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Packers Off Season Off Topic: A Liberal Take on Firearms
33 Plays29 days ago
Delve into the world of firearm ownership with a liberal gun club member. Uncover truths and debunk myths in this thought-provoking offseason interview!
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Transcript
Introduction and Audio Issues
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello, hello, hello, and welcome to another episode of OAP. I am Iowa Joe. Going to continue our off season off topic, off season off topic episodes with a subject that is kind of close to me. I've grown up in the culture and all that stuff. And I kind of wanted to bring this out to people. You are, unfortunately you are massively distorted.
00:00:33
Speaker
The audio. but How about now?
00:00:39
Speaker
so Let's try it again. i just turned my camera off. Okay. How about now? Can you hear me find everything? It's still really broken up.
00:00:59
Speaker
Nope.
00:01:05
Speaker
i shit how about now uh keep talking is this this all right that's better better no worries yeah that's better okay let's try that one again take two all right hello hello hello and welcome to another episode of oh i am iowa joe we are doing another installment of our off-season off-topic episodes We're going to be talking about a subject that I've grown up in the culture.
Introducing Dana and Gun Culture Misconceptions
00:01:40
Speaker
There are a lot of misunderstandings with the culture that I'm hoping to dispel a little bit of. So I brought on a guest from a club that I am a part of, oh which is the Liberal liberal Gun Club.
00:01:56
Speaker
Dana, thank you for joining me today.
00:02:06
Speaker
Does work better? That is much better. Okay. All right. So take three. Yes.
00:02:15
Speaker
All right. Hello, hello, hello, and welcome to another episode of OAP. I am Iowa Joe. This week we are continuing our off-season, off-topic installments with a subject about a group ah culture, ah misunderst misunderstood culture,
00:02:36
Speaker
ah something that I've grown up with most of my life, ah which is the gun culture. And I know a lot that's going to turn a lot of people off as soon as I say it, because there are a lot of misunderstandings about it.
00:02:51
Speaker
ah So I brought on somebody from a gun club that I am a part of the liberal gun club to help me try to dispel some of the things about the gun culture that really turn a lot of people off.
00:03:05
Speaker
Dana, I didn't catch your last name before I jumped on, but Dana, thank you for joining me this week. Yeah. Hi, I'm Dana. I live in Massachusetts. Um, I'm a member of both the, uh, socialist rifle association and the liberal gun club.
00:03:21
Speaker
And that's, and that's the first thing that dispels most rumors that All gun owners are conservative right-wing people.
00:03:32
Speaker
So right there, Dana's part of two different groups. Sorry if I say anything out of line. um I know you' you use your they, their... Yeah, I use they, them pronouns.
00:03:45
Speaker
Yeah, so I'm not used to it. I'm an Iowa guy growing up in the middle of a cornfield. you know i don't meet a lot of the out other pronouns, so forgive me if I make a mistake on that one.
00:03:58
Speaker
Okay. Um, but you know, that, that just goes to show that there's everybody in the go gun culture. So Dana, let's start out with how did you get into gun culture?
00:04:13
Speaker
So I grew up, um, in a very anti-gun household.
Personal Journeys into Gun Ownership
00:04:19
Speaker
Um, I, you my first exposure to firearms was in boy Scouts. I'm trans by the way.
00:04:26
Speaker
um And, you know, so that was the first exposure to firearms and that was kind of it. um And then i got involved in sort of leftist politics and um With Trump One, yeah, so I started listening to a lot of like anarchist podcasts and socialist podcasts and things like that. And you with Trump One became kind of concerned and and ah was feeling that um knowing how to use a firearm or a collection of firearms
00:05:02
Speaker
being reasonably skilled in them might become a relevant skill and the not too distant future. um So I went ahead and got my license with no particular plans to acquire firearms and then kind of fell down the rabbit hole.
00:05:20
Speaker
And so i was i was I was anti-gun for a very long time, you know saying ah take all the guns away from everybody. and in in theory that works but then it's like uh how do you enforce it you know it's kind of like you know unless you have some mechanism to magically remove all the guns simultaneously um you know someone someone's going to end up having guts You know, whether it's the cops or the fascists or the socialists or someone, someone, you know, unless you can magically beam all the guns away simultaneously, someone is going to end up with the power.
00:06:02
Speaker
Right. Right. And see, I grew up on the other end of things where I grew up in a pro-gun house, but we were also pro-democrat because ah ah my dad...
00:06:17
Speaker
since he was 18 years old has been in or he just retired from union work last year so most of your union workers are liberal Democrat leaning uh uh people and but he also grew up in a household where hunting You hunted you shot guns and all that stuff. So he grew up that way. And, you know, I got my, I first started shooting when I was like three or four years old. My dad's holding me. It's a vivid memory where my dad's holding my shoulders and I'm holding onto the little pistol. And I, and i you know, it was just a little 22 and, you know, I shot it.
00:07:02
Speaker
yeah And then I got my first gun at 10 years old because it was my dad's first gun. So he gave it to me and it was just a little single shot shotgun. But, yeah you know, I grew up.
00:07:15
Speaker
Yeah. So that that just, it went from there that I grew up in it. But and, The reason why I kind of wanted to do this episode and i kind of said it at the beginning was there's a lot of misunderstandings with it. Cause like I said, a lot of people think, well, oh, you're a gun owner. So you must be, you know, this hardcore right winger, you know, fly this flight.
00:07:39
Speaker
That's not me. I have always told people that I'm heavily left leaning, but the thing that keeps me more center is gun, uh, gun ownership.
00:07:51
Speaker
Well, you know, if you, if you go far enough left, you get your guns back. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, if you go far enough, right. You become more of a lib, you get more liberal views too. So yeah everything's a, a circle.
00:08:07
Speaker
Yeah. it's So who was it? I think it was Karl Marx said under no pretext should, uh, firearms and ammunition be surrendered.
00:08:20
Speaker
And that would that makes complete sense because that's the big thing about Nazi Germany was that the first thing that Hitler did was disarm the populace. Yes. and it made it easier for him to take control because he basically brainwashed a group and they brainwashed their group and so on and so down the line. And then they took everything away from them.
00:08:44
Speaker
So there was no way for them to protect themselves. So... The biggest thing I, one of the big misconceptions I always see is how easy it is to go in and buy a gun.
Firearm Licensing and Regulations
00:09:01
Speaker
That's the big. Yeah. yeah at least At least in Massachusetts, it is not easy at all. I mean, first of all, first of all, in Massachusetts, you have to have your license. yes And that, that is, that process is not inexpensive.
00:09:17
Speaker
um And it is not, quick yes It takes probably like minimum probably takes two months.
00:09:32
Speaker
From, you know, deciding to get your license to having it in your hand, because you have to take a class that is on the order of five hours.
00:09:47
Speaker
And what that class is about is, you know, rules and regulations. Um, let's let's start talking about how a gun works, but then there's a lot of time spent about like safe storage.
00:09:59
Speaker
and safe handling of firearms and the the rules and regulations around the use of deadly force um and sort of strategies to minimize the likelihood that you'd have to use deadly force.
00:10:15
Speaker
um And then what happens if you do end up having to use deadly force, kind of how you should handle the aftermath and the fact that, you know, even if even if you were um in the right from a criminal standpoint um you're still gonna you're still gonna go to jail you're still gonna get sued and you like you still have to defend yourself um in criminal court and then you're almost certainly going to have to defend yourself in civil court right so so you know there's a lot of time spent on that then once you get your license then you can go to to a a gun dealer and acquire fire uh but then then you have to you know you have to have your your
00:10:57
Speaker
national background check done and things like that. So it's not if you have a license, in theory, you can walk into a gun dealer and buy a gun.
00:11:09
Speaker
um But there's there's a few enough people licensed in Massachusetts that you don't just like, as far as I know, none of the people I know have just walked in and bought a gun. um You know, also because guns are expensive.
00:11:28
Speaker
yeah yeah that's the truth that it's it's a very expensive hobby uh now here in iowa it is closer to what a lot of people think where you can just go in by but there are still a lot of restrictions on it so we have to have a license kind of it's not required to have a perch be able to purchase a gun with a license anymore but you have to go in, you have to fill out the paperwork. They have to run your everything.
00:12:03
Speaker
They basically have to run your background or they don't run the background check, but they send it to the FBI that does the background check. And that can take anywhere from an hour three days.
00:12:17
Speaker
Okay. Yeah. Here in Massachusetts, every time I purchased a firearm, that background check has been 15 minutes. yeah um so so no i i know a guy that owned a gun shop for the longest time and i would sit down there with him and it would just depend on a time of day and b how many they're doing at that time but it could take up to an hour or up to three days and then after three days some other situation
00:12:50
Speaker
like if it doesn't come back in three days then you know it they deem it okay for you to buy the gun or whatever um but now if you have your your license which our license can be combined into a purchase and a carry permit okay um so if you have that It's a lot quicker. All they got, because that is your background check.
00:13:16
Speaker
Right. Okay. So here in Massachusetts, you either have a, what's called the firearms id card, which allows essentially hunting, um, the long guns and sort of the traditional, uh, bolt action, um, and break action shotgun kind of hunting guns, or you can have a license to carry.
00:13:40
Speaker
which is an unrestricted you can have pistols and semiau semi-automatic firearms and that's that's a concealed carry permit yeah uh now here they did pass a law that we are quote-unquote constitutional carry state and so you don't have to have a carry permit permit but in order to be able to purchase something, you still have to run through all the background checks and all that stuff.
00:14:08
Speaker
So I keep my carry permit up one because I do travel to Wisconsin pretty often. Yeah. And yeah super yes, yes. So that's why I keep my and what Dana means by reciprocal is Wisconsin will oh ah accept the standards and the license that I have.
00:14:33
Speaker
with Iowa to allow me to carry and have my, my gun with me when I'm in, uh, Wisconsin. Yeah. So Massachusetts doesn't, doesn't recognize anybody and no one recognizes Massachusetts.
00:14:48
Speaker
Illinois is the same way. So I try to always to avoid Illinois, um, which sucks because I'm in an area where, ah not to like pinpoint my location too much for a lot of people, but I'm in an area where i'm an hour north or not even an hour. I'm probably like 20 minutes to 30 minutes north of the Missouri border.
00:15:12
Speaker
and then i'm like an hour from the illinois border and then it's like three hours to the wisconsin border so it would be nothing for me to jump over to illinois at any time or missouri at any time just don't go to chicago yeah yeah yeah that's the truth well being a packer person it's not advice for me to go to chicago anyway yes um so but anyway back to what i was talking about i always try to keep in my carry permit up that way i can go anywhere and it's a lot of easier to go in and purchase a firearm because of that you know i can just stand up my license my permit and we can do the paperwork and that's basically my background check because when you get your permit you have to run both county state and federal backgrounds on it
00:16:06
Speaker
okay so that that's what i do and that's why i always try to keep mine up to date and everything not that i'm you know going out every other weekend knocking off banks or anything like that but um i wish i wouldn't be as broken living in iowa as i am now but no instead you live in fort leavenworth yeah oh so another thing that a lot of people like to misconstrue is throwing out ideas saying this would be just so easy to enact this law to restrict this, but allow you to keep your rights.
00:16:44
Speaker
And
Challenges of Gun Sale Regulations
00:16:45
Speaker
like you kind of mentioned earlier about ah ah just going out and taking every, you know, all the guns away and all that stuff. What people don't understand is trying to do that is almost impossible.
00:17:00
Speaker
So one of the things that I hear often is, well, no more private sales.
00:17:08
Speaker
Okay. Yeah. I don't, I have less of a problem with, I mean, that's, that's the gun show loophole.
00:17:18
Speaker
yeah Um, and I have less of a problem with that because there's no, there's no background check that happens with the private sales.
00:17:31
Speaker
Um, so, you know, demanding, demanding that all set. So, I mean, the, the way, the way you get around that though, is you say, okay, all, all transactions. Um, so, so the, the background track, the instant background track system is, is restricted to, uh, federal firearms licensees.
00:17:49
Speaker
Right. And so if you are, if you enable, you know, random the person who wants to do a firearms transaction to have access to that in some fashion,
00:18:01
Speaker
so that they can run ah a background you know a criminal background check on someone before they do the transaction um you know that that solves a lot of the um concern i guess around the private sales but i mean honestly um i i don't really have a problem with saying you know all all firearms transactions must go through ah ah a a licensed person and And in theory, I don't either, but in practice, I think that would be the hardest thing because like, let's just say hypothetical, uh, well, we'll just go with my best friend. My best friend lives in Wisconsin and you know, we're both gun owners and we loved and all that stuff.
00:18:46
Speaker
If he wanted to buy a gun from me, I would have to go to an FFL. right you'd have to do because it's across state lines right and then i would have to ship it have it shipped to an ffl up there and then we would have to go through all that issue right now based on law i can sell it to him give it to him he can drive up there and then have his ffl do the paperwork on it nobody knows i mean or how should i break this down if that happens nobody knows whether that's a
00:19:22
Speaker
That was a private sale. Oh, so got it. so So it just shows up in Wisconsin under under your friend's control. Right. so it doesn't So nobody knows how that was done. It was just it shows up.
00:19:38
Speaker
He has it. He transfers it to his name. Right. So the thing that I always say is it's so hard to keep track of who's doing a private sale, who's doing all this stuff.
00:19:51
Speaker
And one of the things that you brought up with giving people that want to do a private sale access to the mix that goes into the whole invasion of privacy thing, because then what's stopping somebody from just using that system to, okay, well, they're going to purchase this gun, you know, right i mean I'm going yeah, I'm going to tell them they're purchased this gun, but I'm just using this to run a background check.
00:20:17
Speaker
Right. Yeah. I don't, That's a good point. And I don't, you know, off the top of my head, I don't have a solution for that. Right. And that's why I always say that it's so nice to say these things and hope that they go into inaction.
00:20:33
Speaker
But that when you get down to brass tacks and trying to figure out how to enact it, It's almost impossible for them or maybe not impossible. It's, but it's in implausible.
00:20:46
Speaker
Right. And then also the the thing that goes along with having access to the mix is like the, the background check is based off of your social. Yeah. And like you have all of the the whole, um, you know, identity information that goes in.
00:21:03
Speaker
And then, so it's kind of like, you know, random person can steal your identity. Yeah. yeah so that that's why i say it's always nice to talk about how easy it would be to make private sales illegal but how are you going to stop it right yeah um another thing is ah
00:21:29
Speaker
Oh, I had a bunch of them on the top of my head, but then we had technical difficulties earlier and now they're all just kind of flew out there. But, um, another one is, uh, ah
00:21:42
Speaker
one Iowa did that it kind of bugs me a little bit is they're making the gun stores run the background checks. Or it's the constitutional carry.
00:21:55
Speaker
Now you don't have to have a permit to go in and buy anything. You can just walk into the gun store and and then that forces the gun store to run the background check. I don't like that because that puts more, again, that opens up to, like I just said, like identity theft and people just running background checks for the hell of it and stuff like that.
00:22:20
Speaker
But then it also puts more pressure onto that gun store, gun shop owner, because let's say you've got five guy, ah five people in your store wanting to buy guns. Well, now that just maybe guy person three and four don't want to sit around and wait for you to run background check on person one and two.
00:22:44
Speaker
Yeah. But I mean, that's, that's the.
00:22:49
Speaker
The, so to me that that's, that's no different than going to a small boutique shop that has a limited staff. Right. And you kind of have to wait your turn to get, you know, to talk to one of the salespeople.
00:23:07
Speaker
But now think of that interaction with that small but boutique or store and double that time because that person now has to run a background check on.
00:23:19
Speaker
You know, what you're purchasing. I mean, to me, it's, it's, it's kind of no different than like, let's say buying a car, you know, cause they're, they're gonna be like, oh, you know, let me run your license and make sure and, and, know, your insurance. And then they're gonna like, oh yeah. And here, here's all the offers of the financing and, and, you know, they're gonna try to push you to do the financing and whatever.
00:23:44
Speaker
And, you know, it's, it's, it's kind of part of the process. but i just i think that's and fine all that stuff but yeah and i think a lot of it is just because there's so many small time gun shops and i think it's meant to hurt the small time gun shops than it is the bigger department store like shops and and i would rather have the small town gun shop because like the guy that i knew you I don't think it's deliberate.
00:24:16
Speaker
I think it's just, I think it's an artifact of the way the system was created. Yeah. But I think in a way that, and I could be wrong because I don't play a lot of politics, but I think it's a way that some of these lobbyists go in there and say, well, we just want the business to come to us.
00:24:36
Speaker
That way we can make them more money. And yeah, And I think it's a way to like think do you really think that the, that there, that there is a, is there a large gun store that, that is like big enough to have the level of traffic to have, to, to have, you know, a lobbyist like that? No, is, is there a Walmart of firearms that has enough traffic?
00:25:04
Speaker
yeah that i mean there's there's there's obviously the like the industry the industry lobbyists and whatever um well like i said bass pro slash cabela's is probably big enough that they they could say that well we just you know if we can do this you know that'll draw more traffic into our stores um I would say Shields is probably getting there with a lot of the stuff that they do because they do a lot of the same things that like a gun small shop would or guns, small gun store would do.
00:25:42
Speaker
Okay. Yeah. I'm not familiar with Shields. I know, I know Bass Pro and I know, and I know the other one. uh yes uh shields is more of the midwestern one but it's starting to branch out a little bit further i think out west uh but they're kind of
Small Town Gun Shops vs. Big Retailers
00:26:04
Speaker
doing a lot of things that a lot of these small shops do where you can go in and you can trade your guns you can sell your guns you can do all that stuff so they're trying to get in or they're trying to do a lot of the business that a lot of these small town shops do
00:26:21
Speaker
Uh, so I could see them saying, you know, we want to flow that traffic to us that we're losing by these smaller shops. Um, so maybe not have so a lobbyist specifically saying, Hey, let's screw over these small town shops.
00:26:38
Speaker
But I could see them saying, Hey, we want to get more traffic into us. So if this law goes into effect, it's going to help us more than it is going to help them. Uh,
00:26:49
Speaker
oh so and my big thing is i love a small town shop because like the guy that i knew it was in a town of less than maybe 500 people but and they didn't even have like a dollar general it was just they had a small little ma and pa gas station they had a a post office and then he had a shop there because he he lives in that area And, you know, he would bend over backwards for a lot of people. You know, he took in a lot of trades. He took in a lot of consignments.
00:27:23
Speaker
ah How I got into him was I had a oh a Glock Model 30 45 ACP that I just was not happy with at all.
00:27:35
Speaker
it it I didn't like it. It it was blocky. it Basically, I'm not a Glock fan because of it. uh I I yeah me too I'm a big sick person and this is this is one of the reasons why I took it to another shop and the guy was only offering me like 200 on the gun I was like no I paid 500 for it I'm not gonna take so I took it down to him because I had heard about him and took it in there and he goes well what are you looking to do I said if we can come up with a trade let's trade it
00:28:10
Speaker
He said, all right, well, what are you looking for? And I looked at it. He had a small display case and he had a SIG SP2022 and 40 cal sitting in there. I said, would you consider this?
00:28:23
Speaker
He looked it up in his book and and the guy goes, you give me $40 and we'll call it good. Yeah. yeah And you're not going to get that at ah at a big, a big box store of guns.
00:28:35
Speaker
Right. So, and that got me hooked and I went to this guy ever since and I got him in my phone and he's kind of got out of the store front, but he still has his FFL that he said that if you find something, just let me know and we'll get it sent to me and we'll get it taken care of.
00:28:49
Speaker
So, you know, and that's what, that's why I like these small town shops a little bit more because like you said, you're not going to get that kind of service. at a big box store or at some of these bigger shops because they have to make money.
00:29:04
Speaker
Right. He wasn't in it to make a lot of money. He was in it as a hobby to help, you know, to, he was going to make some money, but it was more to help people get what they're wanting.
00:29:18
Speaker
Right. And, and I bought a lot through them and yeah so the FFL I've spent most of my time with um he is he's in the business uh to make enough money to cover basically the rent on his shop and so that he has his um license to have all the fun toys yeah pretty much and that's kind of what this guy did is he owned the shop outright he owned you know all this stuff outright so
00:29:50
Speaker
He just ran the and ran it out the shop and and he would have collections there. And a lot of times I felt sorry for him more towards the end of it because he was getting a lot more consignments than he was selling.
00:30:02
Speaker
Yeah. and So, problem yeah. But, um yeah, I did a lot of business with him and I've done a lot of collecting through him. And, you know, ah I would.
00:30:14
Speaker
And there were times that he'd say, all right, well, you don't have to give me all the money now. Just give me this much a week and we'll call it good. Oh, wow. That's so yeah. yeah Never thought about
Mental Health and Gun Violence Prevention
00:30:26
Speaker
being able to do firearms on layaway. Yeah. and And that was really good. and And so or there would be times that if I had something that I wasn't happy with, I could just go down there and say, all right, well, you know,
00:30:38
Speaker
what do you want for it and we would come up with a trade and he'd say all right well this will go in my in my display case and when i get the one that you're wanting in it's yours it go swa yeah so and that that's what i like about it and to kind of get back to the topic with it we have polarizing political ideals he's more the right wing side of it and i'm more the left wing side of things so but we were able to come together and have communication and You know, it it just, it wasn't, it's not all bitter.
00:31:14
Speaker
That's good. Yeah. and and times A lot of times when I've gone into, to, you know, unless, unless I have a recommendation from someone who I know, um I'm always very apprehensive about, against her.
00:31:29
Speaker
against her and And I imagine with with you, it's a little bit rougher yeah than it is with me. but But honestly, in my experience, you know i've i have ah you know i've I've walked into some of these places and been like, yeah, my Glock is behaving this way. like What's going on?
00:31:48
Speaker
And they're like, we'll take look at it. And that's the one thing that I miss is we don't have a lot of gunsmiths in my area, which is weird because we got a lot of you know, metal shops and stuff like that. And, you know, I, that's what I kind of liked about this, this guy in his shop that, you know, he wasn't a gunsmith per se, but he knew enough about it that he could say, okay, well, let's try this. Let's try this. And then if he just didn't know, he didn't know.
00:32:17
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. There's one, there's one gunsmith here in Massachusetts, like everybody recommends. Um, so, but he's far away.
00:32:28
Speaker
yeah And that's the problem I have is I'm far enough away from these bigger areas that it's hard for me to get to. ah Like Des Moines is ah about an hour and a half, hour, 45 minute drive. and Yeah, that's it's that's about what it is for me to, had I had to take my my one of my rifles and I had to go all the way south, basically to Rhode Island yeah to take it to someone.
00:32:54
Speaker
Yeah, and so it's just one of those things that is sometimes it goes through your mind isn't worth it. ah But, um, so another aspect of things that I, I, now this is one that when somebody asked me what I would do to and instill new gun legislation, i tell them I wouldn't so much and it put more legislation in, I would attack
00:33:27
Speaker
gun problems from a different area. And that's, I would put more money into mental health. Yes. Yeah. I mean, the, the, all of the, at least here in Massachusetts, like all of the legislation around firearms control is all about sort of limiting access to firearms with specific features.
00:33:59
Speaker
Right. Um, and it's not doing anything to address the causes of why do people want the firearms in the first place? Right.
00:34:10
Speaker
And that's why I say, you know, let's Let's take the stigma out of mental health. yeah i Here in Iowa, it's really bad because you got the farmer and the big bad farmer and, well, I'm a man, I can't cry and you know i I'm this and I can't do this. Or if you get hurt, just rub some dirt on it and stuff like that.
00:34:34
Speaker
Let's take the stigma out of mental health because when you look at a lot of the issues with these school shooters or the guys going in like like the aurora shooting where you know those types of shootings what's the big common denominator for it they went through something tragic or they went through something that destroyed their mental health they had nowhere to go with it and this was their way of handling right
00:35:09
Speaker
and if we can get people to stop stigmatizing mental health and putting stuff out there for instead of trying to take that away put more into it i think that would handle a lot of things right yeah because that would give people these outlets and that would allow these help mental health uh uh doctors and counselors and stuff like that two target some of these and not so much target but okay they always talk about red flag laws right well if i've got a guy that comes in and he's talking constantly about oh man that would feel so good to kill this person or that's an instant red flag and then that's how you can say
00:35:56
Speaker
okay maybe we need to keep an eye on this guy yeah well i mean there's also the it's it's it's that's like oh why do you want why do you want to harm this particular individual right it's because you know they were you know i was bullied in high school or whatever and this person is bullying me and you know i have i have trauma that is you know leading me to consider violence and and Yeah. So, so addressing those kinds of things, there's also the, um, the economic aspect of this that, you know, people who feel secure and happy and are not economically precarious tend not to do violence.
00:36:38
Speaker
Yeah. Not violence on anybody outside their, their circle. um i mean some of the ones that some of the people that have money are tend to be the ones that are like domestic abusers and stuff like that but they're not the ones to go out into a school and take it out on anybody else right not saying that domestic violence is right let me yeah let me go back i'm not condoning it yeah i mean the the i i think that the largest
00:37:11
Speaker
firearms related homicides are suicide and domestic partner stuff yeah usually suicide is about uh 60 percent of yearly homicide or yearly uh gun deaths yeah yeah and so but but a lot of that is you know the the well why do you why do you want to shoot your partner well because you feel uh inadequate You feel inadequate, you feel insecure, you feel like, you know, your partner is going to go see someone else because you can't provide for them.
00:37:47
Speaker
Um, and so that's, you know, that's where that economic activity comes in. Um, Yeah, so it's it's the, you know, if you feel like you have ah decent job and you're able to cover your expenses and your living situation is stable and you're not you know living someplace where you're constantly subjected to environmental degradation,
00:38:15
Speaker
then, you know, you're less likely to think of violence as a you know as a solution i mean three the reason i've gotten into into guns is because you know i'm scared yeah yeah so it's it's you know so someone who who came from a a you know liberal household uh you know no firearms are bad no one should have guns too yeah we should have guns it's because i'm scared right
00:38:48
Speaker
and you know, going through Reddit or even going through like the, the gun clubs online forum and even their, their, uh, uh, discord, you know, you'll see that occasionally where, you know, Hey, I'm new here. I'm thinking about getting a gun because, you know, I I'm worried about the current state of things or I'm, you know, I've got a or Like in your case, you know I'm trans. i you know I'm worried that some you know something's going to happen.
00:39:19
Speaker
Or you know um I'm part of the other LGBTQ plus group.
00:39:30
Speaker
Or you know currently, ICE. you know i'm i'm ah I'm an immigrant into this country. I'm a legal immigrant into this country. But I'm afraid somebody's going to grab me.
00:39:42
Speaker
Yeah. Or it's someone's going to grab me or someone's going to grab my family. So, you know, and, and to your point, you know, that that's not good for our situation because now that puts more stigma onto guns because now people are shooting at each other just because they're scared.
00:39:59
Speaker
Right. And, and, you know, to another thing, talking about the percentage of deaths and stuff like that, uh,
00:40:11
Speaker
people don't realize that gun deaths don't make up that much of yearly death total. I'm not up to date on, yeah, I'm not up to date on the numbers, but I think a couple of years ago, it was only that, well, maybe it was pre COVID.
00:40:32
Speaker
I keep forgetting that COVID was years ago. But yeah, yeah um but You know, at that time, gun deaths in the United States was only like 38,000.
00:40:45
Speaker
right now i say only only but you know 38 000 is still a lot of people but it when compared to how many people are in the united states right and and you know we are we're spending all of this this time and energy to go after you know firearms to try to limit of firearms deaths great sure if that makes sense but you know how much proportionately how much are we spending to address you know deaths from you know economic prevarity or environmental injustice or you know food deserts yeah or you know let's get into the other things motor vehicle deaths uh drug deaths legal drug deaths yeah um how many people did we lose to the to the opioid addict epidemic yeah and and that's the thing and then when you break that number down even further going back to the original point
00:41:40
Speaker
when 60% of the 38,000 is due to self-harm or domestic violence, then you got to wonder, okay, well why aren't we doing more for mental health?
00:41:54
Speaker
Or why aren't we doing more
Effectiveness of Gun Legislation
00:41:55
Speaker
to prevent this? Or why aren't we doing more? If we if we get, if we get ahead of the problem by, by emphasizing mental health, and all of the other factors, then we drive that. That there' is a significantly more effective way to address firearm shots than simply saying, oh no, you know these people can't have guns.
00:42:18
Speaker
Exactly. Or we limit this, or we limit that. well you're not The thing that I always go back to that always makes anti-gunners mad is no matter what we do to limit legal gun ownership,
00:42:33
Speaker
The people that are going to get guns, aren't going to worry about those limits. ra The ones that are you worried about getting guns, the criminals, the drug dealers, the stuff like that, aren't going to worry about limits. They're not going to worry about mad capacity. They're not going to worry about this. They're not going to worry about, you know, well, is this on the list of across state lines and, you know, buy it.
00:42:57
Speaker
Or you don't even have to do that. You just look for the guy down the street and you say, Hey, can I buy this off you and pop out a wad cash? Yeah. And that's where I say, you know, even though it in theory, it's nice to say we're going to make a private sales illegal in practice. How do you stop that guy from walking down and say, well, that gun is only worth $500. If I go in the store, well, here's a thousand dollars. If you give it to me and don't ask any questions.
00:43:25
Speaker
Right. So, you know, how do you stop that but um you know criminals aren't going to worry about what these laws are so if you're worried about stopping criminals let's look at the group that are supposed to be stopping criminals more than the group that are you're worried are going to quote unquote become criminals and that's law enforcement yes and and what percentage of those those domestic and and and you know self-inflicted gunshots are our are law enforcement.
00:44:00
Speaker
Right. and you know Or how many of those deaths from domestic violence or something like that could be prevented because law enforcement actually did their job?
00:44:13
Speaker
Yeah. I'm in favor of the existence of cops. so Right. um And I've become over the years so cynical when it comes to law enforcement that yeah ah I think part of it is because I listen to a lot of true crime podcasts.
00:44:31
Speaker
And when you sit there and listen, like I was listening to a story the other day that um cops yeah cops don't prevent crime. Right. And they don't have the duty to protect you. Nope. The Supreme courts told them that.
00:44:45
Speaker
Yep. And, but I was listening to a story the other day about a a missing indigenous girl, 15 years old and she something about She told her mom that she was going to go to the movies with some friends.
00:45:00
Speaker
The mom went out to do something. When she came back, there was a ah party going on. ah Some of these teenagers are... The girl called the mom saying something, so the mom rushed home.
00:45:12
Speaker
ah she was in The girl was in the bedroom, but these teenagers weren't letting the mom in to go into the bedroom. The mom called the cops, went outside, called the cops. When she came back...
00:45:24
Speaker
No, no. the When they came back or when she went back in the house, everybody ran and the girl and her daughter ran and the cops claimed it was just a runaway. and and And they wouldn't do anything for her. And this girl's still missing to this day.
00:45:42
Speaker
Yes. yeah So, or do you hear about them once? Go ahead. Yeah, no no argument for me about the the the missing indigenous folks and that the cops do absolutely nothing.
00:45:58
Speaker
or Another example is when you hear about, um well, this this wife was being abused all the time and finally she stood up and said no.
00:46:10
Speaker
and was filed for divorce and got a a restraining order but the cops wouldn't inform straight the restraining order yep yeah well next thing you know she's dead yeah so let's not worry about people getting the gun so much as let's start worrying about the protection of people let's start enforcing the laws that are on the book more than trying to come up with more laws that you're not going to enforce Yeah. I mean, a lot of, a lot of the firearms rulemaking is political posturing.
00:46:49
Speaker
It is very much so.
Massachusetts Gun Laws
00:46:51
Speaker
And, and like the, the, the stuff that at least here in Massachusetts, the, the rulemaking does not significantly impact the.
00:47:05
Speaker
Bethany Collins- Both ality of the fires, you know, we really have we have magazine limits we have we now have bands semi automatic rifles.
00:47:16
Speaker
Bethany Collins- You know, and And, uh, you know, and we, we have, we have, you know, say, oh, you cannot, it's a combination of semi-automatic, ah pistol gri a and, you know, a collapsible, uh, stock.
00:47:33
Speaker
made those There's some collection. I forget all the, the, the combinations of features that you're not allowed to have. It basically boils down to, you're not allowed to have an AR, a modern, a modern And what a lot of people don't realize is the AR is not that much of a dangerous gun.
00:47:48
Speaker
Well, it it It is, but it isn't. If you look at the round, it's just a more powerful 22 round. Right. Right. But it's, it's the, the, um, you know, most, most homicides are, are performed with handguns.
00:48:04
Speaker
Yep. And, you know, having, having 10 rounds versus 15 rounds versus 17 rounds is not going to effectively change the lethality of the gun.
00:48:16
Speaker
Right. You know, it's, it's, you know, you may, you may put two rounds into the person, you may put 20 rounds into the person. yeah just Or if, if my goal was only to go in and shoot two people and I shot those two people, what good was that 10 round capacity?
00:48:34
Speaker
You know, whether I had a 10 round mag or I had a 20 round mag, I still went in and got what I was going to do done. Right. Right. So it's, it's, you know, it looks, it looks good on paper, but the people that are going to do a violence.
00:48:48
Speaker
aren't going to worry about what's on that paper they're not going to worry about what's on what's on that paper and the impact is minimal right um so let's let's stop with the the doom saying and let's talk about what's fun with firearms you know people always yeah it's it's why do you like firearms because it is a skill Um, it's hard.
Guns as a Skill and Art Form
00:49:20
Speaker
it it It is, it is hard to use a firearm. Well, yes. Um, you know, I have, I have spent thousands and thousands of dollars on getting training.
00:49:32
Speaker
Yeah. I feel you. Um, you know, I have, I have gone, I've spent, I have gone through the entire rifle and pistol sequence at six hour Academy.
00:49:44
Speaker
Oh, really? Yes. That's, that's, you know, handgun 101 through 104 rifle 101 through 104. Um, uh, some defensive, uh, carbine stuff where we're operating in and around vehicles, right long, long range or medium range carbine.
00:50:05
Speaker
Um, so, and I am, i am, I don't consider myself particularly skilled with fire. Um, so it's still, it's still a challenge, but to, you know, be able to put a piece of paper out at a hundred yards and then, you know, put all of the bullets in a one inch box.
00:50:27
Speaker
Yup. Um, it's a rush. It's, it's, you know, look what I have done. You know, I, I, I spent, I spent a lot of time, um, building this, this skill.
00:50:42
Speaker
Um, I say the smell of burning gunpowder is like my drug of choice. Um, also, also it is the,
00:50:55
Speaker
it's, it's very mentally focusing. Yes. Um, you know, it's, I hate to call it Zen, but it's, it's, you know, if you're not, if you're not paying attention to everything you're doing,
00:51:11
Speaker
um you're gonna mess your shot up and not just that if you don't practice proper protocol there's no fixing some of the mistakes that can happen with that firearm yeah so you know you have to be hyper focused yeah i have i've had one nd yeah and fortunately because i was you know continuing to have the firearm pointed down range um you know, it went off in a reasonably safe direction, scared the fuck out of me.
00:51:47
Speaker
Um, and you know, I'm like, okay, I'm done for the day. Yeah. I've only had one ND in my life too. And my dad had uh, Bruger single six, which is a, uh, 22 shot, a 22 caliber six shot revolver. And it had a nine and a half inch barrel on it. Yeah.
00:52:10
Speaker
Well, it was him and my uncle's favorite road hunting gun. They would just drive down the road with it. They'd have it set in the middle between them. And then, you know, whichever. um Yeah, I know. it's nervous It's not the most legal thing in the world, but, you know, like i said, Iowa in the 70s and 80s. I was worried about it coming off.
00:52:32
Speaker
Well, hammer fired. So, you know, it's a revolver. Yeah, it goes hammer down. Yeah. Yeah. um but anyway dad had it for years and my uncle always borrowed it once in a while because you know they both loved the gun well they got it back and we had it in the house and i had it in my because i built a gun cabinet when i was in high school so um we had it in my room uh I picked it up because I was going to clean it. And you know how you always do when you first pick up a gun, you're supposed to look and check it.
00:53:05
Speaker
And I didn't. I was 15 at the time. And yeah I aimed it across the room in my room. No one was near me. Nobody was anything like that.
00:53:16
Speaker
But there was a cup on the end of my bed. and I aimed at the cup. Next thing I know, that cup wasn't there anymore. ah So yeah, i had an ND.
00:53:27
Speaker
still one of the best shots I ever made, being it was an ND. But of course, Dad and Mom were both mad, and I was kind of freaking out a little bit because wasn't expecting that. Well, my uncle returned it loaded, and we didn't know about it, and I didn't follow one of the four steps. You didn't follow proper procedure.
00:53:46
Speaker
yeah so you know ah but i'm hyper at vigilant on all those things anymore and yeah um even when i go down to a gun shop if if somebody's down there and we're looking at a gun the first thing i do is always check it oh well i i did that no it i i've heard that before and all that stuff so Yeah. the So one of the first things that they teach you when you go through through some of these classes and that, always check your firearm. Yes.
00:54:17
Speaker
Yes. um Yeah. And it's, i mean, what what they they teach you at SIG is you, you, you, yeah you know, make sure the firearm is clear then you look away and you do it again. Yep.
00:54:29
Speaker
Oh, and I'll sit there and I'll rack it a hundred different times just to make sure that, yeah you know, everything's out of it and, everything's good yeah um the revolver i'll pop it open and spin the cylinder a couple of times just to make sure i'm not seeing any you know yeah yeah it's it's you know you've you've got the you've got the paper at 100 yards you've got the steel at 200 yards you know to to or to you know you're you have a 22 pistol yeah i've i've shot a a ruger what is it mark seven
00:55:02
Speaker
they're 22 45 yeah yeah they're they're standard there's the standard ruger on and you know hit steel at 100 yards you know with a 22 pistol and just being like damn and see i never went well through little tiny bullet yeah well you have to aim you know like off the target but then you know all to consistently make make the steel go ping is an accomplishment it is and you've got to know wind direction and and uh what's the the curve of the earth and yeah all that other stuff um but see i never actually went through any like course training ah all my came train training came out of the backwoods yeah
00:55:53
Speaker
you know it would be nothing for dad to go to the store buy a box of 22s and say come on we're going to your uncle's and go shooting yeah and you know we just go down and out in the woods and you know clear out the box or two boxes or whatever and but i had i i have to admit i had some good trainers my dad was always a good shot because with him he was taught if you didn't hit your target you weren't going to eat and because like i always tell people my dad's parents were kind of up in age when they had my dad so my grandma was 38 my grandpa was 49 when they had my dad so my grandpa was born both of them were born pre-depression so they grew up in the depression where if you didn't hit your target you didn't eat
00:56:41
Speaker
right so that's what they passed on down to their kids was you my wife's my wife's um grandfather hunting for the people yeah and i am now um going to do my my hunter's education thing even though i'm mostly vegetarian um so i can go hunt with friends um just to have that experience yeah and see i have a hard time with it because i just once i see that deer or the rabbit or the squirrel like i don't want to shoot it yeah exactly that's that's the thing it's it's like i want to i want to have the i mean hunting is is part of our dna yeah as as humans know i mean we you know we we first we hunted with sticks and then we hunted with faster sticks and now we're hunting with very fast rocks um
00:57:33
Speaker
But, but the, you know, the, the process of, you know, going into the woods and tracking game and being like, I could shoot you, I could kill you, but I am choosing not to, because I, I don't feel the need.
00:57:47
Speaker
Um, you know, that's, that is an experience that, you know, i kind of feel like is, is a connection to, it's a connection to the outdoors. It's also a connection to our you know,
00:58:02
Speaker
our ancestral past um and so you know also it's just fun to be out in the woods yeah yeah and a lot of times anymore i'll just take because like i said i'm in a small town in iowa so we got woods all over the place so i'll take my dog up to you know the uh woods and just let her run and i'll just sit there and listen to everything you know you'll to hear the squirrel yelling at the dog or you know you'll hear a couple deer running off or whatever and yeah i mean i'm a i'm a trail runner and i do a lot of search and rescue work and stuff like that so and i'm you know spending a lot of time out in the woods but the it's all sort of more active yeah it's not it's not so immersive right um so like i was saying with my training it was all backwoods stuff and uh
00:58:54
Speaker
the one story and this is why i think i got into guns a lot more was because i always strive to try doing this my dad my uncle always said that their dad my grandpa i never got to meet him he died a year before i was born so um could take the 22 rifle that we have now which is a springfield bolt action 22. okay it's it's basically based off the 1903 springfield got it he could take that they would put a stick match into the fence post They would go distant back, and he could light that match every single time. find it hard to believe, but... I've got two witnesses on it.
00:59:36
Speaker
and I have two witnesses on it, so I've got to go off of that. i find i found it hard to believe that you could light the match without destroying it. that's they said that's how good he was and then another story that I heard and this was not even from um direct family this was from just like this would be my grandpa's uncle or my grandpa's um nephews I don't know why I was saying uncle's nephews that uh when they went out he was told that when they went out to do their rifle training for the military because my grandpa was in uh the United States Army Air Corps during World War II
01:00:15
Speaker
So they had to go out and do their qualifications. yeah Him and another buddy were damn i good at shooting. Well, they had the one friend that couldn't shoot to save their life to save his life.
01:00:29
Speaker
So what they did was the one friend laid on one side, the other friend laid on... or he My grandpa laid on the other side, and the one friend that couldn't shoot sat in the middle. And they were taking his exam for him. But...
01:00:41
Speaker
so ah by And then my dad said, even after grandpa stroke, that he could still go out and sit on the porch and grandma hated it, but they would have the clothes pins on the line and he was nailing all the clothes. Oh, nice.
01:00:58
Speaker
Nice. So, but like I said, he grew up in a time that if you didn't hit your target, right you didn't meet. So, you know, he had to get good at things and, and, you know, so I,
01:01:11
Speaker
hearing all those stories, it always strived for me to go out and try to do stuff like that. Like I've gotten good enough where I've been able to hit the clothespin. I've been able to hit a match. I've been able to hit a, a, ah pin a writing pin, but I've never been able to strike the match. And I know that's possible because I've seen guys doing the like, um, Oh, what's the,
01:01:36
Speaker
the fast draw guy mitsup italic oh yes i i've seen him do it and he may not be able to do it every time but i've seen him do it i believe i've seen videos of him so i i've never been able to do that but i've been able to do some of the other stuff so that was always my strive to do was i'm gonna go out i'm gonna try this because i know he could do it and i'm gonna use the same damn rifle that he used and we're just gonna do this um but That's how me and my dad would do stuff on weekends. and I could tell you, you would, it can be a bonding experience.
01:02:14
Speaker
And so it's just one of those things that that's what got me into that. And now it's become a lucrative collection with all the money that I've spent on things. nice Yeah. And I mean, it has, this has, this has led me to, you know, I got in, I, I became much more of a leftist through firearms.
Impact of Firearms on Political Beliefs
01:02:33
Speaker
Right.
01:02:35
Speaker
can you elaborate on that so yeah maybe if somebody's listening maybe that'll change their mind yeah so um you know i i listened to um margaret killjoy's uh live like the world is dying okay um you know so i was i i did a lot of so i did a lot of support for the black lives matter protests and things like that and so i was i was already hitting leftward but i was you know dsa kind of kind of person and things like that um
01:03:09
Speaker
more sort of the, I guess, political leftist. Yeah. hold As opposed to like activist leftist. And then I, you know, I was listening to Margaret Killjoy and she had the folks Miel Apparel Tactical on. They're a, they they do the Tiger Block podcast, which is a, they're based on the West Coast and it's firearms training and things like that for for people of Asian descent.
01:03:40
Speaker
So like the John Brown, uh, gun club. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and so, you know, I got my, that, that was one of the inspirations, uh, J six and was like, okay, I can see where this is going.
01:03:53
Speaker
so, so that, that's how I got my, my, my license. And then I was like looking to try to find people to learn from, um, you know, and cause, cause Most of the training around here is, is right wingers.
01:04:12
Speaker
Um, yeah, I get you on that one. Yeah. And so I, I, you know, linked up with pink pistols, um, and that was kind of the beginning. And then, and then I found my way to LGC and then socialist rifle association.
01:04:28
Speaker
And so, you know, through, through the SRA, I have definitely been exposed to a lot more leftist thought. um and you think about abolition prison abolition and the carceral state and things like um universal basic income a and and uh i've done a fair bit of reading and about the the history of the united states and the the fact that you know we are we are still a slave country essentially
01:05:03
Speaker
and colonial experiment and we're still colonizing and doing an imperialism. um
01:05:12
Speaker
And so, you know, just just from kind of being exposed to those things, i have definitely moved farther and farther left. And people thought I was super leftist.
01:05:24
Speaker
i just believe we need all know universal health care and stuff like that yeah yeah and you go even further than that yeah i'm i'm i you know i i am somewhere on the anarcho-socialist yeah spectrum where it's it's the yeah the workers should own the means of production and like you know the the the this this the town should own the power poles and the people who work on the power lines should own those power lines and you know to to that level yeah and you know i like i said i
01:06:02
Speaker
I kind of like the guy that I listened to and we I've had him on the show a couple of times, we weren't talking guns, but the Yankee Marshall, I'm a little bit more left of center. I used to be fully down the center yeah where, you know, it didn't matter political parties. As long as I agreed with your ideas, then, you know, I would vote for you or I would do this, but then kind of like with what you were saying once the whole tea party and then the Trump movement started kind of moving in,
01:06:31
Speaker
that pushed me way more to the left yeah and it wasn't so much that i would vote right on like the national scale it was more when i was in you know local uh elections but now it's straight pretty well straight down the left side of things so that's good but you need to come join us on the on the socialist side ah well we'll see about that one um so anyway back to a little bit more and we'll finish up here pretty soon because i only i told you we'd be only about an hour but we had a little bit of technical difficulties yeah and and i also i have an interview for someone um joining the sra chapter okay all right so yeah we'll finish up pretty soon but um you say you you've you've went through the training you you're collecting a lot of guns what's your what would you say is your prized possession right now
01:07:28
Speaker
uh so i have a dmr capable um air 15. but really with with the right ammo i can i can do one m moa um at 100 yards oh wow that's you know if for people who don't know that's that's pretty damn good shitting that's that's that's like that's that's a one inch that that's five uh that's five bullets in a one inch box yeah yeah um oh i was trying to think of the movie that it was shooting the uh eye out of the turkey or something like that but i i can't think of what it was but um
01:08:07
Speaker
No, see, I've been more handgun collecting more than I have rifle collecting lately. So yeah, the newest one that I bought that's kind of near and dear to me is ah my Colt Viper in 357. Yeah.
01:08:24
Speaker
ah It's an I've always been a fan of Colt because that was what dad always loved. So that's what kind of got me into it. But i am also a Sig fan that I love. i have my SP 2022 still.
01:08:37
Speaker
um i have a uh sig p226 that i converted from 40 to 357 sig oh fan oh i'm sorry my thing is is i want guns of different calibers okay and the thing about the 226 is all it takes is a different barrel and it can go back and forth so i you know, I, I had a 10 millimeters sig, but I traded that off.
01:09:10
Speaker
Um, or I sold that and that's how I got my lever action, ah Marlon 45 70. but,
01:09:22
Speaker
um but oh i've always wanted just i i don't like collecting one of the same caliber okay i want a variety of things so even though i'm a big 40 cal fan i i wanted to have just because i my thing is is if the shit actually does hit the fan you want diversity yeah yeah but at the same time it's it's the the you know you collect the most common calibers
01:09:57
Speaker
And I have some. um Yeah, thats that's why that's why I'm, i'm you know, 9mm, 5.56,.308. five five six Yeah. yeah ah I've got, or dad's got two, they're basically half and half anymore. We kind of combine our stuff.
01:10:14
Speaker
um We've got a couple of.308 rifles in there. I have a semi-auto.30-06 um and stuff like that. so Wait, you have an M1?
01:10:27
Speaker
no I do not have an M1 it's a uh Remington uh is it the 700. okay it's that it's that that platform yeah that platform where it's basically like a bar but yeah not as cool as a bar yeah yeah i I mean I have I have limited i have limited storage space right so I get you on that one. It's a good thing I don't have kids running around because I'll have like a gun sitting over here and a gun sitting over there just yeah because I run out of places.
01:11:01
Speaker
Yeah, my wife won't let me keep the guns in the house. So I have i have i have an alternate storage solution. Yeah, I feel you on that one. i My wife is one of those people that's, you know, take the guns away from everybody, including the cops.
01:11:19
Speaker
Yeah, i see, I just I can never get into that. Well, I mean, I'd take everything away from the cops. I'm not saying that end of it, but yeah I just, I couldn't take guns away from everybody because that's the one thing that has made the United States the thing it is, is because not only is distance power yeah kind of, but, um, uh, you know, other than distance from places, it's the one thing that stopped people from trying to take over the United States.
Firearms as Deterrents
01:11:49
Speaker
is because they know there are so many people here that you know when you have more guns than people i don't think so honestly yes nobody wants to get in the guerrilla battles and i think that's the big thing about it i think it's more that we're far away and it would be generally expensive It would be, but I think when you look at things like Iraq and and and Afghanistan and that, where the United States and even Russia, when they did it back in, what, the 80s, they had to fight so many guerrilla battles yeah that it wasn't worth it.
01:12:30
Speaker
And I think you would have the same situation here, is you would have to fight so many guerrilla tactics, tactic ah battles, and stuff like that, that it just it wouldn't be worth it.
01:12:42
Speaker
So that actually gets you into something that, that, um, with the proliferation of firearms and things like that, yeah that the, that, that I feel that the, you know, there's the whole, oh, two way resisting tyranny, that kind of thing. And i mean, what we have, what we've seen with all the oil wars and resource wars is that if a state level level actor, once you dead, you're dead.
01:13:13
Speaker
um you know the all the ar-15s in the world are not going to do shit against armor no it's not but what would they will do is um make people pause like like random random um non-state actors you know who want who wish to do you harm yeah um you know it will make them pause right And, you know, go go try to find a lesson ah less difficult target.
01:13:47
Speaker
And that that is part, that's the reason why I have, you know, picked up fires. Right. And that's kind of the point that I was getting at was it's not so much that they would find it difficult to take over the United States, but when you think of cost and you think of the tests you would have to put down yeah it just it doesn't make logical sense for him to have yeah for him to do it so all right well i am going to wrap this up because you got to get to your other uh interview here pretty soon but if somebody is wanting to you know more left-leaning that wants to get into this that's listening what would you tell them to do
01:14:26
Speaker
um so either either hook up with lgc or sra um sra is definitely more leftist than lgc but we're friends with lgc i mean right internally we we kind of we kind of uh you know i'm dual carded internal you know sra is like oh those liberals um but but we you know we we are happy to to um work with lgc folks and i actually got my instructor certification through lgc um so you know lg's even though liberal is in is in the is in the the name of the club um liberal in this case liberal is not a backward right all right well thank you dana for joining me so much again like she said the liberal gun club is a good place to start at least you would have people to talk to with a common uh
01:15:24
Speaker
a common thread more than going maga phil yes yeah or whatever yeah um so again thank you for joining us uh go over to the liberal gun club sign up you know talk to some people there is a discord that you can talk to there is an online forum you can you can communicate with them but you know that's a great resource for anybody who is interested or if you want reach out to me i mean you know i i can i may not know everything but i can at least lead you to places and people to talk to and go from there but
01:16:02
Speaker
find us wherever you find us on your podcasting platforms, social medias, Ohana Packers edition podcast. Um, can pitch, can I pitch, uh, um, some podcasts?
01:16:16
Speaker
Go ahead. Yeah, sure. Yeah. So, uh, cool zone media, which is where, uh, Margaret killjoy hangs out. Um, and also the channel zero network of anarchist podcasts.
01:16:28
Speaker
So, so Mark, uh, Margaret has her cool people who does cool stuff. Um, which is like radical leftist history and then live like the world is dying is her sort of, um, prepping podcast.
01:16:41
Speaker
There you go. There's another resource right there to get you into it if you're interested in it. So, Thank you for those. I'm going to end this by saying what we usually do for a normal ending.
01:16:52
Speaker
Or before I do that, we are going to get back into Packers stuff here pretty soon. I know there's been a lot of things going down. I've just been giving Mike a break because of the kids and all that stuff. So look for that.
01:17:03
Speaker
And if you want us to do any other kind of interview or anything, let me know, reach out, do whatever, but go Pack Go and Aloha. ah