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Tumblereads 19: Identifying with the Characters
69 Plays1 day ago
Holly got big mad at a hero, which prompted the team to talk about identifying with the characters in a book. This conversation could have been five hours, but we kept it to 30 minutes.
Shownotes at smutreport.com
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Transcript
Introduction and Book Club Confusion
00:00:03
Speaker
Hi friends, welcome back to the Smut Report podcast. This is Holly. I'm Ingrid. And I'm Erin. And we are tumble reads in today. And if you don't know what that is by now, I guess this is any time. This week is a good time to start.
00:00:21
Speaker
Just as good as last week or next week. next week Next week we're having. Is next week book club? No. Last week was book club. I don't remember. What is time? we don't um We don't record book club on the same schedule as tumble reads. So I never know when book club is actually going to be coming in. So.
00:00:43
Speaker
so If last week was book club, I hope you enjoyed our discussion of Swordheart. And if next week is actually book club, we're going to be talking about Swordheart and you should read it because it's super fun. It's so fun. I love that book.
00:00:59
Speaker
Oh my gosh. All right. Anyway.
Identifying with Book Characters
00:01:03
Speaker
um So today i want to talk about i identifying with characters. Oh, okay. because there are a couple of things. The first is... um The book I'm reading, i had a very strong, personal, visceral reaction of hatred of hoavo for the hero. Well-deserved.
00:01:33
Speaker
Well-deserved. Is it what I think it is? Yes, it is what you think Yes! And I don't want to talk get it too into with the weeds on this book because I'm working on a written review, but it's Exit Pursued by a Baron by Adra Richards, because which I'm reading because Ingrid recommended it like 15 times. did! But have...
00:01:56
Speaker
an alternate view of this book. um I do think I'm almost at the end. I think Richard's pulled off the love story, maybe, but I'm still working through my feelings about it. So I don't want to get into it. But I want to talk about identifying with the characters because I had this strong visceral hatred.
00:02:13
Speaker
for the hero. And that's part of it is that in, but I didn't like, and then I'm also thinking about when I read Heated Rivalry kind of recently and was like, ah, this felt like Ken dolls.
00:02:30
Speaker
And I didn't feel like I had a space to identify with these characters. um Not because they're both men, but because i felt like they were a little underdeveloped. Right? And so I'm like, oh, wait. Oh,
00:02:45
Speaker
Maybe I'm actually a self-insert reader. And I never thought I was, but maybe part of what I want to see is myself reflected in stories. Yeah.
00:02:57
Speaker
Interesting. Okay. Right? And so... i have I have... I agree. This is a good conversation, huh? I have thoughts. I have so many thoughts. Yeah, you guys have thoughts. So I i am just throwing that statement out there and Respond.
00:03:11
Speaker
You guys have many thoughts.
00:03:14
Speaker
and yes when i say i read a book last night i mean i read a book last night um but i've been doing ah a mini deep dive by this author who is like high drama like I bawled like a baby in one of the books, like high drama, like the whole time was either clutching my pearls, wiping my tears or like, what? Like that.
00:03:36
Speaker
So anyway, and i I had this moment last night where i was reading it
Identification vs. Empathy in Reading
00:03:41
Speaker
and i was like, wow, these characters are just teetering on the edge of Unlikable because they were so... Like the heroine is a princess, right? And she's she's frivolous.
00:03:54
Speaker
She's kind of Marie Antoinette-ish. Like, what's the problem? Why are people like riding in the streets? What, you don't have enough flour? What's your problem? Like that kind of a thing. She is not the heroine who's like, oh, let me go and succor to the poor. You know, like we have none of that here. She's just kind of like self-centered and ridiculous. Cool. Yeah.
00:04:15
Speaker
Yeah. And I remember being like, oh, this is different. Oh, I don't identify with this. But somehow the author pulls it off where you're like, okay, she's ridiculous, but she's kind of funny. You know, like I am kind of like, and I like how the the hero was able to pull it off because he kind of like pulls out more from her on a gentle, near constant basis in silly ways. Like doesn't change her, but he, I don't know Anyway, the point that I'm trying to make is I had this moment last night where I was like, I identify with nothing in this heroine, nothing. Like, I can't think of a single thing that I'm like, oh, I i definitely have this in common with you. Nothing. And I was like, i still I still like this book. This is still okay. It's not my favorite, but it worked, you know? What book was it?
00:04:57
Speaker
Oh, hold on. its I still have it because I just read it last night. So let me just pull it up. Erin, you can. Well, so um pardon me for being myself here, but I think that we need to define terms.
00:05:13
Speaker
Well, I guess part of what's interesting to me about this is the idea of identifying with characters. If I just say that, there are like 18 different ways that people take it. It's very ambiguous. Because what I'm thinking, especially in the context of both of your comments, is...
00:05:31
Speaker
The question of self-insert is very interesting because I think that there is a degree of self-insert no matter what, just because you're the person reading the book and you do have to connect with it in some way.
00:05:44
Speaker
But that's not typically what self-insert actually means. So we can, let's table that. That was one thought I had. So then the other thought that I was having, um and I think both of your
Character Development and Personal Experience
00:05:55
Speaker
examples illuminated this, is that...
00:05:59
Speaker
Identifying with the characters is frequently a term that gets used ah you know as a way that we interact with books. But there is a difference between identifying with the character, which implies a more personal connection. hmm. like empathizing with a character or um being willing to be swept along by a character. And so what i have found in my own, if I give my own examples, is okay. Okay. Oh, man. Okay. So when I identify with characters, they are typically the starchy, buttoned up, high strung characters who need to get their hair messed right. ah Those are the ones that are similar to me and my experience. a Good self awareness there, Erin. Thank you. Thank you. It's taken many years and some therapies. So, um, I, yes, I think also with other characters that I've connected with a lot, i even though they might not be that level of, um, I don't know, personally reflective, there are still probably components of the characterization that I do connect with on a personal level, right? Like, um, I don't know.
00:07:26
Speaker
God. characters who have undiagnosed ADHD and are dealing with repercussions of, you know, social feedback from that or whatever. But that can manifest or these characterization emotions can come across in different ways. So like a character who is ah sort of like a chaos gremlin, like Luke in boyfriend material, you know, I'm sure that there, I probably identify more with Oliver as a person than is You know, Oliver's trying to constantly be the perfect child.
00:07:59
Speaker
um And Luke is just like a chaos gremlin. um I'm not typically the chaos gremlin in the room, I don't think. You guys think? I don't think so. Well, I mean, like maybe between you and your husband.
00:08:13
Speaker
Well, okay. I mean, if you're talking about this room, then no. Right, exactly. what room are you in? Between me and my husband, I bring the ADHD to the party. And yeah. Yeah.
00:08:24
Speaker
So, so, but like, I really like Luke as a character because he has this sort of, he's kind of a shithead sometimes, but he's really self-aware about it. um Whereas other characters who are total shitheads, but are like whiny and making excuses about why their life has to be the way it is.
00:08:48
Speaker
Make me crazy. They make me crazy. Right. So I might identify with the same like specific aspects of character, but the representation is what loses me, I guess. Right. Well, OK. and But also then there's the question of where does the empathy component come in? Like, do I really identify with Luke or am I just empathizing with his situation?
00:09:10
Speaker
because of shared experiences or whatever or my ability to empathize as a human um versus other characters where I like the characters and the other examples that I mentioned where I'm like really sitting there being frustrated Ingrid, this is reminding me of conversations we've had not about books where you're like, OK, I can't listen to you whine about your life anymore. Not Ingrid. I'm talking about Ingrid's conversations. But I can't listen to this anymore because it's the same complaint or conversation over and over again. And you are doing nothing to change your life. um
00:09:48
Speaker
And so I lose those romances almost immediately, you know. Yeah, I guess, guess my, it's, yeah, I guess you're right. My question is fuzzy because there is the identifying, it's a fuzzy concept because there is this idea of I must have, like, I need a commonality with a character to find my way in, which I'm not saying do, but that's the idea identifying with character. That does seem be the idea. Right? And I'm not sure that that's true.
00:10:15
Speaker
Whereas I think that first example I was talking about where the hero made me so viscerally angry, that was like a different kind, ah perhaps, of emotional response that is wrapped up in this character and his behavior and how I feel about it.
00:10:37
Speaker
But it's not... But part of it is like... wow, if I were this heroine, this is unforgivable behavior, which is right. A different kind of identifying with a character in their journey. Does that make sense? So, and I think that that's, that's, this is the game that that book, cause I've read that book. This is the game, by the way, the book that I was talking about, I found it and it's called um beloved or bloodthirsty beloved by Ella Fields. And okay the other thing that I would like to point out is that they're married, like they're, they're married and their marriage falls apart.
00:11:10
Speaker
and so that's they like hate each other they're living together and they absolutely despise each other so anyway and this is the the uh spoiled princess book yes where she's just a brat anyway so okay so but but i think that one of the things i want to call out about the book that holly was specifically talking about is that i think that um a lot of times identifying or not identifying with characters or scenarios in books is a subtle experience like most of the time it's something that we don't really think a lot about because it's more of a vibe like what it we so we don't pinpoint it we're not like oh you know what this the way that this character operates with other people I don't really get that so all you think is oh I don't like that character you know what I mean we don't think that hard about it When it comes to books like what you're talking about, Holly, in that book, the author walks directly right up to like towing the line to this like unforgivable behavior in a relationship. And the line itself, what you're talking about for you is that like, because I remember reading it and being like, this would never, I could never, you know, this this would be over, done. But that line in the sand is different for all for different people. So for some people, adultery would be like, that's it, never again, it's over. And for some people would like, well, I guess we better get our butts to therapy. You know what I mean? right There are different lines in the sand for different people. And I think that most of the time in romance novels, the authors don't go that close to unforgivable things. Do you know what I mean?
00:12:42
Speaker
Right. Unless it's a dark romance and you're like, right the whole point is that he kidnapped you and locked you in his basement. Right. Right. Right. Or because that's the that's also pretty ridiculous. Right. You know what i mean? they They try to keep it away from realities that we as human beings commonly actually go through. I don't know anybody who's had a partner who locked them in their basement or and or dungeon or. beheaded well they're and you would be like how romantic after hearing it right yeah that's oh man yeah so this one in holly's case this is an author who took a very calculated risk and pushed it way farther in ways that were very identifiable do you know what i mean like you can't avoid it it's going head on you're gonna have to watch this train wreck happen and some people can handle it and some people can't and the reason i recommended it to holly
00:13:30
Speaker
It wasn't necessarily because I was like, oh my gosh, this book is the best book I've ever read. But if I recall correctly, I was like, this book is doing some very interesting things. And I feel like there's some key markers that would make either I said, I think in the beginning, I said either Holly will like it or she'll hate it. couldn't know which one it was But I'm really looking forward to your review. Yeah. Yeah. But I started it and I went back to like the very first bio I wrote for the blog for myself. Right. And I don't know if it's still up there, but that my deal breakers were bad writing, bad sex and characters that I hate.
00:14:07
Speaker
And like, and i was thinking about it and for, and it's true. And it's a, sp and it's specifically heroes. Like I'll forgive like bitchy heroines a lot, sure but like heroes who do unforgivable things, I just hate them with the force of a thousand suns. And it's, it's like really hard for me to come back from that really hard. right and yeah so and And that's a me thing. but that Well, that's another interesting thing that kind of we're like unspooling this, right? And there are like multiple threads on this spool, actually, because they're like, you think about why am I reading? What am I reading for? And getting into those uncomfortable books or like there are different reasons to tackle things or different feelings that both the author and the reader are trying to evoke as they engage with material. And like, so it's something like...
00:15:07
Speaker
I'm just thinking of enemies to lovers in general. Some of that is a little bit of like, i prove to me, author, that this that this is going to work. Prove to me that my initial visceral feelings and the antagonism between these characters is going to shift. And now as a reader, like there are some books that I have a really hard time reading that I think when I was, you know, in my late teens and early 20s, I had no problem reading.
00:15:34
Speaker
Yeah. because ah i was like wanted the drama of like um i'm thinking of that fantasy series like once upon a broken heart i guess i think that i read ah and i actually stuck with it whereas most of the time i can't stick out a fantasy series because i just i'm like i don't i don't care to get invested what in the character arc of this part of this character right I don't I don't like where we are starting from with this character and so I don't really want to get invested in and then the once upon a broken heart I was already like I don't like where this is going but I was like okay but you know the plot is engaging enough and I understand that we're going through a growth arc here So I'll i'll go on the growth arc with you. But I have to be like willing to go on this growth arc.
00:16:25
Speaker
And sometimes, a lot of the times, for me, if the beginning of the book doesn't spell out a satisfying growth arc that I can see, I'm just like, Yeah.
00:16:36
Speaker
I don't want to. um And so that's one way of identity. And that ties in a little bit, I think, to that an earlier comment that I made about how a lot of times those characters are starting in a bad place and they need to get to the point at the end of the book where they are finally taking care of themselves. Yeah.
00:16:54
Speaker
Right. I don't want to go on that journey. Like I've been on a journey myself with my friends, with family, you know, like I have been on that journey for 20 years plus with multiple people.
00:17:05
Speaker
And including many books and you don't need to read
Balancing Critical Reading with Enjoyment
00:17:08
Speaker
it in this anymore. I'm over You know what's funny too though? Be a therapist. this is This is interesting too, though, because I feel like I, and I don't know if you guys do this too, but I feel like my ability to tolerate this stuff has really stretched doing what we're doing and for how long we've been doing it. So like back in the day, I feel like it was very easy to just kind of get impatient with it. And now i feel like I'm almost able to sit there and look at it and be like, oh, yep, she's doing that thing i I'm not so sure about. All right, well, let's see how well she does it. And then, you know what i mean? And then my brain can like, it's almost like I take all out my personal pleasurable reading brain and I put in my like critical brain and I'm like, okay, we're not reading this now to see how many squishy feelings and whooos we get out of it. We're reading it to see how well the author's like executing their goal. So yeah. I do stretch more, but not with this particular thing.
00:18:02
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, there's things that I don't like to. Yeah. There's things don't like to. Yeah. Well, and I think that's where I am with this Adra Richards book is I'm like, you know, is I'm like, oh, okay. We got to the like ritual humiliation via manual labor portion of the book, yeah which seems to be a kink for her. Deep brawl. Yeah. Adra Richards. Yeah. She's got a little habit there.
00:18:22
Speaker
Yeah. um And I'm like, oh, okay. Okay. I see. I'm like, I see what you're doing with this now. yeah. But like my annoyed brain was turned on. So now I'm also like nitpicky about like small details. I'm like pianos don't wail.
00:18:40
Speaker
Yeah. That's like what? No, no. Pianos don't wail. Activated and nitpicky. Yeah. Which to be fair. I mean, it's a very poorly tuned piano, maybe. Well, but hold on, Holly. No, they don't. Because is it possible that the author has put you into the frame of mind that the heroine is at that point in time?
00:19:02
Speaker
perhaps the heroin is also feeling brittle and nitpicky perhaps perhaps but ah right a bit so i'm trying but like i'm at the point where i'm mostly stepped out but every once in a while i'm like i'm like uh you don't put out you don't add alcohol to cider if you're in the 18th century because cider was already alcoholic 100 of the time like oh that's so annoying but i'm trying i'm trying but So Ingrid, are you then saying, rewind this,
Challenges with Physical Attraction in Books
00:19:36
Speaker
okay.
00:19:36
Speaker
Ingrid, are you then saying that even though Holly is activated and nitpicky, if the author is also the heroine's brain as activated and k nitpicky, that is Holly identifying with the character? That is what I was saying. I was saying that at that point in the book, the heroine is, she's had it, she's done, she's sped up.
00:19:57
Speaker
and she's not interested in engaging with this and everything he does is driving her nuts and if i recall that part of the book correctly i think the author i now i don't know yeah i think the author was evoking some responses not not a ton but because you i think like at this point she's crossed the line so much that she has to like grab you and then walk you through the grovel do you know what mean Yeah, and that's it And like, that's where I'm trying to get to now is like pulling myself out and seeing how she executes it. But, um you know, there, there are other, there are other things about her writing that I don't like that I think make it not work for me, but I'm trying to I'm still trying to like take it apart and pull myself out. But see, this is the thing about like identifying is it's not something, it's not like a reasoned response, at least um for No, it's just knee jerk. It just happens. No, yeah.
00:20:52
Speaker
Okay. So, and here's one that's an example that we have. We're talking about a lot of behaviors, but ah one issue that I have had in ah trying to stretch and read new authors is that I don't process I don't know sexual attraction the same way as some characters do right so there are I'm thinking of scenes where uh it's very explicitly written like she walked into the bar and he wouldn no Are you talking about like, I see them for the first time and immediate boner? yeah Yeah, that kind of experience. But even some of that I can, I'm like, okay, that's just where we are. It depends on, but if the author gets really involved in like, oh, the big muscles or, oh, I see this erection and I want to climb him. Ingrid, your face. I know. This whole part of the conversation is stretching my comfort level. Well, yeah, but I'm just, that i so i the more,
00:22:02
Speaker
like I guess horny attraction and less cerebral attraction that the character is engaging in for connecting with the other character the more I get lost so I've just stopped artists just if the characters like walk up to each other and are immediately like I got all my pants feels um and then especially if it's like I got all my pants feels and but I also hate this person I'm just like I'm already checked out like I can't that is where I find I don't connect with characters at all and then the book really loses me So it's not even necessarily behaviors.
Personality Influences on Reading
00:22:41
Speaker
It's like, it's still a writing style and a writing choice, but it might be something that people don't even think about because I'm assuming that other people do process their attraction in that way. You know what I mean? Right. It's just not how I can do it. So I'm already like, I don't, I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and maybe, I don't know, you guys can tell me if this is similar to what you're saying, but one thing that I really struggle with also is when we're in single relationships,
00:23:06
Speaker
point of view stories where the narrator is putting themselves down a lot right where this is another kind of stylistic writing choice and this is and it's a day and you know this person's on a journey they have to learn to love themselves before someone can someone else can love them but this like I am in somebody's negative self-talk and I'm in somebody's anxiety spiral and I think that that's maybe the it's kind of the opposite of what you're describing maybe because I'm like oh I too cerebral to well or or like I have that in my own head i I don't I don't want to be in somebody else's shame spiral yeah that is a good point when you're it's like oh this there are books where you're like oh that's too real no real
00:23:52
Speaker
No, thank you. No, thank you. don't about that too much. That can happen to me. Sometimes i don't i don't think that I struggle with this very much.
00:24:03
Speaker
I don't. i There are moments where I'm like, yeah, I don't get that. But it doesn't usually it's like a blip and then I'm back. I'm fine. um But I don't know why that would be because... Maybe you're just better at turning off your pleasure brain and turning on your reviewer brain. Maybe. I think, well, there's, here's, I wonder, should I speculate or It's dangerous, maybe.
00:24:25
Speaker
But Ingrid has a very creative mind, right? Ingrid has always had a much better imagination than Sloppy dust, that one, yeah. um And so like when we were babysitting other kids, she would babysit the same kids and I would be like, oh my gosh, do I have to play dolls with you? I just really don't want to. That's so awkward for me do Tell me what to say. What do the dolls do?
00:24:47
Speaker
And Ingrid's like, oh, let's play with dolls, you know? And so I think that might contribute to it where Ingrid, your brain is already like more willing to like tumble into these imaginative places. Yeah. Yeah, I have a comfort thing. Maybe it's just a comfort thing where I don't have a lot of trouble being like, I'll meet you where you are. Let's go. yeah And then, yeah, ah I wonder if like of the three of us, of the three of us, Holly and i are more like prickly.
00:25:22
Speaker
I was going to say rigid and literal, but Sure. Prickly, rigid. ah um Like every once while, Ingrid will say something and Aaron and I will freak out and then we're like, oh wait, you're testing us. Literal brain strikes again. its so fun. because It's like they have a big glaring giant red button them. know. it's And it's like shining. And it's like ah I don't like it when people say things that are incorrect. Yeah. very stressful why do you do this. And i am the keeper of what is correct and incorrect. ah That is also part of the issue. Ingrid, classic younger sister behavior. I know, right? It is. that Maybe that's what it is. It's like you have –
00:26:13
Speaker
i I'm thinking also of like the characters. So I mentioned Luke and boyfriend material, right? Where Luke is like, kind of got these classic, I'm going to be really prickly, stay away from me. But if you can break through and prove that you think I'm worth it, then I will be yours forever, right? but um And I don't know what the opposite to that is, but I'm going to say like more of a i don't want to use this phrase, but it's very relatable. So I'm going to do it anyway. Sorry, Ingrid. But more of like a people pleasing tendency or more of a highly empathetic. I like people.
00:26:50
Speaker
I like people the way they are a lot. Where instead of being like super. you know rigid prickly cold I was called a nice queen once by one of my staff for example um wear that bed with pride thing I don't think you get that as much Ingrid right you're much more like yeah no I don't warm and empathetic so maybe that also contributes to it like you've got this two-pronged you know imagination plus you're not rigid and prickly yeah I will say that there's a downside to that too, though. And that's this is that sometimes I I'm like, okay, book, I'm going to meet you exactly where you are. This is why I like author requests, because i it feels like I'm being very nice when authors are like, will you read my book? And I'm like, yes, I love that you wrote this. Let's read it. This is great.
00:27:43
Speaker
So it seems like I'm being really accommodating. But the truth is that it's very easy for me to just be like, I will meet you exactly where you are. And then the problem is, is that I swear to you, there have been times where I'll read a book I'll be like, okay, okay. Like this was all right. This was good. I like this book. This book had a lot really good stuff going for it. And then I'll read a review someone else wrote later and I'll be like, okay, but everything that they said is right. You know what mean? And it's really critical.
00:28:05
Speaker
And it's the total opposite of what my review was. And I'm like, oh, no. Did I? Was I not critical enough? like it Because sometimes i I feel like I'm just like, I'll accept you exactly as you are, book. I just love you the way you are. And then later I'm like, oh, hold on a second. No, that was correct. So like when what I recommended the book that started this conversation in the first place to Holly, i but I always pick up on things for Holly. And the things I pick up on for Holly is um a very brassy, confident heroine, right? Which I don't agree this heroine is confident. I don't think so either.
00:28:34
Speaker
I think she has no self-respect. But anyway. I agree with you completely. But that wasn't what I picked up on in this one. And then it's a good hero. Well, men with fabulous clothing. Also hero like –
00:28:49
Speaker
remove their innards for the heroin like okay but but they can't do it in a showy way they have to do it kind of like quietly do you know what i mean that's the thing where like whenever i see that i'm like oh there's a holly one like i read one the other day and i was like this here does that thing that holly likes so um but it's also really tough because there are other things where later i'm like oh but you know what i guess holly probably wouldn't have liked that part because well because i started it i read like two chapters and i texted ingrid i'm like she said i don't think i like this and i was like yeah he's terrible so bad i was like but you told me to read it like i'm not sure about that because of the grovel because i thought that you'd be like oh he grovels so good so well that's what i asked i was like i don't know if there's a grovel good enough to get over this is it good But that's the point the point. The whole point of the book is like he's never going to be able to come back from this because he doesn't deserve to come back from it. Like it's really bad. yeah He messes up bad. So anyway, but there there this is the thing. Some people really like a good grovel.
00:29:49
Speaker
And this one really pushes the boundaries of what I think like, ah you know, it's pretty bad. It's pretty bad. Yeah. you know So anyway, interesting. But realistically so, because it's not like a romantic where it's like, oh, our misunderstanding resulted in you being torched a dungeon for two weeks. That is so bad. Let me bathe your back in this scented witch water and heal you with my tears and my blood. You know, like that kind of a thing. See, I can go for that. Right. Because it's ridiculous. But this one is unfortunately like a deep emotional betrayal.
Conclusion on Character Identification
00:30:25
Speaker
Like him being emotional. Like he just was a he did a bad, bad, bad thing twice. Yeah. And so it's like, it verges on too realistic. And that's why I was like, oh, but this gravel, like, how is she gonna, like, the there are books where I'll sit there and i'll be like oh, no, I really don't know how they're gonna pull this off. Like, this is bad. This is really bad. And this is one of those books where whenever I think of that, this is the book that I think of where I'm like, how, how, because to me there is a point of no return and i remember this is what happens to me and this i remember reading in this book and getting i was i would track the percentage completed in the book and i'd be like oh no we're getting too oh gosh we're getting too close to the end oh no like i would get nervous because i'd be like the grovel is not good enough yet do you know what i mean you have to have enough time to come up from that i mean the execution i feel like she razor's edge this author must really like to play with fire that's all i'm saying No. So, do we come to a conclusion? We just wandered around. a little I feel like this is something we could probably talk about for five hours, but this is a 30-minute podcast, not a five-hour podcast, so I'm going to cut us off right there. Just everybody think think about it in their spare time.
00:31:34
Speaker
Yeah. maybe Maybe we'll come back to this from a different angle maybe sometime in the future. I'm sure there will be an opportunity. Yeah. um Anyway, ah show notes at smutreport.com slash podcast.
00:31:46
Speaker
And until next time. Keep it smutty, folks. Na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na. Smut Report!