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Sinister
18 Plays12 days ago
Join Nicholas and Mercedes as they discuss 2012's Sinister! Directed by Scott Derrickson, written by C. Robert Cargill. And in this one, they're joined by special guest, Evie Martinez!
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Transcript
Introductions and Special Guest: Evie the Dog
00:01:12
Speaker
Hello, hello, guys. Thank you for joining us. We are Morbid Curiosities, bringing you another episode. I'm your host, Nicholas Ewers, and with me is the lightweight champion of the world, the Morbid Mistress of Mayhem herself,
00:01:25
Speaker
Mercedes Martinez. And if you hear any wagging or pitter patter, that is my dog who is joining us today, evie who is being a little thorn in my side. So thank you everyone for joining us tonight.
00:01:42
Speaker
Special guest appearance by Evie. If she um starts barking on the podcast, then I'll give her a guest credit in the episode. Okay, sounds good. put it in little brackets with Evie.
00:01:56
Speaker
With the Evie. Maybe I'll post a picture of Evie and see if she becomes a crowd favorite. She could be like our show's mascot. Oh my God, we would probably get so many more followers just because of her alone.
Introduction to 'Sinister' and Initial Impressions
00:02:13
Speaker
Now, not to jump into the movie we're talking about too quick, but I do have kind of a question for you that may be a little bit of a spoiler. So ah just to get into it, guys, start of a new season today. If you're new to the podcast, thank you for joining us. We're Morbid Curiosities and we're covering Sinister today. And next week we'll be doing Sinister part two.
00:02:38
Speaker
But so spoilers ahead for this movie. Mercedes, there's a dog in this movie. Now, did she remind you of your dog in any kind of way? I referred to the dog in the movie as a she. i don't know its gender, but sorry to assume but...
00:02:55
Speaker
but No, because the dog in that movie, it looked pretty threatening. You know, ah you have ah Ethan Hawke's character. He's staring at the dog just kind of like, oh, shit, let me um me grab my weapon, my bat here so I can bash your skull in or whatever he said.
00:03:15
Speaker
um He doesn't do it, but he wanted to And then the dog just looked menacing. If my dog stares at you, she's just going to smile, wag her tail, act like she's a little angel in front of... There she goes.
00:03:31
Speaker
See, Evie. Does that earn her credit? Her little shaking? Okay, what about that? She just yawned. I think that will.
00:03:42
Speaker
That's good enough. Okay. It might get us some extra listens. Our first guest. Our first guest appearance on the podcast. Little Evie Martinez. she She won't leave me alone right now, so apologies on that. No, it's cool.
00:03:58
Speaker
I mean, you've met my dog. she She was pretty cordial with you. She seems to be yeah chill with most people. um Yeah, Evie, she just prances around and wants to be petted, so um I don't have a good guard dog.
00:04:15
Speaker
But you know who is a good guard dog? That one dog in here was guarding Bagul, or a symbol of Bagul, actually. No, I think the dog wasn't guarding.
00:04:27
Speaker
but The dog was, like, on Ethan Hawke's side That's what I kind of took it, right? The dog was, like, growling at the kids behind him, almost in fear, like, what the fuck?
00:04:39
Speaker
You know what I mean? I kind of took that as so Ethan Hawke thinks the dog is growling at him and he is just so oblivious to what is actually the dog is actually growling at behind him, which is much more scary than the dog itself.
00:04:55
Speaker
you know I like that interpretation because I didn't think about that. um I actually had no idea why this random dog was there. and Then towards the end when they go into more details about Bagul, they do mention a dog being in one of the inscriptions, I think.
00:05:12
Speaker
but Wow, we really jumped the gun on this. Yes, a lot of dog talk. we We might lose some of it. Who knows? but We'll see when we get there.
Key Scenes and Emotional Reactions
00:05:22
Speaker
Have you, so I can't remember off the top of my head right now. Have you seen Sinister before or did you see part two before?
00:05:28
Speaker
I've never seen part two. I had seen this one though. I had only seen it one time and I saw it in theaters. And I gotta say, i was pretty disappointed when I first saw this movie Really?
00:05:45
Speaker
Not because of the movie itself. So this is the movie that has almost made me completely stop watching movie trailers, more so horror movie trailers, because I remember I was so stoked for this movie, ready for it to come out.
00:06:00
Speaker
I had seen the trailer a bunch of times. It was just I remember it playing on TV a lot. They marketed the shit out of this movie. And I went in to see it. And every kill that is in like the home footage camcorder sections of these movie of this movie, every kill except for the lawnmower one was in the trailer. And I find the lawnmower one the scariest moment in the whole movie. It gets me every time I always jump.
00:06:29
Speaker
But aside from that, the scares didn't really work for me because I felt like I had seen them all a bunch of times at home. But with Distance, I'm kind of excited to talk about this movie more. But yeah, to answer your question, yeah, I had seen this before.
00:06:47
Speaker
And i assume you did too. Yeah, I saw this before. I did like it at first. I remember seeing the trailer maybe once or so, so it wasn't too much of a spoiler for me when I did go see it.
00:07:05
Speaker
Yeah. that lawnmower scene is intense. um Yeah, because I saw it with one of my buddies from high school, and i was trying to look at a look away from one of the ah beginning kill scenes, and he saw me do that, and he's he's like, no, you got to watch it. you got to You got to open your eyes. So I'm just thinking, damn, okay, I can't be a bitch right now.
00:07:29
Speaker
And um I really wanted to turn away once that lawnmower scene starts. So Guys, for context, one of the found footage ah clips is um this family. they I forgot what the the whole setting was prior to them being on the lawn. but it's just It's almost like someone is watching the family from outside the house while they're watching TV.
00:07:54
Speaker
Because then it cuts to someone from the inside walking out. And there yeah it's all fucked up from there. Ethan Hawke finds um like a a box of snuff films in the new house that him and his family move in ah just to be a little more clear on it.
00:08:12
Speaker
um So he starts watching them and he sees each one has a different ah title on it. One of them is like, I don't know, family time or picnic or something. Yeah, it's like pool party.
00:08:27
Speaker
cool party, yeah. Like hanging in the backyard or something like that. They all are very misleading titles. Yeah, you think they're going to be just like, you know, cute little home videos. um And they do show off different families, you know, they're they're barbecuing, they're playing together.
00:08:48
Speaker
You always see a kid, one of the kids, they join the family at the last minute. So with this one, as Nick said, um someone is recording this family from outside the house looking inward, which really unsettled me every time i ah or the first time I watched it and even now because, you know,
00:09:12
Speaker
realistically that can happen but then it just cuts to a lawnmower getting started at night and it's going on the grass for a good 10-15 seconds and you know something's gonna happen and then at the last second you hear a loud scream or just a loud noise and the lawnmower just runs over someone so fucking effective and i was even going to ask you what's your favorite kill scene in here but you know you kind of answered that already
00:09:43
Speaker
Yeah, man, that I've seen this movie now three times, even though initially in theaters, that was the only time I had seen it. And every time that lawnmower scene gets me because they you linger on just a shot of the flashlight from the camera on this like POV of the lawn, starting off not on the grass, eventually making its way on the grass, going and
Character Analysis: Ethan Hawke and Family Dynamics
00:10:07
Speaker
going. The light from the camera veers off. from the lawnmower once and then back on.
00:10:13
Speaker
And it just adds to this tension, the sloppiness of the camera work. I will say to an extent, I found the camera work in those found footage moments kind of frustrating. They were very, very dark.
00:10:30
Speaker
And it felt like it was that way because of budgetary constraints. So there was just some times where I really had a hard time telling what was going on. But it it's a very effective method of storytelling that I haven't really seen that much in horror before or even at all.
00:10:50
Speaker
The funny thing too with that is because it made me laugh, that whole scene when I watched it in theaters, it freaked me out so much.
00:11:00
Speaker
and Just seeing the the shaky camera and just the quality of it, it just added more intensity to the scene for me. but Even after, i had asked my buddy, like man, did you see that one part with the lawnmower?
00:11:15
Speaker
that that That shit was fucked up, right? And he was like, oh, I didn't look. I turned away. So I was really mad about that because I had to deal with all the little ah horror parts by myself, apparently.
00:11:26
Speaker
and you couldn't even talk about it after? Yeah, I couldn't. I'm like, okay, well, did I just watch the movie by myself? But I mean, I do look away from certain scenes ah from time to time, but I was kind of mad about that. You can't bitch at me for not looking at all the scenes and then you not even look at them yourself.
00:11:45
Speaker
But anyway, um i really love the found footage feel in here because the entire movie itself is not a found footage ah documentary or anything like that. It it has a storyline. Ethan Hawke, his name is Ellison in here. He moves his family to a more affordable house so he can write another true crime book.
00:12:09
Speaker
It seems that, you know, him and his wife are not necessarily struggling with their relationship, but you see that there is... um They're struggling financially,
00:12:23
Speaker
Yeah, financially, but like romantically, they're not struggling. You just see that there is um ah bit of a like a distance between them because, you know, everyone all unpacked.
00:12:38
Speaker
They're getting ready. Well, she's getting ready to go to sleep and he is still just getting ready to go to a study to, you know, do some work. And just with that alone, you can hear how she's just a little frustrated with how their relationship has become because she was saying, you know, what if your book from before was your 15 minutes of fame?
00:13:03
Speaker
So it seems that they've been struggling for a while, but she's still trying to be a supportive wife. and even when they kind of make up, he kisses her goodnight, and then he leaves. You see her smile. It fades pretty instantly.
00:13:18
Speaker
So you see she's trying to hold it together, but that whole scene is just going to boil up in the end. They don't feel much like a unified front.
00:13:29
Speaker
It seems like Ethan Hawke is kind of leading the ship and she doesn't necessarily have a whole lot of confidence in him as a captain.
00:13:40
Speaker
Oh, captain, my captain is not what she's saying. but had to throw it in there. I love it. It kind of just worked out that way. Very smooth. he ah Yeah, but he's really, i don't know if he was able to instill confidence in her to make this move, but it it feels like that confidence is shaky at best right now. And, you know, the cracks are starting to show, maybe maybe not right away, but she's starting to feel like, hey, this guy's kind of coming apart professionally.
00:14:18
Speaker
Once that scene is over, you're just trying, you're you're wondering, okay, what's going to happen next with them? Because you see, again, she's trying to be the supportive wife and the strong mother for her kids, especially because they just moved into a new house. And No kid wants to move outside of their home. So it just it kept me on the edge of my seat, just wondering what's going to happen with them, what's going to make them blow up. Because right when they actually were ah showing them unloading ah the moving truck, a sheriff comes ah to their house.
00:14:53
Speaker
He's kind of annoyed with his deputy there because he was trying to get an autograph of Ellison's previous book, Kentucky Blood.
00:15:04
Speaker
and the sheriff is just trying to get Ellison to leave. um He was just saying, you know, you you ruin people's lives. This town needs to heal. So you know something happened there previously, and then something happened with the house.
00:15:20
Speaker
And they know he's kind of been known to cause trouble because they say one of his books they let one of his books caused a killer to go free.
00:15:31
Speaker
Yeah, I think um he was able to find some information that the cops overlooked, but they do mention that as well. So no one, and well, not a lot of people are a big fan of him and turn his family either.
00:15:49
Speaker
So he is aware of where he moved his family to and full He lies to his wife pretty much because she does ask him, we didn't move a few houses down from a crime scene again, did we?
00:16:04
Speaker
And he says, no. But then she says, you know what? I don't even want to know. The thing that he relies on with that little lie is you asked if we moved a few houses down. but we didn't. We moved into this house. And then even with that, he uses that as a crutch too, because he is saying, oh, it didn't happen in the house. It happened in the backyard.
00:16:28
Speaker
So many fucking web of lies, that is such a big web of lies right there. i I really enjoy it. I feel like that's just such good writing. So this movie was written by C. Robert Cargill. Him and Scott Derrickson have been known to collaborate. They did this movie together. They did Doctor Strange and they did Black Phone. And I think they both have Black Phone 2.
00:16:52
Speaker
coming up i just loved that writing because ethan hawk feels like such a real person that's such a real lie that somebody would tell or ah it's not even like a lie he's relying on technicalities and taking questions literal and answering them with literal answers. He's taking things at face value and it's manipulative in a way, but not in a very like nasty and mean way.
00:17:28
Speaker
It's, it's very well done. i really liked the way that Ethan Hawke's characters written and how his characters acted. And on top of that too, you had mentioned the law enforcement in this movie.
00:17:40
Speaker
I really, really like both ah police officers, too. I think they both have really good dynamics. They both have different relationships with Ethan Hawke. I think the one who doesn't like him is completely valid in not liking him.
00:17:57
Speaker
And the one who helps him out is believable, not annoying. He, like... is funny and adds this levity to the movie and i I mean a lot of that's the casting but I think a lot of that is in see Robert Cargill's writing I used to listen to his podcast the write-along that he had I'm just a I'm a really big fan of this guy as a writer and watching it this time around it really stood out to me just how human this movie feels Yeah, even with all of the characters, you like them. Even with the sheriff who seems, he's just not on Ellison's side at all with this.
00:18:38
Speaker
But you still like him because he's not being a dick for no reason. He is just trying to get him out of there so you know he can essentially protect his town from enduring any more pain or chaos that doesn't it doesn't need.
00:18:56
Speaker
And even the chemistry between them two with the few scenes that they have, it it's believable. Yeah, they don't give them names, it's just deputy and sheriff. It gets kind of hard to, when he calls him deputy so-and-so, was like, what is his actual name? And it's just deputy in the credits.
00:19:13
Speaker
Yeah, I actually thought he was being you know bogus about that because when I saw his name pop up on his phone, i was thinking, why would you name him like that as a contact? Give him his actual name, but then rewatching it, you hear him. ah his um This character is James Ransone.
00:19:36
Speaker
he introduces himself in a way by saying, oh, you know, when you write um the acknowledgments at the beginning of your book, you can say with all the help from deputy so-and-so, can be that deputy so-and-so.
00:19:53
Speaker
That was what gave him that name. But I thought that was very humorous. It's such good writing, man. This movie, low-key, is like one of the best written like horror scripts like I can recall, like modern horror scripts.
00:20:10
Speaker
but This, Doctor Sleep, maybe like Hereditary, you know it's it's this is up there, though. It feels so real. Is there anything in particular you wanted to talk about?
00:20:23
Speaker
Yeah, so going back to all the characters in here, even with Ellison himself, you can buy that. you know he He is a loving husband. He is a loving father as well.
00:20:38
Speaker
He is trying to do his best to provide for his family. But you do see he's doing a lot of this for himself. He is watching previous reviews of himself or interviews of himself where he's talking about his books, but then also saying, you know, don't.
00:20:58
Speaker
Essentially, I'd rather die than, you know, do a a book for blood money, essentially. But once he finds all these snuff films and watches them and doesn't do anything about it, but just keeps them to himself, you see right then and there, okay, he's only thinking about himself. He even tries to call the um sheriff. That way he can you know file a report on this.
00:21:30
Speaker
But he sees his old book, just a stack of them in his study. And he's thinking, no, I need to write another another ah winner here. like,
00:21:42
Speaker
he hangs up on them and just continues to isolate himself ah with these films and just starts digging himself into a rabbit hole. So even though his choices in here aren't the best ones, you're just, you're kind of rooting for him to watch the next snuff film just to see what happens next.
Ellison's Motivations and Consequences
00:22:07
Speaker
So yeah,
00:22:07
Speaker
I don't know about you, but for me too, I kind of want him to piece it all together successfully and to bridge this gap between our reality and this demon reality. He has evidence, and when he's talking about this could be the biggest breakthrough of my life, I'm talking movie deals, and I'm thinking, dude, why are you thinking movie deals, man? You're about to break the barriers of reality right now if you can prove this.
00:22:37
Speaker
You should be contacting scientists and different religious experts and oh like newspapers and stuff like this. You shouldn't fuck your book.
00:22:50
Speaker
yeah ah Get attention like in other ways or I don't know, man. You've got something big on your hands that you kind of squandered a little bit. Right. Think of the bigger picture in other aspects, not just about movies.
00:23:06
Speaker
Life isn't just about movies, people, as i am doing a podcast with you about horror movies. Let's talk about these kids. What did you think first of the living children, ah Ellison's two kids in here, the daughter who paints all this shit on ah the walls in her room and then the son Trevor who has these random night terrors and just is popping out of boxes and dryers and what did you think of them did you like them
00:23:44
Speaker
i I got to admit, I completely forgot that the kid coming out of the box was in this movie. I thought that was in like five other horror movies. I was thinking, and didn't I see this in The Conjuring or something? i just kept recalling other movies where I thought I might have seen this scene in.
00:24:04
Speaker
But the boy kind of annoyed me a little bit. The girl, she, she really worked for me, especially in that scene where she painted on the wall and it, she kind of sells the dad out and is like, Oh, I,
00:24:21
Speaker
I painted the little girl. She didn't want me to paint in my room because that's where her brother lived. And then she outs him like the little girl. It's the little girl from the family that dad's writing about that all got hung to death in the backyard.
00:24:38
Speaker
And it's about one of one of my favorite moments in the movie. ah Pretty that like big bedroom argument But i I was pretty into her performance, and I liked her dynamic with her brother. There's a breakfast scene where they're throwing food back and forth at each other, and I think it's, again, very well written, very well acted.
00:24:59
Speaker
ah they throw One kid throws something, Ethan Hawke says, hey, don't do that, you know be the bigger person, and kind of diffuses the situation, all while a bigger, more important conversation is happening in the room. It's very...
00:25:14
Speaker
well done and well executed yeah the kids even though they didn't have a lot of screen time especially trevor um i like them and you can actually feel their sibling rivalry there um just that playful throwing of food that was cute i actually did like it um did you like the night terror thing Eh, not really. i thought that was just a way to add more jump scares to it and just give Trevor more of a ah presence in the film.
00:25:50
Speaker
i like that they were letting the daughter paint in her room. So you're saying, okay, she has a little creativity. She's going to end up painting something fucked up that's going to add more tension to this film.
00:26:04
Speaker
Just, yeah, her just kind of selling out the dad. She did it. And when she when she says that, you could still see her innocence um thinking like, damn, I think I fucked up unless she was faking it. Because then after the whole argument with the parents, when the mom is tucking her in, she asked her mom, did I get daddy in trouble? And the mom's like, no, daddy got daddy in trouble.
00:26:29
Speaker
So yeah she yeah she's so worried about her dad. It was. Yeah, shout out to Julia Rylance. I love that she's just British and no one's mentioning it.
00:26:41
Speaker
It's just, yeah, why would anyone mention it? There's no need to, but movies feel the need to call it. I mean, they've all been living with this woman for years. No need to explain. Right.
00:26:53
Speaker
I thought that was a ah nice little touch there. And I think too, um she was in some type of play and Ethan Hawke saw her performance and advocated for her to be the wife in this movie.
00:27:13
Speaker
I mean, good deal too, because they they make a good couple in here. Good for Ethan Hawke. Getting women jobs. Gotta love it. In the sick, sick industry, he's getting women jobs.
00:27:27
Speaker
Yeah, in reality, he's a sweetheart. In this film, such an asshole. Because, again, everything is just all for him. I really dig what he's doing in this movie.
00:27:39
Speaker
There's something i really appreciate and love about Ethan Hawke as an actor and what he brings to the table that I've always kind of known, but re-watching this, really put into perspective, re-watching this, thinking about the fact that he's in The Purge, this will do indie projects of all genres. He's ah great just indie actor you know i i really enjoy seeing him pop up what he brings to the table is so authentic he feels like a real guy that you would know he pours insecurity almost into his characters and on screen i'm thinking the before trilogy if you guys haven't watched that that's beautiful before sunrise is one of my favorite movies of all time
00:28:34
Speaker
It's great. But this movie, he feels, even though he was on top of the world at one point, even though he says he was doing it for other people, he's very selfish. He's very insecure.
00:28:46
Speaker
The moments where he's begging to his wife, like, please, I get it. This will be the last one. I just need a hit to the argument where she's like, you're going to lose me and the kids. And he yells, I know, and loses it for that quick second.
00:28:59
Speaker
And the moments where he's like laying on, not in bed with his wife, but kind of laying on her when she's in bed and talking to her lovingly. He feels so authentic on screen. And I i love, I really love what he brings to this movie and but almost everything I've seen him in.
00:29:22
Speaker
Yeah, and having his ah wife, what's her full name? Juliet Rylance? Yeah. um But her name in here is Tracy.
00:29:33
Speaker
Having her be his other half, she really is his voice of reason in here because, yes, while they were having that argument, he was basically saying, you know, writing is all I have. You know, these books are my legacy.
00:29:49
Speaker
And she doesn't say this while raising her voice at him, but she just says, you know, you know like your meaning of life is our marriage and your legacy, that's our children.
00:30:06
Speaker
And that was just kind of like her mic drop there and she leaves. That was so powerful. She's really trying to maintain ah the glue of the family together while he is doing everything to just fuck it all up.
00:30:22
Speaker
um Unintentionally, but realistically, intentionally, because he knows everything that he's doing is obviously for him but in his mind he thinks it's for everyone else it's just painful to watch because they she's trying to keep it together even though she it seems as if she's given him chances before and um you know he wasn't successful with his last book um as much as he wanted to be you do see a glimpse of the house that they used to live in before when they do ultimately decide to move back there it's a fucking massive house it is i was like why would you got i know you couldn't afford it but why would you leave
00:31:08
Speaker
Right. so it's just, it's a little heartbreaking to see that too, because he thought he was going to maintain an income that he can use to provide for that type of lifestyle.
00:31:24
Speaker
But then he wasn't, and then they had to move to a smaller residence. But You know, he he he's just making all these changes, not for the better or the good of the family, just for himself. and Yeah, because they moved to the murder house.
00:31:42
Speaker
He brings him to the murder house all for the book, and he tells her it was a steal. It's like, well, yeah, of course. But I do really agree with you on her just final lines in that argument.
00:31:58
Speaker
Her delivery is great. I rewound it when I was watching it ah for the second time. I just had to really just take it in. i don't know. It was very well done on both of their parts. Great art ah great argument.
00:32:15
Speaker
i The cast all around, especially the adults, the cast all around, I think, is pretty great. Ethan Hawke, Juliet Rylance, James Ransone as the deputy, Fred Thompson as the sheriff.
00:32:27
Speaker
But then one actor who I found myself just staring at the whole time he was on screen, I was like... I know that face. I know that voice.
00:32:41
Speaker
I've seen him in a bunch of things. And then I just had to look it up because I knew all along, but I had to confirm it that it was Vincent D'Onofrio.
The Antagonist: Bagul and Symbolism
00:32:51
Speaker
Fucking... I know most people probably know him from Kingpin, but he's in fucking...
00:32:57
Speaker
he's in a bunch of shit full metal metal jacket that's you know another notable one that he was in he was in uh the jurassic world movies for people men in black i forgot about that men in black ed wood fantastic movie this guy he like almost never misses and i loved seeing him in this i love seeing him on the other side of that computer screen i'm like Yeah, he's a guy that will show up and give you fucking 10 minutes total on a computer screen and knock it out of the park.
00:33:29
Speaker
Fuck yeah, Vincent D'Onofrio. He has a little friend there, Juliet, who gives him T. Sorry. Right. No, I thought that was like his assistant or something um or a TA since he's a professor.
00:33:44
Speaker
um The little screen time he had on here, I enjoyed it. He even mentioned how um this is where we get to talk about the the main the real main character in here. Yeah, I don't know how we've gone this long.
00:34:01
Speaker
We're 45 minutes deep and we haven't even mentioned, we've mentioned Ooga Booga Guy in other episodes. 45 minutes into Sinister.
00:34:14
Speaker
ah We're the best podcasts out there, guys. don't We won't change if you won't change. Yeah. Rate us five stars. Follow our Instagram. But yeah, so in all of these films, once um Ellison is really trying to analyze them and get all the, you know, little key points in there, he's noticing ah symbol in there.
00:34:41
Speaker
So he, you know, screenshots that, but then he starts to see an image of a figure in there. I believe the first one he noticed was in the pool party clip.
00:34:54
Speaker
So you have this family. They're all tied to these um like ah long chairs outside, and they are all pulled into the pool to drown.
00:35:06
Speaker
And then you see this creepy ass motherfucker in the pool just standing at the bottom and then he just looks at the screen and we are introduced to none other than bagul or as the children in here call him mr boogie which i think is so fucking adorable i'm sorry but it is or as most people may know him as ah the singer of the band Behemoth.
00:35:34
Speaker
That symbol too looked like the fucking Mudvayne logo. i was like, what's what's going on here? got How many bands we ripping off here? So I was um watching, ah what was it?
00:35:50
Speaker
CZ's World Horror History on YouTube. And he was talking about the history of, um you know, Bughul. And he had mentioned that... um They were getting ah the people on this film, they were looking for symbols ah that they can use. And they did find black metal band, I think, from like a norri Norwegian band.
00:36:17
Speaker
ah metal band that had the symbol. They bought the rights to the symbol and they were able to use it, which is why it was cool when ah Vincent D'Onofrio is talking about the symbol to Ellison. He does mention, you know, it's not like a satanic thing. um It's not, you know, a black metal band that you would typically see the symbol with.
00:36:40
Speaker
So he does give a nod to where it actually came from. Man, I got to say, not very black metal of them to fucking sell their symbol to a Hollywood production. Wow.
00:36:54
Speaker
What sellouts? Yeah, exactly. Way to give in to fucking capitalism. and Plus, Bagul's face, it's fucking creepy, but you know he was giving me some Mick thmpson ah Thompson ah vibes from Slipknot, honestly.
00:37:11
Speaker
That's all I think about. I'm like Mick Thompson, some type of dude with corpse paint, something like that. But yeah, his mouth, quote unquote mouth, it's not really a mouth. It's just kind of like a black shadowy smile almost that's on his face.
00:37:26
Speaker
But it looks like the vents that Mick Thompson has on the front of his mask. It does. That's all I kept thinking of when I watched it. But yeah, he he's just a fucking haunting-ass presence. And, you know, he's trying Ellison is trying to figure out, okay, who is this person? And then he even finds this... um like a shoebox cover in his attic and he sees little doodles of each ah film that he watched and all of the pictures you see the the family that's dead and they're labeled you know mom dad whoever whoever
00:38:08
Speaker
And then always somewhere nearby, it says Mr. Boogie. So then when he rewatches the films, he does start to see this guy or this figure in the distance.
00:38:21
Speaker
So, um you know, when Vincent D'Onofrio is trying to help him figure out who it is he tells him the history of Bogool and Ooga Booga, as you like to call him.
00:38:33
Speaker
And Booga Booga.
00:38:37
Speaker
There's even a a part where Ellison has a the screenshot of him like as a close-up of Bagul, and he just turns his head and looks at Ellison while he's not paying attention to his computer screen and then looks back right away.
00:38:58
Speaker
oh my god, such fucking chills. That was a hard scene to watch. I've heard that a lot, but I don't know. but Bagul, come on, man. Reveal yourself. If you aren't a coward, why are you looking back? Why are you pretending like you aren't trying to punk out Ethan Hawke?
00:39:17
Speaker
To add to his mystique, man. You don't know what... whos that we're watching But he you just don't know his role specifically. Is he the one killing these families or is it the kids killing these families?
00:39:35
Speaker
You ultimately find out that Bagul is a ah deity and you know what that symbol, to him. you know it's related to him And what he is, is he's a eater of children, pretty much. So all the kids um that he kind of seeks out, he gets them to essentially sedate the families with, you know, the toxic poison that they give.
00:40:05
Speaker
That way they can... pretty much overpower the family and kill them. Once they do that, then Bagul is able to take the child away and pretty much feast on their souls for however long he can. And that is why all the little ghost children show up.
00:40:25
Speaker
So he's he's not being a punk. he He's just you know waiting for his his time to shine in here. I still thought, you know, I don't know. A real demon wouldn't have looked away. He would have looked Ethan Hawke dead in the eye and would have said, your writing sucks, dude.
00:40:43
Speaker
Get out of here. You're not shit. You want your shit to be made into movie? I'm making movies. I mean, he does look him in the eye later when Ellison goes up to the attic because he hears the projector playing.
00:40:59
Speaker
All the little kids, the little ghost children, they're up there. They're sitting and watching um the first film with the the four members of the family being hung And then Bagul just does a jump scare and gets all in his face and makes him fall down that little ladder that he was on. So he he gets in his face.
00:41:22
Speaker
He's not a punk. At a certain point. I do you really like... There's a scene where the kids all get a pretty cool moment, but Ethan Hawke is essentially... He hears something in the house. I think the projector is playing in the living room, and it's the family being hung.
00:41:41
Speaker
And he's just... He had just locked it away in a closet after his convo with Vincent D'Onofrio. So he's walking around the house with a baseball bat.
00:41:52
Speaker
And every time... Everywhere that he isn't looking, there will be a kid right there behind him. And the kid will start moving in slow motion, almost like they're anticipating that he's going to turn around and see them.
00:42:08
Speaker
But then at the very last minute, the thing that gets him to turn around... happens And it's a very cool and odd sequence that I found myself really just enjoying watching and trying to think about how they executed it. But like one girl in a raincoat is standing there behind him the whole time. And then she makes a sharp turn into a doorway. And he only turns around at the point where it looks like maybe he would see her jacket out of the peripheral.
00:42:42
Speaker
And this little boy kind of takes a turn into another room. And at the last second when he's out of view is when you hear see and hear him step on something that makes a creak.
00:42:54
Speaker
And I found it to be a really good visual representation of maybe hearing things in your house or seeing things out of the corner of your eye, like what may actually be happening. I really enjoyed that sequence a lot.
00:43:08
Speaker
That was really difficult to watch because I honestly feel when, you know, someone passes away, they watch over you still.
00:43:18
Speaker
People do say, you know, if there's good, there is evil. so If all of us have a soul, you know, we all have energy. That energy just doesn't disappear.
00:43:29
Speaker
It does linger. So if you are evil, you are latching onto something. So originally when I watched this, I was thinking, oh, these little kids, they might be trying to you know, help Ellison or warn him.
Supernatural Elements and Fear Factors
00:43:44
Speaker
But, you know, that first girl that popped up right by his face, she she didn't look like she was scared or trying to help him. She just looked mean. so no they seem like malicious spirits, honestly. Like, they're kind of benevolent to an extent, but then they seem like they're helping Bagul. Yeah, that's his name, right? I honestly, like, forgot it for a second.
00:44:09
Speaker
Mr. Boogie. Yeah, cool. Or Mr. Boogie. hate Mr. Boogie. that I like it. I don't know why I like it because I think it's a cute nickname that the kids gave him. yeah Also, none of these kids have any art potential.
00:44:25
Speaker
They're all very basic drawers. ah You'd think one of them you'd watch and you'd be like, and there's something there. They've got a future and drawing.
00:44:36
Speaker
Do you have a future in drawing? Do you doodle? Do you draw better than they do? i think I draw better than they do, yeah. I need to see proof of that. I'll be the judge of that.
00:44:47
Speaker
I'll provide proof. ah If I remember, I'll post something on the Instagram that I drew. Draw of um a portrait of Mr. Boogie Boogie. A portrait?
00:44:59
Speaker
yeah I don't know if I'm doing portraits. I just said I can draw better than them. You can't be talking all this shit to these kids and not accept a challenge. mercedes i'll talk shit to these kids any day i mean they made more money doing this movie probably than i make in a year so i mean same i'm punching up as far as i'm concerned shut up but yeah that's that that was uh just going back to my point um
00:45:32
Speaker
You would think they would be in this film to help Ellison, but yeah, like you were saying, they look pretty malicious. They look like they're up to no good. and it's just creepy to think about because, you know, they are, they do have evil intentions in here.
00:45:48
Speaker
So when you are walking around your house, you're, is there an evil spirit there or spirits? I get nervous sometimes because my dog likes to, you know, bark at the fireplace.
00:46:01
Speaker
But then i have to remember, she's just looking at her, her reflection in there. She kind of sees a small glimpse of what she looks like. But if she barks at any other point of the house, I need to leave.
00:46:15
Speaker
Maybe that's just proof that Santa exists. you know She just fucking hates Santa. She was like, this is how he gets in. I've heard the stories. Then that that means she's ultimately my dog because I don't like Christmas. That means she's a Halloween baby through and through.
00:46:33
Speaker
Oh, man. How would you feel if you found out Santa was real and entering your home? Would you be okay with that? I'd be fucking feeling violated in every which way. you know Who the fuck are you to be entering my house? You didn't have permission. I don't even like it when ah people that I do like show up at my house.
00:46:53
Speaker
Get the fuck out of here. Mercedes, I'm going to ask you this. Is it time to cancel Santa Claus?
00:47:01
Speaker
Has he gone too far? Is this breaking and entering, is this like some sick form of peeping? like He's bribing you with gifts to allow this behavior.
00:47:14
Speaker
yeah also eats your food. but People are fucking welcoming this guy by giving him cookies. No, you're not having the cookies that I make. But also, it depends on the Santa Claus. Are we talking Jack Skellington Santa Claus? Are we talking Art the Clown Santa Claus?
00:47:33
Speaker
We're talking you know Tim Allen Santa Claus. Oh, no. Get the fuck out. I don't need your... you're From Santa Claus 3. Yeah. No. God, no. The escape clause.
00:47:47
Speaker
We don't need you here. I'd rather have Art the Clown than Tim Allen Santa Claus in here. Good debate. Who's scary to you? Art the Clown or Bagul? Ew.
00:47:58
Speaker
I think Art the Clown. He scares me more. He scares you more? Yeah, his deaths seem very brutal. I would take a drowning over ah half of whatever Art's doing.
00:48:12
Speaker
you know you're You have a point on that. Art is pretty fucking brutal, and he's very diverse in the way he likes to you know torture his victims.
Soundtrack and Atmosphere
00:48:25
Speaker
Bagul sedates everybody. he was like, I'm going to get you feeling loopy before I kill you. Art ah sedated a few people, too.
00:48:36
Speaker
and then he rips your fucking face off and leaves you alive for a half hour. No, thank you. True, true. I think what makes... the It makes me want to say Bagul for this question.
00:48:53
Speaker
What makes me want to go in that direction is the soundtrack to this movie. It is so fucking disturbing. Yeah, I was like, did Bagul fucking write a score to these home footage videos? There's like the pleasant one where they're camping. It's like very nice, like lovely music. And then it cuts you and it's like voo, voo, voo, voo. It's some like lo-fi bass thing that I found oddly meditative, especially at like the lawnmower scene. I was like transfixed. Like, oh my God, this is why you have these sound effects. They...
00:49:32
Speaker
suck you right in They lulled me into the the movie. yeah Even with the the car and the garage, it sounded like a tribal song was being played.
00:49:49
Speaker
and You just hear a certain, um I would say, vocals to it, but you don't know what they're saying. It seems like it's diegetic. It's in the movie within the movie that we're watching.
00:50:03
Speaker
Even the the intro kill scene, what what instrument would be playing the the sound? Do you remember how the intro was? Or not the intro, the the first time he watched the first film?
00:50:15
Speaker
No, I don't remember. can you Do you have any kind of a way to describe it do do you I'm doing such a horrible job of it it just sounded really creepy so when i first watched it I couldn't go to sleep that night because that fucking sound was in my head that and the tribal sound It's probably some weird synth-y thing. I wish I yeah remembered. the true The one from ah the car murders I remembered, and then the one from the lawnmower murders I remembered. Those two stuck out to me the most.
00:50:51
Speaker
They were very upsetting. The throat-slitting death, too. i found that incredibly upsetting. it's And Ethan Hawke's reactions while he's watching all of it, it really...
00:51:03
Speaker
like fucking works for me there's something i want to get into that just doesn't fully work for me at the end and i kind of want to know how you feel about it all hit me with it what is it I don't love that it's the kids coming up with all of these contraptions and doing it themselves. I know they have the guidance from Bagul, but that tree trap seems so intricate and looks like it would require a lot of difficulty for a kid to do.
00:51:34
Speaker
And then ah the chains around the car. I can't even think about how a kid would really... Like get the bodies in there. And that's the only part where I feel like the movie kind of strains credibility for me is the fact that it's like the kids are doing these incredible acts and Even though it seems like they are possessed by Begul.
00:51:58
Speaker
That was my interpretation. Because the little girl says something along the lines of, I like that you made the movie. I like the movies longer. Or the way that you made them longer. or Something like that. Because I don't remember if he's like extending them or splicing in more footage that he finds.
00:52:14
Speaker
Yeah, he finds ah the extended cuts of the film so he was able to see um the parts of each film where the kid comes out from the background and is showing that they were the ones that were um ultimately killing the family.
00:52:33
Speaker
so Yeah, so, and I did like that line that Bagul is appreciative of his own work and his own movies. It's almost like even a demon sees what he's committing to film as art in a way. I kind of enjoyed that.
00:52:51
Speaker
it so And if it is Bagul possessing the kids and Bagul doing all of that himself, fine. But it's the same thing as the ah Cult of Chucky thing where it's like, yeah, just because it's a supernatural thing possessing the body doesn't mean the body has any kind of extra extra ability or strength that it wouldn't have had before.
00:53:15
Speaker
So that that's just a hang up that I have where the movie stretches credibility.
Believability and Plot Critique
00:53:20
Speaker
And it's just unfortunate that it's at the end. And the movie really, really needs you to buy it at the end.
00:53:27
Speaker
Yeah, i had so many questions about that because I was thinking, okay, well, how are all of these kids pulling off these kill scenes?
00:53:40
Speaker
That tree ah branch that the family, all all of their ropes were ah tied to, that was a tall-ass branch. You don't see a ladder or anything. um I'm getting too technical with it.
00:53:55
Speaker
I think the ladder's behind the tree because the little girl like climbs down from the back, it looks like. okay. Something like that in the clip. But did you take like get a chance to really look at how intricate that setup was?
00:54:10
Speaker
Like what details? I i was just seeing how um you know, they were all standing there and then they were all being able to or they were able they were hung because the daughter was just cutting off the other tree branch and they were all just able to be suspended that way. That's so fucked up. Yeah, it's so there's the four family members at the bottom, and they all have ropes tied around their neck leading up to a branch of the tree. And I don't know if they all connect into one giant rope, but then that's wrapped around the front of the of one branch, goes higher up to another branch, and is wrapped around the back, and then is going diagonal all the way down to a lower branch that is being cut. I mean, it's fucking ridiculous, the level of work that's put into this shit.
00:55:03
Speaker
It's crazy. First off, I just want to say, this is why you're my co-host, because i kind of speed through all the details and you bring us back and you dissect every scene. So thank you for that.
00:55:18
Speaker
Overexplaining is my specialty. The listeners, they need more. that They need more. I didn't see all of that detail. I just figured, okay, they're all, all the ropes are just tied to one branch that's just being cut off and then able to pull the weight of them upward.
00:55:37
Speaker
So they end up hanging. That scene was so fucked up. Did you say something about that act being forgivable or the the kid being forgiven? what was your question again?
00:55:48
Speaker
Is the fact that it was the kids the whole time and the kids set up these mechanisms, is that something you like the movie enough to where you're able to forgive that?
00:55:59
Speaker
Or it it doesn't even register as a complaint to you like it would for me? don't know. I'm 50-50 on it. i i think that the kids being the culprits here is a good spin on it and you know them being possessed and having that you know manpower to be able to pull off all these kills.
00:56:25
Speaker
It's a good direction of what they were going in because I didn't expect that fully. And I like the fact that the movie ends on more so of a surprise note, like, damn, nobody got out of this alive. Everyone pretty much lost this battle between Bagul and, um you know, the living so far. And Yeah, Ethan Hawke fell right into his plan and just up and moved like he was supposed to move and got the whole family axe murdered. He fucked up, man. He really did. um
00:57:07
Speaker
so i like the fact that it ended on a sour note pretty much because if movies can have that effect on me where I'm leaving the theater or just sitting in my living room thinking,
00:57:21
Speaker
damn, I'm not going to be able to sleep tonight because of how uncomfortable I am, then it's effective. But at the same time, I wish that they had leaned into, you know, the kid aspect more because once you find out, oh yeah, you know, these kids are basically drugging their families to pull off all these kill scenes, it felt very rushed at the end.
00:57:46
Speaker
And you just see the little girl doodling her, a little drawing of her killing the family. You don't even see her kill the family. It's just implied. then she looks at the kids on the screen.
00:58:00
Speaker
They all just look at her. And then you see Bagul behind her. He picks her up. All the kids scatter once they see him. and so you know that they're afraid of him too, and he picks up the girl, um i forgot her name, the daughter in here, and then just takes her into the screen, and then that's pretty much the end of the film.
00:58:22
Speaker
So it's not even these children being on Bagul's side. they were afraid of him too since they all ran off, so it was, i don't know, I'm 50-50 it.
00:58:35
Speaker
Yeah, it, you know, now I'm, now that I'm thinking about it, I think it maybe is a bit more of an effective ending if you see Ethan Hawke get ax murdered on screen, or see him and his wife, or maybe all three of them get ax murdered, but Mostly Ethan Hawke, just because we've been living with him this whole time. And he is an actor, a bigger actor that you don't typically see in movies like this. I think it would hit audiences harder if you see him take an axe to the face or something. Or if it even cuts away as the axe is swinging down to his face.
00:59:16
Speaker
um I think they could have done a little bit more with that. Yeah, just anything, but they don't show that. Even when he was watching um the film where the family was getting their throats cut, i like the point of view where you you see him watching it and it's just a close-up of his eyes and his glasses and you're seeing the reflection of the film and the act itself take place within his glasses. That's great shot.
00:59:45
Speaker
It is. um and you could see, you know, just the the pain and the anguish in his eyes like, fuck, I can't believe I'm watching this. But that alone was a good way to show that.
00:59:58
Speaker
So they they show that part, but they don't. show the main characters death scenes in here i that's a part that i can say i don't forgive out of any film that does that if you have a main character and you're planning on killing them off you better give them a good death scene don't imply it or don't do it off screen that's just gonna that's gonna take the movie a couple notches down in my opinion i do want to ask yeah have you seen sinister 2 already
01:00:30
Speaker
I have um a long time ago. I kind of want to get a better understanding, and I feel like Sinister 2 might make this a little bit more clear. But so Bagul wants these families to relocate eventually so he can follow them there.
01:00:50
Speaker
and murder them at a new location so he can maybe be harder to track and kind of spread a bit more to different areas? Is that what his thing is? like Why does he rely on people moving?
01:01:05
Speaker
Honestly, i was going to ask you that because i had to rewind that scene when Deputy So-and-So was explaining that to Ellison um because I didn't understand it I don't know why he explains it to Ellison too when he calls him because he calls Ellison and like, you moved, you shouldn't have moved.
01:01:23
Speaker
And it's like, Ellison, you're the one who fucking told the deputy this information earlier in the movie when you realize the one family had lived in the previous family's house. You put this information together earlier. Oh my God. It's like,
01:01:38
Speaker
And you're criticizing the police. You have equally as bad oversight as like the police do in the or as you're claiming the police do.
01:01:49
Speaker
um And speaking of two, I think these are and don't know if I said this, the best police officers we've covered in a movie so far. that that yeah That was confusing me because i was thinking, okay, if he you know moves, he gets his family killed.
01:02:07
Speaker
But if he stays in the house, you know what's going to happen? He's going to keep waking up to the projector playing all the time. What if he didn't watch those films?
Moral Implications and Curiosity
01:02:18
Speaker
would that Would all of this activity still have taken place? um i don't think so because the tagline is once you see him nothing can save you so i think it he it requires them to watch the movies which also made me like wonder so all of these other families must have watched these movies the same way that um ellison did but None of them went to the police. Ellison is the only one who is morally bankrupt at this point. I mean, he had a motivation to not go to the police.
01:02:54
Speaker
Why didn't these other people go to the police and report? Hey, I have like this is pretty fucked up. I found multiple snuff films in my attic. I don't know if it's not to sound sexist, like a guy thing where they feel like, oh, well, it's not so much to worry about or maybe they thought it was fake or something.
01:03:17
Speaker
i don't know. Would you automatically contact the police if you found films like that? Yeah, I feel like it's a crime not to contact the police if you find something like that. Yeah, so I think I would. um I'm not trying to get fucking famous writing a book, keeping this from the public. No, I would be like, show this to everybody. i want and credit for it. No.
01:03:40
Speaker
I would just be like, yeah, get this away from me. That would more so be my vibe. I would feel gross for having interacted with it, having touched. I would feel like I partook in a crime watching it, and I would try and wash my hands from it and give it to people who we've deemed by, as a society, fit enough to handle something like this.
01:04:02
Speaker
so If you moved into a house and you saw a box of tapes that did not belong to you in your attic, you would voluntarily watch them? Man, this is a very All Hallows Eve fucking scenario we're talking about.
01:04:17
Speaker
and That's why I'm asking it because I was going to lead it right back to there and do it full circle. Yeah, I would be curious, and I think I would throw i would throw it on just to be like, hey, what is this? I mean, what if it was like some type of actually valuable film reel that... ah There's stories of people finding old, old film reels that were said to be lost to time, and it's like, oh, now we've uncovered...
01:04:42
Speaker
A four hour cut of like planes, trains and automobiles or something like that that was lost to time or they'll find like old assembly cuts of movies and ah recut them.
01:04:53
Speaker
So curiosity, there would be too much beckoning me to check these out. But I wouldn't get caught up in some Coen Brothers-esque situation where I'm way in over my head the moment I have watched them, like I've crossed the line. I think I would know when I need to step away.
01:05:16
Speaker
Yeah, that's the difference between you and me. I just wouldn't watch them at all. i would see that I would look at them, nope, and throw them in the garbage. But then I feel like I would still be fucked anyway because they would pop up back in in the attic, but I wouldn't watch them.
01:05:33
Speaker
As soon as I see them, no, no. I don't want to see snuff films or potential porn. and Potential porn. Yeah, that is the biggest. it is risky. It is risky.
01:05:46
Speaker
But I mean, your situation is a bit different from mine. You're in a partnership with somebody like you co inhabit the same living area. So you're moving into the same new house.
01:06:00
Speaker
You got two people in on this decision making process. Or are you pulling an Ethan Hawke and keeping it from your husband? I'm not watching this shit by myself. And if he tries to turn around and say that he wants to watch it, no, I'll i'll steal that shit and throw him away myself before he even tries to watch it.
01:06:21
Speaker
What if he comes back to you though and he's like, wifey, I'm writing a book. um but It's going to be a hit. They're going to make a movie. Would you be like, you're gone too far, the kids. probably think of the dog think of the dog um yeah no i at that point i would just i would just direct him back to this film be like have you learned nothing from the horror films that i have showed you come on now have you not learned from the previous text
01:06:53
Speaker
Yeah, just you have to learn from all these kids mistakes and not fall victim to Oogie Boogie or Wow, Boogool. I was trying to say Boogool and Mr. Boogie and then I ended up saying Oogie Boogie from Nightmare Before Christmas.
01:07:11
Speaker
Nightmare Before Christmas, guys. Best movie ever. one of them anyway. I have a funny tweet that kind of reminds me of ah what we were just talking about with Bagul.
01:07:23
Speaker
So it's kind of about how we don't learn anything from art and we're just doomed to repeat the mistakes of every movie and ah horror book that's out there.
Art as a Cautionary Tale
01:07:33
Speaker
So this tweet says, Sci-fi author.
01:07:36
Speaker
In my book, I invented the torment nexus as a cautionary tale. Tech company. At long last, we have created the Torment Nexus from the classic sci-fi novel, Don't Create the Torment Nexus.
01:07:50
Speaker
I like it Very fitting. Very fitting here. Yeah, it's basically, you know, we've all seen Jurassic Park making dinosaurs our bad idea, but you know they would be fucking making dinosaurs if they figured it out.
01:08:05
Speaker
Oh my God. Life would end at that point. You got any final thoughts on B'gool? On Sinister and B'gool, I guess. Because the movie's not called B'gool.
01:08:20
Speaker
I was just so excited to say that word again. I know, it's such a cool name. And then I'm thinking of the one episode where my dumbass ah was thinking you were saying Sinister Gates when you were actually talking about the film Sinister. um We're just jacking up names left and right here.
01:08:41
Speaker
This movie, honestly, not enough Sinister Gates too. Never thought I'd say it, but it could have used more Sinister Gates in this movie. Maybe there'll be more in the sequel. I guess we'll have to see.
01:08:53
Speaker
You could always use more sinister gates. Yeah. i i can't really I can't really remember part two. i only remember snippets of it.
01:09:05
Speaker
So I am, want to say, a little excited to jump back into it just because Bagul is fucking creepy. But I don't know. It's just watching this movie now. i used to like it a lot before, but now rewatching it doesn't cut it for me anymore.
01:09:21
Speaker
I had the opposite feeling. I didn't like it as much the first time around. I like it more now. But it's sitting at a ah nice three and a half stars for me out of five.
01:09:32
Speaker
I'll give it a three out of five stars. Damn, I bumped it up half a star and you took it down however many stars. It's just because Ellison, he's such a douchebag to his family. And I know that's just great acting on Ethan's part.
01:09:48
Speaker
But I just, I don't know. I wish we would have gotten more of the plot twist at the end. Okay, it's the kids doing it. Let's kind of dive into that a little bit more. i do like the interactions that he um Ellison and Deputy So-and-so so have when they're trying to just, you know,
01:10:07
Speaker
dig deep into all these ah murder ah cases. But at some point I felt like, okay, it was a little too much. Let's get into let's get back into Bagul and you know what he's doing with these kids. you know Show him a little bit more.
01:10:24
Speaker
Oh man, I was really digging the work with him and the deputy and the cops a lot. I liked it. I just felt like there was a little too much of that and not more of the reveal that we should have gotten at the end.
01:10:39
Speaker
Yeah, you wanted more of the of the actual paranormal elements, which I will say, too, i mean, the movie had room for more of it. This movie's sitting at a runtime that made me kind of frustrated.
01:10:54
Speaker
An hour, 50 minutes, and one second. Guys, you can fucking cut that one second. Just make it an hour 50. You did that just to bother people like me when they just see that one second and are like, guys, come on. Are you fucking kidding me here?
01:11:09
Speaker
How did that slip through the cracks? And then also watching this, any I mean, some of those like real slow paced moments, I was thinking like, okay, guys,
01:11:21
Speaker
It's not fully necessary to be moving this slow. you could have brought this down to less than an hour 50. I'm like Ethan Hawke creeping to his son in the box takes fucking forever.
01:11:34
Speaker
Yeah, it does. Even after the the scene where he's in the kitchen and just walking throughout the house and the little dead children are just kind of following him.
01:11:47
Speaker
Once he sits down on the couch with his bat and he falls asleep, it looks like the film froze, but then you see a light in the corner of the window that he's sitting by And it starts um illuminating the room. So you you do see that, you know, he's sleeping throughout the night and it's sunrise at that point. But did we really need that in here?
01:12:11
Speaker
Which I would like to know how they filmed that. It seemed like it was practical and they didn't do any. It wasn't an actual time lapse. I think they did some light trickery in the back. It's not a bad film to watch. It's not, but I want more It's a tight, tight script.
01:12:26
Speaker
I'm wondering if Sinister 2 will deliver on that. I'm curious what your thoughts will be on it when we review it next week.
Conclusion and Next Episode Teaser
01:12:34
Speaker
It's got pretty bad critic and audience ratings.
01:12:38
Speaker
I kind of knew that going in, but 14% critic, audience is Kind of surprising and part of me is wondering like, damn, I hope this is like bad in an interesting way that kind of makes it a little good and it's not just fucking boring and that's why it has bad reviews.
01:12:59
Speaker
ah Usually with horror, when I see bad reviews, it ends up just being boring and it's like, come on, be bad because it took risks. I don't know. Be bad in the way that people think Ang Lee's Hulk is bad because it just it he took risks and he made it about our damaged relationships with fathers.
01:13:19
Speaker
I have an opinion formed on it already, but I'll save it for the the next episode. so Stay tuned, guys, for Sinister 2 next week And remember to rate and review us five stars. And if you're new to this podcast, thank you for coming along for the ride. We appreciate to have you here and we hope you enjoy our Sinister Two talk next week.
01:13:42
Speaker
We've been Morbid Curiosities.