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When You Are Not Quiet and Gentle
127 Plays5 months ago
When You Are Not Quiet and Gentle is an exuberant conversation with Rach, Maddy, and Bec about extrovert personalities (the personality type that calls out to a speaker from the back of the room), the downward mental spiral when you compare yourself to Maud Flanders, and what on earth “quiet and gentle” actually means. Is it a personality type or something much more? Join an ED nurse, a women’s ministry worker, and clinical psych reg on a tour through nineties church culture, 1 Peter 3:3-4, and Greek words.
Disclaimer: We really, really emphasise that we are 100% not experts here. We’re processing what we’re learning about the application of biblical principles to life in the hope you might have these conversations with your friends too.
In today’s episode, we:
- Deep dive the concepts of quiet and gentle
- Discuss our experiences of not fitting the “quiet and gentle” mould
- Explore personality, internal vs external quietness, restless hearts, and dependence on the Lord
- Discuss what faithfulness to God has called you to do and be looks like in different women
Check out the show notes for everything mentioned in the show.
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Music: Come Back by Ketsa. Licensed under a Creative Commons License Non-Commercial, No-Derivatives 4.0 International License.
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Transcript
Introduction to 'After Dinner Mint'
00:00:00
Speaker
I was going to say my ah original thought when I became a Christian about gentle, you know, like quiet and gentle, I was like Maud Flanders.
00:00:17
Speaker
This is the After Dinner Mint, a podcast of stories I tell you at dinner. Think of the mint as the stories you tell after you've been kicked out of the restaurant, holding your mint, standing in the streets,
00:00:28
Speaker
telling more honest stories with your friends than you did at the table. It's not a sermon. It's not advice. It's not self-help. We're processing what we're learning about faith and life, honestly, in community, to encourage you to do that with your God and your community.
Exploring Gentleness and Quietness in Women
00:00:50
Speaker
Hi, everybody.
00:00:51
Speaker
my name's Rach, and I'm here today with Bec and Maddy for our latest episode. You guys wanted to say hi? Hello. Hello, everyone. right Today we're going to discuss a common topic among women in the church, which is help.
00:01:08
Speaker
I'm not quite... I mean, help in general is all, yeah, but specifically. So, which is obviously based on 1 Peter 3, 3 and 4, which is, do not let your adorning be external, the braiding of your hair and the putting on of gold jewellery or the clothing you wear, but let your adorning be the hidden person of the heart,
00:01:28
Speaker
with the imperishable beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, too which in God's sight is very precious. ah So we're going to start. also Yeah, I know. it's This has been a big one for me as someone who grew up in the church, trying to figure out what does that actually mean as a woman who is by nature neither quiet nor gentle.
00:01:50
Speaker
How do i be that way and what does that actually mean? So our first question is how would you define the word gentle?
00:02:02
Speaker
Bec, do you want to start with that? Do you have a ah thought on that? yeah Yeah. have a dictionary definition. Lovely. know, because I love the dictionary. 100% nerd, whatever.
00:02:13
Speaker
Gentle means free from harshness, sternness, or violence. I mean, I'm probably that maybe. and don't know. It's not what I thought it was, to be honest. i was like, I am 100% not quiet or gentle. You know, super violent.
00:02:28
Speaker
But no, ah yeah, that was not the definition I was really thinking of. No. Maddie? Yeah,
Misinterpretations and Personal Reflections
00:02:34
Speaker
look, I nerded out a little and I looked at what words are used in Greek and when it's in the Bible.
00:02:40
Speaker
And it's like I was interesting because the word that's used in that one Peter reference, which what translation are you using? Because that was not what my NIV said. Oh, sorry, that was.
00:02:52
Speaker
What was it? Let me have a look. yeah ESV. Ah, right. Anyway, still very helpful. the bible is written just slightly but no in that in that case like the greek word that's used is like has the definition of not being overly impressed by a sense of one's own self-importance yes i have a definition that says humble or meek yeah gentle gentle humble like considerate what's the other one meek So not being inflamed, like have an inflamed a sense of self-importance.
00:03:25
Speaker
um The other word is also the one that's used um in that 1 Timothy 3.3 when it talks about the qualifications of deacons. o and And it talks like about how it's not prone to violence but gentle.
00:03:41
Speaker
And so it's the opposite of aggression. Yeah. yeah and and but and says And I guess what the word that's used there kind of translates as not insisting on every right or custom that's due yourself.
00:03:56
Speaker
So, you know, we respond in aggression or harshness because we ourselves feel either threatened or our pride is threatened or something. We're not gentle when we think we need to assert our own, you know, yeah assert something that should be corrected.
00:04:14
Speaker
Yeah, so that's where humility or gentleness comes in. sir Yeah, I think the major issue that the church, particularly the modern church, has had with this is not actually the issue with what it actually means. I think it's the issue of the misinterpretation of what people have taken it to be. Yeah, totally. Which is true of a lot of the Bible.
00:04:35
Speaker
Yes. Bec, what do you reckon?
Societal and Cultural Expectations
00:04:38
Speaker
I going to say my ah original thought when I became a Christian about gentleness you know, like quiet and gentle, I was like, Maud Flanders.
00:04:52
Speaker
Yeah, but she was, you know, quiet and gentle. She probably didn't even scream for help, bro. Yeah, that's true. No. Look, anyway, that's inappropriate. but but i I think it's that. Like I remember I think i've told you this story, Rach, and Maddie, maybe I have told you. I can't remember.
00:05:09
Speaker
I talk a lot. But I have you. honestly just had moments in the church where I've been like, I was at a women's event. I was sitting right at the back. There was this lovely lady up the front. She was talking and you know, giving a talk, but no one could hear her because her microphone wasn't working.
00:05:26
Speaker
And like I was at the back of this women's event and I'm like, Jenny, waving, like yelling. I'm like, no one can hear you. Your microphone's not working. And this whole room of women turned around to look at me And, like, I saw this other woman walking up very quietly to go tap her on the shoulder gently and tell her her microphone wasn't working. And i remember just being like, why?
00:05:47
Speaker
am I like this? Yes. See, I love that you're like that. was like, I love that person who yells out and goes, or am I? Like, you know, dude, turn on the mic you know, whatever.
00:06:01
Speaker
You know, hopefully not, mate, your fly is undone. oh yeah yeah But it's, see, I love that. I'm like, oh, that made it easy. Rather than, you know, the quiet, but everyone knows what they're saying.
00:06:14
Speaker
But that's okay. It's true there. I guess, Rach, you talked about ah what, what how it's been misinterpreted. So what do you think when we think of quiet and gentle, what do you actually think everyone is expecting of a quiet and gentle person?
00:06:32
Speaker
me I think that people have equated particularly this verse in relation to women and women in the church. I think they've associated actual physical quietness and gentleness in the literal sense of the word and associated that with submission. Right.
00:06:51
Speaker
Because that's another word that is associated with women and that is another biblical thing that women should be. and I think people have gone, a submissive woman looks like someone who doesn't speak much, is very quiet, keeps ah a very quiet demeanour and is very calm and very peaceful and is very soothing to be around.
00:07:13
Speaker
And I don't think that is true. And I've really, like, I actually was going to ask you guys this because you neither of you grew up in the church. But I think that this concept of women, given that we've grown up, like, you know, obviously we grew up in technically a Christian nation, I think this view of women is somewhat encouraged universally of like a good wife, a good woman is this way.
00:07:37
Speaker
do you think that was true in non-church houses? Did you feel that you were you were praised more if you were gentle and quiet or not? I don't know because I i very much grew up with this definition.
00:07:52
Speaker
That's really interesting. would that's really interesting. actually did not grow up with that expectation. no No, because also I grew up like being cared by a single mum.
00:08:06
Speaker
So she was, she had to be mum, dad. She was like, she did an amazing job. And so I never necessarily was exposed to that, probably until I started engaging in Christian circles a little bit more.
00:08:20
Speaker
And I think I pushed back a little bit more at like, it almost comes back to the whole Makes me think of feminism a little bit, like how show the feminist movement came back and being like, you don't have to be a quiet homemaker that just submits to everyone.
00:08:34
Speaker
It's like, well, you know, some people they're like, oh, I like that. Not maybe just, I like being a homemaker. But I think maybe what was more interesting was that, you know, perhaps when I looked at my grandparents and there was traditional gender roles.
00:08:50
Speaker
That's when I was kind of like, oh, it's kind of nice not having to just be the one who cooks dinner all the time. I kind of would like not to share that load or, you know. So in terms of being outside of the church, I don't think I ever had an expectation to be quiet and gentle.
00:09:07
Speaker
Or what I feel like that can be a bit more of a Christian circle thing. I think outside the church you get more of the gender roles that might come down from generations above. Yeah. Which our generation and above has pushed back on anyway.
00:09:21
Speaker
Yes, very much so. What do you reckon, Beth? I'm probably similar to you, Maddie. So, like, my mum's family is Spanish and they're quite loud. And I think my dad's side of the family, my grandmother, was quite...
00:09:38
Speaker
like very quiet.
00:09:41
Speaker
Yeah, like but I think my dad because maybe he was in the 90s and I only had a brother, he was very much like he tried very hard to be like whatever your son is doing, you know, you can do too. they were like, okay, my son is riding motorbikes, okay, you can ride motorbikes. Like he was very strong that way.
00:10:00
Speaker
i was the first person in my family on both sides to go to uni. Yeah, so I don't think I – felt that pressure but it was interesting coming in as like in about I think I started going to church when I was about 18 and I do remember being like oh I don't fit here it was just a really bizarre sense of there's a whole culture here that I don't really understand and I don't really get
00:10:31
Speaker
oh and I think that has been a wrestle. I was like, I don't bake. I'm not particularly quiet. I had a lot of theological arguments in Bible studies. I was just a pest, you know what I mean so I think it has been a thing that I've wrestled with.
00:10:46
Speaker
You're still a pest. 100%. Look, you've joined a good crowd. That's fine. One thing I like to think of with this as well is that, like, that picture you just presented, Bec, of the homemaker, the stay-at-home mum, the baker or whatever,
00:11:02
Speaker
A lot of people who do that are not quiet and not gentle. But even if they are outwardly quiet and gentle, they're not on the inside, which is actually what this is about. Yes.
Redefining Quietness and Gentleness
00:11:13
Speaker
And I think that's the problem is that, again, has always been a problem in the church, is...
00:11:19
Speaker
people read things and go, oh, I can do that. I can be quiet and gentle. Yeah, yeah, I can do that. I can take that box. Okay, so God wants me to be quiet and gentle. Okay, I just need to work on keeping my mouth shut more and just presenting as like a gentle person and just being quiet and whispering more. And you go, well, that's not what it means at all.
00:11:37
Speaker
And I think it just ends up becoming a performative thing. And then it ends up when you go to church and you get a scorecard because the women who are introverted and more naturally quiet, win in people's eyes because they are outwardly displaying that, which is not what it means.
00:11:54
Speaker
Have you, how would you say that you've wrestled with the call to be quiet and gentle when it's not your personality? What do you think is personality and what is sin and what is culture do you think?
00:12:08
Speaker
Okay.
00:12:11
Speaker
This is where I've been wrestling. So I think part of it, oh my God made me, He knows what I'm like. He made me with certain giftings and certain sin tendencies, but also like he made me a certain way.
00:12:27
Speaker
And the thing I think that has really helped me is looking at a lot of those verses where the Bible calls you to be quiet, you know, but like God's like be still, be still before me, stop your restlessness. like And it's like a quietness of soul, which I think kind of maps onto what you're saying is like it's not.
00:12:46
Speaker
hey, I'm going to church and i'm not going to say anything. But if I am in internally quiet before the Lord and I can sit and listen to him like, what do you want me to do? How can I serve you today where I am, who I am Then I'm not, yeah, that restlessness doesn't, I'm less inclined to be difficult, I think.
00:13:14
Speaker
Yeah. So I think those are the two main things for me. Like and considering because we didn't really exactly define quiet, but could you? No, that's true, yes.
00:13:25
Speaker
I guess in your explanation there, Bec, would you necessarily equate quietness with contentment? Now, that is really interesting. So I looked at the verse I found was he says, be still and know that I am God. I will be exalted among the nations. I will be exalted in the earth. So that's Psalm 46.10.
00:13:48
Speaker
So I think because the Bible reading i've been doing at the moment is that Tim Keller Psalms devotional, and I was, like, struck by how often it's saying be still. So, I mean, I didn't look up the dictionary definition of what quiet was, but I would, that's what I'm, that's my best guess that I like it be.
00:14:11
Speaker
Yeah. I don't know, man. I read an article about, so for the definition of quiet, I didn't, did you look up the Greek word for it, Maddie? I did not. I focused on gentle. I have, it's i I read an article on this and I think it's, well, I'm going to say it wrong.
00:14:26
Speaker
heyu taste of across yeah whatever which means to keep one seat, which is interesting, to keep one seat, to be still or undisturbed, to be peaceable.
00:14:37
Speaker
Interesting. And I think when I read this in general, it actually just makes me think of the word self-control, the fruit of the spirit of like quiet and gentle is actually self-controlled in that I am not, I am other seeking, not self-seeking. i am able to,
00:14:56
Speaker
control self-control my desire to be heard and my desire to speak over and to be right and able to be other focused in that so the gentleness of spirit is internal not necessarily external what do we think of that Yeah, I think that's great.
00:15:18
Speaker
I did actually look up again but that word in 1 Peter, it's used, it's like without turmoil. So what Beck's kind of describing. But also it says it's like well-ordered, so quiet, well-ordered.
00:15:33
Speaker
and it makes me think a little bit, I think it's James, but i can't recall. Someone can correct me on this. But it's when he says, do not doubt when you pray or anything. No, it's not James. It's somewhere else.
00:15:44
Speaker
Oh. It says don't doubt when you pray. Yeah, and because the person who doubts is like they're tossed back and forth like the waves in the ocean.
00:15:55
Speaker
And I think that's in the context of having a kind of an orderedness, a contentment, a stability in where your faith is in your inner life, in which, yeah, comes from faith.
00:16:09
Speaker
um And so wonder if that's what rather than it being outwardly, you know, You're just a quiet person and you never speak. But um I think you can reflect a quietude in not being a chaotic person who constantly goes back and forth on things but has a kind of a contentment and and a stillness in how they trust the Lord.
00:16:31
Speaker
Yeah, what do you guys think? Yeah. I mean, I struggle with being quiet and gentle on the outside, but I also really struggle to be quiet and gentle on the inside. So i yes. Yeah. And that is a big one for me, actually, that like the back and forthness of, yeah, I'm very often swayed by good arguments from people. And you go, oh, that's a really good point.
00:16:51
Speaker
And then I hear another one go, oh, well, that's a really good point. Like, oh, what do I actually, what do I think? I don't know. And I'm often like, ah like a roiling. I'm not, I'm not a quiet and gentle person.
00:17:02
Speaker
But I read an article on this exact topic about women and interpreting the gentle and quiet spirit. And the definition of gentleness was also meek or humble. But then she defined meek, which I'd never heard this definition, but meekness is strength under control.
00:17:18
Speaker
And I really liked that because ah it it made me feel like my personality and my extrovertedness is a power to be controlled, not a weakness to be squashed.
00:17:34
Speaker
You know, it's like that i have I have self-control over the person that God has made me to be with the Holy Spirit. And so i can be an extroverted person but also be controlled and peaceable on the inside because I can rest, because I'm trusting in God.
00:17:52
Speaker
Yes. yeah i guess It really reminds me of that really famous Augustine quote where he goes, you have made us for yourself and our hearts are restless until they rest in you.
00:18:04
Speaker
e
00:18:07
Speaker
I think like that's that distinction it sounds like you're getting at, Rach, where culture will say conform externally Yes. Like, okay, then you need to be literally quiet. You need to be an introvert. You, you know, need to never like raise your voice of concern about something.
00:18:26
Speaker
yeah But that's not the picture in scripture where it's saying come before the Lord and sit and listen to who he's made you to be because I think if you look at, like I've been listening to this podcast called Women Worth Knowing e and it's so fascinating because these women, they're just stories of different women throughout history.
Role Models and Personalities
00:18:44
Speaker
And some of these missionaries are like fascinating. Like they're not quite people and they have to stand up for people who are poor or they're in prison or all this kind of stuff. and you're like, they were doing absolutely called to do what God called them to do.
00:19:01
Speaker
Like there's all those calls to care for the weak and the poor, which you wouldn't do if you were just externally conforming and you're like, well, I would never... Like Never Knock the Boat, what's that phrase? Yeah, Never Knock the Boat, yeah.
00:19:15
Speaker
Yeah. That is interesting as well because you and in saying that I've been listening to 12 Faithful Women, 12 Faithful Women buy it edited by Melissa Kruger and Jessie Weatherill, I think.
00:19:28
Speaker
think that's one. And then, yeah, it's talking about all these female figures over the last, I think, 100 or few hundred years, these faithful Christian women, usually under trial.
00:19:39
Speaker
And one of them was Elizabeth Elliot. Oh, yeah. And she... Yeah, she obviously, you know, she was faithful and had this overt forgiveness for people who killed her husband on mission.
00:19:51
Speaker
But also it talks a little bit about how later in her ministry she does public speaking and she also talks into the gender issue as that starts to pop up and that she becomes wildly unpopular within and out, like, you know, what like some of those views are quite unpopular even within the church.
00:20:08
Speaker
But she's speaking truth into a situation that she knows is not going to be, not always going to be received well, but, but that was her using, yeah, using her gifts in a way that actually was speaking truth. And yeah, don't think if she was worried about just looking like a quiet and submissive person,
00:20:29
Speaker
She wouldn't actually be coming forth and teaching in such a way that she felt was faithfully representing the scriptures to encourage others. Cause that's the kind of using your gifts with self-control in order to be considerate of others and express encouragement in a way that you hope will be helpful and is faithful to God's word.
00:20:53
Speaker
And that's what she did with her teaching. She used those gifts that she had and her personality. to actually encourage through her story of forgiveness, but also to speak into certain social issues.
00:21:06
Speaker
And I think that's also going back to what Rach was saying in that definition of being of self-control in using those gifts, using your personality in a way that helps others as well as that idea of being considerate as well in that definition You know, thinking about others and how you actually serve others.
00:21:29
Speaker
Yeah, I guess, is that how you also thought? Yeah, and I think a big part of it, well, particularly for me in general, is the concept of fear of man as well, of I... yeah want to be liked and I want to be affirmed. And so often I will, but particularly when I was younger, i would, in a desire to be liked, I would be intentionally not quiet and gentle. And I would be, say what I wanted and say what I thought was funny because I wanted to make people laugh and I wanted to be liked.
00:22:01
Speaker
And so i think that is a big consideration for me of why am i bucking against this Because I think for me, growing up in the church, I find it, I push against a lot of sort of traditional, not and traditional in the sense of the church, not necessarily traditional as in biblical, traditional ways of doing things because I just, it it gets my back up. And so I just want to be like, well, I'm going to be not quiet and gentle because... but And so I think you can
00:22:36
Speaker
b not quite and gentle intentionally as well. So I think some people struggle because it's their personality. You go, oh, how do I how do i be this? And then some people go, I'm not going to be that because I don't want to. And I think I've been both those people.
00:22:52
Speaker
Yeah. And I think, do you think what you guys were both saying about listening to stories of other women, do you think that has been helpful in trying to figure out what that looks like?
00:23:03
Speaker
Yeah. I think it's,
00:23:08
Speaker
I think just hearing stories of people who've been really faithful to who God has called them to be and way where they've been called to be. so you can see it's so interesting in all of these like missionary stories, and not all of them missionaries, who have done all kinds of stuff, but they all seem to have this period of wrestle with am I really going to do this? Am I really going to commit? Like am – it's almost like putting on that weight, like am I going to do this? But then you just see this period of such fruit.
00:23:38
Speaker
And all of these women, like I think what's encouraging is they're so different to each other. Like it's the same God and yet he equips them for their ministry and whatever it is that they're doing.
00:23:50
Speaker
But it comes back to those same traits in the end. You're like, yes, it is that like self that strength that is self-controlled. It's giving up their rights for other people. It's speaking into things when it would be easier to be quiet.
00:24:06
Speaker
um it's that you always like steadfastness in service but yeah it's yeah there's something really interesting in that I think what I've reflected on in listening to these and listening to this book but also just reflecting on the women I know who I admire who I would say have these qualities but Are they just, you know, outwardly gentle and quiet or what is it about their behaviour?
00:24:37
Speaker
And I think it's actually like a servant heartedness is how I've come to, like that's how I seem to picture it, like which comes from the inward self. So even if you look at that one Peter 3 again, it says your beauty should not come from outward adornment.
00:24:50
Speaker
It should be of the inner self. Again, it's like some people you could be either doing things to get outward approval or you can actually be thinking about how you can serve the people around you. And I think that's where these people that I've really admired, they've got this servant-heartedness that they that they they might be a loud person that likes to talk and who potentially is much more of an extrovert than an introvert. um Then, you know, there might be someone who perhaps talks more, but they're also the servant-hearted nature.
00:25:24
Speaker
Their servant-hearted nature then teaches them when to listen as well. And actually they're going, oh, like what do you, you know, what do you think or kind of like how do you feel about this?
00:25:35
Speaker
But also that they are thinking not just of themselves. So, yeah, I think that's actually the quality that I kind of most admired with the women who I've noticed embody the gentle and quiet spirit. It's not just outward. It's actually just a servant-hearted nature.
00:25:56
Speaker
um Yeah. Do you think there's been anything that you have experienced in your life or in the church that has been not helpful in attempting to put this into practice in people's lives?
00:26:12
Speaker
There was definitely something while ago in like some of the really young university Christian circles a while ago, I remember someone saying they felt really unwelcome because she herself was constantly compared
Challenges and Biblical Interpretations
00:26:25
Speaker
to this other person woman they always joked was wife material because she was quiet and she was the baker. She was the really lovely person who just loves to lead the Bible study. And this girl was particularly a little bit more crass. Can't relate. She loved to just laugh loudly.
00:26:45
Speaker
And she just was someone a bit more boisterous in how she engaged with other people. And other people, and there was just a couple of comments by, unfortunately, a few young, um zealous men that were like, you know, you shouldn't act like that. You should act more like this person.
00:27:00
Speaker
And all this girl actually. like Jesus. Anyway, sorry, keep going. Yeah. That's a good point because, you know, this girl actually really sunk in and felt really insecure and then like kind of actually walked away from those circles altogether.
00:27:17
Speaker
um And unfortunately also had a bit of like like ah something in her heart she just hung on to about these people. And like we really can push people away. But you know in saying that, if you think about Jesus, it's like, yeah, he was quite gentle, meek, all of those things, still went into a temple and overturned tables and yelled at people for, you know, dishonouring the house of God.
00:27:40
Speaker
But I'm not saying we should go into temples and overturned tables. But, you know, it's like he actually had like his ah he actually had episodes where he was rebuking and he was loud And he was, you know, yeah, I just think about that. I'm like, yeah.
00:27:59
Speaker
I have just, you just saying that has just made me think of the fact that I think I've always thought of this verse in particular and other verses you
00:28:10
Speaker
I've never thought about them in relation to Jesus because it's always like this one's just for women. Like Jesus isn't a woman, so this one's just for me. So I've got to be quiet and I've got to be gentle because that one's just for me. And I've never actually thought like, of course Jesus is quiet and gentle and meek and all those things, but I've never actually thought thought that about, yeah, I've never thought about the fact that But deacons are called to be gentle. Yes, exactly. And overseers and elders. This concept is not just in this verse about women. Yeah, other, like men are called to be self-controlled and have a peaceful spirit also. Yeah, I've... No, be still before the... This is just occurring to me now, so anyway. LAUGHTER
00:28:52
Speaker
yeah yeah I think the thing that you were saying, Maddie, was just mapping onto the same thing that I had from Rachel's question, which is I think the thing that hasn't helped is just that internal monologue where I'm like, oh, I'm going to compare what I'm like internally to what I see externally of other people.
00:29:11
Speaker
Yes. And then I'm going to feel ashamed that I'm not that. I'm like, oh, well, you know, it sucks because, you know, I've walked in here with a set of jeans and a pixie cut and everyone is wearing like beautiful dresses and, you know, they seem to be very quiet and baking and gentle and homeschooling and I am 100% the opposite of that.
00:29:31
Speaker
Yeah. You know, like that's the inner monologue, but I think it's the thing that you're saying where you're like, well, if I'm being called to be like Jesus and men are called to be like Jesus, then everyone has something to like wrestle with and give up to like have that inner choir before God.
00:29:50
Speaker
Also, I guess, again, like if we all fell into the stereotype of what like, you know, what the traditional Christian woman was supposed to look like, it's actually a number of different areas of serving God's kingdom and serving God's people that would be unmet.
00:30:06
Speaker
Oh, yes. And it's just, and that's in a number of like for men and women as well, you know, whether we retreat into our own and like into our own little comfortable circles where we can be quieter than me.
00:30:21
Speaker
Whereas instead we have been gifted with different personalities, extroverts, introverts, people who are loud, people who are slightly quiet. people who might share a little bit more in a Bible study that helps make other people comfortable, but also people who might know when to hold back a little bit to leave room for other people to join in. And I think we need all of those people in order to then encourage others.
00:30:49
Speaker
And also in order to serve one another. So it's, and yeah, how good God created us with diversity. It's kind of, again, the manner in which we use our personality and our gifting. Because this verse isn't talking about personality.
00:31:04
Speaker
No. It's actually not, which is what we interpret it as, which is what Rach as well has pushed back on a bit, you know. And that's if we actually think that this is only about personality, we're actually reading the wrong things into the you
Character Development over Personality Change
00:31:20
Speaker
that. It's actually about our manner and our character.
00:31:23
Speaker
And so we should be working on our character before God. and asking the spirit to help us with that so that we respond to the things around us with gentleness and with steadfastness and consideration for the people around us.
00:31:41
Speaker
So because whenever this is used, especially in terms of the one for overseers and elders, in the Bible in 1 Timothy it's saying, yeah, that's a response. We're responding not in violence but in gentleness. Right.
00:31:57
Speaker
So if we actually work on our inward character, that is what enables us to respond to the frustrating things around us with gentleness rather than asserting our own authority or asserting our own self-importance into it, if that makes sense.
00:32:13
Speaker
Yes. And I think that just brought to mind the picture of the body. And so whenever anyone brings up the body of Christ, I always think that someone is the appendix. um But that is the thing of the body.
00:32:27
Speaker
All parts of the body have different functions and yet we are all called to gentleness. We are all called to self-control. We are all called to cultivate the fruits of the spirit.
00:32:38
Speaker
And so we all have a different purpose in our serving of the body, in our function. So therefore we can't all look the same. We can't, like, if it was just describing my physical actions, then that is not giving enough weight to the text. um yes As years have gone by, I've struggled with this less and less, but particularly as a young Christian who i haveve never i have never related to being quiet or gentle.
00:33:09
Speaker
And I think, unfortunately, quite a bit of damage has been done in the misinterpretation of this. Yeah, which is a bummer. But, yeah.
00:33:22
Speaker
Can I say something slightly unrelated? Yes, please. I really enjoy in one of the lists where they give instructions to, like, you know, everyone, the young men only have one instruction and they're like, teach the young men to be self-controlled.
00:33:36
Speaker
Yes. That's it. But, like, if you don't have self-control, like, you can't learn anything else. Yes, that's very true. Yeah. I think actually, um just quickly, if we look as well at what the Bible says not to be,
00:33:53
Speaker
When we're thinking about the stereotypical woman looks like it's that quiet and like, actually, I think some of that may have been born about out of what not to be, which is do not be slanderers and gossip.
00:34:05
Speaker
Do not be who causing up. theres Some of these things are things that both men and women are prone to, but stereotypical. you know, kind of stereotypically women have been more tempted into.
00:34:16
Speaker
and you know, 1 Timothy again in 5 actually has instructions to widows not to be like, you know, causing up quarrels um amongst others. And then even in Corinthians again it talks about disputes among one another.
00:34:29
Speaker
so I think, you know, the whole idea it says we don't want to be kind of obnoxiously but loudly slandering and gossiping against one another that would like create disunity in the body.
00:34:43
Speaker
Instead, the quiet and gentle spirit is that idea at which we are consider of one another and not necessarily the stereotypical only one thing, but we work together in unity. It brings unity.
00:34:59
Speaker
not uniformity yeah yeah which is yeah kind of speaks into that body image that you were saying right yeah because otherwise if we were to be uniformed i the picture that first comes to mind is an army everyone in the same uniform everyone marching together which is not a picture that's in the bible of the church that's not the picture of the church i'd be useless same i could yell at people though i'm pretty good on the triangle. Marching orders. the Trumpet. No, am.
00:35:33
Speaker
so this This was really helpful to me. It's just. Good. No, I appreciated the depth to it. it's just There's like so much there to consider in terms of like some is culture, some is like internal, yeah, like that internal. law I want to be with like what I think other, you know, what other Christians are, but growing in maturity is like what who does God actually call me to be and what does he want and how can i sit quietly before him?
00:36:05
Speaker
like that's in the Psalms where it's like, you know, you know, walking with God like a weaned child with its mother, you're like, okay, ill can walk quietly with him in dependence, being like, who do you want me to be?
00:36:16
Speaker
Where do you want me to go? And I think that those calls on our life are for everyone, not just for women.
00:36:26
Speaker
And I think I actually think the times in my life when I've been the least quiet and gentle of spirit is when I've been striving to be quiet and gentle on the outside. because it doesn't actually go with the person God has made me to be.
00:36:42
Speaker
And I, yeah, I think I actually, that again, just occurred to me then that you think when I've been striving to fit this box and look like how this very reductive picture I've had when I've read that verse of, okay, shut up, be quiet, be like what I've seen in movies as of the picture of a wife,
00:37:03
Speaker
or a woman be that and that's when I am least restful and peaceful on the inside.
Conclusion and Call to Action
00:37:10
Speaker
Yeah, you're like shut up and be Maud Flanders and you're like I'm pissed because I can't be Maud. Yeah, i don't I've never had a perm.
00:37:17
Speaker
Yeah. a Look, God did not create you to be mauled. No, exactly. he didn't. Praise him. Yes,
00:37:31
Speaker
That's it from us, friends. We hope you enjoyed today's episode. And if you did, you can sign up to our free weekly newsletter called Stories I Tell You At Dinner. So you get essays, poetry, podcast episodes, everything, photo essays straight to your inbox on Wednesdays from March to November from Christian Women in Western Australia.
00:37:52
Speaker
If you'd like that, the link is in the show notes. Thanks for listening, st guys. Bye.