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Don't Trash Teachers
51 Plays1 year ago
Why do many American's devalue the teaching profession? How can teachers possibly address the wide range of student needs in our society?
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Transcript
The Unfair Blame on Teachers
00:00:01
Speaker
So I hear you like trashing teachers. Teachers are an easy target. Just because you went to school once doesn't mean you know shit about what it means to be a good teacher.
00:00:13
Speaker
Just because your kid's teacher is the only person you've met in education doesn't mean they're responsible for the failings of the entire American education system. If your kid is struggling, it's most likely because they have a significant, unmet need that no teacher, no matter how amazing, can reasonably address or fix.
00:00:33
Speaker
Do you really expect a teacher to inject your kid with motivation? To make them care about school? Do you expect a teacher to clear the path for your kid to be accepted and loved by all other students?
00:00:45
Speaker
Do you expect them to regulate your kid's mental health? Do you expect a teacher to manage your child's weird allergies? Do you expect them to expertly attend to your kids' complex learning disabilities to overcome your family's financial woes and dysfunction?
00:01:01
Speaker
Do you expect a teacher to do what you can't?
Misconceptions and Realities of Teaching
00:01:06
Speaker
The most you should ever expect from a teacher is to effectively manage the classroom environment and to deliver engaging lessons. The rest is bullshit that got piled onto them by cheap-ass taxpayers that want to bitch about how they don't get summers off like teachers do.
00:01:22
Speaker
Teachers have a tremendously high rate of urinary tract infections. Most of them don't have time to use the bathroom during the day, so they get sick. What do you do for a living? I bet you have time to piss.
00:01:36
Speaker
But you want your teachers to operate like a 24-7 community health center and you don't want them to be paid well. Why? Because you need someone to blame for the anxiety you feel as a parent.
00:01:49
Speaker
Your cultural and political fears will not get addressed in your kid's classroom. Think the country's headed in the wrong direction? It's not your kid's teacher's fault. Don't understand or like LGBTQ people?
00:02:03
Speaker
Your kid's teacher isn't responsible for that. If your kid's teacher happens to be trans or gay, do you honestly think they're going to turn your kid trans or gay? Mom, my teacher told me being trans is super fun and exciting.
00:02:17
Speaker
So can I start hormones now? Don't like that Christianity has been losing ground in America? Your kid's secular science teacher is not going to turn your kid into a Satan worshiper.
00:02:29
Speaker
Dad, my teacher said alligators have existed for 37 million years, so so now I love Satan. The more calm and loving you are with respect to your values, the more likely your kid will move towards you in the long run.
Positive Impacts and Personal Stories
00:02:42
Speaker
Work on yourself and leave the teachers alone.
00:03:48
Speaker
So, dude, what's up? Talking about teachers today and why they're such pieces. are you Are you one of those people, before we rip before I get into ripping them apart, why are they complaining?
00:04:00
Speaker
You got one teacher and like and you're where you're like, oh, yeah, that's the one. like Some people are like, I remember my third grade teacher changed my life. NBA players, there's always a Miss Robinson or some shit that straightened them out. like You got anybody from high school, college, elementary school oh yeah that touched you?
00:04:17
Speaker
Touched me. Not that way, because I know you wanted to make that joke. It was the 80s, bro. um ah Mrs. White, shout out to her. and Carrie? That's the daughter.
00:04:28
Speaker
The daughter was Carrie? I think the daughter's name was Carrie. Like high school English, something like that? Yeah, Virginia was her name. Virginia White. Anyway, she had high standards, also was very connecting, and I thought she always put together like pretty interesting stuff from an English perspective that i I wouldn't have been interested in a normal teacher teaching. But she she just was did a good job of connecting to my personality, so that was good for me,
Burnout and Financial Struggles of Teachers
00:04:52
Speaker
bro.
00:04:53
Speaker
I 100% agree with that one. i I forgot about I remember she told my parents and my mom at graduation, basically like... Smart kid needs to find his potential or something. that was It was a very nice message. It was something like, haven't hit your ceiling yet, bro.
00:05:05
Speaker
Put a little more effort in. she had She had kind of like a dry way of talking, right? was kind of She was funny. like Yeah, very funny. I remember I showed her my essay, my entrance essay for Columbia, which I don't know how I got to applying there. And she just she literally started laughing.
00:05:22
Speaker
like pos laugh or what she's like not good enough that's great man oh yeah it wasn't good enough you were like talking telling them how much he benched and shit she's like come on football player i don't even remember you weren't a meathead in my book bro it it was sad that she was great yeah she was pretty good uh So this teacher thing, dude, let me tell you what my biggest problem is. as Society as a whole it has an entitlement about ah teachers and and what they expect out of them, which is the laundry list of things.
00:06:00
Speaker
I kind of alluded to it in the intro, but mostly it's this perception that teaching is like this passion project calling type thing. of a profession that allows us to pay. What's the average salary in the U.S. for starting starting salary for a teacher is $42,000 something.
00:06:18
Speaker
So $42,000, bachelor's degree. And it's this idea that you know people that work with kids, they just love it. So we can afford to pay them pay him shit. And i I just have so much trouble with that. And we can talk about all the other things that teachers have to deal with.
00:06:34
Speaker
But when I hear someone bitch about a teacher, I lose it. think it's I think it's fucking stupid. I think people, like besides just, oh, they love working with kids, so so that's what they deserve payment-wise. I think people also say, and I do this all the time, because in hindsight, I'm like, maybe I should have became a teacher. But you go, oh, you got all that vacation time, and you get the sweet retirement benefits. so um So that the people people frame teacher's salary and what they're worth with that as well.
00:07:04
Speaker
Which is partially true. So if you go get a million credits and a master's, you can you can carve out a good life for yourself over the course of 30 years. Sure. Okay. You can do that with a lot of things.
00:07:16
Speaker
But why is there such burnout? Why is there such a shortage?
High Expectations vs. Low Compensation
00:07:20
Speaker
ah they're actually working all day. i think a lot of people at offices aren't aren't actually doing that. That might be why they're working all day.
00:07:29
Speaker
I mean, have you ever had a day, even ah even if you're a good employee, do you consider yourself a good employee? At times, yeah. I mean, I have been really a high performer at times and then a total piece.
00:07:42
Speaker
Right. when when you When you were like done with it. But you ah like i always i've I thought I was a pretty good employee and I am now trying to get this company going. But if I want to just breathe and go, fuck this, I'm not doing shit today.
00:07:54
Speaker
I can. i don't think a teacher cant can ever do that. Maybe that's the day where you're watching dances with wolves in class because it's three hours or or whatever. But yeah, like, yeah, there's no, you're right.
00:08:05
Speaker
You're all it's always on. So it's that's got to be stressful. I mean, any job like that where it's like always on, no off switch, I don't know, like an air traffic controller or something like those. There's a lot of burnout in those jobs where there's no there's no downtime.
00:08:19
Speaker
And maybe that's part of it. Yeah. Little kids suck in in masses. Everyone loves their own kids, but dealing with 30 of them and other people's kids. and you can't tell them to go fuck yourselves, like that's got to grind on you after time as well.
00:08:32
Speaker
Of course. and Drive that point home. The average salary for teachers, $42,000. But you know you get a bachelor's in marketing, come out make $59,000 plus to sell what?
00:08:44
Speaker
Banner ads? Internet banner ads and shit? But if you get a master's in anything, your teacher salary bumps up as well, right? It bumps up, but it's it's it's a state-funded job or...
00:08:58
Speaker
you're not bumping up like to what you would bump up with the MBA and as a marketing manager or something. So no, it's not great. But let's let's back up for a second and look at the context of teaching now.
00:09:10
Speaker
So I guess in the last two years, dude, there have been 400, let's see, 400 school shooting incidents. i thought you were going to say teacher suicides, actually.
00:09:23
Speaker
75% of teachers report having stress-related health issues. 80% report that student behavior is more difficult in recent years. An astonishing 30% are chronically absent, and then they're leaving the profession for the primary reason of it not paying enough for the responsibility. And so I wasn't joking in the intro when I said like,
00:09:47
Speaker
What's expected of them now are more mental health duties, more social work duties, just more high stress duties that are outside of what you would expect a teacher to be doing, especially at the elementary and middle school levels. Right.
00:10:01
Speaker
So yeah are you are you saying that you think the modern modern teaching has become more difficult and the pay hasn't adjusted? ah just think we're we're lowering our respect for teachers with like sort of without even knowing it. But we're making we're treating them shittier than we did before.
00:10:17
Speaker
Well, I think in the culture, there's been a lot of smack talking about him. We can talk about that and and why that is. But I think it's a six-figure job. I think you could get more of the outcomes you're looking for with that kind of pay. And you go, well, where does that funding come from?
00:10:33
Speaker
Well, they're just teaching ABCs. Why should they make $95,000 or $100,000? Well, it's because you've asked them to do all this behavioral management to absorb all these social determinants of success in education and like figure out everybody's learning disabilities. You've asked
Modern Challenges in Teaching
00:10:50
Speaker
them to be experts in so many different things.
00:10:54
Speaker
It's tough to see that salary that low and then and then hear people criticize them. That's my type, dude. I think it's, I mean, i can't imagine... what it's like teaching in the age of phones and like technology. Like it's gotta to be, I mean, there's some positives, but you can push out homework digitally. You can put like, but I know it's a battle. I can imagine it's probably worse in the U S like just the battle of kids trying to look at their phones and bring their phones and having them turn it off and not have them and that stuff.
00:11:26
Speaker
That battle, that just distraction that we all face as parents is like, is the same thing they're dealing with. Just the possibilities for distraction and sort of short attention spans. It's got to be pretty hard to teach in that environment on the one hand.
00:11:39
Speaker
The other hand, kids can access information pretty quickly. So maybe it's more efficient. But here I mean, but I wonder, like, this is always the debate in the US, s probably everywhere. But like, is it just...
00:11:52
Speaker
If we just paid them more, that's a sign of respect and that's it. Because I just think of like, oh, you know, you think of a parent, you think of what what makes a parent proud. Oh, my kid's a doctor, a lawyer, and a professional athlete.
00:12:04
Speaker
Where does, oh, my kid became a teacher, an elementary school teacher on the scale, especially like a son, let's say. You know, a lot of people might be like, oh, they failed in life or they they settled because they didn't become a...
00:12:18
Speaker
MedTech CEO or engineer. It's like so I think part of besides the money part of it's just going like that is an a pretty amazing job. What's interesting, if you if you're of one of these like s SAT rock star kids, you got your entrance exams, you you crushed it, right?
00:12:34
Speaker
Or you're a valedictorian. No one's going be like, you're valedictorian. You should think about becoming a teacher. You're so smart. You should think about affecting generations of of future generations with your intelligence.
00:12:46
Speaker
No, of course not. Not anymore. Yeah. In our era, there were more... Remember, the the class nerd was more... more apt to say like, I want to be a teacher. Usually a girl.
00:12:58
Speaker
Yeah. Girl nerd. Like maybe, yeah, a guy nerd would be weird, but how great would it be? Like if you have like my, my son's pretty good at math. And if there was like a rockstar math guy who, who, who was at his school teaching, it would be amazing.
00:13:13
Speaker
Right? Like ah a genius to genius type exchange of information. You see that at university level. We got to talk about that because there's so many aspects to this. The fact that there are no men in elementary education. but But let's, can we agree on this? Would you agree on this or do you disagree? so
Parental Involvement and Its Impact
00:13:30
Speaker
in Even with summers, even with the breaks that they get, would you categorize teaching the teaching profession as a hard job, a difficult job?
00:13:41
Speaker
Um...
00:13:44
Speaker
yeah well, I think it's, I don't know. I don't i don't think you just blanket it as a hard, it is a hard job, but every job's kind of hard, but it is a hard job. But it's like, what I think what I'm getting at is it's a hard job if that's not what you, if you got into it as a, as a, um,
00:14:02
Speaker
As ah okay, I can't, I can't because I see people like this all the time. They're like, I can't figure out something else to do. So teaching is an option or someone goes, Hey, you know what? You should be a teacher. You can, the state of Colorado will help you go to Metro and you can become a teacher tomorrow. and People do it as like a last resort.
00:14:18
Speaker
then it's an impossible job because you never want to be there to begin with. You never you were never a teacher, and never a leader. is But for someone who's like assertive and a leader, it's probably easy for them because they're they're meant to do it.
00:14:32
Speaker
Oh, not easy is not the right word, but it's like any other job. If your mentality or everything fits, it's probably a lot easier, like a lot more fluid.
00:14:43
Speaker
I don't love that argument because I think you say that about literally anything. Well, it's true. If you, if you took, so if you did something, it's the same as us, dude. If you took something because you didn't have any of the options, you're probably going to suck at it. And then it's going to be hard because your mentality is like not there. If you're every day going these fucking kids, these fucking kids, going to be impossible.
00:15:04
Speaker
And I know I have seen teachers like that. They're just like, I don't get paid enough for this shit. You know? Yeah, and and one possible cause of that is because we haven't respected the profession. It's not paid what it's actually worth. It's not easy by any stretch.
00:15:19
Speaker
It has a lot of demands, both in terms of its educational requirements, but then the knowledge base to sustain a classroom and to understand learning methodologies, depending on what age you teach, and then obviously subject matter expertise.
00:15:35
Speaker
You can get the impression that people can phone it in. And yet those people don't last. And the reason that they can they have this as an option is because of such a large shortage.
00:15:46
Speaker
And there's a large short of shortage because it's paid so pathetically. Let me just tell you you know I was gonna try to be a substitute. And it was really just mostly out of community service. And I never got around to it because it just seems so agonizingly not worth it.
00:16:00
Speaker
Because they would pay, i think it was $175 a day. So that's like 21 bucks an hour. So for 21 bucks an hour, you want me to have a college degree. I need to be fingerprinted. And then I need to look at your manual.
00:16:15
Speaker
of what it is to be a substitute teacher, which entails so much shit that you would never even consider, including like, be very cautious about using pronouns, like or calling somebody a he or so somebody a she.
00:16:28
Speaker
If the fight breaks out, remember that you should never get involved physically. ah That's just like a couple examples. And then there's a laundry list of things like around like when they do the school shooting drill,
Financial Realities and Substitute Teaching
00:16:40
Speaker
if there's a fire drill, so forth, so on, on and on and on. 21 bucks an hour, you can make it, I don't know, anywhere, Lowe's, like running around restocking piles of wood.
00:16:52
Speaker
It's just, it's just, it's just pretty sad given the responsibility. The substitute, yeah. You talk about lack of respect. Is there anyone who has less respect them in the community than the substitute teacher?
00:17:05
Speaker
That's the bottom of barrel. only from the kids, but like, yeah, but we're talking that's, if I work full time at 21, it's like 42,000. But that's ah the equivalent of a starting salary for a teacher.
00:17:16
Speaker
I mean, like but to my point about besides the salary, the respect, like you're like, yeah, I'm a substitute teacher. No one's like, okay. No one treats you you like you're a hedge fund manager or anything. Everyone's like, no, you're just getting through some shit right now.
00:17:28
Speaker
Yeah. You're just coming off a meth addiction. well why Why are you? Yeah. So, I can't wrap my head around the numbers, dude, because I've been down here for too long. And when I hear 42,000, I immediately click into like a sort of a South of Mexico mindset of like, what are you fucking crying about 42,000 a year? Like, sounds good to me,
00:17:50
Speaker
sounds good to me but I see what you're saying. Like, I'm looking right now at this, what you're talking about. And like some states, like I have, you remember my, i don't know if you remember my friends, Adam and Eli, but both their parents were teachers on Long Island, New York, which actually a state that pays their teachers very well.
00:18:05
Speaker
By the time they were done, they're both making around a hundred grand. And they were going to get, they did everything they could. They got their master's degrees. They got 150 extra credits. They did extracurricular activities to max out their salaries.
00:18:19
Speaker
So they retired. They were getting like, I don't know, close to 90 grand a year for the rest of their lives, both of them. And I'm like, that's that's pretty, that seems good. Like to to tell a teacher, if you if you work and, you know, if you do, if you get through your shit early, youre really you pretty much can retire in your in late 50s with 90 grand a year until you're,
00:18:40
Speaker
till you die. Like, I'm like, I think that's, that's, that's a good sell. Cause you, they also, they all, they had like a DJing company in the summer. So they were like DJ weddings. And I was like, that seemed like a pretty fair life for what they were doing.
00:18:53
Speaker
Sure. I, that sounds great. And there's, there pros, but can you get to retirement is my question, but more to the point of like, what gives people the right, the entitled right to critique and to ultimately trash teachers for the job they're doing, given
Entitled Parenting and Teacher Experiences
00:19:10
Speaker
the circumstances that they're put in and the salary that they make. That's the thing I find most interesting. We could talk about how to gamify the teaching profession and make a good life out of it.
00:19:20
Speaker
Yeah. or figure out how to do the least amount of effort or whatever you need to do to for it to ultimately shake out as a good job from a financial perspective. But the idea that, we're going around and trashing teachers in this culture is still, I struggle i struggle with it. I wanna hear a little more about that because I'm not, I don't hear that at all here.
00:19:41
Speaker
haven't, like my son got into a fight last year and we we thought the administration handled it incorrectly, but we went and talked to him. And some of the other parents actually came to came to the side of my son. They were like, yeah, they they he got screwed in that deal.
00:19:55
Speaker
But is is there a tendency in the US right now to like take the side of the kid excessively? Like, is that the problem you're talking about when you say trashing teachers? There's like no accountability in the student either.
00:20:06
Speaker
There is that. There's just so much here. So let's just talk about that for a second. Would you agree that society as a whole has become, parents specifically have become more entitled, more and more of one of those, what they call a snowplow parent who tries to move obstacles move obstacles out of the way of their kids to make sure that their pathway is clear.
00:20:29
Speaker
and And they the intervention with teachers has increased. to where you know they're concerned about grades early and they're intervening on what they might consider a bad grade or they're second-guessing teachers when they call out their kids' behavior.
00:20:44
Speaker
that's so There's a lot more of that that's gone on. And I've seen that on a personal level too. Do you see that as a trend? A little bit. I mean, I see – I think in general now it's it's hard for parents to – it's the same with like sports.
00:21:01
Speaker
where it's like, do you tell your kid to work harder do you blame the coach for not playing them? Like there's that mentality now where it's like, yeah no, I'm gonna switch teams. It's like, no, this teacher doesn't know what he's doing. my kid Of course my kid can't learn with that teacher.
00:21:15
Speaker
kid The teacher doesn't know how to teach. is There's more of that than like, my kid's a pussy. Yeah, and I firmly have fallen, and and my wife and I have like, are we're we're always like, our kids are idiots.
00:21:26
Speaker
Our kids, yeah, they need to figure some shit out. We always lean in that direction, but so many more people don't. It's like, oh, what this teacher needs to understand is that little Johnny has some emotional regulation issues and that they should be able to handle him. and They're not a doctor in psychology. That's not their...
00:21:44
Speaker
They can within reason, but right, like they they're not, nothing's perfect in that and type of environment. So I just have a lot of empathy for teachers and the criticism that they get. Well, I think it's justified. I just wonder if it's worse now.
00:21:59
Speaker
You think the criticism
Solutions and Societal Shifts
00:22:00
Speaker
is justified? No, I'm saying your empathy is justified. Oh, okay. I mean, I'm sure they're case by case, right? Oh, yeah, yeah. No, your empathy is justified. I just wonder if it's worse now.
00:22:10
Speaker
But I don't know. It's kind of funny. This is where we we always get to this, and then it's like, what's the solution? I'm not sure. like is is The solution could just be make make it worth their time at least.
00:22:22
Speaker
Like, it's like, I wonder if it's, if it was like, I mean, i don't know how in hell you could do this, but if it was like a, You know how like secret service workers or firemen, like we had our friend Chris on a few months ago, they're not theyre they don't expect to work real like in that job more than like 20 years, I think. I wonder teaching is ah should almost be looked at as like that so that you can really go at it. but know that cause i Have you ever talked to teacher who's like 52 and they're just counting counting down the days until they they're just like, their last 10 years are just like, oh my God.
00:22:57
Speaker
man. 2,131 days away from getting my pension. like but they you Like, go at it hard for 15 years and know that then and then you get into like, okay, now you're going to be help consulting on textbook writing, whatever curriculum planning out of the out of the face to face the kids.
00:23:15
Speaker
That path seems like it might help people like prevent burnout. Something like that. well you see Yeah, a new culture around how the job is is viewed. That didn't answer your question. but No, we need a new culture altogether on how this profession is viewed.
00:23:31
Speaker
But I think compensation to a point is usually the number one incentive but for attracting talent. But I would say it didn't help you, did it?
00:23:43
Speaker
What? It wasn't enough to keep you in the in the rat race. like where you I'm sure when you left work, you were making decent money. you The compensation alone didn't make you want to do the job more.
00:23:56
Speaker
Well, and yeah, near the end, no. But look, dude, I i did start ah after I graduated from college. I went back to explore teaching as a career.
00:24:06
Speaker
And I got in there, had a literal panic attack because
Educational System Complexities
00:24:10
Speaker
I started to realize what the actual pay would be for this profession. And try to was raise a family on that. And I was like, no, this ain't going work.
00:24:18
Speaker
And so then i like I usually get anxiety when I've made a bad decision and I have to unwind it. But I just don't understand how the expectations for this profession align with the salaries that are given.
00:24:32
Speaker
And I know people will argue they'll come back to with the summers, they'll come back with the pension and all this type of stuff. And I just wonder, what do you want for your kids?
00:24:43
Speaker
So you want to sit there and you want to complain about the quality of of teaching. And you put your kids in these environments for basically the cost of your property taxes.
00:24:55
Speaker
And then you you bitch when you don't get what you want and they're making garbage money. Yeah. I just think, how do you make it, how do you make it that destination job?
00:25:06
Speaker
Yeah. How do you make it destination job? Money's part of it. I think what I laid out and with my friends in New York, I mean, they didn't start there, but they they had a path or like, all right, you know, we're, we could do pretty well and retire well. So that, that helped.
00:25:22
Speaker
But, uh, it's It's just, I don't know where, I don't talk to too, I haven't talked to too many people about, but I don't know like what the general population feels about the teaching profession right now. Like ah like I said, is it somewhere you're like fucking so happy that your children decided to go in that profession and you're like, okay, whatever.
00:25:44
Speaker
And it's got we need if we really want to solve all these problems, it's got to get raised up to where we look at as like a doctor or anything like that. It should be ah along that line of like respect and value, like valuation.
00:25:55
Speaker
It should. ah Well, you can you can get an idea because they're going to they're um trying to eliminate the Department of Education here. um So on the right wing side, there's this perspective of like. Well, you're teaching that America's bad.
00:26:08
Speaker
You're not teaching Christian values. Therefore, I want school choice so I can go to a private Christian school or I want a homeschool. And like homeschool. I mean, you ever met a fucking homeschool kid?
00:26:21
Speaker
They just they have. They're so weird. Every homeschool kid, because we lived up in the foothills that I met, was a fucking weirdo. I never met a normal one. Yeah, that's a weird choice.
00:26:32
Speaker
That's not a solution. Okay, unless unless you know they are they start off so weird... And so non-traditional that you got to keep them out of the classroom for their benefit and the benefit of others. Fine.
00:26:44
Speaker
But like something else is going on. They're fucking Miley Cyrus. They're on tour. They're Olympic gymnast or whatever. Their schedule, maybe. And go socialize them. go you know And I see this when especially girls like they're of these protective families, usually right wing.
00:27:00
Speaker
Well, they're entering in middle school and they want to get the girls into a private Christian school because they think the middle school will corrupt their kid. And it's like, dude, the Christian school, they're doing all the same shit.
00:27:13
Speaker
They're just not telling anybody. They're hiding it. It's funny to me. But anyway, all these kids need to go through their process. And if they were bound to get involved in risk-taking behavior, big you know they probably were...
00:27:27
Speaker
genetically disposed to that anyway and it just was going to happen i guess there's some environmental circumstances where you you could see where kids get off off track but and this this values thing and that the school system is supposed to like meet everybody's values i get the uh debate but don't know homeschooling specifically come on give me a fuck i could make it i don't i know you probably i don't know if you agree but like i mean i have um experience i have with expensive private schools in the u.s s right now is like with my brother's kids and i i could say that it's worked i mean you hate to you'd hate to think then society gets to a point where that's the only way to get like a great education which i don't i really don't think they're there yet in the u.s i mean the public schools are still pretty pretty awesome but um i mean like the homeschooling is really weird but but people are like yeah i'm gonna send my kid to a private school
00:28:17
Speaker
maybe not necessarily for religious reasons, although for some people that's it, but like for ah where i they perceive a better education, man, I could second make the case going to spend your money that way.
00:28:29
Speaker
That's a good good use of money as opposed to whatever other bullshit could waste your money on. Well, make it because i don't like cause I know every wealthy person I know like that has had money has done exactly that.
00:28:41
Speaker
Colorado Academy, Kent Denver. but What's the issue? What's the case with that? like what what Why does that lead to higher outcomes? It's just the wealth?
00:28:52
Speaker
and I mean, i think these now these schools like Kent, is their focus is like... on education it's actually like an environment which you would like to see the public school where the teachers are respected the teachers have a passion for it the teachers are treated like i think my my nephew is really great at math like he got into like ah some cool like aerospace college programs and got a five on his ap calculus test his teacher is like a math genius you know like ah
00:29:24
Speaker
It sounds so dumb when I say it that way. Like, his teacher fucking crushes numbers, bro. but hes they've They've attracted talent. They've attracted talent. Yeah, now and so you're paying for, like, academic, not, like, people, with you you immediately, I do this too, but because I was like, what the fuck? My brother's crazy when you hear the tuition in these schools. It's like, but you're like, you just think it's a bunch of preppy rich white kids hanging out with other preppy rich white kids. But I think some of these schools are actually like, no, we're going to,
00:29:51
Speaker
challenge our kids and give them this this amazing learning environment with people that love education. Of course And that's why they're there. Of course they are because it's ah it's an exclusive experience that only wealthy people can pay for. They don't have to deal with.
00:30:04
Speaker
And most kids can't even get in there. Like the application is hard to get into. But the public sector has to deal with the lowest common denominator student. They have to deal with the disabled, mentally retarded. They have to deal with these subsections of society that are extremely difficult and extremely expensive does that does that lower the amount of effort that they can put into like all of these enriching things and can they hire and attract talent in an environment like that no it's like this is part of a complex society i mean it does it like it does though you're right because it does lower because you just have more people to serve more different types of people to service exactly yeah
00:30:45
Speaker
But if wealth came into the public environment and and helped too raise all tides, like that would be a good thing for society. And there are some people that are principled and do that. And that like, for example, over in ah Washington Park for Costa Rican listeners is a high end area of Denver.
00:31:02
Speaker
There's a school called South that was a total peace 15, 20 years ago And the the wealthy people in that community have decided to go there and it's brought that school up. It's extremely diverse. It's been known to represent like 80 to 100 different countries.
00:31:17
Speaker
ah But it's a quality school and very dynamic and a great experience for somebody. And city school And a city school. So you can do They whole thing too. They got the elementary school we over there that feeds it. That's like hard. It's amazing. and Right.
00:31:31
Speaker
So you can do it. But people have to be willing. And East is like one of the best high schools in the nation, I think. It's really good. so you can do it, but it's it's definitely more complicated. But like this idea like, ah well, I'll just go pay to keep my kids nice, safe, and in a very perfect box. And look at the talent they're attracting. Isn't that great? Of course they are, is what I would say to that. Of course they are.
00:31:55
Speaker
There's always that option in our society is to pay more for exactly what you need. Well, you'd hate you'd hate to think that... That's your option. If you value education, your only option is to go do that.
00:32:08
Speaker
You would hate to think that. like and right It's happening here. like When I first met my wife, Costa Rica had a really, it still does, but had a really good reputation of having strong middle class, strong health system, and and great public education.
00:32:26
Speaker
And now a lot of people like the public education system sucks. But what a lot of what's funny is a lot of people, they equate the bad education system, not necessarily with the... with the education system, but the people that use it. So then like, okay, now because of people are going to private schools, the regular, like two, two parent families. Now you have like broken home kids. You got like all this shit on the public schools. And so the kid, the people are like, i don't want to put my kid in that environment.
00:32:54
Speaker
And that's like, but that's like, fuck how you fix that. I have no idea. The reality is it's true. even with my own kids since since I'm separated and like, there are times now where they'll be like, they might be home by themselves a little more. And so you see it with other, other divorced kids or their friends where it's like, whatever, they just have more time by themselves. And then kids naturally will like get into trouble if they're left alone sometimes.
00:33:18
Speaker
And like, it's hard to,
Systemic Issues and Societal Values
00:33:20
Speaker
it's how do you, how do you prevent that? Yeah. You know, like, well, there's programs you could do, but like, we can't agree on values in the society. Part of it's because we're, we're not,
00:33:30
Speaker
homogenous like Norway or when it's not all white. And so what what do you envision? oh who do you unu Who do you envision coming through a school with metal detectors at the front entrance? What kinds of students do you envision walking through that type of school?
00:33:46
Speaker
Right. I'm not not going to trap me. I'm not going to say. right So, so, so it makes sense that a huge portion of our society. Now this whole school choice thing wants to move to exclusion.
00:34:03
Speaker
We should be able to choose the best fit for our kid, which means we should be able to choose like this luxurious education approach and pay for it. And fine, ah that happens in every corner of our society.
00:34:18
Speaker
But to abandon the public education school as a result of that is ah silly. you you know You talked a little bit about the property taxes that go into the the U.S. education system. That's probably why it's still pretty pretty solid Like, do you feel like, I mean, I think my parents, their property taxes are like insane out in like where they live.
00:34:42
Speaker
Do you feel like the property tax is in line with the with the education that your kids are getting in the public public school? Or you think, you would you you wish you could pay a little more and have a better experience for them?
00:34:56
Speaker
Ours is pretty decent here in our school system. Our local district is really good, at least by the standards of what it's being compared to.
00:35:06
Speaker
But look, and if you get to a lower income area, the property of taxes just don't add up. They don't add up in a way that help other schools. Sounds like a resource thing at some point.
00:35:17
Speaker
Well, at some point, yeah. like If you're using like a market-based system, version of property taxes and you are a bunch of low income citizens feed this school and a bunch of low ah priced properties, you're just not gonna get the revenue to to keep that school good. But at end of the day, like the quality of the people you have in there, like, dude, if you're trying to attract McDonald's level workers in the school system with these McDonald's level wages, you get what you get, dude.
00:35:45
Speaker
You get what you get. Like, so that's what I'm saying. No, no, no fault to those people. Because like you said, I was we were there. We were young. you're Like, what the hell am going to do? Teachings like some people like there's a shortage. You can be a teacher.
00:35:59
Speaker
So if you get into it like that, the same way you might get into working at McDonald's, it's the outcomes are going to be what they are. but Yeah. Right. So you're right. I mean, you got to raise, you probably have to raise the income. You have to raise the revenue, like the money you can make and the respect if you're, if you don't want people to look at the profession as a job of last resort.
00:36:19
Speaker
Well, that's I don't know that everybody thinks of it that way, but they definitely think it. No, no, definitely not. but Yeah, yeah some some people like to take advantage of it as a calling. And let's like specifically talk about women.
00:36:32
Speaker
What is it with this profession that it's, gosh, I don't know what how many and what the percentage is of women, but it's like significant. In most elementary schools, you'd be shocked to find a single male.
00:36:46
Speaker
Yeah, and people kind of look at them a little little funny, a little bit. It's like a nurse or something like that. or Well, sure. And then like do you wonder about your like some of these parents are so psycho. They like wonder about their kid's safety because he's the only male. Why would he choose that?
00:37:01
Speaker
Did he choose it because he's a predator? I mean, there's just nobody in those school systems. I have to ask myself, well why is that? How come there are no men in the elementary school? Is it because it's not a job that – men do well?
00:37:15
Speaker
it because it's so low pay, so little respect that only women would sign up for that? I'm being condescending on purpose, but like, the fuck? Makes no sense to me. And then even- It's crazy too, dude, because my son- it was like having, there was a time, you know, after COVID, that some of these kids like had a hard time getting back into it and he's got lot of stuff going on, but he's always loved to learn and done real well in school.
00:37:40
Speaker
But I think, I think it was third grade. He had, was your third or fourth grade. i think it was fourth grade. He had a male teacher and the experience was so great for him. Like it, it like completely changed his view on like and getting educated and learning and,
00:37:54
Speaker
It was like, so, I mean, it's pretty valuable to mix it up gender wise, not just have the same person, you know, and like gender and I'm sure culture, race, everything, race, i makes everything is like, is great. And that was such a great experience for him to have a third grade teacher.
00:38:12
Speaker
A male third grade teacher. Right. Yeah. But does it make, is there any wonder why people criticize teachers? Is it shocking to you that most teachers are women and then that the profession is criticized as much as it is?
00:38:27
Speaker
I mean, it isn't to me now. I'm not. think there's a correlation there. Dude. Absolutely. look at And then just look at the predecessor to education or or what you'd call the gateway job would be like childcare, just regular childcare, daycare centers.
00:38:44
Speaker
I'm not saying it's a gateway job. It's just sort of like the lower level version of this. so we want with that You can get it without like accreditation. I think you can work at those places, right? Yeah, you can. You have to have some certifications and take CPR training or whatever. But like the level of respect that those people get in our society is hilarious to me. It's so pitifully low and yet we drop our kids off there. Yeah, maybe the most important thing in society. and bitch And we bitch about the cost of it.
00:39:13
Speaker
And so then- But then i it's like, it buries you is the issue. It buries you. So there's a structural- The price, mean. Yeah. Yeah, systemic issue here in society about that. but then But then it just, I don't want to get too far into that, but go back to the elementary school system where it's entirely women.
00:39:30
Speaker
And you're just like, ah, is that a reason why the pay stays so low? Because some male politician is just like, well, that's ah that's a woman's job. That's a good job for a woman. who you know They shouldn't be making... You're not going to pay an elementary school female teacher $95,000. It makes no sense.
00:39:50
Speaker
I think there's some of that going on, dude. I'm not trying to be super liberal, but I think there's some of that going on. it's What's funny, though, is like this seems like this this conversation, this debate has been going on since I can remember, since I had ears.
00:40:07
Speaker
like Teachers don't get paid enough. And then... The department education sucks or like it's like nothing's ever been done about it. It's just the bait goes on forever.
00:40:19
Speaker
I maybe not. Maybe maybe somebody would go, well, dude, you guys aren't teacher salaries have gone up 20 percent in the last in the last whatever, 15 years or something. But but then you're like 20 percent of thirty five thousand is still like.
00:40:34
Speaker
38,000. It's not that great or something like that. you know It's not livable in in our state. Yeah. In Colorado. It's not livable. I think, have you talked to teachers?
00:40:46
Speaker
You guys have any friends who teachers? Yeah, I have. And they they immediately try to get their master's to get the salary up. Yeah, which then they have to, then they're in debt. They justify the stress with the be with the holidays and the vacation that they get or the summers.
00:41:03
Speaker
They justify, i mean, you know, a lot of these folks, they're in really early and then they're, you know, if they're high school, they have tons of activities that they're supporting, many of them. It's like a six to seven job, 6 a.m. to 7 p.m.
00:41:17
Speaker
There's a lot of extra work, yeah, and and responsibility. It's not exactly easy. and And I think they've accepted – you can just see it on their faces. They've accepted it as a burnout environment, and it's almost like you're going to give your life to this.
00:41:32
Speaker
Yeah. Start by year three, you're wearing the frumpy teacher clothes. You you look ragged. You look fucking exhausted. you have circles under your eyes, and you can just see it on their faces. And very few of them, like the – The gym teacher guy in the high school level usually stays ripped, and you know again you know he's doing what he likes. It's not very super demanding to teach weightlifting and teach like whatever, the health, any coaches or something like that You can see that that that that they look fit, but the rest of them, man, they get a little beat up.
00:42:05
Speaker
And then the the middle school environment, they they look real beat up. Oh, God damn. Middle school must be ah hardest job, Like such kids are kids in that age are just going through a lot and are weird and awkward and emotionally all over the place. Their hormones are changing.
00:42:24
Speaker
That's got to be the worst job, dude, a middle school teacher. Totally. But we talk so much shit in America about how, oh, we're falling behind learning-wise. Goddamn school system. These teachers need to get going. And we're falling behind. And then we we look at the profession. as just like so and It's like an afterthought.
00:42:42
Speaker
And why would we ever pay teachers more? But, yeah, we want to put our kids there and have this exceptional experience. I mean, the right i think it's being put in the – in the limelight because of the trump administration what they're trying to do with the department education which seems ridiculous but but in a good way it's kind of like all right like because i think you know you mentioned denver south and that like it seems better when some of these issues are addressed locally because i was going to say like when you talk to a teacher
00:43:17
Speaker
There's always this thing where they start to get a feel for their curriculum and then yeah years go by and it gets a little easier because they already have their curriculum set up and they know what to do and they're not spending quite as much time on the day-to-day prep.
00:43:27
Speaker
And then department education, whether it's the state of Colorado or their local district or a new principal comes in, set changes direction on how they're going to do. Oh, the math program needs to be more interactive. Changes everything and the teacher starts from square one and then they so they get buried in process and how they're going to teach it and their curriculum building is And they're fucked. And then that's when they start to look ragged because they they were getting into a rhythm.
00:43:52
Speaker
Gym teacher's in a rhythm because there's nothing nothing changes. just that yeah thank And he's cool. But the these people that... can you imagine an elementary school teacher then has is doing all the different courses.
00:44:03
Speaker
So there's got to be, besides the money and all that, there it's like... there's shit It's like, can you can we get it can we agree on the right way to do it and just let people like... let them become experts in the way they manage their classroom.
00:44:16
Speaker
Because when you keep changing shit around the curriculum, what the what the goal is and test scores, they yeah they can never become an expert they're in their own domain. Yeah, and what you're saying too is independent of salary, what people need in a job is autonomy, mastery, and purpose.
00:44:34
Speaker
And they don't have that in that profession anymore. It's just just a lot of things are dictated to them, whether it be standardized testing or certain measures of- yeah and the measures change too much. Constantly, yes. But two, the other side of that, the financial side is per-pupil funding. So the the schools are desperate to keep students.
00:44:51
Speaker
And so they keep turds. They keep kids that are, and and you'll have this like idea. Public schools? Yeah, public schools. They're funded by the number of students. So there's an incentive to keep students, to keep your funding up, and to keep kids that are, you know, they're just not suited to the environment.
00:45:09
Speaker
And um I wonder if there was a past where we're just like, look, bro, you're a fucking piece of shit in this school environment. You need to go work in the mines. Right. Go work at the shoe factory. Let's let's get you on that path.
00:45:22
Speaker
Now, we want to have like a Pollyanna view of people like this. We don't leave anyone behind, no child left behind. I'm just not sure that that works. And maybe there's a way to carve these kids out that, I don't know what age, this sounds like Darwinian, but like at what age do you carve kids that this this environment isn't working for and give them other options? I'm sure people more intelligent about this have great ideas about it. But like the fact that a teacher has to sit there and deal with total pains in the asses or people that are just extremely disruptive or have like extreme learning disabilities, to me is like- Fucking hand them the welding torch and be like, get out of here. You're going to be welder. Yeah.
00:46:03
Speaker
To have to incorporate them into that kind of classroom environment that other people want a more enriched and experience is pretty interesting me. So what they've done, dude, is they've carved off all this gifted and talented bullshit for kids that aren't really gifted and talented.
00:46:17
Speaker
And they like do all these like cloak and dagger things in the school system. It's like, no, go take this advanced algebra. go No, go do this gifted and talented workshop for a semester.
00:46:29
Speaker
They do all this weird shit. And then it feels like the regular classes are just for the slobbering snaggletooths. And it's a weird public school system now. they don't It's funny, in my kids' school, they don't really do that. Because I've also been like, I wonder if my son's some math elite where maybe they should be pushing them in. And they they they don't really do that.
00:46:49
Speaker
They just make a solid curriculum and everyone goes through it. And like the only thing they have now that they have a group of kids that are they're pushing English a little harder. They're in like the international program. And it's basically around English. And i all the only reason I think they're doing that is because so many people worry about English here they're in a French school, so they they they need to be competitive, probably like you said, to keep students, be competitive in English.
00:47:13
Speaker
But I don't see that that that push for like, oh, i gotta have gifted and talented or advanced place placement and all that stuff. That's a probably uniquely American because they they need all of these carve outs to keep students.
00:47:27
Speaker
and And you'll just see, oh, so this school has and an IB program. It's just like international baccalaureate. I don't know. it entails all this hard coursework.
00:47:38
Speaker
You immediately feel guilt. Like if your kid doesn't want to do it, you're like, ah, shit. It's like, all right. You just like, I don't know what it is, but you should do it. It's that's what the what's what you should do it. Right. Like it's going to affect your life.
00:47:51
Speaker
Both of my kids are in the GT program, gifted and talented. My son barely studies. Must have got that from their mom, huh? ah Yeah, but he he's math.
00:48:05
Speaker
And I think my daughter was like, I don't know. and and That's two subjects. But they didn't dude better they know they didn't fucking care that much. It just makes no sense.
00:48:15
Speaker
How did they get into it? They like tested it? Yeah, you test in or your performance on sort of math assessments or whatever other assessments qualifies you with usually earlier on, maybe like middle school.
00:48:27
Speaker
But he is this good? are you Are you like, what's the negative? If you're like, all right, he's he's talented at math and maybe he can he can push himself a little harder. Is that good or no? Because a lot of the administration of these programs is completely worthless.
00:48:42
Speaker
There's nothing that's actually being done. There is a ah report that comes out that makes no sense to me. I mean, it sounds like you're doing exactly what you were talking about, though. who Who you critic, you're not criticizing the teacher, you're criticizing the curriculum. So I'm just talking about a system that in order to to maintain your pew per pupil funding, you've had to begin to like be everything these programs yeah everything to everyone. Like look at how we handle disabled kids.
00:49:11
Speaker
We are a disabled student magnet. We are also one of the top schools for math. The elite math. Yeah, whatever. So maybe you're kind of saying stop doing all that shit and focus on just having like a generally good structure that services at the masses.
00:49:28
Speaker
and starting think so. And stop fucking around with these extra, like put all your focus in just that six hours a day general classroom structure. I think everybody gets that, and then you have opportunities for enrichment that you can do within a school system. Like if it's high school, there's clubs, there's sports, there's all these other things that teach kids.
00:49:46
Speaker
It's funny you mentioned South, like in the mat in the special math program, because my nephew is great at math. His whole middle school, he was he was out of private school, but he was getting he was my brother was taking him to South like two or three hours a day for this crazy math program that they had.
00:50:01
Speaker
and then And then they use that to get into a super fancy private school. right but Right. but yeah like, I think, I don't know, there's a fine balance. Because, like you said, South, as everyone knows, is very reputable. And I think East, there's, are like, inner city schools that have done.
00:50:17
Speaker
When say inner city, we are talking about Colorado. not exactly like Harlem or something. but But that just means there are three black kids instead of one. but But I'm just playing, guys. Come on.
00:50:30
Speaker
but you know, they had to do it too. Like there's a balance because those programs enrich the school and the community and the people that live there. Cause what you, what Lance is talking about is like a city part of Denver, but it's fancy. It's expensive. it's pretty white.
00:50:46
Speaker
So it's city, but like white city. Yeah. Yeah. But so normally those people are like, we can't send our kids to Denver public schools. And they were like, send their kids to private schools, but this school focused on retaining their, their population. Yeah.
00:50:58
Speaker
yep but they had to do it with these programs i'm sure that was like part of it because people are like how's your math program oh it sucks okay we're going to private school because we have the money right like so they had to do it but i i think that it's like so unorganized but how do you tackle that beast this is the problem where where you get in the right wing left wing like the government from a national level can't really work efficiently it's why the united the post office is such a mess compared to like FedEx or something. So I don't know.
00:51:28
Speaker
it seems like it's got to happen at a local level. But then you have research. Like my wife taught in the hood. you but I don't know if you remember, but she was teaching up in like Montbello. Yeah, yeah. And she was people, everyone's like, oh, you could do ESL. You could do ESL. And like you could.
00:51:43
Speaker
So she did 39 students her first year in like an auxiliary classroom. It wasn't a classroom. It was like ah like they had like a portable, like a makeshift wall.
00:51:54
Speaker
And it was like, of course she was going to burn out. First year? Yeah. 39 students. And it was so stereotypical what you'd expect. You know, like we had friends that were teaching out like Douglas County, in like 17 white students.
00:52:09
Speaker
She's in the hood. She's teaching all these these people that just got here, most them from Mexico, 39 students, jammed into a little room. She has no experience. And it's like, it was just a recipe for failure, you know?
00:52:22
Speaker
Right. She had all the emotions of it. of a teacher, they fall in love with these little kids and they're like, some of them are cool, some are pain in the ass. But it was just like, I can't do this for 30 years. I'll go insane.
00:52:34
Speaker
you know is It was such a such an interesting thing. And we ended up moving and it didn't matter. But like I mean, that that that can't happen. If the if the teacher have to if the the education process is gonna be respected, you're throwing an inexperienced person in that environment,
00:52:54
Speaker
it's it's not going to work. You're not going to retain the best people. You're not going to create the best citizens. like It's not going to work. you know Yeah. I want to get into some personal stuff, but just to close the loop here on this societal piece, yeah the two sides of the coin, and which makes this so complex, are just like disagreements and values.
00:53:14
Speaker
So the super liberal side will want to say we're no child left behind, We want to incorporate, we we basically want us the school system to be a catch-all for all of society's woes and make sure that every student's needs are met. Impossible to do. And and absurd to even try to have one environment be an institution that can meet everyone's needs.
00:53:37
Speaker
The other side, the right-wing side is like, sort of like the vaccine argument of like, ah you know, I get that. Privatize everything. Privatize everything. But i I get that there's some goodwill, some societal goodwill for me participating and in this. But, you know, all else equal. If I have the resources to do something else that's perfect for me, I'm going to do that.
00:54:00
Speaker
That's sort of like the the choice. I'm going to take responsibility. It's education. It's so easily justified. It's like, oh, I got it. Like I just did. I'm like, you're going to spend your money, you should do it on my kid's education. Right.
00:54:12
Speaker
It's a possible situation, I think. But at the end of the day, whatever system we have, I think we should leave teachers alone. But I do want to get into where I've made the mistake of criticizing teachers.
00:54:24
Speaker
Some deserve it. Miss Francie, Francie, my daughter's advanced kindergarten teacher, and she was great. Advanced? Advanced kindergarten teacher, and she was fantastic. Young. What that mean?
00:54:36
Speaker
Confident. Advanced is like it was like get a gifted kindergarten program? Exactly. It was a a subset of so wealthy people in the ah neighborhood could feel confident that their kid was getting a good- Rockstar kids.
00:54:51
Speaker
Yeah, I was getting a good public school education. So she was fantastic. A year later, moving to elementary school, I won't use the real name of this teacher. Mrs. Let's call her Lucero was terrible, had bad teeth, just didn't look like a confident teacher and didn't adhere to the needs of high performers this is first grade now and many of the moms complained instead of like you know your kid just sort of cycling through experiences that we we all might have ups and downs in terms of what we experience through life there's an immediate immediate intervention about this quality of this teacher
00:55:30
Speaker
Is this a public school situation or like a private counsel school situation? So, you know, I will say I got on board with this idea that this was a ragged, low effort teacher.
00:55:41
Speaker
Then comes my son going into advanced kindergarten. A new teacher, I won't use her name. Let's just call her Mrs. Butterfield. Was deemed absolutely horrible.
00:55:52
Speaker
In advanced kindergarten, and she was fired after a year, and all the parents complained. And ah sometimes it's justifiable, but sometimes it's just needless, absurd worry and criticism over a job that's already difficult enough.
00:56:09
Speaker
In hindsight? i just In hindsight, with a lot of this stuff, I would just sort of like... Let it go. Allow your kids to experience some adversity or some different personalities and kind of nurture them through that.
00:56:23
Speaker
Not this constant intervention. And I say that right as we've got a bunch of parents who are dissatisfied with some coaching going on and have you know said some things.
00:56:36
Speaker
And there are times times to intervene. So like, I guess my question to you is there are times to intervene or there are times to like give feedback. Like what's your line, dude? Like when do you say, you know, my kid is not the problem anymore.
00:56:51
Speaker
I got I got to get involved.
00:56:55
Speaker
Um, I had, you know, there's one, there's a, there's a well-known and English teacher at my kid's school, our kid's school that, that, uh, universally sucks. all that all Everybody doesn't like this lady.
00:57:10
Speaker
She might listen the show, but I don't really care. and i I'm trying to tell my kid, just deal with it. The kids don't like her? cause he gets real Kids don't like her. Parents think her English sucks and she's teaching sucks and she has no flexibility in anything.
00:57:24
Speaker
Nobody likes her. It's like that situation you know where she's got a bad reputation.
00:57:31
Speaker
It's a funny thing because it's a funny thing because I don't know. Everybody... A lot of people's English sucks. like It's like hard to teach a language when it's not your language. If you've learned it, it's hard to teach it and be good at it. So she gets a lot of criticism about about that. But I've talked to her. her English is fine.
00:57:47
Speaker
But anyways, my point is I'm trying to be the parent that just tells my kid to deal with it. people People are different in the world and not everyone's going to do things the way you want them to, but you just got to do it.
00:57:58
Speaker
And I'm also like, you fucking idiots, you speak English. There's no reason why... Like, just... do well in the class. They can do it in their sleep, you know, because they're like, it's elementary school English as a second language or third language for these kids.
00:58:11
Speaker
They're learning days of the week. Now it's getting, i mean, it's getting more intense, but verb conjugations, but it's like, so fuck it I'm trying to be like, just deal with the teacher, but there's probably a limit where you're like, oh, that teacher's abusive or as it's like a coach who yells, who doesn't have a good message is too much for disciplinarium where you're kind of like, fuck, what do tell my kids?
00:58:31
Speaker
But I'm trying to be like Miss Lucero, Miss Butterfield, just kind of deal with the kids and next year it'll be a new teacher. But it's hard to do as a parent because you immediately take the side of your kid and you're like, well, maybe she's a bitch. Do you vent with your kid about the quality of these people in their lives? Like, oh, yeah. Do you like have like kind of what I would consider an adult conversation with them?
00:58:53
Speaker
About teachers and teaching techniques and that kind of shit? know we do. i Definitely coaches. Like, I can't turn that off. Yeah, coaches. It's like, yeah, we've been about what they did or didn't do. And we talked about that a lot last year. But teachers...
00:59:07
Speaker
you know, it's, it's interesting. Like this program that they're in is, should be pretty hands off for the parents. And like, they really focus on building like the kids being independent. And we're, we're as parents, their mom and I are definitely like down with that. Like, we're just like, don't, we're not the type to want to sit there and nurture them on homework and shit. So it's like, do your shit. I don't want to hear about that.
00:59:32
Speaker
Just kind of fucked up. Like if they were getting at school we're not really checking checking in on that but we just feel like the school and the system is pretty good so we're trying to let it work oh yeah it's you're rare and we were less interventionalist too but like we had those early moments where like oh my god what's happening in advanced kindergarten it's a good environment the kids like i don't think that's why i say i don't think it's just money for example the preschool where they go to school each teacher has an assistant at least one
01:00:04
Speaker
Which is huge. but Think about that preschool, though. like Those kids are running those kids are wild, dude. like there's To control the behavior. Yeah, it's huge, right?
01:00:16
Speaker
Like kindergarten and everything. But I think just those kind of those little things would be like... good for teachers at all levels. Like if you had an assistant or something like that, like it really helped you like deal with some of the shit and like that stuff, the burnout stuff that you're talking about.
01:00:30
Speaker
Maybe that's not funneling all the money to them, but then that might improve their quality of life or they have some help. Like if they had someone to help build curriculum or help, help deal with just the you know, like, yeah, preschool, you're getting kids in the end of the classroom and dealing with parents. And it's almost like we had a secretary, each teacher could deal with all the crap that comes with it, especially now, like managing parents is a huge. And they have, they have those roles in U S they're called like paraprofessionals. Sometimes they're like assistants to the teacher and sometimes they're more behavioral or specific to learning disabilities. But
01:01:07
Speaker
The pair is the catch-22 on the job because you don't get insurance with it. You're not really part of the team. You don't get insurance or you don't get paid when you're in the summer. So, they yeah, you get fucked as a pair. Guess who's staffing that and guess how much they get paid.
01:01:22
Speaker
It's just its the same story. We don't value it. I think that's all part of making that job less's less burnout-oriented. ah Staff them up.
01:01:33
Speaker
Load them up with help. Yeah. not just Not just focus on test results and curriculum because you're just burning people out that way. For sure. yeah um I don't know if answered the original question, but yeah, I'm i'm pretty hands-off. There's WhatsApp like chat groups of parents that I guess a lot of them are really fucking annoying.
01:01:55
Speaker
but What the Tico worries about is insane. like If there's a... In my opinion, no they might they they they think we're insane because we voted for Donald Trump to be our president.
01:02:07
Speaker
But like like, for example, and the pandemic when the pandemic was ending, or not ending, but they're starting to send kids back to school. And one of the, you know, there's all those, pride I'm sure is' the same in the US, there's protocols about distance and how many people could be there and where they were in the cafeteria.
01:02:23
Speaker
And people were like, For some reason, they weren't because the kids weren't going to have access to the microwave, so they wouldn't have hot lunches. And the Costa Rican parents were freaking out, like, what do we do?
01:02:34
Speaker
Like, what do we do? Our kids aren't going to have hot lunches. They shouldn't go back to school yet. And myself and like some of the the foreign parents, the French parents were like, have you ever heard of a fucking sandwich? Like, who cares?
01:02:46
Speaker
Send them to school. It's a fucking education. But like, so there's there's like cultural things about what you're hands on about. Because my wife was teaching those ESL kids in Mexico. Those parents would be like,
01:02:57
Speaker
Beat my kid. They would be like, if he talks back to you, or that like the amount of respect in that culture for a teacher is still pretty high. so it would be like, you're the authority. Do whatever the fuck you want to my kid, but I just want him to get educated and he should listen to you.
01:03:12
Speaker
Like a white suburban parent would never take that side. i I'm not saying that's good that the teacher is okay to hit the kids. But a a white, a white parent now in the U S I think is more like, okay, what is a teacher doing wrong to, to where my kid can't, why are you feeling this way? Is it the teacher that did this to you? Yeah. Instead of being like, shut the fuck up and listen to the teacher. Like life sucks.
01:03:34
Speaker
Math sucks. Just do your work. Or maybe not suck, but it's hard. It's harder than it's it. Yeah. That challenge in math is the same thing you're going to find in a fucking marriage or in a job or in parenting. Like everything is, is,
01:03:48
Speaker
ah It's hard. So yeah, but that message isn't, isn't be I mean, that's got to be so demoralizing as a teacher, like dealing with like hands on parents that are that are always like, wait a minute, did you is your process wrong?
01:04:03
Speaker
Are you doing something wrong? Because it can't be my kid. It's got to be hell. Well, just think about like all the forces hitting a teacher all at once. All the forces. So the liberalism and even the elitism, the box checking.
01:04:16
Speaker
So all these kids who are now, 4.0 isn't good enough, and now I need a 4.6 to go into this exceptional school. And so how dare this teacher give me a B+. So you've got those people, whatever complaints they have on the elite level. And then the liberal level is like, we must...
01:04:32
Speaker
meet everyone's needs all the time, no matter what. Now, did you have this policy in place to make sure that you didn't call that young girl um a girl? did you You shouldn't say her.
01:04:44
Speaker
Don't say her now. We've got to respect everybody's needs, and if they come with... weird allergies or weird disabilities. You're going to have to figure all those out too. Then you have that. And then you got the right wing thing. It's like, why are you bashing America, motherfuckers?
01:05:00
Speaker
Why aren't you talking about God and the Bible? you mean like And then let us add on some school shootings and some other fucking crazy shit. like Yeah. How do you work on Who wants to do that job for furries?
01:05:11
Speaker
Yeah. Fucking now I have to have a furry in my classroom. And just I have to acknowledge that that person had you is... diverse they're right to be a furry yeah diverse they're diverse and like i'm just gonna accept that so dude then now i make 42 000 come on right well i think you're getting back to like a little bit is like you're kind of saying solve it with money i am i think that's the only way to start Where?
01:05:37
Speaker
Raise property taxes or where do you get it? That I don't have a good solution, but we we seem to be able to fund a lot of other interesting things. But I think the states have- wonder what like what the accounting is on it.
01:05:49
Speaker
like if every house it was a hot Is it $100 extra except for every household and all of a sudden teachers are like, okay, this is just or is it more like, no, we all got to pitch in a lot more? you You've got so many factions in this. like Again, it's one of those things where like we want to bitch about it, but we don't look at it as a societal value. So once you age out of having kids and you're older, your willingness to pay for more or pay more taxes for the school system drops dramatically.
01:06:18
Speaker
So have those factions of people. But yeah, you could fund it with property taxes and and raise them for this purpose, but that... Doesn't ever go over well. But yeah, if you're not going to pay teachers more, we're going to get the continuing decline in learning outcomes that we have in this country.
01:06:35
Speaker
ah We could do like 20 episodes on this because. Oh, I'm sure. there's There's like, for me, it was like, i mean, I think it's kind of a known fact that the education system, it was built on like what is originally designed. It wasn't.
01:06:51
Speaker
It wasn't designed to educate our society. what I don't remember. It's like in the 1800s or something. was based on some throwaway for people that weren't fitting into society or something like that. But I have to do more research. But so you talk about, OK, like it doesn't it doesn't work for a lot of people. It's yeah it's like, okay I'm going to play devil's advocate that we're saying about bitching parents.
01:07:12
Speaker
But sitting an 11-year-old boy down in a room for like for eight hours and trying to just listen to someone or isn doesn't really work like for human nature-wise. So first of all, you have that. That's an uphill battle. i was like Is this education system even valuable at some point? We all we all think we value knowing some basic math and reading.
01:07:35
Speaker
And then outside of that, like what are we teaching? And then the other thing is like, What's the goal? Is the goal? mean, how do you how do you quantify it? this is This is where all the problems are with education, like where they keep changing the curriculum.
01:07:48
Speaker
Do you quantify it? Do you judge yourself based on college entry exams? How many people go to college? Do you base it on society? Like, all right, there's this many people have ah have a value in society after they got educated through the system.
01:08:00
Speaker
Like there should like an element, like a middle school and high school, you there should be people learning how to weld and and and whatever, do jobs like that, right? yeah And like, it's like, how we value how do we value how do we value stuff? And I think that is the issue.
01:08:18
Speaker
And like, I don't know what the solution is. Like we always get to that point in our show where you're just like, here it is people deal with it yourselves. Cause we don't know the solution, but it just seems like the education system is going to sound like taking the side of Trump, but like, it's not, it's not really, so I don't even know what it's set up for.
01:08:36
Speaker
Like, what is, what is the point? Cause you know, you mentioned like Mrs. White, the actual subjects she is teaching. There's no like tangible relevance to like, being an adult and working in a job.
01:08:48
Speaker
It's more like she expanded your mind to think and be creative and like challenge yourself. Those are great things that she taught you, but it's not like, okay, I got that in her creative writing class. What did I get out of that?
01:08:59
Speaker
It's like, it's hard for the education system to be like, all right, they got out of creative writing. You got this. And that means that you did better on an entry exam. And that means you got a job at whatever Hewlett Packard as an operations manager because of creative, but you know, it's like, how do you quantify that the education system is working and then all the other shit salaries and all this stuff associated with it would should funnel through that. But that's almost impossible to answer.
01:09:23
Speaker
Well, yes, it is. And I think there's, it's probably your multiple goals in a well-run education system, but those those subjects that that guide people to college or to what you would call white collar jobs are,
01:09:40
Speaker
that's what most of us are subjected to, in at least in high school. And it doesn't make sense for a lot of kids. The question is, is like how do you... funnel kids into different directions without like upsetting society because like this, ah well, how, how come my kid isn't going to be prepped? What, what if they change and and they no longer want to be a carpenter and then they won't have the base education to get back into the college system? Well, you could maybe fix that by opening up community college colleges to be much more flexible in,
01:10:14
Speaker
admitting kids who went maybe sort of a non-traditional route in high school and tried a career as a carpenter and were like, nah, maybe now I want to like find my way into a white collar job.
01:10:24
Speaker
Like don't make it a, that decision is going to fuck you for life type thing. Yeah, exactly. there There could be something like that. We just have a hard time not giving everybody all of the same thing and feeling really left out.
01:10:38
Speaker
And that may be the liberal side of our society. That that is the most annoying. And maybe the right wing people of just pick and choose what's right for you. Maybe that perspective is does work better or could work better.
01:10:51
Speaker
I'm not entirely sure, but the fact that we aren't preparing people for careers and HVAC, which is by the way, is just pretty technical. Lucrative. Career, HVAC, plumbing.
01:11:03
Speaker
But yeah, there should be some track like that. I think the UK has more of a ah track-based system where you actually have to qualify for the higher level. That's a weird thing though. Like just go, out you're eight years old, you didn't do good on a math test. And so you you're you're in you're pigeonholed as a laborer.
01:11:21
Speaker
ah think it I think it happens later, but it does end up being fairly class-based because you you obviously – It is a reality for some people. It is. So it's a complex thing, dude, but just like leave the teachers alone, bros. Okay?
01:11:35
Speaker
I think – yeah, I mean, if we're going to wrap it up, our wrapping thoughts, might have to change it to show name from POS to – ah The no solution show.
01:11:47
Speaker
Just problems. That's the basis of being a piece of shit, though. Expressing your opinion and having no solution. ah you Do you feel like any of this you have a POS on?
01:11:57
Speaker
Are you as highly respectful of teachers as you think you should be? Are you like, these people are, these my...
Talent, Empathy, and Respect in Education
01:12:03
Speaker
I think they're low paid people to your point. That's not attracting our best talent anymore.
01:12:09
Speaker
And I think it should. i think it should attract much more talented people. So I think in that sense, I'm a piece of shit. But where I'm probably most a piece of shit is my inability to have empathy for the diverse concerns of parents, for the fears and anxieties that parents have.
01:12:26
Speaker
I have no ah empathy for that particular. Like, you know, you being worried that your teacher, your kid's teacher is trans. Like, I'm just like, you fuck off, you stupid pussy.
01:12:39
Speaker
But I guess like if I'm empathetic, I could see how some, you know, small town bumpkin might be freaked out by that. But I'm more of that's why that's why I'm a piece of shit. Because these parents parents annoy me.
01:12:54
Speaker
um I don't know where I'm at. I'm a POS on this, but I, I mean, I, I, I did, I, I do like, i feel that, you know, that little bit of people kind of get proud of their kids school and shit. I mean, I'm definitely one of those people that's like proud that they're, they're going to a little different experience than the standard public school option. I also even, I'm like, thank God they're not going to school in U S I just feel like it's probably a better experience, which is kind of ridiculous, but um they probably probably won't get shot down there either. Huh?
01:13:24
Speaker
Yeah, probably not.
01:13:29
Speaker
Probably not. But the Yeah, I mean, it's, I don't know, it's a tough one to solve. And like you said, I probably won't fucking care about it in five years, once they're both done with school, which is part of the problem.
01:13:42
Speaker
It's just like, like, are you really going to be worried about it in 18 months, or however long your your kids are still be your son will still be in school. So that's a tough one. But um I just think I think that I should look at if I can do anything, I think I do this, but I should look more at the teachers as like, hey, great choice.
01:14:03
Speaker
And thank you for trying to help society. Not like, ah, couldn't make it in the real world, huh? Yeah. should respect teachers more in general, no matter what level or where they're at. Like, that's a hard thing to do.