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Remix Boots The House DOWN (feat. DJ John Michael)
267 Plays10 months ago
You are NOT going to want to miss this one! This week, Zach is joined by the one and only DJ John Michael from Peloton. We instantly kiki the boots house DOWN starting with how John Michael burst onto the scene by working with the legendary Junior Vasquez. From there we absolutely geek out over remixes of the 90's and early 00's -- shoutout to Junior's Hard Mix of Mariah Carey's "Heartbreaker/If You Should Ever Be Lonely." And even state we want to create a docu-series that covers the remix greats from that time period. We also discuss John Michael's OFFICIAL remixes for Demi Lovato and Donna Summer and make our official begging plea to Celine Dion's record labels to release her remixography to streaming. We also talk about his meeting with Lenny Kravitz, Debbie Gibson, Shep Pettibone (producer of Madonna's "Vogue") and more! John Michael even reveals which one of his remixes is getting the official release treament next! What are you waiting for? Hit play!
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Transcript
Introduction of DJ John Michael
00:00:00
Speaker
Hey everyone, it's Zach from pop theory aka a functioning gay on Instagram. Today. I am so excited. I am absolutely thrilled. We are joined by a very special guest. I have admired this man from afar for what feels like an eternity. You've been following me and we've been following each other I think for a long time.
00:00:18
Speaker
This man is a DJ he has remakes official remixes for Demi Lovato, Debbie Gibson, the Beach Boys, and most recently, none other than the iconic Donna Summer. Please give it up for DJ john Michael from peloton
00:00:36
Speaker
I actually can't believe that this is the first time that we're actually doing this face to face. It's so strange. I know it's so strange but it feels but it feels like it feels so natural. I have to one really quick I have to comment on your shirt you're wearing a Carly Rae Jepsen shirt. Yes and you're the first person out of everybody that I've seen today that has commented on it so congratulations.
00:00:55
Speaker
Oh, my gosh. Thank you. You're welcome. You're very welcome. Oh, my God.
Role at Peloton and Music Industry Insights
00:01:00
Speaker
So for those that may not, first of all, fools, if they're not familiar with you, but you are the man behind the music literally at Peloton. Well, yes and no. Like, I do have a team. I don't, you know, I'm not. It's just you. It's just me all day long, just like juggling everything as much as best as I can. Right. No, I am. I am
00:01:21
Speaker
What I always tell people is I am the DJ and producer of music programming at Peloton, which just sounds like a lot of fancy words for, you know, I work on the music stuff, but it's music supervision, it's music ingestion. That's what I get to do with a lot of publishing, all the record labels, and it's, yeah. It's, I have to say, it's a crazy, crazy job. I love it so much, but it really is crazy. And what I've learned about the music industry since I've started it is wild. And I think that's, like I was saying before we started recording, is that a lot of times when you and Jeff are speaking,
00:01:50
Speaker
I'll like talk back to the podcast like while I'm driving in my car. And I'm just like, oh, I'm like, there's so much I want to like interject and be like and explain how music publishing works and just yeah, because that's something that I don't know about. And as I get more and more into the weeds with you know, through Instagram and getting these connections like you and other people, right?
00:02:11
Speaker
learning about the record industry and how like we all could just kind of think that like these pop stars that we love who do have a lot of artistic merit and integrity and things like that, but are oftentimes like controlled by their record labels, they are, you know, whether it's, you know, being forced to record songs, whether it's, you know, the type of marketing that they want to do the producers, they have to work with everything.
00:02:33
Speaker
Right. And so, yeah, and just from the little things that you've kind of just kind of told me about or, you know, that you've shared on your Instagram, it is it truly is wild. It is crazy.
Misconceptions about Jennifer Lopez
00:02:44
Speaker
And I think that and I know that we've we've like DMed about this before. And I think that there is JLo is a good example as to why I get so annoyed with all the hate for JLo lately, because I'm like, I kind of fell down a rabbit hole recently. And I'm like, well, why do people feel this way? And I started trying to figure out what exactly is going on.
00:03:02
Speaker
And it always seems to come back to two songs. And it's the, I'm Real, the murder remix, and then Play. And it's those two songs that everybody's saying, they're just like, Ashanti sings all her songs. And I'm like, that's ridiculous. And I'm like, I don't think that people really appreciate or understand. And again, why would they?
00:03:22
Speaker
When you're starting out, even as Jennifer Lopez before Jennifer Lopez was Jennifer Lopez, you're not making these big decisions. Like you get a little bit of a say, but at the end of the day, it's usually men that are sitting there controlling these careers. I mean, you've got your Tommy Mattolas, the Jimmy Iovines, like all of these guys that are sort of pulling the strings, not to mention the producers in the studio, et cetera, et cetera. So this idea that Jayla was like, aha,
00:03:47
Speaker
Right. Like she's Ursula with Ashanti's voice and the Little Mermaid, you know, like she's just saying, you know, like it's so crazy to me. And I'm like, I don't this woman worked so hard. And I think I had seen her on her last tour after seeing that. I was like, you can't tell me anything. Right. Can't tell me anything. This woman is dancing and performing circles around girls after age. Truly. And I just feel and back to the vocals of it all, like I feel like you and I have a specially trained ear
00:04:16
Speaker
for sound and music specifically. Like, yes, I can recognize that sometimes her background vocals are turned way up. Oh, yes. But her voice is still there. Right. I am like, I'm like, yes, I understand where people are coming from. But I was like, I still hear JLo at the end of the day. Right. It is. Yeah. There's a lot of technology that's out now, especially with AI and a lot of what myself and even DJs do. Like, if I want to work on a remix and I don't have the stems,
00:04:42
Speaker
There are ways that you can create them now. There are programs that allow you to do that. So while I'm falling down this rabbit hole at like one o'clock in the morning, I'm like downloading J-Lo music and I'm running it through this thing because I'm like, I want to hear. I want to hear the vocals and I want to hear what we're talking about and see for myself. And I'm like, this is clearly J-Lo. Like in the chorus of play, it's 100% Christina Milian. Like not even a question. But again, she's credited as a songwriter. She's credited on the album as doing backing vocals.
00:05:11
Speaker
Yep. So I'm like, I don't really get why that's a big deal because like, you know, when I have my example that I always go to is Whitney Houston step by step written by Annie Lennox, which she's credited for, but uncredited on backing vocals. Right. Yeah. And she's a lot of the voice that you hear if you if you really pay attention, but she's not credited and she's Annie freaking Lennox.
00:05:31
Speaker
Yeah, so it's like, I don't know. I think JLo is just it's fun to hate on her for some reason for the internet. And I'm like, Look, is she a ridiculous person, sometimes 100%. But you don't get to be a diva without that. Right? And you know, and as much as as much as I love Mariah Carey, and obviously Jeff loves Mariah Carey, like, you know, she definitely fans that fire a little bit.
00:05:51
Speaker
you know, without a doubt 100%. And so it does not help. And you know, I you know, I would love if one day the two of them could just like get together and like squash it. Right, right. It's just I feel like that's the last photo that we need because we have the photos of Gaga with Madonna. Mm hmm. You know, we need the photo we have the photos of Gaga and Kylie. Oh, no, sorry. Madonna and Kylie. Yes. Madonna and Kylie. That's what I mean. Like there's Beyonce and Taylor.
00:06:17
Speaker
So it's like the last one that we need is just Mariah and J.Lo, and I think we achieved that piece. There's one more photo that we would need, I think. Madonna and Janet.
00:06:26
Speaker
Why is it always Madonna and somebody else? I know. I know. Like, let's get just Madonna with so-and-so. Madonna with so-and-so. Please, please, please, please. Right. So, OK, so for people that, again, might not be familiar with you, you are a DJ. Yes. You've been DJing for? We'll go 24 years. 24 years, which is wild since you're only 21. Right, right. From above and beyond, I've been working. Exactly. Above and beyond. We love them. We love them.
00:06:56
Speaker
We love them. You have a really fascinating story. You worked with a very famous DJ for a while, didn't you? Yes. I would say it's a very, very long story.
00:07:13
Speaker
The very, very short version is that I became very obsessed early on with my love for dance music with Junior Vasquez. If you don't know his name, Google him, you've definitely heard something that he's done or something that he's produced. 100%. Yes. Right. Especially if you're an F slur, there's no way that you've gotten away from it. At all. At all. At all. And so I was so obsessed with him in the late 90s, early 2000s, I used to go see him when he was DJing here in the city in New York.
00:07:42
Speaker
You know, I just had it in my mind that one day I was going to work with this man or work for him or do something. And that sort of drove me in my career for dance music and for DJing. So long story, very, very short. One of my good friends, Billy, had his email address and we were working on just some random mashup and he's like, we should send it to him. And I said,
00:08:03
Speaker
I don't have his email. And he's like, I do. And I was like, what's the worst that can happen? He could say no. Don't ever contact me. This is shit. You know, all right. And he absolutely loved it. I couldn't believe it. And then we went to go see him at a show here in the city. And I ended up just meeting what is now one of my best friends, Darren Kawa, who is his longtime lighting guy.
00:08:23
Speaker
And yeah, and it just kind of went on from there. And then I just started working on mashups for him. Because if there's one thing that Junior loves, it's to be self-referential.
The Art of Remixing
00:08:32
Speaker
Anything that is like, me, me, me, me, me, show me, tell me about how great I am. I was happy to do it. So, and it kind of like for a long time, I just worked with him for about 11 years. I was his remix engineer. Even, even though I'm uncredited on this stuff as a ghost producer,
00:08:48
Speaker
Um, so, okay. So help me understand when you say Rick, cause this is something that I've found really fascinating because I've heard about this before with, uh, other DJs and specifically like with honey Dijon and I believe hex Hector, but what is a remix engineer? Like, what does that mean? So, I mean, usually the remix engineer is the person that's sitting down doing the, the doing. So it's like, you have an engineer in the studio. There's a recording engineer. Like you'll see on a lot of, um, like who's a famous one, like Celine Dion's, uh,
00:09:18
Speaker
Humberto Gattica. He's a very famous recording engineer. So he'll get credit on a lot of things like that. And usually, not always, but usually it's the person who's sort of sitting down making all the things work and hitting the keys on the keyboard and whatever. Because a lot of times DJs are not necessarily musicians. I think that that's changed in more recent years. But a lot of times they would have somebody. So like if you see Hex Hector, if you look on the credits, it's usually... Matt Coyle.
00:09:44
Speaker
Matt Quayle, Des Rock, or sometimes it's the guys from Soul Solution, Bobby Guy and Ernie Lake. You can work with a lot of them. So this is essentially, and I don't want to speak at a turn because I wasn't there obviously, but usually what it is is it's Hex Hector saying this is the type of thing I'm going for.
00:10:00
Speaker
Here's a reference track. I like these drums. I like this sound. And then give me a first pass at it and let me see what you got. That is fascinating. Yeah, so you have somebody like Matt Quayle, who is now like Grammy winner, I think, like has won so many different things. Did like the score for movies, for TV shows at Mr. Robot Show. He did that. He's like wild, like an incredible musician.
00:10:21
Speaker
And if you start going through a lot of the, especially from the 90s and early 2000s, you'll see the same people on a lot of the credits. So like a keyboard player named Joey Moskowitz, he's on so much of Madonna stuff and so much remixes and he worked with Jonathan Peters and he worked with Frankie Knuckles and David Morales and they all sort of, it was a very small circle of people that were sort of doing all of this. Because when you're somebody like Junior Vasquez and you have a residency and you're performing
00:10:51
Speaker
these at the time 14, 15, 16 hour nights. And then you got to fly to Japan and DJ over there and fly down to DC and do whatever. You don't really always have a lot of time to sit down and sit and just make music. Right. Absolutely. Especially when you're that busy. I know that for me being a creative person, the busier I get, the less creative I am.
00:11:11
Speaker
100%. You want to if you want to if you people currently right now with my day job, like I have a huge project that's on my plate and it's going well so far, but I have been hitting roadblocks and I have been like, I don't know if I'm gonna hit my deadline if this keeps happening. Right. And so that makes total sense. So, so, so help me understand then, like, why do they get like the credit that is that just the way that they will. You're the marquee name.
00:11:38
Speaker
You know, it comes down to is like you've gotten yourself to a point. And again, this is not to say that these guys don't know how to do it. But I think that at some point when you're in demand, because even if you look at people like Timbaland, you know, underneath Timbaland, you had Danger and these other producers that were sort of his mentor, you have Max Martin, and then you have the Ilya and Shellback. And like a lot of these guys that sort of
00:11:59
Speaker
are the disciples of these big main producers. Fascinating. So I guess you would say that they are the ones out of the, quote unquote, mastermind behind the project. And then he has everyone. OK, that makes sense. Right. So when I would do stuff with Junior, I would say he would get, I think, the first project that I ever really worked on, like an official one, I think was a way to Houston. And I think it was a million dollar bill. No way. Yeah.
00:12:25
Speaker
He gave us the option. I was working with two of my friends, Joel and Billy, at the time. And he was just like, I've got these two projects. It's either Macy Gray Slapped a Bitch or Whitney Houston Million Dollar Bill. And I was like, the choice is clear. Yeah. I don't know. It's a hard choice. I was like, yeah. I was like, we'll take the Whitney. You can give the Whitney to somebody else. No shade to Macy. Love her. But I was like, I want to hear Whitney vocals.
00:12:47
Speaker
Oh, my God. Yeah. And he would just sort of say, you know what, I like this type of sound. This is what I'm thinking for this and would give like a loose sort of like idea of like what he would want it to sound like. And then we'd go in and send him a pass and be like, this is what we've got. And then he'd be like, all right, raise the high hats, take this out, put a drop in here, take this whatever and sort of orchestrate the whole thing. And we would collaborate that way, getting to a point where he's just like, this is the one.
00:13:11
Speaker
Wow. Yeah, that is so cool. Yeah. Yeah. And so like, I have to then say that like, I've been a fan of yours for from afar for years, like, because, because I, I remember when those remixes dropped back in, God, was that what, 2009? Oh, 2008. Yeah.
00:13:29
Speaker
Like I was I was so that's when I was in my cosmetology phase of life. Oh, I didn't even know that. Yeah, because I went so I moved to Grand Rapids, Michigan to go to the Douglas J Aveda School here. And so I went I started there in 2007, graduated in 2008, got my license 2000, like New Year's Eve going into 2009. Oh, so so I remember like taking that that second exam and being like, Oh my god, see, they're gonna be the worst New Year's Eve ever or the best one.
00:13:57
Speaker
And, but then I, long story short, then started working at a salon called Salon Lark. They were only open for like a year or so. RIP to them. But really wild part during that time, I was very poor at the time. Long story short, I was originally going to move back to my hometown and the owner of the salon was like, no, we really like you. We want you to stay. You can, you can live here in our massage studio for free.
00:14:20
Speaker
So I for eight or nine weeks lived in a massage studio of that salon. And I believe it was that summer that Whitney Houston had dropped that album. Yeah. And so I remember a million dollar bill coming out and having the remixes to that. I remember having, um, uh, I didn't know my own strength. So we ended up doing remixes for his. So the first time when I did a mashup for him, when he got those vocals first. So there was a lot of us that were working with him at the time. So it's like.
00:14:49
Speaker
Darren, my friend Darren that I mentioned before, he would do remix work for him. Me and my friend Billy, we would work on stuff. Razor and Guido, they would do stuff for him. So at that point, we were all just working because really without Junior, there were so many of us that, oh, I don't even want to say we owe our career, but at least owe the path that we took to him. Absolutely. Even DJ Scribble was a hip hop DJ.
00:15:13
Speaker
until he went to go see Junior and then famously was just like, no, I love house music and I wanna do this. So he would get the vocals and like give it to all of us and be like, you know, let's see who's got the best stuff, whatever. So Razor and Guido did a mix. I did a mashup because it was in the same key as his mix of I wanna dance with somebody. And so that was the one that he first started playing was that mashup because again, she loves being self-referential. And so then like we worked on like original mixes at the time the label wanted
00:15:43
Speaker
junior to do like a mega mix of all of her club stuff. So we did like a 14 minute. I did a 14 minute like Whitney Houston mega remix like of like Thunderpuss stuff, Jonathan Peters like his own stuff, whatever. Yeah, I remember like being on the phone with a very, very famous A&R guy who was like
00:16:02
Speaker
questioning me about my choices. And I was too young and indignant at the time to be like, no, it's perfect. Yeah. Perfect the way that it is. No, I'm not like, who the hell am I? I had no business whatsoever. But I was like, so like this has to it has to stay like this. But yeah, and so that really was like that was so I had the junior's old record label logo tattooed on the back of my neck. I got that when he asked me to do the first original production because I was like, this is a moment. And no matter what else happens, I will never forget this. So that year,
00:16:32
Speaker
I got the logo tattooed on the back of my neck, so I was like, I won't remember this forever. Yeah. That's incredible. Yeah. So wait, so what were your selections for the Thunderpuss? Not the Thunderpuss, but for the Megamix? What? Do you remember? Yes, the label wanted us to use his mix of step by step. I learned from the best. It's not right, but it's okay, the Thunderpuss. And I think My Love is Your Love, we ended up doing also a remix for Junior. So a lot of the things that I did for him were
00:16:59
Speaker
private like they were things that he would only play at his parties that weren't like given to other DJs so that way he could be relevant and whatever. So have his own stuff. So most of the stuff that I've done for him has never even come out like I have
00:17:13
Speaker
One of my favorite things I did for him was a mix of Billy Ray Martin's Your Loving Arms. That's never seen the light of day. I did a mix of Cyndi Lupper's Come On Home with him, a bunch of Whitney stuff. It's one day, I always say one day, we'll see. One day. One day it'll come out, one day we'll see. Junior, just release it, release it all. Right, right, right. Just give us the keys, Junior, give us the keys. Give us the keys, please. Is he still remixing? Yeah, no, no.
Iconic DJs and Their Legacy
00:17:43
Speaker
He had a party that I wanna say maybe like two or three years ago that was sort of like, you could tell that at the end, I mean, this man is, he's 70 something now. Oh my gosh, he's really, wow. He's like seven, he's the same age as Cher. They've been at it, yeah. Wow, okay. And it's crazy too because like so many guys of that era, whether it's Junior or Peter Rauhoff or even Razor and Geeta, like a lot of these guys, Hex Hector still works and does stuff and he's incredible, I love him. But I don't think a lot of them in a time before the internet really prepared for the future because they had no way of knowing
00:18:12
Speaker
So there's so many of these names that were iconic to people like us, again, F slurs. But if I say Junior Vasquez to most people in a business meeting or dealing with record labels, they have no idea who I'm talking about.
00:18:25
Speaker
Right, which is wild. So wild. And it makes me so sad. And I was thinking to myself that it would be I would love a documentary via Netflix or Hulu to talk about these huge DJs because to the people listening, I think that a lot of people of a certain age, 21 year olds like you and I. Right.
00:18:45
Speaker
They're all going to be like, oh yeah, I've heard of Thunderpuss. I've heard of Hexector. I've heard of David Morales. But no, unfortunately, the way that the music industry, I feel like the music industry has been in turmoil ever since the Napster days. 100%.
00:19:01
Speaker
And, you know, I feel like DJs are definitely part of the bunch that have gotten the short end of the stick because, you know, now when you go on streaming, you often see DJs credited as like lead artists on remixes and things like that. You don't see that often with older remixes. And I think that when I really started to notice the turn in that, that DJs were sort of taking the main stage was the first time I saw it was
00:19:28
Speaker
It was either We Found Love or Only Girl. I don't remember which one, but it was one of the Calvin Harris tracks with Rihanna and it was labeled as Calvin Harris featuring Rihanna. And I was like, this is so strange, I said, because you would never see that for a pop girl to be featured on her own track and to have Calvin's name first. I was like, oh, that's a really big deal. Like something is shifting here. And then when you started to see like,
00:19:54
Speaker
Lana Del Rey, Summertime Sadness. And it was like the Calvin Cedric Gervais remix, but he was credited as an artist. Yeah. And it wasn't just like her thing anymore. And I was like, oh, well, we're really starting to like, they're getting smarter about the business of this, because while I do believe that that era in the 90s and early 2000s was sort of like the golden era for these guys. 100%. Yeah. They really would just work for hire. So it's like, you know, the label would pay them whatever couple of thousand dollars that they were getting at the time. I meant probably more than that, maybe even tens of thousands at the time.
00:20:24
Speaker
But this was also a time when like singles would last so much longer in the public consciousness. Right. You know, it's like you would do Mariah Carey would do Dream Lover and it was like, you know, you had the big rollout for the single and then the remixes would come out and there would be a remix video and then it would be a what, you know, like it was just there was so they would get so much life out of it. Yeah, don't really have any more. So and it's got to miss those days. Oh my God. Well, because we even like to you,
00:20:49
Speaker
in New York, WKTU, like, they were the place on the radio that were playing these remixes. Junior had his own show, Junior's World, that ran for a while in the 2000s, where he would do, you know, the mix shows and stuff. And it was like, you know, Johnny Vicious would do stuff like all these other guys. And it was so... Everything was sort of happening in New York at that time. And then once we made the jump to streaming, I feel like so much of that history got left behind. Right. And it's like, you know, it's just more, more, more, more, more. We've moved on and whatever, whatever, but...
00:21:19
Speaker
see, okay, we're pitching it right now. We need it. We need to have like a docu series about all about the history of DJing and dance music, especially with the 90s and early 2000s. Because I feel like that truly was just like an era where everyone had their own unique sound. Yeah.
00:21:35
Speaker
everyone had like, and this is no shade to a lot of the DJs. And this is what I appreciate about your remixes so much, because I've been lucky enough, you've sent me on some of your remixes, and they're always brilliant. And your sound is you've got a you've got a great sound. I love how you always like shift though, you're not like you don't sound like the other DJs.
00:21:52
Speaker
Well, trying. It's very, very difficult because I think that as a creative, and I'm sure you go through this too, there are times where you see other people doing things that they're getting a claim for and you're like, oh, maybe I should do more of that. Maybe I should try this and I'll try to add that in and whatever. And it's like I listened to a lot of the John Summit and like the guys that are doing things now. And I'm like, I do love the sound. And I think that it's really, really cool. But like when I sit down in front of my keyboard, my inclination is always like,
00:22:17
Speaker
Come on, hands in the air. Let's go, F slurs. Come on, come on, let's go. You know, like I just can't help it. I'm like always making music for like a white party or a tea dance or something crazy. And I'm like, it's harder for me to make like darker music. Cause I'm like, I always want the vocal to be the show piece. And I think that's where sometimes like, if you look at the, I don't wanna be shady, but if you look at the Whitney Houston movie, the soundtrack, all the remixes, I think that's where a lot of them went wrong because they feel like
00:22:46
Speaker
what people try to do now is they take a song like a Whitney Houston song and they try to make it work in the context of their own sound and it's like you're not really giving the vocal the right treatment for what it deserves and you're not respecting the song in many ways and again i'm not i'm not at all a gatekeeper i think that there's room for everybody at the table and everything works on some level sure but if you're talking about you know the reason why
00:23:11
Speaker
It's not right but it's okay the thunder plus remix has always been like such a gold star classic and no matter what when you try to do new versions of it you're always gonna go back to the thunder plus like that's the one.
00:23:24
Speaker
It's the one. It's just it transforms the song. Right. It completely changed it and it worked so well. And that's one thing that I think that a lot of remixes miss these days. There's a lot of remixes that I enjoy. Oh, yeah. There's there are remixes coming out all the time. But a lot of these people know offense to them. They just they they. Yeah, it's probably the climate to like it's you know, it's probably like, you know, oh, a label is giving me a chance. I'm going to give them exactly what they want. Right. You know,
00:23:52
Speaker
So I recognize that too, but I just, I miss the days of, and you and I have talked about this before, but like I miss the days of like true extended remixes where remixes used to be seven, eight, nine, 10, sometimes even 11, 12, 13 minutes. I just did, um, I was listening to the BT and Sasha remix of I'm alive by CEO the other day. And that's like over 13 minutes long. Right. Right. No, it's nuts. Yeah. Well, and I think that that's also like,
00:24:19
Speaker
So here's one of my gripes is because I feel like like it's always so easy to like poo poo on Gen Z and like, because everybody's just like, well, their attention spans, their attention spans. And I'm like, yes, I'm like, but while that may or may not be true, they are a product of everything that has been given to them. Like I don't think that they created this issue. I think the millennials that sort of came into power at record labels and Spotify, whatever, while the streaming game happened,
00:24:45
Speaker
Yeah. Everything got dumbed down a little bit and all of the things got shorter again, because also, and I don't know what this is like in Michigan or if, but in New York, a lot of places have a curfew. So you're not, you're not DJing these like seven, eight, nine, 10 hour long sets. Like most places closed by like 4am, 5am.
Commercialization and Creativity in DJ Sets
00:25:04
Speaker
Yeah. And even now the way promoters book things, it's like this DJ has a two hour set. This DJ has a one hour set. This one's the opener. This one's the closer.
00:25:12
Speaker
So DJs aren't even doing, like when I go down to Philly, I DJ, it's four hours a night. Every time I go down there and I DJ, and that's just sort of the standard. That's why it makes me laugh when I see things, it's like, special, extended, three-hour set. I'm like, give me a break. Like, are you kidding me? That's so wild. And it's the way that the capitalism of dance music has sort of become is that you don't even need to take people on a journey anymore.
00:25:41
Speaker
You know, it's just sort of like you're coming in to do your two-hour set, you're giving them the greatest hits package, it's everything that you've either created or whatever, and you just sort of move on and you play the same set at another place and play the same set at another place.
00:25:53
Speaker
There have been times where I've seen DJs that I love that I'm like, oh, you know, here's the performance of them at EDC Mexico. And I like put it on and this is a real thing that happened. And I'm watching this DJ and I'm like, this is exactly the same set he played at Mirage when I saw him at Brooklyn Mirage a few months ago. And I'm like, OK, I get it. I don't think that it was, you know.
00:26:12
Speaker
done premixed but it was the exact same order and the same and I'm like all right and I started to see like okay so these guys are just so that way they're giving the same good show and it's timed with the lights and there's like a whole production like when you start to really peel back the layers you can see
00:26:30
Speaker
how this all kind of comes to be and why we are where we are right now. Right. Yeah. Oh my gosh. That's so fascinating. Because even when I sent in the mixes for Donna Summer for the label, like I wanted to have a much longer extended version and they were like, no, we don't need that. It's okay. And I'm like, that's I know I'm like, but this is for like posterity. Like maybe we will one day years down the road.
00:26:49
Speaker
Right. And given like her history, I mean, like love to love you, baby. Wasn't that like kind of like her first main huge mainstream hit? Oh, yeah. And that was wasn't it by the request? This is like so different how like the music industry is now by the request of the record label at the time wanted a like 16 minute version of the song. Yeah. And so I feel like if anyone should have an extended remix, right? That would be Donna Summer. Right. When did you finish those remixes?
00:27:17
Speaker
So I knew that this was going to happen at least well over a year ago because when the, so my contact at Universal Music Group, this guy, Anthony, who I adore, he invited me and Brian to go see a screening, an early screening of the Donna Summer documentary. And I had gone there and we had talked about it then. And he was like, you know, he's like, there's a lot of anniversaries coming up and we can get a remix. And I was like, look, I said, whatever it is, I will clear my schedule. If it's Donna, I am there. Whatever. We will make it work.
00:27:44
Speaker
It takes, there's so much red tape and politics for all these things to happen and it's like legal on Peloton side has to be brought in, legal on Universal side has to be brought in. What are we doing? What's the rollout? How do we plan this? Where are we, what class is it going in? How do we premiere? What do we do on social? Like there's so many, everything has such a long rollout. And so I said, I was like, I'm down for whatever. I said, I literally will do any song that you ask. It doesn't matter. I know them all. And they were like, well, it's 40 years if she works hard for the money. And I was like,
00:28:13
Speaker
Maybe not that one. Because I was like, it's almost too iconic. I was like, how do you get away from what that song already is? Sure. You did a great job. Thank you. Thank you. You did a great job. I listened to that remix and I was like, this is fabulous. Well, because I said, I was like, you can't take that away from what it was. And it's like the synth line is just so iconic. And it's
00:28:35
Speaker
I was like, you've got to bring some of that in. And also, the original song is 140 beats per minute. And I'm like, right. I'm like, my sets don't get up to that point, anything close to that. So I'm like 130, that's a good, we can cap there. It's very dance floor friendly. It works in a cycle class and all the fitness stuff.
00:28:56
Speaker
Yeah. And I was very, very nervous to say yes to that, but I was like, all right. I said, I'm going to figure this out and we're going to, we're going to make it work. And you made it work. And I love that. I love that it was like, not just like the one remix you had the extended version, the instrumental and the club version as well, which is the label asked for. They were the, the, the guy at Casablanca, Harry, um, who's a legend to Casablanca. He was like, you know, I really would like a version. He wanted me to start the original remix with just the acapella. And I said, I gotta be honest. I love it because her voice should absolutely shine.
00:29:25
Speaker
But in the context of a fitness class, because I know how these things play out, I was like, starting with the acapella is going to be super messy in a fitness class. I was like, and I need, it's got to have a little bit more music in there so that way it grabs you and it hits harder. So that way you can kind of keep going with
Remix Projects and BPM Preferences
00:29:40
Speaker
the flow. He was like, Oh, I never really thought about that. So I said, yeah, I said, let me just, and I said, but if you want, I sent him like,
00:29:46
Speaker
eight different mix downs. And I was like, we can put out whatever you want. I said, if you want it, I will make you a version. Here you go. And he's like, no, I really like it. I want to put it out. And I said, all right, great. Wow. That is so cool. Yeah. And I have to say, too, that your remix of Demi Lovato's Lonely People, I listened to more than the album. In fact, I think it trumps by far the album version of the song. So real story.
00:30:12
Speaker
Yeah. The label came to us and said, if we're going to do this, we want you to listen to the album and tell us which song you feel like you lean towards the most. So I was like, all right. And that album in general, the Dancing with the Devil is very personal and is very like about troubles that she's had, you know, issues in her life, mental health things, eating disorders, et cetera, et cetera. So it's not a really light, upbeat album to begin with. And I was like, all right. So I listened to it. And my original choice, as I said, I wanted to do Mel and Kate.
00:30:40
Speaker
Yeah. Because I love that. And I'm like, it's already 110 beats per minute. So stretching it to make it a dance song isn't that difficult. So I think that that really would work. And then they came back and they were like, this song is about an eating disorder. And I was like, and have you listened to the rest of the album?
00:30:54
Speaker
Right. It's not her happiest work. I mean, she's fantastic, but like, OK. So they were like, no, we really kind of want, you know, what would you think about doing lonely people? And I listened to it. I'm like, this is 90 beats per minute, which is the danger zone for dance music. Yeah. If you stretch it too and you make it too fast.
00:31:10
Speaker
They sound like chipmunks because of the vibrato in the voice. And if you bring it down to do it at like a halftime stretch, then they sound drunk. Yeah. Right. It becomes this sort of like slow, like Tony Burxton kind of. I was just going to say that. Yes. Yes. I was going to say that it was like the he wasn't man enough remixes very much like that. Yeah. Because that that's the danger zone. And I was like, and Peter Rohoff really tried to do well with that. And like, I think the his remix is like 133 beats per minute. But
00:31:37
Speaker
And again, even back in the day, like some of these, that wasn't really an issue. Like you look at like Mel C's I turned to you, that's like 143 beats per minute or something crazy. Right? Yeah, it's insane. Right. And I so I am not I don't even know if I could call myself a DJ. But back in the day, back like I used to do a lot of premixed music for my friend Mary's bootcamp classes at work.
00:32:02
Speaker
And so I would make these like hour long seamless mixes and I never I never knew how to make it. I've never I've never known how to DJ live. I've never known how to like play any sort of instrumentation. But I would take you know the tracks that I had available and would mix things together and make mashups and things like that.
00:32:20
Speaker
And, um, where was I going with this? Oh, I was doing, I did like a whole, I started getting into themes, right? So I would, so I would do like, you know, an all Robin mix, I did an all Madonna mix, things like that. And I did like this like dance diva one, which really was like a celebration of like the late nineties to the early 2000s dance remixes. And I wanted to include, I turned to you on there. And then I realized, I was like, wait, whoa.
00:32:46
Speaker
Right, right. It's so fast. So much faster than everything else. And everything else already sounds really fast. Because back then, it was like, you know, the standard BPM was anywhere between 128 to 130, 133. Easily, easily. Like, my love is your love, I think is is Jonathan Peters is like 136 beats per minute.
00:33:04
Speaker
Yeah. And so I was just like, which was great. Because again, for for fitness classes, you want about 135 beats per minute ish around there. Yeah. And so this was perfect. But then all of a sudden, the song like so I saved it to be the last track because I was like, right, you know, I was like, well, let's end let's end with a strong note. But I have a very, very strong theory that I think where
00:33:26
Speaker
I think that part of this has to do with, and you know, it's not the nicest thing to say, but I think a lot of it has to do with the drugs at the time. Yeah. Yeah. I think that the drugs were different in that era. And I think that things were leaning towards the more speedy end of things. I don't want to say everybody was doing meth, but everybody was doing meth. And so it's like, I think that that honestly informed a lot of things that were happening on the dance floor. Whereas now.
00:33:49
Speaker
you know, you look at where we're at socially with things like that. And it's a lot of opioids and a lot of downers and a lot of things. So things tend to slow down more. And there's a little bit more of a relaxed vibe with things because I feel like in the
00:34:03
Speaker
90s or early 2000s, like a purple disco machine was just not a thing. There's nobody doing that type of sound at that point, at least in the mainstream. At such a slow BPM. Who was it the DJ who worked with Jonathan Peters who did a lot of the dubs? Jim Hines. The most insane things. Insane.
00:34:22
Speaker
I always send Jeff, like his dubs, and I'm like, because Jeff hates circuit music. And so I will send him that stuff. And I'm like, just taking the casual walk. I think it's the Jim's dub for Jonathan Peters' Midler in these shoes. Oh, I have not heard it. It is one of the most insane things I've ever listened to in my life.
00:34:46
Speaker
If I had never seen Jonathan Peters live, I would never have understood it because a lot of that stuff when I first heard it, I'm like, how do you dance to this? What do you do? How do you do anything? Yeah. Like what is this? Yeah. That's because like literally because again, I'm very like unintentionally straight edge. Like I don't drink, I don't do any drugs or anything like that. And literally though, like in this, I love to go on walks. It's like a little thing that I like to do. And so, and I will always put on either a good remix or whatever. And there last summer I just went down this
00:35:14
Speaker
hard rabbit hole of like revisiting all these remixes and started like discovering new ones that I'd never listened to before and I came across I think it was his dub for uh I want to say it was the spice girls tell me why oh god yeah and oh my god right I was just like I don't do drugs I am I am doing something right now this is what it feels like that's what that's what drugs feels like yeah well so a lot of times what Jonathan would do again somebody who would play for so long is
00:35:43
Speaker
He would give you like a little bit of the vocal at first and tease it if it was the new thing and it would be like T's T's T's and you hear a little bit and then he would take it back and not play the full thing and then a little bit of the acapella and then not do the full thing and then like at a certain hour give you the full vocal fantasy and then in the very late after hours.
00:36:01
Speaker
that's when the dub would come out when everybody's just twisted and it's like you don't even know what's going on and what is time and you know and there's just all of the things are blurring and that's where a lot of that stuff would kind of come to wild because it's because yeah the BPMs are crazy the drum kits that they use it was truly like when Gaga mentions like sledgehammer dance beats right I am
00:36:23
Speaker
actually think of these like the dubs by Jim Hines. I'm like that is a sledgehammer because they're literally it's just like yeah it's absolutely insane. What what do you have any like favorite remixes or any any eras or album cycles that you feel like wow the remixes that came out of this are really good. So I think it's definitely going to be that same era.
00:36:44
Speaker
I don't know which episode you guys were talking about this, but when you were talking about making your top 100 of your favorite songs ever, I heard it and I immediately grabbed my phone and was just like, I'm gonna do this. I was like, I'm gonna do this and I'm gonna see what this looks like and see what is the top 100. I still haven't finished it. I'm like 60 songs in. Wow, good for, I think I'm like 20. It's harder than I thought. It's so hard, yeah. Right. But the first one that I added, the thing that I will always grab for more than anything else is Junior's mix of Mariah's heartbreak.
00:37:15
Speaker
I'm so glad. Yes, the hard mix. Yes, it has to be specifically the hard mix. Yes, I am right there with you. Yes. That is easily one of my favorite remixes of all time. And Morales did incredible things with her and produced some wild, wild remixes where she re-saying everything and we know that.
00:37:33
Speaker
There is something different that Junior got out of her in that studio that day that I feel like Morellis never really got. Like there was a fire in her and the last like two minutes of that mix are the biggest vocal master class you could ever possibly hear on a dance song. I have never heard anything like that. Her vocals, the background, but everything.
00:37:54
Speaker
is just insanity. Insanity. Again, this is why we need a documentary. I would love to hear Mariah Carey talk about this. Yes, yes. Because she's known so much forage. I mean, people know that she's done remixes and ringsong remixes. I would say she's known more for her R&B hip hop remixes. Right.
00:38:11
Speaker
her dance remix. I mean, this is this is what's so crazy about that time is that like Mariah Carey would sometimes re sing her vocals three or four times for different remixes, right? There would maybe be two I think of like, I still believe where there are two different hip hop remixes. And then there were like two or three different dance remixes for it. Yeah, and it's mind blowing. But it really is. Yeah. But that's the one that it
00:38:35
Speaker
I could not agree more. That's so good. That one. And I want to say also in the same spirit of being re-sung, Taylor Dane, Naked Without You, the Thunderpuss Anthem remix. Okay. Do you know that one? I don't. Okay. So the original version is a very sort of like mid tempo ballad, very easy breezy, whatever.
00:38:54
Speaker
She went and I remember reading an interview with, I don't know if it was Barry or Chris, one of the guys from Thunderpuss, and they were talking about how they got her back into the studio and they had this idea, you really need to listen to it because it will blow your mind. There's a part in like the middle where like the bridge would be, where she's sort of building up and there's like, you know, she's singing this whole bit.
00:39:14
Speaker
There is a note in there that is so unbelievable. I can't actually think of anything to compare it to that I remember reading in the interview where they were just like, this is the idea. This is what we want to do. We want to get this note and have it being held. And you know, we, I think they even said to her, you know, we can make this sound like it, you know, with the vocal work. And she was like, you know what? I just kind of want to give it a go and see if I can do it.
00:39:37
Speaker
and they brought her into the studio and she hits this, not only does she hit this note, but she holds it for such an incredibly long time that at the end of it, when she comes off of it, she literally goes, ugh, like that. And you hear, cause it's so insane. I've never heard anything like it that rivals it. And it is wild. That one. And that's on my top 100 too. Like the first five things on my top 100 are like remixes from that era.
00:40:03
Speaker
Yeah, truly, truly insane. And it's it's that type of stuff I think is more what I miss than anything else. And it's just like, I don't like I love remixes of pop songs, but like I want someone to like give the full voice like and really just go for it. You know, like even like somebody like Ariana, you could be doing this easily be in the studio with a DJ and just like re sing a song like
00:40:30
Speaker
You could have done remixes for Yes and that were truly on another level. Yes. You know, and I feel like for somebody like her who has the vocal talent, like I wish that that was still happening. Yeah. Yeah. And I really wish that, you know, obviously we're getting cowboy Carter coming out next week. Oh, God. I'm so excited. I can't wait.
00:40:48
Speaker
But I really wish that was one thing that I felt like that I think I don't want to say was missing from Renaissance because I loved Renaissance and I loved everything about the rollout, even though I'm like she's I'm being edged for the visuals, as we all are. Yeah.
00:41:03
Speaker
But I being that it's, you know, an ode to house music. I feel like the one thing that was missing was a re-song dance remix for one of the songs. Right. Right. Right. And I remember there were rumors at one point that maybe there was a remix album coming. Maybe that could still happen at some point. Who knows? But I just, you know, I think that having some sort of
00:41:28
Speaker
owed to that moment with a DJ. It could have been whoever. I don't care. You know, I would have loved that. Yeah, no, absolutely. It's so crazy. Like she's really got us all just like in the palm of her hand.
00:41:40
Speaker
palm of her hand. I spent $200 on her vinyl so far and she just released another set today and I'm like, girl. Oh my God. Girl. I'm sitting here and I'm like, do I eat this week or do I feed Blue Ivy? I probably feed Blue Ivy. I think Blue Ivy is the one that's to be fed at this point. It's a better investment. Yeah, we don't need food. Right.
00:42:01
Speaker
I don't need my apartment. Right, right, right. I'm gonna sleep on this vinyl. That's fine. Exactly. I'm so I'm so curious as to I think I feel like it's all but confirmed but about Dolly. I mean, yeah, she's pretty much said it at this point. So I'm gonna guess that it's like a
00:42:19
Speaker
I don't know that it'll be a straight cover. I feel like she'll use like the chorus of it in another way. Yeah, that's my suspicion. That's how it feels. Yeah. Yeah. But I'm curious as to who else it could be on the album. I have I'm like, I really don't know. I mean, I I I feel like this is going to be like if if Renaissance Act one was any indication.
00:42:41
Speaker
I think she's really going to do that same type of level of homework and like dig into the roots of the music and like who were these icons along the way. That's why I think Dolly will be on there. I think there'll be other ones for sure, but I really want to see her really shine a light on like black creators in the space. Yes. Because I feel like you don't really hear about them when it comes to country music. And I see it more now, like I've started following
00:43:05
Speaker
so many more black female country artists that I didn't even know who have been talking about how she's really raising the bar for all of us and giving us a platform here, which is great, and I love to
Speculations in the Music Industry
00:43:16
Speaker
see that. I'm really curious, and I'm really hoping that Mickey Guyton's on the album in some way. I would love it. She's phenomenal. She's phenomenal and such a sweetheart. And I share the same birthday.
00:43:28
Speaker
But like she I remember her I think it was like remember her name. Is that the name of her song? Yeah, like yeah. And I really liked that song and just like seeing her story. I just feel like that would make a really great collaboration. Yeah, we will we will see. Yeah.
00:43:44
Speaker
from Ms. Carter, Cowboy Carter. I cannot wait. I can't wait either. And I'm also excited for the rock album. If it happens. Right. Because again, at this point, and again, I feel like Lemonade was the precursor to so much of this. I feel like Daddy issues was from this. I feel like the, what's the Jack White one? Don't hurt yourself. I feel like that's the precursor for what the rock album is going to be. She doesn't do anything without intention.
00:44:12
Speaker
No. So it's like she's so far ahead. Like I don't I don't even understand it. Like I really don't. I really don't either. I just feel like for the rock album, I would love a black cat moment. Oh, I would die. I need it. And who knows maybe like a collaboration with Janet, a collaboration with Lenny Kravitz. Oh, let me tell you something that man.
00:44:33
Speaker
So I'm going to tell you a story here that I haven't really told to many people because who's going to listen. And I'm not, I am not, not a name dropper by any means. A lot of all the things that happen are because of my job and what I do at work at Peloton.
00:44:47
Speaker
got invited to go to a studio here in the city to listen to Lenny's new album before it was going to come out. And it was like me, so usually they'll get somebody, so it's like all the partners. So there's like somebody representing Amazon. There's somebody from Deezer, somebody from Tidal, that's me from Peloton. It's somebody, you know, like they have all these different whatever people from radio. And so we are in a studio that is no bigger than my kitchen. Yeah.
00:45:12
Speaker
When they invite you to these things, I never really know if like, is Lenny going to be here? Is it somebody from the label just talking it through? Because sometimes that's the thing. And I'm like, okay, so they're like, you know, we're in one room and they're like, okay, you can go into studio two or whatever. And I get up, I'm closest to the door and I go to walk in and as I walk in, there's Lenny Kravitz. Oh my God. And I'm the first one in the room and I'm like, I don't, I don't, I don't know what to say. I was like, and I'm just, and
00:45:37
Speaker
Hi, hi, Liddy. You're like, you look familiar. Right. And again, the coolest person, as you would expect, the nicest guy, like so chill. Anyway, he plays us the whole album. There are some incredible songs on there. Is this Blue Electric Light? Yes. It's going to be so good. It really is a phenomenal album. And we're sitting there and you're listening to him talk about the genesis of it and how it came to be.
00:46:02
Speaker
I wrote, he wrote, recorded and produced the entire thing himself at his home studio in like Bermuda or something. And it's like, you've played all the instruments, you've written all the things, like you might just be like the next Prince, like really, because it's like, I don't know anybody who does it on that level. Anyway.
00:46:20
Speaker
goes into the whole thing. At the end of it, we're all just kind of hanging out and talking. He plays us the music video, which if you have not seen the music video for TK, what is it? TK-421? TK-421. Do yourself a favor right now. Stop. Pause this. Stop the podcast. And go watch the TK-421 video. You are welcome. Right. Light a candle. Enjoy. Literally light a candle. Maybe grab a towel. Right.
00:46:44
Speaker
Absolutely. Maybe several. And so like, like, he's playing this video for us. And again, if you've seen it, you'll understand. And I'm standing right next to him and I'm like, Oh, okay. Oh, all right. I'm just gonna write casual. This man is nude. Okay, great. Cool. And I'm like, trying not to sweat anyway. Guy comes in who's a manager of the studio. And he's just like, Hey, Lenny, I don't know if you remember I met you. I met you a long time ago, like 20 something years ago.
00:47:12
Speaker
when you were doing this album, whatever, whatever. And he's like, oh my God, that's you. You worked at the studio and they start talking back and forth. And somehow the subject goes to justify my love. Now I am like ready. I'm like, right. I'm like, tell me everything. And all he said, he was just like, oh, he's like, you were there for that session. And he doesn't go too far into it. But he's just like, man, he's like, at his one session, I will never forget. He was like, and he says to the guy, you know,
00:47:39
Speaker
You remember what Madonna did to me in order to get me to make those noises. And I wanted to be like, what did she do? Tell me. I don't think I understand. Right. Can you say more? Yeah. And give detail, please? Because I would like to know. And he was just like, well, he's like, I'm not going to get into it. He's like, but you know, that was definitely the wildest recording studio experience of my life.
00:47:59
Speaker
Oh my gosh. Oh my God. I want to know. Tell me. I need to know everything. And also like, is there footage? Is there video footage? Like, let's go. Right. Right. Crazy. Oh my gosh. Yeah. One of the, he is, and it's wild that he's going to be 60. I, where?
00:48:16
Speaker
Like, yeah, I'm truly right. I'm like, I'm like, I will drink whatever he's drinking. I will do whatever I will sacrifice forever. I need to. He had to have gone to see Isabella Rossellini and death becomes true. Literally, he's being he's actually being held together.
00:48:32
Speaker
Maybe that's why he's wearing sunglasses all the time. Maybe he lost his eyes. Oh my gosh. I love TK-421. I just watched the performance of Human on the Tonight Show. Incredible. It feels like there's actually a dance element to the song. There definitely is. There's one in particular. I don't remember the name of it. I didn't write it down and I should have.
00:48:56
Speaker
At the end, they were just like, you know, dude, does anybody want to hear any songs again? And I was like, whatever that one was, I was like the one that sounds like I'm in a club in Berlin.
00:49:03
Speaker
and he was just like, yeah, it's so good. And I was like, yeah, you're gonna love it. You're really gonna love it. Oh, I can't wait. He really is so talented. I just, one thing that I would love, and I was hoping that they were gonna do this to celebrate the 25th anniversary of five, but there were some incredible remixes for that album. Oh, yeah. Specifically, I'm a huge BT fan. And so, hit BT's remix for If You Can't Say No.
00:49:28
Speaker
that remix deserves to be on streaming. It is truly an incredible track. This is how I try to use my powers for good nowadays when it comes to the power I have at Peloton because I'm always dealing with the record labels and I'm like, you know, it's not on streaming, which would be really great to be able to play in class. Yeah, right. So maybe you can answer this. What is the reason that record labels don't put these things out?
00:49:52
Speaker
volume people like it's just it's literally just a thing that if you didn't know about it and you don't know, you're just not thinking about it because everything is so forward facing and so forward moving and happening happening at such a wild pace.
00:50:06
Speaker
that a lot of times, you know, the people that I deal with are usually younger than me, and don't even know the things that we're even talking about, or we didn't even know to look for remixes. Because again, not enough F slurs in the industry that are making these decisions at all. And we need more F slurs in the music industry. Right. 100%.
00:50:23
Speaker
And it's true because if you look at that time when all these remixes were happening, there were very specific gay men that were sort of in the seats of power that were orchestrating a lot of this to happen. So now it's just like, once I was able to get like Dolly Parton's Peace Train remixes up on Spotify, I was like, okay, so now I've dipped my toes in the water, what else can I do?
00:50:47
Speaker
And I reached out to Columbia and was like, hey, you know what? These remixes for the Dreamgirls soundtrack, they were never put on streaming, and that would be fun. They put them up on streaming. No way. Yeah. So I was like, OK. Oh my god. I was like, let's see. So now I'm trying to get Warner to upload the Jonathan Peters remixes of Pola Coles I Believe in Love. Yes, please. Yeah, so I'm pushing for that. Oh my god, I love this. That's so good. I tried to go with Celine's team and tried to get them to put all of her remixes up, and they were
00:51:17
Speaker
They're like, no, they're not interested in doing that right now. And I said, I understand. I said, but it's so difficult to play her songs in a class. I was like, you know, but there's remixes for My Heart Will Go On. There's remixes for It's All Coming Back to Me Now. Really good remixes. The Toni Moran remixes for both of those songs are absolutely phenomenal. Right, right. Toni was great because he used to bring in backup vocalists that would just do extra vocal bits. Yeah. Toni Moran, again, and so many of these things, like if you really go into the history, like
00:51:45
Speaker
Tony Moran was in a freestyle group called the Latin Rascals. And so a lot of these guys that ended up becoming the big DJs or just DJs in the 90s came from the 80s freestyle era. And it just was the next evolution. And they were like, oh, now we do this. This is what it sounds like. Wow. Tony Moran kind of came out of that scene and was another guy, George Cali, that used to do stuff on K2U. He also came out of that. And it's like there's
00:52:07
Speaker
some of the freestyle vocalists would end up doing dance stuff like Judy Torres and they would sort of you know just kind of move with the sound and it was really really nuts but yeah there's a it's it's the documentary needs to happen maybe this is our life's work maybe this is what it is maybe this is why we're meant to be to do this is to
00:52:25
Speaker
Now we need to start pulling our strings to be like, okay, let's let's interview. Let's interview these people. Let's interview. Let's interview the DJs record execs. Let's get the artists on because I mean, like, God, we could I I would love if we could get Mariah on it. I would die. That would that not be absolutely insane. I
00:52:44
Speaker
Well, you know, it's funny and this is, and I know that you're somebody who watches a lot of interviews like I do because I spend most of my time on YouTube watching interviews of like, who cares? I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. I can't stop. And it's so crazy because like when you start to do this, you realize how like weak journalism is in a lot of ways because if they're out on a press junket, they're given these sort of like really out of the box questions about whatever project they're working on. It's the same answers and the same questions, whatever, whatever.
00:53:11
Speaker
I saw this a lot, which shares a Christmas album, all the interviews I watched, and I'm like, all right, this is Stevie Wonder bit, and he's being harmonica, and you're jumping on your bed. I already know what the answer is. I totally get it.
00:53:22
Speaker
There is an interview with Mariah that Genius did. And I can't think of the interviewer's name. It's like an hour and a half. Is this where it's kind of they talk about a lot of her songwriting and stuff? Yes. Okay. Easily the best interview I've ever seen of her because this person came prepared with questions like there was research done. And I'm like, that's the type of interview I want to see.
00:53:44
Speaker
because I want to hear you talk about the process and how this all sort of comes to be because, you know, look, Mariah is somebody that never gets credit for her songwriting and really should more than anybody. And it's wild because it's just like, oh, well, you know, it's not just her by herself, it's her and somebody else. And I'm like, but that's all of them. It's all of them. Right. I had such an argument. I have a friend that is a huge Swifty, huge Swifty, and
00:54:09
Speaker
I've always been sort of lukewarm to her. I mean, again, I appreciate her more now because I've kind of had to go through her catalog because of Peloton. Yeah. But he was like, well, you know, she writes everything. And I was like, right, with help. And he was just like, no, she does it all. You can see in her documentary, she's sitting down at the piano. And I was like, right. But there's other people that are writing with her that are doing other things. And I was like, here's a website called ASCAP. There's another website called BMI. You can find out all of this information. And I was like,
00:54:38
Speaker
This is Taylor working with Max Martin, with Shellback, with Jack Antonoff, whatever. I was like, they have writing credits. And it was like very difficult for him to sort of understand that, that she wasn't this sort of... And again, she's great at what she does, no shade. But it's like every one of these artists is a collaborative artist. Madonna's the same way, you know? And so...
00:54:57
Speaker
Going back to very early in this podcast, all of my stuff with Junior led to me working for Shep Heddabone, which frequent collaborator, obviously with Madonna. And so that's where I met my husband, actually. We both worked at the same nightclub that Shep owned in Asbury Park.
00:55:14
Speaker
And I was the resident DJ there for five years. What? Yeah. That is so cool. Because there was a guy that was a very big fan of Junior who saw the work that I was doing with him and then was just like, hey, I think that you should come and maybe talk to Shep and do whatever. And I was like, talk to Shep? I was like, I don't even, what do I say? I was like, are you kidding me? And he's just an F slur like the rest of us. Oh, no way. Oh, yeah. Oh my gosh. Pat a bone. Right. So for the.
00:55:38
Speaker
For those that don't know who Shep Pettibone is, he produced Madonna's Vogue. Right. And produced her erotica album. Yes. And several remixes, not only for Madonna, but for Janet. So many people. Kathy Dennis. Paula. Paula Dool. Yeah. Phenomenal. Really, one of the pinnacle DJs in the house music scene in the late 80s and early 90s. And the person that taught Junior everything that he knew.
00:56:04
Speaker
Yes, so that's what like when I first met him, he was just like, oh, he's like, so I hear that you you know, you you work with my evil twin. That's what he used to call Junior. No way. Yeah. And so I was just like, yeah, yeah, you know, whatever. And then we sort of like bonded over that. And then it just got to the point where I was like, every two weeks I was going to his house and cutting his hair.
00:56:20
Speaker
That's what I was doing here at the time. And it was my relationship. And I was like, just tell me some stories. Tell me stuff about Madonna and Cyndi Lauper. Oh my god, seriously. What is Shep doing now? Is he still with us? Yeah, he owns the club. But I think with a lot of guys from that generation, again, the jadedness. And again, I don't want to ever speak ill of Shep because he's an icon. And I love him infinitely and was pivotal in my career.
00:56:51
Speaker
I think that some of them just got so jaded by the industry and how things changed and the ability to adapt just wasn't there as much. So like he has his business. He owns this hotel and nightclub called the hotel is called the Empress Hotel. And then the nightclub in the hotel where I worked is called Paradise. And it's been for like decades. I want to say it's probably coming up on like 30 some odd years that it's been down there. That's his baby. And he's just sort of like ruled the roost down in Asbury Park for a very long time.
00:57:18
Speaker
Um, and he's still DJs like throughout the summer. He'll still do T dances and stuff, but she's a, she's a tricky one. She's very, very tricky and has lots of opinions and, you know,
00:57:29
Speaker
Right. And it's definitely led to some challenging moments in the time that I was there. I mean, to be fair, I mean, again, no shade, I don't know, Shep, huge fan of his work. But I mean, I think you could kind of see that in the early to mid 90s when Madonna opted to go a different. So Junior, I guess now has a writing credit on Secret, but I think had to fight for that for a while. Oh, I don't even know. I didn't even know if he got one.
00:57:56
Speaker
Yeah, because I think originally he was not credited because I think that the original demo of Secret he produced. Yeah. And and then she opted to go the more R&B route for the album. And so but I would just say that would probably be a good example where like Madonna was like, no, I'm probably trying to go with different sound and probably like, no, you know, I was just assuming. No, absolutely. And I think that that's that's what happens with a lot of these girls is that, you know, the pop girls sort of like they they're again, they're collaborative artists.
00:58:25
Speaker
And it's like the sounds change and things move on. And it's, again, your ability to adapt is very, very key in this industry. Even though I feel like now, and I say this to Brian all the time when we're driving around and we listen to new remixes, and I'm like, everybody's just making 90s music now. That's where we're at. We just come back to the 90s. All right, great. I'm ready. I'm ready. There we go. There we go.
00:58:48
Speaker
Now make a nine minute remix, you pussy. Dance, F slurs. Well, this brings us to the iconic part of the show where I ask you if there is a song that you feel like is not talked about enough. God, I don't even know where to start and I feel like I should have been more prepared for this because I do it all the time.
00:59:12
Speaker
What is one that is not talked about? I think it would be easier if we had like a an artist that we were talking about. Right. It's like it's so hard to pick. I mean, I'm like looking at CDs now like I can. Well, why don't it's in honor of since today that today we're recording on March 21st, it's the 35th anniversary of Madonna's like a prayer. What about Madonna? Is there a Madonna song that you feel like we don't talk about enough till death do us part?
00:59:35
Speaker
Brilliant. Unbelievable. I think it's a fantastic song because not how often can you make an upbeat pop song about domestic abuse.
00:59:44
Speaker
Right. Like that just doesn't happen. Yeah. And not only an upbeat pop song, but it's almost borderline the way it sounds. I dare. I say cheesy in a way, 100%, though, especially the way it kind of starts almost kind of sounding like a video game. Right. Right. Yeah. Wild. So it's like, I feel like that one, like I'm trying to think things that just pop into my head. Shadow of love by Celine Dion. Sorry for love. Celine Dion, free me Debbie Gibson, her nineties banger, which I
01:00:14
Speaker
Oh, it's so good. So do you know that one? I don't know. I'm actually not so I'm not super familiar with Debbie Gibson's music. But you have kind of developed kind of like a friendship with her. It is.
Celebrity Collaborations and Pop Icons
01:00:26
Speaker
Let me tell you something. That's another crazy part of this job is that you meet a lot of people and I've dealt with a lot of like celebrities and had these like random interactions. Like, you know, I did the remix for 30 seconds to Mars because I went to another like studio listening thing with Jared Leto was there, which was wild.
01:00:42
Speaker
Because in my mind, I'm just like, oh my God, you're Jordan Catalano from my so-called life. And I'm just saying that, I'm like, I can't actually believe that I'm sitting here with you like it. But after hearing the album and hearing the song stuck and they played the music video and hearing him talk about it, I was so won over by his passion that I was like, oh, I kind of want to be involved in this. And I kind of want to like, can I do something? Whatever.
01:01:05
Speaker
So off the record, we are going to put the remix out at some point. I'm just waiting for a date, which I'm very excited about. I love the exclusive, exclusive. But yeah, but the Debbie thing is like, she is everything that you would want a pop star to be. She is the nicest person. I mean, and her and her manager, Heather, like they're doing it all on their own. Like it's just the two of them. And they, she's got her own record label and whatever. And it's really like,
01:01:31
Speaker
you want to talk about somebody who works so hard. She is never not on the go. Like she does all of it. And she's got great reputations and great friends across the music industry. And I'm like, it's just, she's just nice. And it's so weird to come across somebody who's had such a long career and just be so nice because like, look,
01:01:50
Speaker
I love Madonna to death like we all do. I don't know if she's somebody I want to meet. Right. You know, I think about that all the time. All the time. I'm like, yeah, she would be she'd be very scary. Right. Like on one hand, I'm like, drag me. Like I kind of want like just read me fulfilled. Like I'm totally here for about the other time. I'm like, you're a little scary.
01:02:14
Speaker
One of my best friends growing up, he was on tour with her, did makeup for the tour for the Sticky and Sweet tour and for, I want to say for MDNA and one other tour I'm drawing of length. But I would hear stories about things that went on and like, whatever. And it's just so crazy, like, because I can't imagine that type of pressure.
01:02:37
Speaker
because so like her work like okay so her work ethic and this is why like when people talk shit about her i get really annoyed because i'm like you don't even know the half she they do a rehearsal during the day that she is in yeah then they do another rehearsal of the entire show where she's sitting in the audience watching and they have someone who is
01:02:59
Speaker
a Madonna body double who travels with the show, performs in her outfits as Madonna and looks and dances just like she does. And she watches it to see what it looks like, makes tweaks, does little things, whatever. And then the night of the show does the show. So by the time that she's doing the show, she's already gone through the show twice in one day, once already performing the entire thing and once just from a visual aspect. So it's like, how do you like that work ethic is something that
01:03:28
Speaker
I mean, you just don't get. I mean, that's why she's the queen of pop. Right. Right. Yeah. Sorry to everyone else. Sorry. Sorry. The position has been filled. The position has been filled. And you don't become a queen until one dies. And hopefully she is with us for a very long time. A very long time. We did almost lose her. Please. And so. When she talked about it at the concert, I was like, I'm not ready. I don't know what I would write.
01:03:50
Speaker
right? Yeah, yeah, I eyes weld up several times that celebration. I mean, when she first came on stage did not expect myself to get overwhelmed. Right. And then as soon as I heard those synths, like really matters, I was like the tears. Yeah. And then that part as well. And when she started talking about her health struggles, oh my god,
01:04:07
Speaker
And it was just Yeah, we're magical, right magical night. Oh my gosh, I'm trying to think my I think I think my song that we don't talk about it. I'm also gonna go with Madonna. I'm gonna go with since we just had a nice conversation about shut put a bone. I'm gonna go with words from erotica work. Yes. Great song that I don't even know what that sound effect is. It reminds me kind of like the old sound effects from the Power Rangers TV show.
01:04:32
Speaker
from that like flute thing. Right, right, right. But like, I absolutely love that song. Six minutes. We all know I love a good length. Right. And I just that's not I mean, it's a brilliant song. I love the spoken word. You know, Madonna. Best spoken word pop star easily.
01:04:51
Speaker
Hands down. Easily. Hands down. When she speaks in a song, I'm like, that is truly the voice of God. When she did the it's a spoken word poetry. She reads the it's called If You Forget Me. It's a poem by Pablo Neruda. There was a whole album where they did. Was it an album or was it the soundtrack? I think it might have been on the soundtrack for this Italian movie called Il Postino or The Postman or something. Yeah. She just reads this poem and it's like
01:05:19
Speaker
If you have your headphones on, oh my God, I'm getting goosebumps just thinking about it. Right. Her voice is just unbelievable. It really, really is. It's the whole spoken part in rain. And that is just phenomenal. Phenomenal. Chef's kiss. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Thanks, Madonna, for all of you done. I mean, and then some and then some. I really it's it's crazy how much like, at least in my career, so many things have
01:05:44
Speaker
around that circle like they've all she's like the tying thing to so many of these DJs and other like there's always been She's just been in that circle. She's of that that ilk and that's why I always tell people I'm like, you know when you talk about Madonna
01:05:57
Speaker
Use some reverence. Like you're talking about somebody who was like, you know, we think about Basquiat and we think about Andy Warhol and Keith Haring and it's like, and Madonna. And Madonna. She was there. She was making this happen with this group of people. Yeah. Like, wasn't Basquiat one of her boyfriends? Yeah. And then and like she was best friends with Keith Haring. Right. And and Warhol. Right. Like, hello. Right. So I'm like, this is this is somebody who is so of that crowd. And that's why, like,
01:06:25
Speaker
when I see her be like disgusted in interviews or like roll her eyes, I'm like, because you're talking to, so you don't even know who you're talking to. And again, I'm not excusing her bad behavior of which there's a lot and I kind of live for it too though. Yeah, it's great. It really like it's, she deserves, she always says, you know, they won't respect her until she's dead.
01:06:44
Speaker
And I know and we need and we really need to stop doing that when you really need to stop respecting people when they leave us. We need to respect them and celebrate them when they are with us, whether whether the queen of pop or the person living down the street. Right. Right. Like we need to start loving people more. But.
01:07:00
Speaker
DJ john Michael, this has been an absolute treat. I need to I'm just saying this now I need to do it again when it's you and Jeff to 100% that that will be pure chaos. Right? Before before we let you go.
Future Projects and Collaborations
01:07:15
Speaker
Why don't you tell the people where they can find you on the socials and ever and all the things at DJ john Michael on all the things Instagram DJ john Michael NYC on tik tok.
01:07:26
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, you just look up DJ John Michael. I'm pretty much the only one I think that you'll find, but you see the remixes there on Spotify. There'll be more coming soon. I've got other things that are going to be happening around the pride time, which I can't say yet, but it's very exciting. Cannot wait. Oh my gosh. Very cool. And I have one more thing that I have to ask you because it's been on my mind. When you said your friends, Billy and Joel, is it Joel Dickinson and Billy Waters? It is. Again, I have like,
01:07:51
Speaker
followed your work for years. So I'm just kind of like I was like, as soon as you said Billy and Joel, and I was like, I know exactly who those are. Oh, yeah. Joel is my ex boyfriend from a very long time ago. Wow. That's when I lived in Minnesota for a time. I moved there and I was with him where I was there for about nine months. I could have had a baby and it would have been less stressful. Oh, my God. Yeah. And so but a lot of that, like we were all such huge junior fans. Billy had the email address for junior and that's how it kind of all started. And then. Yeah.
01:08:18
Speaker
The three of us were sort of working on stuff together when we were going under the name of Audio Assembly for a minute.
01:08:24
Speaker
Wow. So we even did a Taylor Dane remix, a ridiculous Taylor Dane remix for some like song contest in Sweden that she, I don't know, something really crazy. I love that. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Oh my gosh. Well, this has been such a pleasure. Thank you so much for joining me tonight. I need to have you again. When Jeff is back, we will all Kiki and it is going to be incredible. Yes. We're going to have a whole lamely moment. That's what I need. Yes. All right. Well, absolutely. Well, until next time, everyone, peace out.