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The Black Phone
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Join Nicholas and Mercedes as they answer the phone... THE BLACK PHONE! That's what they'll be discussing, and they get down and dirty with this one, diving into the themes of trauma, guilt, shame, abuse, and the bonds we build being what gets us through the darkness. All in preparation for THE BLACK PHONE 2!
Stay tuned for the rest of the month! Black Phone 2, Bring Her Back, and Trick 'r Treat. Happy October!
Remember to follow us on Instagram @morbid_curiosities_pod
Email us at morbidcuriosities10@gmail.com with comments/questions/concerns/recommendations
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Transcript
Introduction and Host Banter
00:00:57
Speaker
you
00:01:11
Speaker
What's up, guys? We are back here for another episode at Morbid Curiosities. I'm one of your hosts, Mercedes Martinez, and with me is the awesome, the one, the only nefarious necromancer of nightmares himself.
00:01:30
Speaker
It's Nicholas, yours. you You're going to pick up the phone? Are you going answer the phone? Hell no, I don't answer phone calls. like This is why i would and i would survive scream but die in this universe because I don't answer phone calls unless someone warns me and asks, like, hey, can I call you or say, hey, I need to talk to you about something.
00:01:53
Speaker
i will not answer my phone, so I'd be fucked if I was in this universe.
Discussion on 'One Missed Call' and Phone-Based Horror
00:01:58
Speaker
I'm not too familiar with the one missed call universe, but how does that work? So like, if you didn't answer that call, like you're going to die in a couple of days or whatever. It's like a ripoff of the ring or something.
00:02:11
Speaker
I don't think there's a way for you to answer the call. it i it like If I'm remembering it correctly, I'm probably not. But yeah, it'll go to voicemail and then you hear the way that you die. So i don't know. I feel like everyone like would struggle to try to answer the phone.
00:02:29
Speaker
Now I got to watch that again. the The original, and not the US version because that one blew. I've only seen the American version, never the original. You've seen both of them?
00:02:39
Speaker
Yeah, the original is so much better, so much more creepy. This one sucked so bad. So yeah, I highly recommend the original for you. I just remember how bad the poster was. It's like a face and I think, are the eyes like mouths that are screaming or something? yeah The face is like on the phone or whatever. yeah Yeah, yeah.
00:03:01
Speaker
I would just avoid watching or looking at that poster because that just reminds me of my phobia that we do not have to go into again. so yeah, yeah. yeah Yeah, good point.
00:03:12
Speaker
We can get off of it. Bad movie, don't watch it. We may never talk about the remake on the podcast. Yeah, exactly. Thank you. I mean, today we're going to talk about a much better phone movie movie.
00:03:27
Speaker
I can only assume. I haven't seen the remake in a very long time, and I'm not throwing any shade at the original because I've never seen it. today, i mean, you heard it at the end of last week's episode. You heard me do it in my intro.
00:03:42
Speaker
We're talking about phone-based movies. that's This is going to be an all-phones episode of the podcast. If we go off-topic, we get a small electrocution. We both have collars on right now. You can't see, but you're just going to have to believe us.
00:03:57
Speaker
yeah And whenever we go off topic, you're just going to have to believe that we get a small electrocution.
Deep Dive into 'The Black Phone'
00:04:02
Speaker
But we're talking about the Black Phone, the 2022 release. We had a big debate on this before we started recording because I was reading the Letterboxd release date and they go by the premiere for some reason.
00:04:19
Speaker
But this is our return to director Scott Derrickson, writer C. Robert Cargill, and beloved actor Ethan Hawke. I think he's one of your favorite actors, right, Mercedes?
00:04:32
Speaker
No, he he is a good actor. do like him a lot. He's the one that does the old Captain, my captain thing, right? Yeah. Yeah. To Poet Society. Yeah. He was a baby in there.
00:04:43
Speaker
But anyway, yeah, i he was a douchebag and sinister. and in here, obviously, he is no better. So yeah, he great performance in here, though. I will not stop praising this man in here.
00:05:00
Speaker
I mean, we'll get into if the grabber's a bad guy or not, you know? Let's not get ahead of ourselves. We haven't cracked to the case yet on this grabber guy.
00:05:12
Speaker
we haven't even announced a spoiler warning yet for the people. I know. I'm jumping again. My bad. Again. Yeah, I mean, if you haven't seen the poster or a trailer, if you've somehow not managed to see the trailer for Black Phone 2, even because that plays before goddamn every movie, I swear to God.
00:05:31
Speaker
But, you know, Ethan Hawke is, you know, a demon mask wearing dude in these movies. But... I guess we'll let's say spoilers ahead for the black phone.
00:05:46
Speaker
We both have a lot to say. Mercedes, do you want to give your thoughts on the black phone first? Your relationship to this movie? I watched it not too long after it came out where you can order it online because VOD.
00:06:04
Speaker
VOD, yeah. I just didn't think I was going to like it too much, but I wanted to at least own some version of it. So, yeah, I ordered it. And when I watched it, I was not expecting what I got. Yeah, they i didn't even rewatch the trailer for this, but obviously I knew what was going on or like some version of the plot before actually watching it.
00:06:30
Speaker
And it just like left me pretty disturbed. and I was thinking I really regret buying this because I don't think I could watch it again. So i was a little.
00:06:42
Speaker
nervous putting it on for the podcast. I watched it yesterday, rewatched it today. i God, i was just like, i I remember how dark this movie is. And it's even darker watching it this time around because I'm able to like pick up on more details and just see how the relationship between this film and Sinister is.
00:07:07
Speaker
and even some of the casts that were in, what is it, Sinister, and here you have Ethan Hawke, and you even have James Ransone in here.
00:07:19
Speaker
it was a cool little like callback to that, but yeah, this movie, it was a lot to go through. was a little overwhelming at times too, but what did you think of all of this?
00:07:31
Speaker
Wait, so did you like it? You didn't say if you liked it or not. I'm going to so leave that until the end. Until the end of the episode? Yeah. Really? yeah wait what? I'm leaving. feel like I'm always throwing everything out there.
00:07:46
Speaker
I don't really like this film. like It's directed very well, but i don't like it just because of how uneasy it leaves me in the end.
00:07:57
Speaker
That's totally understandable. This is a not the easiest watch. It's not a feel-good movie. It's not mean in the way that Smile is, and it's not what you would say like depraved in the way that a terrifier is.
00:08:14
Speaker
But it's still about very dark subject matter. And it's totally understandable if it's something that would make anybody uncomfortable.
00:08:24
Speaker
So I guess maybe even like trigger warning. There's like, like for anybody listening, there's a lot of bad stuff that happens with kids in this movie and a lot of implied bad stuff.
00:08:38
Speaker
Going over some of it obviously there's child abduction going on in here, but you kind of see some, you know well, you do see bullying in here, but you also see a little bit of child abuse. You see alcoholism, you see broken families,
00:08:57
Speaker
You see, it's not really like a coming of age film, but you see kids trying like the two leads in here, Finney and Gwen. You see them like more so leaning on each other in their broken family. Actually, you saying it's not a coming-of-age story, Scott Derrickson would disagree with that.
00:09:19
Speaker
In the making of, he viewed it, and I like quoted him, he views it as, quote, a true coming-of-age story. i put it... You heard the same quote? like I heard that, and I did kind of see it that way, but at the same time, I'm like, is it really a coming-of-age film? She's framing it that way because of the ending.
00:09:42
Speaker
Yeah, the ending, that's the only way I would agree with it. But I just think like the entire movie itself, I just wouldn't view it as that just because, like you know unfortunately, all these other kids did die. Yeah, the main character, obviously, he is growing up.
00:10:03
Speaker
And I could see like him and his sister just kind of leaning on each other more. But and then you follow them, obviously growing within each other, too.
00:10:13
Speaker
But like with everything else going on, I wouldn't really call it that. But I do see how he's trying to get that message across. I got to say when he said that, because I didn't really think of this movie as a coming of age movie like any of the times I've watched it. And I've seen this three times so far.
Character Relationships and Themes in 'The Black Phone'
00:10:34
Speaker
When he said that, I was like wrestling with it a little bit. and i Maybe over time I'll start to see what he sees, but I don't fully see it as a coming-of-age story. That would almost be like, to me, saying that the movie Room is a coming-of-age story, which i mean maybe you could frame it that way.
00:10:53
Speaker
But it just doesn't strike me as one. My relationship with this movie... I had seen it in theaters when it had first come out. I wasn't that excited for it. The trailer really didn't do anything for me. I thought the Ethan Hawke mask looked pretty goofy. And his voice didn't really do much for me. I didn't find him too imposing. so It was a movie I was just going to see just to see it.
00:11:24
Speaker
And you and I hadn't really talked about this just because I didn't want to put a sour mood on anything because you actually wanted to cover Black Phone 2. So that's why we're doing these two movies.
00:11:39
Speaker
So I didn't want to be like, i didn't really like Black Phone when I saw it in theaters. It didn't really work for me. There's a supernatural element, and we're in full spoiler mode.
00:11:51
Speaker
There's a supernatural element. It's this phone that these kids that were killed by Ethan Hawke's character, the Grabber, these kids are calling our main character on Finny throughout the movie.
00:12:04
Speaker
And that's a framing device where if you aren't buying into it, you're just not going to enjoy the movie or really believe what's happening. And that was my initial watch.
00:12:16
Speaker
And I walked out of Black Phone not really caring for it that much. Now, skip ahead three years or so, and we're covering it for the podcast.
00:12:29
Speaker
I threw it on. i was like, okay, I don't know if I'm really going to dig this thing. And I really ended up falling in love with this movie.
00:12:39
Speaker
It like was a complete turnaround for me. Trust me, it's not an enjoyable watch. I found it very harrowing. But I didn't remember anything that happened in the movie.
00:12:51
Speaker
So re-watching it, it was basically a fresh experience. I just remembered the premise and a few key details. But it like really worked for me.
00:13:02
Speaker
Maybe it's because things with kids nowadays affect me. like I feel like more and more things with children in peril are a bit harder to watch. This not only works on an incredible horror thriller level for me, like there were moments where I was on the edge of my seat just sitting there rooting for this character, being like, get out, get out, come on, succeed.
00:13:28
Speaker
It's this beautiful story between this brother and sister dealing with this piece of shit father that they're stuck with and their relationship and their bond getting them through all of these tough times.
00:13:42
Speaker
And yeah, a lot of those scenes are pretty difficult to watch too with the father. Those are honestly the hardest parts of the movie for me to watch. But I just found this movie to be so masterfully done, taking elements from Joe Hill's The Black Phone book, Joe Hill's Stephen King's son also, and combining it with his own personal history with his with an alcoholic father. I'm talking about Scott Derrickson.
00:14:10
Speaker
It just really worked for me this time around. i felt It felt deeply personal, and it I just think this movie has a power to it that not a lot of horror movies do, but they strive for, especially these Blumhouse movies.
00:14:27
Speaker
like They strive for this like type of power like ever since Get Out. I think Black Phone, for the most part, achieves it, but we'll get into the details in a second.
00:14:38
Speaker
To me, the one of the best things about this film is the relationship you see between Finney, who is played by Mason Thames, and then Gwen, his sister, who is played by Madeline McGraw.
00:14:55
Speaker
I love them and I can't stress enough on when I see either a sibling relationship or a relationship in general in films with a lot of chemistry between them.
00:15:10
Speaker
They don't seem like they're just forced to be brother and sister. out You really feel the you know connection they have with each other. You see how you know just in the beginning there's this whole baseball game where Finny is the pitcher and Gwen, she's just like on the benches. She's like rooting for him with her little bag of popcorn. I thought that was such a cute scene to open up to.
00:15:38
Speaker
And just throughout the film, you see them talking. They're not picking on each other. Like, if they do, it's just, like, all light teasing. But later on, you do see, you know, the...
00:15:53
Speaker
There are times when the dad, he's, you know, again, trigger warning, you know, really beating the shit out of Gwen with a belt. And I know parents did use belts on their kids a lot, but like.
00:16:10
Speaker
in this film, it's just so hard to see. And what's cool about it is I believe that the actress who played Gwen Madeline, she improvised that part where she's like crying, where the dad, he's pretty much beating her up because he doesn't want her talking like how the mom talked, saying like, oh yeah, you know, I'm having visions in my dreams.
00:16:37
Speaker
and he's like threatening to hit her again. He's just saying, you know, like, tell me like your dreams are just dreams or however he worded it. So she's like repeating my dreams are just dreams and she's bawling her eyes out. But the last time she repeats it, you could see her just like kind of spitting venom at him. My dreams are just dreams. Like she's angry at that point. And, you know, it took all of them by surprise because no one directed her to do that. This was just her like taking in that part and absorbing it all in
00:17:14
Speaker
And she just does such a great job with it. So that part really got to me. Like you said, it's kind of difficult to watch movies where kids are being subjected to violence. And obviously Finn does get abducted by the grabber along with other boys in this film.
00:17:36
Speaker
and he was even you know dealing with bullies at school. So, you know, you're just seeing, like, Gwen getting abused by her dad and then you see Finn getting the shit kicked out of him by these bullies. Like, it's fucking hard to watch, but you see them, like, leaning on each other in those moments. Like, Gwen, like, looks to Finn for comfort after that issue or that whole scene with her dad And when Finn is getting bullied after, you know, the kid, Robin, who was essentially protecting him, isn't around anymore because he was also a victim who was abducted.
00:18:17
Speaker
And these kids are beating him up. You know, Gwen does try to come to his rescue and she fucking like... beats one of the kids with like a rock and then comes in and calls him a cocksucker yeah and what a line to throw out that's what i throw when i'm driving and right like this girl had no filter and i loved it and i was just like damn this kid is like pouring out blood and you can even see like is his vision fucked up because he's blinking kind of funny yeah i was like he must have some kind of brain damage
00:18:55
Speaker
it it it was kind of hard to watch. Like, that seemed like a tough hit. Madeline's a tough cookie. She also called someone a fart knocker earlier, too. We can't let that go unnoticed. Yeah, I was gonna bring that up, too. Like, she...
00:19:10
Speaker
And she's not one to be shy or just let people kind of walk all over her, like with that scene with her dad. But yeah, there's a scene in the beginning where she's called to the principal's office and you got these two detectives questioning her, which I don't fucking buy because, you know, they're questioning a minor without a parent present.
00:19:32
Speaker
I don't know if it was different back in the day, yeah. yeah And it's funny because they're trying to figure out like, okay, well, You told so-and-so about, you know, this happening and these balloons being scene with the most recent abduction, but we didn't let that be known to anyone. So how do you know that?
00:19:55
Speaker
and She's trying to say, like yeah, these are part of my dreams, but then she's kind of getting annoyed, like, yeah, because I'm the grabber. and i don't know what she said word for word, but she starts going off on them. and Yeah, it was just like, damn, what what a way to stand up for yourself.
00:20:13
Speaker
Yeah, she talks about this kid Vance and how he was a big kid. He could beat up both of the cops. They keep really setting up this Vance character who comes into play later.
00:20:26
Speaker
Yeah, that that Gwen scene when she's arguing with her dad, she's crying, she picks up the alcohol and is like, I'll drop it. She does really well.
00:20:38
Speaker
That scene went on a little too long for me. That's what made it hard to watch. I was like, come on, give us like a breath. and Maybe that was the director's intention, but I felt like they could have pulled back a little bit and that scene would have been a bit more tolerable to get through because it does feel like something you have to get through. It's a deeply unpleasant scene the dad's holding about.
00:21:04
Speaker
The dad played by Jeremy Davies. He played Dickie in Justified. Right when I saw him, I was like, Dickie is no good. And here he is. This guy's even worse than Dickie.
00:21:17
Speaker
Dickie Bennett, I think, is his name. But You like brought up a lot of stuff that made me think about something I'd wanted to talk about. This movie has so much Stephen King DNA in it.
00:21:31
Speaker
and I know I had mentioned Joe Hill as Stephen King's son, and you just feel it. it's Did Stephen King and his son both grow up with the same set of bullies?
00:21:42
Speaker
There's very similar bullies. Right? Yeah, these bullies could be the bullies from it, basically, or bunch of other Stephen King things.
00:21:54
Speaker
They're like male bully male versions of the bullies from Carrie or something. But not only the bullies, the abusive alcoholic father feels very Stephen King.
00:22:07
Speaker
It reminds me of The Shining. If we're going into Stanley Kubrick's Jack Nicholson's character, basically alcoholic, abusive father throughout the whole thing.
00:22:20
Speaker
And then the element of the supernatural being in this otherwise totally grounded world.
Supernatural Elements and Cinematic Techniques
00:22:27
Speaker
that You could say that Finney and Gwen have The Shining, basically.
00:22:34
Speaker
i don't know if you were thinking that at all while watching, that this could be in The Shining Doctor Sleep universe. Yeah, just because you see they have some type of abilities that were probably inherited from their mother. you know, Gwen, she's able to see visions in her sleep.
00:22:55
Speaker
And they're kind of like premonitions just off of the final destination. you Maybe not premonitions, actually, because that premonitions, you're seeing something that's coming later.
00:23:07
Speaker
She's basically seeing in her dreams how these kids were kidnapped and a bunch of details behind their kidnapping. Yeah. I mean, she kind of has a premonition in a way just because she's able to see Finney in the house.
00:23:27
Speaker
And, you know, there there's a part where he's like banging on the screen door and that part didn't happen yet, or at least I don't think. But yeah, and it's kind of like Final Destination 4 when you saw the snake and it was super abstract.
00:23:44
Speaker
This is a better version of an abstract vision where you're getting elements of reality in this vision. but She's got the house and she's got Finney. she just It's almost just a dream, basically. Her mind took real details and created fiction based off of it, basically. but Like, to some extent. I'm doing a terrible job but explaining what's in my head, but, you know.
00:24:10
Speaker
it's It's cool because with her visions, you know, they don't come off as like cheesy dreams that she's having or like, you know, just generic type of clues that are being given to her.
00:24:26
Speaker
I like how you can tell it is a dream sequence and you have, you know, that grainy, gritty like footage film have filter being shown. It's so good.
00:24:38
Speaker
It's so effective. It's way better than in Sinister. I think the opening credits are so cool. Not to cut you off. It makes me excited for Blackphone, too. The way he shoots these dream sequences.
00:24:51
Speaker
Scott Derrickson, going to be honest, not the strongest director for me. There's a lot of shots where was like, A little boring camera-wise. Sorry, no offense. I have great respect for you.
00:25:04
Speaker
But those dream sequences, found footage style, he knocks those out of the park. Even after every child abduction, you kind of see upbringing of some of the kids in there. i think Bruce, yeah, you see like.
00:25:20
Speaker
really makes you feel like it is so impactful and important for caring about these characters who you don't really see most of them.
00:25:32
Speaker
Yeah, you don't get like a strong storyline following them You just, it's all like word of mouth and then seeing like their missing child photo everywhere.
00:25:43
Speaker
And just the rumors you hear, like if they were... a bully if they were someone who wasn't the greatest person or they were a shy person you know like you get a little bit more of that when they talk about their character more and you see how they were abducted by the grabber and it just like makes this film that much more uneasy to watch because again you know the shit that's going on and you know like all these children ended up getting killed by Ethan Hawke's character but when you see those little clips of it prior to that it just it makes it hurt a lot more it's so unsettling to watch
00:26:27
Speaker
men And not to go back to the opening credits, but it really does set the tone real well. that's like That's what bought me where I got bought in this time around was you had mentioned the baseball game. The baseball game has a great vibe. These kids all seem like friends. They're competing, but none of them are really an asshole to each other. You got some great rock music from the time period playing while...
00:26:57
Speaker
this This character, Bruce, who Finney has a connection with, is riding by it's he's riding his bike while it's cut with scenes of Finney shooting a rocket up in the air.
00:27:08
Speaker
And the only reason I could think about for that scene was just to show, like, okay, this guy he has a bit of an engineering side to him. So at the end, when he makes this rig, it would be a bit more believable.
00:27:20
Speaker
That's just... kind of was my takeaway but then bruce as he's riding his bike this black van turns the corner and it fades to into the credits and like you had mentioned it's all found footage and it's all stuff out of context just shots like kids there's one of like a scraped ankle missing posters and It reminds me of almost, I think it's like 28 Days Later, i want to say, has some like pretty obscure opening credits. I could be wrong.
00:27:53
Speaker
The credits really set the mood so well for this thing. They do. And thank you for bringing that up because, yeah, I noticed majority of the credits, instead of it being, you know, just like,
00:28:08
Speaker
random background images or just images of the missing children, you do see, like like you said, a scraped ankle, like someone's knee is bleeding and you see like a band-aid or bandages open and It's like, all right, well, I guess that's foreshadowing a lot of the bullying that's going to take place. But then you start to see all the missing child photos everywhere. And it's like, all right, that shows that aspect of it. So you do see the two different storylines of bullying and then the missing children come together in the credits. And it's just so beautifully done. Yeah, it definitely does set the scene for this film.
00:28:49
Speaker
and Hell yeah. So let's dive into the meat and bones of this thing. Let's bring, bring. Oh, wait, hold on. Hello? it's the plot of the black phone calling.
00:29:04
Speaker
I love it. you're You're the theatrical guy here. i love it so much. Yeah, just got to lighten this up somehow. Talking about kids getting abducted this whole time.
00:29:18
Speaker
Yeah, can't torture the audience. But so, I mean, we've set the stage really well for this movie, I think. Mercedes, you did a fantastic job, especially breaking down Gwen's character.
00:29:31
Speaker
She's kind of the linchpin of this whole thing, I'd say. But basically, like right after the opening credits, you get a lot of good Gwen and Finn.
00:29:45
Speaker
They're talking about the grabber, though, not saying his name. If you say his name, he'll come and get you. I don't know if Finney ever says his name. i don't I didn't pay enough attention to check that, but I don't think he says it, so his logic didn't check. He he still gets grabbed later.
00:30:02
Speaker
There's a lot of table setting in this beginning. You see he's got bullies. There are people that are after him for whatever fucking reason. Finney doesn't seem like that bad of a kid. He seems pretty chill.
00:30:14
Speaker
And it also sets up his friend Robin, who... I've met kids with the personality of Robin and those like, I'm a tough kid and you stick with me, other kids won't fuck with you.
00:30:25
Speaker
They've never been as small as him. They've always been massive people. but I mean, I liked Robin. i felt great that Finney had a friend protecting him.
00:30:38
Speaker
And it wasn't similar to a Stephen King where it is just relentless bullying and this kid has no friend and it's hard for him to connect.
00:30:49
Speaker
The bullying does get taken to extremes, but this kid has... Finney has relationships. He has people there for him, and the bullying isn't his own world.
00:31:02
Speaker
The bullying isn't his whole world. But so basically all of that gets set up. The grabber is in the neighborhood and then Finney encounters this.
00:31:15
Speaker
And if I'm skipping over anything or missing anything, let me know. Finney encounters this black van similar to the one that Bruce had encountered.
00:31:27
Speaker
Bruce is also missing, by the way. I forgot to mention that, but. This guy, creepy guy with white paint on his face, looks like a wannabe magician played by Ethan Hawke, comes stumbling out and tricks Finney into getting close to his car. Finney notices the black balloons.
00:31:47
Speaker
And then it's kind of, i don't want to say masterful because it's gross, but But the black balloons were a clever cover up, I think, from a writing perspective. Maybe it's in the black phone book, but it looks like he's just wrestling balloons into the back of the van. and It doesn't look like he's getting a kid back there. I mean, what did you think of this abduction sequence?
00:32:12
Speaker
So that was something I wanted to ask because I didn't understand what the reason was to include all the black balloons. I was just like, is this guy literally giving himself away? Like, all right, I took another kid. Here's my signature thing.
00:32:28
Speaker
Was that it or was that to cover, you know, his action and that point? point I don't know why he lets them fly away because it would almost feel like sending out his own bat signal.
00:32:41
Speaker
just Yeah, exactly. i just did something. Maybe that's just a cool visual thing and no one really thought about it that hard. Maybe he does want to leave a signature. a lot of these sickos do want some kind of attention and spotlight put on them.
00:33:01
Speaker
So that might be his form, his calling card. But the purpose of the balloons seemed for it to be a cover-up. So it would look like he's wrestling balloons into the back of this van.
00:33:14
Speaker
Balloons that are about to blow away or something. But it seemed like it would be smarter to just leave balloons in the back of the van. Maybe keeping them is a risk in and of itself because the police now know about the balloons.
00:33:29
Speaker
But that's what the purpose seemed to be. But yeah, the whole setup of how he abducts children, I thought it was strange because only because, okay, you have this town where these children are all going missing.
00:33:48
Speaker
Okay, after the first one, you would think that you know, with all of the news and missing photos that are up everywhere and everyone knows about it, you would think that parents would be like, hey, I'm going to go pick up my kid from school. Or there would be like a citywide alert, like make sure all children are attended to, like no children, no child should be walking alone on these streets, like after school, after hours, like a curfew put in place, something.
00:34:22
Speaker
But no, all of these kids, they are still walking around while multiple children have been abducted already and they haven't found them yet. So it's like they're clearly not safe. and then just it's like, OK, the no one knew that this big ass black van was like a big indicator that, you know, something was wrong or no one saw this big black van, like just kind of roaming the streets where children were at. Like no one paid attention to that.
00:34:57
Speaker
So yeah, it's a little unfortunate once Finn does come in contact with the grabber, you know. Real quick to to that, I do want to say like this does seem like it's a time period where,
00:35:11
Speaker
This type of thing it is new. I feel like in the 80s, that's when this takes place, kids were allowed to just kind of roam free, walk to and from school. Child abduction was a relatively newer thing, I think, so there might not have been...
00:35:30
Speaker
protocols in place and i think it is kind of making a commentary on how when kids are in danger similar to weapons when kids are in danger it's kids that are left to fend for themselves well that i can understand like i do get it's a different time i obviously wasn't born or around this time so i don't know but I would think like most parents would be like, yo if there's someone out there like...
00:36:01
Speaker
kidnapping children i'm not gonna let my kid out of my sight i know these two had a very like dismissive alcoholic father so i can understand why their situation was the way it was but like even with gwen walking to her friend's house to spend the night like why wouldn't she walk with the girl from school i'm pretty sure they go to the same school But at the same time, too, she wasn't in danger because it seemed like the grabber was only grabbing boys.
00:36:33
Speaker
But yeah, just the fact that Finn himself, he is clearly nervous about the grabber that he doesn't even say his name. You would think like, oh,
00:36:46
Speaker
let me not talk to anyone else while this is going on but he's still kind of is like you know trying to see who this guy is and then he says oh yeah i'm I'm a magician do you want to see a magic trick and he falls for it but then looks and sees like the balloons in his car why would you get that close to the vehicle and just for this guy to be like yep and fucking grabs him oh my god that was so hard to watch i i hate that whole scene so yeah a good way to set it up but so fucking difficult to watch so yeah executed very well
00:37:24
Speaker
I'd say like all of that is because he like him getting caught so easily or falling for it, I would sum up to him being a kid in a time where, and especially like having a parent who isn't telling you Don't talk to strangers. Don't take candy from strangers. That that feels like a very ninety s saying.
00:37:49
Speaker
And yeah, the grabber is out there. But that interaction was pretty quick. He got him pretty quick. And this guy does catch your attention. He didn't fully warm up
Abduction Scene Analysis and Critiques
00:38:03
Speaker
to the guy. He seemed apprehensive towards him at first.
00:38:07
Speaker
But... I think a lot of people end up getting caught up in some shit because they're being too nice. They don't know how to back away a little too sooner, especially as a kid.
00:38:18
Speaker
There being like weird power dynamics between children and adults. but and Finney's also someone who doesn't really stand up for himself that much.
00:38:29
Speaker
He can't stand up to kids his own age. Maybe he's not going to hop into fight or flight mode immediately when an adult when confronted with a strange adult.
00:38:41
Speaker
Maybe he does just freeze. Yeah, I guess I see your point. It still pissed me off though. I get it. Dude, you know balloons are being left because I'm sure your sister told you balloons are being released at the scene of the crime.
00:39:01
Speaker
and you clearly could pick up like that the shape of the balloons in the window like before like putting your head all next to it, your face all into it. You would think, oh shit, there are balloons there. Let me try to back up or say something. He probably wouldn't have made it, but I don't know.
00:39:23
Speaker
We just won't ever know. We just know that this kid gets grabbed by the grabber. The move of getting abducted in daylight too is a pretty terrifying notion. i does i do think it kind of speaks to this suburban like suburban neighborhoods you feel protected in, you feel secure. We've talked about people who leave their front door unlocked. This is a neighborhood full of front doors unlocked.
00:39:53
Speaker
but I would believe it. These are all people not paying attention, even though there's stuff on the news telling you to. I mean, there's a point where Finney is in the streets yelling the grabbers after me or something, and people turn on their lights. Nobody steps outside.
00:40:12
Speaker
It's irresponsible. And I mean, you were talking about characters pissing you off not to jump... too far ahead but finney when he was when he makes it out of the house and is running him just running straight down the sidewalk of that did kind of irritate me i was like dude you're out like zigzag go into a backyard where he can't get you with his car and start banging on back doors that would be my move Yeah, that part really did piss me off because if you watch that whole part, like we'll jump back to scenes that we want to. I do want to just like call attention to this.
00:40:52
Speaker
So this scene Finney does after he's abducted, you know, he's been in a basement and he's been receiving phone calls from all the dead children who are kind of like giving him little clues as to who they are and how he can escape.
00:41:13
Speaker
And he makes a way his way to get out of the front door, like making it past the grabber who was sitting very creepy-like.
00:41:24
Speaker
Yeah, he gets a call from Griffin. i don't remember if that's the Paperboy character, but he tells him that the grabber's using a bike lock on his front door, which, mean, the grabber, not to, like, jump too much around, but his brother is staying there. It's like, and you got a bike lock on the thing. It's like, how do you explain that? Maybe he just does it at night, and he's like, it's for the dog or whatever. I don't know.
00:41:49
Speaker
the bike lock combination is like etched into the wall. I thought that was so well done. The grabber being asleep, him having to sneak around him, fuck with the combination lock. it I was tense. i don't know about you, but this up until before he gets out of the house, I was so, oh my God, make it out, make it I didn't remember what happened, but I was like, does he get out this early? What the fuck?
00:42:16
Speaker
But yeah. Yeah, that whole scene set up, I was like, okay, cool. You know, the kid wrote the combination on the wall so he doesn't forget it. That's smart because I always forget my lock combinations.
00:42:29
Speaker
I still have nightmares about being late to class in high school and trying to fuck up my locker and I... don't get it open because I can't remember my combination. But yeah, that whole detail where he's like, I just don't remember if the locker combo is this or this or this sequence. You have to try them all.
00:42:54
Speaker
So it's like, fuck, not only are locker is like finicky at certain points but now you have to really fuck with it and be extra careful to make sure you're getting the right combination down but yeah him just like going past the grabber while he's sleeping and then once he's out you're like okay the lock is gonna open and it's gonna wake up the grabber no it wakes up the fucking dog that ends up waking up the grabber It's like, seriously, this dog can't notice. Like, this other human being is upstairs now.
00:43:27
Speaker
He wakes up at a fucking noise of a lock. Oh, yeah. I bought that. I was like, that's such a fucking dog thing where it's like that one sound will set... They know that means the door's about to open, that little click, and then it just sets them off. you know It's like my dog, I check the mail, and like when I get home from work, and when I close the mailbox, my dog goes wild because that's the sound that lets her know the mailman is there, and it's just that slight sound sets her off. So I bought that so hard.
00:44:03
Speaker
was like, fuck this dog. Yeah. you know You're right because with my dog, she's a little douche. She doesn't bark at people. like She'll growl if she feels like threatened, obviously, but she doesn't bark unless she senses something. and i could be There were so many times that i was just like...
00:44:28
Speaker
all chill just watching tv in the living room she's sleeping but then fucking starts barking at the back window and i'm like what and i freak out because obviously she took me by surprise and like now my fucking ass is over here paranoid as shit because i'm like great is there someone outside by this door now i have to look through the window and see if there's someone there No one was, but it's like, what the fuck did you hear see that something was there or something startled you and clearly woke your ass up?
00:45:04
Speaker
So, yeah, I guess I could buy that. But then he's out in the street and the grabber gets up immediately. i mean, this is pretty scary. Both of the scenes where the grabber is upstairs waiting for him are pretty scary. He's trying to play this game called like Naughty Boy, where he didn't say you can leave yet. He purposely leaves the door unlocked downstairs.
00:45:30
Speaker
expecting the kids to go up there and try to leave, and then he seems to beat them until they're unconscious with a belt, which is horrible.
00:45:41
Speaker
Just imagining it is awful, and hearing the kids describe it on the phone is just as awful. And he's expecting Finney to do this, but Finney isn't playing the game Naughty Boy. All of the kids have done it, and they've all basically... it Doing it makes the game progress forward, so which ultimately leads to death.
00:46:05
Speaker
I know I did a terrible job of explaining that, but we'll move on. But he ends up yeah getting out the door and him just like running down the sidewalk didn't fully work for me. I wish he did a little bit more. I wish that sequence lasted a little bit longer and the grab... wish it was scarier and the grabber really had to come and find him. There was an opportunity, I think, to get a little bit more creative with that scene.
00:46:31
Speaker
I don't like how... The kid is already out on the sidewalk and... And he's running. i understand he's a kid. he may not run too fast, but like he barely put any distance behind him And it was literally such a short amount of time.
00:46:54
Speaker
But the grabber had enough time to wake up, get to his van, turn on the van and get out of yeah his driveway to follow this kid, corner him, and then grab him abduct his ass again. And, like my God. Like, even the fact that, like, he knocks the shit out of him to knock him out.
00:47:19
Speaker
It's like, damn... Well... That kid deserved it at that point. No, he did not. But... Yeah, it's just, like, this poor kid, he He made it out, but he wasn't quick enough because this fucker was able to grab him again. And now he's back in the basement. And it's just like, shit, you know, with that whole concept of naughty boy, like, damn, like he's playing this whole game.
00:47:45
Speaker
Maybe that was why the grabber was saying, like, you know, nothing's going right or nothing's going. OK, because I didn't pick up on that until you said this right now.
00:47:57
Speaker
Yeah, that, because yeah Finney's not playing the game, and also his brother Max showing up as well, I think is part of what he's implying when he says that.
00:48:11
Speaker
But all of the other kids fell right into the game, it seems, immediately when he left the door open. They all tried to escape, and Finney's the only one not playing the game, so he can't move forward, because what he needs to do is beat you senselessly,
00:48:26
Speaker
And then I don't know what the second part of the game is that leads you to dying. Did they explain, did any of the kids tell you how he killed them at all? At first I thought he was just beating some of them to death, but towards the end, like he had like an axe or something with him, right?
00:48:45
Speaker
and then Yeah. Yeah, so he does make a comment like, usually I use this, but you know I want to take my time with you. And he tries to bring his dog to you know finish the the job on Finny after he does that. Yeah.
00:49:02
Speaker
Yeah, I'm not sure the exact details on like what the second part of the game was. It could have been that or it could have been something else too. And what makes the whole game even more upsetting is, well, one, he Ethan Hawke's character, the Grabber, has this mask that has interchangeable parts.
00:49:21
Speaker
We first see it, there's no facial expression. i was trying to wonder why, what that is. the His intro is the only one without a facial expression. Uh, there's one part where he just has the lower half and that's where it looks like he's kind of filled with shame. Almost. He looks very sad and vulnerable. It's odd.
00:49:44
Speaker
His behavior does change with the masks and, When he's upstairs, he it's got this frowny face on. And that one does legitimately look terrifying.
00:49:55
Speaker
that And the second thing I was going to say is he's got his shirt off that first time where we're seeing that. And so it feels like there's this weird, almost sexual element to it, even though he doesn't get sexual with the kids. But then he does watch them sleep, almost like he sees them as pets or something. it's very odd behavior yeah the interchangeable pieces of the mask i found so so scary to look at it was just difficult because again i love ethan hawk's performance in here he is such a great actor but in here
00:50:39
Speaker
You can't play off of his facial expressions like you do every other film or every other actor because he has to wear a mask. So you have to rely on his voice, his body movements, his behavior.
00:50:54
Speaker
And there was even a time where he has his mouth covered, but his eyes are exposed. Yeah. Yeah, that's the part where he's just, you know, watching Finney sleep.
00:51:08
Speaker
And then he says, you know, like I he had just come down to the basement just to look at him. and And like his eyes, they're like he barely makes any movement to his facial expression there. But you know His eyes like they almost look like he's teary-eyed. and i think he described playing this role as like a wounded animal.
00:51:34
Speaker
but yeah With each mask, like how it was changed, I felt like the one where his he had the frowny face, like that was pretty terrifying. and You literally went off of... like his eyes just opening up while Finn was trying to escape, well, did escape essentially. And it's like, fuck that.
00:51:59
Speaker
That's hard to watch. And then the beginning part where he goes downstairs and like shows Finn his, well, the happy face of the mask.
00:52:13
Speaker
You know, Finn does make a comment like, oh I'll scratch your face and people will ask why or something. And he was like this face and he kind of like puts his hands out like in a Joker type of look.
00:52:27
Speaker
It's like, man, that subtle movement alone is just so frightening to watch and even Ethan Hawke himself he did state like he was hesitant on taking this role because if actors you know take on a role of someone who's like an evil character or just like a a horrendous type of character audiences will kind of take that role and have that role follow that actor everywhere else that they play into and he references or what were you going to say because he doesn't have to worry about that Ethan Hawke
00:53:10
Speaker
yeah What are you talking about? like People know you from the Before trilogy, and we've talked about Dead Poets Society. You were like in a Marvel series this same year, playing like an evil Egyptian god or whatever. It's like, chill out, Ethan Hawke. You're fine.
00:53:29
Speaker
Your daughter's in Stranger Things. like Chill out. Wait, she is? Who is she? she's It's his daughter he is with Uma Thurman. She works at the ice cream shop or whatever.
00:53:39
Speaker
Oh, yeah. that Oh, yeah. i forgot about that. Okay, okay. Yeah, that girl straight up looks like Uma Thurman. But, yeah, he was referencing Jack Nicholson and how he was in The Shining, and he's like, you know, everyone knows him from that movie, and I'm just thinking, I mainly think of Jack Nicholson from the Batman movie when he's the Joker. like Yeah, Jack Nicholson's a maniac in, like,
00:54:08
Speaker
most of the movies that he right exactly kind of seems like he might just be a maniac he just has that face like all those facial features like that is just him that is his persona like ethan hogg didn't have to worry about that but he said you know i'm I'm at an older age, so maybe it is time that I go into horror films. But yeah, he just does like such an amazing job in this film.
00:54:37
Speaker
Even though you hate his character and what he does, it's just you want to know like what's going to happen next. So you keep watching this film until the end.
00:54:50
Speaker
So yeah, I love his performance in here. And I'm glad that they don't give you many details about the grabber. And I'm totally fine if Black Phone 2 gives you more details and they make it interesting.
00:55:04
Speaker
And as an audience, the movie makes you want the details and makes you care about getting the details. That would be cool. If they don't do that, that's also sweet. But I do greatly appreciate that he's such a mystery and the movie doesn't take time to explain, oh my God, he had abusive father. I mean, he's got a brother who, I mean, seems okay. He's doing a bunch of drugs in the house.
00:55:35
Speaker
He seems like he's very of the time period, but his brother isn't. abducting kids his brother's actually into true crime actually kind of played by deputy deputy so-and-so from sinister yeah i like deputy so-and-so when he was in sinister when he was in it i didn't really like his character in here because he didn't yeah he's the worst part of the whole movie i think Yeah, they didn't have to have him in here. like they
00:56:07
Speaker
If they had the dad kind of like get his shit together and start being like you know just obsessed with like solving this case, I would have bought into that more than having this guy have a brother who's just like, you know, a little druggie trying to solve the case here.
00:56:28
Speaker
it it made no sense to have him in here, maybe just to have like that little comedic relief that this guy typically plays, but it doesn't fit well in here.
00:56:40
Speaker
I really liked the idea of the brother when they introduced the brother. I thought that was so cool. I'm like, oh yeah, this guy's just a fucking loser with a brother.
00:56:51
Speaker
you know he's Everybody else has a brother too. This guy's just a fucking dude who puts on a mask and it really kind of demystifies him a little bit and makes him come off a bit scummier and a bit more like a loser.
00:57:09
Speaker
But just the execution of the brother, I thought was so... It felt like it was from a different movie. Yeah, it just doesn't fit in here for me. And like I was saying, just with the whole comedic relief that they tried to throw in here, there was a part where Finney gets a phone call and it's from Robin.
00:57:32
Speaker
and Robin was the one that he was cool with, the little tough kid. You know, he's trying to warn him about like... what's to come and he's like you know what did i tell you and finn just says you know that i needed to see the texas chainsaw massacre that was a whole scene that they had talked about prior to robin getting abducted And that right there, that was a cute little laugh to have. and you know, i saw that as being very genuine because men like you guys typically aren't expected to show any type of emotion. and even in this moment, you know, Finn had...
00:58:18
Speaker
I love the fact that Finn did not cry once in this whole like abduction scene where you see him waking up, realizing where he's at, all the interactions he had with the grabber and all his little attempts to escape until the final one where he thought he would be able to break through the freezer and he doesn't. And that's where he's kind of just like, man, I'm fucked here.
00:58:43
Speaker
And he starts succumbing to his emotions. But when he answers the phone, you know, Robin says, don't cry. And, you know, he wipes a tear from his face really quick. And he's like, I'm not.
00:58:55
Speaker
And he's like, yeah, you are. I could see you. And it's just like, damn, you know, they're even having that little moment there where, you know, boys aren't supposed to be crying. But you had that little sense of comedic relief and then just that sense of reality right there that I thought was such a great fit to include in that scene.
00:59:16
Speaker
Yeah, I agree with you. Kind of going back a little bit to the Grabber's interior life and we were talking about the mask, you kind of brought it back to the phone calls that we're receiving a little bit throughout the movie.
00:59:31
Speaker
I've kind of got a read of all of this, and it might be pretty basic, so I apologize if this was talked about, but this is what I've come to know that the phone and the mask represent in this movie.
00:59:46
Speaker
So the phone is, like as we've mentioned, a conduit for speaking to the dead. It's the the supernatural object in an otherwise mostly grounded world, aside from the two shining kids we get.
01:00:01
Speaker
And on this phone, the kids who are calling are victims of the grabber. They're almost like his guilty conscience calling him back. And these kids, while they're they're helping Finn, it's almost like two sides to the the same coin,
01:00:22
Speaker
These kids are calling and none of them had enough time to really fully have a realized plan to get out of here.
01:00:33
Speaker
They've all made attempts. They've made discoveries that help Finn. It's almost like the victims are able to come back and help towards getting justice and helping to get Finn out of this situation.
01:00:52
Speaker
And so while it's playing that role, it also plays the role of the guilt for the grabber. It's all of his victims calling and trying to find a way or calling for the purpose of killing him, stopping him from killing another kid. They're calling to stop him.
01:01:10
Speaker
So it's his guilt calling over and over and
Symbolism and Storytelling in 'The Black Phone'
01:01:12
Speaker
over. And he wears the mask out of shame. When it gets ripped off, he screams. He can't take it. It's not any physical condition.
01:01:22
Speaker
He's just... This phone of guilt keeps ringing and he's got the mask to hide all the shame. And the phone getting used at the end, not to like jump too far ahead to kill him, is...
01:01:35
Speaker
kind of poetic justice. It's him not being able to escape his guilt and everything catching back up to him. i I really like that reading into it because i was going to say, you know, i don't really know what the purpose of the phone is aside from yes being, you know, that connection between Finn and the dead children.
01:01:58
Speaker
i like that supernatural link there. i know a lot of people, they don't really like it when, you know, the supernatural communicates with the dead in such a straightforward method like that.
01:02:11
Speaker
But here, i I liked it a lot. I even love the detail where the kids, they couldn't remember who they were if they had been killed so long ago.
01:02:24
Speaker
Like the only one who knew who he was really was Robin and he was the most recent one to get abducted and killed. But I love the fact that, you know, it could be the grabber's guilty conscience.
01:02:38
Speaker
Conscience. calling back each time because I didn't know if he was actually hearing the phone whenever it rang basement. Yeah, he hears the phone, but he chooses to ignore it. He's high pushing his guilt down into the literal basement.
01:02:55
Speaker
Yeah, and I like that because when I was rewatching it today, the first time when he's actually talking with Finny in the basement and he was saying, yeah, I'm going to get you a soda and then I'm going to explain what this and this happened. One, I was mad mad because he said soda and not pop.
01:03:15
Speaker
It's called pop people. Fight me on it. And anyway, it's a regional thing. I learned that from being in California. They're all like, you're a loser for calling it pop.
01:03:26
Speaker
And I was like, well, it's soda pop. I think both are correct. At least it's better than people calling a refrigerator and icebox. That's a regional thing where i'm like, you are crazy. The freezer is where ice is made.
01:03:41
Speaker
No, that that's just, no, we, I get the original things, but no, it's a refrigerator and it's also pop. I will i will take that to my grave. It is pop.
01:03:55
Speaker
But yeah, that was one thing I didn't like about it. But then, yeah, he... turns around and stops talking because he was like, oh, did you hear that? Like the phone's ringing.
01:04:06
Speaker
And I was like, wait, was there a phone ringing? Because his phone down here didn't ring. The one upstairs rang. And I'm like, wait, was there a phone that was actually ringing? am I just like, you know, hallucinating that now? So I literally rewinded that part That way I could put the captions on so I can see if the phone was actually ringing and it does say that I'm like, okay, I'm not crazy.
01:04:30
Speaker
He was hearing a phone ring. But was that a physical phone? Or was that this phone like you're mentioning? So I love that you took that, you know, whole reading from that because that makes so much sense.
01:04:42
Speaker
Yep. my My takeaway from that first phone ringing scene was that Finney just couldn't hear it yet. There was something about it, maybe.
01:04:53
Speaker
i don't know what it was. I just thought maybe he couldn't hear the supernatural phone ringing yet. Yeah, because one of the kids did say on the phone with him that, you know, they had been trying to call all the kids, but none of the kids heard the phone ringing except Finney. So that's interesting that you mentioned that now.
01:05:19
Speaker
I wonder if it's his bond with his supernatural sister somehow creating that link. Maybe Finny isn't supernatural in the way, because there is the point where Finny's on the phone with Vance, and then later we cut to the Vance flashback, and the sister hops in, and she's there while Finny's on the phone.
01:05:44
Speaker
And I was thinking... Maybe the sister's there for all of these phone calls. Maybe her dreams are the bridge to Finny receiving the phone calls. But I think that's unclear. Yeah, I like that little reading into that, too, because, yeah, you know, there was a part where... Throughout all of this, even when Robin was first abducted, Finney asked Gwen, you know, can you try to have like a vision to see where he's at? And she tried explaining, you know, it doesn't work like that. But she's begging her to try anyway. This is some of my favorite stuff in the movie. Go on.
01:06:20
Speaker
Sorry. No, you're good. But same because she opens up her dollhouse and she has like a rosary, a Bible. And she's praying, trying to get some type of vision. And I love the way she prays because she's like...
01:06:35
Speaker
I know you know what I'm going to ask. I'm going to ask it anyway. Like she's a firm believer in God, in Jesus. And, you know, she just wants to try to figure out what's going on.
01:06:47
Speaker
And then she does have a bit of a slump. She doesn't know what's going on She can't have any more visions at certain points. So maybe that was a little bit of Finny kind of absorbing that type of like gift that she had in those moments, but then she does end up like having more visions at the end.
01:07:06
Speaker
It's just so heartbreaking to see, though, because now her brother's abducted. And she probably has guilt in her because she was teasing him like, oh, you think the grabber is going to get you if you if you say his name? Like she does kind of pull back on that a little bit.
01:07:24
Speaker
But she is just like, you know, I'm not having visions. This happened. I don't get what's going on. She's like literally swearing at Jesus. Like, what the fuck are you doing? Like, or why is this happening? Like, it's hard to see that because...
01:07:40
Speaker
She had so much faith. She was not dealt the best card in life. The only person that she really had was her brother.
01:07:51
Speaker
And now she doesn't even have that anymore. Like it's hard to see her lose her faith throughout all of this. But yeah, that was my whole rant on that. Yeah, I really like when, especially horror movies, mostly horror movies, when they have firm believers in any kind of God, really, and the movie does not look down on them for those beliefs. And I also like, too, the idea of...
01:08:21
Speaker
characters keeping their faith with a silent God, them praying to a silent sky. i feel that is like pretty profound. And yeah, when she starts swearing at God and then wondering what if you're not even real? I feel like that's a very believable human thing. And it was so awesome seeing it honestly, honestly,
01:08:47
Speaker
depicted in this movie uh i thought all of that stuff was so fantastic and i really did enjoy watching like the idea of this firm believer in a god having this supernatural ability and you don't even know if it's a god-given ability like the supernatural ability could negate the idea of a god in actuality it's but it's a pretty interesting duality i think yeah and so with the whole sequence of watching gwen aside from all the shit they have to endure from their dad you do see her kind of like in the whole coming of age type of deal
01:09:34
Speaker
with her brother because she can be a kid around him. She could be goofy with him. While she's at school, her only job is to be a little kid in school. And then she even has the opportunity to go stay at a friend's house for the night on Fridays. So you get to see that and you see her having a type of belief in the beginning, but then that slowly dwindles away because now she's just in this nightmare because her brother is gone.
01:10:05
Speaker
She can pretty much feel that he is still alive with the visions that she keeps having, but now she's just at a loss because before she has more visions, she is just stuck and she's questioning she was my brother taken? Why was any kid taken?
01:10:24
Speaker
But mainly, why is her brother taken? So then she does kind of come to that realization, like maybe you are not real. And a lot of people do question their beliefs when they do lose somebody, whether they have been taken from them, or unfortunately, if they are killed.
01:10:43
Speaker
And you know, it's like, everyone can believe whatever they want to believe. I'm not trying to make this a religious thing. But It is very sad to see her at such a young age have to deal with that. She does kind of like go back to that when she's bike riding in the rain, searching for the house that she saw in her vision. You know, she's...
01:11:04
Speaker
praying to Jesus again, you know, just to help her find house. And, you know, you see these kids, all the like ghosts of all the dead kids, they like appear in the street and that makes her like fall off her bike.
01:11:19
Speaker
But that happens and she happens to fall off her bike right in front of that house. So it's just it's sad to see that like happen with her. But you see her still trying to hold it together so she could figure out where her brother is.
01:11:34
Speaker
That was all very well put, and I agree with all of that. But I do really like just seeing, because that's a very real feeling, wondering, just your prayers not being answered, and wondering, at are you even real? And it's, especially to experience it at such a young age, this character having gone through so much in their life,
01:11:59
Speaker
It felt so true to me. And I felt like I saw a bit of myself in this character at that time. But this kind of gets us pretty perfectly to the ending because she yeah crashes in front of the house.
01:12:17
Speaker
I really do like how the detective characters, it it reminds me of what long legs did to the detective characters kind of are like, all right, we have no leads. We'll kind of listen to the supernatural shit because they're, they've got some stuff, right? Like we don't know what's up with this little girl, but she's got leads. She has information that nobody else does.
01:12:44
Speaker
And I really love that. And he or she takes them straight to a house where they find a bunch of graves for children. And there's one that is waiting for Finn for Finney. And he's downstairs in the basement.
01:13:01
Speaker
And at this point, he's basically taken everything he's learned from these kids. You mentioned he hit the dead end with the freezer. I was so sure that's how he was going to get out of there. It was.
01:13:12
Speaker
Such a crushing moment. And I felt like I wouldn't have given up as quickly as he did. But it was pretty hard to watch. But then I don't know if that's when Robin. call yeah you had said that's when Robin calls him.
01:13:29
Speaker
And he basically takes everything he's that these other kids have set up for him. And pulls a home alone. And sets a trap.
01:13:40
Speaker
He had been... Mercedes is laughing. She thought that was a good bit. I did. Because I thought the same thing. Yeah, I did call that out because I got you pretty good with that one.
01:13:52
Speaker
So, yeah earlier in the movie, the first thing he does, this kid, Bruce, the first kid who gets kidnapped, tells him he tried to dig... uh, out under the ground and he tells him some tiles. So there's a hole that's already ready.
01:14:04
Speaker
I was wondering like, what's he going to do with this hole the whole time? And, uh, the second kid, Billy, who warned him about the grabber being upstairs, tells him about a wire he was able to pull loose and it's sitting under the ground. He used that to get a grate down earlier, which was another soul crushing thing. They,
01:14:25
Speaker
There's a thing for screenwriting. They say torture your characters. And I think that's why this movie is so watchable for me, even though it's a kid. Like torturing your character really is a compelling form of storytelling because you're just like, fuck, what next?
01:14:41
Speaker
and It works so hard in this one, even though it's not, like, pleasant. It's incredibly dark. But then, yeah, Van said, told him about the freezer. And so he gets the wire, rigs, like, a little thing for him to trip on, sets a carpet over the hole, and puts the little grate that he knocked down in the hole. So when he ultimately gets the grabber to trip and fall in the hole, the grabber snaps his leg.
01:15:09
Speaker
And then... He implements Robin's punching style. He's got dirt in the phone. And this is where I talked about the phone being used as a weapon.
01:15:19
Speaker
at the very end, his guilt coming back, he ends up boxing the grabber and ultimately at the end strangling him to death with the phone and snapping his neck because a moment in the movie that I kind of hated that it got called back to a bunch was, I mean, his arm was mint.
01:15:36
Speaker
Yeah, it was cool because in that moment, like the phone rang. The phone did ring at that part, right? I'm not imagining it.
01:15:47
Speaker
It did, yeah. Okay. Finney makes him answer the phone finally. Yeah, so you know, as Finney is strangling him with the phone that's not even connected to the phone anymore, like he had cut the wire, he you know, has the grabber, like, you know,
01:16:06
Speaker
Answer it. And i since you said, you know, it's basically the guy's conscience, like it's all hitting him. Like all the kids are able to say like the shit that they wanted to say to him while they were trying, you know, to make their escape or to defend themselves.
01:16:23
Speaker
And, yeah, they were all able to basically say, like, you know, he's going to do for us what we couldn't do to ourselves. And, yeah, the kid ultimately kills him. And i was just like, holy shit, you know, he did it. Like, all those little, like, tips, they actually helped him. Like, fuck, now how is he going to get past his dog that's, like, a monster guarding the door?
01:16:49
Speaker
yeah and i was like, wait a minute. what does he have in his hand? I'm like, oh, that's perfect. The freezer. was able to grab a piece of steak, well, a whole steak, give it to the dog.
01:17:01
Speaker
Yeah. And, you know, that dog was able to, like, you know, just have a whole meal and not even care about Finn. And, Finn just walks up the stairs and in all honesty, if I was in like that situation and I was able to have made it out like that, I would have just jetted up the stairs. There is no way I'm tiptoeing up there. Like, you know, I'm relieved. I can make it up there. If the kid's in shock, I guess I understand. But now fuck that. I would have just up and ran because that dog could have easily turned around and started shredding him like.
01:17:33
Speaker
Yeah, I'm running. Well, maybe you walk so the dog doesn't go after you. It didn't seem like that's what he was doing, but i agree with you. I'm booking it out of that house.
01:17:44
Speaker
Exactly. And then even once he gets to the door, like, clearly he could see everyone outside, but he's very, like, calmly entering that code, that combination into the lock to open the door. And then it's almost like disbelief.
01:18:01
Speaker
Like, he can't believe. Am I actually about to walk out of here? True. It did feel like a very earned moment. And yeah, like he was in disbelief.
01:18:13
Speaker
Yeah, and since all of the cops are, you know, like occupied at the other house because they just found all the graves with the dead bodies of the missing children, Gwen was the only one to see Finn come out of the house on the opposite side of the street.
01:18:33
Speaker
So she runs to him You see the guy's van in the car or in the driveway. The driveway. So it's like, damn, did no one notice this fucking van right here? Like, come on. Maybe he doesn't drive it around that much. So people just weren't thinking about it. Maybe he only goes around when he's going to kidnap a kid and people just don't see it out in the community. Because as far as we know, Finn is the only one that was abducted in public.
01:19:05
Speaker
Like that public. Bruce was behind like a store. Or something along those lines? Yeah, I think when, what's his name?
01:19:16
Speaker
Is Bruce the paper boy? Griffin is the paper boy. Yeah, because when he was abducted, like, obviously it's early ass in the morning, so no one was probably up and...
01:19:29
Speaker
Yeah, okay, well, that makes sense, too. But yeah, then the scene cuts to, like, later that evening there's, like, the sheriff talking about, like, how the the grabber has been, you know...
Conclusion and Aftermath of the Film
01:19:43
Speaker
That whole case has been solved and he's giving it to the detectives who are going to give more details on how, you know, they found the missing children, you know, whatever. And you find out, you know, the grabber, he had two houses and one was where he took the kid while they were still alive. And the other house was just empty, but that's where he was burying all the kids in the basement.
01:20:12
Speaker
And it's like, what the fuck did this guy do to acquire two houses that were literally right across the street from each other? So that was like perfect for him in this whole situation.
01:20:27
Speaker
But like, why would you put your brother in the house with the kid that's alive? Like, you clearly told him not to go in the basement. Okay, well, you could have told him to live in the house that was had no one occupying it downstairs.
01:20:44
Speaker
i don't know. I'm probably overthinking that, but yeah. You got to put him in the house that you're staying in so you can keep close eyes on your brother. His brother might not have known that house across the street was his.
01:20:56
Speaker
I did really like that reveal when Finney walks out. I was expecting it to just be in the middle of an empty street, but to for it to be right across the street, right under everybody's noses, it really...
01:21:13
Speaker
I don't know the words to describe it, but it felt so like, of course it was. Of course it would be right across the street. But I love the scene of the sister running to him and giving him a hug. It was a really nice moment.
01:21:30
Speaker
Yeah, i kind of got confused by that because when they walked into the house and there was nothing there, I'm like, well, then what the fuck did she just envision? Yeah, they're like, we're in the wrong house.
01:21:42
Speaker
Yeah, and then when he comes out of the opposite house, you're like, what the fuck? Fuck, that is that is such a crazy twist just to have it like have him so close and yet so far because like they almost were about to leave when it's like, damn, y'all didn't even do a thorough search of the house until the one cop like happened to see a door to the basement. It's like, well, yeah, you know.
01:22:08
Speaker
look everywhere like what the fuck but yeah once they show like Gwen running up to him you know she hugs him you see them you know in a little ambulance and they're just like all c covered up and their dad their piece of shit dad he comes and like he's he drops to his knees and he's happy that they're both alive you know this is the first time he's seeing his son in however long but like He's apologizing and begging for forgiveness, like even though he knows he doesn't deserve their forgiveness.
01:22:43
Speaker
And it's just like, damn, imagine the pain that he's going through. Like his wife killed himself. Now he's an alcoholic. He knows he's a dick to his children.
01:22:54
Speaker
and One of them was almost killed after being abducted. And now it's just like, damn, he has so much grief that he has to live with now because of this.
01:23:05
Speaker
And yeah, the only thing he can do is apologize to his kids and hope that they can forgive him. But yeah, it was just like a very bittersweet moment after that because Finn, they show him going back to school.
01:23:22
Speaker
Everyone, of course, is fucking like chattering away with their little rumors or whatever, like. oh yeah, I thought he'd be bigger. like He was the one to kill the grabber. Yeah, okay. But some of them, they're like you know they're on his side.
01:23:37
Speaker
He goes and you know confidently sits next to the girl he likes in class and she says, you know hi, Finny. And he's like, yeah just call me Finn.
01:23:47
Speaker
And it's like, that's where it ends. So I guess that too, I guess, is a little coming of age detail. But yeah, it's it's such a It's a good way to end this film because it's like at least the film is ending on somewhat of a happy note.
01:24:05
Speaker
It's still sad because, you know, all the other kids were killed, but at least this kid was able to make it out alive and he was able to kill the killer himself. And it doesn't seem like he's too traumatized by it either.
01:24:19
Speaker
I'm excited to see if, uh, Finny and this girl stay together. If this relationship is even a thing that happens, I feel like realistically, they maybe don't, I don't know. Who knows? I'll believe whatever they tell me, if it's well-written enough.
01:24:36
Speaker
And then, uh, The character that I'm low-key, one of the most excited to see in Black Phone 2 is the dad. I want to see what he makes of all of this, what he does with himself.
01:24:52
Speaker
My guess is he's not going to stop drinking, And he's going to continue to be a bad dad. And he's not really going to change all that much because of the situation. Maybe he stops beating the shit out of his kids.
01:25:06
Speaker
But I don't think he's fully going to get his shit together. Yeah, I don't either. So just, you know, even though, yes, like you said, the trailer for Black Phone 2 has been shown so much with every fucking movie that's out right now. It's even on every YouTube bed every time I pull up YouTube.
01:25:26
Speaker
It's like at first I wasn't like too, too hyped about it. But after rewatching the first one, I'm like, damn, I really want to see how they're going to spin this next one.
01:25:40
Speaker
Because this is yet another movie that did not need a sequel, but we're here. it better live up to it. yeah. don't.
01:25:49
Speaker
i I don't know if I would say it's one that didn't and need a sequel, because if the creators want to do a sequel, if the creators have more story to tell, then I feel like sequel is necessary.
01:26:06
Speaker
If it's the original creators, if it's coming from them, then hell yeah, give me a sequel. When it's like cash grab territory, that's when I'm like, okay, this didn't need to happen.
01:26:16
Speaker
When it starts with a release date on the calendar and then you work backwards from there, that's when I'm kind of against it. But no, the return of the lead cast, the director, the writer...
01:26:31
Speaker
I'm so on board. These movies are why C. Robert Cargill and Scott Derrickson left the Doctor Strange franchise. So if they got more story to tell, then I would i would say it's necessary.
01:26:44
Speaker
Well, we will see once it comes out if it lives up to it and if there is a good enough story to tell. I have high hopes. I think that I'm getting a real Nightmare on Elm Street vibes from this sequel. It seems like it's going to go full supernatural. it's I mean, the Grabber's dead. He can't kidnap kids anymore.
01:27:06
Speaker
So what can you do besides take it in a different direction? And that excites me. I mean, they back themselves into a corner story wise. And yeah mean, you killed your villain.
01:27:19
Speaker
So what do you do next? You have the supernatural element. But what happens next? And that's what excites me the most. Next to I want to see these characters come back, man. This brother and sister. I want to see what happens with the dad.
01:27:36
Speaker
I assume this movie's about trauma, but I mean, Finny, Finn, it seems like he might be like a local hero because of this. How does that affect him?
01:27:48
Speaker
There's a lot of snow, it looks like, in this new Blackphone. Visually, that's interesting. Blackphone 2, I went from like little to no excitement to now being so happy and looking forward to seeing and talking about it so much next week.
01:28:04
Speaker
Any final thoughts on Black Phone? The Black Phone. The Black Phone. Before we wrap it up here? we talked about basically everything. i think we gave this movie great coverage.
01:28:18
Speaker
Like I said, this movie is an enjoyable move like you don't watch it and feel good while watching it but i I think it's just masterfully done i think it's the best thing Scott Derrickson has made so far I just have a great appreciation I could watch this tonight again I'm excited to see where my relationship with this movie goes because now I have this newfound love for it much like when I revisited Smile last year i had this newfound love and went into Smile 2 so excited
01:28:51
Speaker
I'm happy about the state of modern horror franchises with Terrifier, Smile, Black Phone. When they're in the hands of creators... i mean, Smile might be a little studio-driven, but the same creators at the helm of it.
01:29:07
Speaker
When these creators are staying attached to it and they're really putting themselves into these movies... Comes across on screen and I think it makes a lasting impression on the audience.
01:29:24
Speaker
And because of these movies, I like where we're at with modern horror franchises. There's been some movies that you know have a fresh twist on things. like I've said it many times before. i was not intending to watch Terrifier at all, but now I actually love that franchise.
01:29:44
Speaker
I'm so excited for the next one to come out. Again, I'm not a fan of this film, but i can appreciate it a little bit more.
Future Film Series and Past Episode Recommendations
01:29:53
Speaker
i just wouldn't want to watch it again.
01:29:56
Speaker
and I am excited to see part two. I don't know what the hell they're going to do, but you know, Sinister wasn't a terrible film, guys, if you haven't watched or even listened our episodes on Sinister and Sinister 2.
01:30:13
Speaker
At least watch the first one. That one's worth watching. It has some good scares in there. But yeah, this movie, so much better. So pretty hyped to see the next one.
01:30:25
Speaker
Just a real quick side note. Yeah, just if you've been like looking to watch any or listen to any of our previous episodes or if you've just been going down a rabbit hole listening to all of them, give some love to some of the Sinister Movies. Or even Child's Play
Call to Action and Listener Engagement
01:30:44
Speaker
2.
01:30:44
Speaker
i don't know why. i keep re-watching child or re-listening to Child's Play 2. I feel like we have some funny banter in there. so We do. Yeah, that's that's been my favorite one. But also just rate us five stars on Apple Podcasts and Spotify and go follow us on our page or share what you think of what we got going on here our Instagram, morbid underscore curiosities underscore P-O-D.
01:31:10
Speaker
While we're throwing out favorite episodes, our last one, Coraline, I thought was pretty great. If you haven't listened to that, go check that one out too. And we're still taking listener submissions for listener picks.
01:31:25
Speaker
We're doing one the first Monday in November, so go over to our Instagram. Mercedes already threw it out there. Send us an email at morebecuriosities10 at gmail.com.
01:31:37
Speaker
Leave us five-star review, comment on this episode. We'll put them all on our list for movies to cover. Hell yeah. Just stay tuned for everything else. We've been Morbid Curiosities.
01:31:49
Speaker
Let's fucking go.