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The Strength of Being Present Through Someone’s Grief
29 Plays3 days ago
In this heartfelt episode of Exhausted Sparrows Unite, I sit down with my friend Gisele White to unpack the complexities of grief and how to support someone facing the unimaginable. Grief is deeply personal and looks different for everyone, but offering support doesn’t have to be complicated or overwhelming.
This conversation is a powerful reminder that grief doesn’t come with a guidebook, and the best way to help is often through small, thoughtful gestures and simply showing up. If you’ve ever struggled to know what to do or say for someone experiencing profound loss, this episode will inspire you to act with compassion, empathy, and grace.
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Transcript
Giselle's Journey: Grief and Coping
00:00:01
Speaker
This podcast was recorded during the holiday season in centers around grief, a deeply personal and unique journey for everyone. My friend Giselle shares her experience of losing her daughter who was a super mom to two, and we discuss themes of grief and loss and coping with cancer.
00:00:16
Speaker
While her story may not marry your own, it does serve as a reminder that grief looks differently for everyone, which is well needed during her loss might not work for someone that you're supporting through theirs. The best thing you can do is have a conversation to figure out how they cope and then figure out the best way to help. This conversation touches on sensitive topics. Please listen with care.
00:00:44
Speaker
Welcome back to Exhausted Sparrows Unite, the podcast where we embrace life's messiness. We let go
Embracing Imperfection: Podcast Theme Introduction
00:00:52
Speaker
of perfection and we focus on what truly matters. In today's episode, we are going to dive deep into loss. Whether it's the loss of a loved one, a dream, a sense of normalcy, grief affects us all in different ways. And yet when someone we care about is struggling, we often don't know what to do.
Giselle's Daughter: Cancer Diagnosis and Aftermath
00:01:15
Speaker
Or worse we ask the wrong questions if any questions at all this episode I am here with my beautiful friend Giselle who lost her daughter to cancer Recently and we want to talk about breaking through the hesitation and finding the courage to simply help It's a lot Giselle. Good morning. Good morning is I've certainly been um
00:01:47
Speaker
Finding words for me sometimes is incredibly difficult and I know that feeling the void is something I've always tried to do when it gets really quiet. So let's let's talk about this.
Sparrow's Nest Charity: Mission and Impact
00:02:00
Speaker
um For those that that don't know Sparrow's Nest, the reason for this podcast really centers around the charity. Charity is here in the Hudson Valley which is located in New York and we feed families that are facing a cancer diagnosis. A few years ago, Giselle and her beautiful daughter, Sheena, children all came into her life. And um let's talk about a little bit ah about Sheena, the diagnosis. And then let's get into how in the world right do do do people help
Sheena's Diagnosis: From Initial Symptoms to Stage Four Cancer
00:02:33
Speaker
you? and Do you do that? So at the age of 39, she was having a few little symptoms that the doctor didn't think was a very big deal.
00:02:42
Speaker
Um, so she needed a colonoscopy, but it was during COVID. And again, the doctor said, it's probably internal hemorrhoids, not that big a deal. Schedule it when you can. So life, she was a social worker, mom of two very busy girls. Life is going pretty crazy. So she's forgetting about this, that, and the other thing until she gets around to it, maybe six months later.
00:03:10
Speaker
It ends up with a stage four cancer diagnosis, ah colorectal cancer. so How old was she? 39. No reason to believe it was anything more than those nagging internal hemorrhoids.
00:03:24
Speaker
So she went to the doctors, she was diagnosed. yep We came into your life, how long after that? I'm gonna guess two or three months, yeah somewhere around there. She was going to the doctor, she was she was doing her chemo
Sheena's Battle: Treatment and Life as a Single Mom
00:03:44
Speaker
radiation surgeries. Yeah, so they were yeah that she had a lot on her plate going on, the triple threat chemo that they started her with and then it was radiation and it was surgery and it was blood clots in between and hospitalizations for every fever that went over 101 which were frequent. frequent um We were running around like crazy people all the time.
00:04:11
Speaker
And she, through her diagnosis, she was working through the whole thing because, you know, she was single mom. I mean, right you know, dating had a great guy, but, you know, still still single mom and ex-husband still in the picture. But again, you know, she ah she was juggling a lot of this and you and your husband were, you know, trying to help her juggle it all. Right. Right. Because we knew going to work was important to make her feel like she was still contributing. And it gave her a reason to get up in the morning and not focus on herself so much. And that for her was very important. And then we we had this this this great news at some point, right? We were we were we were running. oh yeah We were doing a run in Clearwater and um the hurricane hit. We couldn't go to Clearwater. For those of you that are a little confused about what all this means, we here at Sparrow's Nest have a team
00:05:02
Speaker
um of people every year that go to these great destinations. They raise a pile of money, and it was something that Giselle decided she was gonna do for her daughter. She, you know, got involved in this. So we were gonna go to Clearwater, this hurricane hits, and... Right around that time, you give me what was good news. Right.
Celebration and Return: Cancer-Free to Relapse
00:05:25
Speaker
We thought she was all clear. We got the letter. No evidence of disease. And we were just saying, wow. Ecstatic. We couldn't believe with all the things that she'd gone through, stage four, oh my gosh, I think we dodged a bullet.
00:05:42
Speaker
But then by the time we did this run, we had to turn around and do the run um locally. We have a rail trail here. It's beautiful. So we're like, let's go ahead. Let's still do the run. It was raining outside. We were getting the rain from the hurricane. And you know, we were like, we're still doing it. So we did this run. But the news had changed at that time. Right. Because that week, less than two months after she'd received this amazing news, we found out the cancer was full on back.
00:06:12
Speaker
And maybe just, really I never laughed, it just maybe was undetected. Just kind of was hiding it for a minute. maybe That's what I'm thinking. It was just, it gave us a minute, and which we appreciated. But wow, that felt almost worse than the first time we heard the diagnosis. Yeah. And you know, I noticed with you everything um about you changed. And so I knew We were in a very serious yeah position. I knew because you're a lot like me, you know you were very matter of fact, you were trying to keep the emotion out of it. And you know you were saying, okay, if or when, or you know I need to get this in place in case. you know So I knew there was... some words which I try to pay attention to um that you were saying that made me say, okay, we are in a very serious situation.
Healthcare Struggles: Communication and Feeling Forgotten
00:07:14
Speaker
Yeah, it got to the point where weeks could go by and she wouldn't hear from the doctors who had promised to put together some sort of regimen that was supposed to be, hopefully was going to help, but no one was calling back. No one was calling back and she was feeling so forgotten.
00:07:34
Speaker
So abandoned. And that was a tough time. It was. Yeah, because what they should have said, the professionals at the time, was sat us down and to tell us that you know how serious this was in the way that there probably wouldn't be a treatment that was going to help for it any significant amount of time. Sure. and who Who wants to tell you that, right? It's tough. It's awful.
00:08:03
Speaker
But here's what happened when she called one of her physicians to set up an appointment. She was told by the receptionist or whoever took the call, oh, we're canceling your appointment. We don't see the need for you to come back at this point in time. Right. That was a sucker punch to the gut. And you knew and she knew you know what was going on and and and and she fought for another how many months? She fought that was oh that would have been the spring of 2023 so
00:08:46
Speaker
She died January of 2024.
Supporting Grievers: Actions Over Words
00:08:50
Speaker
So about about nine months. And during that time, you know, you're you're a great mom. First of all, you're a great mom. You're trying to help her. You're juggling the grandkids and trying to make some normalcy for them. And there's there's so much going on. But, you know, the reason I wanted to do this podcast with you is because so many of us When there is a loss, we want to help, but we don't. know And what is it that we say? And what do you want what do you want people to to to know when you when you suffer this insurmountable loss? What do you need?
00:09:33
Speaker
When you're in the middle of something like this, your brain compartmentalizes, like it puts things in boxes. Okay, so we know we need groceries because we're going to have to make dinner, and we know we get to get laundry done because the kids need clean clothes for tomorrow. And you have all these mental checklists in your head, at least I do. I have a million of them every day. And plenty of people had, during that time, would say,
00:10:01
Speaker
Call me if you need some help. I can absolutely be there. Just call me. And in all honesty, in my head, I was already saying, that's nice, but I'm not gonna call you. right And the reason I'm not gonna call you is because when things shift on a dime, because I can be having my day, having planned out the day, all the chores and the tasks, and then I get a call, mom, I've got a fever, gotta go back to the hospital,
00:10:36
Speaker
that you drop everything and you run to do, of course, to put out the biggest fire. In that moment when I still had a laundry list of things to be done, the only thing in my head is getting my daughter to the hospital to make sure she's getting treatment so she doesn't get sicker. Those other things get left because it's not important right now, but they still need to be done.
00:11:04
Speaker
So I think, right, this is like an obligatory comment that we all make, like, whatever you need, just calm. But really what you're saying, and and it's it is good for me to hear, is you know you're saying, I can't even think of what I need.
00:11:22
Speaker
And if I have to think about this, it's too late. So like, just come over, just take my grandchildren, just clean my floor, yeah just drop off groceries. yeah You can't do anything like that that is going to upset me. It can only help me. Right. And I know that I used to get really caught up in that, well, it has to be just the right meal. Well, what if I make this and they and I find out they don't like that? That would be that would be so terrible.
00:11:50
Speaker
Well, there's way more terrible thing. You know, i I when all of this happened because I was raised as a perfectionist, which is exhausting and just dumb because it's it's dumb. um Everything always had to be just right. Just right. Just right. and Good enough was never good enough. But guess what? My life now. Oh, my gosh. So many things are good enough anymore.
00:12:19
Speaker
where in the past I would have stressed and made this big fanciful meal for somebody. You know the from soup to nuts because just bringing over a lasagna would not have been enough because it wasn't an entire meal. Right.
00:12:34
Speaker
Now, if I were doing this for someone that I loved and I had a few minutes, I would wonder the grocery store, grab a grab a few different co-cuts, although for bread, some condiments, and just bring the whole thing over and throw it in their fridge. They just need something to eat. Sometimes it's that simple. Most of the time it's that simple, but we get caught up with doing it just right. Sure.
00:12:58
Speaker
And we get caught up waiting on you to give us a cue. Exactly. And you can't wait on the cue. We don't want to interrupt. Oh, what if I call and she's taking a nap? Yeah. What if I've gotten that a lot with, well, I didn't want to disturb you. I wasn't sure if i if you'd be busy. So what I say to people is,
00:13:13
Speaker
Please, just continue to call, call, call. If I can't talk, I won't pick up the phone. I'll call you back at some point. But if I can talk, I'm going to love that interruption. Because maybe I'm in the mess of a mental breakdown in my head. I'm missing my kids so much, I can't even talk.
00:13:32
Speaker
out loud to myself like I do all day and sometimes a call like that comes in it's enough to jolt me out and remember
Grieving Process: Individual Journeys and Struggles
00:13:41
Speaker
there are people around me who love me i know and I know that but sometimes you just can't get out of your own way and all you need is like a like someone to clap in front of you to snap you out of it What we realized at the charity, we we feed people that have a cancer diagnosis. We give them two meals every week. What we noticed and what I really realized early on is, oh my goodness, you know there are many cases, 85%, where they will go into remission, be cured, no sign of disease. But there is this group that does not. And what I realized really early on is,
00:14:21
Speaker
First, everybody is on you when this loss takes place. yeah And then, of course, it's human you know it's human nature. um They go back to their own lives a month later. So one of the things very early on I said to my board of directors is, hey, listen, we are not going to leave this family alone. We are gonna take another year. We're gonna make sure they're fed because I think that is something that we need to impress on others. If you have a friend, a loved one, somebody that's going through a loss, you know that first month, you're overwhelmed with love. Oh, everybody's there. But you need that more than that first month. And I try really hard. like it it It sounds impersonal.
00:15:05
Speaker
But I don't mean it to be, but for me, I'm really busy. So in my calendar, I literally will write alarms and I will make sure once a week that I'm calling this person or texting this person or because you need that for the rest of your lives. You need somebody to check in. Because your world becomes very small.
00:15:26
Speaker
All of a sudden, the social life that you had, because you were doing this, this, and that, and you had this plan and that plan, and people all around you doing things that you that you all had in common, well, that stops instantly. Of course, people's lives go on, which I completely understand, but our lives got so incredibly tiny and lonely.
00:15:51
Speaker
because people didn't know what to say. yeah And I get that. I've been in that position. I've been guilty of not showing up because I've been embarrassed about not having the right words. It is uncomfortable because we're not a society that talks about death.
00:16:06
Speaker
right and the transition and and what it does to a family. And everybody grieves differently. Everyone does it differently. Some people are in the closet. Some people want to be out there with a million people with them. And some people do just sometimes you just don't know what you need until it walks right in front of you. And sometimes all it takes is a smile from a stranger to make you fall apart in a store that you didn't expect to. But then theyre having that kindness just lift you up when you think you can't even get up to walk out of the store. And that's what we need to know, right? We don't even need words. I think we've talked about this before where, for me, I'm sorry for your loss. It's probably the worst phrase on the planet for me. That's your trigger. Sure. It is. Because especially if it's coming from someone who knows me or who knew my child, I need to hear her name.
00:17:07
Speaker
I need maybe a touch on the arm or on my hand with just a look that of course you feel bad, but it needs to be a more personal personal way of Exuding that yeah And I think we just those of us right that are on the outside looking in we we trip ourselves up, right? We make up these scenarios in our head about you know, how oh my gosh I can't say this and I can't say that and I and listen there are things Everybody's different. There are things that you are gonna say. I I said something a couple weeks ago to someone and um
00:17:50
Speaker
They did not receive it well. And you have to give yourself grace too, right? Because you're trying. You're trying. And if somebody is upset with the way that you say something, you mark it down. You put it in the back of your mind and say, well, this doesn't work for them. I'm going to come at it a different way. But come at it because they need to see and they need to feel that they are loved and that the life that they have lost mattered and it's it's also
00:18:27
Speaker
ah What I never thought about before until it happened to us was it isn't that you lose the person you love so much also. It's also that the life you thought you were going to have is gone. It completely changes, at least in and our, you know, it did for us. Um,
00:18:53
Speaker
And I had to learn that it was okay to grieve that because everything just changed so much. Well, you had and felt something in the last 40 years of your life. Your daughter has been there. She has been in it. right So, right. So you're just going along with the usual. Oh, when we retire, we'll do this and we'll do that. And, and,
00:19:24
Speaker
Sometimes you can't even explain why you feel the way you feel when you're in the middle of all that, you know, aside from me ah being mad and being sad and being frustrated and I mean, all of it. And a lot of times because you're the caregiver, right? you it's It's kind of fight or flight.
00:19:43
Speaker
So
Caregivers' Burden: Grief and Responsibilities
00:19:44
Speaker
you're just fighting, you're not dealing with your own emotions in it because you just know that you have to get your daughter through the day and you're saying, here's a we're gonna be okay. You're you know you're you're you're worried about your grandchildren, your your son, your husband. And sometimes too, after that loss hits, like the emotions that come behind that are just huge and heavy. Yeah, and they come at you when you least expect them.
00:20:12
Speaker
And I think I just, um one of our other families, she was talking to me and she said, you know, we're coming, you know, up we we passed a year of, you know, her passing and Christmas and all this. And she said, and I thought maybe the first year was going to be the hardest. And she said, I don't know why I'm so sad. And I said, Jen, every day can be hard. yeah Like I think some people think, well, if you can get through the first year, but right I mean, every day can be hard.
00:20:40
Speaker
Anything like you said, being in the middle of a grocery store and I don't know seeing an orange. Right. ah trying What you know, what tripped me off was I was trying to pick out the ah best Easter basket for my granddaughter. And I all I could think of was, well, which one would she get her?
00:21:03
Speaker
And when I saw one that I thought she'd get for her, if she were the one picking out her Easter basket, you know i all I had to do was look at it and I fell into a puddle on the floor at Adam's Fair Acre Farms. um I mean, the sobbing, the hole so the whole of it. And I was embarrassed, but I couldn't but i couldn't budge. But through the kindness of,
00:21:30
Speaker
of a worker there who saw me, who came over with a box of tissues and sat on the floor with me and really didn't say anything. this She brought me this little stuffed bunny when I spilled out what, you know, my my angst and my my sadness, it all just spilled and she came up with this little stuffed bunny to give my granddaughter and just sat with me quiet.
00:21:59
Speaker
until I could calm down. And it was incredible it what did but that did for me. I say it all the time. You know, we hear it all the time. You don't know and it's what somebody, and you don't know what somebody's walking through, right right? Right. And that's what this podcast is really all about. It is, you need to be able to show the messiness. You shouldn't be covering that up, trying to make it prettier than it is because it can be downright ugly.
00:22:28
Speaker
Yeah. And I know that, um, I was always, if I'd walked by somebody who knew me in a store or something and I, of course they say, Oh, how are you? And you know, you give out the usual, Oh, I'm all right. I'm, I'm good. When I was nothing, anything like good. And I said to myself when I says, why do I do that?
00:22:51
Speaker
Because if I say I'm fine when I'm not fine, to people who are actually asking, then they deserve to be told if I'm really not fine to give them the option if they want to you know get closer with that or not.
00:23:07
Speaker
And I think,
Genuine Support: Checking In Without Superficiality
00:23:08
Speaker
though, that's a good point that you bring up. I had someone else in here and we were talking about that. And she said, her trigger right is, how are you? yeah And the reason it is, is because she's like, that is something you just say. So do you really want to know? So that is something that I've been trying very, very hard over the past few months to when I say it,
00:23:31
Speaker
I'm really looking at you and i you know what I'm not I'm not passing you right I need to make sure I've got the time to one ask it because I need to make sure that I have the time to listen to the reply and I'm trying to be very very careful with my words and make my words count because I say it all the time. I have a shirt that says, I'm fine. It's fine. It's all fine. Like, you know, like I have that Dory, you know, i bra bang by like that thing. I've got that shirt right because same. Right. But maybe that's what we have. You know, if you don't get anything else out of the podcast, maybe it is as simple as you saying, you know, how are you? But take the five minutes. Make sure you have it. If you're going to ask, if you're going to at really understand that you need to
00:24:19
Speaker
want to know what the answer is. Yeah and we don't want to know how many times you say how are you in a day like as you're walking by someone they don't have any other choice but to say I'm fine right or you know life sucks and you're still walking even if that's what I say. So you know getting that time to really just invest five minutes in a person. Yeah. And for me, I started this thing um where I compliment five strangers a day. So in my journey, and they don't have to be strangers, they they could be people, work, whatever, but I make it a point that there's at least five people that I say, this shirt looks nice on you. You know, oh, I love your hair, whatever that may be.
00:25:00
Speaker
And I'm hoping that out of the five people I say something to every day, that if I ever run across a giselle that is in the middle of a struggle, I'm just hoping that I say something kind when they're really just fighting to have gotten up that morning. And I think if we all just did that, just said a couple sweet things to a stranger, because we're all fighting. Everybody's got something. Something.
00:25:27
Speaker
Absolutely. And it's not a contest, by the way, people who will start. Here's and another another thing that we all need to stop doing is also have someone say, oh, it's it's having a hard day today because of, you know, my car broke down in the middle of running to work and it was a really rough day. Oh, but I don't mean to say that my day is worse than yours. My days could never be worse than yours. I stop.
00:25:55
Speaker
You're having a bad day. You're having a crappy day. It's okay. I don't have the rights to every bad day on the planet because I lost my daughter. And right, there's this comparison. And it's relative to what you're going through at the time. Sure. If you needed to be at a meeting that was going to cost you a promotion and you were late because you got a flat tire. That's a bad day. Yeah, it's a real sucky day. No doubt. You know, I run across that with recipients.
00:26:23
Speaker
a lot yeah that will say, you don't need to feed me. It's only stage one. yeah And I'm like, are you kidding me? I only need surgery. I'm like, what are you doing? right Because we are taught that there's somebody that and it' there's somebody that is always going to have it worse than us. And there's somebody that's always going to have it better. yeah So just be in the moment, take five minutes to go. Today stinks.
00:26:49
Speaker
Get out of it and move on. And don't feel guilty. There are plenty of people that are going through, of course, many, many things. But you have a right to embrace your own suckiness. Absolutely. Embrace the suck. Can I say that? Am I OK? You can say that. You're absolutely fine. I can say that. Yeah, embrace it and move on. But I just think it's important.
00:27:16
Speaker
If you're listening and you've got somebody you love that is going through loss to do something, doing nothing is the worst thing you can do or asking that person.
Taking Initiative: Helping Without Being Asked
00:27:25
Speaker
What can I do for you when their plate is so full already? They don't know what they need. They don't. Or again, if you're, if you're asking, I needed this 20 minutes ago, you know, if you had just maybe walked into my house with a cup of coffee, because my, my coffee maker broke down again.
00:27:44
Speaker
And damn it. If I drink coffee, I would have given you a coffee. I would have brought you a soda pop. But that's the stuff that we need to know. So a Diet Coke always did it for me for a long time. Now I know Giselle likes Diet Coke, but he would like to bring some Sparrow's nest. But that's it, right? and and And we're not, this podcast is not to make anybody feel guilty. No, it's actually to alleviate the guilt that we feel when we feel we're not doing enough for someone. And I'm here to say every little bit helps. i mean Things that you think are so small could mean the world to me tomorrow if I'm having a day that I just can't get out of. Nothing is too small. A smile goes a long way. A hug goes a huge way.
00:28:38
Speaker
um And just, it's a way for you to to let someone know how much you really care when at that moment, maybe they need to know.
00:28:52
Speaker
you know I've been lucky enough to come home with some of these meals with a little note that says, you've got this, you are loved. That one put me on the floor, I won't lie. I was a puddle, but I was a grateful crier that day. gillle is is talking about with with our meals. you know We have um an entire community that just wants to do amazing things. So a lot of times, especially when it comes to children wanting to help us, I will have classes in here and stuff. And I'll say, listen, just write a note. Oh, that's awesome. And then we stick the notes yeah and the meals because wow, that's powerful that a stranger is saying, I don't even know you. Yeah. And I'm still behind you and I still support you. And that was for me that day, I was having a rough day that day. And when I saw that someone said that I was loved,
00:29:47
Speaker
Even though it was just this tiny a tiny little note from someone I didn't know, it soared me. it just It let me do the things I needed to do that that day. I want to thank you so much for for coming in because I know that this is hard, but this is so necessary. It
Conclusion: Showing Up in Times of Loss
00:30:08
Speaker
really is. It really is.
00:30:09
Speaker
Thanks for having me, Krista. I love you, my friends. I love you back. Thank you for listening to today's episode of Exhausted Sparrows Unite. If there's one thing to take away from this conversation, I hope it is this. Do not wait to be asked in the middle of a loss. Just show up. Be there whether it's a meal, it's a hug, or you simply just sit in silence with somebody. Your actions speak louder than... any question ever could. So if this episode resonated with you, share it with somebody that, I don't know, they might be struggling today, is always, please don't forget to subscribe. You can leave us a review. You can tell us what you want to hear about because this is all about messiness. This is about unfilterness. This is probably not your average podcast because I don't want to be average. I just i just want to be messy and I want to be honest and I want to be humble and I want to be transparent.
00:31:08
Speaker
And I want you to see that me and all the women and men that I love that come on this show, we do not have it all together. So just learn to focus on everything that truly matters. And it really is you. So until next time, let's take care of each other.