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143. Being a Grief Ally- with Aly Bird
112 Plays2 years ago
Aly Bird is the author of Grief Ally; Helping People You Love Cope with Death, Loss and Grief. Since her husband’s untimely death, Aly Bird has poured her heart into helping those who feel helpless during an unexpected crisis. Her extensive study of grief psychology and culture, combined with her own devastating first-hand knowledge, led her to create a roadmap for the courageous and dedicated individuals who are willing to show up for the people they love with unconditional love, empowerment, and reverence. A speaker and workshop leader, Aly shows a clear path to those who have the courage to take on the vital role of being a grief ally.
Recognizing that there must be a change the way our culture handles grief, Aly is committed to building a support and educational network not only for the ones who have experienced an earth-shattering loss, but the people who are often overlooked: the griever’s loved ones and trusted support system. Aiding in her mission, Aly is currently pursuing a graduate degree in counselling psychology, and a career in grief therapy.
Learn more at https://www.alybird.com
Contact Kendra Rinaldi to be a guest or for coaching:
https://www.griefgratitudeandthegrayinbetween.com
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Transcript
Understanding Strengths in Grief Support
00:00:01
Speaker
I tell people in the book to reflect on what you're good at. If you are not someone who loves being in a kitchen and cooking and offering food, you have other skills, you have other assets and resources that you can put into helping someone and being there for them. Maybe you're a great note taker.
00:00:19
Speaker
Maybe, you know, you love animals and you're willing to walk the dog, but just be very in tune with your own personal process. Whether that means that you have, you know, your own therapy and you talk about it there, or you practice meditation or yoga. It's really important that you are aware of yourself first and making sure that you get your needs met so that you can be there for this person that you care about through the long haul.
Introduction to 'Grief, Gratitude, and the Gray in Between'
00:00:50
Speaker
Hello and welcome to Grief, Gratitude, and the Gray in Between podcast. This podcast is about exploring the grief that occurs at different times in our lives in which we have had major changes and transitions that literally shake us to the core and make us experience grief.
00:01:14
Speaker
I created this podcast for people to feel a little less hopeless and alone in their own grief process as they hear the stories of others who have had similar journeys. I'm Kendra Rinaldi, your host. Now, let's dive right in to today's episode.
00:01:35
Speaker
Welcome to today's episode.
Meet Allie Bird: Author of 'Grief Ally'
00:01:37
Speaker
I have Allie Bird with me today. She is a speaker, a coach, and an author. Her new book titled Grief Ally, Helping People You Love, Cope with Death, Loss, and Grief. And I'm so excited to have her on. We already warmed up our voices singing to each other right before we started recording.
00:01:59
Speaker
So I already know Ali's favorite song to warm her voice up to. So I'm excited to get to know you so well, Ali.
Allie's Canadian Roots and Adventurous Life
00:02:10
Speaker
Oh, thank you so much, Kendra. I am so excited to be here. Yes, to sing to each other to talk about anything. Yes. You know, it just it's always like good to break the ice and things. And even though we're going to be talking about heavy topic, right, which is the aspect of death and grief and how to be able to
00:02:31
Speaker
be an ally, which by the way, if I say ally instead of Ali, now you guys know why, because this play on words with her name and the name of her title of her book will get very confusing. But yes, and we'll be talking about all things, but let's talk a little bit about you. Let's find out where is it that you live. I picked up on the accent, so let's share with the audience where you live.
00:02:57
Speaker
I am Canadian and I live on Vancouver Island, which is on the west-west coast of Canada. Very wet tropical rainforest, mountains, ocean. Yes, that's where I am. Is this where you grew up? Is this where you grew up? No, I actually grew up in Ontario, outside of Toronto.
00:03:17
Speaker
Um, quite rurally, um, actually, yes. How long ago did you move to Vancouver? Yeah. When did you, uh, we, will and I, my husband, um, moved out here in 2016. So about six years. Okay. So then 2016 you moved there. Were you, were you already married at that time to, to will, when you moved or was it, it was, uh,
00:03:44
Speaker
No, we had known each other for about two years at that point. And I wanted to go on an adventure and his work moved him out here.
The Tragic Loss of Will and New Beginnings
00:03:52
Speaker
And yeah, the rest is history. Would you please share a little bit about you and Will and how you met? Yeah. Because he is the reason you wrote this book. He is. He was the love of my life. He remains the love of my life. So we met in 2014.
00:04:14
Speaker
I was recently single and I wanted to go on lots of dates and instead I bumped into Will and went on lots of dates with him.
00:04:28
Speaker
And yeah, I always say that he filled all the gaps that I never knew I had. Just had this zest for life that I hadn't witnessed in anyone and it was very attractive. His body was wicked as well. And that's certainly something I appreciated. But we really bonded over a love for adventure and outdoor sports.
00:04:54
Speaker
um so when he had the opportunity to to move out to the west coast i was like i i love you enough to to tag along and let's let's do this thing and uh yeah we moved to vancouver island and had this really beautiful outdoorsy rock climbing mountain biking hiking swimming uh
00:05:17
Speaker
Yeah, just really beautiful, adventurous lifestyle together. But that also was what took him from me. So Will died in a hiking accident at the end of 2019, completely unexpectedly. And that has sent me on this wild ride that is grief and living with unexpected loss.
00:05:45
Speaker
Yeah, you did mention the hiking, but I wasn't sure like what it was. So he was by himself when he went hiking. He was with a friend. He was with a friend. But I wasn't there. No. Here you are. Your life just changed drastically. 2019, the love of your life now, not by your side in the same way. And now you're having to...
00:06:07
Speaker
navigate life your life just kind of started to take different turns what were you what were you doing prior to that like in terms of studies and how did it now shift for you now even now studying psychology in the aspect of counseling and being able to also coach people through grief therapy yeah so I I
00:06:33
Speaker
I have an earlier degree in social planning and community development. So I was in that world, have always been very interested in people and helping people make the most of the lives that they have. Social justice, human rights, I'm all about it. So I was working on kind of like a community development level. And then when we moved out here, I started to get into
Cognitive Grieving and Writing 'Grief Ally'
00:07:01
Speaker
coaching. So I was working with,
00:07:03
Speaker
young people and helping them navigate life transitions, whether that was switching jobs, big moves. I know so strange. So already you were in the life transition space. That is crazy. Like you saw my mouth like as it went like that. Yeah. And I think, you know, I didn't really have a name for it at the time, but
00:07:34
Speaker
after Will's death being kind of thrown into this world of grief, all of a sudden having the language for what my clients were experiencing prior to that. Although it wasn't death-related loss, there was grief in those situations and those changes that they were experiencing. And as I was having my own grief experience,
00:07:58
Speaker
Um, I discovered that I was a very like cognitive greever. Like I was, it was happening more in my brain than my body through like an emotional expression. I was just like consumed with like, and what brought me relief is like, what is happening to me?
00:08:14
Speaker
You needed to understand the technicality of everything that was going on. Yes, the science and the biology. Interesting. Yes. So as I was doing that, I was like, oh, this is fascinating to me. And it's kind of sent me down a path of psychology, which is where I am now, studying counseling psychology, hoping to work.
00:08:36
Speaker
as a grief therapist in the near future and more specialized in like traumatic bereavement, which was my experience. But then also I am a problem-solving kind of greever and I noticed that there wasn't a resource for people who wanted to show up and help me. I have the smartest, most brilliant friends in the world and there wasn't a go-to resource for them.
00:09:00
Speaker
they were having to mine all these other books and articles and blogs that were written for people like me at the you know the epicenter of something tragic whereas like I didn't have the the the full brain capacity to kind of dive into that and then push that information outwards towards them and be like this is what I need you to do and this is how I need you to act and this is what I need you to say um
00:09:26
Speaker
And so I was like, I'm gonna, I'm gonna build something for them based on our own experience, which I had a really positive, like, you know, it was still terrible, but my friends never, never made me feel alienated or misunderstood or abandoned. They were right there making mistakes despite being afraid. So I took everything that we kind of learned as well as this, what is happening in my brain, in my body culturally,
Writing as a Connection to Will
00:09:55
Speaker
psychologically and built this tool which has become grief ally, my book, and I'm hoping that other people can can have
00:10:04
Speaker
the kind of experience that I have had in my grief. Not that it's not terrible and painful, but it's just a little bit better. No, you explained it. You summed it up so well. And what you explained in terms of the mental capacity of someone that's grieving of how were you going to be able to tell them what it is you needed? That is so
00:10:29
Speaker
important because a lot of times, for example, even this podcast is a tool, right? Yes. But can someone that's in that moment of grief, would listening to something be the right tool for them in that moment? Would reading something be the right tool for them in that moment that's on that topic, right, of grief and feeling that companionship?
00:10:50
Speaker
We don't know. Everybody's different into what it is that they can assimilate, but what our mind is able to capture in moments like that of trauma and when it's just so scattered brain with just so much. There's so much going on in that, not only emotionally, but mentally with everything that's changed in someone's life, particularly and also in the case of your life partner,
00:11:19
Speaker
there's so many things you have to decide closing bank accounts this xyz all these things that how were they would there be room to then also here's a black like you said here's a blog about how you can.
00:11:34
Speaker
Tell me if I want a chicken casserole or lasagna for lunch tomorrow. Exactly. So that is wonderful that now where you're kind of in another space in your life, you're able to now create this resource for others. So when did the writing process start? So the writing started very, very early, like literally like
00:12:00
Speaker
day one after Will died, someone told me, a dear friend who unfortunately has also passed away shortly after Will did, which was crazy. That's a lot. Yeah, she came over right after she got the news and she's like, they're gone, but you can still talk to them and you can write to them.
00:12:24
Speaker
And I was like, oh, okay. So like literally like that day, like I went to my bedroom and I just like, I started writing. And it was more of like free flow journaling, but journaling became kind of like a lifeline for me through those early, early days. And so Will died at the end of November. And by the end of February, I was like, I think I have an idea
00:12:53
Speaker
And I'm feeling very called to keep writing, but doing it in a more targeted way. And I think I have a book idea. So the book idea didn't become fully formed until probably, let's say like six months, eight months after Will died, but it happened very, very quickly. And yeah, I'll just reiterate that, yeah, it has been a lifeline. It is the thing that has kind of been like, if I can,
00:13:23
Speaker
I keep chipping away at it because it brings me joy. When it didn't bring me joy, I put it down and like let it breathe a little bit. But it was also like this kind of space that I carved out in my life where it was time on my own, but it was also time that I spent with Will and our memories and it was a way of kind of keeping
00:13:47
Speaker
Keeping that relationship growing rather than exclusively being something stagnant in the past that happened to me. It was, we were building this thing together from a really tragic place, but I really enjoyed that. And I still enjoy being able to talk about it because it is
Art as a Therapeutic Tool
00:14:06
Speaker
part of like the legacy of what we got to experience together.
00:14:13
Speaker
I love that because you touched on the fact of continuing this relationship and just how it is for you was through writing and continuing this bond. And that is something that for a lot of people that have someone that's died or transitioned or however we want to call this other, you know, change of reality that helps us
00:14:41
Speaker
It helps us keep on really like is having that connection and that it doesn't necessarily mean the end. It's just different. So you used writing as that way of continuing your your relationship with Will. So beautiful. The something that came to mind as you were talking and how writing, you know, how writing was something that came naturally and we were talking earlier about music.
00:15:09
Speaker
Can you tap into how the arts and how expression, not only for you, but also as you've coached other people that have gone through transitions, have played a part in a person's journey? And now that you're studying psychology, what have you learned about that aspect of expressing pain through the artistic way and that kind of navigating it that way?
00:15:38
Speaker
how that helps us in that journey. It's a loaded question. That's a lot of points. Take whatever chunk out of it. Take any little chunk of it. Yeah. I'll start just from my own personal experience that I
00:15:59
Speaker
I have never experienced such wild creativity as I have in the last three and a half years that Will has died through writing, through like fine arts. I'm making like big mixed media pieces. I'm like doodling and drawing and coloring. I colored so hard that I gave myself carpal tunnel in my hand after he died. And I think, uh,
00:16:28
Speaker
Grief is energy. If we look at it, it is the energy that is created when attachment changes. And that energy needs to be expressed, whether it is expressed through emotion,
00:16:50
Speaker
or through creation or through doing. And art is one of those really wild tools that offers expression in so many like emotional ways, in cognitive ways, like from like planning the project to like free flow, like doing things with your hands. It's just a great way to like tap into both like your head and your heart.
00:17:19
Speaker
and move through things that are
00:17:23
Speaker
confusing, difficult, joyous. Art is just something that's so powerful. And personally, I don't actually have a lot of experience in the psychology of art, but I can only imagine what the literature says. I can only speak to my own personal experience, and then also speaking with other people who are expressing their pain and their love through art as something very, very effective.
00:17:51
Speaker
when you said about the part about the last three years, your creativity just kind of bursting. I was like, you saw my expression because I feel that grief opens up this window of seeing life just differently. It's as if you put on these glasses and you see pain more, you see beauty more,
00:18:19
Speaker
Like, when I'd go out on walks of nature, I'm like, wow, the sky's so blue. Like, you notice things, your perception of life is just different. So at least, let me just put it again, like you said it, in my own experience, that's what I...
00:18:37
Speaker
I have witnessed personally in my in my grief journey and as you're sharing that the same like the arts I remember even in in middle school heartbreak right like you're talking about life transitions heartbreaker things like that that was grief that's when I would write poems songs yeah all these things were always in these moments of of grief
00:18:59
Speaker
Yeah. So most songs are about heartbreak, right? And I think for me too, it was like the art that I've created at least at like a tangible art. And I don't mean like the book itself or in writing. I mean more of like these like mixed media pieces. It's always trying to like demonstrate what
00:19:27
Speaker
what I am feeling. Like I'm trying to like paint a picture of what this feeling is. I'm trying to like give it some sort of representation. Exactly. Yes.
00:19:39
Speaker
It's so hard to put it into words, right? So then you're like, how? How do I get this out? Give me other tools. I love how you said the energy. It was Andrew Garfield once in an interview talking about his mom dying, how he said grief is love.
00:19:58
Speaker
that you just didn't get to express. And so how you talk about it in that energy, love is energy, grief is energy. So it's just that way of expressing. And so it's beautiful. Okay, now let's talk about the ways in which someone can be
What is a Grief Ally?
00:20:14
Speaker
an ally and how in your journey then you started then writing this book as part of your process and with this idea and what your friends had done to help you in your journey. What is it? Let's talk, what is a grief ally? Yeah, so I'd say a grief ally is someone who respects your unique experience of grief.
00:20:44
Speaker
offer unconditional love and empowerment so that you can move through grief in really the kind of easiest way possible. In a nutshell, that's a grief ally and it's a hard job.
00:21:02
Speaker
It's not something that anyone ever wishes to be in, but the reality is that one of the only guarantees in life that we have is that you will die, people die. And so it's really important that we equip ourselves with the tools that will enable us to help others when they inevitably experience grief.
00:21:28
Speaker
And one of the chapters you have is regarding taking care of yours in order to take care of someone. I'm not saying the exact name of the chapter, but it was in order to take care of someone else, you need to be able to also take care of yourself.
00:21:43
Speaker
in that process. So let's talk about the importance of self-care as you're also giving to others in their journey. And you mentioned about life transitions as you yourself haven't been a coach. This goes for anything. If someone, you can be a grief ally if somebody's going through a divorce, if someone's going through, there's many ways in which you're gonna be there for someone. If they're children left for college,
00:22:09
Speaker
And they're home alone now, and they're having to deal with that transition. You will be a grief ally for that person. So let's talk about the part of taking care of ourselves as we help someone navigate their grief. Yeah. So in the book, Grief Ally, every chapter starts with a guiding promise in the self-help chapter, the promises.
00:22:35
Speaker
I promise to take good care of myself so that I can take good care of you. And what that really means is, and what you have to understand about grief is that it is not a short term process. It is a long haul. And the reality is that you're always kind of going to feel something about a loss and taking care of yourself
00:23:01
Speaker
is important because this is an endurance sport. This isn't a sprint. And if you are not taking care of yourself, you will burn out. You will not be able to finish this race. And the reality is that your, your person, this person that you want to show up for needs you to be there through the long haul. It's not just the bring the lasagna after the funeral.
00:23:25
Speaker
send a card, send flowers, and then, you know, bang, bang, we're done. It's much more emotionally intimate and being present to a lot of pain and suffering possibly. And that's a difficult position to be in. So it's very important that you are aware of your own needs, aware of your own thoughts and feelings, and that you are seeking help when you need it.
00:23:51
Speaker
So you can't be everything for someone. I tell people in the book to, you know, reflect on what you're good at. If you are not someone who loves being in a kitchen and cooking and, and offering food, like you have other skills, you have other assets and resources that you can put into helping someone and being there for them. Maybe you're a great note taker. Maybe, you know, you love animals and you're willing to walk the dog.
00:24:17
Speaker
but just be very in tune with your own personal process. Whether that means that you have your own therapy and you talk about it there or you practice meditation or yoga, it's really important that you are aware of yourself first and making sure that you get your needs met so that you can be there for this person that you care about through the long haul.
00:24:40
Speaker
It is so valuable, everything you said, because you mentioned different ways in which someone can be an ally. It doesn't necessarily mean you have to be the one to listen to everything that they're going through emotionally. It could be that the way that you are able to show up is, like you said, white bee walking their dogs or any other way. Knowing your own strengths is important.
Self-Care for Grief Allies
00:25:06
Speaker
And in that process, when you're offering,
00:25:10
Speaker
to the person that's grieving, say, listen, I can come Tuesdays and Wednesdays. And these are the things I'm really good at and can help you with. I'm great at tidying up. Do you have any closets I can kind of go through? Or do you have, right? Or I'm great at walking the dog. Something specific. And I've learned that in this process of interviewing people, because I used to do the
00:25:37
Speaker
blanket thing. It was like, anything you need, I'm here. But just like you said, with a grief brain, you don't even know what you need. Right? Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And I think that it's important to also be mindful of the timeline as well. And it's not just that first few weeks.
00:25:59
Speaker
People, especially with a traumatic loss, like shock is a very real thing. I didn't really feel anything until six weeks after Will died. And at that point, that's when I was having this really intense like emotional waves. But by that point, the support had kind of weaned a little bit. And then I had to be more proactive in getting the help that I needed. Whereas if people understood that
00:26:29
Speaker
You know, grief is a long haul that if someone doesn't take you up on your offer, you know, week one, week two, that doesn't mean that they won't need it. Like follow up month two, month three, and see if you can offer support then.
00:26:47
Speaker
And what would be great, what would be a good way of following up? Let's say month two, would you send a text? Let's give some quick little tips like someone can do. Like, would you send a text saying, Hey, checking in on you, just letting you know, I'm thinking of you. Or like, what would be some ways in which someone could reach out to check in? Absolutely. I'll preface this with saying.
00:27:14
Speaker
Do not ask a specific question unless you have the capacity to be present with that person as they answer your question. So I think a lot of people, you know, reach out and be like, Hey, how are you? They're not okay. Let's just assume off the bat. They are not okay. And to assume that they will say they are okay, uh, is not fair. But also if they tell you they're real feelings, like you have to be prepared.
00:27:42
Speaker
to hear their real feelings. There were a couple of circumstances where people would reach out to me and be like, hey, how are you? And then I would answer their question honestly. And then they wouldn't respond for 24 hours, 48 hours. They wouldn't know what to do. Yeah, with that, I feel like the world is swallowing me whole. Exactly. And that would just silence them. Exactly.
00:28:08
Speaker
Um, so when we're reaching out, if you are going to ask the question, just be prepared. Like that's part of that self-care process, right? Like be mindful that you are entering this situation where the landscape is unstable and you don't know what you're going to expect. So if you are aware of that, that helps just off the bat. And then definitely like, say like you can reiterate the message that you sent at like week one, week two, being like, Hey, I'm still thinking about you. My offer of.
00:28:37
Speaker
coming to help you tidy up on Tuesdays and Wednesdays still stands. This offer is always open. Like, please let me know if I can help now. And is it okay? Or if they say yes or no, maybe they say no. Say, is it okay if I check in in another month? I think that's, it's really important to be like upfront and to take the
00:29:04
Speaker
Take the responsibility off the shoulders of the person who is at the, you know, that you're that you're trying to care for. Giving them the opportunity to reach out sure, but also say like, here is what I am willing to do for you. And here is the timeline that I am willing to do it.
00:29:22
Speaker
I think a lot of you hear the message like, you know, don't disappear as a, as a grief ally in someone in a support role, like don't disappear. But I think people have this idea that this timeline of grief is so short that they message like, you know, every two or three days for the first month. And then if the person that they're trying to help doesn't respond or isn't like taking advantage of their offers that like they're doing okay. And I would,
00:29:51
Speaker
argue that the complete opposite is probably true. Like in that first month, they are probably just trying to like stay alive, literally. And don't disappear. Like if they're not responding to you, maybe it's just the timeline that's wrong. It's not your offering. It's not you. It's literally- I don't take things personally. Exactly. They are doing the best they can.
00:30:17
Speaker
They are doing the best they can with the resources that they have at that moment. So like just revisit it a month down the road, two months, like even a year. I don't think like there is never a wrong time to reach out to someone and offer support in whatever capacity that you have it. The grief doesn't go away. It's always there. There are always things that are going to be hard.
00:30:44
Speaker
and acknowledging the loss, acknowledging how hard things can be, can be really, really powerful for someone who feels as though their loss is being forgotten. Because the loss being forgotten can make them feel as if their person is being forgotten as well. Exactly, yeah.
00:31:12
Speaker
I have like a great story. So this last fall was the three year anniversary of Will's death. And I spent a month in Palm Springs and I invited some people. We called it grief camp because November is traditionally a hard month for me. And Will was a member of the Canadian forces. So my friend and I, we went to the Veterans Day parade.
00:31:35
Speaker
in downtown Pop Springs. And she didn't know Will very well. But we watched the parade because I wanted to watch the parade. And it was a lovely extension of her being like, how can I support you in this tough month? And then as we were walking back to the car, she's like, oh, what would Will think of this parade? And just that simple question was the
00:32:01
Speaker
One of my greatest fears is that I am going to have to be the person who brings him up in conversation for the rest of my life. And the fact that she brought him up and the fact that she was willing to have a conversation about this day and him and how it impacted me was huge. Literally that simple question and the few sentences that followed, a simple question was so, so meaningful and it really just
00:32:31
Speaker
just brought me comfort and made that situation feel so much more ease in that because I wasn't the one carrying my loss. She helped me carry it in that moment. Now, what would Will have thought? Now, I want to know the answer. What did you answer? What would he have thought of that parade? Of the parade? Yes. To be honest, I don't think he would have liked it very much.
00:33:01
Speaker
Um, so in, in the States you have, um, veterans day, but in Canada we have remembrance day and the vibe of them is very, very different. No, it's on the same day. Okay. Okay. No, it's November 11th. 11th. Yeah. Um, in Canada, it's a very like solemn quiet morning. There are moments of silence. Names are read out. The last call is played on a trumpet and then everybody,
00:33:30
Speaker
then it becomes a party. If you are a person who wears a uniform, it was like Will's favorite day. You just go out and get drunk and reminisce about good times at the Legion. Veterans Day in the States starts as a celebration of your soldiers and your veterans. And it's just like the vibe was different. I think Will liked the somberness and that level of respect and recognition.
00:33:57
Speaker
Yeah, it was, it was interesting to, to now have experienced both. But yeah, the, the part of remembering the, you know, memories, I tend to do that with my kids. If they, they remember anything of their grandmother, my mom, you know, like, Oh, what is like a memory that you remember? Like, what is something, because what is something you remember that you used to do with her or, you know, things like that, just to keep it in the forefront of their,
00:34:22
Speaker
mind so that, yeah, those memories don't go away. I want to ask you about a memory. Tell us about one of your adventures with Will. What was one of those things that you guys tried together that you, yeah, your thrill seeker, adventurous partner and you tried. Oh, boy.
00:34:50
Speaker
It's a great question. Or which one's one that keeps coming up on your mind, like when you're thinking of your memories of the things that you guys did? There was one mountain that we were trying to climb and we had tried it in
00:35:11
Speaker
in August and didn't have time to make it to the summit, we had to turn around. And so we tried it again in September and we pulled up to the trailhead and I'm like getting my shoes on and Will has like opened the trunk of the car and he's like, oh no. And I was like, what? And he's like, I forgot my hiking boots. And I was like, oh. And I'm like, oh, we're gonna have to turn around.
00:35:37
Speaker
We'll just go home. We'll try again another day. And he's like, no, he's like, we are going to, we are going to do this. And I'm like, okay. And he's wearing like dad sandals, like, like the TV's with the Velcro. Um, and he's like, no, I'll just wear these. And I'm like, it's like, no, we're going to do this. Um, so he, he puts, he puts the socks on, puts on his TV's.
00:36:02
Speaker
And real dad look there. Oh yeah, classic, classic dad. And we, it was a journey of like, we hiked to a certain spot, we like camped, and then leave our stuff, summit, come back, collect our stuff, and then head back to the car. And we summited the peak at, I think it was like eight, 8 a.m. like the next day. And he's like capturing this video. He's like, check out my feed.
00:36:30
Speaker
And he did it. He climbed it and down sandals. His calves were destroyed for days afterwards. But yeah, he was. It's so stiff, right? It's stiff. There's no. Well, it's right. But also it doesn't have like a hiking boot has more ankle stability. So if you're carrying a pack on your on your back and the ground underneath you is unstable, that that ankle stability in a hiking boot is much more useful.
00:36:58
Speaker
than having to use all your stabilizer muscles in your lower limbs. But he was determined and we made it and yeah that was the kind of
00:37:11
Speaker
Um, go get them attitude that he had, like very little would stop him from achieving. That's the spark that attracted you. That's what you were like zest for life type of thing. Exactly. Yes. How are hikes for you now? What do hikes represent for you now? And yeah, what are they for you now? And how are they, how are they've been part of your journey of your grief journey? I, uh,
00:37:41
Speaker
It's funny because people early in your grief will be like, oh, go for a walk. Go cry at the trees. They don't care if you're crying. And to be very honest, it did not feel safe to be outside in big nature for two and a half years, honestly.
00:38:07
Speaker
And it's still, I haven't done anything big like that. I don't know if I will again, to be very honest. That was the thing that Will and I really, really bonded over. And to do it alone or to do it with someone else just doesn't feel right right now. And that's kind of been my go-to decision-making process through all of this. If it doesn't feel good, don't do it unless you really, really have to.
00:38:38
Speaker
Only recently, when I was in the desert, in the fall, I was able to do some hikes, but I just feel that the landscape is completely different. It's not a place that Will and I visited together, so it was something that I was able to do and make it my own. I also have a dog now, which is funny because Will would have never let me have a dog.
00:38:57
Speaker
I was already even picturing I was already even picturing you guys having dogs because a lot of outdoorsy. Yes, I have to myself but it's like you know that have these companions that go on them with on their walks and tracks and also now we also we enjoyed traveling a lot as well and it was harder to travel when you have a
00:39:22
Speaker
pop. Yeah, I have a wonderful sheep a doodle now who, you know, very much fills many of the needs that I have for for physical touch. Huge. They're the best. They're the best companions for grief. Oh, exactly. And she's also the like, when I'm outside, if I
00:39:45
Speaker
Um, I forget the, there's a psychological term for it, but as I'm out there and I am talking to her about, you know, Oh, be careful here. Like, okay, just step up here. Like, Oh, just a little further. Like there it's, it's kind of like, uh, I'm talking to myself, but I feel less crazy because I'm talking to my dog. Of course. Of course. I hear you and I've got doodles too. I have two doodles, not children, but I have two doodles too. Yeah. That's, they're just.
00:40:14
Speaker
They're so special. My six-year-old, she was really, because I got her, I say I, but we, it's a family dog, but I say I. It was my mom's birthday. That was our pickup, that was the day to pick her up. It was my mom's, and it was the first birthday since my mom had passed. So two months after my mom died, that was our pickup day for Evie.
00:40:41
Speaker
So she was literally like my little therapy dog, you know, from that, like, yeah, so that's, that's so funny that you mentioned that because I renegade renegade is my dog's name. I so it was peak COVID. So puppies were very expensive.
00:41:00
Speaker
And I had this, I, so I'd made it a year with Will being gone and I have a cat as well. And the cat was so sweet, but it was a big workload for my sweet little cat. So I finally decided like, okay, I'm going to get a dog. I'm going to do this. But it was also a big, you know, it's a big commitment to get a puppy.
00:41:19
Speaker
And so my birthday is in January. I'm like, I will put my name on a wait list for my birthday as a birthday gift to myself. If I end up not getting a puppy, it was a birthday gift. No worries. I can just let those, those funds go. Um, but the night before my birthday, I'm like looking for like the right breeder. One of them just happens to have one puppy left and they're like, you can pick the puppy up on Valentine's day.
00:41:44
Speaker
And I was like, oh my goodness. And I was not a Valentine's Day person. Will brought me into the Valentine's world. He always spoiled me. He was so, so generous and so sweet. And I was like, oh my goodness. And his birthday is also the week of Valentine's Day. So it was just like, you know what? The stars are aligning. Like this puppy is meant to be with me. And it's probably one of the best decisions that I ever made.
00:42:11
Speaker
in terms of my own mental health is, yeah, she's just the best. Oh, so it's a good, Renegade, I like, it's a girl, she has a really powerful name with Renegade. She does, yes. I love it. Yeah, the process of grief, as you were talking about your hikes, I also,
00:42:35
Speaker
just thought of the trauma that could be associated as well with the part of hiking, too, if that ended up playing a part, not only because you would used to hike with him, but if that's what the way that his life ended, I would assume that that could and we shouldn't make assumptions, but that that could be a big part of that, too, because trauma can stay with us without even
00:43:01
Speaker
knowing and I recently was watching a TV show that had to do with an airplane accident and survival. It's like a new thing. If anybody wants to cry a lot, go watch Dear Edward on Apple.
00:43:17
Speaker
Oh, I've read the book. Oh my gosh. So I had friends that died in an airplane accident in 1996, 95.
Triggers and Memories in Grief
00:43:28
Speaker
Sorry, my sister died in 1996, 95. And so I did not, first episode of that, and I'm sitting here, my husband's kind of like, what is going on? And I'm just bawling. And I was like, I did not realize.
00:43:40
Speaker
how much I still have in in me from that. So, yeah, the hiking component in your trauma that could tie in as well, right? One hundred percent. And I'm not saying that it like I early on, I was like adamant that like hiking still had to be part of my life. And I did the like the EMDR therapy to like, you know, move through some things. Yeah.
00:44:10
Speaker
And because I haven't done anything of that caliber yet, it hasn't come up, but I've kind of settled into like the mindset that like I don't have to do it if I don't want to. And I think early on I
00:44:27
Speaker
I had this mindset that I had to do it. That would be the only way of maintaining a connection with Will, and that Will would want me to continue doing these big hikes. And I have no doubt that he would probably want me to do those things, but also Will is not the boss of my grief, and Will doesn't know what it's like to live
00:44:49
Speaker
in a reality where he doesn't exist so I get to make the rules here and if I want to do that hike one day I will put in the work to make it happen but right now I don't have to do that if I don't want to.
00:45:03
Speaker
You touched on something there regarding the having to or these expectations that we put on ourselves based on what either others tell us, but he wouldn't want you to be sad. He wouldn't want you to be. So let's go into a little bit about that aspect of the mistakes as a grief ally that we might do, which might come into these kinds of things that we might say.
00:45:29
Speaker
And how we're not superheroes, as you say. So we're going to make mistakes when we're human beings. We're going to make mistakes as we're supporting someone. We might say things that would not be the right thing to say, but how we can still dust off and carry on in that allyship. How does it say allyship? Allyship. Allyship. Allyship.
00:45:56
Speaker
I'm sorry, I've created something. I'm like, ah, it's really cool. Allyship. Wait, how do I say that? Allyship. So let's share with us about that for our listeners, please. Yeah. So I think, and I teach this in the book, the important thing to remember is that if you are willing to show up as a grief ally, you will make mistakes.
00:46:24
Speaker
There is no getting around it. Grief is too unique to every individual that even if you have been in a grief support role before, you will not be able to apply the same lessons to this new person that you are trying to support.
00:46:41
Speaker
And so I say, let's change up the mindset. If you are not making mistakes, that means you are not doing grief allyship right.
Learning from Mistakes as a Grief Ally
00:46:51
Speaker
It means that you are not close enough. But if you are close and you are making mistakes, you are doing grief allyship right. And the great thing about making mistakes is that they can be recovered from if you have a strategic plan for how to do that. And I teach that in the book about how to recover from those mistakes.
00:47:07
Speaker
First thing is like get off the shame and blame emotional roller coaster that that happens when we do make mistakes Whether you do that with like an affirmation That's like simple as like I am here because I care and I make mistakes and that's okay Or you can talk to somebody else and just be like, oh my gosh I did this thing and I can't believe I did it and I just need to talk about it So first do that
00:47:31
Speaker
second circle back circle back to the person which takes some courage um but say like hey i'm like feeling weird about when i did this or i said this um did it feel weird like an uncomfortable for you too and that if you have followed the steps in the book about empowering the person to
00:47:52
Speaker
to do what it is that is best for them in their grief. If you are respecting their grief journey, if you are loving them unconditionally and they know all those things, like hopefully they have enough courage themselves to be like, yeah, yeah, that did make me make me feel a little bit uncomfortable.
00:48:08
Speaker
And then you just apologize. You know, there are different ways to apologize, but you know, like it's really, really simple. Just be like, yeah, I, I made a mistake and I'm, I'm sorry. And I all up for that and I'll learn from this. And then you can kind of both go on, on your way. And I think people get caught up in the misconception that if you make a mistake, you will be rejected. And I, I believe that the,
00:48:37
Speaker
the reality is the complete opposite. That when you own up to making mistakes and you apologize for them, that you're actually creating a stronger bond with that person that you're trying to support because you have more of an open and honest relationship. And that's kind of what we're all striving for as human beings. Don't be afraid to make mistakes and know that you can recover from them. And it's not the end of the world. It's not going to end your relationship with that person.
00:49:07
Speaker
really, really, really screw up to be rejected. I really don't think that's going to happen if you follow those steps. Those are awesome, because it is so true. A lot of times, now, that takes being intuitive, too, to be able to know and read a situation, to know that you might have made a mistake, because that's one thing, too, because you might not know. It's true. You might not know, but I think also,
00:49:36
Speaker
If you are practicing your own self care, which is step number one as a grief ally, right? Like being self-aware of what is happening like within your body, you know when it, and it's, it doesn't have to be like a blatant, like, Oh, it was very obvious that I screwed up. Like it just has to feel like a little bit uncomfortable and be like, Oh, that was, that was a little weird. That was a little weird.
00:50:03
Speaker
A little bit awkward. Yeah. And like when when you see the reaction or how you if you felt or when you're sensing the reaction of the person you're supporting that it just like she she didn't quite respond right. Maybe that was not the right.
00:50:21
Speaker
thing to say and owning up to it instead of sweeping it under the rug. Exactly. Yeah. Like I have, you know, my best friend like sent me like an Instagram account, like probably like around like month five or six. And she's like, Oh, I found this widowed, widow's Instagram account. What do you think? And I'm like, she's like, Oh, you didn't like it. And I was like, no, she's like, Oh, okay. Sorry. My bad. Won't happen again. I won't send you anymore. And I'm like, cool. Thanks. And we're cool. We're good.
00:50:51
Speaker
Um, yeah, it doesn't have to be, you know, the, there are all, there are so many like micro moments for learning what someone, what it will be useful to someone, um, in their grief. It's just a matter of, of being willing to listen and to watch for those things as well.
00:51:17
Speaker
You've given so many, so many different tips and insights and thank you also for sharing your own story. I think that really the listeners are going to be able to relate to you and be able to grab this book and know that this is coming from someone
00:51:35
Speaker
who had this happen to them and what really helped you. So I appreciate you so much, Ali, for sharing that. Ali, is there anything I have not asked you that you'd want to make sure the listeners know and then afterwards we'll say how they can grab the book? Anything that you want to leave for the listeners? I think it's really important
00:52:05
Speaker
that folks know that in grief, you know, there's a lot of emotions running high constantly. And I think the best thing that anybody can do, whether it's a person who is grieving in the midst of their grief or someone in a grief ally role, is just let's just all work from the same assumption that people are doing the best that they can with the resources that
About the Book 'Grief Ally'
00:52:29
Speaker
they have.
00:52:30
Speaker
Nothing out there is malicious or an attempt to really hurt someone else. We are all just doing our best with some imaginable circumstances. Let's just all be really kind to your mother. Thank you so much. Allie, let's talk about how people can get your book and who should get your book.
00:52:57
Speaker
I think everybody should, because as you said, everybody's going to have to support someone in their grief journey. So how can they get it? And yeah, I'll make sure to include that in the show notes. Beautiful. So the book is called Grief Ally, helping people you love cope with death loss and grief, and you can buy it wherever
00:53:18
Speaker
you want to buy your books. It's available in paperback as an ebook and an audiobook so in any format that you want to take in that information. It's good for when you know you get the news that something bad has happened but it would also be a great book just to have on your shelf for when that moment does come.
00:53:40
Speaker
And if you want to connect with me, you can find me on my website alibird.com or on social media at the alibird.
00:53:49
Speaker
Thank you once again. This was Allie Bird with us on the podcast. Grateful for you, grateful for Will for being also in your life and inspiring now this artistic expression in you to now have a tool for others to help them in their own journey as they become allies of others that have dealt with their own grief. So thank you. Thank you, Kendra. It was lovely to chat with you.
00:54:26
Speaker
Thank you again so much for choosing to listen today. I hope that you can take away a few nuggets from today's episode that can bring you comfort in your times of grief. If so, it would mean so much to me if you would rate and comment on this episode. And if you feel inspired in some way to share it with someone who may need to hear this, please do so.
00:54:54
Speaker
Also, if you or someone you know has a story of grief and gratitude that should be shared so that others can be inspired as well, please reach out to me. And thanks once again for tuning into Grief Gratitude and the Gray in Between podcast. Have a beautiful day.