Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
S1 E26 Karin Beasant - Paranormal Investigator, Paranormal Consultant, and Historical Researcher
14 Plays2 days ago
This week I had great fun talking to Karin, as we discussed Ghosts, the Historic Jamaica Inn in Cornwall, England.
Some of the things we speak about are why do ghosts not pay rent, seeing Gandolf as a ghost, Mr Chin’s worm Lozenges and period etiquette when trying to communicate with ghosts and spirits.
We also got to talk about the Danish Royal family visiting, as well as General Patton.
Our final conversation was more light hearted as we spoke about why do ghosts have to be serious, ghosts touching and pinching in personal areas.
Recommended
Transcript
Intro
Introduction of Corinne Beeson
00:00:12
Lee Hatfield
Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of sour SEPA Paranormal Chronicles. Couldn't say, get me words out then. Today I'm delighted to have on the show...
00:00:25
Lee Hatfield
I forgot your name. Corinne.
00:00:26
Karin
Oh,
00:00:28
Lee Hatfield
Corinne Beeson. See, I'm losing it already. Just have one of those days. Corinne is a paranormal investigator, paranormal consultant. She's the assistant producer of My Ghostly Footsteps. We'll hear more about that later.
00:00:42
Lee Hatfield
And she's also a historic researcher. And she's part of the Jamaica Inn paranormal team. Corinne, welcome and thank you for being on the show.
00:00:51
Karin
oh it's an honour. Thank you.
00:00:54
Lee Hatfield
See, and for everyone that knows, me and Corinne have just been talking offline and the conversation we're now having in was nothing like you're about to hear. this is This is all sensible, trust me. Okay, so could you start off by giving us a little bit of background about yourself, please?
First Ghostly Experiences
00:01:13
Karin
Yes, so I'm from Bristol in England and as you will find out, I have what is left of the original Wessex accent or and as we call it now, Bristolian, much to the horror of my foreign mother.
00:01:30
Karin
who wishes I could speak proper English. So I grew up in ah ah in a house, small terrace house, modern built, as old as me.
00:01:41
Karin
And you' growing up, there were a couple of strange things, but no one talked about ghosts or problems or anything like that. And it wasn't until i had my own pub in the centre of Bristol. Now, Bristol is a former medieval city and my pub was over 300 years old and my cellar medieval.
00:02:05
Karin
And the first six months of being there, I used to lock my door because strange things would happen and I would be all alone in this very three-storey tall old inn and keys would get thrown the door would get kicked and people would see a woman. But once I got used to it, it sort of left me alone and concentrated on scaring men that it didn't like.
00:02:37
Karin
And I lived there for over four years. So that was my introduction to ghosts, but in a way that I thought, it was just an invisible flatmate and doesn't pay rent, the little gett.
00:02:51
Lee Hatfield
what Yeah, the amount of times that I hear that, sort of like, yeah, invisible flatmates. So like, if you're going to stay, pick up a mop, do some housework. Come on. If we're going to live together, let's do it amicably.
00:03:03
Karin
Exactly.
00:03:05
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. So we're going to be talking about Jamaica Inn. And for those people that don't know, but the Jamaica Inn is absolutely renowned throughout the world.
00:03:16
Lee Hatfield
There was a novel 1936, the film 1939, and then more recently has been miniseries from 2014 2015. So what got you involved with the Jamaica Inn?
Joining Jamaica Inn Paranormal Team
00:03:25
Lee Hatfield
from two thousand and fourteen to two thousand and fifteen so what got you involved with the jamaicica in
00:03:31
Karin
was a fluke actually. So over 10 years ago, i was chatting with a lady from Cornwall and she said the new owner, Alan Jackson, had just bought this old inn.
00:03:44
Karin
And I think I went there about 30 something years ago. and um she said, i'm I'm looking to do a team. said, would you like to come down? I said, yes, but who wouldn't?
00:03:56
Karin
And they owner formed his own Jamaican Paranormal team. And then over the course of a few months, she left. I stayed on.
00:04:07
Karin
And it went from, you know, having other event companies in, which it always had done, to just being exclusive to its own team. And then i found a golden opportunity of This will be the best study case in the world.
00:04:26
Karin
For me, as passionate investigator, it renewed my love of history. So we look at this, you think, oh, it must be a smugglers inn. But over the years, researching, interviewing people, I interviewed a lady who was born there in the 1950s.
00:04:44
Karin
So you have this fabulous oral history that is so important to write down before the people die off. And there is so much more to this Alden that we know now wasn't built in 1750. It was built in 1776.
00:05:04
Karin
And the history and the conspiracy theories and Daphne du Maurier, what she was told by the local vicar of Alderham called Charles Triplett, who had afternoon tea with her at the Jamaica Inn.
00:05:21
Karin
And I've been looking into him. He was born around Falmouth, so he would have heard stories of smuggling as a child. So when she made the Vicar of Altrincham in her book, Jamaica Inn, as a villain, she may be on to something.
00:05:41
Lee Hatfield
And that's really interesting because as soon as you mentioned the Jamaica Inn, the next word that people tend to use is smuggling.
00:05:52
Karin
Hmm.
00:05:52
Lee Hatfield
And even even my wife, who's Canadian, she's heard of the movie, she's heard of the book, and she says, oh, yeah, it's something to do with smuggling. But what would we can go into more detail because I do have a ah ah list of reports that yeah I've done my homework.
00:06:09
Lee Hatfield
So... What would you say makes it a perfect location for the paranormal?
Paranormal Activities at Jamaica Inn
00:06:19
Karin
Because the first reported sighting was in 1911 of a man sat on the wall outside and locals went up to talk to him.
00:06:30
Karin
was dressed probably in what they called then old-fashioned clothing. He ignored them and he disappeared. So over the years, I was thinking, well, we haven't had any more sightings. And then I was contacted by a lady who was a child in 1977, was sat in the back of her parents' car.
00:06:51
Karin
And she said to her parents, why are those people ignoring that man sat on the wall there? Look how he's dressed. So it still carries on.
00:07:01
Karin
But unless people tell us or tell other people, we don't know. And so what we've got now is a huge database of paranormal reports, genuine ones.
00:07:16
Karin
And we want to keep that. So perfect example, about seven years ago, two medians independently said about a hooded figure in room four.
00:07:27
Karin
Not a monk, because we all jump to a must be monk. It sounds is more like a pilgrim and that was the pilgrim trail because Cornwall was famous for it. And five miles down the road is a village called Temple and it was founded by the Knights Templar.
00:07:44
Karin
They looked after pilgrims on their way to pilgrimage at Jerusalem. So we said nothing because we keep a good 30% back because we want to have proper consistent reports.
00:08:00
Karin
Two years later, A bar staff was in the cellar on his knees, putting up bottles of pills. One got up from the shelf on his own and just sat in front of him.
00:08:14
Karin
And he looked to the left and being a Cornish lad, he said, I saw bloody Gandalf. And that's how he described him. And that's the nickname. The hood, sometimes with and without a satchel, a sort of light white scratchy beard, a gentleman of obviously more senior age.
00:08:33
Karin
And he just looked at him. He thought, oh, OK. Two more years later, a young barmaid in the lower restaurant came out of the kitchen, saw Gandalf stood by the fire.
00:08:46
Karin
She thought someone was playing a joke. Went back in, come back out. He was still there. And she thought, I'm going to get someone. Went back into the kitchen, grabbed a kitchen staff member, came out. He was gone.
00:09:00
Karin
He thought, great, another report. And then last year, a couple in room 34, which is a new build, is only seven, eight years old. She woke up at two in the morning to see Gandalf leaning over their bed, staring intently at her husband.
00:09:19
Karin
And I said, well, what did you do? She said, I left him to it and went back to sleep. So now you have a consistent report of something. But you imagine that time scale it's taken to have that.
00:09:34
Karin
It doesn't mean to say that a ghost, whatever you want to call it, is there all the time. You know, you I've stayed at the Jamaican Inn, I dread to think how many times in room five.
00:09:45
Karin
And I would say it's only twice I've had paranormal reports. Footsteps around the bed, that sort of thing. And other times I've had nothing. Because I think people think you you stay in a haunted room, you've got to have a haunted experience all the time. And it doesn't work like that.
00:10:03
Lee Hatfield
No, and that's a very good point because the team that we're with or that we have, we tell people that yeah we can go to an alleged haunted location And these ghosts or spirits are not performing monkeys.
00:10:21
Lee Hatfield
They're not going to perform on command.
00:10:21
Karin
Exactly.
00:10:24
Lee Hatfield
So you may have to go back to a location two, three, four, five times before they kind of get familiar with you and then start interacting with you as a team.
00:10:36
Lee Hatfield
yeah Because yeah every man and his dog can turn up and go, Yeah, yeah. Please make a sound, make a noise. And it's like, yeah, they're not performing monkeys. and And that's what people kind of think.
00:10:47
Karin
And also, so Exactly. We say to the guests, wherever we go, especially the inn, you are a guest in their house. You have to treat them with the respect. they They are dead people. You wouldn't like someone go into your auntie's house and say, three times in a voice like that.
00:11:08
Karin
Have a conversation. We also have something that's unique to the world. It's our class system. So one of the adverts we saw for Mr. Ching's worm lozenges was the son of the man who actually built the Jamaica Inn in 1798.
00:11:26
Karin
And newspapers in those days were so graphic that And it said that James Broad Yeoman, so he had a title, he's a respected man, of the Jamaica Inn, particulars can be produced, suffered greatly with pain in his bowels in his stomach.
00:11:46
Karin
And he took one of Mr. Ching's worm lozenges and the following day he excised worms of various lengths from a few inches to seven feet. And it was signed with the Good Men of Launceston, which is the old capital of Cornwall, abricating Mr Ching's lozenges.
00:12:06
Karin
And we found out later that those contained mercury. So they weren't that good, really.
Respecting Spirits in Investigations
00:12:14
Karin
But what a wonderful advert.
00:12:15
Lee Hatfield
Oh my God.
00:12:17
Karin
And again, it is all about.
00:12:18
Lee Hatfield
Absolutely.
00:12:20
Karin
So the man who built the Jamaica Inn, Captain John Broad, he was a sea captain, a merchant sea captain. We always address him after his title is Sir, because earned that respect as a captain of a brig to be called Sir.
00:12:39
Karin
And again, our class system was so ingrained and is so ingrained now. I went to a famous historic location and one of the ladies, I just said, hello, Lady Caroline, how are you? I would have never have said Caroline.
00:12:54
Karin
Because that is how we are brought up to respect those of gentry and title.
00:13:01
Lee Hatfield
Exactly. And I couldn't agree more. And even when I go on investigations, if we go to yeah reported haunted locations, I always kind of apologise out loud for all the replication of the questions.
00:13:19
Lee Hatfield
yeah And i yeah I do say, yeah, we're here with the utmost respect. We we don't consider you to be performing artists. yeah ah ah But yeah if you can communicate, ye please do so. yeah and ah ah I do it in a polite kind way rather than go right yeah everyone's here bang on the table three times just just let us know it's not like yeah they're not performing monkeys and that's what a lot of groups or a lot of teams kind of expect that you walk into a that you walk into a house or property and you get like interactions straight away but that's not how it works
00:13:49
Karin
yeah
00:14:00
Karin
Perfect example, about three, four years ago, I hired Chillingham Castle. So I hired it. We booked all the apartments to stay just for investigators, three days and three nights.
00:14:17
Karin
Now, Me, i am such a groupie for one of our King Edwards, the Longshanks. I had nothing paranormal happen to me.
00:14:27
Karin
I didn't care. I could have licked the walls because my hero was there. Yet a colleague had the most amazing experience in the King Edward room because he has a bad leg. She said, yeah you do the tour. I'm going to stay here and wait for my team. So she sat in the dark, 15 minutes looking at two mannequins dressed in sort of early medieval style clothing.
00:14:52
Karin
15 minutes after her team come up, she looked round. There was just one mannequin.
00:14:59
Karin
So imagine that mannequin ghost thinking, well, they normally run off screaming and she's just staring at me.
00:14:59
Lee Hatfield
Wow.
00:15:02
Lee Hatfield
Oh.
00:15:08
Karin
But it shows, you know, would I go back to Chinon?
00:15:08
Lee Hatfield
oh
00:15:11
Karin
Oh my God, yes. Because it's the history that's the most important. And also, if you are going to investigate, know the history, know how people spoke going back in time.
00:15:27
Karin
Our modern language is alien. It's like a different language.
00:15:31
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, and that's a good point again, because one thing that I never, ever do is, oh, can you touch that device? Back in the 17, 1800s, the device was never used.
00:15:44
Lee Hatfield
the word device was never Never about. It wasn't even invented. So I always prefer to say we've had some we have some toys because everyone knows what a toy is.
00:15:55
Lee Hatfield
So we have some toys that have got a green light on or a blue light.
00:15:55
Karin
yeah
00:15:59
Lee Hatfield
or yeah If you feel you can go up and touch them, please do so. But I refer to them as a box or a toy. I never use the word device because that i say that vocabulary is completely foreign to them.
00:16:15
Karin
Exactly. And, you know, we say to guests, right, we don't know. No one knows, you know, oh, this haunts it, that haunts it. We can surmise what we think. But how can we prove ghosts exist, let alone which ghosts are what?
00:16:30
Karin
So as I stayed to guess at the Jamaica Inn, I said, right, Captain Broad, he was there from 1776 to 1798 when he sadly died.
00:16:30
Lee Hatfield
Exactly.
00:16:40
Karin
What was going on? Napoleonic Wars. King George III was mad King George. His son, nicknamed Prinny. was chasing married women, taxation was high, smuggling was rife, and it also was a working farm for nearly 100 years. So, that gives you an idea of the type of conversation to have to someone from that time period.
00:17:06
Karin
What is relatable to them? Not us. So we have to understand. I mean, my education, the school I went to was
Role of Historical Knowledge in Investigations
00:17:16
Karin
awful. was notorious, a very rough school.
00:17:19
Karin
So I'm not a professional historian, researcher, etc. I love history. So I remember things. But you can just write down notes.
00:17:30
Karin
And with those notes, then have the right conversation. if you're lucky, you might have something back.
00:17:38
Lee Hatfield
ah ah Agreed. And it's like this podcast right now. I've got on the screen notes about Jamaica Inn. yeah You mentioned some of the rooms and we'll talk about more of those in a bit.
00:17:50
Lee Hatfield
But I've done my research about what the Jamaica Inn is renowned for. You can't just go into a location or even an interview like this completely blind and not not done any research.
00:18:03
Lee Hatfield
And I, like you, I'm really big into my yeah into my history. And you can see behind me, I've got like photographs from a TV show Sharp based in the Napoleonic War because I'm big into my Napoleonic War.
00:18:18
Karin
Oh,
00:18:18
Lee Hatfield
but you've got yeah But you've got to know
00:18:18
Karin
lovely
00:18:22
Lee Hatfield
about what you're investigating and yeah where you're going. We've been to some local jails that are closed, and I've done my research on who who was held there, who was hung there.
00:18:37
Lee Hatfield
And if you've got those names or you've got we yeah the kind of stuff that happened and you get some feedback and it mentions those names or it mentions a particular hanging, yeah that's concrete evidence.
00:18:52
Lee Hatfield
You can't just go in there completely blind and go, oh, they mentioned sandwich. How can we relate that? yeah it You can't. But if it's mentioning a name or ah ah an activity that happened, then that's the way forward.
00:19:07
Lee Hatfield
So moving moving on from that, you say that you've got this database of activity. Can you mention some of the other stuff that's been going on at the Jamaica Inn?
Historical Changes at Jamaica Inn
00:19:15
Karin
Yes, so again, You know, when I first was there, I went by the history that was known. And you have to adapt. So when new information is verified, then you have to change and throw out all the old ideas. so Again, we now know how it was built, why it was built, and looking into some of the rooms and how they changed over the years. I have a wonderful surveyor's map from 1970 when they did a lot of alterations.
00:19:51
Karin
So reports of the the man in the 50s with the green cape, that was seen. I wondered why he worked a particular walked a particular way.
00:20:01
Karin
Now I know because an entrance or a walkway there's now didn't exist in the 50s. And so you think brilliant reception used to be ah ah generator a room before that, a cattle shed, because like I say, it was a working farm.
00:20:19
Karin
So, You think, right, okay, in 1820s, there were these number of rooms. 1840s, there was more. 1870s, there was more.
00:20:31
Karin
And so you work out the layout, etc. And we also interviewed a lady that lived there in the 1950s as a 17-year-old working there, especially for the summer season.
00:20:43
Karin
And she said, right, the museum, that was the cafe. The coaches used to come in here. Our kitchen was there. So you think, right, now you know that bit of history.
00:20:55
Karin
If you have reports from people walking through this wall, you know that there wasn't a wall there. There was a door. And all this correlation to me is so important. And it's not mine.
00:21:11
Karin
It belongs to the Jamaica Inn. And as we say, you know, there are five of us in the team, the Jamaican's the star. We are just the paranormal custodians.
00:21:23
Lee Hatfield
And i yeah I absolutely love that because it's it's great to have a location where where you can do continuous investigation. And like you say, the Jamaica Inn is a perfect example of that. we We have locations that we can go to, but because they're also used for public investigations, we can't go there as often as what we'd like to do further investigation.
00:21:49
Lee Hatfield
If we had a location yeah that we could say is our own, it would be perfect. So with Jamaica Inn... being an inn and being as old as it is.
00:22:01
Lee Hatfield
It's obviously synonymous to smuggling and obviously there was horses and such like. Do you have anything like a headless horseman or any ghost horses that we can talk about?
00:22:15
Karin
Well, in actual fact there is a ghost car. i've I collect all these old books about hauntings in Cornwall and it's brilliant how you see the early reports are so different to the reports now.
00:22:31
Karin
So as representatives of the inn, we have to be careful that we don't insist on our opinion is correct and go by the actual evidence.
Evolution of Ghostly Sightings at Jamaica Inn
00:22:43
Karin
So like the early days, it was the coach, the sound of a coach and the rims. Now, some people say on the cobbles, the cobbles didn't.
00:22:55
Karin
were put down there, sorry, to the 1950s, so it would have been gravel and dirt. We have early reports of gravel and dirt, a man on a horse. That doesn't seem to happen now.
00:23:05
Karin
Very, very rare. The last two years, we're getting more reports of barrels being moved on gravel.
00:23:15
Karin
So my argument is, why do things change? So the 1950s, the landlady then, the the landlady from Mr. Gross, his second wife, she said to her daughter many years later that during the day, the Jamaican was lovely, but she hated it when it went dark.
00:23:34
Karin
It gave her the creeps. And the young girl's bedroom was room five, one of the famous ones. And the only way she would sleep as a two or three year old was to put the pet or station in.
00:23:48
Karin
So we think, oh, brilliant. And then we have a story of one night of Caroline's team, a team member sleeping in there. And like myself, they have dogs on the bed when you go to sleep. And she thought there was a dog on the bed with her.
00:24:02
Karin
Now, not knowing the original story, does that mean dogs still sleep on that bed? Could be sort of echo from the past. not so saying it's a ghost dog.
00:24:15
Karin
And also, she was saying as well that they had a pet pig. They had famous people visit the Danish royal family when she was a three-year-old. And she had a dolly. And one of the princesses grabbed her dolly.
00:24:32
Karin
And she shoved the princess on her ass, much to the horror of her father, the manager. And I said, well, what happened? She said, apparently, the parents thought it was hilarious because, obviously...
00:24:43
Karin
"'People don't tend to push princesses over on their backside.' Now, that is a brilliant oral story, but also it's oral history.
00:24:54
Karin
And that is so important to to write it down. Myself and Lisa, at some point, we're going to correlate it all together, but we still have more things to know.
00:24:54
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:25:06
Karin
So, room five, everyone associates room five with Hannah, this girl lost at sea with her mother. It's not real. It's a story of, I don't know who who made it up, but it's become ah ghost, if you want to call it that, in its own right, that people leave her toys and writes letters to Hannah the ghost.
00:25:31
Karin
But we're very honest. We know who lived there, most most of who lived there. We have children there. And we can surmise the names, but can we prove it?
00:25:45
Karin
No, of course not.
00:25:47
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, we had a location ah few months ago. that was renowned for smuggling back in the day. And it was the first time that a team had ever been to investigate.
00:26:01
Lee Hatfield
And we did i a double Estus method. And for those people that don't know, the two people that are involved are wearing blind folds, they're wearing headset and they're listening to white noise.
00:26:12
Lee Hatfield
And allegedly you can pull out words to for the spirits to communicate. And we picked up a name And then when we asked her who she was, she actually said that she was a smuggler.
00:26:27
Lee Hatfield
So the fact the fact that there was smuggling back in the day, we only had a first name, so we don't know how she was connected to the family that owned the property.
00:26:27
Karin
Nice.
00:26:38
Lee Hatfield
But, you she could have been a servant that was getting a bit of cash on the side. But, yeah, the fact that we got a name and she said that that she was a smuggler was like quite remarkable. The fact that we knew that they'd been smuggling in that area.
00:26:54
Karin
Well, I, so sorry, but,
00:26:54
Lee Hatfield
But go in. Go on.
00:26:56
Karin
My pub 30 years ago always had things coming through the door. I used to get my perfume from an Irish con man who had a contact in Debenhams. Clothes.
00:27:08
Karin
All the local pubs where I live now, everyone on a Sunday would get trainers, things off the back of a lorry, etc. That is local enterprise.
00:27:19
Karin
And local enterprise went on then. so We know that the man who built the Jamaica Inn was a sea captain. I'll make it really short because it takes too long.
00:27:30
Karin
Before Jamaica Inn, Bolvento didn't exist. There was no building. It was just an old Roman track. So he agreed a lease. He was away at sea. And one of the leaseholders was a man called James Scarwin. He was an MP merchant involved in going the island of Jamaica, etc.,
00:27:52
Karin
Now, why would a stranger agree a gentleman's agreement lease? They must have known each other. And where they built it.
00:28:04
Karin
was perfect because it was England on the route and Captain Broad had quite a few mules. Mules were used for transportation.
00:28:15
Karin
It was built as a farmhouse and then within three, four years they built a tall road and it then became the Jamaica Inn. Nothing to do with the Trelawney family, probably as a respect to James Scalwin or perhaps Captain Broad sailed to Jamaica.
00:28:32
Karin
Now, You think, okay, smuggling went on, but he got married in 1783. Now, the local parish church, Altrincham, there was a curate there, not ficker, a curate. His name was James Benito.
00:28:51
Karin
Just a lowly curate. He married him within two years. This curate was in the court as a domestic chaplain, a teacher to the Prince of Wales, the future George IV.
00:29:05
Karin
How did that happen?
00:29:07
Karin
Where would you hide goods in plain sight? Remember, there's no tunnels where the Jamaica Inn is, is granite. The vicarage or the church? And his other son, Captain Broad, had the pub in Altrincham as well.
00:29:23
Karin
So you had the passageway. Can I prove it? No.
00:29:28
Karin
But if you wanted ah base that looked like a farm and then just a small inn just to change horses, because that's all it was, perfect camouflage.
00:29:40
Lee Hatfield
That's brilliant. So you mentioned a few minutes ago about that the way that the spirits seem to have changed through time. You don't see the horse and carriage anymore.
00:29:54
Lee Hatfield
So moving forward future through time, i I've yet to witness any ghosts that have got the baseball caps on back to front and jeans. But I do believe there's a story about during World War II with an American airman
00:30:11
Karin
yet he's disappeared. We've had nothing for the last year. So just before D-Day 1944, there were 8,000 US troops based around Bodmin and Bodmin Moor, because obviously Cornwall was used to sail off and practice the D-Day landings.
00:30:29
Karin
So on the 22nd of March 1944,
00:30:34
Karin
General Patton stayed there, according to Claude Finneymore, the landlord, because he brought his own eggs. He had 12 eggs and bacon. Oh, no, 12 eggs and gammon for breakfast.
00:30:45
Karin
I looked at Patton's diaries. They're online. And the Jamaica Inn was still a temperance house and no alcohol. And he mentions about staying in a hotel and about the wonderful legs of a woman sat at the bar.
00:31:03
Karin
So there would have been lots of Americans coming in there. And a local historian claims that our own General Montgomery came up to the Jamaica Inn to meet Patton. Now, they hated each other in real life.
00:31:17
Karin
And when I first was there, there was an old timer and I wished I'd interviewed him. And in his strong Cornish accent, he said, you don't know to what went on in the Second World War. Loser secret meetings like, ooh.
00:31:31
Karin
You know, and you think, what a missed opportunity.
00:31:36
Karin
So, you know, this is fantastic. And on the 25th of June 1944, Patton drove to Exeter train station, picked up Eisenhower, Colonel Bade, and according to an American's account,
00:31:51
Karin
on a bluff, which is a hill within sight of the Jamaica Inn. Hatton did one of his famous roaring speeches, etc. You know, as the troops were going out to continue the advancement through Europe.
00:32:05
Karin
It's history. And this US airman, we had him lots of times.
00:32:06
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:32:10
Karin
A 16-year-old girl see saw him come out of the kitchen door, go into the bar, but he didn't make a sound on the flagstones. And she looked up the uniform, that's why we knew as an airman.
00:32:24
Karin
But now, nothing.
00:32:27
Lee Hatfield
So are you aware of any American airman deaths related to the Jamaican that would justify this guy's presence?
US Airman Ghost's Story
00:32:38
Karin
No. No. and The only thing, when supposedly people were talking, and again, you know, we can't prove it, He had a love. they felt He fell in love with a local girl. That's the only thing.
00:32:52
Karin
And I believe it ghosts are real, why can't they go anywhere? So did we just catch reports of a few times he visited and now he's had enough and he's gone back home?
00:33:07
Karin
Who knows?
00:33:09
Lee Hatfield
And that's that's interesting because if he's in the military, he would have to go away let's just call them missions.
00:33:18
Karin
Yeah. Yes. Yeah.
00:33:18
Lee Hatfield
And then when he's on on leave, he could come back to visit the Jamaica Inn. So I wonder, and there's no way that we can ever prove this, I wonder if the times that he was seen matched the times that he was on leave from the military to see his girlfriend.
00:33:35
Karin
yes
00:33:38
Karin
yeah
00:33:39
Lee Hatfield
yeah But that's something that we can never, ever prove until you get a name. And if you don't get a name, there's nothing else you can do about that.
00:33:47
Karin
Well, the first name we had was Frank. a He came from a landlocked part of America.
00:33:58
Karin
And you know the D-Day. They gave them different names. So Omaha and that sort of thing.
00:34:03
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:34:04
Karin
He said he was parachuted in, not on the beach, but further in. And he got shot as he parachuted down. Is it true?
00:34:15
Karin
I don't know. But it would be so lovely if we could get more information from him if he comes back. And if he doesn't, that's another one that's been there for a while and gone away.
00:34:32
Karin
But we also have a modern ghost. He was first reported in the 1980s and we've got four reports the last three or four years. And it's a lad in his 20s wearing jeans, an orange jumper with a crew cut.
00:34:48
Karin
So modern.
00:34:48
Lee Hatfield
do you have any Do you have anything about him?
00:34:51
Karin
No. Just seen in the upper restaurant and in the museum.
00:34:58
Lee Hatfield
Which is really strange. But again, that might have been a location that he drank in. And that was it.
00:35:06
Karin
and Yeah.
00:35:08
Lee Hatfield
yeah Came back to visit to see if he's changed.
00:35:10
Karin
Or is it like a blip in time where, you know, this, you know, I love the fascination that the reports of people walking down a road, they see a lovely um cafe when they come back. It's an old ruin.
00:35:26
Karin
That time slip.
00:35:26
Lee Hatfield
Time slips.
00:35:27
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:35:29
Lee Hatfield
I'm hopefully getting someone to talk about time slips very soon, so that will be interesting.
00:35:33
Karin
Oh my, it's it's just fascinating.
00:35:34
Lee Hatfield
So, yeah. So apart from the novel, the film, and the miniseries, has there been much media interest in the Jamaica Inn? Have you had but professional ghost hunters come down there's and yeah for TV shows or anything like that?
00:35:53
Karin
Yeah, we get a lot. We've got another German one coming out this year. And the one that came before, lucky enough, my German auntie and my cousin watched it in Germany.
00:36:07
Lee Hatfield
Oh, wow.
00:36:08
Karin
And my mum, being of German descent, was most disgusted that I spoke English all the way through. And I said, mum, they speak better English than me. You know, um we've had paranormal captured. We have the big YouTubers down.
00:36:23
Karin
But we're very, very strict on protecting the brand and the history. There's nothing evil. There's nothing demonic at the Jamaican Inn. There's a prankster.
00:36:35
Karin
And they are technically people connected there who we have to protect their integrity. And I know everything today is about, you know, everything's got to be evil. But why? Ghosts. Why can't ghosts be fun?
00:36:54
Karin
And our ghosts are fun there. it's It's the naughtiness I like.
00:36:57
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:36:58
Karin
we We have one that we call Jack. We don't know if he's real or not. But one year on command on the public nights, we would send a guest, say, in the museum on their own with a walkie-talkie and a blindfold.
00:37:11
Karin
And in the bar, we'll say, Jack, could you go and grab the right buttock of that man or that woman? And it did it about four times in a year. And then he stopped, got bored. And this one chap said, not only did I feel the grab, he said, I could feel the thumb digging into my thigh.
00:37:28
Lee Hatfield
Wow.
00:37:29
Karin
And it doesn't matter if it's men or women. One chap was in the bar before he'd started the paranormal night, looking at the sign. And he said he felt someone grab his right butt up.
00:37:39
Karin
And he turned around, ready to punch who it was. He said there was no one behind him. So why can't ghosts have fun?
00:37:46
Lee Hatfield
That's weird.
00:37:49
Lee Hatfield
Exactly. And it's really weird because October, November, I went to help her a friend of mine set up for a public event at an old jail. It's the second oldest jail in in Canada.
00:38:03
Lee Hatfield
And I'm in one particular room that was being redecorated. It used to be a kitchen, but all everything had been taken out and they'd got decorators boards and blankets on the floor.
00:38:15
Lee Hatfield
Everywhere had been whitewashed. So it was pretty sterile area, pretty dark, but pretty sterile. And as I'm walking around, I just get like a stroke.
00:38:23
Karin
Oh, nice.
00:38:23
Lee Hatfield
down the side of my face. And it's like, did that really happen? And my first instinct being rational, cobwebs, something hanging down from the ceiling, and there was absolutely nothing.
00:38:35
Lee Hatfield
It was a completely sterile room. And I said to the guy, i said, I've just been stroked down the side of my face. He went, oh, yeah, that happens sometimes. And it's like, sorry, what? And it was really weird to have the sensation that I cannot explain.
00:38:50
Lee Hatfield
that's the first time that I've been touched, so to speak. But you mentioned about not everything being a demon and all these people that I see that are being scratched and it's ah it's an aggressive spirit.
00:39:01
Karin
Yeah.
00:39:02
Lee Hatfield
And I always tell people, If we try to communicate with somebody who's living, we will speak to them. If they've got headphones on or whatever, we'll tap them on the shoulder.
00:39:14
Lee Hatfield
Spirits and ghosts probably do exactly the same. If they try to communicate with somebody and that person can't hear them because they're one of them is a spirit, the next rational thing to do is to go up and touch them.
00:39:28
Karin
yeah
00:39:29
Lee Hatfield
And if these scratches are due to people being touched, it does not mean it's a malevolent entity. just means that potentially it's someone just trying to get get get your attention.
00:39:42
Lee Hatfield
So leading on to that, have you ever had that kind of experience?
00:39:47
Karin
Oh, do you know what? The weird thing is, though I've got more and more sceptical, I still have these amazing experiences. I've seen, I think I've added it up, nine ghosts or shadows.
Nine Ghostly Figures at St. Breville's Castle
00:40:00
Karin
So, you know, when you're in a ah dark cellar, there's no light source and you see the outline of the figure. And the only way you can describe it is the black is blacker than black.
00:40:15
Karin
It's bizarre. And one case, it was witnessed by someone else, and that was at St. Breville's Castle. But I think the fun is, oh, yeah I've been ploked, I've had my ponytail pulled.
00:40:27
Karin
But I think the two funniest ones, and that's what got me to decide a few years ago that why have ghosts got to be scary? was at a location in Birmingham and I was walking out half three in the morning in it and a man's voice and I could feel the whisper called me the rude W world.
00:40:47
Karin
and said it in such a piss-take way i put my case down i looked around no one's thrown their voice and i said being bristonian so apologies i said well that's bloody charming isn't it And I thought it was hilarious. And then recently, there's a location I i advise, a charity location called the Warbly Clock Tower outside Bristol.
00:41:10
Karin
And I was there with a few paranormal investigators. And I'm quite a busty person. And... I thought perhaps it was a moth, but it felt like a finger had just been pushed down between my boobs for a little grab. And I thought, no, no, it's got to be a moth. I can't see a moth. And then I felt a stroke behind the neck. And I said to my colleagues, I said, well, this ghost must have sunglasses and a white stick or either that he's desperate to come and choose me.
00:41:39
Karin
But I didn't mind at all because I get more than, you know, I wish my husband would do that alone against
00:41:48
Lee Hatfield
Oh, my God. So we've been talking about Jamaica Inn for some time, and we are coming towards
Favorite Investigation Locations and Experiments
00:41:55
Lee Hatfield
the end. But putting aside Jamaica Inn, what's one of your favorite locations that you've investigated and why?
00:42:06
Karin
The other one that I do the most is Wichester Mansion. I'm doing it twice. It's usually two or three times a year, private hire. And Chris Howley, he looks after that. His historical knowledge is fabulous.
00:42:21
Karin
And... We go there to do experiments. So one time we dressed up from different periods because obviously before Woodchester, it was a Georgian manch or georgian manor called Spring Park.
00:42:35
Karin
So someone dressed it up Victorian, Second World War. I was the Georgian cook because I had the figure for it, you see. So i was walking around saying, I burnt the guinea fowl again, me lord. You know, so...
00:42:50
Karin
We did that. It was an amazing night. And then we came back and we did World War II. So we all had military uniforms. Unfortunately, I couldn't get my backside into real English uniforms because there's a wonderful place in Froome called Bath Theatrical Costume Bar where they've been donated real uniforms from the Second World War.
00:43:14
Lee Hatfield
Oh,
00:43:14
Karin
So I was lucky enough to have coat of an English military policeman and my dad was one. It would have been what he would have worn in the nineteen fifty s And we had some really weird things. We if we first put all the clothing in a circle down in the library.
00:43:31
Karin
And we put motion activated boxes. So, you know, it could have been, you you know, low flying bat or seven because there's bats there. But they seem to respond on command when we were on the first floor.
00:43:44
Karin
And then we got dressed in it And one time the men were down in the cellar and Kev felt as if something was crawling up his leg. It was bizarre. Now, is that because we we chose a certain time period? We had fake cigarettes that look as if you were smoking, cards from the Second World War.
00:44:04
Karin
So we were reenacting when... The Americans, the Canadians and the English soldiers were there. And that's my favourite experiment. And Woodchester is an amazing place.
00:44:15
Karin
If it likes you, it plays with you. That's the only way can describe it. Same as the Jamaica Inn. It's like, OK, lads, here we go. Let's have some fun.
00:44:27
Lee Hatfield
That's a great story to finish with. And I can guarantee that the next time my wife and I come back to the UK, the Jamaica Inn will be on our list and we expect a personal guided tour by yourself.
00:44:41
Karin
That would be lovely.
00:44:43
Lee Hatfield
Okay, Corinne, it's been an absolute pleasure talking to you. Your stories have been amazing. i thoroughly enjoyed them. So I will say goodbye to now, but I'm sure we'll talk again in the very near future.
00:44:56
Lee Hatfield
Thanks very much.
00:44:56
Karin
Thank you.
00:44:57
Lee Hatfield
Take care. Bye-bye.
00:44:59
Karin
Bye-bye.