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Building a Hospital – a conversation with Dr Matee Rajput
40 Plays26 days ago
God will never make you poor, if you give to the poor
Dr Matee Rajput is the Surgical Director at KSL Clinic, and one of the leading hair transplant surgeons in the UK.
Dr Matee is also, with his four brothers a founder of the SAMR Trust. a charity that was inspired by the way his father lived his life.
In this episode of the Abeceder work life balance podcast Rest and Recreation Dr Matee explains to Michael Millward how his father instilled in his children the importance of helping people who are less fortunate than yourself.
Dr Matee tells the family story about how his father’s experience led him to adopting a life devoted to helping others, and the commitment he and his brothers made when they became doctors to following his example.
Building a hospital in the village that he grew up in was a dream for his father. Following his death his sons decided to make the dream a reality.
Dr Matee describes the experience of building the hospital in Pakistan and why and how it is developing.
The episode will inspire you to make your dreams a reality.
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Transcript
Podcast Introduction and Guest Overview
00:00:05
Speaker
on zencastr Hello and welcome to Rest and Recreation, the work-life balance podcast from Abbasida. I'm your host, Michael Millward.
00:00:17
Speaker
Today I am talking to Dr. Matti Rajput about how to build a hospital in your spare time.
Zencastr Promotion
00:00:26
Speaker
As the jingle at the start of this podcast says, rest and recreation is made on Zencastr because Zencastr is the all-in-one podcasting platform that really does make making podcasts so easy.
00:00:40
Speaker
If you would like to try podcasting, use the link in the description to say visit zencastr.com. It applies an automatic discount on the subscription. Now that I have told you how wonderful Zencast is for making podcasts, we should make one.
00:00:57
Speaker
One that will be well worth listening to, liking, downloading and subscribing to. As with every episode of Rest and Recreation, we will not be telling you what to think, but we are hoping to make you think.
Meet Dr. Matti Rajput
00:01:11
Speaker
Today's rest and recreation guest is Dr. Matti Rajput Dr. Matti is a follicular unit extraction surgeon I will ask him to explain that He is based in the north-west of England When I travel west across the Pennines As a Yorkshireman, I always make my return, definitely return travel arrangements with the Ultimate Travel Club because as a member of the Ultimate Travel Club, I can access trade prices on flights, hotels, trains, holidays and all sorts of other travel related purchases.
00:01:44
Speaker
You can also access those trade prices on travel by joining the Ultimate Travel Club. There is a link that includes a discount on membership fees in the description. Now that I have paid some bills, it is time to make an episode of Rest and Recreation and say, hello, Dr. Matty.
00:02:01
Speaker
Yeah, hi, Michael. Can we start, please, by you explaining what type of surgeon are you? So I'm a hair restoration surgeon. I so essentially just focus on folliculate unit extraction, as you mentioned earlier, which is essentially taking a single hair follicle on one part of the head and transplanting that hair follicle into area where it's needed.
00:02:24
Speaker
Whereabouts do you have your clinics? Yes, so we I'm the surgical director at KSL Clinic, which has ah clinics in Manchester, London, Kent and Dublin as well.
Inspiration and Philanthropic Roots
00:02:37
Speaker
Wow. Today we're talking about building a hospital and set up a trust yeah as well, the Samar Trust. What was the inspiration? It all began before my father came to the UK from Pakistan as a teacher.
00:02:52
Speaker
One of the requirements for his visas ah before he came to UK in 1987 was that he needed to get a medical done in Islamabad, which is the capital of Pakistan. Coming from a very humble background, he didn't have the money for the medical assessment.
00:03:06
Speaker
So he offered the doctor his watch. The doctor smiled at him and said, don't worry about about it. Just make a prayer for me and make sure you when you go over there, you do something good for other people as well.
00:03:18
Speaker
Paying it forward. yeah that statement that the doctor made to him stuck um with my dad my dad then became a chaplain or imam in the local mosque in skipton in the yorkshireales from day one my dad always exercised that as long as you had a roof over your head and food on the table, any extra you should always give it to less fortunate. So he would send money abroad, help the people in and around Skipton. So that was always instilled in us from day one.
00:03:50
Speaker
And he would always remind us, the the doctor that showed him kindness. So every time, ah important occasions, he would always, always, always remind us of that story and always told us to educate ourselves.
00:04:02
Speaker
And from a very humble background, he's managed to raise three doctors in the
Healthcare Disparities Discussion
00:04:06
Speaker
family. Then he made us all promise that as soon as we are capable, we have to build a hospital in his village because people there struggle just to have daily bread, dying of simple illnesses, just miscarriage, childbirth complications and simple infections, which we have vaccinations for. And if someone had a stroke, that was it.
00:04:26
Speaker
There's no coming back. There's no like, you know, going to the hospital because the hospitals would be three to four hours away from rural villages. Yes. I was working in Africa and met someone yeah who had told me that their child had died and a diarrhea that killed them.
00:04:41
Speaker
And of course, diarrhea here in the UK is like, it's unpleasant. It's unfortunate. But we have medicines, we have doctors. It's not something that people die of in the UK, but to actually talk to someone who had lost a child because they couldn't get the drugs, they couldn't get them rehydrated, is really some of those things that makes you really think.
Samar Trust Initiatives
00:04:59
Speaker
I've never seen my father get ever emotional. So in 2009, summer, I qualified at Kiss College London. My father said, this is the day that I've been waiting for, that the first doctor in the family. He said, you have to promise me this, that third of your income,
00:05:15
Speaker
It's for yourself. third of your income is to help your family, like your brothers and sisters if they need. A third of your income, you have to give it to the poor. Promise me that now. yeah And I've stuck to that principle of that.
00:05:26
Speaker
So between 2009 and 2013, my dad was helping people just sending money abroad on a small scale, like a group of children who were orphans that needed help. He was paid their tuition fees in Pakistan. Or if someone needed to help with building the house because she was a widow and didn't have any sources of income and a house collapsed and paying someone to have a water well, things like that. He was doing all these tiny little things.
00:05:50
Speaker
And then we said, why don't we just formalise and make it into... ah charity even though the people that are going to be supporting it is going to be ourselves ah predominantly. So in 2013, we set up Summer Trust.
00:06:02
Speaker
Where does the name come from? We came up with it because it's an abbreviation of S-A-M-R. That's abbreviation of my dad, my mum and my grandparents, and it's a homage to them. And also Samar, also the word Samar in Arabic means fruits. It's believed that the tree in heaven is called, the the fruits in heaven are called Samarat.
00:06:23
Speaker
ah In Arabic, the word is Samarat, which means summer. So it means fruits. So whatever you put in, you kind of grow. ah So that's where the concept is. ah comes from. Our actual logo is a family encased within a leaf.
00:06:37
Speaker
You grow like the society, you grow the family in a nice way. What we started first doing was doing building water wells in Uganda, in Pakistan, and also um water filtration plants in in deserts.
00:06:51
Speaker
I've been in the Sahara and seen water which no one can drink. yeah In deserts you can find water but it's just undrinkable. But if you purify it, filtration plants, then you enable people to to drink it.
00:07:03
Speaker
Yeah, so in places like Uganda, that's exactly what we do. And you'll be surprised because it looks all green around, but the amount of diseases and the water is undrinkable. So you have to dig holes up to like 200 feet to actually get the pure water. And then within that, you place filters in there. It's essentially like bottled water. The local health ministry then comes and checks the water every six months to make sure that it's safe.
00:07:26
Speaker
That's when the Summer Trust started becoming quite active. And then we started getting some family friends and people from Skipton and helping to contribute. So we started expanding our projects slowly, slowly and started to organise winter food programmes and summer food programmes where people in the mountains, in the Himalayas, in Kashmir, where people didn't have any access to any land because people live so sporadically.
00:07:48
Speaker
ah So that before the snow came in, you would make sure that they'd have enough food for like three to four months to get through those periods or in the desert in the summer where it's so dry that nothing happens.
00:07:59
Speaker
ah You give them food, say, maybe in March, April, just to get through, you know, the the harshest ah months. Yeah, right. And it's giving people a a healthy, balanced diet means that you can prevent yeah all sorts of other health issues later in that person's life. Yeah, lot of these people were dying from poor sanitation and malnutrition.
00:08:19
Speaker
At the same time, we were also running medical camps in which we were doing scans and things like that remotely. we would send a doctor remotely just to do scans. And also at the same time, you know, they would take like emergency pharmacy with them because the doctor may only come once every six months and would give them like a medication supply for six months. So that's the kind of challenges that we
Challenges in Rural Healthcare
00:08:40
Speaker
had. You have to understand people who just struggle to just feed themselves.
00:08:43
Speaker
Health is ah right at the bottom of their concern. And people could just live with health problems without even knowing them or without even knowing they they've even had that problem. It's almost like this is how you're living. This is your normal life. yeah You don't realize because nobody's told you that actually you've got this medical condition. If you can clear it up, then you'll be able to do so much more.
00:09:06
Speaker
Yeah, it's an interesting, it's more than interesting that with a small group of people inspired by one man, can such a such big change on lots of people's lives.
00:09:20
Speaker
Coming on to how we got into the hospital, round about 2018, 2019, we made plans to build the hospital. We acquired the land, we did all of that. And then, you know, round about 2019, we and 2020 when COVID hit.
00:09:34
Speaker
So the plans kind of got delayed ah in that sense. And then unfortunately, my father passed away due to COVID. Before he went on ventilation, his last words ah were, be good to yourself, ah out to each other.
00:09:47
Speaker
And never forget the poor or never forget someone who comes and asks for help. And his last statement was God will take care of everything because he was a very spiritual man. And he said, don't worry about anything else. Just remember those two things. Be good to yourselves, as in you brothers, and ah never, ever turn away someone who asks for help.
00:10:05
Speaker
that That was his statement, last statement that we know. And then he said, God, everything else will take care of yourself. Do not worry about it.
Hospital Project Launch and Impact
00:10:13
Speaker
He was that kind of person who would go to sleep and knowing that tomorrow will be a better day. That was his mentality. As soon as he passed away, we all sat down and thought, how can we quickly fulfill his dream? Actually, in the year he passed, we then went and laid the foundations of the hospital together with his brothers who were still in Pakistan.
00:10:31
Speaker
We appointed an accountant to look after the project in Pakistan and myself and my brothers were managing it from UK. He was a retired military commander and who was also involved in doing lots of charity work. He had a construction company and he took it upon a duty upon himself.
00:10:47
Speaker
And he was amazed at fact that a group of doctors from UK are building a hospital in Pakistan. So he gave us his full support. He said, I'm going to get this project ready for you six months quicker than you anticipate because I believe in this. I want to have a share in and the good work that you're doing. So along the way, we met lots of people who wanted to support We got support from the local health ministry. We got the support.
00:11:07
Speaker
All the local authority was was just so happy that someone from abroad is something doing good doing something good. So we didn't have any issues. And then and being ah you know in the private healthcare care sector, as well as the and NHS, so our income, or myself and my brothers, were enough for us to set some money aside for us to start building this project. And then we did a few charity campaigns amongst our friends and colleagues. Yeah.
00:11:29
Speaker
ah rather than, you know, the wider world where we actually were managed to fund the hospital. Within 18 months, the hospital was up. Initially, we thought we were only going to treat about 50 to 100 people on a daily basis.
00:11:42
Speaker
The hospital opened in February of last year. So it's been open for 18 months. So it's February 2024, you opened the hospital. Yes.
00:11:52
Speaker
To our amazement, and the hospital has just taken a life of its own, where we now we initially thought we're just going to to be doing our patients' investigations and treating minor ailments and minor surgeries.
00:12:05
Speaker
That was our aim. If someone came with a heart attack, someone came with a stroke, someone came with a broken leg, our responsibility was to actually just to stabilise them, to save their life yeah ah before they get transferred. so But the hospital, just it's just...
00:12:19
Speaker
took a life of his own and we're now getting over 600 patients on a daily basis so we've had to massively now start stage two which is the expansion of the hospital right because of the demand that's been placed on it and it's gone way beyond our expectations but we're getting lots of support from high profile surgeons and doctors who want to be part of the project simply because they are seeing this project being really successful what we've done is subsidized it hugely so there's no fee to see a doctor Typically in Pakistan, you pay about, you could even to UK about £10 to see your doctor, which is a lot money in there. But we've waived that fee. We even give the medications in that hospital that we supply are the same medication you and I would be buying over a pharmacy in UK or would be getting it through our doctors. They're not local medicines, they're international, high quality medications, and we heavily subsidise those. So, for example, typical C-section in Pakistan would be costing...
00:13:18
Speaker
let's say 100,000 rupees, our place they would only be paying 25, which is to cover the cost. So we've heavily subsidised everything and it's something that people can afford. 99% of the population can afford
Funding and Philosophy of Giving
00:13:30
Speaker
that. Those who can't afford and you know to contribute or to pay to anything, we then have a fund set up yeah for those. So we have like a 10% of our funding allocated for people who can't afford treatment. They get free of charge treatment in those areas.
00:13:45
Speaker
So it's essentially... A new concept, hospital. You'd be amazed. It's actually more efficiently run than anything that we see in UK. We have our own hospital lab in which basically the patient is getting live updates, saying your appointment is slightly delayed, don't come now, or your blood test is done, hear the results. You can download your history anywhere, you know your medical history, your investigations, and it tells you step by step. And it also tells the surgeon step by step what's happening. I can monitor everything from here.
00:14:15
Speaker
I can check every patient's result yeah through the app. yeah If I wanted to say what's happening with this patient, what's happening. It's a very advanced system and it is allowing us to ah basically manage 500 to 600 patients on a daily basis in a very rural area with limited resources.
00:14:31
Speaker
Limited resources, but where did the resources come from? the The patients themselves are making a contribution, but you talked about subsidising it. Who's doing the subsidising? So that's myself and my brother. So each month the hospital runs on a £10,000 deficit. Right.
00:14:46
Speaker
defit And then during Ramadan, we asked people to contribute a little bit, but we've just done a hundred thousand pound expansion, which means new, new theatres, new baby units. so So things like that. We'll do a campaign.
00:14:58
Speaker
When my father said, you have to contribute a certain aspect of your income to charity. So we're five brothers and that we're we're always going to contribute this much of our income to that.
00:15:10
Speaker
and So out of the five brothers, three of you are doctors. All five have agreed to follow your father's wish that a third of your income would go towards helping other people who are less at fewer advantages than you did. And out of that, you have created health care system. It's not just a building. It's a health care system yeah that is treating five to six hundred people every day. And it's going to get bigger. We've now just bought a laparoscopic machine, which then means you can do all the laparoscopic surgeries more safely on a higher scale. The the actual technical skill is there, yes but it's the equipment and it's the facilities that are not available in Pakistan. So you've got one of the best surgeons in the world there or the ah clinicians there with all the knowledge, but they don't have the actual facilities. And and if someone just provided those facilities, then you have better life and you know better care even in rural areas.
00:16:03
Speaker
Yes, it's absolutely amazing what it is that you have been able to achieve. I'm not very often lost for words, but there are people in the world that you wish you had had the opportunity to mate.
00:16:15
Speaker
And the way in which you have done this, and when you talk about the inspiration for it your father is someone that would have been great to be able to meet he got to watch he was prepared to sacrifice that in order to just have the medical assessment yeah that would decide whether he was going to be able to move to the united kingdom or not shows the just the the desire to improve life my my father was muslim and as we we are we're muslims as well so it comes from statement in the quran says God will never make you poor if you give to the poor.
00:16:48
Speaker
yeah That's a rule. So you start small, you know, being privileged to travel to Mecca and Medina, and you see these massive towers that are built there, and they're owned by these Arab sheikhs, and you ask them, what's the story behind them?
00:17:01
Speaker
The one guy which was selling eggs, he started off selling eggs in barefooted. And I once ah barefooted, ah he still visited the mosque, Holy Mosque, in his bare feet. He gets out of a Rolls Royce, but walks barefooted.
00:17:14
Speaker
And once a cleaner in the mosque offered him his shoes saying, why are you walking barefooted? He goes, no, no. This to remind me what I was and what I am today. And what he did was every time he sold 100 eggs, five eggs he would give to charity. It starts off simple, like we grew up in ah in a council house in Skipton.
00:17:31
Speaker
But within that, my dad, he would tell us that he has to say this much. to give to charity. So it's always been in brill. And then you you you see around you examples, people who do charity, they always live happy.
00:17:43
Speaker
They always con content with life and with those who help others. And you never see them struggling in life as, you know, they don't have they don't have to deal with the stresses because when they go to sleep, they sleep go to sleep with...
00:17:55
Speaker
some kind of satisfaction, some kind of contentment that actually I've made a difference, I've done something good, therefore i have nothing to stress, nothing to worry about, whatever life throws at you. And that's the concept that my dad, even his last words were, do not worry about anything, as long as you're doing those two things, unity and trust, and also helping the helping the needy, and then don't worry about anything else. And we've We've tried ah after his death to fulfill that and to continue that.
00:18:22
Speaker
Yes. And that's what I mean in many ways, is that just an ordinary man has a dream. He's prepared to sacrifice things for his dream, never forgets where he came from yeah and passes on yep to his family that idea that straightforward, you will never be poor.
00:18:41
Speaker
financially or in any other way as long as you give to people who are less fortunate than yourself yeah and it's a message that i think needs to be amplified much more in the world that is i think is becoming increasingly self-centered around what i want what's good for me what rather than looking at someone and going that person is suffering what can i do to help Yeah. So continuing that forward, ah even in UK, ah especially even in this very divisive um times we live in, one of the fortunate things that had happened to myself is KSL company was bought by a pension fund. So I had a share in that company. So as soon as that share was sold, there was a church in my local local area that wasn't being used for anything.
00:19:28
Speaker
and We bought it and turned it into a community centre now. It's used for all sorts of things. and um One of my brother runs it. Essentially, you're getting kids doing tuition there. There's a day where the elderly come and sit down, just have tea and coffee.
00:19:42
Speaker
There's a kid's football on a Friday evening rather than them, you know, going around doing all sorts of wrong things. There's about 60, 70 kids who play football. After football, they have pizzas. You have a group of volunteers.
00:19:54
Speaker
There are people who work in Canary Wharf. There are people who work in, you know, who have really good jobs. They just give their time and they just encourage these kids that actually we've made it. We're doing something good. Tomorrow, you guys can of you guys can do that. And so it keeps them away from wrong. So were we're we're doing that in the local community and also yes ah we're now developing a smart food bank system.
00:20:16
Speaker
So where basically you can, through an app of your phone, you can start helping people ah in your local area, either by volunteering or just helping, like say, for example, I give you, ah you've got an elderly lady living down your street,
00:20:30
Speaker
And she's on the, ah she's one of the people on the app who needs help with certain things. You can remotely just help her by organizing a cleaner for her for the day or organizing a shopping for the day.
00:20:41
Speaker
you understand? Just to help people who are struggling in your local area. So that will hopefully we think we're probably going to get it ready by Christmas. I will have to talk about that in more detail when it when it's ready to launch. But yeah the lesson that I am taking from yeah what you've been talking about, and it is a learning experience, is that you don't need to have vast amounts of something in order to be able to help someone else. No, you don't.
00:21:08
Speaker
You're down. if you think about the times when ah other people have been kind to you, if for every time that someone is kind to us, we are kind to two other people, the world will become a kinder place.
00:21:22
Speaker
And that is the the sort of lesson that I think... I'm very grateful for you to sharing your father's story and how that has inspired you.
00:21:33
Speaker
And hopefully other people will also have felt that inspiration as well. Because I think it's just, you can go from having very little, But you are rich in lots of ways because you share what you have and you recognize that no matter how unfortunate you may think you are, because you haven't got the latest a pair of trainers or the latest iPhone or whatever,
00:22:02
Speaker
you actually are very well off and we need to be more aware of those people who can benefit from yeah the things that we are able to do to support them and that isn't always simply money time energy are much more valuable contributions to the world you remember what jimmy carr i think he did a podcast last year and he said The poorest person in UK who lives in a council house, who gets benefits, who gets everything done, is able to have a roof over his head. He's able to feed himself three times a day.
00:22:36
Speaker
is able to buy all the clothes that he needs and have some money left over. Yes. And it can have a warm water bath. And this is a luxury only afforded by aristocracy and royalty 100 years ago.
00:22:48
Speaker
Yes. He literally said that he goes, this is how much we are moving forward and people are so much hell bent on all these things. But people actually, when they take a step back and actually think, actually...
00:23:00
Speaker
ah Why am I blaming this on that? You know, whether you're blaming on immigrants or whether you're blaming it that part society. If you actually look at yourself and think, actually, I've got these opportunities in my life.
00:23:11
Speaker
I've got all of this stuff. Why am I not happy? Why am I not bettering myself? And why am I not doing ah doing things to help other people or spread kindness? Why am I not doing that? Yes, we could go on to another topic, but of which I would so remind you, if you think yourself poor, but you're miserable, you believe you're miserable because you are poor, you win the lottery, you move into a big house, you have someone to cook your meals, so you have someone to clean your house, you have someone to drive you around.
00:23:40
Speaker
Nothing really changes. You'll still be miserable. You're just in a bigger house. yeah You have to find the things in life that will bring you happiness, make you joyful.
00:23:52
Speaker
And those are very rarely things that are focused on you as an individual. As human beings, I firmly believe that we are happiest when we are helping our fellow man.
Inspirational Advice and Overcoming Challenges
00:24:05
Speaker
Yes, I was fortunate enough to do an elective in Harvard in um in Massachusetts General. And the professor who was head of the department in paediatric and a neuro ITU was Professor Nowitzki, his name was, and he was also an immigrant from Israel. He told me this and he was so kind to me. And he said, look, I also find it difficult here because I'm from Israel as an immigrant and my parents were were also affected by the Holocaust.
00:24:32
Speaker
At that time, when I went to do my elective, there wasn't that many Asian doctors in there. And so he was so nice. He goes, because i mean and I'm in a similar situation to you because I come from abroad here and people weren't too kind to me at the beginning. But because I've been, I didn't let it affect me and I've been so kind to everyone.
00:24:52
Speaker
Over time, people have warmed up to me. And he goes, that's the piece of advice that I would give you. So for example, like and my father always said, every night before you go to sleep, remove any hatred towards another human being, however bad they've done, whatever they've done, however much they upset you, remove the hatred from your heart and go sleep with a clean conscience.
00:25:10
Speaker
And tomorrow will be always be a better day. And he also believed in the concept of, you know, kill them with your kindness. Like show if someone is mean to you, show them even more kindness. So they'll either learn from their lesson or there's only limitations to what they can affect you if you let them affect you. And so that concept from that professor always stuck with me.
00:25:28
Speaker
And I've been really fortunate to be blessed by people like that ah in my life. My father and, you know, also professors that I've met throughout my you know medical time. Yes, there is a thing that I was taught when I was working in Hong Kong, talking to a Chinese colleague about recruitment.
00:25:44
Speaker
And they said to me, tell me about the clubs that these candidates belong to. yeah And I said, why? I'm interested in their ability to do their job, not which clubs they go to. yep And he said, because good people hang out with good people and bad guys hang out with whoever they can.
00:25:59
Speaker
And it's that same sort of attitude is that if regardless of how badly someone one treats you, you respond with kindness. yeah It's unnerving for them. And they are, like you say, people respond to kindness.
00:26:12
Speaker
There's always a reason why someone is is a nasty individual. And if you if you respond in the same way as their nastiness has been caused, yeah you will get more of it back. If you show the other side of human nature, then you will get a positive response. So you create in other people the response that you receive by the way in which you treat them.
00:26:37
Speaker
We must talk about this again, and I look forward to hearing about your Foodbank app at another time. But for the moment, Dr. Matty, it has been very interesting and inspirational. I really do thank you for your time. Thank you. It's been great. Thank you.
00:26:51
Speaker
Thank you. I am Michael Millward, the Managing Director of Abusida. In this episode of Rest and Recreation, I have been having a conversation with Dr. Matty Rajput, a follicular surgeon, hair transplant specialist.
00:27:07
Speaker
You can find out more about both of us by following the links in the description. At Rest and Recreation, we believe in a health and happiness. We can't make you happy, but one of the best ways to stay healthy is to know the risks early.
00:27:19
Speaker
That is why we recommend the health tests available from York Test, especially the annual health test. The annual health test from York Test provides an assessment of 39 different health markers, including cholesterol, diabetes, vitamin levels, organ functions, the list goes on.
00:27:36
Speaker
The annual health test is conducted by an experienced phlebotomist who will complete a full blood draw at your home or workplace. Hospital standard tests are carried out in a yeah UK AS accredited and CQC compliant laboratory.
00:27:49
Speaker
You can access your easy to understand results and guidance to help you make it effective lifestyle changes anytime via your secure Personal Wellness Hub account. There is a link and as you would expect a discount code in the description.
00:28:03
Speaker
I'm sure that you will have enjoyed listening to this episode of Rest and Recreation as much as Dr. Matty and I have enjoyed making it. So please give it a like and download it so you can listen anytime, anywhere.
00:28:16
Speaker
To make sure you don't miss out on future episodes, please subscribe and share the link with your friends, your family and your work colleagues as well. Remember, the aim of all the podcasts produced by Abusida is not to tell you what to think, but we do hope to make you think.
00:28:33
Speaker
Until the next episode of Rest and Recreation, thank you for listening and goodbye.