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Tumblereads 14: The Subtleties of Artistry and Expertise
73 Plays9 days ago
Isn't it amazing how some people are good at making and analyzing art?!?
Full show notes at smutreport.com/podcast
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Transcript
Introduction and FOMO on 'Heated Rivalry'
00:00:03
Speaker
Hello and welcome to this week's episode of Tumble Reads, which is going to be all about heated rivalry. Yay! Okay, but... Okay, Aaron's the only one who watches it, though, and I have so much FOMO. I have so much FOMO because there's this huge cultural conversation about heated rivalry going on, and I want to be part of it, but I don't want to pay for
Cultural Conversations without Streaming Access
00:00:28
Speaker
HBO Max. I'm so sorry. and it is the top this is the struggle it is the struggle the struggle is real deciding when to do the thing i understand i had that problem with ted lasso but i will as someone who watched ted lasso finally for the first time like ah two months ago like all right well except ted lasso was a little different i was like ew i don't want to be a joiner don't want to be
00:00:55
Speaker
conversation and now I'm like oh man I miss my moment i I'm like all excited about Ted Lasso except I'm five years too late know right but now you can just get the DVDs from the library so that's what I did it's like um but no we're not actually just going to talk about heated rivalry because yes I know that I'm the only one who's actually watching the show but I'm also the only one who's read the book but I did put a hold on at's the library also.
Book vs. Show: Critical Perspectives
00:01:24
Speaker
Because I was like, oh, maybe it's time. I know, but I know. Erin doesn't actually want me to read it, though, because she's worried I'm going to be mean.
00:01:31
Speaker
I just don't want you not to like it it. And it's funny because most of the things I'm like, it's fine. oh and we like but i feel like heated rivalry is kind of like my culty, though. And I can say from experience that even though even though I, too, was worried that Holly would tear my beloved culty to shreds.
00:01:51
Speaker
um I did survive it. so Okay. Yeah, you'll be okay. I think I think the cool things well we'll get into it because what I actually want to talk about is um how cool it's been to watch.
Creative Elements and Deep Engagement
00:02:05
Speaker
It's inspired by the show.
00:02:07
Speaker
Absolutely. But it's been really cool to watch all of the like deep analysis of the art that is going into the show, but also that went into the book. All of these little moments that people are pulling quotes from the book that build together to make this incredible story that...
00:02:29
Speaker
has captured the imagination ah of a huge group of people. I mean, I saw the Boston Bruins did all the things she said, which was the ending song on episode four ah for one of their like goal songs or something.
00:02:45
Speaker
What? Yeah. So, okay. Could that be a coincidence? No. Okay. Their marketing manager knows what's up. they're me and so Or whoever is responsible for that.
Social Media Analyses of Symbolism
00:02:57
Speaker
yeah wow yeah so so what sorry yeah my mind is totally blown by that i'm sorry so sorry we got a little off topic and i want to i want to kind of delve a little deeper with like what what i'm talking about um but they're just if you've been on the the socials at all i'm sure you've seen well unless you're living in a completely different socials than i am which is possible they're just like so it's all heated rivalry all the time ah and there have been so many interesting analysis analyses of like symbolism that's going into or like like I read a reddit post about a shot from episode four that's basically like ilia's standing there's a lot of contrasting colors right somebody also in this post pointed out and i'm really bad at symbolism i talked about an elizabeth kingston book or in and a link in an elizabeth kingston review that i did like the first year of the blog i talked about how my worst grade that i ever got was on an english paper about motifs and i still could not tell you i thought i understood but i apparently did not understand
00:04:04
Speaker
What is a
Value of Symbolic Analyses
00:04:05
Speaker
motif? So I'm really bad at this for myself, but I love to see other people be like, hey, did you notice this cool thing and how all of these components are connected? So this particular um commenter on the Reddit post was like, oh, yeah, they've had black and white swapping the whole season because in episode one i don't know shane had white clothes on and black shoes and ilia had black clothes on but white shoes so ilia's in this particular shot in the reddit post that's the the original post uh ilia's where ilia's standing there and he has like uh this art in his background but wi there's like a gray cloud above his head and he's like having you know he's having sad hard time yeah
00:04:46
Speaker
I'm just like, wow. And I feel like I can perceive these visuals as I'm watching. I'm getting the feelings maybe, but not like able to analyze. So I love this and analysis that I'm seeing. um and And I want to
Genre Romance: Expertise and Character Development
00:05:00
Speaker
talk about that. how How cool it is that in this genre where we have...
00:05:06
Speaker
It's like, oh, it's junk food. It's fluffy, whatever. Like we can still dig and get to some interesting, gritty stuff that like, oh, look at this cool thing that the author did. Or now you get the tie in with the show. Like, look at this cool thing. that um you know costumes such as like I was talking about with the art in the background like I want I want to talk about how our I guess it's our expertise not my expertise because you're you are you are an Omegaverse but I know you guys can do it yeah you are an Omegaverse expert Erin well yes and like and
00:05:44
Speaker
You know, you say, oh, not my expertise, but like, maybe you're not an expert in finding symbols and motifs. You can leave that up to me and me and Ingrid. Exactly. i was I would like you to tell me all about the things.
00:05:56
Speaker
ah But like, you're an expert in plenty of other things in ah like, genre romance or in how we read genre romance right and like I would say Ingrid is my go-to expert in like explaining uh character the interiority of interiority the characters and the that the authors are able to do that through ah word choice and Yes, I just love messy people.
Music in Literature: Opinions and Anecdotes
00:06:22
Speaker
I know, I know, but you're also good at like, but you know where their head is like and why they're doing the things they're doing.
00:06:28
Speaker
Yeah, I'm just like, oh, they're so messy. Oh, this is so fun. And you're able to say, okay, but like, here's why that makes sense. And here's how the author supports supports that in the way they use their language.
00:06:42
Speaker
right that yeah i do like to do that that's fun yeah it is fun i do like i do like oh look at these people making bad decisions or i'm like oh they're so irritating why are they being dumb and ingrid's like well they have all this trauma the fear of rejection I'm like, oh, stop talking sense to me. ah and i I know that with the the fact that this is kind of stemming from heated rivalry, a lot of it is visual.
00:07:09
Speaker
um So or audio. I sent a I sent a really fun Instagram reel about heated rivalry of this like British guy doing like reactions. Yeah. And I was like, no notes. Yeah.
00:07:24
Speaker
Oh, but he had also done my FOMO! Yeah, I'm sorry. i'm sorry. ah But he had also done one about why the choice of all the things she said at the end of episode four was so impactful. And I'm always so impressed with like, I can't even remember the titles of songs.
00:07:48
Speaker
When authors can put songs into books and I'm like, wow, that's a great tie in. How did you just like pull that out of the air? Like, I don't understand this encyclopedic knowledge. of Right. But we've talked about, i feel like we talked about references last time and sometimes they'll like pull a song title and I'm like, don't know that song. Or I'm like, oh, wow. but then I'll Google it or something. Then I'll listen. Do you guys not do this? I listen to their songs.
00:08:12
Speaker
I'm like, oh, it's that song. Yeah. to me, it's just a literary device that I just move on. You know what mean? like, whatever. Yeah. And sometimes I'm like, ooh, ooh, why is this 20-year-old so into the Smashing Pumpkins? That's weird. yes. We've talked about that before. But no, i' or the fact that they
Symbolism vs. Real-World References
00:08:30
Speaker
can even do it is impressive to me. This is not a romance example. Or I'm like, it's the time traveler's wife.
00:08:36
Speaker
Which is the most egregious example of this, where they name drop songs and bands constantly, but to show how hipster they are and how much cooler they are than everybody because they know all these niche indie artists and listen to the same weird music that was like, okay just mainstream enough that I recognized who it was, but recognized them as like artists that didn't get radio play, right?
00:09:02
Speaker
Yes. No, hilariously, now that you mention it, there was one And I wish I could remember what it was. I was not mega impressed with the book, but, um but I remember the only part I remember was getting really frustrated because it's this, um she's in love with this, obviously romantic. see He's like 300, 400 years old. Right.
00:09:23
Speaker
And, and um he's like this like dark fake guy, like such a bad boy. And ah anyway, he keeps wearing like band t-shirts and,
00:09:33
Speaker
And I think that it's supposed to be like that he's got really great taste of music and he's like so hot. But because he's so old and she's so not old, right? um It just makes me every time she would bring up like, oh, his favorite Rolling Stones shirt. And I'd be like, you're making it feels like you're dating a 70 year old right now. Yeah. like See, I feel like... wrong. It was not right.
00:09:57
Speaker
See, but I feel like that you could have done this in a really funny way, in a really fun way, being like, oh, his favorite Beethoven t-shirt. Yeah, right? Beethoven back in the day. and like then I'd be like...
00:10:12
Speaker
Alright, alright, I'd give that you. see what she did there. Yeah. This one I was like, no. you they here to you She was picking the wrong era. It was like, it was just, if she even if she'd picked like 80s, but it was just just old enough where I was like, no. Right, or if she'd gone just a little bit older. Like his like Beatles merch. Yes. or Right? no that we're like No, that wouldn't work either. ah it Okay. Because I picture my parents. I'm picturing this 25 year old dating someone who's my parents age. And I'm just like,
00:10:41
Speaker
No, no.
Emotional Evocation through Literary Devices
00:10:44
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, so Aaron, I think you might be alone in the impressed way. Here's what I think. Here's on titles. Actually, actually, here's what I'm thinking based on what you guys have just said. As with all things, it's a tool that can be used for good or ill.
00:11:02
Speaker
yes i have to because you are describing times when it has been like why it didn't work but i am thinking of times honestly i'm just impressed that authors can remember song titles because i can't do that if i had to be if i had we're sitting at my computer and somebody was like you have to put an appropriate song for this mood in right now or eat a gallon of something disgusting i don't know Like I would have to eat the gallon of something disgusting. I couldn't do it. My brain would just go and no songs would exist.
00:11:36
Speaker
But even with that, I've just never connected. Like I like music, but I know I don't connect to it. I know that I don't connect to it. And this is like an age thing, maybe a little bit. just like awareness of how I've how my brain works over time i don't connect to music like that like i was in the car with my family doing a holiday thing and last night and my we were listening to Merry Christmas by Elton John and I think it's Ed Sheeran it's a duet and it's so fun and upbeat and I love it so much and I'm like please play it again for me and my husband played it twice for me because he loves me so much but I was like wow Elton John is so good at music that's so cool and my son was like
00:12:20
Speaker
I don't know, mom, I feel like you're being a little too like hyping him up too much. And I was like, no, you don't you know understand my brain. i know my brain can't do that. And i am so amazed at the fact that his brain can do that.
Symbolism in Fantasy and Romance
00:12:33
Speaker
I've said the same thing about like, ham like listening to Hamilton sometimes. I'm just like, wow, all of the stuff that's in here is like pretty incredible. Yeah.
00:12:41
Speaker
and And so when authors do that too, I'm like, wow. ah The fact that you could even think of a song title. I am so amazed. You know what, though? I'm not amazed by song titles. But then as a tool. I'm more like when authors succeed at making me cry, I'm like, wow, look at that amazing emotional manipulation you did. How did you do that? That's fair. But usually I can't in the moment. I can't be like, how did you do that? I'm too busy crying. But... Right? But it's the same kind of thing, right? If i take a step back, if I describe these scenes that make me cry, like I wrote a piece about this, about ah Love at First, like years ago, when I read Love at First, and I was like, the scene where I was like, ugly crying is just like, if you describe it, he's
00:13:30
Speaker
He like she says that she loves him and he's like, wow, no one's ever said that to me before. And she's like, you mean like a romantic partner? He's like, no, nobody. And I'm just like crying. And but if I describe it, that's like so saccharine. Yeah. Right.
00:13:49
Speaker
But in the moment, it works. Well, and you have all of this stuff. This is often a problem that I have in reviews when I want to capture usually why something was so funny. and And like there's way too much text because it's like maybe two pages of buildup to get to the punchline or something. It's like this it's the same thing. You have the rest of the story where the author has been doing such a good job of dropping all of the hints and all the little moments to build to that point yeah and then you get the impact and i that is also i'm just like wow you wow and so when the tools are used correctly i know i know
00:14:34
Speaker
I will say this. I will say this. I, the thing with, so I think I'm a little bit snooty when it comes to this kind of symbolism because the number of times that someone has thrown in like just the right song or whatever, and it's worked for me fixated on the song has been zero. Like i literally can't remember ever seeing a song thrown into a book and being like, I love that literary decision.
00:14:58
Speaker
Almost every time I'm like, and what if I hate that song? like well cut so now it this is what it does to me. It pulls of the story because then I'm like, now I have to figure out... What I think about this character, I have to, like, reshuffle my my base knowledge of this character or this situation because you've given me something that is so real world that now I have to, like, re reshuffle everything. And I get really annoyed by it. Yes. And so that's why I don't like it. Like, tend to not like
Music and Cultural Memory in Literature
00:15:29
Speaker
it. Okay. But...
00:15:31
Speaker
Oh, sorry. Other kinds of symbolism. Other kinds of symbolism. i eat it up with a spoon. Like if as long as it's not like a real world tie in like that, i love it. I can't get enough of it. I and especially like I think that's one of the reasons why I've been on such a hardcore romanticy binge is because I feel like those books are like 60 percent symbolism for better or for worse. All they do is um always get into fantasy. I'm like, I have to I can't understand. Yeah, it's like just tell me.
00:16:00
Speaker
forget a trail of literary breadcrumbs it's just the author just chucking like sackfuls of feet at you just like look at this symbol look at that symbol see if you can figure out where i'm going now like that's romantic to me and i think it's great i'm like great awesome like let's do this um but that seems so heavy-handed okay but okay what about other literary allusions Wait, I want to go back to the song thing because I just have this example and I want to ask what you think of it. Because in one of Rachel Reed's books, i I can't remember if it's role model or the long game because that's the same team and there's some overlap. um The goalie and they're like the losingest team in the league, basically.
00:16:43
Speaker
And ah the goal song is all I do is win. And their goalie, they're like having a break and they have all I do is win playing. And the goalie is talking to one of the main characters. It might be Ilya.
00:16:56
Speaker
And he's like, well, that's a weird choice, but okay. Because all they they don't win, they never win. They're like the losing a steam. But their their goal song is all I do is win. And I just thought like, it's just it's less like a who little bit of humor um right in there. and I just was delighted by it.
00:17:17
Speaker
See, and I feel like i i feel like that that kind of reference I could actually be okay with um because it's kind of like tongue in cheek, like funny type of a thing, you know? Okay, but not if it's like, oh, we're being so deep and meaningful now. Yeah, you know, and maybe this could, I have to take full ownership here. This could be like...
00:17:36
Speaker
some like a knee-jerk reaction from being in college and hanging out with people and having it be like a screening process for like whether you were cool or not did that ever happen to you where you hang out go to a social gathering and they'd be like pass your ipod let's plug it in did you ever have this happen to you no and they'd be like have you heard of this band well what's your favorite song of that band and you'd be like i feel like freaking no Meanwhile, my friends, a lot of my friends in college had very strong opinions about music. And so they just DJed and I'm just like, all right, cool. Whatever. You can just be in charge of music. but But that's not, that wasn't the point of these engagements. The point of these engagements was to make sure that you knew that you were not
00:18:17
Speaker
cool enough to hang out with these people. um ah And meanwhile, i was in... Yeah, well, it was just... Or like, yeah, like, oh, they're your favorite band. Name five songs from that band. And it's usually dudes, but you know what I mean. Like, just like gross. Meanwhile, I'm in Italy at one point and I was stuck on a song, Aaron, I know you know what i'm talking about, where you have to listen to the song like 500 times and then you never want to listen to it again. Has it ever happened to you? Happens to me all the time. Well, in Italy, it was Party in the USA by Miley Cyrus.
00:18:45
Speaker
And am not that cool, but I am just cool enough to know that that was not something that I should ever admit to anybody else. So I also was unaware at that point that having cheap headphones means that everyone can hear what you're listening to.
00:19:00
Speaker
So bless his heart, the roommate that I had at the time, um he had a class with me. We had to walk fair ways. And so we were both kind of walking and I was listening with one ear, you know, my headphones. And i remember him just looking at me and going, what are you listening to? And I was like, ah nothing.
00:19:18
Speaker
And he was like, you don't know the song you're listening to. And I was like, ah no, I don't. I just put it on shuffle. I don't know what song it is. Because I knew if I said party in the USA that he was going to look at me and be like, are you serious?
00:19:28
Speaker
Because I was older than all these kids, too. I was like a good two years older.
Subtle Symbolism in Romance Literature
00:19:31
Speaker
And he just looked at me and went like and like gave me a little like smirk. And I was like, fuck. And yeah so this is why I think I have like this knee jerk thing where whenever people throw songs into books i'm like great now i'm this kid walking down an alley in florence judging what you're listening to show that you're the one who brought up trauma in your reading today not me i didn't this isn't trauma this is just a major click i'm just playing i am not traumatized by annoying people not at all definitely not all right but wait holly wanted to talk about metaphors or what were you more symbolism tell me how where were we going sorry i I just got distracted by like the one time a guy in college tried to pull that with me um you know and he was just like oh what are you in into and I was like you know I was like i knew the code so I said the flaming labs
00:20:20
Speaker
Oh, good. Right? right yeah i would I would never have answered that in a thousand... I don't know. You know, it was 2003, and he was like, oh, that's like a safe choice. And I was like, all right, fine. The Dixie Chicks, before they drop the Dixie. And he was like, oh, oh wow, that's a brave thing to admit. And I was like, yeah, fuck you. You asked.
00:20:40
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, and like, you know, he he was someone that I like, you know, he was like the president of like the literary magazine. So I like kind of knew him, but I wasn't interested in actually being friends with him or hooking up with him. And so, yeah, I was just like, whatever, i don't care about you. So that's, that's my story about that.
00:21:07
Speaker
It is a brave choice. I'm so sorry. Yeah. You guys had to go through all of that. I can just enjoy the song titles or not, depending on how the other uses the tool. That's because you married somebody that you met when you were still a youth, Aaron. Oh, whatever. he doesn't do it either. You've been able be yourself him forever.
00:21:24
Speaker
Yeah, we're not. We're not. i I know. I'm going to we're already sidetracked. And enough yeah I was going to say, oh, you know, this reference, but no, no, we're going to go back on track because we don't need to talk about audio all the time. We can also talk about visual.
00:21:39
Speaker
yeah more text words I think words are I think that's the that's the fun thing about books right is that like I said before when we were talking about love at first like it's all of these little things that build together that the author was paying attention to and oftentimes i don't even notice that so I'm not that good at I I my poor child is like uh English I'm like man I hear you I did not take any English classes in college I tested out of them i was like I will do all of my writing classes and reading you know credits in history but so and I did um
00:22:22
Speaker
and i was like i have And I was like, I have to take an English class every semester or my life is not as good. yeah But I love being able to talk about or read other people talk about the ways that authors tie things together or pull texts. Like, they're like, oh, do you remember when, man, and here I can't think of any examples anymore because I totally came to this conversation prepared with books and not just like social media posts. Yeah.
00:22:51
Speaker
About the show Heated Rivalry. but But, you know, stuff where people will be like, oh, you notice in this book when, like, we come back to the end. Actually, this is part of what Holly said about Ingrid being really good at, like, remember how the trauma that they brought up here is now being fulfilled at the end here when they're having their bleak moment because...
00:23:11
Speaker
Oh, their dad left and their friends left and they were abandoned by everyone and their greatest fear is being abandoned. And it's just a misunderstanding. But now the love interests left the room and they feel like they're abandoned, too. Or whatever, you know, like the author is just tying all these
Personal Preferences: Subtle vs. Overt Symbolism
00:23:29
Speaker
little things in. And that's like a plot arc kind of element. But I feel like, you know, like, oh, and then they were on the boat. Yeah.
00:23:36
Speaker
And then they brought that back at the end of the book when they were back in the water, but without the boat or, you know, whatever it was. I'm like i'm so bad at it, but I appreciate it. Like i can i I'm in it, like floating on the boat with them. yeah But when somebody explicitly talks about the symbolism, I'm like See, and I was just... I love this this for us. I know. This cracks me up because I was literally... So i one of the books I binged lately, i remember reading it and i end finishing like the series and closing it and being like, she's ah the author's a literary a literature major. like I guarantee you this woman is trained in the craft of like writing artistry. And I'll be danged if I didn't look it up online. I like how I dropp dropped like one ah an egregious
00:24:20
Speaker
swear word earlier and then i can't say damned um anyway i'll be dangd i'll be gall darned if i didn't look online it's rachel gillig um but she wrote uh one dark window and two twisted crowns and she also wrote the knight and the moth which is really they're all really popular right now but i read the um The dark window, I think is what it was. Anyway. And oh, my gosh.
00:24:48
Speaker
Oh, my gosh. She just she just the whole time you were just getting like yanked around like she it was so subtle. And then it would just sneak up on you like later. You'd be like, oh, that was a symbol. Oh, here it comes. It was so much fun. She did such a good job. And then, and then hilariously, like I followed up a couple, there was another one, I can't remember ah who it was, but well, it was the Road to Bones that I read recently that she does a lot of that too with the addiction and stuff and it's subtle. And then all of a sudden it just like rears up and slaps you in the face and you're like, Oh, beautiful.
00:25:18
Speaker
And then hilariously, I was I finished this by rereading something by Stella Reese because it came up on a discussion board. And I was trying to remember because I, you know, sometimes you read stuff and then later you reread it and you're like, what was I thinking? So I had an experience earlier where I read a book by Stella Reese that I hadn't read before. And I was like, this is I do not enjoy this. This is not a good book.
00:25:37
Speaker
to me and then which i remembered holly did not like bad boss remember that one no she hated it and i was like maybe i was just like ovulating when i read stillery like why did i go through phases yeah yeah so i reread one and i was like oh yeah i get why i liked this one now um anyway but um She has a lot in hers, but they're not very subtle.
00:25:59
Speaker
They're pretty overt. um But she's using them like they're there. yeah I think it's another thing. It's a tool that it can be used well or not. But I think the interesting thing is that we are able to do analysis of it and we're able to dig deep because we're, I guess,
Artistry and Cultural Analysis in Romance Novels
00:26:15
Speaker
experts. Yeah.
00:26:16
Speaker
ah in the field I don't know Holly you were goingnna say I just saw you what were you going to say oh I don't know keep going oh no i like that mean my thought is out of my brain so i'm I'm sorry I should have just let you I'll bring it back with with Bad Boss so I was thinking about Bad Boss because you know how we were talking so the Rachel Gillick books um are like fine craftsmanship in my opinion you know what I mean and then you've got Stella Reese on the other hand who like I you know like Aaron said earlier it's not like I would ever want to consider any of these books to be junk food I don't think they're junk food but it's a feel-good book you know what I mean like it's
00:26:51
Speaker
It's meant to elicit responses in the reader that are like, you know, pearl clutching, et cetera, and so forth. And then a happy ending. But with Bad Boss, it was really interesting I was thinking about it afterwards. And I was like, you know, what's interesting is that, you know, when we're talking about me and my character development stuff that, you know, in that book, the heroine has been like, betrayed by positions of power and by men having power over her and of course who does she fall for man in a boss position right so it's obvious but it's not like they ever go into it as like this is I mean she says like you are helping me work through all this like baggage that I have but she doesn't sit there and say well I'm realizing that with you and your position of power over me like she doesn't over explain it it's definitely like your attention is directed to it but it's not so I think it's a little easier for people who maybe aren't as great with symbolism
00:27:49
Speaker
because she kind of walks you right up to it she doesn't throw you across the line but she like she's like right there there it is you know what mean as opposed to rachel gillig who's like i'm just gonna put this here and if you pick up on great and if not whatever you know what i mean and then i was like reading that sebastian nothwell book and i was like i am sure that there is a whole bunch of stuff in here that i am just not getting because i don't understand symbolism ah well That's O'King Holly King, right?
00:28:17
Speaker
Yeah, O'King Holly It was great. I really enjoyed it. right well and but i I haven't read it, but I suspect there wasn't just a bunch of symbolism, but also that he was like specifically drawing on like like a lot of allusions to like a really niche kind of like Robert Graves. We're talking about what the king like ah like pagan, druid, what pre-Christian, I don't even know.
00:28:44
Speaker
Plus fairy stuff, right? so Yeah, yeah, I'm sure. i mean, I would tell you if I knew, but I don't know. ah But I'm sure there was. i Because, you know, there's like little things you're like, oh this probably means something that I'm not picking up on. um Okay, so we're a kind of... I will say that when I read books like that, where I do pick up on it, I feel so smart. I'm like, oh, know. I understood that reference. Yeah.
00:29:10
Speaker
um We're in time. Ingrid, you're going to save whatever thought you had for next time, I guess. It's all good. ah i Just to like tie it back into Heated Rivalry, i want i will like i will conclude with ah my my original... So, I read Heated Rivalry probably 10 times the first year that I read it and I wrote a review of it and I tried to be articulate or something and I kind of just squeed and I kind of was like, it was one of those books that I finished it and I was like, wow, they had a ton of sex. Like, what about this really spoke to me and made me feel like it was so romantic.
00:29:48
Speaker
ah And ah if you don't want to read it or you're curious about what I'm talking about, ah there are like a thousand at least people doing the exact same thing about the book specifically, but the show also right now on every single social you can imagine. So pick your poison. But I think that's that ties into all this other stuff. It's the breadcrumbs being dropped throughout the story. It's the way that Rachel Reed was able to use the words and to create a sense of feeling in the reader about these characters how these characters were feeling and then you tug along and then you get to the end and you're just like oh my god you know um and you know some authors might read it and just somebody might somebody that doesn't read romance might pick it up and be like well that was just sex scene sex scene sex scene um or maybe not maybe they'd be like That was amazing. but
00:30:39
Speaker
But I could see it going either way is my point. And I am glad that we live on the side of being able to read into the artistry of romance novels in particular, but things generally. And that when I can't do stuff, you guys can help me. it Both you guys, Holly and Ingrid, and also the internets of people who actually understand things. Although if we're trying to do it in other genres, ah we you might be shit out of luck.
Navigating Cultural Symbolism in Media
00:31:06
Speaker
like my husband and I are watching stranger things and I'm just like it's so scary but neither of us like watch no I don't like horror so we're just we're just being scared and not um understanding all the references that I'm sure yeah all the visual references I'm sure going on how this works except for all the ones to ET in season one I got those I got those
00:31:32
Speaker
I saw that one. All right. Well, next time we'll talk about something else.
Conclusion and Teaser for Next Episode
00:31:38
Speaker
Who's in charge time? Nipples! I think it's Holly. I think it is. No, it's Ingrid. Well, guess what, guys? We're going to talk about Nipples.
00:31:46
Speaker
and I bet we could do it. I bet we could. I'm sure we could get nerdy about or anything. the Okay, so until then, you can find any show notes that we have at smartreport.com slash podcast. And we're on the socials, sort of, maybe you will find us there at Smart Report. And until then, keep it smutty, folks.
00:32:12
Speaker
Na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na Smart Report!