah. That's ah yeah so much easier. Yeah. Okay.
00:40:23
Speaker
And you guys both have announced new novels coming out. Um, at what point, like, do you know if your publishers are going to like set up a launch party for you? Is that something you guys are going to do independently? What's the situation at what, at what point do you look into doing that?
00:40:41
Speaker
So this is actually an area I don't know much about because, um, chicken house. Didn't throw me a launch from my debut, obviously because of pandemic and then yeah because game of a girl was my second book.
00:40:55
Speaker
Um, I don't think they were really that bothered about it. So, um, I didn't really get much attention from them other than, Hey, here's 150 pounds to go towards the launch. Um, nobody from the publishing house came.
00:41:09
Speaker
um to game over a girl launch it was literally just me inviting my friends and family so i'm really and ah unsure what's going to happen with this one to be honest so we'll see if they you know if if the publishers like if it's the same kind of deal and they're like here's here's a bit of money you you know sort out you can sort out a launch uh on your own and you can do whatever you want are you going to do something similar are you going to maybe go to manchester or something or um try i think i actually really enjoyed doing it with somebody else because um i have i have quite a lot of social anxiety and i don't do very well um in front of a big crowd and i i can't read like i suck at reading out loud and so if i was with somebody else and we were doing it together like i did with cynthia And it was just kind of like a Q&A because you hosted that for us, didn't you, Melva? I did. She did.
00:42:06
Speaker
So i think if I think I would probably try and do something like that again just because it made me feel more comfortable. And I think there's no point doing it if you... if you're not going to be comfortable so and plus if there's two authors who both have a book coming out you're probably more likely to get more people to to an event like that yeah helps with crossover we were in the same genre um sorry uh age range and i suppose genre really like we could have done joint one because our books are coming out at pretty much the same time think might be the same day i don't remember i think we checked um but annoyingly yeah i guess could do one still
00:42:39
Speaker
yeah We'll work it out. i also there we do it It worked quite well with Cynthia because we both had 150 pounds. So she bought the booze and I, or I bought booze and she bought those of cakes and stuff. So it was quite, quite good. Cause you could pull your money together. We'll make it work. Go to here first. No, yeah well we could guys, we can do a live episode of chosen ones and other tropes, which is also like just the three of us talking nonsense.
00:43:09
Speaker
You can host us, Jamie. That'd be brilliant. Yeah, that'd be so good. Yeah, we can do that. That'd be fun. That'd be funny. There we go. What are we even moaning about? them but um Yeah, we can get all of our all of our writing friends to come and and heckle us with questions about.
00:43:29
Speaker
whatever they want yeah that'd be great i'd love that that's good ah wrong answers only um okay okay cool so yeah because i think that's also something that that people don't you know you you've done like you're saying i mean you've done this you've had two books out third one on the way and you're still not entirely sure what the situation is with doing launch parties it's not like a black and white thing there's no like set guidelines for it unless i presume if you're ah big big release like if you're a big name if it's big franchise whatever i presume the publisher has a much bigger role in in kind of and in pushing the direction of the launch party but
00:44:09
Speaker
for, for most mere mortals. Uh, it sounds like it's, it's very much in your own. Is, was that your kind of experience as well, Melissa? It was kind of in your own hands a bit. Yeah. So, um, I was, put because I'd been in the debut group and also been with a smaller publisher and been like, it'd been such an up and down journey. I probably was good at advocating, especially for the first book to say like, we really need to organize something. So I was quite lucky in that, um,
00:44:36
Speaker
So when did Love Life come out? 2023. So it wasn't COVID. So they did say that they would do both a Manchester and a London launch. And then my 150 budget, which if everyone's wondering why it's all the same amount of money, it just is forever.
00:44:48
Speaker
Don't know why. doesn't rise with inflation. unless you get thrown a massive party because you're like Catherine Rundle or something then you are which I think hers was at the Natural History Museum that is so cool and like Charles Dance did her reading Naomi so she didn't have to it so just get Charles Dance to your reading I'm not joking I'll tweet him oh my god that's immense That's wild. So jealous. Catherine, if you're listening, because I know she's like a really big fan. Wow. was really cool. I wonder if Neil Neubon do mine. I don't know if it's okay. I should have asked him that time. I saw him at Comic-Con.
00:45:27
Speaker
But ah yeah, I was really lucky in that they said they would organize Weirdly, they said they would organize the Manchester one and pay for everything and sort it. So they sent up like ah decorations and someone came up and it was really good. And then the London one was the one that basically they said, if you'd like to to another one, that can be 150 quid, ah which obviously I spent way more because i to get like a hotel and stuff to go down. Even my train ticket get was like nearly 150 So, um, I was pretty skint from doing it, but I really enjoyed it. Cause say, lots and lots of people came to that one. People who I lit, that's actually how I met them, like online friends and stuff like that. So was, it was good. i think Jamie, you came to that one.
00:46:02
Speaker
Uh, yes. Yeah. Yeah. One of my rare trips to Manchester. Uh, yeah. um so was it was good like I enjoyed it and they did put something on but also it was you know mostly just it drinks in a room nice bookseller selling the books and sort people feeling obliged to buy your books but in a nice way and I felt like I sold a lot of books at each event so I felt like it was worth it for the bookshop which is terrible actually because it's really a celebration it's not shouldn't be about that but you do feel this obligation don't it's like the tickets thing Like I really need to fill the room and I feel a bit awkward if I don't fill the room. So yeah, they were successful. And I did do one for soulmates, but just in Manchester. And it was pretty much all friends and family. And I felt like I was kind of, but that felt more like I was saying thank you to my friends and family.
00:46:49
Speaker
yeah They didn't feel like it was about my book. I felt more like I was just saying thanks so much for being supportive, um which was like a nice way to do it. And then, yeah, I'm not sure about the next one because I'm in the different publisher.
00:47:02
Speaker
So I don't know what they do. I assume it i assume the ยฃ150 will be mentioned at some point. But I haven't had my marketing meeting and... I would hope they would want to do one because it's the start of um a series. So like I'm writing the sequel right now. Yeah. So I would hope they would want to push the first one because of course people will only read the second one if they've read the first one. So I hope so, but I haven't ah spoke to them about it. And I'm, to be honest, I'm not entirely sure what I would like to do.
00:47:30
Speaker
Because I've done this now a couple of times yeah and I'm not sure if I want to do the same sort of thing or do something a bit different. and I know that like ah Holly Race, and who wrote Six Wild Crowns, that came out a couple of weeks ago, was talking about it um last episode, I think I've been reading it.
00:47:46
Speaker
And that, um, she did something a little bit different for that. Um, they were in this place that you could see the tower of London and it's a Tudor set book. So it was like quite interesting to see that from, I think it was like a bar. Um, and they perhaps invited a bookseller to come out and sell. So that looks quite cool. So I don't know if i'd want to do something a bit different. I'm just not sure. I'm i'm really and indecisive about it, which is why it's probably nice when they just organize it for you.
00:48:09
Speaker
yeah i'm so so you Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. When it comes to the bookshop that is chosen there, from what, from my experience of going to book launches, there's like some bookshops that sort of are prepped to cater for book launches more so than others. and Like even within like Waterstones, there'll be specific Waterstones in London that tend to do the book launches versus other ones, which, which remain, you know, maybe because they're smaller or just don't have the the layout, uh, than others.
00:48:39
Speaker
Uh, I think that you is that your experience as well, guys, that it's you'll you'll generally go to if you have like back to back, if you're lucky enough to be invited to like back to back launches over the course of a few weeks and they're in the same area, they'll often be at the same Waterstones or the same bookshop. Yes, that's definitely true. Manchester Housebooks and Friends has become the place. But again, as I say, Manchester actually does let the team down a bit for independent events.
00:49:03
Speaker
bookshop spaces. And then as Naomi was saying, and when Cynthia was invited to the Deansgate one and they had theirs there, it's a huge space and they do a lot of events. So it's a little bit different again because it's pretty much an event space, the area that they use for that kind of stuff. And the calendar is full all year round. Whereas, yeah, the House of Books and Friends, they're definitely...
00:49:22
Speaker
They know exactly what to do when they're wrong. They're licensed, for instance, so they can sort out your drinks, your food. They've got a cafe so they could do food for you. like They know what they're doing. It feels like a very set thing. When you go in, it's always set up the exact same way. I've been to two or three of those this year.
00:49:38
Speaker
and they've been really good. So yeah, there are certain bookshops that are set up more for that and would probably enjoy hosting it more than other bookshops that are maybe smaller because there are certainly bookshops on the edge of Manchester City Centre that I've been to to say do proof drops, et cetera. And I don't know actually because I've not contacted them whether they would enjoy doing a book launch or whether it's a faff. I've no idea. I don't know how much they enjoy doing it, especially if they're not like an events-based space.
00:50:07
Speaker
couldn't tell you is it is it ticketed at the independent places as well or is that more of a like the ah like a foils and water zones kind of thing it hasn't i think there was one that was ticketed at house of books and friends but usually the dean's water zones deanscape ones are usually ticketed i think that's a fire and safety reg thing i can it i think they have to know how many people are going to be in the building um so but But then they charge for it as well. So I think there's kind of like a bit of a commercial aspect to it too. But I think... yeah They can do free tickets. Yeah. Yeah. I've seen places do that.
00:50:46
Speaker
Like NWA Lit Fest, that's all free, but it's ticketed. And I think that is for fire and safety stuff. Yeah. Just so they know that the the numbers. um Yeah. And is it fairly common in your experiences that that um if an author...
00:51:01
Speaker
Or if an event, you know, if they're if they're unable to sell whatever is deemed the sort of threshold for enough tickets that the the bookshop will cancel the whole event. Yeah, that's really common.
00:51:12
Speaker
I think that is quite common. Yeah, i've I get asked to chair quite a bit. That's always frustrating because if you're chairing, you get a fee. And I have i had, yeah, a cancellation because they didn't sell it. Like literally, and sometimes it'll be like the day before and ah whichever bookshop it might be. And ah my friends who've, say, bought a ticket to support me have said, oh, I just got refund.
00:51:34
Speaker
Is it not running? And then about an hour later, they tell me it's been cancelled. And so then I don't get paid for chairing. So it is quite common that they will. I don't know what that number is or what the threshold is. but No, but but then at the same time, you sometimes you go to events and there's hardly anybody there and you're like, where was this one cancelled? Yeah, very true. How many tickets would be? Yeah, so i'm not quite sure exactly what the ruling is on that, but they they will cancel an event if they feel like they shouldn't be running it, I guess, for various reasons. if Well, because a lot of the time they'll be open late, they've got to keep the staff there.
00:52:10
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. um And then they've got to tidy up afterwards and things like, I guess if that if they think it's going to cost them money or just not be worth their time and just give their staff for extra hours, then they'll be like, this isn't, you know, we're not going to do this.
00:52:24
Speaker
Yeah. Which is rough if you're, you know, a debut author and you're excited about your launch and then it's like, yeah, sorry, we're not doing it anymore. I think that's possibly why it is better to do a launch at like a more independent bookshop because I think numbers are probably less important to them than like a big massive waterstones.
00:52:43
Speaker
Yes, I think so. And also I feel better telling people to, because when you're in a bookshop, often ah you are paying full price for a book. And when it's friends and family supporting, I feel much better saying to them, we're supporting this independent bookshop if you buy from here at full price, as opposed to say Amazon at half price. and So as i feel better saying that in a smaller independent bookshop than say a big chain.
00:53:09
Speaker
That's true. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. um That's about all the notes I had on bookshops and booksellers. Was there any anything else, any kind of other parts of this that you guys wanted to touch on before we wrap things up?
00:53:21
Speaker
No. No, no, I don't think I will. No, there's absolutely nothing. and Yeah, i can't I can't really think of any. I just think, to me, I am enjoying seeing the rise of independent bookshops getting recognised for being a big part. Just because they're 300, 500 small cogs, however many independent bookshops are in the UK, doesn't mean they're not doing something really important for your book. Like, I like seeing all of these indie edition sprayed edges.
00:53:52
Speaker
which only can be got in independent bookshops. I think that's so cool. I've seen independent bookshops that are online only. So they don't have a brick and mortar shop, but they're an independent website that will still get the independent sprayed edge, which I think is really cool. and I think they do a lot on social media to push their books. I think if you can get in...
00:54:11
Speaker
with ah independent booksellers and offer them something like bookmarks, like an amazing sprayed edge, and you're selling two or three copies in each of those independent bookshops, that adds up to like thousands of copies really, really quickly. And I think they shouldn't be written off. On the other hand, I still do love Waterstones. I don't think they're evil or anything, anything even though I've sort of said some like, you should always support indie bookshops and you should support indie bookshops. and But i do also think the Waterstones booksellers in particular are very good at putting on really good events when they run. And I think that they are good at putting together people that you might not expect to go together for those events and those help push book sales. I do think most Wardstone's employees on the floor as such, when you go in, we'll give you excellent recommendations, which also helps. And they're also worth talking to.
00:55:00
Speaker
and So yeah, I think booksellers and bookshops ah are an incredible, it's it's really weird because we talk so often about how all of the marketing and how all the decisions are made sort of like six months to a year before your book even comes out. And there's nothing you can really do. But actually the thing you can do once the book is out is speak to booksellers and bookshops. And yeah, they're amazing.
00:55:19
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Cool. A nice uplifting note to end on. And to round things off, as always, have you guys been reading, watching, playing anything new over the past couple of weeks? We haven't recorded in a couple of weeks.
00:55:36
Speaker
Yeah. What's new with you guys? Oli pushed a DVD at me he wants me to tell you about. It was called Godzilla Minus One. it was great. Excellent. mother Just sensational. It was really cool. Yeah, yeah right. really enjoyed it.
00:55:49
Speaker
We watched it all in Japanese and it just felt, it was really, really cool. I really enjoyed it. I thought, um because they made Godzilla look kind of like the old school movies. Yeah. and would yeah Sort of the plasticine model. And was like, oh, it's really interesting. It was like such a different take on it from, yeah. Yeah.
00:56:05
Speaker
And it was actually, i like that one because it's actually about something like, it you know, it was about like PTSD and things. Yeah, it was a really good interesting, yeah, I thought that was so cool with the whole Kamikaze thing. I could never really considered. Yeah, it was, it was, it was, Godzilla was metaphorical, which he of course always was. ah But like, yeah, you can contrast it with the sort of ah the ones coming out of Hollywood where it's just like,
00:56:30
Speaker
Was it King Kong fighting Godzilla with like a bunch of other monsters now? And they've got like magical gauntlets and things. yeah I mean, those those are fun in like a stupid way. Like I don't hate those movies. I have seen them. ah But ah yeah, there' it was great. Godzilla minus one is excellent. I loved it. Yeah, really cool. glad you guys enjoyed it too.
00:56:52
Speaker
um i've I've watched a bunch of stuff somehow. we Well, Gabby and i love Welcome to Wrexham. don't know you guys have watched it. We absolutely binged the new season. yeah Just a great documentary about how football works. Although what I'm realizing about this season and their trajectory is that, okay, so you really can just buy your way to the top. Yeah.
00:57:17
Speaker
Yeah, they are big rivals of Stockport County, which is our local team. And they sometimes appear on Welcome to Wrexham. You'll see they're at county ground. But I but i think Wrexham are now in the championships.
00:57:28
Speaker
yeah uh not happy which but i can't believe it like i i honestly was like no that though they won't get out of league one for at least like a couple of years and i was like then i saw how much money they were spending and i was like well i guess that solves it maybe uh anyway i watched that i also watched iron heart oh is it good we touched on movie it it's it it's not bad i think Wait, that's the one that got review bombed, isn't it? Ironheart, not Thunderbolts. was getting confused. It's definitely been a review bombed, that one, year yeah. Yeah. I don't know why it's been review bombed. ah But I thought it was I thought it was okay i think the...
00:58:09
Speaker
the The stuff they do with with her, the main character, and like the the people around her, I think was good. I think the sort of main ah sort of villain arc was a was a was not quite as good. It was a bit like, a okay, yeah, sure. but Yeah, he does things and then she yeah she wins the fight.
00:58:31
Speaker
ah Huge reveal though, in the last episode for the future of the MCU. Oh, interesting. invested in the MCU, there is a massive introduction at the end, which ah will absolutely be a recurring character for probably many years to come. Huge character for Marvel. one One for your dad to watch, Melanie. And one for my dad, who I'm introducing to the MCU.
00:58:56
Speaker
ah and then the other thing is we started watching the new season of The Bear. um Oh, yeah, because I was a bit let down by season three, but people say season four picks back up.
00:59:07
Speaker
agree season three was the was a low point season four is feeling so far so good yeah it's feeling um' it's suddenly it's it's it feels like a massive change of pace it feels like season one was like ang season one was like stress season two was just pure anxiety season three was a bit meh and then this feels like a kind of tonic to all of that it feels like It's striving to be like more calm and more happy place. So, so far I'm enjoying it. I'm enjoying that tranquilness of it so far, but I still have PTSD from the, uh, the Christmas episode in season two. So, oh so good, so good, but also so, so bad. And it gave me anxiety watching it,
00:59:53
Speaker
but yeah, it was great. What about you, Melissa? are you, what are are even up to? I have been watching the finale of Pamela. love the Handmaid's Tale. It's been oh really good. okay Oh, Handmaid's Tale, sorry. Yeah, because they're now doing um The Testaments, which if anyone doesn't know, is the other book that Margaret Atwood wrote. and Yeah, which is said I think 15 years after the end of the events of the Handmaid's Tale. Yeah.
01:00:18
Speaker
which obviously kind of lines up, but kind of doesn't with the ah TV series. So that was really good. I've been enjoying that. How many series did they do from that? It's one book, right? Yeah. so but season one ends where book one finishes and then they have continued the story afterwards for four more seasons. But it's been nearly 10 years because COVID and writer's strikes broke a lot of stuff up in the middle. Yeah, so it's been it's been tricky, but i think they've I think they've done a good job. I understand why some people didn't like it, but knowing what I know because I've read the Testaments um and that they're going to be moving on to do that, I totally understand various decisions with no spoilers. and I watched 28 Years Later in the Cinema.
01:00:56
Speaker
Oh, nice. Is it good? Oh my God, it's so fun. It's so fun. It's so Danny Boyle. And I was just like, yes, like with we're back. This is so good. And I understand why some people didn't like it. I feel like it's a really Marmite film. I absolutely loved it. There's a bit at the end, which is just...
01:01:12
Speaker
like very british culture it's it's really really good i also love lindensvarn and holy island and all that around northumbria um it's beautiful area like where they film it and they actually i was worried they were going to do it as like a fake island so anyone doesn't know like lindensvarn and holy island is an island that's only accessible in low tide and only has one road that's accessible and low tide perfect for a zombie apocalypse and they did actually have it as that area and the accents were not horrendous yeah I mean, Jodie Comer's very good accents anyway. She is. So she was fine. When I first heard her real accent in an interview, i was like, what? This is what you sound like? So that is very good. If you're a fan of the original, like, I just love zombies.
01:01:54
Speaker
Like, if you're a fan, you might want to read my book to the death, which has many running zombies in it. um And also i read, i think, Naomi, I think you read this. ah i finally read The Favourites. Is it, um...
01:02:07
Speaker
the one about ice skating oh i loved that yeah did you like it yeah oh god it's so good at lane fargo yes that's it um oh god it's so it's so good it's so fun and so silly i love ice skating like this the thing i'm obsessed with and i was picking up all the torval and dean references because i'm like of an ice skating nerd um yeah I absolutely loved it it's so fun it's so interesting I really have got to a point where do so much reading for work um something has to really grab me from the first page I always say this as if I have really good taste I have terrible taste like it's not because I'm like really good at recognizing amazing writing this was really good though like It was brilliant. Oh, it's so fun. And just kept me reading the whole time. I just raced through it. was really, really good. binged that book. Yeah. I got home with it because I picked it up and then I got home with it and I read it in like a single evening just because I just could not put it down. And Molly was like, can we watch something now? And I was like, nope. Wait.
01:03:02
Speaker
Yeah, very good. and So yeah, I feel like I've absorbed some ah absorb some culture, if any of those things can be culture, recently. They sound like culture to me. but before we go, my my one question is, have either of you started Exposition 33 yet?
01:03:19
Speaker
So Ollie is going through Ghost of Tsushima. Gonna be here for years. He's like, I really want to finish one before I move on to the next one. And I'm like, that's like a three act thing. It's, oh, he's on 30 hours already. he's As long as he's not, he's not picking up all the little doohickeys and like all that stuff. Of course he is, Jamie. He's doing all his high quests. I'm like, you can't. You'll get to see it in about a month then.
01:03:48
Speaker
i'm sorry it's on our let ago's the list yeah i still have not i'm i so it's my treat for when i finish my draft okay i'm drafting and i'm at 30k and i'm aiming for 75k and i draft quite quickly you're doing quite quickly i think that's like 10 days of writing so that's amazing it's everyone solid yeah so yeah okay i'll play after that promise I'll just have to keep watching streamers playing it and reliving the experience through that. I've watched this. I've watched it so many times. It's ridiculous. I just keep watching other people experience it. ah It's so good. um
01:04:23
Speaker
Okay, cool. Well, that's the whole episode. um Thanks again. As always, if anyone has any questions or we missed anything, shoot us a message. You can find us on all the social media platforms or...
01:04:35
Speaker
Probably in other places. i don't know. People are smart. You could be with Google. You'll find us somewhere. Message us. We'd love to hear your thoughts and and kind of respond to them. And we'll see you on the next episode.
01:04:50
Speaker
Thanks for putting up with our nonsense for another episode. To stay tuned to everything we're up to, you can follow the podcast on all socials at The Chosen Tropes. Follow Melissa at Meliva, Naomi at Naomi G. Writes, and Jamie at Jamie X. Greenwood.
01:05:03
Speaker
Don't forget to check out Naomi and Melissa's books, as well as the Right and Wrong podcast. Thanks again, and we'll see you on the next trope.