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The Insurance Industry = Bad
28 Plays3 months ago
The "pieces" discuss how frustrating and annoying the insurance industry is. And, an interview with author Myles Flynn!
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Transcript
Insurance as a Life Warden
00:00:00
Speaker
The dynamic between customer and insurance company is sort of like the dynamic between prisoner and prison warden. The warden sets the terms for what life is like in the prison.
00:00:11
Speaker
I can protest the warden's rules, but at great risk to my quality of life. Likewise, insurance companies set the terms for what you can and can't do in the free world.
00:00:22
Speaker
There are some insurances I'm required to get. If I buy a house, my lender requires me to have home insurance. I can purchase a car, but I'm not supposed to drive it unless it's insured.
00:00:34
Speaker
I can own a business, but in most cases, I will need to have insurance.
Mandatory vs. Optional Insurance
00:00:39
Speaker
If I'm perfectly healthy, the government says I need health insurance. Some insurances are optional, but you feel like a fool if you don't have them.
00:00:49
Speaker
If you've got a few kids, well you better get life insurance. In your 40s and have some assets? Time to get an umbrella policy. Worried you might be temporarily disabled and unable to work?
00:01:02
Speaker
Which by the way is a relatively high probability occurrence. Do you know what you need? That's right, disability insurance. How about the stories of old people draining their life savings to pay for end-of-life care?
00:01:16
Speaker
There's an insurance for that. It's called long-term care insurance. Afraid you might have to cancel that vacation you paid for? Get some travel insurance. And on and on and on.
00:01:29
Speaker
I'm not bothered by the fact that insurance exists. I can see the logic in protecting yourself from financially catastrophic events. I understand the math behind pooling premiums from a large swath of people in order to protect some of those people from a run of bad luck.
00:01:45
Speaker
Yet every interaction I have with an insurance company makes me feel like a little bitch. Every six months my car insurance renews. My family's had no accidents, no tickets, the values of our cars have gone down.
00:02:00
Speaker
But somehow our insurance goes up 15%. I can read about why the increase is justified. Car repairs are more expensive. More people are driving without insurance.
Frustrations with Insurance Costs
00:02:11
Speaker
bla Blah, blah, blah. Knowing why doesn't prevent me from feeling like they stole my penis. My homeowner's policy jumped 33% this year.
00:02:23
Speaker
We had no claims. Penis snatchers. Totally emasculated. I can go get quotes from other insurance companies. I can save a little money if I want to talk to idiots when I file my claim.
00:02:37
Speaker
Or I can go with a company that nobody has ever heard of out of some town like Willow Springs, Missouri. And to top it all off, the insurance industry is notorious for denying claims, for writing in complex exclusions, and for otherwise making everything about their industry confusing and frustrating.
Personal Story and Injury Risk
00:02:57
Speaker
We keep kidding ass to pay more, but we have no idea if when that time comes where we need to file a major claim, whether we'll get screwed. They always seem to get more of my money.
00:03:23
Speaker
So Matt, I get the sense you don't give a shit about insurance. yeah I'm trying to take care of myself so I'm not a burden to the to the health system. Okay. um I was working out yesterday, dude.
00:03:35
Speaker
I got an issue though. my I stopped doing weights after we stopped playing high school football. really maybe maybe c I was like, why the fuck would I ever do squats or lift weights again? For some reason now, I actually kind of like it.
00:03:49
Speaker
But my gym's going to rubber weights, dude. Rubber weights. Yeah, I can't slam the steel around. ah you don't get the clang. You don't get that boom.
00:04:01
Speaker
There's a house a house rolling in right now. Yeah, I don't get to go beast mode, you know, guys slapping steel around. You've put more than one plate on the squats?
00:04:11
Speaker
but Yeah, I got up to, I think my last set's like nothing nothing to brag about, but maybe 205. 205. two oh five But now when I pop that 35 on, I can't just let all the trim know that someone's about to go off because of rubber weights. It's all silent.
00:04:28
Speaker
Yeah, you can't clang it hard. ah Yeah, going hurt though, dude.
Is Healthcare a Right?
00:04:33
Speaker
Yeah, why do you say that? why Why do you think um' it's like a guarantee I'm getting hurt because I'm doing squats? I think it's ah it's, well, dude, it's and an injury risk type of exercise based upon how much weight you put on it.
00:04:47
Speaker
It's not like lat pulldowns. And so when you think about that, Lance, in terms of health insurance, who's at fault there I throw my back out because because I'm doing something stupid for a 48-year-old?
00:04:58
Speaker
No, I feel like I don't do much. and that like I don't actually work out that much. like But I do squats. I just work basically so but because legs you know legs and and some chest workout. That's it.
00:05:11
Speaker
So i feel like squats, if I'm going to be efficient, is like kind of a catch-all. Yeah, you might do leg sled to be a little more safe. But do you get a lot of ass in that leg sled? It feels like it's just all quads, dude. Oh, you got to get the one where it's kind of upside down. You know it's up above you.
00:05:29
Speaker
then you Like we had? Really get your back into the edge of that seat. You'll get plenty of ass, bro. March the back? Yeah, and you'll be more insurable.
00:05:40
Speaker
So think it's good. They should have ah they should have like insurance trained reps like at the you know at gyms being like, this is going to help your premiums.
00:05:52
Speaker
This is going to hurt your premiums. Yeah. What a scam, all this insurance. It's a scam, but I know I'm wise enough to know it's to it's not, but they really embed a lot of little nuance to make you feel like you're getting fucked all the time. did you You were in the industry, right? Did you feel that when you were on the other side?
00:06:12
Speaker
Were you like, man, we are fucking people are or no? Because you could justify right? Because those companies aren't exactly like, I don't know. It's hard for them to make money too, right?
00:06:24
Speaker
I was on the health insurance industry, which is... is It's a bad rap. Well, less of where I have immediate gripes, but yeah, dude, of course, like the benefit structures of some of these like plans.
00:06:36
Speaker
I can't imagine that any consumer of ah the health plans was like, oh, this is straightforward. i and I know exactly how I'll be covered if this happens. I know exactly what the cost will be.
00:06:48
Speaker
Of course not. It was was the worst, the absolute worst. Yeah. It's the worst, like when the HR person is like rolling out a new plan at a company in the US. and it's like yeah it's ah So 20% deductible on your first $2,500, and then it's it slides down to 70%.
00:07:06
Speaker
But if you go to two dental visits per year, it's it's ah you can you can get one pair of glasses. You're like, what? How is it all tied together? Yeah, like who comes up with that, dude? Yeah, if you get this app on your phone that shows yeah that you film yourself flossing, you can get $8 off a month.
00:07:24
Speaker
Yeah. Preventative, all that. Preventative maintenance. Yeah. Well, but i don't know. This is not where you want to start the show. But what I like is it why is why would you like, okay we'll say that you're from a liberal take. Why do you think that healthcare care is ah is a right, not a...
00:07:44
Speaker
Like, why do why do we have a right to that? you Do you believe that, I guess, is I'm saying? ah You could philosophically go either way on that. I think it's, if we were to make it more of a right of citizenship, I think it's a boost to our output and to our collective innovation and happiness and quality of life.
00:08:05
Speaker
That's what I do. It's one less thing to stress about. I mean, it's such a complex thing to stress about. I mean, this ruins people's lives to not be covered for pre-existing conditions, at least pre-Obamacare.
Complexities of Health Insurance
00:08:16
Speaker
I mean, it it was a total mess.
00:08:19
Speaker
Caused a lot of strife, a lot of financial woe, bankruptcy, etc. Yeah, I would think that most of us would want some sense of a fallback. And if you have wealth, maybe you want to like get the Cadillac version of that.
00:08:33
Speaker
But is it a right? We could debate that in lots of different ways. Because like... what What is a right? i don't I mean, we could get philosophical, like my boy Miles Flynn. But that's where that's where it gets down. like That's where the debate comes in. like When people start talking about insurance, that the debate always goes to, like, you have a right as an American to health insurance. And then other people, like, I don't know i don't know what the counterargument is. I don't hear people say you don't have a right, but there is a counterargument.
00:09:02
Speaker
and But I'm asking because you could then that kind of flows in into, like, talk about my squats or something like someone who's maybe not as healthy, not that I'm super healthy, but someone who's not as healthy as other person and they're putting more of a burden on the healthcare system.
00:09:19
Speaker
It's like, not only is is if you have a right to health insurance, do you have a obligation to do everything you can to keep keep it like to not not be maxed out? That's a great point.
00:09:30
Speaker
There's a spectrum of choices here. Like on the one end, you want maximum freedom. I can go out, do all the things that I want to do. I can squat 350, fuck up my spine and get free surgery.
00:09:41
Speaker
Or um do you want a more rigid healthcare system that maybe excludes certain behaviors, is more rational and in like, look, if you're a smoker, if you are obese,
00:09:57
Speaker
And obviously you don't have like a thyroid problem or something else that makes you that way. But if you're a smoker and you do these high risk behaviors, you are going to pay more. That happens, right? I think. It used to happen a lot more. I think what the what Obamacare tried to do was say, look, ah you you we hadn't recognized that Americans have a wide range of problems.
00:10:16
Speaker
Yes, some people live more risky lives, but we're going to allow everybody at least to get coverage. I think that's a good thing for me. Like I could go the other way where like, look, live a li a rigid, pragmatic life and you'll pay less and you'll be more efficient.
00:10:31
Speaker
And maybe just everybody has some catastrophic coverage. But it's a and depending upon your frustration level, any moment in this life, it it can be a place of resentment. When you see people at monster truck rallies, ah riding motorbikes, eating fucking fried butter and hot dogs, you know, those people.
00:10:49
Speaker
People that are unhealthy, that are a part of the healthcare care system that we all share the burden for, and they're driving up costs because of so many chronic disease interventions and research needed to address chronic diseases.
00:11:02
Speaker
We all pay shit tons for that in this system. That's frustrating. Well, yeah. and You also have, you get into the sort of the, Robert Kennedy stuff, are like, is the is sort of the are we just being poisoned so many different ways as well, in addition to people's personal choices and who who should bear the brunt of that,
Personal Responsibility in Healthcare Costs
00:11:22
Speaker
right? Sure, sure.
00:11:24
Speaker
It's complicated a little bit. Yeah, I don't stay there that long on the personal responsibility front, which is why I would lean towards more of a universal healthcare solution, kind of like Costa Rica has.
00:11:35
Speaker
From the government or from, like who would manage it? I'd make the government. I don't think there's no rat there' is any rational private player that wouldn't try to extract more and more value out of a system like that.
00:11:52
Speaker
I'm sure people would be like, you're fucking crazy, but like a sort of non-profi non-for-profit health system, something like that. ah The government, yeah, Medicare for all, essentially. I think we're crazy to think that every other country has figured this out and there are problems with every institution.
00:12:08
Speaker
At least you know you're covered in Costa Rica should something happen. And you're covered at a really low cost. I think that's there's a huge benefit to that. I would lean on that side, figure out the details later.
00:12:19
Speaker
But that's not where I have most of my frustration. have most of my frustration in just like What I feel like is an industry more broadly around insuring cars, houses, life, that just injects constant fear in you and has all the power.
00:12:35
Speaker
I guess health insurance is the same. Are they selling nonsense though or is it just it's scary and annoying but it is a reality of, you mean, do you think most it's nonsense. I think there's a combination of both. And so like, if you're ah a wise consumer, you are right to question some of these add-ons.
00:12:53
Speaker
So it's like, now, sir, do you have an outdoor water line? Well, of course, everybody has a fucking water line that comes into their house.
00:13:04
Speaker
Okay, now would you like insurance? Now this is a very reasonable and we really recommend this. It's gonna add about $14 a month to your policy. It'll help you in the event that there's a backup.
00:13:16
Speaker
Okay, so you're just like, of course, that sounds reasonable, but like they're not gonna insure anything that there's not a profit to. A prime example, I bought a car, got sucked in at the dealership. This was like a few years ago.
00:13:27
Speaker
And i get to the finance office and the guy's like, don't you wanna maintain your car the best way possible? And here's this wind windshield coverage that will add on into the price of your car. And it's really opaque as to how they do it and what the coverage is at the time. It's like a rapid process. But there are just all of these elements of that you can kind of manipulate.
00:13:50
Speaker
And I feel like that every time I talk to my car insurance company, Progressive, or Home Insurance, or any of these companies, dude. It's so fucking annoying.
00:14:01
Speaker
Yeah, that whole whole idea, like maximizing ah like sort of maximizing a client's sort of revenue output is is annoying. Whether it's banking, you get some of the same shit. We're like, oh, maybe you should get an annuity. You should get overdrafted. You're like, I just came here get a checking account. That's it. I just came here to buy a car.
00:14:20
Speaker
That's it. You know? like Yeah, that's like the the insurance industry, like they're pushed to bundle everything or sort of add on other other other things, kind of sell you on it. Like, well, it's the right thing to do is kind of overwhelming.
00:14:34
Speaker
but i i remember But I don't know if like you're saying there there they wouldn't do it if it's not profit, because I think a lot of insurance companies in the U.S., probably everywhere, pitch it as like we can't.
00:14:45
Speaker
where everything's so expensive we can't we have to raise premiums or we'll or we'll go but we'll go bankrupt you know or it won't work it's just fucking weird though everything there's a natural disaster the the rates go up it's like that's why i had you or you got a car accident your kid gets a car accident the rates go up it's like well that's not insurance it's like it's like insurance would be you just pay for it because i had insurance You know, a few thoughts on that, Matt, just a few.
00:15:12
Speaker
There you go. Roll
Dealing with Rising Premiums
00:15:14
Speaker
them out. My daughter got to a wreck. I'm sure the claim was probably like four or 5,000 to repair this person's Subaru with the dented bumper or whatever. And, uh, they wanted to claw that shit back within a year or two.
00:15:27
Speaker
And that the premiums jacked so high for her to claw all of that back, right? They're there. is to the best of their ability, they wanna get into the black ah with every customer.
00:15:38
Speaker
So they're doing that, but then they're also, they have a risk profile of things that like as a consumer, like do I wanna subsidize people living up in the mountains where I used to live actually? do i Is that fair for people down here who don't have fire risk to pay for that? I'm not sure how it all gets pulled together. Do I wanna subsidize like people in Houston who constantly get flooded and rebuild or Florida?
00:16:02
Speaker
Flutter with cheese, Wiz. Those fools are going to fly with. Yeah, they're fucking the insurance industry, health insurance industry too, those fatties. Sugar Land, Texas, if you remember an old bit I did.
00:16:14
Speaker
ah But like that just starts to feel unfair. and like Should I have to pay like $8 million dollars on my fucking car insurance because people are buying like $90,000 cars?
00:16:29
Speaker
I mean, should my insurance go up 20% because the cost of repairing these insanely expensive cars is going up? Well, well Lance, you live in the society, so like people are driving bigger, more expensive cars. You just have to accept that if you have a small car like you do and it gets hit, it's just going to get totaled and be more expensive to repair. and So there's all these things that just make it feel unfair.
00:16:50
Speaker
You don't like the pulled like kind of the pulled system. It's like being healthy and being smart about your house and you're you're paying for people that aren't. Look, if you are a pragmatic, reasonable person, we'll put you into this category and your insurance premiums will be this.
00:17:07
Speaker
But like if you buy a ninja motorcycle, even if that fucking thing isn't that expensive, your insurance through the roof because you cause more accidents than so But they want to add do all these add-ons for boats. And and I just don't understand the industry.
00:17:25
Speaker
And my costs constantly go up, dude. if this like a ah It's an asshole industry, buddy. Assholes. You feel like there's a bit of bait and switch? I'm just trying to think back. we had I had homeowners insurance in St. Louis. We kind of lived in a ah hood that they ah jacked it up a little bit. And I think our house was built in 1890 or something.
00:17:44
Speaker
But ah i I fought hard. And I found like. something i found like a cheap homeowner's insurance and i was like awesome and then they jacked it out was like they got me and then a year later they doubled it or tripled it and and then nobody else would like i couldn't find a better rate i was like damn that is ridiculous also good good for them but Well, they'll do it, you become a captive customer because the switching costs are so high, because it requires you to get on the phone and then like give people a laundry list of information, including they'll know the crime data, the crime data vandalism data in your neighborhood or whatever.
00:18:25
Speaker
Dude, it was um it was a full-time job for a few weeks. like yeah It was like hell. It's a total beat bullshit. They're trying to protect themselves and their business, totally understandable.
00:18:37
Speaker
But yeah, but you kind of want, like, why do you gotta do that? You know, like, why do you, why do you need to that? I mean, it's a law, right? You have to have something like homeowner's insurance. I think you have to have it in the US. You don't have to have it if you don't have a loan.
00:18:50
Speaker
Oh yeah, yeah. You can feel can self-insure. so you pay off your house and if you, if something happens, it happens and you pay for it. Yeah. I mean, if you think of the probability of certain things, depending on where you live, you could justify self-insurance to some extent.
00:19:06
Speaker
What's a roof cost in Colorado, by the way? Sorry. Have you guys had to do your roof because of hail or anything like that? Oh yeah. Between 20 and 40,000. Cause i I just wonder like, you know, if you did that, like does the math work out?
00:19:21
Speaker
Cause you're paying these premiums over the course of 30 years and you're like, Oh, it's going to add up to a lot of money. If you just redid your roof and the, the, I think fire, you know, fire, Colorado fire is an issue.
00:19:33
Speaker
Maybe not where you are. but Yeah, fire. Not where I'm at at all. like I feel like the only real risk here is hail. I thought you were say Venezuelans, but you went with hail. But like what does my insurance company do because of that?
00:19:47
Speaker
I think the hail, they they institute a special deductible. And I will tell you what that deductible is for hail. Is is hail now? Because it seems like what they do now is like...
00:20:00
Speaker
It's ah things that things that are an actual risk become an add-on. So you're like, oh, I didn't know. I thought I had Hale. No, Hale's an add-on in Colorado because it's... my My regular deductible is $1,000.
00:20:12
Speaker
My hail deductible was $6,100. That's not crazy. So you're going to pay that to replace a roof. Or if you were to say some windows got smashed through and those are very expensive to replace, you're on the hook for a shitload of them. Because why? They know that it happens a lot.
00:20:30
Speaker
So now you're sharing in the burden of what you would hope would be they would protect from- What's the annual or monthly homeowners now? 4,000. couple hundred bucks a month? 4,000 a year?
00:20:44
Speaker
Depends on the size your house and all that, sure. but Yeah, and where you live. and Yeah, so four grand a year, i mean, that's a lot. Yeah, what am I going to do, though, if they come back next year and say, nah, everything's gone up. it's which With tariffs, that's been taught we've been told that that's what's going happen.
00:21:01
Speaker
So they come back and they go, nah, dude, it's going to be 4,900. Close to 5,000. It will, right? Or so at some point in your life, it's going to go up. Well, it has perpetually. That's my frustration and why they've taken my penis, dude.
00:21:14
Speaker
It's because fucking there's nothing you can do. And so they come back with 5,000. Put your skirt on. I'll probably try to go get one more quote. Inevitably, it'll come back around the same.
00:21:25
Speaker
And if it doesn't, which I was lamenting about in the intro, it'll be because it's a company that it's like Bob's Insurance out of fucking New Hampshire or something that you've never heard of. They fight every claim.
00:21:37
Speaker
They're just like, no. They have no claims department, like none. They just fucking... nobody's ever filed a claim emails no phone number yeah i'm gonna i can get a cheap policy people have done that i've done some like rando companies and been totally screwed i think the the other thing that the insurance companies would say is like the overhead of fraud is what's screwing us all so they've got to protect against fraud they and then they probably you know, people trying to get insurance claims and stuff.
00:22:07
Speaker
They're not.
Health Insurance After Job Loss
00:22:09
Speaker
I don't know that's true, but maybe. Yeah, but I think more underinsured people. I'm not saying that's the only reason, but yeah, there's that too. I think it's climate change, bro, for the housing industry.
00:22:18
Speaker
I think that nobody wants to acknowledge that. Nobody's like, shit, the weather patterns have changed. Okay, we'll just keep everything the same. And there's a whole thing happening now where the state has to come in and insure people because the insurance companies are like,
00:22:32
Speaker
Fuck, man. State requires us to price. We can only raise prices a certain amount per year or something like that. There's different regulations depending on the state, but they come in and force that.
00:22:43
Speaker
And then the insurance company goes, peace out. Can't fucking make money here. And so they're in a pickle too with the lack of acknowledgement that like, hey, maybe you shouldn't live on a cliff where mudslides happen.
00:22:55
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, you could make that like all those big ass houses like up in Evergreen or like you said you lived around there. Like, I mean, there's a lot of fire risk in those areas.
00:23:06
Speaker
There is. I lived in a meadow with I had a lower fire. I had no problem getting insurance because I had the forest was way around me. The meadow, the meadow's a better place for fire.
00:23:16
Speaker
Cause it's not like that, that dry wood just ready to go up and fucking explode. Well, the meadow is just field and like, you need more fuel to like, you want trees to be like a hundred yards if possible.
00:23:31
Speaker
away from you. I forget all the stuff. I used to be well-versed in it. You want to clear out all the shrubs and anything close to the house. But like, yeah, no, you can live in the mountains and not be huge firewriters, dude.
00:23:42
Speaker
But most people don't. They don't do anything with it. They don't clear their land. They don't work on it. But my frustration there is like, while people get to live in these places, that doesn't make sense, which I was one of them, let's say.
00:23:55
Speaker
You can criticize me. It's just like health. Like you can go fucking eat your carrot cake whatever every night.
00:24:04
Speaker
Now I got to pay for your fucking diabetes care with my higher premiums. But the people out there paying more. is a sliding scale little bit, right?
00:24:15
Speaker
Like if you're in a fucked up place that has a higher history of stuff happening, you pay more. I think so, for sure. Or you don't get insured. But like we're all paying to some extent because the insurance company can only isolate risk so much.
00:24:31
Speaker
Like you hear every few years, every time a tragedy in California, you hear like there's people that like literally can't get insurance. Right. They can't get it. But know who's the I don't really know who is to blame.
00:24:46
Speaker
Like even if you went, oh, these fucking price gouging insurance companies, they're literally going like, yeah, we can't do it. MAGA is to blame. Yeah. For their monster truck rallies and their fat bellies.
00:24:58
Speaker
This then wasn't an issue until 2016. First lap with daisies, Donald daisies. But yeah, like I don't really know who's to blame.
00:25:11
Speaker
That's where I'm at with all this shit. When you go, you don't care. The culpable, the people are fault. It's so gray now, I feel like, that it's hard to even worry about it.
00:25:26
Speaker
I get it. I get it. It's easier. I'm a rare person that wants to first do an episode about this shit and also thinks about the industry itself.
00:25:36
Speaker
But do you have life insurance? Yeah. Yeah. But I got it in Denver when I was like 22. I just keep paying it, but it's not much. But I had a policy of my work, which I don't have anymore.
00:25:48
Speaker
But I have a small policy and I don't know, might be something think about on making money. Yeah. But I don't, life insurance is basically, so if you and I, like you and your wife die, your kids aren't completely fucked.
00:26:02
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. So we got that too at the same time you did. And it runs out when we're 50, 51, something like that.
00:26:13
Speaker
Like an annuity or something like that? get little money in that thing? No, it's not any of that BS. It's just term. You should only get term unless you have some special circumstances. had some stupid annuity thing, but I was like 22.
00:26:24
Speaker
It was the same shit. was getting car insurance and the lady was like, you should get life insurance. Yeah, you got banged. You should have gotten term, which would be a low monthly payment, especially when you got it.
00:26:36
Speaker
And then if you died, it would have been a higher amount than what you probably have. Yeah, ours is useless. I think between the two of us, it's like $1.5 million if we both died. Yeah, and you're probably paying less than me a month.
00:26:49
Speaker
Yeah, mine's nothing, like literally nothing. It'll pay for you to get like a pine box and then hopefully get your kids into a Motel 6 for a week. I wonder if my partners would let my family use some our wood.
00:27:03
Speaker
Build the coffin. Save a couple bucks on that. No varnish though or no epoxy or whatever you put on it. Are you going to get, when that expires, then you're kind of moving on in the old age.
00:27:18
Speaker
Are you going to get another policy, like a term for like 60 to 80 or something like that? No, because at that point, I mean, we have enough assets to not worry about leaving them destitute.
00:27:32
Speaker
So it doesn't make any sense anymore. But at the time we were just dumb kids. Yeah. Well, I had a, I mean, I had a policy with my work and then I went at, when that employment terminated, it was, I'm like, it was crazy.
00:27:46
Speaker
The amount of money, like to roll it over, to make it like my own. Yeah. It was like, yeah, Cobra, but more, less lube and more pounding, dude. Your risk factors are,
00:27:59
Speaker
There's fucking risk here, dude. already told I'm doing squats, bro. I'm sure they'd even, the underwriting department, like when somebody gets laid off, they add like some sort of risk metric about the probability of suicide.
00:28:12
Speaker
And so then offering you life insurance in that instance is really expensive. It's so sick and twisted. But like, I don't know now getting insurance policy. I know it's safe my father-in-law.
00:28:24
Speaker
They were getting insurance because he was working his business into his 70s, paying a lot of money for it, but he ended up getting cancer and- They used it while he was alive, you mean, or when he passed away?
00:28:38
Speaker
when he passed away. yeah. They, like, the family. Just went out and got dope rims. Yeah. So you can buy policies into the, to your older age, but they're like the monthly premiums obscene.
00:28:53
Speaker
Get some blades. Uh, sweet cars.
Insurance for Small Businesses
00:29:00
Speaker
Uh, yeah, I did. I, that's like, what's up with, with, it's almost laughable, dude.
00:29:07
Speaker
Like if you get, if you leave a job and you gotta, and you want to keep some health insurance, And then you got to pay Cobra. It's like Cobra. It's insane. Like it's, it's insane.
00:29:18
Speaker
It's, it makes no sense. I mean that you're going to lose your job and you're going to get fucking railed on, on like prices and premiums and shit like that is so weird that like you would think that should be shit that's simple to fix in the U S like there's a big debate about universal healthcare.
00:29:35
Speaker
It's like, Hey, when someone loses their job, it's probably not the best time for them to get fucked. Like why, why not? Let's, let's figure that out. Pretty easy. Cobra used to be more useful. I think pre healthcare exchange, pre Obamacare, because what would happen is you'd get laid off.
00:29:52
Speaker
And if you had preexisting conditions of any sort, Like people still would work and they still do today. They work for the healthcare coverage because they're such high risk patients.
00:30:04
Speaker
And so if you could keep Cobra for six months, 12 months or something at the price your company paid for it, which is exorbitant at the face value price. I guess that the issue is, guess what I'm, you're just getting, you're paying it all.
00:30:17
Speaker
So then it feels worse. So it feels like it went up, but it's the same rate that your company was getting banged for. Yeah, your company was giving you that benefit, but like it's so much more expensive than if you were to go on the healthcare exchange now and just type in your, depending upon your situation, well, at that point you're laid off, you would get really subsidized care.
00:30:37
Speaker
And you don't fuck Cobra at that point. Unless there's something special about your plan with your company that made your drug, your prescriptions like dirt cheap and your actual prescriptions under any sort of health exchange plan are going to be like $10,000 a month or something I've seen.
00:30:56
Speaker
You're better off going to the healthcare exchange. But back in the day, Cobra was- know that dude. It's like Obamacare where you can have all your pre-existing conditions and the government guarantees you can get a health care policy.
00:31:09
Speaker
Where is that, the exchange? It depends on the state. We have, forget, Colorado Health something. And you go on there and you fill in your income.
00:31:21
Speaker
And then depending on your income. Zero. Yeah, then it's probably 100% subsidized. So you don't even pay. So I'll pay my whatever $2,800 a month Cobra or I'm gonna get pretty much the same thing for free.
00:31:44
Speaker
But all of it's so confusing. For smart people like us, bro, we can figure all this out, but for pieces of shit, it's a problem. I can, dude. I'm in the POS camp on that one.
00:31:56
Speaker
Do you know what an umbrella policy is?
00:31:59
Speaker
like for just essentially pooling all your insurance needs. It sounds like that because it has umbrella in it. It's actually extra coverage.
00:32:11
Speaker
So imagine Slabs takes off and Matt starts banking like a million plus and it was savings per month. No, you bank some major assets.
00:32:24
Speaker
Well, you also have a business and you might have some personal liability in that. I don't how you're structured. But now you have assets that the hungry little fucking vulture lawyers would come at after you.
00:32:37
Speaker
Your own personal assets should something happen. So you get this umbrella policy to protect you in that case. It's usually tied to your car insurance. In fact, your umbrella policy will go up if you're a podcaster or you're youth coach, like a youth sports coach because the places where people sue you.
00:32:58
Speaker
Where you can like get accused of doing weird shit with the kids and stuff? Anything, yeah. Yeah, you went right there to the pedophile stuff. I like that. I like that about you.
00:33:08
Speaker
What's the other option for youth coaching, like beating them? I don't know. Are you putting them risk? Like you're having them run up hills when it's 105 out and they drop. Some kid dies. Yeah.
00:33:20
Speaker
And you're like, don't be a pussy. Get up. Get up. It's 1985. Yeah. No pussies here. Yeah. I get it.
00:33:30
Speaker
But do you have insurance for the business? Or you guys have any kind of base level? Yeah, we have general liability. We have to get it. You have to get it for some of these online businesses. you know like online type shit we have how high how much does it cost oh i didn't i don't know i didn't buy it my my socio my uh partner got it but think we're paying like 250 a month 300 a month but for a million probably a million yeah something like that i mean we don't if you get if you get if you get like um
00:34:06
Speaker
is workman's comp or something like that for, for your company, then it gets pretty expensive. That's, what's crazy is like the price. I don't, you know, for them, it's like the price, the price makes you not want to touch, touch it.
00:34:20
Speaker
If you're like, well, that's like a huge cost to us. So then I don't know. It's like, we're all trying to avoid it. It's like you're getting insurance because you have to, but you're trying to avoid it and try to spend the least amount.
00:34:33
Speaker
I don't know people frame it their heads as like, this a positive thing. at
Should Insurance Be Regulated?
00:34:38
Speaker
some point, it was.
00:34:42
Speaker
It definitely helps you. It looked that way. Yeah, it helps you sleep at night. But there's a reason with a lot of claims why people just go around it and try to negotiate outside of the insurance industry because they'll claw their money back.
00:34:55
Speaker
So if your business had some issues, that policy, that $250, $300, whatever you're paying, nice you know it's like $800. Yeah, it's going to jack us. Yeah, and you would hope that you could rely on the whole pooling system.
00:35:11
Speaker
I'd say the benefit that I can get on board with is this catastrophic things happen that would ruin you financially. Insurance makes sense. all these little add-ons that they put on and in the car insurance companies that make you fucking like download some apps so they can track your driving behavior and then up your insurance.
00:35:29
Speaker
If you're break too hard or do so, I mean all this stuff, I'm just like, okay, I've had enough dude. I've had enough bro. Yeah. I mean, I've had enough.
00:35:41
Speaker
That's a big thing down here. Like if you get an offender bender, lot of people just try to pay it out of pocket and not go through the insurance company. But, You know, the other thing here is like, there's a barrier to that, like growth, you know, just the general growth and capitalism that's, that's a positive in the U S but by some of stuff being more regulated here, it's probably puts a limit on like the growth of the economy and stuff.
00:36:06
Speaker
But it also means that like, Because you have the universal health care, so the private health care has to compete with that. So generally, you can go the doctor for like $80 or something like that. So it's even better that way.
00:36:18
Speaker
But somebody might be like, well, you're putting a governor on what the potential revenue generation can be. And I feel that way about like everything here.
00:36:29
Speaker
It's like good and bad. Like, like the gasoline here is controlled by the government. It's actually like crazy expensive here. Cause there's so many taxes related to it, which might be a byproduct of having universal healthcare system.
00:36:41
Speaker
But, but for what's, what's their philosophy though? They probably want to limit gas. You mean what's their philosophy for what? Well, they're doing it for climate reasons, right? Oh no.
00:36:51
Speaker
Well, that, that they probably say that. No, I just think there's a few people there that are, few rich families getting, making a shitload of money. No, but I think, I think it's just heavily taxed.
00:37:03
Speaker
Like I don't, I think it probably costs the same as the U S but it's like taxed at 200% probably to fund some of the other, other programs they have here. Yeah. No, I mean, I don't mind using taxes for that kind of social or policy shifting.
00:37:19
Speaker
Um, yeah, I could see, I could see the U S could do do a little bit more of that. We, we do, but,
00:37:29
Speaker
It hurts. People are just like, the gas is crazy expensive. And if people are making less money, it could be painful. If you're paying five or six bucks a gallon and you're making $1,200 a month or something like that.
00:37:45
Speaker
Right. Well, let me ask you in terms of like this concept of deregulation or regulation. In the insurance industry specifically, would you seek to deregulate this industry altogether such that they could set their own pricing and they could make rules on what they insure and how they insure?
00:38:04
Speaker
What would be your take on that? Just gut instinct. I know you don't know shit. Well, I don't. Yeah, that's saying. Like, it feels like that's way it is. Like when you're like, oh, my premium just got jacked up.
00:38:16
Speaker
Like what's, rule are they following in that instance? I think it's the most regulated, one of the most regulated. Still fucks you though, but yeah.
00:38:27
Speaker
Yeah, so the question is like, is this one area where even regardless of how you're aligned politically, regulation might be a good thing? mean, that's my take because it's just one of those complex industries that you're asking the average person to decipher.
Preventative Care vs. Insurance Efficiency
00:38:44
Speaker
I don't, what I never understood is the concept of a deductible. Like, it's like, why, why do we have those things? It's like, I pay you, right? Uh-huh. For a thing.
00:38:55
Speaker
But then, oh, by the way, you got to pay a little more. don't understand why. It could be an insidious thing, depending on how you think about this, but especially healthcare. But it's a way to like penalize you for utilization almost.
00:39:11
Speaker
Exactly. But you think that's cool? It also lowers your premium so that if you're not a high utilizer, you're, you know, we can keep those, the monthly premium down. Because one of the worst feelings is I'm paying this extreme amount every month and like I don't even use this shit.
00:39:28
Speaker
So they're trying to keep... My guess is they're trying to keep younger, healthier people satisfied while staying profitable for the people that utilize so much.
00:39:40
Speaker
So it could be an incentive. Well, for health, it could be incentive to be like, all right, well, you don't have to worry about the deductible if you don't have health issues. But that's like, yeah, I broke my arm, dude.
00:39:53
Speaker
It's not because I ate too many Fruit Loops or something. But in the case of your... Like the hail thing, for example, it's like, all right, I'm paying a lot and now I got a 6,000 deductible.
00:40:07
Speaker
It seems like just a way to go ahead and take more money. Well, it is a way to get more money, but here, the problem with that approach is that people, especially with health, avoid care.
00:40:21
Speaker
so as not to incur more costs, which leads to bigger problems in the future. And you could say the same for a house. Like if I got some hail damage, I'm like, eh, I'm not fucking paying 6,100 to get that roof replaced right now.
00:40:35
Speaker
Then next thing you know, that shit's leaking. There's some wood rot up in the attic and the fucking whole roof falls down in the house. I guess that's akin to somebody getting heart disease that- Well, there's people that are just like, well, that's their fucking problem.
00:40:51
Speaker
Yeah, but then you're going to pay higher for people like that who encounter much bigger problems. So the theory with health is, and you could say this with anything, but the theory with health is if everybody just did preventive care, the healthcare system and what we would pay would be so much cheaper.
00:41:11
Speaker
If everybody ate healthy, did the recommended exercise, did their preventative care, which is get their like... blood screen and their labs on a regular basis and got a basic checkup, it would be so much cheaper.
00:41:26
Speaker
Same if everybody did their house maintenance and made sure that shit was tight and upgraded their electrical and they did all that stuff, like you'd have so much less expense, so many fewer claims.
00:41:40
Speaker
So it's just like you're dealing with human behavior But for somebody that does try to do all that checklist like me, you start to resent. But do you get a, you literally get a better rate?
00:41:52
Speaker
Like is there a to prove, hey, I'm doing the whatever. I clean my filters. I don't get a better rate that I know of. You just get less likelihood of fucked up stuff happening in your house or your body, right?
00:42:07
Speaker
Right. I think maybe with car or with driving, they do some of that. And think with houses, you do get a better rate if, mean, you don't have a trampoline in the fucking yard, if you have smoke detectors, deadbolts, other things that they find useful in preventing.
00:42:23
Speaker
A boring house. Yeah, basically a boring house. Did you have to pay insurance on your electric bike?
00:42:31
Speaker
I bet you if I reported it to somebody, they would say you should get insurance on that. But no, I'm not paying. I'm not going to pay shit on that thing.
00:42:41
Speaker
Just thought of a funny joke. I'm not going to say. Yeah. They don't require it, dude. Unless I wonder if they required on like a class I'm not sure what they call them. I'm surprised because you have a motor and you're out on the road sometimes.
00:42:54
Speaker
Yeah, but it only, it maxes at 20 miles an hour. It doesn't have high power, but some of them do. I wonder if they have to do it. I mean, you might do it for your own benefit. probably, yeah, I mean, it's probably, at some point it becomes, it's not a bike, it's a motorcycle.
00:43:09
Speaker
That's probably the crossover. None of them can probably cause too much damage to someone else. And if you already have healthcare, why would you need that coverage?
00:43:19
Speaker
But I guess if your bike was 10 grand or something. You might want insure it, but if you're buying a $10,000 bike, uh, you probably should have some money in the bank.
00:43:30
Speaker
But yeah, that's the thing. Those fucking bikes are like cars. Most people don't. you buy that bike, you're fine, dude. Yeah. Fine. You either, either I got the money for it don't care about money and that's your whole life.
00:43:42
Speaker
Like a gear head. Right. That was the only people. So do you think the insurance industry is something be fixed? It's not functioning the way it should. Is that the basis of this episode?
00:43:56
Speaker
No, I think it's just that the basis of it is it's like you do feel powerless or stupid. I don't think any thought that I have about this industry any interaction that I have with this industry makes me feel empowered and intelligent.
00:44:14
Speaker
Yeah, you're not getting like the whole point of insurance is kind of take away a stress or like a fear and you don't, it actually works the other way. Really, right? Yeah.
00:44:24
Speaker
That's probably the issue with it right now. So it's not making anyone feel at peace. I can't even tell you what I had. Like when I was calculating, looking at the taxes for our health insurance, like when I quit working, we could get some subsidy on health insurance because just my wife is still working.
00:44:44
Speaker
And the calculations that are made to determine the subsidy amount, and it's just such a headache. Everything is such a headache in the industry.
00:44:55
Speaker
Where do you do that? Like someone loses their job and they're like, oh, I'm paying life insurance, but where do you find out if you're eligible for a subsidy? Oh, for health insurance, you mean?
00:45:08
Speaker
Well, yeah. Oh, I thought said life insurance, but health insurance as well. Yeah. You basically go to the site, type in all your income information, and they'll tell you. But then... You might go to Kaiser United or something like that.
00:45:21
Speaker
Yeah. They don't know everything about you. She ended up working a bit more than we thought. So we ended up having to pay another like three, four grand. And it was this complex calculation that it's on the tax form.
00:45:35
Speaker
And so what I was doing was trying to estimate where it would be next year. This is all based on like self-reporting though. It will get trued up to your tax return.
00:45:45
Speaker
So initially you estimate. So if you were to go there and lie and be like, I don't make shit, but then you actually did make a good amount, you'd have to pay it back when you filed your tax return. These are things that only somebody like me would know or spend the time to think about.
00:46:01
Speaker
And I say that not condescendingly, just say that as like, From a time management, like. Well, you have to be a fucking psycho. I would do this stuff, some personal finance stuff when I was working.
00:46:13
Speaker
Like, I just take a whole day of work and ignore work and figure out different things that I would want to maneuver. That's like the only way you do it. Yeah.
00:46:23
Speaker
I mean, because when else are you going to it? Especially if you need to actually call somebody, going to have to do it during the day. At one point, dude, I bought long-term care insurance and we were in our 39 years old.
00:46:34
Speaker
That's how fucking stupid and focused I was on this stuff. Now, long-term care insurance, buddy, you don't really use that until you're like, I think, over 55 in this case. So you got a better rate if you get in on it early?
00:46:47
Speaker
Yeah, but think about paying those premiums for like 20 years straight. And if you died in that timeframe, it wouldn't matter? Yeah, pretty much. Or it's like a sliding scale or like, it's like...
00:46:58
Speaker
or the risk of you dying at that age and using it is so low. But like I dialed into that because there was so much fear around it. You better get in now because the prices of that is going so up astronomically.
00:47:11
Speaker
So if you ever want long-term care, and then it took me probably a week to do all this research on like, well, what's what? What are the probabilities?
00:47:22
Speaker
And what is the industry like? And so it turns out you probably shouldn't buy it until you're like, low 50s, and even then you shouldn't buy it unless, if you have a certain amount of assets, you probably shouldn't waste your money on it because you'll have enough to cover.
00:47:39
Speaker
You have a house or something, your family has that or something like that. Yeah, the premiums can be so high that you're sort of like, well, if that happened, we could use our assets to pay for the nurse to come wipe my ass and sell our dope ass Pokemon cards.
Understanding Insurance Policies
00:47:59
Speaker
collection or yeah so so these are adult things matt these are adult things i know you don't like to talk about but like it's important to educate our listeners on the perils of insurance it's pretty funny here i mean we're doing these episodes so imagine it's hyped up more than what you worry about day to day But do you ever feel hijacked?
00:48:21
Speaker
Like you have a higher, I don't know, sort of a higher tendency to worry about these things like tariffs and health insurance and stuff than normal people? Or you just think it's the new reality that if you're not doing it, you're behind the eight ball.
00:48:36
Speaker
Like you're not worried about it. Are you really just being ridiculous? Or do you even worry about it besides providing this great content? Are you...
00:48:47
Speaker
Are you seriously worried about health insurance or insurance or the tariffs or don't know what else we've talked about? Am I seriously worried about Insurance, think, is a place that can really, yeah, make you feel out of control financially.
00:49:03
Speaker
So, yeah, I do. try to game as much of it as I can. It's place where I'm constantly frustrated by it. I'm constantly frustrated by the rise because I'm not somebody values cars.
00:49:14
Speaker
But, yeah, so I'm insuring kids driving cars and, of course, Like I said in the intro, the value of their cars has gone down, and yet their price to insure them went up 15%, 20%, and they haven't had any accidents.
00:49:30
Speaker
What the fuck? What are you supposed to So I'm constantly surprised by it because everything else in my financial life, dude, I control.
00:49:38
Speaker
I control to the T, bro. And this is one that makes me feel out of control. That's a tough one too, though, because like, Like you said, you could be, you're very knowledgeable about it, but you're still like, you're playing in a stack and rig game.
00:49:53
Speaker
Like you can't, you do all the research. Like we can go, we can go call, you can cold call 50 different insurance companies and try to find a better rate, but they have, they'll get it.
00:50:05
Speaker
Eventually, they're gonna get it from you, right? Well, yeah, introductory rate and then the next month, excuse me, the next year or every six months, they're just like, Jack, Jack, Jack.
00:50:18
Speaker
So, you know, I tried to entertain it up a little bit in the intro by calling them penis snatchers because that's what I do, bro. That's what I do. you know, it is a boring concept.
00:50:31
Speaker
We all have to deal with it. It crazy boring. It's one of those vicious cycles because the insurance companies or even the people that work there, maybe like you worked where you worked in the insurance company, you're not like some you know, what Illuminati white person and you are a white person, but you have some native American in you, so you get a free pass, but you're not like some high level Illuminati, like plotting, plotting to screw over the earth.
00:50:57
Speaker
But the people that work there are probably like, well, the reason we do this is because you know, it's not as profitable as you think. And we have our risk and, and like they, they would justify everything. Right.
00:51:08
Speaker
And no, we actually provide a good service and, and like,
00:51:13
Speaker
I don't know. It is what it is, dude. The growth. If you're going to live in a constant growth cycle, then everything's affected. So everything's going get more more expensive. And then when they cover you for the roof or your heart surgery, that shit's more expensive than it was 10 years ago.
00:51:28
Speaker
So everything's got to go up. It's never going to end. Up and up and up. You're right. The only issue is like when there's a overall like a market correction, there's not like no one's going to be like, Lance, good news.
00:51:42
Speaker
Your premium, your house premiums are tracking the Dow and the Dow shed 14%. So we're making that $4,640 cheaper. It's not going to happen.
00:51:54
Speaker
Yeah. Well, do you have tariff insurance? Protect you from rising tariffs? Nope, but I'm excited to pass that along, that cost.
00:52:05
Speaker
It's just the sales tax in my opinion. yeah so like the insurance you guys are just gonna pay more trump supporters you're doing your part right you're doing your part so you're gonna you're gonna you're gonna attack each table that i sell you pay 10 more and you're gonna you're gonna help the national deficit go down by me passing that cost along view that's my insurance now i would imagine there is an insurance company out there that's like oh that's a good product Well, I mean, writing that policy right now, you know how expensive it would probably be.
00:52:42
Speaker
Well, they would just get you riled up like, well, you think this is bad? Like you're going to put, we'll cover you with a deductible, of course, but up to 75% tariffs or something. And then they'll be like, you know, it's going to a thousand percent.
00:52:56
Speaker
Yeah. Hopefully you bought that policy before he was even considered electable. But yeah. Insurance, huh? I mean, the cool thing about it from a gambler's perspective is it's like, it's just a gamble.
00:53:10
Speaker
Now, most of it's regular. You need health insurance. I don't know if you need health insurance, actually, but you do need a homeowner's insurance for the most part. It's like, are you going to be happy when your house burned down because you had fire insurance?
00:53:22
Speaker
You're like, ha ha, got him. It's like, but it's a bit of a gamble either way. It's almost pissed you like the gamble is to not get it. That's the gamble you're taking.
00:53:33
Speaker
But the gamble, there's a, I mean, you add up all the money over your life. The gamble is like you shut thousands, a hundred thousands dollars and nothing ever happened. Set a peaceful life and you died at a reasonably old age and everything just expired.
00:53:49
Speaker
Your house never burnt down. And you replaced your roof twice in the 60 years you've lived there. Like that's the other side of the gamble.
00:54:00
Speaker
Insurance is pitched as the gamble is to not have it. The game blows to pay for your whole life and nothing happens. Right. Well, let's end on this. I think it should be completely deregulated so that they can discriminate against any and all lifestyle choices.
00:54:15
Speaker
So heavy squatters, heavy gay squatters like you would pay... An HIV tax? Yeah, something bad. Also, which would be, since you opened the door, bro, which would be bundled with your...
00:54:34
Speaker
Electric bike tax, obviously. If it's gay squatting, might well throw that under there. All right, we should probably cut to the Miles Flynn interview.
00:54:45
Speaker
There, we ramped it up, so now they're ready for that. Miles back, huh? That was an interesting interview. I'll tell you what, that guy is a workhorse.
Interview with Author Miles Flynn
00:54:56
Speaker
Just keeps writing, huh?
00:54:57
Speaker
Yeah, I guess. Third book? Third book in two years? He does the work. Unlike us, man. He does the work.
00:55:11
Speaker
And now Matt's interview with Miles Flynn. Welcome back, Miles Flynn. Matt. So Miles, you have a new book out called Cock Versus Penis, A Linguistic Journey?
00:55:25
Speaker
Yes. That's quite the title. Why'd you write this book? Matt, I've long hypothesized that the word cock has held much deeper meaning in human history.
00:55:36
Speaker
Penis, on the other hand, while more widely understood, has been an underwhelming tool in the English language. Cock is a powerful, poignant word. Take, for example, Socrates' famous last words.
00:55:49
Speaker
Crito, I owe a cock to Asclepheus. Will you remember to pay the debt? It's anyone's guess what cock means to Socrates, but we know it's important.
00:56:02
Speaker
Um, isn't he referring to a rooster? Time will tell, Matt. But consider this powerful quote from Margaret Thatcher. It may be the cock that crows, but it is the hen that lays the eggs.
00:56:18
Speaker
A crowing cock? What does she mean, Matt? Is this about her sexual desire? We just don't know.
00:56:27
Speaker
Again, I think she's referring to a rooster. It's a reference to power, I think. Like the hen has real power because it produces the eggs. Time tell, Matt.
00:56:39
Speaker
Let's examine the famous quote by Plato. It is rumored that Plato replaced the word penis with the phrase genital organs. In this famous quote, In men, the nature of the genital organs is disobedient and self-willed like a creature that is deaf to reason and it attempts to dominate all because of its frenzied lusts.
00:57:00
Speaker
In my book, Matt, I argue that had Plato used the word cock instead of genital organs in his quote, this would have been the singular statement to define all human experience.
00:57:13
Speaker
Well, that's very interesting, Miles. I just want to thank you for joining us today. Miles Flynn, everyone. His book is Cock vs. Penis, A Linguistic Journey.
00:57:24
Speaker
Pick it up at all major book retailers. Do you know who I am?