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If the Shoe Fits, Wear It
35 Plays2 months ago
In this episode, Andrew and Patrick discuss the difficulty with accepting blame or criticism, how society promotes not taking responsibility, and how we can learn to be introspective and more honest with ourselves.
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Transcript
Introduction and Kipling's Influence
00:00:00
Speaker
and the brave new world begins when all men are paid for existing and no man must pay for his sins as surely as water will wet us as surely as fire will burn the gods of the coffee book headings with terror and slaughter return
00:00:28
Speaker
Hello, everybody, and thank you for joining us for another episode of the Copybook Headings podcast. If you're a new listener joining us for the first time, this show is inspired by the poem by Redyard Kipling called The Gods of the Copybook Headings. And every week we take an old saying proverb or maxim and we break it down to see what we can learn from it and see if there's still any ancient wisdom in these old proverbs that's relevant today.
Hosts' Banter and Leatherworking
00:00:50
Speaker
I am your host, Patrick Payne, and with me, as always, is my co-host, Andrew Stevens. Andrew, how are you, man? Hey, I'm doing all right. How are you?
00:00:58
Speaker
Good, good. We were just off air talking about your your little side hustle of your leatherworking. Want to plug that real quick before we jump into the show? Yeah, yeah. I um ah just like making stuff. like And lately I've been making belts. um And so i i you you have one. and Yep.
00:01:19
Speaker
And I hear, I hear it's working pretty well for you. Yeah. So a few, a few of the guys have, have my belts. Like I just made them out of, I wanted me, basically I wanted something for myself. I wanted like a really heavy duty belt and, uh, something that'd be really, uh,
00:01:37
Speaker
really durable and, and, uh, yeah, just kind of chunky and some, I got like the thickest leather I could find, like, um, which is they make like saddles out of, um, saddle skirting. And, and so I got thick leather and made some, made some belts out of it. And it's, it's fun. Mine even has like got dunked in the Pacific ocean on accident and is still kicking and everything. So yeah, it's, um, it's, it's fun. So.
00:02:05
Speaker
Yeah, if anyone wants one, reach out to us, um reach out to me. I'll give you a quote, give you the ah give you the friends and family discount, the listener discount.
00:02:17
Speaker
Yeah, heck yeah. it ah Yeah, mine's been great. It's ah it very much as durable. And one of my favorite things about it is it sounds like real leather. Because you put on most belts you buy, they they're like fake or whatever. This one like creaks. And when you move a little bit, it's like the real leather. I love it. It's a great belt. Yeah, it feels highly recommended. It feels very Old West, like you got your your gun belt creaking. Yeah, it's awesome. Yeah, so yeah, we've got a good
Proverb Exploration: 'If the Shoe Fits'
00:02:44
Speaker
good one this week. This is one you picked. You want to um tell us about it?
00:02:48
Speaker
Yeah, it's a if the shoe fits, wear it. And yeah just, you know, looking through, looking through our list, I just kind of picked one that looked interesting. And um yeah, and and this one is interesting to me for maybe different reasons than like just initial grab of like, okay, it's a pretty common one. um But it's kind of Well, at first I'll talk a little bit about the history. So this one um originally was like in the 17th century, I think in in England, it was if the cap fits. And then prior to that, even even older in the 16th century, if the cloak fits. So this ah this idea has been around, I think the consensus is that
00:03:43
Speaker
the shoe change was it more of an American alteration to the to the proverb. And ah people think a lot, it has like some some associations with like the Cinderella story. yep and But but what what struck me after I was researching a little bit is just that it's kind of a negative one. It's it's kind of something you say um maybe as as a backhanded insult or um
00:04:15
Speaker
It just kind of a way to brush people off, kind of deal with it, you know, if the shoe fits. So, um but I kind of like that because it's a, it's one that's meant to make people reflect. So I think, yeah, what did what did you think when you saw it? Yeah, um first thing I thought was, you know, super common, everyone's heard it, ah but I was interested in the history of it. So I looked up, I looked up a little bit of it and I found the same thing that there are other older variations. um I found early 18th century, if the cap fits, wear it.
00:04:51
Speaker
And I found that like ah the phrase cap was specifically referring to the fool's cap, like a dunce cap type of thing, okay were or a we're like a maybe more like a jester or something. you know um Yeah, it says the idea that if ah if if you're like if someone recognizes you as a as an object of criticism, if someone criticizes you, maybe you should take that to heart and think, yeah you know if if the dunce cap fits,
00:05:22
Speaker
you know ah presumably not it doesn't always fit. Maybe someone might try to put the dunce cap on you and it's not it doesn't fit. But if if if their criticism rings true, you should wear it and maybe reflect a little bit on that.
00:05:35
Speaker
yeah um I found there were it it appeared, if the cap fits where it appeared in a play in 1705 titled The Confederacy by ah Sir John Van Brahe. Okay. Van Brahe, something like that. I don't know if you've heard of that one, but it was a comedy and I guess a character in there said something about kind of some self-reflection about some criticism and said if the if the cap fits where it. So that's what I found out about it.
00:06:03
Speaker
Yeah. I like that. And that, that makes a lot of sense as an origin for this one. It's certainly more than something like Cinderella, right? Sure. like if If the, the gestures cap fits, then you might just be a gesture and you kind of need to realize it. Do we know anything about what the cloak meant? Like the earlier one and that would you say 17th century? Yeah. let Let's see. That was, um, Richard Hooker.
00:06:33
Speaker
Um, and let's see this, the phrase that it was from of this, of the laws of ecclesiastical polity. This is the sources saying, uh, grammarist dot.com, which cloak Siddith no less fit on the back of their cause than of the Anabaptists. Um.
00:06:56
Speaker
is is what that comes from. So yeah, I guess a similar sense that like you know you're like you're wearing the uniform of that purse of that side. So yeah you know you look like you're wearing that uniform, so you're on that side. I guess it's kind of the sense there.
00:07:15
Speaker
If you're acting like an Anabaptist, then maybe you need to self-reflect a little bit. I don't know. Do they not like the Anabaptist? Yeah, this is like if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, right? Yeah, kind of like that. Yeah, good one.
Modern Criticism Dynamics
00:07:31
Speaker
What do you think about the meaning of it or its applicability?
00:07:36
Speaker
um I think it's... a Yeah. It seems like people use it a little differently today. Yeah. um And I was trying to think of like, um you know, the last time I've used this one or and and and some of these articles that have the source, it's interesting that they include like this, you know, like on Google, they have those those charts of like usage um of ah phrases and words, you know. Yeah. And so some of these articles had that and and it's really declined in the last 20 years. So I think I feel like
00:08:11
Speaker
when I was like in high school or beginning a college is kind of when this peaked and then it's kind of gone out of ah fashion. um So I'm trying to think of the last time I used it. um and And so I was struggling to come up with some examples of of of this one. um Did you like,
00:08:35
Speaker
Like I get, do you use this one? Is is this in your, is this in your common arsenal here or is this one not used too much, uh, around you either? Probably not common, but I've definitely used it. I, I, I can say certainly that I've, I've said this before at some point. Um, but I feel like my understanding and maybe common usage is a little bit different than what it it's saying. Like this is kind of like, it seems to be.
00:09:03
Speaker
Like we mentioned, advising more towards self introspection and understanding like if if a criticism comes from an external source, you know you should think about it and say, well, you know does this really apply to me? Does this hat fit? Does this shoe fit on me? And if so, maybe you need to just wear it and be like, yeah, you know what? This guy called me a fool, but I kind of was being a fool. so yeah um But I feel like it's, I don't know. It seems like modern usage is a little different than that.
00:09:33
Speaker
Yeah. And maybe, you know, maybe it's fallen out of fashion a little bit cause people are a little touchier than it used to be. maybe Cause this is like, when I think of this one, like who who could I say this to? Right? Like I could, at this point I could really just say it to like my guy friends, my close guy friends. Yeah. Cause it's a little bit, it's a little bit harsh and yeah they would know that I'm not actually being mean. and I'm just, I'm just being blunt. But, but like, I wouldn't use this with my wife, I don't think. And I don't,
00:10:03
Speaker
I'm trying to think of anyone else i'd use I wouldn't use it at work. I might use it on my kids if they're doing something delicious. My brother said I'm being dumb. might If the shoe fits, man. like yeah yeah like you're Were you doing something dumb? Yeah.
00:10:22
Speaker
so yeah I just wonder if it's like... you know People were a little you could be a little more blunt with strangers in the past. um that Yeah, and currently so yeah, probably so it's part I Feel like it's used a little bit differently now, but I'm having a hard time putting my finger on exactly how um I feel like it's used maybe a little more broadly like people are just like use it to mean Like you said, if it walks like a duck, like not necessarily with any introspection attached to it, just like it is kind of, if if if that's what it looks like, that's what it is. If the shoe fits, you know, wear it. Have you noticed that? Because that's kind of what it seems like to me.
00:11:03
Speaker
ah Yeah, that sounds familiar. And and now that this is um on my radar, I'm going to Hopefully, I'm going to listen for this one more and see how people are using it. um
00:11:18
Speaker
Because, yeah, because I just drawn a blank when what it really comes down to it. um but Yeah, I have a hard time also of figuring out exactly how it's used or when, but yeah, go ahead. Well, I just kind of, you know, I thought it would, it's also just a a good jump off jumping off point for um talking about you know, giving and receiving criticism. Um, and so, um, you know, like I just said, it's it seems that it's harder, it's harder to do these days. I don't, I don't know how it's up in your observation as well, that, uh, people are, especially like a a stranger is not going to want to take criticism from you or you might not want to take criticism from a stranger. Whereas, you know,
00:12:09
Speaker
When you were a kid that was not uncommon. Yeah. Yeah. I totally think that it's much, uh, more difficult to give criticism and less likely to be taken. Well, nowadays I had an experience. I'll tell a little story where I had, I was running a, I was managing a sales team. Okay. And it was like kind of entry level sales positions. And so I was bringing in a lot of like younger guys.
Workplace Criticism Story
00:12:37
Speaker
Maybe they didn't have a lot of experience, a lot of education. All they really needed was just a good work ethic. I'd teach them what to do and they could go out and they could sell this product, right? Yeah. So this guy comes and he seemed like a sharp kid, everything, but he just smelled bad. Like the dude had some BO and like, I don't know what to do. I can't send him to like a client or like a customer's home or something smelling like this. Like he's gotta take care of this.
00:13:06
Speaker
And so I had to pull him aside and as gently as I could tell him, hey man, we got to up the hygiene game. And then he just never never came back. I had the conversation with him. He just did not show up the next day and I never saw him again.
00:13:20
Speaker
So I'm like, okay, well, that didn't go well, but yeah. ah So don't ask me how to, apparently, I'm not the expert on how to give criticism. I thought I was like doing it as gently as possible, but that's like, how do you be gentle about that kind of topic? It's pretty tough. It's a tough conversation no matter which way you slice it, but I feel like something had to be said. Yeah. I think you think you're right. ah it Yeah, it's it's one of those things where you you resent like,
00:13:46
Speaker
You resent being in the position that you're the one who has to say it, right? Like someone else in this person's life should should have been the one to to say it. And there's multiple failures along the way before he gets to you.
00:14:01
Speaker
For sure, yeah, and it was, yeah, it was ah it was a tough situation and and I was really hoping it wouldn't go that way, but like, i don't i don't I don't know. Yeah, I guess I'm not terribly surprised that he was just, you know, was too embarrassed to come back. ah but um But yeah, it's, ah I don't know, what do you think? Do you do you think ah that conversation would have been easier 100 years ago? um Yeah, I think a little bit. i think Part of it is um maybe egalitarianism.
00:14:37
Speaker
um you know in the past where like in ah In a work setting, for example, you've got the boss, and the boss is you know has more more power, more authority, and and is viewed with maybe a little more respect. And so if the butt the boss has more leeway in what he can say and what he can do,
00:14:59
Speaker
and people just kind of dealt with it um and just kind of um Maybe grumbled amongst each other you know amongst themselves or things but ultimately they're like Whether or not they realize he has a good point. They realize that he has some authority and and can can say things and um Yeah, so I think people just um had a little bit thicker skin in that regard because like, well, it's it's it's the boss s saying it and he's he's a jerk, but he's maybe he's right. you know Okay. So you think maybe a society being a little more hierarchical led to that being more common? That's interesting. Yeah. I wonder. I wonder.
00:15:47
Speaker
Cause you know, and if you go even farther back, um, you know, I like, I think I've talked about it. I like, I like shows that, um, you know, period dramas, right? So shows that are take place a long time ago. Uh, one, one that's kind of a silly one is, is, uh, it's pole dark. I don't know if you've ever seen that one. I have. Yeah. Late 1700s. You know, I think he was in, uh,
00:16:13
Speaker
I think he used fought against the Americans right in the in the Revolutionary War. I think it's his backstory. um But he has like these, he's this um lesser gentry in in England and he has these um these servants who are terrible, right? Like they're they're not good servants um and he's kind of mean to them back, but like but they don't leave and he doesn't fire them.
00:16:41
Speaker
There's just things grumble at each other and they do their jobs ultimately, you know? yeah And so like that relationship just would not exist today. no but but But it did then. And so it's kind of an interesting change in the way people view hierarchy.
00:16:57
Speaker
Yeah, that's ah that's a good point. i mean um Obviously that's a fiction, so i mean i'm ah presumably that's at least based on some kind of ah accurate or somewhat accurate yeah dynamic from back then, but but you know I wouldn't doubt it if that's kind of how it was. Do you think it was more kind of just good help was harder to find back then or good jobs were harder to come by?
00:17:28
Speaker
Yeah, I'd say it's a little bit of both, like, um you know, your reputation meant a lot back then, and like, ah people actually knowing you. So I imagine it's hard if you're just this, you know, peasant to move somewhere else and try and convince someone to give you a job without a reference, right? And so you need someone to to vouch for you as ah as a worker and so that that's one one limitation there i think that's for sure and then yeah i think good good helps hard to find is another one because i think that shows up in
00:18:04
Speaker
yeah in literature of that era, you know, like in the comedies, like these plays and things where yeah you have these these servants who are always ripping off there their masters and stuff like that. And it's just part of the game. And so yeah, I think think it's a little bit all that. So a stronger job market nowadays And upward mobility and all that stuff has cost us good work banter is what it sounds like to me. You used to just be able to rip on your boss, he'd rip on you back, maybe you'd give your coworkers some sass. And now it's just like, you do that too much and some people, those weenies will just leave. I think that's it.
00:18:49
Speaker
Okay. Well, they wouldn't accept the harsh shoe that you're trying to fit on their foot, as it were. hu But yeah, I mean, I could buy that. I could buy that. It was more common then.
Cultural Impact on Criticism
00:19:05
Speaker
ah Do you have any thoughts on ah like just he criticism nowadays, generally speaking, and when it's appropriate to to give criticism when it's more appropriate to keep your mouth shut because it seems like nowadays the only place people have criticize anyone is online and usually under the cloak of anonymity and then face-to-face nobody says a word it's kind of what it seems like now what do you make of that yeah it does I think part of it is not like there's no cohesive
00:19:39
Speaker
um There's no cohesive culture around offense and, I don't know, fighting, I guess, kind of, right? like yeah um you know ah like The concept of like the the honor culture versus you know the shame culture, things like that.
00:19:59
Speaker
um you know There's these different ways that that groups deal with insults and and and offenses. and so when you have When your whole group has the same outlook, you know how how people are going to react to things. so everyone can kind of It's unspoken and everyone knows how to behave, but when you've got a huge country with lots of different cultures sprinkled around and mixed together, your next door neighbor could really be in a different culture than you. Like the the best default seems to be just to keep your mouth shut. And yeah, you know, if that person's going to want to fight you or, or he's going to slash your tires or
00:20:44
Speaker
Or just say, thank you. think I really appreciate that. That's good feedback. You have no idea. So at least until you get to know them a little better. But for a stranger, you just don't know if it's where where that's going to lead. So I just kind of, nah. That's a really, actually fascinating point that I'd never thought of before, that since we lack ah structure of dealing with slights and and ah insults of various type, it becomes more volatile and yeah we don't know how someone's going to react and if they're going to react violently or in a crazy way, whereas
00:21:25
Speaker
in the past when they had those more rigid social structures, you knew exactly what was going to happen. you know I'm going to do this. He's either going to have the courage to come challenge me to a duel or something, or he's going to let it slide. It's going to be one or the other, but but you know he's not going to slash your tires on your buggy. I don't have tires.
00:21:45
Speaker
It's not going to like go vandalize something because that just wasn't done. You know, there were there were you kind of had you knew what was going to happen. So, yeah, that's an interesting point, man. i I'd never really thought of that at all. Yeah. Well, thanks. Yeah. Yeah. Dropping bombs, dropping. Have me think about different things. Truth bombs here. Yeah. Yeah. ah Or at least thought and so like online, you know, similar thing, though, like online, where if you have kind of If you find yourself in a little online monoculture, people are going to go at it. you know But when you like cross into like and come in contact with another group that has a different way of things like that that back and forth can get weird.
00:22:30
Speaker
you know can get yeah extra mean and and things like that, or you get people going after digging into trying to find out their personal information so they can get them fired, all that kind of stuff, right? Yeah, it gets nasty. I was recently online, I had an experience where I was in a group chat with a bunch of guys. And there was one guy who was kind of like the the the low man on the totem pole, you know, it always kind of stratifies sometimes and you have the guys who are, anyway, right he became kind of the whipping the whipping boy and everyone was dumping on him. right um Not for no reason, I might add, but, ah and then he recently just left the group and he'd been there forever, like years he'd been in this group, finally just couldn't take it anymore and left. And I think much of the criticism was trying to be constructive to help this kid.
00:23:21
Speaker
And then it kind of some of it just became this is fun let's yeah let's give him let's give them a little more so. So yeah there's there's always. In a group dynamic but I mean that I think that's always existed it shifted now from being in person.
00:23:38
Speaker
You're ragging on your friends in a friends group. That's common to have one guy that everyone kind of picks on, you know, ah that's, or at least not uncommon. It like may not be all the time, but it's, it's, it's certainly not unheard of back in the, you know, all throughout my growing up. Um, but now you'll have that, that dynamic online, which makes it a little bit different. Yeah. Um, Oh, sorry. Go ahead.
00:24:04
Speaker
Well, I was gonna shift gears a little bit, so unless you... Nope, go for it. Something else, okay. When it comes to, um you know you mentioned ah using the using our proverb on on your kids, for example, it'd be a good ah good use if if they're if they're acting in a way that is is accurate labeled with a accuracy.
Criticism in Parenting
00:24:28
Speaker
um yeah But when it comes to like offering correction and things like that, ah what have you found um works or doesn't work with your kids? Have you found any you know universal ah approach or has it just really been pretty tailored to each each kid? like What do you find? Yeah, I haven't found anything universal that works um with every kid. ah
00:24:54
Speaker
and i
00:24:59
Speaker
i Yeah, they're they're so different, man. that like The approaches are so... i i I'd treat one of my sons a a way that I would never treat my other one. And it that has entirely to do with their personalities and nothing else. like I just know that this is a quick and easy way to correct this behavior with this kid and it's going to be fine if I do it this way.
00:25:21
Speaker
Whereas if I do it with the other kid, it is not going to be quick. It is not going to be easy. It's not going to be effective. It's going to blow up into something worse. And I have to find a different strategy for this. Yeah. So. um Yeah, i it's man. Giving criticism to kids can be easy. It can be sit them down and you say, like, I remember because we have one daughter and then followed by five sons. We have six kids. And I remember thinking when my daughter was little, we were just like, man, all these people complaining about parenting, they're, they're, they're wimps. Like, they don't know what they're just like, parenting is so easy. yeah
00:26:00
Speaker
You just sit her down and you tell her what you she needs to do and you say, hey, this isn't what we do. You did this, but you're you're a good girl. ge You're going to want to do it the right way, right? And then she just does it right. And that's it. So simple. We'll just do that again. since then And then when her son comes, it's like a hurricane hit and you're like, that doesn't work at all. We're going to figure so something else out. So ah so yeah, criticism can be highly, highly, highly personal, I think.
00:26:25
Speaker
yeah What do you think about that? That's what I'm, that's what I'm finding so far with my, with the young, the youngsters. But yeah, I believe that's where we're headed is that there's not going to be one thing that works for, for both. For sure. the Um, in terms of the the gods of the marketplace, which we always talk about as, you know, society's view on the the various proverbs and, and how they, whether or not they respect it or whether they don't, this one is interesting because
00:26:57
Speaker
I, you still hear it sometimes. It's not like it's completely out of fashion, yet the true meaning of it being introspective and you know, self-critical, I think has kind of been
Cultural Shift in Introspection
00:27:14
Speaker
lost. And I don't feel like that's really something that's very valued today. um I don't think it's common for someone to be like, oh, this person criticized me and have people be like, well, it's it is it accurate? That's morally just like, oh, well, he's a jerk. You know, it's not, well, was the criticism fair? Like, you know, look look at you, take a look at yourself in the mirror. So, I don't know, that that's kind that was kind of my thought on that. What do you think?
00:27:39
Speaker
Yeah, that is kind of the default, right? like um think ah Among a lot of friends and family, yeah people will just say, it's even a joke. like You see it in TV shows and stuff, where someone criticizes a friend and they go, they like Do you agree with them? Are they like, no, they're, they're way out of line. They're a jerk. They're, they're all wrong. You know, but, but really the joke is that, no, that, that stranger was correct. Like you you really are. Yeah. You know, but a bad driver, you know, like something like that. Like, um, yeah. So I think, um,
00:28:16
Speaker
what was I going to say about this? That.
00:28:23
Speaker
No, I can't, I can't get there in time. We'll have to, okay. I have a question if well you while do you think about it. Um, do you, do you think it's possible to get better at taking criticism? And if so, how do you, how would you go about doing that? Do you think?
Developing Balanced Criticism
00:28:38
Speaker
Yes, I think so. I think so. One one thing that I was thinking ah about is, you know, you need to develop kind of this wisdom to know,
00:28:47
Speaker
when you need to change something about yourself or to accept something about yourself. um You know, the the tendency right now in the culture is you just need to accept everything about yourself. um But um including including delusions, I guess, because what what what comes to mind for me was like,
00:29:11
Speaker
the kind of thing where someone will say, oh, I'm an i'm a nowdo um'm an outdoorsy person. My wife talk and I talk about this. like You'll have a friend who's like, oh, I'm i'm out i'm pretty outdoorsy. And there's nothing about them that's outdoorsy, right? They don't like camping. Yeah, exactly. Maybe they like to go for a run. Maybe they like to play golf. But but it's like aspirational. like They dress the part and they like like looking at pictures of the wilderness, but they don't like going there. So like it's kind of like, well, you need to accept that you not are and in fact not outdoorsy. You don't really need to force yourself to be it. like It's just not gonna happen, just accept that you are not outdoorsy. and But people just really latch onto that kind of, you know especially like lifestyle stuff. like They really want to be that, even though they really have no,
00:30:04
Speaker
They ah really have no affinity for it in in real life. I bet that's common where you are down in Utah. I bet Utah, Colorado, those kind of places, you get a lot of these fake outdoors to people who have their hiking shoes around. Yeah, it applies to me a bit because I'm like, you know maybe i used to I used to camp a lot more than I do and now it's like, I'd much rather sleep in my bed. you know I need to like accept that. that is my That is who I am. and And you know, that that'll change maybe, you know, as the kids get older and we're going to do more outdoor stuff, cause I want them to experience that. Maybe I'll appreciate it more than, but in the meantime, like, I don't know. if I don't think I'm that outdoors anymore. Like that's just not who I am.
00:30:48
Speaker
Yeah, we had a there was a time when we owned a ah camper trailer because I'm like, you know, sleeping on the ground. I like going out. I like being there. I can have a real mattress, you know, so nothing wrong with that. You know, my old back got to take care of it. But yeah, this is a this was an interesting one. I appreciate you you' picking it. And ah I think this is we've we've this has been a common theme in a lot of our our proverbs about introspection, about looking inside and and allowing yourself to be critical, allowing others to be critical of you.
Proverbs and Personal Growth
00:31:23
Speaker
I think that's one of the only ways you're able to grow as a human being is to it said identify flaws and say, yeah, that's probably true without getting too emotional about it and to beating yourself up too bad where it's like a horrible experience just recognizing, yeah, I'm a human being. I have flaws. Here's one of them. Maybe I can get better at that over time.
00:31:43
Speaker
and um And this is one of them. I think it's a i think it's a good one. And I think, hey, maybe we should use it more. Maybe I'll try to yeah throw it in conversation more often. Yeah, I'm going to be listening out for this one a lot more now.
00:31:56
Speaker
Me too, and i I'm curious to know how, I'll report back on how it's used if I hear it, because I'm curious to know how it's how how it's used in context. but All right, thanks everyone for listening. We appreciate it. And make sure you follow and and subscribe if if you're not already on whatever podcast app that you like. We're on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. And if you wouldn't mind, give it us give us a review, give us a rating. That goes a long way to to boosting us in the algorithm. so um Thanks so much for listening everybody and we will see you guys all next week.
00:32:28
Speaker
all right we'll see ah there are only four things certain since social progress began
00:32:46
Speaker
that after this is accomplished brave new world begins When all men are paid for existing, and no man must pay for his sin, As surely as water will wet us, as surely as fire will burn, The gods of the copy will hide us, with terrors of water at earth.