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EP 07 - A rare peek into a famous copywriter’s mind on why addiction, disease, and human flaws are the magic sauce to a life of impact w/ Ray Edwards
34 Plays1 month ago
In today’s episode (recorded over a year ago!) I had the opportunity to sit down with one of my business heroes, Ray Edwards.
What’s it like when the person you’ve looked up to for almost a decade for their prowess in business, their laundry list of absolute rockstar clients (ahem, Tony Robbins, Micheal Hyatt and Jack Canfield to name just a few…but nbd) and their uncanny ability to turn words into dollars sits across from you on Zoom as a guest on your podcast you ask?? Honestly, I couldn’t tell you because I blacked out from overwhelming excitement and don’t have a recollection…just kidding. It was like a fcking dream come true that’s what. We talked about the road to becoming an example for others of what’s possible in this lifetime, how Parkinsons Disease and alcoholism (or any other road block out of your control) can be the exact path to your life’s greatest gifts, how addiction has a funny way of affecting us all in some way or another and how it’s the great equalizer in many ways, reminding us that we’re all one at the end of the day and what’s possible for Ray is possible for me and what’s possible for me is possible for you. I couldn’t be more thrilled for this episode that’s been sitting quietly in the vault for so long to be released into the wild where it belongs. I hope you get as much from our conversation today as I did. As Ray eludes to in the episode, you never know what person, discussion, or event will be the catalyst that’ll get you to where you ultimately want to be, but my hope is this raw sharing between the two of us could be it for you.
Connect with Dana HERE and Ray HERE and tell them what you loved most about this episode and what resonated deeply.
Check out Ray's books (mentioned on today's podcast), plus tons of free, binge-worthy content by clicking here!
**If you loved today's episode, don't forget to give this podcast a 5-star rating! You can easily leave a rating and review on Apple Podcasts by scrolling down on my show page, selecting a star rating, and tapping “Write a review.” This helps other modern-day healers discover the show, and your feedback helps me curate more content you love. Thank you for your support!!
Transcript
00:00:02
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the Modern Day Healer podcast. I'm your host, Dana Hayes, and I am so excited to share with you the stories, the trials, the tribulations, and most importantly, the triumphs of my own as well as many other successful modern day healers.
00:00:20
Speaker
We've gone all in to pursue our passion, to make an impact in the world by helping humans heal from the past and find true empowerment in their lives
00:00:37
Speaker
She is me and anyone else who feels a calling to help others heal, grow, and share their light. You could be a wife, a mother, a teacher, a writer, a speaker, a podcast host. You might be a workshop producer, a course creator. You're most likely an entrepreneur and can't shake the desire to make your calling your career because you know how much impact you could make if you went all in and had the opportunity to share your story with the world. That is a modern day healer. I'm a podcast host, a co-author of an amazing book about the journey of sobriety, a wife, a mom of two young children, and the creator of the spiritual lifestyle brand, Living in Power. I am Dana and I am a modern day healer. I am so glad you're here. Let's get started.
00:01:39
Speaker
Hey, all right. Ray Edwards. Thank you so much for being on the Living in Power podcast. I, again, I appreciate you and your time so much. I'm going to try to not fangirl you. Um, but that's where this all started. So again, I appreciate you so, so, so, so much. Is this the first time we've ever spoken?
00:02:02
Speaker
I think in, yeah, in real life, this is the first time we've ever spoken. Just in direct messages on Instagram, I think in the past. Well, it's a pleasure to meet you. Thank you. You too. And I think it actually started on Facebook and then I moved it over to Instagram.
00:02:23
Speaker
it's ah um I'm just, I'm just unaccustomed to this. So it's kind of humbling and embarrassing and cool all at the same time. Really that, okay. So I love the fact that you just said that because that's where I'm going with this. It's like, okay. So I have sitting in front of me, somebody who I am so, um, I.
00:02:47
Speaker
I feel like when we think about when and I say we meaning new coaches, or really like any coach that is on their way eager to build this business from their soul, they're looking at people like you who have worked with dare I say the industry leader, not just leaders like Tony Robbins, right? Michael Hyatt, Jack Canfield, we're sitting here looking at you like this is goals. Okay, so the fact that you're humbled is
00:03:21
Speaker
insane to me. Like, I mean, to me, inside the movie I live in, I'm just a guy who does a thing. And I mean, to me, you're as much a celebrity as anybody else I've seen on the internet. We started communicating and I was it kind of cool. I was telling my wife, look at this person. we're we're We're chatting privately. It's so cool.
00:03:43
Speaker
So it's, it's every, I think we're all, everybody I've ever met who's at any, any level that we think of as successful kind of seems to have the same phenomenon. They feel the same way. We have people that we look up to and we sort of idolize them and we don't sort of idolize them. We do idolize them. We think they have They've got it all perfectly figured out. They've got the perfect life. They've got everything, but they don't. And most of those people, I mean, there are, there are a few egocentric people I've met who are not humbled by the whole experience, apparently, but most people I know who have any kind of, who are known at all are the same. We're just, we're just people doing a job.
00:04:24
Speaker
I love that. That's so before I came on today, my husband was like, Dana, just remember that Ray is just another person. And we're all still just trying to figure this thing out. ah god That's so true. It's a wise man. He's a great guy. So thank you for starting in that way. Because I wanted to kick this whole thing off mentioning the fact that you are this phenomenal copywriter for these phenomenal human beings, which directly affects you and just makes you a phenomenal human being.
00:05:02
Speaker
and so You know people see the results right they just see where you are now, they see what you've accomplished they can see your, your little Instagram bio which is huge explosive you know you've made over $500 million dollars in sales for these um industry leaders and it just seems like, oh my god like How did you, how did you get here? What's the truth of the matter? And what I really want to know is, you know, what kind of dedication did it take? Or was it like a, you you know, all at once kind of thing, like people tend to believe? How, how did you get here? What, what is Wright Edwards' story? Oh my God. I wish I knew. if If you figure it out, please write to me. Let me know.
00:05:48
Speaker
um It was not all at once. Obviously it was over 40 years in the making, I guess, to get me where I am now. Well, I mean, it's been exactly 57 years. Give me where I am right now. But I started working in essentially what I do now, which is writing to persuade when I was 14. Got my first radio job at a radio station in Tennessee. Um, we won't go back that far into the history because it'll be boring. Um,
00:06:18
Speaker
Now, okay, here's the real, here's the real answer to your question. How did I, how did I get where I am? I don't know. I just know I loved writing and it was actually, this career was born out of insecurity. I wanted to write novels. I wanted to write like the great American novel, but I didn't feel like I was good enough and writing to do that.
00:06:37
Speaker
So I thought I could write advertising because I've been doing it. My, my mother was an entrepreneur. She owned a real estate company. I wrote ads for her real estate agency and they did well. And I thought I can do that. That's easy to do. And the more I did it, the easier it seemed to be. So I ended up working in radio. I wrote ads for the radio stations clients and they did well. And I loved it. I just loved the craft of it. How to tell a story in a way that would persuade people to to go to a store, buy a certain car.
00:07:05
Speaker
I just loved that. So I also realized when I was in that business that disc jockeys tended to get fired with alarming regularity.
00:07:17
Speaker
because the ratings would go down and they'd just fire the DJs. So I figured out the salespeople did not get fired because they brought in the money. So I didn't want to be a salesperson, but I befriended them and realized I had something they needed. I had the ability to write really good ads for their clients. So I could be a disc jockey and write the ads on the side to keep my job, which I did. Other DJs, other DJs got fired. I didn't cause people would say, Ray, the Ford account loves Ray. You can't fire him.
00:07:45
Speaker
So that's how I kept my job for 30 years in radio. And I became a vice president in a radio company that was kind of a big deal in the radio broadcasting industry in the 90s. And that was a fun ride. But then Steve Jobs came out with this annoying invention called the iPod. Remember those? And he did his presentation. and He said, yeah you have 1000 songs in your pocket. And I realized immediately, yeah, with no commercials and no DJs.
00:08:16
Speaker
Uh oh. So, um, I was, I was, I had a place of some influence in the in the country radio businesses at that time. I was on the agenda committee for the biggest single country or radio programming conference in the world. It was the country radio conference in Nashville, Tennessee. I was on the agenda committee, which man, I get the hell, I got to help pick the speakers and the agenda for the conference.
00:08:42
Speaker
And I kept for three years in a row, I kept saying, I want to bring in a discussion about the internet and MP3 players. And they said, Nope, that's just a fad. I realized, well, that jig is up. like I gotta find something else to do. Cause radio was in trouble. They didn't even know it. And I realized all this time, Dana, I had been writing radio ads for free. I had a salary. I was paid to be a DJ. The copy I wrote was free. I found out one day that people outside radio would pay me to write copy.
00:09:13
Speaker
um I get paid to write. So I started doing that and I started with a few handful of clients. I started going to seminars. It's where and I knew the people who spent money on that stuff were at these seminars. And I met people and I wrote copy for a few of them and they began, they said, you're pretty good. Started recommending me to their friends word of mouth. And the next thing I knew I was ready for people at the time were well known like Armand Morin, Alex Mendoza and Alex introduced me to Jack Canfield. Listen to this, this one guy and just me to Jack Canfield, Tony Robbins, Amy Porterfield, Stu McLaren,
00:09:50
Speaker
Um, indirectly to Michael Hyatt and to, to Mark Victor Hanson, just one person, one contact whom I didn't, I'd never heard of this guy before. I had no reason to think he was a big influencer. I just knew I liked him. I liked his work. I liked working with him. He was a fair client. I mean, he paid a fair rate. He was easy to work with. Well, I won't say that he was pleasant to work with. It was not easy to work with. He required, he expected a lot of me.
00:10:18
Speaker
He really became a mentor to me. I mean, there was a few times where he come back to me, he said, you know, this job you wrote, this was really disappointing to me. I know you can do better than this. It was never this is a horrible job. You're a horrible person. It's always, I know you're better than this. So he was kind of like a favored wise uncle in the business, who helped introduce me to these people. And he always knew it not embarrassing.
00:10:42
Speaker
So that's another key thing. I mean, when I connect a student with a client or somebody that I know who's appear, that's one of the primary things I'm thinking about. They don't want to be embarrassed by the person I'm introducing. So.
00:10:56
Speaker
I'm just aware of it because I was very conscious of it was Alex. And so anyway, that's it was all word of mouth. And the thing is, the only thing I can identify that I think that maybe is different for me, maybe not all that different, maybe I just like to maybe I just hallucinate, I'm different.
00:11:14
Speaker
Um, I love this work. I love the art of writing to persuade to, to sell ideas, concepts, products, beliefs. I just, I didn't love the process. So it's not that and so many people say I don't like to write copy. I just like to have the copy written, but I actually like to write the copy. I think that's one difference for me. It's made a lot of difference. I enjoy the work. Do you think that somebody who doesn't enjoy copywriting can still do copywriting? Yes, but why? Right. I mean,
00:11:51
Speaker
right
00:11:54
Speaker
However, having said that when I was in radio, there was something I did not like. I've always been tended to behave like an introvert. I won't say that I am an introvert because I'm not sometimes I'm extroverted. That means sometimes I'm an extrovert, but I had a tendency to to more toward introverted behavior. So in radio, when you're a disc jockey, think about it. DJs are by and large, very introverted types because they love to be famous in a tiny dark room all by themselves.
00:12:25
Speaker
Yes. That was what I loved. And then I found out, well, when you're in that business, they expect you to go out and do these things called remote broadcasts where I'd have to go to a car dealership and stand around for four hours, hand out hot dogs and balloons and.
00:12:38
Speaker
say hi, to and I hated that. And I had a friend who was, who was also my boss. One day he said, do you know, Ray, here's something that's gonna hold you back. You hate doing these remotes. I said, Yes, I know. He said, Yeah, it's obvious. Did you need to learn to love it? I said, but I don't I can't learn to love it. I hate it. He said,
00:12:56
Speaker
Don't give me that bullshit. You you know exactly how to do this. Just decide you like it and just like it. Enjoy it. Find a way to enjoy it. If you'll do that, it'll make your life easier and you'll do be more successful in this business. Like, wow. Okay. So I did it.
00:13:14
Speaker
And, you know, sometimes it's just one simple little trick he told me, try instead of standing behind the table, you know, we'd have a tent with a big inflatable cat that would because we were cat country. And, and we'd stand behind this table and hand out stickers and stuff like that. So how about you stop standing high, stop hiding behind the table and get out in front of the table and actually meet people.
00:13:36
Speaker
So that's what I started doing. I started, I greeted, I began, it got to the point where I was greeting people when they came on the lot. I would do the sales people's job. I'd be learning like, what are you here for? What are you looking for? What kind of car do you want? What what have you got now? Do you have a trade in? By the time I got them to a salesperson, I'd had the deal almost done. That's awesome. I actually started, I actually started getting paid bonuses from the car dealership for how many cars we sold.
00:14:01
Speaker
And i so I just discovered one day I'm like, well, I went from hating meeting all these people in public, hating doing the sales thing, just suddenly I loved it because I decided to, and the focus became on the people and the process. Again, it was loving the process. So instead of every weekend, the Oh my god, I got to go to another one of these remotes from a cell phone store.
00:14:24
Speaker
I just think, Oh, I get to go hang out with fun people for four hours, eat some good food, have some laughs, see some cute kids, some dogs have a good time. I get paid to do this. How amazing is that? So that's another way you could approach it is if you don't like copy, maybe give it a chance. It's so key to every business that this persuasive communication thing.
00:14:47
Speaker
if you if you don't if you If you hate it, I got to ask you, what what is it you hate? Do you hate communicating? Do you hate people? Because it's really about that. Copywriting comes down to communicating to people in a way that's meaningful to them. And when you do that, you can be, you can then influence them to do things that you know are in their best interest, like buy your product, get your coaching. Um, and if you, if you look at like the process of bringing people in into your coaching program or onboard for your coaching services, if you don't like that process, if you think, I don't, I just want to coach, I don't want to dirty my hands with the sales part of it.
00:15:26
Speaker
That's a, I think that's a fundamental insecurity you have about your own value and worth that you need to take a look at perhaps. I think you need to. So I'm trying to back pedal from that and just say, maybe it's something to look at. You want to maybe check out and investigate because truthfully it's like, it really is the confidence, the lack of confidence can keep somebody behind their computer, not doing what it really takes.
00:15:55
Speaker
to become the person that is the coach that is doing the business. Yes, that is so true. And I honestly, um, communicating always came so easily for me that I didn't understand when people would say, I'm nervous about doing an interview. I'm nervous about going on a podcast. I'm nervous about speaking or making this video. Cause I could never understand that. I just, it was very easy for me. Um, and then I had this little thing in my life pop up called Parkinson's disease and it began affecting my speech. And I found some time, like I've warmed up since we started this interview, I was having a little trouble enunciating when we started.
00:16:36
Speaker
And part of that is medication. And part of it is I began to relax a little bit. You're a great host. you You have very calming energy about you. So it settled me down and I stopped being so shaky and stopped tripping over my tongue. um so But I've learned, I'm telling you this because this taught me something.
00:16:57
Speaker
I didn't enjoy the process of getting Parkinson's disease, but I began looking for what, how can I use it? What can I learn from it? One thing I learned was to be, to have a freaking heart and understand that some people find this very difficult to communicate.
00:17:12
Speaker
Because I was now finding it difficult and I was like I don't want to go to the interview because I'm gonna embarrass myself because I can't speak clearly sometimes I get start tripping over my own tongue and Start talking too fast and I get all my words get all mushed up together. I never had those problems before So I wish I still didn't have them but on the other hand If I hadn't had that challenge, I wouldn't have learned to be more empathetic toward people who do have that challenge and And it's made a world of difference because now people that used to, I used to get frustrated by people who told me they had this problem. I just say, well, get over it. Well, I was just, cause at that time, apparently I was a heartless bastard, but since then I've learned to be a bit more empathetic and say, I get it. So let's work on it. Let's take some deep breaths and slow down and it's okay. And like reframe the process and make it not so, not so difficult and not so terrifying. And I too,
00:18:06
Speaker
was a very brash, like, I don't understand. It's not computing for me how this is not computing for you until I went through my big humbling experience with alcoholism and never even realizing a day in my life, not truly, that I genuinely had a problem with staying sober until the day I did. And then I was like, oh my God, I got knocked down.
00:18:34
Speaker
can I just share with you, you sharing things about that journey was so powerful for me as I was somebody who was receiving your communications on social media. It was so powerful and meaningful to me. So we I think sometimes we think that people aren't interested in our story. or We don't want to be like we don't want to be a narcissist to be always talking about ourselves. And I think when you're coming from a place of sharing vulnerably,
00:18:57
Speaker
And doing so because I look, I never wanted to be a guy who was going to be a spokesperson for Parkinson's or parking. Parkinson's awareness or I didn't know there was nowhere on my radar screen. um And after I got the diagnosis, I didn't want to do it i didn't want anybody to know I had it. But it began to be It was meaningless what I wanted because I had it and people knew something was going wrong. I was trying to deal with all that. And so hearing from you in and the way you were communicating is you're just relating that it was difficult for you to do it.
00:19:34
Speaker
But it was so meaningful, so powerful. And it's our imperfections that we can share like that with with an aim toward letting people know you're not alone. Other people have been on this journey before. You can make it to to encourage you to give you hope, give you some steps along the way. All those things are so important. And the fact that you you may find it difficult or makes it it makes you nervous or you have trouble speaking or whatever the the thing is that you're dealing with,
00:20:02
Speaker
um Really, the thing it's like Ryan Holiday's book, you know, the obstacle is the way the thing you most wish you could get rid of often is the thing that gives you the most opportunity to progress in your life to hit the highest levels of achievement. If you can accept it and just lean into it.
00:20:19
Speaker
So true. And it's, it's crazy. This is crazy timing to be talking about this because I am rereading for, I think the sixth time, it could be the seventh. I've absolutely read it five times, but, um, thinking grow rich, just, you know, just a great book to go back over. And I'll tell you, I took a good, now it's been four years, I've been sober, a good four years off from reading it because I felt that when I first was reading it those first five times, it was from a very self-centered place, although I wish I wanted it to be coming from an altruistic place, right? Like I wanted to be coming from this compassionate, I want to help, I want to make an impact.
00:21:00
Speaker
But I knew that I was just saying the words not feeling it and really coming from a place of greed, to be totally honest with you, going through the healing processes and all of that now we're talking about, um you know, the fact that you've got this.
00:21:15
Speaker
this thing that's happened or whatever out of your control really. um But it's the thing and they talk about it in the power of now. I'm like back on chapter three or something. And he's talking about how that thing is a thing that's made, you know, the greatest men or whatever and women um know who they are and be themselves and become who they really are. And all of a sudden I'm reading it going,
00:21:44
Speaker
Wow. That's amazing. Yeah. I mean, think about any great movie or story we we love. We don't go watch movies or read books about people who, chapter one, my life is great and perfect. Everything's going fantastic. right Middle of the book. My life is still great and perfect. Everything's still going great. End of the book. Things are still going great. It's a wonderful life. That's not the kind of story we want to read. We want to read about the person who seemed like everything was fine and then all of a sudden their houses burned down, their families killed, their they're in the middle of a war, they've they've got to go find this thing and they't go on this quest. and it's like It's horrible what what the people that were watching in in these stories are reading about in these books are going through, and yet that's the story we want to read. Why? Because I think we instinctively know
00:22:26
Speaker
to make progress to get further along our own personal evolution um as as a human and learn what we're supposed to learn, whatever we're here to learn or whatever we're here to do, we have to go through these this obstacle course. And it's not like to punish us or something like that. It's it's to challenge us, to change us, I think. I mean, my my feeling is um I don't want to get into too spooky territory here, but My feeling is there's there's something in the universe that's bigger than we are, <unk> that's infinitely intelligent, infinitely loving, has created everything for our benefit, even though some of it's really, really stinking hard. yeah And we our challenge is to figure out what it is we've been given and what we're supposed to do with it.
00:23:15
Speaker
Yeah, ah thank you. And we can end right there, but we're not. You know that that's how I feel because I've experienced it. And I think when you experience that transformation where you are You know, you're just riding along, you're just in your head, you're just doing your thing. um You've got goals, right? But then something comes out of nowhere to throw you down so far. I mean, to to the depth that you just didn't know were possible for yourself. But then what happens is you actually consciously um make the decision to move forward, not resist, you know, not in resistance, but to move forward
00:24:02
Speaker
even though it is so painful, but you get through it. And then when you're on the other side, you're in this light that you can't explain unless you've been through it. And um and then you get to then in whatever way ah was meant for you. For you, it's copywriting. For me, it's business. It's like in whatever way that that comes to you, especially as a coach, and now you get to just shine your light in that way because you've had the experience and you now um take on the the qualities of that experience. It's embodiment, right? At its finest. Absolutely. I mean, it's, that's, that's the whole journey. So I'm not right there. And the the thing is, I mean, I have to be, I have to say this because I feel like it would be incomplete if I didn't say it. Every day I get challenged because I get re-hypnotized into some of my old ways of thinking.
00:24:54
Speaker
yeah Um, I, I feel like I lose sight of that. I have that clarity that I've gained through this challenge of having Parkinson's disease and working through all the things that I've been through with that. And you know, it's not done. It's an ongoing journey like life is for all of us. Like we don't, we don't solve a problem and then everything's perfect from then on. And we live ah some of the worst words ever written are happily ever after when ever.
00:25:23
Speaker
it doesn't work that way it's it's like you know we we need I don't know why this is. It seems like we need the pain to be able to appreciate the pleasure. right We need the difficulty to be able to appreciate the times of ease. We need the depth, the dark cold of winter to be able to appreciate the beautiful warmth of summer. And it's easy to say that and to give it intellectual ascend and say, yes, I know that's very wise. good It's It was a whole different thing to actually walk through that experience and live it and understand it from that viewpoint. So I've been in these places of great clarity
00:25:58
Speaker
where I went from wanting to kill myself and take my own life to the point of realizing I'm never going to do that because it hurt too many other people and there's things I was put here to do. And I have these, these not, not, not really beliefs, but I just know things. There are things that I know because I've seen them. And, and yet I can still get caught up in the, um,
00:26:24
Speaker
the hallucination of the world and what what's happening in the world and and get all caught up in the things that seem so important until they don't. I don't know if think that made any sense or good this is the the incoherent kind of podcast you're hoping for. It totally is. And it did make sense. And the way that i I think of this is just like you were talking about in the beginning of the podcast is that if you don't like copywriting, if you're telling yourself, you don't anyway, reframe that, that experience. And it's like, just like every day, I have to reframe my experience every day and make the choice to
00:27:01
Speaker
to feed my soul as opposed to my ego. I need to make the choice to look at the half glass, I mean the glass half full as opposed to half empty because my natural choice is half empty and it really is.
00:27:15
Speaker
i Well, we're we're kindred spirits because mine is too. i am there's There's an argument, and not an argument, there's there's there's a thought, an idea that many people believe is true, which is that we are wired that way, all of us, because of the way we came to be on the planet.
00:27:33
Speaker
we Before we had all this technology and everything, we lived in the wild, things would eat us and kill us and like large things like bears and tigers and other tribes of other groups of people. And so we we we developed, the people who survived developed this uncanny skill to always be scanning the environment for threats. And we still have that within us today, however you believe we got here.
00:27:59
Speaker
We still have that inside of us today. The problem is, it's no longer really appropriate for the environments we live in because we're there's, it's very unlikely that I'm going to be attacked by a bear or a lion today. It is likely that something's going to happen. Somebody's going to leave me a message in my email or a direct message in one of the, in my Instagram account or something that I'm not going to like.
00:28:19
Speaker
Yeah, I get just as upset about that as I would have about the bear or the lion. I guess we get all out of whack or we're just, I say all that. I just say we're, I think, I think we're all wired to be negative thinkers. That's my current opinion on that. It could be wrong. I like that. It makes me feel more normal.
00:28:37
Speaker
Well, yeah. Cause I mean, look at, look at the people, you know, and just ask yourself, are they at all anxious or they ever have, are they moody, depressed? Are they a little paranoid? Yes. Welcome to America. Um, so I think we all, we're all on the same journey. There's a, there's a group, an improv group called the fire sign theater who had this album called we're all just bozos on the bus. Yes.
00:29:09
Speaker
This is a very, um, well-versed phrase in AA. Just another bozo on the bus, another drunk on the bus. I've been really surprised to learn how much of the lingo like the cool buzz phrases and sayings that are so much a part of the self-improvement movement actually originated in AA.
00:29:33
Speaker
It's insane. When I first got in there, first of all, my my very first day, I was like, how the hell did I get here? But then I started looking around and I was like, oh, I'm finding myself in a room, very successful human beings. How does this work? Like, I don't know what's going on. The perception of AA was astoundingly incorrect as compared to what I know it to be now. ie I had the same kind of experience.
00:30:02
Speaker
Really? Are you a member? Um, am I outing you? I can edit this out by the way. It's okay. ah Yeah. Is this, is this a common knowledge thing? No. Right. First time I've ever talked about this. I am so honored that you're telling like me this personally, I had, I mean, obviously had no idea.
00:30:33
Speaker
Are you sure you're okay with this being on the podcast or do you want me to edit it out? No, I'm fine. Okay. Wow. Thank you for sharing that. Please, please go further with that. Just a little bit. What has your experience been? How how long have you been in it? Well, um, this is, this is terrible because I don't, I don't really know. Um, it's, it's been, um, it's been a few years. Um, I, um,
00:31:03
Speaker
I just was, well, there's a saying. Half measures had availed me nothing. I couldn't, I had certain things I was, certain substances I was using. It was not just one thing. It was a number of things. I just couldn't stop. Couldn't stop eating. Couldn't stop smoking. Couldn't stop drinking. I moved from one thing to another. Um, and I needed some help.
00:31:32
Speaker
So I reluctantly went to this meeting and I had the same kind of experience that you described. I, I, I expected to be like, yeah I don't know what I expected. i I thought I guess I expected to be in ah an abandoned railroad car with a bunch of hobos. yes Um, and it was a room full of upper middle-class, upwardly mobile, uh, semi, at least well off people who had the same problems I had. And we were no different.
00:31:59
Speaker
Um, and I was, I, my feeling, I don't know. I don't know whether this is proper to say or not, but I just felt like, Oh, I'm really nothing special. This is, this is how we are. So, um, it was, um, it was a huge revelation to me to, to figure out that all this time I thought everybody else was the problem and turns out. Nope. Me. Me.
00:32:28
Speaker
Right. It's me. i I'm the problem. It's me.
00:32:33
Speaker
Wow. That is the best thing. I mean, it's, you know, it's not great. It's not ideal. It's not what we wanted, but this was, of course it was better than I could have hoped for. I knew it would be. I prayed before this and you know, I just asked it to be what it was going to be. Um, because that's and in my experience, that's what I do. And, um,
00:32:56
Speaker
I just I can't believe that you just divulge that information and how helpful it's going to be moving forward for so many other people who I know for a fact are struggling with addictions because at the end of the day, I really think that.
00:33:12
Speaker
we struggle with the addiction of perception first and foremost, which then gives birth to all of these other um more physical addictions. And it's it's like when you can face the reality of your humanness and the fact that you're not special and that you're a miracle, sure. But as a human being, we're all one, right? And it's when you can face the reality, the truth, not your truth,
00:33:40
Speaker
Not your personal truth, but like the universal truth of what is. You become, right, become this person that that then has the qualifications, just like the natural qualifications to lead and to, whether or not you divulge exactly what you've gone through, you know, with specifics. It doesn't matter because here you are sitting here telling me this,
00:34:06
Speaker
and uh you're saying you've never divulged it before yet I have seen you as a leader from day one and it's not just who you've worked with it's the way you speak it's it's what you do it's how you are it's who you are it's because you're being who you really are and I see it and it makes me want to be who I really am and I just have to say this when I first started as a marketing coach And I hadn't gotten sober yet. I'm watching people like you but specifically you, and I'm thinking to myself and I'm asking this higher power that I didn't even know was real, you know, back and in that time I was like coaching this thing I was like, Oh, you can give me this or that and i'll I'll choose.
00:34:46
Speaker
but What I was doing was asking over and over again, just give me something more. Give me something more. I want what he has. I didn't know what it was. And now it's come full circle because I do know what it is. It's God, it's universe, it's source, whatever you want to call it.
00:35:04
Speaker
That's what it is. And I wanted it. And I asked for it, not by name, because I didn't know what it was. and And then I get it, but I got it in the way of a choice. It was a choice. It was, I have a decision to make. I made the decision that I felt most aligned with what I really wanted, which is what I'm telling you I wanted, which was to be like you.
00:35:25
Speaker
Right. And here we are sitting today on podcasts talking about the fact that we're both sober, like go to AA. And it's a full circle moment for me. So this is very special. Thank you. It is for me too. I had, I had no idea it was going to go this way, but I'm glad it did. Yeah. And you know, it's,
00:35:47
Speaker
Um, it's interesting. I, I just wrote this book and it's a, it's kind of a, it's a weird book. Cause it's a combination of a memoir and also self-help. Um, cause I went through this, this whole long process. I'm still going through it. I don't want to paint it. One of the challenges with the book is the, the publishing industry wants you to write a book that says I had this huge problem. I overcame it. I developed a way to so overcome it. Now I've got it for you. Here's the answer.
00:36:17
Speaker
take the 10-step system and go knock yourself out. And my conclusion in the book is, well, I don't really know what I'm doing. I don't really know what I did. Worked out really good so far. It helped me. Hope this helps you too, and good luck on the journey. it's not That's not an easy book to pitch.
00:36:33
Speaker
um in In the book, I i decided Jeff Goins is a friend of mine. He taught me into writing this book, just through some conversations we had over time. I would go to Nashville. I live in the Northwest, but I traveled to Nashville quite a bit because it seems like all my friends live there, not all of them. So friends who live here in the Northwest, I love you too, but many of my friends live in Tennessee.
00:36:55
Speaker
right And I would go and visit with Jeff, and we'd sit in the coffee shop, and we'd talk about life and how we feel about it and philosophy and what I was going through with Parkinson's. And he said, you know, you should write a book. And so we worked on it together, he collaborated with me. And he got some of the best writing out of me I've ever done in my life. But I decided early on, I was going to be truthful. And he he said to me, you got to decide which book you want to write. Do you want to write a book?
00:37:21
Speaker
that is a good book that fits the standards of your industry that helps you sell more stuff or, or do you want to write a book for each other the truth? And you're brave. And you're like, you do it in service of the readers. Which one do you want to write? follow I want to write that one. He said, good, because that's the version of you I like the best.
00:37:47
Speaker
So that's that's the book I wrote. And i I didn't show it to anybody that I knew until it was done. We were ready to turn it in. I showed it to my wife and a few other people. in them And my wife read it, and she's like, wow, you told a lot of true things in there.
00:38:04
Speaker
you're very open and vulnerable. I'm kind of surprised how open and vulnerable you are. And we we had a lot of discussion around that. It was it was great. the the The reason I'm telling you this is because um I used to be such a very private, secretive person, I would tell nobody anything about anything that was happening that was real in my life. It was I was very, I was very public persona, who divulged almost no actual information about himself.
00:38:33
Speaker
um and And the more open I've become, not because I want to talk about myself all the time, although I do. um so It's not the reason I end up doing so much this in public. It's because I've seen how it can serve other people. Because du what what but opened my eyes was as I began to go down this this rabbit hole of realizing if I was going to figure out how to deal with all this stuff in my life.
00:39:04
Speaker
um I needed to find some people who had also done the same thing. I was looking for somebody, I'm like somebody tell me the truth about what you're going through. That's what I desperately wanted. I read every book Michael J. Fox wrote and many others, not just him. but that's, that's why and it's why I'm, I have these moments where I do things like what I did today here. And I just realized, well, this just feels like the right moment to say this. So bleh.
00:39:35
Speaker
and Well, I obviously, again, I thank you for that. And also that's what this podcast is all about. That's what I wanted for this was like, I need people who have made it in this industry to be honest about what, you know, what, what does that really look like? Is it really just,
00:39:58
Speaker
All of a sudden you have these incredible clients and you're making millions of dollars and you know what I mean? Is it really that easy or is there more to the story? Because I think there's more to the story. Yeah. Yeah. I think there, there always is.
00:40:16
Speaker
Certainly that's been true for me and for everybody I know, I won't speak for anybody, any name in particular, but I'll tell you, everybody I know who's really successful has their own wagon load of stuff they deal with and things they've been through and battles they fight that we know nothing about. And maybe we we never will for many of them, but it's just people choose differently how to process these things. Some people are very private about it. um I mean, I don't,
00:40:44
Speaker
I don't share everything in my life because it would not be appropriate to do that. um but i just
00:40:53
Speaker
As, as I've gone through the, the progression of Parkinson's has gotten worse over time and had to deal with the public implications. When you're a public person, your business is built on being a public person. You have to figure out, well, am I going to keep doing that? Or am I going to quit? Um, and I mean, Michael J. Fox again is, has been a model in this for me as I watch what he's doing. I realized, well, he found a way to just take what he, what he's been dealt and still do the thing he loves to do act.
00:41:20
Speaker
which is incredibly brave and courageous and and stupid and crazy, but he did it anyway. And it's it's it's helped so many people in so many ways, brought so much joy through his through his craft and also through but he's the work he's done raising money to find a cure for the disease. So, I mean, that and the fact also that I'm, I don't know if you've noticed this, I may have a few years on you.
00:41:48
Speaker
And it's it never bothered me until I got this disease and I began exhibiting some behaviors that one associates with people who are older. And then I realized I kind of look older now because of the way I move. and um the way I walk sometimes. And I began to to see, there's lots of people my age, in their 50s, 60s, who have so much to offer the world, 70s, 80s, 90s, I have a client who did his 90s. They have so much to offer the world, but they they tell themselves the story that I'm um too old to do that.
00:42:23
Speaker
And, you know, part of it is cultural programming, because we're so focused on the youth culture. It's like if you're if you just do whatever you can to stay in your 20s, apparently is the thing to do, which is so toxic and damaging and dangerous and stupid. I mean, in the world,
00:42:44
Speaker
We are the leading nation when it comes to finding a way to take our elderly, pair our aging parents and the older generation and shove them off somewhere in a corner and hide them and ignore them and put them out of sight out of mind. And in other cultures, they're honored and they're looked at as the fountains of wisdom and experience that they are. So that's a whole different soapbox. But just for me, it's like, ultimately,
00:43:08
Speaker
I realize as I look at my own career over time, um the thing that I've done that's consistent is I ah find something I love to do. I love teaching, so I teach other people how to do it. And I love sharing experiences and helping people along the way, so I end up doing that.
00:43:24
Speaker
I have lots of copywriters and marketers that I've mentored and both paid and then also just people I took under my wing. um And so part of that now for me has become speaking to people who are 40, 50, 60, 70 and saying to them, you're not too old. You can step up and you've got something to bring to the world that's important and valuable. And and whether your goal is to make $10,000 a month or $100,000 a week or whatever the goal is,
00:43:55
Speaker
um I think you can do it. I mean, there's too much. All it takes for me to believe something's possible for a human being is as any other human being ever done it. If another human being has done it, it's possible. And then I reached a new level of possibility when I realized, well,
00:44:15
Speaker
somebody had to be the first human to do it. So even if somebody hasn't done it, it doesn't mean you can't. So there's a there's a phrase, whatever the mind of man can conceive and believe it can achieve. And I believe that's true. um I'm just gonna not qualify the statement. I was gonna leave it at that. Thank you.
00:44:38
Speaker
Um, so I don't know how I got on that very long river of words. I just spewed out, but there's something valuable. Well, we're sitting here talking about the fact that Listen, if you are following the path of least resistance as opposed to resistance, right? Like don't resist your age. First of all, if you're 20 or 30 and you're trying to be 20 again, it's like these things are what are keeping us from being who we really are and having something to offer the world. And then when you reach a certain age, you still have something to offer. And I will then hand that back to you because you were talking about how now you feel like you've hit this new journey of like, uh,
00:45:21
Speaker
feeling like I look older or something and realize. Yeah. Yeah. So, so for me, I guess is my long winded way of getting around to saying this. um
00:45:33
Speaker
what What I've done over time has just been, I've done something that a lot of people thought was either difficult to do or impossible to do. And then I'm happy to show people what's possible. So there's a there's lady named Brooke Castillo, who I love dearly. We're really good friends. She doesn't know that we haven't met yet, but we're great friends. yes And when we meet, it's going to be such a great reunion. Yeah.
00:46:00
Speaker
so But she says she wants to be an example of what's possible. And that's what I feel like it's the best description of my job I can give you right now. I just want to be an example of what's possible for a 57 year old man who has Parkinson's disease, who has dealt with the things that I've dealt with, who has this addictive behavior, he's, he's learned how to wrestle with and get under control. And, and these are the things that it's been possible for me to do.
00:46:32
Speaker
So I want to be an example of what's possible. And I also want to be a beacon of hope for people who will encourage them and tell them, yes, you can do this and actually have some some knowledge that makes them able to say that in a way that's credible for the for whoever, whoever it's designed for me to to influence, to teach to mentor. I don't know how many people that is. I don't know. You know, some people are i'm I'm always jealous of the folks who will say, well, my mission is to influence 10 million entrepreneurs. I'm like, how how did you get that very specific information? I don't really understand.
00:47:09
Speaker
But I like it. I admire it. I just want wish I had a number like that I could be just as certain about. I'm just here doing the best job I can, doing work I love, trying to be an example of to people of what is possible and to say to people who are telling themselves a story about what they can or cannot do because of their age or because of their condition that they have or whatever it is, is because of their addiction, to say to them, it's still possible.
00:47:34
Speaker
There's still, there's work. Not only there's still work for you to do, there's work you're, you're designed to do. And all these things that have quote happened to you actually happened for you so that you could do what you're here to do. Yes. Now start paying attention to those things and move in that direction and stop trying to get around it and go through it. Yes. Yes. You know, Byron Katie says, I love how she says, when I fight with reality, reality only wins 100% of the time.
00:48:04
Speaker
So true. So true. Okay. This was amazing. I, um, the way I'm going to wrap this up is just by saying everything you just said was perfect. And I agree with all of it. And just like you just said, Brooke is like your friend, but she doesn't really know it. That's, I almost went on my Facebook and was like me and my friend Ray Edwards. He doesn't know he's my friend yet, but we are friends are doing this podcast today. So.
00:48:35
Speaker
Again, I appreciate you being here more than you even realize, I think. Well, I appreciate you inviting me to be here. And we are friends. I felt that way before we spoke in real life. It's so it's so funny because I feel like I knew you already because we've communicated. I've read and watched you on social. And we just had these communications back and forth from time to time. I just felt like I i knew you already. In fact, I told my wife, I'm doing a podcast with somebody I know.
00:49:04
Speaker
And I was on my way into the office and realized, well, okay, it depends on how you define no, I guess. yeah
00:49:13
Speaker
It's true. Thank you. So, um, yeah, I just so appreciate it. And, uh, by the way, if I, if I could mention the book. Please do. I was about to ask you to tell the people about your new book and where they can find you, how they can work with you and anything else you want to tell them as far as your concern personally with your business.
00:49:34
Speaker
Yeah, just the the book is the thing, primary thing right now. It's called read this or die, persuading yourself to a better life. And it's, it's really the story of how, I mean, one of the other titles we considered was how copywriting saved my life.
00:49:51
Speaker
Oh, and that's really the story of the book. I, I was diagnosed with Parkinson's in 2011. And I kept the secret well as long as I could. And then I couldn't keep a secret anymore. And because ah it was obvious something was going haywire with me. A lot of people thought I was drinking, which I was but that wasn't the cause the I was
00:50:19
Speaker
i've always been good at drinking and not getting obviously drunk me too but Parkinson's made it so it seemed like I was obviously drunk all the time. So I went through that and then I began to find that the disease made it difficult for me to do my day-to-day job, do my work. And there's ah there's a whole long story in the book I tell about things I went through as that got worse. Then there was the pandemic, then I had shoulder surgery. It took me out of the driver's seat in my business and I had built a business that was
00:50:52
Speaker
dependent on me showing up every day. I had to I had to go in there and pedal the bicycle or there would be no money coming in. And that was difficult. So I had all this financial and then the the whole cultural thing was happening during the pandemic is as people under pressure got weird or
00:51:10
Speaker
And i I reached a point where I just wanted to die. I wanted to kill myself. I knew how to do it. I thought about how to do it. I had the tools available at any moment. I had a bottle of oxy and a bottle of Xanax fully stocked and a bottle of Jim Bean. So that That was my escape plan for a while. And I finally dealt with the fact that it was not acceptable to me as an option. And I wrote myself a letter, wrote myself a sales letter. And the headline in the letter was read this or die a total failure, leaving behind a string of broken promises.
00:51:53
Speaker
And I use the pastor framework that I teach in copywriting. I realized I had tried all these different things. I tried to self help. I tried miracle preachers. I went to healing services. and I love all that stuff. It it all works sometimes.
00:52:13
Speaker
But none of it works for me. And I was frustrated and depressed and desperate. And the only thing left that I had not tried yet was I decided I'm going to I'm going to try to I've been selling other people and buying things all my life. Now I got to sell me on living and on how I'm going to live.
00:52:30
Speaker
So I wrote myself a sales letter and that whole letter is in the book. I tell a story of how I wrote it. And then as I walk you through the story of how it happened for me, I also tell the readers, here's how to write your own letter to yourself. And so that's what the book is about.
00:52:46
Speaker
and it's uh it publishes on may 23rd so you may be hearing this before or watching this before or after but it'll be available for a long time i'm sure because this i wrote this book to last and it's not just to promote a program or position or it's it's to help people understand what's possible in their life and how they can find a different way of talking to themselves, tell themselves a different story about their life and what it means, what's the difficulty, what's the difficulty you're facing means. It's a way to to process your life story in a way that helps you. Because we all get caught up in telling the story of our life. And we often forget the fact that the story of your life is not your life. It's just a story.
00:53:32
Speaker
And don't you feel like that book itself, by the way, I, obviously I preordered that a while ago, but, um, I say obviously, but it's obvious to me. Um, don't you feel like also that book could possibly be like, if, if there's a new coach out there listening to this going, you know, I'm feeling that lack of confidence that I'm not embodying exact, because I hear this all the time. I hear this all the time with brand new coaches, the biggest.
00:54:01
Speaker
gu for them with putting themselves out there is I don't have the confidence yet because I'm not embodying. I'm not fully embodying that version of myself that I'm telling people that I can help them become, you know? And so I'm hearing you and I'm feeling like, wow,
00:54:20
Speaker
What if these new coaches read that book, wrote this new story, you know, wrote this letter to themselves and had that shift in perspective, right? That we were talking about. And just like for you, for me, there's all different paths to that, that truth to that embodiment, but that could 100%, if it was true for you, it could be true for somebody else. It could really help somebody that's in that position to fully encapsulate who they really are and become it.
00:54:52
Speaker
Absolutely. Yes. And I mean, by all means get the book, read the book and follow the directions. However, while you're waiting for the book to show up, you can also do this little exercise. I'll give you a quick little exercise you can do right now that'll help you. And that is two parts. Part one, write the story of your life so far.
00:55:15
Speaker
And the only rules about it are we want to make it in a page or so. There's one or two pages and it all has to be true. So everything you say in the story has to be true. And it has to be told as if it were a tragedy. So it's got to be true. All the events has to be true. It has to be tragic story of your life. One or two pages. I go right there. And then when you get done with that,
00:55:41
Speaker
Then write the story of your life again. And the only rules for this version are every event has to be true. You have to write it as a story of victory and trust. And when you finish, ask yourself, which of these stories is true? And you're going to, I'll tell you what your answer is going to be. Well, they're both true because you told me they had to be true. I just chose different different things to focus on. Hello. Wow. You get to decide.
00:56:12
Speaker
Okay. That's amazing. And that sounds a lot like a little something called the law of attraction and using it to the like nth degree. Yeah. Oh, that's, that's a whole other podcast. No, no kidding. I'm not going there, but that's amazing. Thank you for that. And if you're listening to this, you better go buy that book. Otherwise, you know, you know what can happen.
00:56:38
Speaker
All right. Right. Is there anywhere else that, um, the people can find you, um, sure. You can find the book you go to. Um, we have a, have a video course that goes along with the book. It's free and it walks you through the process as well. So that's it. You can find that at read this or die book dot.com. And then my main website is just ray Edwards.com.
00:57:02
Speaker
Awesome. All right. Thank you so much, Ray. I appreciate you so much. You're the best and yay. Thanks for doing this with me. You're the best and thank you for inviting me, my friend.
00:57:14
Speaker
i appreciate for