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167 - Christine (1983) w/ Rachel Reeves
88 Plays9 months ago
"Okay… show me.”
Happy 2024! We’re back from our bye week and we’re kicking the new year off with The Kingening: The Drawing of Three, a three-part miniseries centered around failed franchise starters adapted from the works of Stephen King! And we’re EXTRA excited because we’re joined by the cohost of Halloweenies, The Girls on The Boys, The Pod & the Pendulum, and - perhaps most relevant to this conversation - The Losers Club podcasts, the great Rachel Reeves! Together, we discuss our favorite Carpenter movies, our earliest memories of driving our first cars, and the fact that this movie is secretly hella romantic! Don’t miss this one!
Respect Rachel Reeves for her mind by giving her a follow or a listen across the internet:
- @VinylGrrrl on Bluesky. Letterboxd, and Twitter X; @thevinylgrrrl on Instagram and Threads
- Check out the Halloweenies upcoming coverage of the Alien franchise wherever you get your podcasts and follow them @HalloweeniesPod on Twitter X and @halloweeniespodcast on Instagram and Threads!
- Listen in as The Losers’ Club’s conversations about King’s novel 11-22-63 (among MANY other topics) and give them a follow at @LosersClubPod on Twitter X and @thelosersclubpodcast on Instagram and Threads!
- Follow along with The Pod & the Pendulum as they dig into the Universal Frankenstein films and lumber after them at @podandpendulum on Twitter X, @podandthependulum on Bluesky, and @pod_and_the_pendulum on Instagram!
- Be sure to watch along with The Girls on The Boys over at Anatomy of a Scream as they start watching Season 3 of the Amazon Prime show and check their progress by giving them a follow at @girlsontheboys on Instagram and Twitter X!
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Transcript
Introduction to Failed Franchises
00:00:10
Speaker
you
00:00:22
Speaker
Hello, and welcome back to the disenfranchised podcast. That's right. We're back. That podcast all about those franchises of one, those films that fancy themselves full fledged franchises before falling flat on their face after the first film.
Meet the Hosts and Guest Rachel Reeves
00:00:35
Speaker
I am your host, Stephen Foxworthy, and joining me as always, we respect him for his mind, but we know you perverts are just lusting after his body. It's Tucker. Hey, Tucker. Hi, Stephen. How's it going? Not bad, man. How are you? Well, I think I have a hair in my mouth again.
00:00:51
Speaker
That's a problem that happens. No, I feel like every three to four episodes, there's a hair in my mouth and we have to deal with it. Luckily, that one plucked it right out. I don't know where it came from. Sometimes it comes from my gloves. I don't know. Just rubbing your facial hair and it just gets in there? Unless you know I have a cat. Oh, you do. You do have a cat. Could be a cat hair. Could be a cat hair.
00:01:16
Speaker
Our co host Brett Wright is he just bought a shiny new car and he's kind of obsessed with it. Hopefully someday he like looks away and is able to come back. But until then Brett, we love and miss you. But joining us in his stead today.
Rachel's Favorite Movie: 'Christine'
00:01:30
Speaker
God, I'm so excited to have her on. It's been a long time coming. She is the host of one of the hosts of the Halloween East podcast. She is one of the hosts of
00:01:39
Speaker
Girls on the Boys, she's part of the regular panel on the pod in the pendulum and probably most relevant to our discussion today. She is also one of the hosts of the Losers Club podcast, the Stephen King approved Stephen King podcast. Please welcome the great Rachel Reeves. Rachel, welcome.
00:01:59
Speaker
Oh my gosh, thank you. I feel so welcome after that intro. And I am honored that you have asked me to be here tonight to talk about one of my favorite, absolute favorite movies of all time. So I cannot be more excited to be here. And what movie is it that we're talking about tonight, Rachel? Oh my goodness.
John Carpenter's 'Christine' and Its Impact
00:02:20
Speaker
We are talking about John Carpenter's 1983 love story, Christine.
00:02:28
Speaker
Christine, yes, directed by the great, not late, but still great John Carpenter, and starring Keith Gordon, John Stockwell, Alexandra Paul, Robert Proskie, the great Robert Proskie, the late great Harry Dean Stanton, Christine Belford, Robert's Blossom, and is that? Yes, it is. Kelly Preston in this movie as well. What a cast. Friends, what a picture.
00:02:54
Speaker
That's that's got to be like the third or fourth movie that Roberts Blossom has been in that we've covered. I always I always mention you guys got to see deranged if you haven't seen deranged. No, basically plays Ed Gein. And it's as if he has. Yeah, if he wasn't terrifying enough. Right. That's the thing is like in deranged, he's like super low key, like very quiet and like subtle and
00:03:23
Speaker
It's real good. He's one of the first movies Tom Savini worked on. It's really great. You guys should check it out. Yeah, I'm sure we'll probably cover it on a straight up one of these days. Oh, it's on the list. No doubt, no doubt.
Adapting Stephen King: Challenges and Triumphs
00:03:38
Speaker
No, I, of course, know Robert Blossom best as the South Bend shovel slayer from Home Alone. Home Alone, yeah. But you know, I'm a child of the late 80s, early 90s. What can I say?
00:03:48
Speaker
I, okay, I've seen this film 800,000 times and it was literally just the last time we were, I was in Chicago and I was watching this at the music box. I was like, it hit me. And I leaned over to my friend, Jen, my fellow Losers Club co-host. And I was like, holy shit, it's the same guy in Home Alone.
00:04:10
Speaker
I don't know why. Like, I just wasn't. It's just because like how he looks, I guess he's so gross and Christine and like he's scary in Home Alone, but also like well dressed and like he is a lot in those seven years between 1983 and 1990. He lives a life in those seven years. Goodness. I just don't know why I never connected those two. But it's just one of those. He shows up in a lot of stuff like you'll just be watching a random thing. You're like, oh, hey, it's homeboy from Home Alone. Yeah.
00:04:40
Speaker
Yeah, he is. He is one of those guys. There's another gentleman whose name is escaping me at the moment. I know he is in they live and back to the future. He's got another his last name, I think, is Flowers.
00:04:53
Speaker
And he's in flowers. Oh, no, I just I just watched the the season finale to two detectives season one. I don't want to talk about flowers, man. I don't want to talk about making flowers, dude. George Buckflower is the actor's name. So, OK.
00:05:11
Speaker
So just two of those great character actors with very flowery, floral last names. I dig it a lot. So yeah, of course, within the time it took
Rachel's Stephen King Journey
00:05:22
Speaker
me to look that up, everyone is screaming at their podcatchers because they knew that and I didn't. And that's just what it is to be a podcaster. It still goes.
00:05:32
Speaker
So we are kicking off a three week miniseries slash mini theme month called the Kingening the drawing of three since we took last week off. We're dedicating the rest of this month to Stephen King failed franchise starters. We've covered one before we covered the dark tower a couple of years ago.
00:05:52
Speaker
Brett and I had our friends Mandy and Molly Gossage on the program to talk about that film. And I shared my history with Stephen King, but I don't know your guys' histories with Stephen King. And Rachel, of course, you are...
00:06:06
Speaker
You're a Losers Club co-host. You host the Stephen King approved Stephen King podcast. What is your history with Stephen King? How did you get into him? When did you first engage with Christine? What's your history with the book, the movie? I want to know everything.
00:06:23
Speaker
Oh, goodness. Yes. So as far as like Stephen King, the author, my mom is a librarian. And so not surprisingly, read a lot of books. And I got into him. My first book that I read by him was The Talisman.
00:06:41
Speaker
Which I think is a really odd entry point into Stephen King because it's like you might be the only person that has that as their entry. Honestly, it's because my mom would like read a lot of fantasy novels and stuff like that. So I like I felt like I was kind of drawn to that just because that's what she was into.
00:06:58
Speaker
And I think that falls more into the fantasy realm of things. I think that's where it was shelved. And so I read that. And then second book I read was The Stand. So I feel like it like the horror stuff came a little bit later. You know, obviously The Stand has like some some horrific elements to it, but I still not sure that's what he's, you know, in the world of horror anyways, what he's known for.
First Encounter with 'Christine'
00:07:22
Speaker
And so
00:07:23
Speaker
Yeah, all the horror stuff came much later and that was a bit of a eye-opening experience for me because I don't have any older siblings. I don't have any like, so I kind of had to discover that on my own. I didn't know.
00:07:39
Speaker
It's also pre-internet, you guys. So like I didn't necessarily know that he was like a big horror dude. So that kind of came later and then just, you know, couldn't get enough, couldn't get enough. And then Christine, the movie I actually saw before I read the book, I was obsessed with Grease when I was in middle school, obsessed with it. I know that I think that is kind of one of those universe for like
00:08:07
Speaker
like women our age, I think it's kind of like a universal thing because just about every girl in my middle school was also obsessed with Greece. Well, our moms loved it. Wait, is that what you're saying? No, no, I'm 41 years old. I'm saying my mother liked it. And that's why I was exposed to it. And I have to imagine that's why a lot of people, my age at least,
00:08:32
Speaker
Uh, yeah, yeah, I'm sure, I'm sure that I like, I don't remember who showed it to me, but I, I'm sure it has to be my parents. And I, I loved the cars, you guys. I loved the fifties. I thought, I mean, I think everybody is so hot in that movie. And yeah, I loved the car, was obsessed with that, wanted grace lightning and.
00:08:53
Speaker
then one day my dad, like I had just gone to bed and then he woke me up and he's like, oh, you love Greece? You got to watch Christine. And so he showed me Christine and that was just like- How old were you at this point? I mean, I think I was like 14.
00:09:09
Speaker
when I saw it and it was just playing on TV. It just happened to be on and he wanted me
Book vs. Film: Differences in 'Christine'
00:09:13
Speaker
to see it because he knew that I love Greece. And so that was my introduction to it and just fell head over heels in love with it and the car. That was a big part of it. And so, yeah, like my very first car that I bought was a 1951 Chevy business coupe because I'm so obsessed with like those 50s cars. Wow. I was like, I want one and I got one. And so like that and my dad like
00:09:38
Speaker
has always like had hot rods and restored them so I had somebody who could help me and like helped me find it and you know supported me in that way um so I want to I lived I lived Christie and so this movie has always like resonated really heavily with me because I feel like I understand Arnie in a very special way that we can talk about more as we go on but that's my
00:10:00
Speaker
That's my background a little bit with King and specifically with this movie and yeah I've never never stopped loving King and I'm just so grateful that I get to talk with all my fellow losers about him all the time incessantly. When did you get to the book when did you when did you read the book for the first time and then compared to the movie like how did you engage with that?
00:10:20
Speaker
Yeah, I read the book not terribly long after because I was like, well, I got to know about this. I got to know about that. Oh, that's what this is about. Like a car. Of course I got to read this. And obviously the book has some differences that I was a little like, oh, OK. And now that I feel like at the time I was like, I don't know, that's kind of weird. But I was also just, you know, 14, 15 years old or whatever. Sure. Now I'm like, OK, I totally understand why
00:10:49
Speaker
Carpenter did what he did to make those changes. It makes so much more sense from like a film perspective.
Stephen King's Storytelling Style
00:10:55
Speaker
Like, okay, we just need to simplify this a little bit. Agreed. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely agree. Thank you. Tucker, what about you? When did you when did you engage with King First? What was your first exposure? When did you see this movie? Read this book? Tell me everything, man.
00:11:13
Speaker
Uh, well, uh, my mom really liked Carrie. It's one of her favorite movies still. Um, so I was kind of introduced to King that way. Um, when I was in middle school, I started getting, uh, after I saw it, the mini series for it, after I saw that on TV, I was in middle school. I was, I was excited about Stephen King after that. So I kind of, I got like every book of his that I could from the library and I read,
00:11:42
Speaker
Most of them, and to be honest, I kind of binged them. So a lot of them I don't really remember a lot about. Okay. Christine was one of the ones that I read during that time. I saw the movie.
00:11:57
Speaker
Uh, probably when I was like 15 or 16, uh, cause like I was, my roots are in horror. I consider myself to be kind of a broad cinema fan now, but like I started out heavily into horror. So Christine was, you know, part of that horror education.
00:12:17
Speaker
And I liked it, but I just never really gave it a second thought after I saw it. And I always forget that John Carpenter directed it. When I'm talking about John Carpenter movies, it never enters my mind. I feel like there's a reason for that, and we'll get into that, I'm sure. But yeah. No, it's weird because there's a lot of things in this movie that are very obvious staples of John Carpenter films, but as a whole.
00:12:43
Speaker
Yeah, it doesn't. You know what I mean? It's like the Fargo TV show versus the Fargo movie. Like it's not. It's not the whole thing. It's just pieces, you know, it kind of it kind of feels like I don't know. I don't know if he was completely into it as he was. Oh, no, he was not at all. Yeah.
00:13:06
Speaker
Like this was a job. He was a director for hire on this. And he's like, this was a career move for me. I didn't really think it was that scary. I just did it because I needed to. Well, and that that that speaks well of John Carpenter because it's still it's still a fantastic movie. Yeah. Like even if he was kind of phoning it in by his own account,
Cars and Personal Fascinations
00:13:25
Speaker
it's still fantastic. I just I think at the time that I saw it, I was more interested in other aspects of horror and other aspects of cinema. So it didn't really stick with me.
00:13:36
Speaker
This time I really enjoyed it though. I don't know how soon I'll watch it again, but I think there's definitely repeat viewings in my future. Yeah, I first caught this one in 2020 when I did my John Carpenter watch through when I just binged.
00:13:52
Speaker
all the Carpenter movies that I could, didn't watch them in order or anything, just kind of watch them as I found them. And by the time I got to Christine, I'd seen most of the canonical classics by that point. And so I was kind of mixed on Christine. I liked it, but it didn't like wow me. Watching it kind of isolated from the rest of Carpenter's oeuvre, I think I was able to appreciate a lot more
00:14:19
Speaker
what he's doing with this one. And I think given what we've what we culturally have been through over the course of the past, like.
00:14:29
Speaker
seven or eight years, it really, really resonates a lot more now in a lot of ways, which I'm sure we'll get into. But particularly with regard to just the concept and notion of weaponized nostalgia was particularly interesting for me on this watch through. Yeah, that's so interesting.
00:14:55
Speaker
Because I think this was the first John Carpenter movie I saw because, yeah, growing up I was not allowed to watch a lot of horror. My parents were pretty conservative with what they kind of like let me see. And I think it's just mainly because my parents weren't big horror people. Like my dad was more of like an action guy. So it's like, oh yeah, I saw Predator and Terminator and, you know, First Blood.
00:15:19
Speaker
somehow horror movies were like, oh, no, you can't watch that. That's the bridge too far. Yeah, exactly. So I didn't actually get to see a lot of that stuff until I was in high school and could babysit other people's children. And then I could watch those things at other people's houses while my parents weren't looking. And I was old enough to rent the VHSs by myself. So that didn't come till much later. So I think that's
00:15:46
Speaker
I didn't have anything to compare it to. So it's interesting hearing, you know, you say that like, this was, you know, you, you had seen other carpenter stuff before that. And I'm just wondering if that's part of why they're like, this is so impactful for me. Cause this was my first introduction to John Carpenter. I hadn't seen Halloween. I hadn't seen the thing. So I was coming at it just baby, you know, doe eyed, like, what is this magical thing? And so I just, I, yeah, it's always such a special place, my heart. Is this your favorite carpenter?
00:16:16
Speaker
I don't know if, that's a big question. It's up there though. I mean, it's probably like top three. Okay. Yeah. It's in the top three. I would have to think really hard about, you know, between Halloween and the thing, like where I'm going to put those, but the fact that I'm struggling right now on the spot to place them. That speaks volumes, honestly, as to your love for this movie. So absolutely. I don't know. Ghost of Mars is in there too. I'm just kidding. I hate that.
00:16:44
Speaker
Look, there is no judgment here.
Themes of Nostalgia in 'Christine'
00:16:47
Speaker
No judgment at this table whatsoever. No, you like what you like. That is okay. Honestly, not even my least favorite Carpenter movie. I'll just put that out there. Yeah, that's a conversation for another day. That is. Look, even Carpenter is the kind of guy who will admit that some of those probably aren't great.
00:17:07
Speaker
Um, like Friedkin's another one of those guys that you're like, look, a lot of movies I made were absolute shit. That's just what it is. So, um, no, but I, I can appreciate that about carpenters. Just like, nah, I didn't, didn't really connect with that one. That was just, you know, it was just the thing I felt like I had to do. So. Yeah. But it's so interesting to me, this one, because from what I understand, like.
00:17:26
Speaker
post the thing and like how bad that like flopped. This was like, okay, now I just got to like, do some stuff and pay some bills and like make a comeback basically. Yeah, this was this and Starman, right? You come back with like, I love Starman too, which is great. Yeah, if you want to know if put it make a connection my very that car that I told you that I bought
00:17:50
Speaker
Yeah, that exact car, well, not exact, but like that make, model, color, everything is the car that Jeff Bridges drives in Starman. Hell yeah. If you want a visual, that's what my car was. Hell yeah. Love that for you. Honestly, I would love that for anybody. That's amazing.
00:18:09
Speaker
But yeah, I mean, like, yeah, Carpenter is I don't know, he's one of those canonical guys. But yeah, I can I can absolutely always appreciate like he's the thing is very much a passion project, kind of his one of his bigger blank checks after the success of Halloween. And it bombs so spectacularly becomes it comes out like the week after E.T.
00:18:34
Speaker
just bombed so spectacularly that he he's immediately on his heels, immediately now in damage control mode. He's originally working on Firestarter. That's his original project. And then that falls through for some reason. I don't have a lot of the specifics on that, but that falls through. And then he ends up getting punted. This one, the rights actually are purchased before the novel is finished. The movie goes into production before the novel is published.
00:19:04
Speaker
So both the movie and the novel come out in nineteen eighty three which is. Rare. The way i understand it the reason he didn't do fire starter is because universal was not.
Christine as a Metaphor for Toxic Relationships
00:19:18
Speaker
Happy with the returns from the thing and that's why yeah i went elsewhere and did yeah i basically got fired.
00:19:26
Speaker
OK, that that explains it then. Yeah. And then he gets punted over to Columbia, who are anxious to have a name to direct their Stephen King adaptation. And if you look at the Stephen King adaptations up to this point, they've generally been directed by names. De Palma directs Carrie. You've got all the names just went right out of my head. Cronenberg with the Dead Zone.
00:19:53
Speaker
I'm trying to think of what this is only like the third or fourth one that get a Kubrick, of course, for The Shining, like like the big names are directing these Stephen King movies. Like he is the biggest name in literature at this point. And so they're able to pull in a lot of big names for the directors. Now, that changes within a few years of this. But like I think you get Romero on Creepshow and you get like a few others, but then like the
00:20:19
Speaker
the directors of Promise start passing and doing other things very soon after this. But this is still in that, like, King is hot enough stuff that everybody wants a piece. Yeah, it's just that weird, interesting thing that horror has always had to, like, deal with, right? Like, where certain people, they don't want to take on the projects because it's like, oh, it's just a horror movie. And that's, I mean, that's something that King has always, like,
00:20:44
Speaker
not struggled with, but had to contend with was just being pigeonholed as like a horror writer when it's, you know, he writes all sorts of different things, but you don't get the same respect, whether it's literature or film, because it's horror. And I, you know, so I think a lot of
00:21:03
Speaker
interesting when you chart kind of King's popularity where yeah like all these like names want to make his movies and then it kind of like drops off and then oh nope now everybody it's prestige again and now everybody wants on a King movie because it's you're gonna get... Rob Reiner does misery and here we go yeah
00:21:20
Speaker
Oh yeah. Yeah. Shawshank and stand by me. And then it's like all of a sudden you get kind of that, Oh wait, this is a Stephen King thing. It's like, yeah, guys, there's other stuff out there. And so it's really, I know it's so weird.
00:21:36
Speaker
And I know King has said he's the literary equivalent of a Big Mac and fries, but there's something to be said for a Big Mac and fries sometimes. Sometimes you just want a quick bite, something that goes down easy and something that you know what you're going to get.
00:21:55
Speaker
Um, and that doesn't mean there's no artistry to it. That doesn't mean it didn't take work and effort to put together. Um, it's just, you know, it's, it's a fairly mass produced thing that he's, that he's making. Um, because a lot of people really love it. A lot of people engage with it because, and just because it's popular doesn't mean it's bad. No. And vice versa.
00:22:18
Speaker
And it's so interesting with some of his stuff because it's like, it's just, it's so simple, but somehow like he's able to just create magic with that, like, oh, you know, possessed car, Christine, like, oh, rabid dog, Kujo. Like, it's just like so, it was like, oh, creepy clown. Like, you know, it's
Arnie's Transformation and Identity
00:22:39
Speaker
just so iconic with imagery and it's just so easy to sell.
00:22:45
Speaker
because, yeah, you see that and you know exactly what it is. And it's so simple. But yeah, he's able to create so much within that world. And I think that's why so many of his projects are so
00:23:00
Speaker
perfect for adaptation because like we see with Christine, it's very easy to kind of boil it down and make it work in an hour and a half window. It doesn't have to be some crazy epic. It's easy. Even The Shining, which obviously King has mixed feelings on, but even that is Kubrick was able to pull out certain things and kind of
00:23:24
Speaker
boil it down to these basics, and obviously it's very artsy, but what he's representing is really just the core of that story. And that core is what makes these films and these projects and these books so powerful and so iconic. Right. I've always said or long said that I like Stephen King's premises. Like I think I'll read like a premise or a synopsis for a King book and be like,
00:23:52
Speaker
I want to engage with that and then I start reading it and I just get bogged down in the details and I get like so overwhelmed by all the minutia and I know he's painting a picture and he's trying to create like a full vision of something but I personally, me, I just kind of get bogged down and all that and it's difficult for me to push through.
00:24:11
Speaker
I got about I did get about halfway through Salem's lot before I had to put it down. And then I just I didn't pick it back up. I want to. Yeah, I have it. It's there. I enjoyed what I read of it, though, like I didn't because I understood that one. The scope of that one is much larger
Carpenter's Cinematic Adaptation Skills
00:24:27
Speaker
than some of his others. And so I was on board for what that was. But like when I tried to pick up and read, like any number of others, like desperation or wealth. Yeah, don't do that. Yeah.
00:24:40
Speaker
Had you told me that sooner I Would say based on what you're saying I would recommend going for some of the short story collections
00:24:53
Speaker
Right. And I think that may be the move. I also have 1122.63 on audiobook. And I've gotten about halfway through that one. Yeah. And audiobooks are great for that, especially with some of those larger tomes.
00:25:11
Speaker
30-hour listed on Audible. It's a mammoth. We just covered that. And so, yeah, we did six episodes on that book. Damn. On just the book. So, yeah, understandable. So you haven't even gotten to the Franco miniseries yet, have you?
00:25:28
Speaker
Oh yeah. No, we're covering that later this month. So that's coming. Teasers right on. Yes. Yeah. I would recommend tapping into some of the short stories because there you're really getting, you've got a good like breadth of size and scope too.
00:25:45
Speaker
Some of them can be kind of like, well, is this a short story? Is this a novella? I don't know. I don't actually know what the defining page count is for novella versus a short story because there's some that are 150 pages or whatever, but then you've also got some that are 20 pages.
00:26:06
Speaker
Right. Yeah. And again, he's prolific in that he can write for... Christine started as a short story about a car whose odometer ran backwards, and then by the end, it's just its component parts laying on the ground. That was the initial concept. He's like, this is going to be a fun short story.
00:26:25
Speaker
And then he starts pulling in all these other things. And the next thing you know, it's a 500 plus page novel. And he's saying all these things about, you know, fifties nostalgia and looking back and going forward and obsession and being a teenager and all this other stuff that's kind of woven itself into that narrative, which and again, it just started as a very short story. So
00:26:53
Speaker
It's I don't know. I find again, I find his ideas very fascinating, but I always tend to get a little bogged down in his execution. That's always been kind of my line on King. I'm still willing to engage like he's one of my partner's favorite authors. Like she's she's a fan of his. So I need I need I need to get into Stephen King is what I need to. It's just because he is so prolific and because he does dip his toe into so many genres, I think that
00:27:23
Speaker
It's just finding the king that works for you because yeah, it's you know You put out that many things You're gonna have some stinkers and you're gonna have some like you knock it out of the park And obviously when you know like as so many people do his history his personal history and everything that he's gone through and the ups and downs of his own personal life and things that he struggled with and
00:27:48
Speaker
I mean, you can chart that in his output. So yeah, if you're jumping in a dreamcatcher, you're going to get a very different king.
00:27:58
Speaker
that you would have 20 years earlier or that you would 20 years later. I
Personal Reflections on Driving and Themes
00:28:05
Speaker
can totally understand where you're coming from and I have faith that you will find the story and you're gonna be like, this is what everybody, this is it. This is what they were talking about. This is the attraction and I'm excited to hear when that happens what that story is because it seems to be different for everybody.
00:28:26
Speaker
I did read one of his short stories with my partner. It's the one about teleportation. It's forever in there, I think, is the line. And the ending was so light. Oh, it is. OK. Yeah, the John. The John. Yeah, that's it. Yeah, the ending was just so like I just kind of like sat there with like my stomach in my mouth, just kind of like.
00:28:55
Speaker
I didn't know. I was so incredibly disturbed by that story. Yeah. And I think sometimes what I personally love about King and to bring it back to Christine, like what I love about this book and this movie is just kind of the way he's able to capture things that sometimes it's like
00:29:19
Speaker
I don't know how to put into words and I've never heard or read or seen somebody capture of these feelings quite like he does. I think that he's so observant and it's something that I just think is so cool about King is that he can just see something, just a normal everyday thing and he'll be like, huh, but what if?
00:29:45
Speaker
that's something that goes from there. Yeah, that's something that fascinates me is like listening to him talk about where his ideas for stories come from, right? Like the forward to Salem's lot where he talks about how he was an English teacher teaching Dracula and
00:30:02
Speaker
He his wife asked him what would happen if Dracula came to America and he's like, oh, well, he'd get hit by a car going through Times Square and just kind of like laughed it off and then actually thought about it and built Salem's law around that whole notion. And so that book is is Dracula in small town America, which is, again, an incredibly fascinating concept. This one, he got the idea because he was driving his car. And as he pulled into his driveway, the odometer flipped.
00:30:32
Speaker
to 10,000,000 miles or whatever. And he was like, huh, what if the odometer ran backwards? And that was just where that idea came from. Like that happened
Critiquing Nostalgia and Societal Impact
00:30:42
Speaker
in my car. And like those older cars, like you see that in Christine, how it has like 93,000 miles. And what happens is when it hits 100,000, it goes back to zero.
00:30:51
Speaker
And like that happened in my car too. And so it's like yeah, it's just all of a sudden it's like it just resets And now it's like it's starting over. It's like a fresh start like does it have a hundred thousand miles or you know
00:31:06
Speaker
you know, two miles or six miles. Like it's, it's just, it's just like one of those interesting things. Or 400,000 miles. Yeah. It's like, you don't know. It's like not actually very accurate. No, not at all. For whatever reason. I'm not sure what the logic, maybe they just never expected people to drive a hundred thousand miles. I don't know why they did that, but it seems. Who's going to spend their entire life in a car, please. Those are, those things were made for Sunday drives at most, right? Like, yes. Yeah.
00:31:36
Speaker
I mean, who's driving cross country in the 1950s, really? Well, I mean, that's like Route 66, right? Like you got like the open road and that's the appeal, right? That's a different kind of America.
00:31:51
Speaker
Yeah, I know. I guess it just kind of depends on where you're at, where you're from and what you're, I mean, because now I'm thinking Karawak. Yeah, Karawak is pure 50s. And that's exactly what Karawak did just hitching across the country with whoever happened to pop up. So yeah, I guess I live in the West. So it's just kind of like, that's the appeal out here, right? Is that you can just get in your car and drive and
00:32:16
Speaker
Where are you going? Who knows? Who cares? But you're going to go somewhere and you can just go north and you're going to head in the mountains. You can go south and go to the desert. Yeah.
00:32:25
Speaker
Whereas I'm in the Midwest and so, you know, you just, you drive 45 minutes to get to work one way. So yeah, that's gross. I'm sorry. It's life. I actually have worked jobs where I've had to drive 45 minutes to get into work one way. So yeah, see, that's not the kind of driving that I know that's not a fan. I'm not a fan of that, but I think, and I think that,
00:32:55
Speaker
I just think that's such a, like the appeal of having a car like Arnie, like Dennis, and like myself, like when you're a teenager and something that I think
00:33:07
Speaker
I think, well, I think like you were saying in certain areas, if you live in an area where driving is a necessity or public transportation, it's not quite up to snuff. The appeal and the freedom that having a car brings and just like that independence and that stage of life when like that first big purchase, that first big investment, that first big commitment, it's like,
00:33:33
Speaker
I just find it so romantic. I find this movie so romantic in a lot of ways in the story, which I know is weird. I was going to say that's not the word I would pick. You picked it earlier, and I was like, there's a story there, and I know we're going to get into it. But for me, I was never in a hurry to drive personally.
00:33:58
Speaker
Um, because I had the best friends in the world and they all got their driver's license the second they turned 16 and they were, they all wanted to hang out with me for some reason. So they'd come pick me up and we just go places. Um, so I never had to like look very far for a ride anywhere. So I didn't get my driver's license until I was 19 and it's like the day before my sophomore year of college.
00:34:20
Speaker
I got it. I got it 10 minutes before my little sister because my mom knew that if she got her license first, she would lord it over me for all of time. And she would have rightly so. But like I same day, I same day as my little sister, we both got our licenses on the same day, because I just was not in a big hurry to get it. Like I just was just kind of like, Oh, I guess I should probably do this then, huh? But now wait,
00:34:44
Speaker
Well, and see, yeah, that's it. But I was also like a very, and I've talked about this on the show before, a very sheltered, very conservative from a very conservative church family. Like I was not the kind of kid looking for independence or looking to get into trouble or looking to stretch my, you know, wings and fly away. That was not who I was.
00:35:02
Speaker
I was happy in my little cage, thank you. So like, as I got older and realized, oh, I can, I can like, get away with stuff now, like that, that the appeal, but that would have never occurred to me at 16, because I was a very, I was a very good kid. So yeah, I think that probably speaks volumes about me.
00:35:23
Speaker
because I lived it like we had like a slightly rural part of town at that time it's grown a lot in the last you know 20 years but at the time it was like it felt like we're living out in the middle of nowhere and so right to get anywhere to do anything
00:35:39
Speaker
I had to drive, like public transportation was not a thing where we were, Uber was not a thing, Lyft was not a thing. And so, yeah, I could borrow my parents' car, maybe, but they had other things going on, so that didn't always work.
00:35:55
Speaker
So by purchasing my car, that was freedom. And because you're a teenager, those choices matter. And so it's like, oh, I'm going to make a statement with my car. I'm not going to get some Honda Civic. I want a cool car. So I'm getting my own grace lightning.
00:36:14
Speaker
I was gonna say, it sounds like you, you did get that, which is, I mean, but I think, I think your experience is probably a more prototypical teenage experience in that, you know, you want the car, you want the freedom, you want the expression of a car. For me, a car has always been a necessity. And my, my view on it has always been very utilitarian. Can it get me from point A to point B? Great, then it works.
Carpenter's Subtle Storytelling Techniques
00:36:36
Speaker
Oh, see, yeah, see that, I will say.
00:36:39
Speaker
was the downfall of getting a antique classic car is that it was definitely not very reliable. And ultimately, that's why I sold it. I actually sold it twice and bought it twice because I had it for a really long time. And then I moved out of state and was like, well, maybe this is the time. So I sold it and then ended up coming back home a few, like,
00:37:08
Speaker
A couple of years later and at one point a little bit before that, my dad found out that the people we sold it to actually were selling it again because the engine threw a rod.
00:37:19
Speaker
And so it was a lot of work to like, yeah, it needs a new engine. And so they were selling it. So I bought it back and then put a new engine in it and did all of that and then had it for a really long time. And it was my daily driver. And then at another point, I bought another car just so I had something that was actually a bit more reliable. And then ultimately it was just like, okay, this is.
00:37:43
Speaker
Um, a little bit more maintenance. This is not very practical and that, you know, when you're not necessarily, you know, struggling in your late twenties to pay bills, it's like, okay, this is probably not very practical. Um, so ended up selling it to, you know, a stereotypical older white guy with disposable income could actually do all.
00:38:08
Speaker
all of the things that I had always wanted to do and take it that final across the finish line thing. But yeah, sometimes you just you don't always want the practical thing. You just the heart wants just like already man the heart wants with the heart. My first car was a I don't even know what color it was. It was like
00:38:29
Speaker
somewhere between purple and brown, a Toyota Camry hatchback station wagon. And it was called Chewbacca, because whenever you opened the hatch on the back, it would make a kind of sound. And I drove I and that's my story with all of my cars, I drive them until they break. Yeah. And then I only get a new one when I am forced to get a new one. Like once I cannot drive the previous car anymore, then I start looking for a new one.
00:38:59
Speaker
That's that was honestly the case like it sounds really silly like stating out loud but like so after I sold it for the final time and this was probably like 10 years ago like I was like a little bit like heartbroken over it because I felt like I had like sold out a little bit like oh I gave up and
00:39:18
Speaker
kind of thing, like, ugh, now I just have like, and I just had boring cars. I was like, all right, I'm just getting a Volvo. Okay, I'm just, you know, like, just something. I was like, I don't even care. I took like my sister, like my sister like gave me like her old Passat. I was like, whatever, I don't fucking care. Like, just give me, it's just a car. I don't even care.
Plot Summary of 'Christine'
00:39:37
Speaker
You know, I was like so bitter. The way you said Volvo just sounded like a piece of your soul was dying. I was so, exactly. I was so bitter and it was just like, I don't care.
00:39:47
Speaker
Just a car. I don't even care about it. Whatever. And I would just drive them into the ground. And I will say it's not until I got my most recent car and it was like, Oh, I can't love again. But it was also reliable. Like I have, I currently have like a Subaru, a WRX and it was like, Oh, I can, I can have something that's fun that I love. And it's also like starts in the winter.
00:40:12
Speaker
You found your balance. That's good. It doesn't have to be a 60-year-old antique. Right. Right on. There's a middle ground. And you found it. Congratulations. That's not always easy to do. Yeah. We are 40 minutes into the shindig, so let's go ahead and get into the plot of this MOFO. For those joining us, this is the plot in 60 seconds. This is the part of the show where we discuss the plot
00:40:42
Speaker
of 1983's Christine. And we do that in 60 seconds or less. Now, typically, that would be decided by either the coin of justice, the Canadian quarter of indifference, or the D6 of destiny. However, we have a guest. And so we have asked Rachel if she would be so kind. And she has graciously accepted the invitation to attempt the plot in 60 seconds. So I've got 60 seconds on the clock right here.
00:41:10
Speaker
I will give you the 30 and 10 second warnings and I will go ahead and start the time whenever you start the plot. Okay. All right. Once upon a time, there was a teenage boy named Arnie Cunningham. He was a bit of a loser with a bully problem and only one real friend named Dennis. That was however, until he met Christine while driving home from school. One day Arnie caught a glimpse of a beautiful 1958 Plymouth fury with a for sale sign in the window.
00:41:35
Speaker
Sure, she was a bit haggard, had a bit of a past, but it's only because she wasn't being appreciated properly. Against the wishes of Dennis and his parents, Arnie bought Christine and their tragic love story officially began.
Romantic View of 'Christine'
00:41:45
Speaker
For the first time, Arnie found someone, or something, who truly appreciated him and that love allowed him to blossom.
00:41:50
Speaker
Yes, it only made him a bit aggro. 30 seconds. She loved him. This new confidence even allowed him to snag the most beautiful girl in school. Soon, however, Christine's true colors begin to show she would do anything to protect Arnie and their love, even kill. As the bodies and close calls begin to pile up, Christine and Arnie spiral further into the darkness and their commitment to each other. Friends, family, who needs them when you have a love like this?
00:42:13
Speaker
Then, like so many star-crossed lovers, Arnie makes the ultimate sacrifice as an effort to save Christine from his meddling friends and pays for this love with his life. Christine, of course, returns the favor. Ah, true love. And that is time. Brilliant. Well done, Rachel. Bravo. Nicely done. No, you nailed it. Well done.
00:42:36
Speaker
I know that was a bit of a interpretation, but that's how I see it. You've got a take, and I love that. Actually, let's go ahead and start there. Again, you've brought this up a few times, the way that you have, whether it's that you saw it as a child, but you romanticize this movie. I'd love to crack into that a little more.
00:43:05
Speaker
I mean, if I would say if this is a love story, it's an incredibly tragic, dark, dare I say, toxic love story, like what I mean, but but you romanticize this. So I'm kind of curious, like, if I can put this as bluntly as possible. Why?
00:43:23
Speaker
So I think what I find romantic when I'm looking at the story, just like Arnie and this car and finding something that you can like love and you find purpose in and you find a sense of identity and freedom in, like I had that with my car and like I remember the way it feels. I remember the way it smells and like the freedom of like driving it at night with the windows down and listening to music and just like how it felt like
00:43:48
Speaker
like, like part of my identity and like part of my personality and not in like, oh, I'm going to make this my entire personality, not like that kind of thing, but just like, you know, when you're young and just figuring out who you are and
00:44:02
Speaker
finding that in a car. And I think that that's what's attracted to me, to the story and what I see in Arnie, because I just haven't really seen that relationship portrayed this way. And it's the same kind of thing that I liked about Grease too. And just, you know, I love car movies in general, and I think you do see that in some other
00:44:21
Speaker
car movies, but I think it's just a little bit more sensual in some ways, but also innocent, if that makes sense. I know those are two weird ways to pair it together, but just kind of that youthful attraction to that idea of car and independence.
00:44:37
Speaker
And then i also just think that the way that this movie is filmed i find it to be just so gorgeous and
Parallels with Other Media
00:44:45
Speaker
i mean that moment where he's in the garage and says show me and she like like that's such a sexy scene like it is sorry like it is so sexy and
00:44:56
Speaker
Even the way he says, show me, I'm like, holy shit, this is about to get NC 17. Like, this is about to get illicit. Like, just based on the way he delivers that line. It's sexy as hell. Yeah. And it's impossible, I think, not to just, you know, make those connections because
00:45:17
Speaker
He's a boy and her name's Christine. And obviously, you know, like there's that dynamic between them, you know, the subtext becomes the text at some point. Yeah. Like would she do that with a female driver? Who knows? That's a movie I would love to see. But it would be a great sequel for this, honestly. I I that's my that's my pitch. I when they when they remake it, because I'm sure they will. It's like it doesn't have to be a dude.
00:45:44
Speaker
But I think that that's what I just find romantic about it too is just the way it's filmed, the way Carpenter interprets this story. I also think it just looks great. And I just never seen like the like the scene where the gas station and Christine just
00:46:04
Speaker
through all the bullies and then she's chasing Buddy Repperton down the street and just like the patients and seeing the car that way I think is just so cool because Christina's not a typical like muscle car, right? Under the hood she is, but that's a little bit of a muscle car for the time period, but that's a whole other thing. But you see like Dennis's car, which is a charger, which is like a muscle car. I mean, that's what
00:46:31
Speaker
You know, Dom Toretto drives like it's like it's like a tough car, right? But Christine is this weird, this fury, which is, you know, kind of like the Bel Air and it's it's not that kind of car that you think of when you think like tough guy or like that car is bad ass.
Carpenter's Filmmaking Influence
00:46:48
Speaker
You know, it's not not necessarily what you think of. And so it is the reason why King picked it, right?
00:46:54
Speaker
Well, I mean, I've always thought, and this is what my dad thought, that people always romanticize and dream about or want to obtain the car that they thought was cool in high school. So whatever that car was, when you were in high school, whatever you thought was the baddest car out there, that's what you're always going to dream about.
00:47:17
Speaker
maybe this is what King thought was really cool when he was in high school, you know, like it was still older at that time. But like, you know, maybe he's just a car that he always thought was cool. And we see cars from this period like pop up in a lot of his work, like in from a Buick eight, it's a very similar car and eleven twenty two sixty three. It's a very similar car. So I think that there's something about this era of cars that King just likes. And it makes sense because it would have been around him at that age.
00:47:46
Speaker
where he thought that they were cool and affordable because they're a little bit older like you know at this time i mean obviously like 58 this movie it's it's a 20 year old car it's technically an antique and same thing like dennis discharger is already 10 years old so they're cool but they're not new cars and so yeah i can't even remember where i was going with all of that but i i just love the way it's
00:48:12
Speaker
The car is made to be badass in this movie. And I think that's what I also really like about it, because Carpenter makes this car look so cool and sound so cool. And I'm just not used to seeing this era of cars put forth that way. Usually it's like 60s and 70s era muscle cars, not this big boat of a car with these like huge wings.
00:48:37
Speaker
I love the personality that he infuses into the car just by virtue of the filmmaking, the way he shoots it, like the initial scene, like the Christine is born evil scene, where the guy is just, he's got his hand under the hood while he checks something in the front grill, and you zoom in on his hand, and then you get a shot of the,
00:49:02
Speaker
the hood up, and then it just slams down. And you cut to the guy screaming like, you, it's a car. So it has no emotion whatsoever. But you absolutely know, just from that from those that series of shots, you know, exactly what the car is thinking in that moment, like, I'm gonna crush this motherfucker's hand.
00:49:26
Speaker
Well, yeah, how dare him? They don't even know each other and he's like grabbing around under her hood. Like, excuse me, sir. I'm a lady.
Identity and Obsession Themes
00:49:37
Speaker
But like, they're just in again, just the car has absolutely no thought process whatsoever. But you're watching this movie, you know exactly what this car is thinking at any given moment. And that is, that is all thanks to Carpenter and his DP. Like that is, that is some filmmaking 101 stuff right there. And that's exactly the reason why I think it works to the degree that it does.
00:50:01
Speaker
in the clever way that they use the music because like in the music is part of the book but the way carpenter utilizes that to kind of be christine's voice it's something that michael bay would steal for bumblebee and transformers many years later yeah like using like because whatever the lyrics are saying that's kind of like
00:50:22
Speaker
how she's communicating outside of the actual physical actions that she's, you know, doing and like the movements and, you know, whatever. And so I think that's just like such a brilliant way to do that because and I think that's something too that I just find kind of romantic and I like about this film because, you know, when you're like little and you're like assigning personalities to inanimate objects, you know, like your stuffed animals and things and you're like,
00:50:50
Speaker
Oh, I have to rotate which stuffed animal I bring to bed because I don't want the other ones to get upset. Maybe that's just- You don't want her to feel bad at all. Yeah.
00:50:59
Speaker
I just slept with all of mine. That was how I avoided that. You know, but I think that's like, it's in some ways, it's like an extension of that where that I find romantic that like, Oh, this car actually like can feel how much I care about it. You know, it's not even like an animal or something. But I think that that's kind of like a remnant of like a childhood thing where you're like, Oh, I just, I want them to know how much I love them. And
00:51:26
Speaker
feel it and that's the same thing i feel like i guess did you think this was based on this movie did you think this was what high school was going to be like for you when you got to high school like i know like i would watch stuff as a kid like saved by the bell and think oh that's what high school is going to be like like did christine light and grace like influenced your idea of what high school was going to be
00:51:49
Speaker
Uh, well, yes, it did in some ways. And I think in some ways it, it did. Like I felt like that kind of came true in,
Cultural Nostalgia Critique
00:52:02
Speaker
in certain ways, like I do love, and that's part of like the car and the freedom to be able to like go to a concert with my friends or go to, you know, some sort of event with them and that kind of stuff like that part, but I never,
00:52:18
Speaker
We didn't look as cool. I certainly did not look as cool as any of these people. I know she made some questionable fashion choices, but her hair is amazing in every scene and my hair never looked that good. I mean, it's 1983. One could argue most fashion choices were questionable in the 80s. Yeah.
00:52:41
Speaker
Um, no, I, I mean, you were talking about kind of the, the early love story of it. Like I know Keith Gordon said that he, whenever he touched the car, he, as an actor had to like imagine that it was a woman and had to imagine what part of the woman he was touching.
00:53:01
Speaker
whenever he touched a part of the car, like to kind of imbue his performance with that. And given how he looks at the beginning of this film versus the change that comes over him once he begins driving Christine, he goes from like this very awkward, virginal teenager to this very confident individual. And the implicate again, the subtext is almost yes, I've had sex and now I am
00:53:29
Speaker
I've become a man. I'm now to be respected. And you see that in a lot of his behavior. Like, again, it's all subtext, but it's absolutely there. Like, which I find really fascinating. And I think Gordon, for someone who didn't really do a lot of acting outside of this movie, basically became a director. But I think his performance is absolutely incredible in this movie. Like, I'm kind of bummed we didn't get more Keith Gordon performances, honestly.
00:53:58
Speaker
Yeah, no, I mean, I really like his his transformation, I guess, like he's so dorky at the beginning and so sad and pathetic. And I think that.
00:54:11
Speaker
It's interesting because I do think a lot of it we see through Dennis's eyes because it's not like we're charting. We're following him around but it's almost like we're kind of observing it in bits of pieces from Dennis, his friend who's seen him forever and it's just kind of like he just shows up.
00:54:29
Speaker
at least for the first like act, I think we're definitely looking at Dennis's eyes for sure. And it's just like, you're not quite sure what's going on and why he's doing this. And it's like, you know, he's still friends with Dennis, like
Arnie’s Tragic Downfall
00:54:45
Speaker
he still shows up like there's still
00:54:47
Speaker
bits and pieces. And it's just like, wait, how much original Arnie is still left in there. Right. And it's interesting to kind of follow that until you realize that, like, oh, no, like Arnie's gone. Yeah. Like he's been. And that's like those final moments in the movie where we see like.
00:55:03
Speaker
him in the car and stuff. It's like, Oh, no, he's, he's gone. Like, Christine, Christine has taken over all, you know, everything there's, there's no, there's no Arnie left. And that's what's so sad. That's the tragic part of this is he just
00:55:21
Speaker
Went too hard for the wrong gal. Yeah, that co-dependence just never pays off, right? Yeah. Yeah. And again, they have, it's almost like a Sid and Nancy kind of relationship, Arnie and Christine, really. Like, it's really toxic for both of them. Neither one of them is profiting off of this thing. But it just like, and it ends up destroying
00:55:47
Speaker
both of them. Obviously, Christine will live again, but Arnie tragically will not. Well, yeah, yeah, I think Sid and Nancy is a good comparison because the thing is like you can see what's attractive about Christine and what she's able to offer Arnie like that attraction makes sense.
00:56:07
Speaker
Like, even though it doesn't make sense to anybody else around Arnie, like, why would you like this car? Why would you? But he sees the potential in it. He sees something in her, you know, he sees what she could be just with a little investment in time. And then, you know, what that can turn into. But then. Ultimately. Yeah, Christine just like sucks
00:56:37
Speaker
that same thing that he found attractive about her at the beginning, just like you said, like Nancy, it's like, oh, ultimately, it's just going to be your downfall.
Carpenter's Adaptation Choices
00:56:45
Speaker
That's like not sustainable. And you're giving up too much of yourself to this thing. Exactly. And in that way, it almost seems Faustian. Like there's almost a Faustian bargain here. Like he's traded his soul for
00:57:00
Speaker
for whatever it is that Christine's offering. I'm showing my references. I'm showing my hand here a little bit when I say this, but it's also giving Little Shop of Horrors a bit as well. It offers you
00:57:17
Speaker
everything. And what does it ask? Well, just just just blood. That's all doesn't have to be yours. You know, what unspeakable things are you willing to do to get what you want is really and again, that's incredibly Faustian. Like that, that's the whole note. Like, I'll give you Yeah, I'll give you a turn of life. I'll just know your soul, you won't miss it. It's fine. Like, and that's, that's very much, I think, what both
00:57:44
Speaker
in a much more absurd way, Little Shop, but in a much more serious way. Christine, I think both of those kind of have that weird through line of that kind of Faustian bargain within them, which I find, again, really interesting.
00:57:55
Speaker
Yeah. And, you know, Christine, I mean, not to get it twisted. It's like, I fully understand. Christine is just, she's just born bad. She's just evil. Like she's just right up. But how like sexy and how alluring that can be, right? And I mean, obviously that's a tale as old as time, you know, the attraction to the dark side and how enticing it can be at first, but ultimately that's, you know, it's going to suck you down and it's going to take you with it. Like the,
00:58:25
Speaker
You could only go so far with that, and that's what we see here. She's the femme fatale. Really, when you get right down to it, Christine is the femme fatale. She exists to cross our hero to stumble and fall and to try to drag him down with her, really. And in this case, because we're not under the Haze Code anymore, she succeeds. Yeah. Oh, I love it.
Stephen King's Film Adaptations and Legacy
00:58:53
Speaker
And I do think, I think it was smart to do that because in the book, obviously there's like a whole ghost involved and like, that's great in the book. And I think it makes sense. And I do like that part of the story. Um, but I think it was really smart to just like leave it ambiguous and just like strip that part away for the film. Number one, just because that's hard to like, I think, not hard, but.
00:59:15
Speaker
You put that on film, it would be some extra. It's a lot of war that you don't need to tell the story. That feels like one of those things that.
00:59:28
Speaker
You know, King felt like he needed an explanation. And so he kind of plotted and wrote this whole thing out. And I think that, again, like you said, I think that works on paper, but on screen, it's much more direct. And that opening scene does it perfectly. Look, it's just a bad car. Yeah. The car's just evil. What else do you want from me? It's an evil car. Just get on board with that, and we're going to have a good time. And we did.
00:59:56
Speaker
Like I think I think that that is an absolutely incredible decision. I think it works really well and I think it really helps.
01:00:03
Speaker
this movie and it becomes instead of Arnie being possessed by like the spirit of the car's previous owner as he is in the book, he's basically become possessed of just like Christine's ideal of what, you know, her maybe perhaps her ideal or original owner might have been. Like he's he's making these much like Sandy does at the end of Grease. He's making these changes for the person he loves to become someone that they want to be.
01:00:33
Speaker
with.
01:00:34
Speaker
Yeah, it's just that, you know, obsession is great in some ways, right? Like we're all obsessed. We're obsessed with films. You know, we're obsessed with horror. We're obsessed with all these things. But it doesn't matter what your obsession is. You take it too far. Right. And it's going to be your downfall, right? Everything in moderation. And yes, very a very wise sentiment that honestly, Arnie probably should have listened to. You should have listened to. But it's hard to do when you have
01:01:04
Speaker
some supernatural entity just casting a spell over you. Yes, absolutely. What are some other differences between the book and the some other differences between the book and the film? Well, some of the deaths. Yeah, I mean, some of the way the deaths unfold are a little bit different. Who dies is a little different. Like Harry Dean Stanton's character.
01:01:33
Speaker
dies in the book but not the movie.
01:01:37
Speaker
And, you know, but everything like it's, I don't feel like there's any major change. I mean, the major change is the idea about the ghost, like that's the major change. Other than that, it's all kind of like some small character things. Some of the characters get condensed in the movie, you know, like, okay, we're just going to put these two characters together just because why do we need this other, you know, we don't need to go down that road or explain that. Like, let's just boil them into this character.
01:02:04
Speaker
Um, so I think those are just like the main, the main differences. It's funny because I think that this is a movie that is known for like, Oh, they made all these changes from the book. But when you read the book, it's like, uh, there's a lot of stuff that it's like beat for beat out
Carpenter’s Career and Impact
01:02:21
Speaker
of the book. So it's like, it still feels very true to me. It is one of the best King adaptations. I will say that.
01:02:31
Speaker
All right. Right on. I just, I just, I feel like it captures the spirit of the book. I feel like it captures the spirit of King, but it also captures the spirit of like carpenter too. I feel like, like to me this looks and feels like a carpenter film. It sounds like a carpenter film. And so it's like that perfect blend.
01:02:53
Speaker
of filmmaker and king where it's like, okay, this person gets it and is able to capture both of those things without losing the full identity or leaning too hard one way or the other, because we've seen that.
01:03:06
Speaker
So somebody leans too far one way and we get the shining. Right. Which is still an incredible film. It's just not a very good adaptation. Right. And then somebody leans too far the other way and we get the shining. The other adaptation. The McGarriss shining. Yes. Bless McGarriss' sweet, sweet heart. But sometimes it's like when you're married to the original source material,
01:03:32
Speaker
Doesn't necessarily translate to screen the same way that it does on the page right at that point. It's not an adaptation you're just Putting the book on on screen and that's there. There's no edit. There's no skill in that
01:03:45
Speaker
Well, there's a skill, but it also like they're different mediums. Like that doesn't always work that way. Like what works on screen is not always necessarily what works best on the page and vice versa. And so I think this is like a perfect middle ground for that. And I just don't think, I don't know, it gets credit for that. I think people, there's a lot of people that I think, I don't think that's a hot take. I think that's a pretty normal take.
01:04:10
Speaker
Well, I think I read somewhere that King himself considers this adaptation boring. Like he's like, well, I would rather it be bad than boring. Like, yeah, I don't think King was particularly impressed with this, with this adaptation from what I've read.
01:04:27
Speaker
That's not silly. I really don't know you guys. This is one of those things that I just, there's a lot of times when people are like, oh, I'm not really into it. I'm like, okay, I get it. I can see that. I can understand. I don't get that here. I don't understand. My brain can't process it and I know I'm too close to it. I know this is a me thing. But you recognize that and that's fine. You recognize it and that's okay.
'Christine' in Carpenter's Body of Work
01:04:58
Speaker
Tucker, we know that your your power box got hit by a 58 red 58 Plymouth Fury. So you've been you've been kind of quiet for a while, but you're back. You guys, I'm back. My power went out. I'm having a winter storm or something. There's like snow and rain and wind. And I live in a very rural area. So my power goes out a lot. Yeah. Yeah.
01:05:25
Speaker
But hey, I went outside and it's so dark. Like I cannot believe how dark it is outside because like nobody's house lights are on, like the campground lights aren't on. You guys not have generators on the campground? We do for the store in the office, but it only keeps like the essential stuff going. OK. And apparently your your living quarters are not essential. My house is not essential, man.
01:05:58
Speaker
Well, that's a bummer. We've been having a good old time talking about Christine. Do you have any thoughts on adaptation at all, Tucker? That's kind of what we've been talking about just most recently. This specific adaptation? Yeah. I think it's good. It's kind of hard to come right back into this. I know.
01:06:27
Speaker
Nope, keep going. Sorry. I was gonna say it's good. I think I think it gets the you know, the broad strokes, the tone of the book is the same.
01:06:40
Speaker
I mean, I'm sure you guys discussed the differences already, but I don't think any of those really separates it too much from its source material. I think it's a pretty solid adaptation. And like we talked about specifically with remakes, like with the remake of Robocop, it's kind of like that in a way to where you have to adapt
01:07:05
Speaker
the material for a different medium, you know? And I think the choices that were made that were different in the book are pretty solid. I think it makes for a better film. Yeah, I am curious. That's the most generic thing I could have said. No, no, no. But I also wanted to ask you because you said like it doesn't necessarily feel very like carpenter or like signature carpenter to you and
01:07:34
Speaker
Yeah, can you talk? I'm just curious because like I said, what about it? Why do you think it is that this is the film that you forget Carpenter directs? I think it's just that there's not a lot of like I said before, there's bits and pieces of him in it. Like if you've seen his other films, you'll be like, oh, that's some shit John Carpenter does. But like as a whole, it doesn't have
01:08:01
Speaker
the overall feeling of it doesn't feel as much like a Carpenter film as stuff like In the Mouth of Madness or, you know, Halloween, even. I think it I think it's missing some of his acerbicness, if if if that's the right word or acerbicidity. I don't know what the word is, what the noun form of acerbic is, but like that kind of energy that he usually brings to things like
01:08:29
Speaker
The thing that speaks to me as being the most carpenter is the disillusionment with the nostalgia, which is why I think I said the idea of the weaponized nostalgia in this movie, which I think and he gets into this, I think a lot more in They Live, but the idea that Reagan was using this kind of
80s and 90s Nostalgia in Modern Media
01:08:49
Speaker
40s and 50s era nostalgia to weaponize the conservative base and it worked
01:08:55
Speaker
so well that he got elected to two terms and probably could have gotten a third if they hadn't made it law that he couldn't. Like he he just weaponized that to such a degree. And Carpenter, of course, is extremely anti Reagan and extremely like progressive and forward thinking filmmaker that I think those ideas, although subtle and not as overt,
01:09:18
Speaker
like but you get the idea like as arnie kind of regresses into this 50s thing you get like the 50s rock music coming through christine stereo we talked a little bit about that like all the things that the radio is singing are the things that she's thinking but and i mean i grew up on those oldies so i i fucking love the soundtrack of this movie it's absolutely incredible um but like those elements
01:09:43
Speaker
That you almost feel like when Alexandra Paul delivers that final line of the movie, God, I hate rock and roll. You're almost like, I feel like that's carpenter on some level just being like, God, I hate this shit. Yeah. And it's the idea about romanticizing a period of time, right? That like, okay. Yeah. It might've been this kind of ideal life or ideal image of America, but for whom?
01:10:07
Speaker
Like that was not necessarily the experience for everybody. It was a very privileged select group of people that had kind of that idea. When we think of the fifties, that was not the experience for everybody. And there was a lot of things not great about that era. And so there is a danger in romanticizing and getting obsessed with that idea. And I mean, that's something we're still struggling with, right?
01:10:35
Speaker
That is the entirety of the MAGA movement, absolutely. Like, it's literally what the phrase means. It's like, like, what? Like, what was so great about that, you know, like, there's a real danger in becoming obsessed with that. And
01:10:51
Speaker
Whether, you know, if Arnie is America, right, you're going to lose part of your soul. And if you get too obsessed with it, ultimately it's going to be your downfall because it's just going to you over and ultimately like destroy you from the inside out.
01:11:07
Speaker
And it's just, I think that that's such an interesting and I do see a lot of carpenter in that because obviously we've seen him explore that a lot. And I do think he doesn't know if he feels as free to explore that here as he would in later films, 100%. And I think that is, you know, with King and I think that he knew coming off like a different
01:11:31
Speaker
approach to this. This wasn't a passion project necessarily. This was a for hire thing. It doesn't feel like he phones it in. I feel like he commits to it and like does a good job at it. But yeah, I think he was looking at it differently. And I mean, can you blame the guy? Like who wants to get like
01:11:50
Speaker
beat up like that like it would be hard to put something else back out there and like to trust your own gut and to trust your own instincts and to like have the same kind of confidence that he did in some of those earlier things and it just gets like shot down by audiences and critics right like that's got to be so frustrating which it's funny because obviously we've seen how things have been
01:12:13
Speaker
We evaluate it and reappraised and like actually appreciate it because they are brilliant. And it's not that they were right, but at the time that has to feel just like so demoralizing. And that's why his attitude now is pretty much like, okay, cool. Give me money. Yeah.
01:12:29
Speaker
like, Oh, yeah. Like, Oh, you, you love my films. Why didn't you go see them when they were first run in theaters? Like, like, and I get it. The man got kicked around and was basically disallowed from doing what he wanted to wanted to and loved to and needed to do. And he's understandably bitter about it. And now he just wants to play video games and smoke weed. And I wish him all the best in doing that. Yeah. I do think that he was a good choice for this though, because
01:13:00
Speaker
I also think that his like horror leanings and horror chops came in really handy because I think Christine the way she's filmed and the way we see her kind of like stalking Moochie and Buddy and like these bullies like it's very Jaws like to write it is just like how she's filmed and like that stealthy like that tension that we get.
01:13:22
Speaker
I think that somebody, especially somebody who has experience with something like Halloween, like that experience, I think is part of what I love about it is just how we see Christine kind of like just hanging back a little bit. And, you know, when she's stalking all of these people, I think is
01:13:42
Speaker
Perfect. I mean, it's very slashery. Yeah. And I'm not sure that's necessarily how somebody else would have interpreted that. But I think that he executes that so well. I love it. I agree.
01:13:57
Speaker
Well, I don't think that the fact that this doesn't feel as carpenter to me as some of his other films makes this bad or any worse than those films. I still think it's a phenomenal film. I think with this movie, he didn't really have to. He didn't have to do that because it's already it's kind of all there in the script.
01:14:23
Speaker
So I don't think it's a bad thing necessarily. And one thing that I love about this film is that this comes on the heels of stuff like Happy Days and American Graffiti. And it's kind of one of the first stories, novels or films to kind of turn that on its head.
01:14:48
Speaker
And that's something I wanted to say about five minutes ago, but like we moved past it. So no, but look, I really needed to throw that in there. I completely agree with you on that point. Like, no, that's, that's a hundred percent on the money. Absolutely. Which I think is really funny because like pairing this with like something like grease, which we also see like some interesting ties, you know, and like, you know, some weird like Kelly Preston's in this movie, right? Mm-hmm.
01:15:17
Speaker
Well, in the shot where he's right on top of the hood, that's right from Greece. That is, yeah. Well, and the dude looks like John Travolta. Kelly Preston married to John Travolta. Just like so many kinds of...
01:15:35
Speaker
interesting comparisons. Yeah, like we were saying earlier, like, aren't he kind of transforming into like, this is kind of like, Sandy, a little bit like, Oh, this is what you want me to be like, this is who I am now. Right? Yeah, she changing for this thing that you love. It's just I can change for you. Yeah, I can be what you want me and need me to be. Yeah, at the expense of my own sense of self and identity.
01:16:01
Speaker
Yeah, it's just so funny, this weird, like cyclical obsession. I mean, we see this with multiple different decades. Yeah. I mean, obviously, Grease was, wait, what year did Grease come out? It was later, right? It was like 78. Yeah. Aren't they watching it in this movie? Like, aren't, are they not? Did I, did I miss it? Okay. Nevermind. That's about when this movie takes place though, late 70s. So.
01:16:29
Speaker
Yeah, so I think there is like there is definitely some things there like you're saying like a response to that to that like flipping it it's on it on its head a little bit and just kind of yeah exploring the underbelly of that like you were saying like in a in a way that's not so obnoxiously preachy or so it's like it's just there and obviously we can tear it apart and I do think that that's very much a part of it and I think that that's very much something that King was
01:16:59
Speaker
thinking about as well. I think Carpenter was just a brilliant choice for this movie. I think we need someone to come in now and turn this wave of 80s, 90s nostalgia and turn it on its head and shake it up a little bit because the Duffer brothers have a lot to answer for is all I'm going to say.
01:17:21
Speaker
I don't know if they have a lot to answer for. I mean, can you blame them? It's like, I don't blame. I don't blame them at all. But no, no, 100 percent. But like I just you know, the kind of the wave of 80s nostalgia that Stranger Things kind of kicked off to the extent that, you know, just about every movie getting made now is a reboot or a retread or a reimagining or a remake of some 90s, 80s or 90s property.
Impact of 'Stranger Things' and Nostalgia Trends
01:17:47
Speaker
And I'm just, you know,
01:17:48
Speaker
Isn't it wild how long that's last? I feel like Stranger Things came out a billion years ago. I mean, just about, yeah. Why are we not past this? I feel like that trend is just too long. It's been too long. Well, those kids are so old. Right. Those kids are practically in their 50s now.
01:18:12
Speaker
But yeah, just the fact that the industry is still like remakes nostalgia, like leaning into it's like, that was 10 years ago, you guys can we like find something else? And the answer the short answer to that question, Rachel is no, no, we can't. I'm so sorry.
Recasting with Dick Miller and Donald Pleasance
01:18:31
Speaker
Is it just me or does this movie just feel like Dick Miller should be in it somewhere?
01:18:35
Speaker
I would put Dick Miller in this movie. Sure. Like I just have. Harry Dean Stanton is kind of. He is Robert Proskie or Robert Proskie, one of those two. And I honestly, I don't want to recast either of them because I think they're both perfect and they're both wonderful. But I'm just like, you need like another like, why can't the shop teacher be Dick Miller? The shop teacher should be Dick Miller.
01:18:58
Speaker
Oh, yeah. The shop teacher. Oh, no, wait. Sorry, I got my movies mixed up. I've been preparing for the rage carry to unenfranchised. And a fact just tried to weasel its way into this movie. So a nonfactual. Never mind that. Never mind that. Yes. Yes. Moving on.
01:19:20
Speaker
But no, like, yeah, played by David Spielberg, Mr. Casey, the shop teacher. I would not guess so. But yeah, yeah, I would. I would. Dick Miller should should have been the shop teacher in this movie. I'm just going to I'm going to that's my that's the flag I'm planting. I'm just going to go out on that. That's a good note. What if Donald Pleasance was in this movie?
01:19:48
Speaker
I don't know who he would be, but I don't need a room for his accent in this. It's too much Americana. You can't
Friendship Representation in 'Christine'
01:19:54
Speaker
you can't have Donald Pleasants in there. I shot the car six times. Like, yeah, I like he's too. He's too fancy and. Yeah. Or something to be well, to be like La Bay, you know, like we need somebody. Oh, yeah.
01:20:13
Speaker
I mean, he could play Hagrid. I mean, we all saw the end of Escape from New York. He can pull that off, but yeah. Can he? I don't know. I guess. He's a talented actor. I think he could probably play it. No, but he's too proper. I'm not sure. My lights are flickering, you guys. Uh-oh. Is Christine back?
01:20:39
Speaker
Oh, do you see that? I did. Scary. The house began to twitch. Okay, I think we're good. Okay. I'm in a very fragile space right now, you guys. It's okay, man. It's okay. For now, you're among friends. All right, good. This can be a safe space right now. This is Ncaster meeting right here. This is a safe space for all of us.
01:21:08
Speaker
Um, no judgment, as I said earlier, no judgment at this table. Um, what, what else do we have? Uh, what else do we have about Christine Rachel? What else? I mean, go off. What else you got? I mean, I really liked John Stockwell. I like his character of Dennis. I think he does a really good job at like selling that friendship because that's a tough one. Like, Oh yeah. This like super popular jock is like friends with Arnie, but I think he does a decent, like a pretty decent job. I think of like, can,
01:21:36
Speaker
I get the feeling that like they've known each other since they were little kids. Yeah. Which I think is something like that's the thing I think that happens. Like as you get older and like you get in high school and you kind of like, you know, when you were seven, you were both, I mean, you're seven, but then, you know, as you get old, maybe you're the loser and your friend goes like the jock way. It's just like how people evolve. But I, I just think it's really sweet to see a friendship like this represented in this way. Um,
01:22:06
Speaker
because especially like during this time period in the 80s, you know, jocks and nerds were always like pitted against each other. So it's kind of rare to see.
Practical Effects vs. Modern CGI
01:22:16
Speaker
There were whole film franchises based around that idea. Like, yeah. So to see a friendship like this and like not just like, oh, we're friends, but like I'm going to fight for you and I'm going to call you out and like I'm going to do what I can. You know, ultimately he fails. Right. That's right.
01:22:35
Speaker
Just you know part of that tragedy I I like that notion like it that speaks a lot to the character of Dennis that he has maintained that friendship because how easy would it be for him.
01:22:48
Speaker
It's so much simpler if he didn't have to stand up for this guy in front of Buddy, like if he didn't have to step in and save this kid's ass every day, which you get the impression that he absolutely does, but he does it because they're friends, not because of any sort of obligation. He genuinely cares for this kid.
01:23:10
Speaker
So like it's, it's, it's a touching thing to see. And it's not a friendship that we see portrayed very often in film or in real life. I guess, well, I guess the, the closest TV equivalent I can think of is saved by the bell because there's no way that all six of those archetypes are hanging out every day. It just doesn't, it just doesn't happen. But yeah. Yeah. Um, I mean something.
01:23:35
Speaker
that I think has just aged well. And I think just people continue to appreciate too, like the practical effects on this film, like still just look so great.
01:23:45
Speaker
the reconstruction scene, I know exactly how they did it. And I still ask, how the fuck did they pull that off? Because it's just so well done. Yes, I know it's plastic. And yes, they ran the film in reverse. And yes, they put like suction cups all over it. And but like it just it, it's so seamless, like the way the way it's edited, the way it's shot.
01:24:09
Speaker
It might be one of the best scenes in Carpenter's entire career. And that's saying something because that man has directed some incredible scenes. Like it's just so good. It's so good. It looks really good. It's the same effects guy as the thing. He was the same guy. He was on. He wasn't the head guy because I think Rob Botin was the head guy, but he was like on the effects team. If I'm not mistaken, I'm going to look this up.
01:24:38
Speaker
And also like I mean, when Christine's on fire, that's like I mean, that's also like an iconic thing and looks so cool. I was thinking about that when I was watching it and I came to the realization that if that was done today, it would be CGI and it kind of made me sad. Right. Yeah, because it looks so good. It's a car.
01:25:04
Speaker
There's gasoline in there you guys There's so many flammable fluids in there. That's in the gas tank. Boom. Boom. Yeah.
'Christine's' Box Office and Sequel Questions
01:25:12
Speaker
Yeah, like not not good So the fact that they were able to pull it off and yeah I mean as I'm sure we know like fire is very hard to like scale and do properly like in CGI and so like there's just
01:25:26
Speaker
You know, I just appreciate that they did it. And obviously it was a different time, so they had to do it that way. But, yeah, that holds up so well. And it's an iconic image for good reason. The only effect that doesn't hold up well in this movie, I don't know if it ever held up, was the dummy when Christine is crashing into the gas station. And one of homeboys buddies, the guy from Ghostbusters,
01:25:57
Speaker
When he gets squished like that, Debbie's just like that. Yeah. So obviously a dummy. The other I love it because there are campy moments in this movie. Oh, yeah. And and that to me kind of is one of them adds some levity to because that's a pretty intense sequence. And I don't know if it was intentional or not, but it adds some levity to it kind of makes it all go down a little smoother.
01:26:21
Speaker
Yeah, there's also a thing that has always, like, not bugged me, but it's like, so when Christine kills Moochie in that, like, alley nook, right? Or that, like, delivery drop-off port, whatever.
01:26:39
Speaker
I mean, I think it's so cool how it's just like she just like forces her way in like, oh, it's so cool. Also, it's like, why didn't Moochie just jump onto the hood of the car? Correct. Because there's a lot of standing in front of the car. There's a lot of standing in front of the car as it comes towards you in this movie. Yeah, there's a lot of it.
01:27:00
Speaker
Alright, so I want to clarify real quick. Robotene is the special effects, the special makeup effects creator and designer on the thing. Special effects foreman on the thing is a guy named Hal Bigger. But then Roy Arbogast is also on the special effects team. He's just credited as special effects.
01:27:21
Speaker
He is, however, credited as the special effects supervisor on another little film that came out several weeks earlier in 1983 called, let me see if I'm saying this right, Return of the Jedi. So, yeah, he was the supervisor on that one.
Trend of Adapting King's Work
01:27:40
Speaker
Coordinating on Starman. An American Graffiti guy made other movies, I guess. Yeah, that's wild. Wild, dude. That's crazy. Who'd have thought, not me.
01:27:52
Speaker
Damn, Christine, though, good movie. Good movie. It is, you guys. It is good. It got raised a whole star ranking in my in my Butterbox review this time. So I didn't even remember it. So I'm like. My review is it's more positive now than it would have been when I originally saw it, I think it's good.
01:28:16
Speaker
Yeah, mine definitely definitely was. So this movie comes out on December 9 1983 just in time for Christmas. Don't forget there is a scene set at Christmas. So Christine is a Christmas movie. Tell all your friends.
01:28:34
Speaker
And the it opens in fourth place the weekend. It comes out to three point four million dollars. In number one is a little movie called Sudden Impact, also new this week. That is John Claude Van Damme or Steven Seagal. Neither. That is Clint Eastwood and Dirty Harry.
01:29:00
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Oh, sudden impact. Yes, that's something is sudden death. Is that what we're thinking? Probably. I don't know. I don't know. All the Dirty Harry movies, the the titles are all different. Sudden death is to get them all. And that's what we are. I remember the dead. The Deadpool is the Dirty Harry. Yep.
01:29:21
Speaker
Jim Carrey's in that. He's a rock star. Then there's the other Deadpool, which is definitely not that. No.
01:29:32
Speaker
In second place, he has a little friend and he'd like you to say hello. It's Scarface, speaking of De Palma. That's that De Palma guy. Yeah, it's a De Palma guy. He made a carry. In third place, it's down from number one the weekend before. I think it's been in theaters for three weeks up to this point. The eventual best picture winner for 1983, Terms of Endearment, a little James L. Brooks joint there.
01:30:01
Speaker
And then fourth place, Christine, and in fifth place up from 18. So I'm guessing this is its wide release weekend in after having been out in limited release for four weekends. The Barbra Streisand film, Yentl. Oh, boy. Yeah, yeah. And then rounding out the top 10, we've got A Christmas Story at number six, The Big Chill at number seven. That's your boy. Larry Kasdan, yeah.
01:30:31
Speaker
Never Say Never Again in 8th place, the Sean Connery Bond movie Not by Eon. In 9th place, The Smurfs and the Magic Flute. And in 10th place, a little Tom Cruise film called All the Right Moves. Christine would go on to rank as, I want to say, 66th film of the year.
01:30:58
Speaker
earning a grand total in the year of its release of $11.7 million. It would go on to make, across all its theatrical runs, it would go on to make $21,200, and another $29,000 international. So really not the box office draw.
01:31:21
Speaker
Despite the fact that this ending of this movie absolutely leaves it open for sequels, we don't ever see one. What was the budget, Steven? The budget, I just closed that tab. You would ask me that. I'm so sorry. Okay, here we go. I thought it was included. Oh, battery's not included on this one. It looks like...
01:31:43
Speaker
Nope.
Multiple Cars in 'Christine' Production
01:31:45
Speaker
Nope. Not seeing it. No budget. Nope. That's amazing. They don't have it. It looks great for no budget. 10 million. Okay. 10. Okay. So then with, um, with, um, or with advertising and all that marketing, marketing, that's the word I'm looking for. They did not end up making that back for sure. Um, but yeah, the, uh, 15% of that budget, by the way, cars, just cars.
01:32:12
Speaker
And yeah, I think they went just that one car. I think they went through 20, 20 cars and only like two survived. Yeah. That's what I read too. You know, makes sense, which always like breaks my heart. Cause I'm like, Oh, all those cars. I mean, I know they're probably weren't all in great shape to begin with, but.
01:32:30
Speaker
Yeah, they had like a few that were like the show cars, like the ones where she just is looking pretty or getting driven around. And then there's the ones for just like some of the more scenes that require a little more driving or a little more action. And then there's the ones where she's just getting the shit kicked out of her. And those are the cars that are barely hanging on, barely run. We just need it for this shot kind of cars. Yeah.
01:32:59
Speaker
This is such a, I love looking at this. We were talking about just like kind of the early King film adaptations and it is like, God, that first run of films is just crazy. Yeah, Carrie, The Shining, Cujo, The Dead Zone, and then Christine. I mean, it's just solid. And like, I think that that's, you know, this just plays into that and just kind of showing everybody that like, oh, okay.
01:33:27
Speaker
Now we got to make every king thing ever, which is for better or worse. Which has been done. Yep. Every king thing ever. It's crazy that there's still some stuff that hasn't though. That's what's so funny yet. It's not done yet. He'll get there.
01:33:46
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Well, not in a feature capacity either, because there's a lot of a lot of student films do King adaptations because he famously will give you the rights for a dollar. Dollar babies. Yeah. Oh, he just ended that like a few weeks ago. Oh, really?
01:33:59
Speaker
Yeah. So there was a woman who has kind of like, that's been her job to handle like the legal part of it and to like kind of coordinate all of that. And she's been doing it for decades and she retired. And so now they're like, all right, dollar babies are done.
01:34:17
Speaker
It dies with her, I guess. I think it was just one of those things. And I guess like his lawyers obviously have been telling him for years, like, what the fuck are you doing, dude? Right. You can't just give this shit away. Yeah. So like for years, they've been just like, this is like, I mean, because obviously he doesn't make any money. It actually costs them a lot of money for legal side of things, like, and make, you know,
01:34:45
Speaker
monitoring and making sure all everything's like up to snuff and paying this woman right and so finally I think it was just like all right and he said I mean come on he's like almost 80 years old so it's like just just enjoy it just enjoy your time and just take a break and so all our babies are done.
Stephen King's Dollar Babies Initiative
01:35:02
Speaker
Well, I always appreciated that he did that though, cause he's really just encouraging like the next generation of filmmaker and just, and particularly now that filmmaking has become a lot easier. Everyone has a video, like a movie camera on their phone, on their person at all times. Like he's really just encouraging people to tell stories and to tell his stories in interesting ways. And I think he'd be the first one to admit, no, they're not all that good. In fact, most of them are pretty bad.
01:35:30
Speaker
But, you know, he's encouraging them to make stuff and to learn. And I don't know. I always admired that about him. And I'm sorry to see it go, but I'm glad it lasted as long as it did. I know. Such a unique thing about him. So now do the adaptations get more like hyper focused and better maybe as a whole because of that?
Challenges of Adapting King's Short Stories
01:35:53
Speaker
Well, yeah, TBD. I mean, we're going to see. Yeah, I will see. Right. I mean, there have been plenty of big budget studio adaptations of his work in the last, you know, 10, 20 years that have not panned out. At least he'll be making more money off of them. I think that at least we can say that.
01:36:11
Speaker
Like, I mean, some of the recent ones like the boogeyman, which just came out last year. I mean, that's based off of a short story, right? And so it's like, okay, how are you going to make a feature out of this like 20 some page short story? Some would argue that like, well, maybe that wasn't such a good idea.
01:36:27
Speaker
And so like sometimes it's like hard to flush out something like that or because it's like sometimes what do they say brevity is the soul of wit something I could learn but I haven't learned that yet but you know sometimes sometimes I think King understands that like this is just needs to be a short story but people make a whole feature film about this doesn't always necessarily work out right or let's take one book and I don't know let's expand it into three
01:36:58
Speaker
Yeah. Yes. Yeah. It's funny. He's kind of, he kind of goes either way sometimes. I'm like, I'm going to make this into an eight book series. That sounds like a great idea. Definitely can do that. Very simple concept and let's just expand it.
Review Scores and Film Opinions
01:37:14
Speaker
Tomatometer score on Christine is a 69%. Critics consensus. Nice. Nice. The cracks are starting to show in John Carpenter's directorial instincts disagree. But Christine is nonetheless silly zippy fun. Silly zippy? Look, the critics don't always get it right.
01:37:37
Speaker
Especially with Carpenter, it seems like. Yeah, that does seem to be the real consent. I'm honestly surprised Christine is that high, to be honest. It's a 57 on Metacritic, based on 10 critic reviews. 57? That's it? 57, I know, man. And then on Letterbox, it's a 3.5. This is a fine film. It is. That's more like it. I could get with that Letterbox score, for sure.
01:38:06
Speaker
Uh, Rachel, out of five stars, how do you, I don't think I need to ask this question, but I'm going to ask this question out of five stars. How do you rate John Carpenter's Stephen King's Christine or Stephen King's John Carpenter's Christine? Five, five stars. Five stars. I knew, I knew that's what it was going to be. And I've, yeah, it was five stars the first time I've seen it. I've seen a million more times and it's always, I'm always like, God, I love this movie.
01:38:37
Speaker
Is this the perfect film? Maybe. For me. That's all that matters.
Personal Reflections and Ratings for 'Christine'
01:38:45
Speaker
That's all that matters. Look, art is inherently subjective. And a perfect film means different things to different people. And I'm glad that this is a perfect film for you. I am. Thank you. Tucker, what do you rate Stephen King's John Carpenter's Christine?
01:39:04
Speaker
This is a solid three out of five for me. I really like this movie. I like it a lot. I don't know if it's something that's going to become a mainstay on the rotation, but I did have a really good time with it. And I love the carpenter of it all, even if I didn't think there was as much as there could have been in it. I still really, really solid. Really like this one.
01:39:25
Speaker
It was a three out of five for me the first time I watched it, but this time, I don't know, it hit this time. It hit real well. I'm giving it a four out of five this time. We're covering all our bases here. We are. Nice solid through line there. No, this film rips. I had a blast with it.
01:39:48
Speaker
I would like to see it again. I don't know when. Maybe in a couple years, I'll sit down with it again and reengage and maybe find some more stuff I didn't see in it the next time. But yeah, I am excited to get back into this one and maybe watch some more Carpenter movies. I don't know. It's starting to snow. I mean, the snow is here, so it might be time to watch the thing.
01:40:12
Speaker
Wait, have you not seen it? Have you seen anything? Oh, of course I have. The thing is like my favorite horror movie. Yeah. No, I love that thing. I thought I've heard you say that you have. OK, I just the way you said I was like, wait, you've not seen it. No, that's I watched all of Carpenter in 2020. And before that, I think the only king or the only carpenter I had seen was the thing and Halloween. All right. All right. So, Steven, your your favorite carpenter is the thing, obviously, obviously.
01:40:42
Speaker
And Rachel, yours is obviously Christine.
01:40:47
Speaker
Oh, wait, no, you said that might be different. Yeah, because like at the beginning of the podcast, you said this is one of my favorite movies. Right. It is. Oh, I do ask her. I did ask her her favorite carpenter earlier and she wrestled with it for a bad. I'm having a hard time committing, but just like I mean, because I love Halloween and I love the thing. I'm just like if I could own. OK, if I could only have one.
01:41:14
Speaker
Oh my gosh. And this is based just solely on me personally. This is not a statement or an indictment on the quality of the other films or their importance or their impact on the culture. Things you dust protest too much, Rachel. No, no. If I could never watch another film, I would probably take Christine.
01:41:37
Speaker
All right. No, okay. You don't you do not have anything to be embarrassed about that. No, you've over the course of the last hour and 40 minutes you have professed your love for Christine so that that is completely if I had to pick Christine or big trouble. That's a conversation for another day. It would be Christine for me.
01:41:59
Speaker
out of those two i like big trouble but christine i feel like is for me a little little more rewatchable oh see i think i think big trouble is imminently rewatchable i was like i love big trouble too as long as we follow big trouble with in little china and not just leave it at big trouble because then that's that really weird ass tim allen movie that like they had to like push back because of 9 11 and
Brief Discussion on 'Big Trouble' Movie
01:42:23
Speaker
Oh, God. I don't know what you're talking about. Oh, you don't you don't know. It was written by Dave Barry. It's got like. Oh, Dave Barry. It's Tim Allen. Did you guys ever watch that sitcom? Dave's World with Harry Anderson. Yeah, I saw all of that. And shadow Stevens and Vsauce Taylor from Designing Women. I love you, Shaq Taylor. You guys.
01:42:44
Speaker
Fucking A. Missing out. No big trouble. It's it's Tim Allen. It's like Jason Lee is in it. Oh, I forget who the female lead of it is. I feel like someone famous is also playing his daughter. I think Janine Garofalo is in there somewhere. Patrick Warburton, Dennis Farina. It's got a great cast, but it's not a good movie. You literally I've literally never heard of this and you could be making this up and I wouldn't know.
01:43:13
Speaker
I could be. You'll have to look it up and find out. I'll never know. There's no way I can find out. There's no way I'm going to look it up, so. There's no way.
Rachel's Podcast Involvements
01:43:24
Speaker
Rachel, it has been such an absolute pleasure having you on to talk, Christine. Thank you so much for being here. I honestly cannot thank you enough. This has been an absolute joy. Tell everybody, first of all, they should be tuning into this because you're on it. You shouldn't have to tell them where to find you, but just in case. Sure. Where can the people find you? What's going on on all of your shows? Just tell me everything.
01:43:52
Speaker
Sure, yeah, I'm still kinda sorta on Twitter at Vinyl Girl GRRL or Instagram at The Vinyl Girl. And yeah, on Halloweenies, we're getting ready to dive into just a minor franchise, no big deal, Alien.
01:44:10
Speaker
And so excited. We're a little like overwhelmed, but also like super excited and can't wait because we all are obsessed with that franchise. So it'll be a lot of fun. And then Losers Club. Yeah. Just kind of just finished covering the book. 11 22 63.
01:44:28
Speaker
So if anybody's a fan of that, we've got so many episodes and some supplementary episodes and some interviews with some experts on various related things about that book, The History and King. Yeah, it's just incredible.
01:44:43
Speaker
Uh, so that's been a lot of fun. And then on the girls on the boys, me and my friend, dear friend, Jen Adams, also from the losers club, uh, talk about, yeah, I love Jen. Um, talk about the Amazon prime series, the boys. So we are just diving into season three of that. And yeah, who knows by the time season four comes around, we'll probably be caught up. So if you're a boys fan, you can find that over on the anatomy of a scream pod squad feed.
01:45:10
Speaker
Are you doing are you doing Gen V as well or just the boys? Well, we're probably going to do Gen V, but it happens in between season three and season four. So we're gonna we haven't watched it yet. We're holding off because we want to watch it in chronological order. Okay, so you are going to do that before you get season for that.
01:45:29
Speaker
That's our plan. Yeah. Are you going to do like the animated stuff as well? Or no? No. Well, I don't know. We'll see if maybe if we get season four, maybe we'll drop that in as we go. But playing right now is just boys Gen V. And then yeah, we'll see where it goes from there. And are you planning on covering the comics at all?
01:45:49
Speaker
TBD. I mean, I would say you don't have to. Having read them, you don't have to. Yeah, as you say, we brought on some people like our friend Nicole Goble, who's also on Pod in the Pendulum. Yeah, she did our most recent Black Christmas episode. Yeah.
01:46:08
Speaker
She came on and did our season two recap episode and she has read the comics as well. So she gave us a lot of insight into that and some of the changes and at least in this part of the series and that. So she's been, she was great kind of illuminating us to some of the comic book differences from the characters and stuff. So yes. So sometimes we just bring on people who know more about the comics than we do. You don't have to worry about it, right? Take their word for it, yeah.
01:46:37
Speaker
That's a good call. That's a good call. That's it. Oh, wait, and then what am I talking about? And then the pod in the pendulum, we're also they're covering Frankenstein. Yeah, we're doing Frankenstein. I'm on the bride of Frankenstein episode that's dropping here in a couple of days. So, yeah. Oh, yeah. Definitely check out there because and then we've got a ton of fun stuff planned for the rest of the year, too. So all the pods, all the things. What was your franchise of choice that was on the wheel?
01:47:06
Speaker
Um, VHS. Oh, that's going to be fun. Yeah. So that'll be fun to do an anthology one. I've been bugging Mike to do Exorcist for years. So I'm just excited. We're finally going to do it. Just another, you know, no big deal. Yeah. Just, you know, minor trifle of a franchise, right? Nothing totemic about that at all. Nothing at all.
01:47:29
Speaker
Awesome. Rachel, thank you so much.
Promotion and Engagement with 'Disenfranchised' Podcast
01:47:31
Speaker
We need to have you back sooner than later. This has just been such a treat. Right on. Any car movie? All right. I'm going to pencil you in for Hobbs and Shaw. That's what I'm going to do. Oh, yeah. Any Fast and Furious, obsessed with that. If you want to cover the car, 1977. Ooh, OK. I know nothing about that at all. I'm going to dig into that one right on.
01:47:56
Speaker
Awesome. Thank you so much for being here. This show that you've been listening to is the disenfranchised podcast. And you can find us on pretty much any social media platform, mostly though Blue Sky, Instagram, Letterboxd and Facebook at disenfranchpod. Shoot us an email disenfranchpod at gmail.com. Let us know how we're doing.
01:48:21
Speaker
Or if there are any failed franchise starters you would like to see us cover, shoot us an email over there. We're actually covering two within the first half of this year. We are covering two oft requested ones from our mailbag. So those are coming very soon. One next month and then one in March. So I guess we're covering two in the first quarter.
01:48:44
Speaker
So we do get to those, some of them later than others, but we do get there. Disinfranchpod.gmail.com is where you can...
01:48:53
Speaker
Email us about that. I'm rambling now. It's late. I'm tired. The whiskey's starting to hit. Oh, no. Oh, no. Shoot on over to the Patreon, patreon.com slash disenfranch pod, where you can find for just five dollars a month, just hours, just hours of content behind that paywall. Maybe weeks. Days.
01:49:17
Speaker
including our weekly show, What Are We Watching, where we talk about the media that we've consumed over the course of the past week. Tucker and I did kind of solid two hours. The longest episode so far by six minutes. Honestly, it's longer than this episode. We did it, Tucker. We did an episode of What Are We Watching that's longer than the main feed episode. Fuck, finally.
01:49:38
Speaker
that you've been pushing for that forever. But that's, again, Patreon or patreon.com slash disenfranch pod. And while you're on the internet, or if you don't have the money, you can absolutely go to Apple podcast, Spotify, wherever you listen to us and leave us a five star rating and review, please. And thank you doesn't even have to be a lot. Just podcast. Good me likey.
01:50:00
Speaker
and we'll take it. As long as it comes with five stars, we'll absolutely take that. That goes a long way to helping us find more people like you to hear our dulcet tones. I'm your host, Steven Foxworthy. You can find me on Instagram, letterbox to blue sky at chewy walrus.
01:50:18
Speaker
the absent Brett Wright can be found on blue sky and instagram at sus underscore warlock and litter box as well sus underscore warlock or just sus warlock on blue sky. Tucker where can we find you these days?
01:50:32
Speaker
You can find me on YouTube and Instagram at ice909. That's I-C-E-N-I-N-E, the number zero and the number nine. And also, hey, speaking of like leaving reviews and stuff, like subscribe to our YouTube channel.
01:50:49
Speaker
I always forget that we're on YouTube. I always fucking forget that. Yes. Subscribe to our YouTube, please. Because sometimes, like, I don't know what happens, but the algorithm will shine upon us and we'll get a lot of views on something. And then the very next one is like one view. So, you know, if you if you already listen to the podcast all the time, subscribe to the YouTube just, you know, to if you want to help us out without giving us money for the Patreon.
01:51:18
Speaker
That's all. Also on Instagram is tuckmugs. That's tuck underscore mugs. Steven just did a guest mug. It was fabulous, which gave me time to sort of work on the two posts that I have brewing right now that I accumulated over the holiday break. Those are both guest mugs as well. One from Jimmy and one from my sister. So.
01:51:43
Speaker
It's pretty exciting. I'm pretty excited about it. And you guys should be too. Anybody that subscribes to tuck mugs on Instagram, like get ready. It's, it's coming. And if you have a mug that you want to see featured, just shoot an email to disenfranchpod at gmail.com with a picture or pictures of your mug and a description of how you got it, what it means to you and what's inside it. That's the format. That's it.
01:52:07
Speaker
Yeah. Join us on Tuckmucks. Do it. Do it now. And that's all we got. Good heavens. This has been so much fun. This has been our episode on Christine and the start of our three episode, Kingening, the drawing of three. Join us next week for another Stephen King failed the franchise starter.
01:52:28
Speaker
Um, until then I've been your host, Steven Foxworthy for my co-host Tucker, the absent Brett Wright, and our incredibly amazing guest, Rachel Reeves. Until next time. God, I hate rock and roll.
01:52:55
Speaker
you