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Bash Them Brains - Toughness In America
74 Plays1 year ago
The "Pieces" discuss the appeal of violent sports in America. Does watching or participating in violence fufill some human biological need? Does society give a crap about atheletes who put their bodies and brains on line everyday? If you expect these two "Pieces" to have the answers then you're new to this podcast.
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Transcript
Personal Experiences and Concerns with Violent Sports
00:00:35
Speaker
I hear you love watching tough guys jack each other up for big paydays in m MMA, boxing and the NFL. Is that because you're tough as nails bro? You relate to those modern day gladiators because your brother used to torture you with noogies and charley horses?
00:00:50
Speaker
But have you seen someone you care about unconscious from head trauma? Have you actually seen a friend or family member struggle with a truly bad concussion? Have you ever felt the fear of not knowing whether your loved ones brain was going to swell or bleed out as they lay down to sleep for the night? Have you watched a friend or family member try to recover from a bad concussion? Forced to avoid light, complex tasks and physical activity while sleeping 14 plus hours over days and even weeks?
00:01:18
Speaker
Have you watched them suffer through extended migraines and confusion? Have you taken them to get their third um MRI and listened to the doctor explain the life-altering risks of future head trauma? If you've answered yes, then I doubt you watch violent sports nonchalantly. When someone understands the true cost of the entertainment they're watching, they respect the violence.
00:01:41
Speaker
Years after the discovery of CTE in football players and boxers, punctuated by the brutal suicides and early deaths of famous athletes like Junior Seau, we seem to be back to freely celebrating head busting sports. While the NFL today has made some changes to make pro football a bit more safe, like trying to minimize kickoffs and direct head blows, we still get a juicy helping of collisions every game.
00:02:05
Speaker
It's funny to watch the defensive players adjust to more restrictive tackling rules. so I'm sure they're all thinking, isn't my whole job an inherent concussion risk for me and the people I hit? When Miami quarterback Tua Tonga Beloya got another concussion in 2024, people were worried he'd retire.
00:02:23
Speaker
To his head trauma had been characterized as medically concerning and yet, he decided to keep playing. There was a lot of commentary about his toughness, but toughness doesn't prevent future concussions, so his decision to keep playing is interesting from afar. Perhaps the financial rewards are just too big to pass up, or perhaps he just has way more societal validation to keep playing football than to walk away from it.
00:02:46
Speaker
The NFL has become such an ingrained cultural phenomenon that most of us don't even think about the lifelong injuries football players will sustain. If Tua develops Parkinson's when he's 45, we won't remember all the times his head got smashed in the 2020s. We'll just think, man, that is sad. And we'll go on watching the current NFL games of the day. I wonder if society justifies the health risks of the NFL because players get big money.
00:03:13
Speaker
But I think we forget, most football players never come close to the NFL. And they still
Society's Relationship with Sports Violence
00:03:19
Speaker
accumulate 12 plus years of head trauma from youth football through college. My skinny ass played eight seasons of football, one of those in college. I believe I had three legitimate concussions in football, two playing youth football and another one senior year in high school. If I could go back in time, I tell my younger self to stick to basketball. Maybe I'm a little bitch.
00:03:42
Speaker
I'm such a little bitch that I have a hard time watching the UFC in boxing now. Whenever I walk into a family-friendly sports bar and see men and women destroying each other in a cage, I'm like, Jesus Christ, should kids see this UFC shit? You know the big Netflix event with Jake Paul and Mike Tyson and how it was pretty underwhelming? But did you happen to see the female fight just before between Katie Taylor and Amanda Serrano? That was some serious boxing violence, and it was hard for me to watch.
00:04:12
Speaker
The growth of the UFC and apparent resurgence of boxing signals the new distorted era of toughness that I can't imagine is good for our long-term psyche. We've convinced ourselves violent sports are about celebrating our warrior roots, but the many athletes that do this for a living have serious long-term health consequences.
00:04:32
Speaker
Isn't it interesting most fighters come from poverty-stricken neighborhoods and otherwise disadvantaged backgrounds? Who else is going to take that kind of risk? Who else is signing up for early onset dementia? You just don't understand fighting lance. Boxing and mixed martial arts takes discipline and intelligence. The footwork, the strategy. Do you know how hard it is to master grappling techniques? Do you understand fight management? Do you even know what an in-fighter is versus a pressure fighter in boxing?
00:05:02
Speaker
Nope. I don't know shit about that stuff. I will freely admit those athletes are amazing specimens of focus, discipline, and hard work. It's not that the UFC and boxing fighters aren't impressive. It's that they're so athletically spectacular that it's strange how willing they are to risk severe, lifelong injury. There's plenty of technique and strategy and athletic talent and freestyle and Greco-Roman wrestling, but nobody wants to watch that on prime time because those athletes don't brutalize each other.
00:05:30
Speaker
Regular wrestling is too boring for American society. So don't tell me you value fighting technique and strategy. You value the devastating violence. And this is the most fascinating thing to me about America's love of violence. The more serious the injury consequences athletes face, the more entertaining.
00:05:48
Speaker
Suppose American laws loosened in our society to where fighting to the death was legalized. Do you doubt for one second whether some entrepreneur would step up to promote those fights? Of course someone would, and Netflix would probably find a way to pay for the rights. Do you think you'd watch a fight to the death?
00:06:07
Speaker
I bet many Americans would, especially if the losing fighter's family got a big payday. I bet our current president
Children, Sports, and Societal Norms
00:06:13
Speaker
would gladly show up to a fight to the death, and I'm guessing he'd call the dead fighter a total loser. As much as America's acceptance of violence has me concerned, I think it's important to point out that the gladiator games during the Roman Empire lasted seven centuries. Most of those fighters were criminals or prisoners of war, and sometimes they fought to the death.
00:06:35
Speaker
If it wasn't for those damn Christians, the gladiator games may have never been banned. So we've got 700 more years of UFC cage fighting to look forward to. Are we capable of evolving past our violent impulses? Or will we bash them brains until we die off as a species or get replaced by intelligent robots? You tell me. I'm just a little bitch.
00:07:31
Speaker
just woke up from a nap Oh yeah? Yeah, need a lot of sleep, dude. That's some retirement shit right there, especially in the US, a nap. No, that's a life full of concussions. Oh, yeah. You've got, did you, how many times did you ever get fully knocked out cold in your athletic career? No, not knocked out. I saw stars, kind of was confused. I got knocked out snowboarding where I just like, all of a sudden I'm i'm going off a cliff.
00:08:00
Speaker
And then the next thing I know, I'm on the lift saying stupid shit. My friends are like, you all right, buddy? And I'm like, what what happened? um And i yeah I don't know, people that get concussions are kind of cranky. We've been around some ways and they're just like, shut up, shut the fuck up. How did I get on the lift? Yeah, yeah I'm sure they looked out for yeah nature ah you, were all right to keep going.
00:08:26
Speaker
They were like, dude, are you all right? That's a snowboarders. That's the extent of their concern. Yeah, bro. ah Yeah, just woke up from a nap. So it might be a little slow audience, but hey, what can you expect from a concussed individual? um Dude, it's impressive though they're even here. Like I cannot do naps because I can't function. I am, I become a concussed individual like the rest of the day.
00:08:54
Speaker
Hey, that's another episode. We should talk about napping. I'm sure that'll get people fired up. What about if you want to go off the rails right away? What about when back? you yeah I know you're so, so you only have two beers a day, but like ever, but when you get into a good day drinking run,
00:09:12
Speaker
And then you got that decision like mid-afternoon, like, do I just go go for it? Because if you fall asleep, you're you fucking done. Eight o'clock, feeling not hungover, just like a dizzy mess. You either got to rally it, like I'm going the distance or all right. That's what I feel about naps. It's kind of like I'm going down for the night if I'm taking a nap. Yeah, no, I yeah pretty much always went for the nap. I remember you back and like sneaking in like 15 minutes with like your head on a desk.
00:09:43
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Back in college, Bill. All right. Enough of that. Enough of that, dude. So when's Luca going to start training? Mixed martial arts.
00:09:55
Speaker
um That's a, I actually, dude, he was, some kids were pissing him off. It was like a couple of years ago. I actually talked to a guy that trains people like MMA, but it was more for like an exercise thing. Yeah, yeah. I actually talked to a guy. That was my solution.
00:10:13
Speaker
It was like violence always works. But is is that going on in the States? Like if you wanted your your teenager to train, is that like a normal thing now? Like sign up for Little League? I don't see it. i I'm sure it exists. I know there's a lot of self-defense stuff, but yeah, I'm sure there's so venues where mixed martial arts is big. or I'm sure even in this city, there's quite a few. I don't see them.
00:10:37
Speaker
and You got like the traditional like Taekwondo karate class on that kind of yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. kids doing these Yeah. If my kid was like, I want to train and do this stuff and my goal is to get in the cage. I'd just be like, I don't know, dude. I'd i'd fucking pick him up and move to the most liberal LGBTQ neighborhood I could possibly find. You mean stay in your neighborhood.
00:11:05
Speaker
I mean, it just seems like a terrible trajectory for ah physical health. But I know a lot of people would argue with this and this, ah the the whole intro, which is why I was calling myself a bitch.
00:11:17
Speaker
My whole intro, I know a lot of people, at least in this stage of American history, would be like, would you shut the fuck up? Would you just shut the fuck up, pussy? I'm
The Decision to Engage in Risky Sports
00:11:28
Speaker
sure that's a reaction that would be a reaction of a lot of people. Yeah, and I agree with them. how what's What's crazy about you, I don't really like, I'll say this, I don't really watch the UFC at all. I love watching boxing. And I will say from like a violence perspective, like I mean, if if a guy back in the mid 80s, even when I was young, like went more than around with Tyson, I was like so disappointed. Like there's nothing nothing brought me more joy than like when he knocked out Michael Spinks and it looked like Spinks looked like he was dead for like a few minutes. I was like, that was great. But so I'm not I'm not better than than anyone, but it doesn't
00:12:06
Speaker
It doesn't appeal to me that much, because I don't feel like these are like the best athletes in the world. I think if if I saw that, OK, really good athletes are getting into it, it might appeal to me. To me, it just seems like bar fights. And a lot of people would say I'm wrong. But um but the the fights are entertaining. But what I was going to say is like it seems like, for whatever reason, these this like UFC in particular appeals to so many more people than traditional sports now. like Somebody you might be like some geek.
00:12:34
Speaker
Who's into like shit, you know, whatever kids that just didn't get into sports. They like this stuff. Yeah, like it appeals like video game geek You know like even sports jock geek it appeals like everyone for some reason ah Yeah, I remember the first time I saw it I was like geez this is real and I don't know if the rules have changed in terms of how much they can do to each other, you know, in terms of physical violence. But like when I first saw it, I was like, damn, this is insane. It's hard to watch. And it's so ubiquitous now. Like I said, in a little intro, like, you can go into a sports bar and on a huge TV, amongst other things like golf and basketball, there's like dudes in a cage smashing each other's faces. It competes with the Super Bowl. Blood everywhere. Yeah. It's, uh,
00:13:27
Speaker
It's a strange phenomenon. And I don't know. I mean, what do you think about the athletes that do it? Yeah, that that I'm not sold on that yet. I mean, I'm sure they would beat the living fuck out of me. Well, like, or I don't want people to think that I think that they're not good fighters. I just don't like people to be like, these are the greatest fighters in the world. And I'm like, well, those are the people that are signing up. I mean, the same with boxing now. Like, I heard someone say that like Muhammad Ali, if he was he was growing up now, he would be he probably playing tight end for Louisville, not not boxing his way out of Louisville, right? University of Louisville or something like that. But like, do you feel like the best athletes are getting getting in into MMA? And that's that's where I'm at.
00:14:09
Speaker
Oh, you're you're concerned with that I'm more concerned of like, probably not the best all around athletes, but the most disadvantaged people that need to do something like that in order to make the motivation have a dream. Yeah, I think that's a sad consequence of this type of sport. But is that where it's at? Like that, that used to be boxing, that that was boxing, right? But like, is MMA and UFC like you are are the Because it seems like so it's so mainstream now. It seems like people not it has nothing to do with Economic level like it just seems like people just decide I'm a badass. I'm gonna do it
00:14:47
Speaker
There's probably some of those folks, I don't know who they are, but there has been a long standing criticism of the UFC and its pay structure. and And basically very few people reach that star status and how little you're paid on your journey up. And think about the risk you're taking on your way up. It's not the same risks that you're taking ah becoming a budget analyst in the corporate world to ultimately become a CFO.
00:15:13
Speaker
I mean, nowhere near. So, but there's no, um I don't know, I didn't redo all that research in terms of what health care options are provided for some of these guys in the grind. But- These guys, their career is like 15 fights. Yeah. pretty right Potentially unfortunate, but but with lifelong industries, like, I mean, you get your, you get an arm bar that goes wrong. You can so you can imagine what happens and, you know, obviously the head blows.
00:15:39
Speaker
are not necessarily immediate in terms of their consequence, but down the road, some shit could happen. But ah apparently boxing is is much worse from a head trauma perspective, because it's just constant hits to the head. Really? More bodily injury for UFC. But the point remains, like who goes into this? Why do they go into it? And why do we celebrate it? I have a friend, actually, I don't know if she listens, but I know my buddy Doug.
00:16:08
Speaker
St. Louis, thanks for listening, buddy. He listens, his wife, but ah who's actually at Costa Rican, she's she's fought, she's done a few fights. UFC or boxing? UFC. Okay, wow. Like at a, I don't know, regional level or something like that. But she loved it. She she absolutely loved it. I mean, it's like a professional, smart, smart person, as a doctorate, like, whatever, but she loved it.
00:16:36
Speaker
I don't know if it's like getting the aggression out or like she also like was probably in the best shape of her life when she did it, right? It was like training for the fight gives you motivation to get in shape. So some of that like, but that's but that's different than just like doing the exercise. People are doing a lot of this stuff for like to get in shape, kickboxing classes. She actually went in the ring. She's got six kills. She's killed seven, six women in the ring. So that's good. Well, you think this is just innate human craving?
00:17:06
Speaker
ah Become a warrior and see what you can do so like in the in the yeah olden days or in the historical ages, like a lot of the games that people played, well well, basically for humanity, a lot of the games we play are to get practice for something in the real world. So there were a lot of like fighting games and things like that when, you know, we were in our tribal era of humanity and learning to fight. And obviously that's not really necessary anymore, but there's something still there for people to get in and and want to do this. Do you think it's like a mating thing still?
00:17:42
Speaker
Yeah. and I'm not, I'm not sure, dude. I'm not sure. It's strange that you, it was strange that you have to ask her like, is that she's at a professional level, has a, has a real job, real life. And that that, that may be her escape of sorts, but, or I'm not sure what calls you to go in and do that. Yeah, but I think you probably do. Okay. Hit me.
00:18:05
Speaker
Let's just, okay. It's not, it's not as violent, but like you got off like playing hoops and getting super competitive about it. And there's like, you needed to compete. I think it's an extension of that. It's more violent, but it's like you got, you like when you didn't, you didn't go play pickup basketball at the Y you were playing in like rec leagues and shit. You weren't going there just for fucking exercise. I mean, a little bit, but like you were, you want to like go compete and win, right? I mean,
00:18:34
Speaker
Okay, fine. Again, when i a snaps guy I know you're a stats guy. and You were trying to put up a line. I get it. With all this conversations we have, we get to the concept of what's the line and what's our line versus other people's line.
00:18:51
Speaker
I mean, I'm going to play hoops tonight. It is for exercise, but I always feel better when I played well and I won. yeah Okay. Sure. But the, the risk to you is what the risk to you and the people that you're playing with is what you're going to break some ankles. You're going to break some ankles. They're going to what's going to happen. You're talking with me and my age and clumsiness. You're literally talking about potential for a broken ankle.
00:19:14
Speaker
not ah not a crossover highlight or something. Yeah, I could get hurt. Okay, you could get hurt. Hurt my back. But let's now let's put you in a UFC cage. I mean, but I'd be i'd be going against, I'd be going in a weight class and an age class, right? I don't fucking know anything about that stuff. I'm just saying the the the risk to you, would you reasonably consider that in your life right now? is this Is this the reason why I'm not doing it is because of the risk?
00:19:44
Speaker
I'm just asking. I'm just asking and like
Competition, Confrontation, and Modern Society
00:19:47
Speaker
what compels people to get in and do it. it's ah It's a challenge. Obviously, I get where people from poverty and disadvantaged backgrounds see it as a pathway to wealth and fame and an opportunity. But for other people that are compelled by it, I don't see the comparison of basketball being justified.
00:20:06
Speaker
It's like, oh, you're out there competing. Why don't you just get in the cage if you want to compete, you know? Why don't we just go to war? yeah Have you ever got close to or closer into like a physical confrontation playing hoops because someone's checking you up too hard or, you know, someone has someone was overweight on your team and you couldn't take it.
00:20:32
Speaker
not I can't think of one beyond maybe my teenage years. Come on, dude. Really? You never were like, oh, you want some of this? like that No, dude, because i haven I garner respect on the court where it's like nobody's fucking with me, bro.
00:20:48
Speaker
Why? What's the motivation? It has nothing to do with like, that sense of like physically dominating somebody. I think it's ah a bit of an extension of that. Not that what level you take it to, you're not ready to go bash someone's head in and in an arm bar or whatever the fuck in the in the ring, but you are like, we I mean, we all like a bit of physical confrontation sometimes.
00:21:09
Speaker
yeah um So I buy that argument. i actually buy I buy the argument that humanity is compelled to this type of violence. But I guess what I put in the intro is more of, is it cool to celebrate it and profit off of it? Is there a dark underbelly of of society as a result of supporting and and profiting off of this kind of stuff? Like who where are the consequences, the dead bodies that we don't see?
00:21:38
Speaker
Yeah, or the or the I mean, football has some of the same head trauma and all the stuff. And you see these guys, they're hurting later on in life. I mean, there is a you would you get you buy into like, no one's holding a gun to your head and making you fight. Like it's, it's a conscious decision. It's not like the gladiators that these these guys aren't slaves forced into combat.
00:22:02
Speaker
Well, it's sort of like signing up for a mortgage with ah a ah bad actor bank who doesn't disclose all of the ah things they've put in the fine print. they They're not very ah clear about it. I think that most people are signing up for the dream and that these leagues, well, they profit off of off of the dream without really outlining the consequences. Same with college football.
00:22:28
Speaker
You think people are like, I didn't know there was possible for head trauma and mixed martial arts fighting. Now you tell me after they're like crippled. I think people know they can get knocked out, but it wasn't until recently that there was a the studies available to give people insight into long-term consequences of just like early onset degenerative brain diseases.
00:22:50
Speaker
This might be kind of modern. like We might have talked about this one in shows, but there is a little like it when we played high even high school football. Oh, you got your bell rung? Just kind of silly stuff. like Oh, yeah, nothing. Yeah. yeah and Tough enough. Yeah, you got to toughen up. So I think some of this is.
00:23:08
Speaker
maybe somewhat new, the information and people find out about it. But it's it's funny that it doesn't matter. like there pride Football participation might be, I don't know if it's going down, but it doesn't seem like it. There's enough what enough kids to field a team everywhere, right? like We know this could fuck us up and we keep doing it.
00:23:26
Speaker
Well, so that's the premise, I'd say oh a large part of the premise of the intros. You got information about the consequences of these sports and the participation did die down. And actually like people had a certain call it woke pussiness about it. And now it's back up.
00:23:45
Speaker
to where we just ignore it. Football is more popular than it's ever been. ah The UFC is more popular than it's ever been. Boxing is resurging, ah given some prominent people coming back into the ring and doing stupid things. But ah it's it's interesting to me. We just just choose to ignore it. And I'll go back to like our experience in football. I mean, we did drills where we laid on our back and we stood 10 yards from somebody. They blew the whistle, we rolled over and then we sprint full speed at each other and smashed each other. lean and whoever with the crown of the hell yeah I was taught to tackle with my helmet in the chest of the other player.
00:24:28
Speaker
and we would drive see who could drive the other back or just we both just knock knocked each other onto the ground and that those drills were every practice for me. What's
Youth Sports and Health Implications
00:24:40
Speaker
funny too is is you know you got four years of high school like sometimes you're doing those drills either either you're the young kid and you're getting your ass or you're like i'm gonna knock I'm gonna knock the living shit out of this poor kid if you're fifty pounds heavier yeah whatever you've had right more opportunity to work out or you're like but it's not but everyone's like get up keep going i don't know what they do now i think they do less contact right less frequent uh but i would say too like i don't know what they do in youth but that's where i was pretty brutalized if you just look at
00:25:13
Speaker
the variability in when people go through puberty, sixth through eighth grade is dramatically different. In my area couldn't be over 150 I think and and play in ah in the league I was in or something in seventh grade.
00:25:31
Speaker
And you had to have certain weight to play running back and things like that. But you still saw muscle structure that was different. And then one of those muscle dudes hit you, your bells were wrong. They're much stronger. It's like your body would stop working for a split second. Like your whole body would like you'd like stop breathing, your head would you just be like, and then on your back, yeah back to work. And didn't you get used to ignoring that?
00:25:56
Speaker
Yeah, it's like it'll go away. It's gonna go away. It's gonna go away. That's fucked up. That's fucked up. Both of you and I might be slobbering our way through our fifties, dude. Because of fucking high school football. and That's all I'm saying is are these risks outlined for the fighters, yeah are the risks outlined for fighters in the UFC and in boxing and for the NFL? I think the NFL has a little bit more of it, but it's again, it's not just the guys the guys that get to the NFL. It's all those years of shitty college football. Maybe you were just on a practice squad, dude, and you committed four years and you just got fucked. I think that's the UFC problem is like, you gotta spar. Same with boxing, like your head is taking low level trauma all the time just through like sparring and moving and headbutts.
00:26:39
Speaker
the The actual, a fight, a boxing fight, even a UFC fight, it's only like, what, 12 minutes or something like that. Like, it's probably not the, I mean, I'm sure you get cracked in the head and it could be detrimental or catastrophic, but it's like the slow slow grind of all the work that these guys have to put in to get there. It's like never ending head trauma or like, ah yeah.
00:27:04
Speaker
Or or you know you sit when you first start learning the mixed martial arts, and then it's like, all right, you're with the sparring partner, and he's working on his kicks, his head kicks. And even if you have pads on, you're just sitting there like, oh, the pads are worthless. They just keep for me from getting cut. Yeah. But and i yeah I think a lot of reasonable people that with their head on would be like, we can't it's not like tangible. It's like, oh, I got my bell run. Who cares?
00:27:31
Speaker
And so I mean, even I'm I think the other thing is like, almost everything we do now has the potential to be catastrophic and we don't care. So it's just like you're moving the needle just a little bit UFC and mixed martial arts and boxing is just a little worse than like, like my son's in the skateboarding pretty easily and most likely if he does it for a long time, he's gonna fuck up his body. But he wears a helmet. But like, you know, skateboarding is like your one move away from really Okay. i see what I see what you're saying and yet I would say what's the objective of skateboarding? The objective isn't to like fly off the ramp and dive your head into the concrete, right? That's like a consequence of you not landing. yeah And good boy good most people wear a helmet and all that and and those helmets are designed to slip off. and
00:28:21
Speaker
Whatever But you're in boxing you're in ufc you're trying to destroy each other and even football i'd argue That sport was rooted in trying to destroy your opponent physically. It's it's built around toughness And I will say dude, that's the peel In many ways. I I love football dude. I don't give a fuck about the ufc to be honest but football I love it as a way to build character for young men and um now you got women playing flag football, I think it's a great sport in terms of building camaraderie and everybody doing their assignment. It's kind of like what you might get in training for war, basic training. yeah button that so you know to But to get that at what consequence is still perplexing to me. I said, I wouldn't go back and want to do that, given what I know now. did your i know I don't think your son's played football. Did he ever play?
00:29:16
Speaker
No. And I just knew I could see his body. I knew he would be a concussion risk. That's what I was going to ask. for Were you, um, did you say, Hey dude, you probably shouldn't do that. Or you just get lucky and and so to speak. And, and he, uh, he never wanted the play. Oh, we wouldn't know. We wouldn't sign off on it. Even if he wanted to, he never really asked. Really? You, you were just said, can't do it. No, you're not going to do it. Yeah. Wow.
00:29:41
Speaker
That's like one of my son's thing, like why he doesn't, why he would like to live in the US so he could play football. And I would let, I mean, I would probably let him play. Sure. but Sure. I mean, I think I have a partner too that has even stronger opinions than I do. I got it under certain circumstances I would have, but like he was young first his grade developed late. I might consider it, you know, at this point be a decent receiver, although he'd get lit up at six four. Yeah. He's a good athlete. He'd be good. Uh, well, I guess you're not, you're not dealing with a trad, tradwife situation there, huh?
00:30:18
Speaker
Oh, nope. She'd
Entertainment Value and Audience Attraction
00:30:21
Speaker
be filling the Gatorade tubs and snacks. Would you guys, would would you or her let them do like, did he do like karate when he was a kid? No.
00:30:35
Speaker
He didn't want it because I didn't want, cause I mean, I'm like, all right, a lot of, let especially here, a lot of little kids do karate and taekwondo. And then a few of them actually going to be pretty good. And it just kind of flows into this making, you know, it's kind of like, what's the, what's the next thing you're going to do as you get older, you start.
00:30:51
Speaker
people either go to those competitions or they start doing mixed martial arts. And it's not this like one big decision. It's just kind of like, oh, I'm doing this. And then it flows into something a little more violent, a little more violent. When they're five years old doing Taekwondo, it's like the cutest little thing ever. It's not very violent. right And then it, it's like, so I think, you know, why do we let that happen? It's like a slow burn where it's just kind of like people are moving towards it. And then all of a sudden,
00:31:17
Speaker
Okay, now they're doing something that's really violent, but they've been training for it for like 15 years and people like it and they're getting notoriety and it's like, well, fuck it. What else am I going to do? Yeah, but what's the purpose for all this developing toughness stuff? Do you see the purpose of it in our society now? I know, dude, some freaky right wingers would be like, would you shut the fuck up? Dude, like the same people that are going to monster truck rallies and and and and doing all kinds of nutty stuff, the people that love jackass or what? I don't know, I'm just... See, I don't think it's that. I think it's i think it's everyone now.
00:31:55
Speaker
besides your household. But what are you after? Like what kind of toughness are you developing? Like I'm gonna go- I'm sure you know a lot of people that watch it that aren't just going to fucking monster truck rallies, right? Like normal- Well, no, I know. I'm fucking obviously targeting right-wingers, which I try to do every episode. Just because now it's so counter, it's so easy to talk shit about woke now. It's like the thing. I like to just make sure people know that, no, I'm back. Fuck the right-wingers.
00:32:24
Speaker
I think it's funny though dude like I would have not that long ago you probably would have been like who the hell's going to remember when they had like these other leagues like pride or sabaki challenges it was like a fringe weirdos are going to watch that shit like this fighting groups and now it's like all right my my whatever my friend's wife is into it or like Watching it or you know, like it's normal. And so it's kind of strange. It should be what you're saying. This should be French. Violent. Yeah, but it's not. yeah But how how did this happen? Like, what what's the toughness for it? Do you think it's just an escape of society? It's like a ah way to we we just thought we've lost adventure. We're trapped in this mundane cycle of
00:33:07
Speaker
Boring work and fucking phone toggling and now it's like okay. Well the only only options I have are like we've talked about in the past Ultra marathon climbing Everest or getting in the cage and beating the shit out of somebody or getting beat up This whole message of like, find your limits is like, it's too much. What are the skills when I, if I do this, if I do this and it's even football, take it to football, what, what are the skills that I'm taking away from this that I can apply to life? What's this? What's the, what are what the toughest bullshit of, of failing, persevering, organizing a team leadership.
00:33:50
Speaker
But I mean the physical stuff. I can take a punch. Like how do you translate that into like life success? i'm I'm still struggling to do that in a logical way. Like how do I translate? Oh dude, I used to be a fighter and you know, I can take a punch, man. You can't keep me down. is it just It's better to be it's better to be that the than the hunted.
00:34:15
Speaker
generally in our society, and if you're a badass, people respect you more physically and that something like that. ah Yeah, I think in a biological level, but like, how do you move beyond this? Like, or will we move beyond this? Like, I see no discernible reason for us to pursue this type of toughness outside of joining a military organization, which is what one of my arguments would be is like, why don't we train, although it all become irrelevant with technology, but like that's where all that training should happen is in the military, all the the mixed martial arts stuff, if it isn't already, but I don't get the, yeah, that ain't good. Yeah. You're going to be like, you're going to put a,
00:34:55
Speaker
a drone and an arm what did you call it arm bar like I guess you don't see too many opportunities we have that hand-to-hand combat need anymore but But my point is, what's the point of teaching this toughness or going through these manufactured like environments of violence? They're they're sort of they're not faux violence because it's real, but it's like, you know you're not fighting to the death. It's not a war environment, but we're like we're clearly trying to replicate it. And I'm just trying to think what skills we're pulling from that, why you would want your kids to be in that and any more given the the nature of the modern era.
00:35:32
Speaker
And you have no fucking answers, Matt. No, it's entertainment and those people make money. I mean, that's it. It's it's clearly entertaining for the majority of society. Even me, I mean, i i'll so I'll watch it. i just I just haven't got into it where I'm gonna like follow it or something or or worry about it. I'll always be at some restaurant or something that'll be on TV that'll catch my eye and I'll watch it. But I don't i don't know anything about who's fighting or anything like that.
00:36:00
Speaker
but it's just entertainment. And some people are like, I could do that, I'm a good fighter. It's like a skill, like a model who's like not very smart, but was born beautiful, might as well take advantage of it. Someone's a good fighter, that's a way for them to make money. Yeah, so it's just a capitalistic pursuit. What do you think, dude? That's the answer to everything. Yes, I don't know, I don't fucking get it. But how about football? Because I think that's like- You love football.
00:36:26
Speaker
I don't really anymore. but yeah i It's entertaining. you're not Nobody's going to tell me it's not entertaining. a lot like ah People down here would tell you it's not entertaining. yeah But but do you do you respect the violence or do you ever think about it? Because I just think I'm a rarity in the sense like when somebody takes a big blow, I'm not just like, whoa, good. I'm more of like, I'm more damn.
00:36:53
Speaker
Yeah, probably the opposite of you. I mean, I'm not i'm like not saying fuck yeah, but I'm like, holy shit, that guy got lit up. like it's It's always entertaining. When you see like a really good hit,
00:37:06
Speaker
And you or you can kind of anticipate it. Like you'll see a quarterback who's like blindside unprotected and he's just kind of standing there like an idiot. And you see a defensive end that's about to torture him. I'm like, this is exciting. This is good. You like that? Yeah. You like when his head like slingshots back and then it's it's at the right moment as he's hitting the ground, it slingshots forward. So it increases the impact on the ground too.
00:37:32
Speaker
it's yeah Fuck, yeah, look at his head bounce around, little bobble doll. Dude, you're sick, man. it's What are you doing when that happens? You're like, oh boy, i take it easy on him. Nope, I got that look of like, oh shit. I get that a little bit too. like Or when they show the replay and you see the next snap back and you're like, ee. Yeah, I don't know what happened to me, man. I used to be a hardcore toughie and now I'm just like, i I start to see like, ah, do these guys,
00:38:05
Speaker
Man. cause i thinking i'm i'm not I'm not straight up all excited about, oh dude, it's funny that we're saying this. I just i just read a headline, Earl Campbell, I don't know, his brother died at 68 though. It's like a good football player died at 68. I think it's taken its toll. But ah I'm not excited to see someone fucking get the their head like, but I mean, I don't know, like a hit, ah a big hit executed correctly, like is to me as exciting as some fancy touchdown or like a ah catch or something like that.
00:38:35
Speaker
But it's like ah in my head, it's a football play, not an act of violence. i'm not I'm not excited about the violence of it. Like, kill that motherfucker. It's just like, damn. There's a great athlete running full speed and knocking the living shit out of somebody. That's exciting.
00:38:51
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. What do you, do you think about just the day to day combat that like even the lineman go through? I mean, that's fine. You don't think about it all. It's just like, we just look at this. and That's the boring. Yeah. It's the
Physical Toll and Athlete Sacrifices
00:39:04
Speaker
boring part that if you're from a different country, you're like, what are these fat fucks banging into each other in the middle for, but that, that act, which by the way, it would just be such a silly way to make a living, like conceptually. Yeah. So, uh, I work on, um, firing out and pushing into a guy and different angles and stuff. They don't have to fire out anymore until pass, RPO protection. That's your whole life. But there's a lot of, there's a lot of like head trauma and constant violence in those moments that we don't even care about. and the I'll say this dude, nothing. I'll sit there, especially when I'm watching the game with like of someone else who likes football or my brothers or something. And I'll see a lineman just not do anything. you If you really key in on the lineman, a lot of times they're not, they'll just miss blocks and shit.
00:39:50
Speaker
And it really bothers me. and but But it's kind of like, what are you doing? It's not necessarily straight up like you gotta fuck everyone up. It's like, you get, there's a guy right there, put your fucking body on him and block his ass. Like it's kind of related to related to that though. Like how?
00:40:08
Speaker
abnormal, they get their bodies to perform these positions. That's not healthy. Just how fucking giant they are. and Well, offensive linemen in general, like they they they appear to pack on additional fat pounds. Yeah. Wow, what's that guy? That was a white lineman. I think he played for the Browns in a couple of teams. and he's In day-to-day life, he's like 215.
00:40:33
Speaker
He, like once he stopped playing, he couldn't keep weight on. he He had, he had like a crazy diet to get, to get up to like 300 pounds or so. Like he had to maintain that, which isn't even big anymore. 300 pounds. No, it's like 340. Yeah. But he's just weird. Yeah. He's unique. I mean, some of these guys, it's not the problem that they lose the weight. The problem is when they're done, they keep, they so keep eating like that. They're burning no calories and then they're 450 pounds, you know, pretty quickly because they're six, seven and they can they can put the weight on. But yeah, I mean, i it's like, what are you, you're gonna be like, I'm not watching the game because I don't like what these guys are doing to their bodies. That's what that's what you'd like to see more of.
00:41:16
Speaker
ah one real though like that's the only That's the only thing you can do. I don't know. i don't know the and i just I just don't think there's enough respect for what these guys are doing to each other. I just don't think there's enough respect. I think it's just taking for granted. What I'd like to see is sort of an amusement park where everybody gets to experience some of the things that these athletes. So TJ Watt lines up 10 yards away and your fucking dumpy average middle-aged guy has to stand there and just get waxed. So then he gets a pass to watch football from here on out. Maybe that's a free ticket. That should be how you get your season tickets or like your NFL red zone. You gotta get
00:41:56
Speaker
Like, yeah, just crushed. And how about like, like some women, those women that love football, well, they can take the blindside sack from like, who's, who's a kick-ass? Just some, some freak. I don't know. I don't see, I don't know. Like all, then you got Watt, you got the, the Bosa brothers. Yeah, but those are all the white guys and that's our problem. We got to be able to offer up some different names. and I mean, look, I mean, i'm um you know who I really like watching? We want to talk about ah an amazing brother. Like, Von Miller, when he was in his, like, heyday for the Broncos, was unstoppable. Elite athleticism, just fucking tearing through people. But I'd like to see Von then. He also got busted for, what, HGA or that kind of shit. But I think they're all, that's the other thing about this. Most of these guys are are our jat are are juicing in the NFL. Like, they're all taking shit.
00:42:48
Speaker
Oh, okay. How about this? Have you seen Saquon Barkley's legs? Oh, yeah. How about he just yeah he can run through you. ah You got to you got to tackle him. And he's just pumping his thighs in the air in the air. But you got to you got to tackle him like with a contained lane, like this block blockaded. Yeah, where it's just direct. And I want to see the average American do that and then respect the game a little bit more.
00:43:16
Speaker
And cause you played high school, if you played high school football, you don't, you have no fucking clue what these dudes are bringing to the table. It's a, it's a very, it's a different, different game, but that dude is a machine. Saquon and, uh, but I, but I don't like, you want to, it's like, you want, you want to watch the best. It's a professional league and you just wouldn't.
00:43:41
Speaker
It's it's the the problem is like everything else. And I like that we talked about what what bothers you is this endless growth and endless. Like if you look at some of these sports, it's like the body types from 1980 to
Future of Sports Violence and Societal Acceptance
00:43:54
Speaker
now.
00:43:55
Speaker
It's like, it's ridiculous. So but when you start to push, okay, so that's the, that's the chain, right? So you you push, you push the envelope on like strength, the conditioning and body types, then that makes that sport a little more violent. Football is probably more violent and they keep putting in rules to protect it. But then that means that all these, this other stuff that's coming, it is becoming famous. It's just more acceptable. It's easier to get there. So why can you stick two guys in a cage and and have them,
00:44:22
Speaker
blood each other up and no one cares. It's like we've been like moving in that direction for, well, not for like years, but. Well, that brings me to where I closed the intro is do you think we'll just continue to get more insane? It's funny, if we're getting like more violent and then we're selling a message of like that we're we're taking we're also taking care of it at the same time, you know? like Like we're putting in rules in the NFL, like you can't do kickoffs now or whatever. Yeah, like great. There we go, we solved the problem. Or have you seen some of the fucked up helmets they got now?
00:44:57
Speaker
They're like getting more batting and shit. well And how many people watch are looking at that and going, what's this pussy doing with this weird ass helmet? But do you think though, and actually think about this, don't do your normal matte contrarian garbage. Do you think there's a point in our history, our modern history here, where you might see fights to the death, similar to the Roman Empire? No.
00:45:26
Speaker
You don't? Not in, I mean, maybe in, I could see, well, I guess I could see like an underground scene like that starting to develop. Maybe, it maybe it does. Maybe it already has. I'm sure it's happening around the world, but yeah, you don't think it could get to where it's, I don't see it like, ESPN sponsored death matches or shit like that.
00:45:49
Speaker
I can see it, man. I don't want to sound too dystopian like I'm sitting here in my retired life just fucking spiraling, napping, apocalyptic viewpoints, but yeah, napping. How far out? How far out? 40 years, maybe. because What? Yeah, because look, dude. Okay. Listen, Matt, the writing's on the wall. No.
00:46:15
Speaker
I think when we get to, and I have an episode coming up of ah a whole host, or excuse me, when we get to the point where a big portion of our society, if not the majority of our society is living on the fringes in a world that ah doesn't accept them or has no use for them. Just think AI, just think a little dystopian. Could you not see an environment where some psycho promoter says, well, we can, you know what we can do with these these pores? We can get them to kill each other in a ring and make a shitload of money, right? you I could see that. is This assumes that shit goes south.
00:46:56
Speaker
Okay. This is like 40, 50 years. wow And then I can see that being accepted. I'm sort of saying that tongue in cheek, but I'm also like, dude, I don't know. We're just, it just starts to look a little weird or it's just, everything looks weird to me right now rith with respect to this violent stuff. I think, I mean, I think there'll be a collapse, maybe in our lifetime, maybe not, but I think there'll be a societal collapse eventually. And then, and then yeah, then like everything,
00:47:24
Speaker
everything's everything's on the table like if it's like comes down to survival then you're like all right I can fight to the death and that's how I survived and I whatever then then yes but I think for that to happen you have you need like a nuclear holocaust or or real, like if, if, if this climate change shit is actually real, right? And then, and then we have, we have a made like major, like you know, storms and all this weird shit and drought and famine, then anything's possible. Anything's possible. And I say that in a shed a negative light there. But if you think that's common in the next 30 to 40, which I think you probably do, or maybe even sooner, the next three to four,
00:48:06
Speaker
No. How's it? Donald D. I'm not saying I think it's coming. I'm saying I could, so sometimes in in when we're in the philosophical arena here together, I can envision something happening and sometimes I can't. Like I'm like, eh, that just doesn't seem possible for humanity. But this seems pretty, pretty realistic. Fight to the death. Yeah, this seems pretty realistic for me.
00:48:32
Speaker
Okay, that's all i'll say dude like what's stopping the UFC from Like what I don't know what the rules are because I don't lay labor laws criminal laws But if you kill somebody in the UFC match, and you, I mean, you're no one's trying to actually kill anybody, but they're not, you're not going to jail, right? It's just like, same with the boxing match. Yeah. It's probably. Do you get like a manslaughter charge though, or something like that? No, I don't think so. Unless you did something illegal. I think it's, it's a form they sign when they get in there, but they're managing the fight. The fight is structured to prevent that. Let's just put it that way.
00:49:08
Speaker
Like, cause you're saying we're going more violent, but I can make the case that we're going less. Like the the boxing matches used to be like 30 rounds. It was like fight till one opponent is down syndrome. I think was, was like, how, how, you know, now.
00:49:24
Speaker
The fight like they call the fights pretty quick and I think even UFC can tap out pretty quickly. So I think we might be going in the other direction. I think what's weird is that these things that look like ah maybe some middle aged guys or would like to watch. What's weird to me is that everyone is watching. and I think it's the same with even football now is like a family thing.
00:49:45
Speaker
So I think that's what you're having problems with. Well, so yeah. And in a society that's hooked on excesses, you may be right that they've put more controls in, but in a society hooked on excesses, where does it keep going? Like how far does it keep going? My question is like the, the other, like the, the, ah the other side of your question is at some point did we just stop doing shit like football because no one's going to want their kids to play.
00:50:10
Speaker
Because there are always going to be people that are in a bad enough situation where they take violent sports. I've talked to a lot of people, not a lot, more people like you than they played the sport themselves, excelled at it, and then are happy that their kid's not going to play it. They don't want them to play it. That seems to be a direction people are going in. It's going to be like everything else. It's going to be like two paths, right?
00:50:36
Speaker
Yeah, just like one set one side on society loves it and the other's just like, what? i I don't know if this this like UFC thing is is a sign of the end to end times.
00:50:49
Speaker
No, I'm not saying it is. I'm just saying that the excess is like it doesn't take long to normalize behavior in society. I mean, look how fast we've we've gotten to certain addictions on our phones or and that that the phone isn't that old. I could see. It's like about the same as UFC, I think. Yeah, maybe. But I could see a future where just things get a little more freaky.
00:51:16
Speaker
More violent though. Yeah, maybe we need a new religion though to come forth. Maybe we need a new Jesus. We need something to believe in again. But it's starting to feel like a weird society. So that's all I'm gonna say. It's starting to sound like Bret Michaels, bro. But let me ask you this, dude. Last question. Do you worry about any head trauma impact as you get into your fifties and sixties? You think you're gonna fucking...
00:51:43
Speaker
Man, if I, if I was still banging on comedy, I would have, I would have said something silly right there, you know, something really dumb that would have showed that I already have head trauma. I don't think we, this is why these things are fine because we can't. Like you can't worry it. Like you're going to sit around and be like, man, I wonder if that shot I took at Stuttler ball 1993 is going to make me a little slower when I'm 75. There's no way to more like fifties sixties.
00:52:13
Speaker
Do you feel like it's happening? You ever get a moment where you're like, damn, I can't remember. I mean, I have these moments where I'm like, I can't remember a damn thing. But I don't go fuck. that Is that because I hit my head snowboarding? Well, right. That's the the gray area for this kind type of injury. But um no, you're going to have those things with normal aging. But there are some degenerative diseases that, you know, could be more we're at higher risk for because of head trauma.
00:52:40
Speaker
My biggest worry is like, what am I eating that's fucking me or like, what's in what's in the environment around me that's that's gonna cause Alzheimer's, cancer, heart disease, all this stuff that I think I'm doing fine. And then you'll see some online where someone's like, if you're drinking anything or eating anything that's at a plastic bottle, you're just pouring plastic and you're like, really? So that all that shit's gonna add up. I'm not worried about the head trauma. Yeah. Well, okay.
00:53:08
Speaker
I'm gonna kale my way out of this bitch, dude, out of this out of this head trauma. ah I was I mean, today, dude, by the way, is fucking kale, spinach, an apple banana, because I don't have any food because I was at the beach for a few days. So I had i basically have been eating the same shit every day for years.
00:53:30
Speaker
for the last month. It's like oatmeal. Everything I do, dude, just makes me sound like such a pussy. Oatmeal, some blueberries on top, a little bit of some walnuts, a little bit of honey. That's my breakfast. Okay, followed by a fills you up ah salad that has a ah full apple cut, carrots, cucumbers.
00:53:56
Speaker
a shitload of spinach and some sunflower seeds and some pistachios on top with a little olive oil mat and a little balsamic vinaigrette to top it off. Okay, so that's pretty much every day those two things and then there's some variability in the evening.
00:54:12
Speaker
But yeah you feel full all day. You know, the great thing about the the vegetable stuff is that that sits there. and Do you feel that? Yeah, you get used to it. Yeah, you get used to it. I don't feel hungry for a long time. I don't know. It's just exactly what they say. Fiber fiber fills you up.
00:54:31
Speaker
So not on topic, but maybe that'll prevent our, our future brain degeneration. Could you just fucking diet your way out of some of the head trauma stuff? I wonder. I think I've heard people say that it helps, but I don't know. I don't, I don't sit up. I occasionally worry about it. Head trauma is a tough one. Maybe your wife has more insight, but like the other thing is you don't, how do you know that you're, what you're thinking and what you're doing and your lack of memory is like,
00:55:01
Speaker
It's a reaction to something that you did in the past or like, or it's you, it's like, everything's your own reality. So it's hard to say like, what, what happened? because You can't compare yourself to somebody else because you're like inside your own head. What do you mean, dude? Now you're getting trippy. Like people, you don't like how we'll never know if, what if,
00:55:23
Speaker
if our violent sports, like what they did to us. I mean, I don't know, maybe sometimes- Oh, they do after you die. A lot of those guys donate their brains and they confirm it. They confirm the trauma, but yeah, you're right. In the moment, like we could all be susceptible to these neurological diseases and it could stem from anywhere. We're like laughing about it. You know, like when you get older, like I forgot something again, it's like all kind of silly and funny, you know? It's just like, wow, where's my head?
00:55:51
Speaker
You know what's really funny? ALS. Ha, ha, Where the guy loses all control of his body and his his brain is fully intact but his whole body is shutting down one by one until like literally his lungs don't work and he's choking. That's funny. Ha, ha, ha. Yay, football. He's holding on to his fucking state championship trophy and he's like worth it. No, it's it's laying on his lap. He's not holding shit.
00:56:18
Speaker
But anyway, uh, all right, man, good talk. So yeah, I don't know. We didn't solve much, but we never do. No, but you came off as a, a soft, uh, wimp. So I liked that because you don't like violent sports anymore. So enjoy watching your badminton matches and shit like that, bro. I'm going to be watching the Superbowl fucking cheering for blood. I just wish there was a sport called professional hugging.
00:56:45
Speaker
That probably is,
00:57:01
Speaker
What day is it?