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Tumblereads 13: COVID and Trauma in our Reading
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We went serious this week and are talking COVID in contemporary romance.
(This is a slightly modified version of the previously-posted Tumblereads 13)
Show notes at smutreport.com/podcast
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Humorous Mix-Up
00:00:04
Speaker
Hi everyone. Welcome back to the Smut Report podcast. ah It's Tumble Reads time. Tumble Reads, Tumble Reads. I won't sing. I won't ever do that again. Actually, that was terrible. um I'm Holly and I am a singer the master of ceremonies today. fancy too.
00:00:24
Speaker
Woohoo. I'm Ingrid. No, I'm not Ingrid. What? You're not Ingrid. What are you doing? Sorry. Wow.
00:00:40
Speaker
Definitely. I'm Aaron. I'm Aaron. Not Ingrid. yeah I'm angry but I can't breathe oh my gosh you can't ever criticize anyone in our family for mixing us up ever again when not there at Thanksgiving when was like which child are you I was like what name do I say right now there are only four of them oh my gosh anyway sorry oh my gosh go ahead Holly today yeah wow gosh
00:01:15
Speaker
my gosh I don't even know where to go from there.
Should COVID Be in Romance Novels?
00:01:20
Speaker
Let's wrap it up. that That's our tumble reads. It was good tumble reads. Thanks for hosting, Holly. Oh, man. okay so eyes this Okay. So I saw this conversation. There was this conversation that happened.
00:01:38
Speaker
on the socials. And i wanted to ah bring it up and feel you guys out about this and see what you think. um But if it's too much of a downer, then we can just talk about what we're reading.
00:01:50
Speaker
No, okay I need a downer. I have to pull it together. Okay. Yeah. So um basically the question is about ah COVID and contemporary romance. Okay. Like books that acknowledge that...
00:02:05
Speaker
This is a thing that happened to the world and that people experienced. They don't do that, Ingrid. No. I have a strong, have strong feelings about this. Continue, Holly. Yeah. And so ah it came up because a couple of authors were saying that they had books where they did acknowledge it and ah those books were less ah critically and commercially successful than their other books. that they And they got strong reactions from readers saying, I do not want to see this.
00:02:37
Speaker
um And I thought it was really interesting because it it was all books that I'd read and wo um enjoyed and thought either the COVID stuff was necessary or like so unobtrusive that I didn't even think about it.
00:02:53
Speaker
So, yeah um, I can give you the so the exam, the examples of authors that I saw talking about it were, so Jackie Lau, um, said that like in a couple of her and some of her more recent books and for her, it's very, it's very minor. It's just like, characters will be like, oh yeah, back in lockdown. i I had trouble with this and now I'm having now like this thing is a challenge for me now.
00:03:20
Speaker
Or there was one book where one of her characters just like low key, like puts on a mask every time he gets on the train. And like, that's it. Like, there's no commentary about it. It's just he puts on his mask and like, gets on the train and then takes it off when he's like done and being in public transportation.
00:03:35
Speaker
um And she was just like, yeah, like, ah she like those series might not even continue because of like all the backlash she got about it. Wow. And another one is the Jodie McAllister, Marry Me Juliet trilogy, um which um takes place in Australia. It's about its take on the set of The Bachelor.
00:03:55
Speaker
And the whole idea is that they start filming, COVID lockdowns happen, and so the contestants who are kicked off the island can't leave the set. Because in Australia, the lockdowns were really serious, right? And so the whole premise of the series, which in the first book, the woman who gets kicked off first is the one who ends up with The Bachelor. Like, that can't happen right under any other circumstances. But the she also apparently got a lot of feedback from readers who said that they did not like that COVID stuff.
00:04:28
Speaker
So, yeah, I just wanted to hear what your thoughts
Personal Reactions and Historical Comparisons
00:04:33
Speaker
were. You guys, I i mean, i absolutely cannot. it It completely takes me out of the enjoyment when there's even a mention of it. So I actually completely understand why. Now, I've always thought that was a personal problem. you know what I mean? Like, I would have read it and been like, oh, but then I would have just been like, all right, whatever. And I would have kept going. Now, the mask thing, I think, is very weird because people have been wearing masks on.
00:04:55
Speaker
mass transit public transportation in other countries for ages. Yeah, I was going to say, when I was in China, everybody wore masks all the time. Like I brought home a mask as a souvenir. And i think that's a big cultural thing where we historically, in the in the West, I guess, in general, but in the United States, in you know like we don't. And so we think, oh, that's that's something specific. And I mean, I was in China 2008. Right. Right. And it was, you know, they're selling masks and groceries and they weren't, they were like fun masks, not like medical masks, you know, like pretty ones. So, ah cause there's so much smog.
00:05:35
Speaker
So yeah, and it was kind of like Holly when we were in Japan and everybody's walking around with umbrellas because they're sunshades, not because you need an umbrella. yeah because Here we just wear walk around with an umbrella if it's raining. But, yeah you know, it is a very useful sunshade if you have the right kind, you know? So I think there's a cultural component in play for sure, Ingrid. You're right.
00:05:58
Speaker
I do. And so for me, like, I think it really depends on the context. it I will say that, like... Like the bachelor, like the lockdown thing, if they really kept it away from, like if they kept it, if they kept the detail locked down to a minimum, might not be so bad for me. But for me, it just, yeah, it here's what it is. I think this is what it is. Because it's not really over for us culturally because there is still so much contention. We don't have a shared unifying experience about this. so you can't just throw it out there because if you throw it out there, that's taking a stance.
00:06:34
Speaker
You what And so for me, I'm sitting here and it's just yeah I immediately as soon as somebody says anything about it, I get a pit of dread in my stomach because I'm like, please tell me you believe in vaccines. Like, I just don't I don't want to hear about it. And it's interesting because I've talked to people. I mean, I'm I have, you know, friendships with people, interestingly enough, who I have very different opinions on about this stuff. um And.
00:06:55
Speaker
I have had conversations about it, and I do understand a lot of it was the, you know, that it was really mentally challenging for a lot of people. Yeah. And that they felt very resentful for the limitations that were being put on them, that they were worried for their children missing stuff in school. Like, I understand this, but, like, it's not like World War twoi where we have, like, kind of – – well i Nowadays, I can't even say that. But like, you know what I mean? Like, they're in history, like there's usually enough time where we have so a shared understanding of like, this is what happened. And this is like the general impact on the, you know, a glossing experience for us culturally. And this is the overview big picture experience we've accepted. But we don't have that.
00:07:36
Speaker
Like, and I don't know when we're going to have that because... it's um it's just immediate like idiot like nope no yeah i don't want to talk about it no i agree and actually now that you're talking about that ingrid what what it probably boils down to is that ingrid didn't go this far but it it was a global trauma like you psychologist i was just talking to a psychologist it was like you know for talking about like clinical evaluation stuff and whether or not in practice ah stuff happened post-COVID or has been happening to a person for their entire life because it is a trauma that we all experienced. And Ingrid, I think the World War II analogy is not bad because that was also a trauma. And maybe the thing that was different is that there was a very concerted
00:08:29
Speaker
centralized propaganda campaign and we don't like to use the word propaganda because it has very negative connotations but like really in order to get the people on board with the fighting in this war and having to give up what they had to give up ration cards and all these things like there needed to be a propaganda campaign to create a social unity like alignment yeah that people were doing something and it didn't work with ko well it didn't work for covid Yeah, and actually I was reading a biography of ah oh Eleanor, president of Liberia. Okay. um
00:09:07
Speaker
Sorry, my brain, that was back in January. um And they had an Ebola outbreak and the government, you know, it was i was like, oh, wow, it's exactly the same. Everybody was like, no, you're lying about Ebola. It's like, this is not a joke, you know. Yeah.
00:09:22
Speaker
um And that was back in, i think the ah Ebola outbreak was back 20, I want to say 2008, but I feel like that was too early, maybe 2012. So it's not too long ago. I mean, you guys remember it probably because Ingrid, you were going to Germany. Okay, it had to be pregnant. Yeah. And ah so even later than that. So yeah that would have been 2014.
00:09:46
Speaker
2014. End of 2014. Yeah. And if you don't have a really good message, then it gets messier. Anyway, I'm rambling. But... I think the thing about the World War II comparison is that we are two generations removed from it.
00:10:01
Speaker
okay And so we are looking at it from a historical context and not a personal experience context. Right. So that what we i'm you need to stop. I'm my history hat is on now and I can't. So but yeah like it's not like there were unified.
00:10:18
Speaker
thoughts even then but what you get now is mostly the political history right right a lot of the some of the social history a lot of the context and personal social experiences are not present and especially of underrepresented groups this is the trauma that we just experienced See, that's interesting, because when I read a book that where a character acknowledges that lockdown was a thing they went through that changed how they interacted with the world, I'm like, oh, yeah, that's that's real.
00:10:51
Speaker
I think it's too real is what my problem is. So for me, it's like i even in contemporary to me, I'm like, this is romance land. This is like bad it's not like bad things don't happen, but you know, it's going to be OK. Right. And for me, we're still not OK from covid. Like there's no okay. There are still families that are fractured. It comes up at Thanksgiving. you get you You're afraid to talk to people about like getting your kids vaccinated because like what if they start spouting off on you about how you're a terrible person for getting your kids vaccinated?
COVID Mentions as Personal Triggers
00:11:22
Speaker
Like the the rip in our social fabric, this is it for me. It's not the start. Obviously, it's not the start. We were already fractured before that. But that was one of those moments that like it became clear that it wasn't going to be OK. Like I don't feel and I still feel like that.
00:11:40
Speaker
So when I hear that, when I when they bring it up to me, I'm like, you can't have this. This ingredient can't be present in a happily ever after because it will never be resolved. Because it's not resolved now.
00:11:51
Speaker
And you can, maybe if you had it in the future, right? And it was like, oh, this is how they fixed it. And it was like some kind of fantasy novel. I could see it working and I could be like, oh okay, cool. But like, it's not fixed. we're not It hasn't fixed. So you bring it up and I just sit there with a pit in my stomach because I'm like well, that's not, there's no okay. Right. Okay, but like, ah you read Romanticy, right? I feel like a lot of Romanticy takes place in kind of dystopian settings. Absolutely. But it's fake.
00:12:16
Speaker
Okay. So because like, there are always there are ingredients in these books that like, sometimes in Romanticy, get they get fixed. And sometimes they don't. Yeah. And well but it's so can you have a happy ending if you have like social fracture, I guess, that's part of the story? It's just too real.
00:12:33
Speaker
Is the problem? Okay, what what genre are we talking about? ah It's contemporary genres. Yes. but Yeah. But maybe not. Maybe not romance. Maybe maybe a little bit in romance. But the overall is happy and optimistic. I mean, what is a happy and optimistic ending entail?
00:12:50
Speaker
Well, that's now we get back in our great smut debate, guys. Right. now But for me, this is one of those, you know how there's those things where it's like some people, there's just this, for me, immediately I just freeze and it's just too much controversy for me. Even the mention of it makes me freeze up because I'm just like, I'm so tired. Like can do, okay, we can talk about something that really happened. Like I won't even say COVID. I can't say the Ebola outbreak in Africa. It was not on the continent that I live on. There's degrees of removal. There were a couple cases, but...
00:13:19
Speaker
Yeah, for the most part, we do not have to worry about it. um And, you know, so that is a real thing that real people live through. and it is harrowing, right to think about whatever. That's not the same as zombies, but zombie outbreaks are effectively very similar.
00:13:37
Speaker
right to how Ebola functions right and zombie book fine but this is the comparison that I would like to reality because you guys I think you're thinking too big picture here I want to bring it back to like the personal thing right like you're thinking broadly of historic historical context and what I'm saying is this I am saying it's the same as if you're reading a book and you're meandering through it and then out of nowhere there's a miscarriage and you had a miscarriage and it's too fresh and you can't handle it It's the same. That's what I think the trauma issue is. like yeah Yeah, that's what it is. So like with COVID, it's like, you know, like, There are people that i you know I know that I never spoke to again and died from COVID because we disagreed on the truth of what was happening with COVID.
00:14:23
Speaker
And they're dead and from COVID. And there was a fracture in the relationship, and they're gone forever. do you know what I mean? like Right. there's this is not And that's not like a unique experience. This is a lot of people. Hmm.
00:14:36
Speaker
have had lost relationships because of political and, you know, like ethical and moral divide. You know, they've lost family members or, you know, and they're still alive. They're just, they're they're not accessible anymore. their family Their family forever changed. So it's not it's It's too fresh. It's the same as like if you had a parent loss and then a a character's parent dies in a book. It's like that. It's too personal. That's what it is. And so here's the difference, though.
00:15:05
Speaker
Saying, OK, for parental loss, miss what are the big ones? It's like parental loss, miscarriage, sexual assault are the big trigger warnings in books a lot. Right. right Yeah. um And those are, on the one hand, unfortunately, common enough that it is a, it's not such a niche experience that, like, describing it is something that people don't find accessible, right? But it is also something for which there are trigger warnings because people don't
00:15:39
Speaker
or content warnings depending on your phraseology like don't want to read that people know that they don't yeah they're like no but we but as a group i think we can say oh well that's a personal experience you personally experienced a miscarriage you personally experienced a parental loss right um and covid isn't really personal so maybe that's i mean it is but it's it's also not like it's both yeah Right, so it's a personal trauma, but it's something that like we all went through it. Like we all didn't go through parental death from cancer. Right. I think it's just situation. all went through COVID. And so we have, it yeah, it's like, it's it it's treating it differently than that kind of trauma. I don't think, I think that's the, does that make sense? it's That's the disconnect. I need more disconnect. Treating it different from the other com trauma doesn't make sense because it's still a form of trauma. But since we all experienced it, we don't relate to it with the same kind of disconnectedness as those other specific examples.
00:16:40
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah.
Anxiety Responses and Reading Experiences
00:16:42
Speaker
And like for me, it's not, I mean like the, what i when I was talking about personal stuff, like mine was like extended. It wasn't anybody really close to me. So like there's that, but I'm thinking about it from ah from a perspective of just like the conflict that there's this pit in my stomach about the conflict. you know what i mean? Like, I don't like, I don't want it in my books and i I get it, but I just don't like it. Which is so interesting because like at it like,
00:17:05
Speaker
Romance at its core is about conflict. conflict right i mean and It's just too soon, man. It's too soon. And I just, I think it's not, we're not even at a a point, like we are not at a point yet where there's even like a shared, so like big picture. There's not a shared narrative. We are still fractured as a society because it is the people who believe it's a hoax or that the government was terrible and ruined everything.
00:17:31
Speaker
I mean, in in my, in the pit of my stomach, it's not, it's like enemies. Like this is not a situation where we're anywhere near. We're nowhere, nowhere, nowhere near as a society having a shared understanding of like, man we went through that together for better or for worse decisions were made, but we got through it and it was so scary and terrible. And I'm so glad we got through that. We're not even close to that. Yeah. i Okay. I don't want to, I don't, I don't know what I want to say. I don't want to be like, okay, I'm done with that.
00:17:58
Speaker
But you're done with that.
00:18:05
Speaker
think it's correct as i believe i've already said but i want to circle back to some cultural aspects because some of it is just extra context stuff like i don't necessarily need a description of the character when they say i'm getting dressed i don't need a description of and then i put on my socks and then i pulled on my pants and then I put on my sweatshirt. Right. Like and so when you're talking about and then I took my mask off and I put my mask back on. That's an extra step. Right. right That culturally I want to circle back to the cultural notion of like culturally we have not been a mask wearing society.
00:18:36
Speaker
And now there are people it's more common now to see people in masks in public. um But still it is not the way we operate culturally. And I think that has an impact on the writing. Like when we're saying, oh, it's a contemporary, it's still a fictitious world building setting. Right.
00:18:57
Speaker
And so there is a degree of imagination there. And so, you know, if you're imagining, then why are you imagining this? I guess. And then ah so like i have I had one friend when the mask mandates ended, she was like, I'm never wearing a mask again. That was horrible. I hated it. I'm throwing them all away. I'm never wearing one again. like i don't care what happens ah um and you know and i'm like not and i'm like you know what masking wasn't that bad that's what thought i was like and like if i have a cold like if i um have a cold then like it it's like it's an easy way to me to like put one on when i go to the grocery store yeah or like i didn't get on than i get on a plane
00:19:40
Speaker
Right. But I feel like, you know, she's probably not the only person who feels like that. No. yeah Oh, no. and like you guys aren't the only people who feel like you do. And so adding that thing in, it's kind it's one of those things that might take you out of the story because culturally we're in a situation where we're not a high masking society. And then on top of that, you know, it there's this personal preference thing. yeah Anytime an author inserts, kind we talked about this in a recent Tumblereads too, didn't we? Anytime author is inserting content that kind of pulls a reader out of the story, that is ah It's an opportunity lost, right, for connecting the reader with the book.
00:20:11
Speaker
Right. But, i mean, they could, like, you know, if we're talking about, i put the mask on when i put on when I get on the train, right? Well, yeah. that That character, right? And so what she found was that more people were taken out of the story than were like, oh, I feel seen in that. Like... yeah Yeah. Moving on. Because you know what? I don't think about the bus driver getting spit on when I'm reading a book. I do think about it when I walk into the bus and see the shield between me and the driver. You know, like, yeah. Gross. Yeah. A few years ago. so
00:20:47
Speaker
think the person got an assault charge because of the germs. I think that, yeah, I think that, um I think that, yeah, if I were to give, so like, I know I came in hot, but like, for me, I think that that's, it takes me out of the story. I immediately feel a sense of anxiety because my, my natural state of things is that I just want even, this is why I love romance. I just want everybody to get along. I just want everybody to feel loved. I just want everybody to feel safe. You read like those high stress, like 10 book saga romanticies. Hey, you know what guys? And we all end up reading stuff. That's nothing like our real lives. But for me, like I, that is for, yes. And I read high stress stuff and crazy things like yeah major tension. No, I know. But that's just for me. I'm like, Oh no. that's too much pressure because now I have to be like, I immediately, without even trying to, will sit there because of my little people-pleasing, everybody-get-along-kumbaya brain. And I'm like, well, what is he going to say about this? So like if if it's even a mention, I'm like, what is he going to say about this? Am I going to like what he has to say? I going to have to find a way to like this person even though I don't like their viewpoint? Am I going to have to like – you know what I mean? And so I immediately get this pit in my stomach and it's about this dread of like how much work am I going to have to do
00:21:57
Speaker
to like reconcile this person's viewpoint with my own beliefs and it's immediately like i can't do it i can't i can't do it yeah okay it the thing so it yeah and i guess and i get with the you know with your shadow daddies and romanticy you're like yeah i you don't have to because it's fake you're like oh you're terrible and and then you're gonna turn around and i'm gonna be like oh you're so handsome and it's just make-believe it's just pretend yeah Yeah. You don't have to worry about. And you know, he's going to get a personality transplant. Yeah. yeah And it's all fine. So this is, i want to articulate because I don't think it has been explicit. I explicitly stated because we all are aware of this stuff in our personal lives. But when we're talking about trauma and responding to trauma, what Ingrid just described is like her brain, what she's describing is her brain getting activated because of a trauma response, basically right to the book. Right? You're so you're reading the thing and you are personally reacting to, now what do I have to do? I have to go in protect protective mode.
00:22:53
Speaker
i am already elevated. I am no longer in the green zone. I am minimum in the yellow zone. So in order to actually function as a human person without staying in the yellow zone or getting further activated into the red zone, you have to take calming measures. You have to self-regulate to get yourself back to green. Yes, and romance novels are supposed to be how I self-regulate in the first place, guys. Exactly. That's why read them.
00:23:18
Speaker
true They are a soothing technique. Because when they smooch each other, I go, aww. See?
00:23:27
Speaker
And to be fair, I think Jackie Lau is ah i love her stuff.
Content Warnings for Sensitive Topics
00:23:33
Speaker
I could eat her stuff with a spoon. I think her stuff is so good. i would actually read. i don't I would read anything she wrote, even if it included COVID, because I just find the way she does things is always so like tactful. And I just she's able to have mess without it being like, yeah.
00:23:47
Speaker
I don't know. She's fantastic. So I she's one of the authors where as soon as you said that, I was like, ah I'd read that, though. I mean, yeah, even though it' like, I don't like I don't like COVID. I don't I don't want to read about it. I'm in La La Land. Everything is rainbows and sunshine. I don't want to read about it.
00:24:01
Speaker
But yeah, but I would read her stuff. Yeah. And we haven't really talked about content warnings, but, you know, okay, this is one thing. Like if if you, just for an example, and I'm not making a value judgment on content warnings at all, but if you know about it going in, your read will probably be different. Yeah, that's a good point.
00:24:20
Speaker
That's a good point. I still would never just personal on a personal thing. I would never expect any author to put one in for that just because. But if it were there, I would definitely be like, oh, OK, either I would go into differently. Yeah. Something. this a Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. If you're just like, oh, this is just reality. Like this is our life. Okay, but I guess the question is, how much do authors really... You're writing contemporary romance. like There are some authors, this has been a discussion a lot the time, when you're looking at race in books. like White authors just frequently don't put any race at all in. And, you know, is that the reality? I live in... Well, but I live in a very racially diverse area. Like, my normal is not predominantly white. You know?
00:25:06
Speaker
So, what... what is reality you know we're looking at a slice of the author's imagination and so fixating on oh this actually happened in the world like yeah we actually know who the president was when this book is set or whatever is like no contemporary romance isn't necessarily and that's the author specifically says that it is it's not necessarily tied to a year it is tied to a nebulous present Right. And depending on how many tie ins the author puts in, like I was just reading a book, not it was a repeat, but I was like, oh, there's a lot of references right now. Like there was a reference to Encanto and something else that just like had just happened. There was like a lot of pop culture stuff. It's like that yeah dates the book hard. yeah yeah If the author's not describing all the clothing, not describing a lot of other stuff that's going on, not describing using you know popular slang, it floats a lot more over a greater time period. See, and I will say that now that you bring that up, now I know to be we need to be done, but I will say that i get i I also get a little bit annoyed when stuff has dating issues.
00:26:09
Speaker
dating Okay, but remember when we did categorically 80s and the best part was reading the clothes? Yes, yeah. And the eyeshadow. don't like it now. put on my blue eyeshadow. You know what I mean? Like, I don't, I think it's very much like it's, maybe I need to sit with this because I think it's a contemporary problem. I like it when it's like, if it's in the 70s, I want it to feel like the 70s. If it's in the 80s, I want to feel like it's in the 80s. But if it's right now, I'm like, I don't want to know what you thought about the Wicked movie.
00:26:38
Speaker
I don't. Or say if it was written in 2015, you want to still be able to feel like it was written now. Yes. Yeah. Contemporary is its own thing. And I don't want – I want contemporary to exist in a bubble, which isn't entirely fair. I hear myself authors. Don't get don't get twisted. Because i just want it to exist in a bubble where there's no identifiers. And then in like a decade, then they can put the identifiers in. Yeah.
Dated References in Contemporary Books
00:27:04
Speaker
Right. there yes like that yeah no i know it's like i read a book that was maybe a year ago or so um oh geez ah i i don't remember the title um but it was it was written in the early twenty twenty s but it was explicitly set in like twenty fifteen and it And it took me a while to figure that out because I was like, this is weird. But it's because like the characters who were 10 years out of high school were talking about, there were flashbacks to 10 years ago when they used to talk on AIM to each other. you're what? With their handles. And I'm like, how, like, what? How old are these people? And then i was like, oh, they are my age. This is just set 10 years ago. um And it was very explicit like that. Yeah, I don't want do math gymnastics. What? I don't know like to do math gymnastics. Yeah, I mean, and so in that case, it worked. But like there were –
00:27:57
Speaker
best woman by rose domu which i read this earlier this fall like has a lot of references in it and all and ah the references and ah and some of the thing ways that um identity was dealt with in the book made me feel like the book was actually written five years ago uh just now published because of um yeah like of how they were i'm like this like like why Like, why are you talking about bandage dresses? Like, this is not... That's so funny. Not, like, like what? But was such a moment. It was such a moment. and
00:28:37
Speaker
yeah And, yeah. And there were, like, a couple things like that where like, this doesn't doesn't feel current anymore um so yeah you're right it like these cues which ones are like so basically we just have to tumble all the way into like a whole examination of a contemporary room no but first but first a but like more silliness Yeah, well, my time's up. So sorry, I didn't bring the silliness. Next time, I'll bring it. It's okay. I'm not being very silly. No, it's a good...
Episode Reflections and Future Topics
00:29:07
Speaker
This was a very... It was a nice, a good thought. It made me think about a lot of things. And again, i do think my stances are probably a me problem. And i I don't want authors to feel like, you know, they have to...
00:29:16
Speaker
tiptoe around these things because it will pass and everything will be okay eventually how optimistic of you have to be optimistic I have to mean at the very least we're all gonna die and then somebody else will be worried about whatever they're worried this such an interesting happily ever after type I just really it's fine we'll all be fine Yes. And now I can't hear that without thinking maybe dead, but fine. Well, we should discuss epilogues with old people further. Or like, actually, i ah I'm not going to get something else started. No, it no. We're at time. That was Tumble Roots for this week. Sorry, guys. Next time I MC, I'll try to bring something really fluffy.
00:30:09
Speaker
But like doing doing games like what Ingrid did last time, that just requires too much advanced planning. That's good advanced planning, Ingrid. And i ah I can't, so...
00:30:20
Speaker
That's okay. I can be fluffy yeah and you can be thoughtful and Aaron can be aggressively intellectual. and We're all well balanced. Let us decide. Proposal for fluffy.
00:30:34
Speaker
The duke off. Oh yeah. When Ingrid wrote our Mad Libs. Oh yeah. That was fun. We could do more Mad Libs. I will do Mad Libs for you anytime. About our buddy reads or something. don't know.
00:30:47
Speaker
all right. Sorry, Holly.
Closing and Audience Engagement
00:30:48
Speaker
Sign us off. All right. On that note, um show notes at smutreport.com slash podcast. You can find us on socials and yell at us about trauma in your podcasts now, in addition to trauma in your romance books.
00:31:03
Speaker
Not sorry about that. And until next time. Keep it smutty, folks. Smutreport!