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The American Craftsman Podcast Ep. 32 | To Veneer Or Not To Veneer
37 Plays4 years ago
On Episode 32 of The American Craftsman Podcast, hosted by Greene Street Joinery, we discuss veneer and it's uses.
Beer of the Week (Ross Brewing Co. Meet Me At The Snack Shack): https://untappd.com/b/ross-brewing-company-meet-me-at-the-snack-shack/4229046
Tool of the Week: (ZEROPLAY Miter Bars by Microjig) https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008O2KVR8/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=greenestreetj-20&camp=1789&creative=9325&linkCode=as2&creativeASIN=B008O2KVR8&linkId=df7ed64c193b4ddf896bf85d12d9da1c
Greene Street Joinery is a custom design & build shop located in Monmouth County, New Jersey. We build multigenerational furniture with an eco-friendly and sustainable mindset.
Inspired and guided by the ideals of the Arts and Crafts movement, we believe in the use of traditional craftsmanship and simple, well-proportioned forms; sustainability and ethical practices; and importantly, taking pleasure in our work as craftsmen to create quality pieces of enduring value.
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Transcript
Partnership & Craftsmanship
00:00:16
Speaker
Ain't no shame, but there's been a change
00:00:22
Speaker
The American Craftsman Podcast is proud to partner with Montana Brand Tools. The West was built by people with strength and great pride in their workmanship. It was a necessity that early settlers of Montana have a strong will, a resilient character, and great determination to tame the rugged landscape while adapting to its dramatic climate. That spirit made in the USA pride and craftsmanship is alive today, both in how Montana Brand Tools are manufactured and how they perform.
00:00:48
Speaker
Montana Brand power tool accessories are manufactured utilizing proprietary state-of-the-art CNC machining equipment and the highest quality materials available. Montana Brand tools are guaranteed for life to be free of defects in material and workmanship because we build these tools with pride and determination. Montana Brand tools are manufactured by Rocky Mountain Twist located in Ronin, Montana. Montana Brand's heritage comes from a long line of innovative power tool accessories.
Episode Kickoff & Snack Talk
00:01:14
Speaker
All right, party people, here we are, episode 32. Yeah, 32. Of the American Craftsman podcast. You might notice we're snacking on some peanuts. We're hanging out. We've been sitting down for two hours now. We just got done with our... We're hungry. Yeah, we just did our first live stream with our Patreon patrons. What we're calling the pre-pricing and... Sorry, pricing and pre-fabrication protocols. So going over the whole process between
00:01:41
Speaker
First contact with a client to the point of booking a job with them. Yeah Ran for two hours. Yeah, and you you may have noticed At the beginning of the podcast you heard a a new little advertisement. Yeah for Montana brand tools, so What we did
00:02:04
Speaker
We got rid of those, uh, pre-generated ads.
Tool Giveaway Announcement
00:02:06
Speaker
We partnered up with, uh, Montana brand tools and we're happy to have them on board. Yeah. And we're going to hopefully, not hopefully, I mean, part of what we're going to do is pass on some of this stuff. Yeah. We're going to be giving away some Montana brand stuff to our, uh, Patreon patrons. So we're, uh, we're happy to do it. We like their stuff all made in Montana. Yeah. It's pretty exciting. Cause it's like a, a little, uh, step for us, you know, as we're starting out here.
00:02:33
Speaker
Yeah. And, um, I really wanted to get rid of those, uh, pre-generated. Yeah. So between eating peanuts here and saying, hi, we'll try to get a podcast in. Yeah. Um, so what better go with our peanuts then beer the
Local Brew Highlight
00:02:56
Speaker
week? Yeah. Yeah. I'm thirsty.
00:03:01
Speaker
Got another local brew this week. Ooh. Right here we have... Snack Shack. Ross. Focus. We've had some Ross beer in the past. Yeah, I think this will be our third, maybe third Ross beer. Ross is actually opening a brewery about three blocks from here, so... Maybe we'll go visit one day, do a live podcast.
00:03:31
Speaker
I don't think it's frozen this week. Last week was a bit of a debacle. Now this week is just cold. Last week we tried to outsmart ourselves. We did outsmart ourselves.
Micro Jig Miter Bar Introduction
00:03:57
Speaker
So what we have here is Snack Shack. Session IPA. Oh, no, sorry. Meet me at the Snack Shack. It's called Session IPA from Ross Beer Company.
00:04:10
Speaker
Sometimes you don't feel like something heavy. Sometimes you just want a snack. So you head on over to the snack shack at the beach or on the boardwalk to grab something to hold you over. And this beer will do exactly that and more. Any day, any time. This session IPA will hit the spot and leave you wanting another one. Complex, crisp, and citrusy. It drinks like a much bigger IPA, thanks to our mix of Citra, uh, Matuka,
00:04:36
Speaker
Azica and Eldorado hops. Man, hops are getting crazy. I don't even know those ones. You'll be enjoying this one for a long time to come. So come on down to the shore and meet me at the Snack Shack. Nice. Ross Brewing, Port Monmouth, New Jersey. Wow, they even say Port Monmouth? No, I just said that. Cheers. Cheers to you. Here's to you guys.
00:05:04
Speaker
It's a good one. These are actually leftovers from the weekend. I bought a four pack and had two. Good for you. Yeah. Man, beer and peanuts? What a life. Who's got it better than us? Just don't send me to get coffee. Who knows what'll happen? Oh my God. Yeah.
00:05:35
Speaker
Well, I have the honor of Tool of the Week this week. And this is a good one. Yeah. So you all know, we got the shaper, I don't know, a couple of months back and we're going to be building an exterior door coming up pretty soon. Already kind of started. We brought the wood in at least. Yeah. Been working on
00:06:00
Speaker
Figuring everything out and cutting a sample. So we had to build a coping sled to cut the, you know, the copes on a coping stick door. So I got peanut skin all in my mouth. So use these. The, uh, Oh, that's the company that sold the power feeder calling me back. Uh, zero play miter bar for micro jig.
00:06:28
Speaker
So what this is, it's a two piece you see there. Those are a top and a bottom and they have a wedge. So they interlock together and they actually, it gets wider. Yeah. So you put it, it has a very specific setup.
00:06:43
Speaker
Excuse me, I need a sip of beer. And you get a perfect fit with zero play. Comes with the screws to attach it to whatever you're making. Comes with some plans as well. And it comes with two of the miter bars and two stops. So it has a stop that goes into the miter slot so you can set a stop front and back, whatever. Slides really easily. Yeah, it's made of like a glass reinforced nylon or something. It's super hard and super slick.
00:07:11
Speaker
I was pleasantly surprised because I had my doubts. And I didn't know in until today. I think all of this micro jig stuff is made in the USA. So yeah, that was a pleasant surprise. You know, big supporters there. Those grip blocks are awesome. Yeah. So yeah, check them out. The micro jig zero play miter bar got it in a two pack. Awesome.
00:07:40
Speaker
Alright, we're gonna have to put you in. That's gonna be tough. You got the tool of the week. I'm just gonna sit here and keep cracking peanuts. I just did it. Oh. You're lucky I'm not reminding you about the gripe of the week. Life is too good to have a gripe of the week. Yeah. What about that mishap you had with the coffee? That was the
Podcast Recommendation: Against the Grain
00:08:06
Speaker
other old guy.
00:08:10
Speaker
You don't say. This old guy knows how to run a coffee machine. How to pour a cup of coffee? Mm-hmm. Well, we got a lot of questions this week. I was joking around this morning. This is like the period craftsman episode. Because Freddy hit me with about, I don't know, a dozen questions. So it's like every other question is a question from Freddy at period craftsman.
Finishing Techniques: Rubio Monocoat
00:08:32
Speaker
Well. Who actually has his own podcast called Against the Grain. Yeah, we should check it out. Yeah, I have listened to it before.
00:08:41
Speaker
When I was on the plane going to Atlanta, I downloaded a couple and listened to it. But I didn't I don't think I even realized it was Freddie and Justin. And I'm not I'm not familiar with the other guy, but it's three guys. Oh, like what? There was a there was a time we had another guy here. Was it? I know it was it's hard. It's hard now. It doesn't ring a bell. Here's our first question.
00:09:08
Speaker
What finish did you use on the cabinet in the background? He's referring to the, uh, the cherry. Oh, that can right there. Yep. Yeah, it's still there. Believe it or not. Waiting on some hinges. We use that Rubio for exterior use. Yeah. So that is, um, it's called Rubio Monoco hybrid wood protector. And the color is Royal. It's, um, a nice,
00:09:38
Speaker
Nice golden brown sort of orangey shellac look almost. Yeah. You know, as, as the piece has been sitting here collecting a bit of sunlight, it really mellowed out. Yeah. At first it was a little orangey I thought, but it's coming to its own. It's, it's really a nice finish. Yeah. Goes on nice and easy. Buffs out really well.
00:10:06
Speaker
And I think it came out great. We chose the exterior because there's going to be so much water going on in and around this piece. And the color was right. Yeah. Yeah. Because they don't really have a color that looks like this. This and that. It's called Look E-Pay. I don't know who named that. Look E-Pay. Not E-Pay. Look. Yeah. Look E-Pay. Yeah.
00:10:31
Speaker
It was between those two. Sounds like it was named by somebody who's not a native English speaker. Yeah, yeah. But not someone from Belgium. No. Which is where Rubio is based. So yeah. Rubio Monaco hybrid wood protector. Yeah. So far it's the first time we used it and we don't have like long term results on this but I'd say it's a good finish.
00:10:56
Speaker
Yeah, I'd be curious to, you know, probably wind up doing work in the future for these folks. So be nice to check in and see how it performs under the wet conditions. Yeah.
00:11:09
Speaker
I mean, because it's going to have a font in there and then the coffee maker, you know, it's going to be steam. They have like five kids, so it's bound to get abused. Exactly. He'll slam in the doors. Yeah, I'd like to try the hybrid wood protector on the door. Yeah. Maybe just a clear. Yeah, that's a good idea. All right. So what's your favorite kind of furniture to build and what do you end up building the most? That's from Hey Good Hardwoods on Instagram.
00:11:42
Speaker
Well, personally, I like to build anything that is kind of out of the norm, something unique, something with a very specific purpose and a lot of very specific requirements. Yeah. Makes it for a more interesting build.
00:11:57
Speaker
Yeah. I'll agree with that. My favorite kind is usually the kind I'm building at the moment. Yeah. Because we tend to always try and incorporate something new. Every time we get an opportunity for a job, we'll throw a twist in. We read a book. We saw a picture. We said, hey, let's try and do this. Yeah. Or saw one of you doing something. Yeah. Yeah.
00:12:24
Speaker
and became inspired. We're definitely, you know, inspired by everything around us. It includes other woodworkers. Yeah. And things outside of woodworking too, you know? Yeah. If musicians were only inspired by music, what the hell? We probably wouldn't have very good music. That's right. There'd be no, no muses.
Trends in Built-in Cabinetry
00:12:42
Speaker
And then what do we end up building the most?
00:12:46
Speaker
We do a lot of built in sort of cabinetry I'd say is a lot of what we do. It's just a common thing that people you know seek out a custom builder for. Goes in spurts. Yeah. I remember when.
00:13:03
Speaker
flat screen TVs first came out and became affordable. Everybody wanted the wall unit. It was good for business. Everybody wanted to do something over the fireplace, so they needed a mantle or something. Yeah, built-ins, everybody loves that built-in.
00:13:23
Speaker
Yeah, I don't understand the hang up with it. I think we I don't know if we talked about this on the podcast last little bit. Yeah. Or if we were just talking about it ourselves. But yeah, the the hang up with the built in gotta be built in. Yeah. I don't know if it's like a status thing or.
00:13:38
Speaker
I don't know. People see old homes with built ins and they think it's a requirement, I guess. I don't know. Yeah. And most of that stuff in the old homes, it was all site built. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You know, it was the carpenters and their handsaws. Well, yeah, because they were actually skilled.
00:13:58
Speaker
Like when you go down the basement of my house, you could see the back of the panels in the living room where they actually cut, you know, with handsaws and the flathead screws holding the panels in. Yeah, it's cool.
00:14:13
Speaker
I almost saw that next question as as the same question as as hey goods but it's yeah I noticed I didn't put a paragraph right there that's a Freddie question coming up next how big in detail is your contract that's from Freddie appeared craftsman oh it's big in detail
00:14:34
Speaker
Yeah, we don't have a contract per se, but we, we send a scope of work letter. It's funny. Cause we were just, we just did the live stream about this. It is.
00:14:44
Speaker
I guess in court it would be a legally binding contract. There's no signatures and a witnessing and stuff like that. But it protects us and it informs the client. Right. And it's simple and casual and it doesn't get to doesn't inundate anybody with all these sort of formalities. But it's but it's it's a contract to say the least. It's as thorough as we make it and we make it very thorough.
00:15:08
Speaker
Yeah, not a lot of big words. It just spells out in every detail what we're doing and what we're building and the time frame, the cost, the pictures, everything. Yeah. The schedule of payments says shop garbage out. Thanks for the reminder.
00:15:25
Speaker
All right. So, yeah, we're not a napkin kind of guy. We don't pull numbers out and just say, yeah, it'll be twelve thousand dollars. We'll get a drawing to go with that. I got this cabinet vision elevation view.
00:15:43
Speaker
You want a plan view? I got that. You can see the uppers over top of the base cabinets. I know. So, yeah, we present full 3D renderings, you know, all angles, all dimensions.
00:16:00
Speaker
And then we reiterate all those things pictures of any type of hardware or parts that will be integrated purchased parts Right all specialty hardware is it's gonna come from bloom. It's gonna be this it's gonna be that Mm-hmm. Yeah, so we like to cover all our bases. Oh, yeah Doesn't take much time. No We sleep better at night too. Oh, yeah, I sleep like a baby
00:16:25
Speaker
We got one here from our buddy Tyler. He's a badass rocketeer. Wooden Whiskers trading on Instagram. How often do you use setup pieces for your joinery before you cut the final work? Essentially trial and error practice before you cut a joint? For me, it's almost every time. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. If we're making doors, you know, you always have a stick a stick or two of extra. You got to set up your dado.
00:16:51
Speaker
And then you use that same piece to set up your tenon and you test fit on, you know. In fact, I'm trying to think of a time I didn't do that. Very rarely. I mean, I don't have that kind of confidence. No, no. And I mean, even people that have been doing this forever. Yeah. And also by the time we've gotten to that point.
00:17:13
Speaker
We've tracked that piece of wood, you know, three and four steps. That piece of wood is going to match its its partners. It's adjoining partner. So it's a it's a domino effect if we screw that piece up. You know, we'll we'll have to probably replace two or three other pieces then.
00:17:33
Speaker
You know, I love doing the test fits and everything like that. It's just it's just the way we roll. Yep. I'm going to hand this next one over to you for a second. I got it. All right. We we just got our power feeder in, guys, and it had a little bit of damage. And I got to get a picture over to this guy before. All right. This is from Freddy, period. Crafts on Instagram again.
In-house vs. Outsourced Painting
00:17:59
Speaker
He's asking us, is it worth doing the painting or finishing in house? Well,
00:18:06
Speaker
Painting, no, not for us because we have a, you know, like a 900 square foot shop and there's just no room to, once you start painting, you have to shut everything down. We have to mask off, you know, half the shop and it just consumes the entire, you know, everything in the shop. We can't, we can't do anything else.
00:18:32
Speaker
The other sort of finishing that we do, which is, you know, hand applied oil finishes, oil and wax. Yeah, we do all that stuff here in house and we're pretty good at it. And it, it's something that will generally do towards the end of the day, or if a project is going to be finished all at once, we'll do it that way. And it's, it doesn't require the same kind of, you know,
00:19:07
Speaker
It's really special stuff we work with. It's all food grade. You wouldn't even really need gloves if you didn't want to use them. So it doesn't raise up any kind of bad odor or volatile chemical. That's the other thing. Yeah, there's zero VOC. The tunnel that we use, you can use on a cutting board. It's 100% food safe.
00:19:30
Speaker
masking and things like that.
00:19:35
Speaker
And so the time involved in painting, it'll raise the price of a job. Like if somebody if we were going to do a painted job, we'd build it out of hard maple and we'd have to hire a painter, which we do because they do it right. You know, they're painters. And it's more expensive to have us build a painted piece than it is just
00:20:02
Speaker
Have us build something let's say from cherry or even a more expensive would like white oak is expensive now. Yeah, we don't cut any corners on a painted piece. You know, some people might use soft maple and they putty everything and Bondo it and you know, use use shoddy setups because they they're going to cover with with a thick layer of paint, but
00:20:22
Speaker
It's the same exact piece. Not our style. Yeah. Yeah. You could take it instead of the painter coming to paint it, he could just put a clear on it and it would be a. Right. It's presentable then. Right. Yeah. We don't use MDF. So we're not using any engineered products. It's either. I shouldn't say we don't use any engineered products. We may use plywood panels for a painted piece, but you know, nothing that can't be hit with clear can be as as good as something that would be stained. Otherwise,
00:20:49
Speaker
Right now we're not using anything with all these voids and junk like that. Yep. So yeah, it doesn't pay for us to paint in house at all. No, and you know, I don't like paint anyway. We got one here from one of our patrons, Alex. On an episode, you mentioned carrying liability insurance.
The Need for Liability Insurance
00:21:10
Speaker
What instances is that for?
00:21:13
Speaker
Well, that's, God forbid, something happens. You damage something in somebody's home. It's for work outside the shop. You know, whenever we're delivering something, you put a screw into the wall and hit a pipe. I mean, you run into these things in people's homes. Or even, you know, the freestanding bookcase you built falls over and lands on somebody.
00:21:42
Speaker
Right. And maybe liability insurance isn't the right terminology. I'm not fully up on the verbiage of insurance, but I think they call it an umbrella policy. Yeah. So it's for those those instances. Fingers crossed they don't happen. You know, right. And it's cheap. It's like a thousand dollars a year for a million dollars coverage or something like that.
00:22:06
Speaker
It's got to be in that ballpark somewhere between 1000 and 2000. Yeah. I know some guys, Freddie was saying, you know, he's got a big policy with tools and and maybe stuff in the shop and he pays like maybe five or six thousand a year. Yeah. But, you know, it depends on if you have employees, we don't have any employees. And if we go on eight installs a year, that's a lot. We might not leave the shop for months at a time.
00:22:34
Speaker
I only leave the shop once a week to go to rehearsal. Oh, well, yeah. Like I don't leave the property for business. I mean, we very rarely leave. You know, we'll make a site visit and a delivery or install. That's about it. There's only so many jobs we can fit into the year. Oh, yeah. We got another one from Freddie here. All right. What's he say? Have you been saying no to more jobs these days?
00:22:59
Speaker
No, not really. I mean, not any more than usual. I think maybe he's getting that. Hasn't been so busy with, you know, this COVID boom that we've been turning people away. We've been pretty steady, you know, we're not
00:23:17
Speaker
We're not really a part of that boom because we're not like really like in that whole renovation kind of mix. We're more like a specialty kind of builder. We say, we don't say no. This is something that we talked about in the live stream, but we vet out a lot of clients before it ever gets to the point of, you know, manifesting itself into a potential job.
00:23:47
Speaker
So we don't have to say no to a lot of people. They kind of weed themselves out. I'd agree with that. I like this next one because it's kind of relevant to our current situation. This is from St. John Woodworks on Instagram. Any preference in doing residential work versus commercial work? If so, why? That's Brian at St. John's.
00:24:12
Speaker
I'll say we've been being approached more and more with commercial work. What do you prefer? I would probably say I prefer residential work. I don't know. I think the cool thing about commercial is
00:24:39
Speaker
Typically they're looking for something maybe a little more unique because they're trying to make a grand impression. Yeah. Statement piece. Where residential is kind of a lot of we get approached with all this cookie cutter BS. Yeah. Like we were talking about the wall unit or the built the built in wall unit. Everyone's a white shaker built in. Commercial is not really looking for that. There is a lot of repeat kind of things. Repeated designs. But
00:25:10
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, the commercial things we've been approached with have been pretty unique. So yeah, definitely interesting. Maybe not the highest quality things, like in terms of craftsmanship and materials, but definitely unique and interesting. They both have their pluses. Yeah. And for different reasons than maybe you might expect.
00:25:31
Speaker
One of the things I like about the residential work is actually getting to deal directly with the client. Yeah. That's what I was going to say. And getting that, that real satisfaction. Cause with the commercial work, it's cool that you can just kind of drop it off.
00:25:48
Speaker
Yeah, we dropped off those cheese lounges and it was kind of like, it was a letdown wasn't it? You know, usually we bring a piece into a client's home and they're there. Everybody's ooh and a nine and telling you how much they love it and you get to see it in the space and then.
00:26:06
Speaker
We drop off these change lounges. On the lone dock. Yeah, into like the freight elevator on, you know, that's still attached to the side of the building outside. And it was like, oh, wow, that's it. Like this kind of like let. Yeah. Yeah, we weren't used to that. So that's why I would say if I had to choose, it would be the residential workers. We really get to that. But there's completion.
00:26:33
Speaker
Yeah. With the residential work. And it just feels more personal. It is. I mean, we put a lot into it. Yeah. Even even the commercial work, we put the same amount of ourselves into that work. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That's why there was kind of that emptiness.
00:26:51
Speaker
All right. On the one side, send them up the seventh floor. They just came and dragged them away. Be careful with those. They were going to put them on the concrete upside down. Oh, my God. You know, like, no, no, the other way, the other way.
Residential vs. Commercial Work Preferences
00:27:09
Speaker
So, yeah, I mean, I definitely think a mixture is good. Mm hmm. A mixture of everything is always good because it keeps you keeps you interested and and all that good stuff.
00:27:21
Speaker
Hey, Nick's got a good question here. Nick's also one of our patrons. You skipped over Freddie. Oh, Freddie. Well, I see his name all over you. Sorry, Freddie. Period. Craftsman on Instagram. Do you answer the phone while in the shop working? Personally, I don't. Rob doesn't answer his phone ever. No, yeah, you're right. I don't pick up the phone. Usually just doesn't hear ringing. Yeah, I have the ringers set either off or super low.
00:27:51
Speaker
Anybody that wants to get in touch with me is going to be an old client and they know the best way to get me is to email me. So Jeff Fields, every phone call. Yeah, I do answer the phone. You know, if it's from the middle of something, I probably won't, depending on what I'm doing. Yeah. But if I have a second where I can take a phone call, I always try and take it. Yeah.
00:28:19
Speaker
We're pretty good about getting back to people too. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Better than about 99.9999% of people out there. I'll agree with that. Even me. So the answer is yes. All right. Now we get to Nick. I'll let you take it because you were excited about it. All right. Where and when does Veneer fit into furniture making?
When to Use Veneer in Furniture Making
00:28:44
Speaker
I used to look at it as quote, the easy way out or quote unquote cheap, but watching John Peters make a few dressers using veneers changed my mind. I'm not sure if you guys ever use it, but what would be some instances where you would, I kind of had the same sentiment at one point. Um,
00:29:08
Speaker
But then realizing how much work it is to actually use veneer. Like veneer plywood is one thing. That's a whole different animal. That's where I think our minds tend to go when you look at it. It goes to veneer sheet stock. Yeah, where people just do that half ass job and put some banding on it and screw it together. Right. It's not like building a frameless cabinet out of plywood.
00:29:30
Speaker
you know, veneer work is an art in and of itself. Um, situations where we, we, I mean, you've done some veneer work. Um, I, I won't say I have, I've done some facsimiles, but, um, I won't claim to be, you know, have done veneer, um, situations where you would use it.
00:29:53
Speaker
When you have a species that's unstable and when you have a species that's extremely expensive. Yeah. I don't know. Can you think of any other reasons. Well for us not really. I mean it's like a specialty kind of thing. It's an accent for us. So the times we'll use it.
00:30:11
Speaker
It would be if there's multiple doors and we're going to use like a figured wood for the panel. And like I did that quarter song butternut. Yeah, that was nice.
00:30:25
Speaker
butternut and quarter song, for that matter, was really hard to get. Yep. And they were like one or two boards and the guy cut it into veneers. And I use it for all the drawer and doors. And that kind of speaks to both instances that you were talking about.
00:30:47
Speaker
but no large glue ups or anything. I've never done anything like that because everything I did, I just did with, you know, physical clamps and battens. What about for Micah? You know, if we got like this big commercial job and we didn't have any other work and it was something we had to do to like pay our mortgages,
00:31:13
Speaker
I would do it. I would probably, you know, I'd probably try and do it under pseudonym or something like that. Not because I don't think that that work is
00:31:26
Speaker
take skill, but because it's it's not what our brand, so to speak, is. Right. Yeah, it doesn't align with our. Yeah. Yeah, I've done more for Micah than I care to admit. But again, like you said, there's nothing wrong with that. No, no, we're we've we've carved out an identity for our company. And and that's what we have to do. You know, we're we're a niche, a niche company. We were two guys that do a specific thing.
00:31:56
Speaker
Yeah, and you gotta like, if you wanna do what you wanna do, you have to do that. That's it. So, can't try and please everybody. If you wanna build fine furniture, you can't do for Michael Ward. No. Because you're gonna become a guy that does for Micah. Right. Um, you know, it's a tough decision to make because the work is few and far between and, you know, you're turning people away and not getting jobs more often than you are getting them, but, you know, sacrifices. That's what it's all about. Compromises. Yeah.
00:32:26
Speaker
Yeah, we don't go out to eat much. Who's this next guy? We got this question from Freddie. If you guys don't follow Freddie, he, man, this guy's a beast. He does all kinds of restoration work on these historic buildings up in Boston and Massachusetts, the whole area.
00:32:46
Speaker
That's the thing about social media. You find I mean, it can get a bad rap because there are a lot of posers out there that are just, you know, like kind of creators of content. Yeah. But there's an amazing array of skilled folks out there doing stuff. Yeah. Like Freddie. Yep. Yeah. I mean, in the shop room, we've got guys who work on rockets, Tyler, robots,
00:33:13
Speaker
It's humbling. It really is humbling. The stuff that people are into and good at. This guy is engineering rockets. We're worried about fitting a mortise and tenon. What do you want to know? Do you work on multiple jobs in one day?
00:33:37
Speaker
Rarely, I mean, typically we get a job and it's, you know, start to finish. Yep. And and that's how we operate. The only time we'll do something like that is like, in the case of this, this cherry piece, it's just sitting around here waiting. It's done up to the point where
00:33:58
Speaker
I mean, we're waiting on the hinges and then there are a couple little things we have to do once the hinges are here. But so we've been just working around it. Yeah, only we avoid doing it. Yeah. Only if they're.
00:34:14
Speaker
Usually a small job may get interspersed with a bigger job. Right, like a quick mantle or something like that. Yeah. So we may fit in small tasks when you have that lull in the big job, whether you're waiting for panels to glue up or something like that. Right. But yeah, no, we try and focus on one job and one job only. It's easier for us and keeps you focused.
00:34:36
Speaker
We may have like, you might be working on one small job and I'm working on another small job. And then I pick up some of the work, you know, and you pick up some. We did. We kind of did that last couple of jobs because you more or less built those chases while I was working on those. Some years. Some years thing. Yeah. And then when there was time in between, we both would help each other out.
00:34:58
Speaker
Yeah, the shop is too small to have too much going on. And it muddies the lines between the jobs, which is not good for like budgeting the hours, I feel like, because we have to keep in mind how much time we're spending on things. Exactly. All right. Is this next question from Freddie? No.
00:35:23
Speaker
Hal Den. We don't know the real identity of Hal Den. We're gonna have to dive into that. Either they're one of our patrons or they hacked into the livestream somehow. You want to read it? Yeah. How do you combine your Sanders? Do you start with Rotex and move to ETS 155 or ETS 153?
00:35:47
Speaker
Or do you rock the Rotex all the way? I've got the Rotex and thinking of getting the ETS. Which one would you recommend? The ETS 155 or the 153? If you don't know, the 150 is the size. So that's a six inch. And then the five and three are the millimeters of travel in the orbit. So the five is a little coarser than the three.
00:36:11
Speaker
Well, we got the Rotex and I mean, I love the Rotex and as long as I can work on my bench or on a table, I'll rock the Rotex. If I got to do angles, I'll reach one of the smaller sandals. Yeah, the Rotex gets a little heavy when you got to sand edges and stuff. Yeah. Yeah, I...
00:36:32
Speaker
I will go Rotex all the way. I do like to finish last, though, with the 153 because we have we've got a 153 and two LTD fives, which are sorry, one 125 is the 125 of the five inch. Yeah, we have 125 threes. We used to have the 153, but Rich killed it. Yeah. Just no coffee on it. Thanks a lot. Yeah.
00:37:03
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know the big difference between the five and the three. I guess you get a more fine finish with the three. I don't know how much more. It's only a two millimeter orbit difference, but, um, we love the rugs. That's what it does. Yeah. I'd say grabbing one 53 and then, you know, your, your, uh,
00:37:26
Speaker
I don't know what the orbit is on the Rotex on orbital mode. Oh yeah, I don't either. If I had to guess, I'd say it's probably five. Yeah. I wouldn't think it's as fine as the three. I'd get an ETS 153. Well, you know what, Sander, I want next. I think all the listeners out there know too. Put it down in the comments. What's Sander rub once?
00:37:58
Speaker
All right, what's next what we got up next we got another one from Freddy here Do you buy your lumber at two to three hundred board feet at a time to save money and not waste time?
Buying Lumber in Bulk: Pros and Cons
00:38:09
Speaker
well We bought we have to buy 300 board feet from our supplier to get a delivery. Yeah, cuz we're out in Pennsylvania And they deep deep into Pennsylvania
00:38:20
Speaker
Yeah, it's several hours drive and the wood comes on a semi trailer and it's the best wood at the best price available to us. Yeah, everybody always says, Oh, did you try Rex? Did you try it?
00:38:37
Speaker
This stuff. I don't know that place. The price is so fucking good and the wood is so good. Yeah. I don't know how they do it. It's like and we're buying in smoke. We're buying in the smallest possible quantity for them. They're selling by the thousands of board feet. I'd have to assume for the most part they're supplying some of the places that you guys are getting wood. Yeah. One time we bought like almost 800 board feet.
00:39:02
Speaker
We was 770 when we did. No, I think we got more than that. That was just the five quarter. Yeah, that was the oak. But then we got four quarter also. Yeah. But. Yeah, so we're buying 300 board feet at a time. Sometimes, you know, we'll divide that up. We might get 100, 150 board feet of one species. Yeah. Yeah, but the truck doesn't show up unless it's 300 or more. Yeah. How much room you think we have in our little shed?
00:39:31
Speaker
Uh, a couple thousand board feet. Yeah. Maybe like about 2000. Yeah. Yeah. We could probably store about 2000. We've had that thing packed. No joke.
00:39:46
Speaker
So it does save us money and saves us time. Yep. Because you know, we have to, we have to take a trailer. The shop is behind the house. So there's no way a semi could get back here. Nope. So we drive a trailer out to the street.
00:40:03
Speaker
and load up the trailer and then drive the trailer back to the shop, which is about 200 feet. And then we put it in our shed. Yeah, even with a thousand board foot delivery, you're talking an hour and a half. It's no big deal. No, we take it off the truck in no time, actually. It's still faster than going to buy lumber. Yeah. And here's the thing.
00:40:26
Speaker
We don't have to sort through anything or look for a good board that's all graded, FAS, it's all good. I mean, rarely do we get a board that's not usable. It is. It's much faster, even the way we have to do it, than having to go out to a lumber yard. Yeah, I mean, the closest place for us to get wood is
00:40:46
Speaker
It's an hour round trip, half hour there, half hour back. Yeah, easy. Well after time, you have to spend in there digging through all the junk. And waiting in line because there's only like two people in the whole place. Then you're paying about 75% more or double than what we're paying.
00:41:04
Speaker
Yeah. Like last time we were there again, like $9 for cherry. Yeah. And less than $3 for cherry. I think we buy it for probably the same price they're buying it or something. Yeah. Where they're making some kind of insane profit. Yeah.
00:41:19
Speaker
All right, so update from Parker was looking for a new saw on previous episode and after searching for a new table saw he lucked out, found a used SawStop PCS 52 inch in excellent condition with the ICS mobile base and floating over on dust collection.
Listener Question: Dust Collection Recommendations
00:41:41
Speaker
Forget this, two grand. Now he needs a dust collector and
00:41:48
Speaker
Right now he's just using a shop vac. That's a no-no. Any suggestions Parker's asking? Parker is P Haynes on Instagram. I got a brand to tell you not to buy. I won't tell you what it is, but... Is that the one we're using? Because of their stellar customer service? No, different one. You could guess.
00:42:15
Speaker
They're on they're on a new blacklist. Yeah. I would look at like I know a couple of brands make them now, but like Oneida has a freestanding cyclone that you can kind of like wheel around the shop. That's what we have in Oneida. We have one of those super gorillas. Yeah. So this I think is called like a King Cobra or something. Maybe you can wheel it around the shop. You can hook it up to different tools. It's like a little top. You know, it's a little cyclone over top of a bucket. Yeah.
00:42:45
Speaker
It's pretty small. It's got to have good dust collection. The closer you can get a small dust collector to the tool, the better. Those flex hoses and shit are terrible for dust collection. So you want to have very short runs of flex hose if you want to have good dust collection.
00:43:06
Speaker
And it's good for your health to have good dust collection. Yeah. Like if you're going to get like a bag dust collector, it's really all the same. Um, just, I'd just go to Harbor Freight or something at that point. No sense in buying like a Powermatic or it's a fan with a bag. Um, you're looking at the size of the impeller and the horsepower of the motor. Those are the two.
00:43:29
Speaker
Not much you can do to improve that design, you know, and then the micron filtering of the bag medium itself. Yeah. And those things are it's blowing shit into the shop. Oh, yeah. So.
00:43:45
Speaker
I mean, I'd wish you luck, but it seems like you got luck. Yeah. That's awesome. Because I don't see you saw stops popping up now really ever. Man price. I got a kick out of this stupid video they got suggested to me on YouTube. Oh, oh, the Luna versus saw stop. And the guy's only argument was that the saw stop was too expensive. Yeah.
00:44:14
Speaker
Meanwhile, he's like moving the fence on the lagoon and it's like rattling back and forth. It's made out of like inch and a half square. Clearly not the same category of tool. And we're not even talking about the safety feature. We're just talking about the machine itself. Right. It's a dust collection ability. It's usability. It's a stableness. And everybody poo poos the safety thing. I know. Which pisses me off because you know what?
00:44:42
Speaker
There's always a chance. Every time you use a table saw, I don't care how long you've been doing it. That's right. There's always a chance that you could get cut. Doesn't matter how much attention you're paying. You get a piece of wood that has a lot of tension in it. Yeah. You get distracted for a millisecond. Anything could happen. We've all heard of guys who get their arms sucked into joiners and shit. It happens. Yeah. Yeah, it does. It does. So right on, Parker. Yeah, that's awesome. Better than than a Unisaw that we're telling you to look for. Yeah. Yeah.
00:45:13
Speaker
And we have a Unisaw, it's a good tool, but hey, now you're protected. And you got a newer saw. Who's this guy, Freddy? He's got another question for us. Did I say, Freddy? Freddy, no, Freddy. That was a misprint. This is Freddy. Do your hand plane edges before gluing? No, Freddy, we gotta join him for that. Yeah, not typically.
00:45:37
Speaker
Can't say we've never done it. No. You might get some squirrely reversing grain and stuff and have to clean something up. But no. With that spiral hat, I mean, the one tool that's just so rocks out, the one machine, I'll say.
00:45:54
Speaker
that is old and reliable, that have never faltered, knock on wood has been our joint. Like some others. Yeah. Freddie has this powermatic tenoning machine. Oh, man. It's like two heads like this. Yeah. Pass the board through this way. That thing is so badass. He's been shown he has a oscillating mortising machine. Oh, yeah. It's like.
00:46:21
Speaker
Domino took the idea and created the domino So it's a square mortise chisel and it goes back and forth like this and makes a square Yeah, so you don't have to you know, drop it down move the piece over. Yeah, you know oscillates and it's super sweet. That's cool Yeah, no, of course we we joined all the edges. Yeah, in fact, we helped out a buddy came
00:46:47
Speaker
Steve with the glue up. So shockingly good glue up for having cut the edges with his tracks. So tracks. So a lot of guys do that, believe it or not. Yeah. Wasn't wasn't that bad. I mean, it was happy. I mean, not not to our standards. Yeah. Yeah. I guess second best thing to have in a joiner. Yeah. Or a joiner plane. Yeah.
00:47:14
Speaker
Oh man. We got one from Colin here, one of our patrons, one of our newer patrons, another Australian guy. Yeah.
00:47:21
Speaker
So, Colin supplies a lot of the wood to, uh, H.T. Gordon. You ever heard of them? Did they do those benches? Uh, I think they might make benches, but they make a lot of plan- is it H.N.T. Gordon? Um, you guys know who I'm talking about just by mentioning the name if I'm getting the, uh, H.N.T. Yeah, H.N.T. Gordon. Um, man, they make some gorgeous stuff. Like, look at that. Oh, wow. Yeah. What kind of wood is that?
00:47:55
Speaker
Gidgey. He was just telling me about that. It's like a type of acacia.
00:47:59
Speaker
Aboriginal wood. Yeah. He wants to know, how do you cheat doing dovetails if you're not doing them by hand? Yeah. Well, we have a Keller jig. That's how we do all our dovetails, really. Yeah. Keller jig is basically a piece of phenolic resin that will cut the pins on one side and the tails on the other with its respective bits. Yeah. Rides, the bits ride on a
00:48:27
Speaker
a bearing as opposed to most of the the jig systems they use a collar. And 100 years ago when I first started the Keller jig came out and it was my very first jig. And then I thought I was going to be a professional woodworker I needed the lead jig with the 600 page manual.
00:48:52
Speaker
Now we have the color jig again. It's basically just an unadjustable lee or porter cable or whatever, you know, you know I'll tell you this is this is what I learned It's it gave me the the tightest most Hand-cut looking dovetails. Mm-hmm, and it was the easiest to use this this was my knock with the lee jig and
00:49:19
Speaker
All that adjustability left all these Yeah, and I found that the collar wasn't as accurate as a bearing. And it would, there would always be like one pin that had like a gap in it that I'd have to fill with like a shaving of wood or something like that, no matter
00:49:44
Speaker
how hard I try. The thing was I'd have to try and keep the router oriented the very same way, you know, without turning it. Yeah, except that collar isn't dead center. Right, right. Even with the centering cone. I found that it would get a little oblique sometimes. Yeah. Yeah, brass is soft. I'm not sure why that's the go-to material for those things.
00:50:06
Speaker
Yeah. So that that's how we do it. And I wouldn't say I mean, they're not hand cut dovetails, but they're they're full through dovetails and take plenty of time to make. I mean, yeah, we get we get a good penny for our drawers. It's a it's a nice upcharge, but. Excuse me, like if I'm I'm pretty much the the drawer guy here like a
00:50:35
Speaker
for a kitchen with 20 some odd drawers. It's almost a full week to mill all the material because we use, you know, full hard maple, nice tall sides. We don't really skimp there. Then I got to set up, do all of the dovetails. I mean, you don't edge glue like four pieces into like a three inch drawer. No. You know, and that's industry standard.
00:51:03
Speaker
you got a plane and sand and of course you got to finish and you got to cut the the you know the the notches in the back and all it's it's a lot of work yeah but there's nothing like it i mean it's something that the clients really dig when you when you show them like these big drawers and then they see how heavy it is like the drawers like 20 pounds oh yeah
00:51:32
Speaker
And it adds to the experience of the closing and opening, you know, it's like, I kind of like it to, you know, like the way a door and a nice Mercedes or something shots it feels heavy goes.
00:51:47
Speaker
Yeah, or like when you close a two and a quarter inch front door instead of an inch and three is right, right? It has that substantial feeling to it. Yep. So that's how we do it. It's it's definitely I'm gonna say in my experience, the next best thing to hand cut dovetail, which
00:52:10
Speaker
For me, if I'm doing something like that, I like to leave in all the makers marks and all that stuff so that it really looks hand cut. You know, as described lines and all that junk. That's the way I like and most people they look at it. They go, Why do you see all these marks on it?
00:52:32
Speaker
Yeah, like hand-cut dovetails on a kitchen is a little excessive. It's like that's something you do when you have a few drawers on a dresser or something like that. Yeah, like as soon as they had machines that did it, they stopped hunting them by hand. You know what I mean? So that's our secret.
00:52:52
Speaker
Alright, here's something from Freddy, and we kind of went over this in our Patreon lecture series. Do you mark up material these days with how they've increased? I don't know, maybe it's just us. We haven't really seen an increase. No, the stuff that we use hasn't gone up yet.
00:53:14
Speaker
Maybe slightly, but I wouldn't even say anything more than 5%, which you get fluctuations like that anyway.
00:53:24
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, we we see more fluctuation based on the woods that China is using than, yeah, anything else. I mean, that was something we learned. I mean, everything that we're buying is coming from a few hundred miles away at most. Yeah. Sapili is the one thing that we buy that comes from outside the continental United States.
00:53:47
Speaker
Like oak went up because they were using a lot of oak in China and cherry went down because they weren't using a lot of cherry in China. Right. And even the domestic demand for oak is a lot higher because it used them and everybody's using it for flooring. Yeah.
00:54:02
Speaker
So, yeah, I mean, we mark up material anyway. Not a lot. Handling. Yeah. And to account for, you know, the fact that we have to buy more than we may use. But we haven't really had to increase the price because of price increases in the material. No. You know, I'll call for a price before we bid a big job and haven't seen a crazy increase.
00:54:32
Speaker
The penultimate question from Rich, also one of our patrons. Rich is building a crawlspace access door.
00:54:47
Speaker
Front face is decent quality plywood, but the grain is still showing after about three coats of good paint. Oh man, I lightly sanded with 180 after the third coat. I know you guys don't use paint much as a finish, but do you use a grain filler that you like?
00:55:06
Speaker
That's a good question. I can't say that I have any experience using grain fillers, but any any good wood putty is going to be fine. Skim coat that puppy, sand it, paint it, you'll be good. Yeah, even if you have to thin it down a little bit, huh?
00:55:24
Speaker
Yeah, if you use something that's, uh, I'm assuming cross-base act, you're talking about inside, uh, like, I like the Elmer's, uh, that comes with the orange top. You can just throw some water in there, get it real thin, take a wide spackle knife and just, uh, coat it, sand it. Yeah. And you're golden then. Yep. I agree with that. Yeah. Oh, so it's oak grain. Yeah. It's probably pretty deep. Yeah.
00:55:53
Speaker
I mean, you could just paint it like a couple more times and maybe it might be filled in, but. Yeah. I like, I like your suggestion there. Skim it with some thinned out Elmer's. Yeah. And a new container. That stuff is pretty, pretty, um, spreadable. Yeah. It's nice when it comes out. It's like icing. Yeah. Like the first time you open a thing of putty, it's, it's the best it's going to get.
00:56:17
Speaker
I'm not going to get any better than that. Once you get one little dry spot and it gets mixed in there somehow, you're screwed. Man, we got one more question. Who's this from? Birdie?
00:56:32
Speaker
I'm Freddie here at Craftsman. We want to thank Freddie for all kidding aside. He hit me with most of these last week and it was too late. It must have been right before we started. So I didn't get a chance to because we love getting the questions. I mean, it's really what drives our podcast. So and he's got good ones. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. And don't forget to check out Freddie's podcast. Yeah. Against the Green with Justin De Palma. And I think Guy Dunlap is the third guy's name. How many hours a day or week do you work?
00:57:03
Speaker
in the shop, we work about 40. Yep. Out of the shop. It's untold. I mean, could be could be yet to a week or it could be 20. And it also depends on like how you define work. Yeah, as small businessmen.
00:57:23
Speaker
It's, you know, the job is never far from our minds or something we're doing. So we might be reading, we might be pricing, we might just be looking for design inspiration. Yeah, doing social media, whatever. Yeah. So as a small business person, you're always on, I would say.
00:57:47
Speaker
you're awake, you're working. Yeah, I agree. And that doesn't mean like we're slavishly working. I mean, hey, if you don't like what you do, get another job. Yeah, we're present in in what we do at all times, I think. So I never feel like that I'm overworking myself. There are some days where you're more tired than others. But
00:58:16
Speaker
It's as Jeff said, we're lucky isn't the right word because we put so much effort into it. They I feel we've made a lot of our own luck. But to be able to do this in today's climate of you know, fast and disposable stuff. We really run against the grain and we're supporting two families. So
00:58:45
Speaker
Thank you. Actually, I have two questions from our buddy Manny. Some seeing that we're not even at an hour. We spent two hours. We've already been doing this and talking and hearing our own voices for over three hours now. We've got to do the Patreon show after this. This is from our buddy Manny Sirianni. Two Manny mistakes on Instagram.
00:59:11
Speaker
What is one trick you have learned that changed the game for you? Oh god. Um... I can't- I don't know, uh... A trick.
00:59:23
Speaker
I don't know if I'd call anything a trick that I've learned that would change the game. It's it's been a slow for me accumulation of knowledge, you know, because I didn't have any mentors or anything like that. So I always had to learn by bumping my head against the wall. Yeah, join the club. So I really can't think of anything offhand that being that cracked me up. John Peters put up a video using the shop.
00:59:52
Speaker
of me running the Shaper, and somebody commented, oh wow, yeah, he really learned a lot in woodworking school. What woodworking school? There isn't even one around here to go. Guys like Freddie are lucky that they have North Bennett Street School up there. Yeah, yeah. So I would say that the thing that I learned the most was not about woodworking, but more about my person, about my mindset.
01:00:21
Speaker
And my being is that I would much rather, you know, do my own thing, and take the burden of success and failure and all that, but be in creative control of, of my destiny. Because I think at, at the heart of it, I'm an artist and to, you know, most degrees,
01:00:49
Speaker
and working for other people and doing sort of like assembly line work.
01:00:56
Speaker
It's unfulfilling.
Creative Control in Woodworking Business
01:00:58
Speaker
It is. There was the camaraderie of working in a place where you have friends. But now I got you. So we get to build bullshit. I get the best of both worlds. You know, before that, it was work by yourself and, you know, do what you want, which could be exhausting. You know, it can. Because just having the presence of another person is is good. Being able to commiserate and share, you know, the bad parts of the of run the business.
01:01:26
Speaker
Yeah, there's something to that. So that's what I learned. It was I like being the captain of the of my own ship. And that means, you know, sharing it with Jeff. So it's not like, you know, it's your captain Bly. It's a it's a full on partnership. You're making deep literary references that you expect people to get. Sorry.
01:02:03
Speaker
I'd say one of the biggest ones for me is like that the
01:02:11
Speaker
like stacking and measuring kind of thing where. You know, you're making a door and needs to be 20 inches wide and you have your rails, your styles and you stack them together and pull your tape to 20 on the outside and then read the inside. Yeah, that's a good word to explain. I we have like a little YouTube clip about it. That is a good one because it just translates into so many different operations in the shop for a way to just reduce your math and and.
01:02:37
Speaker
you know if you have two pieces that are 64th light well that adds up to a 30 second and you might not always see that on the measuring and you know you hold your tape at a little bit of an angle and it you know it skews your view I remember whatever you bit when you did that video yeah so I like that one and Manny actually has another question
01:02:58
Speaker
Do you guys ever bump heads and have strong difference of opinions on projects? I mean, I think we did a little bit at the beginning as we were when there were three of us here also, and we were just trying to find our feet, but yeah.
01:03:14
Speaker
I think as time goes on it's it's definitely been less and less and we've learned to just go with the flow of yeah and I mean truth is we more or less agree on everything and it's always
01:03:30
Speaker
not always but it's so often six of one half dozen of another yeah the finish line is always the same yeah so is it and it's just no big deal that's that's really the the end result yeah i mean
01:03:45
Speaker
And it's a lot easier with two guys, especially when when one of the three has no real opinion on anything. I thought you were going to say back. Well, yeah, no comment. So, yeah, it's it's easier. It's just it's just easier. It is. It's like any relationship, you know, they get better as you as you go on.
01:04:13
Speaker
Because, well, I guess the healthy ones do. No, it's I think a lot of the answers are self evident, too. So that it's within, you know, the sphere of our work. The answers are pretty much there for everybody to see. Yep.
01:04:41
Speaker
Well, they emailed me back about the stuff. Oh, yeah, what'd they say? They said, thanks. Was the box punctured? And they said it's just cosmetic, so it won't affect the function until we get it figured out. So that's cool. We had some damage to our new power feeder. Yeah. Maybe they'll give us a little, they'll throw us a couple of t-shirts. I know.
01:05:08
Speaker
what the big companies think of us. Yeah. Thank God for Montana. You have catastrophic failure with your machine that will get to it.
01:05:20
Speaker
You got a couple weeks? Oh, Lord. Well, what do you think about the beer? I like it. Yeah, it's like it. It's a just a nice simple. Yeah, I think citrusy was, you know, they described. I think that's that's accurate. Yeah, it's got good bitterness, kind of that lemon peel kind of bitterness. Yeah, not citrusy in a juice kind of way. But yeah, like you say, the the peel, that kind of more
01:05:47
Speaker
bitter taste that the lemon peel might provide. Yep. I like everything I've tried from them from Ross. I want to say who was the s'mores beer from?
01:06:03
Speaker
That wasn't them? No, no. It was in one of those similar types of cans. The one that you liked? No. No, that was the waffle one. The s'mores one was good. Yeah, which the waffle I forgot. I don't know who the hell made that. That was interesting. That was terrible.
01:06:22
Speaker
Yeah, well, you but you know, the week before last when I brought in that Kona, that was the first ever two thumbs down beer in our entire podcast history. Yeah. And we've had some okay beers, not every beer. Can't say the Kona was undrinkable, but definitely.
01:06:40
Speaker
No, it was like it was really like it was like masquerading as like a craft beer. So yes, it's kind of put a bad taste in my mouth. Right. I felt cheated. Came in like these little bottles trying to make it look like, you know, it was all crafty. Just made out of melted down Budweiser bottles.
01:07:00
Speaker
The ones that break when they fall off the assembly line. Like, yeah, melt these down. Send them to the longboard factory. Yeah. Hawaii. Where was it? Rude again. Fort Collins, Colorado. Yeah, I know. It's probably like a spill off from the Coors factory or something. It's Budweiser, apparently. Oh, yeah. Oh, geez. Yep. Now I really feel cheated. Yeah.
01:07:30
Speaker
at least it wasn't Coors Light. Yeah, thank God for that. Well, that brings us to the end of another podcast. We thank our Gold Tier patrons. Yeah, Jerry Greenan, David Murphy, Manny Sirianni, Dustin Fair, Adam Pothass, David Shoemaker, and Colin Lai. And as always, we'll have a link to the Tool of the Week, the Micro Jig, Zero Play,
01:07:57
Speaker
Yeah. If you're making some kind of sled or anything like that, a jig in the shop, I would say that's based on the price and its performance. There's no other equivalent option. We tried all the HDP doesn't work. The metal ones aren't great. The making one out of wood. It's always changing with. Yeah, it's great one day. It's jammed the next. Yeah, it just saves a headache.
01:08:25
Speaker
If you would like to follow us on Patreon, we have a link down there too. We're doing these live streams now. I guess we're going to try and do them either bimonthly or quarterly. You know, these sort of learning educational type things. We did the pricing and prefabrication protocol today.
01:08:44
Speaker
And we'll be playing in the next one. We'll be a little more prepared technologically. Yeah. The next one. Yeah. It was a bit of a learning curve to do a YouTube live with the screen switching and sharing the screen and stuff. So we could easily plug in another monitor for next time. Oh, yeah. We could even probably do dual laptops somehow. Yeah. Yeah. Also, the American Craftsman podcast Glass. Oh, yeah. We still have
01:09:12
Speaker
I don't know, maybe about 10 left. Yeah. So you can find those on the website and you can have a beer with us while you listen to the podcast. And yeah, I think that's all we got. Thank you as always. Thank you. See you guys next week. Episode 30. Three next week. Double three. Later on.
01:09:51
Speaker
Sunday ain't no shame, but there's been a chain.