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Begin Again: Navigating the Shame of a Separation, Inner Child Healing & Starting Life Again - With Roselle | EP 21
217 Plays1 year ago
This is the most vulnerable podcast I've ever recorded with one of my best friends, Roselle, who is also the co-facilitator of my Wild & Free Retreats.
In this podcast we go on a journey exploring:
- The year of 2023 that shattered our lives & how we began life again
- Our individual experiences navigation separation of our marriages at the same time
- The story of how we met at a retreat in 2021
- Grief & heartbreak
- Navigating firsts & feeling like we became adults for the first time
- How the 2023 Wild & Free Retreat prepared us for the year to come
- Navigating deep emotions & intense pain
- What went down at the 2024 Wild & Free Retreat
- Our favourite moments from Wild & Free Retreat
- A big fear I've been navigating
- The power of women coming together to heal in a group
- A taste of the experience attending a retreat hosted by us
This is the most open I've ever been on a podcast and you get a real insight into what it's like in my world. I'd love to know what resonated with you about this conversation, send me a DM to let me know!
If you're curious about joining the next Wild & Free Retreat, join the waitlist here.
Connect with Steph on Instagram.
Connect with Steph on TikTok.
Connect with Roselle on Instagram
Don’t forget to leave a review about the podcast and then tag me on Instagram to receive a special gift from me as a thank you!
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Transcript
Personal Guilt and Shame
00:00:00
Speaker
I felt extreme guilt and extreme shame. It felt like this horrific secret that I was terrified to let people know about because I was so worried that people were going to think that I was a fraud.
Life's Challenges as Hurricanes
00:00:15
Speaker
You will absolutely experience multiple hurricanes in your life. And after every single one, you're just more prepared for the next. The biggest
00:00:25
Speaker
gift out of any moment in life where you feel like there's no way I'm ever gonna fucking get through this is that you do get through it and it proves to you that
00:00:37
Speaker
You can literally do it. Welcome
Pleasure, Sexuality, and Relationships
00:00:40
Speaker
to the Unfiltered Femme podcast. Your new world to get the lowdown on all things pleasure, sexuality, the mysterious female body, dating, relationships and everything you need to know to step into your most unfiltered, unapologetic, empowered and turned on self.
00:00:57
Speaker
I'm Steph Morris, a love, sex and intimacy coach and along with some incredibly fabulous guests, I'm here to spill the tea on those topics that are typically hush hush. The juicy things that you want to know all about that have maybe been a little bit too shy to talk about.
Introducing Rizal and Her Work
00:01:14
Speaker
Think of me as your fearless guide and partner in crime, creating a space for the unfiltered, the raw, the authentic chats where nothing is off limits and there's no such thing as too much. The Unfiltered Femme podcast is all about breaking down those walls and celebrating what it means to be an unfiltered, feminine being. I hope you're ready for a wild ride. Let's dive right in.
00:01:38
Speaker
In this episode, I am joined by one of my closest friends in the world, Rizal, who also is the incredible woman that supports me at the wild and free retreats. This episode is the most vulnerable episode I have ever recorded. We talk about our separations that we both experienced in 2023, navigating grief, heartbreak, healing our inner child. We go on a journey diving deep into our emotions and we top it off
00:02:04
Speaker
At the end, coming back in to laughter and joy and happiness, talking about the 2024 wild and free retreat and the incredible impact that had on the women that we got to share the magic with and on us as well. I know you're going to love this episode. Let us know what resonates and I'm excited for you to listen. So let's get into it. Welcome to the unfiltered femme podcast, Rizal. I'm so excited to have you here. How are you doing today?
00:02:31
Speaker
So excited too. We had a little bit of technical challenges, but we've overcome them. And this is like the theme of, I think, 2023 for us last year. We can overcome anything together. That's the evidence that we have. So let's dive in. I'd love for you to share a little bit about yourself. Who are you? Can you tell us? Who is Rose? Who is Roselle? Yeah. So I guess on paper, I am like a cellular healing health coach, I hope.
00:03:00
Speaker
Women really figure out the root cause of their different physical imbalances, but specifically like thyroid issues. And my passion lately has been really connecting their traumatic experiences to figuring out where they feel that need to stay in fight or flight.
00:03:21
Speaker
whether that's like consciously or subconsciously to help them like move through that and get back into that regulated, really healthy homeostatic state. I love the work that you do. It's fascinating to me. And also I love that you're such a resource whenever I have something or I know a client or someone I'm like, wait, what does this
Beekeeping and Healing Practices
00:03:41
Speaker
mean? What is the emotional conflict around back pain or around something around the lungs? So I love that you do that. Also, I feel like I want you to share that you're also
00:03:50
Speaker
A beekeeper, you also do all these other things because you're just a woman of many talents and skills.
00:03:59
Speaker
Yeah, so I actually got into beekeeping because I started reading about how people were using bee venom therapy to reset their nervous system response or like their pain response to different symptoms, specifically around Lyme disease, what we call like Lyme disease and conventional medicine. And so I was like really interested in like, how does this affect the nervous system and how does it almost like rewire that pain response or that, that inflamatory
00:04:27
Speaker
response that we experience whenever we have like joint pain or whenever we have like different flare ups of
00:04:33
Speaker
even like skin issues, right? Cause I think it's fascinating how it like pattern interrupts almost very similar to breathwork. So I'm also like a breathwork practitioner, breathwork guide. And I think that's how like we really connect because we can see how like miraculous it is to just override and not maybe not override, but just be able to sit in specific emotions and let them come up and come out and almost relate to them differently. That's how it like,
00:05:02
Speaker
all weaves together, just building relationship with your body, building a relationship with yourself and just allowing your experience to shift in ways that maybe you didn't think were possible. I love it. And before we dive deeper into this episode, just to summarize what you do as like a takeaway for people so that they actually can understand what's something that you would say to the people listening that if there's one little nugget from the work that you do that you want people to know, what would
Steph and Rizal's Friendship
00:05:28
Speaker
that be? Yeah, I hope
00:05:30
Speaker
people remember that they can literally heal from anything. Boom. There we go. So let's dive into how we met. So you are literally one of my best friends. You're one of the most amazing people and I'm so grateful for our friendship. And it's wild that we didn't know each other a few years ago. Like it's been less than three, it's only been two, two years and actually two and a half years. We've actually only hung out in person
00:05:57
Speaker
three times, right? There's been three occasions, but it's been like a week per time.
00:06:05
Speaker
all at retreats. I was thinking about that the other day. I was like, wait, we've only actually hung out three times, which I think is wild. But in retreat experiences, which if anyone has experienced retreats, they know that time does not exist. And when you are in a retreat container, you build such deep connections. It's as if you've been together for years. Like the depth that you get to know people is beyond what
00:06:30
Speaker
some of your friendships that you've had for a lifetime are because of the vulnerability and the openness and just
00:06:38
Speaker
intimacy that you experience as a group. So we met in 2021 at a women's retreat, a seven day women's retreat, and we were roomies. We were our beds were next to each other and we bonded deeply then. So let's talk about the 2021 retreat, how we met and your experience of attending that retreat.
00:07:03
Speaker
First of all, I just want to say immediately when we met in the room and I think we were just talking about sex. Honestly, we were both just like, yes, we want fucking cervical orgasm. And I think we were talking about John Wineland too. Yes, bub.
00:07:19
Speaker
Because I was about to do my year-long certification. And I remember you being like, report back to me. I was like, oh, I will. I think I just bought a butt plug. That's it. I'd had to order a butt plug for this certification. It was like on the recommended things. And I was so excited, but I'd never used it at that point. So I was sharing. It was the first time I'd ever even heard of a Yoni egg. And then you said butt plug. And I was like, what butt? What is a butt plug? Tell me. Have you used a butt plug now? No.
00:07:49
Speaker
Okay. Maybe the 2025 wild and free, I need to be like recommended items at butt plug, not for us to be using at the retreat, but just so that people can buy an experience of butt plug for the delicious butt pleasure that exists.
00:08:04
Speaker
that in the gift bag. I'm here for it. I wanna, we're gonna be upping the game. We're gonna be upping the level every time. I definitely would love to be including sex toys in the wild and free retreat gift bags. That would be fucking epic next year. Open for sponsorship. Yeah, so in 2021 though, I would say, so what I was saying before, it was really the first time that I chose to go on a retreat for fun. Like I'd done different like weekend long
00:08:29
Speaker
workshops or quote unquote retreats, but it was more from a student aspect versus me just, I want to see what, what comes up or I just want to have some fun and be in this environment that I've never really allowed myself to be in because I had a lot of sisterhood wound shit around just being myself. And that 2021 retreat really showed me that it was very safe to be myself around other women and that it wasn't
00:08:58
Speaker
like too much or that it wasn't even, I don't know, I had this story around, it's really shameful or really disgusting to just be who you are because you'll get cast out of this group of friends. I had so many of those issues before and that retreat specifically, especially bonding with you almost immediately. That had never happened before.
00:09:21
Speaker
So that was just like a whole new experience
Retreat Experiences and Personal Growth
00:09:24
Speaker
for me. And then it just, I was like, okay, I'm open to that. And then I allowed myself to see what happened the next day and then the next day and the next day just got deeper and deeper. And I just felt more love and more open and just, yeah, a lot more acceptance for myself and a lot more acceptance for who I was. What were the favorite moments for you or maybe most challenging experiences for you attending that retreat?
00:09:49
Speaker
speaking. Yeah, it was like I had this story that what I had to say was not important or not valuable enough. And that it had to be this like really profound or like really wise expression versus just just saying how I felt in the moment. And when I did that, I had
00:10:12
Speaker
I had women reflect like, oh yeah, I actually, I resonate with that or I feel that too. That was very healing for me because it gave me the sense like, okay, it doesn't have to be like anything special. You can just speak your mind or speak how you feel and you're not going to be cast out if it's not super special or whatever. It's safe to be heard just in your true expression. Exactly. Yeah.
00:10:36
Speaker
really powerful. And I think something that so many women struggle with is just using their voice and being authentic, not having to look a certain way or express themselves in a certain way. So that's really powerful. And I really resonate with that too. I think for me, it was challenging in some ways or many ways.
00:10:53
Speaker
because it was a larger group. It was 30 or 40 women. And I found that at times challenging to still be my authentic self in a larger group because I'm typically much more of a space maker than a space taker. I definitely like to, especially in larger groups, I don't really feel the need to
00:11:15
Speaker
be out there and be like, I think it's a little bit different actually now. I'm definitely way more in my fiery energy and can be like really loud and attention loving at moments, but I still love to be in the background as well and be space making when that feels right. But yeah, for me, that was definitely interesting to reflect. And something also that I wanna touch on that I think is gonna be interesting for people to reflect 2021 to 2024 is actually not that long. That is,
00:11:45
Speaker
from that retreat just over two years, really. In that time, I personally have hosted four retreats myself. I have gone on my own life-shattering journey evolution. Since then, I've got married and separated from my partner. That's crazy. So much has happened. Living a single life in my 30s and finally feeling really happy and feeling really content and more in love with myself than ever.
00:12:13
Speaker
And it's wild to reflect back on 2021, even thinking to my expression of self back then, I had grown so much and evolved so much and really felt comfortable in who I was. But that was such a pivotal time for me, because that was a retreat where there was a lot, not a lot, but there were a number of occasions where we were all naked. We were doing naked photo shoots. I think we did three or four naked photo shoots. And at first,
00:12:42
Speaker
At first I was like, Oh my God. Cause that was the first 2021, November, 2021 was the first time I'd ever been naked around a hot, like 30 other women. That was so new to me. And I was really, I think I was nervous. I must've been nervous. I don't really remember now. I think it was the fear of doing it, but then actually once we were doing it, it was like, Oh, this is really not a big deal. Like it's just bodies. What was your experience of that?
00:13:10
Speaker
totally resonate with that. I was just like, oh my God, we're gonna do what? I was honestly, I'm so glad you were my roommate, because you were just like, okay, we're gonna do this. And we just fed off of each other's energy. We're like, whatever, it's gonna happen. It's gonna be great. I was like, oh my God, people are gonna see all of me. And at the same time, I'm just like, I'm bearing my heart and my soul and the body is just like this,
00:13:37
Speaker
physical manifestation of all of that. So why would I just not take a photo and bear it all there too? And it was so fun. It was so much fun. All of the people watching us get naked in the ocean, in the jungle with the leaves. And yeah, it's really cool to think about now of like the evolution of I felt like we were babies and we were attending the retreat and we were such different, more
00:14:02
Speaker
innocent versions of ourselves, especially because what we both experienced in 2023, which I can't wait to dive into. But I just remember also that after that retreat, I did my first ever naked photo shoot. I had this most amazing photo shoot and I felt so good. And that was where we both got tattoos at the end of the retreat. And I actually got three tattoos after this retreat. Like,
00:14:29
Speaker
Not just one, I got one at the retreat and then I was in Costa Rica for another like week or 10 days, staying in the same place as Shawn Mendes for two weeks. So I was like, I need more tattoos. And that was the time where I got my tattoo on my wrist that says, alive, wild and free. Because I felt so liberated. I felt so...
00:14:49
Speaker
connected or reconnected to my primal state where I was not having to be a version of myself that I thought I had to be. There was no more hiding. That was really the time where I felt safe to just be me and to be seen in all of myself, using my voice, being naked with my body, with my authentic expression. And I got the tattoo alive, wild and free after doing my first
00:15:18
Speaker
like feminine embodiment kind of photo shoot with some of it where I was fully naked. And it felt so good. I was like, this is fine. This is not a big deal at all. It was really amazing and liberating. And that is why my retreat is called wild and free because that true feeling that can only be experienced when you're in Costa Rica, where you are attending a retreat experience or you've experienced something similar where you're like, I feel wild. I feel free. I feel so.
00:15:48
Speaker
alive. And that was that's the summer to sum up anything else you want to share about that retreat and your experience. Yeah, no, totally exactly. The freedom that I felt to just be whoever the fuck I wanted to be without any previous history. And I know we talk about this a lot, but it's literally like an opportunity for you to just experiment and be exactly like
00:16:15
Speaker
You have your vision board or you have like all the scripting, right? And it's, it's the most opportune time to really let those things play out because you don't have any other history wherever you, from what you were doing or people that know you or it's just you and the creative capacity that you get to enjoy.
Hosting a Retreat: Challenges and Joys
00:16:39
Speaker
I completely agree. And that is what is so profound. And I think people can often have fears about going to retreats and they want to go with somebody. They want a friend there. An actual fact, sometimes there are people that go with people or they know someone and I think that's fine. That's meant to be.
00:16:55
Speaker
But for the most part, people attending retreats on their own is literally the most empowering thing you can do. And you're going to freak out and be like, what if everybody is weird? And what if nobody likes me? And what if I don't make any friends? And what if it's just like the worst time, which it literally won't be. If you trust the person running the retreat, it will be great.
00:17:13
Speaker
But it is just being yourself and practicing because the problem that we have as humans is we just live in a bubble. We can very easily hurt ourselves and just stay in our comfort zone of the bubble that we live in, hanging out with the same people, doing the same things every day, eating the same types of food, doing the same kind of workouts, having the same routine. And when we do desire to change and to grow and to evolve,
00:17:41
Speaker
We can do that at home, but also there's not that chance for us to really almost be tested and challenged. Okay. You've done this growth. Now let's see if this is true. If you are truly embodying this and that's the power of going to retreat is you've done all this work. You are embodying your inner sex screen. You're embodying essentiality. You're embodying your confidence, or maybe it's not even that, maybe it's like you are starting to express your needs. You're starting to express your desires. You notice that.
00:18:10
Speaker
you feel unworthy around other women or you judge other women or you feel judged by other women so let's go to a retreat and work through that or practice showing up is the real version of you so you don't feel misunderstood or whatever it is but you can't do that at home with the same people.
00:18:25
Speaker
You have to go to different experiences and experience different people to challenge you where you don't have your comfort blanket of your partner, of your friends, of your dogs in my case, me and my codependent dogs. Getting out of the comforts is where you really grow and this is why retreats allow you to grow at such an exponential rate because
00:18:48
Speaker
It's such an intense experience for many days. You're not in your usual environment. You can explore different habits, different behaviours. And it's just, retreats are just magical. And I really want everybody to experience retreats, especially mine and ours, but any retreats really do yourself a favour and book yourself a retreat because you're already spending that money probably going on holiday or going out for dinners or buying loads of clothes. So really investing in yourself is a no brainer.
00:19:16
Speaker
Totally. Yeah. And it's, I think it's like the, we look for all of these different daily pattern interrupts, but the exactly like you said, the best way to really give yourself that full like push to maybe take it to that next level is to give yourself that completely new environment. Mm-hmm.
00:19:42
Speaker
That is 100% true. And it's very hard to do. So just acknowledging for people who are trying to grow and evolve and change, it is challenging. It is hard. And going away to a different environment is where it's at.
00:19:58
Speaker
And also, you never know who you're going to meet. If you want to completely change the kind of people you attract, if you want to be in the most high vibrational state, if you want to really just feel so magnetic and create an incredible group of friends that you have, like all around the world, retreats where it's at, I always come away with at least one, you best friend. Like I have one like sole best friend after each long retreat that I go on, like week long retreat.
00:20:25
Speaker
And it's the best. So I knew I was going to be spending the winter in Costa Rica and decided to take the leap to host my first retreat, which was terrifying. But at the same time I knew that was the path that I wanted to take, but I'd never done, I think I had hosted one.
00:20:43
Speaker
in person event before by myself. I was just taking to a hundred person events, retreats for up to 40 people, branding workshops of 20, 30 people. So I knew I could do the event planning piece. I was like, that part is easy. Creating an magical experience. Totally my jam. Like I've got that down. Facilitating and coaching. I'm like, I'm a great coach. So I'm thinking I'll be fine. But also I was like, I don't know, holding a space for
00:21:07
Speaker
a group of like 10 women for six days seems like quite a lot. Is that going to be exhausting? And obviously I knew that I needed somebody to be the right hand woman, the co-supporter, co-creator of the space to support me and support the women.
00:21:24
Speaker
so that we can go really deep. So I asked you, it was like, you're the only person, you're the only person I want. So that's what we did. We had only spent, we'd only been together that one week at 2021 in the retreat. We had not seen each other since. And a year later, I was like, can you come support me in my retreat? I remember as we were leaving that retreat too, we were like, we were just like living on this high and we're just like,
00:21:53
Speaker
We can't fucking wait to do this for ourselves. We're like, we're hosting retreats. I still remember like that exact moment walking away. And we're like, we're going to host our own retreat soon. I didn't remember that, but it does. I'm glad that you remember. I knew I had the desire, but I think I thought it was going to be quite far off. Like I knew I wanted to do retreats. You did say it was going to be a while.
00:22:12
Speaker
Yeah, I didn't realize it's gonna be a year later. I can change quickly. So let's talk about the 2020, sorry. 2023, I'm kidding the year. The last year was a blur. We don't really know what happened. So 2023 retreat, let's talk about that. So wild and free retreat. We had eight amazing women ranging in the ages from 18 to 51. So the 18 year old was my amazing niece who was wanting to come out
00:22:41
Speaker
for a trip in Costa Rica. And it just worked out that she was going to be coming out at the same time. And she was like, can I please come to your retreat? I was like, obviously you can. And that was such an incredible gift that I'm forever so grateful that I was able to give her that opportunity of at 18 years old to be experienced. Like accelerating development. Hashtag best auntie in the world. We know this.
00:23:08
Speaker
So that was the 18 year old. Typically I don't have people that young at the retreats. Usually it's late twenties, but typically thirties, forties and fifties age range for women. And how did you feel going into that? What was your experience of that retreat? Cause that was my first retreat that I'd hosted.
Adaptability in Retreat Hosting
00:23:27
Speaker
What was your experience and how did you feel going into this? I would say I was.
00:23:32
Speaker
nervous because I was just like, I've never created anything like this before. You have a history of event planning. I think the most event planning I've ever done was like doing like a health and wellness fair at my office job when I was in the Navy. And that was like, I don't know, like five vendors. And that was like the extent of anything that I ever planned. And so I was like, how am I going to
00:23:58
Speaker
help these women feel really like safe and really okay to do some of the things that we were talking about and like planning for the workshops and I was like, oh my god, is this gonna be? Are they gonna be okay? By the way, how if we don't mention that you were in the Navy and you fly planes and you're such about us? I was in the Navy. Yes. That was a whole nother life. But yeah, I think when you talk about the masculine in me, I think that's totally like where I got that
00:24:28
Speaker
from, it's having to learn the discipline and having to learn the ability to just make sure that the other person feels okay. And I guess yeah, that kind of set me up in a sense for this event planning. But I would say the biggest piece was, okay,
00:24:49
Speaker
I don't know these women and I hope I can convey, you can trust me, we can hold you. You definitely did. You're literally cool as a cucumber. When you say, oh, I was nervous, I'm like, were you? I didn't even know because you're so calm and collected that I never know if you're like dysregulated or nervous until you tell me you seem like you have it all
00:25:12
Speaker
together you're like everything's under control everything's great which is I'm like talk to me but also in the moment it's a very nice to have such a calming grounding presence and everybody does distrust you and feel so supported by your energy and I do what we say to you at this last retreat I was like you have such an amazing embodiment of king energy and also really incredible queen
00:25:36
Speaker
beautiful feminine energy, like the perfect balance. I've never seen that in a woman, that embodiment of divine masculine in a really strong way, but then to be able to be so soft at the same time is beautiful. Thank you for receiving that. I love you. I love you so much. We're the best. We're the best retreat queens. So let's explore a little bit around this experience. Actually, let me share from my perspective, probably not share this for that. I was really nervous too, especially
00:26:07
Speaker
in the lead up and the day of the welcoming ceremony. Once we got into the welcoming ceremony, I was like, I've got this. It's all good. But I remember being fucking terrified to have the women gather for that opening circle sitting around. I felt, I remember feeling so nervous. I felt like I was mumbling and jumbling and fluffing up my words because so
00:26:30
Speaker
I couldn't believe I was like, shit. I have to like bring these people to get, I have to start this. Getting it going was hard. Yeah. So much energy. These people have traveled from across the world, from the UK, from the US, from Austria, all around. Yeah. Everywhere. I was so nervous. Oh my gosh. I feel nervous now sharing about it. And not having that, you have to have such trust and faith in yourself to be able to put something like that on. And for us in each other.
00:26:59
Speaker
that we have got this, whatever the week throws us, we'll be okay, which we were. And it was amazing. It was such an incredible experience, like so many highlights for me. I think the confidence in myself being one of them afterwards, wow. Because when you see that the space that you've created, women are able to go really deep and really confront some of the deepest wounds and pain and challenges that they have.
00:27:27
Speaker
Like they went there and they did the work and I'm not taking that away from them. They have to be open and willing and they, the women get out of it, how vulnerable they're ready to be. And also the space that we created was facilitating that. Yeah, that was facilitating that. What is some of your favorite moments and how did that set up, set you up for 2023?
00:27:56
Speaker
Yeah. There were just so many things that were going wrong. And we were just like going at it and just adapting every single turn. And I was like, wow, we can do this no matter what we are capable and resilient. And at the end of the day, I was fricking exhausted, but I was just like so excited and filled with joy because it just, it almost, one, they just had so much fun that day.
00:28:23
Speaker
And they just could not stop. I remember even going to bed and they were just like still laughing at the pool and just having so much fun. And I was like, wow, I can't believe this is the reality. Like they're just.
00:28:35
Speaker
allowing themselves to enjoy life and being able to create that experience even amidst all of these obstacles that we experienced that day, I was just like, face 100%. Yeah, that was such a fun day. So that was hilarious because we had a waterfall trip that I was like, oh, it's just a small walk up to the waterfall in 30 degree weather. I'd never done it.
00:28:58
Speaker
And I've done it a couple of times since and it didn't seem that bad, but this particular day, it was fucking hot. It was so humid. We had women, a couple of women who had like really bad asthma, who probably would have opted out of the walk had I asked them if they were able to do it. But I hadn't asked them because in my mind I was like,
00:29:17
Speaker
Oh, everyone can do an hour, an hour walk. So we had to hike up, literally it took so long. We had to split into two groups and then basically I messed up because I hadn't purchased the golf cart ride down or something, because I didn't realize. And then basically it sold
Community and Personal Growth
00:29:38
Speaker
out. So then I'm trying to use my basic Spanish skills to try and buy us the tickets to get back down. Because I'm like, if I have to tell these women that they have to walk back down,
00:29:46
Speaker
after what we just experienced. I feel like there were moments where they were almost angry at having to do it as well, weren't they? They were like, what? We're like, it's fine, it's fine.
00:30:01
Speaker
Um, so then me, Roselle and one of the other women who was a runner, actually the woman in her fifties couldn't get tickets for the little golf cart. It was basically like a truck. You had to buy, you had to either buy a ticket to walk back down, which would be another hour. And we didn't have time in the schedule for that.
00:30:18
Speaker
Or you had to buy a seat in the car and there was only limited spots in the car. So there weren't enough. So we literally ran down, sprinted down this, it took an hour to get up. I think we were down in like 20 minutes and it was honestly such a fun. It's definitely a magic moment for me because it was just.
00:30:35
Speaker
Hilarious. We were like, we've got this. It's fine. Like everyone who needed to get on the car got in the car and we're just going to have fun running down. It did really throw out the schedule today. I was stressing a little bit because I didn't plan for the waterfall to be until 2pm that day, but it worked out and it was fine and everyone was exhausted afterwards. Then we had a really fun evening, embodying the wild woman, embodying different elements through movements in our body.
00:31:02
Speaker
to music, playing with what does it feel like and how would your body express water and earth, air and fire. And that was super fun. And I also remember being in bed at 10 o'clock and hearing them giggling down in the pool and just was like, wow, this is magical. Like they're good. They're doing their own thing. And creating that space where women can just be themselves and have fun is so fulfilling and so incredible. Yes, exactly. We need more of that.
00:31:29
Speaker
Yeah, because even where I live in the Sierra Nevada foothills in California, and there are a lot of gatherings for women circles, drum circles, song circles, and all of that. And you can even just feel how much women just want to gather and just want to be in their primal nature and just like express and dance and move and
00:31:52
Speaker
Having the ability to create that space is just, I would want nothing else. Yeah. Where it's not circled around. We're not gathering around drinking or around performing or performing exactly. It's just because. Yeah. Just, just to be. There's nothing more magical than that.
00:32:13
Speaker
no expectations. That's where true healing takes place. And I think for women need to gather with other women and have these unconditionally loving, supportive, nourishing friendships. That's how we heal even more deeply the relationship to ourselves and to other women. And I really believe that
00:32:35
Speaker
the connections and the support and the friendships and the relationships that we have in our life has such a massive impact on the overall success, fulfillment, satisfaction, and happiness of us as individuals. Because if we are around people who are unsupportive, and this goes for romantic relationships, platonic friendships, family, if they're unsupportive, that's going to bring you down. It's going to be hard to get further ahead. What's the crab bucket analogy? The crabs in the bucket are trying to always pull the other crabs down.
00:33:04
Speaker
That's what it's like. And even if you don't physically have people trying to pull you down, if you're around people who are negative or who have a very fixed mindset and see the world through a certain lens, that is going to rub off on you. That's just the way that we work. Our nervous systems are tuned to each other. So even if you're not.
00:33:22
Speaker
taking on consciously their beliefs. If you're around someone who is living in dysregulation, constantly stressed with a lot of anxiety and you're sleeping in the same bed as them, you're living in the same house as them, you're spending a lot of time with that person, that is going to disrupt you and affect your nervous system and your overall happiness, your health, and ultimately what you can create in your life. And the same thing goes when we have incredible friendships and an incredible partnership that can really propel us to the next level as well.
00:33:52
Speaker
of having that support. So this is what is magical about experiences like this is to create these communities back home. I think it can give us a taste of what we want.
00:34:03
Speaker
I know it did for me because I didn't have these kind of friendships at home. And this has been something that I'm working on. I've been working on the last six months or so and really is a focus for me for this year is creating more community for myself locally. Cause I've traveled so much and I have so many incredible friends around the world. And I really want that community and that connection and that depth of support and friendship in person as well. So retreats,
Emotional Journey Through Separation
00:34:28
Speaker
man. What else do you want to say about this retreat and how it prepared you for the year 2023?
00:34:33
Speaker
Well, I think just like seeing how I was able to hold others while also holding
00:34:40
Speaker
all of the emotions in myself, I was just like, oh yeah, I can do a lot more than I thought I could. So just like a lot of validation in that sense. And then also we were like retreat mamas, like parenting and holding these women. And that was like practice for the self-parenting that I had to do for the rest of that year, like becoming that stable force or that stable pillar so that
00:35:07
Speaker
Even though I was like in so much unknown for 2023, which is, I think we were like rhyming our subconscious for that, right? By doing all these feminine embodiment practices, which is the feminine being in her unknown, the feminine
00:35:24
Speaker
just being in that cosmic womb of darkness and nothing exists. It's all just potential and creation. And having those little moments during the retreat prepared me for everything that was to come in 2023. And what did come in 2023 for you? And later that year, in April of 2023, we had come to this point in our relationship where we were just like, okay, we're going to separate.
00:35:55
Speaker
And we've had like little conversations around it, maybe a year leading up to it, just trying to be as transparent with each other as possible. Cause that's what we'd always agreed upon. Like we were in relationship to enhance each other and not to possess each other, which was what I loved about our relationship. It was never from this place of.
00:36:19
Speaker
owning the other person, it was more so from a place of, okay, we respect each other's independence so much that if at any point we feel like our relationship is no longer contributing to the happiness of that individual, then we're going to part ways, respectfully, lovingly, et cetera. And so we got to that point in April of 2020 finally, and it was just like, okay, we're going to let each other go. And it was fucking painful.
00:36:49
Speaker
your word shattering like that is like exactly what it felt like you just go into the depths of like death and you just feel almost like a withdrawal from this like drug that you've been on for for me it was a decade because we've been we had been together since we were 19 and we were 30 at that point
00:37:08
Speaker
And so this was that unknown. There were so many things that I just didn't even know how to be an adult because there were moments where I would take care of all the health stuff and he would take care of all the finances and being
00:37:23
Speaker
the person that was meant to take care of everything now for myself, it was so foreign to me. And it was just like, how the F am I gonna figure all this out? And I was judging myself the entire time. And I was just like, how could you let yourself get here? How could you let yourself get to this point? So much, almost even like resentment for myself showed up. And you feel all these like heavy emotions that I had felt maybe
00:37:53
Speaker
maybe five years before, but it was not it about like relationship, like romantic partnership. It was just like relationship to work. Like I, I knew how to sit in the unknown when it came to work because I had tried so many different things since then, but I'd only been in one deep devotional relationship my entire adult life. And it brought me so much closer to God and
00:38:20
Speaker
Like that divinity within me and it just brought more faith and more trust in the humanness. Like my human is able to handle what I chose to experience here. Wow. Thank you for sharing all of that. Obviously I didn't go through your experience, but
00:38:35
Speaker
what you experienced was profound. And it's wild that there were similarities between both you and I during 2023. I'm so grateful for you and our connection, our relationship, because you having gone through that and as you were sharing, like I actually had chills, but also now I feel a lot of emotion in you sharing that because I resonate so deeply with
00:39:02
Speaker
being an like being an adult for the first time basically like when you come out of a relationship and we're gonna come full circle with your experience oh my gosh literally feel so emotional and i think people can probably resonate if you've ever experienced a separation
00:39:21
Speaker
from a marriage or being in a long-term relationship for almost a decade. And then for the majority of your twenties, especially that's why you are really becoming an adult for the first time and you sharing that I resonate deeply. I feel like I became an adult for the first time at 31 once.
00:39:40
Speaker
I went through a separation. So I'm like, fuck, I have to do everything myself. I have to clean the toilet and like I'm used to doing so many of those things, but not having the full load of everything and make sure the bills are paid on time. It's just like, it's a lot. So I didn't realize like how much.
00:39:59
Speaker
the worst of being an adult and the finances and everything. And it really is so challenging. Too many emotions have come up for me now on this. So how did you find that connection with your like re-parenting yourself? Because that ultimately is what's happened when you go through something so intense as a separation.
00:40:26
Speaker
or any form of life-shattering transition or experience, the work that you're being invited into is healing yourself, but re-parenting yourself and re-parenting that wounded inner child that feels like their life has been ripped apart from them. Because what we can feel as adults is like our mommy or our daddy has been taken away.
00:40:49
Speaker
That's how it feels in our bodies, even though we are adult human beings that do not have, we're not codependent on the person for our survival, but that's what it can feel like internally. And that's another reason why it can be even more intense and painful for us to experience things like this. So how did you navigate that? What did that look like? How was the experience?
00:41:09
Speaker
Yeah. So thank God for you, Steph, because you taught me so much about just allowing those emotions to show up and to, to live and be right in all the feminine embodiment practices that we talk about and that you guided us through during the retreat in 2021. I don't, I'm sorry, 2023 yourself, be angry and
00:41:38
Speaker
not making any of it wrong, right? Because I used to do that all the time because when I was growing up, not to like shit all my parents or throw shade at them or anything, but in Asian culture, you don't express those kinds of emotions, especially not in front of people. I didn't have any of that practice whatsoever. So being able to just go by the river and just cry and wail and just be like,
00:42:06
Speaker
This ball of mush was just seeing this little version of me be like fully in her emotion and like fully, gosh, I'm even getting emotional like thinking about her because she was just so hurt when we don't allow ourselves to go there. Then you have a lot more wounding and a lot more of that, that shame around it. So.
00:42:34
Speaker
I think discharging all the shame around those really heavy emotions allowed me to really love on myself and give myself that compassion that I think any parent would really want to give their child. Thank you for touching on shame because I think that's such a big piece that we all deal with as humans. Everybody has a different level of internalized shame, whether that's around
00:43:02
Speaker
their body or their sexuality or their expression or something not working out. I know that I felt so much shame for my marriage ending. Like that was so intense for me and I felt guilt as well for
00:43:19
Speaker
the people in my life towards my parents, like my family, my ex, just every, every part of me for months. And I was working with my therapists around this was, I just felt extreme guilt and extreme shame. Like it felt like this
00:43:35
Speaker
horrific secret that I had that I was terrified to let people know about because I was so worried that people were going to think that I was a fraud or that I was like name the judgment that I was telling myself that people were going to say about me. That was going through my head and it's a self-deprecation but on such an intense level that the inner child was
00:43:59
Speaker
Doing like that's a pattern from my childhood i used to beat my beat up on myself like why am i like this and why am i not like everyone else and just all of the.
Support During Life Transitions
00:44:08
Speaker
Life's not fair and people don't understand me and i'm so misunderstood.
00:44:12
Speaker
people don't listen to me, people don't get me. We can keep going, but the shame piece is really big and being able to meet ourselves in the shame and know that's part, like that is going to be part of it, but we don't have to live with that. We don't have to allow that to stay as part of our narrative. And the healing really is about going into the inner child piece. And I just want to share as well, I feel like
00:44:38
Speaker
This is just a great example of the synchronicities that can experience when you are really tapped into, I think yourself, but also into the fact that there is something greater than us. Whether you believe in the universe or higher power or God or whatever it is, I truly believe that there is more to life than humans living in their heads, thinking that we are the shit. There's more than that. And there is more.
00:45:07
Speaker
than our minds. There's energy, there is consciousness, there is everything. So when you are on this path and when you have trust in yourself and you also have trust in your life's path and that you're a good human and things will work out for you, but that doesn't mean that you're not going to experience challenges of life. Synchronicities happen, people come in your path and what I'm really grateful for with us is we met in 2021, we hosted a retreat together in 2023 and then we both experienced
00:45:36
Speaker
very similar, but obviously very different, but parallel-ish experiences of being with our long-term husbands going through separation at the same time. What the actual fuck, but also what a fucking gift.
00:45:55
Speaker
Literally because you had gone through it before me, that was April and May, right? So when shit was hitting the fan for me, which was around June, May, but really around, really around June, I was so grateful to have you to support me because I was the first conversations that I started to have with people around it. I think you were one of the first people that I was openly talking to about it because again,
00:46:19
Speaker
So much shame. Like I couldn't tell people what was going on. We hadn't been married for that long. We've been together a long time, but that was weighing on me heavily. What are people going to think? What are people going to say? It was just, oh my God, it was so hard. And I'm laughing now. Cause I'm like.
00:46:36
Speaker
I don't even know how I fucking survived that year, but here we are. But yeah, I'm grateful for that. And again, it's the power of retreats because you would had gone through and going through your own stuff and being able to support each other and be so open and vulnerable. Had we not experienced retreats together, we wouldn't have had that level of connection and that ability to send each other like 10, 20 minute long voice notes or hop on a call.
00:46:59
Speaker
And just be completely fucking honest about what we're feeling and what we're experiencing, meeting ourselves and being able to hold each other with the shame and the guilt and the pain and the intensity and the grief without retreat experience. I don't think there's not many women that I was able to do that with or not many humans that I was able to do with that with at that time. Me neither.
00:47:22
Speaker
Oh, wow. All right. Let's, let's keep the conversation rolling. I'm like, Oh my God. I can't even reminisce on 2023, but I'm really proud of you and I'm really proud of me. And I would love for you to full circle.
00:47:39
Speaker
Obviously we could literally talk about this for hours, about the experience of 2023. But how did you go from there of going on this journey, experiencing this separation, going through all of this? Like what did the next few months look like leading to where we are today and leading into the 2024 retreat and how different that was? But what was the rest of 2023 like for you? Three. So I ended up, I stayed in the town that we both moved to, but I ended up doing like a lot of
00:48:08
Speaker
Like the whole Eat Pretty Love thing where you're just like, I just got to figure out who I am without this person. I got to figure out what I stand for. Like all that. Yeah. I went to, I went home for the very first time since everything happened in 2020. And it was just like this huge, almost like the cap to the re-parenting, right? Like I saw all the ways that I had picked up all this programming to create
00:48:37
Speaker
the relationship that I had with Joshua. And I was just like, wow, I felt so unworthy living here. And now I'm back home and I'm like in this completely new headspace and I actually feel a completely different sense of identity in myself. And it was just like, okay, I know, I don't know who I am per se, but I know that
00:49:04
Speaker
I will have the ability to just keep moving forward and that I will like always have my back. And that was like the biggest thing for me as I went to Italy and I went to Paris and meeting all these people and trying on different personalities, trying on different ways of being Roselle. And it was almost like the whole like main character energy was like,
00:49:31
Speaker
now you get to actually like play and express and try on all these different versions of you, not just in a retreat space, but also like in real life. So that was really fun because it was almost like reflecting on all the different workshops that we had done in 2021. Right. 2023. Like the lover, the wild woman, the dark feminine, the queen, just trying on all those different
00:50:01
Speaker
archetypes in the rest of 2023, as I was trying to come into this more whole version of myself. Right? Where I'm just like, okay, yeah, I can do all the things that I wrote off if I choose to.
00:50:19
Speaker
And I think that was like the biggest piece is I personally believe that choice is what makes us as humans divine and being able to practice all the different ways that I can choose to be sad or happy or feminine or masculine and just lay.
Redefining Relationships
00:50:40
Speaker
and all these different expressions. That's what 2023 provided for me when I was in that empty liminal dark space. And it's just, no, you don't have to stay there. You can just go explore, go have fun. And whatever it was meant for you will not miss you.
00:50:56
Speaker
I love that quote. I do too. I love the theme of play amongst all of that because it can, this has been something I've been very conscious of is we can form emotional addictions and we can get really stuck in a certain way of being. So I think it's really good to have the awareness when you've gone through your life shattering into a million pieces of the point where you're done with it.
00:51:19
Speaker
or you're through the mass of it, but where you're still choosing that. Because we can be like, oh, this is now my known state. I have to stay in the grief or I have to stay in the sadness. And I think having that discernment between, yeah, there's still going to be moments of that, but actually I'm not choosing to identify with those emotions all the time because we can
00:51:40
Speaker
perpetuate our self-suffering as humans and also feel like it's all or nothing, it's one or the other. I'm in pain, therefore I can't feel pleasure. And I love that you touched on finding play through that because I've really leaned on pleasure, of course, through my experience. And you actually had a happy ending. I did, yeah. So
00:52:08
Speaker
through all of that, through all of this play and like really experimenting with how I had gotten our relationship to the not saying like it was all my fault or like it was all his fault obviously this is a co-creative experience and really reflecting on how I how my choices and my decisions
00:52:31
Speaker
to make him feel like I didn't need him. I think I was just like a little too in my masculine at that point when we were separating and really allowing myself to feel all of those emotions when we were separated and tapping back into that femininity really was the catalyst in us coming back together, right? And learning how to communicate in a way that wasn't blaming
00:53:00
Speaker
and it was just like expressing right just this is how I am and this is what I'm feeling in this moment and yeah I think that was the biggest piece is coming back into that feminine energy versus yeah being so like gotta do this gotta produce this gotta do all that yeah
00:53:20
Speaker
I love your story so much. I find it so inspiring because it's such a great example that there is no one way to do relationships and relationships are going to experience death and rebirth cycles and
00:53:37
Speaker
There are gonna be times of struggle and challenges and shit hitting the fan, and it's really up to the two individuals in that relationship to look at it and say, what are we gonna do here? Are we gonna keep rushing under the rug, going through the motions and one day end up potentially resenting and hating each other that it becomes this big.
00:53:54
Speaker
explosion, or should we have an honest conversation, perhaps go our separate ways, go on our individual journeys, detach completely and which is what you did, really found yourself and healed yourself individually on a deeper level and then coming back together and starting again in a way, like forming a new relationship because you're a different person and he's a different person from the two versions of yourself that married each other and
00:54:24
Speaker
at the point of separation. I think it's such an inspiring story and imitation for people that it doesn't have to look a certain way with your relationships just based on the way people are telling you or society or whatever other bullshit you're being told or you have been conditioned to believe. I think it takes great courage to
00:54:46
Speaker
be able to walk away. And then the fact that you came back together is incredible. And moving forward in this new energy with 2024 is really exciting. So thank you for sharing your story and your journey. It's really inspiring. Honestly, throughout the entire process.
00:55:03
Speaker
You have inspired me with the courage. I feel like I've said this after the retreat a couple of times already, but I'm just like in total awe of you and your capacity and how loving you are able to be throughout everything. And still, it's funny you reflect it to me, like the perfect balance of masculine, feminine, and that's what I see in you.
00:55:25
Speaker
Thank you. I received that. Oh, I love our friendship. I love it. Yeah. I'm really so grateful for you and so grateful for our journeys of 2023, which I really believe two things I want to say here is one, even in my own experience of separation and going through divorce.
00:55:48
Speaker
I can't remember if it was you I was saying this to or who I was saying this to this morning that I'm really paving my own way for the way that I'm doing that. Oh, it's right before this call I was saying that. I'm getting people saying things to me like, oh, you have to do this or you have to create this or cut this off or boundary this. And I'm like, I'm the fucking queen of boundaries. I know what my boundaries are, but also it's not so black and white. You spend almost a decade with somebody. You're not just going to cut them out your life or that's not the kind of person that I am. I'm not like,
00:56:18
Speaker
Brush the rug like you're done. We're never going to speak again. That's just not the way that I operate. And I'm paving my own way of focusing on my own life and doing my own thing. And I'm very grateful and very happy and just really, truly enjoying the time on my own because I've never.
00:56:36
Speaker
had time by myself before like this i've been in relationships for the past 11 years and this is such a gift for me because i know it's not going to last forever and i'm a relationship girl i love relationships and i know the next one is going to be fucking epic but i'm not there yet
00:56:51
Speaker
And I totally trust in the timing also. But at the same time, I'm paving my own way of the way I'm going to do this and I'm not going to buy into toxic narratives over the ways that a divorce has to happen because I don't agree with that. And I've always taken the simple route of doing things and I don't buy into the stress and drama of a lot of ways people do that. And so
00:57:14
Speaker
it's i love hearing other people's stories obviously i know yours intimately but hopefully giving sort of inspiration and faith to other people that you don't have to do things in a certain way like even for people who have kids you don't have to do things in a certain way you don't have to be at war with someone now of course there are going to be times where there is a breakup and something
00:57:35
Speaker
really bad is happening. You need to cut that person out completely and have no contact, which I did go through that phase with my separation of having complete no contact. Anyway, that's the whole thing. The no contact. Yeah. At first. Yeah.
00:57:50
Speaker
Yeah, to, to unsubscribe and like completely reprogram, I definitely think a period of no contact is like, it is really, cause it's wild when you're like with someone for so many years and you're messaging every day and you're speaking every day and you're seeing them every day to then to be able to untangle and emotionally detach. Definitely no contact is needed to come back into yourself. But then you have to figure out like what's actually true for you and what's, what's theirs and what's yours and
00:58:18
Speaker
Yeah. Totally. Yeah. I think the emotionally detaching and untangling is probably one of the hardest pieces. Yeah. It's a wild ride. But yeah, back to what you said, I think two pieces. One, feeling like an adult for the first time, having to figure stuff out. That's been a wild ride for me. I literally, this is embarrassing to admit, but I had to message my mum and dad be like, how do you clean a toilet?
00:58:42
Speaker
Because I have cleaned toilets before when I lived in Australia with my ex, but that was like, probably eight years ago. And I have not, I had not cleaned a toilet or a bathroom in eight years. So I literally, my mum, my dad, every time I was FaceTiming them.
00:58:57
Speaker
Stephanie, have you cleaned the toilet yet? And I was like, yeah, I like a literally how embarrassing is that? But I think people can relate you all have your own version of the toilet. What is something that you have to deal with for almost a decade that suddenly you're on your own. And it's Oh my God, I had the dishwasher like cleaning out the
00:59:16
Speaker
cleaning out the lint thing there in the dishwasher. It was like the filter that you have to clean out. I didn't, I didn't even know that was a thing. And then I pulled the filter out, cleaned it. Cause I was like, go me, that's not something I would have done. And then I couldn't put it together. I literally couldn't like get it back in the dishwasher. And I was like, fuck, there are so many things that you just don't realize. And I think it's also an invitation. If you're in relationship to really acknowledge like, what is your partner doing for you that you're not even
00:59:46
Speaker
That you don't even have the awareness of that if you weren't in that relationship you need to be figuring out on your own But it feels really good. It feels really good to that and my therapist was telling me this is very normal staff She's like everyone who's going through divorce or like a big separation
01:00:03
Speaker
they have to experience all of
Emotional Expression and Resilience
01:00:05
Speaker
the firsts. The first holiday, the first Christmas, the first birthday, first time going to a place that you've been together, the first... I just rented a car in Costa Rica and that was low-key drama for me because I've never rented a car by myself before. That was the first time I rented a car and there were things within that even a month ago that were stressful for me and that's normal. That is so normal.
01:00:30
Speaker
But it's life. I love that you drew attention to the, have gratitude for everything that your partner does. Cause that is totally what I felt like every single time I had to do something for the first time. I was just like, holy shit. Wow. I did that for granted. And sometimes it's even the security of having them to call, right? That's something that I.
01:00:55
Speaker
When I started to travel, so around like August, that was once we'd separated and I was traveling, going to Dubai, staying with my sister, traveling. I was like, fuck, I don't have anyone to text. Like who do I now text? And you land and you're like, just landed. Usually you text your partner.
01:01:13
Speaker
I was like, oh, I'll text my mum and dad. I text you. I remember voice noting you in Dubai, actually, as I was walking down. And I felt so good and still didn't realize that life was about to get even more fucked up. That, yeah, I was on a high. I was on a high then and life had other plans for me, which I'm grateful for now. I can see the gift and everything, but there's small things like that, small moments where it's, and I think it's the same, it's grief in all forms. So obviously this is a relationship ending is one form.
01:01:43
Speaker
It's more extreme if somebody has passed because that person literally is no longer there, but similar things where it's like you do something for the first time and that person isn't there and available for you to message. And it hits you a little bit like a dagger to the heart slightly, but then you move with it. You're like, okay, I noticed that I acknowledge you and it's valid to have these feelings of sadness in this. But yes, the biggest gift for me from last year was expressing my emotions. So something that I wanted to touch on was that 2021 retreat, I
01:02:13
Speaker
maybe shed a couple of tears during one workshop. I was not a cry. I remember you crying. Everybody was crying at that. Yeah. And I remember being like trying to force out the tears because I didn't cry. Like I, I'm a Pisces. Like I'm a very deep feeler. I've always felt deeply, but I, as
01:02:37
Speaker
A person who has had much more avoidant tendencies in the past, like to say I'm secure now. I definitely am secure, but I have avoidant tendencies that can arise, not in terms of commitment issues, but in the way I express. Again, not anymore. I'm very like open and vocal. Great person to be in a relationship with if I do say so myself.
01:02:57
Speaker
Just doing my own horn there. But what was I saying? That I struggled to express myself because I had so many times swallowed the tears, shut down the emotion. Don't cry, don't cry, don't cry. That even 2021 at that retreat, I was not crying. I could feel things deeply, but expressing it was a struggle for me. And 2023, it was like,
01:03:24
Speaker
Just the way I got to know my emotions and meet them in such a profound way. Like I have sobbed, like there's a difference between crying and sobbing. And I was just, I still sob a lot where it's like full body shakes and it's painful. Like it's actually painful, but that's the gift. I feel so fucking grateful.
01:03:44
Speaker
to be able to meet my emotions with loving presence, to be able to meet my emotions and just hold them and be with them and process them and feel them and scream and cry and shake on the floor whilst my dog Bo stands over me just checking that I'm alive and functioning.
01:04:00
Speaker
to process it. But what a fucking gift is that? Because it means I'm alive. Anytime I felt the pain, I've been like, you're alive. And that is a gift. And it's temporary. And also I can still find pleasure in that. And that's one thing I'm very proud of is I deepened my relationship to pleasure in 2023, or specifically the second half of 2023, which was the the struggle for me, the life
01:04:27
Speaker
fully shattering, but I'm really grateful for that because now I know whatever life throws at me.
01:04:32
Speaker
I've got this, like I've totally got it. I'm like, surely can't be as painful as last year, but maybe there will be other stuff coming up. And obviously we haven't gotten into detail. There's a lot of stuff I won't share around the experience just out of respect for the other people involved who I still have a lot of love and respectful. It's not necessary to go into. So that's the part of that. Anything else to add? The biggest.
01:04:58
Speaker
gift out of any moment in life where you feel like there's no way I'm ever going to fucking get through this is that you do get through it. And it proves to you that you can literally do anything, right? Especially if it feels hard. And then the emotional mastery that comes out of it, that's not to say you'll always know exactly how to do something or feel a certain way when you have
01:05:27
Speaker
something come up, but I love this analogy that you use stuff, the hurricane. It's not even a maybe that you're going to experience, right? You will absolutely experience multiple hurricanes in your life. And after every single one, you're just more prepared for the next and for the next and for the next and for the next. And even if it feels like it completely turns your entire life upside down and you have no idea how you're going to recover, you have evidence that you have done it before. One,
01:05:56
Speaker
And you're more prepared for the next time. Yeah. Let's talk about this hurricane analogy. I'll share, vulnerably here, that a fear I realized I had recently is, and I'm sure people can resonate with this, when you've experienced the absolute depths of despair and pain and grief and to the point of
01:06:17
Speaker
I could not work in twenty twenty three my whole nervous system was absolutely fucked I was experiencing immense dysregulation all the physical symptoms which I've talked about before in another podcast. Couldn't work had no motivation didn't know if I would be able to work again or get my fire back or feel good or what the future health me I didn't see a clear path.
01:06:38
Speaker
And when you've gone through all of that, and again, it could only be described as life shattering. I think, I'll speak from personal experience, I had this fear around rebuilding and a fear around, like there was a part of me, and again, it was the inner child part of me that was quite terrified of what's to come because I know that what is next to me is fucking amazing.
01:07:04
Speaker
in terms of business, in terms of the relationship that I desire, the love, the intimacy, the connection, the friendships. I can already see and feel and experience life is unfolding in ways that I couldn't even imagine. And this is truly just the beginning for me of this next phase of my life. And I couldn't have scripted it out. And the opportunities, the people, everything that's unfolding is incredible. And I have such trust and faith. Like I know what I'm worthy of. I know what I deserve. I know what I desire.
01:07:34
Speaker
And I know that it's coming imminently. I know it is. And I'm also patient slash trying to be patient because I can be a little bit impatient. But with that, I was sharing with Rizal and also with another friend who is incredible. There's two or three people who I voice note like all the time and share the fears I'm having. And I just want to be seen and witnessed and heard. And I was sharing that. I was scared to rebuild.
01:07:57
Speaker
And I'm scared for the relationship that's going to come. And I'm scared for the success of my business that is going to come. And I'm talking about the real fucking huge, big, immense love and business success that I'm desiring that I've been working towards for the last few years. Because there's a part of me that's scared of going even higher and experience this bliss and ecstasy and satisfaction and fulfillment at such a high level that the come down from that is going to be worse.
01:08:26
Speaker
And that's not me necessarily having this doom and gloom perspective, but the way I was sharing it, it's the insights that came through from my journaling. There was such relief that came from me acknowledging the fear that I had around what's to come and about me really receiving and being in that, because I know how magical and amazing that's going to be. And I'm so excited, but at the same time acknowledging the fear and
01:08:49
Speaker
Because the way i described twenty twenty three was i experienced a hurricane and everything was destroyed now. The inside that i have is when you experience one hurricane and everything is destroyed you have two choices do you just live in that do you just do you never rebuild you move somewhere else do you just give up or do you say i'm gonna learn.
01:09:11
Speaker
The lessons i'm gonna rebuild stronger i'm gonna create even more steady foundations and build a shelter and have the support and have the supplies and the food and the people and the resources that i need if and when another hurricane. Comes into my life and just like you said rose.
01:09:29
Speaker
There will be more hurricanes in life, but maybe it's not going to be for 10 years or for 20 years or for 30 years. It doesn't have to necessarily be anytime soon, but the chances are that I will experience some form of hurricane again in life in a different way. And that could be the loss of a person close to me experiencing grief in a different way, or who knows what life is going to throw at me. But that was the acknowledging the fear that I had, but then having the rational
01:09:57
Speaker
like the part of me going, I'm rebuilding a different way. I'm creating my, I've restructured my business to build security for myself. And my main guiding principle is building a steady foundation and structure so that if shit hits a fan, I can take six months or a year off and my business can still run. And I'm not going to be fucked and in a position of building from the ground up, which is basically what I've had to do over the last like little while is start again.
01:10:24
Speaker
And that was basically the hurricane analogy. So I had faith and had trust in myself. I can't fear the amazingness that's to come.
01:10:35
Speaker
because I'm scared of the downfall because it feels almost safe in a way to stay where I am. Cause I've got security of my home, the people, like the support, my business. And there's a part of me that's like, it's safe here. This is my comfort. Do I need more? Do I need the relationship? Do I need the business success? Do I need to be visible at the level that I desire to be visible? And I'm like, yes, I do. That's ultimately what I desire. And I'm not going to let the fear rule me. So.
01:11:05
Speaker
We're getting vulnerable here. Uh-huh. No, I totally felt the same way too. Cause you're just like, what's the point? At one point there.
01:11:14
Speaker
last year for me, I was just like, I can't do this again. Like I, I refuse to because we were talking to each other again. And it was so hard because there were so many parts of me that were just like, you can't go through this pain. And it was like the trust in myself to be able to discern like, okay, no, this isn't a part of you that is just like looking for comfort. This is a part of you that knows
01:11:44
Speaker
That what you can create moving forward, because of how much the both of you have grown up, you can actually create something entirely
Supportive Communities
01:11:52
Speaker
different. And even if you do experience the pain, what you will create.
01:11:57
Speaker
together from this new healed place will be worth it. The most courageous thing that a human can do is open up their heart again after experiencing pain and after experiencing a closure of the heart based on heartbreak in whatever form that looks like.
01:12:17
Speaker
It is much easier to say, fuck this, fuck the world, fuck love. I'm done. I'm going to build an armor around my heart and protect myself and stay closed off. That's fucking easier to do that than to say, no, I want more. I deserve more. I desire more. I'm going to do the fucking painful and messy work to reopen up, knowing that you are opening yourself back up for pain.
01:12:43
Speaker
And that is part of life. That is part of the human experience. I would rather all of the pain again and even more than to be numb to it, then to be cut off from the pure pleasure and bliss and joy that I get to experience on a daily basis and find from
01:13:00
Speaker
Magic in the mundane and I'm so grateful for I'm so grateful for the pain and for the for the emotions and Grateful to be living in this way now because I was living closed off for my whole life. I was living Disconnected avoiding with a closed heart not truly open not allowing myself to be seen or to be experienced to experience true love and true love for myself and
01:13:25
Speaker
I think it's the biggest gift that we can give ourselves and it is messy. And that's why we have to have the support around us because we would not get through the hurricanes in life. It's fucking hard to get through the hurricanes in life without a village. And we see this. Let's look at actual hurricanes and typhoons. People aren't individually rebuilding. Everybody comes together in those moments. Okay. And that is exactly what we have to do as humans on this
01:13:54
Speaker
wild ride of life, you have to find your people. It's not, it's not negotiable. It's not, uh, a nice to have. It's fucking essential.
Pride in Hosting Retreats
01:14:05
Speaker
So find your people.
01:14:08
Speaker
go on retreats, go to events, put yourself in the rooms. Let's start to wrap this up. I feel like this is a juicy one there. This is the longest podcast I've ever done, but we go deep. Let's talk about the 2024 retreat, which is probably one of my most
01:14:25
Speaker
proud experiences, accomplishments of my life. Aside from surviving 2023, which is an accomplishment in itself, that's definitely up there, obviously. But in terms of work accomplishments, which I can't even believe that it's work, to be honest, I would host retreats for free if I could survive without like,
01:14:48
Speaker
Without needing to, I would do it for free because I love it that much. It doesn't feel like work. It's mind blowing to me. That's something that I can do and get paid for because it is truly my mission, my purpose, my path, my pleasure. Like I am in my fricking essence when I'm hosting a retreat and around people hosting experiences. So Wild and Free 2020, no, Wild and Free 2023, sum it up in two to three words.
01:15:17
Speaker
And then I'll do mine and then we'll do 2024. Three words for 2023 playful, expansive. The last word that's coming to me is giggly.
01:15:27
Speaker
My words are the warm up. 2023 was the warm up and it was the baby, like the innocent. It was so incredible, impactful, expansive and deep, but it was the picture that comes to my mind of that retreat is where we were wearing all white. And that is all I can remember. I don't remember any other days of outfits apart from us all in white because I feel like it was really
01:15:50
Speaker
deeply focused on the innocence and the playfulness. Like it was the maiden energy. Whereas 2024, very different mind blowing, sexy, turned on. Oh my gosh, so hot. I don't think I felt like my pussy pulse like that in a group of women with a group of women. I don't even know the dark fem day just turned me the fuck on.
01:16:17
Speaker
Oh my God, that literally was my favorite day. And I was like, we are going fucking deep because I've been torn to shreds in 2023, come out the other side. I know I have got these women. And that is truly what I believe.
01:16:34
Speaker
why I had to go through that in the way that I did, because the confidence I had in myself was like, we can go fucking anywhere and I've got them because I have myself experienced all of the trauma releasing, the dysregulation, the intense healing that a lot of it I was guiding myself through, like completely
01:16:58
Speaker
self-healing. So I was like, if I can do this to myself, I can do this for them. So yeah, I feel like it was...
01:17:05
Speaker
I've just, the skills and the confidence that I've gained in my own. I now know that I'm a really fucking powerful guide and facilitator and healer and medicine woman. And reason being that I feel like I really have a skill of helping people find their own medicine and become their own healer. I'm not this guru with the power, but I can guide them back into themselves to discover their own magic that they have within. And that's the journey that I've been up with myself. And that truly is the biggest gift that I think any human can give someone else is
01:17:34
Speaker
coming back to their own power.
Inner Child Work and Transformation
01:17:36
Speaker
Nobody needs me, they need themselves and they need to find their own inner wisdom. So, 2023 was the retreat was the warm up for the year and the year was the warm up for the impact that I believe I'm here to have on this planet. Yes. A hundred percent. Yeah, no, that was totally. 2024, the retreat itself, I'm still like, I still think about it and I laugh and I'm just like, how the fuck?
01:18:03
Speaker
Did it transform from what we did in 2023 to like what happened this past January? Like it was just two totally completely different experiences. We changed because of us. Like what we went through, right? Yeah, it was so deep.
01:18:20
Speaker
I didn't think we would go the places that we went with the women. And also just thinking about the... You're like, I wanted to express and cry at the 2021 retreat, but I couldn't. And there were people that said the exact same thing, this retreat. And you were like, yeah, just wait. You're gonna feel it. Yeah. Oh yeah. And we cracked them wide open. Yeah. Two Brits who would...
01:18:48
Speaker
you know, self-pronounced disconnected from their emotions, closed off, hadn't cried in a year. And I'm like, I get it. I get it. And by I think night one or day two, they were crying every session. And crying is such a powerful release. As reclaiming our crying, there is nothing more powerful as human beings to reclaim that.
01:19:07
Speaker
and to be like it's fucking beautiful it's powerful and it's necessary it's how our nervous system regulates herself how we get back into parasympathetic state so we encourage your crying it is very powerful so just to cap about the 2024 thing i love that you said there is
01:19:23
Speaker
no guru and I think that's really what sets the wild and free retreat apart is that you as a facilitator you're not like on this pedestal and you're not like I figured everything out or I don't feel all these things anymore it's no like you show them and you really comfort them and tell them like it's all okay and you're with them and I think that's what allows them to feel
01:19:51
Speaker
okay to go places that and feel emotions that they didn't allow themselves to feel before because you make it so okay and so safe for them. Ask you. Thank you.
01:20:05
Speaker
We create the space together and it really is our synchronicity in the way that we have our dynamic and work together. Like people always comment on that. You've got such complimentary energies and how grounded and calm we both are and just go with the flow, but we've always got each other. There's no stress, like the epitome of no stress. And it's amazing. Ease and flow, baby. It's so good. So good. Let's just talk about what's your favorite
01:20:31
Speaker
transformation and obviously not naming names here, but is there an experience or a practice that we were guiding that you saw somebody like crack open or break down or the overall transformation? Like what would be your favorite piece? Everybody, I think it's always like the, I don't know if it's because it's like the first day and you're just like seeing everybody open up, but it's always the inner child for me.
01:21:01
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. The, it's almost like they get to experience a part of themselves that they had maybe seen before, but they just like pushed it to the side or they're just like, Oh, yeah, there's that part of me, but I'm not really gonna, I don't really know what to do with that. And
01:21:26
Speaker
with the way that you like lead the exercise, you get to really see how they actually get to hold their inner child and be with their inner child. And you can hear it in their voice when they're like saying all the things that they wish they heard or want to tell their younger self. And it's just, I don't know, that hits deep because the inner child work is never ending for me. For all of us. Yeah, for all of us.
01:21:55
Speaker
That's one thing that I got out of last year too. I thought I'd like checkbox in a child work. I was like, done it. Been there. Got the t-shirt. Like I'm all good. I healed my inner child. LOL. Like basically what I realized was that it literally never ends. And actually the most important work that we need to be focusing on as humans is the inner child work because that's everything comes back to childhood. And the more that we can bring consciousness to
01:22:22
Speaker
the way that we are and the way that we've been programmed to be, the more we can heal that. And then we then have a choice and we get to decide how we are and what we attract and who we surround ourselves with. So I really love that. And that's one of my favorite exercises to guide. I believe everybody needs to do that in a child process that I guide. Especially in a group setting, I do it with one-on-one clients as well. There's something different that happens when you're in a group
01:22:48
Speaker
of people together. I've done that with 20 people, my previous retreat, 20 people, men and women, and it was profound. And that is always one where I'm either crying, witnessing it and leading it, or I'm like, there are times where I am actually holding back a little bit the crying because I'm like, I have to stay in the facilitator mode. But if I were just observing, I would be sobbing, witnessing it because it's so fucking beautiful and so incredible.
01:23:17
Speaker
For me, I think what really was powerful, two things I want to share, but guiding the womb healing breath work. And then we went into womb massage. That touched me because.
01:23:29
Speaker
Obviously for me in 2023, June retreat that I went to the womb healing breath work was the one that tore me apart. And that was so profound to me. So I have a deep connection to womb healing work and womb healing breath work and women connecting with their wombs. Cause I have personally experienced how much pain and trauma and emotions from our lifetime and previous lifetimes and previous generations lives within us. And when we give ourselves a permission to feel it,
01:23:59
Speaker
oh it's really painful but it's so profound and incredible like it's some of the most powerful workers women that we can do so that was really powerful to see the women some of them just like in their fucking pain like they were allowing themselves to feel the fucking pain that was there and the connection that they formed with their womb and yeah that was a really intense one but very fulfilling to guide and also just because i was like
01:24:24
Speaker
I've been there.
Transformation Through Retreats
01:24:25
Speaker
Like I know it. Like I know that pain so well. So I love that. But really one of my favorite things was the final day where we did the reintroduction. So basically we had everybody come out two pieces. There's a lot of work that we will have depending on the size of your treat, but
01:24:42
Speaker
We'll have each person take the stage and everybody is seeing them and witnessing them and celebrating them. And on the final day, everybody reintroduced themselves to the group. I would play a song and they would like strut up to the take the center stage and tell us all who they are and what they're claiming and what their fuck yeses are and their fuck nos and what their desires are for the next year.
01:25:05
Speaker
And the way that the women, I was like putting on a song, you have to strut in. And they were like all actually doing it. I was like, whoa, I wasn't expecting you all to actually be taking up the space in this way. And it was such an amazing surprise. Even the women who were like more closed off and shy and quiet were like, this is me.
01:25:26
Speaker
Yeah, their posture was just completely different. And you could even see they were glowing. Literally. So good. So good. And then the final one, of course, was the dark feminine day, which we had so much fun about witnessing each woman dancing. I don't want to say the word dancing because it's not accurate.
01:25:46
Speaker
expressing themselves in their own flavor of the dark feminine energy was so fucking wild and powerful and having all eyes on them for two minutes whilst they were just in their body and moving. Oh my gosh, I've goosebumps now. It was so hot. It was so sexy. It was so inspiring. Like each woman has her own flavor, but seeing how
01:26:16
Speaker
They just were so effortless and how everybody changed after that. Because when you find safety in being yourself and your full expression in one of the most vulnerable ways, being seen as being sexy in your divinity and your femininity and your pleasure of movement, because that's really what it is. It's such an embodied expression where it feels good. So regardless of what it looks like, you might feel clunky for a second, but because you're expressing yourself freely and it feels good to you, it looks good.
01:26:45
Speaker
because we can feel that. And that was something that I wasn't sure everyone was going to be comfortable doing. And obviously there was a bit of resistance, but they fucking loved it. I think it helped that you went first. Yeah. And by the way, I was nervous. We were nervous to do that as well. We were fucking nervous. Even though it was like, oh, I know you can do this, of course, being witnessed and seen by other women. But there's still that element of being seen is still scary. Like when you're healing that part of you,
01:27:14
Speaker
and you're doing something for the first time in this setting, there's going to be those nerves. But yeah, I was like, I want to do more. I love the attention. I think everybody did at the end. They were like, oh, that was it. Yeah, it's literally such a profound experience. Dance for two minutes or express yourself for two minutes, and you're going to have a group of nine women watch you for two minutes in silence. OK, that's pretty... It's an edge. Yeah, for sure. All right, so what do we want to say to close this out? Final pieces.
01:27:45
Speaker
Come. Come in which sense? You can't say that to me and not expect me to make a dirty joke. That's why I love you. I will. I will come in all senses. Come to the wild and free retreat. Wild and free retreat. The next one is February 2025.
01:28:06
Speaker
I really believe that all women need to experience this. It is an investment. It is an investment. You have to be committed to yourself and to your own growth because you will not be the same woman walking away from this experience. I have goosebumps. You will not be the same woman. You will become more of yourself. You'll remember your power. You will feel safe expressing yourself. You'll know who you are. You'll know what you're meant to do.
01:28:32
Speaker
the confidence that you'll have in yourself afterwards, change not only the way that you show up today, but it's going to change the relationships, your expression in the bedroom, your expression outside of the bedroom, and you're going to feel so on fire. I've been chatting with a couple of women this week
01:28:50
Speaker
This has been a week or 10 days since we got back from the retreat. And they're like, I'm a different person. I feel more. I am noticing where something feels off. I am loving starting my day, not going on my phone, doing my breath work, doing my Kundalini yoga, doing my journaling, having my cacao. And I'm noticing how different I feel throughout the day. I'm noticing how I respond differently. People are commenting on how calm I seem and how happy I seem and how much I'm glowing.
01:29:19
Speaker
These things have an impact. When you stop running around life like a headless chicken and you start moving through life with ease and grace and compassion and in your fucking power, in your queen energy, everything changes. Everything changes and life gets juicier and fucking better. And by the way, let's just say we have so much fun at the Wild and Free Retreat. It's not all crying and emotions and pain. It is so
01:29:46
Speaker
Fud, right? Honestly, I don't think I laugh more in a day than when I'm at retreats. Yeah. Everything is just, you're just so tapped into your joy because you're able to experience the opposite end. And you're just like, wow, life is fucking amazing.
01:30:10
Speaker
100%. I have not laughed as much or danced as much as we did at this retreat. How many times were we crying? I was crying. Tears streaming down my face with laughter could not stop. And there is no better feeling than just being
01:30:33
Speaker
absolute hysterics and i definitely can see how the more i've embraced my emotions of crying the more i can laugh let yourself go in that hysterical fit of laughter it's so good it is one of so when i was going through nutrition school we did like muscle testing and everything and actually the moment you feel like ticklish
01:30:51
Speaker
That is actually like the precursor to like pain and crying. So those two sensations are like very linked in the body and obviously in the brain.
01:31:03
Speaker
Yeah, and if you think about it, the shaking, you're shaking, laughing, and then you're shaking, crying, it's the same thing. It's just, and you're crying, the tears streaming down my face when I'm laughing are the same tears streaming down my face when I'm laughing versus crying. It's just, there's a different label to it.
Promotion for Future Retreats
01:31:21
Speaker
The felt sense is different. The sensation in the body is different. And then we make it mean something. So, invitation to embrace your crying, to embrace your laughing. Come to the Wild and Free Retreat, February, 2025. You will have the best time of your life and make new best friends. And you get an amazing photo shoot as well to capture your globe and your experience. Oh my God. The photos, seeing the women, seeing everybody's portraits.
01:31:49
Speaker
as they're streaming it over the week, I'm just like, who are these women models? Who is she? Who is she? Who is this bitch?
01:31:58
Speaker
It's my favorite thing. Literally. And it's, some of these women have never had a photo shoot before and the fricking transformation caption in that, plus we get tattoos. I didn't get a tattoo this time, but I'm sure I will next year. We love to celebrate by getting tattoos or piercings to commemorate as well as take the photos home, take some physical marking on your body. If you so desire, there is no pressure, but hopefully you get an insight from this conversation. The longest podcast I've ever recorded of the depth.
01:32:28
Speaker
Like this is a true insight into the way that we are like nothing is off limits we. Both ruzelle and i share really openly about our own journeys and our own experiences will express in ways and so that you got to have an embodied.
01:32:45
Speaker
Experience and we are embodying that resonance of what you're going to be going through. We're not just talking at you saying, I'm not just saying do this. Here's an example. We do a sisterhood healing workshop and just to preface this up, a lot of the workshops for next year will inevitably change because I'm going to grow and evolve and change so much in the next 12 months that.
01:33:05
Speaker
There'll be so much more that I want to add and evolve and go even deeper and wilder and more sexy, but there will be a few staples and the sisterhood healing wound. So we always do demos of stuff before we tell, before we, we guide the experiences so that people know what they're supposed to do. And so that they feel a safety. And I was demoing the sisterhood healing wound and.
01:33:28
Speaker
I dropped into it and I think I was crying and then I was like, okay, I'm going to now, I'm going to feel the emotion of the wound and I'm going to express it. And this like really loud scream came out, didn't it? It was really loud sound. And I was like, what the fuck? I didn't know where that came from, but it felt really good. And what was my point is that we are right there with the experience. Exactly.
01:33:56
Speaker
We are gonna separation between facility. Obviously we're still holding space, but like I said,
01:34:05
Speaker
It's not like pedestal stuff and I are like over here and we're not in it with you. We're right there in it with you. Yeah. And we'll help you express and tap into your own emotion and unlock what is within and your true self. So that's the invitation. Have you gone through or are you going through a separation or some form of grief or life shattering circumstances?
Collective Healing Process
01:34:26
Speaker
We're here to support. So reach out, let us know how you've resonated with this, what you loved. And we can't wait to welcome you 2025 Costa Rica, February.
01:34:35
Speaker
first week of your life, wild and free baby. All of the details will be in the show notes. Let's do it. And we'll see you then. Rizal, thank you for being here. Thanks for just being the best. This was a very healing conversation. I think to actually share and put this out is, I believe part of our healing process and journey as well, because a lot of this is stuff that we were sharing from 2023, because it's
01:34:58
Speaker
We're not that far removed from 2023. Of course, the more time that passes, the less emotional charge there'll be around sharing it. But I think for both of us, it's still pretty real and it's still pretty fresh in some ways. A lot of it has been healed, obviously, but life is a journey and there's always going to be layers that we go into. So we are real and we wanted to share that. So let us know what you resonated with. Yes, healing from the inside out.
Audience Engagement and Feedback
01:35:22
Speaker
Right. To help everyone become their own healer. Thank you so much for this conversation. And I hope everyone has a beautiful day. Last thing I'm going to say, if you have not rated the podcast, whether you listen on Spotify or Apple, please make sure that you give me a five star rating. And if you're on five star rating on Spotify and on Apple podcasts, if you can leave a comment and just
01:35:44
Speaker
Let me know what you've loved. If you've loved this conversation, leave a comment about that. It really does help when you rate and review and leave your feedback so that other people can see how amazing this podcast is and experience the magic too. So thank you for that.