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Lost In The Battle - One Battle After Another
27 Plays1 month ago
Late to the game, but does it matter with a movie this good?
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Transcript
Celebrating Milestones & Podcast Beginnings
00:00:13
Speaker
If you've been listening to this podcast for a while, you must realize that we are on something like our 30th episode. And so if you were just sitting and binging them, you would be listening to one podcast episode after another. Welcome back to Lost the Frame. My name is Alex.
00:00:36
Speaker
My name is Malik. My name is Tachi.
Horror Movie Marathon Insights
00:00:38
Speaker
And we are officially out of Spooktober and into something-vember. We're in the clear.
00:00:46
Speaker
Woo! Tachi, are you recovering? I'm recovered. It was a tough month. It was a strange month. I've never watched that many horror movies in that small of a time frame.
00:00:58
Speaker
I think I watched at least like eight last month. Do you think I messed with you at all, like mentally? oh there's sometimes I'll imagine something is going to scare me as I like walk around a corner in my home.
00:01:14
Speaker
But, um, I try to shut it out. So i would you, and don't know if I've asked you this before, but you like to, you like to partake.
00:01:26
Speaker
I do like to partake. would Have you, or would you, And will you partake with ah like during a horror movie? I have. You have?
00:01:36
Speaker
I have. How is that? Because like when I used to, i drew a line in the sand. Like I never, i never did it. I thought it would be too much because I would just, I just get so like enveloped in a movie where I felt everything so much more.
00:01:51
Speaker
And I was like, I don't think I should do this with a horror movie.
Seasonal Transitions & Routine Disruptions
00:01:55
Speaker
it actually wasn't too bad. i think it was, um, the witch or the bitch, which is probably the worst one that I watched or the hardest to watch.
00:02:06
Speaker
Um, it was pretty disturbing, but, um, I think it went okay. I, I didn't have any sort of meltdown or, really bad reaction that's just chilling but spooked so well i had a good spooktober i enjoyed it that was a lot of fun good i i did enjoy it i i like challenging myself to do difficult things so Now we're on to the next challenge.
00:02:35
Speaker
Bigger, better, and brighter things as we are on the cusp of the Christmas season. It's now November, and it's getting dark at 530, and I hate it. I've been so tired this week.
00:02:46
Speaker
We need to abolish daylight savings. Yeah, I've been doing this, I started this new job. I've been doing this ah get up at 6 in the morning bit. I'm not having lot fun.
00:03:00
Speaker
And then it's dark when you're driving home, I'm sure. Um, well, that was because I love the office is 530 today. So. That's right. I feel like that'd be normal sometimes like five, five thirty, but even like five thirty, like it shouldn't be dark.
00:03:16
Speaker
It's the whole day you're spent gone. Yeah. Well, that's why. well that's why part of the reason why I'm getting up so early, because it's only like a 30 minute commute in. But um I don't have to be there till like nine.
00:03:29
Speaker
So. I'm doing my like workout in the morning. Getting your routine in before the day starts. Smart. Couldn't be me, but I respect it.
00:03:40
Speaker
I've tried. It's I'm not built for that. It's difficult. I'm a failure. You're not a failure.
Cinematic Reflections & Movie Analysis
00:03:47
Speaker
I was going. You're a little bit of a fit.
00:03:51
Speaker
I was going through some old pictures or like old like tweets or something. um And I saw like a couple of old text exchanges between you and me, Tachi. Oh, God. And there was one where I'm assuming we were roommates. And I was like, waking up at five, we're going to the gym.
00:04:08
Speaker
And you were like, really? And I was like, yes. And then your only response was why?
00:04:14
Speaker
sounds about right so i guess it's always been a struggle it has when i tried for a little bit um ah than that you guys see anything interesting recently i saw the palm d'or winner uh it was just an accident i saw you did yeah wow sick invite how was it indisposed i think That's okay.
00:04:37
Speaker
What'd you think? How is it? I liked it a lot. Yeah. You should go read my review for it right now on the podcast. Okay. I'll go to it right now. I heard a lot of good things for this movie coming out of con.
00:04:51
Speaker
What's it called? And, uh, it was just an accident. Hmm. And I'm very excited to see it. Oh man. If I could type properly one day, that would help.
00:05:03
Speaker
Let's see, Alex, four stars. Um,
00:05:10
Speaker
This is in another language, so... What did you do? I won't... It's actually somewhat relevant, sort of, so I won't tell you what it is until after you see it.
00:05:27
Speaker
Is this... What language is this? Persian. Persian? Yeah. listen how do you How do you say this? Urdu? Urdu?
00:05:38
Speaker
No, Urdu is udu like Pakistan. This is saying that it's in Urdu. No, this was Persian. Okay, well, I guess I won't translate It won't let me. Well, pretty good.
00:05:49
Speaker
How about you, Tachi? ah On Halloween night, I watched It Follows. I like that one. I can see kind of freaky. Yeah. Yeah.
00:06:00
Speaker
That puts the freak in freaky. It does. Uh, I can see why some people hate it. I can see why some people love it. I'm kind of torn in the middle. Um, probably need to rewatch it to have a better understanding of how I feel, but it was interesting.
00:06:15
Speaker
I think it has a lot of promising aspects to it. Um, and a neat premise. Um, Just a little strange of a story.
00:06:26
Speaker
You said to watch that one on Halloween? Yeah. Nice. I watched the new Chris Duckman movie Shelby Oaks recently. watched The Smashing Machine.
00:06:37
Speaker
I stood you up to watch Shelby Oaks. Yeah, i got stood up on Shelby Oaks on my way to the theater, so that was awesome. the ah when the Whenever the people come by to scanner tickets, they could see that I had two tickets.
00:06:49
Speaker
They're like, oh, is the other person coming? And I was like, no.
00:06:53
Speaker
say, no, he left me. Yeah. I was watching cinema. He was watching a football game. It was an incredible football game. Well, I need you to watch Shelby Oaks. It harmed Tachi. It That's okay.
00:07:07
Speaker
I need you to watch Shelby Oaks. I need to know what you guys think. Smashing Machine, and then I watch a Good Boy, that horror movie from the perspective of the dog. Succeeded at the premise. Story stretched super thin.
00:07:20
Speaker
Hmm. I feel like it'd be a good movie for like 20 minutes. That's what I was thinking. I would love like novella movies. know, like a novella. It's like a short, short novel.
00:07:31
Speaker
I wish kind of we we kind of get that with like Black Mirror. But like I would just appreciate like a like a 50 minute. You know, higher budget production. I don't need a TV show. i just yeah sometimes like just be perfect, like 60 minutes.
00:07:46
Speaker
Just like a quick premise. You're in and you're out. The movie was 73 minutes. So it was an hour, 13 minutes, which I thought was really nice. But it felt like ah it felt like a while.
00:07:57
Speaker
I'm not going to lie. it It was kind of a snore.
00:08:04
Speaker
But the dog was very cute. So good. I believe. Of those three, what was your favorite? oh Smashing. Okay. Barely. Just barely.
Box Office Trends & Personal Movie Stats
00:08:16
Speaker
believe we have some movie news we're getting we're getting back into the normal rhythm of things guys we are we are if you love spooktober sorry we'll be back revisit revisit us in a year yeah actually don't please continue this now we're still gonna do it we're gonna have spook july 2 um let's see let's see that month keeper is that the new osgood perkins movie yes it is i've seen a lot of the high praise for it i'm just managing expectations alex what do you think i feel like you're iffy on mr perkins
00:08:52
Speaker
We are between a o ah we between a long legs and a monkey situation. Oz good and Oz bad. Yeah. It could be Oz gover.
00:09:09
Speaker
We'll see. I hope it's good. and I also hope it's good. Is that one you want to see Tachi in theaters? Yeah, I want to keep trying to push my own personal envelope.
00:09:20
Speaker
Watch more. Watch more stuff. I think your numbers scary and think it comes out pretty soon. If I'm not mistaken. So we'll keep our eye on for that one. Tachi, you should watch Skin in the Rink. Should I?
00:09:31
Speaker
You should. I would love for you to join in on the conversations. All right. oh it's not It's not good. You'll be okay. It's interesting. It's neat. That's another one that could have just been or should have stayed at like 20 minutes. I think it was a short film.
00:09:45
Speaker
it It was a short film before it became a feature. Yeah. Should have kept it there. Oh, yeah. Not great reviews. ah Brendan Fraser and Rachel Wise returning for Mummy 4. Neat.
00:09:56
Speaker
Cool for all you mummy heads out there. Mummy heads rise. Do you guys get excited with these? i have quote unquote mummy issues. Hashtag mummy issues.
00:10:10
Speaker
ah Alex's camera is off right now. So it's just like a voice. He could be up to anything right now. wouldn't know.
00:10:19
Speaker
um Yeah, have I feel like my excitement level for these types of s sequels just is always on floor. It's going down. Yeah. Like, I think we're also getting, like, Gremlins 3.
00:10:30
Speaker
We are getting a Gremlins 3. Yeah, it's just a cash grab. Like, who is asking for Mummy 4? One crash grab after another.
00:10:40
Speaker
Sequel slop. ah Domestic box office for October was the worst in 27 years. I think that's my fault. It could be.
00:10:51
Speaker
um The Malik index was really down. Yeah. i I mean, how many times did I go to the theater in October? I missed so much. So we saw Perfect Blue and Shelby Oaks. I went to the theater twice.
00:11:05
Speaker
I went once. One, two, three, four times. Which is low.
00:11:16
Speaker
and is low. This month's not going any better. I've just been one time and it's already the, I guess it's the sixth. We'll catch you up. We'll catch up.
00:11:27
Speaker
We need to before the end of the year. I made a ah ah list on Letterboxd for the 2025 movies that I still need to watch. I've got 44 on there so far. Okay.
00:11:38
Speaker
And I've only seen 40 of the releases this year. so What am I at for this year? I'll share this list with you 35? I really got to get going. Yeah, I'm going to share this list with you guys so you can... I guess I'm just a loser.
00:11:52
Speaker
ah What else we got? Tachi, you want to read the next one? Sure. ah Robert Pattinson is currently working on 11 films in the next two years. Jeez. Or maybe including this year.
00:12:03
Speaker
Probably including this year. We're up. Yeah. 100%. We've never been more back. Can't wait. Live at. Oh, speaking of sequels, live action. Aladdin two is in the works.
00:12:18
Speaker
I actually was asking for this one. Why? I like the live action. Aladdin. I think it's good. and I think it was, it came out, I think after the Lion King and people were, you know, already not happy with how that one went.
00:12:34
Speaker
Um, but it was good. liked it. Hmm. Ladies and gentlemen, it is with tragic news that we were announcing that Tachi will no longer be on Lost in the Frame. unilateral decision.
00:12:47
Speaker
yeah I've never seen it. i just i just have no interest in the live actions, but I remember you saying that it was good. Of the live actions, it's one of the better ones.
00:12:58
Speaker
Okay. Will Smith returns? One of the few better ones. ah i think so, yeah. I think the the main three are returning. They should replace him with Chris Rock.
00:13:10
Speaker
Uh-oh. Aladdin.
00:13:17
Speaker
what else is there oh mason i don't know how to say that last name mason mason tames becomes the second actor since jim carrey to have three films hit the number one in the box office domestic box office in the same year wow so that was how to train your dragon live action the black phone 2 and then what's the third forgetting you or remembering you of those what it yeah i don't even know what that is the rom-com uh let me find it i think the only thing i saw of that is that it had uh that kind of tanked on rotten tomatoes if i'm not mistaken but i don't know anything about it but they all tank on rotten tomatoes and they're all garbage regretting you i was wrong
00:13:58
Speaker
reg regretting you yeah yeah i regret watching that movie hey oh i haven't seen it it's future you talking after you watch it uh yeah shout out good job good job mason uh yeah that's kind of huge that is big since jim carrey wow yeah since 1994 i like the black phone too by the way need to watch it i don't know if guys have seen it i i enjoyed it i thought that was going to be another one of those just like cash grab sequels because like Blackphone has an ending like it ends.
00:14:29
Speaker
It ends just fine. And so whenever they announced it, I was just like, oh, that's just the they're just doing it just to make a little bit of extra money. But for a sequel, I mean, like I had something to say, it kind of expanded on the world and and enjoyed it.
00:14:45
Speaker
It's great seeing Ethan Hunt in a different type role. Ethan Hunt grabber. That's like Ethan Hunt. Yes. Ethan Hawk. That would be crazy. That would be. Ethan Hunt in the Blackphone universe.
00:14:59
Speaker
Imagine picking up the phone and it's like, you just have to trust me one more time. i just going to grab you one more time.
00:15:13
Speaker
Michael, teaser trailer. Hee hee hee.
00:15:19
Speaker
I can't deal with this not being able to see him. It's kind of scary. um
Halloween Traditions & Community Stories
00:15:25
Speaker
What do you guys think of it? I haven't watched it. All right, cool. It looks promising. I'm not really huge fan of biopics, but we'll see.
00:15:38
Speaker
Speaking of biopics, I think that Springsteen movie is doing great. No interest. I haven't heard. and it like it came out, and it's just been crickets, I feel. I actually heard it's doing decent in the box office, which is really surprising.
00:15:51
Speaker
That is really surprising. I mean, I feel... Yeah, I mean, I guess, like, for general honesty, it's like biopics kind of get people to theaters. Whether this Michael movie is good or not, it's gonna make a bajillion dollars.
00:16:04
Speaker
and what's like here I can guarantee that. A jack-sillion.
00:16:11
Speaker
But I'll watch it. Is this where Michael Jackson announces he hasn't been dead this whole time? Yeah, that be sick. Michael will return. Yeah. Michael has returned.
00:16:23
Speaker
Pops out of your screen. he All right. You guys ready for this movie review? Let's do it. What movie are we reviewing? One battle after another.
00:16:36
Speaker
one month ish after it came out sorry this is a great movie we wanted to find the time to talk about it spooktober got in the way and so we make the rules here so we're gonna talk about it and i'm excited to talk about it um i'll read the synopsis real quick 2025, we all know this, directed by Paul Thomas Anderson.
00:16:58
Speaker
When their evil nemesis resurfaces after 16 years, a band of ex-revolutionaries reunite to rescue the daughter of one of their own. Starring Leonardo DiCaprio, Sean Penn, Chase Infinity, Benicio Del Toro, Tiana Taylor, and more.
00:17:15
Speaker
So it's been a month. did Moore play? Moore played the rest of them. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So like we said, it's been a little over a month since we've seen it. I feel like I've been thinking about it.
00:17:27
Speaker
It pops into my head every few days. I got a shirt. I got a shirt from TikTok. It says a few small beers after another. Nice. so but I dressed up as Bob for Halloween like three times. I was surprised to see the amount of Bob Ferguson costumes on TikTok.
00:17:42
Speaker
Why? It's so low effort. It's low effort, but I was just, I don't know. I don't know. I shouldn't have been surprised, but the best one that I did see was a couple that dressed as the, uh, like the, the homing device, like the trust device. Yeah. Trust device.
00:17:56
Speaker
They hit, they built them at home and they were both the trust device. And i was like, that's cool. Like they took the high road because like, yeah, the Bob Ferguson one, it is low effort. It's great. Low effort. They put me, me being low effort was why no one showed up to trick or treat at my house.
00:18:11
Speaker
oh is that true yes i bought 34 of candy and nobody showed up do you still have candy i have a ton of candy you had lights on and everything yes no i yeah i left the lights off like come to the door day my my door light and my garage light were on dang maybe kids just don't be trick-or-treating like that anymore it's over It's all about trunk or treat now.
00:18:39
Speaker
What is that? More like trumper tree. Oh, God. Trunk or treat is when a bunch of cars just pull up in a parking lot and they have the candy in the back of their cars and the kids are just walking around the parking lot.
00:18:53
Speaker
Frankly, I think if you advocate for that, you need to be beaten to death. Yeah, that that was popularized because of COVID and now it just won't stop. it's It literally... Never heard of it. All all it does...
00:19:06
Speaker
Not to derail this episode, but I'm going to derail the episode. Cool. There was something so electric and like freeing and liberating about like when you were a kid and the one night of the year that you could just run around the neighborhood with no supervision. Yeah.
00:19:25
Speaker
You felt a little bit like a rebel, like in the movie, one battle after another. True. One house, after one trick or treat house after another. That's what it was like. You were dressed up.
00:19:37
Speaker
I went as like a sniper one year and my buddy went as something else. So I was running around with a Nerf rifle in Narragansett, Rhode Island. You know what? That was electric. You can't do that anymore because I would get shot.
00:19:50
Speaker
Yeah. it was cool i do feel so like trick-or-treating wasn't a thing for me growing up so i just never had like the most i knew about it was just like from like movies and tv and i will say i feel as the years have gone on i'm not surprised to hear that like less and less kids like there's just more dead neighborhoods like i've seen videos about it too um i was in california for halloween um we were driving around and like I saw like droves of of kids and their parents trick-or-treating and like I don't think I've ever seen that before and it was just really it was really cool good I'm glad to hear that so it's alive some places and so many people I think I told you guys but so many people had like projectors on their driveways playing the Dodgers game and just like groups of people just stopped trick-or-treating and they're are just all watching the game like huddled around like multiple people's driveways
00:20:46
Speaker
Electric.
'One Battle After Another' - Audience Reception
00:20:47
Speaker
It was electric. Let's get to our Letterboxd love, like, and loathe. Alex has got our five-star Tachi with the three. Oh, yeah. And me with the one. I'm going to do a little bit of a preface.
00:20:57
Speaker
ah This review does contain a spoiler, so just be forewarned. ah This review comes from J, like the letter J, not the name J. Sean Penn coming back as the Terminator just to say he was reverse raped by a semen demon had me cackling.
00:21:20
Speaker
Five stars.
00:21:23
Speaker
That's valid. I sympathize with that review. That's me. All right. For the like review, three stars from Josh Rowley.
00:21:37
Speaker
Funny, gross, overlong, overscored, simple, uneven, unsubtle, well cast, well crafted, well shot.
00:21:51
Speaker
What a rollercoaster of a review. Sure. So mixed bag. Yes. i guess I guess it aligns. It's mostly accurate, I think. One star comes from user Duffy.
00:22:03
Speaker
Gonna be brave and say this movie was legit bad. Could have cut out two thirds of the script and had made a hit. Literally considered walking out during the first few scenes just felt so disgusted and violated and turns out it was for no real reason plot wise at all.
00:22:19
Speaker
What? So if you wanted to cut out two thirds of the script, but you were already considering walking out in the beginning, what did you like? Who knows? They were cutting out one third after another.
00:22:33
Speaker
The puns won't stop. just one pun after another. Alex is electric when he's like towards peak tiredness. That's when he just rips these one liners.
00:22:45
Speaker
If we were recording over the weekend while I'm at this conference in Virginia, it would be incredible.
00:22:52
Speaker
Get your boss on the pod. See what their letterbox... He probably would. See what their letterbox top four are. tuck Tron Aries in the office. Yeah. I still need to see that one. um What were your guys' expectations going into this?
00:23:05
Speaker
I think since I was unfamiliar with um Paul Thomas Anderson, I wasn't really sure what to expect. um I just knew that it was garnering a lot of hype once the the premiere happened and those early reviews started pouring in.
00:23:23
Speaker
so i was hoping for a really good movie. and And that's just kind of it. I didn't know anything about the plot or anything. i this was one of my favorite movies. I've said this way before, like many times before in the pod.
00:23:36
Speaker
Um, this was one of my most anticipated movies the year. And to prepare for this, I read, Thomas Pynchon's book Vineland, which this movie is loosely based off of. Um, it's not a one for one, but, uh, so that book set my expectations about what this plot was going to be like going in.
00:23:54
Speaker
um and we will discuss after. what I thought.
Book vs. Movie: 'Vineland' Adaptation
00:24:00
Speaker
Yeah, I actually kind of want to kick it off with that, if you wouldn't mind. So all following the movie, since since you read the book, you had some, some comments just regarding the adaptation as a whole. So I'd love if you could kind of talk about the book and maybe its themes to kick off the, just our general, our, our feelings on one battle after another.
00:24:25
Speaker
Stop making me talk about the podcast on my podcast. I'm sorry. God.
00:24:35
Speaker
So Vineland is, ah one of Thomas Pynchon's most popular books. I'd say his, like the most popular one is also a Paul Thomas Anderson movie, uh, Inherent Vice.
00:24:48
Speaker
And from what I understand, Inherent Vice pretty much a one-to-one adaptation. yeah, Both those books are fairly similar in the fact that they dealt with counterculture and the reaction by the masses and, you know, Big Brother-ish in how they reacted to the counterculture movement. ah They do so in very, very different ways.
00:25:16
Speaker
ah Vineland specifically... um follows a character named Zoid.
00:25:28
Speaker
Zoid is the, it starts off, you know, following Zoid and then his daughter Prairie. And it runs fairly similar to the plot of one battle after another outside of a few different things.
00:25:42
Speaker
um Their life is kind of invaded by this uh reagan nixonian you know war on drugs personified uh and completely turns everything upside down and as the book progresses you kind of figure out how things got this way the book is very very different from the movie uh like the skeleton is there but ah the body looks completely different this book is also insane It's really dense.
00:26:13
Speaker
It took me like three months to read it. ah Thomas Pynchon, just something about the way he writes. It really takes like you got to read a page twice to fully grasp it. um You got to go back like, what? What did I miss? And then you get like, it's it's really you're slogging through.
00:26:28
Speaker
He's very, very talented writer, um but his books are a slog. They you got to work for him. Um, he's almost like the, he's probably the closest thing I've seen to like reading Russian literature by an American because Russian books are very, very dense as well. It took me like a year to read Brothers Karamazov and I really enjoyed it, but it, oh my goodness, it will, it'll take you a long time if you're not like a giga reader or something.
00:26:57
Speaker
The book is nuts. There are things that happen that are unadaptable to the big screen without, I think, losing the general audience. I won't really say what they are because I think it's pretty much worth a read.
00:27:13
Speaker
But I'll give you a hint. Ninjas, Ghosts, and probably Godzilla.
00:27:22
Speaker
Okay. Yeah. I'm hooked. Yeah. um And it's, you know, the theme really is about the ah the government's response to the ah to counterculture via the war on drugs um and how they wormed their way into that arm of society.
00:27:46
Speaker
It's
Character Dynamics: Perfidia & Lockjaw
00:27:47
Speaker
a it's a very good anti-authority book, um and I think it's very multifaceted, especially the way it depicts a lot of its characters. um There are one to ones for basically every one of these characters in the ah in the movie, save for a few.
00:28:05
Speaker
um But ah really the biggest players are Zoid is Bob. So Zoid is Leonardo DiCaprio's character. a Prairie is Willa. um Steven Lockjaw is a guy named Brock Vond.
00:28:19
Speaker
And ah Perfidia is Frenessy. Frenessy is her name and I don't know if that's how you really pronounce it but um that's what it looks like so I'm gonna go with Frenessy and i don't know if we want to jump more into your thoughts before I talk about the differences and where I had a big problem um Yeah, let's know yeah like we we can talk about kind of the i guess like the overall structure of the themes of the book and what Paul Thomas Anderson took from that and adapted into the movie and how that plays a part.
00:28:57
Speaker
um I had a quote from PTA because yeah after we saw the movie, you had made that comment and then you told me about like the Ghost Ninjas and ninja't Godzilla and I was just like... What do you mean? So like that got me really interested to want to read the book. So I was curious to see if there was anything that PTA had said regarding adapting this book into the movie and and what he saw as kind of giving him that skeleton for for making one battle after another. So His quote reads, Vineland was a story that I loved very much, and there was a central premise that we stole.
00:29:28
Speaker
What happens when revolutionaries scatter, and what happens when one of them ends up in the Northern California woods and the past comes back to haunt them. But rather than directly adapt the book, I just took what I needed and combined it with some of my other stories and just started running with it over the years.
00:29:44
Speaker
So pretty how you're describing just the overall with how you're describing um just the overall narrative themes i guess when it comes to the movie um like you were saying the main theme is like the government having this war like against counterculture we follow this group of revolutionaries the french 75 and we can kick it off there the opening of this movie the first 20 to 30 minutes is seeing the french 75 in action and i thought it was electric
00:30:19
Speaker
I thought this movie opened so good. I loved it. It flowed really well. It's nice to watch for a three hour movie. I think this entire movie flows very well. Like it did not feel like it.
00:30:32
Speaker
And I honestly did not want it to end. I was on, I was on board. It just had me hooked from, from beginning to end. You wanted more battles. so Give me the next battle. Do they know that there's another battle after this one?
00:30:45
Speaker
um i there's a lot to talk about with this movie so i guess we can just start with we'll start with performances we'll kick it off with perfidia confusing threatening threatening is a good one threatening confusing what's confusing about her I didn't have a queer picture of her motivations really until I guess the end of it.
00:31:10
Speaker
She, i guess it was a little self-serving, ah despite wanting to continue fighting, uh, this like bigger fight.
00:31:22
Speaker
Um, so that was interesting. I did some dimensions to her, but. I will say as much as I thought the perfidia performance was very good, I think ah her character was basically ruined.
00:31:37
Speaker
Why do you think she was ruined? Like in comparison to the book? In comparison to the book, yeah. Is she a lot more present in the book? Like, I don't know. the the book is largely told in a lot of flashbacks, um especially in regards to the relationship between Perfidia and Lockjaw.
00:31:55
Speaker
um And the changes that I think Paul Thomas Anderson did with that were frankly horrific.
00:32:06
Speaker
Strong words. Very strong words. I was like floored at how much he ruined what was my favorite part of the book. Interesting.
00:32:19
Speaker
Yeah, I guess I would have to read the book to to have the other side of that. I mean, but for the movie's sake, like, I think Tiana Taylor did a fantastic job. She did. She killed it.
00:32:30
Speaker
She killed it. Like, she there's not a lot of screen time, like, less than 10 minutes of total screen time that she has, but every second Dare i say she captivated the screen when she was on it. She commanded it. I was thoroughly impressed.
00:32:41
Speaker
Yeah, every site every second she was on was just, she was just locked in. For sure. even though we don't get a lot of her character physically in the movie, her presence just feels felt throughout, like, the entire runtime.
00:32:58
Speaker
Like, she's the catalyst for a majority of what this of what happens over the three hours. Immediately kicking off with this, like, weird relationship with Lockjaw. Yes. Yeah.
00:33:11
Speaker
Like it, it plays funny, but it's just all just like looking back at it. Like, it's just, I mean, I guess I would say that it's confusing and it's also kind of threatening and it's, it's just like uncomfortable.
00:33:26
Speaker
Do you like black chicks? I love black chicks. Sean Penn in this movie, which we'll get into. I don't even think he was acting. I think this just a bit and they filmed around it.
00:33:39
Speaker
He's so good in this. Yeah, he is. But for Perfidia, like, I really appreciate that even with the minimal screen time that her presence has just felt so much throughout the movie. And I think it caps off really nice in the end with the letter.
00:33:55
Speaker
Would you be able to see it kind of like... Like, outside of the book, Alex, is there... I don't know. Is there like any like resolution to how you feel? Or is it just because you are aware of the stark differences between the book and the movie?
00:34:13
Speaker
What do you mean? Like resolution to the story or to like perfidia, like as a character, character like she's kind of disappears. Yeah, i did I didn't love that. I did not love that. I just I thought it was almost like a cop out.
00:34:26
Speaker
Oh, we forgot about her character. Like. Whoops. I kept waiting for a comeback. yeah And it just never came. I was too. i was I was too. We'll put it that way.
00:34:40
Speaker
I don't even know if the movie would have been better off with that, but it is what I just kept expecting because like you said, Malik, her presence was felt throughout the entirety of the film. um And I don't know if part of that is just me wanting her to come back because she was great on screen, but um yeah, don't know. It was just strange that she just disappears.
00:35:00
Speaker
What we think about Perfidia's Lockjaw's relationship? We can get into that a little bit because while weird, also felt kind of mutual.
00:35:11
Speaker
Yes. It's so...
00:35:18
Speaker
human I think because it is so weird and layered and i don't know, like animals don't do this sort of stuff. Humans are so particularly weird when it comes to relationships and things they're into. And but I've seen dogs hump stuffed animals. They absolutely do this stuff. Yeah.
00:35:40
Speaker
Yeah, on an emotional Yeah. ands i've seen chimpanzees do things you wouldn't believe. I don't know how you keep finding yourself in these situations, but... I just go in the woods and there they are.
00:35:56
Speaker
Yeah, no, it was um it was shocking when they actually started hooking up. And um I don't know, because at least to me,
00:36:08
Speaker
my interpretation was that she was just using him but then it was like is she only using him so i know yeah it just feels like there's a lot of there's obviously a lot of external battles throughout this movie but immediately there's so many internal battles um one external battle after an internal battle and the whole thing with like perfidian lockjaw just catapults the rest of the story into her kind of fumbling the ah the bank heist, her turning in ah other members of the Front 75, forcing them all to to separate, yeah and and ultimately like making the choice and leaving Bob and her daughter to kind of fend for themselves just to give herself a little bit of safety. And so, I don't know, there's just there's so many...
00:37:03
Speaker
There's just so many conflicts going on within this, which is why I think the movie works and is so interesting. I think that my biggest problem with the relationship between and you you did hit the nail on the head. it Like it seemed mutual in the book. It's mutual, like explicitly mutual.
00:37:23
Speaker
and what Perfidia does is. Like it actually toned down what she does in the movie. In terms of betrayal. And the way she goes about in the book is so like subtle and like thought out and well executed. it's like, whoa.
00:37:47
Speaker
Here, it just, it felt so rushed. Do you think we need to see the details of her, of her betrayal? Because I mean,
00:37:58
Speaker
I mean, books movies are two completely different mediums, and so I feel like... Well, in this case, like, if you had kept it one-to-one, you would have, or else it wouldn't have made sense. Uh-huh. In the movie, like, it's hard because they're so different in terms of...
00:38:15
Speaker
how they actually go about hitting plot points. But the problem for, at least for me is the aspects I held in the highest regard were some of the ones that had the most change on screen, which I did not expect.
00:38:29
Speaker
And I really think, especially the theme of Vineland as a book, I really thought it hit home with how the perfidia lock jaw relationship happened.
00:38:43
Speaker
and what she does and the the fallout of that. i I really, really was like, whoa. And here it just felt like it didn't feel like it had that kind of gravity.
Favorite Scenes & Performance Highlights
00:38:58
Speaker
It just affected like ah bunch of people we had no relationship to. Really like Elena Haim. Okay. Like she's wearing a wig. That's all I know about it.
00:39:13
Speaker
But in the book, when you really find out at that point, there's so much emotional weight carried, you're just like, oh, man. You're bread crumbed all the way to like this reveal. And then it's just like, whoa, like, how are you going to get around that?
00:39:27
Speaker
Yeah.
00:39:30
Speaker
With the character of Lockjaw between the book and the movie, since it seems like there's a lot more, that Profitia at least is a lot more fleshed out in the book, what are the like the the main differences between Lockjaw and the movie and the book? like Is there still this...
00:39:49
Speaker
this internal struggle that, that he has because like, I mean, throughout the entire movie, he's wrestling with himself for like wanting to be one accepted by like this, this club that he's trying to get into the Christmas Adventurers club. That's like, that's like his whole stick.
00:40:04
Speaker
And then I also feel like he's just like trying to fight this urge that he has in his, attraction, black chicks. Yeah, and his attraction to Perfidia. And so do we see like, do you see a lot of that um internal battle within Lockjaw in the book as well?
00:40:19
Speaker
No, I'm going to put it this way. Lockjaw in the movie is a complete clown. Lockjaw in the book, Brock Vond is like Anton levels of intimidating and scary.
00:40:31
Speaker
Like you can feel him coming like three pages before he shows up. I kind of like that Lockjaw is the butt of the joke in this movie, though. It works, and I think, in the context of this movie, but I think for the theme they were trying to deliver, i felt like like a strong Brock Vond character would have been more appropriate.
00:40:51
Speaker
And I i am like the only one that thinks this. I don't know if he was a total clown. Oh, he was a complete... No, this like come if you compare the two, like complete clown Like Vond was a guy who like got stuff done and was like scary efficient. Like he was even like other agents in the book who worked for the government, like spoke of Brock Vond and like whispers.
00:41:21
Speaker
He was just like this force, this, this menace. And it made sense why perfidious character would go along with it.
00:41:34
Speaker
But just because of the overall confidence that he was carrying yeah in this one. Yeah, he just. He just is like that he's such a loser. He's such a loser. And yeah, like these people in real life, they're losers.
00:41:49
Speaker
But. You know. I just i I did not like that. He was such a clown like it didn't again. And one thing I will say is I need to rewatch this movie. I need to rewatch in the lens of this is what the movie is about.
00:42:06
Speaker
This is what the movie is going to be like. Divorce your thoughts of the book and just watch the flipping movie. I owe the movie that I was so excited about it and I liked it Like I'm being really negative right now. I really like this movie.
00:42:19
Speaker
Like, it's good. it's It hasn't really left my mind since I watched it. I liked it. This is a good movie, and I think everybody should go watch it. But I almost am having, like, 301-level problems with it that no one else is having.
00:42:34
Speaker
I am so alone. i have seen no one talk about this, except for myself. You're just staring at the wall. Even like old man yells at cloud.
00:42:45
Speaker
Even trusted friends of the pod I've had the conversation with are saying the same exact things as you guys. what it's like Well, I liked he was a clown. what's like But I didn't. And that's a problem.
00:42:56
Speaker
I'm having my own battles. One after another. Let's talk about some of our favorite scenes and moments. kick it off because I've been so negative. Okay.
00:43:08
Speaker
The car chase. Fantastic. I love the car chase. It's so good that honestly, that whole sequence start to end is so good. I would stop thinking about it. It's so good.
00:43:20
Speaker
the hills it's insane perspective yeah oh my god and the silence i was driving to a pumpkin patch and we were just there's just like a small hill like coming up you could see the hills yeah and i pointed i was just like one battle after another it's here i've never been so excited to look at it it went on so long They're driving along and they're going through these windy curves and these hills and up and down up and down. There's just one hill after another.
00:43:50
Speaker
in IMAX, it was so cool. Oh, yeah, dude. In IMAX, it was just insane. Nice. It was so good. um Bob running through the city.
00:44:02
Speaker
That was fun. Yeah, that was good. That was a fun one. I wasn't expecting the end of that sequence, though. When he falls? Yes. He immediately tased. That scene was shot in El Paso.
00:44:13
Speaker
Nice. Shout out. Shout out. Out in the West Texas town of El Paso. Yeah, I remember hearing Leonardo DiCaprio fell off the roof. I remember hearing a few years ago that Leo was shooting a movie in El Paso and I was like, what's that going to be?
00:44:28
Speaker
Why are what do they need to be doing there? There's nothing there. They did a great job. For sure. Yeah. It was fun action sequence. It was. Tachi, other favorite scene moment.
00:44:41
Speaker
uh yeah hills came to mind um beginning sequence with the raid on the uh i guess don't know immigration compound um that was great leo is so good in this movie the entire sequence of him not remembering the password on the phone that was a good bet with the french 75 is so funny the frustration his face We got a new generational reaction meme. reaction shouldn meme but valid.
00:45:14
Speaker
ah would Leo has had one from like every movie he's done. Like the last five or something like that. I feel like this performance of his, like, comparatively, or I guess, like, he he's he does a great job in transforming into and into all of these different roles and characters that he does.
00:45:33
Speaker
And I feel like this one was pretty tame from ah transformation standpoint, but... is one of my favorites. Like he just completely nails it and steals the screen and is just also kind of pathetic, but enduring and wanting to get Willa back in in his actions and what he does.
00:45:57
Speaker
there's one scene right before the hill chase starts and he's he's driving around and he pulls over and there's some guys on the side of the road and he's trying to see like which direction the car went. And he, I don't i don't know why i like it so much, but it's just like he does this like whistle.
00:46:12
Speaker
Just like, oh, oh buty but i can't go by like whatever, the way he's yelling, it's just, it's so good. just Just these little things that he does in his performance that that make this so enjoyable for me.
00:46:24
Speaker
When we did our Oscar prediction episode, the site picked a name, and God has it aged so good. That is my girl, Chase Infinity. Oh my God, she kills it. She is fantastic. She is the star of the movie. Yes.
00:46:40
Speaker
She's so goaded. For her first real like big screen performance, she was in that... um She was in that Apple TV show with Jake Gyllenhaal. What was it?
00:46:53
Speaker
Declared innocent or something. oh yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember. Reasonable doubt or something like that. Worth the watch. And she was fine in that. like
00:47:04
Speaker
She just blew away my expectations. And I picked her as the best supporting actress over like a ton of seasoned actresses. That pick is going to age very well.
00:47:16
Speaker
I should have put money on it. Like, that's how much I was like, this pick was so goaded. There's got to be like a prize picks website for movie nominations. It's it's probably just prize picks.
00:47:29
Speaker
Oh, they're not just football? No, but like, po maybe Polymarket.
00:47:37
Speaker
We should get in that, guys. We can make a lot of money. We're actually pretty good predictors. Our last couple like Oscar predictions have all been like, I think I got like 19 for the Anora year and I got like 16 the year before that.
00:47:53
Speaker
Yeah. I got like half right and I didn't even watch half the movies. So not bad. I'm going to have to re-listen to our Oscar predictions episode and write down what we said when whenever we come back to it.
00:48:04
Speaker
There were a couple that I know for sure are not happening. Yeah. Just based on like reactions to movies I've heard. After the hunt. Yeah. After the hunt. Yeah. After the hunt. I'm like our second highest movie or something. It just...
00:48:18
Speaker
I don't think we're going to see anything from the Smashing Machine. Yeah. Like, I don't even feel that strong in maybe seeing The Rock for a performance there. I don't know. but got a lot We got a lot more to shake out, though. Are we about to find out which Safdie really had the sauce? We are. Because Marty Supreme is... It's getting...
00:48:39
Speaker
It's growing. Yeah. The hype is real for Marty Supreme. Supreme heads. I guess I can't really ask this, but I mean, do you think Timmy could surpass, do you think he could surpass Bob?
00:48:56
Speaker
Like, based on what you've seen Timothee Chalamet do, do you think he could beat Leo's performance of Bob in like a head-to-head?
00:49:09
Speaker
For Madri Supreme? Yeah. I don't know because it's just... I mean, going into one battle after another, like... feel like the trailer kept things pretty vague. You got a good just vibe for what the movie is like going to look like in the world that you're going to be in. But like, like you said earlier, Tachi, like from a story perspective, had no idea like what to expect.
00:49:32
Speaker
Didn't know what to expect from like Bob Ferguson as a character. Marty Supreme. I also kind of don't really know. He's a world renowned ping pong champion. Yeah.
00:49:42
Speaker
And I think on paper it sounds so stupid, but I just know it's going to hit. So I don't know. I don't know if I feel comfortable putting money there yet.
00:49:54
Speaker
I'm going to, I'm going to do something and I'm going to say that he wins. Really? Yeah. I'm going to that Timmy will win best actor.
00:50:05
Speaker
That would be crazy. That's crazy. I love it though. And if I lose, um, or if I'm wrong, we, you can decide my punishment. No, even if you're wrong, two nights in the ex house I'll be busy Even if you're wrong, Timmy's, Timmy's here to stay.
00:50:23
Speaker
And we'll be from, from what we've seen. it It's certainly in the realm of possibility that he will outperform Leo. Is it likely? I don't know, but it is a possibility. And I think it'd be really fun if he won.
00:50:36
Speaker
Only time will tell. Yeah. um I want to go back to Chase really quick though. I really, really, really love the scene with her and Lockjaw in the church.
00:50:48
Speaker
Great scene. That was really tense. Really well done. was awesome. Shout out Lockjaw's walk.
00:50:56
Speaker
How do you learn to walk like that? He has a saunter to him. He's got something. The saunter. He's got the the the lick in the comb. He's got the problems. think Sean Penn is just an actor in Lockjaw.
00:51:11
Speaker
Or no, he's just a character in Lockjaw as the actor.
00:51:15
Speaker
The real side of him came out. He does suck, so it wouldn't be like that far the truth. Anything else you guys want to shout out? or any least favorite scenes? I've been trying to think of a least favorite scene.
00:51:28
Speaker
um i don't think I... I can't. And I won't. I don't know if I have a least favorite. We only lightly touched on Benicio.
00:51:40
Speaker
I really like their their friendship. Their almost immediate friendship. um tell That was cool. Well, I guess it wasn't immediate. he They didn't know each other. but Yeah. The thing with Benicio that I think I really like um is, again, like the subtlety of his character. So we've got this whole movie's about these these revolutionaries, Benicio included.
00:52:04
Speaker
And we see in the beginning the French 75 and kind of the way that they do things. They do things very loud. They meet violence with violence. that That's their type of revolution. There's no there's really no no peace to it.
00:52:19
Speaker
On the flip side... Once the dust is kind of settled, it feels like those things that they tried to accomplish had only gone so far.
00:52:30
Speaker
Whereas with Benicio's character, it's a lot more, it's just like, it's quieter. You know, like he's still partaking in the revolution and he's he's housing these people and he's got like a whole network of family and friends and and immigrants that he's helping shelter.
00:52:52
Speaker
He's got friends in so many places. He's got friends in the hospital that help Bob escape ultimately. He's got ah um like numerous escape
Music Score & Technical Achievements
00:53:02
Speaker
routes. like I just really like that we see both sides of revolution between the French 75 and the sensei.
00:53:10
Speaker
yeah So he doesn't do or say too much in the movie, but what he does I think is very effective and something that I just really appreciated out of his performance.
00:53:22
Speaker
And he gave me my favorite quote from it after he gets pulled over by the cops. I'm like, sir, have you been drinking? A little bit. How much have you had? A few small beers.
00:53:33
Speaker
Yeah, that's a great point that you made, is that his his rebellion was was built through love, and it's something that's sustainable. Yeah. Whereas the Front of 75 was very reactionary, violent, you know built through hatred. Yeah.
00:53:50
Speaker
And it's not to say that either one is wrong or would with one is better than the other. It's just interesting how many different like facets of revolution can exist within. One the other say?
00:54:01
Speaker
Yes. I caught myself and I was like, no. hurt hear everything. They're not even puns anymore. It's just how we speak. um But i just like how like multifaceted it is um through multiple different lenses in the movie.
00:54:15
Speaker
Anything else that you guys want to shout out? The music, we haven't talked about the music at all. It was playing, what, like constantly? Yeah, constantly. Johnny Greenwood, him and m PTA are cooking together. The ah the Phantom Thread soundtrack was his, and I thought it was fantastic as i also love the Phantom Thread soundtrack.
00:54:35
Speaker
Yeah, Tachi, I would implore you to to check out um some of PTA's other films. Okay. I'm almost okay with not getting any more Radiohead albums because Johnny Greenwood is just doing soundtracks now. Yeah, that was something I was about to say. i had no idea that's who it was and until after this movie.
00:54:57
Speaker
And it makes a lot of sense. Now, I disagree with your statement on not receiving another Radiohead album because I would like one. No, that's what I'm saying. Like,
00:55:08
Speaker
But like if we're going to, you know, because we're not going to get one because it just seems like we're not going to get one. um You should just keep scoring movies. Yeah, I got it.
00:55:20
Speaker
I'd like to live in a world where we get both, though. I would like another Radiohead album. Same, same. Final verdict. I need to see it again. I hope they re-release it in IMAX.
00:55:32
Speaker
I bet they will. I bet when it gets nominated, they will. That seems to be a common theme that the Oscar movies always get yeah put back in. Malik, did you like the color grading?
00:55:45
Speaker
Why do you say that with a smile? I'm just curious. Is because of the one car movie? Yes. One car movie after.
00:55:57
Speaker
Yes, I thought this movie looked very good. Good. It very pleasing on the eye. I honestly, yeah, I just really don't have anything bad to say about this movie.
00:56:08
Speaker
Spoiler alert. It's my second favorite so far of the year. What's your number one? Twenty eight. Years goaded later. Goated pick. Yeah, it's my third right now.
00:56:19
Speaker
What's my top five? Warfare is one. 28 is two. Okay. Tachi, have you ever shuffled around at all? oh I don't remember what my rankings were, so i'm not I can't answer that right now.
00:56:30
Speaker
and That's fine. What are you guys' ratings? I know you guys' ratings. I gave this 4.5. Easy four from me. easy four from me I don't know if it's 4.5 level, but maybe after a rewatch, it could be.
00:56:47
Speaker
Four out of five for me. um But I do need to rewatch it because like I said, I just, I can't stop thinking about it. And maybe that's just me trying to delude myself into giving it ah five out of five so I can be a part of the gang.
00:57:01
Speaker
But um just live your truth. Yeah.
Final Thoughts & Ratings
00:57:05
Speaker
Honestly, that's my truth is that Brock Vaughn was so goaded and such a great character and everybody is against me.
00:57:13
Speaker
i am the only true rebel there is. okay you want to talk about the revolution i am the revolution before you better than everybody before you end the episode can you just give us a little snippet into what you mean by god maybe godzilla in vineland what um so like okay so the the uh The sensei character is kind of like three or four characters smushed into one.
00:57:41
Speaker
One of them is this Japanese guy who gets pulled into the story in like this very crazy way that involves Brock fond. And he works at like this company that does like data science testing of things of stuff.
00:57:59
Speaker
And, um, Basically what I remember is there's this giant footprint in Japan that looks like a dinosaur footprint that they're in. And they think it's a prank, but then it's like, oh, it could be genuine. And it's, then they just never talk about it again.
00:58:15
Speaker
Interesting. And then they're like sitting in this crater and and, you know, there's only one thing that could make a footprint that big in Japan. And it's, uh, it's my boy, big G.
00:58:30
Speaker
Speaking of big G. Minus zero. Godzilla minus zero. We're back. I'm in. I'm so in. Do you think if I go to Japan when Godzilla minus zero comes out, they'll have a screening in English subtitles?
00:58:48
Speaker
eaten No. Yes. I think. One time when I was in Japan, we watch we went to a movie theater and I'm pretty sure my movie had subtitles. so Really?
00:59:00
Speaker
I think so. And it wasn't, it was a new release. That would be so, but I don't know. I can't say that with certainty. Imagine Japan.
00:59:11
Speaker
It might be, I might be the first person to be going to Japan specifically for media related reasons and it not be weaving out over something or because of Godzilla.
00:59:22
Speaker
Maybe what it was is it was you English dub with the Japanese subtitles. I think that's more likely. That's heinous. Why are they watching the English dub?
00:59:33
Speaker
I don't know. That's actually heinous.
00:59:38
Speaker
It wasn't a Japanese movie. It was an American movie. Oh, well, that's not dub. That's just the audio. Yeah. Sorry. yeah you you i dub yeah You said dub and that threw me off. i was like, why would they do a Japanese movie with an English dub? No, the the the original release with Japanese subtitles.
00:59:57
Speaker
You know, apparently there's like a small contingent of Japanese King of the Hill fans. And like anime fans, they argue. About whether the subbed or dubbed version is better of King of the Hill of King. There's only like three Japanese release seasons, like officially.
01:00:15
Speaker
but there Are there only three fans as well? I don't know, but I have always said that King of the Hill is Texas's anime. So yeah. You are always saying that.
01:00:26
Speaker
I'm telling lot of women that. One woman after another. That's the last pun.
01:00:38
Speaker
We're done here. Yes. I want to rewatch this movie. I feel like there's still a lot that we didn't even get to. There's, i i just feel like there's so much yeah with this, but it's, it's going to last.
01:00:51
Speaker
I have a good feeling about this one. It will stand the test of time and it's great. And one day Alex is going to come around not because we pressured him to, but because he's just going to be like, Oh, okay. was just being a big poopy diaper baby.
01:01:02
Speaker
And this movie great.
01:01:04
Speaker
You're a sheep. I'm a revolutionary. Yeah. Not according to my one star. She hated it. Viva la revolution. She hated it. All right. Anything else from you guys?
01:01:16
Speaker
think that's it.
01:01:19
Speaker
For now.
01:01:21
Speaker
and Until next week. Until next week. We'll be back. And we'll see you guys in the next one. Bye. Bye. See ya.