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200- Illegal government elephant sales...and Mario Kart World drama!
100 Plays15 days ago
We're back and covering as eclectic a range of stories as usual! Namibia's government seems to be doing some suspect selling of elephants to 'unknown' bidders, and Mario Kart World are under the spotlight for their 'Cow' character who has a nose ring; is it jewellery, or a reminder of bovine oppression? Freedom, Paul & Anthony are here to look at a dozen or so stories from the vegan & animal rights space from the last month or so, and have plenty to chew over.
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Enough of the Falafel is a community of people who love keeping on top of the latest news in the world of veganism & animal rights. With the Vegan Week podcast, we aim to keep listeners (& ourselves) informed & up-to-date with the latest developments that affect vegans & non-human animals; giving insight, whilst staying balanced; remaining true to our vegan ethics, whilst constantly seeking to grow & develop.
Each week we look through news stories from the past 7 days in the world of veganism & animal rights.
If you spot any news stories that might catch our fancy, or have an idea for a discussion topic, get in touch via enoughofthefalafel@gmail.com.
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This week's stories:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cr74340v9p8o
https://nypost.com/2025/08/11/us-news/animal-rights-activists-target-vogue-editors-at-their-homes/
https://wildbeimwild.com/en/animal-rights-groups-call-for-a-global-ban-on-fur-farms/
https://plantbasednews.org/lifestyle/health/vegan-nun-medal-powerlifting-competition/https://plantbasednews.org/lifestyle/health/vegan-nun-medal-powerlifting-competition
https://www.news-medical.net/news/20250729/Vegan-teens-exercise-more-often-than-meat-eating-peers-study-finds.aspx
https://www.v2radio.co.uk/news/west-sussex/tui-at-gatwick-airport-targeted-by-animal-rights-group-peta/
https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/video/9.6873832
https://wildbeimwild.com/en/export-of-42-wild-namibian-elephants-causes-a-stir/
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/aug/17/supermarkets-suspend-supplies-from-lincolnshire-pig-farm-after-covert-filming-of-animal-abuse
https://www.theanimalreader.com/2025/08/05/man-smuggles-600-baby-red-footed-tortoises-in-suitcases/
https://www.theanimalreader.com/2025/08/18/colombia-lab-that-abused-night-monkeys-is-shut-down/
https://www.theanimalreader.com/2025/08/12/protests-grow-as-india-court-orders-removal-of-all-stray-dogs-from-delhi-streets/
https://plantbasednews.org/lifestyle/food/eleven-madison-park-reintroduces-meat/
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Thanks everyone for listening; give us a rating and drop us a message to say "hi"; it'll make our day!
Freedom, Paul & Ant
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Transcript
Introduction: 200th Episode Celebration
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello everyone. If you are looking for the latest in vegan and animal rights news, you are in the right place. I'm Anthony. Joining me for episode 200 from Enough of the Falafel are Paul and Freedom.
00:00:16
Speaker
But that is Enough of the Falafel. It's time for Vegan Week.
Societal Views on Veganism
00:00:21
Speaker
So I think vegans go looking for trouble even when they're not looking for trouble. That's not what butter's used for.
00:00:27
Speaker
Brrr! Take your lab grown meat elsewhere. We're not doing that in the state of Florida. about your protein and what about your iron levels? Should I call the media and say, hi, sorry? They're arguing like, oh, poor woe is me.
00:00:41
Speaker
Hang on a minute. You always pick
00:00:48
Speaker
of social injustice has connection another. That's just what people think vegans eat anyway. As long as you didn't get the wee brunions with the horns you'll be alright. Does veganism give him superpowers?
00:01:04
Speaker
No I cannot fly around the city. I don't have laser vision. and Hello everyone, this is Freedom I welcome you to the show. Hello, everyone. This is Paul. As you are probably aware, we've had a few weeks off for our summer break.
00:01:21
Speaker
But now we're back and we've got a lot of catching up to do in this 200th episode. ah But that's enough of the falafel. Let's hear what's been going on in the news this month.
00:01:34
Speaker
For more details on the upcoming news stories, including links to our original source material, check out our show notes for this episode, available on your podcast player.
Veganism in Public Policy: Calderdale Council Case
00:01:44
Speaker
Okay, let's kick the ball off with a story that feels like we've heard a lot of times before in that we are talking about a UK council who've decided to make all of their events have plant-based food.
00:01:58
Speaker
You might be thinking, are you reporting on another one of those? Well, this one is slightly different. As Paula said, we're going to be recapping the news from the last month, so all across August because we weren't recording before.
00:02:09
Speaker
week to week in August. Hope you enjoyed the special episodes. um This one comes from the BBC on the 20th of August from Calderdale Council in the UK, where complaints have been made because the plant-based menus served at council's official events have not been enjoyed by some, and apparently a large amount of food has been going to waste. Now, last year, Calderdale Council approved plans to have only vegan food, so no dairy, no meat options, served at their meetings and catered events.
00:02:43
Speaker
The council's deputy leader, Scott Patient, great name, urged people to try it. You might like it. but Particularly good surname, it seems. However, another councillor, Geraldine Carter, told members of a scrutiny meeting she'd received complaints about the plant-based menus at various events.
00:03:01
Speaker
Apparently, most people don't eat plant-based food, so it's not aligning with the council's values of inclusivity and asked for the mayor to be allowed to serve non-vegan food if it was being funded from the mayoral budget. I mean, Paul, this is quite pathetic just anyway, but the fact that they're looking at taking some of the mayor's budget to give people their bacon fix, it's carnists hitting a new low, I think.
00:03:29
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, there's holes all over this article. I think there's, it talks about a large amount of food going to waste. I mean, that doesn't define what that is. And there's no real exploration about why that might be the case. I mean, are they making too much food?
00:03:44
Speaker
Is the food that they've got in that's vegan, not great quality? Or is it possibly that people, some people are making a stand, ah making a bit of a principle point and and refusing to eat it? I mean, we don't,
00:03:57
Speaker
We don't know the background and I think that's lacking in the in the context here. It's probably worth noting that in this article it talks about this protest, if you like, coming from the civic advisory panel. who They're the people that have said it's not suited to everyone's taste. So these aren these aren't the elected councillors.
00:04:14
Speaker
So yeah the democratic vote that took care took place with the councillors supported this and it was a majority vote. So I don't think there's any immediate threat. It sounds like sour grapes on on on the path of some people, I think, here. this Again, some of the language is quite telling. Again, it says Geraldine Carter says it was logistically a problem to supply and the food. I mean, again, what what what what does that mean? I mean, is it like building a bridge over the Severn or is it like ah you know like coordinating ah a big music festival or something like that? I mean, i mean if if they had...
00:04:50
Speaker
cooked some non-vegan food and they were having to pick the meat out or the egg out. That's logistically difficult. But to just just serve plant-based food, it's really difficult to see what's logistically difficult about that, isn't it? Yeah, generalised language and no real kind of reason. But yeah, again, and I think we've seen this probably with a, well, we've certainly, it's ah it's a phrase that has come up in at least two, if not three of the articles I've got here this week. But I think we've seen it.
00:05:18
Speaker
certainly have seen it in some of the other instances of this where people have argued against the introduction of this or tried to fight back against it with this message of saying it doesn't align with the council values of inclusivity. That seems to be a bit of a line that's coming out with all the objections to this.
00:05:35
Speaker
But of course, as we've said, I think at the start, everyone can eat a vegan diet. No one's being, no one is being ah stopped from eating. It is a choice whether you decide to Eat that food, which you can if you decide you're not hungry or you want to make some kind of protest.
00:05:49
Speaker
Fine. But that is surely outweighed by, um you know, what they're really trying to push this choice of meal, vegan food here, which is much more on the environment my environmental impact. So.
00:06:02
Speaker
really does seem to be ah trying to play a a really poor card on it. So I think basically it's a few people moaning in another committee ah the decision has been made, democratic decision, democratic vote.
00:06:14
Speaker
So I hope that it can continue on that on that base basis. And if there is waste, then we need to know why, you know, and and then address that particular concern. Yeah, there's no there's no issue. if if If people are eating less of the plant-based food,
00:06:29
Speaker
Well, that's fine. Make less of the plant-based food. it it It doesn't mean you should do yeah maybe something made wrong because people are eating less of it. That's fine. So long as the mayoral meeting isn't lasting four days, isn't it's not really going to affect people one way or another, is it? You know, even if you choose to skip the meal. Maybe the vegan food is so nutritious that people are getting full up and they can't eat anymore. yeah so it Can't deal with all that fibre. What's wrong with you? Yeah.
00:06:56
Speaker
Anyway, anyway, let's ah let's move from the ridiculous to the sublime.
Inspiring Stories: Vegan Achievements
00:07:03
Speaker
We're delighted to have Freedom on the show with us for for his first ah vegan week episode. And his first story is certainly an interesting one. I kind of want to apologize to you, Freedom, for giving you this curveball to start with.
00:07:15
Speaker
The headline, Vegan Nun Receives Medal at First Powerlifting Competition, Age 72. This is sister Pat Farrell, who won her weight class at the USA Powerlifting's California Summer Open in July.
00:07:32
Speaker
She's actually been plant-based, um or her plant-based journey um started in the late eighty s She has said by her own admission, She's been sort of vegetarian off and on at at the start of this, but she says she's been steadily vegan for around 12 years.
00:07:50
Speaker
She does cite animal welfare and environmental reasons for for for being plant-based and those being big parts of why you might want to go plant-based.
00:08:00
Speaker
But she she effectively can deadlift she can dead lift 72 and a half kilograms which is more than her body weight which is uh is quite a feat really isn't it especially in the age of 72 and she's been encouraging her uh fellow nuns to take up weight lifting and to be engaging in a plant-based diet which uh freedom this isn't a story that we would see every day is it it's it's quite unusual what did you make of it it's it's not um a story we usually see every day if you look closely at this story, it's so motivated by her diet, you know.
00:08:39
Speaker
Studies have shown that certain plant-based foods, you know, can actually slow down aging because the one thing that makes this story surprising and is about the age, you know.
00:08:52
Speaker
It's not about being a nun, but um at that age, 73 years old, the modern day research keeps on showing that um certain diets, most especially plant-based foods,
00:09:03
Speaker
could um lower aging, also resist reduce the risk of ah stroke and heart disease, you know, also improves ah your metabolism, kind of makes you makes one feel more younger to actually undertake on these weight lifting pathway, be it also to try and learn new exercises.
00:09:27
Speaker
For instance, if you you could also check on Okinawa. There's a place in Japan called Okinawa where the investigation is ah not only Okinawa, there's also another place in Pakistan.
00:09:43
Speaker
They are called the Hazaras, you know. They kind of live very young very long, you know, and they're also always in their youthful age. So it's all traced down to the plant-based diet, you know, that which they all make very well use of. So It's high time that people get to know this sick week because some people do are just more focused on meat-based diets, you know, but without realizing the truth of what it causes to their health. So, and of course...
00:10:15
Speaker
Science also always ah proves this to be true, that a plant-based diet actually helps you be more fit and helps you also overcome aging. Yeah, and and and ah you know obviously she's doing that now at the age of 72, but actually you know by her own account, she's been steadily plant-based since the age of 60. I mean, but very often when I think of elderly friends and relatives that I have, and I think, oh gosh, I wish they would go vegan or I wish they would kind of ah adopt more of a plant-based diet. Sometimes I can think to myself, oh, but I bet they're set in their ways, but it it shows it's never too late to change. And my goodness, like we can, maybe we shouldn't promise that everyone can turn into a, yeah.
00:11:01
Speaker
a power lift at age 72. But hey, it were a great example, isn't it? Great example. Fantastic. Thank you for that one, Freedom. Let's move on to our next story. It comes to us from the New York
Activism and Ethical Debates
00:11:12
Speaker
Post.
00:11:12
Speaker
ah We have a lot of listeners stateside. We do love ah you tuning in. um So this one is from the US of A. ah The headline, animal rights activists get aggressive targeting Vogue editors at their homes and calling them killers.
00:11:28
Speaker
over fur coverage. First of two stories regarding the fur trade this week that we are reporting on. The animal rights group is called the Coalition to Abolish the Fur Trade, or the acronym CAFT-USA.
00:11:45
Speaker
In the words of the New York Post, they're aggressively lashing out. Basically, their tactic is to find these Vogue magazine, and ah guess they have an online profile as well, and editors in Manhattan and Brooklyn and basically go outside their house and protest, write down on on the street using chalk that their address, their social media handle, and basically taking very seriously direct approaches. There's there's no reports in this article of direct physical violence, though unsurprisingly, we have heard in and the story that the the people who are being targeted, ah spokesperson or a source close to them has said that they do feel very intimidated, which we
00:12:29
Speaker
we can understand. And I guess that is the tactic of the activists. One of them named Andrew, who declined to give his last name, was protesting with around 15 others.
00:12:40
Speaker
Apparently, um one person gained access to the the sort of shared building and put lots of pamphlets under their neighbours' doors. Paul, we've seen this kind of tactic before in single issue campaigns where you You go after the people who are working at a facility or their family members, real direct stuff.
00:13:02
Speaker
Not surprising that it's made the news. I'm interested in your personal response to this because I feel like these kind of tactics can divide those of us in the animal rights community. I don't think there's any anyone doubting that it will be making people unsure whether they should be carrying on you know supporting the fur trade. But does it cross an ethical line for you? Yeah, I mean, I'll come on to that after going through this. So it's probably worth giving some context. New York Post, if people aren't familiar, it's a real it's a real rag.
00:13:34
Speaker
it's ah It's kind of the, I'd say it's the American equivalent to The Sun. It's very clickbaity, comic looking, conservative, um not the sort of publication that's going to be typically positive of...
00:13:50
Speaker
anyone protesting I think to be honest so there it's just worth bearing that in mind um you know it talks about as I say tries to drag attention with the aggression aspect here aggressively lashing out at Vogue editors i mean that that that sounds like physical violence doesn't it when you read something like that and that that isn't the case here so you do wonder if that done on purpose and I suspect it is interestingly uh there is a feedback from some of the people are close to those that have been targeted and It says it's very invasive.
00:14:20
Speaker
Interestingly, they say it feels more invasive than in the past when they just throw paint at a fashion show, which I think actually says in throwing paint, that's that's good. We're OK with that. So long way that continue.
00:14:31
Speaker
and That's a long held tactic, isn't it? And on fashion walkways to do that. Yeah, they've kind of said, oh, this is people's homes, there's kids inside, et cetera, et cetera. I mean, again, there's two arguments here. One, you could say, yeah, maybe that's crossing a line. Or you could say, well, yeah, maybe good that the kids are aware of what their parents are doing and maybe the objections that people are out there.
00:14:50
Speaker
So, yeah, that's, ah again, you could look at that in two ways. I was quite confused in the article that, obviously, ah Vogue being ah one of the targets here, there is a statement here saying, from Vogue, saying that they don't photograph fur.
00:15:04
Speaker
But that made me think, well, what, that sounds very specific. So I'm assuming that they still write articles about fur-based fashion, describing it, just maybe not actually showing photos, which, you know, ah you could say, well, that's one that's one thing. But, you know, they might talk about trends or something like that, where they're they're kind of saying it's the next big thing, you know, that kind of thing.
00:15:27
Speaker
And that does seem to be the case, sadly, that, That's growing because the the view from the protesters is that they are promoting fur, but they haven't actually said by doing X, Y, Z. So I'm kind of a little bit in the dark about what is it they're still doing. So that would be quite useful to to understand, I think.
00:15:46
Speaker
So what else have we got here? Yeah, I mean, you mentioned that some of the tactics here, as well as standing outside shouting and chalking people's details on the ground, is, you know, one activist entered the building and shoved flyers under residence doors. I mean, that doesn't sound that aggressive, does it? I mean, that leaves a lot of people pizza delivery companies in in problems, I think.
00:16:07
Speaker
um you know it's uh it's it's aggressive leafleting isn't a law that i'm aware of that that you could break but there you go they do i mean just showing what a rag this is it's least the longest printout of a news article i've had with all the adverts in it 28 pages it's killed my printer um yeah there's there's various pictures of of stars should we say wearing fur but they don't seem to be in the publications that are being attacked so I mean, there are clearly people wearing fur, promoting fur, wearing it as fashion, quite despicable sort of people you wouldn't want anything to do with. But it doesn't seem to be, from what I can see, in the in the publications being targeted. So, again, I'm a bit bit confusing. What... what
00:16:51
Speaker
what we protest in here exactly it does say here while fashion magazines including ellen in style have stopped covering fur designs which i presume means like writing about them maybe not photos vogue still does but again what i don't know what it is and and i need to know more what it what it is Well, ah yeah and in a sense, could we not critique the action in so far as what's making the headlines is their own actions rather than the education piece, the information of what the fur industry is doing? Now, they might argue, well,
00:17:26
Speaker
well, actually, this isn't about raising awareness, it's about putting pressure on individuals who've got the power to change their media company's output or their tone and what have you.
00:17:38
Speaker
I mean, just for what it's worth, for but my my opinion would be these people seem very motivated that they They've got a lot of passion. I don't know whether it might be better put into it into a different campaign because if it's not that palpable what Vogue is doing wrong.
00:17:53
Speaker
obviously Obviously, anyone who's not completely decrying the fur industry, horrid things happen to animals in the fur industry. So, unless you're against it, like you do need to take a long, hard look at yourself. but I don't know, for me, it just it doesn't it's it's not my cup of tea, but each each to their own.
00:18:10
Speaker
Yeah, it does. You're right, actually, reading through the article, and i hadn't really picked up on it, as you mentioned, there's nothing really there that says the objections are... not not Not the objections to the magazine, but the objections to the fur industry. They're not bought out at all. They don't mention that.
00:18:25
Speaker
So there's no real education piece for the readers to say, oh, why why are people objecting to fur? What's the problem with fur, basically? So that isn't bought out. um And there is another reference to another designer, Mark Jacobs, saying that he'd been target of CAFT.
00:18:39
Speaker
And again, he seems to be saying, he's almost sort saying, I don't really know why, because I haven't used fur since 2018 and eighteen in the protests in hope that they're targeting... people with the the the right targets because then you lose, that's when you lose all credibility and then it's definitely the wrong tactic. So you have to be, again, you have to be specific about what it's the what and, and, and the who, isn't it really? So make sure it's accurate because otherwise,
00:19:05
Speaker
you know, you'll lose general public support. Yeah, and and they're already being ah decried as being ah incredibly aggressive through, like you say, employing the same tactics as pizza delivery companies and writing a bit of chalk on a pavement. So it doesn't take much to inflame people, does it? Let's move away from the tabloid reporting.
00:19:26
Speaker
of the New York Post and get a bit more academic.
Veganism and Youth: Austrian Teen Study
00:19:30
Speaker
ah This comes to us from um a medical journal and it's Freedom's Next Story. We are reporting on a study. The headline says, vegan teens exercise more often than meat eating peers, study finds.
00:19:46
Speaker
When you actually read down, um there is is more of a difference, interestingly, in terms of the amount of alcohol that meat-eating teenagers drink yeah compared to vegans. that That was actually the biggest data point difference.
00:20:01
Speaker
um But in terms of the study, we just to give everyone a bit of background, was based in Austria, in Europe. Quite a large number of participants, nearly 10,000 people um taking part ah in the study.
00:20:13
Speaker
Their mean age was 15 years old. So as as the headline suggests, It's teenagers. People could, it was like a self-reporting study. People could do it on their mobile device, tablet, laptop, etc.
00:20:26
Speaker
Looked at both their dietary type, but also their motives um for following that diet, as well as other lifestyle behaviours. And in short, and obviously unsurprisingly, the vast majority of these 10,000 people weren't vegan, but apparently,
00:20:43
Speaker
1.6% of them were. um Generally speaking, health was the larger motivator for them being vegan or reporting themselves as vegan, not necessarily animal rights or environmental region at reasons.
00:20:59
Speaker
They were generally more active, not not by much, only 4% more than meat-eating peers. They Unsurprisingly, ate more fruits and vegetables.
00:21:10
Speaker
And as I say, they um the biggest difference was 38% of the vegan teenagers ah drank alcohol, whereas 55% of the vegetarians drank alcohol.
00:21:24
Speaker
ah Not quite sure what the legal age of drinking is in Austria, but that was there the biggest change. It's an interesting one, this one, Freedom, because obviously we want to we want to take any positive headline about veganism Looking at the study itself, I would say there aren't that many differences between. It might be it might be that the vegan teenagers were exercising slightly more, but not by much.
00:21:50
Speaker
Do you think it's all the same fair enough to report on this and take this as a positive thing to celebrate? Or should we be a bit less biased and say, well, they were about the same, really? Yeah, in my own opinion, I think vegan lifestyle...
00:22:06
Speaker
helps one to be more exercising, you know, helps you to exercise more. I think is it should have the higher percentage when it's been rated, you know, because the art of being vegan comes with a state of consciousness, you know, about your body, about the metabolism of your body, you know.
00:22:26
Speaker
And um once you're conscious in this diet, you also have to see yourself be exercising more because I myself have noticed this one thing about exercising also you also be ready to burn off fat and all that be ready to put in the work so if I should take a look on how this was being reported I think it's on the positive uh looking to it as something being positive but um think it's unfairly matched you know
00:22:58
Speaker
because one thing about keeping fit is that you also have to cut down um on some certain on some certain diets you know you also need to cut out on some certain diet on what you're gonna eat so and um in essence sense most actually end up being vegetarian but if you're about to go more extreme means you have to reach out to the vegan diet you know like i said it you have to work on your metabolism.
00:23:29
Speaker
So if I'm to say, like I said, and I said this earlier on that, like, if you look closely at the article, it said that 51% of Australians reduced meat intake, you know? Yeah.
00:23:44
Speaker
If you said 51% of Australians reducing meat intake, once you exercising, you have to call out on some certain diet, which you will,
00:23:55
Speaker
induce you to have more fat, you know. So meat is one of those diets, you know. Meat is one of those diets that you have to cut down on enable in order to achieve the ultimate goal of keeping fit, you know.
00:24:11
Speaker
And um again, one thing about meat-based diet is that I don't think they actually are reported it well on where they said the alcohol intake, you know. One thing about meat base diet is that it actually induces you to kind of combine alcoholic beverages with water eating. Yes, I saw a research on that. it was kind The research was kind of comparing the meals that actually induce you to combine them with alcoholic beverages.
00:24:45
Speaker
Most of those diets were related to meat-based meals, you know. So I think they didn't actually report it well there.
00:24:55
Speaker
Coming back to the central theme of the article, which says that um vegan teens exercise more than meat-eating peers.
00:25:07
Speaker
I would stand on that to say that it's true because I said this earlier that vegan-based diets be vegan based um lifestyle actually induces you to watch out for your body is it is a conscious state whereby you watch out on what you're eating you watch out on the things you're gonna do to keep your body fit so the comparison actually do not match it doesn't match if you look closely at it
00:25:38
Speaker
That's my own opinion on this. Yeah, yeah. And I think my biggest take two takeaways from from this article are actually not the headline, not the main numbers in terms of what they were researching, but something that that you've already mentioned in terms of the proportion of people in Austria where the study was done that are trying to reduce their meat just as a whole. That was a great, great number, like really high proportion.
00:26:04
Speaker
And just the fact that nearly 2% of the teenagers who were interviewed are vegan. Like, that's great. I think 10 years ago, that certainly wouldn't have been the case. There wouldn't have been 2% of Austrian teenagers being vegan. So either way, we'll well we'll take these things as a positive and definitely better than the other way around.
00:26:22
Speaker
Let's move on because we've got other stories to to cover now. an interesting little icon on the top left-hand corner.
Global Animal Rights Campaigns
00:26:30
Speaker
If you follow the link in the show notes for our next story, the the website is wild. It looks like B.M. Wild, but i've I've looked it up and it's the word bime, which ah in in sort of Germanic languages, as far as I'm aware, roughly translates as leave them alone.
00:26:46
Speaker
So it's basically leave wild things to be wild. But then on the top left-hand corner of their website, we've got two stories coming from them this week. There is a picture of three different animals with the slogan, make animals great again, which has got a horribly Trumpian vibe to it.
00:27:04
Speaker
Anyway, that aside, let's hear what the actual story says. This is Paul's last one before his We hear his pick for the week. The headline is animal rights groups call for a global ban on fur funds. So another fur related story for Paul. The aim is to prevent future COVID like epidemics. This is ahead of the G7 meeting where governments around the world have been called upon to agree to a permanent and global end situation.
00:27:31
Speaker
to fur farming to prevent future epidemics of pandemics such as SARS-CoV-2. who um In India, animal welfare NGOs wrote to the Prime Minister with a comprehensive white paper on fur farming and zoonotic diseases urging him to protect public and human health by supporting the global ban um and the Humane Society International in a huge range of countries, Australia, Canada, Germany, Italy, South Africa, the UK and the US have also appealed to their respective governments.
00:28:04
Speaker
If you read the article, you can see that they're making lots of arguments about some of the horrific things that go on in fur farms. And Paul, this zoonotic disease link is an interesting angle to take Do you think that stands more chance of getting through to world leaders than just saying this is horrendously cruel and shouldn't happen?
00:28:26
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, this is, like you say, this is my second fur-based story. It's a very furry week. um And yeah, two two different approaches. I guess one is, first one was a bit more Petter sort of...
00:28:39
Speaker
attention grabbing in terms of headlines this is much more factual scientific I guess straight straight to the point on that one um I I always come back to i think personal belief that social change tends to require lots of different tactics and so when we say is this tactic effective or is this tactic effective I think that's kind of fair but it does look at it in isolation and I think in general my view would be ah mix of things are probably what ah what leads to social change and some of those things might not be palatable to everyone um but you know you look at social change in the past there have been a range of things that I think of contributed to that anyway that's my take on it
00:29:20
Speaker
Yeah, so this is very much focused on the health aspect and the the the SARS aspect that um is linked to fur farming these and such as zoonotic diseases. Quotes 400 outbreaks of this in mink farms in particular, across those range of countries you listed before.
00:29:38
Speaker
One assumes... I mean... It's interesting, isn't it? ah I don't know if you'd say that the outbreak is sourced from these places or whether they are almost introduced and then multiplied by the close confines of these animals kept in captivity. So maybe from our point of view...
00:29:58
Speaker
doesn't really matter either way, but it would be quite interesting to know that. So, yeah, there's that. The article does kind of allow for statements to be made around the cruelty aspect as well.
00:30:08
Speaker
ah There's quotes about there about the physical and psychological suffering of millions of animals. So puts it side by side, but I think in a way they're sort saying... Let's not forget that bit as well. But we're talking about the science here.
00:30:20
Speaker
Sometimes you've got a play to the audience, haven't you, really? I think if you're going to politicians, you're going to get more attention going back to your original question with with them so these sort of health-based stats, if you're talking to those people.
00:30:35
Speaker
I think something that often contributes to to change happening quicker as well is politicians seeing other politicians making decisions ahead of them. And that the article raised the fact that Hungary and the Netherlands have both banned mink farming in their countries in in recent years. And I so i sometimes think that things like that have the biggest impact because people want to keep up with the Joneses and that, you know, highlighting that might... Yeah, good point, actually. I hadn't really pulled that out, but you I think I agree.
00:31:04
Speaker
And especially countries that like to sort of hold themselves up as being more forward-thinking on this, I think. you know In my mind, this is just my stereotype. Netherlands, I'd have thought probably...
00:31:15
Speaker
up there although i was wrong I remember um when I thought the population of vegans in Netherlands was a lot lower than what I thought it was um hungry again doesn't ring an immediate bell as like a real bastion of animal care but great you know it's kind of great to see that sort of thing going on there and like you say others may want to kind of say well we don't want to be behind hungry because you know that's kind of we're more advanced than them. So we're surely we should be ahead.
00:31:40
Speaker
Who knows? Who knows? Yeah. this it It does also remind readers that, you know, things like fur and particularly mink are vanity and fashion products. They're not, they're not survival products.
00:31:52
Speaker
you know It's not like we're talking about people wearing these in in the Arctic and they've got no other food source. you know they haven't got a They haven't got a M&S to pop to to get to a jumper or something. these these are you know You don't need to wear these things like you don't need to eat meat. But yeah, worse worth people being reminded of that.
00:32:11
Speaker
Yeah, and it it does, you know, I think the way it really hits home the importance of this from health aspect is it does talk about not just this disease being in populations such as mink, but it does talk about the the the risk of transfer to to humans. and that's the key thing here, isn't it? When we think about what's happened recently with supposedly with COVID, et cetera, that, you know, it's it's it is that key to be able to jump between animal and and human that is what really worries people, even though we should really be worried about animals as well. But it's like, oh my God, it's on the doorstep. It's going to affect humans. it might affect me. yeah Therefore, I'm worried.
00:32:47
Speaker
And that's what they've play into. I think there's a bit of a fear factor at the end of the day. Scare them into veganism. That's the way. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. yeah what how we works how we know Whatever works for the animals.
00:32:58
Speaker
Yeah. Well, including whatever works for animals does include protests. We've already featured, um Paul, you've you've covered a story of people directly protesting against fur farming and Freedom's last story before his pick for the week. Yeah. is another protest. This took place at Gatwick Airport, which is one of London's big airports in the UK. The animal rights group PETA, that we hear from quite a lot, they were targeting TUI, which is a travel company.
00:33:30
Speaker
And interestingly, the way that they did this protest is that PETA representatives dressed up as members of other holiday companies. So it's this really interesting picture of people looking like a group of holiday reps, but they're actually PETA supporters because TUI are one of a few companies who are still ah soliciting people going to visit places where orca whales are being held in captivity and
00:34:01
Speaker
for entertainment, whereas other holiday package companies have stopped doing this. And the the line that Peter were going down was, look, lots of companies have stopped doing this.
00:34:13
Speaker
Come on, Tui, you need to stop doing it too they obviously made the arguments that you know in the world orcas live in complex family groups they cooperate fun they swim up 150 miles a day all the arguments for why these beautiful animals shouldn't be kept in captivity at all as well as saying come on holiday makers you need to not book with tui as well as saying to tui themselves you need to change what you are doing and Freedom.
00:34:42
Speaker
Tui, the holiday company, have not replied yet. That suggests that either they're not going to do something about it or they're working out what to do. It's great that this is being drawn attention to, though, isn't it? Because as Paul was saying in the last story, sometimes when animal abuse happens for things like entertainment, it's It's even more sickening than than somebody abusing an animal, ending its life in order to eat it. Well, they might think that they need the food, but no one needs to watch a whale perform tricks in an aquarium, do they?
00:35:16
Speaker
It is one of the problems we have in the world today. When it's been made mentioned that hawkers and whales, dolphins, they do not need to do something that's for amusement, you know.
00:35:28
Speaker
Some people think that it's all about the fun that um people get to see. and don't know. Be it fun to them, it's not fun to me. They forget that um these um animals are actually kept captive, you know.
00:35:42
Speaker
They're actually limiting how they should live their lives, you know. Animals need to be like whales and orcas. They need to be in the oceans. They need to be in the oceans and live their life the way they have to live it.
00:35:55
Speaker
But the problem we have in the world today is that people tend to see and think that um these animals, you know, they're actually making us happy and that um they should be things that should be turned into amusement or fun.
00:36:08
Speaker
So I think it's high time the world begins to pass that message, you know, in terms of what it it it should be. It's not about um calling them amusement parks. I think they should coin the right word for it.
00:36:21
Speaker
think I should call them captive packs or something like that. or Because when people tend to use the word like zoo or maybe amusement park, that's where the confusion sets in, you know.
00:36:32
Speaker
People tend to forget and that these animals, they actually feel. They feel, they experience life, you know. They are aware of how it feels, you know. Because there was an incident the last time where an orca actually killed quee a performer, the orca killed a performer and you so tend to see that these um amusement parks should be shut down you know because these animals they actually reacting violently the way they are being treated is not right because orcas they are very intelligent you know dolphins are very intelligent so actually keeping them captive in the long run
00:37:13
Speaker
They will rebel as we've always seen in the in day years by, it's not one incident, it's not two incidents, there's been various incidents, there's been many incidents of hawkers attacking the performers.
00:37:25
Speaker
And again, in the right sense of keeping these animals captive, you know it's not right, it's not right. think We should actually present our message and pass our message to the people we understand that animals being kept captive is not good for them.
00:37:41
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. It's not good for them. And what's what's great, like we were saying about um in the previous story, Hungary and Netherlands saying, well, we've already stopped doing mink farming.
00:37:51
Speaker
In this story, I think what Peter have done well in this press release is they've drawn attention to the fact that whilst Tui are still encouraging people to go to these amusement parks where orcas are being abused, actually...
00:38:07
Speaker
Other companies have said, no, we're not going to do that anymore. And along the same lines, hopefully the peer pressure of of other companies well will encourage TUI to do this. But good on Peter for drawing attention to that.
00:38:21
Speaker
Thank you for that one, Freedom. So we've now heard from Paul and Freedom's take on our first six stories of the week. We're going to take a short break now, so quickly put the kettle on, listeners.
00:38:31
Speaker
We will be back hearing Paul and Freedom's Pick for the week. We have got two very different stories. One, some awful news about wild animals being sold to countries far, far away.
00:38:45
Speaker
And then also some news about Mario Kart World. As well as producing these audio-based shows, our podcast hosts at Zencaster also provide the written transcript for each show.
00:38:56
Speaker
This is AI generated, so it might not always be 100% correct, but nonetheless we hope that this will increase the accessibility of our show. So to access any of these written transcripts, head over to zencaster.com forward slash vegan week.
00:39:16
Speaker
I'm going to spell it all for you.
00:39:24
Speaker
then a forward slash, and then the word vegan, V-E-G-A-N, then a hyphen, and then week. Zencaster.com forward slash vegan hyphen week.
00:39:35
Speaker
And then each transcript is embedded with any of the shows that you click on.
00:39:41
Speaker
Okay, Paul, let's start with your pick for the week if we can. And you have got this slightly um unusual story that is relating to Mario Kart World.
Controversies in Media and Gaming
00:39:51
Speaker
It is reported by CBC Kids News. So it's a news source that we're not used to referring to either. And we've got Peter featuring again. And they're not happy about one of the characters. do you want to tell us a little bit more?
00:40:04
Speaker
Yeah, so yeah Nintendo Mario Kart, big game in the games world. um And this is all revolving around a particular character in in this game.
00:40:15
Speaker
So whereas Freedom was talking before about the importance of words, which is really important, it's a massive area, this is almost like the importance of imagery and and what we see and and how and how that can have an effect. So yeah, two real fundamental underlying things about communication, I guess, at the end of the day.
00:40:33
Speaker
So there's this particular character in the game and that's a cow and the and the bit that has riled Peter and others is the fact that the cow has ah as a nose through, has a nose? Has a ring through through their nose.
00:40:48
Speaker
Get that the right way around. And obviously the point being made by Peter is that this this is part of the adornments of cattle that are part of their abuse. So and allows them to be tugged around etc as as as objects now the reason that i pick this is i think this is a really interesting area and i don't think it's necessarily that clear cut or needs to be that clear cut so you've got the view that's being presented here the objection which is you know this is i guess perhaps trivializing
00:41:24
Speaker
a cruel insertion into an animal in a kind of cartoon form. So that's, you know, that's bad. We shouldn't be doing that. That's, that's one take on it. I've, I think there's another potential view and perhaps I'm, perhaps I'm being more hopeful here than is, was intended, but I wonder whether if you take,
00:41:42
Speaker
certain images of cruelty and do make them into cartoons, whether that gives the opportunity to bring those out into shine a light on them.
00:41:53
Speaker
And, it you know, it's kind of the it's the opposite of just showing, say, happy cows on a farm. um which is a very common imagery that we have, but it's showing a cow with a ring through its nose, which is something that's not nice.
00:42:05
Speaker
So would that maybe be get kids asking questions about, well, what's that what's that ring for there? Why has the cow got that sort of ring? there's no evidence to suggest that's the case, but I'm i'm kind of...
00:42:17
Speaker
I'm wondering if that's another ah alternative view there. And perhaps, you know, it would I'd really love Nintendo to come out and say, yeah, we purposely chose that to make make make people aware that this is what cows look like in reality when they're objectified and used as as as cattle. um That would be what they should really come out and say. And maybe if they're clever, they will do.
00:42:37
Speaker
So I think, and this is going to be an awful joke here, I think Nintendo could switch this ah could switch this um article around. Yeah. and and fun kind of turn it to that and say, you know, we wanted to use it in this in this way to do it.
00:42:51
Speaker
um Well, interestingly, I was looking at at people's response to this online and and some people gave sort of whimsical comments saying, well, actually, it could just be a nose ring that the cow has chosen to have, you know, human beings have nose rings and maybe the cow is is consensually partaking in this racing game so it's actually it's actually fine even a statement like that from nintendo would still draw attention to the fact that millions of cows across the world who have nose rings aren't being treated consensually haven't
00:43:28
Speaker
haven't had a choice as to whether they have this ring. And this ring has a very functional purpose. It's not a a body adornment. um Yeah, I'm i'm often sceptical of these these Peter press releases where they they're saying, oh, you shouldn't have fur on these Warhammer figurines, even though it's not real fur. It's just a depiction of fur. But I'm not sure about this one. I'm kind of more inclined to be like, yeah, fair enough for raising this.
00:43:56
Speaker
Yeah, I think he's it's good to point it out and and kind of drive a conversation. But yeah, I think I was trying to think, and I can't really remember, maybe maybe either of you might better help me out. But I was trying to think back to other cartoon type...
00:44:12
Speaker
projections of animals where perhaps there were things like this that we could compare it to. So I was thinking, was there anything like this in, say, Chicken Run or Babe or something like that where certain imagery was used? I i don't... I've watched both of them, but I can't remember anything. But maybe there is, and, you know...
00:44:30
Speaker
I can't remember. Maybe you know, Anthony. I mean, ah i've I've said this several times on the pod before, but I think even if they did, they would be a drop in the ocean compared to the swathes of literature and and media depictions that that young children get when they're seeing farm animals.
00:44:50
Speaker
It's always happy animals that have been humanised and they're happy and they're all living together and none of them ever get taken away to a slaughterhouse or anything like yeah that. So yeah I think they would be in the minority. So maybe it should be a game where the cow is kind of trying to take over the truck that's driving other cows to slaughter and kind of driving that through an obstacle course or something. That'd be pretty cool. Yeah, that could be a little bonus level for the Mario Kart world.
00:45:16
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. So, but I think, you know, Nintendo could and should, I think maybe try and um embrace this criticism and try and turn it around because it's a good opportunity. But as it stands, yeah, it's probably fair, a fair swipe, but you know, I'm not, I'm not ruling out that there's a chance to um make something positive of it.
00:45:36
Speaker
Or perhaps there is maybe was an inkling of that hidden under, hidden under it, maybe a bit of and not subjective, what's the word I'm looking for where you're trying to run, um undermine the kind of image almost. So, Subversive.
00:45:48
Speaker
Subversive. Thank you. I just can't concentrate because I've got a cat's bottom. I was going to say you're doing very, very well giving your commentary on this story whilst one of your rescue cats does their best to ah parade between you and the microphone on the screen. Well done for your professionalism there, Paul.
00:46:03
Speaker
That's great. Thank you for that one. Now, from that slightly lighthearted story, we are now moving on to Freedom's. pick for the week, which is considerably sadder and and more personal. So I'll ah just quickly summarize it here. It comes again from that um news source that we cited earlier, a Wild Bime Wild. I think I'm pronouncing that right.
International Conservation Concerns
00:46:24
Speaker
um The headline is Export of 42 Wild Namibian Elephants Causes Controversy. This is the news that 42 wild elephants from Namibia that are being exported A light is being shone on that, especially because international conservationists are saying that this might be illegal.
00:46:46
Speaker
This is potentially violating international rules of the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Flora and Fauna. There's a bit of a mouthful. um Humane Society International, the Franz Weber Foundation, Born Free Foundation and five others have called on Namibian authorities to immediately stop elephant exports. They've written a letter giving very compelling arguments.
00:47:14
Speaker
and the The Namibian government announced in August that it had auctioned 57 elephants to three unnamed bidders. That's a concern, isn't it, self-reported?
00:47:25
Speaker
um for a total of less than 400,000 US dollars and would export 42 of them. In January, Namibia announced it would sell 170 elephants to reduce confrontations with humans and control the growing elephant population.
00:47:44
Speaker
freedom This is obviously incredibly sad to hear and you'll you'll have a good understanding of the the wider context of this. At the same time, it's it's similar to stories that we've heard all across the world where people are trying to encourage people wild animal populations and then they get quote too big because there's conflict or things like that and then we step in and intervene and ask for them to be killed or or shipped off it's it's incredibly difficult are you able to give us some more information and insight on this story you know at the moment elephants they face the problem of poaching again their numbers are increasing because in the last decade there were reports that their numbers were
00:48:32
Speaker
and on the decrease you know due to poaching and then also deforestation so at the moment there is a high concentration of their population in Botswana you know and then the ecosystem there is not able to sustain them so at the beginning it was agreed that um some of the elephants will kind of be moved to other eco-regions within Africa and not exporting them. So the the problem with this that Namibia is trying to do is that um the identity of the buyers are not known at the moment.
00:49:16
Speaker
It's most likely that um these animals will be exported to foreign zoo, which will also bring in another problem of captivity for the animals, you know.
00:49:27
Speaker
So we do not know whether the beaders are actually related to the problem. And one thing that causes the act of poaching elephants is the demand for their tusks, you know. There's a market for elephant tusks. So, and it could be that um when these elephants end up being shipped, you know, or being a exported, and that will be the end of them.
00:49:50
Speaker
You know, no one knows the particular location that are gonna be shipped through. It's not enough to justify that there is a S.S.
00:50:03
Speaker
elephants in Namibia. think the only country that has that problem now it's is Botswana, know. The only country that actually has that problem now is estimated that there is a total population of around 200,000 elephants in Botswana.
00:50:20
Speaker
elephant in boswae So the Ecoregion is kind of um experiencing this problem. So the only solution is just to move the elephants to other Ecoregions within Africa. So which was what happened when I first saw, read through this article, I checked through the data that I have. Namibia is not actually facing because that's the excuse they always come up with.
00:50:46
Speaker
At the moment they kind of come up with the excuse that I'm at the moment, that there's SS elephants. And then trying to give excuse, the elephants actually come across ah humans, or maybe they always have encounters with humans.
00:51:02
Speaker
Elephants in the jungle, how possible is it that, um yeah, elephants in the jungle having encounters with humans, instead of saying that it's actually humans that um actually encroach within their territory.
00:51:16
Speaker
you know, so if if you look into it, it's all about something that is related to maybe a profit-making means, a selfish profit-making means by the government, you know, without actually looking into these and these animals, human activities would soon send them to extinction, you know. It's something that is of great concern in the world right now because the data shows that in the last 50 years, the population is reducing, you know, and then through the help of animal organizations, the population started increasing again. And now they're trying to use it as an excuse to reduce their population again for their own selfish gains.
00:52:04
Speaker
which is the Thorscom market. Can I ask, Freedom, like obviously Namibia is like your your culture, your heritage, and and like you've got a ah much better understanding of that context than than Paul and myself and and probably the vast majority of our listeners. Obviously, you're coming at things with the added lens of veganism and animal rights, but to the everyday person in Namibia, what do you think their perspective would be on this would they also be thinking oh the government is being corrupt here they're they're trying to you know um raise money but by selling these elephants or or would they be more okay with it yeah for someone that's non-vegan it would be an investigation into how corrupt that is you know you know because like i said it could be so mostly selfish um
00:52:59
Speaker
interest you know of the government because they wouldn't stop at you know they they said um exporting 42 they wouldn't stop at that once they achieve this they will go on to export even more hundreds before you know to be thousands it's been happening even in other regions because other regions where there are no more elephants now you know like in kenya in uganda there were huge populations of elephants there So, and this is how usually it starts, you know, from, let's say, you they start with a little number before you know, to being thousands.
00:53:37
Speaker
And before you know, there will be less than even 10,000 elephants left. So this was how it was happening before international organizations raise them.
00:53:48
Speaker
The red signal whistleblowers detected that something was going wrong with um the elephant population. And, you know, one thing about these marketers or whatever who are after the tox market, they don't care of what's happening. It's always when the deed has been done, you know. so It's only when the deed has been done that um then the reality will now seep in. So this was actually trying to happen at the moment. From 42, before you know it,
00:54:17
Speaker
is 9,000. Yeah, yeah. it's it's It's really upsetting stuff, isn't it? And we we have to hope that that those really appalling examples from from history that you're citing there, that we have to hope that we're not starting to see that again yes in this case.
00:54:34
Speaker
really Really appreciate you you giving us your insight and into that freedom. And obviously it's a very upsetting area, but I think think listeners will but will really have appreciated that insight.
00:54:46
Speaker
Thank you, Freedom, and thank you, Paul, for your picks of the week. Now, obviously, listeners, we really love hearing what you have to say as well. It's not just about those of us who are behind the microphone here.
00:54:57
Speaker
So if you want to get in touch, giving us your take on the news, or maybe you want to disagree with something that we've said, give us an insight that we've not had before, or even tell us something that we've not covered, a new news story.
00:55:11
Speaker
We love hearing from you. Here is how to get in touch. To get in touch with us, just send us an email at enoughofthefalafel at gmail.com.
00:55:22
Speaker
We see ourselves as a collective. our listenership stretches all around the world and everyone's opinions, questions, feedback and ideas are what helps shape the show.
00:55:34
Speaker
Go on, send us a message today. Okay, just before we feature our last news story of the show, we're going to just quickly whiz through some of the stories that didn't make the cut this week. So from The Guardian, supermarkets halt supplies from Lincolnshire Pig Farm over animal abuse footage, Tesco's, Asda, Sainsbury's and Morrison's.
00:55:58
Speaker
have said they've immediately suspended supplies from Summerby Top Farm after piglets were filmed being kicked by workers. Horrible stuff, but good to see that response from those supermarkets.
00:56:10
Speaker
And then there's a host of stories from the animal reader that we just didn't get around to featuring So one is about a man who has been caught smuggling 600 baby red-footed tortoises in suitcases. That is in Rio de Janeiro in Brazil.
00:56:27
Speaker
Also in South amen in south America, a Colombian that abused night monkeys has been shut down. So lots of horrible stuff going on, but it seems like people are getting their comeuppance and being caught.
00:56:42
Speaker
And then over into Asia, in India, protests grow as India court orders removal of all stray dogs from Delhi streets. We've obviously been hearing similar stories from Turkey and from Morocco ahead of the Men's Football World Cup and it seems like similar things are happening in India they're wanting to just I don't know clean up their image by getting rid of stray dogs what's what's wrong with stray animals like does that really make your community look so horrendous clearly they think so in New Delhi however
00:57:14
Speaker
The one story we are going to go into a bit of detail before we round things off comes to us from plant-based
Industry Shifts: 11 Madison Park's Menu Decision
00:57:20
Speaker
news. Listeners might have come across the Michelin-starred restaurant 11 Madison Park.
00:57:27
Speaker
It is based in Manhattan, New York. They have been serving plant-based food since 2021. They retained all three of their Michelin stars in 2022, so they were kind of still awarded them as a fully plant-based restaurant.
00:57:45
Speaker
Unfortunately, the news coming out in the last few weeks has been that they have announced that they are putting meat back on the menu. In a statement, they said things like, change is fundamental to who we are and how we grow.
00:58:00
Speaker
We've decided it's time for a change again. We will offer plant-based menu ah starting from October 14th, but also select animal products for certain dishes, fish, meat, and yes, our honey lavender glazed duck.
00:58:15
Speaker
I don't know how they're calling it our honey lavender glazed duck when they've not been doing it for at least four years, clearly, if everything's been plant-based. um I think you've lost the claim to that, actually. 11 Madison Park. Eating together is the essence of who we are.
00:58:29
Speaker
And I've learned that to truly champion plank-based cooking, I need to create an environment where everyone feels welcome around the table. That was a statement by the chef Daniel Hum.
00:58:42
Speaker
Hum, indeed. Paul, do you want to go first on this one and Freedom will come to you for your response afterwards. It's one of my favorite vegan commentators has been saying on their social feed recently, we need to stop pinning our hopes on vegan capitalism and vegan businesses. They're just a small part of this, but still you can't help but feel a bit deflated when you see this.
00:59:05
Speaker
Yeah, and I mean, the reason they're giving is financial. And I guess we know that times are still hard. Restaurant sector, particularly vegan or not, tough to kind of be successful, even if you're Michelin star, probably.
00:59:18
Speaker
However, it does kind of smack. Well, all it does is it underlines the fact that ultimately this was a business for profit and not a business for moral reasons.
00:59:29
Speaker
Because if you really, really were committed to that, moral reason, then you wouldn't you wouldn't do this. But the the kind of you know they've played back that same message that we heard from Calderdale Council earlier earlier on about, oh, well, it's offer choice. It's like, well, what about a choice for animals? I thought you were behind...
00:59:49
Speaker
The choice of of of kind of not creating animal suffering. And now you've that's the that's the choice you've removed from the animals. you've You've given it to people, maybe, but you've taken it away from the animals. he's He's alluded to this might happen. And I think, you know, there's comments from various people as well, but it could backfire.
01:00:05
Speaker
um um' If business that he does have, that I don't know the mixture. We don't think we know. So the business he does have from people that are like... committed to going to vegan-only restaurants some people are you know i'm not one of those people particularly but some people are those people are saying well yeah the reason we went there was because of what you offered and now you don't offer it so we'll all look elsewhere so i think it's a bit of a a bit of a suicide move potentially but and it's it's a it's a it's a fairly bold move and you know time will tell in terms of what the success of that is but um you know their announcement says it's time for change again and it's like well change isn't always positive you know this isn't this is actually going backwards so it's not you know you can't sell it as a positive move because if you're if you're basically now embracing animal slaughter and cruelty that ain't that ain't a positive step forward is it under anyone's
01:00:59
Speaker
i't They've even gone. I mean, I know there's the argument that all animal deaths are ah kind of equal and all that. They're bad. But they they're even putting lobster on the menu. So you're going to have lobster being cooked alive in the kitchen.
01:01:11
Speaker
i don't know many vegans that are going to go for that. Again, I can only give a personal view, but I know people that aren't even... vegan or aren't even vegetarian that don't like going into restaurants that might serve foie gras or lobster, you know, because there's such an ardent view of that that's stuck with a lot of people.
01:01:29
Speaker
I mean, that's almost just going, we're not just going back to serving meat. Well, yeah, fuck it, we'll do everything. You know, it's kind of like... ah So, yeah, really, really looks like a real abandonment of any veneer of of moral moral business. So it's disappointing. But, so yeah, just shows that it probably wasn't the moral venture that maybe in the first instance it was selling itself as. I don't know. I don't see didn't see the original material marketing, et cetera, et cetera. But yeah it's certainly not that.
01:01:58
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. A real shame. It's interesting. Can I ask you, Freedom, like it sometimes if we see a restaurant that has been serving meat and then all of a sudden they add a few vegan options onto their menu, we start thinking, oh, this is great. Yeah, sure, they serve meat. That's not good. But look, they've added a few vegan options. That's that's really good news.
01:02:21
Speaker
But in a way, because this is going in the other direction, I feel like I would be less likely to go there. I don't know whether you have the same opinion because it's like they're moving away from veganism.
01:02:32
Speaker
that It feels a lot worse somehow. i ah Is that something that you feel? Yeah, I feel the same way. When restaurants try to introduce recipes or meals that are not vegan, you know, I feel the same way that um I wouldn't want to go there because it's not promoting what I identify with.
01:02:53
Speaker
with you know and also it's ah it kind of doesn't work with what I also would don't want to eat you know and it doesn't help with the kind of diet ie i would like to be eating so The two do not go hand in hand. The two do not work together.
01:03:10
Speaker
Well, luckily we've got Happy Cow that we can look up and if we're visiting Manhattan or listeners who live in that area can find plenty of exclusively plant-based places, exclusively vegan places that will champion that lifestyle and that diet. So we'll just go somewhere else. Hey, well, we really hope that you have enjoyed listening to this, our 200th episode. If you have,
01:03:35
Speaker
As ever, we're going to ask if you could do a little something for us if you've got a moment. If you've enjoyed today's show, we'd love it if you could take just a few seconds to share it with someone else who you think might enjoy it too.
01:03:49
Speaker
We don't have a marketing team or a budget to spend on advertising, so your referrals are the best way of spreading the free Enough of the Falafel Joy further still. And if you haven't already, we'd be really grateful if you could leave us a rating on your podcast player.
01:04:05
Speaker
That will also help the show pop up when people search for vegan or animal rights content online. Thanks for your help. Thank you everyone for listening. The Nerds Vegan Talk will be available from Thursday 4th September with Anthony, Carlos and Julie Pagliari.
01:04:25
Speaker
The theme will be predictions for the future the vegan or non-vegan world. Anyway, that's enough of the falafel for this episode. Thanks to Anthony and Freedom for your contributions to this 200th episode.
01:04:38
Speaker
ah Thanks again, everyone, for listening. I've been Paul and you've been listening to Vegan Week from the Enough of the Falafel Collective.