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S3E24 Who?! The Unexpected and the Unbreakable: Claire on Being a Gestational Carrier
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Summary
In this episode, Whitney sits down with Claire, a two-time gestational carrier who shares what it’s like to walk through not one, but two very different surrogacy journeys. In her first experience, Claire opens up about navigating the heartbreak of a miscarriage followed by the joy of a successful embryo transfer. In her second journey, the pregnancy progressed smoothly until the anatomy scan revealed the baby had a congenital heart defect. This unexpected diagnosis brought new layers of emotion, medical planning, and continued hope as the journey unfolded.
Claire has experienced both the beauty and the challenges that come with helping grow a family through surrogacy. She speaks candidly about the emotional resilience required to walk this path, the deep connection between surrogates and intended parents, and what it means to show up with love and intention, even when things don’t go as planned.
If you’re looking for real stories, and a deeper understanding of the surrogacy experience, this conversation delivers.
Takeaways
- Exposure to surrogacy can normalize the concept for others.
- Community support is crucial for those navigating infertility.
- Miscarriage can be a shared experience between surrogates and intended parents.
- Surrogacy is a selfless act that requires emotional resilience.
- Hope is a challenging but necessary part of the journey.
- The matching process can feel like dating, with many deserving families.
- Unexpected challenges can arise during pregnancy.
- The delivery experience can differ from expectations.
- Life after birth involves ongoing care and adjustments.
- Building relationships with intended parents is important.
- Surrogacy can lead to unexpected emotional connections.
- Sharing stories can provide hope to others in similar situations.
- It's important to keep perspective and focus on the joy of helping others.
Links
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Surrogacy Experiences
00:00:00
Speaker
Hi everyone. Today's guest is Claire, a two-time gestational carrier who brings so much warmth, honesty, and perspective to the conversation. Claire has been through two very different surrogacy journeys, one that included the heartbreak of miscarriage and then the joy of a successful transfer and another where everything was going smoothly until there was a scan that revealed a congenital heart defect.
00:00:28
Speaker
Through it all, Claire has stayed grounded, hopeful, and incredibly thoughtful about the role she and surrogates alike play in helping build happy families. She shares what she's learned, how she stayed connected with her intended parents, and why even the unexpected twists can lead to something really beautiful.
Role as Surrogacy Coordinator
00:00:49
Speaker
I loved this conversation and I know you will too. Enjoy. Me, you, and who? Who knew it would take more than two people to have a baby in a world where infertility is no longer a taboo topic.
00:01:05
Speaker
This podcast will take you through all of the different aspects of surrogacy and egg donation through the lens of many who walk this journey in different ways. My name is Whitney Hall. and I am a two time surrogate now turned surrogacy coordinator for egg donor and surrogate solutions.
00:01:22
Speaker
the very agency I used when I chose to carry for two amazing families. With this podcast, it is our goal to help guide and support you as you learn about what it takes to grow a family in an alternative way, as well as hear inspiring and beautiful stories of how this path has changed lives forever. We can't wait for you to hear about just one more way happy families are created every day.
00:01:52
Speaker
Claire. Hi. Hi. Thank you so much for being here. I'm so excited. It's a privilege. I'm so excited to join. Oh, for sure. I'm, yeah. No, it's so funny because I, um well, first of all, I've heard your name just from Katie and things like that. And then um you were always. It's also your daughter's name. So to be fair. To be fair. It's great name. Yeah, it's a great name. Claire's are great.
00:02:12
Speaker
She should be on all podcasts. agree. I totally agree. Okay, but I am so excited to talk to you about your journeys because I've heard, again, like I've heard of you, I've heard about things, just all of that, and I'm excited that I get the the privilege of getting my firsthand account. So- I'm honored. Aw, thank you.
00:02:30
Speaker
but Before we even like dive in though, how did surrogacy even become a thing in your world? Oh my gosh. So- Honestly, it was kind of a slow drip. So i think I first heard of surrogacy when I was in a small group at my church years before I ever even would have considered it myself. Like we were still in the process of like having our own babies and all of that. So um there was just a girl that was in our group who was...
00:02:55
Speaker
um had done that before and had just what openly shared about it and um in the context of someone else sharing about their infertility struggles. So it was just kind of like heard of it then. And then I ended up um having a coworker who was a surrogate twice while we were working, while we worked together. And it was really cool to get to hear her story. And then of course I have been friends with several people that are um part of the egg donor and surrogate solutions group for a very long time.
Normalizing Surrogacy Discussions
00:03:24
Speaker
Kind of, it was all just very surrogacy adjacent, um very like, oh, I've heard about it and it just was normal, I guess. I think normalizing it, talking about it, um just kind of was like, okay, this is a thing um that exists in the world and my, like, I,
00:03:42
Speaker
personally growing up was not like a stranger to like this idea that like families are created in a lot of different ways. My brother's adopted. and We just, it was like, okay, this is a thing that exists in the world. And so um for me, when it like came time for us to like consider are we done with our family? Are we not? Surrogacy just kind of felt like, okay, this is the next right step for us. And it was um very just normal, I guess, to talk about. Because i it again, I'd been exposed to it over time. It wasn't like it was something that
First Surrogacy Experience and Miscarriage
00:04:14
Speaker
I was like, I'm gonna research what this looks like um and like decide that I need to do it come at it from that angle. It was very much just like, this just feels like the right next step for our family. so I love that. And I feel like that's not the most common thing because I feel like a lot of people's first, you know, kind of hearing about surrogacy, it's usually through the media or celebrities or right yeah something like that. Yeah, mine was just like a slow drip of exposure. Like a friend told a friend, somebody shared about their personal experience. And like, I think that that um it just, i don't know, it normalizes it. And I think that there, like how many people are there in the world who
00:04:50
Speaker
could make this step for another family and help another person who just doesn't know about it, like who's not thought about it it. just didn't occur to them that they could serve in this way.
00:05:01
Speaker
um So I think like for the more the more that we can do stuff like this, like sharing on our podcast, sharing about how this has impacted our life in so many of the nuanced ways and the positive ways and the hard ways, like I think that that just helps normalize the this entire industry that is,
00:05:19
Speaker
like the the non-traditional way of creating families. Yeah, no, for sure. I couldn't have said it better myself because I think you're exactly right. You know, what feels like a taboo topic, right it's not. It's absolutely not. And it's so much more common and normal for like,
00:05:36
Speaker
then people think, right, that, you know, what is it? It's one in four that are going to struggle in some area. um And I think that the more we can normalize, like, you're not alone. And there are there's a community of people around here that want to support you on your journey, um whether that's just Helping now you navigate that through hard conversations or stepping up and actually like being able to tangibly support you through this process. I think that you know there's such a there's a heart. you know
00:06:08
Speaker
People aren't alone. And for as much as you can think about how you can help tangibly address that, it's just it's it can be very normal. It can be very normal Absolutely. And i mean, and again, to your point, you know, there are so many people that are struggling with it, but because people don't talk about it, then they feel like they're alone. And the more you talk about it, the more normalized it is. And the more, like you said, people can support you, yes whether it's in your case, you found out about a couple yeah that was struggling and you were like, oh, wait, I can do something about that. yeah yeah it So, yeah, tell tell me a little bit more about that, because you were kind of
00:06:46
Speaker
for lack of a better word, like pre-matched, if you will. Yes. So it was really interesting. um It just kind of, these this two storylines kind of just were running in parallel and then converged in the form of derogacy, right? So for me and my husband, we had had our third child and she was probably about six months old. And I just remember just having this like moment of just joy and thinking like,
00:07:11
Speaker
There are people in the world that that are missing this, that that are craving the late nights and craving the complicated parenting struggle. And I'm like, somebody is is craving my heart right now.
00:07:26
Speaker
And if I can do something about that, why wouldn't I? I had no good reason to say i shouldn't do this. like I don't come at this from like, oh my gosh, I love being pregnant. Pregnancy is such a beautiful experience. like That's not my story. I mean, and it like my pregnancies we're not de were not challenging or difficult, but it wasn't like, I just, I love this experience for myself.
00:07:45
Speaker
It was more of, I love being a mom. yeah And if I can help offer that to somebody who like so deeply wants that, I have really not a great reason to not do that. right like there's just it just Every reason I came up with was like,
00:08:03
Speaker
All right, well, that doesn't feel like it. like a That's kind of selfish. I mean, not not to say that people who don't do this like um are thinking that way, but just it just, for me and my husband, there was a not it was really just a, why wouldn't I? Why wouldn't we do this?
00:08:16
Speaker
So that was kind of our story. Also, um the our first set of IPs, they were like talking about being open and vulnerable about your story. like They were super open and vulnerable um with their infertility struggles. And this was a couple who was like...
00:08:33
Speaker
a friend of a friend of mine. We kind of like, we weren't really like buddies. I had her number because we'd been to like girls nights together. she for sure So we were like adjacent. In the same circle. Yes. But yeah like, we weren't like, we'd never just hung out the two of us. like And so um we were Facebook friends and she was doing such a good job of chronicling her story and her husband's story of trying to have a baby and grow their family.
00:09:02
Speaker
And I just remember being like, okay, I feel like on one hand in my story, God is calling me to surrogacy. I feel like this is the next step for me and family. something that we wanna do. It's an area that we are going to pursue regardless.
00:09:15
Speaker
And at the same time, somebody has been put in my immediate circle who can influenced and who be impacted in this way. So it was really funny. um The timing of it, ah they had just done, gosh, probably their fifth transfer. They were transferred to embryos and this was Christmas time and we were just like praying, like i like praying in our in our circle that like, okay, this takes for you, right? Because I had been hoping for and following their journey.
00:09:44
Speaker
And um we found out shortly around Christmas, New Year's that it didn't take for them. And so I was talking to a couple of friends that were closer to them.
00:09:54
Speaker
And was just like, hey, where are they at in their story? You know, what does this look like? And had learned that their um reproductive endocrinologist had suggested that like at this point in time, the surrogate was their next best option.
00:10:09
Speaker
And I was like, you know, i'm thinking of So I reached out to her i gave you know a couple weeks into January, reached out to her and was like, hey, any chance you want to have coffee?
00:10:20
Speaker
And she was like, oh, of course, that'd be so great. So we met for coffee. And she's just thinking that like I'm just being nice and supportive this area, just wanting to like, hey, i I know you're walking through a hard season. Meanwhile, between family,
00:10:33
Speaker
like
Starting Second Surrogacy Journey
00:10:34
Speaker
early December and us connecting in January, I had connected with my friends at Surrogate Solutions, was like, if I'm gonna like do this, I wanna make sure that I can, right? Like I don't wanna have this conversation and end up being like, actually, sorry, take these backsies, I can't do this, like for whatever reason. So like I would gone through during that period of time,
00:10:52
Speaker
um doing as much research as I could about what that would look like for us, what it we'd need to do. Like, can i am I going to get medical clearance? What does this look like for me and my husband? Is how is he going to be supportive?
00:11:04
Speaker
Is my family going to be supportive? And just kind of wanting to be really prepared because ah literally, we went into this coffee and i had all of my like paperwork and was like, Oh my gosh, look at you. and So prepared of like, okay, I want them to know like what...
00:11:21
Speaker
like that that the i i My heart is, I want to do this. Whether or not this this conversation goes, like I hope it does, I'm going to pursue this one way or the other. um So we sat down and I was like, you know tell tell me about where you're going, like where you're at in your journey, what's your all's next step? And she she had said, like oh yeah, a coworker kind of half jokingly said that they wanted to carry mar eyes and that and and I was like, well, I don't mean to throw my hat in the ring, but I really feel called to this.
00:11:48
Speaker
I feel called to surrogacy and I would love to do this for your family. And just, I feel like I'm supposed to offer to go on this journey with you guys before I go and open up to the matching process. So I basically, I joke now that basically I was like, I wanna have your baby. But mean, really and truly, that's kind of how the conversation went.
00:12:12
Speaker
Absolutely. In a very sweet and wonderful and beautiful way. Of course. And about 30 minutes later, like, they received it so beautifully. About 30 minutes later, where I'm still in the car on the way home. And she called me. She's like, we're in. Let's do this. And it was just so great.
00:12:25
Speaker
And for it to be somebody that, like, I knew. Like, to me, one of the things that I kind of tried to process was, I didn't want to carry for somebody that I knew super closely and personally, or like a sibling of mine or something like that, there're you know stories like this can be filled with so much loss. And I didn't want somebody to have to continue to see me or have
Challenges and Support in Second Surrogacy
00:12:51
Speaker
me in their circle if I was gonna be a constant reminder of hard part of their life. and so
00:12:56
Speaker
For me, having that separation of this is somebody who that is our relationship. Our relationship is a one of an IP and a surrogate that like has a little bit of additional. Sure. But that it was important to me to give them the freedom to not have me part of their life if something right to have happened and like not have that hurt a friendship. So that was kind of a unique part of our um bringing them into this process, not going through a matching journey because a matching you're match basically matching with a stranger. Right. Yeah, absolutely. So for me, bringing someone who was an existing acquaintance, an existing friend, um was a little unique because I wanted them to be able to cut ties if that needed to be part of their healing process, however it would have looked, because there's no guarantees in any of this. Yeah, and that's really conscientious. And I mean, that that's such that's such a great awareness that you had in that in in that part, because I think there are so many people that are, you know, they look to, um oh, I want somebody that's like I would do this for somebody that isn't a stranger and, you know, all of that stuff. And i think you're right. I mean,
00:14:02
Speaker
Yes, we want those happy fairy tales. Of course. But, you know, it isn't a guaranteed process. And that is a really great point to bring up of by no means. I mean, certainly there's nothing wrong with something more transactional. But, you know, the fact that you guys kind of had a little bit of both worlds of, you know, we kind of sort know each other, but there's still a level ah a level of. Right.
00:14:23
Speaker
And like, I always went into this saying like, I don't need to be like Aunt Claire at the end of the day. I don't need like, yeah i don't need to be besties. Like if that grows and becomes that, wonderful. But at the same time, if to protect their heart, they need to have a little bit of distance. Like I wanted to be able, like I needed to be okay with that. yeah So um I think there are some, like I'm part of but a lot of the surrogate groups and and many of them are very much like this is a like this is all very relational heavy and they want to be besties and they want to do it.
00:14:56
Speaker
I'm wired a little bit differently. I am a little bit more like, yes, i want I want to do this for you. I want to have a great relationship. But at the end of the day, I let them set the terms. Because yeah it's like there's just so much nuance to it. And that's certainly the IP's experience is not one that I have. Right. Like I can I can imagine what it's like, but I don't know what it's like to have to process that so much loss. Before people come to this experience and come to this journey, there inevitably is some loss. So yeah for them to be able to set the terms of what that looks like and um take it on their terms was really important to me. So all have to say is bringing an acquaintance into this process was um really fun and rewarding. And it's been really beautiful to see because we had do have so many friends that were kind of on both sides, right?
00:15:45
Speaker
Yeah. ah for to them be able to be witness to this really beautiful story that has heart in it. um It's been really cool. And just being able to see. So it's a funny, them they are this my first set of IPs go to our church. So I see them almost every Sunday. i love it. um And like it is still, it's not by tried transactional by any means, but it is still very much, there's a like ah a healthy, beautiful distance that like I don't need to be in their circle of friends. It's not for me. I didn't do this for me. I did this for them. And like,
00:16:15
Speaker
we um it's It's just a beautiful simplicity to that. like i don't it's not I didn't do this because I needed somebody to depend on me, right? And I just i think that that's- Well, it's neat that you were part of that, you're part of that story in that way.
00:16:30
Speaker
And then it can be one of those situations where that chapter is is closed and then you still get to kind of- Yeah, be on the outside. Be on the outside. I've always said, hey, if I got a picture, or like i fight can we be friends on Facebook? And like- I want see like, like her grow up and like that just kind of like that would just bring me joy.
00:16:49
Speaker
If it's more than that, wonderful. That would be joyful too. But it wasn't about meeting my need in that way. Yeah. kind of No, I love that. I love that. Well, you kind of alluded to it. There was hard in, um, in the journey. Um, tell me about that.
00:17:03
Speaker
So with, um I've carried for two families. um So my first family, our IPs are Aaron and Lisa. And um they, when we first matched, they had embryos. They they had um one embryo left that they were prepared to transfer. And so the the idea of one embryo didn't scare me. It was very much like, okay, like I still feel like this is what I'm supposed to do. So yeah like that was not a barrier to um kind of fulfilling this calling that I felt like I had on my life. So,
00:17:32
Speaker
um We transferred our baby boy embryo and unfortunately miscarried at um nine weeks. So we went in to the very first appointment at like after graduating, because we'd graduated from the reproductive endocrinologist, everything was fine. We had a heartbeat confirmation. Everything was fine, yes. So we went into, like I think we were at 11 weeks at that point, went into the first appointment that they were able to be at and we didn't find a heartbeat.
00:17:56
Speaker
And that was super challenging for people for us because like we'd had experienced the joy like they had never had a positive like heartbeat confirmation like yeah they had never made it to that point and so for them to have that experience and then it'd be you know stripped away in that outcome was so hard like but I approached it very much like okay let me handle the physical part of this like I can still serve by you know managing the physical discomfort of we ended up doing a DNC and just processing the physical loss of like, did, you know, people, you know, process like, it did my body fail? Did something like, was there anything I could have done differently? And, you know, we know that, no, there's very, like, there's very little. Very rarely, yeah. That we are doing that can actually like,
00:18:46
Speaker
like create the outcomes we hope, right? um But i I felt like being the person to um undergo this miscarriage was also a way to serve them, was a way to like let them just heal emotionally. um Because they had announced, like they were so, like they just, like it was just, you know, so much hope and joy. um Of course, they had never been to that point. Absolutely, right, right.
00:19:14
Speaker
um And so we, anyway, being able to do that for them with Baby Hudson was just, I treated it very much as like, this is how I can serve them and I can handle the the physical part of it. I can handle my emotional part of it. And um they're not alone in this, right? Like they have somebody who, you know, like I remember texting her and being like, I just like, I just want to sit on the couch with you guys and just eat ice cream and watch sad movies. Like I just, my heart just wanted to like, was grieving alongside them.
00:19:44
Speaker
So, again, a way to serve them and just love them through that experience while they could process the emotional grief of what they were were navigating and not have to worry about the physical effects on, you know, her body. and So it was super hard and they didn't have any embryos. So then they had to go through that whole process. Right. And so there's just kind of that level of things. I was going to ask, you know, how you you had mentioned, you know, again, you were you were viewing.
00:20:07
Speaker
what was physically happening to you as an act of service, which I think is just a beautiful perspective and a great way to to put that. um And then you were saying processing your emotions.
00:20:19
Speaker
How were you navigating not only, mean, a miscarriage is hard on anybody. And then not only is it is it that, then you're also, like you said, you're holding space for your intended parents and those emotions. Yeah, and that grief. Yeah.
Community and Communication in Surrogacy
00:20:35
Speaker
um I remember, i i should you should go back and find it. I remember posting a, like, like a like not really a poem, but just like a written thing like where I just needed to like process and get my thoughts out about what it's like to be a gestational carrier on the side of miscarriage, like what that's like. Because I never had a miscarriage um with yeah with any of my um pregnancies. And so this was my like first experience of like feeling like, OK,
00:21:02
Speaker
I know that this wasn't me. I know that like, I know that there's little, like we just said, like there's, you know, this isn't an outcome I can direct. There's many factors. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And like they had done everything that they were supposed to do. know, they had tested the embryos. They had, like we had done all, we had checked all the boxes. And so to come to this result was just like,
00:21:24
Speaker
It just felt so unfair, right? like It's like, you know, for them to have that joy of, you know, first heartbeat confirmation and have these like beautiful pictures taken. Now I look back and think like, and, you know, they have these memories of that joyful moment yeah and they have a baby who was known and loved and was named that they don't they didn't get to bring home. right um And that's just super hard to do. But like I think even now, like i look back and i you you know all of my friends that have ever gone through this process um and had miscarriages or infant loss, I remember their babies and I remember their babies' names. And I think like to just be somebody who can...
00:22:08
Speaker
Like, I remember your baby. yeah Like, they are not forgotten. um And to be able to be part of that um is is a gift. To be invited into anyone's story in any way is a gift.
00:22:19
Speaker
um So, yeah, I think my my experience from loss in that way just you you know it it is unique. It's hard. um ah you know For a while, we weren't sure if they were going to create more embryos and yeah go through this process again. It was you know still very up in the air. and you know This was just felt like another hit for them because they had gone through, I think this was at this point, their eighth transfer it, then Brea or whatever. It was just like just so much loss. And so not wanting, I really did not want to make it about me. I think that that was um super clear in the process. Like you guys take whatever time you need, you process it how you need to process. And if you never need to see, want to see me again, i understand. Like I completely understand.
00:23:05
Speaker
um And thankfully, that's not how it went. Right. Right. Yeah. So it's it's definitely a challenge. I think like having a community, you know i think how do people do this journey independently when you don't have a community of other surrogates and carriers and people that have gone through hard stuff, too? Like I think like the community that egg donor and surrogate solutions offers for IPs and for surrogates to be able to just like.
00:23:25
Speaker
process that grief and to share that story and to share the joys, you know, sure. is that Joy um shared is joy multiplied and grief shared is divided. And I think that, you know, when you are doing this in community, it, it just is a way to lift each other up and and to navigate because everybody experiences hard in some way, shape. Yeah. And so um community is so important.
00:23:46
Speaker
Oh no, I couldn't agree more. and I think it's beautiful. I mean, you keep saying, you know, you were like, I don't want this, I don't want it to be about me. I don't want it to be about me. And you're so right in that ultimately at the end of the day, this is a selfless act of, you know, of of doing something like this.
00:24:00
Speaker
But exactly to your point, You had never experienced miscarriage before. And so, mean, it's not like you're going to go and talk to your intended mom about it. You're going to go and talk to somebody else about it. I had to talk to my husband. I had to talk to my friends.
00:24:13
Speaker
um remember being at some you know going in for our DNC and um you know you just feel so numb. And and like the whole process, you're just like, i you know... Is there anything I could have done differently? One of the things that was really important to me was after the procedure, i was i the nurse came in to check on me and I was like, I have a really
Delivery and Post-Delivery Reflections
00:24:31
Speaker
weird request. i Can I, like can do like, do you still have him? Can I just hold him in his little jar that he was wrapped up in or whatever? Can I just pray over him?
00:24:43
Speaker
Like, because they still wanted to send the tissue off for testing to see like, is there something that they missed, right? Like, it's like, we're all just trying to figure out what went Which common in this type of process for sure. Absolutely. And so I was just like, just remember like my husband and I sitting there and just like,
00:24:59
Speaker
like literally I'm still in the gurney and like just praying over this little boy and just like, please give his parents answers. Like like like praying for the testing facility, praying for the doctors, nurses, just like that, like God, like please,
00:25:14
Speaker
if if there is something to be known here, please let it be revealed. Because I can't imagine going through this over and over again with no answers. And that's so many of our IP stories. yeah right like They don't know what's causing it. And so um it was just special to be able to do that and like to have those memories And I hope that our IPs know that like as surrogates, like that's our heart. like we like We want this so much for them. and to And to be able to just be in their corner and like to be sending up prayers and well wishes and all of this, like that's it's a it is a honor to get to do that for them and with them. so
00:25:54
Speaker
That's beautiful that you were able to have
00:25:59
Speaker
almost a sense of closure yeah to that of the story. It's a little strange, all right? little A little bit odd, but also like that's what like I needed. like I needed to be able to this to not feel like you just went in and went out, right? Well, yeah. Like you said, it was it was it it it it's very easy for something like that to be so um so clinical.
00:26:17
Speaker
yeah And it needs to be in some way. Like it is it very much like it very much is. It needs to be. And also to be able to exactly like you said, hold space and be able to, you know, in your own way. We're honoring Hudson. Hudson had a name. Yeah. Hudson had a name. And so, we you know, you you were able to have that sense of closure. And I think especially, you know, like you said, this was your first experience with a miscarriage. ah Prior to that, all of your pregnancies had been.
00:26:43
Speaker
you know, like you, that was kind of your first moment of like, my body didn't do the thing that I was expecting it to do. Right. And that can be, that's its own level of hard. Yeah. um And feeling like, you know, there's no guarantee, even if you have your own, you know, children, there's no guarantee that you're going to be a successful surrogate. yeah So, you know, you're by doing this, you're opening yourself up to the potential that you're going to, you know, this this journey that you is very idyllic and you think is going to be, um you know, just this wonderful, happy ending story may not be.
00:27:14
Speaker
You know, there's you know, you might be inviting a level of heart into your own story that you're not prepared for. And so. um But to your point, when you have that community. Yes.
00:27:25
Speaker
And when you, you know, you you go in knowing that. You just have a healthy perspective on it. Like, you know, again, if you're if you're approaching, like, you know, people, there's like criticisms around surrogacy of like, oh, it's just, you know, it's very transactional. You're doing, you know, this whole concept of you're buying a baby or you're like, you're going to say like,
00:27:42
Speaker
like Or as a surrogate, you're only doing this for the money. money right. Like, that's not, like, at all what it is. yeah Like, it is, there's, like, if you're going into it for that, you will not. Be successful. You're not going to be successful because, like, you're just, your perspective is just so, like, that I can't imagine.
00:27:58
Speaker
I've never talked to anybody whose perspective was that. Like, because it's. you're on this journey with this family yeah to achieve this goal, right? And that and in having a heart posture of service.
00:28:12
Speaker
um And like I'm trying to do something to like help you experience something that has brought so much joy to my life. and That's what i what I wanted for them. Yeah, yeah.
00:28:23
Speaker
And ultimately, you guys were able to, they did choose to create more embryos. they created How was going into, because I feel like with the with a first transfer, right, it's very rose-colored glasses yeah and sunshine and, you know, pineapples everywhere and, you know, all of that.
00:28:42
Speaker
And then now it's, okay, we're going into this and... There's the reality that we've experienced a heart, right? we Yeah. Yeah, um so they did decide to create more embryos.
00:28:55
Speaker
um You know, I think that it... It just, it makes it more, you know, it's it's definitely more challenging. You know, it gives me such a greater perspective for my friends who like when they have found out after a miscarriage that they're pregnant again, like just the like complexity and the nuance of joy and hope.
00:29:17
Speaker
um Hope is always the harder choice, right? Like hope is the harder thing to do. and so um it it It personally is so inspiring to see people when they can continue to hope and continue to move forward. That's like the biggest just show of strength and courage and bravery in the face of loss after loss after loss. Yeah.
00:29:41
Speaker
um So it was just, I've felt so inspired by our IPs and just hearing stories of people that are going through this and they don't give up. and um And to go through the process of just trying to seek peace and find peace with their their decisions is as is just really inspiring.
00:30:01
Speaker
um We ended up, they created three new embryos um uniquely to this one. We did not test these embryos. okay So it was actually kind of a fun part of that is we didn't know what we were having. that was really fun.
00:30:14
Speaker
So like they got to do like a gender reveal that my family went to. And, um, you know that Once we got to experience some of the milestones that were part of a more typical pregnancy journey, right? So that was really fun. And um you know they had fully planned on having a boy because their embryo was a boy. So they were like, let's do this. So when we found out um they were having a girl, like it was just fun to get to do the girly things. And I didn't find out what i was having with my kids. So like this was a really fun experience for me to get to you know be part of that with them. Yeah.
00:30:50
Speaker
be like the one who like ordered the like whatever the confetti can is and stuff like that. So it was such joy to get to do that. and And because they were local, like we got to be part of a lot of that journey, like going to see how they decorated the nursery. oh I love it. Really fun things. yeah it was It was really exciting.
00:31:09
Speaker
How did you because I mean, you had gotten to a heartbeat confirmation and it wasn't until that first OB appointment that we found out, ah you know, about the first transfer. How was that first OB appointment with?
00:31:22
Speaker
Yes. Yes. So um I remember Lisa saying just like. it was very surreal being in the same like it same office, right? Sure.
00:31:33
Speaker
of Going there and being like, okay, what's going to happen here? And um and think, you know, at this time, I feel like i was like, no, this one's going to be fine. like i just I didn't know, because you didn't know the first time, but like I feel like I knew that it was going to be okay. There was just something. It's just like, this is going to be fine. And so just having that, like,
00:31:52
Speaker
Okay, like they got to like just breathe a little bit more after that. Now, uniquely about our story, and ah this are ah right after that heartbeat confirmation appointment at nine to 11 weeks or so, um we had COVID lockdown.
00:32:11
Speaker
So from that point on, I was pretty much solo in terms of appointments and things like that, which was so much more challenging yeah because like I wanted to share this journey with them. They're local. That was one of the benefits of being being local. Absolutely. is is We get to do this together and we didn't get to. So I talk about another like layer of hard and complexity of like, okay, this is not turning out to the idyllic journey that envisioned in my dreams.
00:32:38
Speaker
Sure. We found rays around that. like There was a local 40 ultrasound clinic. So we got to go do a couple times to just get to like help invite them into this experience because like dad had never been able to do any of this with us too. so like that was good. I remember, like and I would hear stories of like,
00:32:57
Speaker
I've seen the, um, sonographers, like, offering to, like, sneak the parents in, and stuff like that, and we didn't do that. But, um, I'm very thankful that I had a set of IPs that were really chill about that and about this process. Like, I know that it wasn't ideal for them either.
00:33:12
Speaker
um But they were so, like, go with the flow and just, like, it is what it is. We made arrangements so that way um there wasn't going to be any issues about having them in the hospital for delivery. Like, were just, like, we had, like, we felt okay about that process. But it definitely made the, like, journey you know, a lot stranger. Now, granted, I was not exposed to anything because I was stuck at home.
00:33:35
Speaker
There you go. There we go. Like, we made, it's just all right, like, I'm going to be as healthy as I possibly There you go. Yeah. But that was, you know, and just another layer of like, hey, this isn't always going to be exactly what you expect it to be. So. For sure. for sure. We're going hope and pray nobody has to go through a pandemic again. No more pandemics.
00:33:52
Speaker
Please. Thank you. Yes. But yeah, I mean, no one had ever done that before, right? Oh gosh, yeah. And like, you know what to expect. And like, you know, having to, you know, yes, now we have this healthy baby that's growing and doing all these, you know, you know, great hitting all the the milestones that you're expecting in a typical pregnancy. But like they didn't get to be part of that. And like so it just changed how we communicated about it. You know, they got to um they FaceTimed in for the transfer for that one, because, again, we were just in like the middle of this like complicated story. And, yeah that you know, I think that.
00:34:23
Speaker
I am very grateful that most, you know, by the time that we were hitting those stages, a lot of these clinics and hospitals were figuring out how to make this work for families. But it we didn't know right at the, you know, on onset. No, that of course not. Of course not. Oh, my gosh. What an added layer of fun. So that's what we'll call COVID. Yeah, an added layer of fun. Yeah, i I also was carrying during COVID. And yeah, it was, I mean, like, all right, like, here we go.
00:34:49
Speaker
Let's do it. Yeah, exactly. Yes. The FaceTime button and learning Zoom and all of the things. Yes. And like knowing like, okay, and having to add conversation every time that you're going to appointment that like you're meeting a new you know practitioner in some way, like hey, this is not my baby. Like, I want mom and dad to get to be, like, how can we involve them in the process? They were so accommodating where they could be. No, I love that. I love that. That's amazing.
00:35:12
Speaker
So going, you had an amazing delivery and that everything was beautiful. Yes. How, and then so much so that you were like,
00:35:23
Speaker
I'm going to do this again. Let's go again. Let's do this again. Why not? But these were not friends of a friend. You went through the kind of, i guess, for, you know, quotes, typical matching process. Yes. So, yeah. That was new to me, going through, like, the matching process. I tell people that it was like, it's kind of like a dating profile. I don't know. Like, we created our profile. Absolutely. um Got presented several profiles that, you know, are our matching coordinator was like, I think this is a family that you would like. give them and um But here's some others. Like we gave her our criteria, which I always, like, i'm like, how do you come up with criteria? Because every one of these families is deserving, right? Every one of them has gone through some incredible story or journey to get to this point.
00:36:04
Speaker
And so, funny, i and the reason we picked our IP, this is not the reason we picked them, like so have say this But the spark. But the spark. So my husband's name is Aaron. Our first set of IPs that we knew were Aaron and Lisa. And our second set of IPs was Aaron and Rachel. And I was like, well, we're just going to go with baby daddies named Aaron. That seems to be working for me.
00:36:29
Speaker
All of my babies have been Aaron's in the world. So that's kind of funny. But like, well, How else do you pick? like Everybody's got a compelling story, right? and Absolutely. To me, I was like, I feel like local is a good good fit for us because I i had that experience. and i would like Part of me was like, i'm going to redo the COVID experience. Yes, absolutely. Get somebody who gets to be part of all this. um But then it was just like, are we going to vibe with people and in all that? So I ended up going with the first...
00:36:57
Speaker
um couple that was actually record the one that our coordinator was recommending. ah um But yeah, the criteria for matching and figuring out like who you're gonna choose, to me it's just so hard. Like you're just gotta like pick some arbitrary reason. Oh, like they like to travel, we like to travel or like they like board games, we like board games. You're just like, I don't even know.
00:37:18
Speaker
And then um thankfully we hit it off on our matching call and that was just, um that was a fun gift to be able to go through that process too, because I had not experienced that. Yeah, yeah. I always say guy that matching call is kind of like a, um it's a first date where you you know talk about a uterus and yes. Yeah, just like, hey, get to know us.
00:37:38
Speaker
You know, I think that, you know, getting to like review profiles and and figure out like, who do you think you'd vibe with? was just kind of, it was fun. It was a fun process. And we were excited to the timing of it worked out. We were like, we hope we get to like, it was Christmas time. We're like, for Christmas, we hope we can have somebody going into the new year yeah with this journey in mind. And so that was really Oh, love that. I love that. Yeah. No, but you are so right. There are there's so many people out there and and having criteria is, you know, it it's hard. it's What are you going to pick, right? like Yeah.
00:38:09
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So you guys did vibe well, which is so fun. did. um And it was, you know, successful transfer baby we're so excited but of course of course because storyline is perfect there's no fairy tales no there's no fairy tales so we went to our 11 no i'm sorry our 14 week appointment and they were doing um an ultrasound i don't remember why we were doing it so early um but ah the ultrasound technician
00:38:42
Speaker
who i she was like i've been doing this since i was born and basically like she's decades right yeah she noted and noticed that she suspected the baby's heart was facing the wrong direction which um is to like technically called heterotaxy so like you can have um an entire inverted um central like organs, because your body is made um from, like it's weird, the way that your your organs are made are basically all directional, like inside. You have I ever knew that. Yeah, so you have a left lung and a right lung. Oh, sure, yeah. like like But like there's actually, you have a left one. like It's not like you just have two that are identical, like it's and one is flipped.
00:39:23
Speaker
There's a sidedness to your body. Your appendix is on a specific side. you're Your kidneys are in a specific place. All that location is very determined. when you're being formed.
00:39:33
Speaker
And this ultrasound technician was able to detect with the size, like your heart at that size is the size of your thumbnail, noticed on the ultrasound that I think that that heart might be facing the wrong direction.
00:39:46
Speaker
And so she sent us off to a specialist. And you know during this time, we're like researching like what is this condition? Are there people in the world that he like Enrique Iglesias has this condition where his entire insides are flipped. love it.
00:40:00
Speaker
This is a thing that can happen. And if it happens entirely perfectly, it actually can be fine. And you can have, like, there are people that like are living and walking around today that didn't even know that they had this because they didn't they couldn't just they couldn't tell this um on ultrasounds, you know, 30 years ago. Yeah, absolutely. um So you can, if if everything thing is backwards, it's perfectly fine.
00:40:23
Speaker
If everything is not backwards, then you're basically, the easy way to say is your plumbing gets, like all of the connections that are having body are twisted and going the wrong like way. And so we were praying, Lord, if it's backwards, let everything be backwards, right? Like let i love everything be, and that's kind of a fun fact, right?
00:40:41
Speaker
um So we ended up going to a Maternal Feele Medicine Clinic, um as many sergates do anyway, um to just ah you know kind of go for a deeper diet. We had to wait for several weeks for her to get larger because you know that's a tiny little spot that you're measuring through a belly. like right um And a deeper diet.
00:40:59
Speaker
Come to find out that ah through testing and lots of lots and lots of appointments that um she had a single ventricle heart and and was did have heterotaxy. So her heart is facing the wrong way in her heart and her heartbeat is on the right side of her body. not on the like So like if she does the Pledge of Allegiance, she's got to use the other hand, I guess. um And um that the plumbing, the all of the the the vessels um that were connecting her heart were not um designed the way that you would expect in a typical baby. And so when that happens when that diagnosis happened, um that was really hard. ah the
00:41:41
Speaker
you know don't like Don't Google people. like I feel like I should look in the camera and be like, Do not Google this stuff. um I always say it, i Dr. Google. know, but we do it anyway.
00:41:52
Speaker
Oh, absolutely. Like the prognosis for what they were expecting at the time when they were doing these first rounds of testing was not good. It was really like there's a good chance that she was not going to um make it.
00:42:03
Speaker
And um like that was so hard to wrestle with as a surrogate. Like I'm being compensated for something that you know, it may not come to fruition. Like that was so hard to wrestle with. And like, here I am, like I'm doing my part of the pregnancy, which I have nothing to do with it. Like that it's for all other intents and purposes, it's a normal pregnancy. As long as she's on the inside, she's perfectly fine. Because my body is doing all the breathing and the pumping for her. Like i there's nothing about like,
00:42:37
Speaker
My pregnancy ah otherwise would have been completely normal, except that now she we need to do super routine monitoring to check and see if anything's changing with her um heart anatomy so that they can come up with a plan for how they're going to address her heart condition in the days and weeks and months and years.
00:42:59
Speaker
come after after she's born. yeah so here I am, like, I'm just here. Like, I am just, you know. I am truly, literally just showing up. I'm just showing up because like, and they're having, like, mom and dad are having these really hard conversations with,
00:43:15
Speaker
Cardio, cardio surgeons. And like, um like how. And pepping. And it's like, I remember having a conversation with Rachel and I was like, look, I want, like, we are in, we are fully in on this. We are here to support you. We are on her team.
00:43:33
Speaker
But if you need us to not be in the room for some of this, like please, like I am okay with, I don't need to be there. um So like for as much as you want us involved in this process, we're here, we're here to help, we're part of that team that's supporting you guys through this, but also, like you're having some really tough conversations with um these physicians and practitioners that you know you may not wanna have with me present and that's okay. They were so kind and gracious and they're like, no, you're part of our team. like This is like this is you know your journey just as much as it is ours, which felt silly because i was like, no it's not, I'm just here.
00:44:10
Speaker
um I felt very much like I was um part of a very private thing for them to be walking through, like um hearing like the prognosis for how do children live with this. And hers is an incredibly complex case. Like there are people, there are kids all the live long day that are walking around with, um you know, congenital heart defects that are, ah you know, you wouldn't know, right? Like right you wouldn't know. Like this is a- Look at Enrique.
00:44:38
Speaker
Enrique Iglesias, no. Like there's it's it's not it is it is, um you know, it's a very common thing that that families have to walk through.
00:44:49
Speaker
um And there's a lot of great medical teams. like I'm so thankful we are in like we are here in Dallas. There is an incredible. facility here that, you know, only I just look back i think only God like could have put us in a position where the one of the best hospitals in the nation is, you know, a 40 minute drive down the road that um are my intended mom, Rachel. she's ah She works in the medical field. So for her to like kind of be able to process all of this stuff, they have family that's here locally that lived right near the hospital they could go and stay at. like
00:45:25
Speaker
Just like I'm so thankful for, again, being where we were yeah um with the like people that she had worked with somebody whose kiddo was a heart baby. So like there's just like people coming out of the woodwork to be able to be like i like, I've gone through this or I'm here to support you. like I'm so thankful for that. um But it was really complex and really nuanced um to try to deal with that.
00:45:47
Speaker
For sure. Because that's heart is actually it's ups it's it's backwards and pointing the wrong direction. so If your heart normally goes like this, I'm just going to try to do some of the hands. Yeah, hand, fingertips are pointed down. Fingertips pointed down over like the... Over the center, like your sternum. Yeah, like where your pocket is on your shirt. Yeah, there you go. um Hers is actually facing the other way, and it's backwards. So now we're flipping our hand. Our palm is up over the center of our chest, pointing down towards the right. So hers is completely backwards, and all of the plumbing is really wacky. We're wacky,
00:46:22
Speaker
And she's got a single ventricle, which means that she's not getting, um like her oxygenated blood is also deoxygenated blood. like So it's all mixed together. And so that can affect your development, your ability to participate in athletics, your like ability to to hit your normal milestones.
00:46:41
Speaker
And this is not something that you can live with. It has to be fixed. And so we are now in this process going through um meeting with doctors to come up with what this plan is. Right. And there's there for a typical CHD baby. There's all kinds of different things that they can do um for hers. and It was going to be a three phase process where potentially she was going to have intervention within the first couple of days or weeks of life. Wow. um This is like you're not taking a baby home from the hospital for several weeks. kind of right thing, right? right um We don't know. like There's a risk that she might not come home from the hospital, right? It was really, really like scary and dire.
00:47:19
Speaker
um and then there's ah phase two and a phase three open heart surgery where like these kids go through like really, really, like serious, invasive u yeah surgery, very young, very tiny little nuggets, right?
00:47:34
Speaker
um So we're kind of expecting this whole plan of what's gonna happen to her and just doing our best to prepare. We've got great doctors, like the best, like we've got all of the like department heads that are putting their brains on this product. Oh you've got the dream team happening. she is like, this girl, she is definitely gonna keep us all on our toes, right? I love it. I love it. Well, I want to pause you just for a quick second because, you know, all of those department heads, all of those, I mean, all of that, that's not your typical appointment schedule. Right. And I couldn't go to my OB anymore, right? Like, at that point, like,
00:48:13
Speaker
was told, okay, this is what's happening with your baby, this is the doctor you're going to go see now. right And you, like, so I could not, like, you know, you think, oh, I'm just gonna go with, you know, my i mean my person or whatever. And yes, I still had a say in who what I could have gone to see, but it was like, you're choosing from these people that are now at this facility. Because you're going, like, my appointments now were at a hospital.
00:48:34
Speaker
and versus being at my just OB b clinic. yeah um I would go to my OB appointment and then we would go into an hour long echocardiogram appointment where I'm laying on the table and they're taking pictures and images of our heart. So super different than what I had expected or envisioned for this journey. And, um you know, again, I'm like, where is this beautiful thing that I like I was supposed to do?
00:48:57
Speaker
everything was just gonna be fine it's gonna be yes and no it's not it was this was another layer of really um just hard stuff to have to navigate and so well and but you're not only are you navigating that with them so you're you know it's it's it truly is kind of that situation where yes ultimately within a small scope you got to choose a practitioner but really you're you're like oh nope I'm along for the ride truly along for the ride much just along for the ride. Because again, all other intents and purposes, my pregnancy was normal. Nothing about my, like I'm just being monitored.
00:49:28
Speaker
They're just checking how I'm feeling. Like, it's like, you yourself, Claire, you were fine. I'm fine. yeah Baby girl was causing all the drama as but baby girls do, right? That's fine.
00:49:40
Speaker
Yeah. But not only are you, so not only are you going through all of that, but you also, you have your family yeah and you're juggling, hours and hours of appointments and you're still living life. Yes.
00:49:54
Speaker
And like navigating, like a people know in my circle know what I'm doing. And so like, I have people that are, you know, asking how things are going and wanting to keep updated on this. So it's just like, you know, it was definitely, it's different. And like, we talked with my, our kids about like, Hey, yeah. Cause that had her heart is, um, her heart's upside down and backwards and it's a little bit like just trying to figure out how do you talk about this super complex thing that I really don't even understand sure um with people that want updates on the story want to know how it's going and like how do I explain to my kids that like yeah you're probably like my kids in either case didn't get to come to the hospital to meet the baby right or I didn't have this like great like
00:50:34
Speaker
closure experience. Both of my journeys were C-sections, which is not what I expected because my my kids were not um did not make their debut in the world that way. And so like I just didn't have this like, okay, I feel like I'm called and I'm supposed to do this.
00:50:49
Speaker
Why is this starting out so much more challenging than I expected? um And so like it's weird because like ah you know my kids were very much, ah you know they were part of the process, but very much not. And like i don't it took us, we we were very intentional about like once the babies were both here, like making sure that they got to meet them after the fact because they didn't get to see the whole like and it thing in happening in the hospital. Right.
00:51:13
Speaker
typically would have been where you expose them to, and they get the closure of like, here's this baby that doesn't belong to us, that's gonna meet these parents, and this is how it goes. Like, we didn't get to do that. Like, mom just went away and came home and wasn't pregnant anymore, and now there's this um you know this other family that we're connected to in this strange way. So yeah um it was definitely ah just a different,
00:51:33
Speaker
was just challenging. It was just you know having to keep my own emotions in check. like There were some days where it was just really hard to to navigate like I want to do this for this family. And at the end of the day, they might not get to take home a baby that's going to outlive them. And that's so hard to, you know, to just, how do you wrestle with that? There's not there's no blueprint for that.
00:51:58
Speaker
Like talk about, and so you know, finding community. i joined like I joined groups for heart moms to like, just like, how are people processing this? yeah like And again, this was not to like make this about me in any way, but just like,
00:52:10
Speaker
I'm on this journey with this family and I'm in, like i'm I am fully in, I'm on your team. So like, what are things that we can do to help make this still special? How can we um still honor and celebrate um and and experience the joy of these moments? Well, sure. Knowing that there's like a very real obstacle that's going to happen on the other side of this when she gets here. Yeah, for sure. Well, yeah, not letting...
00:52:33
Speaker
you know what is an incredibly important and obviously a you know just huge point of the pregnancy, but not letting that overshadow, like you said, the joy of being able to still yeah celebrate what was or what is. And I think I'm so thankful r i p are just like they're just built different. like they Rachel and aaron were just like,
00:52:53
Speaker
feel like i mean nobody you know, any, everybody who walks through this has to step up to the plate in some way. I just am so thankful that they were wired the way that they are, because I think that they just, they took it all in such great stride and they had built, put such great community around themselves and were just so open. And, um, you know, they released what they had to release in, in this, um, journey to be able to allow themselves to enjoy it and um you you know they process their grief with me in certain ways and that was like you know feel very exposed and yeah and vulnerable to be able to be invited into that so it was it's just beautiful story there's like there's so much beauty in the brokenness if you can yeah look for it and you you're open to seeing it there was just a really great um a great connection i think that we built through that process and um
00:53:48
Speaker
anyway She made it. She's here. Spoiler alert. Spoiler alert. She made it. She made it. But, I mean, yes, to your point, it there is something so unique and beautiful about the... about just y'all's connection of, you know, yes, ultimately, sure, you were along for the ride, right? Like, you're just showing up. You're just bringing baby girl to her appointments, essentially, at this point. But also...
00:54:13
Speaker
you Like you said, you were you're your goal was, i'm going to I get to do this for a family. And now you're like, oh my gosh, I'm i'm doing this but not doing it. Like what's happening and like wrestling with that, but then also being there to support them in such that special way. And then them supporting you while they're also you know going through this. I mean, it's it's so much more like, it's just like nothing is surface level. It's nuanced, it's complex, it's complicated and it's good. yeah And it's good. And there's so much good that can come from it.
00:54:42
Speaker
I love, you know, I think, um you know, you've said it so many times of they had community, you had community, you had people that were surrounding, you know, all of you. You were seeking out community, whether, you know, hey, how do you guys handle, you know, a CHD baby and, you know, just all of that stuff.
00:54:59
Speaker
And I mean, I think that's something that is just so important because, again, kind of like what we said in the beginning, you're not going through this alone. No, you're not. Whether you are to a point of and of your infertility journey where you are using a surrogate or egg donor or you're just starting out, you know, I mean, you're just, you're not going through this alone. And to have that community is so important. It is. I don't see how people do it without it. I really don't. Because, like, I can't imagine.
00:55:23
Speaker
like yeah can't imagine walking through, like, even just my own heart, like, how I could navigate any of that without community. And so, i don't know. If our one takeaway from this podcast is... like find community of people like wherever, whatever story you're in, find a um And like agencies like, you know, EDSS are like, you guys make community a really big deal too. And I'm thankful for that.
00:55:47
Speaker
Thank you. Yeah, no, I mean, it is because it's so, it's it's so important. You've got to have that support system. You've just got to. So, okay. Spoiler alert. Ultimately, she made it. What was delivery day like, especially after like,
00:56:00
Speaker
all It could be this. It could be this. Yeah. Delivery day. We were not planning a C-section for her. We were like, you know, I had no reason to believe I could not have, um you know, her ah vaginally. So we ended up, you know, we went to the hospital. I'm in labor needing a little bit of help because like, you know, just whatever. and and um i What's so great, like when I say that these IPs are built different, like I'm like, hey, I'm going to the hospital. They're all right, just let us know when we should come. like They're literally like, I'm like, you guys are wild.
00:56:29
Speaker
I love it. We go to the hospital that night. I'm like, I typically have longer labors, so I'll keep you posted. But like you know they're monitor they're keeping baby girl on the monitor, and she's not doing too hot. right like And i you know we kind of expected that she wasn't going to do too great Not too hot as in like her heart's in distress. She's having D-cells and we're just like, okay, like everything good.
00:56:49
Speaker
There was a moment in the middle of the night. It was probably two in the morning, or three in the morning when like they were like, oh, this is not good. And like, there's a bunch of people rushing in and mom and dad are at home asleep. Like I'm like, guys, like.
00:57:00
Speaker
Why does everything like that happen at like two in the morning? I know, and I'm like, okay, I need, and I looked at the nurse, and i was or the doctor at the time, and I was like, here's, I am not this baby's mother, and if they need to be here, I need you to tell me, because I have to wake them up, and they are 30 minutes away.
00:57:17
Speaker
I need to know, like, you have to tell me if I need to call them in. And they were like, we're gonna give it a little bit more time, and then we're gonna see. So it's okay. They got her happy, like, I'm moving around, you know what they Sure. moving me up in all kinds of positions to get her happy.
00:57:30
Speaker
And then the next morning they come in, they like, um gosh, probably, I don't know, 9 or 10. And um they're here to kind of just see how things are going. And the doctor comes in they're like, all right, so I think at this point we are going to, you know, we're going to do a C-section and plan it before it's an emergency. Right. Like, they're like this, you know, she's not happy. We still got a long way to go because I don't dilate or have any progress until I'm. in actual labor like I'm like, I go into the hospital with all of my kids and they're like, you might be a one. I'm like, oh my God, this so terrible. So I'm like, I'm expecting a long labor and baby girl's just not going to tolerate that. yeah So they're like, we're going to take we're goingnna take you in for C-section.
00:58:08
Speaker
um My husband was my support person in the room because they knew that they were going to be taking Kazette to the NICU like this. So it's like, all right. We're getting her out and immediately going to the NICU. We're stabilizing her and she's going to mom and dad are going with her. So that was like, like relatively easy decision. And I think in my, with um Lisa and Erin with Emerson, she was at C-section as well. And it's the same thing. Like baby comes out and like they go and they take baby and and do what they need to with her.
00:58:33
Speaker
um And then that leaves my husband to attend to me. So that was a like, they everybody was on board with that's what we needed to happen. um So, cause that come, like we have, ah we know we're having a C-section. I asked the anesthesiologist to play um a song that like, as she's coming out, like it's a long song, right? So we have enough time, but um like, so she was born to a song that like we chose for her. And, um you know, I, she comes out, she's,
00:59:02
Speaker
and she's crying and... Pink and perfect! This is beautiful and she's so tiny. This is like, she's like the tiniest little baby nugget, which is expected for heart babies. They to be a little smaller. right So she comes out, these big eyes looking at us and oh I was just like, hey, can I just tell her happy birthday? So i she comes over, they put her near my head. I said, happy birthday, sweet girl. Jesus loves you, I love you. Like, go see go meet your mom and dad. I give her a kiss and they stabilize Oh, that's beautiful!
00:59:30
Speaker
send her off and to meet her parents. And they, you know, You know, praise God, she, like, her birth for all other, like, you would not have known that she needed any interventions. Like, she was just, she was an otherwise normal baby. A little tiny.
00:59:46
Speaker
Sure. um But they took her off to the NICU and were monitoring her, and she was doing great. And, like, just, like, i just, you know, everything was doing really good. um So they sewed me up. My husband's taking care of me. I'm, like, you know, the throes of, like, vomiting or whatever. I was like, sure, post C-section. And you're like, what's going on. I shook violently. like That was my thing. I'm like, why am I shaking? Make this stop.
01:00:08
Speaker
This is embarrassing. So we took us to a room for recovery, all of that. Before we left, um then in and mom and mom and dad came to visit us after you know as they had baby in the NICU. Mom and dad came back to visit us check on me, make sure I was okay a couple times.
01:00:24
Speaker
um I ended up, you know when they discharged me, I was able to go and visit the NICU. Oh, that's great. So I got to see her again after the fact. um And she stayed in the hospital for a couple weeks, I think. and they By like the grace of God, I don't know, she did not need the first stage of intervention that they expected and they had planned for her. Like her heart pressures and her function, her oxygenation.
01:00:48
Speaker
was such that they felt like she was gonna be okay, which was like, okay, that is first off wild. yeah Based on the what we were expecting and the prognosis is like, I am just, we were shocked that girlfriend like stayed in the hospital for i think like 10 days and then went home.
01:01:06
Speaker
Look at that. I know, and and thankfully now they have so many great resources and tools that they can equip parents with to be able to kind of monitor at home. So they were able to do that, plus Rachel, nurse So it's like, she got like they got of they they figured it out, right? She's got a lot that she's going on and and now that she's going to weekly appointments and all that stuff.
01:01:22
Speaker
But um again, made a little complicated because like I couldn't give my kids that closure. And like we cut like how do you expose this to very at-risk baby to like my kids with all their germs and all that stuff? Sure, sure, sure, sure. And their chaos. So like it took a while to like figure all of that out and um you know let them settle into this new crazy of like not just having a newborn, but having a newborn that has you know ah that needs you know higher medical attention than Right. A typical. Right. Like you said, weekly appointments. And it's like, yeah, yeah, it's just a lot more.
01:01:49
Speaker
um So she, um you know, very normal, like first year of life. And they so they did notice like, hey, you know, as she approached her one year old birthday that like, hey, I think now's the time that we need to go ahead and do this first stage open heart surgery.
01:02:07
Speaker
um So they did that. And it was a really that was a really rough um recovery for her. She she had a hard time with that. um Just, you know, any baby like she's small and tiny and I need anybody going under. i mean, it's open heart surgery. Like, yeah, exactly. How were you? I mean, you. OK, so.
01:02:25
Speaker
a typical journey, right? Like, like you said, you kind of get that, that closure of like, yeah I did this, there they go. This is wonderful. yeah And really it was, okay, I did this. And now there's this whole new waiting game yeah of like what, you know, what's going to happen. Right. And like being like, you know, knowing that they'd invited us to be part of their quote unquote team, like, right what does this look like for how we're supporting? So, you know, um,
01:02:50
Speaker
They had, ah towards the end of the pregnancy, had asked um if Erin and i would be Cosette's godparents. that's beautiful. We got to, like, so I'm like, we're in this. Like, this is, yeah you are fully bought it. Not that we weren't with Emerson, but like. Whole layer. they They named her Cosette Claire. Like, it was just really sweet. Oh, that's beautiful.
01:03:08
Speaker
know, nothing I'd ever expected. Like, so we got to go and and be part of her christening or baptism at their local church and just like, like being invited into their story. Like, yeah they don't, like,
01:03:19
Speaker
um they don't have a lot of like like cousins and sisters and family like immediately. So like it was like kind of cool to get to be part of that. um And you know just you know we're here for the journey. We're praying. i post a you know that She knows that I have a circle around me that's like loving and supporting them. and like yeah my mom still can't walk by like a Texas Rangers like baby outfit and not buy it for Cosette.
01:03:44
Speaker
Because she's just like... love it. My mom just was like, let's get all the cute baby things. And so my siblings, like everybody's like, we're just all you know Team Coco at this point. so it's been really... um need to still be part of that.
01:03:57
Speaker
And now it's still on the outskirts. Like it's complicated. Like I have three children that are on elementary school. We have a very full plate of life. Our life is busy. We've got something going on almost. I work on Sundays.
01:04:08
Speaker
So it's not easy for us to like get up, meet up and connect. So like that's been a challenge that I think like if if I could change anything about our our relationship with our IPs now um is like we we just don't have as much flexibility to go and connect and like ran out I mean, but that's with like any friends, right?
01:04:27
Speaker
Yeah. You know, and it's to me, I'm like, I'm sitting here. I'm like, we're local. Why don't we hang out more? But it's like, okay. My kids are almost always like someone's sick. So like, I can't, you can't be around ah complex, um, you know, uh, immunocompromised child. Right. So like that was, that's challenging. Right. Sure. Um, there's been times where like we were expecting to be able to go to her first birthday. Well, spent birthday.
01:04:50
Speaker
So Erin and I went up, but my kids didn't get to it. the family nuance of like being able to build this relationship relationship has been a little more challenging, I think. But um now that she's on the second side the the other side of her second stage open heart surgery, like we're planning to go to her birthday party in a couple weeks. And she'll turn two.
01:05:06
Speaker
And it's so great. I'm so excited like just to continue to like, show my kids and like my circle, like this she's still part of our family. like in ah In a weird, extended way, like yeah we're we're still part of the circle. like um And I think the same of Emerson. like i'm like this What's so funny, um Emerson just turned four last fall, and she's her mom was telling me that she started asking questions about, like you know do you have pictures of me and your parents?
01:05:33
Speaker
and things like that. And Lisa and Erin are very open with her and like have told her, like actually, no, you grew in Ms. Claire's belly. So Sunday, they go to our church, right? I see her at the, and this the very first time, she runs up to me and goes, Ms. Claire, and comes and like talks to me about her week. And all of a sudden, I was like, this is the first time that now Emerson knows I'm part of her story. right It's just really interesting. And like again, i've never I never intended for this journey to be like I'm coming into this so that I can, you know, someone was dependent on me for something or like and I was part of someone's story and that makes me feel special, wonderful. Like, I mean, it does, but like that was never, it was never for me.
01:06:12
Speaker
So to be able to reap the joys of being part of birthdays and baptisms and um to get to have, you know, this cute little girl who looks just like her dad run up to me on a Sunday and just tell me about her little stuffed animal and all sorts of things. What a cool thing. yeah to get And like I've never needed that.
01:06:30
Speaker
um So like again, to have these two stories that both have their own layers of hard, that it's now like, my life is forever changed because of this, and my kids' lives are forever changed. And for them, it's so normal. like The idea that mom had a baby that wasn't hers is like, they're like, okay, cool, whatever. like They don't think about it at all.
01:06:50
Speaker
No, it just is. It just what it is, and it's such joy to get to do that. Yeah. it's so funny. At the very beginning of this, you said, you know, you were sitting there and you were like, someone is craving my heart. Yeah.
01:07:01
Speaker
And then to have journeys that had their own. Like I was invited into someone else's heart. Exactly. But in that way, you know, you you have always like you said, you you wanted to support you wanted to be there. It wasn't ever about your vision. it was just.
01:07:20
Speaker
Right. Let's do this. Although I do feel like maybe need to do it again. So like I can get like, need this. I do. Has anyone out there had this idea? ah You can check the boxes so many times and then something comes up. No, it is really been. It's just a it's a joy. I know people say all the time that like it is made our life richer to be able to to serve another family in this way. And that the fact that there are two little girls that.
01:07:47
Speaker
um are living just life to the fullest and that may not have been here without my yes and without my family's yes. It's like it's a whole village that has said yes to this. Absolutely. Is is just an incredible privilege. Like I cannot believe I get to be part of this. Like that and and truly like I people ask me like they say like, oh, I could never
Reflections and Advice on Surrogacy
01:08:08
Speaker
do that. And I'm like, I really don't feel like what I did was that big of a deal. And I know that it's silly to say that, and but I really don't think like I did anything all that special.
01:08:17
Speaker
I just said yes to something that I could do that like was not. Yeah, it there's inconveniences to it. There's hard to it. But I don't I still don't think I've ever had a good reason not to.
01:08:29
Speaker
So, i don't know. It's just as weird to be like, yeah, I don't feel like it was that big of a deal. But I know it is. Like, I know it is. and No, I say that all the time. i i think back to my first journey. and i And I remember, you know, like, on the other side of it, and i you know, ah my husband was so sweet, and he had posted something about, you know, oh, my wife did this today, or, you know, whatever. And it was a it was lovely and wonderful. And then all these people were like, wow!
01:08:54
Speaker
And I just look at them, I'm like, is it wow? like it. Is it well? Like not to take away from it, but just like it just was. Yeah, it just was. I could do it. So why wouldn't I? Why wouldn't I? Yeah, yeah absolutely. Absolutely.
01:09:05
Speaker
OK, what ah maybe we've kind of already touched on this, but for anyone, you know, just what advice would you give to anyone who is either thinking about doing this or in the middle of this?
01:09:16
Speaker
If you could maybe go back and say to day one, Claire, what advice would you would you give? You know, I wouldn't change anything about like all right my story. Nothing about anything that we've walked through would would stop me from from doing it. I think that I definitely did go into it with a little bit of rose-colored glasses. Like, OK, there's going to be this like great moment where we're in the delivery room and the baby's just been born and we're all together.
01:09:42
Speaker
I did not get to see my IPs meet their baby for the first time, which was like this whole vision in my mind. Like, neither of them. I got to do that. Sure. Because we had sections, and that was just like, you know, just different. Yeah. So, like, I had this thing in my mind that has never come to be, and, like, that's okay.
01:09:58
Speaker
um So I think just, you know, anybody who's on the fence about um being a carrier, I think, like, you just... you know, make sure your heart's in the right place. Like, and I, you know, everybody who, who does this, like, all all it almost always is right. Like, but like, it's not about me. It's never been about me. It's always been about like, if like me doing this is a way to give someone the joyful experience that I get to experience right with my own kids. yeah Um,
01:10:25
Speaker
And so, i don't know, just like, you you know, be, you can't prepare yourself for this, these things. There's not really like, I can't say like be prepared. I think just like, just make sure you, you know, kind of keep your reasons in check, I guess, because like if you're doing this for, because you get to have some type of like, oh, I get to do this and it's going to be like beautiful and wonderful.
01:10:45
Speaker
Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. But um they're like, there's always an opportunity for beauty in it if you're willing to look for it. So know, perspective has a lot to do with it, I think. I love that. Remember your why.
01:10:56
Speaker
Yes, absolutely. Like at the end of the day, this wasn't about me having a straight journey. This wasn't about like that moment for me. It's never been about what is for me because none of that is guaranteed. Right. And um even all and all of it that's happened after the fact, the, you know, being part of these girls lives is it's just it's extra. Oh, it's magic. Yeah. Yeah. And they never needed it. Right. Like I never like I would have been fine with like, can I just be friends with you on Facebook? And like, can I comment on your photos? Like you don't have to tell anybody that I was your surrogate or anything. Like, I just would love to like get to like see that happen and yeah that to still continue in the form of any any type of relationship at any level has been ah just an added joy.
01:11:38
Speaker
I love that. I
Personal Fulfillment and Podcast Conclusion
01:11:40
Speaker
love that. Well, my final question to you, and it's a fun one um for anyone who knows me. They know that I have a very codependent relationship with coffee, so much so that i'm I'm really struggling right now not having one in front of me. no moment We both downed our coffees before this podcast. We did. We did real fast, real fast. So I always like to ask what filled your cup today, literally or figuratively. What's been the thing that has filled your cup?
01:12:04
Speaker
You know, i think it's, this may be odd, but I think getting to talk about the hard stuff really does fill my cup because I know that there is somebody out there in the world that is walking through a their own hard or who will walk through ah season of hard. And like, I think anytime you can share, where somebody has hope that they are not alone, that there is joy on the other side of whatever part of your journey that you're on, whatever that looks like, as complicated as it is, as much as it doesn't turn out how you expected,
01:12:34
Speaker
For people to get to hear you're not alone, that that there is there is hope, whatever that looks like. like I don't believe that there is... like And there's no guaranteed outcomes in any of this, but anytime you get to talk about...
01:12:49
Speaker
the hard things that you've walked through um or that you've been able to experience with other people, like being able to do this um has always been what kind of motivates me and keeps me passionate about talking about surrogacy is that like, this has never been about me. It's about helping other people see where maybe they can see themselves in our story. If it's like,
01:13:13
Speaker
sitting here like you and me being like, I can do that. Like, great, like go and do that thing. If it's like, you know what, I had a really tough pregnancy and wrestled with you know miscarriage, like how do you do that as a surrogate? Or like wrestled with like having a a baby with you know challenges that and like navigating those emotions.
01:13:31
Speaker
There are people that have walked through that. And so like being sharing your story is so important because you never know who's who needs that hope in that moment. Absolutely, absolutely. Thank you, Claire. This really has been so awesome.
01:13:44
Speaker
so joyful. I love it so much. It's so fun. Well, thank you. Thank you so much for joining us on this episode of Me, You, and Who. We appreciate your time and hope you enjoyed our discussion today.
01:13:58
Speaker
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01:14:12
Speaker
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01:14:28
Speaker
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01:14:42
Speaker
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01:14:59
Speaker
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