Transcript
Speaker: Hey friends, welcome back to Artists of the Way.
Speaker: I'm John, the host.
Speaker: Today, I'm very excited to welcome on Johan Daza to the podcast.
Speaker: Johan is an artist and mental health activist in the Grand Rapids area.
Speaker: He's worked at Wedgwood Christian Services, has a degree from Kendall College, and I was introduced to his stuff from the Stray, the local coffee shop that I go to.
Speaker: He has a really cool art style that kind of blends this mixture of street art and graphic novel art and classical art.
Speaker: really great color usage.
Speaker: I'm a big fan of it.
Speaker: And then he also does a lot of work for children, has written and self-published a couple of children's books that deal with mental health awareness or bullying.
Speaker: Just a lot of really great work.
Speaker: He was really lovely to talk to.
Speaker: We have some examples of his art that he brought in that we're able to show you guys and some really great insights and recommendations for artists.
Speaker: So I'm super glad you guys are here to join us, listen to this discussion and hope you guys enjoy it.
Speaker: So how are you doing today?
Speaker: Pretty good.
Speaker: Thank you for having me, John.
Speaker: Yeah, it's a beautiful day.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: A beautiful Saturday.
Speaker: I haven't done a podcast for years.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You did a little bit of your own podcast at some point.
Speaker: Is that right?
Speaker: In the beginning, yeah.
Speaker: With my friend Jeff Vili.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: When we started doing an anti-bullying program many years ago when...
Speaker: all this anti-bullying stuff started.
Speaker: We were one of the few first ones here around the area.
Speaker: Okay, that's cool.
Speaker: Even before a lot of the popular ones that you see nowadays.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So yeah, we started some of those and now he is a motivational speaker.
Speaker: That's his full-time job.
Speaker: And I was the artist behind that.
Speaker: And we did some podcasts.
Speaker: Yeah, without knowing what we were doing.
Speaker: That's fine.
Speaker: That's how podcasting goes.
Speaker: Yeah, and I think, yeah, there was a few podcasts back then.
Speaker: So, yeah, it was fun.
Speaker: The editing part for me was difficult.
Speaker: Editing is the boring part.
Speaker: And then you're listening back to your own conversation again.
Speaker: So hopefully this one is not going to be as bad that we have to cut, you know.
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So the first, there's a couple of questions I always ask everybody at the start of each episode.
Speaker: My first one is, how is God using art in your life right now?
Speaker: You know, that's a good question.
Speaker: And I'm glad that you asked because...
Speaker: Sometimes we forget.
Speaker: You know, we have that eight to five job.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And just a few months ago, I was probably too busy with work.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And when I was a state of mind that you like, you don't feel like doing anything unless somebody asked you that question.
Speaker: And then you realize, oh, actually I've been doing some stuff.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: And for the last few, I would say few months, I've been pushing to do more art.
Speaker: And some of the things I've been doing is, you know, I do children's books, illustration.
Speaker: I like to paint.
Speaker: But I've been trying to figure it out every year.
Speaker: I try to figure out a way to have a message with my art.
Speaker: I do a lot of art.
Speaker: It's just for my own, you know, like my own pleasure.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Just because I like to draw.
Speaker: I like to paint.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: But at the same time, I always try to find how am I going to use this for God?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because he gave us the gift, you know.
Speaker: So we have to use it for him, too.
Speaker: So, you know, lately, and I brought one of the t-shirts here.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I always done t-shirt design.
Speaker: I have never printed my own.
Speaker: I always, you know, design it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Every, I will say every year I will have one, a new one.
Speaker: And this time I was at church doing a service and the pastor was talking about when you feel tired physically and mentally.
Speaker: And I think this year I've been feeling mentally tired.
Speaker: I work from home.
Speaker: I don't get to see a lot of people.
Speaker: So I work on the phone all day long in the computer.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: It's just that mentally tired.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's completely different than physical tired.
Speaker: I experienced both.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Maybe when I was younger, I was very tired doing like the heavy work, but mentally affects me way more.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, you know, in one of the verses, you know, and he mentioned the verses in the t-shirt.
Speaker: I don't know if you want to.
Speaker: I'll hold it up.
Speaker: So if you're on the video, you can see a sample here of the shirt.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So it's in English.
Speaker: in Spanish.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's Nehemiah 6.9.
Speaker: Well, it's paraphrased.
Speaker: It's not the full verse, but that was the line, God strength in my hand.
Speaker: So in Spanish also says, Dios fortalece mis manos.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So that's kind of like when you feel that tired, like physical, mentally, that you need to hear that, that God understand that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: and that he can help you during that moment.
Speaker: So when the pastor mentioned this, right away I saw that in a t-shirt.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's like, maybe I can make that for the church, to help the church.
Speaker: But at the same time, we can wear it.
Speaker: And you never know, you might be walking down the store and somebody might see that verse.
Speaker: And that might make their day.
Speaker: Maybe you're not going to have the conversation, but they will read that and say, yeah, that's how I'm feeling right now.
Speaker: You just need to be acknowledged.
Speaker: Sometimes we don't have the solution for things, but to feel that you're being acknowledged and God understand that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's pretty big.
Speaker: Like for me, especially working from home, you don't have the interaction.
Speaker: Like you asked me, do you want to do this virtually in person?
Speaker: Like in person.
Speaker: Because everything I do is virtual.
Speaker: And you lose that connection with people.
Speaker: And, you know, sometimes you need to hear that or see it.
Speaker: So my idea with that teacher is like, yeah, I'm making it for my church church.
Speaker: But I want to be able to give it to other people.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So they might be walking on the street.
Speaker: They might be walking in the store.
Speaker: You don't have to say anything.
Speaker: They might be able to see it.
Speaker: So...
Speaker: it might help that little bit of that healing moment.
Speaker: You know, having that bad day.
Speaker: We have good days and bad days.
Speaker: So that's one of my, one of the things that I'm working on, but there's a lot of other things, but that's one of the things is trying to figure out an easy way to communicate people.
Speaker: For me, like art, graphic design, I can communicate that way.
Speaker: You know, that's the way I communicate with people.
Speaker: Yeah, no, I love that.
Speaker: And I love the, I feel like,
Speaker: Just the idea of like being able to put the art out there on a t-shirt is just not something I would have thought of, but then it can just, I feel like it, oh gosh, what's the, see my brain's falling apart and the words aren't coming.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um, like the strength of art is, is really in, like you said, there's not always a solution, but it can just be that little seed or that little step towards being heard and being seen for healing.
Speaker: And I know.
Speaker: like i saw on your instagram page the shirt and that like you i i work from home half the time that i that i work and i'm on phones and chats a lot so i'm talking to people all the time and so i totally get that mentally tired thing yeah and then it's like oh well i i have a podcast going we're in the midst of godspell it's like well i have this consistent other artistic thing that requires a lot for me mentally and so i
Speaker: really relate with that idea of, I don't have the strength, God be my strength.
Speaker: I just need, I need you to help me float along here.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's the thing sometime, maybe the beginning of COVID, that's when I started working from home.
Speaker: I mean, I was having a lot of like physical issues.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: where to a point I was having a hard time working and I don't know how I was doing the work.
Speaker: And when I look back, it's like, it's just God keeping me there.
Speaker: Like, you need the job, you need to work.
Speaker: And I just kept pushing, but at the same time, it's just not me pushing, there's that hand.
Speaker: It's pushing you.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Sometimes, you know, people say you just keep pushing forward.
Speaker: But who's pushing you forward?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's the biggest thing.
Speaker: If you, especially when you're working from home, you feel alone.
Speaker: Even though you might see your wife, kids, I have dogs.
Speaker: It's those eight hours that you feel kind of alone.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because you're not having that physical, personal interaction.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It's important to feel that push.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And a lot of my art, you know, even this one, you see hands.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That one again.
Speaker: This one is an older one.
Speaker: And this one is more related to mental health.
Speaker: When I was working for Westwood Christian Services, I worked there for over 20 years with kids at risk, like young kids and also like teenagers.
Speaker: And I,
Speaker: I mean, this one is a representation of that and also my own representation
Speaker: That's a big story behind this, but that's God's hand grabbing you from the water.
Speaker: A lot of people will think, oh, is that Jesus grabbing Peter from the water?
Speaker: Similar.
Speaker: When I created it, I wasn't even thinking about that.
Speaker: That's the amazing thing about art.
Speaker: Sometimes you create stuff, and then people find meaning to it.
Speaker: You're like, oh.
Speaker: I didn't think about that.
Speaker: This was my idea, but then like this, find your reason to live.
Speaker: There's so many people that they have their own interpretation.
Speaker: That's a beautiful thing about art.
Speaker: And then you can use that to communicate.
Speaker: But this one has to do with me almost drowning when I was a kid.
Speaker: And I was born in South America and Chile.
Speaker: He went to the beach with my family.
Speaker: My uncle was there and we got into the water and the ocean.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Racked flags were there.
Speaker: The idea was like, we're just going to get into the water up to the knee.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And I remember that we were just kids.
Speaker: I don't, I can't remember how old I was, maybe 10, 12.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And then it's like, okay, a little bit more to the waist.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: And you don't know about the undertow, the currents and all that stuff.
Speaker: And suddenly we're like up to the deck.
Speaker: And I was with my uncle, he was close by and he's like, okay, we need to get out.
Speaker: This is not good.
Speaker: And he's a strong swimmer.
Speaker: I was not a strong swimmer.
Speaker: And then, you know, you start feeling like it's pulling you into the ocean, pulling to the ocean.
Speaker: Then the waves are a little bigger than you think.
Speaker: And then, you know, I start going underwater.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: There was a moment that I was underwater thinking this is it.
Speaker: Because I was not a strong swimmer.
Speaker: My uncle was like, he knew he can get out.
Speaker: But he waited next to me.
Speaker: Because he knew I couldn't.
Speaker: And I was like, okay.
Speaker: But the weird thing is I was underwater but I was not that afraid like I thought I was going to be.
Speaker: And I just started praying.
Speaker: Underwater.
Speaker: And it's like...
Speaker: If you want to take me, take me quick.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because drowning is probably the worst thing.
Speaker: So just take me quick.
Speaker: But if you're going to save me, do it now.
Speaker: Right there, I felt the water just... It was... Me and my uncle were just... Right by the shore.
Speaker: And it was super quick.
Speaker: Now, I didn't know how long we were in the water.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I could feel like there was something that was taking me out of the water.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's what it represents here.
Speaker: Now, my uncle stayed with me there.
Speaker: My dad was, by the short, he didn't know how to swim, so he was freaking out.
Speaker: Oh, man, yeah.
Speaker: My mom was crying, and she thought I was already dead because they couldn't see you because the waves were going like this.
Speaker: So you couldn't see anything.
Speaker: They couldn't see me at all.
Speaker: And then I was suddenly there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And after that, it's like, oh my goodness.
Speaker: It's like, I was just super young.
Speaker: I was already playing at a church, but it's like that day.
Speaker: It's like, I remember the next, I don't know if it was the next day, but that week I brought my electric guitar and one teacher was like, okay, I'm going to dedicate my music and continue my work because you took me out of the water.
Speaker: So it was kind of like a promise to God.
Speaker: It's like, I have to use my art.
Speaker: And that time was music.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I was not an artist yet.
Speaker: I was a musician.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: And I mean, the promise.
Speaker: So, and as I got older, you know, that changed more into art.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, but, yeah, that's what this represents.
Speaker: So this one is going back to, like, something super personal.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Then now working with kids, you know, that I used to work at Westwood.
Speaker: That's how it feels, depression.
Speaker: It feels like drowning.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And, you know, when you don't work with...
Speaker: that group of people, you don't group in that environment, it's hard to understand depression.
Speaker: But that's how it feels like in, you know, I got to see that like almost every day.
Speaker: I think we all go through depression, you know?
Speaker: But that's one of the things in talking to kids and teenagers, like that's how they feel, they feel like they're drowning completely.
Speaker: But one of the things is like, you gotta be willing to reach out
Speaker: You know, with your hand.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But at some time, there's going to be somebody also willing to grab the hand.
Speaker: So that's what this means.
Speaker: So, you know, there's a lot of different meanings to this one.
Speaker: You know, you can reach out to God, but you also got to be willing to take the hand from somebody else, too.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because God could be using somebody else.
Speaker: to reach out to you, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, yeah, there's this one.
Speaker: We had a little, I don't want to call it campaign, but between my friend, I created this t-shirt, then I made a little one of my first book and it was stories of different people telling their reason to live.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So hearing stories from other people, you know, and I entered our price.
Speaker: I did our price with this.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So
Speaker: that's kind of the things that I like to do.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But it's not like I plan.
Speaker: It's just kind of like... It kind of... The inspiration hits you and God arranges things.
Speaker: And it's one of the things that's from all the people, from all the Christians and non-Christian.
Speaker: They tell you, you just got to listen to that voice sometimes.
Speaker: You just got to act on it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And not just like, okay, I have this idea, but I'm not going to do anything about it.
Speaker: So sometimes you just got to get the...
Speaker: comfortable position it's like yeah okay we're going to do something about it it's you know we're not trying to be famous or anything like that it's just like how can i communicate this message how can i be part of that little bit of healing you know yeah
Speaker: I'm not an expert in anything.
Speaker: But one of the things is like, yeah, we can all be part of that little bit of healing, a little bit, you know?
Speaker: And we have to act on it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: What was it that, because mental health awareness is a big part of your art and things that you platform, I suppose is the word for it.
Speaker: So what was it that first made you passionate about that?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So working out Western Christian Services, at the beginning I was working with teenagers and I don't want to use the word, well, it was more like the delinquent part.
Speaker: Okay, yeah.
Speaker: So that was a little bit different.
Speaker: But then I started working with a different type of population.
Speaker: There was a group of young kids, they were, you know, they didn't have families and they were being bullied.
Speaker: I also work in another program where they deal with suicide ideation.
Speaker: So I was working on those programs.
Speaker: And that's when I think I became more passionate about it because we have great therapists.
Speaker: They start teaching us about that.
Speaker: The other program, not so much, but this one.
Speaker: But there was one young kid that I remember...
Speaker: He was probably eight.
Speaker: He had a lot of different kind of issues, but we were just playing basketball.
Speaker: He liked to skateboard a lot, so we would go outside and kind of skateboard together.
Speaker: We'd shoot hoops together, and he just asked me the question out of the blue.
Speaker: It's like, why do people hate me so much?
Speaker: And then he also said, why my parents hate me?
Speaker: And it just kind of struck me.
Speaker: Like, how can a kid say that?
Speaker: Especially about their parents.
Speaker: These were adopted parents.
Speaker: And just kind of like, I didn't know what to say to the kid, you know?
Speaker: You know, and it's one of the things, I didn't give him like a straight answer because I didn't have a straight answer.
Speaker: So we started working on it.
Speaker: And we kept playing, you know, during the week.
Speaker: And one of the things we start...
Speaker: joking around was about Bigfoot.
Speaker: And I try to use the analogy of Bigfoot.
Speaker: You know, why he gets... We just made some jokes like, you know, what if Bigfoot went to school and how he would get bullied because he's so big.
Speaker: He couldn't pronounce his... He can't pronounce his words because he's Bigfoot.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So he started laughing.
Speaker: And so we just started kind of like playing around with the whole idea of Bigfoot, how he gets bullied.
Speaker: And then he started talking about how he gets bullied.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I didn't have a plan or anything about that, but...
Speaker: That day, I think it was the same week, I talked to my friend Jeff and we were talking about we wanted to do something related to bullying.
Speaker: This idea came out and we just started talking and talking and he started researching and we came out with this book that took like two years.
Speaker: I'll show on the camera as well.
Speaker: Bigfoot is Bully.
Speaker: Yeah, he did a great job researching how to deal with that.
Speaker: Because when a kid asks you that question, it's like, why do my parents hate me?
Speaker: Or why do people hate me?
Speaker: Why am I getting bullied at school?
Speaker: And one of the things that we started learning little by little is how to cope with that.
Speaker: A lot of people say, well, tell all your parents you're getting bullied.
Speaker: Well, he was saying his parents hate him.
Speaker: Tell all your teachers.
Speaker: Teachers, sometimes they don't have the answers.
Speaker: So we have to teach kids how to cope, you know, give them the skills, how to cope with that.
Speaker: Because a lot of times they're going to get bullied.
Speaker: Adults are not going to be around.
Speaker: So that's one of the things that we started working on this book.
Speaker: It's like, how do we teach kids to cope with that?
Speaker: Give them the tools.
Speaker: One of the things that I learned working with kids is, like you like to do, to practice by acting it out.
Speaker: If you practice acting it out, you get more comfortable.
Speaker: So if they start picking on you, making fun of you,
Speaker: And we're just practicing.
Speaker: You practice what to say back without being mean, you know?
Speaker: You learn how to respond in a positive way.
Speaker: So that whole practicing
Speaker: It's just like theater kind of.
Speaker: So that's kind of like what this book is about.
Speaker: It's like you practice.
Speaker: The more you practice, you get better at it.
Speaker: We don't teach kids at school how to deal with bullying.
Speaker: They just have plans.
Speaker: It's like, tell your teacher, do this, tell your parents.
Speaker: But I think some of the things that we're missing in schools and parents sometimes, it's like you have to teach your kids how to deal with it.
Speaker: It's part of life.
Speaker: It's not going to go away.
Speaker: So you have to teach kids how to defend themselves without using aggression, without being physical.
Speaker: So you have to, you know, it's one of the things you learn.
Speaker: Actually, it's a good skill even for an adult.
Speaker: How to deal and work with bullies.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: or how to deal with somebody who is being aggressive at work.
Speaker: Same principles.
Speaker: So if you practice those kind of things, you get better at it.
Speaker: And then you feel more comfortable, and then you can deal with that.
Speaker: And one of the things is like in this book, right at the end, we have steps.
Speaker: They're very simple steps.
Speaker: Let me go to that page.
Speaker: And it says step one.
Speaker: you don't get upset.
Speaker: That's the first thing because that's what the bully wants you to get upset.
Speaker: Which is really hard because we all get upset.
Speaker: As an adult, we can say that to a kid.
Speaker: You're driving somebody just not following the rules.
Speaker: You get upset.
Speaker: This is really hard, but you have to practice how you control yourself.
Speaker: So as an adult, we also have to practice with a kid.
Speaker: And, you know, it says when others are being mean, don't get upset, be calm on the outside and strong in the inside.
Speaker: So you have to learn how to do that by practicing, you know.
Speaker: You know, and there's other things.
Speaker: Step two, treat your enemy like a friend.
Speaker: Now, maybe we don't want to use that word anymore, but treat others like a friend, even if they're being mean to you.
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: This is coming... You can find this in the Bible.
Speaker: Yeah, I know.
Speaker: So there's nothing new about this.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: It's the golden rule, pretty much.
Speaker: You know, Jesus taught the golden rule.
Speaker: Gandhi taught the golden rule.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Mark the Luther King.
Speaker: So this book is just... It's the golden rule.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's what we're trying to teach.
Speaker: But the golden rule is not as simple as saying practice.
Speaker: The golden rule.
Speaker: No, you have to practice.
Speaker: It's still hard for me.
Speaker: I have to practice.
Speaker: I work from home, customer service.
Speaker: You really have to practice.
Speaker: You have a lot of opportunities to practice.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And that's the thing.
Speaker: I use these skills in customer service and it works.
Speaker: You can turn a negative call into a positive call.
Speaker: And also you learn how to set boundaries too.
Speaker: which is the biggest thing, it's like how you set boundaries.
Speaker: But yeah, I don't know if I went off track with that.
Speaker: No, that's good.
Speaker: What's different, if anything is different in your process?
Speaker: Because this and Louis the Little Pirate, you do things that are aimed towards children and then you also have other works of art that are more...
Speaker: yeah um i don't know general is there a difference in your process or what your goals are with those like do you notice differences in how you work yeah i think my i think my mindset is completely different yeah um you know as an adult we
Speaker: There's a lot more mature subject.
Speaker: Maybe I get into more of the dark parts of life.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Which I, you know, more careful with children's, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: When I work, you know, I try to do children's books.
Speaker: This is taking me back when I was a kid.
Speaker: I like kind of like a lot of imagination things.
Speaker: Be playful, imagination.
Speaker: And what I try to do with like children's books is to give that little spark so kids can use imagination.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: For adult is more like less, um,
Speaker: let's look into more like more of the dark stuff.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, kind of like serious stuff.
Speaker: So it's completely different.
Speaker: I also like to do art just for the beauty of it.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So, you know, a lot of the artists, you know, sometimes like what inspires you is like, it's just beautiful sometimes.
Speaker: But sometimes we go into other parts where it's like, we're trying to show other part of life, you know, especially with adult stuff.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Which, you know, we have good days and bad days.
Speaker: And I like to show both.
Speaker: So it's a different approach.
Speaker: And I think that my mind is completely different when I'm working on children books.
Speaker: It's almost like taking me back when I was a kid.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So every time I'm working on kids stuff, it's almost like me when I was 10.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Or 12.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And when I'm working on more adult stuff, it's just me now, like in life.
Speaker: So it's kind of interesting because I think our mind kind of goes back and forth.
Speaker: I don't think we ever change.
Speaker: Like if you look back when you were a kid, you're kind of still the same.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: but not really at the same time.
Speaker: Like you can go back, it's like, yeah, I mean, I still feel the same way.
Speaker: But it's interesting, and this is my own personal, I don't know about other artists, but I think my mind goes back, it's like, this is me when I was 10.
Speaker: Luis, a little pirate is about foster homes, but a lot of the games and playful stuff here is stuff that I used to like
Speaker: play pretend yeah i did that all the time uh stuff that i did with my daughter like um you know trying to find treasures and things like that you know um so going back when i was 10 or going back when my daughter was little yeah um so i think our minds just kind of like go back and forth like in time almost but yeah um it's interesting process but um i did that with art and music i usually kind of
Speaker: If I'm working on a subject, I kind of like to get soaked in that subject.
Speaker: So, you know, if I'm doing skateboard, for giving example, I try to get soaked on that.
Speaker: I would ride maybe like longboard.
Speaker: I will look at some skateboard videos.
Speaker: I will look at skateboards.
Speaker: I will look at the art.
Speaker: So I'll try to get soaked with that moment during those weeks.
Speaker: And then if I'm working on children's books,
Speaker: I'd be looking at children books.
Speaker: It's almost like you get to get yourself completely soaked on that.
Speaker: That's my process.
Speaker: I need to kind of like feel it in a way.
Speaker: But it's not like one day I'm working on this and the next day I'm working on the next.
Speaker: I spend weeks on one subject, one state of mind, almost like actors.
Speaker: If you're going to play a role,
Speaker: you stick with that role for a while and then if you play another role you know you get into that role for a while too yeah and i think i do the same as an artist um i did that the same with music too so if i will write composition i will stay with that state of mind for a while because i need to like understand myself what i'm doing right um most artists we don't know what we're doing
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, people think it's like, oh, you know, how can you come up with this idea?
Speaker: I have no idea.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: I have no clue where they come from.
Speaker: And that's when people, you know, ask you that question, like, how do you know God is real?
Speaker: That's how I know.
Speaker: Because I don't know where that comes from.
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: There's so much beauty in the world.
Speaker: There's so much beauty in the art that we're...
Speaker: It's like I don't have a clue.
Speaker: I can look at some of my art.
Speaker: I have no idea how I did it.
Speaker: I don't know where the idea came from.
Speaker: And then there's something pushing you to do it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Something divine.
Speaker: And that's the, you know, that gift that God is giving you.
Speaker: So... Just kind of embracing the mystery of that and giving it space to breathe and develop.
Speaker: That's the thing.
Speaker: It's like you have to let it breathe.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, that's when art becomes real.
Speaker: That's why...
Speaker: you know i don't do a lot of graphic design for me graphic design is more like it's work yeah it's just like oh here's a logo yeah here it is there's nothing behind it right art is alive it has to breathe yeah so and it has to grow too so sometime i can even at home i do i will paint a canvas just the background and just let it sit in the living room until i get an idea
Speaker: Yeah, I don't have white canvas.
Speaker: What I do is I grab a canvas, I start mixing some colors, I'll make a background.
Speaker: And then I will stare at it.
Speaker: the color for even a week sometime until something and they're like there it is um but yeah it's it it is kind of interesting all sometimes we'll draw something and it won't be unfinished but it'll be sitting there where i can look at it for a week yeah uh until i can finish it yeah but sometimes it's never done so i love that i i feel like i think that's something i've been
Speaker: discovering is this idea of like, it's okay to kind of let it go and let things inside of you work themselves out.
Speaker: Um, and it's so counter to,
Speaker: the culture we're in where it's like you've got to hurry up and do this thing and always be productive.
Speaker: And I think I've noticed it for myself when I've been doing school because I've been doing Bible school.
Speaker: And so that is a time frame where it's like in a week I have to write a paper and research all this stuff.
Speaker: But a lot of times I've found if I just kind of read everything I'm supposed to and then I just let that sit and stir in me for a little bit and then I re-approach it in like three days...
Speaker: it has just breathed and sort of worked itself out.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And I find that in art too, like you said, if I'm just living with a character, like you'll just discover those things.
Speaker: And so building in or giving ourselves permission to take that time as artists and just as people, because that's kind of the same way with our emotions too, and figuring out what's going on inside of us.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We just need room to breathe.
Speaker: And I feel like.
Speaker: And that's what people talk about meditation.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: That's my meditation.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, a lot of people sit there and just relax and do the breathing exercise.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: They're really helpful.
Speaker: For me, meditation is, I can see a blank skateboard or canvas.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And my mind is just meditating and just trying to find that, trying to grasp that idea.
Speaker: There's something there that I'm trying to grasp and then suddenly just kind of,
Speaker: you know, it's a spark.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: And then you go with it and then it's like, yeah, that was the right thing.
Speaker: And sometimes you just sketch, you know?
Speaker: There's all there.
Speaker: Every artist is different.
Speaker: So there's people that will sketch, sketch, sketch until they get an idea.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Especially if you're working for somebody.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You have to do that.
Speaker: But if I'm not working for somebody, this is my own art.
Speaker: I will take the time.
Speaker: That's the beauty of it.
Speaker: I like how you say, let it breathe.
Speaker: For me, art is a life.
Speaker: And that's why I brought real things.
Speaker: Because the digital world...
Speaker: Sometimes you cannot touch that.
Speaker: You can't.
Speaker: But yeah.
Speaker: I love that.
Speaker: So one of the things you brought is a skateboard that you've painted.
Speaker: And I've seen some of your stuff at the Stray too.
Speaker: I don't know if you want.
Speaker: Yeah, we can hold it up.
Speaker: That are just these everyday objects that you've painted, which I always love to see.
Speaker: So when you get these things, is it like...
Speaker: Are you like, oh, I proactively know I want to do something on a skateboard sooner?
Speaker: Or is it more just like you come across it and you do just kind of let it sit and see what comes to mind?
Speaker: Yeah, so...
Speaker: I love the whole skateboard culture since I was a kid.
Speaker: You know, the whole thing of riding.
Speaker: I can't do tricks.
Speaker: I ride longboard.
Speaker: But just, you know, watching skateboarders.
Speaker: I grew up in Tony Hawk's age.
Speaker: We're all the same age.
Speaker: And just love the whole thing, that feeling.
Speaker: But when you see skateboard art, it's kind of plain.
Speaker: One of the things, I think I was messing around with a skateboard one time with ink.
Speaker: And actually it was for one of the kids that I was working at Westwood.
Speaker: He wanted me to, because he knew I was an artist, paint when I see skateboard.
Speaker: So I sanded the skateboard.
Speaker: And the skateboard, you know, that wood is different than the white paper.
Speaker: Right away, there's color in there.
Speaker: And the other thing I noticed with ink, it kind of looks like, you know, a tattoo in a way or a skin.
Speaker: And I didn't have to work that hard.
Speaker: Well, I did.
Speaker: But by himself, when I started applying the ink, it's almost like it was happening by himself.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, like the shading and all of that.
Speaker: It's like in the paper, you really have to be very clean about it.
Speaker: This one was the wood was soaking the ink.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: And then at the same time, I was using my fingers to push that in.
Speaker: So in a way, it felt like, I don't know, it was like becoming part of the skateboard.
Speaker: I like the whole idea that art has to look alive, you know.
Speaker: And somehow, it was just giving more...
Speaker: life to the skateboard that would you can feel that wouldn't you know have to send it so there's a lot of like that process you have to touch have to push with my finger laying so there's a lot of intentional stuff happening yeah that you don't see in digital art you know even though i went to school i did a lot of digital art um and even though i don't have any tattoos when i see tattoos it's like
Speaker: that ink in the skin in here is similar.
Speaker: There's something alive.
Speaker: This one
Speaker: Yeah, it kind of worked the same way.
Speaker: I'll sand the skateboard and just let it sit there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I have a fascination for birds.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: Different type of birds.
Speaker: Just the whole idea of flying.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: So I knew I wanted to include a bird, but he was not the first one.
Speaker: I started drawing her first.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: And this is based on some of the stories that I'm working on.
Speaker: I like to write short stories.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And...
Speaker: So for this one, it's kind of based on a story that I haven't finished writing yet, but I have drawings.
Speaker: And this story is...
Speaker: humans become birds.
Speaker: Once I get it done, maybe I'll share it.
Speaker: So that was the whole idea become this.
Speaker: The whole idea, you know, you got the idea of angels, but this one is a little bit different.
Speaker: It's like humans, it's like, I like all that kind of,
Speaker: magical world, kind of like Lord of the Rings, Narnia, fantasy, right?
Speaker: And in this world, at sunset, the birds will fly and their feathers will kind of cover all over the forest.
Speaker: And if you were around that, those feathers would kind of drop over you and then you will become one of the birds and you will fly with them.
Speaker: it's all fantasy.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I was like, I started working on doing the art first because I couldn't flesh out the story.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So she, she's one of the characters.
Speaker: She's one of the, the characters in the story.
Speaker: You know, this is one of the birds that's flying.
Speaker: You have the feather here.
Speaker: So some of my arts are based on my own personal stories that I wrote.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Or haven't finished yet.
Speaker: And people don't know that.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So I have a lot of art pieces that are connected.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: So actually this one have, um, I had it at the Stray.
Speaker: There's like three, um, graffiti drawings that I did and they all connected to the story.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And, um,
Speaker: And those, actually, the idea became, just having walked with my wife, right at dusk, twilight.
Speaker: Everything looks a little bit blurry and kind of magical.
Speaker: That's why people, you know, they talk about twilight, it's kind of magical.
Speaker: And I was telling my wife, we were going for walks, it's like, I wish I could paint, draw this.
Speaker: How can I draw this?
Speaker: And I did some drawings.
Speaker: where everything looks a little bit blurry and kind of like that twilight yeah time where everything's possible and a lot of people thought in back back in the days it's like that's a magical moment yep and it is magical because it the light will trick your eyes you know you you think you see things you know like people that they they thought they saw fairies back in the days like it was around twilight because your eyes were playing tricks yeah
Speaker: But, you know, playing with the imagination, it's like, how can I actually draw that type of light?
Speaker: And I didn't bring one of those drawings, but I did some playing around with graffiti and charcoal where I faded a lot of the charcoal where it kind of seemed a little bit blurry.
Speaker: And kind of that twilight hour, you know, time of minutes.
Speaker: I don't know how long it lasts.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And...
Speaker: I think I kind of captured it, but this story is happening during that time.
Speaker: It's just a magical moment.
Speaker: So that's the other way I approach art too.
Speaker: I will create stories in my mind while I write it down.
Speaker: Maybe I will never share the story.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But they're all connected.
Speaker: And this one is a series of stories.
Speaker: They're all connected.
Speaker: And hopefully one day I'll make a book.
Speaker: And that will be a book more for adults.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it will have illustrations like this.
Speaker: And there's a lot of books like that.
Speaker: They're like children books for adults.
Speaker: But they're illustrated books.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Graphic novel.
Speaker: But that was the idea of this one.
Speaker: It just kind of captures some of the characters.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's cool.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: That's awesome.
Speaker: So you started off in music.
Speaker: What was it that got you interested in visual arts and painting and that world?
Speaker: When I was in South America and Chile in school, I went to a Christian school.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: And you know, you always have that art class, but your art teachers are not like super artists.
Speaker: They're art teachers.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But we were lucky that when I moved to that school...
Speaker: The art teacher was an amazing artist.
Speaker: It was just, it blew my mind.
Speaker: And he just shared, like the first day he showed a picture with a charcoal drawing of shoes, leather shoes.
Speaker: They looked so real.
Speaker: You could see the leather, almost touched the leather and it was done with charcoal.
Speaker: And when I saw that, like the first time I saw like that type of art, you know, and I was just a kid, I was in,
Speaker: sixth or seventh grade, maybe.
Speaker: When I saw it, it's like, I really want to learn how to draw like that.
Speaker: And I think it was his class.
Speaker: You know, having a fine artist teaching you, sixth, seventh grade, it makes a huge difference.
Speaker: I mean, I was drawing before that.
Speaker: I like to draw cartoon, comics, in a way.
Speaker: My mom and dad told me that...
Speaker: I guess I won a competition when I was in first grade, which I don't remember.
Speaker: I have a vague memory.
Speaker: Maybe it's just an implanted memory when they tell you this story.
Speaker: So I always like...
Speaker: to draw but I was not good at it.
Speaker: But I think that class, just having a fine art artist teaching you and showing you fine art, it made a huge difference.
Speaker: So that was one of the things.
Speaker: That's where I started.
Speaker: Then I started trying to do portraits and things like that.
Speaker: And when we moved here, I was in high school.
Speaker: At the same time, I was able to take a lot of art classes in high school.
Speaker: The teachers were not fine artists, but they gave me the space to work on a lot of stuff.
Speaker: My classmates were great.
Speaker: And that was the thing.
Speaker: It's like always having the, I guess, the opportunity to meet people that actually were good.
Speaker: There was a comic artist in the school that...
Speaker: he was doing stuff like DC.
Speaker: And they were putting it in the school magazine.
Speaker: And when I was looking at his stuff, I was like, oh my goodness, he's doing some high school.
Speaker: And his stuff is like DC.
Speaker: I don't know where he's at now.
Speaker: He's probably working for comics.
Speaker: And I got to see his stuff right there.
Speaker: I keep bringing this back.
Speaker: You know, looking at art in the computer and your phone is not the same as looking at the real thing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And if you're an artist or you want to be an artist, go and look at the real stuff.
Speaker: Look at the fine art.
Speaker: Go to a museum, see a Van Gogh, see a Salvador Dali, Rembrandt.
Speaker: When you see the real thing, your brain can see the difference.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: and you can actually learn by looking at real painting.
Speaker: Looking at a digital picture, you don't get none of that information.
Speaker: You just see a flat image.
Speaker: And there's not much learning process.
Speaker: Your brain is actually getting more information from a real painting.
Speaker: And I think that was one of your questions you had, like you emailed me.
Speaker: It's like, that's one of my biggest recommendations is like, go and see real art in person.
Speaker: you will see the difference.
Speaker: It actually will inspire you and you can also learn from that if you take the time to look at it.
Speaker: Or hang out with artists.
Speaker: They're better than you.
Speaker: I remember that was one of my art teachers.
Speaker: Always hang out with people that are better than you because they will teach you.
Speaker: I went to Calma College and I remember my first year I met this guy
Speaker: I think he was like a year ahead.
Speaker: But his art was like way ahead of everybody in the class.
Speaker: He was an illustrator.
Speaker: And as soon as I started hanging out with him, just looking at his stuff, you know, and asking questions to do was super, super friendly.
Speaker: And he took the time to explain things.
Speaker: He was an animator too.
Speaker: He was a better animator than anybody.
Speaker: There's teachers.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I was having that conversation with my wife today.
Speaker: It's like, it was, that was my first year.
Speaker: When I was in my third, fourth year, it was the opposite.
Speaker: The new students were coming to me.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I was like,
Speaker: And when you realize that, it's like, so I am learning, you know, I am learning because now, you know, we're turning things around.
Speaker: But I remember like my first year, like I was looking at the other students, like they're so good, you know, I want to.
Speaker: And that's what some of the teachers, they'd like sit with them, ask them questions.
Speaker: And I was not a fine artist, so I was taking more of the illustrations, so we're a little bit more open to criticism.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Like that's the first thing they teach you.
Speaker: You have to learn to be criticized.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Fine artists, they have a hard time with that.
Speaker: because it's so personal.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's so personal.
Speaker: It's what was in my heart.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's one of the first thing I learned is like, you got to learn that because you will grow from that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And at the beginning, it's kind of like, oh my goodness, you're destroyed my heart.
Speaker: I know.
Speaker: But then you realize that's how you actually learn.
Speaker: And then, you know, teachers taking apart your drawings is like, you got to work on this.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: One of the things they did, it was amazing.
Speaker: It's like,
Speaker: We did live drawing, still live drawing.
Speaker: They will sit where you're sitting.
Speaker: Grab your drawing and compare it.
Speaker: And tell you, okay, this is what you got to do.
Speaker: So they actually sit where you're sitting.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And see the angle.
Speaker: The angle.
Speaker: Perspective, yeah.
Speaker: And then they'll actually fix.
Speaker: I'll show you how to fix it.
Speaker: But when you're seeing that, somebody's actually guiding you.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And the teacher will tell you, sometimes you have to learn how to see.
Speaker: The first year is you have to learn what you're looking at.
Speaker: But sometimes you don't know what to look the right angles or where to look because proportions were completely off.
Speaker: Drawings will take me forever.
Speaker: I remember one time they asked us to draw objects or toys, and I had some toys I was drawing.
Speaker: And because they're 3D, it's hard to draw something that's in front of you as 3D to 2D paper.
Speaker: It took me two, three days.
Speaker: And nowadays I can do that in like
Speaker: half hour, 15 minutes because you weren't learning.
Speaker: But that lesson of teachers sitting where you're sitting and guiding you is kind of like, you know, that walking with you, kind of going back to all these things with mental health.
Speaker: Like, it's very important.
Speaker: All that stuff is like real important.
Speaker: Like somebody wants to be a better artist.
Speaker: It's like you actually, if you want, if you want to form an education, yeah, if you can afford it, do it.
Speaker: If you can't afford it, hang out with artists.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because they will sit with you and they will show you how to do things.
Speaker: And I love that idea of the first year you're just learning to see.
Speaker: Which again, I feel like connects back to what we were saying about...
Speaker: giving it space to breathe, letting it be slow.
Speaker: But I feel like for every art, like I think about myself as an actor and early on, I'm like, oh, I just want to make people cry.
Speaker: If I could make an audience member cry, then that's like, I'm winning.
Speaker: And it's like, okay, but before you do that, you have to like,
Speaker: Learn how to just understand people and listen to the other actors on stage.
Speaker: And see the other actors.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's just this slow, untangling process that initially you're like, but I want to do the cool thing.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But giving yourself that time to just learn to see the world around you and slow down and develop.
Speaker: Be patient.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: is so important for artists and people in general.
Speaker: And I always have to relearn that, I feel like, because I always want to hurry up.
Speaker: Well, think about Jesus.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: 33 years.
Speaker: He was a carpenter.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: He didn't come to this world to be a carpenter.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: He took his time.
Speaker: So even that's like the biggest example of to be patient.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, it's like when you as soon as you say that, that came to my mind.
Speaker: It's like he 33 years, you know, Van Gogh started painting when he was an adult.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But yeah, I.
Speaker: I love the whole idea of acting too.
Speaker: Like when I was a kid too, I love all that.
Speaker: I can't memorize lines.
Speaker: But yeah, you have to be patient.
Speaker: You have to take the time.
Speaker: The other thing is like, if you want to be a better artist, and that was one of the questions you emailed me, is anybody can be an artist.
Speaker: The biggest difference between a good artist and...
Speaker: and a so-so artist is how much time you spend drawing.
Speaker: People are not willing to do the work.
Speaker: So, I mean, first two years in school,
Speaker: The amount of drawing that we did, it was insane.
Speaker: I never drew so much in my life.
Speaker: I mean, in a week, I have to do like, I don't know how many drawings that they will tell you like, okay, I want you to do sketches per day, about 20.
Speaker: And then you do finished drawing about two.
Speaker: And then you're doing over 100 drawings a week or more.
Speaker: That process, you know, your hand is working, your brain is working, and suddenly, second year, it clicks.
Speaker: It's almost like all those wheels were separated, you know, and that learning process, that coming together, and suddenly it just clicks.
Speaker: You have to put the work.
Speaker: You have to actually do the work.
Speaker: That's the, a lot of people tell me, like, I don't know how to draw.
Speaker: I'm never going to be a good artist.
Speaker: How many drawings have you done in your life?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If you haven't done over a hundred, a thousand, yes, you have to do the work.
Speaker: And that's with everything in life.
Speaker: If you want to be good at it, you actually have to do the work.
Speaker: And a lot of people, a lot of new artists, they give up too quick.
Speaker: Well, I did five drawings.
Speaker: I'm not good at it.
Speaker: five you yeah after you do 100 or 200 maybe yeah but you still gotta keep going um any any type of art you have to practice if you're a musician how many hours you're gonna put to be a musician i i'm a guitar player i i used to spend when i was younger
Speaker: I don't know how many hours a day playing the guitar, playing the guitar, playing the that.
Speaker: Because I loved it so much.
Speaker: But people ask me how, why you became so good at guitar.
Speaker: I play like five, six, seven hours a day.
Speaker: It's the same with art.
Speaker: Most people don't, they don't want to spend that amount of time because I guess,
Speaker: You have to be passionate about it, but if you want to be an artist, do the work.
Speaker: I mean, I guarantee if I'm looking at a picture over there beside Captain America, is that a kid's drawing?
Speaker: Which, oh, which kind of, what is it?
Speaker: It's a little picture in the blue.
Speaker: It's a stick figure.
Speaker: Oh, this guy.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, okay.
Speaker: So, it's actually Hitler and there's a background to that.
Speaker: So, I have...
Speaker: My wife drew that.
Speaker: She actually is a good drawer, but she drew me a little stick figure Hitler because I have an action figure of the original, like Captain America costume and his first cover, he's punching Hitler.
Speaker: So when I was setting this all up, I like put him in the punching pose and I was like, I don't have a Hitler action figure for him to punch.
Speaker: So she drew that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I want to use that example.
Speaker: If you ask somebody to draw like an adult and they draw like
Speaker: it looks like a kid's drawing.
Speaker: That's the age they stop drawing.
Speaker: It doesn't get better.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, and I've done that experience with people, like they,
Speaker: So I taught a few classes.
Speaker: I'm not professionally trained to teach, but people ask me to teach drawing classes.
Speaker: And people start drawing.
Speaker: And then you can see the drawing.
Speaker: Okay, it looks like probably you stopped when you were 8 or you were 10 or you were 5.
Speaker: When was the last time you drew?
Speaker: If you remember when you were a kid, you probably used to draw.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: in a certain age you stop.
Speaker: If you start drawing now, you're going to draw exactly the same when you stop.
Speaker: That is interesting.
Speaker: I'm thinking back, I just did Godspell and there was a couple stage pictures that I had so specifically in my brain that I wanted to try and draw them.
Speaker: And I hadn't drawn in a little while, but I used to like
Speaker: I loved superheroes, so my brother and I would draw, like, comic books and superheroes all the time and different things.
Speaker: And then eventually I was focusing on other things and I didn't do it as much.
Speaker: But I was, like, remembering and I was like, oh, I'm enjoying this.
Speaker: This is fun.
Speaker: But it was, like, it did look exactly like, and I don't know, I was probably, like,
Speaker: late middle school or junior high or something.
Speaker: But I'm thinking, I'm like, yeah, that would map like totally to exactly where my skill level was.
Speaker: Stop, yeah.
Speaker: That's when it stopped.
Speaker: So yeah, if you keep going, it gets better.
Speaker: So why Leonardo da Vinci?
Speaker: drawing looked like a master he never stopped and the amount of drawing he did it was ridiculous yeah you know if you if you think about it um i mean any uh the famous artists if you if you start looking at how many drawings they did that amount is ridiculous i mean it's hundreds and hundreds and i was telling my wife it's like i have a horrible memory i don't keep track of my art
Speaker: I have given away a lot of art, I have soul art.
Speaker: I forgot what I had done.
Speaker: And I want to start documenting because I see like in writing, oh, so-and-so made a hundred thousand drawings.
Speaker: I have no idea how many I've done.
Speaker: Because I lost track.
Speaker: But I want to start putting it in a book.
Speaker: Maybe take a Polaroid picture.
Speaker: I drew this, I give it to so-and-so.
Speaker: But yeah, it is important to whatever you like to master, whatever the art is, you actually have to work on it.
Speaker: Really put the work.
Speaker: I mean, it is possible.
Speaker: Anybody can draw.
Speaker: It's just how much amount you want to put to it.
Speaker: So if you want to draw like when you were 10,
Speaker: Yes, if you stop at 10, that's how I was going to stay.
Speaker: But if you're going to keep going and you want to draw like you went to college, to an art school, yeah.
Speaker: I wasn't that good when I entered Kendall College.
Speaker: my skill level was probably like a high school, you know, because I was still drawing high school.
Speaker: And then it made a huge leap from my first year to the fourth year.
Speaker: That training and amount of work you have to do, it is worth it.
Speaker: To me, it was worth it.
Speaker: Because even if I don't have a job, like,
Speaker: I would love to work for DC or Marvel, but I still have to do a lot of my art.
Speaker: I make my own books.
Speaker: I do my own designs.
Speaker: I create work for people.
Speaker: I create a lot of work for the church.
Speaker: I still use my skills, and I went to school for that.
Speaker: Not for my own personal things.
Speaker: It's to actually use it in every aspect of my life.
Speaker: So, yeah, if you can afford, you know, formal education, I highly recommend it.
Speaker: If you can, hang out with artists.
Speaker: They're better than you.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You're always going to learn.
Speaker: So, yeah.
Speaker: That's awesome.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We're getting close to our time here.
Speaker: So the last question, we've been talking about resources for people growing as artists.
Speaker: As far as people's faith, do you have resources or things you would recommend for them to deepen or grow in their Christian faith?
Speaker: A lot of people probably know this one.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And this is related to a lot of the purpose-driven life.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: A lot of people probably read it.
Speaker: People probably read it and they forgot about it.
Speaker: I remember reading it and then completely forgot about it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We used it in one of the programs with suicide ideation.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: It was hard because it was not a Christian program.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So...
Speaker: but I still used it and I bought copies and left it around so people wanted to read it.
Speaker: you know, the big question, what on earth am I here for?
Speaker: Asking those questions of your purpose in life is very important.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um, and this is a great book.
Speaker: I mean, you know, you can use it to study, you know, with somebody else or a group.
Speaker: I think this book is great not to read it by yourself, but to read it in a group.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And, and learn from each other.
Speaker: The, um,
Speaker: like i mean proverbs 11 28 right here says a life devoted to things it's a dead life a stump a god-shaped life is a flourishing tree so just that verse right there it's like that's the purpose you know you have to have a purpose in your life yeah if
Speaker: And sometimes, you know, you got to take that time to find a purpose.
Speaker: It can take you your whole life.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: But you have to be looking for that purpose.
Speaker: And sometimes, like, even, you know, if we relate this to art, if you don't know what your purpose is, you know, hang out with people.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Then maybe they have a little bit of idea what their purpose is.
Speaker: Or talk about it.
Speaker: You know, same principles, you know, hang out with somebody, with another artist, hang out with another Christian.
Speaker: Same principles.
Speaker: Like, you might find a purpose in life.
Speaker: This is a great book, like, to start reflecting on that if you feel you don't have a purpose in life.
Speaker: I mean, and this is going to go back to the Bible, too.
Speaker: So it's good.
Speaker: Sometimes we lose that, like, okay, I have the Bible.
Speaker: I don't know what to do with it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: like what book should i read sometimes you need like another guy to guide you to the bible i think this is a great one this one is in from my point of view it's related to a lot of the mental health and also christianism so yeah it's kind of like it's related a lot um i used this in the suicide ideation program i thought it was great um i used it at church i lit up
Speaker: like a small group with this.
Speaker: And it was an easy way to start communicating with people.
Speaker: I think we're all trying to find that purpose in life.
Speaker: But somebody, I don't know who posted on Instagram, it's like the whole thing about Jesus that he didn't come to this world to be a carpenter.
Speaker: What is his real purpose in life?
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: He came to this world to be a savior.
Speaker: And a lot of times we have jobs that are not our purpose.
Speaker: That's part of our life.
Speaker: But what are we here for?
Speaker: Maybe I'm not here to be an artist.
Speaker: Maybe something deeper.
Speaker: So I'm still searching purpose.
Speaker: And I think this also helps
Speaker: with that guy because if we're mixing mental health, there's good days, bad day, depression is real.
Speaker: Having
Speaker: a purpose or trying to find a purpose.
Speaker: Or maybe, you know, you talk about seasons, like what are you doing during this year?
Speaker: What is your purpose this year?
Speaker: Maybe you don't have to think about your full life.
Speaker: What is your purpose this year?
Speaker: And kind of set that goal.
Speaker: You know, that's going to be very helpful, like to keep pushing, you know.
Speaker: But also, you know, having that guide from God, like, okay, how can I accomplish this purpose?
Speaker: Is that the same purpose?
Speaker: purpose God is giving you though.
Speaker: Sometimes we try to... Yeah.
Speaker: We try and manipulate it a certain way.
Speaker: Manipulate our way.
Speaker: I like doing this.
Speaker: Sometimes your purpose is something you don't like doing.
Speaker: So, yeah.
Speaker: So this is one of the... I will say... I will recommend and I don't want to forget about this one.
Speaker: If you ever want to write a children book, this is a great one too.
Speaker: yeah take my diamond children books are very complicated it's a lot of work uh you would think like writing a novel is a lot of work children books are way more complicated because you you have to think about this is for a kid and we are an adult yep this one will give you a step by step uh my friend jeff billy he uh researched different book and found this lady in the internet
Speaker: And this book actually did all the homework for us, like how to go step by step, how to publish a book.
Speaker: That's awesome.
Speaker: Without like making all the mistakes you have to make.
Speaker: So it's a great book.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It will save you time.
Speaker: That's awesome.
Speaker: I mean, we spent a lot of time trying to figure out how to do it.
Speaker: And then when he found the book and we started reading the book, it's like...
Speaker: Here it is.
Speaker: Yeah, that's great.
Speaker: Somebody actually knows the steps.
Speaker: And it's very, very, very easy to follow.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So if you want to do a children book or a book, I recommend for people to write a book.
Speaker: This one works too.
Speaker: Awesome.
Speaker: Sweet.
Speaker: Well, thank you so much for coming on and chatting.
Speaker: This has been a really lovely discussion.
Speaker: Thank you for having me.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Appreciate your time.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: All right.
