Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Amber Bites Big with Ally Doubé - Head of Marketing @Uber & Uber Eats – Japan
331 Plays1 year ago
Coming to you from Tokyo Japan, Amber Bonney will be co-hosting Bite Big's first episode with boss woman and innovative powerhouse Ally Doubé, Head of Marketing for Uber & Uber Eats Japan.
Inspired by Amber's own Mantra, 'bite big and chew like hell', in this episode we will delve into what Ally's own personal mantra is, and what it means, “Cut through the bullshit, make really cool shit, live for the real shit and help people find “it”!” We discuss how she coined it, how it helps set her focus and energy, and how it helped define her true north star.
These boss women delve deep into what elements have impacted their careers and have helped define who they are today, the importance of having balance and discipline in their lives and what expectations they and others place on them, as Ally says "The person who puts the most pressure on me is myself". They discuss how important it is to help raise others up, to help others find their own personal mantra's that will help guide and live their lives by and how one can only really grow through imperfection.
Tune in as Ally shares with us what her version of 'biting big' is, her belief in "faking it until you make it" and what her biggest boss move is to date!
This episode is dedicated to two great boss women in Ally's life, her mother, Janet, who she lost to breast cancer when Ally was just 28 years old, and Natalyia Senytsya who is the founder of Angels Care a Ukrainian charity that provides support for families experiencing the loss of a baby. A donation of $500 has been made to both Angels Care and National Breast Cancer Foundation on behalf of Ally.
If you would like to know more about our host Amber Bonney her business The Edison Agency or co-host Ally Doubé you can connect and follow these boss women via the socials links below!
Ally's Linkedin
The Edison Agency's LinkedIn
The Edison Agency's Instagram
Amber's Instagram
Amber's LinkedIn
National Breast Cancer Foundation
Angels Care
Recommended
Transcript
Acknowledgment of Traditional Owners
00:00:00
Speaker
On behalf of the Bite Big team and my co-hosts today, I'd like to acknowledge the traditional owners of the land. Not the land that we are recording on because we recorded this episode in Tokyo, but the land that this has been edited, created, workshopped, and had numerous emails and phone calls from the Boonwurrung people of the Kulin Nation.
00:00:21
Speaker
We recognise First Peoples of Australia as the original storytellers, designers and artists of this country and we pay our respect to their elders past, present and emerging.
Introduction to 'Bite Big' Podcast
00:00:42
Speaker
Hello, good morning, and welcome to episode one of White Big, a podcast about boss women leading big brands. I'm your host, Amber Bonney, and wow, do I have an absolute powerhouse of a co-host with me today, introducing Allie Dubay. Welcome, Allie. We're recording this episode from the super cool, or should I say uber cool? Pardon the pun.
00:01:05
Speaker
Studio in Tokyo, Japan. Pretty privileged to be here. And by the way, it happens to be cherry blossom season. So I'm pretty excited about that. I'm going to introduce Ali and then she will get to say hello. Ali is an experienced marketing leader with a demonstrated history of working across major Australian government and consumer brands like the Australian Trade and Investment Commission and the iconic Arnott Biscuits.
00:01:27
Speaker
which is where we stumbled across each other about five or six years ago. So far, Ali, you've spent your career spanning communications, brand strategy, product innovation, creative problem solving, digital strategy, insight development and analytics. The list goes on and on. Really, what don't you do is probably more the question. You are probably one of the most passionate driven and innovative markets that I've ever come across in my 25 year history. And it's no bloody wonder that today you hold the position of
00:01:54
Speaker
Head of Marketing Japan for Uber and Uber Eats. And oh my God, congratulations on that role. Firstly, could you be more of a boss woman if you tried? What an intro. I feel like I'm semi-lost for words, which is quite the rarity for me. That doesn't happen often. Thank you. I feel very privileged to be sitting across from you. I'm pinching myself that we're in Tokyo together. What a fortuitous turn of events. And I'm really excited to chat through the podcast today.
Inspiration Behind the Podcast: 'Bite Big and Chew Like Hell'
00:02:24
Speaker
Well, the Bite Big podcast came about really inspired by my personal mantra, Bite Big and True Like Hell. That mantra has really gotten me to where I am today, both personally and professionally. And when we were brainstorming, what should this podcast be about? We thought, well, if Bite Big's your mantra, why doesn't each episode be based on the mantra of the boss women that you're interviewing and how that's motivated them and how we can use that to help get under the skin of what it means to be a boss woman leading a big brand.
00:02:53
Speaker
So I'm going to read out your mantra and then you're going to tell me a bit about it. So your mantra is cut through the bullshit, make really cool shit, live for the real shit and help people find it. And for those who are listening, Ali sent me a PC and non PC version. Then when I read the non PC version, I was expecting some sea bombs and way more explicit content. And it really just was the word shit.
00:03:16
Speaker
So how did this magic
Finding Personal Purpose and Career Focus
00:03:18
Speaker
come about? Talk to me. I think a few years ago we were doing some work as a leadership team at Uber around finding your purpose, your life purpose and your career purpose. And I think I realized that despite the many and varied career history that I had, I'd never actually sat down and tried to define what actually motivates me, what can help be a guardrail for me in terms of setting focus and setting energy.
00:03:43
Speaker
And so I sat down and tried to workshop, what is it that actually defines my North Star and also helps keep me on track when things are tricky or tough or stressful? What can I use to help remind me what's important? I really love that. I love that at Uber, you sit down and talk about your personal purpose. What a great way to initiate yourself into a business.
00:04:06
Speaker
So how do you show up for this? What are the principles about cutting through the bullshit? I mean, making cool shit is innate, I think, in your DNA, given A, the brand that you work for, but also that bucket list of all the career milestones for you to date in innovation and brand development. How does that show up for you?
00:04:25
Speaker
Yeah. How about I start by kind of breaking it down a little bit, because there's four key components to the mantra. So I think the first concept is about cutting through the bullshit. And I think as a leader in any way, shape or form, this is the most important thing to be able to cut through complexity, bullshit politics, whatever it is, to get to the core of either a strategic challenge, to get to the core of a brand insight, or to get to the core of a problem and a complex problem that you're trying to solve.
00:04:54
Speaker
I think this is just getting rid of red tape, creating clear and compelling direction and making sure that, you know, everybody's really on that journey and clear as to where we need to go. So that's the kind of first part of it. And I think if you know me as a person, I'm a very cut to the chase person. I don't spend time mincing my words. I'm quite direct. Raw authenticity is what I would define that as. So I think this is really definitely true to who I am as a person, as well as how I work and what's important for work and success, I believe.
00:05:23
Speaker
Make really cool shit, I think, is an interesting one. What I really mean by this is cool is ineffective, not cool as in, wow, that's really hip and cool. And I think there's so many parts to this when it comes to marketing specifically that's really important. Obviously, everything from cut through as a North Star and the attention economy and how important it is to actually get people's attention with anything because otherwise.
00:05:45
Speaker
there's no point doing what you're doing. But really at the heart of what motivates me is driving effectiveness, effective marketing, marketing that works and marketing that has impact. So impact is key, isn't it? Yeah, I think making really cool shit is not just about fun things, it's really about how to drive effectiveness and prove that effectiveness overall. Live for the real shit. When I spoke about guardrails, this is probably the one that's a really important guardrail
Journey to Work-Life Balance
00:06:11
Speaker
for me. I've had many different
00:06:14
Speaker
attitudes to my career through my working life. And there were times where career was absolutely everything for me. And I would be more than happy to work a 12 hour day, every day, 15 hour day, every day, work weekends and really not have any boundaries. And there's been moments through my life where I've realised that that is completely not the way it should be.
00:06:36
Speaker
Work is a big part of your life and I believe it's important to to enjoy what you do because you spend so much time there. But work is not your life. And I think this is really about what's the real shit. It's family. It's friends. It's.
00:06:51
Speaker
self-care, its balance and making sure that that is the most important thing, not work at all costs. So that to me is a really important guardrail and I know where I've struggled in my career, it's often when that is not prioritised. That's amazing. And for those of you who don't know Ali, who will definitely be doing some research and looking you up on LinkedIn, no doubt. If you don't mind me saying, I don't like to introduce women's age, but you are
00:07:17
Speaker
early 30s, a good 15 years younger than me. How long did it take you to get to that point where you understood finding that balance? Because I imagine early in your career that wasn't the case.
00:07:32
Speaker
Yeah, I think it took a while. It also took big events. So I lost my mom when I was 28. And it was a big moment of reappraisal for me to say, you know, it sounds really stereotypical, but at the end of your life, you're not sitting back going, look at all the impact I've had in my career. What a great power point, I believe. That's exactly it, right? It's about the friendships, your relationships and the people that are closest to you. And that's all that matters. So there was a lot of kind of big moments. But
00:07:59
Speaker
Even past that, I still over-indexed in work and I find that it's a really risky strategy to over-invest yourself into your career because you're not in direct control of everything. So from a mental health point of view, from a physical health point of view, if you pour yourself 100% into your job, that becomes who you are.
00:08:19
Speaker
And if your job isn't going well, you aren't going well. And I think it's so important to delineate yourself from your job and your career. It's really important to love what you do. I truly believe that. And if you can be passionate and interested and wake up every day excited about your career, fantastic. But you need to delineate yourself from your job because they are very different things.
00:08:40
Speaker
Yeah, it was a lot of probably missteps that let me know, understand that in conjunction with the Pippinies that, you know, have come through hardship. And I'm sure that would resonate with lots of people. It's certainly not a skill that I feel like I have harnessed with complete synergy as a business owner and like you, quite a driven person. It's a constant check in reminder. And for those people who have children and specifically for mothers, as they say, if you don't look after yourself, you then can't care for
00:09:11
Speaker
children. That's why on planes they say parents put your mask on first because then you're no help to anyone else. So I can certainly understand how that would resonate.
00:09:19
Speaker
Yeah, I completely agree and I think what's really interesting is when you realize that you're the one that's in control, you're the only person that can control this. It's everything from the hours you work to how many times you check your phone on the weekend for emails. When you realize it's just you that's standing in the way of your ability to have balance, it's such an uncomfortable but
00:09:40
Speaker
important moment because it's it's nobody else that's forcing you to do this it's your own energy it's your own focus that is determining you know how much engagement you're having with your with your job so I think it's also about you know having that hardcore ability to self-reflect and say I'm the problem here you know overall that takes a lot of discipline right like a lot of maturity and self-reflection but also a lot of discipline in
00:10:05
Speaker
recognizing the pitfalls and holding yourself accountable. And I know that if anyone's listening that works with me, they'll probably be laughing and saying, you know, I am also terrible at this at times, right? I am not always good at this. I think if you can ebb and flow, it's better. I will pull myself into crazy hours at times and kind of lose my boundaries there. But at the same time, if you can have that discipline to your point and pull yourself back, it's really important.
00:10:31
Speaker
I think that's just awareness, right? Like, we're all fallible. We're not going to get it right all the time. But just having the awareness to be able to check yourself. And sometimes I need other people around me. Do you have other people in your life that are like, hey, you're not really living your mantra, love? So many people. I am so blessed to have an incredible partner, incredible family. I've got, you know, three sisters who are constantly
00:10:57
Speaker
lecturing me if I'm working too late, and incredible friends as well who help remind me that this is important. And my team, my boss even, you know, I'm very fortunate to have an incredible, you know, leader who will constantly pull me up if she's concerned about burnout or anything like that. Now, we've talked about the three, the last sort of pillar help people find it. Let's just talk about that.
00:11:19
Speaker
Yeah, this one is something that's come later in my career. And I guess it's also because I've been so fortunate through my life and through my work life to have so many incredible mentors and managers who have really spent time and invested in developing me. It is the part of my job I love the most is developing and mentoring my team.
00:11:41
Speaker
helping people understand what's important to them and then helping them build their career around that. And, you know, it's something that I spend a lot of time doing. So, you know, this is something that I get so much joy and reward from, helping people find what's important to them, even if it's not what they're doing at that time and that moment, really helping them to find what their purpose is and what their mantra is in life.
00:12:01
Speaker
Yeah, my observation, having known you for a while now, you have a magnetic charm about you. And I think what I really respect about you is you build a sort of a community or village. And so not just with your staff, but you are always thinking about ways and opportunities to connect people that you know and love and respect and sort of
00:12:22
Speaker
You know, I know when we spoke yesterday, you were talking about, you know, people that you've known that you've tipped in for jobs or tried to connect with other great people. So building my observation is that you love to build a really strong kind of beehive, I suppose, of connections. I'm going to refer to you as the queen bee.
00:12:41
Speaker
This podcast is all around boss women. So yeah, you've got, you know, a hive of great people. And yeah, I certainly feel lucky to be in that hive with you. No, I think there's that quote, which is be the person who says other people's name in a room full of opportunities.
00:12:56
Speaker
And I feel like I've gotten to where I have today because other people have done that for me. So it is something I'm incredibly passionate about, making sure that you're connecting, raising everybody up and helping people. Oh, I love that. And that is a great segue. I want to talk about...
Expectations for Women in Leadership
00:13:11
Speaker
expectation. There's certainly a lot of pressure on women and you know that I'm a strong advocate for women in leadership and for raising women's profiles. But there's also a sense of personal expectation and then expectations that others have of women in leadership. So we know there's the cliches around women being bitches or women being narky with each other or the way they dress. We know in politics, you know, you just look at
00:13:38
Speaker
Julia Gillard's misogyny speech. You know, you hear about this all the time and you see it in practice. I want to ask around two parts of expectation. The first one being what expectations do you put on yourself and how intense are they, which sort of links a little bit really to what you were saying about
00:13:56
Speaker
finding that balance. But let's talk about that for a bit. Such a good question and a hard one to answer, I think. Personally, I have incredibly high expectations of myself. I am very unforgiving of any low performance or non-successful work, but I have learnt
00:14:14
Speaker
over time to use that as a learning opportunity rather than to be really hard on yourself. So again, it's something I struggled with a lot more when I was younger. I didn't ever want to put a foot wrong and I would agonize over the smallest decisions that were completely meaningless because I was putting way too much pressure on myself to be perfect and right every time. So I
00:14:37
Speaker
still have really high expectations of myself and I find they come out more and more in situations where you're stretched the most. For example, I've recently moved to Tokyo and been acting in a role in the Japan business for about seven months. I had such high expectations of myself and was very hard on myself in the first three months, moving to a new country.
00:15:00
Speaker
particularly a country as foreign as Japan means constant missteps, constant mistakes. And I would just get so frustrated at myself for not being able to thrive in an area like this and not give myself enough time to be able to learn and grow. So I just, I expect myself to be able to come in at 100% every time. And that strategy is completely flawed and basically has you getting your ass handed to you on a constant basis.
00:15:27
Speaker
And I think that's been a really important thing for me to learn and to be a bit more gentle and forgiving with myself, allow myself the time to learn.
00:15:35
Speaker
and continually learn, as well as embracing more of an 80-20 style. That side comes a little bit more naturally to me. I'm not necessarily a perfectionist when it comes to kind of work per se. I'm quite good at 80-20, but how do you transition that 80-20 from work style into that expectation on self and allow yourself the room to fail to learn to grow?
00:15:57
Speaker
It's a continued journey, I would say, but it's a really big challenge, I think, for women in leadership, for a lot of people in leadership, you know, to be able to balance that. Yeah. And I suppose there's this sense, and I don't know if you feel this, but there's this sense that when you're a woman and you're at the C-suite boardroom, that you have to work harder or you have to check yourself and you have, you know, the considerations of
00:16:23
Speaker
You know, what do you wear? Like, are you in your power suit? Are you in your dress? Are you looking too feminine? Have you got too much lipstick on it? Like, what's the, do you not wear lipstick at all? Do you experience that where you're just conscious of your, like, physicality as well as what you say, how you say it when you respond?
00:16:40
Speaker
It's so interesting because I've had such a diverse career in terms of industry. So I started in advertising, moved into FMCG, had a stint in government, and now I'm in tech. And I would say throughout those roles, I have had very different sets of expectations placed on me. And my role or my gender has been very prevalent or not prevalent at all. And even within the roles I've had at Uber, I think it's quite different, even within the same company.
00:17:07
Speaker
And is that culturally based on being in the Australian team versus being in the local Tokyo team? That's it. So I would say where I am the most out of my comfort zone, I will have a high level of awareness of those things. I will overthink everything from what I'm wearing to what my makeup looks like to how I wear my hair.
00:17:28
Speaker
I will be very critical of myself in terms of, you know, wearing loud clothing and standing out too much and feeling like I'm too much for so many situations. And that is generally in periods of very...
00:17:40
Speaker
big growth, lower levels of confidence. That is a hyper-aware thing. So the other area that I felt it a lot was in government. I think government has a long way to go in terms of the way that women are perceived and the roles that people expect women to have. And I have had
00:18:00
Speaker
direct conversations in government with senior leaders who advised me to buy a three-piece suit, wear pearl earrings, wear a pair of high heels so that people... Now, I love... Look, I'm getting to the age, really, where you just... I'm loving on pearls. I love pearls too. Again, I've come full circle. Nothing against pearls. But, you know, it certainly says something, doesn't it, when someone says, put some pearls on? It means, you know, be a respectable mum.
00:18:24
Speaker
That's the vibe I'm getting. Respectable mother of the bride is what I hear when I hear pearls. Yeah, I think there's something that says that what you wear is important to be taken seriously. And I think that that hopefully is continuing to be eradicated because it is complete and utter bullshit.
00:18:41
Speaker
And actually just letting people be their authentic self is how you should be letting, allowing people to be taken seriously. It's a difficult journey, right? Just on that point of expectation. It's a slight segue and you know, I like to go down rabbit holes, but the idea of not judging other women is like something I am so conscious of. And if you want to wear a short mini skirt and a crop top to a meeting,
00:19:09
Speaker
I am trying very hard now to be the type of person that's like, you do you. I might think I would make a different choice, but the idea and certainly the messages that we want to pass on to the next generation is that if you want to wear a power suit or you don't want to wear a power suit, I mean, obviously there's context to professional environments, but they're judged on the merits of their intelligence and what they're contributing as opposed to what they're wearing. And I certainly understand what you're saying because I mean, today I'm wearing
00:19:37
Speaker
a very loud pink, white and fluorescent yellow boiler suit. Certainly no pearls. I did contemplate putting the pearls on, but I'm also the type of person that's quite considered when I'm going to a meeting.
00:19:52
Speaker
what would be the most appropriate thing to wear. And sometimes that's just based on my mood. If I'm just feeling sassy, I'll just go, I don't care. I'm going to rock that boiler suit to a conservative meeting. And other times, you know, potentially, as you said, like I might be feeling like it's a high impact or a high pressure moment, stakes are high. I'm just going to wear black and keep it super simple and get those pearls on.
00:20:15
Speaker
It's so interesting and I think there's a role within that that's around stereotyping that's also interesting that I think we all play. I play this too in terms of choosing my outfit based on the conversations and meetings that you're going to have. It's almost like we're perpetuating the stereotype within ourself by saying, I need to feel serious for this meeting, therefore I'm going to wear a blazer.
00:20:35
Speaker
But at the same time, if that's giving you confidence, should it even matter? It's such a meta conversation. And I just think we just put so much thought and so much energy into so much of this, which is so unnecessary, but also could be important to you. So I think like Uber, for example, has a really great culture in terms of, I remember when I went for my interview at Uber, I was in my government role and I was wearing quite a conservative
00:21:00
Speaker
dress down to my knees. Was it navy blue? Navy blue, of course. What a guess. You know, and some conservative shoes. And I was having an interview with the head of marketing for Australia at 8.30 in the morning. He gave me the kind of address. It wasn't the floor that reception was on that he was greeting me on. And I kind of knocked on this glass door and this guy came. No shoes, shorts, white tea, eating a bowl of cereal.
00:21:25
Speaker
And I was like, oh, hello, I'm here to see Andy Mollie head of marketing for Australia. And he's like, oh, cool, I'll just grab him. Do you want a coffee? And he kind of took me over to the coffee machine where the barista was working with chatting away, chatting away, chatting away. And then after about five minutes, I was like, oh, well, it's been so great to meet you, but should I be introduced to Andy? And he laughed and he's like, I'm Andy.
00:21:44
Speaker
Was he eating fruit loops? He was eating, I think, cornflakes. But, you know, literally no shoes, shorts, t-shirt. Uber is a company. Nobody gives a fuck what you wear. You can wear whatever you want and people will take you seriously. And that was so refreshing after a world of government where it wasn't the case. And I think that took a lot of pressure off myself to worry and care as much.
00:22:06
Speaker
Yeah, you can just be. You like color. I love color. Yeah. I wore this for you because you like pink. I do love pink. And this is actually the only thing I have that's pink. So it's in your honor. Just before we finish up on expectation, what about expectations that others have in you? Have you had any, I suppose, key life milestones or people in your life that have put immense pressure on you?
00:22:32
Speaker
Interestingly, I think the person that puts the most pressure on me is myself. I am surrounded by incredibly supportive people. I am so lucky in that regard. And if anything, people are trying to teach me to put less pressure on myself, not the other way around. Be kind to yourself. Be kind to yourself and don't let yourself and these expectations be to your detriment. So I'm very fortunate in that regard in saying that there are moments where
00:23:02
Speaker
I still think there are genuine expectations, right? Coming into this role. Well, there are now in this role. Yeah, that's exactly it, right? The stakes are high. It's a very big role, incredible opportunity, phenomenal team to work with. But you've got skin in the game. You have to perform. And I don't want to make it sound like that all the jobs that I've had through my career, there is very high expectations on performance.
00:23:27
Speaker
That actually motivates me. So I quite like having high expectations to be able to continue to push myself and challenge myself. That's really motivating for me. Do you need that carrot? 100%. Because I'm the donkey that needs the carrot. Yeah. Which is really where the bite big came from. Yeah. I will say yes to something and then work out how to do it later. I know before you took the role, we had a conversation around just
00:23:51
Speaker
what a massive role it is obviously you're pretty young for a role like this like it's a significant global role and one of the things i said to you and i had a debate with someone at my business recently about the term fake it to you mate and he's like i don't know that i agree i feel like that's uncomfortable because it feels inauthentic and
00:24:12
Speaker
That expression actually came to me from a psychologist, and you studied psychology, which I only just recently found out, which is quite amazing. But from a psychological perspective, I suppose what the psychologist was saying to me was, even when you don't feel like you're in that space, you have to pretend that you're doing that. And to some extent, bite big is about that. I will say, yeah, that sounds like a great idea, and then realise I've got 10 great ideas going on.
00:24:40
Speaker
How the hell am I going to get all of these things to market, including this podcast? But the idea that you just reach, you reach and look up and then you will make it. You will do it. You will find the way to persevere and get through. Is that something that you felt coming into this role? And is that something you've experienced multiple times over?
Imposter Syndrome and Career Risks
00:25:01
Speaker
I would say every single big jump I've had, not in terms of promotion, but in terms of growth, so changing industries, coming into new roles, it has had that through and through. I've met very few people who
00:25:17
Speaker
genuinely think that they are capable for the roles that they are in as soon as they take them. So I think that fake it till you make it is 100% true of all humanity. And particularly if you're a person who loves big challenges, that will be your modus operandi for a very long time in my opinion. So I definitely think fake it till you make it is
00:25:43
Speaker
needed to be able to have confidence or to be able to have surface level confidence that you know what you're doing, that you are in control of a situation, and that you have the ability to thrive even if you feel completely the opposite. I think it is very similar to imposter syndrome in a way. It's kind of the other flip side of imposter syndrome. And if you can embrace that as your mantra, I think that
00:26:06
Speaker
you will be set up for success. I mean, just it's for me, that's about seeing it. So knowing when you're feeling that way, recognizing it. One of the challenges that we have certainly in Australia and imagine Japan probably even more imbalanced is
00:26:23
Speaker
so many women don't even apply for leadership roles or executive roles because they feel under qualified, right? Like if you read your own resume, you would say, there's no way, like that is who can do that? Like that is way too intense. But the reality of those jobs, like resumes are just like 70% bullshit anyway, right? And then the job description and the reality of what actually happens, there's also like a whole lot of puffery that goes on.
00:26:52
Speaker
And so there's this kind of that imposter syndrome manifests itself for lots of women in going, actually, I won't stretch, even though they're fully capable. And so the point that you made earlier around feeling privileged because you've had women that have elevated you up. It's such an important message in you helping other people to find it, because not all women have that opportunity. Not all women have great mentors that have
00:27:20
Speaker
Elevated them up. I had a boss of mine who was a man and he was just like that put me into a role from a senior designer To an account director. I've never even opened word. I had no idea how to run an estimate I had absolutely no credentials for this role at all and I had a one-day handover with the account director who I'm still friends with and
00:27:41
Speaker
Hi, Kim. In that handover period, I had no idea what I was doing, but he had faith in me and he just let me sort of fumble along and he's like, well, you understand the clients, you understand the process and strategy, so the rest we can teach you. And what a gift that was. You've hit the nail on one of the most important things for a successful career, a successful life and a happy life is by surrounding yourself with incredible people.
00:28:04
Speaker
And I think while I've had incredible mentors along the way, I've also had horrendous mentors or horrendous leaders who have taught me everything that I don't want to be. But it's about how you can foster and continue and establish that connection with the people who are bringing you up, celebrating you, and constantly helping bring out the best in you.
00:28:25
Speaker
I think the point around fake it to you make it is so critical in women in leadership positions. And there's a specific example that comes to mind. One of my best friends recently was promoted into a regional general manager role.
00:28:37
Speaker
of a massive tech company and the number of conversations we had to have around fake it till you make it, around, you know, I'm not qualified for this job, I'm not sure how to succeed in this role. I don't even know if I can do it, I don't even know what the role is and what it entails. But being able to back yourself enough to say every opportunity that I've been thrown in the past, I've been able to step into and smash.
00:29:03
Speaker
why would it be any different for this role? Just look at the data of your life and go, here are all the obstacles that I have overcome. And, you know, if you looked at that analytically, you'd say, well, sure, I can overcome this or I can do this. But it's just not the natural tendency. The natural tendency is to move into that fear state and go, I'm not good enough. Here are all these amazing people surrounding me. You know, you look on
00:29:28
Speaker
Instagram and LinkedIn and all these amazing people doing amazing things and go, oh wow, like that's just overwhelming. And there are so many, even incredible women, you're like, oh my God, I cannot believe they've written five books, they've done their PhD, they've raised six children, they've homeschooled, they've, what? How did you even, you know? Yeah, but if you sat down and had a conversation with all of those women, they would tell you all the 10 things that they've done wrong in that timeframe and not necessarily the things that they've done right.
00:29:55
Speaker
And I think there is this natural tendency for people to be so hard on themselves, particularly women, and to look at people around them and overestimate other people's ability while simultaneously underestimating theirs. And I think that's the data that I continue to try and feed
00:30:12
Speaker
other people and remind myself of. When you get into these big opportunities, you will actually see that there are flaws in what other people that you previously idolized did, right? Nobody is perfect, yet it's such a natural tendency to sit there and go, they're perfect, I'm sub-par.
00:30:28
Speaker
And I think continuing to build data points, rational data points, because emotionally it's very hard to be challenging in that way, but to continue to build rational data points to suggest actually everybody is flawed. Nobody is perfect. And that, you know, if you can back yourself into these big opportunities and these kind of big moments or small moments or whatever it is that is in front of you and continue to fake it till you make it, that's only going to be for the better. And what a powerful leadership message that is, because
00:30:58
Speaker
in order to inspire other people. So whether they're people that report to you or just people around you, your community, your hive.
00:31:08
Speaker
actually having that level of authentic leadership where you do show up with imperfection, you do express yourself in an honest way, and you do show people that you can make mistakes. And yes, that even your fallible really just is a ripple effect on everyone else. Because if everybody thinks that everyone else is perfect, everything just becomes a mask, really. Like there's. Yeah. I think the most interesting part of this is that I spent so
00:31:38
Speaker
much energy and time in my early career wanting to know everything. I thought success was knowing every answer regardless of the question and I killed myself to be the smartest person in the room every time. I would read, I would
00:31:58
Speaker
listen, I would try and be a sponge and I would write notes on everything so that I knew the answer to any question. It's like 48 years of my life flashing in front of me. And you know what, there are some stats and I really wish that I had them here around
00:32:13
Speaker
the imposter syndrome and women and being over-preparing for meetings. So where their counterparts who are male might just sort of swan in, women will over-prepare for everything because they're so fearful of being caught out or not knowing when the question comes. And certainly something that I've learned over the last 25 years, and hopefully I teach other people and mentors, it's actually okay to not know.
00:32:41
Speaker
It's actually okay in the moment to go, wow, that's really interesting. I did not know that. You do not have to solve anything in the moment. Learning it is one thing. Truly believing it took me a long time. Learning it to show other people that I was listening to things that they were telling me. But it took me a long time to actually take it to heart and say, being the smartest person in the room is actually limiting.
00:33:06
Speaker
Being adaptive, being authentic and actually taking the time to get the right information is so much more powerful and will take you so much further. So understanding that rationally and emotionally in my heart to say, it's okay not to know, it's okay to be fallible, it's okay to not take yourself so seriously and kind of let yourself relax and stop putting all this insane pressure on yourself, that has actually enabled me to grow more
00:33:35
Speaker
in my professional career than anything else. And when you're not active listening, you're sort of in fight or flight, right? So your adrenaline is running because you're fearful you're going to get caught out or the question is going to come. And therefore you're actually not even present to the moment you have. You would walk out. My personal experience is sometimes I'd walk out of a meeting and I'd be like, I don't even know what happened because I was just ready to pounce at every point.
00:34:00
Speaker
thinking I needed the answer and I would have like five screens up on my laptop so that I could like remember everything. It gives me a flashback. We used to have these meetings at Arnott's for innovation which are called gate meetings and they're kind of big innovation milestone meetings and I used to get so stressed in those meetings I would type out word for word what I was going to say as a script. I would put it in front of me and I would try and read it or remember it and kind of if I forgot a word my mind would go blank and I would completely panic.
00:34:29
Speaker
It was so detrimental instead of just going in and saying, I know what I'm talking about. I am living this every day. I know as much as anybody else in this room does. I know more than most people in this room do on this specific subject and backing yourself to say, be present, listen and engage. Yeah.
00:34:47
Speaker
And sometimes that's also about self advocacy, right, which is an expression I learned recently working through a diversity and inclusion course that we were doing with
Self-Advocacy and Inclusive Cultures
00:34:59
Speaker
the business. And one of the things I realized was
00:35:03
Speaker
I've actually always been pretty good at self-advocating, but it's actually not a skill or a trait that everyone has. And therefore, we have all these biases around, you know, when you're interviewing, for example, interviews are designed for people who can self-advocate, who can, you know, defend themselves. Never thought about that. Yeah. And you know what? I had so many flashbacks to all the people that I potentially didn't hire.
00:35:27
Speaker
because they lacked confidence in the presentation itself or in the second or third interview. And then I thought they were probably just really nervous. They might've had the skills that we needed. They just needed to be nurtured and needed to be elevated. And I've just cut them off because they didn't have the most bravado. And to be honest, I've made some terrible hires over time, which actually killed my own confidence about
00:35:53
Speaker
Am I actually good at reading people? But when I started to unpack this idea of like advocacy, and it's the same in a meeting. A, people need a safe space to feel like they can advocate in their own way. And, you know, if I think about that sort of nervousness you were talking about in those gate meetings, sometimes if a culture does not foster openness and transparency and authenticity from a, from a leadership group.
00:36:18
Speaker
It puts everyone into fight or flight mode and then it's very hard to advocate for yourself. It's very hard to sort of feel confident because you're just feeling the immense pressure. Yeah, I completely agree with that. A lot of it is cultural and I think even the format of meetings.
00:36:34
Speaker
That was a very traditional everybody sitting around a boardroom table, you would have a 15 minute time slot, you would wait outside the room five minutes beforehand, you would walk into the room, sit down, have a two minute introduction. It was a super formal process. And I think even that format of the meeting is driving that fear behaviour and that self doubt that then will only
00:36:56
Speaker
let certain types of people thrive. Maybe that's why I do feel a bit guilty because sometimes I can be that person in the meeting that's quite loud or a lot or has an opinion. And one of my own personal journeys is actually learning to just be a bit more chill in a meeting. And also to be aware of those people whose voices might not be as loud still obviously equally as valid, but trying to give other people space. The biggest
00:37:26
Speaker
Aha moment for me on this has been moving to Japan. A, I'm working a lot with people, English is their second or third language. So my pace, my directness, my confidence in what I'm saying can be very disarming and very confronting. And that was one of the biggest shifts in coming into the Japan organization is to
00:37:49
Speaker
be okay with silence, to sit in silence, to allow people to go away and come back and not expect everybody to have the answer in the moment. I'm still learning and I'm still on the journey for, but I think so much of what we
00:38:03
Speaker
do particularly in an Australian culture is we like to make quick decisions. We like to, you know, radical candor, have the food fight in the meeting room, you know, debate face to face. And that is a very, you know, Western perspective. It is a very privileged, you know, confident
00:38:21
Speaker
extroverted personality. Exactly. That fosters people who are like that. And I think that is limiting. And I think that the more we can be open to the quieter voices or the introverted voices or the less self-advocates, allow people space to think about problems and solutions or to allow them the safety to ask silly questions that are not going to have judgment associated with them, I think is critical. And I think you learn so much more by
00:38:50
Speaker
giving those quieter or less self-advocating or introverted voices the time and the space to be able to come back. I've got people in my team I can think of already who blow me away by the incredible responses and the incredible thinking that they will come back to me on if you allow them the space and the time to be able to do that.
00:39:17
Speaker
When we think about, you know, beyond just the, I suppose, corporate ticking boxes of having diversity, and diversity means lots of things, right? It means like ableism, it means cultural, it means socioeconomic, it means
00:39:34
Speaker
gender, it means sexual preferences, like there's so much depth to diversity. But if you don't have those differences of opinion, then you're only ever seen through the singular lens, which is, you know, certainly in Australia, still a massive problem. It's still very dominated by.
00:39:50
Speaker
middle-aged white men to be sort of just to play to the cliche. But that makes decision making really difficult because it means you're only talking to the same people. They're just talking to each other. And so, yeah, having those different perspectives, I think, is really important for culture. And making sure that we allow the space and time for them, because I think the other thing is, particularly in fast moving businesses,
00:40:12
Speaker
decisions need to be made quickly. And again, that is meaning that the type of people that end up thriving in those environments are, again, the extroverted, self-advocating, quick thinkers rather than necessarily balancing that depth of thought and the kind of more consideration that is required for some of these big strategic decisions. So how can we get better at allowing the space and time
00:40:35
Speaker
the right space and time while moving quickly is something that I've really struggled to kind of balance as a leader. Yeah, I get that. All right, let's talk about being a brand boss.
Risk-Taking in Brand Leadership
00:40:47
Speaker
It's obviously the foundation of this podcast and we've talked about reaching and we've talked about the challenges around feeling like
00:40:56
Speaker
you're not enough. How important in your role now is it to take risks and be courageous? I think that is the foundation for success. I think particularly in advertising.
00:41:13
Speaker
taking risks to create work that cuts through. And yeah, I think it's just so critical in this visually complex and busy world that we live in. It is the foundation for success. And your current role on a scale of one to 10, how embracing are they of risk-taking and courage compared to potentially some of your other roles?
00:41:39
Speaker
It depends what we're trying to do. So there is a lot of what we are trying to do that is actually more about being a brand than understands local culture. So in that way. So it's all about context, right? Because what's brave in one culture or country might not be hitting any metric at all on bravery or distinction in another. That is exactly it. And we spend a lot of time with our global brand colleagues and the APAC MLT discussing this because bravery means completely different things in different contexts, particularly when it comes to work.
00:42:08
Speaker
And I think being really intentional and clear about what level of bravery or change or cut through that you need for each of the pieces of work that you're doing upfront is also really important because it's always a tension when
00:42:24
Speaker
We want work that cuts through, but cut through doesn't always equal out there. Cut through can mean a million different things. That's quite subjective, right? Yeah, and I think we have a tendency to say cut through means crazy, which it often does in an Australian context. I would say cut through is often linked to out there or different or innovative.
00:42:43
Speaker
Whereas in a Japanese context, cutthroat can mean something completely different. It could just be a really rational, linear storytelling with some crazy visual or crazy celebrity combinations or something like that. It's a really interesting challenge. I mean, you've been here two and a half years.
00:43:02
Speaker
Yeah, I've been at Uber two and a half in Japan for seven months, so I am not the expert in this at all. I am just lucky I have still a journey. Oh, yeah, I have this incredible team. I'm the local expert. Again, I need to, you know, embrace the fact I don't know what's best in a lot of these situations. And I'm lucky to be surrounded by other brand bosses in my team who are
00:43:22
Speaker
incredible judges of the level of change and impact that we need from each different communication. In terms of other areas, if I think more traditional FMCG, what I'm seeing in FMCG and the trend away from consumer packaged goods into everything but consumer packaged goods mean that industry's future is reliant on big bold bets. And I think
00:43:47
Speaker
there is a fundamental challenge with a lot of FMCG innovation at the moment that it needs to be margin-accretive, it needs to be non-cannibalistic.
00:43:57
Speaker
But to be able to do these big bold innovation bets, it's going to take five years to make a sustainable opportunity. And I think, you know, there's that famous book, The Innovator's Dilemma around, you know, short term incentivisation not leading to big breakthrough bold thinking because everybody's rewarded for a new performance. And I think no one wants to be accountable for something not working.
00:44:18
Speaker
Exactly. Certainly my observation, like in the thick of that space. So if you're working for a big blue chip, what they deem to be innovation versus what a creative person might deem is innovation are like 3000 points different.
00:44:33
Speaker
And so really where the innovation is coming from at the moment are all the independence. It's all the startups. It's all the hustlers that are really even some of them strategically building brands to sell because the big businesses can't do it. No one wants to be cannibal. They're like turning the Titanic.
00:44:52
Speaker
It's also just that we like to think success is overnight. And I think there's a lack of patience in terms of we can build a sustainable business, but it's going to take three or five years. Or we'll take the hit now to then invest in something to make it more sustainable. Bigger businesses who are incentivised on a short term basis are always going to struggle making those decisions because they're not going to be rewarded for it. They need instant gratification. That's it. Someone needs that for their next promotion. That's exactly it.
00:45:22
Speaker
Have you ever taken a risk that hasn't paid off? Oh, millions. I think four out of 10 of the things that I do don't work. And are you kind to yourself when that happens? Depends. Sometimes. Depends how big the impact the results are. I would say my entire foray into government was a mistake. Yeah. But what I'm learning in my wise old age is that actually sometimes you learn
00:45:52
Speaker
more from understanding what doesn't work and what you don't like as a person than what you do. It's almost easier to learn from failures than it is to learn from success. Yeah. And if you don't learn from the failure, then what a waste.
00:46:07
Speaker
Yeah. And I think particularly in different cultures. So again, thinking about Australia versus Japan in Australia, it's okay to fail and it's okay to not be perfect. Whereas in a culture like Japan, but you know, it is a culture of perfection and that's why it's the most incredible place, one of the most incredible places in the world. But that means it's harder to empower a team to fail, which is so critical to success and to let people
00:46:35
Speaker
almost celebrate when they are learning instead of celebrate when they are perfect. It's a really interesting challenge that I want to try and continue to kind of push, but is so hard when your deep cultural values are for such a long time of rooted imperfectionism. What's been your biggest boss moment?
00:46:58
Speaker
Like, what are you most proud of? If you think, if you're comfortable with the term boss woman, which not many people are. Of course, I am absolutely not. And we'll just, uh, yeah, we'll go over and pretend that that's someone else. Like if you step back, if you were your friend talking about yourself, what would they say has been your biggest boss moment? Most people would say it's, it's the move.
00:47:26
Speaker
to Japan. It was only ever going to be an interim basis until recently. It's been confirmed to be a more permanent opportunity. Interestingly, if I reflect on it, I actually think the biggest boss move I made was leaving my first job.
00:47:44
Speaker
I remember the intensity and pressure that I put on myself to make a decision around leaving my first job, which I adored. I was in an advertising agency, a startup advertising agency that was on fire, still is an incredible place, but I just knew deep down advertising was only a very small part of what I wanted to understand and do. And there was an opportunity in FMCG at Campbell-Arnett's
00:48:11
Speaker
to work on brand innovation for end-to-end marketing. And that was so exciting for me. And when I got that role, I was almost paralysed into indecision as to whether I should take it. I cried my eyes out for days. I consulted every single person under the sun to ask them what to do. I wanted to outsource that decision to somebody. And I just put the entire weight of the world on me at such a young age to, you know, I didn't want to let the people down that had nurtured me so well in the role that I had.
00:48:42
Speaker
I didn't know if I would succeed. And I think making that jump was one of the most critical things to help me understand that I can do hard things. I can take risks. I can jump into the deep end and I can swim. And understanding that has then enabled me to make these decisions again and again with more confidence.
00:49:08
Speaker
Wow. It is quite brave because you were there for two years. Yeah. It's quite brave two years in, like to acknowledge you need another challenge and you need to keep growing. And you mentioned before about, you know, your preparation for meetings and
00:49:25
Speaker
wanting to know everything. I imagine that your thirst for knowledge is insurmountable. And so I suppose the, you know, the recognition, and I see that as a real boss movie, knowing actually this is to leave something comfortable that you love and to, you know, fly out of the nest when everything's going great, because it's really easy to leave when it's
00:49:51
Speaker
terrible, right? Like that's, that's kind of traditionally human nature. When you're getting bored and, or you just, you've got people that you work with that you don't like, it's really easy to make that decision. You're like, hallelujah, see you later. Door closed, never coming back. But when things are great, that is super brave to say, actually, this is really amazing, but I need to move on.
00:50:12
Speaker
100% and even the two roles that I've had at Uber, I would say the role that I was in previously is my dream job. So I was in my dream job before this Japan opportunity came up. You just jumped off the high rise into the air. Exactly. And struggled so much when I first got to Japan. It was a real battle. I mean, you could not have picked a country with more complexity in terms of
00:50:38
Speaker
cultural difference, the rituals, the language, the structure. You know, you talk about thinking that you're too much. I have never felt more too much than in this culture. Everything from what I wear to my voice being so loud to how I walk to every single thing that I do is
00:51:01
Speaker
too much for Japan, right? Because Japan is such a structured and orderly society, which is incredible. And it's just such an amazing culture to be a part of. But in every single situation, in work, in on the train, you feel too much. Yeah, it's hard to assimilate when you feel so different. Just and that self-doubt creeps in and that self, you know, flagellation of like, be better, you know, be smaller, be less, but also not
00:51:31
Speaker
letting yourself listen to that so much that it destroys who you are and why you're here in the first place. It's a really tricky balance. Just a cycle. But what an amazing personal journey. I reject the idea that you have to be passionate about what you do only on the premise that like, I'm very passionate.
Passionate Careers and Personal Values
00:51:53
Speaker
You're very passionate in my circle.
00:51:57
Speaker
or my beehive, I have a lot of passionate people who love what they do. But having a career is a privilege. Probably 80% of the world work because they have to work. They're not doing what they love. They're doing it because they need to earn a crust. And so having the opportunity and the privilege to do what you love
00:52:21
Speaker
in a way that has impact and is emotionally and intellectually fulfilling is just such a beautiful thing. Totally. Incredibly privileged to be able to do so. And it reminds me, one of my sisters, one of the smartest people I know, she was a lawyer. She got into a graduate program at a big four in a really strong role.
00:52:46
Speaker
And she cried every day. She hated it. And she bounced to these other incredible walls at like the World Bank. And she was in Kiribati and she was doing all this incredible stuff, but just.
00:52:56
Speaker
hated what she did. And she ended up retraining as a teacher, and she is the most incredible teacher, and she's so happy and fulfilled by that. And she just loves it. And she is just such a better person for choosing a path that is, you know, that is right for her. Not about status. Not about money. And I think
00:53:16
Speaker
That's bravery. It's braver to take that path than it is just to kind of constantly be chasing the dollar signs. Or something that's just not authentic to you. That's exactly it. And again, it comes from a place of privilege to be able to do that. And side note, we do not pay our teachers anywhere near enough. Absolutely not. Or our nurses. Or nurses. It's like 5,000 podcasts on that topic.
00:53:37
Speaker
So, bite big starts with a B, both words. My last name starts with a B. What's been your biggest B moment and what was the impact? B moment, the word I've chosen is bloom. As you know, we are recording from Tokyo, Nakameguro. And on the way to the studio, we walked
00:53:57
Speaker
past the cherry blossoms. Absolutely amazing. They are in full bloom at the moment and I think that word represents so many things. It represents the opportunity that I've had to move here and being incredibly privileged to take this opportunity. But it also reflects a more internal mindset shift in me and I guess it comes back to that idea of transitioning from the smartest person in the room and having to know everything to be able to actually be a leader and not know everything.
00:54:26
Speaker
And that's kind of, it sounds so lame, but a kind of bloom within oneself and allowing myself to grow.
00:54:35
Speaker
to not know everything, to be fallible. All of that is my B word. What a beautiful response. And might I say I'm exceptionally envious because you're about a decade before me when you've discovered that. It's taken me a long time and it's still on a journey. And for those listening who aren't familiar with the, I suppose, the delicate nature of the cherry blossoms here in
00:55:00
Speaker
Japan, it's a two week window and it changes every year. So I have always loved the cherry blossoms. I'm not sure why they just speak to me as a flower and a tree. And so to be here during that period is just like a life bucket list and even more fabulous that it's tax deductible.
00:55:21
Speaker
I will say, though, I do feel like I've probably sent the benchmark really high, episode one. I'm not sure how I'm going to top this. I've only got one more thing to ask you. If you could go back and talk to your younger self, what podcast would you ask her to listen to? Is there a TED Talk that really speaks to you that we'd say when I was younger, I wish I had read that?
Advice to Younger Self and Inspirational Figures
00:55:45
Speaker
What another great question. I think.
00:55:48
Speaker
There's a theme here throughout this conversation. Uh, I would say to my younger self, it's going to be okay would be the first thing that I say to her, you know, there's going to be tough shit that comes your way, but you're going to be able to, you're going to be able to cope and you're actually going to be able to not just survive, but thrive. And I think the thing that I would want my younger self to listen to or read is, is Brené Brown, another B, B boss.
00:56:14
Speaker
double B. I mean, she is definitely one of the world's boss women. I just adore her. I mean, she's up there with Oprah. I feel like Oprah is my other boss woman. She, I think the power of vulnerability. Did you watch the TED talk before the book or the other way around? I watched the TED talk before the book and I just think,
00:56:33
Speaker
She personifies all that entire talk, book, everything, personifies so much of what is deep within a lot of us in terms of shame and fear versus being vulnerable and putting yourself out there, being in the arena. If everybody in the world could read one book to make themself a better person, I think there is something incredibly powerful within Renee Brown and the concept of vulnerability and embracing vulnerability.
00:57:00
Speaker
I mean, this is a big call, but I honestly think that book and her TED Talk actually introduced the word vulnerability to the workplace in general. We talk about that. I gave a talk for International Women's Day recently at a client's and they thanked me for being vulnerable. That word would not have existed outside of that book.
00:57:25
Speaker
being the most critical thing to my success and to be able to help other people and to be able to build these connections and everything, you know, and I feel so privileged to be able to have learnt about that, to have been able to go on the self-discovery journey of understanding what that means for me and just embracing the fact that we're all imperfect
00:57:46
Speaker
flawed hot messes and the more incredible people and women that I surround myself by. I just laugh. You know, we're all hot messes. We're all too much. We all think the same. And actually just embracing that becomes our superpower. I love that. Well, they are beautiful parting words.
Charity Work and Personal Connections
00:58:03
Speaker
I really want to thank you, Allie, not only for just gracing us with your authenticity today, allowing me to come
00:58:13
Speaker
to Tokyo was very critical that we did not do this over the internet. I really felt like I needed to feel your presence and your energy. Certainly that's the rationale I passed on to the business when I was booking this ticket.
00:58:25
Speaker
I really appreciate you just showing us your version of Biting Big. I think what's really important about this podcast is actually everyone's version of Biting Big is going to be different. Some people's exceptionally big and some people have lots of small chunks to go on their journey. There are three things that I've really taken away from here. One is your impact on people.
00:58:47
Speaker
and effectiveness and being very, I suppose, results driven, but that's not just about business performance. That's actually about having impact with people and community as well. I also loved when you spoke about being kind to yourself and finding balance and peace, and I know that that's a continued journey for you.
00:59:07
Speaker
probably for everyone, but I think that's a really important message. And also this idea of blooming. I thought, what a beautiful metaphor for growth through imperfection and growth through imperfection. If there's any core takeout for today in episode one, I think that's probably what we want to be on a T-shirt.
00:59:26
Speaker
Yeah, I love that. And I have a strong suspicion I'm going to listen back to this podcast and hide under a table and die of embarrassment about all the things that I've said. So I think that growth through imperfection is going to be a continued journey to continue journey. Yeah. We'll try not to edit the good pieces out. We'll fake it till we make it. Embrace the uncertainty and see how it goes. This podcast is produced and made by women and to show our gratitude
00:59:52
Speaker
bite big, donating $500 on your behalf. And you've chosen the charities National Breast Cancer Foundation and Angels Care, which is a Ukraine charity. Talk to me about the significance of those for you. Oh, I'll start crying. That's okay. This is the moment where I probably burst into tears and you can you can hear the emotion in my voice.
01:00:15
Speaker
Two charities that mean a lot to me. The first charity is The Source of My Tears. I lost my mum to breast cancer when I was 28.
01:00:26
Speaker
It's part of who I am, but she was the most incredible, inspiring boss you could ever imagine raised for beautiful, crazy girls who never thought that being a woman was anything other than a strength. So the first donation is on her behalf, if at all, and she'll be rolling her eyes at me and my emotion in this moment. What was her name, Ellie? Janet.
01:00:56
Speaker
We're thinking of you Janet. She's the OG boss. And the second one is actually another beautiful story. The universe has introduced me to another boss. Her name is Natalia and she is currently living in our house in Sydney. Natalia is from the Ukraine and she has had her own really interesting story. And she has a full-time charity, a bereavement charity on child loss.
01:01:18
Speaker
called Angels Care that is run out of the Ukraine and she's a phenomenally inspiring force that the universe has connected me with and I'm incredibly grateful. Well that's beautiful. Well let's dedicate episode one to both of those fabulous boss women, let's do that. Thank you Allie, what an incredible experience and thank you for being vulnerable with us. I'm your host Amber Bonny, until next episode may you bite big and chew like hell.