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SIPA Paranormal Chronicles S1 E17 - Kate Rae - Creative author, Fae researcher, speaker, teacher, writer
9 Plays9 hours ago
This week i speak too Kate Rae, Kate is fascinated with the world of Fairies, Faeries and the Fae, and we talk about Non-human Entities, Elementals, Changlings, the Classification of Fairies and much much more
Definitely an eye opening episode, if all you thought you dealing with was Ghosts and spirits
Recommended
Transcript
Intro
Introduction to SIPA Paranormal Chronicles
00:00:12
Lee Hatfield
Hello, everybody, and welcome to another episode of SIPA Paranormal Chronicles. Today, after much, much, much technical issues, I'm glad to say I finally have kate Ray.
00:00:26
Lee Hatfield
Kate, welcome.
00:00:27
Kate Ray
Thank you. Yeah, we we have been trying. The fairies have not been on our side this evening. and
00:00:34
Lee Hatfield
They definitely haven't. It's taken us over an hour to log into this podcast. like Someone's playing them up with us, but we're not quite sure who it is.
Meet Kate Ray: Paranormal Investigator
00:00:43
Lee Hatfield
So, Katie, if you can just tell us a little bit about yourself first before we get into the episode.
00:00:48
Kate Ray
Yeah, I am a, well, I class myself as a paranormal investigator, researcher, writer, podcaster and public speaker. I'm also a published author. I write for Haunted Magazine.
00:01:01
Kate Ray
and I'm part of ah ah GPE, which is Ghostfinder Paranormal Events, which i'm very proud to be part of that team, as it's International Paranormal Day today. So i that's ah that's a top one.
00:01:17
Kate Ray
I'm jack of all all trades, master of none, better than being master of one, I think is ah is in a nutshell.
Facing Fears: From Childhood to Passion
00:01:26
Lee Hatfield
Perfect. So how did you first get involved with the paranormal?
00:01:30
Kate Ray
oh so i this is a really potted, very quick history because it goes way back. I was chatting with my mum a couple of days ago, in fact, and she recounted that I'd had paranormal experiences when I was about three years old.
00:01:48
Kate Ray
And I think it was that age that it absolutely terrified me so much that I shut down from it and I didn't want anything to do with it. Fast forward.
00:01:59
Kate Ray
I'd always been interested in supernatural, you know, anything anything weird, but i steered clear of ghosts. I had an insane phobia of poltergeist activity. Absolutely, absolutely petrified me.
00:02:16
Kate Ray
And I decided on a certain significant birthday, I shouldn't tell you which one it was because I don't want to give my age away, being a lady and all that. It was 21.
00:02:25
Lee Hatfield
twenty one
00:02:25
Kate Ray
Yeah.
00:02:26
Kate Ray
twenty it was twenty one i
00:02:26
Lee Hatfield
twenty two on
00:02:28
Lee Hatfield
yeah
00:02:29
Kate Ray
um um i i was I challenged myself to make a ah ah mark on that birthday. you And I was discussing it with my brother and said, you know, I want to do something significant.
00:02:41
Kate Ray
And he said, well, why don't you do something that scares you? You know, bungee jumping or swimming with sharks or, you know, that kind of fear fear-based activity.
00:02:54
Kate Ray
and I just said, hey can you see me bungee jumping? You know, that doesn't even, yeah, it scares me, but it's not not something I want to do. So he said, well, what really scares you? And I said, poltergeists.
00:03:07
Kate Ray
So we kind of sat there thinking about how we could do that, you know. So I decided to go on a ghost hunt on my own with a team.
00:03:17
Kate Ray
But it was a weekend in a very haunted castle. And I went in there petrified and came out there feeling like a hero. i was a warrior of the paranormal after that weekend.
Joining the Ghost Hunting World
00:03:29
Kate Ray
So from there on in, the universe just literally gave me in bucket load of opportunities. I joined within a couple of weeks, ah ah local ghost hunting team.
00:03:42
Kate Ray
And I started going on Barry Guy's events. I had a friend who was part of the team. And I'd been on two, I think. And by the third one, he said, would you like to join the team?
00:03:54
Kate Ray
He threw me straight in at the deep end and asked me to hold a seance with 60 odd people in a very, very haunted location.
00:04:01
Lee Hatfield
wow
00:04:03
Kate Ray
And and that that is in a nutshell how I kind of got into it. I said to the universe, I'm open to this. I want to face this. And years later, it's it's become a massive part of my life.
00:04:17
Lee Hatfield
And it's interesting that you see that because I noticed that there's two different teams. There's team i want to go out and get scared or this team I want to investigate to see if it's all real.
00:04:26
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:04:28
Kate Ray
yes
00:04:31
Lee Hatfield
So, yeah, I can see where you're coming from on that because can actually relate to what you've just said, because a few years ago I refused to watch any paranormal TV shows.
00:04:44
Lee Hatfield
I don't know what it was. I didn't have any previous inkling that there was anything out there. I just did not like watching them.
00:04:55
Lee Hatfield
But since over the last couple of years and I've got involved with paranormal teams, I watch every single one of them. And then I go, yeah, that's not real. That's not real.
00:05:04
Kate Ray
Yeah.
00:05:05
Lee Hatfield
That's not real. So how, like for your very first investigation, What was going through your mind? ah ah At what point did you realize that I'm no longer scared with this?
00:05:20
Lee Hatfield
I'm going to move forward and like take it all in.
00:05:23
Kate Ray
Well, that that weekend wasn't the very first investigation. I'll briefly tell you about the very first one that I went on. And I was duped into it and it it compounded my fear to a petrifying stage.
00:05:37
Kate Ray
and I ah got a phone call from my cousin. It was probably about three o'clock in the afternoon. She said, we're all booked on this event to go to a place ghost hunting.
00:05:49
Kate Ray
She just discovered she was pregnant and couldn't go because the insurance of the ghost hunting team didn't cover her pregnancy. Would I like to take her place? I didn't have anything to do. So stupidly said yes.
00:06:02
Kate Ray
And as as we were driving to that location, i said, so where are we going? I had no idea. And I think it was Coventry Guild Hall. it was It was one of the famous guild halls. Now, I had in my mind, I had seen the photograph, very famous photograph of a lot of councillors, black and white, lot of councillors sat around a massive table in a banqueting hall within a guild hall.
00:06:28
Kate Ray
And behind them is a very clear Knights Templar apparition.
00:06:34
Kate Ray
And I when they said where we were going, I said, pull over near a
00:06:35
Lee Hatfield
wow
Parapsychology and Fairies: A Unique Path
00:06:38
Kate Ray
service station, pull over. I'm getting out. And they wouldn't. And I spent that night absolutely petrified, literally clinging on to anybody who stood next to me.
00:06:50
Kate Ray
So fast forward to the one where I decided to face my fear. Similar thing happened. i pulled up. It was a. It was St Breville's Castle, which is it it's not a true castle. It's a ah ah place where I think armoury was was stored.
00:07:06
Kate Ray
So it's not a a massive place. So I pulled up and I sat in the car park thinking, can don't go in. Just don't do it, Kate. Just don't do it. And these two absolutely lovely ladies pulled up beside me in the car and rolled the window down and said,
00:07:22
Kate Ray
are you here for the investigation? And I said, yes, I'm here for the investigation. And they said, have you got any alcohol?
00:07:29
Kate Ray
And I said, no, I haven't. They're like, well, we have, we're not going. It was their first investigation as well. So we all felt like we were going into, you know, team scared together.
00:07:39
Kate Ray
And the investigation, I think on the first night was fairly quiet, but I'd heard stories. I was actually stopping in one of the bunk rooms that's called the hanging room. Now, each of the rooms has a certain tale to it in terms of ghostly activity.
00:07:55
Kate Ray
And the hanging room, one of the rumours is that people, I think, if I remember rightly, people get their hair tied to the bedstead in the middle of the night and see the apparition.
00:08:06
Lee Hatfield
I would i'd have a problem with that.
00:08:08
Kate Ray
I know.
00:08:08
Lee Hatfield
actually
00:08:10
Kate Ray
So this is this is me on night one. I literally had, I was the last person to bed, bizarrely enough. And I got into bed and I know put a hat on so nothing could touch my hair.
00:08:22
Kate Ray
I had earplugs in so I couldn't hear anything. And I had an eye mask on so I couldn't see anything. And I lay there like a wooden plank, totally awake for the entire night. And when you've lay in that kind of scared sense of things, you get so stiff the next morning. I was aching so badly.
00:08:44
Kate Ray
And the next day i thought, this, you know, i can't do this anymore. and And suddenly the the evening after I just found I found ah ah found my own my heroic side and and just went for it and thought, you know, this is what I'm here for.
00:09:03
Kate Ray
I can't have another night laying there like a plank of wood.
00:09:09
Lee Hatfield
aye I so have to come out on investigation with you because I think it's going to be ah ah it's going to be hilarious.
00:09:13
Kate Ray
Yeah.
00:09:16
Lee Hatfield
So how how did you transform from being that scared individual going to investigations to getting your knowledge about the subject we want to talk about today, fairies?
00:09:32
Kate Ray
Yeah. So the the fairies, I'll put i'll put on the back burner for a minute because the fairies have always been my life. This is pre pre-dating the whole ghost hunting thing.
00:09:45
Kate Ray
So how that that evolved was, like i said, I joined a very small local group of ghost hunters. I was gifted to to go and be on the team with Barry Guy. And during that time, in a very intense period of time of about two years, I decided that if I was going to do this and it was being offered up by the universe, then I was going to learn everything I possibly could and in ah in a very short so space of time.
00:10:13
Kate Ray
So I would go out with other teams to get um um investigation knowledge. I did a parapsychology course up to a certain level. Any course that was coming up, whether it be mediumship, I went to spiritual circles. I literally went to anything that was connected. I went to see platform mediums to see how they worked and and and just absorbed as much.
00:10:36
Kate Ray
I mean, you never stop learning in this game, do you? You never, ever stop. But I would...
00:10:41
Lee Hatfield
True.
00:10:41
Kate Ray
A very short space of time, I was learning Kabbalah. I was learning all kinds of different spiritual pathways. was really immersing myself in everything that I possibly could.
00:10:52
Kate Ray
And the two worlds collided, the the fairy world and the ghost hunting world, collided when I was doing mediumship training. Now, I am probably the world's shittest medium. i'm I'm just, excuse my language, I am rubbish.
00:11:09
Kate Ray
I am rubbish. i But I thought I'll i'll train. i'll I'll give this this a go. i must put a caveat on that. I'm i'm a rubbish medium, but i i I was able to really skill up on my psychic ability. So the two the two are in slightly different quarters and where other people, when they were developing their mediumship, were seeing spirits of the dead and then, you know, I'll move them onto the light and all all that jazz.
00:11:37
Kate Ray
I was seeing creatures, beings and that were not human and were not of what I would deem a demonic you know entity they they they were definitely something other now when I first got into really got into fairy lore folklore and was probably my very very early teens late late sort of childhood early teens and I was always disgruntled about
00:12:11
Kate Ray
children's books and children's tv portraying fairies it didn't sit right with me it looked wrong it felt wrong and I discovered the work of Brian Froud and Brian and Wendy Froud both were concept artists on the labyrinth and on the dark crystal movies and Brian's work just it was like a light bulb moment that somebody saw them in the same way that I did that they were animistic they were of the land they were gnarly they were they were You know, humanoid to some extent, but something very, very different to the Tinkerbells that we'd seen.
00:12:47
Kate Ray
So as practising mediumship, this is what I was seeing. This is what I was getting. And it eventually got me kicked out of um out of my mediumship course because apparently I was frightening people.
00:13:03
Kate Ray
Because that was I was saying I was seeing these things. Which it really devastated me the time, really devastated me at the time that I was asked to leave because I felt like these things were real more real to me than seeing the spirits of the dead because they traverse in in the world. And I'm sure we'll talk about that.
Exploring Fairy Folklore
00:13:23
Kate Ray
But it wasn't until I went on a very early investigation with Ghostfinder Paranormal Events. And i we have the opportunity to go to some incredibly haunted spaces.
00:13:37
Kate Ray
And these are places that I've not been to before. So i would give them a psychic scan, if you like, and i would go into the building way before any guests turned up.
00:13:49
Kate Ray
And I could wander around the building, usually with a historian or somebody who knew the building, and see what I could pick up. And we're in this one particular building and we'd gone up into the attic and I psychically saw these three...
00:14:04
Kate Ray
i probably about four, four and a half foot beings um that were kind of had tufts of fur all over them, sort of big nose. And they were swinging like monkeys in the rafters and they wouldn't go. and they were literally giving me images of the haunting activity that they were producing within the property, which I got verified from the historian.
00:14:31
Kate Ray
Now, I turned to my colleague at the time and said, He said, are you picking anything up? And I said, yes. And i didn't want to tell him. And I told him I didn't want to tell him. And he said, what are you seeing?
00:14:43
Kate Ray
And I told him, describe what I'm seeing. And I said, these are from the fairy realm. You can imagine the ridicule that I got. You can imagine whole, you know, this isn't real. And the whole piss take that took place, you know, for months, I think, after.
00:15:03
Kate Ray
Fortunately, Barry took me very seriously and was very interested in these other beings that that fell into this fairy realm.
00:15:14
Kate Ray
And he's been incredibly supportive of my work and also his increasing knowledge of these things often tie in with haunted properties and haunted activity.
00:15:29
Kate Ray
So that was the moment the two worlds collided. And from there on in, I almost, i i'm I'm used by the fairies. I became this advocate, if you like, for this slightly darker side of the fairy realm i that I can see them, I can interact. it And when I say see them, I see them more on a psychic level.
00:15:51
Kate Ray
I can interact with them on a psychic level. And they use that to that to their advantage. You know, they want to tell their story and their side of things. Sounds crazy, doesn't it?
00:16:01
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, because, yeah, and like, yeah, I've been speaking to you for about 20 minutes. And I now know, no, you're crazy. but But seriously, like, I'm, the fact that you said a few minutes ago that you wanted to learn everything, I'm exactly the same.
00:16:18
Lee Hatfield
So in my group, I'm called The Brains, because I've done a demonology course, I've done a poltergeist course, and I'm actually teaching a course on paranormal equipment for the company that I started doing the courses with.
00:16:19
Kate Ray
Yes. Mm-hmm.
00:16:27
Kate Ray
yes
00:16:32
Lee Hatfield
So when I decided to do a podcast, you you type you Google paranormal and it comes with so so many different subsections. I thought, right, I want to cover everything.
00:16:43
Lee Hatfield
With so many podcasts, we'll just cover UFOs or they'll just cover ghosts or spirits. But I want to but and wanted people to learn. about everything, hence why you and I got in touch.
00:16:55
Lee Hatfield
Well, I got in touch with you then you responded, but hey.
00:16:57
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm.
00:16:59
Lee Hatfield
And then like this is how it's grown from then on in. So the fact that you can spiritually see these entities, for want of an easier easy word, was there a point, though, that you actually thought to yourself,
00:17:16
Lee Hatfield
Am I normal? I don't mean that in a derogatory way. It's sort of like, yeah, do I need to go and see a doctor kind of thing? Or did you did it come more of a natural thing that you understood what it was straight away and you knew that you wasn't going to come to any harm?
00:17:34
Lee Hatfield
Or did you think there was something wrong with you like mentally, for just for example?
00:17:40
Kate Ray
i never quite I never questioned that. and And the reason why I never questioned my own mental stability. Yes, I am mental, but in a good way.
00:17:51
Kate Ray
But I've never questioned that. I've never had a doubt about that because the way that the images come to me and the snippets of verification that I get of what I'm seeing ah ah When you're doing in any kind of mediumship, when you're when you're doing any kind of psychic work, the only blocker that you have is doubt.
00:18:13
Kate Ray
And when you start doubting yourself, you start putting logic into play. And when you start putting logic into play, you can't do it. You can't do the searching. It works on it on on a different different white wavelength.
00:18:26
Kate Ray
Just before I got kicked out of and my mediumship sessions, was quite close friends with ah ah with a lot of people in the circle. And at the end of one of the sessions, I had just finished writing an article that day for Haunted magazine about fairies and fairies in a haunted environment.
00:18:48
Kate Ray
And at the end of it, I'd done a section about how you can ward off fairies, how you can protect yourself and how you can banish them. Now, that section, when I wrote it, I felt uneasy about it, but decided it was all part and parcel of what i was writing.
00:19:05
Lee Hatfield
please
00:19:06
Kate Ray
So fast forward and standing outside a spiritual circle after and after the mediumship ah session, we were all stood in a circle and there was a ah copse of trees behind, so a ah ah tree line behind me.
00:19:20
Kate Ray
And we were just chatting. It was dark. there was ah ah There was a light on just above us, so. And we heard this almighty crashing sound coming through the woods like somebody was running at full pelt.
00:19:33
Kate Ray
Now, this is going to sound crazy, absolutely crazy, but this is one of those verification moments that became more of a verification to to me. The next thing I knew, I'd braced myself forward because I felt like somebody was going to jump on my back.
00:19:49
Kate Ray
And I felt like a bird had got stuck in my hair. So it was flapping about. And I bent down and as I bent down, a load of soil came out of my mouth.
00:20:00
Kate Ray
Do you know how insane that sounds?
00:20:03
Kate Ray
How insane that sounds. If that had happened to me without several other witnesses, i would never have I would never tell that tale. Everybody around me, when I lifted my head up and I was still pulling soil from my mouth, I looked round and this is probably one of the reasons why I got kicked out.
00:20:03
Lee Hatfield
so
00:20:18
Lee Hatfield
Thank you.
00:20:21
Kate Ray
Everybody looked petrified, absolutely petrified. They saw me spitting this and they heard it and they heard the wings beating on my head and they saw me spitting this dirt.
00:20:34
Kate Ray
I just kind of went, I think I know what this is. So we all kind of dispersed. And as I was traveling home, I got a text message from two of them independently who are mediums and said, we saw psychically what jumped on you.
00:20:51
Kate Ray
And they described it because they had a very Christian take on things. They described it as a demon. I knew it wasn't. Inherently, I absolutely knew this was a shot across the bowels from the fairy realm saying, take that section out of the magazine.
00:21:10
Kate Ray
You know, you do not give those secrets away to to to people willy nilly. I took that section out and I felt a lot better. Like you say, ah ah every time that story comes out of my mouth,
00:21:22
Kate Ray
I feel like I'm insane.
00:21:26
Lee Hatfield
And yeah, it sounds completely like you're off your rocker. But this is the good thing that I like because people have got so many different experiences.
00:21:40
Lee Hatfield
And like you not everybody's like as nutty as a bag as a bag of frogs.
00:21:45
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm.
00:21:46
Lee Hatfield
We could probably mention a few that are.
00:21:47
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm.
00:21:48
Lee Hatfield
But yeah rational people experiencing these kind of incidents, there's got to be some there's got to be more out there than what we know. and And that's what I love about like speaking to people like yourself.
00:22:04
Lee Hatfield
Because I'm learning, every time I do a podcast, I'm learning more and more and more every single time.
00:22:07
Kate Ray
Yeah.
00:22:10
Lee Hatfield
And to hear something like that is sort like, I want to experience something like that to say that what I want to believe in is real.
00:22:22
Kate Ray
Yes.
00:22:24
Lee Hatfield
So the stereotypical... fairy that people know about it's like you've already said is the tinkerbell fairy wings little yeah but yay big but there must be other other types like people yeah people have heard like of changelings of elementals so are they connected with the fairy world or are they something different that's a different subject
00:22:38
Kate Ray
Yes. So for me, the easiest way to explain it is the word fairy means the others.
00:22:57
Kate Ray
So it's anybody or any being that's not within the realm of the dead or within the realm of the angelics or demons. Now, changelings, definitely changelings are swapped out babies. So the fairies would come along and swap human babies for usually lumps of wood or and for fairy babies who um um hadn't been born particularly well.
00:23:23
Kate Ray
Elemental, elementals is is ah ah is a is a tricky one. Everything to do with the fairies, there is tricky and sticky patches within the whole linguistics, terminology and understanding.
00:23:36
Kate Ray
And that's one of the reasons why I love it because it's it's quite a mercurial subject. Elementals has has really gained traction within the paranormal community and especially within TV shows.
00:23:49
Kate Ray
I've heard it on American TV shows, British TV shows that people have referred to fairies as elementals. I understand why, because it's it not, fairy isn't an easy word to accept because of it its 20th and 21st century connotations.
00:24:06
Kate Ray
Elementals is easier because people think of spirits of the land. The word elementals is something that came way after fairy folklore and came with Paracelsus and the Alchemists.
00:24:20
Kate Ray
So Paracelsus was you know an alchemist and he wanted to create these almost egregorial type characters that would take on the elements of earth, air fire and water to help within the process of alchemy.
00:24:36
Kate Ray
So within that, we get gnomes of the earth, we get sylphs of the air, we get salamanders of the fire and we get undines of the water. But that word has become synonymous with fairy. And some really hardcore fairy people, which sounds ridiculous, doesn't it have Hardcore fairy people.
00:24:58
Kate Ray
They won't entertain using the word elementals. They won't write the word elemental. won't put it in the fairy realm. I put it in that realm just because it's become a collective name now, an acceptable collective name for fairies.
00:25:17
Kate Ray
So for me, under the umbrella of fairies, there is as many diversities as there is within the animal kingdom. So you have those beings that are as small as your thumb, maybe even smaller.
00:25:30
Kate Ray
You have light beings, of ah ah tiny light beings, right the way up to giants, dragons, trolls, huge, huge creatures and everything in between.
00:25:43
Kate Ray
Now, the ones that I generally come across are animistic, humanoid, usually between probably two and a half foot to four foot.
00:25:54
Kate Ray
i But I've known, because I run my own podcast and I talk to people who've had experiences, I've known people who have seen flying twig men, you know, that that look like humanoids made out of twigs with wings.
00:26:09
Kate Ray
I've had people who have had what we would consider as ghost hunters poltergeist activity but they've said they've had a house brownie that's just gone rampant so you know the the the face of how people interpret what fair is is definitely changing from the tinkerbell which pleases me no end because the paranormal investigators you know we need to have in our toolkit that we may be dealing with something other than the spirits of the dead and how we deal with these beings is very very different
00:26:41
Lee Hatfield
Could you stop talking about stuff I've got no idea about? Because I'm really struggling to get some questions out now. ah it so like OK, so one thing that I've always wondered, and this is going really, really, really back to basics, is you mentioned the word fairy.
00:26:58
Kate Ray
yes please do yes
00:27:02
Lee Hatfield
yeah You spell it F-A-I-R-E. But then you have the fae, and then you have fairies, F-E-A-I-E-S.
00:27:06
Kate Ray
yes
00:27:11
Kate Ray
yeah
00:27:11
Lee Hatfield
Is there any difference between that?
00:27:13
Lee Hatfield
And if there is a difference, why is it spelt differently?
00:27:17
Kate Ray
So the the the the old spelling, one of the old spellings is the F-A-E-R-I-E or why at the end. And Faye is just a shortening of fairy in that old spelling.
00:27:29
Lee Hatfield
okay
00:27:30
Kate Ray
Fairy with an eye is the same thing. However, there is a definite shift away from, for those who are serious about studying it, away from spelling with an eye because of it the link to Tinkerbell, because of the link to the Industrial Revolution, diminutive,
00:27:47
Kate Ray
ah ah sexualized, and fluttery little butterfly being and and take a more serious look and from a folklore perspective or from an encounters perspective.
00:27:57
Kate Ray
And the way I see it is fairy spelt with an I lives up in the sky. So it's your your butterfly beings. Fairy with an E is everything.
00:28:08
Kate Ray
So if you see that E is everything encompassing. That's just my take on it. I just think that spelling it with an E gives it more grounding within folklore, more grounding with pagan connections and ancestral connections.
00:28:21
Kate Ray
That's
Global Perspectives on Fairies
00:28:22
Lee Hatfield
to it
00:28:22
Kate Ray
the basics of it.
00:28:25
Lee Hatfield
That explains it perfectly. And now I'm more knowledgeable than what I was five minutes ago.
00:28:29
Kate Ray
Good.
00:28:30
Lee Hatfield
so So one thing that's also interesting, if you start Googling you know fairies, you kind of get pointed in the direction of Cornish fairies, which could be deemed Cornish pixies.
00:28:43
Lee Hatfield
And then you've got Welsh fairies.
00:28:43
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm.
00:28:45
Lee Hatfield
And then you've got Irish fiction picks it up irish fairies that could be leprechauns. So is there a more... populous location, Cornwall, Wales, Ireland, so to speak, or England, come to that, than what there is like internationally? Or and are there cultures for every kind of variety? Yeah.
00:29:11
Kate Ray
I think yes and yes, which is the short answer. I think England's a very interesting, an interesting view on fairies because there are pockets of rural Britain, Ireland, Wales, Scotland, that have really retained the connection and their and their connection with the folklore and with fairy folk and will still ritualistically do things.
00:29:35
Kate Ray
For instance, putting out milk and honey to appease the fairy folk. i Globally, it's it's an interesting one. i've I've often spoken to different people about this. Globally, we there is lots of similarities all around the globe with with these beings, lots of similarities.
00:29:55
Kate Ray
And it we we often talk, is it just a case of, you know, the the pixies down in Cornwall, are they the same as the red caps that live um um in the Scottish borders?
00:29:58
Lee Hatfield
Thank you.
00:30:08
Kate Ray
It's just that colloquially they've got a different name and culturally they they have different roles. You know, because we we have a whole subsection. When you look at folklore, we have this i bulk of a subsection, which are little men who and usually look quite wizened, usually wear kind of very earthy tone clothing and they can either do you great, great harm or they can do you good.
00:30:35
Kate Ray
And there there are all those similarities. Or is it that these things are cousins to each other and they've kind of split off and lived in different areas and become different, their race has developed differently?
00:30:49
Kate Ray
or there could be no connection at all that they are just self-developed within those areas globally. But it is it it is very, very and interesting. I mean, we definitely see connections in this country with, ah ah you know, those people who came to this country. You know, you've got... you your Vikings and your Normans and and whoever else kind of rafted into into the UK and they brought their cultural i demigods, if you like, the little gods, the hearth gods with them, which are often tied in with the whole fairy folklore story.
00:31:26
Kate Ray
it's believed that that may be one of the origins of of understanding of fairies, that they were house demigods that would look after the hearth or look after the cattle or and would be called upon for for different favours.
00:31:39
Kate Ray
it's ah ah it's I mean, that in itself is ah ah is a huge subject.
The Cottingley Fairies: Myth or Reality?
00:31:44
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, because I'm finding it's absolutely like amazing and interesting. So yeah I've got questions in front of me, but I'm like, OK, you've kind of answered a little part of that, so I'm going to try and twist it.
00:31:54
Kate Ray
Yeah.
00:32:00
Lee Hatfield
So one thing that I do find that if you do Google fairies, it comes ah ah comes across with, yeah yeah if you communicate with them communicate with them, you must do it in a in a particular way.
00:32:12
Lee Hatfield
yeah You've already mentioned about leaving food out and stuff. So, you know, that also brings to mind the story in the UK back in the... but before both of us were born of the of the children that encountered the fairies that's really popular with the the fairy pictures. But on their deathbed, they actually said that it was it was fake.
00:32:37
Lee Hatfield
Now, do you think that that was 100% fake? Or do you think there was something in it that started off small, but then it was blown completely out of proportion?
00:32:51
Kate Ray
I recently ah wrote an ah for and Dr. Simon Young about the Cottingley Fairies. And, you know, for the life of me, the the girl's name, it it was Elsa and somebody else, as has completely evaded me.
00:33:04
Kate Ray
So this is my feelings and it's it's my personal feelings on it. and I believe that there was something that they encountered. They always stood by the fact that there were fairies that they encountered down at the the the brook.
00:33:17
Kate Ray
And they wanted the world to believe. They were desperate for the world to believe them and because they wanted people to believe in this this beautiful thing that they'd found.
00:33:28
Kate Ray
I remember, don't know whether it's a false memory that I saw it live, or whether it was something that was recorded, but I remember be being on the the youngest girl being on telly, obviously a very elderly lady, and saying they were faked.
00:33:46
Kate Ray
Now, there's two psychological things going off here. So it could have been that they said it was faked because they wanted to safeguard the fairies.
00:33:59
Kate Ray
They didn't want people to go find in them. because they felt a duty of care for the fairy. So they said, no, that's it. You know, they're all faked. Or it could have been that they were faked. But both girls stood by completely that the last photo that was taken was a true photo.
00:34:17
Kate Ray
And they both stood by that. I think that there was something in it. i i I don't think the amount of publicity and those who got involved with it, it would have happened if there wasn't authenticity within within that case.
00:34:32
Lee Hatfield
And it's interesting that you say that because I've done research on some very highly mentioned paranormal activity within the UK.
00:34:42
Lee Hatfield
Borley Rectory, for one, for an example.
00:34:43
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm.
00:34:46
Lee Hatfield
There was some initial paranormal activity, but then there was some fakery in it to make it bigger than what it is.
00:34:49
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm.
00:34:53
Kate Ray
Yes.
00:34:55
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm.
00:34:56
Lee Hatfield
The Enfield Haunting. There's reports that some of it was genuine and some of it was faked again.
00:35:05
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm.
00:35:06
Lee Hatfield
So I do find that yeah I don't know if these people just want the publicity.
00:35:11
Kate Ray
Mm-hmm.
00:35:12
Lee Hatfield
and thinking, I'm getting all these reporters coming down. This is great. I want to keep this on. And then try to, yeah if the the real stuff has kind of faded away a little bit, they try and bring fake stuff enter into the world just to try to to boost what's already there.
00:35:30
Lee Hatfield
So it's interesting that that we mentioned that particular fairy story. and But yeah it's a shame that people have to do that. Yeah.
00:35:39
Kate Ray
Yeah.
00:35:40
Lee Hatfield
Come out with what you've what you've seen. If you want to report it, do. If you don't want to report it, keep it to yourself. Yeah. and and then And then move forward from there. But it's it's a big shame that people don't just yeah keep focused on on what's happened rather than I need to make this bigger than what it actually is.
00:36:00
Kate Ray
Yeah, I totally agree with you. and I think it was slightly different with the girls at Cottingley. I think that, you know, they there was definitely a sense of excitement. They were excited because, you know, they were being given cameras.
00:36:14
Kate Ray
They were having very esteemed people coming to visit them. and But these these were things that were fairly short lived. You know, it wasn't reams of people, you know, rafts of people polling up.
00:36:26
Kate Ray
And yeah Of course, the children, they're going to love the attention. Of course, that that there's that aspect. so But I genuinely in my heart believe that they they encountered something in that first summer, if not continue to encounter.
Interacting with Fairies
00:36:43
Kate Ray
i And then i I hope in my heart that that last photograph was a genuine photograph.
00:36:52
Lee Hatfield
That's it. And unfortunately, in this day and age, so many things can be doctored, which puts our world to shame because some people will will go out there.
00:36:57
Kate Ray
Yes.
00:37:01
Kate Ray
Yeah.
00:37:04
Lee Hatfield
So when you talk about fairies, everybody mentions fairy circles. And most people probably don't know what they are.
00:37:13
Kate Ray
isnt
00:37:14
Lee Hatfield
So can you give me your interpretation on what a fairy circle is?
00:37:19
Kate Ray
Are we talking about one of my second favourite subjects of mushrooms by any chance?
00:37:24
Lee Hatfield
We might be.
00:37:27
Kate Ray
ah Okay, so i actually found out something really, really interesting that I'll tack on to this. So in terms of fairy circles, one of the theories is that when you get a perfect circle of mushrooms popping up, it's usually in an open space that you can see it. I have actually seen fairy circles that have been, they've got to have been 50 metres wide and they were they were trooping trumpet mushrooms. And these things were huge and that spotted them those those in the woods.
00:37:54
Kate Ray
Let me tell you, I will often jump in them hoping that I will get portaled away to fairyland. I will do that. So the the theory is that i wherever these circles, these perfect circles appear, and it doesn't have to be a specific mushroom, but the you know the aesthetics of it is usually the flyer garrick, which is the the quintessential red or white.
00:38:15
Kate Ray
It's said that the fairies had danced in that space the night before. And with them doing so, that they create a portal to take them back to to fairyland.
00:38:27
Kate Ray
And if you stand in them, you'll be transported away to fairyland. One snippet of information that ah ah has come out fairly recently over the last couple of years. And it'll come to me, the the guy's name. He's he's very well known for his.
00:38:41
Kate Ray
He's kind of like the guru of all mushrooms. He's a doctor, somebody. It'll come to me. He was so he he was saying that and they've recently found out that mushrooms respond highly to bass notes.
00:38:55
Kate Ray
So ah ah people drumming in a circle will stimulate the mycelia, the the network under the fruiting mushroom. And often when those people have utilised that space for drumming or dancing or singing,
00:39:10
Kate Ray
within a couple of days, mushrooms will pop up within that vicinity. And they don't know why it's highly stimulated by this really deep base note of dancing feet. So I wonder whether this idea of fairies dancing and creating circles has maybe come from a pagan past where people have been celebrating, dancing maybe around a fire or just in circles because it's a very ancient thing to do is to dance in circles.
00:39:38
Kate Ray
And then they wake up from their stupor of the night before of drinking, you know, probably ghastly homebrew and whatever else. And they suddenly see these these circles, the these circles of mushrooms, which would have been mind-blowingly magical, that they'd been there dancing at that very same spot and there they go.
00:39:57
Kate Ray
So that would have, you know, developed this idea that after they'd stopped dancing, the fairies started dancing and they magically popped up these mushrooms. mushrooms that that's the kind of pseudoscience part of it but you know i will always stand in a fairy ring and and sort of challenge them and say you know come on then take me take me away exactly now what do I do
00:40:19
Lee Hatfield
And if that happened, you'll be going, okay now what happens? Yeah, yeah. So are you familiar with the term the green map?
00:40:28
Kate Ray
yes
00:40:30
Lee Hatfield
Okay, so one of my colleagues, Volta, I asked him to create me a couple of questions because he's got like a bit of a spiritual mind. i'm going to ask him two I'm going to ask you two questions that have come straight from Volta.
00:40:38
Kate Ray
ah
00:40:42
Kate Ray
Okay. Oh, when you see this is this is another one of my favourite subjects. i I grew up next to Sherwood Forest.
00:40:42
Lee Hatfield
The first one, how does your belief in fairies connect with older nature-based traditions like the Green Man of European folklore?
00:40:59
Kate Ray
So the Green Man I hold very dear because there's obviously that connection with Robin Hood, the crossovers. know, the Green Man goes into that. The green man is also, in my mind, Canunos, is also Pan.
00:41:13
Kate Ray
So it's that that that wild god energy, that fertility god energy. And of course, it plays into the whole fairy spectrum and very much of that and that fairy energy and mentality.
00:41:29
Kate Ray
I was recently doing a talk and I said to the audience, why do we think that fairies have become so utterly popular? right now again there's a resurgence um in in fairies and i'm working with fairies fairy meditation etc and we got you know we we we thrashed around some some ideas and i have a theory we in this country alone spend billions of pounds billions of pounds on therapies whether it's yoga whether it's going out and taking ayahuasca whether it's sit down therapies whether it's
00:42:06
Kate Ray
Whatever it is, medications and therapies for for two reasons. One's anxiety and one's depression. They're usually um the the the staple of why people go for these therapies.
00:42:19
Kate Ray
Now, if you think about it in terms of depression is looking behind you. Anxiety is looking in front of you. So depression is milling around things that have gone off in your past and you can't change. Anxiety a future fold thing, a worry about what's going to be in the future.
00:42:36
Kate Ray
The fairies live in the now. Whatever they do, they do in the now. And it's it's gone. You know, it's it's gone. They will often carry with them retribution for humans, but that's it. they they They don't suffer anxiety. They don't suffer depression.
00:42:52
Kate Ray
And for me, when you're talking about the green man, he's very much in the now. he He very much lives in the moment. He is of nature. He is of what's around him and his surroundings and protect him.
00:43:04
Kate Ray
that nature but he has more i think of a human connection than a lot of the fairies do he kind of cross over because he is that he is that that that god that old god you know and the fairies respect him
00:43:18
Lee Hatfield
And it's funny that you mentioned it being a god because one of his other questions, he he loves the green man for some bizarre reason, is that do you see him as a fairy king, an elemental guardian or a spiritual archetype? And how does his presence influence your connection to the land?
00:43:38
Kate Ray
So that's brilliant. So for the for the first, the the answer is yes. I see him as all those things. I see him as he could have been too human.
00:43:38
Lee Hatfield
So like, where's he coming out with these questions?
00:43:49
Kate Ray
He could be God. He could be an elemental. He could be ah ah ah ah ah ah whole holistic nature spirit. You know, I think he's all of those things. And I think that this is the this is the world of the fairy, that they can be all of those things all of the time.
00:44:06
Kate Ray
And it's how we receive and interpret them. Sorry, what was the second part of that question?
00:44:12
Lee Hatfield
I don't know. I forgot myself. and Yeah. How does his presence influence your connection to the land?
00:44:21
Kate Ray
Now, on a personal level, I don't tend to work with a green man i simply because, you know, i know he's there and doing his job and I'm i'm quite happy with that.
00:44:32
Kate Ray
i i think I think in terms, when I think of him in terms of fairies, I possibly think more Canunos. And I think don't mess, just don't mess.
00:44:44
Kate Ray
You have to listen to your gut instinct. Now, if I had listened to my gut instinct when I was writing that article and not left that section in at the end about the fairies, I don't think I would have encountered what I encountered. And what I encountered felt like Canunos energy.
00:45:00
Kate Ray
It was very powerful. It was very raw. It was very from from the land and the earth. So I don't mess. And listen. I listen. I listen.
00:45:11
Lee Hatfield
And sort like, yeah, ah when I see this guy tonight at this investigation, I'm going to go like, these questions, I can't even say half the words.
00:45:21
Lee Hatfield
So one of that that kind of brings me nicely on to the next point where, yeah are there any rules or guidelines for humans interacting with fairies?
00:45:33
Lee Hatfield
Or if a human does think that they're going to be interacting with any kind of entity that they may think is very yeah is it a point of yes go ahead and make contact or should you generally avoid interacting
00:45:48
Kate Ray
so ah ah my my golden rule is when when anybody asks me that question is don't don't um Unless you are very clear about what you're dealing with, what you're asking of, how to sever that relationship, what that relationship's for, you have to be very specific with boundaries.
00:46:09
Kate Ray
One of the traits that all fairies, all fairies have is the trickster element. So you may think you are, I'm blessed. I know a lot of lovely, genuine people who work with fairy energy.
00:46:25
Kate Ray
And, i am I have played devil's advocate on time and said, you know, so you're working with fairy. Who? Who are you working with? Oh, well, I'm working with the fairies.
00:46:36
Kate Ray
No, no, no. who Who are you working with? You know, because then I liken it to if you go to your front door with a bottle of gin and you throw open your front door and you shout out that front door, does anybody want a drink?
00:46:36
Lee Hatfield
Thank you.
00:46:50
Kate Ray
You have no idea who's going to come through that door or what their agenda is going to be. or a you know, what the atmosphere is going to be from from doing that. You have to be very, very specific and you have to understand that there is always payment, always.
00:47:07
Kate Ray
No matter what deal struck, there is always payment for your interaction. Now, in terms of if there are paranormal investigators that are going out and they are coming across these kind of beings, I think the best advice that I can give is you are not there to banish, you are there to work with.
00:47:27
Kate Ray
Finding out why they're there is the first port of call, opening up it a dialogue of communication. But it's also respecting that they're not there for no reason.
00:47:39
Kate Ray
They are definitely there for a particular reason. Now, in terms of ah ah going into a property and moving the spirits of the dead on or banishing and exercising demons, they're very prescriptive things to do.
00:47:56
Kate Ray
With fairies, it's like those kind of tactics don't work at all. And I've always found that reason and rationale and communication have been the perfect starting point for these beings. Good.
00:48:16
Lee Hatfield
I could talk to you all day about this. I really could. So we've got we're coming close to the end. So I've got a couple of, I think, really good questions. But you might probably tell me different.
00:48:29
Lee Hatfield
With you bearing in mind what you just said about the interaction, if you are going to go out with the intent, like this is you personally, not not all these crazy people that listen.
00:48:37
Kate Ray
yeah
00:48:41
Lee Hatfield
If you go out and with your intention of trying to connect with the fairy realm, do you do any spiritual practices or protections before you go out?
00:48:56
Lee Hatfield
Or... Do you do anything after you've finished?
00:49:00
Kate Ray
used to do, i don't anymore. So i i was definitely of the ill curve. My pockets clanked with crystals. I had all kinds of anointing oils that I would put on. i would, you know, bubble all myself up, et cetera, et cetera. And i've come to that I've come to the conclusion after years and the years of doing this, that the best form of protection is understanding and knowing I have a divine right to be on this planet and a divine right to be on this planet undisturbed.
00:49:29
Kate Ray
And knowing that has been enough. And it's, it's, It's really helped with a smooth smoother connection. I will only connect in with these beings if I am asked to help in a situation that's become tricky for somebody who's living.
00:49:45
Kate Ray
So if a house is haunted and they suspect that it's not the spirits of the dead, they suspect that it's something more, I'll be asked to do a remote view on that property. So I will connect in with the energy of the property to see if I can scan and and see what's there.
00:50:03
Kate Ray
I have only ever twice come across beings that haven't been interactive with me in that situation. And the majority of the time, these ah ah other beings are very surprised that somebody of the human realm can see them on a psychic level.
00:50:20
Kate Ray
That's number one. And number two, they are usually quite excited to communicate anyway, um because because a lot of the time they are there with purpose. And it's usually because humans have wronged them in in some capacity.
00:50:36
Kate Ray
So, ah no, i don't do any protection. i don't feel like because I feel like I've become an advocate for that realm and that particularly darker side of the
Conclusion and Promotions
00:50:47
Kate Ray
realm. And I use that very tentatively, that word.
00:50:50
Kate Ray
I don't feel like I'm under any threat unless I step out of line. So I don't step out a line. I doth my cap, if you like. wherever I can and say, yeah, i'm I'm going to do what you say.
00:51:04
Lee Hatfield
So with that being said, people talk about having attachments from the paranormal spiritual world.
00:51:15
Lee Hatfield
Is it possible and does it happen for you to get attachments from the fairy world as well?
00:51:21
Kate Ray
oh yes, definitely. Definitely. I think properties and people can get those attachments and some of them really quite malevolent and destructive.
00:51:32
Kate Ray
And again, it's a very different way of dealing with wisdom them because they're very rarely there, with like I say, without cause or without meaning.
00:51:44
Lee Hatfield
okay So final question of the day. Well, it's not a question. It's more of a statement. You've mentioned your podcast. You've got a few ah ah few books out. So it's now time to plug yourself.
00:51:56
Kate Ray
Oh, bless it.
00:51:56
Lee Hatfield
So please feel free to to mention your podcast and yeah your books that you've written and where they can get them from.
00:52:04
Kate Ray
So the podcast is Hair in the Hawthorne. That's on YouTube. And we talk about fairies under a 14 umbrella. So it's everything that that's kind of connected either loosely or generally to to fairies and where the crossovers are between ufology, hauntology, that kind of thing.
00:52:23
Kate Ray
um um I have written a book and I've got it here. It's the Woolies Snots. And that was about a particular case that took place in Nottingham in 1979. where a group of children encountered 60 gnomes in hovering cars.
00:52:38
Kate Ray
So that's about that. I've also written for the Ferry Investigation Society under Dr Simon Young. Several of his books have got my essays in. What else? Forward for Lionel Fanthorpe for one of his latest books. So Reverend Lionel Fanthorpe, who who is one of the paranormal world's great godfathers,
00:53:00
Kate Ray
I've blank. I've gone blank. and And go out and buy, if you can, if you can get a copy, go out and buy Haunted Magazine because that is just a spot on magazine when it comes to all things paranormal.
00:53:12
Lee Hatfield
And that is where I kind of got your foot yeah your name from. It's sort of like, because that is my go-to because yeah i subscribe to it and it's like, that's an interesting subject, right?
00:53:18
Kate Ray
Yes.
00:53:23
Lee Hatfield
That person's name and then stalk them. in I mean, contact them on social media. So, and that's how i've I've reached out to quite a few people. But, okay, I could speak to you all day and let's do it because this connection was sucky to start off with.
00:53:38
Lee Hatfield
But, okay, You've got so many other subjects that I'd like you to talk about. So the invite is out there to come back on with a better connection and then we can talk about something else.
00:53:49
Kate Ray
I'd love to.
00:53:49
Lee Hatfield
But in the meantime, awesome.
00:53:52
Lee Hatfield
In the meantime, I thank you for your time and the listeners can look forward to hearing from something else from you in the near future. Thanks very much. You take care now.
00:54:01
Kate Ray
Thanks, Lee.
00:54:03
Lee Hatfield
Okay, bye-bye.