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PGW 28: Folksy Horror with Kat! + THE EXORCIST 3
4 Plays1 year ago
Our dear friend Kat is back with three folk horror films for the boys to discuss. This episode gets pretty strange, but what else do you expect from Folk Horror?!
After Kat says goodbye, the fellas discuss Joe's pick for horror month, The Exorcist 3.
Just a heads up this episode contains some discussion of assault and assault involving minors. 70's British horror was wild.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Paddington Godwild Podcast
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome to Paddington Godwild, the internet's only podcast about spooky Bob Dylan songs.
00:00:05
Speaker
I am one of your hosts, Saret Rankin, joined as always by my illustrious co-hosts.
00:00:09
Speaker
This man saw Goody Proctor with the devil, Joe.
00:00:12
Speaker
What's up?
00:00:14
Speaker
Our resident voodoo priest, Zach.
00:00:16
Speaker
Who?
00:00:18
Speaker
Who?
00:00:20
Speaker
Lichen Enthusiast Austin.
00:00:22
Speaker
I love a lichen.
00:00:23
Speaker
I love it when it's all over all my flowers.
00:00:25
Speaker
Not just one.
00:00:26
Speaker
All of them.
00:00:27
Speaker
All of them.
00:00:28
Speaker
As soon as I get to stop writing No Change, I'm happy.
00:00:32
Speaker
And our returning special guest and the woman who came up with the idea for B-Headgear.
00:00:36
Speaker
Our friend Kat is back.
00:00:38
Speaker
Kat, thank you for being here.
00:00:41
Speaker
If you already said lichen, but I was going to say also goes by the lichen on your midriff, but that was already taken.
00:00:48
Speaker
Yeah.
00:00:48
Speaker
The lichen on your midriff is really good.
00:00:50
Speaker
It's a sick tat idea just to get a bunch of lichen tattooed across your torso.
00:00:57
Speaker
Sounds like it hurt.
00:00:58
Speaker
Pretty great.
00:00:59
Speaker
It'd be a fun tattoo to explain like, oh, what's that?
00:01:02
Speaker
What is that?
00:01:02
Speaker
Oh, it's from this movie, Innesmen.
00:01:04
Speaker
And they're like, what?
00:01:06
Speaker
Check it out.
00:01:07
Speaker
You're going to love it.
00:01:08
Speaker
It's like, I don't know.
00:01:10
Speaker
So I don't know what happens in it.
00:01:11
Speaker
There's like a rock.
00:01:14
Speaker
She gets like in her stomach.
00:01:17
Speaker
And she drops rocks.
00:01:18
Speaker
I don't know.
00:01:20
Speaker
It's a movie about a woman dropping rocks down a well for an hour and a half.
00:01:23
Speaker
Best of luck to you.
00:01:24
Speaker
Cool.
00:01:25
Speaker
Go have a great day.
00:01:26
Speaker
Can we intro a little bit of what we're talking about today?
00:01:29
Speaker
No.
00:01:30
Speaker
It's true.
00:01:30
Speaker
I do have so many questions about where we're going with this conversation.
00:01:34
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:01:35
Speaker
So today's episode, we are back for another horror centric pod in Horror Month.
Exploration of Folk Horror Films
00:01:39
Speaker
Kat has graciously assembled a list of three folk horror films.
00:01:43
Speaker
Yeah, I thought we were just going to be talking about the trailer to what's the Bob Dylan movie called?
00:01:49
Speaker
A Complete Unknown?
00:01:51
Speaker
A Complete Unknown.
00:01:52
Speaker
But you spoiled that with your intro, Red.
00:01:54
Speaker
I'm sorry.
00:01:54
Speaker
You had the number of my bit and I'm mad.
00:01:58
Speaker
The scariest Bob Dylan song is Hurricane.
00:02:00
Speaker
It's because he says the N word.
00:02:01
Speaker
He says the N word in Hurricane.
00:02:03
Speaker
It's not great.
00:02:03
Speaker
Hard R.
00:02:04
Speaker
yeah with i mean to be fair he was quoting a cop he was quoting yeah he's yeah but still not great we'll talk about racist cops later on in this episode yes we will we will indeed and uh we'll talk about three folk horror films that cat has uh assembled that are we all totally enjoyed and all loved and don't have any hot takes about after that say goodbye
00:02:26
Speaker
And then the boys are going to discuss William Peter Blatty's The Exorcist 3.
00:02:30
Speaker
Yeah, baby.
00:02:31
Speaker
So, Kat, I have to ask just a couple of questions.
00:02:35
Speaker
First off, why folk horror?
00:02:38
Speaker
Oh, man.
00:02:40
Speaker
I was hoping you weren't going to ask that.
00:02:44
Speaker
For me, I was actually doing some reflecting in traffic on I-35 on the office that you would ask me.
00:02:55
Speaker
And so my really simple answer that's also not so simple is that why full core number one?
00:03:01
Speaker
Because I'm from the Ozarks.
00:03:05
Speaker
If you know anything about full core, one of the themes is isolation.
00:03:10
Speaker
Like,
00:03:11
Speaker
because of your environment.
00:03:13
Speaker
And so like the Ozark Mountains, really similar to Appalachia.
00:03:16
Speaker
I'm thinking specifically like American Fulcour, like where, yeah.
00:03:20
Speaker
So the connection is there.
00:03:22
Speaker
Number two, Fulcour in terms of, um,
00:03:26
Speaker
just like cults, I guess, or being in a community that's slowly losing its marbles.
00:03:33
Speaker
Red, looking at you.
00:03:36
Speaker
We've all dipped our toe in some religious cults here and there.
00:03:41
Speaker
Yeah, Red and I have shared history there.
00:03:44
Speaker
And so I truly, I think that my interest has
00:03:48
Speaker
like surged as I have been in therapy for the last five years.
00:03:52
Speaker
Sure.
00:03:53
Speaker
Sure.
00:03:54
Speaker
We're both at the Waco standoff.
00:03:59
Speaker
They were both correct.
00:04:00
Speaker
Like David Koreshians.
00:04:01
Speaker
They were both.
00:04:02
Speaker
Yeah.
00:04:02
Speaker
We were seven.
00:04:04
Speaker
Yeah.
00:04:04
Speaker
Red was in David Koresh's band.
00:04:07
Speaker
He played triangle in David Koresh's band.
00:04:10
Speaker
Yeah.
00:04:11
Speaker
And cat fired the first shot, hit a officer right in the damn head.
00:04:15
Speaker
Oh,
00:04:18
Speaker
Wait, why is the ATF logging into Zoom?
00:04:20
Speaker
Oh, shit.
00:04:21
Speaker
Fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck.
00:04:24
Speaker
That was good.
00:04:25
Speaker
Okay.
00:04:25
Speaker
So we got to hear a little bit from you, Kat, about what draws you to the genre.
00:04:29
Speaker
And so then I wanted to ask, specifically, to give a little backstory, Kat sent...
00:04:35
Speaker
I don't know, 10, 12 movies that you were like broken down into categories.
00:04:40
Speaker
And correct me if I'm wrong, the three categories we were going for, like, Asian folk horror, something more contemporary, and then British folk horror.
00:04:47
Speaker
Was that right?
00:04:48
Speaker
Okay.
00:04:50
Speaker
So then broken down to those three categories.
00:04:52
Speaker
And then we kind of decided on these three movies.
00:04:54
Speaker
So why these three?
00:04:57
Speaker
And then I think we just go ahead and go into our first movie.
00:05:02
Speaker
Yeah, real quick, I wanted to do categories too.
00:05:06
Speaker
Folkore is like a new term, not necessarily a new genre for like literature or media, but I think the term has been around since the 70s.
00:05:14
Speaker
And so I wanted to do, and folkore can look different depending on the region that it's done.
00:05:21
Speaker
And so also it's such a loose term, like there's not like a one size fits all for folkore.
00:05:26
Speaker
So for Modern, I wanted to do so that I'm so excited to get to be insufferable here.
00:05:32
Speaker
It's pronounced Inesmayne.
00:05:34
Speaker
It's Cornish, which is a really big part of this movie.
00:05:38
Speaker
So it's Cornish for Stone Island.
00:05:40
Speaker
Yeah, which essentially is the movie.
00:05:45
Speaker
Yeah.
00:05:47
Speaker
I like this one, yeah, because I thought personally, I thought it would be a little divisive.
00:05:52
Speaker
I like to view it as folk horror ASMR for however long it is.
00:05:59
Speaker
It is more contemporary.
00:06:00
Speaker
It's really recent.
00:06:01
Speaker
And then Asian, where the whaling comes in,
00:06:06
Speaker
Asian folk horror looks less like what we tend to think of folk horror as.
00:06:11
Speaker
It's more folklore centric, if that makes sense.
00:06:15
Speaker
And then I wanted to do, I mentioned last time I was on, there's like an, they call it the unholy trinity of like the first three movies that we deemed folk horror.
00:06:26
Speaker
And one of them was the blood on Satan's claw.
00:06:28
Speaker
And I felt like aside from the wicker man, which is an obvious one,
00:06:32
Speaker
I felt like the Blood and Satan's Claw kind of hits, has all the earmarks of like what we think of as like a traditional British folk whore.
00:06:39
Speaker
So yeah.
00:06:40
Speaker
Yeah.
00:06:40
Speaker
For sure.
00:06:41
Speaker
Excellent.
00:06:42
Speaker
Love it.
00:06:43
Speaker
So I also love that you corrected us and I will try to make sure to say.
00:06:48
Speaker
Corrected Joe more specifically, but yeah.
00:06:51
Speaker
No, I was going to say that in our heads, you son of a bitch.
00:06:56
Speaker
I read an explainer online and it had it phonetically written out.
00:06:59
Speaker
So I knew it was in this man.
00:07:00
Speaker
See, I got the I got the movie without reading an explainer.
00:07:03
Speaker
So I just wanted some help, you motherfucker.
00:07:06
Speaker
Shut up, Mr. fucking Baylor Film Digital Media Master's Degree.
00:07:10
Speaker
Yeah, let me find my Master's Degree really quick and see if... Yeah, let me shit into a diaper.
00:07:14
Speaker
It's worth as much.
00:07:17
Speaker
Actually, I think this shitty diaper is worth more.
00:07:18
Speaker
It's worth more.
00:07:20
Speaker
There's some very specific internet circles that would pay good money for that.
00:07:24
Speaker
That's very true.
00:07:25
Speaker
If it came from you...
00:07:26
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:07:27
Speaker
Not just anybody's shit.
00:07:28
Speaker
Not just anybody's shit.
00:07:30
Speaker
So Ennis Mane.
00:07:32
Speaker
Yeah.
00:07:33
Speaker
Ennis Mane!
00:07:34
Speaker
Is a film directed by Mark Jenkins, starring Mary Woodvine, about a woman who is on a stone island out in the middle of the ocean, and she is documenting flowers and...
00:07:51
Speaker
temperatures and dropping rocks.
00:07:53
Speaker
And it's, it's such an interesting thing because I, I think this movie, it feels very difficult to give what the elevator pitch is.
00:08:01
Speaker
Like if I had to explain it in a single sentence without turning into a run-on, I would feel conflicted.
00:08:08
Speaker
But in my experience watching the movie, I was like, okay.
00:08:13
Speaker
At about the 50-minute mark, I was like, I think I know what's going on here.
00:08:16
Speaker
And then at about the hour and 10-minute mark, I was like, I don't think I know what's going on here.
00:08:20
Speaker
And then at the hour 30 mark, I was like, okay, I think I like this flick.
00:08:24
Speaker
I think I dug it.
00:08:25
Speaker
Oh, yeah.
00:08:29
Speaker
Yeah.
00:08:29
Speaker
Oh.
00:08:30
Speaker
36-minute movie, it was an hour and 30, and I was like, yeah, I like this.
00:08:33
Speaker
Yeah.
00:08:33
Speaker
Yeah.
00:08:37
Speaker
I really liked it a lot, actually.
00:08:38
Speaker
I'm a big... I love...
00:08:44
Speaker
I have a weird sweet spot for movies where it either has to be trashy as fuck and just disgusting or raunchy or something, or it needs to be full-on... The trifecta is trashy, or full-on masterpiece-level The Apartment or Citizen Kane or Seven Samurai, or it needs to be completely...
00:09:09
Speaker
on an understandable visual metaphor and poetry with almost no, uh, almost no story.
00:09:16
Speaker
Yeah.
00:09:18
Speaker
What's up.
00:09:20
Speaker
And I said, that's why we like megalopolis.
00:09:22
Speaker
Yes, exactly.
00:09:23
Speaker
Um, not understandable.
00:09:25
Speaker
I, yeah, I, I was kind of similar to you, right?
00:09:28
Speaker
I, by the end, I was like, I think I, I think I dug that.
00:09:33
Speaker
About 30 minutes in, I texted everybody and I was like, I'm bored as all shit.
00:09:37
Speaker
Like, I don't know what the fuck is going on.
00:09:39
Speaker
But I love I love the super like the 16 millimeter photography.
00:09:43
Speaker
I like the use of the radio kind of filling us in on kind of like bits and pieces of history.
00:09:48
Speaker
I was like, that's kind of cool.
00:09:50
Speaker
And then when they showed up in like the speedboat with the fucking helicopter, I was like,
00:09:55
Speaker
what?
00:09:57
Speaker
Those weren't around in 1973.
00:09:59
Speaker
What's going on?
00:09:59
Speaker
Like, that's weird.
00:10:02
Speaker
And so I just kept like asking questions of it, but I liked that it kept asking me questions and kept asking questions of its audience and not really answering them.
00:10:13
Speaker
We can get to this in the whaling, but kind of one of my problems with the whaling, I didn't have many, was that it answered too many questions.
00:10:20
Speaker
And so we can talk about that later.
00:10:22
Speaker
But I did end up broadly liking it, even though I was pretty confounded throughout all of it.
00:10:29
Speaker
What to say about in this movie?
00:10:32
Speaker
I don't have anything bad to say about this movie.
00:10:36
Speaker
I have a lot of questions about it, though.
00:10:39
Speaker
I came away
Discussion on 'Inesmayne': Time and Trauma
00:10:40
Speaker
from this movie feeling like I appreciated that I felt like someone just finished reading Stephen King's The Shining and then took a vacation to a British island with a 16mm camera and just had some fun with it.
00:10:54
Speaker
Um, that's kind of what I took away from it.
00:10:56
Speaker
Like, I thought it was gorgeous, like photography, but I mean, I'm not going to pretend like I wasn't pretty bored for most of it, but I attribute a lot to that of like, I don't understand this movie at all.
00:11:10
Speaker
Like it was as basic as I thought it was, which means I probably didn't love it or I'm missing something.
00:11:17
Speaker
So I'm open to what y'all have to say about it.
00:11:20
Speaker
But yeah, really beautiful movie.
00:11:23
Speaker
Yeah, for sure.
00:11:24
Speaker
Yeah.
00:11:24
Speaker
Pat, did you rewatch before this podcast or was it, I mean, it's a recent enough release that-
00:11:30
Speaker
Well, I watched it like probably a month ago or I don't even know what it was last, probably not a month ago, actually.
00:11:37
Speaker
Maybe a couple of months ago.
00:11:38
Speaker
I have it playing right now in the background because it is such a visual movie.
00:11:44
Speaker
So it's like, I don't need the sound on.
00:11:47
Speaker
But I did do research.
00:11:49
Speaker
I don't know if I'm allowed to do research.
00:11:51
Speaker
Really?
00:11:51
Speaker
You're the most prepared guest we've ever had.
00:11:53
Speaker
Yeah.
00:11:55
Speaker
So like number one, it is so visual.
00:11:59
Speaker
And I love that about it.
00:12:00
Speaker
Also too, like this is, I have it for me, my sweet spot for movies are movies where like I can watch like what they're eating and drinking.
00:12:07
Speaker
And I really want that.
00:12:08
Speaker
So like watching this movie, I want a hot cup of tea so freaking bad.
00:12:12
Speaker
Like made with a kettle and like this like cornish kitchen.
00:12:16
Speaker
But I like took some notes again because there's like there's three movies.
00:12:20
Speaker
I had watched this one a couple months ago and I had written
00:12:23
Speaker
time but not like tenant i like this movie no so like it's so funny because i was like i'm gonna sound like such a hypocrite because like i remember you guys are probably i i don't know i am predicting at least someone in here liked tenant is that is that probably all of us i want to say all of you guys if i was holding out
00:12:45
Speaker
To me, like, like this movie.
00:12:48
Speaker
So I like the ambiguity.
00:12:51
Speaker
I like movies that are not necessarily trying to have some deep meaning.
00:12:57
Speaker
I like movies where you don't have to go back.
00:12:59
Speaker
Like, I think you could rewatch this and you still don't, you're still just as confused.
00:13:04
Speaker
Like they're not hiding.
00:13:05
Speaker
I don't think this movie is hiding anything from you.
00:13:08
Speaker
But essentially, I guess the reason why I say time but not like Tenet is because Tenet, there's a time, the whole movie is around the reversal of time.
00:13:17
Speaker
And so once you get to the end of it, you go back and you're like, I'm going to have to watch that again.
00:13:21
Speaker
And there's this explanation, there's such intentionality behind this central theme or motif of time.
00:13:30
Speaker
It's the same thing with Innismain, except not.
00:13:33
Speaker
So Mark Jenkins, the director,
00:13:36
Speaker
was just fascinated by the concept of like block universe so basically i have this written down um like the stanford encyclopedia defines the theory of block universe as objects from the past and future exist so like when you watch this movie it doesn't make sense but that's because
00:13:58
Speaker
Like they're showing you like milkmaids from the past or like dead miners or even like the man who gets into that accident, they show like the paramedics out at sea or even her past self.
00:14:10
Speaker
Like I thought maybe she had like a really weird mute daughter, but it's her, which they reveal with like this, you know, the scar and falling through the window.
00:14:18
Speaker
So, like, the whole movie is essentially just this woman being haunted by, like, time.
00:14:23
Speaker
Like, existing all at once on the island.
00:14:25
Speaker
And that's the whole movie.
00:14:26
Speaker
And you don't... There's nothing deeper to it.
00:14:28
Speaker
Like, there's no deeper explanation.
00:14:31
Speaker
And I love that.
00:14:32
Speaker
Like, I... You don't have to, like, claw at, like, deeper symbolism.
00:14:36
Speaker
Like, it's just this haunted island by time.
00:14:40
Speaker
I don't know.
00:14:40
Speaker
So... Yeah, I love that you just have it playing in the background.
00:14:44
Speaker
Because the way, like, throughout the whole runtime, I was like...
00:14:48
Speaker
Picturing what I felt like this movie was for is like catching 10 minutes of it at a time and like a museum gallery, like absorbing some of it, like stepping away, coming back to it and like,
00:15:01
Speaker
I see a lot of value in it.
00:15:03
Speaker
Well, yeah, it does feel like an art piece.
00:15:06
Speaker
And I had a rant about this that I just like was about a different movie, but it applies to this one.
00:15:13
Speaker
I just have this... I get so fucking mad whenever I hear people complain about movies that don't make sense or movies that don't interest them or don't like...
00:15:26
Speaker
I don't know, strike a chord within them personally.
00:15:28
Speaker
And it's just like so boring of an opinion to have because not every movie has to be entertaining to you.
00:15:36
Speaker
Movies as an art form have been poisoned by capitalism more than anything else, like art form wise.
00:15:41
Speaker
It may be music, but that's because people expect movies to make money.
00:15:47
Speaker
And that's bullshit because it's art.
00:15:49
Speaker
Like people don't expect paintings to make money.
00:15:53
Speaker
I guess they sell for a ton of money.
00:15:54
Speaker
Some do, but most of them don't.
00:15:57
Speaker
But you go to a museum, a lot of them are free.
00:16:00
Speaker
You just get to appreciate it.
00:16:02
Speaker
And if you don't like it, you move on.
00:16:03
Speaker
And it's the same thing with... I texted everybody earlier that I saw this take where someone was like, Megalopolis is boring and badly executed.
00:16:12
Speaker
I was like, first of all, it's not boring.
00:16:15
Speaker
There's nothing... You cannot say it's boring because there's something to either laugh at or go, huh?
00:16:23
Speaker
all the time yeah every few seconds my favorite folk horror movie yeah my favorite but like same thing with innis main where it's like okay maybe it's not like maybe there's not really any story but to me it kind of felt like a meditation on uh like how places have trauma yeah
00:16:45
Speaker
like how objects can retain the, the bad things that happened to them or around them and about how someone kind of breaking through the other, like paranormal side of that and seeing that objects can have trauma.
00:17:00
Speaker
And like, I don't know if you didn't get it, that's fine.
00:17:03
Speaker
But it, this movie shouldn't have to be entertaining.
00:17:07
Speaker
The director doesn't owe you entertainment.
00:17:10
Speaker
That's fair.
00:17:11
Speaker
Or like, why do you have to get everything?
00:17:13
Speaker
Totally.
00:17:16
Speaker
You don't have to get everything.
00:17:19
Speaker
It's way more boring if you do.
00:17:21
Speaker
And maybe if people...
00:17:23
Speaker
would watch a movie they don't understand it would uh challenge their worldview maybe sometimes and instead of just seeing uh instead of just seeing the next uh marvel dc disney plus bullshit where it reaffirms the status quo and doesn't challenge you at all maybe you'd be happier actually yeah so i gotta say this is not where i saw this conversation going but i love it
00:17:45
Speaker
Listener, call your racist grandma and say, hey, I'm coming over.
00:17:48
Speaker
We're going to watch Ennis Mane.
00:17:50
Speaker
And you're going to be woke by the end of it.
00:17:53
Speaker
Speaking of, before we move on from Ennis Mane, I do have to... That comment just made me... It's something that I saw earlier, but like...
00:18:01
Speaker
I was I'm a real estate photographer.
00:18:04
Speaker
That's my job.
00:18:04
Speaker
And I was taking photos in this really nice house.
00:18:07
Speaker
They had a theater room and everything.
00:18:09
Speaker
And I went into the theater room and the only Blu-ray they had, maybe they had packed up and moved all their Blu-rays, but they had left one specifically out on the DVD player.
00:18:18
Speaker
and it was straight out of Compton.
00:18:21
Speaker
And I just... And it was like a white... They had a Blue Lives Matter flag in the house.
00:18:26
Speaker
I'm like, why do you own... Oh, Jesus Christ.
00:18:28
Speaker
Why do you own straight out of Compton, first of all, if you have a Blue Lives Matter flag?
00:18:32
Speaker
And why did you leave it out?
00:18:34
Speaker
They were like, fuck this movie.
00:18:36
Speaker
It's staying.
00:18:37
Speaker
Yeah, they wanted you to take it.
00:18:38
Speaker
They were like, the photographer will like this.
00:18:40
Speaker
They're trying to catch me stealing.
00:18:41
Speaker
Yeah, let's talk about the movie that we're supposed to be talking about.
00:18:45
Speaker
Something that I kind of love that you...
00:18:50
Speaker
I had not
Themes and Elements in Folk Horror
00:18:51
Speaker
really considered that time is what haunts this island.
00:18:56
Speaker
And the more you think about it and how old it feels and simultaneously contemporary in some aspects and shooting it all in 16, is there's... Even just in the actual filmmaking, it feels like you are getting this... What did you call it?
00:19:16
Speaker
Block universe?
00:19:18
Speaker
Yeah, just like everything.
00:19:19
Speaker
Yeah, everything existing all in this one spot, past and present and future.
00:19:27
Speaker
it's a this is something that people often reference especially in like video games or whatever but like environmental storytelling of the understanding of like you don't have to get it but like the more you pay attention the more you look at the details and the textures of this film is it's it's communicating so much and even then the communication might not be like here's the exact thing that happened this is what this woman's name is and this is where she's from and this is what her life is like but it's just communicating like this used to be a place that people lived
00:19:56
Speaker
And these are things that used to happen here.
00:19:58
Speaker
And these are people who existed or currently exist on this island.
00:20:03
Speaker
And I just I found it fascinating.
00:20:06
Speaker
And it's it's one I.
00:20:09
Speaker
It's what I'm actually excited to rewatch.
00:20:12
Speaker
And I really, I really wish I would have gotten to see this in a theater one because I just think like really beautiful.
00:20:17
Speaker
That's what Mark Wilson said.
00:20:19
Speaker
Yeah.
00:20:19
Speaker
It's like, it's so cliche because every director's like, you need to go see my movie.
00:20:23
Speaker
Like, okay, well, that's not, you know, like, sure.
00:20:26
Speaker
But he was talking to the guy.
00:20:28
Speaker
I don't know if you guys saw Skinnamarank, but he was.
00:20:30
Speaker
Yeah.
00:20:31
Speaker
He was bonding with the guy who did that.
00:20:34
Speaker
This movie made me think about Skin and Marink a lot.
00:20:36
Speaker
There's quite a few reviews on Letterboxd comparing them.
00:20:40
Speaker
And there's a lot of the same criticism.
00:20:43
Speaker
I can see that.
00:20:44
Speaker
Yeah, I think the two movies are definitely in conversation.
00:20:47
Speaker
They're definitely trying to say very different things and they use very different tactics to say those things.
00:20:53
Speaker
But they're...
00:20:57
Speaker
in I guess the fact that they are both boring, you know, like they're both like, they're both a movie you have to lock into to like appreciate that.
00:21:08
Speaker
Yeah.
00:21:09
Speaker
It sucks.
00:21:10
Speaker
Cause movies like this get underlooked on, on like Hulu or whatever, because they label it as horror and it's like not really scary.
00:21:19
Speaker
Like it's not, it's, there's like one, one or two things that kind of like shocked me or maybe like made me jump a little bit, but,
00:21:27
Speaker
It's not scary.
00:21:28
Speaker
And so people will see this and go, what the fuck is this?
00:21:31
Speaker
I wanted to watch a horror movie.
00:21:33
Speaker
Whereas the thing with Skinner, Marink is it's not scary unless you lock in.
00:21:39
Speaker
Yeah.
00:21:39
Speaker
If you watch it, if you have your phone on and your lights are on in your house, Skinner, Marink is not scary.
00:21:43
Speaker
But if you watch it how it's supposed to be watched, it's fucking terrifying.
00:21:47
Speaker
Yeah.
00:21:47
Speaker
Yeah.
00:21:47
Speaker
I think it plays with the ideas of what things can scare you.
00:21:51
Speaker
I think for Mark Jenkins, again, the idea of time slipping, I think it was what his original concept was.
00:21:59
Speaker
Yeah, time can be scary.
00:22:01
Speaker
I think time haunts all of us.
00:22:02
Speaker
And then for Skin of Marink, too, I think that's more so atmospheric.
00:22:06
Speaker
Everyone knows what it's like to be a child and you're
00:22:09
Speaker
your dark basement and and you know what i mean like not and even as a kid you don't really have like a concept or understanding of when your parents are going to be home or like what time it is like um but yeah just like i think this is another movie where like the mode of consumption supposed to be in a theater because it is very like i don't even want to say immersive but it's like you can't look at your fucking phone like you can't you can't get up and use the restroom and what i really liked about innis main is um
00:22:32
Speaker
Like, like thinking about, I think, right, you had said like about it took about an hour before you really started to figure it out.
00:22:38
Speaker
And Zach, like, you know, you mentioned like it's definitely slow.
00:22:41
Speaker
But like, if you notice, like she's the main character that I think they call her.
00:22:45
Speaker
I forget what they what they call her, like the journalist or researcher, I think.
00:22:50
Speaker
Yeah.
00:22:50
Speaker
Yeah.
00:22:51
Speaker
um she's writing in her journal like no change no change no change but then eventually things do start to change or at least you think they're changing in a linear sense um but it's one of those movies where like if you look away you miss the woodcut photo on the wall that shows the
00:23:08
Speaker
standing stone with the skulls underneath it or like you miss like the flash of her former self or like it's like you look away once and something so key is you miss it and I really like that kind of force you to like you know
00:23:24
Speaker
Yeah.
00:23:26
Speaker
So I was the first of us four to watch it.
00:23:29
Speaker
And like my first reaction was fairly tongue in cheek, just like, oh my God, that was the slowest movie I've ever seen.
00:23:35
Speaker
And kind of sat with it longer.
00:23:38
Speaker
And even like my first reaction, like when I wrote a review on Letterboxd and all that shit, I was like, this is gorgeous.
00:23:44
Speaker
I just didn't feel much from the story, but I did still think there was a lot of
00:23:49
Speaker
kind of where people try to branch out of loneliness and like put them into different situations or dream about them whether good or bad just kind of generally longing for something other than like the captivity within themselves um and so that's that's really what i got out of it and like it's interesting to hear some of y'all's other i don't know what you got from it um
00:24:16
Speaker
I'm rambling in a sense of I still don't fully get this movie, but I do feel like it said something to me about where we go from places of loneliness and how it's not like, I don't know, something to be found within ourselves.
00:24:30
Speaker
And I can't still can't put my finger on it exactly.
00:24:32
Speaker
So it is something I do want to rewatch at some point.
00:24:35
Speaker
Well, Zach, you mentioned Zach, you mentioned the shining.
00:24:38
Speaker
Like I do think,
00:24:40
Speaker
The Shining is an example of, Kat, where you're talking about, like, Block Universe.
00:24:43
Speaker
It's like the Overlook Hotel is, like, a place where all of this time exists.
00:24:49
Speaker
I mean, it's the last shot of the movie.
00:24:51
Speaker
It's not in the book, but the last shot of the movie is, you know, him 100 years earlier at the dinner.
00:24:56
Speaker
It's like he has existed there for all time.
00:24:58
Speaker
Everybody who's been through there in this time has existed there for all time.
00:25:02
Speaker
And it's like...
00:25:03
Speaker
So I do think it's in conversation with that.
00:25:05
Speaker
Like, I do think the two are tied together in a really interesting way.
00:25:08
Speaker
It's obviously a very different movie.
00:25:11
Speaker
But I like that comparison because I think it's working in the same role.
00:25:14
Speaker
The Miners felt directly like the ballroom from The Shining.
00:25:17
Speaker
Yeah, for sure.
00:25:18
Speaker
For sure.
00:25:19
Speaker
I loved those shots of, like, just, like, the group of Miners and kind of, like, honing on their faces.
00:25:24
Speaker
I was like, where the fuck is this?
00:25:26
Speaker
Like, what's going on?
00:25:28
Speaker
Which I love.
00:25:29
Speaker
Like, I love...
00:25:30
Speaker
when movies can do that, it's like I just started reading this book and it's like it's very also like jumping around in time a lot.
00:25:36
Speaker
And I spend the first like four pages of every chapter being like, what the fuck is going on?
00:25:41
Speaker
But that makes me read more like that makes me really get into it.
00:25:44
Speaker
And so I really I yeah, I think
00:25:47
Speaker
this conversation has made me appreciate it even more.
00:25:49
Speaker
And I, I already appreciated it a good deal.
00:25:51
Speaker
So not just my, I only have one more thought on, and he's main, and it's at first, Joe is talking about like how you don't have to get something from it.
00:26:01
Speaker
And my initial re like,
00:26:03
Speaker
You don't have to get every movie.
00:26:05
Speaker
You don't have to like every movie.
00:26:06
Speaker
And at first I started in my mind pushing back on it a little bit.
00:26:09
Speaker
I'm like, well, like you still don't have to like everything.
00:26:13
Speaker
And that's like where my brain went immediately.
00:26:15
Speaker
But the more I've thought about it, the more there is something inherently very artistic about not explaining everything to people.
00:26:23
Speaker
And like the ambiguity is what locks you in.
00:26:27
Speaker
Like the uncertainty and not knowing what's going on is what keeps you invested in following that thread.
00:26:33
Speaker
wherever it leads you, even if it leads you to a place that you're still following after the movie is over.
00:26:38
Speaker
Like that's art and that's beautiful and cool.
00:26:41
Speaker
Yeah.
00:26:41
Speaker
Basically what we're saying is just watch, watch anything and everything and don't quit.
00:26:48
Speaker
Unless you're Joe and you're asked to watch Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice and...
00:26:53
Speaker
That movie is the fucking opposite of Ines May.
00:26:56
Speaker
We have to move on to the next film.
00:27:01
Speaker
I'm going to rant about fucking Beetlejuice again.
00:27:04
Speaker
No.
00:27:04
Speaker
Red told me that we were going to do Ines May first because we were going to have the least to say about it.
00:27:10
Speaker
I thought so too.
00:27:11
Speaker
Well, let's move on.
00:27:12
Speaker
What's next?
00:27:13
Speaker
The Wailing?
00:27:14
Speaker
No, the next one, because I want to save The Whaling for the end because Joe's going to have a lot of opinions.
00:27:21
Speaker
But the next one is Pierce Haggard's 1971 film, The Blood on Satan's Claw.
00:27:25
Speaker
The Blood on Satan's Piggies.
00:27:27
Speaker
The Blood on Satan's Piggies.
00:27:30
Speaker
Satan's famous.
00:27:31
Speaker
Yeah.
00:27:32
Speaker
A movie?
00:27:33
Speaker
I have to say up at the top.
00:27:36
Speaker
I have to say up at the top, when Kat recommended all of these, I didn't expect there to be as much titty as there was, and then there was a lot of titty.
00:27:44
Speaker
A lot of titty.
00:27:45
Speaker
A lot of titty.
00:27:46
Speaker
Oh my god, or like, sorry, child rape.
00:27:48
Speaker
I'm so sorry.
00:27:49
Speaker
Yeah, dude.
00:27:50
Speaker
Child Bush.
00:27:54
Speaker
Sometimes I watch old British movies.
00:27:58
Speaker
It's weird that it's mostly old British movies, huh?
00:28:00
Speaker
But there's a lot of weird child nudity in a lot of these movies.
00:28:03
Speaker
Bad news.
00:28:04
Speaker
The French did it too.
00:28:06
Speaker
Yeah, and also, fucking, I've never been able to get, like, I've never been able to get past it in the Holy Mountain.
00:28:11
Speaker
Like, people freak out about that movie, and I'm like, there's, like, child penis in that movie.
00:28:15
Speaker
I don't want to watch that.
00:28:16
Speaker
Baby dick.
00:28:17
Speaker
That's fucking weird, man.
00:28:18
Speaker
It's wild.
00:28:19
Speaker
Yeah, so Angel Blake, the blonde bad character, she was 16 when they filmed it.
00:28:27
Speaker
That's fucking weird!
00:28:29
Speaker
That's crazy.
00:28:31
Speaker
Yeah, it's crazy.
00:28:32
Speaker
I hadn't seen it before I recommended it and I was watching it the other night and I was like, oh my God, I know.
00:28:37
Speaker
that is wild i felt so bad she disrobes in front of a priest i mean it's like necessary in my opinion educational viewing but i was like christ the 70s that is wild yeah it's like al pacino going to it's like michael corleone going to sicily and marrying a 15 year old in the godfather just like i guess this is happening
00:28:59
Speaker
Yeah, right.
00:29:00
Speaker
Jesus Christ.
00:29:01
Speaker
That actress I remember was not of age as well either, correct?
00:29:04
Speaker
No, she wasn't.
00:29:05
Speaker
Apollonia?
00:29:06
Speaker
Yeah, Apollonia was like 16 when they filmed.
00:29:08
Speaker
It's crazy.
00:29:09
Speaker
Come on, guys.
00:29:10
Speaker
I wanted to say, the Blown in Satan's Claw.
00:29:13
Speaker
I really dug this movie actually.
00:29:16
Speaker
So I'll tell you, I'll tell you where I cut off.
00:29:18
Speaker
Except obviously.
00:29:20
Speaker
Well, I cut off.
00:29:22
Speaker
This is going to sound bad, but I cut off right after they, Catherine, is that her name?
00:29:28
Speaker
Kathy.
00:29:28
Speaker
Yeah.
00:29:29
Speaker
Kathy.
00:29:30
Speaker
Right after they raped Kathy is where I had to stop to come record.
00:29:35
Speaker
And that was the moment where I was like, this is getting interesting.
00:29:38
Speaker
Yeah.
00:29:39
Speaker
Again, that sounds really bad, but I was like, oh, something's happening.
00:29:43
Speaker
It is true, though.
00:29:44
Speaker
It's fun that you're fucking breaking into your house.
00:29:46
Speaker
Yeah, that's fine.
00:29:47
Speaker
But I was like, oh, something, like, there's a devil cult here.
00:29:51
Speaker
Cool.
00:29:52
Speaker
Like, I was like, I was, and he sensed that before that, but I was like, this is real.
00:29:56
Speaker
Like, this is happening, and this is really freaky.
00:29:58
Speaker
And there's that weird fucking guy with...
00:30:01
Speaker
string face in the corner or whatever the fuck.
00:30:04
Speaker
I don't know.
00:30:05
Speaker
So I'll have very little to say about this because I didn't get to watch the whole movie, but that's where I cut off and I am excited to go now and finish it having just, you know, cut off there.
00:30:16
Speaker
Let me, let me tell you what I think.
00:30:18
Speaker
This movie is annoyingly British.
00:30:22
Speaker
Like, even more so than like, it's like Downton Abbey is super, super British.
00:30:28
Speaker
Like, it's just like so British.
00:30:31
Speaker
But it's like, I get it.
00:30:32
Speaker
It's like about these like rich, it's like, that's a part of it.
00:30:35
Speaker
You have to deal with that in order to understand why Downton Abbey is a story that's being told.
00:30:41
Speaker
Blood on Satan's Claws is like, when there's a devil call in the town, every point we'll talk about how the older children love the devil.
00:30:52
Speaker
You're like, come on.
00:30:54
Speaker
I could listen to 90 minutes of you doing that and probably like it more than the movie.
00:30:57
Speaker
I got to be honest.
00:30:58
Speaker
Now it's have to find all the children before the devil comes and takes him up down there.
00:31:04
Speaker
I will say a movie I thought about watching the beginning of this movie is The Witch.
00:31:08
Speaker
Robert Eggers.
00:31:09
Speaker
I thought about The Witch a lot.
00:31:11
Speaker
Probably falls into this full core category.
00:31:13
Speaker
Would you say, Kat, that that kind of falls in?
00:31:15
Speaker
Yeah.
00:31:16
Speaker
And I think part of the reason I thought about it is because The Witch does this sort of same period dialogue much more effectively, in my opinion.
00:31:25
Speaker
I think for me, if you're going to do what this movie does with the period dialogue, you need really good actors to carry it off and make it seem natural.
00:31:33
Speaker
Yeah, maybe not children.
00:31:34
Speaker
yeah and maybe not children because like to me the beginning of this movie i was similar to joe i was like this is insufferably british like i could not just just because i was like i would be much more engaged in even whatever the storytelling is if you just put it in the period but had more modernist dialogue um because i didn't think the actors were able to carry off the dialogue that they were given
00:31:58
Speaker
It's very of its time.
00:31:59
Speaker
And I was listening to a podcast that was reviewing it and it was for Britain specifically, it's kind of nestled in between like, you have like, um,
00:32:07
Speaker
a period where like British theater, like people were classically trained Shakespeare actors.
00:32:12
Speaker
And that's a super different way of like, cause you're, you're like emoting and acting for the stage.
00:32:16
Speaker
And then you have like acting now, which is very grounded, very realistic.
00:32:20
Speaker
And this time period for British movies is right in the middle where it's like it, to me, it's funny because the director didn't want to make a campy movie, but the dialogue was so damn campy, which I love.
00:32:32
Speaker
They said, I was like, that is so like, you know, I don't know if you guys remember, but like, um,
00:32:38
Speaker
one of, I don't know if he was like a squire, I think one of like, like the head squire, like it's whenever he's in bed to come back to the village and he's like, he says something to the effect of like, I'll come back, but I have very unorthodox methods or he said in such a campy way and I'm like, I love it.
00:32:56
Speaker
I fucking loved the squire.
00:32:57
Speaker
I like, like the real big dude, like every time he was talking to like the governor and like the governor would disagree with something and he would immediately like change his tone is I just,
00:33:08
Speaker
He was a funny character.
00:33:10
Speaker
He carried it off the best in my opinion.
00:33:12
Speaker
If I was going to tell my friend about this movie, I would tell them, imagine The Wicker Man, but it sucks.
00:33:20
Speaker
And that's about what I would call it.
00:33:22
Speaker
I like this movie more than The Wicker Man.
00:33:24
Speaker
I also like this movie more than The Wicker Man.
00:33:26
Speaker
I fucking love The Wicker Man.
00:33:27
Speaker
The Wicker Man is boring as dick.
00:33:28
Speaker
Me and Red watched The Wicker Man together a few years ago, and the credits rolled, and we both were just like, oh.
00:33:35
Speaker
Okay.
00:33:36
Speaker
The Wicker Man, I like it.
00:33:39
Speaker
It's kind of crazy that nothing really happens until like the last 10 minutes, in my opinion.
00:33:46
Speaker
I'll caveat it with like, generally, I've just come to find that 70s British folk core is not for me.
00:33:54
Speaker
Yeah, yeah.
00:33:56
Speaker
Blood on Satan's Claw was probably my least favorite of these three movies that we're talking about.
00:34:01
Speaker
There were a lot of parts that I thought were great.
00:34:04
Speaker
I think the stage prosthetics they used for multiple arm stumps.
00:34:09
Speaker
Yeah.
00:34:09
Speaker
The arm stumps?
00:34:12
Speaker
Pretty sick.
00:34:14
Speaker
I did really like that scene.
00:34:19
Speaker
The way he walks around with the devil's hair after taking it off, just wagging it around.
00:34:24
Speaker
It just looks like a fucking merkin.
00:34:26
Speaker
Like it just looks like a pub.
00:34:27
Speaker
That's certainly what it was.
00:34:29
Speaker
Yeah.
00:34:30
Speaker
He like smelled it.
00:34:31
Speaker
He like stiched it.
00:34:32
Speaker
What the fuck are y'all talking about?
00:34:34
Speaker
I'm ready.
00:34:35
Speaker
I'm ready to get into it.
00:34:37
Speaker
Oh, Austin, I forgot you haven't finished.
00:34:39
Speaker
No, I'm here for it.
00:34:40
Speaker
Tell me about the Merkin.
00:34:43
Speaker
Well, basically what you're going to see is there's a scene where they cut a Merkin off of this girl.
00:34:48
Speaker
Okay.
00:34:50
Speaker
And that's basically it.
00:34:51
Speaker
Great.
00:34:52
Speaker
Okay.
00:34:52
Speaker
So Kat, you had not seen this film before.
00:34:55
Speaker
No, I had seen the Wicker.
00:34:57
Speaker
So out of the three I had mentioned, it's part of like, and I agree with Zach, like I'm not into this time period either.
00:35:03
Speaker
I watch it more like, this is so like dumb, but I watch it more for like, in a sense, comedic value.
00:35:10
Speaker
Yeah, sure.
00:35:12
Speaker
It's very of its time.
00:35:13
Speaker
But yeah, I hadn't seen it.
00:35:16
Speaker
And I was entertained by it, but probably not for like the right reasons.
00:35:19
Speaker
But also there is a lot there again that you can see why this falls in category full core, you know, like, yeah, something's wrong with the children and the weird isolated rural community.
00:35:30
Speaker
I mean, like, yeah, so yeah.
00:35:32
Speaker
It has a lot of weird juxtapositions going on that I think are valuable in, I guess, the growth of film in that period.
00:35:40
Speaker
Because you have the weird, like, I say stage prosthetics because I feel like they were just using methods of stuff you would use in a theater to make some things happen that maybe not, I don't know.
00:35:53
Speaker
Sorry, Joe just took a bite of something very confusing.
00:35:56
Speaker
I'm so sorry.
00:35:58
Speaker
It looks like a bar of soap.
00:36:00
Speaker
Is that a marshmallow?
00:36:01
Speaker
It's a marshmallow.
00:36:02
Speaker
Fuck you guys.
00:36:03
Speaker
Okay, sorry.
00:36:05
Speaker
That just had to go talked about.
00:36:07
Speaker
I'm sorry, Zach.
00:36:07
Speaker
I'm so sorry, Zach.
00:36:08
Speaker
You're good.
00:36:09
Speaker
You're good.
00:36:09
Speaker
I didn't see Joe take the bite, and I saw y'all's faces, and I was like, I know I'm getting there, but... No, no, no, no.
00:36:17
Speaker
You're doing great.
00:36:18
Speaker
You're doing so good, sweetie.
00:36:18
Speaker
Your pitties are really stupid.
00:36:20
Speaker
Sweetie, you're doing so good.
00:36:21
Speaker
It's Joe being a fucking weirdo.
00:36:23
Speaker
You look beautiful.
00:36:25
Speaker
That being said, yeah.
00:36:26
Speaker
So there's like a lot of weird, goofy stuff happening within the same time.
00:36:29
Speaker
There's like really cool handheld camera shots for the time.
00:36:33
Speaker
Yeah.
00:36:33
Speaker
And there's a shot where they're walking through the field with like the torches that looks super cool.
00:36:39
Speaker
So like it throws you off a little bit because you start laughing like, wait, wait, wait.
00:36:43
Speaker
Are we back?
00:36:44
Speaker
Are we back?
00:36:45
Speaker
Zach, if you liked the cool kind of like ahead of its time handheld shots for the 70s, you're going to freak out when you see Seconds, the Frankenheimer flick.
00:36:54
Speaker
That movie is actually good.
00:36:56
Speaker
I'll add it to my list right now.
00:36:57
Speaker
Fucking incredible.
00:36:59
Speaker
Oh, my God.
00:36:59
Speaker
Holy shit, that movie.
00:37:00
Speaker
Zach, next time you're in Waco, borrow my Blu-ray.
00:37:04
Speaker
Or maybe I can bring it to you in San Antonio.
00:37:05
Speaker
We can figure it out.
00:37:07
Speaker
I will say a kind of through line of these three movies altogether that I found.
00:37:11
Speaker
is their use of locations is tremendous.
00:37:14
Speaker
Yeah.
00:37:15
Speaker
All three of them have a terrific understanding of place and use it to the nth degree, in my opinion, sometimes overusing it in the course of, in the case of Ennis, Maine, but in a way that I like, because it's the whole thing is the location.
00:37:29
Speaker
It is.
00:37:31
Speaker
So I, I think, I think that's an incredibly, that must be a sort of like, um,
00:37:36
Speaker
you know, sort of a standard of the genre, I suppose.
00:37:40
Speaker
But it's great.
00:37:41
Speaker
I love that.
00:37:41
Speaker
Yeah.
00:37:42
Speaker
Speaking of Zach too, and I think you had just mentioned this, but like, yes, it is funny.
00:37:47
Speaker
It's campy.
00:37:48
Speaker
Like it's of the time.
00:37:49
Speaker
Some of like the way that they do blocking for action is very like, does not make sense.
00:37:54
Speaker
But there are some visually like striking moments like leading up to Kathy getting raped and murdered.
00:38:03
Speaker
When she's being lured into the forest, there's a scene and you've seen it done in movies, but you get the feeling that this was the first time it might've been done where she's with the two boys, the camera zooms out in the woods and all of a sudden all of the children appear out from behind the trees.
00:38:21
Speaker
That was genuinely spooky.
00:38:23
Speaker
Also when, what last thing, sorry, also when they're chasing Mark into like the ruins of that church,
00:38:31
Speaker
and the camera's following him playing blind man's bluff.
00:38:34
Speaker
But in the background, you see Angel with her blonde hair standing in the foreground.
00:38:40
Speaker
Freaky, man.
00:38:41
Speaker
Very freaky.
00:38:42
Speaker
Yeah, totally.
00:38:44
Speaker
The image making is very strong.
00:38:46
Speaker
Before we move on from this movie, I want to talk about another movie, which I now have a new appreciation for after having seen this.
00:38:51
Speaker
The Litter of the White Worm, which I talked about a couple episodes ago, is very much in the same vein of like- I've got a white worm for you, Joe.
00:39:02
Speaker
For the listener, he put up his middle finger, not his penis.
00:39:05
Speaker
I thought he was talking about his tapeworm.
00:39:11
Speaker
So the layer of the white worm is very much in this kind of era.
00:39:16
Speaker
It's making fun of while also being a 70s-ish folk horror.
00:39:21
Speaker
It was made in 88, but 10 years after this whole...
00:39:26
Speaker
But it's a it's a full court movie.
00:39:29
Speaker
But instead of dealing with a devil cult, there is it's a it's the cult of the snake who tempted Eve in the garden.
00:39:38
Speaker
Oh, cool.
00:39:39
Speaker
And there's only one person in it.
00:39:40
Speaker
And it's a very, very, very beautiful snake woman.
00:39:45
Speaker
who seduces and then kills several people in this movie.
00:39:48
Speaker
It's very campy, but it is, it takes like this, like, I feel like the seventies full core from Britain is especially like it's religious horror.
00:39:58
Speaker
And so you're like worried about all these kids worshiping the devil.
00:40:01
Speaker
But Ken Russell takes that imagery and goes, what if I just made the most sacrilegious thing you've ever seen in your entire life?
00:40:09
Speaker
Like, what if there is a bunch of nuns getting raped by a bunch of centurions in front of a crucifix of Jesus who's being choked to death by a snake?
00:40:21
Speaker
Whoa.
00:40:22
Speaker
That's wild.
00:40:24
Speaker
Ken Russell's also the guy who made a movie that was like, what if you did so many drugs that not only did you see God, but you also sort of turned into God?
00:40:32
Speaker
Became God.
00:40:33
Speaker
And then he also made The Devil, which has been banned in so many countries.
00:40:37
Speaker
And also, you can't find a good cut of it because all of the original cuts got burned by the Catholic League or whatever.
00:40:44
Speaker
Sick.
00:40:45
Speaker
He's a cool guy.
00:40:46
Speaker
More of that imagery with Exorcist 3, I feel like.
00:40:49
Speaker
Yeah.
00:40:50
Speaker
I would personally recommend, Kat, if you had not seen Layer of the White Orb.
00:40:53
Speaker
You just sold it.
00:40:55
Speaker
Did a great job.
00:40:57
Speaker
It's on Tubi.
00:40:57
Speaker
It's so fun.
00:41:03
Speaker
Shout out to Tubi, man.
00:41:04
Speaker
Tubi's fucking doing the Lord's work.
00:41:05
Speaker
It's the People Streamer.
00:41:07
Speaker
It's the People Streamer.
00:41:08
Speaker
Paddington Gone Wild.
00:41:10
Speaker
Please be sponsored by Tubi.
00:41:11
Speaker
Yeah, Tubi's sponsored by BGW.
00:41:13
Speaker
And this is for no one except my dear friend Kat.
00:41:17
Speaker
I was watching Blood on Satan's Claw last night on Tubi, and I got a fucking Mercy Ships ad.
00:41:22
Speaker
And I was like, I was like, oh, I felt it.
00:41:27
Speaker
That was scarier than the movie.
00:41:29
Speaker
I was like, oh, I...
00:41:32
Speaker
What were you doing that Mercy ships with that ad?
00:41:36
Speaker
Because nowadays, ads are like a direct correlation.
00:41:40
Speaker
They're all tailored.
00:41:42
Speaker
I wasn't even logged in.
00:41:43
Speaker
And also, every ad I've been getting on a streaming service that runs ads, like 70% of them are in Spanish.
00:41:51
Speaker
Oh, interesting.
00:41:52
Speaker
So if any beautiful Latino women want to hang out with me, hit my line.
00:41:59
Speaker
And I'm sure they do, Red.
00:42:00
Speaker
Shit.
00:42:02
Speaker
Please, please.
00:42:03
Speaker
Kat, the last film that you were going to talk about on today's podcast is a little film called The Wailing.
Analysis of 'The Wailing'
00:42:11
Speaker
Now, Kat, why did you choose The Wailing?
00:42:15
Speaker
I chose The Wailing because I'd heard really good things about it, which makes me very excited to talk about this with you guys since it seems like that was not the general consensus.
00:42:25
Speaker
I didn't know much about it going in.
00:42:27
Speaker
I knew that it had like folklore elements of Asian culture, which is I think what primarily would define like this is a full core in terms of just like the region it was filmed in.
00:42:37
Speaker
Also, but after watching it, and I wanted to say this quickly too, because this ties back into what we were just talking about.
00:42:44
Speaker
one theme that's really common in full core is I think there are always, there are often themes of like, I would phrase it as like the old gods pushing against like the new, you know, like paganism versus Christianity.
00:42:57
Speaker
And I think that's like present in like the blood of Satan's claw.
00:43:00
Speaker
You could argue it's present in, in its main, you know, like what happened in the past versus like this new person coming in and kind of like exploiting the land.
00:43:09
Speaker
And it's definitely a central theme in the wailing.
00:43:12
Speaker
So yeah.
00:43:14
Speaker
So was this also a first watch for you or had you seen it before?
00:43:17
Speaker
No, no.
00:43:17
Speaker
Yeah.
00:43:17
Speaker
I think with all of these, the everything was new except for NSMade.
00:43:21
Speaker
So it was, it was so long.
00:43:23
Speaker
I had to do it in two sittings.
00:43:25
Speaker
Like, yeah, I did too.
00:43:26
Speaker
So what do you think?
00:43:29
Speaker
I don't think it's a perfect movie.
00:43:31
Speaker
There are some clunky parts to it.
00:43:35
Speaker
It is a movie that I will probably watch several more times.
00:43:38
Speaker
Now, having gotten to the end, I feel like it's similar to Tenet.
00:43:43
Speaker
I hate that I'm bringing up a movie that I hate.
00:43:45
Speaker
The safe space to talk about Tenet.
00:43:47
Speaker
Always wrong.
00:43:48
Speaker
If you don't like it.
00:43:50
Speaker
Christopher Nolan, folk horror movie win.
00:43:52
Speaker
Yeah, dude.
00:43:54
Speaker
Yeah, my favorite folk horror is Tenet.
00:43:55
Speaker
Yeah.
00:43:57
Speaker
I mean, the nuclear bomb is sort of like the American devil.
00:44:01
Speaker
So no, but essentially like, I want to go back and watch it again because I feel like I will have a completely different viewing experience.
00:44:10
Speaker
And I always value that in a movie.
00:44:12
Speaker
Like, yeah.
00:44:13
Speaker
Yeah.
00:44:14
Speaker
I, I want Joe to go last because I was going to say, I'm going to go last.
00:44:18
Speaker
Yeah.
00:44:19
Speaker
I'm going to go ahead and say the whaling fucking rips, dude.
00:44:23
Speaker
This movie is so tight, is so rad.
00:44:27
Speaker
I was delighted.
00:44:30
Speaker
I've recommended it to like seven people.
00:44:32
Speaker
I watched it two days ago.
00:44:34
Speaker
That's wild.
00:44:35
Speaker
I mean, it is on Netflix, so it's easily recommendable.
00:44:38
Speaker
It's like, I've got enough perverts in my life.
00:44:40
Speaker
Like you all for sure who like horror movies.
00:44:43
Speaker
And so just being like, yo, check this out.
00:44:47
Speaker
You want to see a weird devil?
00:44:48
Speaker
Yeah.
00:44:49
Speaker
Watch the whaling.
00:44:50
Speaker
I like, I love about Asian cinema.
00:44:53
Speaker
I don't know if you guys feel the same way, but like they always pull this bait and switch where it's like, it starts out on the tone of super joke, like super bumbling and jovial and the character like dopes.
00:45:02
Speaker
And then by the end, you're like, what the fuck?
00:45:04
Speaker
Like that was the bleakest thing I've ever seen.
00:45:07
Speaker
I feel like Korean cinema in particular.
00:45:09
Speaker
This movie made me think a lot of Lee Chang-dong's movies, particularly Secret Sunshine, which is an incredible movie about grief and incredibly upsetting.
00:45:20
Speaker
But it starts kind of like you're saying, kind of fun.
00:45:23
Speaker
It's a mom and son on a road trip.
00:45:25
Speaker
And then it gets to be the darkest, most fucked up movie you've ever seen.
00:45:28
Speaker
Is that the guy that did Burning?
00:45:29
Speaker
Yeah, it's the guy that did Burning.
00:45:31
Speaker
Burning fucking ripped.
00:45:32
Speaker
burning ribs i mean uh you know i thought about his his movies a lot watching this i think i think you know director bong is similar like bong jun ho or yeah there's some memories of murder i was gonna say memories of murder is like two bumbling detectives who like to drop kick mentally and against people yeah and then it's the most fucked up movie it's like incredible
00:45:50
Speaker
I think Asian folk horror is like my favorite corner of it.
00:45:54
Speaker
Like Onibaba is one of my favorite horror movies ever.
00:45:57
Speaker
It fucking rules.
00:45:58
Speaker
I have not seen quite on yet, but it's on my list for this month and I'm really excited for that one.
00:46:03
Speaker
But this movie,
00:46:06
Speaker
I was like, we're still getting to Joe.
00:46:08
Speaker
I was actively not excited to watch it because of his reaction to it.
00:46:12
Speaker
So a little foreshadowing.
00:46:15
Speaker
But like 10 minutes into it, I was like, wait, what the fuck?
00:46:18
Speaker
Did we watch the same movie?
00:46:19
Speaker
This is funny as shit.
00:46:21
Speaker
And I went from thinking like, this is the best Korean version of like Shaun of the Dead I've ever seen.
00:46:28
Speaker
So like...
00:46:29
Speaker
terrified like there's a exorcism scene in this movie with a traditional dance that i stood up in my living room for like i wanted to start dancing with them y'all the chicken it the chicken strung up flapping it like i was having a full-on body response it it like
00:46:50
Speaker
I want Joe to go because I'm going to push back.
00:46:53
Speaker
I have to go first.
00:46:54
Speaker
Yeah, let Austin go.
00:46:56
Speaker
Yeah, okay.
00:46:57
Speaker
We can circle back to that.
00:46:57
Speaker
Be a generous lover, Zach.
00:46:59
Speaker
Yeah, come on.
00:47:00
Speaker
Give me time.
00:47:01
Speaker
No, so I will say, I think I fall somewhere in the middle of us.
00:47:06
Speaker
I really liked this movie.
00:47:08
Speaker
I thought it was like 40 minutes too long.
00:47:11
Speaker
um i thought it could afford to be like an hour 45 hour 50 and it probably would have been a lot cleaner in my opinion my only problem with that scene i was talking about and i really like that scene is i was honestly so much happier when it cut back to the fucking devil beating his drum with the chickens than the fucking shaman i was like the shaman i found kind of boring i was like i don't really did this guy that much um but i really like the devil guy beating his drum and freaking the fuck out um
00:47:37
Speaker
My biggest problem with this movie, and this is kind of a spoiler, is the ending.
00:47:42
Speaker
I don't like that we learn that he's actually the devil.
00:47:45
Speaker
I much more enjoy the ambiguity between the woman and the devil, for me personally.
00:47:51
Speaker
Yeah, respond, because I, yeah.
00:47:53
Speaker
I can see your reaction.
00:47:54
Speaker
I want to hear it.
00:47:55
Speaker
Listen, listen, y'all.
00:47:56
Speaker
This is the thing.
00:47:57
Speaker
There is no ambiguity, and that's the whole point of the movie.
00:48:00
Speaker
There's no ambiguity.
00:48:01
Speaker
There's none.
00:48:02
Speaker
It tricks you.
00:48:03
Speaker
The way that certain scenes are shot,
00:48:06
Speaker
I think the more you go, you're supposed to find yourself second-guessing, which is exactly what happens to the main character.
00:48:13
Speaker
I mean, you know what I mean?
00:48:14
Speaker
Like, the whole theme is, like... That's why they open up with a Bible quote, which, in my opinion, if a horror movie opens up with the Bible, like, shit's about to get real.
00:48:21
Speaker
For real.
00:48:22
Speaker
Yeah, I agree.
00:48:23
Speaker
The whole point is it's about, like, how do you have, like, just...
00:48:28
Speaker
we have to be able to see, have tangible evidence or else we're not, we don't believe.
00:48:32
Speaker
And like, even if you think about it, the opening shot is the Japanese man baiting worms to fish.
00:48:39
Speaker
And at one point the shaman tells, I think his name is like Jung.
00:48:43
Speaker
I don't, I shit.
00:48:44
Speaker
I like, I'm going to fuck up these names, but the main character is like, why is he doing this to my, like, why my daughter, why my daughter in the shop was like, you know, like, have you ever gone fishing?
00:48:53
Speaker
Yeah.
00:48:53
Speaker
Yeah.
00:48:54
Speaker
You know what you're going to catch?
00:48:55
Speaker
Like, no, he's just, he's just seeing he'll take the bait.
00:48:57
Speaker
It's there the whole time.
00:48:59
Speaker
Like the freaking photos in his cabin, like it's there the whole time.
00:49:03
Speaker
Yeah.
00:49:04
Speaker
I guess, I guess for me, it's just like, I'm trying to think about like movies that use the devil as like a,
00:49:12
Speaker
as an emblem of all evil.
00:49:13
Speaker
And I guess you could call it The Exorcist.
00:49:15
Speaker
It's like, it's a demon movie, but it's close enough.
00:49:17
Speaker
And it's like the whole time.
00:49:18
Speaker
Yeah, Pazuzu.
00:49:19
Speaker
It's like the whole time you know what that is.
00:49:22
Speaker
And I agree with you that it's there present the whole time.
00:49:24
Speaker
But with the convention that this movie is playing in, where it has the switcheroo and it wants you to think it's somebody else, I then like that the movie to me kind of becomes more about the main character's madness at this happening.
00:49:40
Speaker
And to me, that madness is only going to be more amplified if there's never an answer.
00:49:46
Speaker
And he doesn't really get an answer because he doesn't ever see the devil.
00:49:50
Speaker
But like, I guess it ends in some ambiguity for him.
00:49:54
Speaker
I don't know.
00:49:55
Speaker
I was just like, when they cut back and he's like got horns now and he's turning red, I was like,
00:50:00
Speaker
okay, I'm just kind of, it was a sick visual.
00:50:03
Speaker
I was like, that's kind of cool, especially in front of the only priest in the movie.
00:50:07
Speaker
But I don't know.
00:50:08
Speaker
I just, I didn't love that, but I did love,
00:50:12
Speaker
the sort of like final act of the family like the daughter like killing them all i was like yeah i didn't mind it at all because the fucking line where he says how do you know i'm gonna let you leave is a fucking banger like that that's just fun as hell when he turns that is great yeah okay joe joe i fucking hated this movie
00:50:36
Speaker
I hated almost every single second of this movie.
00:50:39
Speaker
I thought it was so boring.
00:50:41
Speaker
I thought it was bloated as hell.
00:50:43
Speaker
That's crazy, dog.
00:50:44
Speaker
I thought everyone was overacting.
00:50:47
Speaker
I thought that- A lot of them are.
00:50:50
Speaker
It was a movie that was so confused about what it was, but at the same time thought it was so fucking smart for trying to trick you.
00:50:59
Speaker
Also, by the way, I don't know if you guys know this about Korean culture, but my writing partner is Korean.
00:51:04
Speaker
He has made this very clear to me several times.
00:51:07
Speaker
This movie is just about how Korean people are right to hate Japanese people because they're the devil.
00:51:12
Speaker
Well, that's true.
00:51:13
Speaker
I don't love that.
00:51:15
Speaker
It is very anti-Japanese.
00:51:17
Speaker
Yeah, the movie is literally like, it's like, haha, yeah, they shouldn't have been xenophobic.
00:51:22
Speaker
Psych, fuck you.
00:51:23
Speaker
They were right to be xenophobic.
00:51:24
Speaker
The Japanese man was the devil.
00:51:28
Speaker
I think that's a little oversimplifying, but you're, I, yeah.
00:51:31
Speaker
I'm not oversimplifying it.
00:51:32
Speaker
He literally goes like, it's that fucking Japanese guy.
00:51:35
Speaker
I know it.
00:51:36
Speaker
And then at the end, the director and God are like, yeah, you were right.
00:51:41
Speaker
It was that Japanese man.
00:51:42
Speaker
It was the devil.
00:51:45
Speaker
I don't know.
00:51:46
Speaker
It just, like, I was so bored.
00:51:47
Speaker
I don't think it's that much deeper than attributing to, like, uncertainty to otherness, but sure.
00:51:54
Speaker
I mean, sure.
00:51:55
Speaker
Here's the thing.
00:51:56
Speaker
This movie is... I thought I liked the... I was, like, the first act happened.
00:52:00
Speaker
I was, like, okay, I like... It's kind of funny.
00:52:03
Speaker
I liked that visual of the lady, like, throwing rocks at him.
00:52:06
Speaker
I thought that was so funny.
00:52:07
Speaker
Yeah, that is a good one.
00:52:09
Speaker
It's just, like, there are...
00:52:11
Speaker
there are parts of this hole that I thought rocked, like the shaman scene that you guys are all talking about.
00:52:17
Speaker
I fucking love that scene.
00:52:19
Speaker
Uh, but I didn't care about anything that was happening in it.
00:52:21
Speaker
I just thought it was filmed.
00:52:22
Speaker
Cool.
00:52:24
Speaker
Um, I love the die.
00:52:27
Speaker
I wanted that little girl to die.
00:52:28
Speaker
She was a bitch.
00:52:29
Speaker
Yeah.
00:52:33
Speaker
She was a bitch when she was possessed.
00:52:34
Speaker
Yeah.
00:52:35
Speaker
Yeah.
00:52:35
Speaker
It wasn't her.
00:52:37
Speaker
Oh, she was extremely.
00:52:39
Speaker
That's by the Joe watching.
00:52:40
Speaker
Will you have to happen to be Japanese?
00:52:43
Speaker
That girl sucks.
00:52:43
Speaker
Reagan in the head.
00:52:44
Speaker
She were in the fucking throat.
00:52:46
Speaker
That would have ended the movie.
00:52:48
Speaker
No, it wouldn't.
00:52:49
Speaker
She wouldn't have died.
00:52:49
Speaker
She had a fucking demon inside her.
00:52:51
Speaker
Pazuzu would have left her body and gone into someone else's body.
00:52:54
Speaker
Yeah, exactly.
00:52:55
Speaker
That's exactly what happens at the end.
00:52:59
Speaker
Trump handsing over here at Joe.
00:53:01
Speaker
So I just, I listen, I wanted to like this movie.
00:53:04
Speaker
I love Korean cinema.
00:53:06
Speaker
I just also think from a style standpoint, this movie had zero sauce.
00:53:13
Speaker
Every shot was so boring.
00:53:16
Speaker
There was almost no visual ingenuity to how the movie was shot.
00:53:19
Speaker
It was just like if a director read a script and thought, what is the easiest way for me to shoot this scene?
00:53:25
Speaker
And then he did that for every scene.
00:53:27
Speaker
Oh, I just totally disagree.
00:53:28
Speaker
That's so strange.
00:53:31
Speaker
The second act, by the way, is the most bloated piece of shit act two I've ever watched happen.
00:53:36
Speaker
I agree that the movie's blooded.
00:53:38
Speaker
There's so many avenues that the act two takes that it doesn't need to, that don't add to the story.
00:53:44
Speaker
And frankly, I was never once scared.
00:53:47
Speaker
Dude, what are you talking about?
00:53:48
Speaker
I don't think it's very scary.
00:53:49
Speaker
There's an entire sequence that literally just asks the question, what if you got drunk with your boys and ran away from the devil?
00:53:56
Speaker
And that's fun.
00:53:58
Speaker
That's fucking cool to me.
00:53:59
Speaker
Yeah, I want to watch that movie.
00:54:02
Speaker
That's not what the movie was.
00:54:05
Speaker
It also was what the movie was.
00:54:07
Speaker
I would also like to take this time to shout out Hong Kyung-pyo, who shot this film, also shot a little film called Parasite, and Burning, and Snowpiercer, and Mother.
00:54:19
Speaker
Tell me I'm stupid.
00:54:21
Speaker
I mean, I get with a grain of salt.
00:54:23
Speaker
I...
00:54:25
Speaker
I wanted to like it.
00:54:26
Speaker
I just didn't.
00:54:27
Speaker
And I also... You're entitled to your opinion.
00:54:29
Speaker
That's great.
00:54:30
Speaker
I'm entitled to my correct opinion, and I want to hear why... Okay, let's pause.
00:54:34
Speaker
I want to hear why all of the people who are wrong about this movie tell me why it's good.
00:54:39
Speaker
Red, what were you going to say before you froze?
00:54:41
Speaker
Sorry.
00:54:42
Speaker
I wanted to shout out a specific...
00:54:47
Speaker
Part of this movie, the cinematographer is a guy named Hong Kyung Pyo, who shot a couple of movies you might have heard of.
00:54:52
Speaker
Broker, Parasite, Burning, Snowpiercer.
00:54:56
Speaker
Sure, and the guy that shot The Exorcist 3 also shot The Mask.
00:55:01
Speaker
Yeah, a fucking visual master.
00:55:04
Speaker
Yeah, what the fuck is wrong with you?
00:55:06
Speaker
We were just talking about how much of a genius Chuck Russell is, Joe.
00:55:09
Speaker
Hold the fuck on.
00:55:10
Speaker
Jesus fucking Christ.
00:55:12
Speaker
This is ridiculous.
00:55:13
Speaker
Hold the fuck on.
00:55:15
Speaker
You guys keep talking.
00:55:16
Speaker
I'm about to prove my fucking point.
00:55:18
Speaker
Yeah, exactly.
00:55:21
Speaker
Chuck Russell.
00:55:21
Speaker
Fucking genius.
00:55:24
Speaker
I will say like I did, I could feel in a way that I didn't mind, but I could feel other directors influence on this movie.
00:55:33
Speaker
Totally.
00:55:34
Speaker
Which I think might contribute to- Every movie ever.
00:55:37
Speaker
Well, exactly.
00:55:37
Speaker
But I think that might contribute to what Joe is saying a little bit, just trying to play devil's advocate on his behalf.
00:55:42
Speaker
It's like, I could feel the director being like, this is my Fincher shot.
00:55:47
Speaker
And this is my fucking like Friedkin shot.
00:55:50
Speaker
It's like- Yeah, it's just so boring.
00:55:52
Speaker
Well, I could watch a director play a cover album for three hours.
00:55:56
Speaker
In a way that didn't bother me.
00:55:58
Speaker
It didn't bother me, but I could feel it.
00:56:01
Speaker
Speaking of Devil's Advocate, I love that the Devil's Advocate appears in a mismatched tracksuit.
00:56:06
Speaker
That is pretty great.
00:56:08
Speaker
That is pretty great.
00:56:10
Speaker
Yeah, my biggest qualm with the movie, and again, I liked it, is that I thought it should be a lot shorter.
00:56:15
Speaker
I thought it was really... Yeah, I could save 20 minutes off for me.
00:56:18
Speaker
It's got the Return of the King problem.
00:56:19
Speaker
It's got three endings.
00:56:21
Speaker
Yeah.
00:56:22
Speaker
It's got three endings because it tried to be three movies.
00:56:26
Speaker
Anyway, I know, Kat, that you graciously deflected back to Reg.
00:56:30
Speaker
I do want to hear what you have to say about this.
00:56:33
Speaker
I mean, yeah, I don't.
00:56:34
Speaker
Well, is there like a specific there's just so much here.
00:56:38
Speaker
I agree that's too long.
00:56:39
Speaker
I think I don't think it's a movie everybody should like equivocally love.
00:56:44
Speaker
You don't even I think it's like if you like in this and this main for its visual symbolism and ambiguity, I like
00:56:54
Speaker
Conversely, I like the wailing not so much for like it's cinematography or it's shots, but I like that you, again, it's like I have, you have to follow it to piece together what's going on.
00:57:05
Speaker
And every step of the way you're, you're, you think you're wrong or you might be wrong or maybe you're right, but it's asking you to like reconsider.
00:57:14
Speaker
I was reading too because I think for me one of the areas that caused confusion was I think I was getting a little convoluted and I think this is partially too just like the culture right like I don't names are difficult this is not my culture.
00:57:27
Speaker
I don't know what was happening with the townspeople who the townspeople were like that like the more like police procedural
00:57:34
Speaker
parts were confusing for me.
00:57:37
Speaker
But the scene where they're doing the shaman, like you're, you're, they frame it to where that you think the shaman is exercising the demon out of the girl and killing the Japanese man.
00:57:50
Speaker
But what's actually happening is it's two completely separate
00:57:55
Speaker
like rituals, like the Japanese man is actually possessing the dead body in the car, switching bodies.
00:58:02
Speaker
And the shaman is tearing down that totem and that totem is like the village protector, which is like the woman in white.
00:58:10
Speaker
And you just don't know that until the very end.
00:58:12
Speaker
So I just,
00:58:15
Speaker
It's not a perfect movie, but it's so much to chew on and to think about and to go back and to watch again.
00:58:20
Speaker
And yeah, so I just, you know, like that's candy for me, you know?
00:58:24
Speaker
So, sorry.
00:58:26
Speaker
I love that.
00:58:27
Speaker
I'm with you.
00:58:27
Speaker
I'm with you.
00:58:28
Speaker
That's great.
00:58:30
Speaker
Well, any final thoughts, Kat?
00:58:32
Speaker
We've kept you here for almost an hour.
00:58:34
Speaker
Yeah, I did.
00:58:34
Speaker
I'm sorry.
00:58:35
Speaker
I do have one more thing I want to say about.
00:58:36
Speaker
Please.
00:58:37
Speaker
Yeah, sorry.
00:58:39
Speaker
One thing I value about this movie too is like, I think a lot, especially when I watch horror movie done in like in a different country or nationality, like they highlight certain things.
00:58:49
Speaker
And so like with American cinema, when you watch it, because this isn't a zombie movie, it's like, it's a possession movie.
00:58:54
Speaker
When you watch it, the American possession Hollywood movie, they play up the physicality and the theatrics of it all.
00:59:01
Speaker
There's a really specific scene
00:59:03
Speaker
I really like in the whaling where he, his daughter is on like the come down from, from her possession.
00:59:09
Speaker
It's like right in the middle of the movie.
00:59:11
Speaker
And he's asking her like, are you okay?
00:59:13
Speaker
Are you okay?
00:59:13
Speaker
And she's, she's crying.
00:59:15
Speaker
Like I, you know, like, and they just hold each other and they sob for like a couple minutes.
00:59:20
Speaker
And I sat there and thought like,
00:59:22
Speaker
You never watch an American possession movie where you're really grounded and the absolute fucking trauma of what this would feel like.
00:59:31
Speaker
But this movie all of a sudden made it feel so real.
00:59:35
Speaker
How absolutely awful would this be if it were happening to your child?
00:59:40
Speaker
And like, we have like the Amity Bills and you never like, you never.
00:59:44
Speaker
I will say that the part of this movie that I was that I latched on to and then got really angry with that it didn't stick that it didn't like stick the landing for me.
00:59:52
Speaker
So I love the dad daughter like I have to get this shit out of my daughter.
00:59:58
Speaker
I loved that.
00:59:59
Speaker
And it spent so much time doing other shit that I like didn't have.
01:00:02
Speaker
I didn't have time to care about it because they can't.
01:00:06
Speaker
If the movie was an hour 45 and it was just about those two, I think it would have been one of my favorite movies that I had seen this year.
01:00:13
Speaker
Yeah, because I love their dynamic.
01:00:15
Speaker
I thought they were so cute together.
01:00:16
Speaker
Yes.
01:00:17
Speaker
And I think that's fair criticism.
01:00:18
Speaker
I love that he was kind of a deadbeat, but also that he loved his family.
01:00:22
Speaker
Like, I think he's just a very lovable, like, bumbling cop.
01:00:26
Speaker
And I would love a story that's just the emotional core of the father and the daughter dealing with heinous evil shit happening to them.
01:00:35
Speaker
And I'm just like, why is there, why are they fucking killing zombies in the forest right now?
01:00:40
Speaker
I also love a movie where like the child is more mature than the parent.
01:00:44
Speaker
It's always great.
01:00:45
Speaker
It's great.
01:00:47
Speaker
Jimmy Neutron.
01:00:48
Speaker
Lisa Simpson.
01:00:49
Speaker
Yep.
01:00:49
Speaker
When she sees him like fucking the neighbor and she's just like, dad, I know you've been doing that.
01:00:55
Speaker
It's okay.
01:00:56
Speaker
Like, and he's like so worried about it.
01:00:58
Speaker
And she's just like, it's fine.
01:01:00
Speaker
Whatever.
01:01:00
Speaker
Everybody needs herbal supplements.
01:01:02
Speaker
It's fine.
01:01:02
Speaker
Yeah, exactly.
01:01:03
Speaker
We all need something to help us get hard every once in a while.
01:01:06
Speaker
It's great.
01:01:07
Speaker
But it was very, I love, I agree with you, Joe.
01:01:10
Speaker
I love their dynamic.
01:01:11
Speaker
And I think,
01:01:12
Speaker
I think I agree with you that I wish that was more central.
01:01:15
Speaker
But I do think it's central enough in the movie as it exists, but I do wish it were more central in the film.
01:01:21
Speaker
By producer Maddie.
01:01:22
Speaker
Maddie's here.
01:01:23
Speaker
Maddie, how was your shift at McDonald's?
01:01:26
Speaker
It was so good.
01:01:27
Speaker
I prepped Happy Meal boxes and ran food to tables.
01:01:31
Speaker
Hey, Maddie, can I get a royal apple with cheese?
01:01:34
Speaker
Yeah, Maddie, I love you.
01:01:35
Speaker
That is absolute dog shit that they made you do that.
01:01:38
Speaker
Austin says he loves you, but it's absolute dog shit that they made you work a shift at McDonald's.
01:01:42
Speaker
Yeah.
01:01:43
Speaker
She's Mick Hayes.
01:01:44
Speaker
That's what they put under Mick Hayes.
01:01:46
Speaker
Mick Hayes.
01:01:48
Speaker
Kat, for some context, Maddie is a teacher and was part of a fundraiser where they had teachers work an hour shift at the local McDonald's.
01:02:00
Speaker
That's like pouring salt in the wound of being a teacher.
01:02:02
Speaker
Exactly.
01:02:02
Speaker
It's absolutely bullshit.
01:02:04
Speaker
After my day of teaching, Joe told us that and it made me physically angry.
01:02:10
Speaker
It made Zach almost as angry as I was watching this movie.
01:02:14
Speaker
Any final thoughts before we get to Cats High and Low and say goodbye?
01:02:19
Speaker
Just thank you, Kat, for bringing these movies.
01:02:21
Speaker
Yeah, this was fun.
01:02:22
Speaker
This is three movies I probably would never have engaged with at this level.
01:02:25
Speaker
So I'm grateful to have done it.
01:02:27
Speaker
Very thankful that you love to do research and that you bring it to the pod.
01:02:31
Speaker
We're all very bad at that.
01:02:32
Speaker
We're all very stupid.
01:02:34
Speaker
Yeah, no, I just need friends, honestly.
01:02:37
Speaker
We're here.
01:02:39
Speaker
Open invitation to come on the show.
01:02:40
Speaker
We could use a fifth chair.
01:02:41
Speaker
Yeah.
01:02:42
Speaker
No, well, I'm sorry that I watched, I made you guys watch child rape.
01:02:50
Speaker
We watch everything.
01:02:51
Speaker
It's really not a problem.
01:02:52
Speaker
I am going to have to do a little bit of a recording at the beginning just to be like, there's conversations about sexual assault in this episode.
01:03:00
Speaker
There's conversations about sexual assault that we laugh at.
01:03:04
Speaker
I watched three Nightmare on Elm Street movies this week.
01:03:06
Speaker
It's really fine.
01:03:08
Speaker
It's really all good.
01:03:10
Speaker
Freddie does love putting his hand right where it's not supposed to go.
01:03:13
Speaker
Right where it's not supposed to be.
01:03:15
Speaker
Big yikes.
01:03:16
Speaker
Kat, we ask every guest who comes on the show to do their high and low.
01:03:20
Speaker
We typically do ours at the end of the episode, but because you are going to be saying goodbye.
Media Highlights: Shudder Series and 'Joker 2'
01:03:25
Speaker
What's the best media you've consumed over the last week and what's the worst media you've consumed over the last week?
01:03:29
Speaker
If you can't think of anything within the last seven days, go for whatever's recent, whatever you loved recently.
01:03:35
Speaker
Oh, I honestly, I forgot this question was part of the process.
01:03:41
Speaker
And I- We do too, it's okay.
01:03:43
Speaker
Here's a high.
01:03:45
Speaker
Shudder, which I recently got, I'm so happy I did.
01:03:50
Speaker
They're doing a television series or it's like a series called Horror's Greatest.
01:03:54
Speaker
I think it's like five episodes and they do, it's super diverse.
01:03:57
Speaker
They have an episode where they have like a panel on and they talk about like one episode was monsters.
01:04:01
Speaker
So they talk about-
01:04:04
Speaker
I think it's like Asian, I think it's called like kaisu.
01:04:06
Speaker
Like there's a word for like Japanese monsters.
01:04:08
Speaker
So they have a monsters episode.
01:04:09
Speaker
They have a Stephen King episode.
01:04:12
Speaker
They have a Japanese four episode, which is like, so they do and they do like, they just do, sorry, I'm like stuttering because my dog is at the door and trying to get out.
01:04:22
Speaker
I'm like playing babysitter at the same time.
01:04:24
Speaker
um but they just go through like genres of horror it's really interesting it's really short it's super fun they give you a list of movies to watch there's a japanese movie called house suit which is a great movie an absolutely batshit movie incredible movie yeah my high is just that series i feel like i have more like what was it called again
01:04:46
Speaker
house sue i mean it's house no the show the show i love the movie house that's we talked about it last week a little bit but the series oh really yeah no it's just called horror's greatest it's like five episodes even if like there's a topic you're not interested in i think it's still worth watching
01:05:03
Speaker
um oh yeah yeah and uh my low this i have not seen it so i don't know if this counts but i i am very intrigued and captivated and enthralled by how
01:05:16
Speaker
horrible reception joker 2 has gotten since i'm intrigued i'm very i'm even more intrigued than i was before i'm very excited yeah i i read all like i i saw the first one and i watched it again just as like a reminder because i did really like the first one i thought walking did an excellent job um i think for like a movie that tries to give the joker an origin story which is like
01:05:41
Speaker
kind of something you don't do i thought it was really well as like a take so i'm just really excited that everyone hates the second one i don't know i'm excited about that like yeah it makes me want to be the devil's advocate and just be like actually you're all wrong i'm intrigued that madame webb got better reviews than it madame webb made more money at the cinema score yeah yeah
01:06:04
Speaker
We might all have to watch it and then have you come back in November, even if just for like 15 minutes to talk about Joker.
01:06:10
Speaker
I'm very down for that.
01:06:11
Speaker
I'm going to see it.
01:06:12
Speaker
I haven't seen it yet.
01:06:12
Speaker
I'm going to see it as well.
01:06:14
Speaker
Yeah.
01:06:14
Speaker
So yeah, my parting thought on that too is like, I think I forget what the director's name is.
01:06:19
Speaker
Is it Zach?
01:06:20
Speaker
What's the director?
01:06:21
Speaker
Todd Phillips.
01:06:22
Speaker
Todd Phillips.
01:06:23
Speaker
A real bitch.
01:06:27
Speaker
Everyone is basically like, this is Todd Phillips.
01:06:29
Speaker
Fuck you.
01:06:30
Speaker
And I'm like, that's kind of cool.
01:06:32
Speaker
Yeah, it's fascinating.
01:06:35
Speaker
I don't know.
01:06:35
Speaker
Because the budget was insane.
01:06:37
Speaker
Yeah.
01:06:38
Speaker
And it bombed.
01:06:40
Speaker
Yeah, it's the same thing as Babylon.
01:06:43
Speaker
It seems like a fucking angry ass movie.
01:06:45
Speaker
Angry at its fans.
01:06:47
Speaker
Angry at the people who are paying for it.
01:06:48
Speaker
Like,
01:06:49
Speaker
And I fucking love Babylon.
01:06:50
Speaker
And people hated that one too.
01:06:53
Speaker
The review buzz that I've heard that makes me the saddest is that it doesn't work as a musical.
01:06:58
Speaker
I know.
01:07:00
Speaker
I think people are fucking stupid about musicals.
01:07:03
Speaker
Well, you can shut the fuck up.
01:07:05
Speaker
No, I'm saying that people don't get musicals.
01:07:07
Speaker
Sorry, sorry.
01:07:08
Speaker
Yes, you're right, Joe.
01:07:10
Speaker
Joe, I love you.
01:07:10
Speaker
I'm sorry.
01:07:11
Speaker
Shut the fuck up.
01:07:13
Speaker
I heard that they don't let Lady Gaga really sing.
01:07:16
Speaker
And that's going to be really upsetting to me.
01:07:18
Speaker
If I don't hear her go, ah, ah, ah, ah.
01:07:22
Speaker
I don't hear her do that.
01:07:23
Speaker
I'm going to be really fucking pissed off.
01:07:25
Speaker
Well, I'm off the deep end of this podcast.
01:07:28
Speaker
Thank you so much for coming on.
01:07:31
Speaker
Thank you, Kat.
01:07:31
Speaker
We'll see you next time.
01:07:32
Speaker
You're the best.
01:07:33
Speaker
Thank you so much.
01:07:34
Speaker
Bye.
01:07:36
Speaker
Joe, you were being so respectful in a way that you're never that respectful to us.
01:07:42
Speaker
It was so nice.
01:07:46
Speaker
I'm not going to bring a guest into my mood.
01:07:49
Speaker
No, which I appreciate it.
01:07:50
Speaker
I appreciate it.
01:07:50
Speaker
You were being very diplomatic.
01:07:52
Speaker
I love being rude to you guys because you all love me.
01:07:54
Speaker
Exactly.
01:07:54
Speaker
We'll forgive you.
01:07:57
Speaker
But I loved how diplomatic you were with your responses.
01:08:01
Speaker
Because I can see it in your eyes.
01:08:03
Speaker
The vitriol and the hatred.
01:08:05
Speaker
Yeah.
01:08:06
Speaker
Joe, you picked a specific film.
01:08:08
Speaker
It's called The Exorcist III.
01:08:09
Speaker
The Exorcist III Legion.
01:08:11
Speaker
Legion.
01:08:11
Speaker
Some might subtitle it.
01:08:15
Speaker
Why?
01:08:15
Speaker
Why this movie?
01:08:17
Speaker
Man, I love this movie so much.
01:08:19
Speaker
It's so fucking good.
01:08:21
Speaker
It's just... I watched it because...
01:08:25
Speaker
Criterion put out a collection on the Criterion channel a couple years ago, I think, called 90s Horror.
01:08:31
Speaker
And I was just watching a bunch of those.
01:08:32
Speaker
And I saw The Exorcist 3 on there.
01:08:34
Speaker
And I always knew about it from that jump scare that everyone talks about, the hallway one.
01:08:38
Speaker
And I'd only seen that.
01:08:39
Speaker
And I was like, this is so cool.
01:08:40
Speaker
It doesn't feel anything like the original.
01:08:43
Speaker
How is that a sequel?
01:08:45
Speaker
I don't understand.
01:08:46
Speaker
So I just threw it on.
01:08:49
Speaker
And...
01:08:50
Speaker
Holy shit.
01:08:51
Speaker
It's just... Incredible.
01:08:53
Speaker
It's just like... It has everything I love about noir, which is like snappy dialogue, moody protagonist, mystery that... George C. Scott.
01:09:01
Speaker
Yeah, George C. Scott.
01:09:02
Speaker
Yes, sir.
01:09:03
Speaker
A mystery that you can't really solve because it's impossible.
01:09:08
Speaker
And then at the same time, it has these, like, I just, I said in my Letterboxd review that it's a movie that knows how to stay in first gear until it gets around the corners.
01:09:17
Speaker
And then once it sees it straight away, it just hits the fucking gas.
01:09:20
Speaker
Yeah.
01:09:21
Speaker
And the visuals at the end of this movie are otherworldly.
01:09:26
Speaker
I mean, even, even towards the beginning, there's that, it's just like, I won't, we won't get into spoilers yet, but.
01:09:32
Speaker
It has such a sense of style and a sense of... It's such a confidently directed movie.
01:09:40
Speaker
It's both austere and very heady.
01:09:46
Speaker
It's very philosophical.
01:09:49
Speaker
But it also has gonzo-ass visuals.
01:09:54
Speaker
If someone were to ask me what my perfect movie looks like, it's very philosophical but knows how to put some fucking gasoline on the bomb
01:10:02
Speaker
fire yeah for sure i did i did a little bit of this is the most basic research but i was just looking at other movies that william peter blatty wrote that were not like his own books so like not the exorcist and i was kind of shocked to learn he worked a lot in the 60s with blake edwards who made who made a lot of british comedies with peter sellers
01:10:25
Speaker
So he was writing these like sort of witty comedies along with this career as a very famous horror writer.
01:10:33
Speaker
And to me, this movie is the marriage.
01:10:35
Speaker
Yeah.
01:10:35
Speaker
Like it's so smart.
01:10:37
Speaker
The first act of this movie is really funny.
01:10:40
Speaker
And it's so funny.
01:10:41
Speaker
Before we started recording, we were talking a little bit about like Peter Blatty or
01:10:46
Speaker
William Peter Blatty's influence and seeing... Because Joe had mentioned he's heard Blatty's not the best writer.
01:10:56
Speaker
I don't know exactly what you said.
01:10:57
Speaker
The books aren't supposed to be that good.
01:10:58
Speaker
I've heard Legion especially is quite bad as a novel.
Horror Movie Dialogue and Performance
01:11:01
Speaker
I haven't read them, but I was surprised to hear that because I've never heard tighter dialogue in a horror movie before.
01:11:09
Speaker
It's just clever, smart, funny,
01:11:14
Speaker
takes you places.
01:11:15
Speaker
And it's surprising.
01:11:16
Speaker
Like the dialogue, it completely, some of it takes you off.
01:11:19
Speaker
Like that scene that you, you, you text us about where it's like, he's like, I'm going to go see.
01:11:24
Speaker
It's a wonderful life.
01:11:24
Speaker
I've seen about 40 times.
01:11:26
Speaker
And the other piece is commendable.
01:11:27
Speaker
And he goes, you have a favorite movie.
01:11:29
Speaker
He goes,
01:11:30
Speaker
The fly.
01:11:31
Speaker
And it's a priest saying that.
01:11:32
Speaker
Yeah, it's just like so cool.
01:11:33
Speaker
It's so cool.
01:11:34
Speaker
That's what I'm saying.
01:11:35
Speaker
It's so confident.
01:11:36
Speaker
Like all the choices that it makes.
01:11:38
Speaker
Like to start on that rowboat team and then have that be the transition into the town.
01:11:44
Speaker
Like, I don't know.
01:11:45
Speaker
That doesn't have anything to do with the story, but it's a cool ass intro to the movie.
01:11:49
Speaker
Like, I don't know.
01:11:50
Speaker
I mean, it's just like all the choices that Blatty makes in this movie are just so self-assured.
01:11:56
Speaker
He's never second guessing himself.
01:11:58
Speaker
Nope.
01:11:58
Speaker
Nope.
01:11:58
Speaker
and it feels so lived in all the characters like kinderman and father dyer particularly like you feel that they've been friends for this long like it feels yeah it feels so like the way they talk to each other particularly when dyer's in the hospital and kinderman comes to visit him with the penguin and he's like kind of feeling weird that he brought the penguin
01:12:18
Speaker
And you're just like, you're just like, oh, this guy's just like a little uncomfortable to be here.
01:12:22
Speaker
He doesn't like being in hospitals.
01:12:23
Speaker
That feels very lived in.
01:12:24
Speaker
And then the way they talk to each other and he's making fun of him for having the fashion magazines and all this stuff.
01:12:30
Speaker
Like, it's just, I've, again, like you were saying, Zach, like I've never seen like horror movies are necessarily out of necessity.
01:12:39
Speaker
so interested in getting to their plot getting to their story that so few of them have that interest or getting to gags and that's what i think is most remarkable about this movie is that it it gets to gags it gets to like crazy shit that you see visually but also spends time describing things with words that you don't ever see that are just as scary like you were talking about the rowing team it's like when he's talking about the kid getting beheaded and then crucified on the oars from the boats yeah like
01:13:09
Speaker
chilling well my i'll say my favorite thing about this movie i made a note about it is that and this is this wouldn't be the case in like 0.1 of movies ever made but i love that we never see any of the dead bodies
01:13:24
Speaker
Yes, exactly.
01:13:25
Speaker
Because it's so much worse what you can imagine.
01:13:28
Speaker
Yeah.
01:13:29
Speaker
Like it knows that the more grotesque, the more horrific that the descriptions are, the less we need to see it.
01:13:38
Speaker
It's like the lust killing in Seven.
01:13:40
Speaker
Exactly.
01:13:40
Speaker
It's like what we're going to picture is already so much worse.
01:13:43
Speaker
And so like when they're describing that first kill about him, like being crucified on the oars and having his head replaced with like a wooden Jesus, it's like... With blackface.
01:13:52
Speaker
With blackface.
01:13:53
Speaker
And then they end up showing that one.
01:13:54
Speaker
I was going to say, I will correct you that they do show the crucified kid with the... Which I think that's effective because of the way that it kind of... Oh, it's perfect for the scene.
01:14:03
Speaker
Yeah.
01:14:03
Speaker
And then you see Karis on the cross right after.
01:14:06
Speaker
But it's like...
01:14:08
Speaker
I just love I love that touch of telling, not showing.
01:14:11
Speaker
And again, this is maybe the only example I can think of where that would be my preference.
01:14:15
Speaker
So I do want to say I will be rewatching this this weekend because I watched it last night and I was really, really sleepy.
01:14:23
Speaker
And I feel like I have a lot of holes in it.
01:14:26
Speaker
But like the parts that aren't holes are like so, so good.
01:14:30
Speaker
Did you see Patrick Ewing though?
01:14:33
Speaker
Yeah.
01:14:33
Speaker
You saw Pat?
01:14:34
Speaker
Okay, good.
01:14:34
Speaker
As long as you didn't miss Patrick Ewing, you got the film.
01:14:36
Speaker
Did you see Kevin Corrigan?
01:14:38
Speaker
Yeah, Kevin Corrigan.
01:14:39
Speaker
Again, so lived in.
01:14:43
Speaker
Him and Father Dyer, that just feels like any old conversation.
01:14:48
Speaker
Although I have holes in it, I rewound the dream sequence three times.
01:14:52
Speaker
Hell yeah.
01:14:52
Speaker
It's excellent.
01:14:54
Speaker
It feels like you're missing something.
01:14:55
Speaker
Yeah, because Fabio is there.
01:14:58
Speaker
And fucking Patrick Ewing is there.
01:15:00
Speaker
And you're like, what the fuck is going on?
01:15:01
Speaker
I was so confused.
01:15:02
Speaker
This is crazy.
01:15:03
Speaker
And then after three times rewinding it, I was still confused.
01:15:06
Speaker
I'm like, let's just keep going.
01:15:06
Speaker
Yeah, run it back.
01:15:08
Speaker
The more I think about it, the more I'm like, God.
01:15:10
Speaker
I mean, like, Zach and I watched The Exorcist together for the first time.
01:15:14
Speaker
The first time I had ever seen it.
01:15:16
Speaker
Oh, hilarious experience as well.
01:15:17
Speaker
I'm going to tell this very briefly.
01:15:19
Speaker
A dear friend of Zach and I's, our buddy Forrest, had seen The Exorcist.
01:15:23
Speaker
He also likes horror movies.
01:15:24
Speaker
This was either Halloween night or it was the 30th.
01:15:29
Speaker
And we're watching it on a Friday night in my old house.
01:15:33
Speaker
How long ago is this?
01:15:34
Speaker
A couple years?
01:15:35
Speaker
This is 2020.
01:15:37
Speaker
This is 2020.
01:15:40
Speaker
This is also right after I started getting into horror movies.
01:15:44
Speaker
That's about when I did too.
01:15:45
Speaker
I avoided them because I was very scaled.
01:15:48
Speaker
We're watching it.
01:15:50
Speaker
And right before Max von Sydow basically comes into the film, obviously, like, in the beginning of the film, von Sydow is there, and then it goes to DC.
01:16:03
Speaker
Yeah.
01:16:04
Speaker
It takes forever for him to come back in.
01:16:06
Speaker
I love that you talked about it feeling so lived in, because, like, it...
01:16:10
Speaker
These are great Washington, D.C.
01:16:11
Speaker
movies.
01:16:12
Speaker
I mean, it's Georgetown.
01:16:13
Speaker
You know what I mean?
01:16:13
Speaker
Totally.
01:16:15
Speaker
And Forrest is telling us that like, oh, I need to drive.
01:16:19
Speaker
Forrest is from Corpus Christi.
01:16:21
Speaker
And he's like, I need to go down to Corpus, yada, yada, yada.
01:16:24
Speaker
And basically right around the time, or it might have been the second interaction where Ellen Burstyn goes and is like, I need an exorcist.
01:16:36
Speaker
Forrest stands up, boom, stands up and then walks out.
01:16:42
Speaker
And Zach and I paused the film.
01:16:45
Speaker
We are like, we're texting Forrest.
01:16:46
Speaker
He's not responding because he's driving.
01:16:48
Speaker
He was driving to fucking Corpus.
01:16:50
Speaker
That's a six and a half hour drive.
01:16:52
Speaker
Yeah.
01:16:53
Speaker
On like a Friday night?
01:16:54
Speaker
On a Friday night at 930.
01:16:56
Speaker
That is a wild behavior.
01:16:58
Speaker
And it was so terrifying.
01:17:01
Speaker
That's really scary.
01:17:02
Speaker
Genuinely, like it didn't register with Forrest at all that like Red and I legit, that would be weird sitting on the couch with the movie turned off, like speechless and terrified, like shitting ourselves.
01:17:15
Speaker
So scary.
01:17:16
Speaker
Dude, I will say, go ahead, Red.
01:17:18
Speaker
Sorry.
01:17:18
Speaker
Oh, I was just gonna say, I fucking love the exorcist.
01:17:21
Speaker
It's a class.
01:17:22
Speaker
And thinking about, and like the performance is incredible.
01:17:26
Speaker
Elbertson's amazing.
01:17:28
Speaker
But think about Jason Miller.
01:17:29
Speaker
I was really glad to see Jason Miller back because Jason Miller to me is such an interesting figure as a performer.
01:17:36
Speaker
Because Jason Miller is a playwright.
01:17:38
Speaker
Yeah.
01:17:39
Speaker
Also Jason Patrick's father, which we should say.
01:17:42
Speaker
Oh, I didn't know that.
01:17:43
Speaker
That's interesting.
01:17:44
Speaker
Shout out to Speed 2 Cruise Control.
01:17:49
Speaker
Not good movie.
01:17:50
Speaker
With a very fun Willem Dafoe performance.
01:17:53
Speaker
One of the biggest set pieces of all time too.
01:17:56
Speaker
Very expensive movie.
01:17:57
Speaker
Practical Cruise Ship Crash.
01:17:59
Speaker
Jason Miller...
01:18:04
Speaker
I think also adds, and it's much more felt because obviously this is really Brad Dourif's movie.
01:18:10
Speaker
This is Brad Dourif and George E. Scott's film.
01:18:14
Speaker
But even the moments of which Miller comes in, and I think it actually is way more a testament to Dourif's performance of how do I...
01:18:28
Speaker
elicit and how do I become this bastardized version of Father Karras?
01:18:36
Speaker
Something I also love in the film is that George C. Scott says that Karras was 21 when he died.
01:18:41
Speaker
And it's like, you look at Jason Miller in that film and you look at Jason Miller and it's like 34.
01:18:45
Speaker
I mean, I love – Karras is – when he first goes into the cell to talk to him, and it is Jason Miller, it is Father Karras.
01:18:55
Speaker
The way he talks, I love so much.
01:18:59
Speaker
All of his ending consonants are separated from his words.
01:19:03
Speaker
He has such this weird way of talking where he's like, and he left me dead.
01:19:07
Speaker
Yeah.
01:19:09
Speaker
Like he like separates all of this stuff and it's so it's so engaging and strange.
01:19:15
Speaker
And then when Brad Dourif comes in, it's so silky smooth.
01:19:19
Speaker
It's so like low and just like it's so different, but it still has the same terror to it.
01:19:26
Speaker
I was I was interested in asking about this.
01:19:28
Speaker
So.
01:19:29
Speaker
For me, and I bet it's the same for most of you, the first time I ever saw Brad Dourif was Lord of the Rings 2, was Two Towers playing Wormtongue.
01:19:38
Speaker
And so to me, he cannot play a not scary figure to me.
01:19:44
Speaker
Anytime he's in a movie, he's freaky as fuck to me.
01:19:47
Speaker
One of the best villains in the history of the X-Files.
01:19:50
Speaker
Absolutely incredible.
01:19:51
Speaker
Oh, incredible X-Files episode.
01:19:53
Speaker
Incredible X-Files episode.
01:19:55
Speaker
Thank you for bringing that up.
01:19:56
Speaker
I like I picture him anytime I see him on screen.
01:19:59
Speaker
I just because I've seen two towers 150 times just saying like, I told you to take the wizard stuff.
01:20:07
Speaker
I think of that every single time I see him on screen.
01:20:09
Speaker
And he is unreal in this movie.
01:20:12
Speaker
Yeah.
01:20:12
Speaker
Like he's got like two or three page monologues.
01:20:16
Speaker
that he just fucking crushes.
01:20:18
Speaker
And half the time you're like, what is this guy on about?
01:20:22
Speaker
And half the time you're like, this is the scariest, basically all the time.
01:20:25
Speaker
You're like, this is the scariest book.
01:20:26
Speaker
And when he's talking about how he drained the father's blood and how, like how much care and thought he put into it.
01:20:33
Speaker
It's like, Ooh.
01:20:35
Speaker
And all the years that came into like, um, rebuilding his brain.
01:20:40
Speaker
Like, it's just like, Oh, it's, he's like, it took me 15 years, but I like it.
01:20:45
Speaker
I like it when he's like,
01:20:46
Speaker
He's so angry in that scene, but then he gets tired.
01:20:49
Speaker
Like, I love that he gets tired.
01:20:50
Speaker
It's so cool.
01:20:52
Speaker
It's so good.
01:20:52
Speaker
He's crying the whole time.
01:20:54
Speaker
Yeah, exactly.
01:20:54
Speaker
There's always a tear.
01:20:56
Speaker
Bill, George C. Scott's character, is, like, such a quippy, like, character.
01:21:01
Speaker
Like, of course he is, because that's who George C. Scott is.
01:21:04
Speaker
But there's several moments in that room that, like, cat's got his tongue, and he's just like, I don't know.
01:21:08
Speaker
He hardly talks when he's investigating him at all.
01:21:12
Speaker
Like he just lets him rant.
01:21:14
Speaker
Even though... So I was so fixed on not missing Ewing.
01:21:19
Speaker
I did not notice that there are two other people besides Fabio in that scene that caught my eye that are uncredited.
01:21:29
Speaker
One is...
01:21:31
Speaker
Larry King.
01:21:32
Speaker
No, he's Larry.
01:21:33
Speaker
No, he's he's in the restaurant at the beginning when we really.
01:21:37
Speaker
Yes.
01:21:37
Speaker
When Dyer and Bill go to eat, there's a quick shot to an old man eating with two young women.
01:21:43
Speaker
And it's Larry King.
01:21:45
Speaker
I clocked that.
01:21:46
Speaker
And I was I did text because I wanted to talk about it.
01:21:48
Speaker
The other one is I did not see Samuel L. Jackson in it.
01:21:51
Speaker
He's in it.
01:21:52
Speaker
He's wearing sunglasses.
01:21:54
Speaker
You can't... You won't notice him.
01:21:55
Speaker
Yeah.
01:21:55
Speaker
But he basically looks like he doesn't do the right thing.
01:21:58
Speaker
And this is the year after do the right thing.
01:22:01
Speaker
Very strange stuff.
01:22:02
Speaker
But he's right at the beginning when the dream first starts.
01:22:05
Speaker
I did not even notice that.
01:22:07
Speaker
That's so cool.
01:22:08
Speaker
I also... I...
01:22:11
Speaker
There's something really cool.
01:22:12
Speaker
Like there's some fucking sick horror movies that are set in hospitals.
01:22:15
Speaker
I think Halloween 2, the original Halloween 2, is fucking awesome.
01:22:20
Speaker
I love that it's set in a hospital.
01:22:23
Speaker
There's something so interesting about, and I haven't seen Exorcist 2.
01:22:29
Speaker
It's on the list for this month.
01:22:31
Speaker
But because it's, because this doesn't,
01:22:34
Speaker
It doesn't tie in.
01:22:35
Speaker
It doesn't tie in.
01:22:36
Speaker
I was like, you know what?
01:22:37
Speaker
I'm just going to watch Exorcist 3 and go ahead.
01:22:40
Speaker
I love how often, especially this and the original Exorcist, is it's like, really, they're pretty confined.
01:22:50
Speaker
Like, the original Exorcist is almost entirely confined to this beautiful house in Georgetown.
01:22:56
Speaker
And this film is almost entirely confined to this hospital.
01:22:59
Speaker
And then it like has these little moments where it leaves, but really like it is here.
01:23:03
Speaker
It is in this place.
01:23:04
Speaker
Yeah.
01:23:05
Speaker
And it is, it's a very interesting thing because it does, it has similar pacing to The Exorcist in that like, basically the moment that Von Sydow shows up in The Exorcist is it's like, all right,
01:23:19
Speaker
It's fucking on.
01:23:21
Speaker
Yeah.
01:23:21
Speaker
And it's like 35 uninterrupted minutes of the scariest shit you've ever seen in your entire content life.
01:23:28
Speaker
And this film does something similar, but it is really bold.
01:23:34
Speaker
And Joe, I loved how much you talked about the confidence and how adept Blatty is as a filmmaker to spend so much time, of which it's like, here's monologues.
01:23:45
Speaker
Not even really dialogues or long sections of which they're talking to each other.
01:23:49
Speaker
We're going to sit you in a room.
01:23:51
Speaker
The camera is like... There's a couple of shot reverse shots.
01:23:54
Speaker
There's a couple of moments in which the camera moves a little bit in that cell.
01:23:57
Speaker
But really, it's like... The camera, it's static.
01:24:00
Speaker
It's on a tripod.
01:24:01
Speaker
And Durif is just going to go.
01:24:02
Speaker
Yeah, he's letting the actors work.
01:24:05
Speaker
And that is...
Film Techniques and Visual Storytelling
01:24:09
Speaker
It was funny, last night I did a triple feature.
01:24:12
Speaker
I started with The Exorcist 3 because I knew it was going to be the scariest of the three movies that I watched.
01:24:16
Speaker
It was fucking scary.
01:24:16
Speaker
There were some parts that I was like, whoa!
01:24:18
Speaker
It's very scary.
01:24:20
Speaker
But like, it's incredibly bold and an amazing testament to the writing of this film and the performances that are at hand and at play.
01:24:33
Speaker
that you can have long stretches in a cell where not a lot is happening that is interesting visually, but that is so interesting from a pure dialogue and performance perspective that I was scared and very taken by it.
01:24:51
Speaker
And I was like, holy shit, like this is a real master at work.
01:24:55
Speaker
It's written and edited so well that like when it does take those moments to just let you listen to like three to five minutes, probably sometimes of monologue.
01:25:04
Speaker
Yeah, it doesn't lose any steam.
01:25:06
Speaker
Not at all.
01:25:08
Speaker
It's so fascinating.
01:25:09
Speaker
And he pulls the Demi trick of letting him just letting you monologue straight to camera, like which is so smart.
01:25:16
Speaker
Because if it was just happening, there's all of this weird... I was noticing when they're in the cell, there's all this weird changing of the light on Brad Dourif's face, where sometimes the right side of his face is in focus and sometimes the left side is.
01:25:30
Speaker
And it's like, that is such a simple, easy thing that keeps you engaged.
01:25:35
Speaker
Because you're like, what...
01:25:37
Speaker
Who am I watching?
01:25:38
Speaker
Who is this person?
01:25:39
Speaker
It's so vaguely supernatural too.
01:25:41
Speaker
Exactly.
01:25:42
Speaker
It's not supernatural in an in-your-face way.
01:25:44
Speaker
It's supernatural in a very like, it just kind of puts you off because there's no logic to it.
01:25:50
Speaker
Yeah.
01:25:51
Speaker
Yeah.
01:25:51
Speaker
I was doing a little bit of research on this.
01:25:53
Speaker
So I found a letterboxd list of this because I was curious about directors adapting their own novels.
01:26:02
Speaker
And like that happening.
01:26:03
Speaker
Hellraiser, I think, is the only other really primary example of a person directing a novel.
01:26:09
Speaker
But to me, like, this is the peak.
01:26:12
Speaker
Like, I was looking at this list and it's like, there's also like plays on this list.
01:26:15
Speaker
And so I'm not really counting that as much.
01:26:17
Speaker
But like, the only other thing on this list that competes for me is like,
01:26:22
Speaker
is like Miyazaki adapting his own manga, which I kind of think of as a different thing.
01:26:27
Speaker
Yeah.
01:26:28
Speaker
Like, or like Akira, because Akira is adapted from the director's own manga.
01:26:34
Speaker
But I was like, that's such a fascinating thing to take your own novel and be like, I'm going to rethink this all visually.
01:26:41
Speaker
And like Zach was saying on our text chain, like,
01:26:45
Speaker
Placing it into a universe of something else you wrote when it didn't originally exist in that universe.
01:26:51
Speaker
That's crazy.
01:26:52
Speaker
And the fact that he executes it, in my opinion, pretty seamlessly is like unreal to me that he's able to do that.
01:27:01
Speaker
Yeah, I'm kind of interested to know how the novel ends because like the addition of Father Karras is like,
01:27:07
Speaker
That seems so integral to why the movie works.
01:27:11
Speaker
Yeah.
01:27:13
Speaker
Which, I mean, that, I guess, is why it threads back as not a different film.
01:27:18
Speaker
Yeah.
01:27:20
Speaker
Something that I want to talk about Because we've just spent a lot of time talking about how good it is I want to talk about how It's still scary Like that hallway jump scare It's so ubiquitous It's on every list of top 10 jump scares When they come out of the room Like with the scissors Yeah
01:27:39
Speaker
It is, it still gets me.
01:27:42
Speaker
I know the exact moment it's going to happen.
01:27:44
Speaker
I know everything leading up to it.
01:27:46
Speaker
I've seen it before.
01:27:48
Speaker
Still got me because it is such an expertly constructed, filled with restraint scene.
01:27:54
Speaker
Yeah.
01:27:55
Speaker
It's so long.
01:27:56
Speaker
Yeah.
01:27:58
Speaker
It's mostly from that ultra wide.
01:28:01
Speaker
It barely cuts to close up.
01:28:05
Speaker
Like, it does a couple times, and then there's... It does the fake jump scare thing.
01:28:09
Speaker
Like, it does, like, the bait-and-switch jump scare.
01:28:12
Speaker
Yeah, where the guy jumps out of the bed.
01:28:14
Speaker
But most directors who do a bait-and-switch jump scare scare you right after the bait-and-switch.
01:28:19
Speaker
Yeah.
01:28:20
Speaker
He makes you wait.
01:28:22
Speaker
Like...
01:28:23
Speaker
I'm thinking of one that I particularly like, which is in Candyman, which is the mirror one that makes you think, oh, he's going to be behind her.
01:28:30
Speaker
When she closes the mirror, he's going to be behind her.
01:28:32
Speaker
And then, nope, he's behind the mirror.
01:28:36
Speaker
Yeah.
01:28:37
Speaker
Which is so sick.
01:28:38
Speaker
But this one is like, okay, we know that the devil is in this hospital.
01:28:45
Speaker
We don't know where he is.
01:28:48
Speaker
He's supposedly locked up in a cell.
01:28:51
Speaker
And also, like, we genuinely don't know how he's committing these murders because it hasn't been made clear yet.
01:29:00
Speaker
And the only explanation that really is ever given for my money is that catatonics are easy to possess, which is what he says.
01:29:08
Speaker
It's just old people.
01:29:09
Speaker
It's just old people, which leads me to the other biggest scare in the movie, which is the old woman crawling on the ceiling.
01:29:15
Speaker
so fucking which is fucking and the way he shoots it where he speeds up the the frame rate a little bit it's so scary and it's now been repeated it's now repeated ad nauseum oh shit my connection's bad sorry gang
01:29:33
Speaker
And fucking good.
01:29:35
Speaker
Yeah.
01:29:36
Speaker
Oh, you're good.
01:29:36
Speaker
You're good.
01:29:36
Speaker
That I thought was kind of fun.
01:29:37
Speaker
I watched dream warriors the night before watching this.
01:29:39
Speaker
And while being totally very different movies, it is a very cool that there are two third entries in huge horror franchises that just spend the entire movie attributing like supernatural, uh,
01:29:54
Speaker
possession just written off as like psychosis or mental health and like that just adding to the terror we talked last episode a little bit about like something that's so scary about horror movies is like the gaslighting of them just no one believing you and mental health is a perfect way to do that because it whether you recognize it or not in your own life and journey it affects us all yeah for real
01:30:23
Speaker
I also love the scene where the nurse with the garden shears is on her way to George C. Scott's house.
01:30:33
Speaker
And like when he calls her and she's like, oh, OK, sounds good.
01:30:38
Speaker
And then it comes back to him and he's like, what is he?
01:30:40
Speaker
Yeah.
01:30:42
Speaker
And then and then like when he gets home and he's like, oh, nothing's wrong.
01:30:49
Speaker
And then you're like pants to her.
01:30:51
Speaker
That's such a that's such an effective moment of horror storytelling.
01:30:55
Speaker
Well, and it's like it's like you were saying, Joe, at that moment to me, the moment of her in the cab is equally horror storytelling and noir storytelling.
01:31:03
Speaker
Yep.
01:31:03
Speaker
It's like that moment could be present in either genre.
01:31:06
Speaker
And the fact that they're being married in that moment, it makes it like all the more effective.
01:31:12
Speaker
Like it's just so special.
01:31:13
Speaker
My personal favorite scene, besides I think the last like chunk of this movie that takes place inside the padded cell is some of the best horror film of all time.
01:31:23
Speaker
Lights out.
01:31:24
Speaker
But my other favorite sequence that truly like blew my mind that a novelist could
01:31:30
Speaker
not only perceive but also execute the scene is the one where he's going to see the father mourning.
01:31:39
Speaker
And he they're just having a conversation.
01:31:44
Speaker
He notices the lights are flickering, walks outside of his office,
01:31:49
Speaker
And then just hears these evil ass whispers in Latin.
01:31:55
Speaker
And it's so scary.
01:31:57
Speaker
It's so tense.
01:31:59
Speaker
It's weird.
01:32:01
Speaker
The sound design, the sound design all over this movie is insanely good.
01:32:04
Speaker
But the sound design in this scene, I was like,
01:32:07
Speaker
How do you, how do you, like as a novelist, I like, I get that people can be talented at two different things, whatever.
01:32:14
Speaker
But as a novelist, that's not how you write.
01:32:17
Speaker
Yeah.
01:32:17
Speaker
Like that, that doesn't work in a novel.
01:32:19
Speaker
There's another thing.
01:32:20
Speaker
One of my favorite shots is right at the beginning of the movie.
01:32:23
Speaker
And it's when you have a first person camera view of tumbling down the stairs.
01:32:28
Speaker
Yeah.
01:32:28
Speaker
Very cool.
01:32:30
Speaker
So good.
01:32:31
Speaker
I literally had that moment of which I went.
01:32:33
Speaker
Okay, so this is 1990.
01:32:34
Speaker
I'm thinking about... Yeah, I said 90.
01:32:40
Speaker
Yeah, I thought you were leading into another... No, no, no.
01:32:44
Speaker
I started to think.
01:32:45
Speaker
I was like, okay, so thinking about how large a 35mm camera is and how big is the cage that they have to build around it to push it down because...
01:32:54
Speaker
Because it is very obvious that this is not something that is generated.
01:32:59
Speaker
Like, they pushed the camera down the stairs.
01:33:02
Speaker
But then thinking about, like, it's the fun... This is, like, the fun part of being fucking, like, dorks like us is then getting to imagine, like, what does that look like?
01:33:13
Speaker
You're, like, at the stairs, and you're like, okay, so I need this shot.
01:33:17
Speaker
So then it's like, do they build a cage that you put around the camera and then they push the camera down or they put a track on and then they push it?
01:33:23
Speaker
Or are they building a small section of stairs and the stairs spin around the camera?
01:33:28
Speaker
And then it's like, it's just, it's incredible.
01:33:31
Speaker
It's like bravado filmmaking.
01:33:32
Speaker
They just put a wheel around the camera.
01:33:35
Speaker
I think that's what they did is, in my opinion, I think that it was a, like they built a, they built a wheel on tracks and then rolled it down the tracks.
01:33:46
Speaker
Yeah.
01:33:47
Speaker
But it goes to your point, Joe, of like, yeah, this is not like a filmmaker by trade.
01:33:54
Speaker
Like this is a person who writes novels and writes a few screenplays here and there.
01:33:57
Speaker
Let me tell you what, I didn't finish it, but his other movie, The Ninth Configuration, is just as visually fucking nutso.
01:34:05
Speaker
I'm going to watch it tonight.
01:34:06
Speaker
One of the first visuals in Ninth Configuration is this rocket ship that's about to take off.
01:34:13
Speaker
it's like starts to leak like the, like the steam or whatever.
01:34:16
Speaker
And then a giant ass superimposition of the moon comes up behind it and it just gets bigger and bigger and bigger.
01:34:23
Speaker
And you can like, it's, it looks obviously like it looks kind of cartoony and a little bit stop motion.
01:34:29
Speaker
But it's just like, how'd you think of that?
01:34:33
Speaker
Is it 9th Configuration is about Vietnam War vets?
01:34:37
Speaker
It's about a special it's about an experimental psych ward for men who developed psychosis in Vietnam and the military thinks they're faking it.
01:34:51
Speaker
Oh, sick.
01:34:53
Speaker
I'm going to watch it tonight.
01:34:56
Speaker
Also starring Jason Miller, Ed Flanders, and Scott Wilson.
01:35:00
Speaker
By the way, Ed Flanders, hilarious name.
01:35:03
Speaker
Let's just get that out of the way.
01:35:05
Speaker
Speaking of, I've been re-watching so much Treehouse of Horror.
01:35:10
Speaker
Yeah.
01:35:10
Speaker
Oh, nice.
01:35:12
Speaker
Love that.
01:35:13
Speaker
Maybe we have to do a little PGW selects where we talk about some treehouse of horror.
01:35:16
Speaker
I think it'd be a fun like half hour episode or something that we just throw in.
01:35:22
Speaker
You know, when I think about how great of a director William Peter Blatty is and how great of a writer is, it reminds me of how gifted Joe is at podcasting and beating off.
01:35:31
Speaker
Dual roles.
01:35:34
Speaker
There was not enough Jackoff talk in the first half of the episode, so I had to bring it in now.
01:35:38
Speaker
Again, respectful of our guests.
01:35:40
Speaker
We don't want to do all the Jackoff talk, but it is necessary.
01:35:43
Speaker
And by the way, it's really hard to talk about jacking off when you're talking about a movie that has naked 16-year-olds in it.
01:35:50
Speaker
It's true.
01:35:50
Speaker
The least toy you can possibly be is during that movie.
01:35:54
Speaker
I'll be honest, I thought this was going to be the movie that had Titty in it.
01:35:57
Speaker
I didn't think any of the other films we were talking about would have Titty in it.
01:36:00
Speaker
No, Blatty's too Catholic for Titty.
01:36:02
Speaker
Yeah, he's very Catholic.
01:36:05
Speaker
He's not showing you bush.
01:36:06
Speaker
I love the Catholics.
01:36:07
Speaker
This is one of the most Catholic movies I've ever seen.
01:36:10
Speaker
Oh, unreal Catholic.
01:36:12
Speaker
There's a line in the Ninth Configuration where the guy goes, you show me a Catholic, I'll show you a junkie.
01:36:18
Speaker
Damn.
01:36:19
Speaker
Sick.
01:36:20
Speaker
I've never seen more church mechanics explained in a movie.
01:36:27
Speaker
Yeah.
01:36:27
Speaker
For real.
01:36:28
Speaker
Physical mechanics inside a church.
01:36:30
Speaker
It's so funny to me how Catholic Blatty is.
01:36:34
Speaker
Contrasted with other Catholic filmmakers like Schrader and Torsese.
01:36:39
Speaker
They are Catholic in such different ways.
01:36:41
Speaker
Yeah, that's true.
01:36:44
Speaker
I also think Schrader is actually a little bit more Protestant in a lot of ways.
01:36:49
Speaker
I think he was actually traditionally raised Lutheran, which actually Lutheran is Catholic light.
01:36:53
Speaker
Respect to my Lutherans.
01:36:55
Speaker
But you're right.
01:36:56
Speaker
Shout out to my Lutherans.
01:36:57
Speaker
My extended family is all Lutherans.
01:37:00
Speaker
I love him to death.
01:37:02
Speaker
But you're right.
01:37:04
Speaker
It's fascinating.
01:37:05
Speaker
It is very interesting.
01:37:06
Speaker
He's religious in a way where it's like, oh my God, the scene where
01:37:11
Speaker
the Legion looks up at Scott who's pinned to the wall and says, did I help your unbelief?
01:37:16
Speaker
And Scott goes, I believe in death.
01:37:20
Speaker
Yeah.
01:37:20
Speaker
I believe in sickness.
01:37:22
Speaker
Yeah.
01:37:23
Speaker
But when he goes, I believe in slime.
01:37:26
Speaker
I was like, Whoa.
01:37:28
Speaker
Now can you do that again?
01:37:29
Speaker
Put it in your blood of unsaid and his claw voice.
01:37:32
Speaker
I believe in sin.
01:37:35
Speaker
I believe in dick.
01:37:37
Speaker
I believe in dick.
01:37:38
Speaker
And most of all, I believe in you.
01:37:42
Speaker
We have it.
01:37:44
Speaker
What does Jerry Seinfeld believe in?
01:37:46
Speaker
16-year-olds.
01:37:49
Speaker
Jerry Seinfeld would love Blood on Satan's Claw.
01:37:51
Speaker
I love Blood on Satan's Claw.
01:37:54
Speaker
It's crazy.
01:37:54
Speaker
They never let you look at a naked 16-year-old.
01:37:57
Speaker
You got to watch the British.
01:37:58
Speaker
You got to watch the Blood on Satan's Claw.
01:38:01
Speaker
What's the deal with the Blood on Satan's Claw?
01:38:04
Speaker
Where is it?
01:38:05
Speaker
Why is that blood not on my penis?
01:38:08
Speaker
You're getting into Woody Allen there.
01:38:09
Speaker
Yeah, sorry.
01:38:11
Speaker
Who also loves 16 year olds.
01:38:12
Speaker
Why is the blood not on my penis?
01:38:14
Speaker
That's my Woody Allen.
01:38:16
Speaker
And not my therapist.
01:38:17
Speaker
Not on my therapist.
01:38:18
Speaker
Oh, I called my therapist.
01:38:20
Speaker
They talk about my love of 16 year olds.
01:38:22
Speaker
And then I married my daughter.
01:38:26
Speaker
One thing I do want to say, because we haven't, I don't think talked about it, is how fucking incredible George C. Scott is in this movie.
01:38:33
Speaker
You know what?
01:38:33
Speaker
I was just thinking about this.
01:38:35
Speaker
Specifically, how come we don't have horror movies now with just insanely respected classic actors?
01:38:44
Speaker
I also didn't realize my review of this movie last night was George C. Scott is my hero and I didn't realize until after I pressed post that George C. Scott is also my Letterboxd profile picture.
01:38:58
Speaker
In a very different performance.
01:39:00
Speaker
It would be cool if George C. Scott looked at
01:39:04
Speaker
the demon or like right as he was about to shoot Father Karras to get this whole thing over with and he goes I'm mad as hell and I'm not gonna take it anymore or the moment where he he's walking out after Chasta and then for being racist and he's like go home see your families talk about WAFs that was so incredible right after right after quoting Macbeth he says tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow and then he says go home
01:39:33
Speaker
It's crazy how smart this movie is.
01:39:35
Speaker
It's just, it's one of the smartest.
01:39:37
Speaker
It's so brilliant.
01:39:38
Speaker
Yeah.
01:39:38
Speaker
A Spaceballs reference in this film.
01:39:41
Speaker
Yeah.
01:39:41
Speaker
There is.
01:39:42
Speaker
May the Schwartz be with you.
01:39:44
Speaker
I mean, he talks about the fly.
01:39:46
Speaker
Like the guy, the guy has his finger on the pulse.
01:39:48
Speaker
He really does.
01:39:50
Speaker
It really does.
01:39:51
Speaker
It's incredible.
01:39:53
Speaker
Basically, all we've been saying for the past 45 minutes that we have talked about this movie is that William Peter Blatty cannot make a wrong choice.
01:40:04
Speaker
He just is incapable of making a bad directing choice.
01:40:08
Speaker
Which, let's talk about the ratings that this movie received.
01:40:11
Speaker
What the fuck?
01:40:13
Speaker
Nobody got it.
01:40:14
Speaker
Did it get bad reviews?
01:40:15
Speaker
50% on most of the places.
01:40:16
Speaker
What?
01:40:17
Speaker
Yeah.
01:40:18
Speaker
That's crazy to me.
01:40:20
Speaker
It blew my mind when I saw that.
01:40:22
Speaker
Was Pauline still writing reviews when this movie came out?
01:40:24
Speaker
I'd be interested in her take.
01:40:27
Speaker
I'd also like to know what Pauline thought.
01:40:28
Speaker
Hold on.
01:40:29
Speaker
I just bought a huge book of Pauline reviews.
01:40:32
Speaker
RogerEbert.com.
01:40:34
Speaker
Okay.
01:40:34
Speaker
While y'all are looking at reviews, I just want to say to the listener, if you rate your movies with the five-star system, stop that.
01:40:42
Speaker
Yeah, all of us here at PGW are thumbs down on the five-star system.
01:40:46
Speaker
That's all I have to say.
01:40:47
Speaker
Conversely, thumbs down.
01:40:49
Speaker
Use the thumb system.
01:40:51
Speaker
God gave you two.
01:40:51
Speaker
Yeah.
01:40:53
Speaker
Yeah.
01:40:53
Speaker
Yeah.
01:40:54
Speaker
I agree.
01:40:56
Speaker
I agree.
01:40:56
Speaker
This one makes me mad.
01:40:57
Speaker
I did not find a review that Roger Ebert wrote on The Exorcist 3.
01:41:03
Speaker
That's so fascinating.
01:41:04
Speaker
I bet Cisco liked it, though.
01:41:06
Speaker
What did you do, Joe?
01:41:07
Speaker
There's a review written for The Washington Post by Rita Kempley.
01:41:12
Speaker
I don't know this person.
01:41:13
Speaker
Fuck you, can't play.
01:41:14
Speaker
But the rating is a 50 out of 100.
01:41:16
Speaker
But this is Metacritic.
01:41:17
Speaker
They're assuming.
01:41:19
Speaker
But the review says it is unsparing when it comes to gruesome depictions and ominous characters, but it's got more giggles than goosebumps.
01:41:26
Speaker
The Exorcist 3 isn't about to scare anybody.
01:41:30
Speaker
That's bullshit.
01:41:30
Speaker
What movie were you watching, you dumb piece of shit?
01:41:32
Speaker
That person didn't see the right cut.
01:41:34
Speaker
That's crazy.
01:41:37
Speaker
I don't think this... I mean, this is the peak of Siskel and Eber.
01:41:40
Speaker
I don't think that there's a review.
01:41:42
Speaker
Which is fascinating.
01:41:43
Speaker
I wonder if we could find a show like a Siskel and Ebert.
01:41:47
Speaker
No, dude, I mean, most episodes of Siskel and Ebert and even... They're mostly on YouTube.
01:41:51
Speaker
I think Leonard Malton have to think about this movie.
01:41:54
Speaker
Oh, fucking Leonard.
01:41:56
Speaker
What about... What was the guy's name?
01:41:58
Speaker
There was the New York Times guy.
01:42:00
Speaker
I can't remember his fucking name.
01:42:02
Speaker
I wonder what John Simon... Yeah, yeah.
01:42:04
Speaker
What's Tony Scott think about this?
01:42:07
Speaker
Ayo, Scott.
01:42:08
Speaker
I'd love to know.
01:42:09
Speaker
He goes by Tony.
01:42:12
Speaker
No, he doesn't.
01:42:13
Speaker
I swear on my life.
01:42:14
Speaker
A.O.
01:42:15
Speaker
Scott goes by Tony.
01:42:16
Speaker
Yes.
01:42:17
Speaker
His friends call him Tony.
01:42:19
Speaker
That's fucking absurd.
01:42:21
Speaker
I swear on my life.
01:42:22
Speaker
We're talking about the New York Times film.
01:42:24
Speaker
Yes.
01:42:25
Speaker
His name is Tony.
01:42:27
Speaker
He goes by his first name is Anthony.
01:42:30
Speaker
He goes by Tony to his friends.
01:42:31
Speaker
A.O.
01:42:31
Speaker
Scott is his fucking pen name.
01:42:34
Speaker
news to me.
01:42:35
Speaker
I know.
01:42:36
Speaker
The reason he doesn't go by Tony Scott.
01:42:38
Speaker
There's a director named that.
01:42:40
Speaker
This review is funny because it makes it sound awesome.
01:42:44
Speaker
It's a zero out of a hundred review from Entertainment Weekly.
01:42:47
Speaker
It says The Exorcist 3 has the feel of a nightmare catechism lesson or a movie made by a depressed monk.
01:42:54
Speaker
That sounds cool as hell.
01:42:55
Speaker
You can't write a negative review and then talk about how awesome it is.
01:42:58
Speaker
That sounds like Paul Strader writing a five star review.
01:43:02
Speaker
This is again like a thing of
01:43:06
Speaker
We can't let not perverts review these movies.
01:43:10
Speaker
Yeah.
01:43:11
Speaker
It's a pervert.
01:43:12
Speaker
This one's dumb.
01:43:13
Speaker
This one's from the Miami Herald.
01:43:15
Speaker
This one says, Exorcist 3 is as gory, convoluted, and deafening as any Nightmare on Elm Street sequel.
01:43:21
Speaker
Which, first of all, the Nightmare on Elm Street sequels are awesome.
01:43:24
Speaker
Sounds cool, brother.
01:43:26
Speaker
Yeah, sounds good to me, my man.
01:43:28
Speaker
I like the sequels more.
01:43:33
Speaker
I'm kind of with you having seen three of them yeah Red I just have to say A.O.
01:43:38
Speaker
Scott's Wikipedia his name is Anthony Oliver Scott under other names Tony Scott I believe you I just thought it was fucking insane it is pretty wild I'm sorry any other thoughts on The Exorcist 3 we've been going like almost it's so good if you haven't seen it go watch the damn flick
01:43:59
Speaker
If The Exorcist didn't exist, this would be my favorite Exorcist movie.
01:44:03
Speaker
For sure.
01:44:05
Speaker
This is my favorite Exorcist movie because it is exactly the kind of thing.
01:44:10
Speaker
I think The Exorcist is a perfect movie, but it is so viscerally upsetting for me to watch it.
01:44:17
Speaker
This is more fun.
01:44:18
Speaker
This is a fun and also scary horror movie.
01:44:21
Speaker
I have...
01:44:22
Speaker
I like horror movies, but I like my horror movies to be fun.
01:44:26
Speaker
Yeah.
01:44:26
Speaker
Like, I think The Witch is perfect.
01:44:29
Speaker
I think The Witch is genuinely a perfect movie.
Impact of 'The Exorcist' and Audience Reactions
01:44:31
Speaker
I will not watch it again because it scared the bejesus out of me.
01:44:35
Speaker
So what do you not find fun about a demon saying your mother sucks cocks in hell?
01:44:39
Speaker
Your mother sucks cocks in hell.
01:44:41
Speaker
Your mother sucks cocks in hell.
01:44:42
Speaker
That is funny now.
01:44:43
Speaker
Yeah, it's hilarious.
01:44:46
Speaker
It's because we've been so internet poisoned that your mother sucks cock in hell is just something that you see on Twitter every day.
01:44:53
Speaker
I will say Clarissa and I last year for the 50th anniversary saw The Exorcist in a theater.
01:44:59
Speaker
We drove to Temple to see it at the Cinemarkan Temple and like...
01:45:04
Speaker
I've hardly ever been that blown away.
01:45:08
Speaker
I actually haven't rewatched it once.
01:45:10
Speaker
It's so scary.
01:45:11
Speaker
Because it scares me a lot.
01:45:14
Speaker
Nothing scares me more than demons.
01:45:16
Speaker
My dad saw The Exorcist in theaters the day it came out.
01:45:20
Speaker
Oh my god.
01:45:21
Speaker
Is that like 12 years old?
01:45:25
Speaker
Was he 12 years old when it came out?
01:45:27
Speaker
My dad is almost 70.
01:45:30
Speaker
Oh, okay.
01:45:31
Speaker
So he was like 18.
01:45:32
Speaker
My mom was 19 when it came out.
01:45:34
Speaker
She's 70, so I was just curious.
01:45:36
Speaker
Yeah, my dad also started in theaters, but he was 18.
01:45:40
Speaker
He said there were people in the theater who had to leave to throw up.
01:45:44
Speaker
There was like... My dad said he didn't sleep very well for days afterwards.
01:45:50
Speaker
Yeah, I believe it, man.
01:45:51
Speaker
At that point, like...
01:45:54
Speaker
Holy shit.
01:45:55
Speaker
It's scary now.
01:45:56
Speaker
And I can't imagine in the seventies, like, because we've all, we've all seen the derivatives of the exorcist.
01:46:03
Speaker
We've all seen like people, we've seen people break down how to do the stunts they did in that movie.
01:46:08
Speaker
Yeah.
01:46:09
Speaker
You know, but there's still nothing scarier.
01:46:10
Speaker
Like it still works like gang.
01:46:12
Speaker
Like we, we know it's pea soup, you know, but, but like, imagine not knowing that.
01:46:17
Speaker
And imagine like, I mean, I I'm assuming it's kind of similar to how people reacted to the great train robbery.
01:46:24
Speaker
that scared the shit out of people or the psycho like you know it's all it's all in the soup there it's like in the pea soup mind you it's like it really like people just being like there's no way this is possible like people are probably going to look back in like 20 years and be like you were scared by hereditary and i'm like yes the fuck i was i had to leave the theater fucking scary it's really fucking scary
01:46:47
Speaker
Any final thoughts, gentlemen, before we get to the Akira Kurosawa high and low?
01:46:52
Speaker
Let's do it.
01:46:52
Speaker
Let's honor Akira and do our highs and lows.
Weekly Media Discussion: Best and Worst
01:46:55
Speaker
The Akira Kurosawa high and low for listeners who have never listened to the show before.
01:47:00
Speaker
In which case, welcome, I guess.
01:47:02
Speaker
I don't know.
01:47:02
Speaker
There's no way you're listening to the show for the first time.
01:47:06
Speaker
We got this far.
01:47:06
Speaker
As we're almost 30 episodes into this show over a year.
01:47:11
Speaker
I'm sorry, almost half a year.
01:47:13
Speaker
Almost half a year.
01:47:13
Speaker
Just over half a year, rather.
01:47:14
Speaker
I don't know how to do math.
01:47:16
Speaker
Fuck math.
01:47:17
Speaker
You're doing great.
01:47:18
Speaker
We still haven't figured out how to market it.
01:47:20
Speaker
It's true.
01:47:21
Speaker
It's true.
01:47:21
Speaker
Maybe we'll get on the ticky-tock.
01:47:22
Speaker
Maybe we'll post about Joe.
01:47:24
Speaker
I've started messaging pseudo-famous people and commenting on Twitter.
01:47:28
Speaker
Zach messaged John Carpenter and tried to get him to come on.
01:47:31
Speaker
Next week's episode is John Carpenter and the Fog with Andrew Ingalls.
01:47:38
Speaker
That's right, baby.
01:47:39
Speaker
I got to do some re-watching.
01:47:41
Speaker
Yeah, me too.
01:47:43
Speaker
I already thought about so many things.
01:47:45
Speaker
I want to talk about the fog next week.
01:47:47
Speaker
And I haven't rewatched it.
01:47:48
Speaker
That's going to be one I'm going to fire up.
01:47:50
Speaker
Rips, dude.
01:47:51
Speaker
I also saw Christine in the theater last year.
01:47:53
Speaker
Fucking incredible.
01:47:54
Speaker
Incredible.
01:47:55
Speaker
I love it.
01:47:56
Speaker
We're going to talk about highs and lows are best and worst media of the week.
01:48:00
Speaker
Zach, are you good to go first?
01:48:02
Speaker
Yeah.
01:48:04
Speaker
I mean, we talked about already.
01:48:06
Speaker
I,
01:48:08
Speaker
Although there were fun things to glean from it, I had the hardest time getting through Blood on Satan's Claw.
01:48:15
Speaker
There were just 10, 15-minute stretches where I'm like, okay, come on, come on.
01:48:20
Speaker
But we talked about it already, so I won't go much deeper.
01:48:26
Speaker
Honorable mention to an album...
01:48:30
Speaker
And I'm pulling it up because I don't know how to pronounce it exactly.
01:48:33
Speaker
But they were just on Tiny Desk and did an acoustic version of some like Latin reggaeton like hip hop too.
01:48:43
Speaker
But Catriel and Paco Amoroso have a new album called Banho Maria that is just like fun and stupid and recommended.
01:48:53
Speaker
And the Tiny Desk too, if you haven't seen it.
01:48:55
Speaker
It's very cool.
01:48:57
Speaker
Very fun rhythmic stuff.
01:48:58
Speaker
So that's my honorable mention.
01:48:59
Speaker
I don't usually talk about music on here for that stuff.
01:49:02
Speaker
Love it.
01:49:02
Speaker
But, I mean, dude, it's probably... Shit, man.
01:49:09
Speaker
I...
01:49:10
Speaker
Most of the movies I watched this week were stuff that we've talked about today because we tried to fit a lot of stuff in.
01:49:16
Speaker
That's true.
01:49:17
Speaker
Just for the sake of not choosing something that we've talked about already, Halloween is a perfect fucking movie.
01:49:27
Speaker
Amen.
01:49:29
Speaker
I think it's going to make the rotation of non-October horror season just casual comfort movie rewatches.
01:49:36
Speaker
Halloween should not be as much of a comfortable, cozy movie as it is.
01:49:40
Speaker
It just is, though.
01:49:41
Speaker
It is a warm hug for me when I watch it.
01:49:43
Speaker
Totally.
01:49:45
Speaker
Yeah.
01:49:45
Speaker
So yeah, that's it.
01:49:47
Speaker
Halloween.
01:49:48
Speaker
Shout out John Carpenter.
01:49:50
Speaker
I want to hear from... Let's throw it back to you, Red.
01:49:53
Speaker
Yeah.
01:49:55
Speaker
My low is I was at work trying to listen to music on Spotify and nothing felt inspired.
01:50:04
Speaker
And so I was like, you know what?
01:50:05
Speaker
Let's go to my day list.
01:50:06
Speaker
I went to my day list.
01:50:06
Speaker
My day list sucked.
01:50:08
Speaker
Or at least it wasn't what I wanted to listen in the moment.
01:50:09
Speaker
So go to the Spotify DJ function, which I had never used before.
01:50:12
Speaker
Yeah.
01:50:14
Speaker
Hey, Red, it's X. You're D. Joe, that is exactly what I was going to say.
01:50:20
Speaker
It's so annoying.
01:50:22
Speaker
I liked the wrecks that it gave me when I skipped that bullshit, but I was like, let's go back to what you were listening to in 2005.
01:50:31
Speaker
And it's also marketed as this next generation AI thing, but it's literally just a dude that recorded a bunch of soundbites.
01:50:38
Speaker
Yeah, it's absolutely terrible.
01:50:40
Speaker
It's not actually AI.
01:50:42
Speaker
It's the standard Spotify algorithm.
01:50:43
Speaker
Just pulling from your own data.
01:50:46
Speaker
Yeah, exactly.
01:50:48
Speaker
I liked the Rex, but I was like, what the fuck?
01:50:49
Speaker
Honor will mention... Zach, I'm also going to mention some music.
01:50:53
Speaker
I have been listening to...
01:50:56
Speaker
A lot of really great music lately, and even kind of outside of what I've normally been listening to.
01:51:00
Speaker
This year has mostly been Charlie XCX and country music for me.
01:51:05
Speaker
But the last week or so, I have gotten back into Benny the Butcher and Griselda.
01:51:10
Speaker
It's not really getting back.
01:51:11
Speaker
It's just like reminding myself...
01:51:18
Speaker
reminding myself that Griselda is the best active rap group on the planet right now and I just need them to keep making music especially Griselda albums together because I also I need that Conway shit that gravel and I have been listening again I got really into this record earlier this year but 3D Country by Geese so fucking good man
01:51:45
Speaker
is a record that is so musically tight in a way that is awesome.
01:51:50
Speaker
It's literally interesting.
01:51:51
Speaker
It's legit one of the best rock albums I've heard in a long time.
01:51:56
Speaker
Just like classic, just straight up rock and roll.
01:51:58
Speaker
I'm going to listen to it tomorrow.
01:52:01
Speaker
The song I sent y'all earlier in the chat, if you want some more MJ Linderman type shit, that is where to go.
01:52:10
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, to open that record...
01:52:14
Speaker
3D Country by Geese is just a fucking awesome record.
01:52:18
Speaker
If you like rock and roll music, open on 21-22.
01:52:20
Speaker
If you want the most palatable Geese song, you should either listen to the title track or Cowboy Nudes.
01:52:28
Speaker
The bass line on Cowboy Nudes goes crazy.
01:52:30
Speaker
Hell yeah.
01:52:32
Speaker
It's a great title.
01:52:35
Speaker
It's interesting that Zach said...
01:52:37
Speaker
not to just talk about the shit we can talk about.
01:52:39
Speaker
I think my high is fucking The Exorcist 3.
01:52:40
Speaker
That's great.
01:52:43
Speaker
If I add to say a movie that wasn't The Exorcist 3, but it's also, we're talking about it in two weeks, is I rewatched The Blair Witch Project.
01:52:53
Speaker
This is my third or fourth time this year watching The Blair Witch Project.
01:52:56
Speaker
I still am like... That's sick.
01:52:58
Speaker
I'm going to save most of my thoughts, but I keep building...
01:53:03
Speaker
more of my thoughts of the depth of that film.
01:53:06
Speaker
It's also really interesting because we're going to talk about that movie in the context of found footage, but it's a folk horror.
01:53:14
Speaker
He's gone.
01:53:15
Speaker
Sorry, it froze for a second.
01:53:16
Speaker
We're going to have to figure this out and perhaps in the future we might have to all start recording our own audio.
01:53:20
Speaker
You're doing great.
01:53:22
Speaker
When you really think about it, like,
01:53:24
Speaker
Blair Witch is a folk war.
01:53:26
Speaker
Yeah.
01:53:26
Speaker
Yeah.
01:53:26
Speaker
No, it's definitely in the lineage with this, with these movies you talked about today.
01:53:29
Speaker
For sure.
01:53:30
Speaker
It's definitely like an American folk war because we build our folklore off of like, you know, like a creature that no one's ever seen.
01:53:38
Speaker
And like stories of townspeople and like,
01:53:42
Speaker
And it's like pseudo-religious.
01:53:47
Speaker
It's not like British folk horror where it's like, okay, this is actively Satan.
01:53:51
Speaker
It's more like, hey, what the fuck is this thing?
01:53:54
Speaker
Do you know what I want to say?
01:53:55
Speaker
Did we do a cryptozoology segment with the found footage episode?
01:53:59
Speaker
Yes.
01:54:01
Speaker
I could talk a lot about Moth, man.
01:54:04
Speaker
Love it.
01:54:05
Speaker
I was talking about this with a friend the other day.
01:54:06
Speaker
You know what I want to see that I haven't really seen is a Mormon horror story.
01:54:11
Speaker
Did you know that there's one coming out?
01:54:13
Speaker
What is that?
01:54:14
Speaker
Heretic.
01:54:15
Speaker
Oh, is that Mormon?
01:54:17
Speaker
So it's two Mormon missionaries are Mormon.
01:54:20
Speaker
Oh, yes.
01:54:20
Speaker
Yes, I did.
01:54:21
Speaker
Okay.
01:54:22
Speaker
So to me, it's fascinating because Mormonism is the only American religion.
01:54:28
Speaker
And so it's the only one established in the United States of America.
01:54:32
Speaker
And so I really-
01:54:33
Speaker
Where's Jehovah's Witness from?
01:54:35
Speaker
Your mom's house.
01:54:39
Speaker
No, I should say Mormonism was the first American religion.
01:54:47
Speaker
It was the first one established.
01:54:49
Speaker
And frankly, the best.
01:54:52
Speaker
If we're comparing Mormonism and Scientology, I'm going to have to go with Mormons.
01:54:56
Speaker
I go with Mormons.
01:54:59
Speaker
I love the state of Utah.
01:55:00
Speaker
It's incredible.
01:55:00
Speaker
Mormons gave us the killers.
01:55:03
Speaker
It's true.
01:55:04
Speaker
Shout out to Brandon Flowers.
01:55:06
Speaker
And Imagine Dragons.
01:55:08
Speaker
And Imagine Dragon, these nuts across your forehead.
01:55:11
Speaker
I want to hear from Austin.
01:55:11
Speaker
Bing, bong.
01:55:13
Speaker
Shout out.
01:55:13
Speaker
Okay.
Classic Horror and Modern Critiques
01:55:15
Speaker
My low for this week is I watched the original I Know What You Did Last Summer, which I thought was like this movie.
01:55:22
Speaker
I thought it was fine.
01:55:24
Speaker
I was like, it's okay.
01:55:25
Speaker
I liked, I mean, it's a Kevin Williamson script who wrote the first few screen movies.
01:55:30
Speaker
So, you know, it has something to say about the tropes of the genre.
01:55:33
Speaker
I just thought all the performances were very insufferable from Ryan Felipe to Frankie Prince Jr. to Sarah Michelle Gellar, which I think is kind of the point, but it doesn't distract from the fact that I found it pretty, uh,
01:55:45
Speaker
pretty tough to watch.
01:55:47
Speaker
But I was glad to have watched it because it's a classic of the sort of 90s horror genre.
01:55:51
Speaker
Couple honorable mentions on my highs.
01:55:56
Speaker
I had a fun experience on Tuesday.
01:55:59
Speaker
It's the first time in a long time I've read a whole book in a day.
01:56:02
Speaker
I read, we were talking about, you know,
01:56:06
Speaker
Filmmakers adapting their own novels.
01:56:08
Speaker
I read a Clive Barker novel who made Hellraiser.
01:56:12
Speaker
I read his novel, The Thief of Always, which is really great if a little...
01:56:22
Speaker
kind of simple and it's storytelling in a way that I don't mind.
01:56:26
Speaker
But it's basically about this kid and he, it's like this 10 year old kid.
01:56:32
Speaker
The first line of the book is incredible.
01:56:33
Speaker
The first line is basically like the great gray beast of February had swallowed Willis whole, which is a great opening line.
01:56:41
Speaker
But it's basically about this kid who has like seasonal depression and it's February and he's like,
01:56:47
Speaker
he says out loud to a mirror in his room.
01:56:49
Speaker
He's like, if I don't have some fun, I'm going to die.
01:56:52
Speaker
And then immediately a creature flies into his window and it's like, I can take you somewhere that you'll have fun.
01:56:57
Speaker
And so he takes him to this place called the holiday house on the outskirts of town where there's all these kids.
01:57:02
Speaker
It's the opposite line of Franklin from Texas Chainsaw.
01:57:04
Speaker
Exactly.
01:57:06
Speaker
Exactly.
01:57:06
Speaker
He's having too much fun.
01:57:08
Speaker
But it basically like takes him to this place called the Holiday House on the outside of town.
01:57:12
Speaker
And there's everything he could ever ask for.
01:57:15
Speaker
But then shit starts to kind of go sideways.
01:57:18
Speaker
Really great, engaging book.
01:57:20
Speaker
It's only like 260 pages.
01:57:22
Speaker
And I literally read it during a pub shift.
01:57:24
Speaker
I read the whole book during a pub shift.
01:57:26
Speaker
Nice.
01:57:27
Speaker
So highly recommend The Thief of Always.
01:57:29
Speaker
My other honorable mention is season four of Slow Horses on Apple TV Plus, which is just top to bottom, like maybe one of the best shows on TV.
01:57:40
Speaker
And it does this incredible, it just ended season four.
01:57:42
Speaker
It's only six episodes a season.
01:57:45
Speaker
Could not recommend it more highly.
01:57:46
Speaker
Gary Oldman is doing the Lord's work.
01:57:48
Speaker
The new season has some really fun cast additions, including Hugo Weaving playing an American, which is kind of funny, but he's really great.
01:57:56
Speaker
And it does this amazing thing because they film so quickly where they give you a sizzle reel of season five at the end of season four, which is fucking amazing.
01:58:06
Speaker
Cool.
01:58:07
Speaker
um so highly recommend slow horses to anybody my actual high not to go into movies you've talked about the whole episode but nightmare on elm street 3 dream warriors which fucking slaps and fucks and is absolutely incredible um the cast is next fucking level um i love seeing heather lang and camp back cannot wait to keep watching these movies i've only seen the first three at this point so i'm going to continue watching the nightmare on elm street movies um
01:58:33
Speaker
I think this might be in terms of horror franchises that I've watched and I haven't seen a lot of them.
01:58:38
Speaker
So let's be, I just want to be, you know, taste for the grain of salt, but this might be my favorite horror franchise that I've gotten into.
01:58:46
Speaker
I have loved all of them.
01:58:48
Speaker
I really liked two.
01:58:49
Speaker
I thought the main guy in two was really good and like,
01:58:53
Speaker
freaky and subtle at moments where he needed to be and i thought i i just i think these movies are super special and do are able to do insane shit and chuck russell's a fucking genius who directed dream warriors so i highly recommend nightmare and i'm sure three dream warriors i'm gonna watch this weekend i need to oh dude you'll you're gonna fucking freak yeah it's so fucking good man it's a sicko movie for sure totally joe yeah
01:59:17
Speaker
My low for the week is not... I legitimately have only seen good shit, so I can't... My low for the week was the fact that I was trying to download a game to play with some of my boys, and my computer was out of storage.
01:59:33
Speaker
I was like, what the fuck?
01:59:34
Speaker
Why do I have... What's the problem with my storage?
01:59:37
Speaker
And it seemed to be that Apex Legends, a game that I do not have on my computer, was still installed.
01:59:47
Speaker
Damn.
01:59:48
Speaker
It was eating up 60 gigabytes of hard drive space for no reason.
01:59:53
Speaker
That's way too much space.
01:59:54
Speaker
Let me tell you the solution I had to get it off my computer because it wouldn't delete.
01:59:58
Speaker
I kept pressing delete and it would say it deleted and it wasn't gone.
02:00:01
Speaker
I had to clear up enough space.
02:00:03
Speaker
This is a horror movie premise.
02:00:04
Speaker
I had to clear up enough space on my computer to re-download it again.
02:00:09
Speaker
Yeah, and then delete it.
02:00:11
Speaker
And then it deleted everything.
02:00:12
Speaker
But I had to troubleshoot for like...
02:00:16
Speaker
The whole time everybody else was playing games, I was troubleshooting how to get it off my computer.
02:00:22
Speaker
I hate that shit.
02:00:23
Speaker
And nobody had the same problem as me.
02:00:25
Speaker
I Googled it for like an hour and I couldn't figure it out.
02:00:28
Speaker
You're like on fucking Reddit boards.
02:00:30
Speaker
I was like on Reddit like four years ago, Reddit boards.
02:00:33
Speaker
When you really think about it, Joe, you're like an explorer.
02:00:37
Speaker
This is really like the lost city of Z. You're out in the unknown.
02:00:39
Speaker
You're our local Dora.
02:00:40
Speaker
Yeah.
02:00:43
Speaker
I have a lot of honorable mention highs, though, before I get to my actual highs.
02:00:47
Speaker
They're all music.
02:00:48
Speaker
Great.
02:00:49
Speaker
Actually, one of them is a movie, but mostly music.
Music and Film Recommendations
02:00:53
Speaker
Gordy Greaves, the new sound, the front man for Black Midi released a solo record.
02:00:59
Speaker
Oh, sick.
02:00:59
Speaker
That is inspired by Steely Dan.
02:01:04
Speaker
Sick.
02:01:05
Speaker
You're the second person to recommend that to me this week.
02:01:08
Speaker
Joe, have I ever told you about when I saw Black Mini live?
02:01:10
Speaker
No, but I bet it was incredible.
02:01:11
Speaker
Dude, I saw them at Pitchfork in 2021 in Chicago, and the lead man who you're talking about, he came out wearing a full suit.
02:01:19
Speaker
Yeah, he's kind of a nerd.
02:01:20
Speaker
Yeah, by the end, he had sweat through the entire thing.
02:01:23
Speaker
Yeah, because he goes fucking hard.
02:01:24
Speaker
It was fucking incredible.
02:01:25
Speaker
But this album is inspired by Sealy Dan and Brazilian club music from the 70s.
02:01:30
Speaker
Sick.
02:01:32
Speaker
And it's basically like all of the songs are from this like weirdo alpha male incel character, like caricature, like he's singing in this character.
02:01:44
Speaker
And he has a lyric where basically the song Holy Holy is maybe my favorite song of the year.
02:01:48
Speaker
It's probably going to be my favorite song of the year.
02:01:51
Speaker
But it's this song about this guy who is meeting a sex worker in a bar, but he has this list of things that he wants him to do for her and none of them are sex.
02:02:02
Speaker
It's all, can you make me seem like a fucking big shot?
02:02:07
Speaker
I want you to put your hand on my knee.
02:02:11
Speaker
I want you to ask the bartender if I really am who I say I am.
02:02:17
Speaker
I want you to tell me that I smell good.
02:02:18
Speaker
I want you to go to the bathroom.
02:02:22
Speaker
I want to wait an appropriate amount of time.
02:02:24
Speaker
I want to choose your new lipstick.
02:02:25
Speaker
And we walk back out.
02:02:26
Speaker
And I want you to give the other girls a snide look that makes them jealous that I chose you instead.
02:02:32
Speaker
It's just really sad.
02:02:34
Speaker
But the song is so propulsive.
02:02:38
Speaker
He's good at that.
02:02:39
Speaker
It's insanely good, this record.
02:02:42
Speaker
My other music honorable mention is Absolute Elsewhere by Blood Incantation.
02:02:49
Speaker
Sick.
02:02:51
Speaker
I'm not a huge metalhead.
02:02:53
Speaker
I love almost every single music genre.
02:02:56
Speaker
There's not really a music genre that I can't find something to like in.
02:02:59
Speaker
But this is a death metal record that is equal parts death metal and Rush.
02:03:04
Speaker
Oh, sick.
02:03:06
Speaker
It's crazy prog rock.
02:03:07
Speaker
It also has lyrics about aliens.
02:03:10
Speaker
I don't like satanic death metal because it makes me uncomfortable because most of those satanic death metal guys hate gay people and also anyone that's not white.
02:03:20
Speaker
So this is this is a total non sequitur, but this is maybe the only group in my life that I could say this to.
02:03:27
Speaker
There's a great if you go back and listen, it's on YouTube.
02:03:29
Speaker
Listen to Jason Isbell on Marin.
02:03:33
Speaker
And he has this very funny moment in his interview where where he starts talking about death metal because he toured with Ryan Adams and all Ryan Adams listen to his death metal.
02:03:42
Speaker
And he's like, what do you like?
02:03:43
Speaker
And Jason Isbell is like, I really like Mastodon.
02:03:47
Speaker
He just talks for five minutes about Mastodon.
02:03:50
Speaker
That's fucking awesome.
02:03:50
Speaker
That's why he's a goddamn genius.
02:03:52
Speaker
Exactly.
02:03:53
Speaker
It's like my favorite thing.
02:03:54
Speaker
I love it so much.
02:03:55
Speaker
I think about it all the time.
02:03:56
Speaker
Before I let you go back, I have to say something right now.
02:03:59
Speaker
Dylan Washington, fuck you for your Jason Isbell takes.
02:04:02
Speaker
You're a fucking idiot.
02:04:03
Speaker
I love you.
02:04:05
Speaker
You mean the world.
02:04:06
Speaker
Does he not like Isbel?
02:04:07
Speaker
I hold you in my heart.
02:04:08
Speaker
You're a fucking idiot for how you feel about Isbel.
02:04:10
Speaker
No, he doesn't like Isbel at all.
02:04:12
Speaker
Yeah, well, yeah.
02:04:13
Speaker
Fuck you, Dylan.
02:04:15
Speaker
He hates to go against, he loves to go against the grain, I should say.
02:04:18
Speaker
Like, he just, like, hates any, he loves anything that everybody hates and hates everything that everybody loves.
02:04:22
Speaker
Fair.
02:04:22
Speaker
I feel similar sometimes.
02:04:24
Speaker
Yeah, it's fine.
02:04:25
Speaker
I love him.
02:04:26
Speaker
Yeah, he's the best, but also that's a bullshit opinion, so whatever.
02:04:30
Speaker
Three of us have worked for him or do work for him.
02:04:32
Speaker
Yeah.
02:04:34
Speaker
My movie honorable mention is Basket Case.
02:04:38
Speaker
The first film from the director of one of my favorite movies of all time, Brain Damage, and also Frank and Hooker, which is also great.
02:04:49
Speaker
Right.
02:04:49
Speaker
Hennenlotter.
02:04:50
Speaker
Is that his name?
02:04:50
Speaker
Yeah.
02:04:51
Speaker
Hennenlotter.
02:04:52
Speaker
This movie is really bad.
02:04:57
Speaker
It has Tommy Wiseau in the room level performances.
02:05:00
Speaker
Sick.
02:05:00
Speaker
And I'm not even exaggerating.
02:05:02
Speaker
Every single person in this movie is as bad as Tommy Wiseau.
02:05:07
Speaker
However...
02:05:09
Speaker
the filmmaking is next level.
02:05:11
Speaker
There's these stop motion sequences that truly like, I was like, I literally went, Oh hell yeah.
02:05:18
Speaker
Like several times watching the creature design is so cheap, but the way that they film some of it is just like, I don't know.
02:05:26
Speaker
It's really effective.
02:05:29
Speaker
And it's as gory and gross as you can be with how little money they made it for.
02:05:35
Speaker
And Frank Hindenlotter has gone on record to say that he doesn't think of himself as a horror filmmaker.
02:05:40
Speaker
He thinks of himself as an exploitation filmmaker.
02:05:44
Speaker
And that really kind of, you can sort of see that in the film, that he cares more about the violence and the sex more than the horror.
02:05:53
Speaker
Love it.
02:05:55
Speaker
And it's very gross.
02:06:00
Speaker
And it's very stupid.
02:06:01
Speaker
But at the same time, the central theme being about these two brothers who are conjoined, but then separated unwillingly from each other.
02:06:11
Speaker
There's like a really sweet story about brotherly love and like how hard it is to be someone's brother who's kind of a fuck up.
02:06:21
Speaker
It actually made me emotional at the end.
02:06:24
Speaker
And for how bad all the performances and the script is, it's actually kind of mind-blowing how effective the directing is.
02:06:32
Speaker
Wow.
02:06:33
Speaker
Love that.
02:06:34
Speaker
And then my actual high of the week.
02:06:35
Speaker
Sorry, this has been long.
02:06:37
Speaker
My high of the week is the French-Canadian film directed by Pascal Plante.
02:06:43
Speaker
I don't know how you pronounce his name.
02:06:44
Speaker
French-Canadian.
02:06:47
Speaker
The fact that you just said the words high and French in the same sentence are absolutely shocking.
02:06:52
Speaker
This film is called Red Rooms or Les Chambres Rouges.
02:06:58
Speaker
Beautiful.
02:06:59
Speaker
It is about the high-profile case of serial killer Ludovic Chevalier, who has just gone to trial, and Kellyanne, our protagonist, is obsessed with him.
02:07:08
Speaker
When reality blurs with her morbid fantasies, she goes down a dark path to seek the final piece of this case's puzzle.
02:07:15
Speaker
It's kind of like David Fincher...
02:07:20
Speaker
And it gets a little lynchian at the end.
02:07:23
Speaker
Oh, sick.
02:07:25
Speaker
Speak my language.
02:07:26
Speaker
But it is more restrained than both of those directors.
02:07:29
Speaker
Interesting.
02:07:30
Speaker
And in a way that works, I like it that David Fincher is just like, fuck you, I'm going to do what I want.
02:07:35
Speaker
And also David Lynch is the same way.
02:07:38
Speaker
This movie has it, the initial scene that's in court, the first scene that where you see Ludovic and Helian in the same scene, it has one of the coolest, most restrained one takes I've ever seen in my life.
02:07:57
Speaker
It's this camera going around the courtroom as the defense and the prosecution are giving their opening statements.
02:08:03
Speaker
And it's just moving so fluidly.
02:08:05
Speaker
Yeah.
02:08:07
Speaker
Camera work in this movie is... What's up?
02:08:09
Speaker
I was going to say, listener, if Joe is recommending a film that he continually describes as restrained, that means it's got to be a fucking masterpiece.
02:08:18
Speaker
Because if Joe's recommending something that he's like, no, no, it's super restrained, it says something.
02:08:22
Speaker
But what I'm saying, I have never felt more internally frightened by a movie that showed literally nothing scary.
02:08:34
Speaker
I love that.
02:08:34
Speaker
There was zero horror imagery in this film, but I needed a hug after I finished it.
02:08:41
Speaker
It's so evil.
02:08:44
Speaker
That's sick.
02:08:44
Speaker
The vibe of the movie.
02:08:47
Speaker
Someone on Letterboxd said the vibe of this movie is everything Longlegs thought it was.
02:08:51
Speaker
Oh, cool.
02:08:53
Speaker
It's high praise.
02:08:55
Speaker
Yeah, and it, like, I don't know.
02:08:58
Speaker
Basically, the central premise of this movie is that Ludovic Chevalier is a serial killer, but he live streams the killings of these people
02:09:09
Speaker
like young women, the three women involved in this case are 13, 15, and 16.
02:09:16
Speaker
And he live streams the brutal, torturous murders of these girls on the dark web.
02:09:24
Speaker
And there is one particular scene where you only hear the video.
02:09:29
Speaker
Oh, God.
02:09:30
Speaker
Jesus Christmast.
02:09:31
Speaker
It is.
02:09:32
Speaker
It upset me so bad that I just watched Terrifier 2.
02:09:38
Speaker
That is one of the most disgusting movies I've ever seen in my life.
02:09:42
Speaker
I didn't feel nauseous once during that film, but I felt nauseous during The Red Rooms.
02:09:47
Speaker
Damn.
02:09:48
Speaker
I legit almost had to pause the movie to go...
02:09:51
Speaker
Take a lap.
02:09:52
Speaker
Take a lap.
02:09:54
Speaker
I cannot recommend this movie enough.
02:09:55
Speaker
The central performance is so wonderful.
02:09:58
Speaker
It's like girl American Psycho.
02:10:00
Speaker
It's like girl Patrick Bateman.
02:10:01
Speaker
She's so detached.
02:10:03
Speaker
But...
02:10:06
Speaker
I don't know.
02:10:09
Speaker
But like, it's just, it's just like the movie is so viscerally upsetting, but also it's about a girl who is a model who doesn't need to model for the money because she's so good at scamming people in online poker.
02:10:24
Speaker
Sick.
02:10:24
Speaker
Fucking A. Again, is she single?
02:10:27
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know.
02:10:28
Speaker
She is in this movie, but she's single because something's wrong with her.
02:10:32
Speaker
Fair, fair, fair, fair.
02:10:34
Speaker
But yeah, no, please watch it.
02:10:35
Speaker
I can't wait to watch it.
02:10:36
Speaker
I'm so excited to watch it.
02:10:38
Speaker
I cannot recommend it enough.
02:10:39
Speaker
I truly have not been this blown away by a new release from someone I didn't know existed before in a long time.
02:10:47
Speaker
Where is it on your 2024 list, Joe, if you don't mind sharing?
02:10:49
Speaker
I think I put it pretty high.
02:10:52
Speaker
It's definitely in my top 10.
02:10:53
Speaker
Let me find out where I put it.
02:10:55
Speaker
While you're looking, I... Oh, I put it at fucking four.
02:10:59
Speaker
My top four is Challengers, Furiosa, I Saw the TV Glow, and Red Rooms.
02:11:04
Speaker
Damn.
02:11:05
Speaker
Pretty good top four.
02:11:06
Speaker
I just submitted a DoorDash order, and my Ashley responded with a dad joke.
02:11:11
Speaker
Oh, what'd he say?
02:11:13
Speaker
He said, what do you get when you cross the computer with a hamburger?
02:11:17
Speaker
A Big Mac.
02:11:18
Speaker
Damn.
02:11:20
Speaker
Pretty good.
02:11:21
Speaker
And with that, listener... My P. Terry's is in good hands.
02:11:24
Speaker
Yo!
02:11:24
Speaker
I'm getting P. Terry's tomorrow when I go down.
02:11:26
Speaker
I can't wait.
02:11:27
Speaker
Y'all want to hear what you... Wait.
02:11:28
Speaker
Have I told you what you can get for like $18 from P. Terry's in San Antonio on DoorDash?
02:11:36
Speaker
No.
02:11:37
Speaker
$18 with tip.
02:11:38
Speaker
Like tip included in the $18.
02:11:39
Speaker
Go for it.
02:11:40
Speaker
Double cheeseburger with bacon.
02:11:43
Speaker
Fries.
02:11:44
Speaker
Shake.
02:11:45
Speaker
Cookie.
02:11:46
Speaker
Whoa, with tip?
02:11:48
Speaker
Anywhere else that costs $35 on this.
02:11:50
Speaker
It doesn't make any fucking sense, and I eat way too much Pete Terry's as a result.
02:11:56
Speaker
Pete Terry's fucking rips.
02:11:58
Speaker
Pete Terry's is so good.
02:12:00
Speaker
Pete Terry's is the Exorcist 3 of fast food joints.
02:12:02
Speaker
Amen, brother.
02:12:03
Speaker
And with that, take us out.
02:12:05
Speaker
And with that, listener, thank you so much for listening.
02:12:07
Speaker
Thank you.
02:12:08
Speaker
For sticking all the way to the end of this long fucking episode.
02:12:11
Speaker
You know, it's been a long time since we've done a two-hour episode.
02:12:14
Speaker
Yeah.
02:12:14
Speaker
But we're fucking needed it.
02:12:15
Speaker
And guess what, motherfucker?
02:12:17
Speaker
We're getting a two-hour episode next week.
02:12:18
Speaker
Because any time we come to the show, we go long.
02:12:21
Speaker
Andy goes deep.
02:12:22
Speaker
Yeah.
02:12:24
Speaker
Thank you to my dear friend, Kat, for coming on.
02:12:27
Speaker
Really our dear friend.
02:12:28
Speaker
Friend of the podcast.
02:12:29
Speaker
Absolutely.
02:12:30
Speaker
We had a fucking blast.
02:12:31
Speaker
She is.
02:12:32
Speaker
She's the best.
02:12:33
Speaker
So smart.
02:12:34
Speaker
So thoughtful.
02:12:34
Speaker
We really, really appreciate her.
02:12:36
Speaker
Gentlemen, I really appreciate you.
02:12:37
Speaker
Thank you for coming on.
02:12:38
Speaker
Listener, we love you.
02:12:41
Speaker
Thanks for listening.
02:12:42
Speaker
Bye.
02:12:43
Speaker
Love you, bye.