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162. Empowered Voices: Grief, Politics, and Mental Health with Mary Hayashi
122 Plays10 months ago
Mary Hayashi is an award-winning author who is among this country’s most accomplished champions for diversity and women’s rights. As a national healthcare leader, public affairs consultant, non-profit director, and former California State Assemblymember, Mary has dedicated her life to serving America and its most vulnerable citizens.
Her book, Women in Politics: Breaking Down the Barriers to Achieve True Representation. “In this book, I hope to provide insight into the many facets of my life as a girl growing up in Korea; as an Asian American immigrant; as a survivor who lost her older sister to suicide; as a national health care advocate; as an elected official; and as an advocate for women’s rights. Each of these parts of my life has provided its own challenges, lessons, successes, and struggles, and the sum of these experiences has made me who I am.”
Mary has been the driving force behind meaningful reforms to expand the coverage of healthcare. She also established unprecedented partnerships in support of social causes that previously had no financial or public backing.
https://www.maryhayashi.com/about/
Episode Highlights:
- Mary shares insights from her book, "Women in Politics: Breaking Down the Barriers to Achieve True Representation."
- The book is not just about politics; it's a journey of self-discovery, inspiring women to chart their unique paths.
- Discusses her upbringing in South Korea, the loss of her older sister to suicide, and the impact on her life choices.
Contact Kendra Rinaldi to be a guest on the podcast or to inquire about coaching with her: https://www.griefgratitudeandthegrayinbetween.com/
Recommended
Transcript
Empowerment through Mental Health Advocacy
00:00:01
Speaker
And it's just a very difficult, I think, experience to process when you go through that process. And I think one of the appealing things about getting involved in mental health advocacy issues was that I always felt like I was doing something. Maybe this wouldn't help my sister, but it could help others. And that is such an empowering process. And at least it was for me.
Podcast Introduction: Grief, Gratitude, and the Gray in Between
00:00:32
Speaker
Hello and welcome to Grief, Gratitude, and the Gray in Between podcast. This podcast is about exploring the grief that occurs at different times in our lives in which we have had major changes and transitions that literally shake us to the core and make us experience grief.
00:00:55
Speaker
I created this podcast for people to feel a little less hopeless and alone in their own grief process as they hear the stories of others who have had similar journeys. I'm Kendra Rinaldi, your host. Now, let's dive right in to today's episode.
Meet Mary Hayashi: Author and Advocate
00:01:16
Speaker
Our guest today is Mary Hayashi, a distinguished author, health care leader, and trailblazer in the realm of public service. She has an upcoming book titled Women and Politics, Breaking Down the Barriers to Achieve True Representation. Not only does she explore the strides made by women in government, but she also delves into the deep,
00:01:41
Speaker
personal aspects of her life that have shaped her path. And that is primarily what we will be talking about today is the why she is passionate about the topics she advocates for and her own journey. So welcome, Mary. Thank you so much, Kendra. I love the title of your podcast. It's so amazing that you provide the safe space
00:02:11
Speaker
for people to come and, you know, grieve and reflect on their life journeys. And I just, I think what you're doing is amazing. Thank you for having me. I am grateful that you're here and grateful that you will be sharing your story. I got to read part of your book and I'm really excited to talk to you about
00:02:35
Speaker
the aspects of your life that you are passionate about. You touch about different subjects in your book, and you have different stories of different people within your book as well. But let's talk about your own story. Share with us your upbringing, please. Yes.
Journey to Advocacy: Personal Loss and Cultural Stigmas
00:02:54
Speaker
And this is my second book. I actually have another book that was published
00:03:02
Speaker
Now, 20 years ago, and it really centered around my upbringing and my sister's death and how we dealt with it. And when I got older, completed my education, I really wanted to dedicate my life's work to advancing mental health issues for others. As you mentioned, this book centers around politicians. What motivates women?
00:03:27
Speaker
to run for office. And there are a lot of barriers to overcome, but they still get involved and run for office. And when they are elected, they do amazing things. I really wanted to focus this book on sort of the why women run for office. And that's why my foreword in this book is written by Mario Hemingway. People ask me, this is about politics, but you don't have a politician writing the foreword.
00:03:57
Speaker
You know, I did that deliberately because, you know, Mariel, like me, you know, she lost family members to suicide and she became more vocal and active in social change because of her personal experience. And so even though the book is about women in politics, it's really about our journey and my journey
00:04:22
Speaker
and how it began and the book sort of providing women's platform to speak their mind. I also wanted to inspire younger women to realize that they can write their own life path and to see that we don't have to be
00:04:40
Speaker
controlled by our ethnicities or culture or background. Well, what I mean by that is, I mean, I'm not even supposed to be in politics. I was born and raised in a very small town in South Korea and moved here when I was 12 years old and I didn't speak any English. That same year, my older sister passed away, died by suicide six months prior to moving here. She was only 17 years old.
00:05:06
Speaker
And I had no idea what had happened to her. I mean, she's somebody that I shared a room with and looked up to. And she was such a, you know, I use this phrase, good girl throughout my book. And I think this is something that we can all relate to regardless of our, you know, ethnicity or family histories that, you know, women are supposed to be quiet and be good and get along and build consensus and not get into fights.
00:05:33
Speaker
And I think that the way we sort of, or the way I dealt with my sister's
Breaking Silence: Cultural Norms and Mental Health
00:05:39
Speaker
death really shows that I was a good girl. According to my culture, we weren't supposed to talk about a death or mental illness or any type of issues that have stigma associated with this and something that we talk about. So not even as a family, and that had a big impact on me.
00:06:00
Speaker
And I didn't know it then or I didn't know, you know, I mean, I did, I had no idea, but I, I grew up, even when I came here, my parents were like, you're going to get married before you become an old maid and you're going to get married before you're 21 and have children. That's what you're going to do. And I always thought that that was my life path until I went to Cal State Long Beach, took a class called women's studies was women's
00:06:27
Speaker
literature class and at first I didn't know what it was. I thought it was something that maybe would help me become a better wife or maybe a better homemaker. So I took this class and it turns out it was about you know feminist theories and
00:06:44
Speaker
what American women have done to change their life trajectory. And that was so inspiring for me. And after that class, I decided, you know what, I'm going to move up north, join my friends who are going to UC Berkeley, and just create a different life for myself.
00:07:06
Speaker
And so I, you know, in my book, I talk about sort of my own journey, which is to get into nonprofit work and, and just thinking about my sister's dad and how nobody really helped her.
Founding an Organization: Asian-American Women Focus
00:07:19
Speaker
And I couldn't help her. I really wanted to do something for her. And, and there were just so many people suffering in silence because of stigma and discrimination. I thought the best thing to do was to create an organization that could amplify
00:07:36
Speaker
Asian-American women and mental health issues. And so that's what I did. And that experience basically changed my entire career.
Political Path: Legislation for Suicide Prevention
00:07:48
Speaker
And even when I got into politics and even after I got elected, the first legislation that I authored was to create Office of Suicide Prevention for California. So even to this day, I mean, this is an issue that I continue to
00:08:05
Speaker
to work on. And I think what's really amazing about your show, and just kind of bringing it back to, you know, your own personal journey and your podcast is that, you know, whether it's politics or nonprofit, or, you know, even if you work in business, you know, we were all impacted by grief, and we're all influenced by, you know, like you said, the grain between, and we have had incredible
00:08:32
Speaker
professional achievements and a lot of things that I'm very proud of. But in the end, spaces like this allow me to come and talk about my grief and be honest about my family background and just have a conversation. So again, I really think that your podcast is just so perfect for this book, even though this isn't about politicians.
00:08:57
Speaker
No, it's about stories, the stories that shape us. And that is exactly what you share in your book. It's not only how your own story shaped your life and the choices you made, but also other women that you highlight in your book, as well as how it shaped their path as well. So let's talk about the aspect of then death by suicide and the mental health
00:09:23
Speaker
component that you're so passionate about. You were the commissioner on California Mental Health Services. Is that correct? Is that one of the things that you did? Tell us what kind of spaces. You mentioned you've done suicide awareness platforms as well. How did your sister's
00:09:46
Speaker
life and choices in her life and her death impact you to now create these different platforms. Yeah. So I think what's really tough about grief and losing somebody and somebody that you're close to is that you feel very helpless, especially if somebody dies by suicide, that's very hard because you don't know.
00:10:11
Speaker
And it's unexpected. And so, I mean, not that, you know, somebody dying of cancer is easy, of course not. But I think because we were, you know, and I was very young at the time, too, it's just, you feel like there's really, you know, you think, oh, should I have done something? Or could I have done something? And it's just a very difficult, I think, experience to process when you, you know, when you go through that process. And I think
00:10:39
Speaker
One of the appealing thing about getting involved in mental health advocacy issues was that I always felt like I was doing something.
00:10:49
Speaker
Maybe, maybe this wouldn't help my sister, but it could help others. And that is such an empowering process. And at least it was for me. And in my book, and I don't know if you got, this is sort of in the later chapter of it. I talk about mentors, you know, cause that's, that's a phrase. That's, that's a word that that is. We throw around. Yeah. We throw around very easy. And even though I interviewed 17 women, I interviewed one man and he was a mentor of mine.
00:11:19
Speaker
And I acknowledge in my book that many of these women that I interviewed in the book talked about having male mentors. And I thought that was important to highlight whether we like it or not. They are part of the solution for gender parity. And I had an incredible mentor and I was very lucky. He was a legislator and he had a family member who suffer from mental illness.
00:11:47
Speaker
And in the legislature, he championed some really amazing pilot programs and just amazing mental health work. And back then, this was what, 15 years ago or so, a lot of, you know, a lot of politicians didn't adopt, like they didn't really adopt mental illness as their platform. And so I thought, I thought that was really different, that he did that. And so, you know, when I worked for him, he
00:12:14
Speaker
approached me and said, you know, I'm thinking about sponsoring a statewide ballot measure that will tax millionaires 1% surcharge on their annual income to create mental health funding. And so those of you listening to this podcast, if you're a millionaire, I'm sorry, because it did pass. If you're in California, I apologize for that. But, you know,
00:12:43
Speaker
When Ronald Reagan was the governor, he closed a lot of the mental health hospitals. There was a lot of dysfunction, abuse. Also, he wanted to cut the budget. And that's when we had this huge influx of homelessness start. And he said, well, community-based programs will be better for mentally ill people. But that promise was never fulfilled by money.
00:13:09
Speaker
So this ballot measure was our opportunity to kind of fulfill that promise, more community-based, more compassionate mental health care. So I got to work on that ballot measure in 2004.
00:13:23
Speaker
And that experience really changed my path from working for nonprofit organizations to basically going inside the government and running for office. I mean, that experience was amazing. And because we were taking on millionaires, we didn't have a lot of rich people saying, oh, I'm going to donate to this ballot measure and help you. I mean, it was really just
00:13:53
Speaker
just, you know, very, very small budget. Um, and you know, there's 40 million people in California. It's a big state. And so you have to have a significant amount of money to run a statewide ballot measure. But
Ballot Measure Success for Mental Health
00:14:06
Speaker
we, we passed that and we won with a lot of grassroots help. And honestly, I think it was because everyone, everyone I met during the campaign had somebody, they know somebody who was impacted by mental illness.
00:14:22
Speaker
family, friend, friend of a friend, they knew someone who needed help. So after that passed, the governor appointed me to the commission that was set up to oversee the funding and approve, you know, county level grants. And so after that experience, I decided to run for office, and I apologize for this long-winded answer,
00:14:47
Speaker
that that commission was so significant in that we had on the commission people living with mental illness serve as commissioners. I mean, we really wanted to show that people with mental illness can get help and they can be treated and they could be leaders. And it was so important to show people that. And so it was incredible. It was an incredible opportunity for me to go out and help
00:15:16
Speaker
um, help organizations and we would, you know, we would get, you know, grant applications and we would, you know, review them and we, you know, approve them. And 20% of them set aside ballot measure money had to go to prevention and innovation. And so we were approving a lot of innovative, you know, ideas. People had ideas just to, to break down the stigma and
00:15:41
Speaker
There wasn't, nobody was really funding mental illness and mental health issues at that level. So that was an exciting time. Let's talk about that, the stigma. First off, let's talk about the cultural stigma in your upbringing since your sister died by suicide before you moved to the US, correct, in Korea? Yeah, in that same year.
00:16:02
Speaker
Yes, let's talk about your own culture and then also in the culture then that you guys then adopted to be your own. How do you see it having evolved in the years? Because it's been many years since your sister died by suicide. So would you share about that, please?
00:16:24
Speaker
The morning that my sister passed, she showed me these, she said, why don't you look at the trash can? She was a little bit weird. It was January 1st, 1980. And I was actually heading out to go see my friend. And she said, I want you to look at the trash can. And it had these sleeping pill packages in there. And I said, well, what did you do? And she's like, I really needed something.
00:16:53
Speaker
And she asked me, she said, don't tell anyone, don't tell dad. And so she wasn't quite right, but I left because as a good girl, you've got to keep the promise. And you were only 12 too, right? Yeah. You didn't know what that
Family and Cultural Shame: Erasing Existence
00:17:10
Speaker
was. Like, how would you have even put that connection there? Yeah, so I left.
00:17:17
Speaker
And, you know, it's on January 1st, basically, you know, we, we go to like our relatives homes and we, you know, we wish them like new year, sort of like, you know, wish and we bow and they give us money. That's kind of the tradition. New Year's is like a big deal. So I went out and I went to my friends and we were kind of, you know, going to go, we had plans to go visit my relatives, her relatives, and, um,
00:17:45
Speaker
I got a call from my cousin who said, you know, you need to come home right away. So by the time I got back, they've already, you know, and she, she hung herself and they've already got rid of the body. I don't know where it went. And my parents decided to burn everything like the photos.
00:18:07
Speaker
Like I actually have photos in my, in my first book, I have these pictures that I included where the sizing's all weird because they cut her out of the photos. It was one of those things where they want, they did not, my parents did not want to acknowledge that she ever existed. You know, that's kind of how they dealt with grief. You know, it was just so much shame. She brought so much shame and there's just, you know, there's this,
00:18:33
Speaker
I mean stigma doesn't even really describe it because there's like another layer of just an acceptance. It's, you know, you're not being a good girl if you divulge this kind of family's dirty secret kind of thing. So was her name ever mentioned again after, like her name, her birthday, her anniversary of her passing were those kind of moments of her own life ever.
00:19:01
Speaker
mentioned again in your family after her death? Would they acknowledge that it would have been her birthday or did they acknowledge not at all? No. So it's like completely erasing the person at that moment. Yes. So in my first book, I talk about the- What's the name of your first book, by the way? It's called Far From Home.
00:19:23
Speaker
Okay, and I have to read that one. Yeah, so that I mean, that really aligns probably a lot more with like the subjects that you've covered. And I saw some of the guests that you had in the past. But I mean, I do talk about it in this book, it's just more of
00:19:41
Speaker
in a like a summary, but the first book talks about all of this great detail. You know, my family decided not to ever mention her. I mean, my sister, I have another younger sister, we talked about her, you know, like, Oh, if she was like, what kind of mom do you think she would have been? I mean, like, and now those kinds of conversations, but like, we're not allowed to have her photos or discuss that she ever existed. So yeah, there was no funeral or anything.
00:20:11
Speaker
Um, we weren't even allowed to have our photos and all of our belongings were just gone. I mean, I don't know how, I mean, they were so fast because it only took me like 40 minutes to come back home from my friend's house and.
00:20:26
Speaker
Everything was gone. Her body was gone. Her belongings were gone. I can't even fathom. It's, yeah, but it's, of course, a different way of culturally and grief wise of how they dealt with it. And as we say, everybody grieves differently, not only individually, but also culturally. It's just expressed differently.
00:20:48
Speaker
grateful for you sharing that. But it must have been really hard as a 12-year-old suddenly just erasing your 17-year-old sister from your life in that way for you, that they erased her from your life. Right. And you don't really realize. I mean, you realize things much later. Because when I think back, it's just like, OK, I have to do what the parents tells
Silent Expectations: Good Girl Syndrome
00:21:14
Speaker
me to do.
00:21:16
Speaker
It's not like there's a choice. So the whole good girl kind of concept, in my culture anyway, we value girls who are silent. We celebrate silence as a strength. That's a strength, not talking about it. That's being a strong person.
00:21:39
Speaker
And so I, you know, for a long time, I think, you know, even on, even when I started my own organization and I was like 26 years old, I had no idea what I was doing, but I thought, you know, somebody needs to start talking about this. And I mean, until that point, like it was.
00:21:58
Speaker
I just felt really weird talking about it in public. It's just sharing with people. And when I shared it with friends when I was in my early 20s, I still remember I had a girlfriend who never called me back after that because she, and she was Korean, just like me, she just didn't want anything to do with me. And she just thought it was
00:22:28
Speaker
you know, like I was from like a really, you know, damaged, damaged. Yeah, damaged. Good. Yeah. And she just didn't want anything to do with me. So and this was, you know, this was here in America. And so a lot, you know, so we kind of carry those values with us, even if we're not in the home country, I think we tend to listen to our parents and you know, that was kind of our upbringing. And so think about
00:22:55
Speaker
One example that I give in the fundraising chapter is that we don't ask for money from strangers. As good girls, we don't do that. Who does that? But when you're running for office, you got to make cold calls. I mean, it's sales. You got to call people and ask for donation. And I had to do that, and I was just horrified. I mean, I had such a hard time making that transition
00:23:24
Speaker
Even though I had raised like $10 million for my nonprofit organization, that's different because I'm doing it for a cause. But can you write me a check? That was so hard. And my very first job when I moved up to San Francisco area during the job interview, they hired me. They hired me on the spot. But I didn't even ask them how much this job pays.
00:23:48
Speaker
Well, because in our culture, you don't talk about money. You don't talk about debt. You don't talk about money. And you're supposed to be grateful. If you're a good girl, you're just grateful for anything. And that's so Asian, too. And not to stereotype all of us, but that was my experience. And so when the HR person said, well, do you want to know how much this pays? I mean, I was so uncomfortable. And I remember just looking down, and I was like, OK.
00:24:14
Speaker
She's like, you know, this is an hourly rate and blah, blah, blah. And I was like, okay. You know, and it's just, I was just so not comfortable. So I went from that to, you know, when you run for office, I'm calling these mostly men donors who I've never met before, introducing myself over the phone and.
00:24:35
Speaker
asking for a contribution. And that was such a hard thing to overcome. But I did. How did you? Yes. Let's talk about that. How did you? Because that is, first off, that's like you're in your 20s at that point, probably, right? When you already start. Yes. Around your 20s. So for 20 some years, you're living this good girl type of persona that you've been
00:25:01
Speaker
Basically, how do you indoctrinate it to be, right? That is your culture. That is how you are. And breaking away from that, because so many of us carry things of our own identity that are just part of it, either because of culture or because of our parents or the, yeah, whatever, different things, stigmas around society.
00:25:25
Speaker
And to break away from that, that takes so much strength and courage. So how did you start chipping? I know you're saying little bits and stuff of it, but did you do a lot of personal growth and development or reading a lot of books? What were these channeling forces that helped you be able to really unleash who you are?
00:25:52
Speaker
So there's, so I want to make two points. One is that, you know, like I said in my book, and I'm quoting our first partner, Jennifer Newsom, you know, you can't be what you can't see. And I talk about these role models that I had and mentors.
00:26:11
Speaker
And other women of color leaders got out there and just started an organization, African-American women, Latina, Native American. And so I had very specific examples to follow. And the second thing I want to talk about is that I still catch myself. I ask myself, oh, am I taking too much credit for this? Or am I being too aggressive?
00:26:41
Speaker
Oh, is this okay? Is this okay to say in front of people? I still have those conversations with myself. It never goes away. And there's a phrase in my book that I love very much. I talk about how there's no magic moment in this. And I think it's true for grief too. There's no magic one moment.
00:27:07
Speaker
You know, but it's just it's it's ongoing thing. It's just an ongoing process growth. And, you know, because even to this day, like I would be in a meeting and I'll self check. Oh, I shouldn't take too much credit. I shouldn't be too aggressive because women are not supposed to be ambitious. You know, I should give credit to somebody else.
00:27:29
Speaker
I mean, those are like the good girl training that I got when I was a child. And so even though I'm in my mid fifties, I still have those questions. And so that's one thing to kind of remember is that there is no magic moment, unfortunately.
00:27:44
Speaker
Sorry. No, it's a journey. No. No, no, no. You said it actually perfectly. It started chipping away because, one, you started seeing other women, like you said, of color, of other nationalities, minorities representing and speaking up. And then you're having this example of what it could look like to speak up for yourself. So that was one of the things that were a catalyst for your change.
00:28:10
Speaker
Yeah, of course. Then once you start getting into politics, like you said, you just kind of had to start asking for money or things like that. Now, let's talk about women then. Since the title of your book is Women in Politics, you started aligning yourself with different women as well as men that were your mentors and such.
00:28:33
Speaker
Let's talk about the role of women and even the, because you mentioned this a little bit, the aspects of motherhood in politics. Yeah. So this is another thing that I discovered during my research for this book. Many women, because I've asked everyone that I interviewed, like, why did you run? And studies have shown that women run for office to solve problems. I mean, it doesn't mean that men do not.
00:29:03
Speaker
But for men, it's more about leadership. And women start their own business because they want to have that flexibility. They want to be able to pick up their kids and be available to people. They want more of that in their life. Whereas men, when they start their own business, it's because they seek a leadership position. Oh, I want to own my own company. I want to make more money. I want that leadership spot.
00:29:31
Speaker
very in that sort of similar way in politics, women run for office to solve problems. And one of the things that I asked everybody is like, Oh, so what, you know, what motivated you? And almost everyone talked
Motherhood and Politics: Female Experiences
00:29:46
Speaker
about being a mother and how that influenced their decision to run. And I don't have children. So this was very interesting to me. And
00:29:55
Speaker
I struggle a little bit writing about the motherhood chapter just because I don't have a personal experience of being a mom. I'm an auntie, but I think that's very different because I don't really need to worry about their problems 24-7 like their mothers do. But I start the chapter with a woman asking me at a training, candidate training. She asked me,
00:30:23
Speaker
Can I run for office if I have small children? And I thought it was like, well, yeah, of course you can. There's so many examples. But I didn't want to tell her the truth. I said, yeah, you can. But I didn't follow that up, which
00:30:42
Speaker
but you're going to have really hard time because of gender bias. And, you know, there are just, although it's a fuel, it's a motivation for women for running for office, like Cindy Ru from Washington, she says she came home and complained about city council's decision on some land use issue. And the daughter said, mom, stop, you know, stop complaining and do something.
00:31:08
Speaker
And that really motivated Iran to solve that problem. And so there's so many examples like that where, you know, women use motherhood and their role in, you know, in their home and in the larger society for greater good. And I just thought that it's almost like a qualification, you know, and I need to write about this. And so, you know, motivation for running, there's that.
00:31:35
Speaker
Now, we also experienced, you know, double standard. Congresswoman Grace Meng, you know, she talked about how she, you know, took her kids to like a community event on the weekend and a voter confronted her and said, I didn't vote for you. So you could be a babysitter. Meaning like, why did you bring your child? But when this happens with a male legislator, people often say, Oh, that's so great. What a great dad. Great example.
00:32:06
Speaker
you know, showing his kids how to be a leader. And so that gender bias and that double standard is very tough for women in politics. And being a mom is, it's tough. And it's not just the, you know, the time and the obligations and the responsibilities, but what the society sort of expects women to be, and we still have that bias about
00:32:33
Speaker
oh, who's cooking the dinner if you're doing this? That kind of mentality still exists. And so it makes it tougher for women. One of the women in the book that I really enjoyed getting to know is Florida Senate Minority Leader Lauren Book. When she got to the Senate, she was very young. She's still in her mid-30s, I think.
00:33:00
Speaker
asked her like, Oh, you should run for the Senate leader position that's going to be available. You should be the leader. And one of the, you know, one of the men in the caucus said to her, you just had, you know, you just delivered like two small babies, like twins, you know, and you can't lead, you can't possibly do this job. And that those kinds of comments are never directed at men, but very much directed at women leaders.
00:33:27
Speaker
And I think women experience that in the business, too. This is no different anywhere else. But I just think that it is, yes, we can overcome. You can still run for office. You could still be a CEO. But we've got a lot of work to do. We've got a lot of education to do. We have women still experience discrimination and double standards. So I really wanted to write about that, even though I'm not a mother personally.
00:33:57
Speaker
I thought that was an experience that was commonly sort of talked about among all the women I interviewed. Thank you. Thank you for sharing that.
Mental Health in Politics: Gender Biases
00:34:05
Speaker
Now, how does mental health play a part in women that are in politics?
00:34:11
Speaker
Do you notice anything? Because of all these double standards as well, is there more of this pressure in women, do you feel, in politics of what you've observed and with mental health in general? Well, I love this quote. I didn't use it in my book. Women's courage is often misunderstood as crazy or something. I think
00:34:40
Speaker
There's this bias that women are not strong. There's already this, the minute you announce for candidacy, like people are like, oh, you know, is she strong enough to lead? You know, is she strong enough to do this job? That's kind of on the voter's mind that gender bias still exists today. And so, you know, when you're strong, and when you show ambition, and when you're aggressive, then there's also that, oh,
00:35:09
Speaker
You know, I don't really like her. I don't like that. She is, you know, she's aggressive and she's really ambitious. And women get penalized for that. Men, they don't because they're expected to be ambitious and they're expected to seek leadership position. I mean, Bill Clinton said he wanted to run for president because he met JFK. That was his reason. But women can't have reasons like that because we're not supposed to be ambitious. So that, yeah, so that gender bias still plays a role.
00:35:38
Speaker
and women in politics. And it's difficult. It's a very delicate balance. We have to be likable to win. But then if we show our ambition or if we're aggressive, then people don't like us. The voters don't like us because our behavior run contrary to their stereotype of what a woman should be.
00:35:58
Speaker
And so it's a, but then we can't be weak because we've got to be strong and we need to show that we can lead. And so it's hard. And I'm not a psychologist, but I'm sure that has impact on women. Now, what are things that you see help us as women to really support our mental health?
00:36:21
Speaker
some tips in your experience of working in this field of mental health awareness and suicide prevention as well. What are some things that we can do to really support our mental health? Not just as women, as everybody, but I mean, I was just saying if you have a speaker or something. Yeah. Well, it's an important question because we do need that. We need something to use as a guide.
00:36:50
Speaker
One thing that I found kind of troubling during the research part is that women don't always support women. You know, it's, we should, if women voted, I mean, just as an example, and I'm not trying to be like partisan, but Hillary Clinton was the first women, you know, Democratic nominee for president, but she didn't win, even though
00:37:16
Speaker
51% of the voters are women. So women don't always vote for women. Women don't always support women. It's because some women still have that gender bias. They were raised to be good girls, and so they think that's kind of how they also have that sort of view.
Women Supporting Women: Overcoming Bias
00:37:37
Speaker
And so one thing that I like to ask is people to kind of check their bias. Do like an inventory.
00:37:45
Speaker
don't have to write about it or blog about it. But you know, we all have these biases. And I think it would be nice if people could realize that, you know, Asian women aren't gonna like we're not that the stereotypes are, you know, we have to be quiet and grateful and quiet and all of that. But it's, that's not necessarily who I am. And that should be okay. But
00:38:11
Speaker
When I was in the legislature, I didn't feel like all women supported me. They haven't really dealt with Asian women as colleagues before. And so they had a really hard time, like, oh, wow, she's so aggressive. Because I mean, I can be aggressive, but I'm not aggressive. Assertive. Assertive. It's assertiveness. It's assertiveness. It's very different, right? You would be surprised. People would just constantly criticize me for my style.
00:38:40
Speaker
It didn't matter like if I was doing something good, they were so focused on the style. And women do that. We judge other women by their style and not by substance. And men do that too. So we really need to rethink some of these gender bias issues and be open.
00:39:05
Speaker
People confused me and another Asian women legislator. I mean, there's only two of us, for God's sakes. And it's like, we go to work every day and people still confuse us, you know, for like six years. And when I was doing the research, I found out that that really takes an emotional toll because it says that I'm not important. I'm not worth kind of remembering. You know, I think, yes, we need tools ourselves, but
00:39:33
Speaker
I really wanted to highlight in my book that we all have bias, and we need to we need to support other women. You know, and for us, you know, so let's start let's let's change like from here. You know that that not all women are the same, you know, we need to be more open minded about age, like Asian women in leadership. I mean, we still have no Asian women
00:39:56
Speaker
CEO running Fortune 500 company, because we're not seen as leaders. And so those kind of bias really hurt people. And so that's kind of my suggestion. You know, I know you're looking for some quick guides to help with grief, but
00:40:16
Speaker
I had a lot of time to reflect on my service, you know? Yes. No, it's your personal perspective. So that's the thing. It's like, what is your perspective on this matter? And it's all so valuable because other people will relate to the words and your experience as well. Because just like what you're saying, representation matters. In this podcast, that's what I try to also share, is different viewpoints, different ways of life.
00:40:45
Speaker
different life experiences, not only just in grief, but of the individuals dealing with the grief, because that way people that are listening can relate. And in this case too, it's like your grief, your story was part of the catalyst to get you to who you are and what you do now and the advocacy
00:41:07
Speaker
that you do now. Thank you for everything you do to highlight and support mental health and bring awareness to this issue as well as suicide prevention as well. Thank you for that. Thank you for that.
00:41:24
Speaker
mentioned one other thing. I interviewed Amanda Hunter from the Barbara Lee Family Foundation and they, you know, they work on electing more women to executive level positions, which is really hard, like governors and mayors. They did some focus group research and asked participants to picture a governor and an overwhelming majority envision a man.
00:41:51
Speaker
And that includes women as well, like women focus group participants also envisioned a man. So when we talk about gender bias, we really, it's, it's, it's just not, it's just not men versus women thing. You know, women supporting other women and just showing more compassion, you know, toward each other, I think would go a long way.
00:42:15
Speaker
But it also comes to what you were even just saying for yourself, for your own upbringing of certain stereotypes or standards that are end up kind of putting into your subconscious from your upbringing in this country and other probably countries too.
00:42:31
Speaker
It's these, you know, we don't even know how indoctrinated we are ourselves, to then even as women, to then, like what you said, if they put, oh, what do you picture your governor to be that automatically put a male? Because again, we might have not seen enough representation out there of other women that are mothers, that are juggling all these things that maybe look like us.
00:42:59
Speaker
that have done it, right? So that's why a lot of times I think these kind of biases continue is because we don't break away from the cultural patterns that we are brought up into. Of course.
00:43:18
Speaker
It's not just, I mean, this is, you know, this, we're talking about at an individual level, but there's many structural systemic barriers that women experience. So not to excuse, you know, these, these biases that exist within our systems. I mean, think about how much wealth we've lost because of unequal pay, you know, for equal work. I mean,
00:43:43
Speaker
So there are lots of barriers, but just like on an individual level, when you asked like what we could do, I really, you know, I think it would be great if women could support other women and more of that is certainly welcome.
00:43:59
Speaker
Yeah. You know, we focus a lot. Like I even was saying to my husband, just even this week, we had been with family and we were trying to pick a restaurant. I'm like, can we please pick a, let's pick a local restaurant. Like we make conscious choices sometimes to say, oh, let's pick a local restaurant. Like not a chain. What if we also say, let's pick a women owned business to purchase from this week or, you know, or support a women, different things like that. Those are ways in which we can support.
00:44:29
Speaker
women as well or in politics, the same. If you see a woman on the ballot, investigate. Investigate. Not only just vote because she is a woman or because somebody is a man or whatever, really look into what each person offers
00:44:47
Speaker
and see that don't automatically check somebody out because of their gender if by chance you have gender biases that you've kind of been brought up to kind of hold onto. So that is important. And those are the little things that we can do to start implementing changes to not just automatically
00:45:08
Speaker
choose just one way just because that's what we've always done, right? Right. So yeah, that's great. It's funny, like your last talking points is actually in my book, so that's good. You're aligned. Let's talk then now about your book. How can people get your book? Mary, please share with the listeners. Yes.
00:45:32
Speaker
You know, it's it's on Amazon, but I always like to promote other retailers as well, especially bookshops.org. They actually contribute to your local bookstores, brick and mortar. So that's a great place. It's also available on Barnes and Noble and Apple and Google and
00:45:54
Speaker
all the other retailers. And I thank you for this opportunity to talk about the book. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for coming on to talk about it. And again, to allow me to ask you more about your own personal journey.
00:46:10
Speaker
that had to do with grief that led you to write this book. But it's the first time I hear about the Bookshop. What is it? Bookshop.com or Bookstore.com? It's Bookshop.org. It's the first time I ever hear about that website. So thank you for that. That's a great one to have in mind.
00:46:28
Speaker
And again, this is Mary Hayashi and her book, Women in Politics, Breaking Down the Barriers to Achieve True Representation. And her previous book, Far From... I can't understand my home. I can't understand my own writing. That was her first book. I saw some used copies on thriftbooks.com, I think.
00:46:55
Speaker
of your other book? Yeah. They were super cheap and they were available. I think they were used copies because it's out of print. It was 20 years ago, so it was available at bookbooks.com. Yeah. Perfect. Well, thank you. Is there anything I have not asked you, Mary, that you'd like to share or any other way in which people can get
00:47:18
Speaker
a hold of you or check any other things and initiatives that you have, your website, of course, all that I'll put in the show notes, but is there anything else you'd like to share with the listeners? Well, I want to just end with, I really want the book to inspire people to create their own life path.
00:47:46
Speaker
regardless of their family background or ethnicity or histories, that women can create their own life path. And so I hope that message came through today. And again, I really enjoyed this and appreciate the opportunity to be on your show. Thank you. Thank you so much, Mary. Thank you once again.
00:48:13
Speaker
Thank you again so much for choosing to listen today. I hope that you can take away a few nuggets from today's episode that can bring you comfort in your times of grief. If so, it would mean so much to me if you would rate and comment on this episode. And if you feel inspired in some way to share it with someone who may need to hear this, please do so.
00:48:41
Speaker
Also, if you or someone you know has a story of grief and gratitude that should be shared so that others can be inspired as well, please reach out to me. And thanks once again for tuning into Grief Gratitude and the Gray in Between podcast. Have a beautiful day.