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Disclosure Team; James Iandoli - UFOs, Wilson/Davis & Crash Retrievals
1.7k Plays1 year ago
Creator of Engaging The Phenomenon which explores and researches UFO/UAP and related phenomena. Including Ufology, current events, human interaction with nonhuman intelligence (NHI)/CE-5, Consciousness, and beyond.
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Engaging the Phenomenon YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnFc...
Engaging the Phenomenon Twitter: https://twitter.com/EngagingThe
Engaging the Phenomenon Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/engagingthe...
An Inquiry Into Anomalous Experiences & The Phenonemon 2 - https://aninquiryintoanomalous2.rsvpi...
Loose Threads: https://omega-point.medium.com/loose-...
!! SUPPORT DISCLOSURE TEAM !!
Become a YouTube member: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMEn...
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/disclosureteam
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Transcript
Introduction to Anomalous Podcast Network
00:00:01
Speaker
You're listening to the Anomalous Podcast Network. Multiple voices, one phenomenon. One realizes very quickly we've been seeing this technology for decades. I had access to all those programs.
00:00:49
Speaker
windows, no real wings or control surfaces, no obvious signs of repulsion. And yet this object is witnessed now by four separate individuals and two separate aircraft.
Host's Solo Broadcast and Guest Introduction
00:01:10
Speaker
Hey, guys, how's it going? My apologies for the delay.
00:01:16
Speaker
Now, unfortunately, Nicole is still not with us, but I'm going live and I might have another guest jumping on. So these things happen, you know, these things happen when you're doing live streams, you know, if this was just a simple recording, then I could just wait for Nicole to turn up or we could record. I just hope that she's okay. That's all that matters. I spoke to Nicole yesterday or the day before, and we were like, had a back and forth. She, you know, she had the link and the times, but
00:01:44
Speaker
life gets in the way of these things. So whatever happens, I just hope that Nicole is okay. So let's chat to you guys while I wait for my, uh, other guests. Um, let's have a look in the chat here. I've got Jason, Benji, Lara, Andre, Dave, Davey, Alex, Fusi, electron blue eyes, Michael Crawford.
00:02:08
Speaker
You guys are awesome. I really appreciate you guys hanging around. Nightgazer, good to see you. So yeah, like I said, these things happen. It's okay. I'm sure we can get Nicole on another time. She may still turn up. My other guest and a huge thank you to this gentleman because I know he's had a busy week, but
00:02:31
Speaker
I'm going to bring him on right now. The man of the moment, the man who put together crash retrieval week. Please welcome James. I am Dolly. Hey, how you doing? I'm good, man. Well, this is a turn up for the books. Yeah. You know what? It just happened to be perfect timing. Uh, like literally just boom. Right.
00:02:53
Speaker
I appreciate it. It's so much, man. You know, we've, I've been wanting to speak to you again for some time, but dude, you've been so busy and I completely get that. So thank you so much for jumping on. And if Nicole jumps on still, that's great.
Panel Discussions and UFO Transparency
00:03:06
Speaker
You know, we can still have that conversation that was planned, but, but James, man, what a week for you, man. You've had two huge panel discussions. So let's talk about that. And maybe you can sort of talk about some of the highlights from those conversations.
00:03:20
Speaker
uh starting with i think it was ross kultar ron robins christopher sharp so yeah dude incredible man
00:03:27
Speaker
Yeah. So, I mean, again, the, the talk with Ross and Christopher Sharpe and, and, uh, Ryan Robbins, AKA UFO Jesus. Uh, it was a great talk, but it was a little, uh, a little somber, right? If we're going to use that word because, you know, Ross, Ross was a little pessimistic and I get it because he has inside sources. And I mean, we all do have telling us different things and.
00:03:54
Speaker
And I think that's Ross's inclination as well. I'm not going to speak for him, but I've noticed he tends to be that way. But again, I know he wants people to use that as a determination to say, like, this is bullshit. I don't know if I can curse on here. Yes, he can, my friend. His good old phrase, fuck him. I love when he brings that attitude and spirit to it, because it really is nonsense.
00:04:23
Speaker
Um, some of the things that are going on, you know, especially with all the progress we've made, right? It's like still, we like, we're still doing this and, and I get it right. Because if there are different factions, right? Like there's a faction that's trying to get this out within DOD, within intelligence, um, and, and, and different sectors that are for transparency.
00:04:49
Speaker
And then there's a group of individuals in those same organizations and institutions that are not for transparency. You know, that's what we're seeing, we're seeing the kind of rollout. I mean, there's different names for some of the groups like of course we know about the Gary Reed thing and
00:05:05
Speaker
We've heard the terminology and name Collins Elite. We know the US Air Force hasn't been that cooperative. They've been trying to undermine the effort as far as an organization goes, as far as we can tell. That's all we've heard. I haven't spoken to anybody from the Air Force, except for one person.
00:05:29
Speaker
You know, they're not tapped in on that level. Yeah. So, yeah.
Crash Retrievals as Proof of Non-Human Intelligence
00:05:34
Speaker
So, I mean, you know, this is what we're seeing roll out. And I really appreciate George Knapp's perspective because, you know, he's he's an OG. He's a legend. He's been in this so so long. And he said, listen,
00:05:46
Speaker
The closer we get to this, to the core, the core secrets, or the fundamental basis of this gatekeeping and the secrecy around UFOs, which crash retrievals, and part of why I did crash retrieval week is because it's dude, it's the holy grail.
00:06:04
Speaker
You can say, oh, we have an unidentified object in the sky or underwater or in space, and it's trans-medium. But if you have actual material, that's beyond evidence. That's proof of humanity being engaged with a non-human intelligence.
00:06:26
Speaker
And that's, that's it. I mean, once you cross that, and again, when I was talking with Richard Dolan last night on one of the panels, he said, that's the red line. Once you cross that line, I mean, like, well, I think on a consensus level, we've already kind of crossed the point of no return. But once you cross that line, that's, that's it, man. I mean, that's when, um,
00:06:53
Speaker
Like again, the general public has like the entertainment of the idea of it being serious has been introduced. The stigma has been reduced. It's not fully gone. But once, once you cross that line, that's when, when things are really going to hit people like, holy shit, this is real.
00:07:14
Speaker
You know, that's that's the moment of contact, right? If he uses the name for James Fox is excellent movie. That's that's the point in which, you know, there truly is no going back. And that's that's when everybody on this planet has to face the reality point blank.
00:07:33
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely, man. And this is, you know, stuff I was going to talk to Nicole about tonight. And in particular, I really wanted to bring up the work from 1985 at the Advanced Theoretical Physics Conference involving the Advanced Theoretical Physics Working Group. Because, you know, we've had the Wilson Davis talked about for some time now, but now that ATP group has come in, I think that adds more to the conversation. So what are your thoughts on the importance of what happened back in the 80s with John Alexander's group?
00:08:02
Speaker
Yeah. So, I mean, uh, you know, first shout out to Omega point and the hermetic penetrator for putting together loose threads. Um, you know, and a number of has helped them as, as much as we can on the side while they really did the big work, you know, they did the long haul, they did the heavy lifting and some of us were just like pushing supporting, you know, throwing in what we can.
00:08:26
Speaker
And, you know, what they did is, is absolutely brilliant. And, um, I mean, as, as far as I'm concerned as, as a, like a researcher and I, you know, I've been around for a while now, actually, even though I've only been more public in the last few years. But to me, that is like, you know, true UFO research. That's what it's about. So what they did is like, to me, it's like, it makes me proud, right? As a UFO researcher that.
00:08:55
Speaker
that they were able to make that accomplishment. I'm like, wow, you know, I'm amongst like some really skillful individuals. Right. And, um, so the loose threads, uh, paper, right. I, which I hope it gets turned into a book. I mean, it easily can be a book. It's, yeah, it's, you know, 250 pages. I mean, there's a very large appendix. So, um,
Secret UFO-Focused Groups and Influential Figures
00:09:23
Speaker
It's kind of overviewing the advanced theoretical physics working group that was put together by John Alexander. And, um, I'm forgetting his first name, but Blackburn, the guy from Lockheed. And, um, you know, if, you know, part of the point they're making, you know, other than, you know, obviously the kind of journey that these individuals that we are all familiar with now from awesome.
00:09:48
Speaker
A-tip the invisible college Which again back in that time they had this secret group with people with security clearances called the advanced theoretical physics working group You know and they use that name to hide the UFO idea, right? they didn't want to be looked at as a UFO group or be able to be foyed and And oh, we found the secret UFO group. So they were very clever about it you know and
00:10:16
Speaker
The interesting thing is it's all, it's all the same people, right? You know, I mean, there, there's some other people that were, you know, again, like Blackburn was there, um, uh, Roger Wood and, and other people like that, that aren't in the conversation as much today. Um, and I, I think some people have passed away as well. Um, Oh yeah. Robert would, you know, he's big on the MJ 12 documents.
00:10:42
Speaker
So and and had a background in aerospace. So all those people did You know, they were trying to figure this out back then right and but these were people That were kind of like heavyweights. They had you know, high-level security clearances They had connections in the intelligence world in the aerospace, you know corporate military industrial complex world so You know back then you know
00:11:08
Speaker
We have the stuff that we have now because these people were doing all this crazy work back then, you know, not just with UFOs, but also remote viewing. You know, Jack, how had done incredible work with, you know, again, you know, remote viewing, but also like the spoon bending, which, you know, John Alexander and then we're throwing spoon bending parties back then, which which is a fascinating phenomena to begin with.
00:11:37
Speaker
But so the loose threads is kind of like showing their entire journey from, you know, almost pre 1985 up to modern day. And they kind of argue that, you know, we probably wouldn't have a tip and awesome.
00:11:53
Speaker
If those efforts weren't put forward and you know, they, again, they were able to dig up a lot of things and there's all, I mean, you gotta read the paper loose threads because there's, there's just so many things in there to go over. Um, you know, they talk about Bobby Ray Inman and you know, how.
00:12:15
Speaker
He was, he was very, very involved in this. And if you look up, you look the man up, it's like, holy shit. Uh, this, this is like, you know, this guy's on the committee, right? MJ 12 kind of figure like, wow. You know, the director of the NSA and all, all these other, um, roles that he played. And, you know, I'm really glad they included, uh, Bob Exler.
00:12:39
Speaker
Yeah, because he you know, he was a nasa engineer and he was I mean again, he was just a badass man. He was doing incredible work and He got in touch with bobby ray inman and he you know, he asked him at a conference Hey, I want to talk to you about mj12 and you know, bobby ray inman kind of like Gives him a nod and a smile and then they end up getting in touch afterwards So and and there's a recorded phone call so, you know
00:13:08
Speaker
Bob Exler has Bobby Ray Inman on a recorded phone call. And it's obvious that Bobby Ray Inman had no idea that this call was being recorded. And he's talking about crash retrievals and reverse engineering programs and how Bob as a NASA engineer would be able to offer his expertise and if it would ever be made public that other scientists can work on it. And Bobby Ray Inman saying no,
00:13:39
Speaker
Uh, you know, 10 years ago, I'd say definitely not. He said, maybe nowadays things are different and they'd be more open. So, I mean, just, and again, these are all kind of loose threads that, that Omega point and the hermetic penetrator are putting together to kind of put together a tapestry. And, uh, again, fantastic work. And it's again, it goes up to even up to modern day with everything. So, uh, yeah, I can't say enough about it.
00:14:07
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. For anybody that's interested in the paper, it is in the description below, along with James's channel, where you can go and see the two incredible panels that happened this week for Crash Retrieval Week, but also just historically James's work and his interviews are well, well worth checking out.
00:14:27
Speaker
And you mentioned there about all these connections that were made between different people. And it was really impressive to see what happened the moment that Jay from Project Unity interviewed Oak Shannon. There was that snowball effect where Grant piped up and he was like, well, I've got Oak's notes. And then Melinda Leslie popped up with Jack Halke's notes. And you see, this is what can happen when people work together in this subject. We see a snowball effect of data and information that we've been crying out for. You know, what are your thoughts on
Insider Information on Crash Retrievals and Reverse Engineering Programs
00:14:54
Speaker
that?
00:14:54
Speaker
Yeah and it's incredible i mean it's absolutely incredible because these notes are from you know the nineteen eighties and nineteen nineties and in in the notes it's it's it's referring to things that are in the wilson davis. Memo right the notes the meeting when doctor davis met with vice admiral tom wilson then retired in two thousand two to talk about crash retrieval and reverse engineering programs.
00:15:24
Speaker
And, you know, again, Tom, you know, vice-admiral Tom Wilson was all due respect to the man. Um, you know, he, he was like, I don't know who Eric is. You know, it says in notes that if, if the notes ever came out or, you know, if, if this conversation ever got out, he would deny knowing Eric and that's exactly what he did. Um,
00:15:47
Speaker
But, you know, he said, Oh, Oh God, I might, I might know him. And he said something like that to journalist Billy Cox when, when Billy Cox inquired. And, you know, again, we have Oak who was, you know, instrumental and kind of setting up this meeting. Yeah. And Oak is like, yeah, I was on the phone with Wilson for two hours talking about, you know, not just Eric Davis, but how put off and probably kick green.
00:16:13
Speaker
And, you know, if they're trustworthy and the stuff that, that Oak was talking about with Tom Wilson is it's all reflected in the notes. So, I mean, you couldn't have made that up. They had that conversation in 1999. The notes are from 2002 because Wilson was retired then, um, at least from his DIA director of DIA position and was able to have this kind of meeting.
00:16:40
Speaker
All you know again, it's talking about that the eight it says in and I believe the Wilson notes. It says AP 10 Yes, because because he was on the phone with with oak. So he that's probably his abbreviated version of ATP 10 which were in Oaks notes, you know, so I mean that's just
00:17:02
Speaker
It can't get any clearer than that. All these individuals were talking with each other in that timeframe and communicating and coordinating, which led to this meeting happening with Dr. Eric Davis and Tom Wilson. And again, there's still the question of what Wilson was told by the security officer, the project manager, and the corporate lawyer, accurate.
00:17:32
Speaker
And the thing about that is if you had these three individuals that were trying to block Wilson out, but they wanted to appease him a little, maybe so he would back off. Maybe they did feel sorry for him and respect him a little because he was the deputy director of the DIA at that point and J2.
00:17:50
Speaker
So if anything, Wilson was expecting to find out that this is some kind of Soviet technology that they found and they're trying to
00:18:01
Speaker
exploit and you know to his surprise I said no that's not what this is these this stuff was not made by human hands and we can't make we can't make sense of it um it's it's just so advanced that we can't we can't make progress on it but every few years we revisit it and with the advancements in science and material science and technology we see if we can make sense of it every few years
00:18:27
Speaker
and ended in 89 and all this. So the significance of that, if you go back and listen to the old Eric Davis interviews from just one or two years before the notes came out, he's saying the same things. So I was like, come on, really? So there's so much cooperation there that it's silly to think that the meeting between Eric Davis and Tom Wilson didn't happen at this point.
00:18:57
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I mean, and then there's also another argument of, well, you know, this is just disinformation and I, you know, I don't know, but if it is disinformation, I don't know why. Well, I mean, I guess I could still see why I was going to say why, you know, Eric Davis allegedly, I don't want to say allegedly because the New York Times reported on it and Christopher Mellon
00:19:23
Speaker
uh, cooperated that Eric Davis was at a classified briefing where he was telling people with clearances who have need to know, I guess that, you know, where some of these programs are and how they operate, you know, and the New York times printed that, you know, uh, Eric Davis's quote about off world vehicles. And that's kind of the last thing we ever heard from Eric Davis publicly, because you know, that's the, he took it out, you know, he,
00:19:53
Speaker
He took a step a little far. He bends the rules, I guess, where he can. And that was probably the last big one. Absolutely. And some of these interviews you mentioned with Eric Davis are incredible to go back on now. In this time, they're really poignant. So he did one with Martin Willis. I think there's a couple of others flowing about there. But I recommend anybody just take an evening and just
00:20:16
Speaker
Go and listen to the old Eric Davis interviews. And they're not that old. They're only a few years old. I mean, yeah, we're talking 2018, 2019. The notes came out 2019. You know, some of us had them early on. And, you know, again, I was talking with Eric at that time and I was not going to just dump them out there because I had respect for him. But I said, Hey, Eric, just so you know, these are out there.
00:20:38
Speaker
Uh, I do want to give a comment. He said, no comments, which I didn't, I didn't publish that for awhile, but, um, you know, heads up this, if, if I have this, it's eventually gonna, it's going to get out there. And I, you probably know from Joe merger and Danny Sullivan, everybody, like we had those notes for quite a while before.
00:20:58
Speaker
You know, we were, every day we were like going on Twitter, waiting for somebody to have post them. And then they finally made it out. Like after like, I don't know how many months it was months though. Um, but at the same time, you know, we were able to.
00:21:12
Speaker
do a lot of research and digging in that time period so that when they actually did get out there and went viral, we already had a body of research ready, you know, and, you know, huge, huge shout out to Joanna Morinkovic, a UFO Google. I mean, the man has, is a legend in my eyes, has done incredible work and it's, you know, total, totally people have no idea.
00:21:37
Speaker
how involved and such great work that he does because he's very low key and he doesn't want to take credit and all that stuff but he's really done tremendous work and you know they don't call him UFO Google for nothing. Absolutely and this is the funny thing about UFO Twitter that I always take a step back and realize is that everybody thinks it's just the place where drama occurs and it's just a place for negative conversations but
00:22:01
Speaker
There are some silent characters and some public ones such as yourself, James, who do incredible work. But some of these silent people, if people knew the things they've been doing for the past few years quietly, they would be mind blown and they would rethink how they view the subjects, in my opinion. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there's definitely a number of people who I talk to
Secrecy and Whistleblower Protections in UFO Research
00:22:22
Speaker
that, you know, they're, they're not even, again, I mean, like,
00:22:26
Speaker
Look at the hermetic penetrator, right? He has, he's using that name for his own protection, I guess, if we can say that. And the guy is doing such incredible work and he's so forward thinking. Um, and you know, maybe nobody will ever know, you know, I've encouraged him to come out a little and he was going to come on my channel before the loose threads thing. But after loose threads came out, cause you know,
00:22:54
Speaker
I don't, he's, he's protective of his identity and stuff and I get it. Um, Omega point. Uh, I suspect we'll, we'll be coming out a little more. So people are going to know him personally, at least, you know, um, but I hope they do follow up work. Yeah, for sure. Um,
00:23:15
Speaker
Yeah, but again, yeah, people like Giuliano and Omega and Hermetic Penetrator. I mean, there's countless others. And there's definitely people that I'm not even aware of are doing the work that they're doing because I only have my network, so to speak. Yeah, absolutely. This is an interesting point I'd like you to tackle as well, James.
00:23:39
Speaker
Weren't these notes available about 15 years ago though? I seem to remember reading them quite a while ago and they just weren't verified, but plausible. I think the earliest thing we saw, all we heard about was two pages that Richard Dolan got in in the early days, but we didn't even have access to them, did we? No, we didn't. Richard didn't put them out. No, and that was the funny, Richard didn't have them. So this is the crazy thing. And I recently got a number of people on the record recently to kind of,
00:24:07
Speaker
paint this picture, you know, Richard was shown notes in 2006. He was at a conference and somebody from NIDS, AKA somebody from this group showed him two pages or three pages of the notes. Yeah. They did not allow him to take a picture or whatever. He was just allowed to read them.
00:24:28
Speaker
And on a few occasions, he talked about it. And I remember this back in like 2007, 2008, 2009, him talking about the Wilson Davis meeting and that he had corroborated it through a number of sources. And I, at that time I had no idea that he had seen that because I didn't know at that, at that time the notes existed because nobody did.
00:24:47
Speaker
The only people who knew at that time were Richard, because Richard saw the notes. The NIDS group, everybody in that group, I assume that all the players we would assume have seen. And again, I had Valet on the other week and I said, Jacques, when's the first time you saw the notes? And it's clear, again, he saw the notes back when
00:25:09
Speaker
The knits team got them, right? I mean, again, Eric left knits early 2002, but by all means they were all still connected. Um, you know, and we know that. And then Leslie Kane was shown the notes in 2007 or 2008, which she talked about on my channel for the first time, but she saw the full notes and yeah, she saw the full, she was at a conference in 2007 or 2008.
00:25:38
Speaker
And she was taken to a car. She was not allowed to take pictures or notes or whatever, but she was allowed to see the full notes. And, and again, you know, she, and the thing was too, is like, I don't know if too many people know that, but one of, one of Leslie Kane's major sources, and I don't think this is the person who showed her the notes to be clear, but one of her major sources back then or in the early days was commander Will Miller.
00:26:06
Speaker
She cites him in the Boston Globe and even in her books, UFOs, generals and pilots and officials go on the record. There's a few quotes in there from Miller and Miller, again, he's one of the people, he set up the meeting basically between Wilson and Greer and Ed Mitchell because Miller was a Navy guy and so was Wilson. They knew each other and I had found a document
00:26:36
Speaker
Um, you know, during, uh, in, in Steven Greer's work, actually that had Miller and, and Wilson communicating in two and in 1995. And the issue was brought up. So in 1995, Miller and Wilson are talking about UFOs and, and, and their interest in it and, and possibly putting together a meeting. And then, you know, low and behold in 1997, the meeting happens with, with Dr. Greer.
00:27:06
Speaker
Will Miller, Commander Will Miller, you know, who I've spoken to, and Joe Merge is friends with as well. Yeah. Dr. Edgar Mitchell, and then and then two people from the disclosure project were also there, Sherry Adamack, who was Stephen Greer's right hand and right hand woman, who was very instrumental in the CCETI work, who passed away in 9798, maybe 9798.
00:27:32
Speaker
Um, and, uh, Steven Lovekin, who was another disclosure project witnesses, his testimonies on the disclosure project witness testimony, um, YouTube stuff. So they were all there for, you know, the, this meeting with Tom Wilson, vice-admiral Tom Wilson, J2 at the time. And, you know, there's a lot of, there's still controversy about this document. Um,
00:27:58
Speaker
That that Stephen Greer had that he allegedly was given the document by an NSA source. That's what he claims I don't know but the document was an NRO document and It lists code names and and and you know different programs and allegedly Greer sent this out to Wilson's people, you know a bit a little bit in advance of the meeting and
00:28:28
Speaker
And in that time, Wilson and his assistant were able they identified a program somewhere in that document. And again, this controversy of the documents real or not, but. I don't. I think that is probably genuine or because the story goes that, you know, even Ed Mitchell says that Wilson was able to identify a program on there and
00:28:57
Speaker
Wilson tracked down the program and, and they told him he, he didn't have a need to know, you know, and, you know, within two months he had arranged a meeting to fly out and, and talk with the security officer, the program manager and a corporate lawyer or attorney about the program. And that's when they get into the weeds about, no, this was as non-human technology.
00:29:25
Speaker
Can't make the progress on it. Uh, he doesn't have need to know he's not on the bigot list. He doesn't meet the requirements And you know again wilson was furious. He he went back to the um special access oversight committee I believe and and said what the hell and they told him to back off unless he doesn't want to retire earlier lose a star or two. Yep and um, You know wilson was the deputy director of the dia at that time
00:29:53
Speaker
And likely because he, even though he was still pissed and chasing the story several years later, you know, he, he, you know, he listened basically, and he ended up getting promoted to the director of the DIA. Um, you know, which good for him. Um, I can understand why he would never want to talk about this. Uh, you know, for several reasons, other than the, the national security implications, I mean, it's embarrassing, right? This is,
00:30:22
Speaker
one of the head honchos and they're telling him like you, you don't have the need to know. And, uh, you know, sorry, basically. Yeah. No, absolutely.
00:30:32
Speaker
I mean, where does that link in with, I mean, what we're hearing now is that Congress has been made aware of legacy programs. And one thing that isn't, I mean, it's mentioned quite frequently, but I can't quite seem to find the connection. And it seems to be a real gray area is the aerospace, you know, the private aerospace industry connection to all of this. And just while before you pipe in, I'm just going to unlock this window next to me. So you go ahead, I can hear you.
00:30:59
Speaker
And, you know, just for, uh, well, so yeah, the aerospace legacy connection.
Aerospace Industry Connections with UFO Programs
00:31:04
Speaker
I mean, it seems, you know, even the Wilson, when Wilson was inquiring about this and he found the alleged program, it led him to a private aerospace contractor. So you're talking about, um, you know, there's the big names in the, in the aerospace world that are suspects. A lot of people suspect that it was a Lockheed. I have no idea.
00:31:29
Speaker
But Dr. Eric Davis has said the same thing. And Steven Greer has said the same thing. And I believe Ed Mitchell has said the same thing. So all these people are talking about private contractors getting access to the material for a number of reasons. Even if you go back to the Philip Corso,
00:31:53
Speaker
you know, testimony, um, and not even the book that Philip Corso wrote, there was all, he had something before that, which, um, is available through open minds website. Uh, but it's also a PDF on the internet. And, uh, you know, Philip Corso before he had the book, he had written his, the basic notes, um, called dawn of a new era. And it's, I, it's,
00:32:20
Speaker
It's a more pure form of what Philip Corso was trying to communicate. And just for people listening, Philip Corso is a disclosure project witness who came forward and said that he was authorized as one of his jobs to take UFO recovered technology and get it out to national laboratories and private contractors. So that story goes back
00:32:50
Speaker
several decades. And, you know, even Dr. Davis in one of these earlier interviews is saying that he, he tried, he checked out the, the Philip Corso story and it was basically true, you know, um, you know, and he was able to confirm that through official channels. So you know, there's the connection with, uh, with private aerospace and
00:33:16
Speaker
There's a few reasons that people speculate why, you know, private aerospace gets access first. They're the leading minds in the field, right? You want the best minds possible in the field and you know, corporate pays better, you know, proprietary companies pay better. So they get, they get the best. And, and you know, a lot of people,
00:33:40
Speaker
have said, even I believe Dr. Kick Green has said this publicly to Rich Dolan in an interview, is that actually, when you leave the Pentagon and go to the corporate world, say you're in DOD and now you're working for a private contractor, your clearances go up. You get more access. And I don't know the mechanism or reason for that, but
00:34:06
Speaker
If Kate Green is saying that, I tend to take his word on it because he's been in the business for so long. You have the best minds and also you can't foya the recipe for Coca-Cola. It's proprietary information. It's protected by the law.
00:34:24
Speaker
So it seems they found like a loophole, right? Yeah. To, you know, not only get the best minds to look at this technology and try to make sense of it, but also it's, it's protected by the law, basically. And even in secret machines, you know, the, the fictional version, uh, you know, they're talking about the, the Maynard consortium corporation is this like private,
00:34:54
Speaker
group of people who are big banksters and people with a lot of money and power, but they are able to get the contract. I forget the exact title, but again, this is something that was in the Secret Machines book, which came out in like 2016 or something, 2015, 2016.
00:35:18
Speaker
And in the book, it's talking about this special title and code that you're able to use in the classified world. And if you look up the code, it's talking about the waived SAPs. So they released it in this fiction book. But actually, even years later, Christopher Mellon and Lou Elizondo were out there talking about the waived SAPs. And that's where it seemed that these programs exist.
00:35:50
Speaker
Absolutely. I mean, and that's the thing. And we keep hearing about this whistleblower language coming out for the National Defense Authorization Act for fiscal year 2023. But then we hear people like Ross Coulthard, who are like,
00:36:03
Speaker
It's bullshit. It's not good enough. It's not protecting these whistleblowers enough. And what I've sort of gathered from that is that some of these whistleblowers do have connections through outsourced programs into the, I'd say the black world, but I think it's the gray world, the gray that in between where they're just buried programs within programs within programs. And there's no guarantee that if these people come forward, that they'll get their pensions, they'll, they'll keep their jobs, they'll be safe. You know, is that the kind of what you're getting at the moment?
00:36:34
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, again, I'm, I'm hearing different things. Um, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, Dean Johnson had, had responded to somebody's tweet about that. Uh, cause Leslie Kane also said, well, you know, she's not sure, you know, again, just like Ross cold heart, if the language is adequate to protect these people. And I, I agree with Ross that it should be,
00:37:00
Speaker
You know, there's the responsibility and the stress shouldn't be placed on the whistleblowers. It shouldn't work like that. It, you know, the ramifications for that should be placed on the institutions for basically doing something illegal. Um, so, so they're not taking as much of a chance. Um, so I don't, I, I don't know on, on a technical level,
00:37:27
Speaker
how much protection they have. Um, and if it's, you know, when push comes to shove, what, you know, what they're actually up against. Um, but I do know that some of these legacy people, you know, have been helping the, this whole time and they've been cooperating, um, you know, more than that, they've been going out of their way to push this forward. And we've probably heard one or two of these names before in, in a leak or something. And,
00:37:59
Speaker
They're still helping, right? And they're still meeting with people and they're still pushing this forward. And from what I have gathered, I have not seen that they're not going to come forward in, in, in the way that they are able to, you know, that doesn't mean that they're going to be on CNN talking about crash retrievals. No, they have to go through proper channels. They have to go through Congress. And at that point, I don't know what's going to happen.
00:38:29
Speaker
But the people that I've spoken to are optimistic that, you know, crash retrievals are going to be put on the agenda. And, you know, shortly thereafter is somehow going to be acknowledged publicly.
00:38:46
Speaker
And I don't, you know, again, we're, we're still, we're, we're still seeing resistance and, you know, infighting basically. And that's why we have all these distortions and nobody knows what's going on in the public, uh, because it's not everybody's in agreement about this. Um, so I, we're in uncharted territory literally. And I don't think anybody knows what's going to happen. Uh, but I know that,
00:39:14
Speaker
people that are trying or trying their darndest and they're going to see it through. They're going to do everything within their power and maybe a little more to see it through because they're on a mission now. Some of these people like Lou and others, they're very mission oriented. They take it very seriously. You don't just drop the mission, you see it through to the end and that's it. Wherever the chips fall, that's where they fall.
00:39:42
Speaker
I'm optimistic. I'm optimistic and I'm confident that, you know, if, if there were some of these people, um, you know, it's, it's possible that they've already spoken to the people they need to speak to and, and they didn't even wait for the language to be drafted. Uh, so, you know, for whatever that's worth, people know what's going on and it's, it's a matter of,
00:40:10
Speaker
what are people going to do with that information? And you know, Lou said some years ago now in an interview with George Knapp, like you got to give these people time, you're trying to give them a six course meal and in one course, it's not going to work. They have to process this, right? Like if you're on the Senate Intelligence Committee or Armed Service Committee,
00:40:29
Speaker
Congress even if you're on the gang of eight and this is the first time you're hearing about this and You have some kind of military Slash retired corporate insider telling you that we are in possession of non-human technology And we've been visited and everything you heard about UFOs and all that is true And you're responsible for it now because now I've told you you're liable to act out on that information like holy shit
00:41:00
Speaker
What are people going to do with that information, even if they're told through official channels? Maybe not everybody that's being briefed is in agreement or even knows what to make sense of that. I foresee things taking time, but I'm still one of those people who has faith in humanity.
Maintaining Positivity in UFO Research
00:41:25
Speaker
So I think that people are going to try to do their best given that information. And again, I'm optimistic. And if I really want to get super speculative, I think that the phenomenon is guiding this process at least. Or I can say guiding, I can say manipulating, I can say influencing.
00:41:54
Speaker
I don't think that all the increased encounters are a coincidence. I don't think they're purely because of the upgraded technology and sensors. I think that there literally is more activity and it's the phenomenon's way of pushing the issue. No, absolutely. And I'm a positive person too.
00:42:18
Speaker
That might turn around and bite me in the ass further down the line, but it keeps me going. And that's, that's all I can say about it. It's good for your health. Exactly. Exactly. On a very, on a very literal level, it's actually good for your biology and mind state.
00:42:33
Speaker
And especially working in this subject, you know, because you start feeling the weights getting on your shoulders and before long, you just, it becomes so heavy and too much. So yeah, tell us what I do for fun. You're the whole, you're like the, I just came from the gym. I was just putting weights on my shoulders for fun.
00:42:53
Speaker
Beast mode activated today with James and we love it. Blue eyes, as race is a point here, how can people talk about agencies and other people withholding information when they're doing the same thing? I suppose the one thing I would have to say to that is it's source protection. We hear this through journalism, we hear it through researchers is that
00:43:15
Speaker
People get told things and they get told not to release it. And you have to kind of respect source's wishes because if you start spouting out what you've been told to withhold, then you're never going to get told stuff again. And I mean that to a point where you're not getting told the secrets of the universe here or the secrets of the UFO subjects, because I believe it's just little directions to go in from what I garnered. Same with Ross, who talks about this a lot. And so it's kind of...
00:43:45
Speaker
That's how I look at it when it's withholding information. The government and the military may be withholding the big picture, but within that, you'll get people withholding little tidbits that they have to respect. What do you think, James? Yeah, so I mean, there's several levels to that, right? Yeah. I mean, yeah, some of these people and sources, they'd love to tell you everything they know. They have a great...
00:44:09
Speaker
Stress and responsibility. And again, like the weight on your shoulders of holding this secret, right? And being in the shadows and they want to help. And it's not like they're trying to hoard the information. Like, okay, if you have a NDA or security clearance, literally your life depends on it.
00:44:33
Speaker
uh, you know, your career, your livelihood and your family and your house and your mortgage and everything like that. Um, and again, like Lou has said, it's not, it's not about, you know, it's not like, Oh, it's about money. I'm going to keep my jobs. Like you have an honor, a code of honor that you're respecting to protect the people of this country. Um, and they take that very seriously. That's an oath that they took.
00:44:56
Speaker
So there's that level to it. But then again, there's the trickle down effect where, you know, maybe some of these sources, they want to help inform the public's research, right? So maybe a researcher gets ahold of them and they can't really tell you the details of something, but they can steer you in the direction that's going to help the research. And if me or you or, you know, other researchers are told something, it's not like, Oh, you know, we're,
00:45:24
Speaker
you know, we're positioning ourselves above the community because we have information. It's like we all, you know, don't want to compromise the work that's being done, right? Like if we go blurt something out, um, that could potentially sabotage an initiative and, and, you know, and the, or gambit that they're playing, right? Like,
00:45:47
Speaker
Uh, for example people and again, I don't know how true this is But you know someone speculated that you know, the new york times piece um That was done by julian barnes really pissed some people off and you know part of the reason that we haven't seen the report yet is because congress was really pissed and they wanted more information from the od and I before the report was officially submitted
00:46:14
Speaker
So that's it, you know, and that was like a preemptive strike, right? It's an anonymous source and it is in complete controversy and conflict with another article that was put out by the Daily Mail saying way different things from other sources. So, you know, that's an example of how
00:46:37
Speaker
It's information getting out in different ways and the spin that's put on the information can affect what's going on and everything that we're seeing here on the outside. Again, as a researcher, you want to protect your sources. It's not only like, oh, if I protect my source, I'm going to get more information. You have a responsibility and a respect for that individual that you're not going to
00:47:07
Speaker
below their cover either because, you know, in the intelligence world, they, they use that as a way to track who's talking. You know what I mean? You're given certain information and they follow where the information goes. And this person has this piece so they know where it came from. All right. So, uh, there's, there's all different levels to it. Yeah, absolutely.
Anomalous Experiences Conference and Continued Focus on Crash Retrievals
00:47:30
Speaker
Now, James, man, you've been awesome jumping on here tonight and we've gone nearly getting close to the hour, but we cannot leave because one thing we need to talk about, because in a week's time, you're hosting the second inquiry into anomalous experiences and the phenomena conference in New York City. So please, please tell us about that. Sure. Yeah. I'm really excited about it. It's a, you know, it's, it's really incredible that
00:47:55
Speaker
You know, we were able to put the first one together at all and and the second one as well now so that is going to be uh Saturday december 3rd in new york city But it's also going to be available on live stream because when we've done these the live stream the the in-person Tickets have sold out within like a week each time. It's like really incredible um, but you can join in through the live stream and uh, you know, this event is going to have
00:48:22
Speaker
Christopher Mellon, which is incredible. Leslie Kane, Ralph Blumenthal, Whitley Streber, Sharon Rowlett-Hewitt, who is on the BICS board, the Bigelow Institute for Consciousness Studies, and Jeffrey Kripal.
00:48:40
Speaker
is incredible and it's amazing that he's gone under the radar for so long. And I jokingly say that he's gone under the radar for so long because he goes over most people's heads. Because he's done a lot of things that, again, people don't know about and people probably won't know about.
00:49:00
Speaker
But he's been a big supporter of this and getting academics on board. And, you know, I think he's mentioned a few times in American cosmic so people might get an idea from there.
00:49:14
Speaker
It's incredible that he's participating in this event. He's the chair of religious studies at Rice University, where the archives of The Impossible took place. And again, I encourage everybody to go look up the archives of The Impossible. Diana Pasalko participated, Jacques Vallée, Greg Bishop. Jay Christopher King was able to speak on a panel on that as well, which is really awesome. So people can join the event.
00:49:43
Speaker
Via live stream and if you join the event via live stream the next day you get access to the full You know, you'll get an email with access to the full event so you can rewatch it as many times as you want um, you know, but also You know, we're we're uploading the the lectures and the talks and the q&as to the youtube channel so everybody can freely access it afterwards
00:50:08
Speaker
It takes a ton to put these kind of events together. If you took an event down like that yourself, I think your head would explode. It's really an effort, but it's totally worth it. And the first event, I think it was incredible to see everybody there in person. And I know, Jay, you've been to events like that. And just to meet everybody and talk to people is really incredible.
00:50:39
Speaker
It is. I mean, it was incredible. I can't wait for the second one. I've just popped the link into the live chat here on the side. Now, obviously this whole show was meant to be Nicole coming on. So what I'm going to do is as soon as this ends, I'm going to go and change the description. This is going to be a James Iron Dole. You can lay me as Nicole. I wish I was Nicole. I wish I was that good looking. I'm sorry. It's all good brother, man. You do it for me.
00:51:06
Speaker
It was totally serendipitous. I wish Nicole made an eye. I was looking forward to her talk. Me too, man. Me too. And I'm sure whatever happens, it's all good. I have no grudges for her not turning up. Life gets in the way. It's all good. We can reschedule. And this has turned into a fantastic conversation that I've wanted to have with you since at least last month. And like I said earlier, I appreciate how busy you've been. And you are doing next level work at the moment. And one thing I will say is that
00:51:36
Speaker
work that you do still pushes me to work better myself because you were the original person that kind of pushed me to do YouTube. So that's the kind of level that I always set myself up. So thank you so much, dude. I appreciate that. And I mean, you're you're able to do this even more consistently than me. You know, I'm kind of all over the place and I do my best. But and, you know, for people watching and listening, you know, Vinnie and I talked about this
00:52:04
Speaker
off the record. Um, I'm not going to blow it. No, but I'm going to continue to be, to be, you know, hammering away at the crash retrieval issue for months to come. And, you know, James Fox has, has said that Lou told him like the Calvary is coming. Um, and I think that the crash retrieval issues is incredibly important right now. And,
00:52:33
Speaker
I mean, I don't think that should be our only focus. And, you know, I think there's, there's other areas of the research which are very important, but I think that we need to put pressure on the crash retrieval issue. I think it needs to be a constant theme that we, that we visit and, and, and form people on and form UFO, Twitter informed journalists, right? Who may be watching our work or seeing us on Twitter, seeing us on YouTube, because there's a lot of material there. There's so much material there and.
00:53:03
Speaker
You know, some people that may have come on board 2017 and after may only be familiar with Roswell when, you know, there's, there's hundreds of crash retrieval cases, but there's dozens of good ones. Right. And I think that, you know, putting that on our priority list is, is going to be helpful, especially if we have people from legacy programs,
00:53:30
Speaker
potentially going to speak with, you know, are going to have their testimony heard and hopefully acted on that we have made the proper information available for those who said, Oh, so what is it with this legacy stuff? Right. Well, maybe Lou can't go into too much detail, but guess what? I'm just a random dude.
00:53:54
Speaker
Uh, on the internet, I can say anything so I can make information available to people, you know, Vinny, you're, you're, uh, Tony Stark, you can make information available to people. Um, you know, so that that's kind of the way it is. And I think it's, it's important that we, we keep that on the forefront and not let that get buried just with a, you know,
00:54:25
Speaker
begging and waiting for a UAP report to tell us what we already know. Yeah, it's going to be great if we hear about new cases and we have something new to work with and research ourselves and find the good cases within that and promote it so that we can put that in front of the right people. And not even just people in Congress and the Senate, but
00:54:46
Speaker
family members, friends, you know, people in your social circles, you know, um, but the, you know, the crash retrieval issue is like, again, it's the red line, man. It's the holy grail. Once the pressure is applied on that from both the outside and the inside, you know, I'm optimistic that it's, you know, it'll be taken seriously.
Speculation on Phenomenon Influencing Disclosure
00:55:11
Speaker
I can play. They agree.
00:55:14
Speaker
And that's the thing with me is, you know, I do my YouTube, I do my interviews, my research that I do is another secondary. I have, you know, people coming forward. I had a pilot I interviewed last week, 747 cargo pilot, which has led to me being contacted by other people who I can't talk about publicly yet, who may not come forward publicly.
00:55:35
Speaker
I just want to say there are conversations happening because the momentum is snowballing. Yeah. And so we are we are going in the right direction. And it's incredible. It's so good to see. And I wish the public could see the same thing that I see and that you see and that.
00:55:53
Speaker
I just think it's going to be an interesting end to this year's start of next year. And I'm going to keep hitting it full force with the Avengers. Yeah, totally, man. We need to. And again, I am optimistic. There are a lot of things and conversations going on. There's more academics coming on board.
00:56:16
Speaker
But it is going to take time. And of course, we all want it to happen yesterday, but that's just not how the reality of it works. Potentially, there are a number of things that could happen that accelerate the process, some good and some bad.
00:56:35
Speaker
You know, if the phenomenon wanted to, it could, it could end the whole charade and in a flat second. And, you know, maybe that's not the best thing that could happen for us. Right. Uh, and maybe that's why the phenomenon's interaction has been in the way it has this whole time. Maybe it's anticipating our, our level of readiness and reaction. And again, this is part of me being optimistic. And this is part of me having a ton of my own experiences.
00:57:06
Speaker
That's how I tend to think about it these days. Yeah, it's difficult, isn't it? It's difficult. We all have our individual thoughts and the way that we break it down and keep it in our minds as we progress day by day in the subjects. But like you said, positivity does help that even though we get these. I had it in Instagram Live earlier and people were saying it seems like we're in a low period. I'm like, I can understand that.
00:57:35
Speaker
You know, sometimes in the low periods, it comes with a smack and we're back up into the high and you know, it's, who knows what can happen. And the whole thing is like, I don't want to say like this, but you're not going to be high forever.
00:57:51
Speaker
Exactly. I mean, the nature of the universe itself is transient, right? So that's, that's the way of, of anything. There's always highs and lows, whether you're talking about a football game or re, you know, research, right? Like if you're talking about like even technological research, right? They hit walls and they're going and they finally make a breakthrough, right? And it's like a big event. And then it,
00:58:17
Speaker
there's a come down from that and there's a law and then bam, there's just like an explosion. So, I mean, look, look at the past five years. There's, we've seen the highs and the lows and we've seen, you know, don't expect that to stop. Basically. We're going to see that continued, uh, pattern, right? There's, there's like a low for a few months and then something explodes and there's a media wave for like two or three months and then it lows again. And then,
00:58:47
Speaker
We get another amazing revelation or confirmation and then lows. And, you know, some people say, oh, it's a drip drip disclosure. Um, and I, I don't think necessarily it's, it's by design like that. Um, I mean, if you want to talk about the grander consciousness scale, okay, we can get woo and talk about that. But in, in, in, in like the real down to earth grounded reality,
00:59:14
Speaker
approach like yeah i mean that's you know this is the the way progress works absolutely man absolutely we're just about the hit the hour james i think we'll we'll call it there tonight because i don't want to keep you any longer i really do appreciate it everybody that has been watching thank you so much but please go down into the description which will change after this live stream
00:59:37
Speaker
so far in the description James's YouTube channel is there along with a link to Loose Threads the 250 page article by Omega Point and the Hemetic Penetrator but it will what I will add is a link to James's upcoming conference a week today from New York City where you can watch virtually as well so all of that will be in there the inquiry into anomalous experiences and the phenomena
01:00:02
Speaker
And I'll try and put anything else in there that I think is relevant to the conversation that we've just had. But thank you so much to everybody in the live chat. But more importantly, James, thank you so much. You really, really just filled in and made it into an explosive conversation. I cannot thank you enough, brother. That was a pleasant surprise. Totally serendipitous. You know, I just finished at the gym and there we have it. Thank you so much. Always. Yeah, it's always great coming on and talking to you, Vinny. And, you know, we got to have you on engaging the phenomenon again soon.
01:00:32
Speaker
because I'm going to be doing more panels as well. And again, touching on the crash retrieval subject.
01:00:38
Speaker
Yeah, anytime you know that man. But listen, we carry on speaking behind the scenes as we do. But for now, guys, I will update you if I can on what happens in Nicole. Like I said, I just hope that she was okay. She will be rescheduled to come on because that conversation is going to be incredible. But thank you guys for being patient and being here and having fun with us all. I will be back next week with
01:01:03
Speaker
I can't even remember my own schedule. Go and follow me on Twitter and Instagram and you'll check out my schedule. You had John Burroughs coming on. John Burroughs is coming on. Actually, I think I've got a week off next week and then John Burroughs is coming on to talk about Rendlesham. That's going to be fantastic. John, make sure to press John because John knows a lot.
01:01:27
Speaker
Yeah, that's kind of like I've wanted to cover Rendlesham for a long time and I've never quite figured out the right guest. And here we go, finally. Honestly, and I think that John is the best guest to talk about Rendlesham. That's my own opinion. Maybe I'm biased. I've known John for a number of years now. But I really appreciate some of his perspectives, although he
01:01:51
Speaker
He's John Burroughs. Go listen to some of his old school phenomenon radio interviews. I recommend that, but he's John Burroughs, so. Got to love it. Got to love it. Yeah, guys. Thank you so much. So yeah, go and follow me and James on all the social medias. The links will be in the description in the next half an hour. Thank you guys so much. Take care. Enjoy the rest of your weekend and we'll see you soon. Peace.