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Angels Landing
281 Plays4 months ago
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May contain explicit language and unfounded accusations.
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Transcript
Introduction to 'Mothers of All Crime'
00:00:22
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the Mothers of All Crime. This is a podcast where we deep dive into mothers involved in infamous crimes and scandals. I'm Monica and this is Crystal.
Exploring Angel's Landing and Connections to Lori Vallow
00:00:56
Speaker
Welcome back to the Mothers of All Crime. This week we're going to be talking about Angel's Landing. We're talking we're having one of our cult-adjacent episodes. How are we doing today, Crystal?
00:01:08
Speaker
I'm good. How are you? Excellent, excellent. Excited to learn. Excited to listen. Yeah, so we briefly mentioned Angel's Landing during Lori Vallow's conversations, kind of when the life insurance ideas.
Discovery Through 'I Escaped a Cult' Series
00:01:26
Speaker
ah But I had never heard of the Angel's Landing until I was watching the I Escaped a Cult series on Hulu, which we've talked about a couple of them. Really great series. They kind of follow and individual from the group and talk about their experiences.
00:01:44
Speaker
And one of the episodes was Angel's Landing, which took place in 2001, was the height of it. And it was one that surprised me that they included because i do think it gives off cult vibes, but it's more of, in my opinion, like a charismatic leader of like a family versus cult.
00:02:08
Speaker
But I could see how it could still categorize if that makes sense.
00:02:14
Speaker
Yeah, it does make sense. So basically, and i'm we're going to kind of gloss over it because it is a man leading this, so it's a little off topic for us.
Lou Castro's Claims and Group Dynamics
00:02:26
Speaker
A little bit. But basically, Lou Castro was the leader of this group, and he... told his followers and people around that he was an angel from the past and he was there to protect them.
00:02:41
Speaker
ah He also would tell them that he had the ability to bring back people after they passed away if they wanted to come back. And I liked that little additional addition that he would put in there because it'd be really easy just be like oh I can bring anybody back if I want to and then when people challenged it now he has the ability of like well I spoke to them on the other side and they they just don't want to come back which is a lot easier to talk away from than the other way around
00:03:16
Speaker
I mean, that's so smart because you could just always use that as an excuse if something doesn't work. Oh, didn't want to. Yeah. so he also claimed he was thousands of years old. He could see the future. ah Again, all very convenient for him.
00:03:34
Speaker
But as they kind of go through, they follow her family meeting him and joining this group, which had a couple different families in it.
00:03:45
Speaker
I want to say it was two or three. couldn't quite figure it out. There was at least two. I think there were three, but so they moved to Wichita, Kansas and kind of really get involved in this group. And at first and on the surface, it seems really fun. They had a lot of toys, four wheelers on this huge property.
00:04:09
Speaker
But Lou didn't work and seemed to have all this money. So there was always that question of like where it was coming from. And it did draw the eye of local law enforcement.
Suspicious Deaths and Life Insurance Schemes
00:04:21
Speaker
But again, when they were watching him, his property, and the people who live there, there wasn't the normal things that you would see for something like drug trafficking, for example. A lot of the time, if you're not working, you're selling drugs. and That's how you get your income.
00:04:37
Speaker
but you're going to have a lot of foot traffic. You're going to have a lot of people coming in and coming out. And that just wasn't the case on this property. It was just these same people kind of living their lives. And the police wouldn't open an official investigation, but in the episode, there was one police officer who yeah on his off time was like, there was something there. He's like, I didn't know what it was, but something wasn't right. So I in his off time, he would keep tabs on this, quote, family.
00:05:10
Speaker
And it continued, but then lou kind of focused in on Sarah, who's the girl that we follow through the documentary, And she was a teenager, but he, and we see this a lot, kind of zoned in on her and said there were things wrong
Manipulation and Control Tactics
00:05:30
Speaker
with her.
00:05:30
Speaker
And the only way to fix her was for him to have sex with her. Otherwise, she wouldn't be able to be full and corrected. and of course, if she told anybody, his her whole family was going to die.
00:05:48
Speaker
Why is that always the solution, though? Yeah. Like, it seems to be with every cult that no matter what, it ends up with the leader needing to have sex with a teenage girl.
00:06:01
Speaker
At least one. but At least one. Yeah. At least one. So obviously they started having intercourse because she had these conditions of believing that she had to do this.
00:06:16
Speaker
So interacting sexually, but also in her outside. And then suddenly Trish, who was one of the adult women there that was kind of like a second mother to Sarah, was found unconscious in the pool and died in the hospital.
00:06:35
Speaker
This was in 2003.
00:06:37
Speaker
So it was it was weird because from the story that they told the police, Sarah's sister just came outside, saw Trish in the pool, called law enforcement. They came and she was transported and she died at the hospital.
00:06:59
Speaker
But from the followers, it really reinforced the idea of Lou having an idea of the future because he prior to her passing, he started saying things like her time is coming and we're going to move on. Like basically kind of hinting towards the fact that Trish wasn't going to be around much longer. And then all of a sudden popped up and she's dead in the pool.
00:07:31
Speaker
Wow. Mm hmm. That's crazy. So law enforcement again started they looked into it and it did get ruled in the moment as like an accidental.
00:07:45
Speaker
And they started digging in. And if we're going to work backwards, South Dakota, 2001, Lou was married. He had a child and they both died in a plane crash.
00:08:00
Speaker
However, in the article that got published about this pillion crash, it was her brother, not her husband.
00:08:11
Speaker
Right. So, again, weird dynamics happening and ah no one's really knowing what his history is because there's always these different stories.
00:08:23
Speaker
Is it a chameleon? The story changes is based on... who we're talking to.
00:08:30
Speaker
And from like conversations, she wasn't sibling. She wasn't a wife. She was a follower. So time goes on. 2008 comes around and Sarah's mom started kind of becoming the new focus of Lou.
00:08:50
Speaker
And she went for a drive. She was speeding. There were reports of her driving erratically around and then she swerved and drove straight into a truck, was ejected from the car and pronounced dead on scene.
00:09:09
Speaker
Wow. So the reports, oh yeah, but the reports are saying there's no way that she didn't see this truck. There's no way that It wasn't her swerving into the truck.
00:09:24
Speaker
However, it was ruled as an accident. And it's weird.
00:09:35
Speaker
So there's, you can tell by the marks on the road that she that she didn't swerve or that she did swerve. So she swerved, she was driving erratically on the road earlier and then swerved into the truck and hit him head on.
00:09:54
Speaker
And then she was ejected from the car. Gotcha. Gotcha.
00:09:58
Speaker
So that's two people of his followers. We're going to categorize the plane crash as a follower. And then we have another one, Brian Hughes, where he was a mechanic who was working on a car.
00:10:14
Speaker
And in a bizarre instance, he was working in the car. The car fell off the jack and fell on top of him. And he died.
00:10:26
Speaker
Again, rules as an accident from an investigation. Hmm. So this point. Seems weird, right? verytys Very convenient.
00:10:39
Speaker
um Local law enforcement did end up opening an official investigation, kind of looking into the money and the fact that these deaths were always on average about three years apart.
Investigations and False Identities
00:10:53
Speaker
And as they're looking into it, Lou Castro on paper didn't exist. So now not only were they trying to figure out the money aspect, they're trying to figure out who this person is.
00:11:07
Speaker
And the first thing they figure out is the money is coming from what we hinted last time is life insurance policies.
00:11:17
Speaker
Yes. ah That's a homage to our girl, Lori Vallow and che dad Chad Daybill, how they were in a very profitable industry of cashing in on life insurance policies due to tragic deaths in their families.
00:11:33
Speaker
Yeah. But also, like, if you kill someone, the life insurance, like, if you murder your husband, you don't, and you are the beneficiary, you don't get it because you murdered him to get it.
00:11:46
Speaker
so there Well, you're not supposed to. first Yes. If it's proven, you don't get it. Got to be a little more sneaky like Lori.
00:11:58
Speaker
um But in this case, they were all ruled as accidents. The life insurance policies were paid out to one of the followers of Lou, never Lou directly. And then he would use it until the money ran out.
00:12:12
Speaker
Two and a half, three years later, another person would. suspiciously slash accidentally pass away. It's becoming a pattern.
00:12:25
Speaker
Yeah. So Sarah, on the other hand, was really focused in on her mom's death because of course, who who wouldn't be?
00:12:36
Speaker
That her mom never kind of gave off signs of being suicidal And then goes off and drives erratically, unsafe passing, swerves, hits a truck with no signs of braking. It just seemed very uncharacteristic in Sarah's opinion.
00:12:55
Speaker
And she blamed Lou. She flat out was like, nope, you killed my mom. And she believed that he had convinced her mom to kill herself.
00:13:11
Speaker
Convinced her to kill herself. I guess is that murder? Is that manslaughter? And that's where the question comes in. Because she had a life insurance policy of one million dollars.
00:13:26
Speaker
She had two children and the life insurance policy went to one of the followers in the group and nothing went to her kids.
00:13:36
Speaker
Wow.
00:13:38
Speaker
that's that's crazy yeah it seems very strange that someone would take their kids out of their life insurance policy and it kind of turns into that the control that lou had over these people where he convinced jennifer who's sarah's mom to divorce her husband to move to wichita to And he was in full control of the food, the money, the activities, and it didn't seem like anybody really argued about it.
00:14:10
Speaker
ah But then again, i don't think they necessarily were see putting all the things together that outsiders were starting to see, where the timeline, the money, everything kind of became bizarre.
00:14:27
Speaker
And this is when law enforcement started kind of more actually investigating. And someone went to him and talked to him bringing, and I loved this. I never even would have thought of this, but um they brought these glossy photos of the accident to have him whole like pick up the photos, look at them, go through them, ask what his thoughts and stuff were.
00:14:52
Speaker
But he wouldn't pick up the photos. He would just use like his fingernail to like push the photos around the table.
00:15:00
Speaker
o Because his fingerprints could have gone on the glossy photos. Which is so smart. And I never would have thought of that. So clearly this man has dealt with law enforcement before.
00:15:14
Speaker
And has learned, all right, these are glossy photos. I'm just going to push them. I'm not going to pick them up because then they would have had his fingerprint and they could have figured out who he actually was. That's so smart.
00:15:27
Speaker
sir I feel like if I didn't have gloves, I would just get fingerprints on everything. ah Right? it so easy to mess it up and just like have one flat fingerprint on a surface, you know?
00:15:38
Speaker
Yeah. So very, very smart, very foreseen. um And then quickly after he picked up everything, moved to Tennessee.
00:15:49
Speaker
And. Like, so he left the compound, Sarah lives somewhere else, and he would still try to control her while in a different state than her, which, again, kind of reinforces it.
00:16:05
Speaker
But she started seeing a guy kind of helped her understand that What happened to her when she was younger was not her fault, but also was illegal, was sexual assault, was underage rape of a child. Like he kind of helped her understand all of this and actually ended up telling the fbi And that's where the new real deep investigation kind of opened up.
00:16:41
Speaker
Thanks to her boyfriend, really.
00:16:46
Speaker
Yeah, that's, I mean, that's definitely what it sounds like. Yeah. And, like, kind of sweet of, like, she's just trying to share her history and he's the one, like, hold on a minute. That's not, you know that's not normal, right? Like, you know that that's illegal, right?
00:17:02
Speaker
ah So, lou ends up getting arrested. it and
00:17:11
Speaker
it More comes out because Trish, who we had talked about, the girl in the pool, ah she had a past boyfriend named Danny Perez.
00:17:22
Speaker
And he had a criminal record of sexual assault with minors. who His booking photo is the same person as Lou Castro.
00:17:35
Speaker
So a coincidence, I know how convenient, but also it's showing like Trish had children. She was knew that there were children there and she knew that this man had these tendencies because the charges were from the late ninety s and you can you didn't do anything which is crazy to me i understand mind control and i understand blah blah blah but it still is always
Arrest and Convictions of Lou Castro
00:18:05
Speaker
going to be hard for me for having someone know that there is a predator around children and then doing nothing about
00:18:17
Speaker
Yeah, unfortunately, that seems to happen all of the time, pretty much. And kids are incredibly vulnerable.
00:18:25
Speaker
So lou was arrested he for identity theft. He was guilty. He was incarcerated for two years and came out right back to his group.
00:18:37
Speaker
However, during that time, going to jump ah bunch, but another investigation was happening. He ended up with 28 different charges out of Wichita, including first-degree murder, rape, abrogated criminal sodomy, aggravated assault, sexploitation of a child, false information, um and I think there was multiple counts of each of those.
00:19:05
Speaker
So his case then uncovered the fact that Trisha's incident. The real story was there was a ruckus outside and Mandy, who is the younger sister of Sarah, daughter of Jennifer, heard a really loud splash outside because there was a pool.
00:19:29
Speaker
When lou came in the house, he was soaking wet, told Mandy to wait 10 minutes, call the police, and tell them that Trish had slipped and fallen and was in the pool.
00:19:51
Speaker
And that was what actually happened where it was found that he was the one who, and this is where i wasn't quite clear of if he like attacked her and then they both found the pool. If he attacked her while they were in the pool like continued to attack her like that's the part i wasn't quite sure if like they started outside the pool and they both fell in or you know what i mean like i can't figure out the order of it from the episode so either way it was found that he was responsible for her death
00:20:33
Speaker
Plus, even if it was an accident, telling someone to wait 10 minutes rather than getting help immediately kind of just shows the fact that he had no care of actually helping her if it did start as an accident.
00:20:48
Speaker
Right, which seems pretty unlikely just based on the series of events that this is an accident of any kind. But I guess you never know 100%.
00:20:59
Speaker
Yeah. So ah through these cases, Mandy, who was 10 or 11 at the time, came out that was also being sexually assaulted by Castro. And...
00:21:13
Speaker
and During the trials, Jennifer testified, and he would, i guess, stare down any of the witnesses.
00:21:24
Speaker
And then, because he was chained up during it, he would, like, rumble the chains to try and intimidate people. oh And what I really liked about this prosecutor is they would stand in front of him.
00:21:38
Speaker
So he would block the view between the offender and the victim or the witness so that they could make eye contact, which I thought was really smart to try to like protect not only the victim, but also give them the opportunity to like truly say what they want to say and not be scared or intimidated you afraid. Like, change what they were going to say. Tell the truth.
00:22:08
Speaker
So I thought that was really, really good on their part.
00:22:14
Speaker
I definitely agree. Because it would be so hard to not be freaked out in that situation regardless. And then if someone's groaning, rattling their chains at you, oh i mean, that would be scary.
00:22:27
Speaker
Although, obviously, he's in a position where he can't really do anything to you. It's just... He's trying to make it seem like he could. Exactly. So ah in 2015, he was found guilty of all counts.
00:22:41
Speaker
He was sentenced to 80 years to life incarcerated. And with his age, he he's not going to ever be out, which is really nice. But it was one of those ones that he had done this for so long. He had so many different identities that...
00:23:01
Speaker
It took so long for people to put it together that I'm kind of surprised anybody did.
00:23:09
Speaker
Yeah. i I mean, the way that this was spaced out, like, I wouldn't be surprised if it could have, like, he could have gotten away with it way longer. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And again, you had all these different names and think his legal actual name was Daniel Perez.
00:23:29
Speaker
So again, another name on something the else that I think was on a bank account and that's how they determined that. But if you're constantly changing identities, you're moving around and you're convincing, you're so charismatic that you're able to convince people to take their own life for one.
00:23:48
Speaker
But it also now comes to mind of that car probably didn't accidentally fall off the jack. It probably was nudged.
00:23:59
Speaker
And then he happened to be underneath it. I think the one that truly showed his control of the people was Jennifer, who drove into and that's the thing is like, there's no guarantee if you are in a car accident that you will die.
00:24:19
Speaker
So i really wonder what he said to her. i wonder if he like threatened the girls or what it could have been because for him to get her to do that was very shocking to me compared to the other two seemed to like he had a handle in it.
00:24:41
Speaker
this one would have just solely been convincing.
00:24:49
Speaker
I definitely agree. It does seem convincing. I don't know that... I feel like people probably get away with this all the time. and Yeah, and then like you said, it kind of brings up the idea of for her... So ah Trish, it was determined that he had killed her, but when you are convincing someone else to do it, you...
00:25:11
Speaker
technically didn't kill them but you're the reason that they're dead so how do you go about gathering information for something like that because everything would be hearsay so that could be really hard to prove
00:25:27
Speaker
yeah it's pretty pretty incredible they're even able to get any kind of convictions any kind of trial
00:25:36
Speaker
Because it is a lot of just circumstantial evidence and it could be explained another way. It's just like, I guess, the the logic and the pattern. Yeah, exactly. It's a lot for a jury to interpret.
00:25:53
Speaker
Yeah. So ah not that I'm saying fortunately, but there were enough other cases that he was charged with and evidence on other things that there was no question on that conviction.
Financial Crime with Life Insurance
00:26:05
Speaker
But it really brings up the reason we wanted to talk about it is the life insurance connection, because this is not something that I think people commonly think of when they think of violence and murder and cults and money.
00:26:23
Speaker
And Lori was a great example of how quiet it could be. Like that wasn't a very public thing that was talked about was the life insurance until later on.
00:26:34
Speaker
And you would think in larger circumstances, that's something because you murder your wife, your wife gets murdered. The first person they look at is the husband and vice versa.
00:26:47
Speaker
But It is really easy to kind of disregard the life insurance because a lot of the time it makes sense, right? Like it goes to your kids, it goes to your spouse, it goes to whatever.
00:27:01
Speaker
But having it go to someone who's not even related to you is when it starts getting interesting,
00:27:11
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. i mean, it makes it makes it easier to get away with, for sure, because it's you're less connected. But also, it does seem like it would be a little bit more suspicious that you have life insurance on someone who is not your spouse, not your parent, not someone who, like, theoretically financially provides for you.
00:27:30
Speaker
That's usually who gets life like who has life insurance for someone. Yeah. or has it on their behalf. Like people get it for their spouses in case of their own death. People get it for their kids in case of their own death. But like you don't usually take out insurance policies on friends or for friends or acquaintances or anything like that. It is ah red flag for sure.
00:27:56
Speaker
And I think that you make a good point that financial crimes are kind of looked at as not as big of a deal sometimes but i feel like they often go hand in hand with other types of abuse and crimes because it's just another way of taking power getting control manipulating it's an abuse for sure but i think that all of these things go together and it's like anti-social behavior
00:28:23
Speaker
Yeah, no, absolutely. And one thing that i also thought about as we were kind of going through this unique situation, this unique cult is the the level level of consent.
00:28:37
Speaker
Because when you take out a life insurance policy on someone else, that you need that other person's consent or signed consent, not necessarily real consent, that Because it on paper, it shows that they're aware of the policy and the details.
00:28:57
Speaker
However, it doesn't say anything about consistent consent. So all you need to do really is get someone in a vulnerable state to sign a piece of paper and that's it.
00:29:12
Speaker
Because you can pay into the life insurance policy and not have the other person aware of it. And I'm thinking like a more generalized thing of like spouses who get divorced.
00:29:24
Speaker
That other person, if they keep paying into that life insurance policy, you might not necessarily know they even have it on you. But if you signed it once, they can still collect it even though you've been divorced for 20 years. Right.
00:29:39
Speaker
That's true. Which is a crazy thing to think about. And I think that this is something that's probably a lot more common than we know because it's not technically illegal, right? Like if...
00:29:55
Speaker
I, you and i have this big thing and I'm like, hey, I want to protect you. and want to make sure everything's okay after you're gone. Sign this piece of paper. 20 years from now, we stop talking.
00:30:08
Speaker
You might not necessarily remember you signed that paper. and if I keep paying it in 40 years from now, when you die, i don't want you to die. But in this theory, I can get a million dollars. In 60 years, it's fine.
00:30:21
Speaker
And nobody's going to know. like and I'll just get this cash out.
00:30:28
Speaker
Yeah, but if you didn't kill me, then it's fine. And you've recouped on your investment now. You know what I mean? like if It's only a problem if you kill the person. I know, but it's still a weird thing just to like have a life for insurance policy on someone that isn't connected. Right? like Because in in theory, wouldn't it be very hard to convince a lot of people to sign those. And you can make a lot of money doing very little.
00:30:55
Speaker
Sure, but you just have to hope that the people you can convince die before you and hopefully kind of prematurely. you know You don't want to pick your youngest, healthiest friends for that.
00:31:06
Speaker
Oh, yeah. But also, like, if you're thinking in a nursing home, how easy would it be to get people to sign off something that they aren't fully aware of?
00:31:17
Speaker
They might just sign stuff because they sign or slip it into another packet of things that people are signing because most people don't read the fine lines on everything. They just say sign here, sign to here, sign here, and people go okay, and to do it.
00:31:32
Speaker
That is true. Although I will say it is more expensive and less lucrative to take out life insurance on people who are old and or sick. What you really need and what a lot of times people do in these situations is they take out life insurance policies on people who are young and healthy and able-bodied. and Yeah. That's when you get...
00:31:51
Speaker
actual money for it because then their lives are worth something on paper essentially and then they take it out for six months for a year for two years whatever and then this person tragically dies which is what happened in this case because who wants to pay a life insurance policy for 40 years right I mean that's if you're taking it out for yourself like on yourself then you kind of do want that because obviously as you're paying it you're not no one's using it which means you're alive but if you're taking it out with the intention of making money then picking someone young that doesn't have pre-existing conditions is just going to be the best bang for your buck yeah especially if they drop dead yeah and yeah and conveniently something falls on top of you and crushes you
00:32:38
Speaker
i mean i guess that could happen anybody you know Mm-hmm. But I know it's a focus on a man, but it was an interesting connection to Lori and makes me wonder if it's something that she was aware of because this was far before her.
00:32:54
Speaker
So, and also in the, not, I don't want to say same area, but like same region of the country, like it might've been televised and something she heard of. So it it's curious if it was something that she thought up on her own or if something like this was an influence of inspiration for her moving forward with all of her other decisions.
00:33:22
Speaker
Yeah, I think so.
00:33:28
Speaker
But yeah, ah so that was a quick little overview of Angels Landing and kind of a smaller group that I had never really heard of.
00:33:40
Speaker
So kind of a fun connection on on one of our moms that we had talked about.
00:33:47
Speaker
Yeah, and I do think that this is a theme that we'll continue to see also with the life insurance. It comes up so much in true crime, so it it is nice to talk about someone who that's their main focus and the major consequences that they still get for that.
00:34:01
Speaker
um i think I think it's just an interesting interesting topic. Yeah, absolutely. Well, before we go, do you have any final thoughts on our multi-personality identity Yeah.
00:34:18
Speaker
I just think in general, even though it's very, very boring, it is really good to read things before you sign them and not to authorize anyone to take out life insurance policies for you or on you unless it's kind of reasonable that they would get all of your money when you die.
00:34:37
Speaker
Yeah. um Pretty much just that, though. How about you? Yeah, I think that it's good to always kind of have that foresight on questioning what people tell you.
00:34:52
Speaker
i think even if something sounds really great, if it sounds too good to be true, there's a chance that it might be. So always double check yourself, ask outsider people's opinion. You don't have to always listen to it, but it's good to have those insights because I think if some of these people who followed Castro maybe got some other opinions, they may have seen some of the questionable things that were happening. They might not have.
00:35:24
Speaker
But everyone's got to join at some point. And moving to Wichita, Kansas in the middle of nowhere with another family seems a little weird.
00:35:36
Speaker
So have those people around you. Have those conversations. And if anybody who can tell you that they can bring people back from the dead, they're probably wrong.
00:35:49
Speaker
Probably wrong. Otherwise, everyone would have heard about it. ever but that was my last one but I hope but everyone kind of takes a peek at this documentary series there's a lot of good information on each episode about different groups and I'm sure we'll bring up another one of them sometime in the future yes I think so so we'll pick up right back here next week have a good one you too till next time