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Celebrating Independent Bookstore Day (with special guests Cathy Jesson & MLA Christine Boyle)
0 Playsin 15 hours
It's Independent Bookstore Day, and to celebrate, Friendless is doing a double feature — two short conversations recorded at the Bookshelf, both circling the same question: what do bookstores actually do for us that nothing else can?
First up is MLA Christine Boyle, BC's Minister of Housing and Municipal Affairs — and a lifelong library and bookstore nerd. We talk about the physical, relational experience you can't get from an online cart, why her 11-year-old plays her like a fiddle every time they walk past a bookshop, and the climate novel her book club still hasn't forgiven her for.
Then I sit down with Cathy Jesson, the owner of Black Bond Books. Cathy started in her mother's store in Brandon, Manitoba in the sixties, moved to the coast, built the business into a three-generation family operation, and in 2012 stepped in on a five-day turnaround to save Book Warehouse from closing. She talks about running a bookstore as a business (not a pipe dream), why the magic only happens on the floor and not in the office, and what she wants customers to feel walking out on Independent Bookstore Day.
Both conversations are short, warm, and — if you're anything like me — going to send you straight to your nearest independent.
Mentioned in this episode:
- Black Bond Books, Book Warehouse, Hager Books - https://www.blackbondbooks.com/
- Ministry for the Future by Kim Stanley Robinson
- Fire Weather by John Vaillant
- A Truce That Is Not Peace by Miriam Toews
- The Women by Kristin Hannah
- Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir
- Stranger in a Strange Land by Robert Heinlein
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Fun and safety, Sweet Peas.
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Transcript
Introduction and Celebration of Independent Bookstore Day
00:00:08
Speaker
Well, hey there, sweet peas. Welcome back to Friendless. I'm your host, James Avromenko. And this week we are celebrating Independent Bookstore Day. To mark the occasion, we are doing something very special, a double feature.
00:00:20
Speaker
Two conversations, both recorded live at the book warehouse with two people who think very seriously about what bookstores do for
Christine Boyle's Affection for Bookstores
00:00:28
Speaker
a community. First, I speak with Minister Christine Boyle, who is the BC Minister of Housing and Municipal Affairs. But we are not talking politics today. We're talking about why she feels her nervous system settle the moment she walks into a bookstore, what her 11-year-old has figured out about how to manipulate her at the checkout counter, and a book that her book club has still not forgiven her for her recommending.
Kathy Jessen on Family Business and Community Support
00:00:50
Speaker
I then got to chat with Kathy Jessen, the owner of Black Bond Books, who started working with her mother in the family business six decades ago, who stepped in to save Book Warehouse when it was days away from closing in 2012, and who now runs the whole thing alongside her daughter.
00:01:05
Speaker
Three generations of booksellers, one very real answer to what it looks like to keep showing up for a community over a lifetime. So it's now time to lean back, get comfy, set your volume at a reasonable level, and enjoy this celebration of independent bookstore day here on friendless.
00:01:27
Speaker
All right.
Boyle's Reading Preferences and Impact
00:01:29
Speaker
So I'm not sure minister, minister, Christine Boyle, which is their proper title to to address you. third Maybe. I mean, minister. Minister? Okay. But no, please call me Christine. Okay. Unless you're mad at me, in which case. Don't call you anything at all. yeah but i yeah Just don't call me. you know yeah yeah but No, Christine. I'm so happy to be here with you. Thank you so much. I really appreciate it. So right off the bat, you know, being in a bookstore, what are you reading right now?
00:01:53
Speaker
um So I will say, come in here. I was worried I would forget every name. It happens to me all the time. So you can help me in this quiz. I have the Canadian author from Winnipeg, Mennonite author. Miriam Taves. Yes, here we go. I just started reading Miriam Taves' new book about writing. Yes, yes, yes, yes, okay.
00:02:16
Speaker
Which I'm really enjoying. I mostly these days read fiction because in my work life I do so much reading of non-fiction. But usually as a human, I like a broad mix of books. But yeah, lots of novels by women lately that is what I...
00:02:36
Speaker
kind to want in that time kind of from work until in bed before falling asleep have do you have you read a heat arrival yet i haven't read the books i watched the shows that its like more than one time speaking of kind of you know repeats what's one book that you really consistently reread or just kind of keep coming back to Oh, you know, the book I think about often and recommend to people all the time is Ministry for the Future. oh yeah. as a As somebody who thinks about and worries about climate all of the time, I found it both fascinating and oddly hopeful. I will tell you, i so I'm in a book club.
00:03:20
Speaker
I recommended it to my book club. it It was the last time that my book club accepted one of my recommendations. My book club was like, that book was so depressing, yeah which I think was maybe a reflection on our starting points of depression around the climate crisis. sure But i found it super compelling and still think about the ideas that it brought up.
00:03:42
Speaker
Over the years, is there a book that has kind of continued to really influence your career or anything that at all? Like, is there a book that you really feel kind of influenced you throughout your life?
00:03:54
Speaker
I don't think there's one book. I think reading generally always influences me, both you know in terms of I read a pretty broad array, not right now, but of nonfiction, and I like i like Getting to learn from somebody who's delved deep into a topic. um So I saw John Valiant's Fire Weather over here as an example. Like, incredible story and that powerfully written, I thought. I loved that.
00:04:26
Speaker
But I also just, I love a novel because I like narrative and the human experience. I like reading about... people's friendships and their inner lives. And I think it helps me get out of my own self.
00:04:43
Speaker
Totally. Because it's valuable to be learning about other people's lives and stories to sort of shape how I understand the world, you know, particularly, and I, we're not going to go into politics, but as a public policymaker, decision maker,
00:04:59
Speaker
I talk to a lot of people in my regular life to inform what I'm thinking about, but I also appreciate getting to read about stories and lives that are far beyond my own.
Supporting Local Bookstores and Personal Joy
00:05:11
Speaker
And last question, you know, thinking of the ideas of community and, you know, the sort of the state of of bookstores, what is something that you think we can do to help support local bookstores versus the sort of encroaching, you know, the Amazons of the world? Yeah. I love getting to come in in person. and I mean, i'm also I'm also a huge public library nerd. Yes. I love the public library system. in in my I'm the Minister of Housing and Municipal Affairs. Public libraries fit within that. Gotcha. And so anytime I go to a new community, I want to visit their library. Yes. And I feel the same about a real physical bookstore.
00:05:52
Speaker
There's books that people recommend and i book club keeps me busy with recommendations, but to walk into a place like this and see a hundred things that I could dive into and like the visuals of it and to know local booksellers and get their recommendations and nothing beats that for me. I i feel my nervous system relax a little when I walk into a...
00:06:18
Speaker
Physical bookstore. Somehow also i get a way over. so way over yeah yeah Very excited. And I leave with more books than I could possibly read. But there's a like there's a physical and relational thing there that I think can't be experienced by online ordering. That sort of the friction the the the loss of friction, you know, that' thats this is a bookstore is like good friction. Yeah. in the And I love getting to support a local business and knowing you know all the studies about those dollars staying locally in the community and supporting local jobs. That all means a lot to me. So my son is 11, also a big reader, and he knows this is a major weakness for me. So...
00:07:05
Speaker
He plays me so hard and effectively. Anytime he can get me into a bookstore and then I'm like, the deal is before we walk in the door, one book and we leave with six because I feel great about it. Because I feel great about supporting the local bookstore. I love that he loves books.
00:07:23
Speaker
I mean, it's a bottomless
Jessen's Bookstore Legacy and Challenges
00:07:25
Speaker
pit of joy. There's really no, yeah, yeah there's no there's no bad dollar spent on a book. Yeah, yeah exactly. yeah well Mr. Boyle, thank you so much. i really appreciate this. Yeah, delighted to be here and glad to get to have this conversation. Awesome. Thank you.
00:07:45
Speaker
So this episode is going to be coming out around, you know, the independent bookstore day and and celebration around that. so So that also links into Blackbond Books turned 60 2023.
00:07:56
Speaker
And you yourself, you know, you've been a part of the company for over five decades. when you When you look back to, you know, Brandon, Manitoba in the 60s, does it feel kind of like ah straight line to where you are now or or more like kind of like a series of...
00:08:11
Speaker
happy or other emotional accidents. Hills and valleys. And coming to the coast from Brandon was the best thing ever. Sure.
00:08:22
Speaker
To join my mother who had opened her first store in White Rock. It took me five years to talk my husband at the time into coming to the coast. What was, why was he dragging his feet? what was no I don't know. He was afraid of the unknown, I guess. Sure. Yeah. But I was all just, let's go. Yeah. Let's get there. yeah and when we got here, then he said, why didn't we wait so long?
00:08:45
Speaker
Because the opportunities were so incredible at that time. re and Within a short time, we opened our store in Langley. And that was something, you know, basically ran it by myself. Right. Just just doing everything. Yeah.
00:09:03
Speaker
And my mom was doing her store and transport. The stock would go into her store and then I would transport. And I would see how many boxes I could get on ah on a shopping buggy to put them into the store. Yeah.
00:09:15
Speaker
To kind of have as few tra ah as few trips as possible kind of thing. Yeah. yeah yeah Because I was the only one there. Yeah. yeah Anyway, it was was interesting times. And then had people volunteer to work in the store. Mm-hmm.
00:09:29
Speaker
And after a time I said, okay, I'll pay you as soon as I can afford to pay you. And they became one time people kind of little working with me. And it all becomes, even today, we feel sort of like a family. and And I feel very blessed by that. Yeah. Well, and that, you know, and even the name itself is a family story, you right? Yeah, my two great grandmothers, Celia Black and Catherine Blonde. Do you feel that history brings...
00:09:57
Speaker
Oh, sort of a weight or were more of like a, like an anchor for, for the sort of trajectory of the, of the, of the stores? I would say it's an anchor. Mm-hmm. Yeah. An anchor. Even, even from people who remember a black wine store in Brandon, Manitoba. Mm-hmm.
00:10:12
Speaker
And it's, it ceased to exist soon after I left. Mm-hmm. So it just, it's a business that's harder than it looks. Yeah. For sure. yeah Yeah. And a lot of people go, oh I like to read. So I think I'll open a bookstore.
00:10:26
Speaker
You know? That's been by that's been my back of the mind dream all my life. And I've always known that's a pipe dream. you know yeah I mean, you should go, a person and should go and work in a bookstore then. That's just it. Exactly.
00:10:40
Speaker
It's a business and we all love, love the books. And you know, that was part of the reason why mother got into it because she loved the books and also that community felt that they needed a bookstore in Brandon, Manitoba when there wasn't.
00:10:56
Speaker
whos And it was, you know, yeah even the same when, uh, when i came to the coast, the Langley didn't have a bookstore and I was teased very much that I was going to open a bookstore in bra and Langley because he said, you know, people don't read out. Right.
Saving Book Warehouse and Community Passion
00:11:13
Speaker
Yeah. they're Like it's horsey set. this and yeah I said, I think you're wrong.
00:11:17
Speaker
And we did prove them wrong. yeah And it was a very successful story. I love that. how And you've got to imagine too that it's it's not that people don't it's that they don't have access to a bookstore. No, they didn't. They didn't. And then we did the same thing in Maple Ridge. And that still, to this day, I think it's probably 35 years old. And still going strong.
00:11:39
Speaker
yeah Still going strong. Very strong. And so community grounded. It's doing something. I feel like that's very much the spirit of all the stores kind of under the umbrella. They're not just...
00:11:51
Speaker
one of the bookstores on the street or something, there's a very different kind of energy when you come into a, you know, whether it's a BlackBond or a book warehouse or wherever might be, you know, it's, it's, yeah, every, everybody brings a different energy than, than most bookstores, you know, you mentioned, you you obviously, your mother started this, you're now co-working with your daughter.
00:12:09
Speaker
What does it mean to you that this is a genuinely ah multi-generational story that books have kind of been the thread that has ran through your family's story for so long?
00:12:23
Speaker
I guess that goes back to my mother. And then... Uh, when my, uh, then my brother and my sister, and so the four of us were partners for many, many years until, until my mother retired.
00:12:38
Speaker
Then my brother went to, to Kelowna and, and bought his store in at mosaic books in Kelowna. And where that again is another multi-generational thing. His daughter is the, the guiding force of mosaic books in, in Kelowna.
00:12:54
Speaker
And my sister went off sailing. the seas and i just stayed with it i loved this business i love customers i love my staff i still see people from 30 40 years ago who worked with us and many of them say that was my best job ever so Building on sort of the, the, the, you know, the, the count community outreach and the community building, you know, you, you stepped in and you saved the book warehouse in, in 2012. And I gotta say, as, as just as a personal note, I'm very grateful for that. Cause, cause these were the, you know, the, this location and the location on, on, on Broadway were, have always been my favorite stores. And i remember when it was closing, i was, I was.
00:13:35
Speaker
really sad you know it was down to the wire yeah it really was the the book warehouse on Broadway and this so much passion by the by the staff there and I was amazed that that Even though they knew that they weren't going to probably have a job anymore, they still stayed with Charmin and and the book warehouse. And, you know, he's again, another very strong person who loves his team, loves his people. And he's still pops into the to the store on Broadway.
00:14:09
Speaker
just Just to say how proud he is Caitlin, because Caitlin was the manager. right She has stepped in Mladner from our location there. You know, what a I think an element, you know, for me is, you know, as a person, as a reader, you know, I know what I would have kind of lost if if they had closed down. and i'm And I'm curious, you know, from a sort of, you know, not only from your perspective personally, but just just sort of the broader almost Vancouver reading, you know, mosaic. What do you think would have been lost like if that would to have gone through?
Balancing Reading as a Private and Communal Activity
00:14:43
Speaker
I think there was a lot that was lost already because yeah they closed the he closed the one Davie. That's right. And he closed the one on West Forth. came down to the crunch of the last big one. I think there was a real outreach and I can't believe the response we got when we know said, we're going to do this. Oh, the relief. And it was a fast turnaround too. It was fast. It was five days you were closed down or something? Five or six days. there wasn't much stock, so we were doing what we could. To get it filled back up. Getting the floors done, getting the shelves done, pulling the team together. Yeah.
00:15:22
Speaker
It's amazing. Yeah. I remember walking along Davie Street. And went into the, the Davie location that was closing. And there was, I want Alison, who was a long-term book warehouse person.
00:15:41
Speaker
She didn't know who I was when I went into the store her passion still for the business was really something. So I said, I said to Kate, we want this person. Yeah.
00:15:52
Speaker
Is she still around? And that's amazing. I love that. That's fantastic. she's She's a real driving force at the Broadway book warehouse. Okay. Gotcha. And Arlene. another wonderful person from that Dave in the Street location. Reading is often kind of framed as this very solitary, you know, kind of private act, but a bookstore is very much the opposite. and And I'm curious, you know, how do you find yourself kind of holding both those elements at the same time?
00:16:26
Speaker
Getting to know your customers is the key for the team in each location. You know the customers that come in and some of the same labor. What they're going to Yeah, what they're going to want. And you know the other ones that just don't want you to pay.
00:16:44
Speaker
don't Don't go near that person. it's yeah yeah They come in here for a specific purpose and and they want to find their book or their discovery here, but they don't need your help. Yeah. Yeah. So
Bookstores' Resurgence and Physical Books' Appeal
00:16:56
Speaker
it's just learning that. You have to, you get to know your customers. Sometimes I'll go into a store and just, just being there and I love interacting with the customers. Totally. And they'll say, don't go near that person, Kathy. Don't go near that person. because they already know that, yeah. So it's kind of funny. You know, something that we talk often about on on Friendless, on the show, is this idea of how difficult at times it can be to sort of, as an adult, you know, make new connections and make friends or all these kinds of things. And and I really feel like a bookstore sometimes can be one of those kind of like ace in the hole kind of things that not everyone necessarily thinks of. Do you see bookstores as kind of one of those
00:17:41
Speaker
Sometimes they call them third spaces, you know, and things like that. Do you see them as one of those, one of the few remaining spaces like that for kind of a a natural connection to build out of, strength for strangers?
00:17:53
Speaker
I think that's a very, very smart depiction of of who we are. And I think in this time, especially, that's why there's been such a growth of bookstores. Like we were probably eight or 10 years ago, we were being written off.
00:18:09
Speaker
Right. yeah Yeah. Kindles here. and that There's no of future. As times got. Khafer and all sorts of things thrown at all of us. I think it is, it it feels like a safe spot. It's an interesting thing to you to think about how it's something I've been thinking a lot about lately in conversations around kind of technology and things like that, where During you know lockdown, during COVID, the the sort of tech companies were saying, you know go into virtual reality and do all these things and nobody wanted them. What they what people reverted to was reading physical books and you know baking and gardening and all the like tactile, real human things. you know and And not all of those practices have continued since you know we've we've come back.
Fostering Lifelong Reading Through Personal Choice
00:18:54
Speaker
Breaking the stone off a bit. Yeah, exactly. yeah ah But at least, you know, it it does feel like the like the book element has kind of stayed on. oh it stayed on. Right? Yeah. That's good. It has totally stayed on. The fact that digital reading is, I think, runs about 14% in Canada. So it's very, you know, and again, that was another thing that we were all in the business, setting our hair on fire. Of course. that You know, is everybody just going to read on their device and they're and we're not going to be here anymore?
00:19:23
Speaker
No. i But it's a totally different experience is the thing. it's not a It's not the same at all when you hold a whether it's on your phone or the Kindle or something versus a book. It's a, you know, the words might be the same, but it's not the same no experience, you know? No, it just, it hasn't, it hasn't. hasn't There's people that that do both, you know, read both. and If they're on on holiday or whatever. Exactly. It's an easier way. that's very he hack that because i'll be Yeah. me. That's exactly what I do because I, you know, if I'm traveling, I'm like, well, I should bring this book, but what if I'm going to want to read something different, but I should probably finish this one, you know? So by then my backpack has six books in it, right? You know?
00:20:01
Speaker
So, so I do, you know, I do, you know, put them on my phone or something like that, right? But it's it doesn't... doesn't feel It doesn't feel... Because of that, I then end up not reading very much because I don't want to, no you're right? You know, right? Yeah. It becomes, yeah, deterrent to read. Speaking of, do you have kind of a...
00:20:19
Speaker
Do you have favorite story of a book kind of becoming a bridge? You know, when we're talking about, know, building connections and things like that through the story. do do Can you think of or has it ever happened where, you know, a book has kind of become a bit of ah a connection between between people, whether it's strangers, friends, even, you know, co-workers, whatever it might be?
00:20:41
Speaker
probably just kind of anonymous sort of interaction with people that say, you know, i came into your came into the store, I haven't read in years, and being able to put that book yeah in their hand, and they said, okay, going to give that a try, and then seeing them come back,
00:21:05
Speaker
And become a reader or again. Yeah. I've had that happen numerous times. And it's really important. And also dealing with parents. Right. And with kids that are having, struggling.
00:21:18
Speaker
And being able to bridge that gap. Right. And get them, you know, show them that there's something there for them. There's something there. Yeah. yeah that reassuring parents that, you know, even though that their child is just reading graphic novels or whatever, whatever they're reading, yeah they're reading.
00:21:34
Speaker
That's just mean, I had to have that discussion with my son. Mm-hmm. with his nine-year-old. Because too many comic books or is that the... Well, just graphic novels. Yeah, yeah. He goes, that's not a real book, mom. Of course it is. Of course it is. Yeah, right? Does it is it doesn't have pages of words on it? Like, come on, grow up. yeah I know. Well, i he just was was trying to get him to read chapter books. Totally. I'm going like... Didn't get there. If he to love books, he'll...
00:22:01
Speaker
He'll grow. That's just it. that's it's It's with anything, you know, often and a refrain, this show by no means coined it, but but but it's a very common thing of, you know, it's the idea of meeting people where they are, right? You know, and and that's another example of that, of yeah of let him come to it. You know, that's not where he is right now. So he'll enjoy it more if he decides to come to it on his own, right? yeah It's like forcing kids to read what they don't want to read. It becomes painful instead of ah something that should be
English Classes and Encouraging Reading Engagement
00:22:30
Speaker
a lot of fun. so this is a digression this but you you sparked my mind it's something i've been talking about a lot lately with with some of my teacher friends who oh good you know the the idea of the sort of the structure of the english class is kind of counterintuitive to how we would naturally encourage people to read because you know we we make you know 30 kids sit down read the same book and it's and it's this very uniform experience for what should be a very personal
00:22:57
Speaker
kind of almost intimate experience of you know picking a book for yourself and deciding when to read it and how to read it and and and so we've been you know just spitballing like how could an English class actually work to so that you don't have so many people who years later say oh I hate Shakespeare because they made they made me read Hamlet in grade 12 and it was the worst or you know all those kinds of things right you know by no means do I have any answer but I just I can't help but feel like that's If that's the first experience so many people have with literature, then of course they're gonna resent it or struggle with it, see you know?
00:23:31
Speaker
Yeah. It could almost be like a 30 person book club. yeah Exactly. Where everybody votes on what they want to read. Exactly. And see how that goes. They would then pick material that they they want to be engaging with and that's actually talking to them and is actually important to them. a Passionate part of, okay, want to share And that's the other part of it. Exactly. And perhaps maybe the other kids would pick up the other class.
00:23:58
Speaker
Exactly. The idea of the, the idea of the... And it coming from one of their peers. Exactly. Yeah, exactly. Oh, there's some fun ideas that can happen. I think that's brilliant. That's exactly where if we all go with it. But how do you then unpack but how many decades of curriculum and all that? Yeah, but you can add a wrinkle to it yeah in order to achieve your goal of You know, what what people in university are classes are saying that the kids come in and they not read. That's exactly it. And that's like the core.
00:24:28
Speaker
The key to the kingdom, actually. Well, that's that's exactly it. And it's, the it's all you know, yeah, if you
Love for Bookstores and Their Loyal Patrons
00:24:33
Speaker
can... We were talking about with ah when Susan Nielsen was on the show recently, and we were talking about how you know she has so many young readers, you know and if you if you if you get someone young as a reader, you kind of have them for life. Whether they're whether they're always following you or not, they'll they'll always come back. you know For me, I have you know authors I haven't read since I was a kid, but i I still am so fond of them, and also I come back to other books.
00:24:59
Speaker
that kind of remind me of them in a way, you know? And so it's, it's, yeah, it's where're we're, we're, we're, we're doing a disservice, I think to potential readers, yeah you know? Yeah. Yeah. know So we're talking because of independent bookstore day, you know, which is huge, the celebration, you know, right. And, and it also, it's all over. I mean, it's through, through ah North America. And it becomes a kind of a love letter in a way. Right. But who do you see that letter kind of being written to in this, in this celebration?
00:25:28
Speaker
our probably core base customers and wanting to thank them so much for for being with us through every part of our, of our, where we are today. It's funny hearing that because instinct goes to thanking the bookstore owners, you know, and the managers. it shows you humility here that you went to the customer first, you know, I know that our booksellers have so much fun with it and their enthusiasm for the day and brainstorming and ways that they can give back to their customers. Do you see a, a, how do I put it? This is kind of a top of mind question, but do you see a differentiation between the sort of the sellers and the buyers and in a certain light, you know, in the sense that we're sort of all readers, you know?
Bookselling: A Passion-Driven Endeavor
00:26:16
Speaker
Oh,
00:26:19
Speaker
Definitely. yeah Yeah. The passion for reading. None of us in this business are in it to get, to be wildly wealthy. It's a tough business. Yeah. and and i'm and we're in it because we love what we do. And let's see that's just it. A couple questions just kind of for for you. what's a book that you, what's a book that you have sold so many times that you could kind of recite the back cover in your sleep?
00:26:50
Speaker
Like, is there one that really sticks out? And if there is, why do you think That's the book that keeps finding new people. oh Probably over the last, time it changes for me from from time to time, but but probably over the last three years, it would be The Women.
00:27:08
Speaker
Oh, okay. Just a powerful book. Building on that a little I know it changes, but I'm curious, there a genre or kind of a kind of book that you personally really love that you think might surprise people?
00:27:23
Speaker
Oh, I'm just voracious mystery reader. Okay. Yeah. yeah And, but then on when I was away just lately, I read Project Hail Mary. Oh yeah. What'd you think? I loved it. Yeah. Totally out of character for me Oh, really? Because I'm not a sci-fi person. Gotcha. Although one of my all time favorite, favorite books is Stranger in a Strange Land. Oh yeah. Okay.
00:27:46
Speaker
I feel like that's a book that... comes back around every every few years or so, right? You know, and people kind of red rediscover like but those classics of... Because something like a Project Hail Mary will come out and then people try to find out kind of where... What's its lineage? Where's it coming from, right? Do you have kind of ah a memorable moment? You know, thinking of just sort of your experience within a bookstore, do do you have a memorable moment or something that you witnessed of of, you know, someone finding the exact right book at the exact right time in their life?
00:28:18
Speaker
You know, it's just more
00:28:24
Speaker
almost a, you know, anytime I'm in a store, it's like, it's like a day to day thing. Totally. And I'll go home after, cause a lot of, a lot of the time these days I'm spending my office. Of course.
00:28:36
Speaker
And my happy moments are when I'm in the store. Of course. Yeah. Cause that's where the magic happens. It doesn't happen in my office. Not for the most part. yeah It doesn't. But so when I'm in the store, if I can have that magic moment with the customer, and then I can go home and share that with my partner and say, oh, I had the best. pun have and And it was just a simple thing. Well, and that's, i think, you know, when I think about the question, it's, I think I worded it, you know, in a way that, because you're right, it's not a magic bullet moment. That that that happens every time, but you know.
00:29:15
Speaker
Thankfully it happens so much. yeah I mean, it happens to me practically every time I go to a bookstore, you know, I'm like, yeah, that was what I needed today. You know? Yeah. yeah So, so Caitlin is now your your partner in this. Before that it was my ex-husband. Gotcha. And my, and I would consider him my best friend. So we were partners for, oh gosh.
00:29:37
Speaker
in the business, probably 15 or 20 years. Gotcha. Yeah. And and he did all the the parts that I hated to do. Ah. The accounting. When somebody wants to open the bookstore, yeah they forget about all that stuff.
Unlimited Potential in Bookselling Industry
00:29:49
Speaker
Yep. And Caitlin's now taking on that role somewhat.
00:29:54
Speaker
I love that. but And, and doing a good job of it, but missing this part of it. yeah I mean, she, she ran the book warehouse and on Broadway for 10 years or something like that. And just an incredible bookseller. Yeah. And the connection she would make with customers was just, it was over the top. Yeah. And the team she built was super too. Yeah. Yeah. And then Debbie comes on here yeah and I mean, the magic is just. You know, building on, on, on.
00:30:25
Speaker
you know, the the sort of the idea of a legacy in a way, you know, what does it feel like to be sort of handing something forward rather than outright building it or or sort of starting starting over? yeah
00:30:39
Speaker
I'm feeling very... confident about the team we have. There's opportunities out there. Absolutely. No other, perhaps even not, but there's room for other stores to come on and be part of this wonderful community. And i I'm not bored of it yet. but Even though people say, aren't you retired yet? And I'm going like, you know what, I kind of just do what I want, what i want to do. Well, and that speaks to something too, you know, I really appreciate you saying that it's like, it's not like we have to have a stranglehold on it. and And it's something that I think more people need a reminder of, especially when it comes to, you know, art of any kind. It's not a zero sum game. It's not, there's there's an infinite space for all the art you want, you know, and and there's always room for more of it, you know, so so it's it's, you know, I do wish more people would jump in, right? Look at look at streets in Europe where there's, you know,
00:31:34
Speaker
Just lined with
Supportive Nature of Vancouver Booksellers
00:31:35
Speaker
bookstores. This is a bookshop. Exactly. Or whatever. yeah But no, there's there's definitely room to grow. Well, it's one of the magic parts of Maine is that each bookstore down the road, you go there kind of for a different thing. oh It's not a one-to-one, these are in competition. It's like, well, I'm looking for this, so I'm going to go here, right? No, it's a very special... Apparently it's a little bit different in Toronto. There's a little more of competition. types to Toronto, but but you know. But in Vancouver, there's definitely a camaraderie between booksellers. And we all want each other to do well. For someone, this is my last kind of planned
Community Engagement and Appreciation in Bookstores
00:32:12
Speaker
question here. For someone who's never really paid attention to independent bookstore a day, what do you want them to feel when they are, you know walking out of, you know, Black Bond Book Warehouse or whatever on that day?
00:32:26
Speaker
Appreciated. Yeah. Yeah. I love that. And feeling that. this, you know, on any of our locations are an important part of their community.
00:32:38
Speaker
I mean, we do our best for, you know, doing what we can to to help. We're doing a ah donation of thousand books to a school that that needs help. yeah It's all put together.
00:32:53
Speaker
So it's sort of a paying it forward. And it's really important. that's yeah So it's somewhere in in this in this main
Learning and Evolving in Bookselling
00:33:03
Speaker
neighborhood. So it's good. Well, I'll get the name. I'll throw it in the... yeah Debbie came up with that. It was great.
00:33:09
Speaker
Well, thank you so much, Kathy. I guess, last question, what's your favorite book right now? um i I would say Project Hail Mary. Okay. That's the one that like... And it caught me by surprise. Yeah. That's the best kind when you just kind of get locked into something that we're not expecting. yeah No, it's but it's banquet all the time. Yeah. My TBR list is... It's painful. painful. And then I come to see Debbie yeah and then it gets worse. She hears more. It gets worse.
00:33:37
Speaker
but ah Well, Cathy, thank you so much one more time for joining. I really, really appreciate I enjoyed chatting with you. Is there anything you'd like to kind of plug, anywhere you'd like listeners to kind of go next from this interview?
00:33:51
Speaker
Just keep coming and visiting and then also remember that we part of our family is Hager Books. Of course. Yes. Yes. would those Not to be cut out. Yeah. That was a great. We were honored that the owner of that store approached us to to make that part of our family. She said, I think it would make a nice fit. yeah And that's, you know, that's high i praise. Yeah. Because that's another just a That's a very great store. Yeah. It's a quirky, wonderful... yeah And we just said, no, we're not going to do anything to it. Just leave it. And even after being in the business or, you know, yeah being around for 60 years, we learned.
00:34:33
Speaker
many things from them. And then we pushed them to try some things we did. But it was definitely how yeah um you never stopped learning. ah Never start, never figure you've got it all fed out because you don't. Yeah.
00:34:48
Speaker
who I had a prof who always said, the day you stop learning is the day you die. Well, it's true. Yeah. Yeah. no So he was a very happy adding to the family. I'll make sure in the show notes, we've got a full list of all the, all the different stores so that listeners can go anywhere they like. I mean, it's complicated because there's three different brands. Right. But we're, we're all.
00:35:07
Speaker
It's all connected. It's all books. connected Right. yeah it's all bug but So hopefully people come out and have some fun up because there's lots of fun things happening that day.
00:35:23
Speaker
And that's it. Now, before we go, Two things I want to leave you
Closing and Call to Support Local Bookstores
00:35:27
Speaker
with. First, if you've been putting off going into your local independent bookstore, this is your sign. Independent bookstore day is the excuse, but honestly, any day works.
00:35:38
Speaker
Walk in, talk to the bookseller, let yourself get way too overstimulated and then leave with six books when you came in for one. Second, of course, a huge thank you both to Kathy and Christine for sitting down with me, to everybody at the book warehouse for hosting. Huge shout out to, you know, the Black Bond books umbrella of Black Bond book warehouse and Hager Books.
00:36:01
Speaker
We recorded both these interviews live at the book warehouse And that is also where we have been recording um ongoing monthly interviews with local authors. It has been an absolute joy. If you are new to the feed here, go check those interviews out. They are a ton of fun and they are going to be continuing on into the foreseeable future.
00:36:23
Speaker
If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with a friend in your life who owns too many books and is proud of it. You know exactly who I'm talking about. Do us and them a favor. and share the episode with them.
00:36:35
Speaker
As always, if you have any questions or want to share any stories with me, you can find me at FriendlessPod on Instagram and TikTok, or you can drop me a line at friendlesspod at gmail.com. But that's going to do it for me, so I'm going to wrap things up here. Thank you so much for listening one more time, and I hope I catch you back here again next week. But as always, I'm not going worry about that right now, and neither should you, because that is then, and this is now.
00:36:57
Speaker
So for now, I'll just say I love you, and I wish you well. Fun and safety, sweet peas.
00:37:36
Speaker
you