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Your Body My Choices: Why Gen-Z Is Having Less Sex
116 Plays3 months ago
In this thought-provoking episode, we dive into why Gen Z’s sexual activity is on the decline, uncovering the cultural and political forces at play. Starting with the widening gender divide, we discuss how the recent wave of conservatism among young men and anti-feminist sentiments are influencing dating dynamics. We break down the alt-right pipeline that’s radicalizing young men to blame feminism and women for personal and societal issues while demanding contradictory ideals of femininity and sexuality.
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Transcript
Introduction and Topic Setup
00:00:00
Jon McCray Jones
Hi, welcome to the Fun with Sex podcast. My name is John. And I'm Natalie. And today we're talking about why Gen Z is having less sex. Because it's a fact that Gen Z is having less sex than their parents and their grandparents. And we just want to give our two cents into the conversation for why we think that is. Yeah, especially as Gen Z people, um we're going to give that perspective.
00:00:26
Jon McCray Jones
yeah Because there's this thing where I think in our collective of consciousness We think they're like the kids today in college are fucking like rabbits when in reality, that's not true Gen Z is a little bit more sex-positive when it comes to things like kink, but when it comes to like Having actual sex with other people Surveys are showing that there's less and less sex happening Yeah. And I think the way the older generations look at it is they kind of envision, you know, Oh, it's because Gen Z we're all just these like socially awkward people who get anxious by everything. So we're just not capable of like forming connections to have
Political Divide and Its Impact on Dating
00:01:11
Jon McCray Jones
sex. And, you know, I think that could be the case for some people, but I don't think that's like,
00:01:17
Jon McCray Jones
the generational issue at hand here. Or I think they think it's the exact opposite that like Gen Z are these wild and free going doing drugs that raves and fucking every person who walks by, which is also not true. Gen Z is not that much different than other generations. And like, if anything, I think this recent election show is that with the idea that there was this idea that Gen Z was going to be socially way more progressive and liberal yeah than other generations and Gen Z in general showed that's not going to be the case and specifically Gen Z men showed that that's not going to be the case and I think that's a big reason why sex is going down because
00:02:06
Jon McCray Jones
men, cis men and cis women are dating less. And the big reason why is the stark political divide between cis straight guys and cis straight women, and especially like when you group in bi women who also date men too. Yeah. And I think that's the interesting thing that happened this past election is men across a variety of demographics, not just white men chose to vote red. And of course, white women, plenty of them still voted red, but more and more women are moving further left, especially when you account for getting more education, you know, women are more
00:02:49
Jon McCray Jones
Educated I think more than men nowadays. We hold more degrees and we're moving further left also the idea that like what More and more women are identifying as queer Yeah, I think it's like a quarter of all women. Don't quote me on this one because I'm like Trying to remember the fact but I think a quarter of all women identify as bisexual which also leads to the idea that like women are identifying as queer, and Republicans are attacking queer rights. ah And also with conservatives are attacking abortion rights, conservatives who are attacking IVF, conservatives are trying to remove no-fault divorce, and they're trying to bring America back to this patriarchal, traditional status quo, and more and more women are rejecting that, right? Yeah, and I think, you know, choice lesbianism has always been around, especially for bi women.
00:03:45
Jon McCray Jones
Um, but now it's becoming even more popular. Like the W I believe it's W for movement gain for B yeah it's starting to gain popularity here where people are just like, it's not worth it to interact with men or date men. So I think we're getting a lot of women like that where in the past, I think a lot of bi woman turned towards dating a man. Cause that was the easier option.
00:04:12
Jon McCray Jones
And it was easier to deny the fact you were attracted to your same gender. But I think now a lot of bi women who may have typically just dated and married a man are looking around and being like, yeah, my, uh, my life would be a lot happier if I like dated women. And I think that's the one thing that the surveys are missing out on when they're saying that Gen Z is having less sex. I wonder if Gen Z is having less sex or Gen Z is having less straight sex.
00:04:40
Jon McCray Jones
Yeah, especially with more and more women identifying as bisexual and a lot of times these surveys define sex as penetration ah with an emphasis on like penis penetration. I wonder if like a lot of women who are like, Hey, this is how many sexual partners I've had, if that number would increase one or two people, if you would consider like women on women sex or fem on fem sex.
00:05:06
Jon McCray Jones
Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if the data was definitely geared towards heterosis people. Yeah. And I guess the other important part of this is that It's obvious why women are moving more towards the left because like the right is slowly trying to strip away women's rights. And yeah they're pretty vocal about their disdain for women. I mean, you have Donald Trump saying things like, I'm going to protect women, whether they like them or not. odd Nick Fuentes, who the name of this podcast episode is based off of, recorded himself saying, your body, my choice. In response to Donald Trump being elected, talking to a lot of abortions.
00:05:44
Jon McCray Jones
So it's very obvious why women are alike. The Republican party doesn't represent me as much. Why do you think young men are shifting more and more towards conservatism?
Challenges with Masculinity and Changing Roles
00:05:54
Jon McCray Jones
I think for a lot of men, their self-esteem and their sense of self was one of the major things was built upon was first of all, your ability to get a good job and have money.
00:06:08
Jon McCray Jones
and then your ability to have a hot woman serving you, you know? And that's just not readily available anymore. I mean, we are in a deteriorating society where nobody can afford to live even if you do go to college, even if you do get a good salary job. And things aren't promised to you anymore. Back in the day, women had to marry men and they had to marry at a very young age.
00:06:37
Jon McCray Jones
because Otherwise, you would not have access to anything. You wouldn't be able to go out and buy a house, get a credit card, whatever. so Now, that isn't the case. A woman can do pretty much anything they want on their own without having a man sign off on it.
00:06:56
Jon McCray Jones
So there isn't this dependency and this need to marry a man and to marry a man right away. um So a lot of women back in the day, you just kind of settled for the first guy who was ready to marry you who seemed like a decent guy.
00:07:13
Jon McCray Jones
And you know I think it's kind of thrown off the balance of things for these men who are very dependent on a traditional masculine role. It's like, women don't need you anymore. And because you're not like a nice, respectful guy, they're not like chasing down your car to try and get a date with you. so I think they feel very disgruntled by that and they're trying to push back for more traditional ways. Yeah, I agree and I think two things happen and I want to like take some time to explain both. I think one, men have lost the power of economic and social coercion that they once had, that their fathers and grandfathers had. Yeah. And two, I think that cis straight guys are having
00:08:03
Jon McCray Jones
an identity complex slash victim complex happening right now where they don't know what healthy masculinity looks like in the modern era. So like I think you really did a really good job of explaining the economic coercion that men have lost in the past, say 40, 50 years ago ah or so, the idea that In the sixties and fifties, if a woman wanted to live a good life, nine times out of 10, she had to find someone to marry and to have kids with. And that was the only economic and social protection that she have. Whereas now women who are single or women who marry other women report some of the heaviest levels, the highest levels of happiness in our society. yeah They live longer. They're healthier. They're happier than like.
00:08:57
Jon McCray Jones
Women who marry men and they also seem to have like more economic autonomy to yeah economic power So like that's being taken away for men that power but also like I don't I think that like that tells half the story. I think the other half of the story is that Women had multiple waves of feminism to define what femininity looks like. Yeah and modernity whereas men haven't had those thinkers define what masculinity looks like in a healthy way. Like there has been moral panics around masculinity in America going back to the mid 1800s about what's going on with men. I know there was a big moral panic that happened in like the 1920s and 30s about ah women teachers, quote unquote, feminizing young boys. Yeah.
00:09:48
Jon McCray Jones
More fathers are working not ah at the farms, more fathers are working not at the farms and they're working away from home and young boys are spending more time with their mothers. And like, what does that mean for masculinity? There's always these moral panics around men, but there's never anything constructively done. Yeah. And I think that that's where we're at now where liberals in an attempt to decenter men and like the left, which is like very fair.
00:10:17
Jon McCray Jones
stopped talking to men in a way that I think hasn't been healthy. Yeah. And I think that the only people who are talking to men at this point is like right-wing influencers. People like the Andrew Tates, the Jordan Peterson's, the Joe Rogan's are the voices that men are hearing talk to them. And these are the people who are defining what masculinity looks like.
00:10:41
Jon McCray Jones
And I understand the importance of the century man because men have been so have been center for all of history. But what I would say is that like, they still make up 50% of the voting block. There's still people that we need to have as a functional society. And I think if we did a better job of like, educating men what healthy masculinity looks like, we may may not be in this predicament that we are in now, if that makes sense.
00:11:06
Jon McCray Jones
Yeah, because I think the whole thing with feminism is like back in the day woman and still to an extent to this day, we're programmed that our value is based upon how we look, how good of a partner in service we are to a man, how submissive we are, how you know, and feminism, all the waves of the movement just completely destroyed that. And now most women have the realization of like, yes, I hold more value than what I look, but the issue is men are still stuck in this state where it's like my value is defined by what kind of job, how much money I make.
00:11:49
Jon McCray Jones
how hot the girl is that's with me, what car I drive, how strong I am. These very superficial measures of like what a human being is. And that's what I was going to say that like a lot of the metrics of what defines masculinity has not shifted in the past 100 years.
00:12:09
Jon McCray Jones
It's like muscles, wealth, and power. And then you see like modern day masculinity influencers talk directly in that language. It was like how did Andrew take blow up? He talks about the beautiful women that he have with him and like the nice cars that they drive. And it was also like a weirdly anti-capitalistic movement where he's telling young men how to like exploit other people to remove themselves from having to work themselves. yeah and i think that like you can't separate this crazy cringe outright movement with men from capitalism and the fact that like services like youtube and spotify in a mental sphere is incentivize these young men to go into these echo chambers
00:13:01
Jon McCray Jones
where they build up these anger and frustration oftentimes at women, most of the time at women, yeah often ah like community like queer communities and modernity in general, and they tell these men, hey, if you just go to the gym a little bit more, you build a little bit more muscle,
00:13:21
Jon McCray Jones
um you get a nicer car, you fight for the return of traditional norms and then maybe you'll be happy. Maybe you'll understand what it means to be masculine in society.
Double Standards and Misogyny in Modern Dating
00:13:32
Jon McCray Jones
yeah Whereas I think that like if we want to move forward about what's happening with man, we may need to create a culture around communicating to man of like, no, no, no, like this is what masculinity looks like. You don't have to uphold these stringent gender norms that keeps you in a cage and you can be more than that. You can wear the color pink. You can also like find peace in things that are deemed more feminine by society. You don't always have to uphold this very powerful image. It's okay to cry. It's okay to say that you need help. And I think a lot of it too comes down to the sense of entitlement that white men have been
00:14:19
Jon McCray Jones
socialized to feel secure in for generations upon generations because there are so many of these guys. I mean, when you look at their stories as to what radicalized them, like when you look at a woman's story of what radicalized them to like be hateful towards men, it's like, yeah, I was assaulted like five times before the age of 18. So fuck men. But then you look at these men's story and like, sure, there are some people where it's like,
00:14:49
Jon McCray Jones
you know, more sob stories. But like a lot of these guys are just like, well, I was a nice guy to this girl and she cheated on me. So now you just like hate all women. And like, I get they're viewing it that way. And we understand there's something deeper going on with society and men's mental health and stuff like that. But it's this sense of entitlement of like,
00:15:14
Jon McCray Jones
i I should be entitled to this woman's attention. yeah Nowadays, when I hold the door for a woman or when I hit on a woman, they're allowed to be like annoyed at me and not feels super flattered that I'm hitting on them. And I don't like that because I should be entitled to woman. I did everything right. I did what my dad did. I went to college. I got a good job. So what's going on? And it's like we're all sitting here and we're like, well, you're an asshole douchebag. So that's why women don't like you. But it's resentment politics and it's a lurch towards the past.
00:15:52
Jon McCray Jones
Like we said before it's an attempt by men to say that like things were easier for us Back in a time when women were forced to economically and socially be dependent on us. Yeah, and I think that The same thing you see that trump does with like poor white people of all genders I think that you see that conservatism does with men in general and I think that's why you're seeing a return or more and more man of color voting for conservative politics because it's the idea that Your life in society was better and your life now would be better if women were dependent on you yeah Women were forced to date you if women were forced to have sex with you in order for them to have a good life and that's the other thing too is that like a Lot of men aren't socialized if you women as people I think three not I think a lot of men are socialized if you women as one and
00:16:46
Jon McCray Jones
another object like you were saying like I deserve to have a hot woman like I have a hot car if I check all these boxes of accomplishment if I make enough money if I have enough muscles if like I get the education then like I deserve to have a quote-unquote hot or physically a attractive woman on my side and it's another marker of my masculinity versus like I want a partner who I value their opinions and I value them as human beings Yeah, and I think that's the another reason why like men are having less sex is because like Women today are like you don't see me as a person when we have sex. You don't value my pleasure You're not using a vibrator on me. You're not doing foreplay Sex for you is some type of reward that you feel entitled to and that's why like I think that there's also like going on a tangent. There's this weird ironic double standard where men are fucking themselves over just like out of self-interest we're like
00:17:44
Jon McCray Jones
The same guys who absorb content about like women over-sexualizing themselves and being too sexually promiscuous are also the same guys who like are going to enjutate for like information of how to like hook up with women better. Yeah. And it's like, do you not understand that? Like if you stop sex shaming slut shaming women, probably more women would be in, will be open to the idea of casual sex. They knew that.
00:18:14
Jon McCray Jones
They want to be socially judged for participating in like normal, natural human behavior and sexual desires. But you can have a society where you like expect women to have casual sex with you, but then also shame them when they do have casual sex with you. Like you're hurting yourselves at that. Yeah, but that's not what they want. Nobody marries the girl who was already a slut. You're supposed to,
00:18:38
Jon McCray Jones
Marry the nice girl who wasn't sexually promiscuous and turn her into a slut because if she wants it then it's like Oh, she's just easy who wants a girl who's just easy, you know, yeah, and I think that like That's the cognitive dissonance that happens when you have A cult and like I think that like what we're watching is that like young men are being indoctrinated into a cult because they don't know the answers of what it means to be a man in today's society. And I think that they're turning to these gurus to try to help them figure out what masculinity and modernity looks like. And what is so funny going back to capitalism, all these guys are trying to sell them supplements and products. like That's the one thing that I don't think people talk about enough is that
00:19:29
Jon McCray Jones
And you take Joe Rogan, Jordan Peterson. They're not just giving them advice because they care about these men or because even are trying to get like a personal brand across. They're selling products to these guys. yeah This is a.
00:19:43
Jon McCray Jones
That's nice. It's an MLM marketing chain. It's like, yo, we'll fix your life only if you buy these products. I know like Joe Rogan has this weird like alpha brain product that he sells. Jordan Peterson sells books and speaking engagements. Andrew Tate has like a crash course on like how to like get women. And it's like, it's a matrix of how much sex our generation is having.
00:20:07
Jon McCray Jones
Is their metric of success it's not working. Yeah, and I do think that like These next four years under the trump administration and and and if we want to have men Mature into more progressive people or the next generation of men to like view women as human beings I think we do need to talk to them and instruct younger guys on like Hey, this is what being a man and this is what dating and modernity looks like because also people like a lot of guys are scared to approach women in a way that like people in a few paths weren't. I think that like we don't talk about consent in school. So like a lot of guys are like, I don't know how to flirt in a way that is consensual and respectful. So I decided to just not flirt at all. And instead I just have this like resentment towards women because I'm scared of them.
00:21:03
Jon McCray Jones
Yeah, I mean, I think it's also just that more is at stake now, like back in the day, you could just actually harass harass somebody, even if like, you weren't harassing them and you just go up to a girl at the bar.
00:21:18
Jon McCray Jones
women were so socialized back in those days to always be very nice and submissive. So even if she wasn't into you, she would be like, Oh, okay. And you know, you could still kind of live in this imaginary world where every single girl or you approach is into you. And now women have the freedom and we're not confined to that specific personality. So,
00:21:45
Jon McCray Jones
were able to somewhat more deny people and say we're not entrust interested. And I say somewhat because you know there's still a lot of coercion. Some guys are so extreme to threaten violence or threaten rape, but a lot of guys are will just be an asshole to you and say you were ugly and fat anyways or whatever. But you know there is more freedom to like politely be like yeah, I'm not interested and I think the reason why men resort to violence rather either in rhetoric or physical violence after they get rejected is because society tells them that their masculinity is tight like getting laid and getting
00:22:30
Jon McCray Jones
And like to be fair that doesn't just come from like the endu-taste of the world one of the like biggest insults that like people of all gender give against men is like Oh, I bet you get no girls or like you don't give yeah, and like it ties masculinity and successful masculinity to the idea of like you need to be able to get these objects that are women. And if you don't get these objects that are women, then you're not doing masculinity correctly. And I think that's an unhealthy way to do masculinity. And going to your other point, I don't think those two things are mutually exclusive. I think that like
00:23:09
Jon McCray Jones
The reason why men in the past weren't as nervous to like approach women were because they knew that they could harass without consequences. Yeah. And like that was just the culture at the time. But like culture today is we, you need to learn how to respectfully approach a woman or there will be consequences, but there's no lessons on like how to like do these interactions. Cause this is like a new modern thing that people are doing.
Future Discussions on Gender Norms
00:23:39
Jon McCray Jones
And we need to like guide people in how to do it correctly of how to flirt and like how to make the first move in a way that is healthy for everyone involved. Yeah. And like we're running out of time. and I think that like we have even made it halfway through our outline for our conversation today. Um, I think we should like come back and revisit this conversation in two weeks and like talk about gender norms and talk about how do we move forward and talk about how capitalism and like online dating has kind of ruined flirting and like relationships too. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Well, this has been a fun of sex podcast. Thank you for listening.