Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
When Fertility Battles and Cancer Collide Finding Strength Through Pain
0 Plays2 seconds ago
Sometimes the stories we carry are heavier than what the world ever sees.
Sarah Cunningham McWilliams sits down with us to share a life marked by loss, resilience, and unexpected hope. From 14 miscarriages and ectopic pregnancies to surviving cancer in the middle of a global pandemic, she shows what it means to keep standing when life consistently knocks you on your ass.
Sarah opens her heart about the quiet battles no one prepares you for, the humor that kept her sane, and the way nature and the sea became her refuge when words and medicine failed. She speaks about love, survival, and the small moments of light that pulled her through the darkest seasons.
This is not just a story of pain or survival. It is about the courage to keep moving, the grace to laugh even in grief, and the reminder that strength often comes in the softest of forms.
Tune in to hear a story of fierce grace from an Irish warrior woman that will irrevocably change the way you think about resilience and the hidden weight so many of us carry.
Key Topics:
-Enduring miscarriages and ectopic pregnancies with unspoken grief
-IVF and its hidden toll on body and spirit
-Confronting cancer while raising young children ..all in a worldwide pandemic
-Holding on to humor as a shield in moments of deep pain
-Finding refuge in sea swims, nature, and quiet resilience
Quotes from the episode:
"If you keep your inner voice negative, you will collapse. I had to keep saying "yes I can, yes I will."
-Sarah Cunningham
"I come from a long line of warrior women with soft hearts."
-Sarah Cunningham
"Life can look so amazing on the outside, but you never really know what’s going on in the pains that are happening on the inside."
-Jennifer Muldowney
Timestamp:
[00:00] Podcast Intro
[00:22] Sarah shares how her friendship with Jennifer, her struggles with miscarriage and illness, and the resilience of Irish women shaped her way of looking at life with humor and kindness.
[08:52] Sarah opens up about living with permanent health struggles, multiple miscarriages, an ectopic pregnancy, and a difficult fertility journey in America that tested her strength.
[23:30] Sarah talks about turning to surrogacy after countless miscarriages and ectopic pregnancies. She endured a painful experience with a carrier yet found gratitude in her children while carrying the unseen pain behind what looked like a perfect family.
[31:30] Sarah recalls how finding a lump led to a breast cancer diagnosis, life-saving surgery, and lasting effects.
[44:51] Sarah shares how medical negligence, unprocessed trauma, and years of battles left her with PTSD.
[52:51] Sarah reflects on how IVF drugs may have fueled her cancer, exposing the profit-driven side of healthcare. She endured harsh chemotherapy and relied on her inner strength, natural supports, and the will to survive for her family.
[1:14:54] Outro
Connect with Sarah Cunningham:
Website: https://goodgrief.ie/
Email address: sazcmcw@hotmail.com
Connect with Jennifer/The Glam Reaper on socials at:
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/jennifermuldowney/
TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@therealglamreaper
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@TheGlamReaperMuldowney
LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennifermuldowney/
Facebook Page - https://www.facebook.com/MuldowneyMemorials/
Email us - glamreaperpodcast@gmail.com
Shop Merch - https://the-glam-reaper.printify.me/products
Listen to The Glam Reaper Podcast on Apple Podcasts:
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-glam-reaper-podcast/id1572382989?i=1000525524145
The Glam Reaper® AMAZON Storefront - https://amzn.to/4hObpOh
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Sensitive Topics
00:00:00
Speaker
At least they were early losses is something I would hear. And I was like, how the fuck is that early loss when you've seen four scans of your baby's heartbeat and then at least it was only like, at least you didn't tell people like, fuck off. It was horrible.
00:00:23
Speaker
Hi
Meet the Hosts and Guest
00:00:24
Speaker
everybody and welcome to another episode of the Glam Reaper podcast. I'm your host Jennifer Muldani aka the Glam Reaper and on today's episode we have one of my besties.
00:00:37
Speaker
I actually am laughing at this. This is an interesting story because we have never met physically in person. We've only met one time on video call because we're both always too busy. We're both working in the same space interestingly enough But our journeys have somehow parallel walked side by side for the last five or six years, something like that.
Friendship and Shared Experiences
00:00:56
Speaker
Probably even more, actually, I think.
00:00:57
Speaker
Anyway, without further ado, I would love to welcome one of my favorite people in the universe, Sarah McWilliams. Come into the house. So Sarah, tell us. Gosh, there's so much to unpack, as the American the Yankee Doodles would say in your story. But tell us who you are.
00:01:15
Speaker
Yeah, we grew up in same neighbourhood, didn't we? We're from the borough. I think how we met is really lovely because I think I followed you first just because you're TED Talk. And then and i was like, she's like, wait, we have friends in common. and And then when I was diagnosed, you sent me i little Ireland, little gold Ireland necklace, which now I send to people that I don't know or do know and love.
00:01:39
Speaker
And I think um it's a lovely little thing that we've that we've created. Well, because both of us were, I was living in the States at the time, you were in Connecticut. I think somehow a friend, mutual friend connected us somehow. was like, you guys dead on replay. You said, I don't think even we knew how well we'd get on, which here we are. And yeah. But I was excited. I remember being excited because I was Connecticut and you were in New York and we'd have new pals. But then, you know, pandemic and everything Yeah, like that's we didn't get to actually physically meet. And then you bailed on me and moved back home to Ireland. How are you?
Living Away from Home: Challenges and Support
00:02:16
Speaker
We're just going to chat about our parallel lives and what the fuck happened to me while I was in America. Exactly. way Exactly. So, and so, yeah, I got you that.
00:02:27
Speaker
um I got you that Ireland and necklace. Actually, somebody gave it to me. So technically somebody else started this. It's a chain that started a chain of events. Being over here can be really, really, really hard being away from your family and friends and everything, especially when you're going through stuff.
00:02:42
Speaker
Now, you went through a lot of shit, girlfriend. It was hard anyway. When we first moved the first year, i was thinking, Jesus, if somebody just walked into this bar now that I actually knew, i would be having a way better time. You know that way?
00:02:56
Speaker
Yeah. i'm kind of yeah You meet lovely people, but they still, and they um they became really good friends. But it's just that little bit anonymity that's not fun. You cling to home. You definitely do. i I find when I'm going through a hard times, I'm more likely to call my Irish friends than I am my American friends.
00:03:16
Speaker
And that's nothing against America. It's just... I think that's why we kind of connect then in America. You have your own little Irish groups of people. Yeah. yeah And English and Australia. Anybody else? that's but It's true. It's so true.
00:03:31
Speaker
So my one is if is a mad story because we had a little bit of trouble before we moved away. and little bit of trouble.
Facing Multiple Miscarriages and Health Issues
00:03:40
Speaker
And so we lost some babies and i had an ectopic.
00:03:45
Speaker
And we just bought a house in Leopardstown and everything was was great. But I feel like in Ireland, there's a bit of eye, there's eyes on you if you don't have a baby or if you're not married or, you know, things like that. And you just like, fuck off. Like we got married because we were love and we wanted to have a big party.
00:04:02
Speaker
You know, no, yeah, we weren't going to have a baby straight away anyway. And then so it was 2012. We traveled the world and I'd had a little miscarriage when we came back. And I was like, oh, maybe maybe we would be OK if we had a baby, you know, this kind stuff.
00:04:18
Speaker
And then the pattern was that they continuously didn't work out. I think we had three, as they call spontaneous pregnancies, you know, when you're just getting pregnant, living your life. And there's a funny little, like I feel like I don't belong in any group.
00:04:33
Speaker
We weren't trying to have a baby. We were just living and being together and getting pregnant. And, you know, the first, after the first couple, we didn't even tell anybody because we were just like, oh, that happened again. All of the pieces came together ah for me in my brain about things that were happening like And after I had this methotrexate, I had an ectopic and I had this methotrexate stuff and it gave me Hashimoto's and skin lupus.
00:04:59
Speaker
It took me couple years to figure out what the hell they were and why I was so unbelievably fatigued and all this kind of stuff. And that methotrexate was to get rid of an ectopic that was in your in your tube.
00:05:11
Speaker
And that started this like autoimmune disaster. And you do it, you try to pretend like everything's fine. And I want to preface this because we actually have, this is our second time recording this podcast, everybody. So just the, Sarah is very, um you deal with, you know, the dark parts of your life in a very lighthearted way.
00:05:33
Speaker
Not everyone deals with things that way. Yes. We bond over sort of, and i i there is a bit of an Irishness to that, I think as well, where it's sort of, you know,
00:05:43
Speaker
My arm is falling off. What's your Jesus? Haven't you got another one? Yes. Looking at the toxic positivity. But I just want to preface that the start of this very serious conversation and very, you know, traumatic things that you've gone through and and you're going to tell us all about with saying that if you're not comfortable, you know, please turn off or, you know, don't.
00:06:05
Speaker
Don't come for Sarah in the comments just because it's her life and she can talk about it however
Coping with Trauma through Humor
00:06:10
Speaker
she wants. So just... Yeah. Don't. But not everyone understand your heart and that's okay. But we we live on the sunny side the street. So every disaster that happened to us, and mean they really were disasters, you'd just be like, Jesus Christ, this is a fucking joke.
00:06:23
Speaker
You know, you're just like, what the hell? Okay, let's go for a movie or something. like china to And also think it's ah a little bit of it is Irish women as well. I come from women who are warriors but with soft hearts.
00:06:37
Speaker
And they taught me real strength. Like, I know that all of the things in my life that lined up to before all of this stuff happened to us, like other things that would happen to me, like, you know, not down by a car or, you know, other kind of illnesses had in hospitals and stuff like that.
00:06:55
Speaker
And you get, up you would get on with it. You just get on with it. And your you might have a little moment to yourself or a moment to your close friends whatever. But when you'd meet people like, like, everything's fine.
00:07:06
Speaker
You're fine. And I think that the women in my family, like my Nana is going to be 104 in November. And, you know, my mom and all of her sisters, they live with strength, but like the strength that has grace.
00:07:21
Speaker
And that can come in like, I think kindness is like a strong form of power. that people don't realize. And and and also, i was talking to my cousin yesterday, we also don't judge.
00:07:34
Speaker
but I've heard horrific stories that people have done or things that I have done. And you just, you're like, you know, they made a choice. You know, it didn't work out you know, mistakes.
00:07:45
Speaker
You know, you just don't judge. You just, oh God, that's a terrible thing that you did. But now you know you've done that and you move on from it. Or, you know, somebody else has done this awful thing.
00:07:56
Speaker
And really, we should support them with kindness. And there's, I think there's a lot of power in kindness. But we are daughters of resilience, you and I. up God.
00:08:06
Speaker
I swear, if if another person says to me, you're so resilient, Jen. Gosh, you're so, I'm like,
00:08:14
Speaker
But like take this, for instance, right? This is night every day. And people say to me, oh, your arm's not better. And I'm like, well, the lymph nodes are not going to grow back. They're gone. And it's permanent.
00:08:26
Speaker
And I wear these horrible compression garments all the time. And I refuse to let them take me down. I refuse to let them get me down. So like I take it off and it's uncomfortable because you know what compression is
Navigating the IVF Journey
00:08:38
Speaker
like. It's it's yucky.
00:08:40
Speaker
And you just have what am I going to do Be miserable. So I prefer get on with it with. And even if I cry to somebody, I will still be making jokes about myself. And that's just who I am.
00:08:52
Speaker
And I see my hundred and three year old Nana doing that about herself as well. I didn't lick it off a stone.
00:09:00
Speaker
There are going to be so many people, Americans watching this going, wait, what's that saying? Wait, what's this? Taking those. Oh, God, that's too funny. um Yeah, that's exactly it. And so you move to America with the love of your life. You've had a couple of miscarriages. You've had an ectopic pregnancy. They've pumped you full of crap that has now led to other crap.
00:09:25
Speaker
Tell us, tell us take this pill, then this pill is for that pill, then that pill is for that pill. and Greg got offered a job. um Greg was working in St. Michael's and I was working privately with families and he got offered a job in Yale.
00:09:39
Speaker
So he did, i remember in doing his little interview, And he was going over to be the director of rugby of Yale and to coach the women and the men's teams in rugby. And I did a little interview for like the Bulldog rugby offices.
00:09:54
Speaker
And we were just like, let's skedaddle out of the country because we've had a couple of crappy moments with the miscarriages and stuff. And then, you know, it did it did take a toll on us too. we' He was working all the time and I was kind of going through it on my own. So,
00:10:10
Speaker
We like, this will be great. Let's go away. And we'll just go away for a year. And it'll be great. a A lovely little adventure. And we needed that. Maybe we'll come back pregnant. But let's not make that the goal.
00:10:22
Speaker
and And so we moved. We'd only moved ties. And then... packed up the entire house and Greg was coaching the Irish women's team in France. they He was ah the assistant coach and they won.
00:10:36
Speaker
And while that was happening, I was packing best and planning to make, and we were at the end of it. Everybody will know, you know, unless you get a company to help you, we were just shoving everything into boxes.
00:10:49
Speaker
At the end of it. And just like. We'll be back in a year. We'll deal with it after. I remember finding. um Like bits of cigarettes. And stuff. And that was like. 10 years before. I was like. I smoked. How disgusting.
00:11:01
Speaker
You know. There's just. In our. When we opened up everything. That would that means. We packed. We clearly packed in a hurry. But yeah when we flew, out we said goodbye to everybody, said goodbye to the house. ah Everybody knew we were just going for a year and we didn't come back for the guts of a decade. So it went well.
00:11:17
Speaker
But we had this lovely adventure, but we had all of these ah horrible things happen in between. And the biggest was after we first landed, and i had an ectopic, but I didn't know I was pregnant and was out for dinner and just felt awful. And the next morning,
00:11:35
Speaker
i I met this girl out the night before, Shelley, and she is she essentially saved her life because um I was texting her asking, would she come with me ah to the game, to the rugby game? And it was Greg's first game and we were all excited to go.
00:11:51
Speaker
And I remember dusting on the eyeshadow onto my pale eyebrows and I couldn't lift my arm up I was like really really weak and I texted her saying I'm feeling really weird and she was saying I'm still in my pajamas so that and then I said her I might need to go to the hospital instead of like a couple of texts later I might need go to the hospital instead of the game and she was like are you joking and I was like no I feel really shitty And she, long story short, she got the concierge to let her in. And luckily they did because I was bleeding out and would have been gone.
The Emotional Toll of Ectopic Pregnancy
00:12:24
Speaker
Like the topics.
00:12:25
Speaker
There was a a girl in the news at the time that had just passed away in Ireland or France. um So I knew how serious they were once I heard that in the hospital that it was in their topic.
00:12:36
Speaker
I went into a really long surgery and then woke up. My mom had just jumped on a plane and it threw us into this. and Because we had had three or four losses, it threw us into like a fertility battle that we we didn't enter into ourselves.
00:12:57
Speaker
You know, they, well, because this happened to you, we're going to throw you into the fertility clinic, meet this doctor. When you walk in the door with your mom, she's going to say, let's have a baby together and we'll go, OK, and make it sound like it's a normal thing to do But really, we had no idea what we were getting our ourselves in for.
00:13:15
Speaker
it was a really long, shitty IVF battle that I kept trying to get out of. you know, asking, could I do a natural way of doing this? quick They were saying, you know, you've lost a tube now. You should save the tube, bypass the tube that you've already had mid-topic in and just do IVF. And you're covered with two rounds, so you're fine.
00:13:36
Speaker
um And then, of course, after the two rounds and two more losses, and I was just getting sicker and sicker and half-flashing and walking around with one of these Oh gosh.
00:13:48
Speaker
And I can't believe it's a permanent fixture now. Thank you, Menopause. But it throws down this bloody fertility battle that we weren't prepared for. They told me the first methotrexate had shattered the thyroid, gave me Hashimoto's.
00:14:02
Speaker
In Ireland, they sent me to a naturopath and he was giving me tonics. And when I went to see a doctor in America, this is where America is a little bit better for me sometimes, is that they were like, why are you not on thyroid replacement? Your thyroid's shattered.
00:14:18
Speaker
And once they caught me on replacement, I started to feel better. And that's all it took. They were trying to go like the natural route, and which was just making me sick. I was so sick that just to preface how sick I was, I passed out while driving, went into the Lewis Gate, almost died and killed other people.
00:14:37
Speaker
Because I was so ah pushing through. Them telling me nothing's wrong. And me not able to function, not able to breathe some days, things like that. And it was like just ah in fight or flight mode all the time.
00:14:50
Speaker
remember watching TV and somebody talking and all I was passing out because the two different sounds... was making me feel crazy. It was kind of the same feeling you have when have like, when you don't drink coffee, which you're not really, and then you'd have two.
00:15:05
Speaker
And it's like a panic, But there's nothing going on. ah it was really strange. It was hard it was hard to hard to fathom what the hell was going on. But it was the American doctor that told me, my aunt's doctor, that told me I had had Hashimoto's. And it was the levels have changed. So your thyroid levels used to have to be a five.
00:15:27
Speaker
But now they know to sustain a pregnancy or to feel normal, it should be at a one or two. You know, whereas the chart was kind of old fashioned, I think. and so i Where do we crack into the crazy stuff that happens? So I had this ectopic and I went into the surgery. Rokokman was there.
00:15:46
Speaker
that And then we went into our apartment and I got this call. I was probably three or four days in to recovery and, you know, new scars. I'd lost ah tube, not an ovary, but it was Weird when you lose it like something that makes you, ah you know, thought it made me less of a woman.
00:16:10
Speaker
You know, I've had my uterus out and everything up since then and that doesn't make me feel anything. But when I lost a tube, fallopian tube, that's when my humor got dark. I remember my mother-in-law asked me what I wanted for Christmas and I said a fallopian tube and she did not think was funny.
00:16:26
Speaker
But I did because that's how I dealt with it. yeah It made me feel like less of a woman or something, like I can't sustain a pregnancy and my now my tube is gone. And why?
00:16:38
Speaker
Why are we thinking that? You know, this is not not something that you could prevent. And so it's so hard to stop yourself from being hard on yourself when things like that happen.
00:16:50
Speaker
So like yourself, I'm writing a book and um one of the one of the main stories in it was the Dollar Tree miscarriage. You know, this is just a wild story where... It's a fucking wild story.
00:17:05
Speaker
They give you this pill. That's, you know, like a, it's an abortion pill, I think. And that's what it's called, like on your papers when you get it back.
00:17:16
Speaker
and missed a post call or something it's called. Don't go with me. And um they they gave me that because every miscarriage I had was a missed miscarriage, which means you go into your scan, everything's fine. You go to your next scan, no heartbeat.
00:17:31
Speaker
And that could happen three or four times where we get good scans and we tell when people we're pregnant. And then the next scan, there'll be no heartbeat. So was always ah missed miscarriage. It was always something I had to make a decision of how to get rid of it, either a DNC or this pill, you know, those kind of things. It was a fucking nightmare.
00:17:52
Speaker
Just for your body to continuously go through that, you know, several times in a year over and over again. and And then the pill didn't work the first time for this one. And so I went back to them and they gave me more.
00:18:06
Speaker
And then i have to go and get sterilized equipment. One of those little grabbers and little cup and some wipes and all that kind of stuff. And I went down to the Dollar Tree with this girl that I'd met.
00:18:19
Speaker
Another girl, Elizabeth, who he became the best friend over there. And she came down with me to make it more fun. Because I was like, I'm not walking down to this dollar tree to get all this sterilized equipment to catch my baby so that they can test it and see what the hell is wrong with me or it.
00:18:39
Speaker
And there was never anything wrong. We never got an answer. They were like, there's nothing wrong. The baby's fine. There's nothing wrong with you either. Everything's fine. And it's Greg's fault. but But um she came with me ah when she found out what was happening.
00:18:54
Speaker
And it's like going on a train journey. You can read your book and look out the window and have a lovely time. But if someone's there, you do have a bit more crack. So, yes, I was like, come down with me and make this more normal for me so I don't have to ball with the road. I'll just instead take the fucking piss out of myself and it'll be fine.
00:19:13
Speaker
Greg was in like New Zealand or something. and And when I got down to into the Dollar Tree with Elizabeth, we were just, the Dollar Tree is fun when you're Irish. There is a lot of stuff in there.
00:19:25
Speaker
I was in there and and I got the most horrific pain. i was in there and I was like, you have to be joking me. And ah Elizabeth found me the bathroom and I was just like, Jesus Christ, I'm collapse.
00:19:36
Speaker
And I got in there and I remember like through a haze of pain. taking the tissue and putting on the toilet seat taking the bits of tissue for other to and seat and had a miscarriage into the toilet in the Dollar Tree with Elizabeth like keeping sketch at the door and had to blindly fish it out you know the way you cross your eyes because you don't want to see something Yeah.
Miscarriage in Unexpected Places
00:20:02
Speaker
And it was so traumatic, but I didn't want to see it. I crossed my eyes so I could see where it was and grab it and put it into the little container, which I happen to have totally robbed the container and the wipes accidentally by going into the bathroom with them and using them.
00:20:16
Speaker
And then came outside and told Elizabeth like it just it was weird because you think having a little miscarriage like that. um with the pills working, there was a little pop, like a water balloon.
00:20:28
Speaker
And was like, what? And then, like, something came out. Something. And I realized after that it's it was the little sack popped. yeah So it was like a miniature water break.
00:20:40
Speaker
it was just It's just crazy how your body works. How far along were you at that stage, if I'm not asking? 13 14 weeks.
00:20:49
Speaker
um Because we'd already told people. so it's definitely the 12 week mark going past. And we we didn't really tell people. Even when we ended up having babies and through a carrier, we didn't. We still didn't tell people.
00:21:05
Speaker
but We told like really close friends because of the it was unusual, the situation. That was one of the weirdest and shittiest things that happened. but But just, again, i just put on friends and, and like, had a good time with Elizabeth and went out that night.
00:21:25
Speaker
And I was in a heap and I was taking painkillers for the cramps everything. But you just, I don't know, I didn't want to waste the time being there and I didn't want to, I thought I was there for a year, you know, but I didn't want to,
00:21:37
Speaker
wallow in it. I didn't want to just sit around feeling shit like this isn't worrying. It was kind of like a coping mechanism where we just go and have an experience. And a lot of times I find myself in nature and in the water and that's still my go-to today. Did my cousin's days consecutively in the sea that really helps. all right I don't know if it's just an Irish thing but my God the difference when you come back to Ireland and you're sitting in the woods it is Like it's home and it's, yeah, 100% healing.
00:22:12
Speaker
In America, was still very foreign to me being out in the woods or in the sea, just like, what the fuck is that thing? Or you just, I was sitting on a rock one day and I looked over and there's this yellow and black snake, you know, so it wasn't the same.
00:22:26
Speaker
Yeah. first here it say heard Also, if you're sitting in the woods over here, somebody, somebody is either going to probably call the cops on you or a serial killer will find you. I feel like, whereas in Ireland, it's like, no.
00:22:40
Speaker
but that Just be like, oh, look at your one. That's all right. She's crying out of hell. I wonder if she okay. Fucking Asia. Out of it. Gotta grab.
00:22:51
Speaker
So I met a girl quite like how I met online. She owned modeling agency and we got chatting and she was like, you want to do some work? And was going, absolutely not. I'm doing IVF at the moment. And she was like, I just did IVF.
00:23:05
Speaker
We became fast friends, still are fast friends. And she used a carrier, ah gestational carrier to have her babies because she had MS, has MS. And so knowing her,
00:23:19
Speaker
In the beginning of all of this, she introduced me to that world. And when it came to me and Greg being completely done with me being sick, I'm pregnant all the time.
00:23:30
Speaker
pregnant all the time. That we were just sick of it. And there's the kind of, you know, when when you look forward, you think everything's going great. And then you look back and you go, Jesus Christ, how do I survive that?
00:23:44
Speaker
Yes. and i think if you had told me all of this stuff, that was was going to happen, i i probably wouldn't have gone to America. probably would have sat in a dark room. Because it's happening gradually, you you don't really have even time to process.
00:24:02
Speaker
It all kind of came crashing in after. And all the dark humor became way too dark. And so so I ended up meeting a gestational carrier through this friend of mine, and my bestie. She was in California. And I decided that I wanted the experience of breastfeeding because I would have had home birth, breastfeeding, all us al of that if I could have. But the gestational carrier um wasn't who we thought she was. Yeah.
00:24:32
Speaker
In the beginning, you know, we talked to this girl. So my friend was getting milk off her because you can get, I don't know how it works in in Ireland, but you can buy ah The milk that matches your child. So we had boy-girl twins. So you would need boy-girl twin milk and you can buy it like $5 per ounce, that kind of stuff. like So Greg went to New York and met this this woman because I was like with the babies and in an absolute heap as well.
00:25:01
Speaker
And he I would find them through either agencies or other people. And God, you just go on Facebook Marketplace and put it in breast milk and it pop up. And some of it was really expensive.
00:25:13
Speaker
Some of it was tested, you know, all that kind of stuff. They had to have tests, but they it wasn't, um when you get it from a bank, it's pasteurized or something.
00:25:24
Speaker
So I wanted a roll from the mammy and the colostrum and everything else. So we did that. But I remember when the babies were coming, Greg did four-hour drive through Florida to go pick up boy-girl milk.
00:25:36
Speaker
And the morning time milk... It's different to the nighttime milk. Like if you mix them up you're going have the baby up all night or a baby asleep in the morning. So it was all had to be very strict and legal and all of those things.
00:25:50
Speaker
So she was one of those girls for right pal and She told her about me. ah My pal told her about me. And then she contacted me and was like, you know, I've always wanted you to do this for a family and da, da, da, da.
00:26:03
Speaker
And she didn't pass the tests for an agency. So she wanted to go indie. And indie is basically just independent. But, you know, indie, crunchy. And i was and am quite crunchy. So that's for want of a better word.
00:26:19
Speaker
um So we talked to her for maybe a year and we went to meet her in Florida and and where you are babes.
00:26:30
Speaker
and And yeah, noel went it all went smooth, but there was just, there was lots of red flags that I ignored because i I had just we'd done one more round and I'd asked the doctors so many times if I could do it naturally, if there was any way they could just take the egg that's going to come out of me anyway. And they were going, no, no, this a better way. And you still have two rounds left. And but then we were, you know, one hundred thousand in a hole before actually not in a hole. We just we paid one hundred thousand before the babies were even born.
00:27:01
Speaker
And so they keep saying to me, it's only 22,000. It's only 8,000, you know, yeah do the another harvest, get it done. And then we were just like, Jesus Christ, like we can't keep this up. So um it was my mom got us a loan in Ireland to get the last harvest.
00:27:17
Speaker
And that's where my bag is getting from. And I never had a problem with eggs. I always had a bunch of eggs and they were always really good. Genetically, everything was fine. yeah But it was when we pumped Greg full of the same vitamins and strict diet and all that other this stuff that things worked.
00:27:34
Speaker
So, you know, don't always blame the girls. and But that is, you know, that is a big problem. Huge problem is that it's automatic. Just the woman is is the problem. And granted, yes, we are the caretaker of the baby for the nine months and stuff. But, you know, it does.
00:27:53
Speaker
It takes two to tango, as they say. You've had about 14 miscarriages, one ectopic pregnancy, right? Yeah. Three ectopics. Three. Three, sorry.
00:28:04
Speaker
Yeah. So you've had 14 miscarriages, three ectopic pregnancies. They were included in there because I used to include it include them. And I used to say I had 11 and then I had 12.
00:28:16
Speaker
And then somebody asked me, why aren't you including them? I met somebody who had ah name on their arm and I said, oh, who's the name? And they said it was in a pregnancy I had. It was mctopic. And I was like,
00:28:27
Speaker
an ectopic, like that was never going to be viable anyway. And she was like, I don't care. It was my baby. And I was like, fucking hell, like I've just been ignoring all of these things, trying to get through. I was trying to feel normal and feel okay and, and sidestep them, which didn't work out in the end.
00:28:44
Speaker
It comes out as a bag of stress. and Yeah. So it had 40 losses total. Okay.
Challenges with a Gestational Carrier
00:28:52
Speaker
And freedom are really my topics. And then we met this girl.
00:28:56
Speaker
We, um she had all the tests we got. We lawyered up everything. um I ignored all the red red flags. So said, we'll do that and another time because it's such a long, harrowing story.
00:29:08
Speaker
And somebody carrying for you like that is threatening suicide and and things. Like it was the worst experience of my entire life. It's like a hostage situation where somebody is holding your babies and you have to pacify them and pretend everything's okay and be nice and ignore all the shitty things that they're saying because your baby's lies are at stake.
00:29:30
Speaker
So, yeah, I was there as much as I possibly could, but it was horrific. Yeah. And it was your, um we'll come back to it. There definitely will be a follow up episode. We already know this.
00:29:43
Speaker
um We, there it was your egg, Greg's sperm. This lady's carrying it. Right. We're going to come back to her. I can already tell people are probably like, no, talk about it now.
00:29:54
Speaker
Guys, there's so much we have to get through. You have absolutely stunning children now. Absolutely. but I mean, you're stunning. Greg's stunning. Like the babies are stunning. It's like the perfect family, which is why you and I have chatted about how it's so interesting, how, and you know, life can look so amazing on the outside, but you never really know what's going on in the pains that are happening on the inside. You know, um I personally haven't had kids, don't have a partner, you know, and I've often envied that in you, but like, look at all that you've gone through and It's and you know, it's it's just it's so fascinating. I find the way we are. And sometimes sometimes we're sitting here with with the babies not sleeping and haven't eaten and need to go the toilet. I'm watching Jen on a ferry like going somewhere with margarita and I'm just like, fuck, we're nice.
00:30:41
Speaker
You know, so it's the exact same and the other way around. You know, you can't. I know at the time to process the life that I lost having these young kids. Yes. I remember talking to my grandmother and it was, i think it was a lot more popular then for women to go through miscarriages and sort of pregnancies and stuff. And my grandmother was supposed to have had 14 children, but she only ended up having seven.
00:31:08
Speaker
And because she lost the babies, because that was just what happened in Ireland at the time. You know, ah we all know now we know even more about these mother, the mother baby homes and that are.
00:31:19
Speaker
Anyway, we won't go into that because that's a whole other thing. and But that's huge, Sarah, like 14 losses is. Yeah, I can't even wrap my head around. But you've two beautiful children and them.
00:31:33
Speaker
Undead. And that three beautiful children. Greg, I'm just kidding. He's amazing. So I had i had a kidney stone. So we were moving our very best friend, Eddie, over there. He owned this bar that I worked in for a little stint.
00:31:47
Speaker
Every best friend I have in America is from that bar. And he had a house with his best friend ah and we were living in an apartment. And I was saying one day, had been so good to me when I had ah loss. He arrived with um like the equivalent of a paddy box.
00:32:05
Speaker
And just I was like, that's that's me, John. I love this guy. And we were telling him that we just it was kind of like an identity crisis coming from your house that you finally got married.
00:32:17
Speaker
you know, lovely big house and let me say, to an apartment on a campus. And there was a bit of, after a couple of years, I was like, this is great fun. But, you know, I don't want to say that it, like my myself and Greg had, you know, like every every relationship, great times, shit times, great times, shit times, great times, shit times.
00:32:40
Speaker
And In the beginning, he was away so much that when he came back, I was pissed off and I was going out. Like there was, yeah I was just like, how can you leave me for three months when I don't know anybody? you know, this kind of stuff.
00:32:54
Speaker
But we also, on the flip side of the coin, became so much closer because it was just us. Even though we were making these new pals and going out and all that kind of stuff, he was the family that I had there.
00:33:09
Speaker
So yeah, he was my family no matter what happened. So we were in Eddie Higgins' house. So we were in Eddie's house, the bestie, he brought me the paddy box and we were moving out of his house because we'd had the babies.
00:33:22
Speaker
And he moved out of his own house. God love him. And I was moving and I i had a kidney stone. I never had a kidney stone before. it was horrific. I kept making jokes about how now I know what labor is like because unbelievable.
00:33:37
Speaker
It's the worst human pun. And I went for a scan. And when I went for the scan, they put you in to like to the CAT scan. It doesn't matter where you're getting scanned on your body. They have you with your arms above your head.
00:33:48
Speaker
And in that scan, I discovered that my arm wouldn't like stay up without this pull feeling. So when I go home, I was like, what's the story of my armpit? And when I go home, I stood in front of me and i noticed that one of my breasts was heavier than the other.
00:34:06
Speaker
And I had dry pumped for five months before the babies arrived so that I could, when they were off the infant milk, that I could breastfeed them and have the experience of breastfeeding, which I did. and it was amazing.
00:34:20
Speaker
But i I wish I hadn't on one end because it was twins and it was a lot and I was exhausted. and But on the other hand, and I put off going to the doctor for this lump I found because I thought it was mastitis.
00:34:36
Speaker
Back when I'd had my first pregnancies, I had a mastitis. It was needle aspiration and an antibiotics and you're all set. So I was going, shit, same exact feeling, itchy, hot, hot.
00:34:50
Speaker
armpit pull, fucking mastitis again. And we were in the middle of moving house out of Eddie's house into a beautiful house in Fairfield. And our lives couldn't have been better.
00:35:02
Speaker
You know, relationship back on track, you know, none of this going away anymore because I got babies, blah, blah, blah. Although we did go away for seven months when the babies were born. So we did for those seven months.
00:35:13
Speaker
But therefore we moved house. Greg is going to get a lot of angry matters after this podcast. Yes. He had fully support what he was doing.
00:35:25
Speaker
He's a dote. We were fully supporting what he was doing.
Cancer Diagnosis and Community Support
00:35:29
Speaker
I just wasn't prepared because I was, especially these nurse feeders, child's oncologist, I can do this. I'm amazing with babies.
00:35:36
Speaker
Baby whisperer from the time I was six. You know, all this kind of stuff. Any time that there was a baby around, you'd just be like, oh, just give me your baby. And I thought I could do it.
00:35:48
Speaker
But oh my God, no. Not when I ate my mammy and Greg, no way. couple of our friends were knocking in all the time, which was great. But it wasn't the same as being able to be there with mammy or whatever. So um it was really hard.
00:36:02
Speaker
So when we moved, all of that was done. Greg's traveling was done. We were home from Ireland and we moved house and I had the kid in stone. And when i i moved, I was looking for a gyno.
00:36:14
Speaker
Now, when you're in the fertility clinic, you're getting all the tests done. And I didn't need anything. But because I graduated or had babies, we had a beautiful boy and a beautiful girl and we had them.
00:36:27
Speaker
I graduated. I didn't have a doctor. And you know what it's like and ah in America. It's so difficult. You have to get referred for every everything. But you also have to get referred for a GI. So I had no one.
00:36:38
Speaker
And yeah, had a pocket for a guide out. It was almost a feckin' grand or something. So I asked my aunt and they used like a regular doctor. So I went to a regular doctor eventually.
00:36:49
Speaker
And this was like October. I felt my boob was different. November, we moved. The end of November, I was looking for a doctor. Then they made me wait three weeks for the appointment.
00:37:01
Speaker
Then it was Christmas. You know, it just shit gets in the way. And so now i get a lot of stick actually from some people saying to shut up about the cancer journey and, you know, stop talking about it, all that kind stuff.
00:37:14
Speaker
I find that work doesn't work for me, baby. That might work for you. It doesn't work for me. I find talking about it helps me. And also the 50 people that have messaged me saying I just found early cervical, including one of my best friends, found early stage cervical cancer because of me pushing, because of my posts, because of my feel it on the first.
00:37:36
Speaker
And I'll never stop doing those things. If it's the people that I knew beforehand that had cancer. Kind of to the outside people were doing good and were dealing with it well and handling it well and they all looked great. so And because it was so ferociously hot, I couldn't wear a wig anyway. I was bald the whole time.
00:37:58
Speaker
It was Connecticut in the summer, like. Your hair falling out hurts. People don't tell you that when you're a cancer patient. Your hair falling out actually hurts. That when you buzz it, so my hair started fall out, I cut it off. And I remember our best days of time saying, what are you cutting off for? It's not falling out. I was like, it is falling out.
00:38:15
Speaker
You do this and it's falling out. So I didn't want to see that happen. That was more traumatic. So I chopped it off into a little French bob and then buzzed it as it started to get like a little patchy at the back and stuff.
00:38:30
Speaker
And it hurt. Anytime you need your head against anything, the dead follicles pushed back into your head. So it's like little needles every time you leaned against something. So was dry brushing and doing all this stuff, like trying to get it all of the rest of the hair out.
00:38:46
Speaker
So on one side... I thought it was better that I chopped it off. It was easier for me mentally. I did not give a shit about the hair. i was like, chomp off the boobs, take out the uterus, take the hair. I don't give a shit.
00:38:57
Speaker
Take everything to keep me here for those babies. I didn't give shit. But I didn't realize that buzzing your head and leaving it to fall out that way hurts like a bitch.
00:39:09
Speaker
Like getting needles in your head every day, every time you lay down. Yeah. So went to the gyno. She said, it looks fine, you know, mastitis, but we'll send you in for ultrasound. They'll confirm and then they'll usually aspirate there.
00:39:21
Speaker
So they do medial aspiration. So they did that and the ultrasound tech brought the doctor in and I'd been on the phone to my friend Pam and she was telling me about her twin sister who's just had a baby. And I was going, this doctor, this ultrasound tech just came in and said like that looks like a tumor to us you need to go to breast specialist immediately and I was like someone's gonna lose their job you can't say that to people you know this fucking tech I didn't know it was the doctor because they all look the same you know they're all hearing the same stuff
00:39:53
Speaker
I realized that the tech had gone to get a doctor. I thought she was getting another tech. And they were coming in and going like, that looks like a tumor. And I was like, where's the doctor? And then I mucked out. i was taking the piss out of it still.
00:40:03
Speaker
It didn't dawn on me that it could actually be a tumor. And I rang my mom and I rang Pam. She was like, let me know how it goes. I rang her back. i was like, they said it was a tumor. And she's like, hopefully it's not, you know, this kind of stuff.
00:40:15
Speaker
And then the next day went to a breast specialist and he did a bioxy. And all in this time, mom and my little brother came flew over. And so they were there with me and we got the news that it was...
00:40:31
Speaker
95% relignant lobular carcinoma and it was 2A at that stage and then the specialist did a surgery it was really long surgery so my husband God love him was in a heap and Rob was there I think my mom had gone home Because the pandemic was kicking in.
00:40:55
Speaker
So they had to leave. And they were both planning on staying as long as they could. And then other people all have the flights but booked. and And it turned out that nobody could come over. But that doctor, Dr. Kenner, saved my life.
00:41:10
Speaker
If he had been in any way of a rush to go play golf or something, I wouldn't be here. He took 29 Lufthansa out and he didn't stop digging into my body until he got three that were negative.
00:41:24
Speaker
So he got 26. They were all positive. And he was obviously, you know, worried for me because we'd had a little... connection then and him Selvin Greg fell in love with each other was a gorgeous good looking tanned man going out to Lake Alva Grego and he was like don't worry you're going to be an old lady I'm going to sort this out for you and then when I came out of the surgery it was a much worse situation I'd gone from two a to 3C and there was no more room to move there the there had been a little spread and
00:41:59
Speaker
to To this day, I'm living with the the effects of those lymph nodes taken out gut lymphedema and the whole other side of me is completely numb. You know, my little kids put their hands on the back and can't feel it.
00:42:11
Speaker
Actually can't feel it. It's completely numb. All of the nerves came out with all lymph nodes. But I'm so grateful to him because... If he had stopped at 26 or 27, yeah, that one's fine. He took three more after the he saw the spread.
00:42:26
Speaker
and And, you know, I'm all dented and scarred, but I'm still here. So it's a small place to hang and sing with a smile on my face because I'm so fucking grateful to be here to see my baby's I just fought so hard, so hard to get them here.
Resilience and the Power of Storytelling
00:42:43
Speaker
To then, i couldn't believe the ridiculousness of it, that I was now writing them letters for their 21st birthday and for their wedding days and all that kind stuff after fighting so hard to have them.
00:42:56
Speaker
It was absolutely ridiculous to me. It didn't make any sense. It's just it's it's mind boggling. It is absolutely mind boggling. And there's even like there's parts of this that I know.
00:43:09
Speaker
So, again, you know, you and I obviously have seen your journey over the last years and we've been friends, you know, internet friends. Yes, I'm there. are swift jen But also, we we we tried to record record this podcast before, but we actually, with the two of us were nearly too excited and to sort of... um yeah I kept laughing. I was like, this is not how I want to come across, Jen, because it's so fun chatting to you.
00:43:35
Speaker
And this story is ridiculous. Yeah. And there was, there's two... Like there's so many other parts to this. um i Like I genuinely feel like this interview could be like three hours long, if not more. But and there's other parts to this as well, because, you know, we talked about, which I do want to touch on. There was an incident with a needle incident.
00:43:56
Speaker
And we also need to talk about how your thoughts on IVF. yeah contributing to what you're currently going through and did go through. So, yeah and you know, let's touch on that because those were mind boggling. I kept saying to myself, go say, say what Jen told you.
00:44:18
Speaker
If you miss something to say. Can I just go back for a second? Because the surgery ah that my mom flew over for, you know, I had gone, been put to sleep for the surgery saying, please have a phone beside my bed.
00:44:34
Speaker
ah don't want my mom to know until I know what's happening because I haven't a clue. They said mectopic, but, you know, had a belly full of blood. And so I said, just please have a ah phone there for me.
00:44:47
Speaker
And so they did. They had an old dial phone there for me. And I was like, my phone would have been fine, but thank you. And I ran my mom. She knew straight away something was wrong. I was like, I'm in trouble.
00:44:58
Speaker
Mom. And she was like, ran away. You know, i she just stood up and went to the airport and got a flight. um And so I was sitting in my bedroom and she had gone to get like, the we found this vegan place that had vegan icing and you could ask for extra. And she'd gone there to get muffins and vegan icing.
00:45:16
Speaker
Because she had planned to come over for my birthday, which is Halloween. And we landed in August. It was September. um i think it was six weeks after we landed was the ectopic rupture. So she had a flight booked to come surprise me for Halloween.
00:45:30
Speaker
And she was going to order a cake from here and we were going to go pick it up and she would surprise us there. So she went there to get the cupcakes and I got this phone call. And it was this guy and telling me that the needle that had been used to put me to sleep had been used on 40 other people that day, two of them homeless.
00:45:50
Speaker
And they couldn't find those homeless people. So i went into three, four months of infection control, um every four days going for a blood test to see if I had HIV or AIDS or any of the hepatitis, hepatis um any of those things like HPV, all of them, I was going test, test after test after test.
00:46:13
Speaker
And this guy, we'd actually been taking piss out of, that anesthesiologist looked like he'd had a night out. He'd like, one of his, the lapels of his stomach, of his shirt hanging out and he was kind of all over the place big long beard which was kind of funny for somebody in such a professional setting to just look so feel it yeah he was disheveled and myself and Greg were taking piss out and coming from the stone having good night out and then I was like bye i love you see you when I wake up and then this bastard was using the same it was a needle that goes into the beginning in your arm
00:46:50
Speaker
The IV. Yeah. And so that was horrific. And then I went to the doctor who I won't name for legal reasons, and she told me that the statute of limitations had gone because it was a year before I realized that we could sue the fucking shit out of them.
00:47:08
Speaker
We had this letter of apology stating everything that happened, and she said no. She said she would be dragged through the courts, and also it was the time frame for suing was gone.
00:47:21
Speaker
And we were going into another IVF cycle. So we had no support. There was nobody there telling us, yes, you should do something about that, considering they are bleeding you dry for IVF that you don't need because you get pregnant.
00:47:35
Speaker
So it was all, you kind of trust doctors and what they tell you. And then when something bad happens, they just move you on to the next thing that they're going to do and it costs a lot of money.
00:47:50
Speaker
And then ah you're just kind of left... to your own devices to process all this crazy shit that had happened. So it wasn't until I came home that I started to, I kept a diary, a journal the whole time I was in America and it was was not until I came home and read the diary from start to finish that I realized how crazy the story was. It was something horrific that somebody would have in their lifetime over and over and over again.
00:48:19
Speaker
I was in the end diagnosed with that continuous, um because I don't take PTSD lightly. ah don't take that diagnosis lightly. And um I didn't think I had it.
00:48:32
Speaker
But the therapist and psychiatrist that was seeing when I was diagnosed with cancer said that I had this continuous trauma syndrome. So it was, you know, lights or noise or jump scares, which I freaking loved.
00:48:49
Speaker
roller coasters, any of that stuff. And I would just pass away because my body had completely changed. My mind had completely changed. It was just too much trauma. And I was going, it's grand. Let's go get margaritas. It'll be flying, you know, and then and I wasn't processing any of it.
00:49:07
Speaker
Until I got into the forest and into the sea in Ireland. And then it all came fully the ice floating out. Floating out. had so many moments in the sea and sea points where I was like, there's God there.
00:49:19
Speaker
That's Yeah. And I'd never been like that before. I was like, who else is doing that? Sending a, like, a seal up to come up and talk to me or I'm there on my own and this like, a double rainbow in the sky and and the the rain stops. Like, sounds crazy, but, like, these magical things happened to me when I was in the sea and in the forest. And
Nature's Role in Mental Health
00:49:40
Speaker
you just go, Jesus, it...
00:49:42
Speaker
I am teeny tiny and this universe is so much bigger and there's so much more going on. There's nothing else. I came out of the sea one day into the car. Greg doesn't love getting into the sea. He's not really a beach guy.
00:49:54
Speaker
ah He's more of golf course guy. And he'd be sitting in the car. You know, he'd, during the winter months, high tide would be nighttime. So I'd be getting into the sea. I was not missing a day.
00:50:05
Speaker
it was my mental health. And when I get into the sea, all the tension was gone. And yes, it was cold water shock now and all that kind of stuff too.
00:50:15
Speaker
But the relief of it, it's like acupuncture. Do you ever get acupuncture? yep And I feel kind of like stoned or something that you can't move and you're like forced to relax.
00:50:28
Speaker
And then you have this outer but out of body experience and the sea was like that. You'd get in, you'd be freezing cold. you' like look ah My sister-in-law started coming with me and she became my swim buddy. And now i couldn't even go without her because she was so amazing for me.
00:50:43
Speaker
love her so much. And we broke through so many like processes of all of the shitty things that happened down there like at sea is just amazing but I so I fully believe in like nature and all of those things like it's about learning how to rise out ashes like they say this is how I feel about grief I'm like you don't need to take somebody else's trauma and to minimize or maximize your own.
00:51:12
Speaker
We're all on a different journey and what's painful to you might not be as painful to somebody else and vice versa. You cannot be comparing your issues, your grief, your trauma with somebody else's and you cannot judge somebody else's.
00:51:27
Speaker
And I was like, how the fuck is that early loss when you've seen four scans of your baby's heartbeat and then at least it was only like, at least you didn't tell people like, fuck off. It was horrible.
00:51:39
Speaker
But yeah, the it's it's it's not about avoiding the fall. It's about rising from the fall and getting up every time. Yeah. But then, yeah. yeah giving yourself time to grieve as well though I do think that you know you know get up yes we all have to get up and put one foot in front of the other but it's also about allowing yourself the time to grieve and I think by the sounds of it you didn't get that chance fairly often yeah crazy did not process any of it I laughed through all of it and then like people would be like
00:52:14
Speaker
You know, it's great that you're putting your head down and getting through a global pandemic and cancer at the same time. But we have no choice. What else am I going to do?
00:52:25
Speaker
You know, throw myself off a building. I had two kids and a husband and a family at home who I didn't know if I was going to see again. That's one of the one things that is hard for me to say without crying because...
00:52:36
Speaker
I say goodbye to my mom in Connecticut. I didn't know her to see her again. You know, they're the things that maybe wouldn't have come into other people's heads because it wasn't as serious, you know, like, oh, the pandemic will have to postpone our flight. I was like, I'm going to die over here and I'm not going to see them ever again. I'm not going to put my hat my feet on Irish soil. So when I did, my God, I made a show myself. oh But I do find that, especially all the women in my family who have all been through hell,
00:53:03
Speaker
The you have to stay your internal voice has to stay positive because if you allow yourself to come down into that, like, oh, my God, fuck this shit or I hate him or why is he doing this?
00:53:15
Speaker
Or or why did the doctor say that? Or like can't believe this is happening to me. Why me? If you keep that going, you will collapse. You have to keep that inner, your own voice that's in your, I talk to my kids about it all the time. That's you in there.
00:53:30
Speaker
You have control over that. So if you're feeling some kind of way and you think that's not okay, I don't know how to do that. You s say to yourself, yes, I can. and I do. And I will. yeah And you will rise. And the ashes like a phoenix.
00:53:44
Speaker
um But it's mad, isn't it? The stuff that we go through. Yeah. And then you realize after, like, I see myself bald now and I thought I was fine back then. People might think that I chose this hairstyle. It's totally you fine.
00:53:58
Speaker
But when I look back, it's quite shocking. It's quite shocking when you look back, like what happened when actually when you're in the middle of it, you're like, this is totally fine. I look normal, don't I? And then I look back and I'm like, Jesus Christ, like I was putting the kids to bed and making food and doing all this stuff and trying to get somebody to come and mind the kids during a pandemic when no one wanted to go near anybody.
00:54:18
Speaker
To go to get chemotherapy was mental when you think about it. um But what we show and what we carry are rarely the same.
Misconceptions about Fertility Treatments
00:54:31
Speaker
So what I was showing was everything's fine, everything's going to be fine. And even if it's not fine, it's going to fine. But what I was carrying was way heavier. And you only realize when you get to look back and go, Jesus, have some work to do, lads.
00:54:47
Speaker
Getting under the sea quick. And you, I mean, the whole journey is just, it's so heartbreaking for so many reasons. But, you know, you had these 14 losses. You were then thrown into a fertility clinic that you didn't have a problem being fertile. That wasn't the problem. It was the ah carrying and the, for first whatever reason, which is, said, you never feed it. A specialist.
00:55:12
Speaker
Then it was, it was that. So, I mean, it's bananas to me. So it was that IVF crap that then resulted.
00:55:24
Speaker
So my, so my specialist, um, a different specialist, cause I played that out. this This will be the thumbnail for take up that bit out.
00:55:36
Speaker
But I was in a room. ah was it I was in a room with a breast specialist. And so he told me that when he found out how many IVFs I'd done, and I'd actually been harvesting first, you know, I wasn't trying to get pregnant IVF. I was harvesting eggs for my future because I was losing babies.
00:56:00
Speaker
And even that with the progesterone and estrogen, after two, don't quote me on this, but after two or three, Or maybe it's from the get-go IVFs. You are 25% more likely to have a cancer in your lifetime.
00:56:16
Speaker
And that was never said to me. And it's in no fine print. I have every freaking document from the entire journey. All the genesis, genetics, everything, all Yale University, all of the IVF stuff.
00:56:29
Speaker
Nowhere does it say that it causes cancer. And that specialist told me that my tumor was made up of progesterone and estrogen that I had been injecting to get pregnant.
00:56:41
Speaker
And that was wild to me that I so many times sat them down and had a meeting and asked them, could I not do IVF?
00:56:52
Speaker
Like, why am I doing IVF if I'm getting pregnant? They would say to bypass the tube that you have. But I have a tube. Why not use the tube until that's gone? Or if it doesn't work, if I have an ectopic again.
00:57:04
Speaker
So myself and Greg were in between IVFs, then we got pregnant. And it turned out to be an ectopic. So had to take more melchotrexate. It's bloody crazy. And then... youre an iv yeah during During two IVFs and they were like, give your body a break now, you know, get off the estral and then I'd go back on it again and have a test and they'd do, you know, a scan and give a little test and I was pregnant.
00:57:30
Speaker
So I was getting pregnant in between IVFs. I did not need to be doing my IVF. And when I look back at it now, like I remember even the gestational barrier saying, like, what do these drugs do to you?
00:57:41
Speaker
And I was just like, I don't know. You know, because you just think it's going to be fine. It'll flush out of your body and then it'll be fine. But actually, it has profound effects on your body.
00:57:52
Speaker
And I find that, yeah, hard way. Yeah, it's a huge problem, I think. and the I mean, we all know, I think, even if even the most sort of blinkered person on knows that the pharma industry is it's like even when they talk about the funeral industry and they hate me using the term industry. and You know, there's people in the industry who don't like using the word industry. And I'm like, but it is that.
00:58:16
Speaker
And, you know, it's the same as talking about pharma. We don't want to think that our health is a business. or our death care is a business. But hello, it is. Because you know what?
00:58:28
Speaker
In modern day times, everything is a goddamn business. Everything is a transaction. It's what can you give me for what I give you? And that's just the end of it. And I think if we stop being so delulu about how everyone is just, you know, sitting in fields and, and you know, in ring-a-ring-a-posy and and in daisy fields and whatnot, like, it's not that. Unfortunately, like, that's what we've created. It's just monsters.
00:58:53
Speaker
And it's greed, it's corporate greed, it's money, and it's our health care on the line. I saw that in cancer treatment. I saw that firsthand in cancer treatment where luckily in America they give you a medical card for your diagnosis.
00:59:10
Speaker
So instead of taking the Colace and the painkillers and the pill for the Colace that gives you side effects, them and then all this other stuff, they put me on a pill that was for the hot flashes.
00:59:24
Speaker
The hot flashes were seven tons of vomit and they give me more pills for that. And then i saw this doctor who asked me that I went to medical college. So they give you and like high dose CBD and THC.
00:59:38
Speaker
In tea bags, honey, different things. And it's all for the symptoms that you have. And it's natural. They don't do that in Ireland unless you're stage four, which I think is absolutely brutal.
00:59:50
Speaker
If you're diagnosed with cancer, you should get the medical card for stage. the height is high dose CBD or THC to help you through those symptoms they are the most horrific I was begging Greg on my knees please God don't I can't do another chemotherapy I can't is the worst thing you go out and drink some some petrol mixed with nail polish remover while stabbing yourself in the eye like it's the worst thing ever seriously I'd be like Jesus Christ
01:00:22
Speaker
I had a spittoon beside my bed because I couldn't swallow my own saliva or vomit. It was like all of these things. You don't even think like, oh, yeah, it's terrible. You have to get out of chemotherapy.
01:00:34
Speaker
But what you have to put up with is, like I did yoga one day and I passed down until the floor, Greg came and thought I was dead. I went for a walk and this the place where we lived, I had, you know, in America, they really look after you. yeah When you're in a private and housing estate and a pool and there's gardeners and, you know, people shummer your snow for you have to do anything.
01:00:58
Speaker
And they dug a hole for a tree and the lush grass had grown over and I fell into the hole. But it was just a little dent. I broke my ankle and my arm and everything else. Like, I mean, dislocated my arm and broke my ankle just going for a walk. Like it's because the chemotherapy was messing with my bones, which it still is. I'm currently in a boosh.
01:01:22
Speaker
For a break in my ankle, running out to go for a swim at sea point, trashed myself at the end of the stairs. So there's all of these other effects that you don't realize. Everyone's moment about their perimenopause and all the stuff that's going on. And, you know, they stub their toe. And I'm like, I can't get into how many symptoms I have and side effects I was still dealing with that poor Greg is still dealing with, too.
01:01:47
Speaker
You know, some mornings I can't walk and it's so stiff. I'm like, I want cup of tea. If he's not there, I just have to suffer until I can get down there and get a cup of tea. But he has now become the man that leaves a cup of tea beside the bed or even when he's going out at 6.30 in the morning and I do the school runs and that kind of stuff.
01:02:05
Speaker
I still need help because I'm booked. Cancer treatment ruins you for life. So it's not just while you're in it.
01:02:17
Speaker
It's for the rest of your life. We had a backtrack a little bit. The last um IVF I did was three months. female embryos and they all talk so I was pregnant with tricklets and we lost one at a time and I said that's it I'm done I want a baby ah don't even fucking want a baby You know, I don't want one.
01:02:39
Speaker
but don't want to be I don't want to be pregnant ever again. So these people thinking, oh God, like she didn't get to carry her baby. My vagina is great. You know, like my stomach's great. I don't have like, but I know my mother, my mother never had any a stretch marks anyway. So I would have been fine there. But you know, all those things you worry about when you're younger, try your whole life, like make sure you don't get pregnant, make sure you don't get pregnant, take all the shitty pills, not get pregnant.
01:03:05
Speaker
And then when it comes getting pregnant, you're just, it You know, it's the opposite way. youre like, oh my God, I can't sustain. And then when it came down to it, I'm so grateful for the body that gave me my twins because I didn't have to do it because I was spent.
01:03:19
Speaker
I was done-zoned. And, you know, I'd been pregnant for like almost three years in total of my life with no baby alive, you know? So people would be like, had you been pregnant before? You know, doctors or whoever.
01:03:33
Speaker
And I'd be like, yeah, a lot. And they'd be like, how kids you have? None. Or you do like one of those little fill out sheets for the doctor when you go in they're like, how many times are you were pregnant and you take it off?
01:03:44
Speaker
And then how many live births? And I'd be like, none. You know, it got to be ridiculous. And I would try to make these people feel comfortable by messing about it, which can come across like just immature. But actually, that's just how me and Greg deal with things is we are somewhat erachtic.
01:04:05
Speaker
ah wrapped up fallopian tube for christmas it's just how you get through you very much do like your social media cracks me up but like you know i love it because there's there's an equal amount of realness and reality and advice as well you know like get your but boobies checked and all that sort of good stuff that people need and the ivf warnings and stuff But also then you just ultimately you just see four human beings, too bait too many ones um and too grown ass ones kind of, and who just love each other so much,
Family Support during Illness
01:04:42
Speaker
you know. And there's just so many moments that like I nearly brings tears to my eyes when I see some of the like there was one where you were in the hospital um room and you were they were across the street waving and your little girl was waving and I was like, my God.
01:04:58
Speaker
My nose, I kept coming back. So I had, I'm like co-sleeper, all of the, you know, making my own soaps and all that kind of stuff and to to have never, never spent a night away from them.
01:05:14
Speaker
And then I ended up in hospital with suspected patients lung cancer and suspected um tuberculosis. And so they had me in quarantine for two and a half weeks.
01:05:27
Speaker
And it turned out to be just a nishmash of, I was working at a classroom in a preschool and it turned out to just be COVID, bronchitis, pleurisy,
01:05:39
Speaker
walking pneumonia all mixed in to my radiated lung which is just tighter than the other lung and so it consolidated in the lung and they thought it was cancer but I was like oh my god it's back and we were supposed to go to Vegas to see yeah the bestie And go on this little k connecttic tri-state area tour to see all of our pals since we slunk out of the country.
01:06:04
Speaker
COVID and cancer. Good job. And then we were coming back and I ended up in hospital we postponed. And then this year we were going again. Then I broke my ankle and my foot. The same day.
01:06:16
Speaker
Yeah, maybe something was stopping us from going. Jen, we'll have to come to Florida instead. I have to talk about the community though. whatever people say about America and the government and blah, blah, the community spirit over there is amazing. There's always a party, always, always a gathering.
01:06:34
Speaker
And we miss that so much. Like we are like the crazy people in the town. They're like, let's go do this. Let's go camping. Let's go do this. Because it's so much fun. And as our new pal Val said when we moved here, geez, you're really throwing yourself into living, haven't you? Like we've got chickens within a week of moving in.
01:06:52
Speaker
We've got the puppy, you know, just painting the house, knocking out windows and walls and just like living from the day from day one. ah yeah And so I love that saying, bloom where you're planted because you shouldn't.
01:07:05
Speaker
slow down or not live as full as you can yet. And I don't think that I've changed from before I was diagnosed or before day infertility battle.
01:07:17
Speaker
and Well, is it an infertility battle if you're getting pregnant all the time? But I don't think, like people are like, have you have you changed? Did you gain more perspective? No. i was like this before.
01:07:30
Speaker
boss yeah you have way more compassion for anybody going through anything. My aunt lost our baby cousins when and Anna was born with Edward syndrome and she was five months old when she lost her.
01:07:45
Speaker
And when I had ah couple of miscarriages in a row, I remember having a conversation with her and she made me realize that, like you said earlier earlier on Everyone's pain is valid.
01:08:01
Speaker
So it doesn't matter if you've had a stillborn or your baby passed away a couple of years old or you've had a miscarriage. That pain is all the same. It's pain. And so every single pain has to be respected.
01:08:15
Speaker
And that's something that I've learned from all of my experiences that somebody giving out about something that matters to them is valid. Whereas before, maybe I would have gone like go over it like it's fucking nothing, you know, whereas pain is pain is pain is pain. It's all pain.
01:08:31
Speaker
And so two girls that I connected with when I came home, had been through horrific situations. One of them, Sarah, had lost her goddaughter to choking incident.
01:08:43
Speaker
And one of them, Sinead, had lost her husband, who happened to be a family friend of ours. And it was on their holidays and m she was pregnant with his child when and he passed away.
01:08:57
Speaker
Just horrific experiences. And so we all bunched in together and started this website that Sarah had this amazing web website. You know, she's just fantastic at all of that stuff.
01:09:10
Speaker
She had Lucy and me. So she started the website and brought me in for the cancer section. And it has blown up since then. But the aim for me, i always said I was going to do a website or ah like a building where people could come in when they needed help. Like I wanted to do something.
01:09:32
Speaker
Went from the cottage business in Connecticut with the organic products and, you know, wall hangings and weaving and dream cutters and anything I can make with my hands. And that was something that got me through shitty experiences was crafting, as they call it in America. Oh, you're so crafty. And I'm like, crafting sounds like I'm five, but actually it is. It's just I come from a long line of artists and singers and musicians and both my brothers and my mom and everybody and my grandmother and grandfather. They met on stage, you know, that kind of stuff.
01:10:03
Speaker
It all comes down to what works for you. And crafts worked for me. I would go through somebody's shitty. I'd make seven batches of soap. um And then I'd sell them in a fair, like had a vendor's license. all that And I ended up in eight shops in Connecticut. And during COVID, that all collapsed.
01:10:19
Speaker
of course, and then we slunk home bankrupt. We didn't even touch on any of that, but the we had the the best life crawling out of the doom from having babies, um you know, the fertility costs to having Yale health insurance and not being covered for cancer benefits or surgery benefits. And I had this bye-bye boobie photo shoot with this lowly girl, Nicole, who who's, it was, I think it was her idea and she did it for nothing and she was amazing.
01:10:50
Speaker
And a look back on those photos like, I'm so glad that it happened because I wasn't going to do it. Basically, I wanted, when that business collapsed, I knew when I came back to Ireland that I would still start something again.
Creating a Supportive Community
01:11:04
Speaker
And so this has worked for me that I wanted to create something that I, back in 2020 being diagnosed, could come across.
01:11:15
Speaker
And could read the stories of people that have been through what I've been through or been through what Sinead had been through and Sarah had been through and get comfort from those stories.
01:11:27
Speaker
All I did when I was diagnosed was search for people that had the same diagnosis as me, the same stage and young people. Just to see if they were alive and how they were doing.
01:11:37
Speaker
And yeah, from that search, found this tribe of wonderful ladies that were still all in touch on Instagram. Some of them we've met. They really have and changed the course of my life. And some of them are in heaven now.
01:11:51
Speaker
And it's it's just, it's such an important community to have. Like this one, like... your one I'm good grief it just was something that really wanted to be part of so when Sarah contacted me about it I was like not only am I in but I'm also going to like put my all into it because it's something that I wanted to find when i was diagnosed so that's It's a community. So I do swims and we all meet up and Sinead does walks and we're going to continue to try and get people that are grieving together yeah to not do what I did and hide away from it.
01:12:28
Speaker
So it's goodgrief.ie. It's based in Ireland, and especially a lot of the physical in-person activities. They're all in Ireland. But if you're over in the US, you're more than welcome to join in any of their virtual activities.
01:12:42
Speaker
and Actually, I have a page in there, which we're going to put all of this information anyway below and both the podcast and the YouTube. So Listen, Sarah, we could talk to you. I know I could talk to you all day and night. You did great. You did great. We're doing It's a fantastic episode. It touches on so many things.
01:13:02
Speaker
We will definitely have you back maybe in season six or something because there's so there is still so many stories. I mean, it's just bananas. We haven't even touched on the stories that kind of connected us at the very beginning of all of this, like the fairy stories and all of the and you getting knocked down and you the babysitting you did for families and stuff like that. There's still so much.
01:13:22
Speaker
So if and when Sarah's book comes out, everyone better buy it because it's going to be epic anyway. Yeah. like of Thank you so much for sharing your story.
01:13:33
Speaker
Thank you for just being you. And i don't know, like brave, courageous. Jesus. Yeah. Just thank you for for having us. And my brother, my brother had a had a gig in town and my cousins came to it. And my oldest brother, my oldest cousin, Con, when I said, thank you for coming. I'm so glad you're here to the gig.
01:13:52
Speaker
He said, Sarah, we're glad you're here. And I was like, oh, no. and because just it brings it back doesn't it all the time so I'm glad you were here too un day we'll count glasses I know hopefully soon mother of god our little snail mail relationship snail mail on the internet but anyway ah we'll eventually get the physical one going alright my love thank you so much and we will talk to you soon