Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
ARRT NEWZZZ: M&Ms, Minnie, and Wordle
180 Plays2 years ago
We can all agree, way too much ART NEWS happened last week… So in this episode, we are bringing you MEGA ART NEWS—giving you our hot takes on three stories including, M&M’s and Mini Mouse’s new looks and the new gaming phenomenon Wordle.
For all of Artpop Talk's resources, click HERE.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Episode Overview
00:00:01
Speaker
Hello, hello, and welcome to Art Pop Talk. I'm Gianna. And I'm Bianca. This week, we've got an art news roundup for you all. That's right. There were really too many big art news stories that we wanted to talk about, so we are combining them all into one art news episode. All right, let's get into these mini wink, wink, cough, cough topics for today.
Snow Day Adventures in Boston
00:00:34
Speaker
Hello, hello, my dear. What's shaking, Bacon? Happy February. Happy freaking February. Did we make it through? I am thrilled. Honestly, I'm investing in some new extreme lotion. I got to get this static under control for my hair, but other than that, I feel like February is looking good.
00:01:01
Speaker
You got a little snow day yesterday. You went out with all the little doogies in the park. It looks so cute. Yeah. Yeah. I'm on the hunt for Liz Warren and Bailey, like constantly in the park. So yesterday, after the blizzard that we got in Boston, Andrew and I walked around the park and there was just, I mean, normally I can count on a doggy meetup somewhere in the common, but
00:01:30
Speaker
There was a big doggy meetup and they were all just running around playing in the snow and it was so cute. And I did see a golden retriever who looked like Bailey, but I don't think it was Bailey.
00:01:42
Speaker
Honestly, we were the creepers who would stand on the edge of a children's playground and just watch or something, but we just stood on the side and watched these people's dogs. We were just staring at them, but we saw this golden retriever just plop down in the snow, just sat down. From my apartment window, I can see them bounding in the snow. Just see little tufts of snow fly up. It's so cute.
00:02:11
Speaker
So, yeah, yesterday we we watched some football and we watched some some dogs in the park. Good day. Yeah, good day.
Career Transitions from Art Museums
00:02:24
Speaker
I do have some some news, I suppose, that is related to our pop talk. I no longer work at an art museum. Gianna, isn't that wild? Welcome to the other side.
00:02:38
Speaker
It's just wild to me. Happy for you. Know that I am. I mean, I do need a job. So if anyone is listening in Boston and is looking to hire, it's up. I'm here. I mean, how do you feel? Honestly, I do feel good. It is definitely
00:02:58
Speaker
You know, it's never fun, I guess, being out of a job. And really, I'm very, very lucky because I've never found myself in this position necessarily. I mean, since school, I've always been very lucky to know what's coming next, I suppose. Like, I've just never had a break.
00:03:21
Speaker
I'm looking forward, it's Monday and I don't have to check my email. I feel a little bit unnerved, I guess, in that fact. I feel the need to get on Outlook and start doing stuff. I'm making a lot of headway in terms of interviews and I'm feeling good about that. I had a lot of first rounds the past two weeks, so I'm kind of waiting to hear back from some things.
00:03:50
Speaker
You know, it'll be a little bit longer until something comes up, but I am feeling better about it. But I was talking to, really, I feel like a bunch of our friends have
00:04:03
Speaker
transitioned recently in jobs. I've been meeting people here in Boston who are kind of transitioning out of a job and into a new one that they're really passionate about. And people are kind of taking that break if they are able to. And a lot of people have been talking about taking two weeks off or having a little staycation. So, I mean, it's not my choice, I suppose, that I'm doing that. Like, it's just because I haven't found another job yet.
00:04:31
Speaker
It is interesting, I guess, just to navigate this. It is a little stressful because I feel like with other people, they do have another job lined up, you know what I mean? And they picked their start date to be two weeks out or be able to take a two week break. But I don't know, it's interesting. I don't know if I'll ever work at an art museum again, which was kind of what I was thinking about this past weekend, so.
00:04:58
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, you know what the startling thing is? Maybe this is a startling discovery for the art pop charts. But in my journey, my quest, not that people forget or I know it's hard to put things in perspective towards Bianca and I's work history because it's just like a fucking a lot. Because I keep changing jobs every five seconds. Is that I guess if you don't count, you know, 21C Museum Hotel, which isn't
00:05:28
Speaker
I don't know. That's like a gray area, I feel like, of museum-ish world. That's a unique situation. Yeah. I've only formally worked in one museum for quite a long time, but still, and it's just kind of been
00:05:49
Speaker
been a little bit downhill from there. For me, it's been more of how can I be involved in community work and spread a love and a mission and a passion for arts and be an advocate for people, but just doing that through different types of places. I'm in probably the most healthiest work environment that I've been in.
00:06:14
Speaker
a year and a half almost two years and you know it's been the farthest removed from a formal arts institution. Yeah yeah well I'm looking at some things that are creative in nature I suppose or there are other positions that are kind of related to the arts in different ways other than museum work that I've been looking at so
00:06:39
Speaker
It is really interesting, but in interviews, people are asking me about why I'm making this change on the museums. And I feel like the people interviewing me have been really receptive to that. And also shout out to every single art historian in Boston who is no longer working in art history, because I feel like I've met about five of them already. I joined Bumble BFF to start meeting people and making friends in Boston.
00:07:05
Speaker
And it's completely coincidental. We haven't talked about our education background on Bumble Chat, but when I meet up with someone, I've met a handful of people who studied art history, maybe they studied liberal arts, and now they're working in a completely different field here in Boston. And it's just been so cool and so interesting. So in that sense, I also feel excited about
00:07:33
Speaker
a different path. And also one of the hiring managers that I met with in an interview, she asked about why I was switching from kind of art history and museums and she was like, well, I studied art history and I'm working at this place whenever I was like, oh my gosh, this is just so that kind of stuff has also been, I don't know, making me feel comfort in the fact that I can still
00:07:56
Speaker
kind of cherish the parts that I do love about art history and museum work, but that doesn't mean that I have to be paid by them as my employer any longer. And I think that's just cool about what we're still doing with APT.
00:08:11
Speaker
Anyway, kind of a tangent, I know, but I just, it's so wild. Here I am, Monday morning, we're recording and nowhere to go. I know where to be. Nowhere to be, no Zoom meetings to be had. I checked my calendar last night and I was like, oh, why? I don't know, just have it. That's funny, but I can definitely relate to
00:08:40
Speaker
like the job interview process or application process when venturing outside of other like art nonprofits and other museums. Yeah. Definitely same questions like what it like you know tell us about you know everything you're showing me is kind of art related like are you ready to take the step out of that and just use that as a super unique
00:09:00
Speaker
like talking point and not have that. It's not a question that's like a gotcha question or meant to like trick me. It's that it's more like tell me about this perspective that you have that is really fascinating. Right. And really useful too. Yeah. And so I feel the same way. I feel like people have been really
00:09:19
Speaker
receptive to art outside of the art bubble, which is like, wow, it's, um, it's like, Oh, I can do other things with this. That is reassuring. This is shocking. Was that $51,000 of student debt a total waste? TBD? TBD will keep you posted.
00:09:39
Speaker
Yeah, I keep it busy. And I'm not saying that I feel like I totally have my life figured out. I feel like I have days where I'm kind of really OK with where I'm at. And then I have other days where I'm feeling a little different about it. You know what I mean? Yeah. So it's still a back and forth situation. I'm still grappling with how I'm feeling about it. But parent life is the journey of my life.
00:10:08
Speaker
There you have it. There you have it, folks. Well, keep you posted. Again, if anyone is in Boston, hit me up. If you are an art historian who's now working in marketing, let me know because I have a group that I think you'd be interested in meeting. Well, Gianna, we want to get into the topics for today. Yes, I am so excited for today's like mega art news episode. Oh, yeah.
00:10:41
Speaker
All right, everyone.
M&M's Character Redesign Debate
00:10:43
Speaker
So like we said, today's art pop dot is just a bunch of art news stories that we've wanted to cover. But they all popped up at once. So we're just running through the bulk of them today. And to start, we have well, all of them are strangely maybe cartoon animation.
00:11:09
Speaker
based. But we're gonna start with with two very specific cartoon characters. So I'm sure that you've all actually heard about this by now. But at first, I was really confused about this story. So we're just gonna walk through it all together. The M&Ms. That's right.
00:11:33
Speaker
pieces of candy have a new design that's got the whole world up in quite a tizzy. I'm going to read the statement that was published by Mars, which is like Eminem's, you know, parent kind of company. And this was published by Mars on January 20. So we're a little bit behind, but quote,
00:11:55
Speaker
At Mars, we believe that in the world we want tomorrow, society is inclusive. Not the world we want today, but the world we want tomorrow. And as one of our most iconic brands, M&Ms is announcing a new global commitment to create a world where anyone feels they belong. M&Ms has been around for more than 80 years, and this year the brand continues to evolve and reflect the more dynamic, progressive world that we live in.
00:12:25
Speaker
And as part of this evolution built on purpose, M&M's promises to use the power of fun to include everyone with a goal of increasing the sense of belonging
00:12:36
Speaker
for 10 million people around the world by 2025. The brand has also introduced the M&M's fund to track the brand's impact on our mission, which will offer resources, mentorship, opportunities, and financial support in the arts and entertainment space to help ensure people have access to experiences where everyone feels they belong.
00:13:00
Speaker
The refreshed M&M's brand will include a more modern take on the look of our beloved characters, as well as more nuanced personalities to underscore the importance of self-expression and power of community through storytelling. Fans will also notice an added emphasis on the ampersand to more prominently demonstrate how the brand aims to bring people together.
00:13:22
Speaker
Eminem's branding will also reflect an updated tone of voice that is more inclusive, welcoming and unifying, while remaining rooted in our signature jester wit and humor. Okay, so off the bat, I'm not opposed to any part of this statement here, like it seems good to me, nothing, you know, really to complain about. But when we look a little deeper, that's when I see some some
00:13:52
Speaker
issues may be arise. Now I'm going to read from a CBS article on the matter, which, you know, gives us a little bit more nuance into this redesign of the characters. So, quote, Eminem's iconic characters, six different colored lentils, each with their own personality have gotten a modern makeover for a quote
00:14:15
Speaker
more dynamic progressive world. The redesign is focused on creating a sense of belonging and community as well as spotlighting the character's personalities rather than their gender.
00:14:31
Speaker
The most notable changes include the Green M&M's redesign, which will exchange the white-heeled go-go boots she was given in 1997 for quote, cool, laid-back sneakers to reflect her effortless confidence. Mars has received criticism for the Green M&M's sexy characterization.
00:14:53
Speaker
The green M&M will also be quote, better represented to reflect confidence and empowerment as a strong female and known for much more than her boots. The green M&M and the brown M&M will have a more friendly relationship, showcasing a force supporting women. The two character dynamics will have them quote, together throwing shine and not shade, the company said.
00:15:23
Speaker
The two characters have sometimes been at odds in advertisements, but they have also been seen as friends. Or more than friends in others, like this viral tweet from 2015 showing the two MM's holding hands on a beach. And this tweet from M&M's chocolate, the caption is
00:15:44
Speaker
It's rare Miss Brown and I get to spend time together without some colorful characters barging in. It's from, supposedly, Miss Green is reading that caption. And I have the picture here and it's literally just Miss Green and Miss Brown holding their little hands on a bench in front of a body of water, like the ocean or something.
00:16:10
Speaker
It's just a while to me that this CBS article is insinuating that Miss Green and Miss Brown are more than friends. Maybe we should just, uh, Gianni, you and I should just get into some of these thoughts here. Okay, so is, is that what's happening in this photo? They're insinuating that like they're together, like they're a lesbian couple.
00:16:36
Speaker
I mean, that's what the CPS article is like. I'm like, this is the first that I'm hearing about this aspect of it. I mean, which is like, like in this viral tweet from 2015 showing the two holding hands. I have so many thoughts about this. The reason that I was confused whenever this was first announced.
00:16:59
Speaker
is because, tell me if you have the same reaction, but whenever I saw the redesign of the characters, like it was all over, you know, where social media feeds and that kind of thing, I didn't see the difference between the two. And right now, Gianna and I are looking at a picture of the old design and the new design. And the only differences are in the quote unquote,
00:17:26
Speaker
female characters and that's Miss Green has sneakers instead of boots and Miss Brown has a block heel instead of a
00:17:42
Speaker
Stiletto there are a couple other differences to in their legs. So in the new design Or I should say in the previous design, you know, she's wearing the go-go boots But she has like her skin showing like let's say like her scandalous upper thigh But here her legs are now like white almost like she's wearing like leggings and it looks like in the other
00:18:07
Speaker
Characters to like the blue M&M the peanut M&M Well, especially in the blue one like it looks like he's also like his legs are white now too and if you look at like Miss Brown the brown M&M it looks like almost Like her skin tone is a little bit too different on her arms and her legs. I
00:18:28
Speaker
I agree, Gianna, I think all of them, all of the, and this is a very, I mean, I want to say a slight change, but in terms of their kind of mission to promote inclusivity, in the old design, all of the M&M characters had white skin, basically like the skin of a white or Caucasian person. And in the new design, their skin tones are still light.
00:18:58
Speaker
but they reflect this slight hint of the color of each M&M. So Miss Brown, her skin is still very light, but it has a slight brown tint. And then for the yellow M&M,
00:19:17
Speaker
that yellow M&M skin is still very, very light, but it has a slight yellowish too. Do you see that orange, red, yellow? But they're all still light skinned.
00:19:33
Speaker
i can't believe we're talking about this honestly it's it's yeah it's funny it's uh yeah but you know it's funny with the blue well actually i take that back now that i'm looking at it their arms and legs aren't just like white there's like a blue tint to them too so yeah that's interesting right so i just kind of feel like can we just like call a spade a spade like the whole reason this is happening was because
00:20:00
Speaker
we get it like the green lady M&M is just portrayed as being like a sexy caricature and like right now it's become this whole thing and I just feel like the sexy green M&M was not the hill that I was here to die on you know what I mean like whatever like she's cute I never had a I didn't have a problem with her I'm also fine with her wearing sneakers why can't like
00:20:25
Speaker
you know they don't have to look the same every day like if they're like m&m people they can like wear different outfits all the time just like regular people just like regular people do like the blue m&m can wear go-go boots for all i care you know change it up man like let them wear whatever they want
00:20:44
Speaker
My biggest problem with this whole thing is, Jenna, you're right. Again, it only seems like the most drastic changes are coming from the two lady M&Ms. Like that's what I mean. It's just like the whole thing about it is like, I guess I appreciate. So you're not trying to sexualize two pieces of candy. Thank you for that. But in terms of their mission to promote inclusivity, all of them now have still super light skin. Like, no, they're not all
00:21:14
Speaker
Caucasian white skin, they're light green and light yellow and light red, but they are all light skinned. They also have these kind of pronouns and they're still gender- it's my understanding that they're still gendering them as quote-unquote male and female.
00:21:36
Speaker
I am also assuming that they only have two prefixes like the mister and the miss. I don't see a gender neutral prefix anywhere and they're still calling freaking M&M's male and female as if they have sex anatomy ascribed to each of them. The other thing that's killing me about this is
00:22:02
Speaker
In this statement and in the CBS article, the change from the go-go boots and the stilettos to sneakers and a block heel is this idea about
00:22:14
Speaker
power. And where is it in there? She's getting these cool laid back sneakers to reflect her effortless confidence. And then they also talk about Miss Brown's stiletto to block heel being more work appropriate. And I just feel like that is a fashion trend and not
00:22:40
Speaker
You're still dictating what is and isn't appropriate for quote unquote women to wear to work. I'm using quote unquote women as like they're freaking M&Ms. But do you know what I mean, Gianna? Do you feel the same way? Yes, I do. And again, this is the whole thing because like they do each have different personalities and the kind of
00:23:08
Speaker
minimal amount of energy that I put into paying attention to the M&M commercials and like I don't know maybe it's More fresh in my mind after the holidays like we have the M&M like holiday commercials and they are funny I think we don't pay attention to M&Ms all the time But we are aware of their signature tongue-in cheek humor and the fact that they all have different personalities and like to be honest
00:23:32
Speaker
some of their other character patrols like the peanut M&M is like portrayed to be like really, really stupid. That's the joke. Is that like he's not smart? I don't know. Maybe we can focus on that more than like if a woman wears heels or not. Like I really don't give a shit. Exactly. Exactly. I'm just hung up on and I know that they are kind of getting personality updates as well. And I'm not saying this is not
00:23:58
Speaker
important to discuss because in I think we may have brought this up before but in a lot of my gender courses or sociology courses we talked about how in animation this these like designated features of
00:24:16
Speaker
that in larger societal mindsets evoke masculine and feminine personality. So for example, Miss Green has these ultra feminine type of very sleek
00:24:32
Speaker
eyebrows and For example, the red M&M has these thicker Eyebrows, I can't tell if they oh Miss green definitely has eyelashes and I'm thinking mr. Red does not have a
00:24:48
Speaker
Well, also her lips are very different. They're very effeminate and they're glossy. Uh-huh. Miss Brown also has like some lipstick on it. Right. It's just really funny how we know how to gender things that aren't even real. Like this is something made up. This is an inanimate object that we have somehow figured out how to make masculine and feminine. Right. And I think that
00:25:15
Speaker
Looking at those attributes and analyzing those attributes are important.
00:25:20
Speaker
That's something there's an article that deals with like Princess and the Frog, for example, because whenever Prince Naveen and Princess Tiana turn into frogs, you can tell which one is which because Princess Tiana has like eyelashes. I think she's like a cylinder. And she has like a little like frog waist. Right, right. So I think it's important to look at those structures. But if M&Ms is redoing their character design to be more inclusive,
00:25:50
Speaker
I just feel like they completely went around it in this ass backwards way. You're still telling women what is and isn't appropriate by giving them a block heel or by giving them sneak. If Miss Green wanted to wear go-go boots and they don't even look like go-go, her old boots look perfectly nice. They look like a pair of boots that I would wear to work. No, I know. She can wear whatever she wants to work.
00:26:19
Speaker
Right. Don't tell me that your block heel is more appropriate. You're still telling me what to do. It's just like, Oh my God. I also do think it's funny if we look at M&M body type two or like body sheep. Of course, the yellow peanut M&M is going to be a quote like male.
00:26:41
Speaker
M&M because it's more of a husky body. It's not like a slender feminine Shape. Yeah, right. Yeah So it's also just funny that we only get one person one person Jesus Christ. What are we even talking about at this point? We only get one
00:26:59
Speaker
character that represents that color or that type of M&M. You know, we don't see any other M&Ms, so it's like only the red are like the classic quintessential M&M. Only the yellow ones are like the stupid peanut M&Ms. Only the green ones are like the girly M&Ms.
00:27:19
Speaker
I don't know. It's all very interesting. I would say in terms, too, of people who are like behind the M&M, like voice the M&M, I know there was like a statement that Morris had like made about the voices. But I believe it's Vanessa Williams, who's the actress and the, yeah, for Miss Brown, and she was the first African American Miss America.
00:27:46
Speaker
that was in like 1984 and she was an ugly Betty and she's just like a queen. So I'm interested in what she has to say too, because being in something like a beauty pageant, being like a female entertainer and like a highly intelligent like activist, like I'm very curious about like her thoughts about, oh, yeah, like take me more seriously now that my heel isn't pointy. Like what? I don't know. And her attitude to like Miss Brown's
00:28:16
Speaker
demeanor or her attitude the way her character is displayed and even in this picture like she has her arms crossed she's wearing glasses like she's smarter and more intelligent like then the rest of them and like her character trait isn't gonna change just because now she has a black heel what is this I just feel like we're totally like missing like the bigger picture like I literally like this is not the issue
00:28:44
Speaker
No one thousand percent. I just I can't believe this made such a big
00:28:49
Speaker
stink. And honestly, we're about to get into another article that's along the same lines. But I was like, I feel like I am crossing over into this like Tucker Carlson Fox News line of thinking, like we don't need to update the freaking M&Ms. But we are on completely different pages about why. Or why, correct, correct. But we can agree, I think like,
00:29:17
Speaker
I would agree with Tucker Carlson and Candace Owens that these characters don't need enough tea. I don't know if that's the problem. No, right. But we're missing the point. I agree with Candace Owens. I was not offended by the previous Minnie Mouse outfit. However, it's fine if she wants to mix it up a little bit.
00:29:42
Speaker
Right, so let's get into our next story. Minnie Mouse is getting a new look.
Minnie Mouse's Fashion Update
00:29:55
Speaker
A jumpsuit designed by Stella McCartney. Congratulations, Minnie. Happy for you. Know that I am. Get a personal design by Stella. Okay, this was announced
00:30:08
Speaker
to promote Disney's 30th anniversary of their park in Paris. And in addition to that, the bigger premiere is supposed to take place in March, coinciding with International Women's Day. Minnie is just gonna debut a jumpsuit for International Women's Day. Cool. A press statement about the project said,
00:30:35
Speaker
McCartney was chosen to create the look because of quote, her legacy of female leadership, as well as her commitment to sustainability.
00:30:46
Speaker
Yeah. What? Minnie has always had a special place in my heart, McCartney said in a press video shared with CNN. We share the same values and what I love about Minnie is that she personifies happiness, self-expression, authenticity, plus she has a great style. I can't. So in the CNN article that we'll link in our resources, they talked about obviously the association
00:31:09
Speaker
of pantsuits to women leaders, which is great. Nothing wrong with wearing a pantsuit, nothing wrong with wearing a skirt either. Queen AOC likes to debut a variety of pantsuit skirts and dresses, and I don't think there's a problem with that. I don't think she's any less of a leader for maybe not wearing a pantsuit one day.
00:31:34
Speaker
Then, our dear friend, Candace Owens, said, quote, they're trying to make her more masculine. She said this on Jesse Waters Primetime. Don't even know what that is. Adding that mini mouse in pants is an attempt to destroy fabrics of our society. So after reading that, she's such a strong statement to make about an animated mouse.
00:32:03
Speaker
Candace Owens in pants. I would just like to add that Miss Owens. Does she wear pants? She does wear pants. Oh my god. Is she just destroying society with her pants? She didn't look any different to me. I didn't think that she was trying to personify masculine vibes, I guess, with her pants. She just looks like her own self.
00:32:31
Speaker
It's not like she only wears dresses and skirts, but I mean, all of you listening know that this is like a bunch of BS that she's just like spitting out into the ether. I just literally had to Google Candace Owens in pants. Sure enough, she's fine. According to CN and internet users have pointed out that this is not Minnie's first time for going her dress.
00:32:55
Speaker
In 2019, Disney Cruise Lines debuted Captain Minnie in a red and white maritime uniform with pants, both as an inspirational outfit for young girls and presumably a practical one to be out at sea in.
00:33:13
Speaker
This is for International Women's Day. The collaboration with McCartney will also include a limited t-shirt collection featuring Minnie with the phrase, quote, divine feminine, which I also don't love, which will appear on the runway at the March 7th Stella McCartney winter 2022 show and will be available for purchase the following day.
00:33:37
Speaker
I am fine with anyone who wants to be masculine, feminine, anywhere in between, anywhere outside of those realms. I just, I feel like with both of these stories, again, people are missing the point here. You know what I mean? And I am all for designers promoting clothes that make
00:34:00
Speaker
women feel more comfortable that make women feel more empowered. But the point is that it's not up to a designer. It is up to each person individually to wear clothes
00:34:15
Speaker
that fit their expression, how they want to portray themselves, what makes them feel comfortable, what makes them feel like them. And I am just tired of this ultra feminine, ultra masculine. It's like those those gender bender days that we used to have in high school that were really problematic, you know, because it would be basically
00:34:37
Speaker
men dress up as women and women dress up as men and that's that's just not that's not acceptable and and that shouldn't gender bending is not a thing like it's just right right because gender is not a thing it's not real right and so the fact that people are still just collaborating with these big names to put Minnie Mouse in a jumpsuit
00:35:05
Speaker
And then turn it into a whole thing about women empowerment. Well, not every woman is going to feel empowered in a jumpsuit. Well, not everyone's going to feel empowered by Minnie Mouse, a character that you also might not have an emotional attachment to. I am not an OG Disney person. Like I have no affinity for Mickey or Minnie Mouse or like the whole original crew. Like I just...
00:35:31
Speaker
I don't know, probably the Goofy movie is maybe like the farthest back I would go. Goofy movie slaps. But I don't know. Or that computer game. Yes, I was gonna say. And I think the thing that I remember about... No, it wasn't Minnie. It was Daphne. Daphne Duck? Daphne Duck? She like... It was like a diner. It was like a 50s-themed computer game. Didn't we have...
00:35:55
Speaker
Yes, and there's I can picture it. There's like a little diner I don't know that it was 50s themed but there was like a 50s diner in this. Yeah Mickey and the gang. Yeah. Oh my god. Do you want to talk about like Daphne like she's like
00:36:09
Speaker
maybe the equivalent to, I don't know, Mrs. Green or like Miss Green or like Miss Brown. She has like a feisty and like saucy like personality, you know, whatever. She doesn't wear pants. Like, oh my God, like, are we gonna get into that? Like, I don't know. Like in some of those cartoons, like none of the ducks.
00:36:27
Speaker
wear pants. I guess my thing is I don't understand and again maybe this is my ignorance like not absorbing this kind of like OG Disney content but it's not the first time and in the statement that Minnie has changed outfits before and even in our silly computer game I would say like I guess she wears different outfits so if you keep changing
00:36:53
Speaker
the appearances and the visual attire of these characters, then for the better it won't become such a big deal when they do change and mix it up. And I think it's great to have like a designer come in and, you know, design for a quintessential
00:37:10
Speaker
Um, animated character. I think that collaboration is really cool, but I, the jumpsuit is super cute. Oh, the jumpsuit, like the jumpsuit is so cute. I would definitely wear the jumpsuit. But like, as far as like an effeminate jumpsuit goes, like this one really hits the mark on that. Like she still has her quintessential bow on top of her head.
00:37:29
Speaker
her blazer has two bows on it it's got polka dots this is still a very much a mini outfit you know what i mean there was definitely some thought that like went into it and i'm fine with mini being a feminine character like i don't really or with mini just being mini she likes polka dots exactly exactly polka dots like polka dots are a thing she likes polka dots like cool and
00:37:53
Speaker
I think the thing that's interesting and we don't have to talk about it too much, but this whole divine quote, divine feminine is kind of weird. I don't understand why that necessarily has to be a part of this collaboration or why that has to be like a slogan that you slap on a t-shirt. Yeah, the divine feminine thing also maybe it just is rubbing me in the wrong way and I can't quite put my finger on why.
00:38:24
Speaker
I don't know. And we're, June and I are also looking at a picture of Minnie dressed up at one of the Disney parks in this kind of lame pink silver little dress. And I love this dress. I would just say I love Minnie in this tutu skirt almost. And when I was reading the CNN article, they referenced this because they were talking about Minnie has, you know, previously
00:38:52
Speaker
walked around in this ultra feminine outfit. But then when I looked up photos of this, Mickey is also wearing a kind of LeMay suit that corresponds with this. So I'm just, I'm just not really here for any of this. And I like, I like the collab. I like Minnie's jumpsuit. I just don't think that a jumpsuit, similar to the way that we talked about a stiletto heel or a block heel defining what is
00:39:20
Speaker
currently acceptable for feminine leadership or women in the workplace. I congruently do not think that a jumpsuit or Minnie's dress defines what is quintessential for a kind of female leadership and that doesn't mean anything in terms of celebrating International Women's Day for me. People who identify as women are going to dress however they fucking want so
00:39:46
Speaker
That is what we should be talking about for International Women's Day, not many in a jumpsuit. Right, right. Exactly. The whole conversation is literally just going back to critiquing their appearance and to changing their appearance. Right.
00:40:01
Speaker
to dictate what you think is powerful, to dictate what you think is appropriate, and to dictate what you think is current and relevant, I suppose, too. I am fine with a good modern outfit, like her showcasing something modern and bring her into a contemporary realm. That's great, but when that's all that you're doing,
00:40:23
Speaker
that you're so right. That's where it just becomes a no-go for me. We're not really doing anything productive here. We are just continuing to scrutinize women's appearances to make you feel more comfortable.
00:40:36
Speaker
Exactly, exactly. Yeah, this is just like... And the fact that they both happened the same week, I was like, what is going on? No, I know, I know. Well, Bianca, any last thoughts on Minnie? Wear whatever the fuck you want, Minnie, honestly. Put on some go-go boots or just to let it heal. Dress up like a fucking green M&M, do you? To you, to you, Minnie.
00:41:04
Speaker
Well, do we want to take a quick break? And when we come back, we will be talking about our last art news story. And don't worry, it doesn't have anything to do with any more animated characters. Thank God. Thank God.
00:41:49
Speaker
All right, everybody. Welcome back. Hope you got to take a little breather, simmer down, cool down a little bit. So for our last art news story today, we are kind of going back to basics. Another story in the pandemic, but also more of a little pop culture craze story for you.
The Rise of Wordle
00:42:11
Speaker
So we are gonna be talking about WordL. So Bianca, have you been playing, like what's your take on WordL? I just heard about WordL in another podcast a week or two ago. And I just, I don't play games on my phone. I just, I don't do that. I don't think ever in my life I have downloaded a game to play on my phone. It's just,
00:42:39
Speaker
not my thing. So no, I'm not playing Wordle. So in that sense, I am confused about, I guess, you know, like the logistics and inner workings of Wordle, but I'm not oblivious to its existence or all of the yellow and black, you know, squares.
00:43:00
Speaker
yellow, black and green squares or whatever. Like that is very much in my visual language now to associate those squares with Wordle, but I'm not playing. But tell me why it's in like your visual vocabulary right now. How have you been exposed to it?
00:43:17
Speaker
Yeah, just on social media, but of course CBS News also did a story on it. And I feel like I'm like an older person maybe because sometimes on CBS they do these stories where like the new hippie young craze with kids is playing wordle. You know, like have you experienced like maybe you've seen these on your Facebook page. Let me tell you what the craze is. And so I'm sitting there being like, oh yeah, I've seen this story.
00:43:46
Speaker
Like sometimes I feel like I am not the target age demographic for a lot of these CBS stories, but I fit in because I just don't do some of that stuff.
00:43:58
Speaker
That's really funny. So I ask those questions because we are talking about Wordle because it is a little bit different than like a traditional app. And to my knowledge, or at least how I've been playing it, it's not something you actually download. It's not an app. It's just like something that you Google and you just click on it and you play through Google. And then once you also search for Wordle, the Google text changes to Wordle font too.
00:44:24
Speaker
There are games like Wordle that you can download, but when I first went to look for it to download Wordle, I wasn't getting the app. But maybe I'm wrong, but that's just how I've been playing it. It's just through Google, through the internet. That's really interesting. Yeah.
00:44:41
Speaker
So, and I had absolutely no clue what this was. One day people are posting about Betty White and the next, did you guys get those word right? I was like, what is happening? Like I have no clue what we're talking about at all. So it was truly for me, like I was not in the know about word all.
00:45:01
Speaker
But New York Times did a great little story about the creator of Wordle, Josh Wardle, a software engineer in Brooklyn, who basically it's a cute little story. And the article which I'll share for you guys talk about the story in terms of like, like romance, like it's kind of a love story, which is
00:45:23
Speaker
a hot take for New York Times because they're all about those cute stories. So definitely, Wordle is a play on his name. In the pandemic, the couple was playing this game
00:45:38
Speaker
So basically after the couple and Josh had kind of collaboratively created this game, they kind of played it with like their family, their friends, their small group, and then they thought this might actually be a thing. So they released it into the world basically in October and by November it picked up some traction, really small. They had about 90 people playing it.
00:46:00
Speaker
And then later on, two months later, there was 300,000 people who were playing Wordle. So it was definitely like a craze that kind of happened overnight. So Wordle is a little bit different, because it is a once a day game that all it does, I know you guys don't need like a full synopsis of the game, but all you do is guess a five letter word, right? That's all it is. And you have
00:46:24
Speaker
Six tries to get it right. The interesting thing that we'll talk about and maybe part of the visuals of it, the lack of visuals, what we're not seeing
00:46:33
Speaker
is that there are no ads, no flashy banners, no window pop-ups. No one is asking for your money. You don't have to pay for this. It is merely just a once a day game. So to quote Mr. Wardle, he says, I think people kind of appreciate that there's this thing online that's just fun. It's not trying to do anything shady with your data or your eyeballs. It's just a game that's fun.
00:47:01
Speaker
This also got me thinking because there's a really short Enzi Zanzari special on Netflix now and like he talks about basically like the Chinese government trying to steal your data and how we're all like oh no like you're not going to mess with my freedoms blah blah blah like you're not going to get my data but then it's like want to see how you look when you were old and it's like oh yes like here's a picture of my face gladly please take my picture I want to see what I look like when I'm old like
00:47:28
Speaker
It's amazing. Please go watch it. So the interesting thing about Josh Wardle is that he was formerly a software engineer for Reddit. And I want to talk about his past projects that he created, which were essentially two collaborative social experiments through Reddit. One is called the button, and the other one is called the place. And each were kind of like a phenomenon in their own moment.
00:47:58
Speaker
Reddit to me is like the dark web. I don't fuck with Reddit. Like I've never been on it. So these things are totally new for me. I don't really understand how Reddit works at all. So, you know, this whole episode is me just like an outsider looking in like I don't give a shit about M&Ms. I don't really care that much about Disney, Mickey and Minnie. And I don't fuck with Reddit. Well, we've I remember this one of these being an art news story, this image that you have.
00:48:25
Speaker
that we definitely, I feel like, talked about that at some point. Was this art news or did I talk about this in a class? I feel like we've talked about this before. I have never seen this image in my life. You definitely have. Oh my god, what? Okay, well, we've either talked about this or
00:48:44
Speaker
There was definitely some art historical context where I've talked about it. Keep going. Keep going. Get into it. All right. Well, let's just say I slept since then. So the button was a really interesting social experiment, which basically all it was a timer. And to my understanding, only a handful of Reddit users had access
00:49:06
Speaker
To the button and essentially like the goal was like they can only press the button so many times throughout the day You're like the week and you can't let the timer like go to zero and I think the lowest number the timer got to was like in the 20s and it was based on this idea of competition and boredom like that was a social experiment to like see what people would do based on this idea of competition and boredom and
00:49:35
Speaker
But the place is a little bit interesting. This happened in 2017 because it deals with more of a visual vernacular that we talk about here on our pop talk. So since I
00:49:50
Speaker
At least I thought I knew nothing about the place, Bianca. I don't know. I'm just going to take this straight description from Reddit and translate it for you all. So the experiment was based in a subreddit called rplace in which the user could be greeted by a screen displaying a section of a canvas. Registered users could place a pixel or title of an empty canvas, but had to wait
00:50:16
Speaker
before placing another. So this was kind of the same thing we see with Wordle and the same thing we see with the button. It's this idea of waiting. You can't do it whenever you want. The waiting time varied from five to 20 minutes throughout the experiment. The choice of the color for a user's pixel was between white, light gray, gray, black, pink, red, orange, brown, yellow, light green, green, aqua blue, blah, blah, blah, blah, purple.
00:50:41
Speaker
The early hours of the canvas were characterized by random pixel placement and chaotic attempts at image creation. Among the first distinct sections of the canvas to emerge were a corner of entirely blue pixel named blue corner and an homage to Pokemon.
00:51:00
Speaker
As a Canvas developed, some established subreddit communities, such as those for video games, sports teams, and individual countries, coordinated user efforts to claim and decorate particular sections. So I think it's this interesting thing when a pop culture phenomenon takes place that's a visual representation of something, you want whatever you're into to be on that thing, right?
00:51:25
Speaker
Other sections of the canvas were developed by specially created communities and coordination efforts, such as reproductions of the Mona Lisa and the Starry Night. And it's funny, even just looking at this picture, there's a lot of different pixels going on here. It kind of reminds me of, I think it was Beebel's NFT image that, you know, sold for a boatload of money. All these random pixelated images, but Mona Lisa, you can
00:51:54
Speaker
kind of clearly see on this image i can't see starry night i don't know if you can find it no i can't see starry night but that reminded me of another art news story which we didn't cover because we want to save it for another episode it just reminds me of the van gogh experience that they had on the bachelor last week oh god which i know we put on our instagram stories but uh no i can't find it on this image
00:52:22
Speaker
Well, only on the Bachelor. Well, several works of pixel art were created as a result of this experiment, varying from fictional characters and internet
00:52:34
Speaker
memes to patriotic flags, LGBTQ flags, and recreations of famous pieces of, again, artworks. Several, quote, cults also formed, which I'm really bummed that APT was not represented on this canvas in 2017. What a marketing moment that would be for us. So several cults also formed
00:52:56
Speaker
to create and maintain various emblematic features such as a black void and multicolored rainbow roads. So this is basically, again, like I say, people just wanting to be represented on something that is a phenomenon. And I would say the other thing that I can pick out from this as the kind of overview stated was there are a lot of flags. I mean, there's no kind of
00:53:25
Speaker
Flags are a really easy way to slop a visual simple on something to be easily kind of represented.
00:53:32
Speaker
The funny thing about this, too, was this launched April 1st. And I also believe that the button launched on April 1st, too. So these whole social experiments also, coincidentally, not coincidentally, took place on April Fool's Day. So going back to Wordle, but also keeping in line with this experimental thought process, I think that kind of makes the breakthrough of Wordle even more interesting.
00:54:01
Speaker
So and also thinking about Josh Wardle's thought processes, I think he's very clever in making something limited, maybe making something exclusive. I don't know how like underground things are on Reddit because that is not a platform that I'm super into. I wouldn't
00:54:24
Speaker
say that word all is super underground. I think that's definitely surpassed a red-up bubble. But there's this routine involved with word all that people are experiencing. It's part of their daily routine.
00:54:39
Speaker
It's something that maybe is held in a more sacred way or because of its scarcity, as he describes. I think that scarcity and that limitation is a part of this ritual that we're experiencing on the daily. Going back to Wordle's visuals and its development, again, a part of the reason Wordle was created
00:55:06
Speaker
Um, and as the New York times tell us was basically because his partner really loved word games. It was something they did in the pandemic. They really loved the spelling bee. So this was something that he was doing for his significant other, which is really cute. But because of its kind of niche, um, stardom, I suppose it quote lacked this growth hacking feature.
00:55:30
Speaker
that are virtually expected of other games in the current era. So while other games, you know, they give us notifications on our phones that will keep coming back to it, you know, if we want to get more points, maybe we have to watch an ad. Wordle does not have that intense relationship with this kind of game era.
00:55:53
Speaker
Josh says quote, it's something that encourages you to spend three minutes a day. That's it. Like it doesn't want anything more of your time than that. So it's really interesting that Virgil lacked the ability to also share results until December until it probably got really popular, which is why for me, someone who like didn't know it was a thing. It wasn't until like,
00:56:17
Speaker
I guess recently where people are picking up that they could start sharing their results. And I honestly didn't know this until
00:56:28
Speaker
was like hey Theban have you played this game and I was like showing him how to do it and then I realized that we had the same word and then when I looked up the story for art news for today the social sharing feature also doesn't give you spoils on what essentially the word of the day is so there's also this like I think greater sense of community happening because we're all visually guessing the same word. There are two different levels I think one is a little bit easier one is a little bit harder
00:56:57
Speaker
But I think at the end of the day, we're all guessing the same word, which is also a limited dictionary. We know that there's only five letters, but even from there, my understanding is that some people have gotten upset because like, oh, that word is so hard. I would have never guessed that word. But the dictionary is supposed to be limited to almost 2,000 words to be
00:57:22
Speaker
more of like a common like vernacular like it's this game I don't believe is meant to be like extremely challenging you know what I mean like he said it doesn't really want a lot from you there are things especially at this point because the game has taken off that Josh as a creator could you know create links to things to you know make sure that you go here after someone is you know sharing their basically how long it took them to
00:57:51
Speaker
to guess the word, but he thinks that would look quote trashy and not as visually compelling. And he really likes that the grid is kind of mysterious. And he thinks that that is what is peaking people's interests is that it's not this really kind of oversaturated. You know, I feel like if you picture a game today, it does have a vibe.
00:58:16
Speaker
And Bianca, I put a picture for us to look at and this is Words with Friends. And I don't know if people still are really into this, but it's definitely a game where you play with other people online. It's just like crossword or like Scrabble, you know what I mean? But when I was in high school, this was something that people are playing a lot. But the letters are in yellow blocks.
00:58:38
Speaker
highly saturated and bubbly. It reminds me a lot of what Candy Crush looks like or Angry Birds. All of those games visually use like the same color palette and something like Wordle doesn't.
Personal Experiences with Wordle
00:58:51
Speaker
It's something very simple back to basics kind of like if when I'm playing like Sudoku like online. So yeah I don't I don't know I have been playing Wordle. I am I'm not a big like
00:59:05
Speaker
game person either over the holidays I did download a couple games on my phone because I was bored and I just really wanted I just have this urge to be like I just want to play a game on my phone and I haven't done that since like I was in high school which would have been something like
00:59:25
Speaker
really popular like Candy Crusher words with friends. I've never gotten into like animal crossings or anything like that. So I don't know for me, World War One is fun. It doesn't demand much of my time. I've been like playing it on my lunch break, but honestly, I'm pretty good at it. Ever since I've done it, I've gotten everyone right. I haven't failed yet.
00:59:47
Speaker
That's really impressive. Yeah, I'm impressive. Honestly, for me now, knowing that it's not something I have to download on my phone, that it's only online, I honestly feel like that is something I would want to play because that's what I like about, I don't know, physical games or, you know, Andrew and I have played Animal Crossing and he definitely plays more games than I do. I like playing games with friends, like going over to friend's house if they have
01:00:16
Speaker
a gaming system, it's easier for me to get involved through them. But I like the idea that it's online. I don't have to download anything on my phone. I'm like anti-downloading apps. So I am, I'm definitely, definitely more intrigued. Also something that, I don't know, I've never been much of a puzzler. But Andrew and I got, well, I got Andrew a puzzle for Christmas.
01:00:46
Speaker
And we've been working on it and I am surprised at how much I am enjoying working on just a simple
01:00:55
Speaker
puzzle, I guess, or something as simple as a puzzle that has a lot of pieces. But I am surprised at how much I'm liking that. So maybe I will like word all. Yeah. I think you will. I don't know. I feel like too little things like this, again, that don't take too much time, kind of make me feel better. I have a super big irrational fear of, quite honestly, getting dementia and I'm not using my brain.
01:01:25
Speaker
And as far as reading goes, I'm having to do always so much reading for work or for APT that it's taken me a while to get back into pleasure reading, which I'm happy to say that I'm doing right now. But sometimes I just feel like I'm not exercising my brain in ways that I should be. And so when I do little things like Wordle or a crossword puzzle or a Sudoku, I really
01:01:51
Speaker
like sudoku's, it makes me feel like I'm exercising my brain and it's not gonna turn to like mush. Right, right.
01:02:00
Speaker
Yeah, okay, I'll give it a go and can be posted. Yeah, but don't let my like irrational fear like, you know, scare you into like playing word. No, I think about that all the time, just because I watch so much television. Also, I don't have a job now, as we talked about. I have to find some different activities for me during the day in between job applications. Puzzling is great, though. I love a good puzzle.
01:02:27
Speaker
Um, so Gianna, we have some things to talk about for February.
Upcoming Art Pop Talk Events
01:02:31
Speaker
February I think is going to be a really fun month of APD. So get ready for some special guests, a little surprise here and there. But at the end of the month, we are starting to let you guys know about a trivia session we have with Women's Art Wednesday. If you do not know Women's Art Wednesday, you should. And we are going to start linking them in our
01:02:57
Speaker
social media, blah, blah, all the typical stuff. So our last episode of February is going to be a trivia session with two amazing women from the platform. And we need trivia questions from you all. So you can send this to us via email at artpoptalk at gmail.com. You can of course always DMS on all of our social media platforms and we are going to put
01:03:20
Speaker
options up in our stories and in posts on Instagram and Facebook and Twitter for you to submit your questions to us. So we need trivia questions on women in art history and women in pop culture so that we can play a little game with these two amazing women at the end of the month. So we will keep reminding you, but we need those questions by mid-February. We'll get you a solid date and you should be seeing that from us soon.
01:03:47
Speaker
Yay! Well thank you everybody for staying with us for the end of this episode and we will talk to you all next Tuesday. Bye everyone! Art Pop Talk's executive producers are me Bianca Martucci-Vinc. And me Gianna Martucci-Vinc. Music and sounds are by Josh Turner and photography is by Adrienne Turner. And our graphic designer is Sid Hammond.
01:04:29
Speaker
you