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A Brave Conversation About Race, Community and Tipping
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Once again the "Pieces" prove they are in the top tier of authentic podcasters. You will not find another podcasting duo that goes deeper on important issues.
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Transcript
Playful Banter and POS Jokes
00:00:04
Speaker
Why don't you go get me one of them P's, boy?
00:00:10
Speaker
I want one of them
00:00:15
Speaker
Now go get one of them S's. What's that spell? POS. It doesn't stand for anything.
Accidental Recording and Humor
00:00:37
Speaker
You feel me, motherfucker? P to the O to the S, you know. P to the O to the S, you know. P to the O to the S, you know. You stupid motherfuckers ought to know.
00:00:49
Speaker
Dude,
00:00:54
Speaker
did you just hit the record button, Lance?
Tipping Norms and Expectations
00:00:58
Speaker
Yep, I was seeing how long I could pause before you had to say something. Why didn't you turn the screen around and hit me for a tip, dude? You hit record button. Why don't have a screen here that says, Lance, 20, 40, or 60%. Those are my only options because you lifted your your index finger and hit record.
00:01:18
Speaker
I don't ask for tips when i I'm just doing my job, guy. Well, you're the only person in the service industry in America that's not asking for tips. like you You can go to, I don't know, they still have 7-Elevens up here?
00:01:31
Speaker
oh Yeah, of course, dude. Come on, Jesus. You're not that far we gone. well i don't Maybe it's regional, dude. I haven't seen one. I'm not acting like i'm um I'm cast away. I'm just saying. I don't see it. haven't seen a 7-Eleven. I haven't seen a tip thing at 7-Eleven, though.
00:01:45
Speaker
Dude, I don't know. I'll let you know. ah Maybe Quick Trip. I feel like one place like that was like there was a tip thing on it. But but I feel like Starbucks hitting that...
00:02:00
Speaker
is is not that much different than Quick Trip when you're literally just like putting liquid in a glass and hand it over. I mean, there's always been like a tip jar at coffee shops, but I feel like when you're popping
Cigar Bar Experiences and Tipping
00:02:10
Speaker
the 20 to 30% on me. Yeah, yeah.
00:02:13
Speaker
yeah Because those people are making some money now too, right? Matt's had enough. Yeah, now I hear you. So what are you doing? You doing 25? You 15? do fifteen Well, it depends. like um Like Starbucks, I'm just trying to drop a dollar. So in reality, it's what, 25? The large coffee is 350.
00:02:29
Speaker
So it's it's a high percentage, but I get It's just a dollar. But yeah if I like I've been going talk about this a little bit, but my buddy's got this sweet bar here. And I when I don't know why haven't smoked cigars in years, but come up here and he has like a humidor and these nice cigars.
00:02:44
Speaker
I feel like smoking a cigar like every night. But that's like I'll go up to the to the cigar counter, get a cigar, get a club soda. And then I'm sitting there with 15, 20, 25. And I'm like the guy just handed me a cigar and a drink.
00:02:58
Speaker
and i But I feel like now, I feel like if I hit 15, they're like, hey, tight ass. and know I mean, no one's going to say that, but 15 is the entry point now. That used to be ah good tip, right?
00:03:10
Speaker
Well, I've always thought 10% for any kind of pickup and any kind of preparation, and you go pick it up. 20 used to be for delivery driver. and And then in a decent restaurant.
00:03:23
Speaker
And then 15, I'm not sure where 15 fit in. I think it was just really just for cheap people in a restaurant. But for just handing me some shit, I always thought 10 was okay back back in the day. But now 20 is the threshold, I think.
00:03:38
Speaker
Right. It depends too. Like the coffee and buck dollar makes sense a little bit. Well, I just, I wasn't standing in line at like, it was a place where you stand in line and order and somebody brings the shit out. But it was, someone said their rule is like, if I stand in line to order, no tip. I actually thought that was pretty good.
00:03:56
Speaker
Yeah. Well, I do want to mention that since you're from Costa Rica, this conversation was hot two, three years ago, but we'll go with it. We'll go with it, dude. Well, you if see, that's the thing that like, that's the problem.
00:04:10
Speaker
Nothing ever, nothing ever in this and this, like if it was hot two or three years ago, why wasn't there a shift where where people are like, all right, let's get out of fucking control because we're fighting for minimum wages. People are starting to make money in these places.
00:04:24
Speaker
from From what we remembered, we we're in high school. We were, you know, I know it's 30 years ago, but still like if you, the dollar, if you did the dollar valuation, I don't think we were making the equivalent of 18
Value of Service vs. Office Jobs
00:04:35
Speaker
bucks an hour or some shit.
00:04:37
Speaker
Yeah, because we just bitch on X and on Instagram and wherever, and we don't actually solve problems. That's why, guy. Come on. Same way as in the United States. Yeah. So it was hot two or three years ago, but we all just decided we're going to accept it.
00:04:49
Speaker
Yeah, it was hot because was getting ridiculous outside of the pandemic, and then people went back you know from being at home. you know It made sense to tip when people were losing their businesses and losing their jobs, but...
00:05:00
Speaker
Then it got extreme. What I hate most, to stay on this subject, that's two or three years old, what I hate most is like a store that sells jewelry or or novelty gifts or something like that and they'll flip the iPad around with the tip thing. And it's just a dude standing behind with just regular merchandise like any old store, no service.
00:05:23
Speaker
And why why on earth would you flip it around there? And then how about the snaggled tooth, pimply ass idiot at the yogurt frozen yogurt place where you go through with the cup.
00:05:33
Speaker
Self-serve. Fill the ice cream. You fill all the toppings on it. And all they do is tally up what it weighs. And you're supposed to drop 20. And that they lead with 20, 25.
00:05:44
Speaker
Frustrating for sure. Frustrating. But who's at fault? Like, is the kid at fault? Or is this is it just, it's the new norm? Kid's at fault. He's a piece of shit. There's no doubt.
00:05:55
Speaker
i was I was filming that process and I was on a video call with somebody Costa Rica and they were like, they simply asked, well, what happens if you don't tip them? Because like you said, we'll just bitch about it, but we'll still tip them.
00:06:07
Speaker
And I had to sit there and think for a second. Like, literally, what happens if we don't tip it And then I went, well, nothing. You just get your coffee. yeah Nothing bad happens. And they're like, right, moving on.
00:06:19
Speaker
Profit solved. But it's like, oh, I might have to go back there and face that 18-year-old girl again. And she's going to be like, there's Dick who doesn't tip. Or maybe not. they don't care. We should have a we have a Starbucks employee on.
00:06:32
Speaker
You can see the other side of it. Yeah. Yeah, I think it's just factored into the cost now. I don't know when I wouldn't tip. I'd feel pretty bad. I wonder though if they, I mean, the I know the answer is yes, because we all love money.
00:06:46
Speaker
Like, but when you you go work at a coffee shop, are you kind of going, all right, I'm expecting a substantial portion of my income's tips, or is that just gravy? But you know, you're like, I can make pretty good money now. Starbucks actually has to pay me a decent wage. So like,
00:07:00
Speaker
that's just gravy or they're like, why they're kind of nervous, like a waitress, you know, their livelihood is tips. I think it still is. i don't know if that, that industry changed too, but like they're, they're excited and they get a ah decent tip.
00:07:12
Speaker
But like, I wonder if that, that, that weird industry, which is like over the counter still, but now we tip for it. It's like, are you counting on that ice like yogurt guy? Or is that just like gravy? And they, they're almost like, this is free money. Shit.
00:07:25
Speaker
Yeah, I wonder. And I'm starting to think that those jobs are a little harder than we probably give them credit for. There's some skill involved to like understand the different types of coffees and orders and get that going and then keep yourself calm. This is some liberal pussy shit. No, no, keep yourself... Okay, let's compare it to the corporate environment of fucking doing a PowerPoint and pushing some paper around.
00:07:46
Speaker
Making 150 plus K doing dumb shit like that and having a few conversations with... So-called exact. And then these guys are on their feet all day grinding, bro. Like they should, would you say they should make 50 grand or is that just too much?
00:08:02
Speaker
I don't think so. I don't think they should make that. I mean, I think we need to go back to that. Like i I was happy to see here, wherever I'm trying to, like, I
Race and Tipping Habits
00:08:10
Speaker
don't go out much while I'm here. Like, but occasionally the afternoon I get tired. I go to Starbucks. It's all kids working.
00:08:16
Speaker
I think that's great. Yeah, but you're dumbass surfing all day, making three, four times that. That makes sense? i'll be I'll be happy when that happens, dude. No, when you're when when you're when you were doing your doing your whatever job you had, fucking ops job.
00:08:32
Speaker
Well, I think that i mean what society values, which I think is okay. Society values people making decisions and people solving problems. And like people might not see getting coffee into a cup or even brewing it as a huge problem they're overcoming where they might see how I managed us out of a backorder situation or or got us change suppliers or something as critical to ah to a big business.
00:08:58
Speaker
Yeah, I think it's logical, but I'm also starting to feel, it's a felt sense that we've devalued the people that consistently serve us and and that that skill is a little more challenging.
00:09:11
Speaker
There have been some ticky-tocks, bro, that people starting to bitch who were in like service industry jobs and then went into the office and are just like, what the fuck is this office job shit? I do nothing all day. I sit here, I do a few emails. um I need to get back to actually helping people.
00:09:27
Speaker
I wonder, we because because you're right. I agree with that. I do agree with that. It's a framework that we manufactured of like, I value this versus something else. I wonder if it's changing too with everybody being anti-college. You you you said you love the the economic classes in college. And I remember it was you it was a macroeconomic. I don't know what, it was macroeconomics like the base level, but the guy was using the analogy of why Michael Jordan got paid what he did and why why a janitor who's working harder gets paid what he did because the amount like there was a lot of lessons to be learned but one of them was like the amount of people that could probably do the job is less sure that's why so the people perceive those office jobs like well these are educated these people are have gone farther in education then we all know a lot of that's horseshit
00:10:16
Speaker
Yeah. i Don't tell the pussies working at service jobs that so or they might revolt. Yeah. if you If you start to argue with the market or the marketplace, then, you know.
00:10:28
Speaker
You're a communist. You start getting, well, that's what the market's are asking for. market Market says Jordan's worth 200 mil. um yeah i get it buddy i fucking get it i'm just asking what's funny is like nobody like who feels value like the people sitting in office making 200 000 or like still feel like i should i should be getting more like nobody it never solves it like it's just fucking bullshit dude i just like pitched this new project and the exec said no this is bullshit i gotta rework all this ah i should be getting 300
00:11:00
Speaker
ah Yeah, there's no end. But I do feel the that folks that are grinding all day and dealing with pain in the ass people, especially maybe the tips are OK, but but also maybe they should have a livable wage.
00:11:13
Speaker
I've said that before. So you got to put it on Yeah. Yeah. it Right. Like when it is might be an old topic because the the pandemic changed things. But when I've been away for a while and I come back, you see like the consumers getting pounded on both sides.
00:11:29
Speaker
And so and and then I feel like it's a it's a part where I like, oh, man, I got to be a dick. like the prices have gone up and then you and then and then you're paying for the service that you feel like they should be paying for a little bit. So it's like, you're charging me more, so why don't you kick that down the employee so I don't have to kick in more money? Or like it feels like you're kind of taking it on both ends if you gotta to tip somebody 20% and everything's way more expensive is what I see as like a guy reentered the American society. Yeah, and the social pressure's the part that's the most difficult.
00:11:59
Speaker
Now what type of person do you, decide to withhold a tip from or do a bigger tip for let's go with the hot girl hot young girl withhold I'm a sucker I'm a sucker you go up huh you go high no I will have you ever gone it's like so subconsciously but you go the other way because you don't want to be the guy you don't want to be doing that like or perceive that you're doing that Like it's almost like you go the opposite.
00:12:25
Speaker
ah Like you'll give the person you might not be attracted to, might have
Cultural Perceptions of Race
00:12:30
Speaker
a plus size person. You'll kind of throw more love that way because you're like, I'm not going to be the one who's giving hot dids more money.
00:12:39
Speaker
um I do that sometimes. I just know that the thoughts come into my head. So like if I'm in a... Less privileged area, like I'll wonder, for some reason, I'll default towards a lesser tip because it's a shittier area.
00:12:54
Speaker
And then I... Ah, you'll go less. ah Well, I'll catch myself mentally and go, what what are you doing? These people probably need it more. and Because there's a social guideline.
00:13:05
Speaker
And if you're in a nicer area, like you don't want to be the one loser. Because you know that in those um shadier areas, like a lot of people don't tip because they can't. And then I'll like, I'll just fall in line with that mentally.
00:13:18
Speaker
So it is a tricky thing, the social pressure of it all. I think it's funny. It is funny. I will, I'll go big, any overweight, like, especially if they're super happy and charming, any overweight black person, dude, I'll make it rain.
00:13:32
Speaker
It's just true. Like if you get the the ah comfortable in the skin, happy, happy, large black dude, um ah and then ah ah one of those like kind of happy sisters, like big, fat black women that are super nice and here you go, child, and that kind of stuff, I'm going to shell out there.
00:13:51
Speaker
and Would you say in 2020 that would have been a racist comment? I mean, I don't know. I doubt they would be pissed that I'm telling them I'm going to give them more money. Do you think the left wing white women would have came after you in 2020 for that?
00:14:07
Speaker
You think that was the DMARC point where things changed in 2020? Or you think we're moving back towards, we've talked about it, but we're we're getting becoming more racist again? Well, i think people are just more shock value on the right and just trying to like upset people just to do it.
00:14:23
Speaker
But no, I'm just curious. Well, part of it's like my expert like my experience in St. Louis, you have so much more access to to different races, definitely black folk, and like then you do probably in Colorado. And it's it's still like ah like ah it's still like interesting to me.
00:14:41
Speaker
yeah Yeah, it's great. That's like Chicago's great city. I think they would, but I have no respect for those white women because like yeah by simply mentioning race, it's not racism is how I feel.
00:14:56
Speaker
You know, like, cause I've had a lot of, cut we can get into this, but i've had a lot of conversations with black dudes at my friend's bar, like in the last few weeks, cause I'll go there and smoke a cigar and race comes up a lot for no, no like negative reason, but it, it's just comes up.
00:15:11
Speaker
Yeah. And it's like, ah, you yeah like, if you go, Hey, I'm, I gotta go, I gotta give Hey, can you give my friend this, this, uh, whatever this money, because I'm going out of town, what does he look like?
00:15:23
Speaker
And you can't, you can't say that he's black. Even though that's the easiest you got, you'll recognize him. He has a, he has a, yeah you know, a white Tesla, it's a black dude. So it was like, there's some white women that might be like, that's racist.
00:15:36
Speaker
You're simply describing someone.
00:15:40
Speaker
I hope not, but oh, maybe. Dude, there you know there are. Okay, maybe, I don't know. I just asked a question about- He's Asian. What you said. Yeah, i know I think that there's permission now to like act like you're comfortable with everything. And the truth is you're having conversations about race probably because everybody feels themselves, everybody feels each other out.
00:16:00
Speaker
And I know I'm talking hoops with the dude, black dude. And, you know, my son's on a white boy team. I'll bring it up just like that. Just because don't know why i do it.
00:16:12
Speaker
It's like ah you're just trying to let them know you're not fucking. Nothing worse than when white dude goes overly gets it. Yeah. Ah, shit. Man, he's fucking white boy, man. No. I saw that the other night at that place where was a guy. I was like, oh, God, dude.
00:16:28
Speaker
It was awkward for everybody because it was like, take it take it easy. like I mean, I'll give you example. When I say it's coming up in conversations, I was talking to this. i was i was on the phone with somebody, and and I was lighting my cigar, and I and i said, this is my last vice.
00:16:46
Speaker
And he was sitting at the table next to me, and he was smoking a cigar, and he started laughing. And he's like Oh, this your last place. I like that. I like that. So we had started kind of conversation dudes. Like turns out he's like amazing chef. He worked with like that famous restaurant in Chicago. The guy died, but it's like Trotter or something like that. I don't know if you know what I'm talking about. but So that he was a chef and he's all over the world. And he was talking about how, how,
00:17:09
Speaker
how he almost felt like it was harder, even in the in that community, like to get respect in the US when he went to France and Italy and cooked, it was really just merit based and had nothing to do with like race or anything. And he was like, they completely accepted me. And he's you gotta understand, i'm a black man. I grew up here and i and I dealt with some of this stuff here and I go over there and I'm like, oh shit, what's
Urban Living and Community Dynamics
00:17:30
Speaker
gonna happen?
00:17:31
Speaker
So it came up like that very casually in a conversation. And I was like, I said, you know, something like trying to like relate. I said something like, i like the NBA, you know, I just froze.
00:17:43
Speaker
And I didn't, no, just kidding. But it came up like that, but that's like, it's okay. It wasn't, it wasn't like we were trying to hammer out race relations. just, it came up in the story and it was cool.
00:17:53
Speaker
Yeah. You were like, boy, those blacks can really put the round ball in the net guy. Yeah. ah I've heard that before though. I've heard that, that, Black people go out of country and it's like a different world. They don't have that same sense that that people are viewing them in a way that is completely independent of what they're actually doing, just viewing them from the perspective of race, which would be pretty shitty. He almost made it sound like they do it to themselves, but which is a product of like the way you're treated for hundreds of years.
00:18:26
Speaker
Yeah. so oh you can't you owe you a chef now? yeah Yeah, oh yeah. He had to deal with that. I was like, yeah, I'm a fucking chef. I trained in Paris and Milan. He was talking about how he was training in Milan.
00:18:40
Speaker
was like, damn, dude, you should write a book. Pretty sweet. But anyways. Just because he's black, right? Huh? Is that what you meant? You think in 2020 they'd be mad at you for that guy? I like 2020 as the reference.
00:18:53
Speaker
No. ah Yeah. I think it's rate. somebody was saying some Somebody was saying race is like the only conversation in the U.S. It's so ridiculous. The only thing that matters.
00:19:06
Speaker
And I kind of agree to some extent because... Yeah, I mean, a lot of stuff that's happened here in St. Louis, dude, I hope you're saying you're going to come out and visit I hope you come out. You would love it. First all, these guys, these dudes I've been hanging out with in this place, but fucking hot as hell. But like, there's so much cool shit here, like cool architecture, because this is a really old city, because people came up to Mississippi. There's buildings that date back to 1700s, and the French, I think, settled this area. Yeah.
00:19:33
Speaker
but it can't get its shit together. Like you have the most amazing city neighborhoods and they're still boarded up and people are still worried about getting shot and all the white people, all the yeah everyone lives on way west of the city.
00:19:45
Speaker
And I'm just walking around these neighborhoods. I'm like, these are the coolest neighborhoods. Like they're way cooler than cities out west that aren't aren't old enough to have the character. It's just like the way it is, right? and And like, but it it they it won't flip. Like it was a cool downtown area. It sits on on the Mississippi of the arch.
00:20:03
Speaker
It's freaking ghost town at night. and And like, so some of the conversations aren't even about race, but people are just like, well, people keep capping people. Like people are worried about getting shot, like homicide and shit. And you're like, what is it? Like, why is that? Why here?
00:20:19
Speaker
You know? Mm-hmm. Very strange. Yeah. Because I'm so impressed with like my buddy's bar, Brennan's, and the and the neighborhood. and like and um'm kind And I noticed that when I left it, we were doing comedy and like the neighborhood was pumping. And all these places are closed down. And I talked to old friends and I'm like, what's going on here, man?
00:20:38
Speaker
And they're like, yeah, it's crazy. They're just like, but people are so used to it. People are just like, yeah, you know, St. Louis. People are scared. And you're what is that, man? That's weird. Tale as old as time, buddy.
00:20:52
Speaker
Poor people kill each other. Yeah. there's it's But as a percent, I know it's definitely reality. You took that comment seriously? It's true.
00:21:04
Speaker
Well, how many, how many like a like Cherry Hills, which is super high end, but like how many homicides per capita are there like in the Cherry Hills area? it's let it's It's less in affluent areas and poor areas, right?
00:21:17
Speaker
I suppose it's because they're superior people, huh, Matt? Well, my question is why? oh it's money, man. It's just resource. It's resource. It's being able to get out of bad situations. I get that, but how does money correlate? Give me, I might have my own answers, but okay, how money correlate to higher, less money correlate to higher homicide rate?
00:21:39
Speaker
Yeah, let's say Joe is hitting Tamara around at home and Tamara... They're poor? Has money. Okay, has money. Tamara has money. She's like, fuck you.
00:21:51
Speaker
I'm out. Without that, desperate to figure out how to survive, you might see some more violence go down that shouldn't. That goes on and passes on to the kids. and the The people with money do their do their homicides with lawyers. Is that what you're saying?
00:22:05
Speaker
Uh-huh. Yes, sir. I mean, though i think my answer would be that you just have the economy, the the drug, illegal drug activity economy and poor, poor, desperate.
00:22:16
Speaker
It's a way to get out. It's it's also an escape for some people to get hooked on shit. And that creates an environment where you're making decisions that either you're fighting for turf or you're fucked up and you're making decisions that you wouldn't normally make.
00:22:27
Speaker
All that. and And we should call out that we're two pieces of shit analyzing poverty. I think we should call that out. But I think everything we've said is pretty logical.
00:22:38
Speaker
i'm just I'm just analyzing like, because when I bought my house in St. Louis, it was in somewhat of a hood, but this cool neighborhood, all these antique shops. I've talked about it before. and And I remember my friend who I just had lunch with was like, yeah, that neighborhood's about 10 years out.
00:22:54
Speaker
That was 2009, I think we bought the house. And guess guess how far out the neighborhood is in now, in my opinion. Same, still 10 years out. Still dope, still on the cusp.
00:23:05
Speaker
Some of the houses that were 200 grand, that might be like 300, 400 now, but they're still like boarded up houses. They're still like, oh, that restaurant didn't make it. That restaurant was awesome, didn't make it There's still all that shit.
00:23:16
Speaker
And i just I just don't understand. How far is Ferguson from St. Louis? Is it like a burp? As a matter of fact, the dude, the chef guy that worked at Trotter's, was he's I think he lives in Ferguson. It's probably, i would, it's like an Aurora, maybe something like that.
00:23:32
Speaker
I wonder if that chaos. In many different ways, is like an Aurora, actually. Yeah, I wonder if that chaos scared the honkies away. No, but it's it validates. like The honkies live far away, but it validates.
00:23:45
Speaker
yeah But honkies go to gentrify, typically, and and help balance out some of these rough neighborhoods. That's what you did, effectively. And if they're scared, they won't do it.
00:23:57
Speaker
It's funny you say that because now when you listen to what I'm saying and what you just said, like what I'm want, I guess when you what I'm actually saying as a white idiot is why aren't why aren't these neighbors neighborhoods gentrifying faster?
00:24:10
Speaker
That's really what I'm saying. Well, maybe. But ah you've been to Atlanta where, look, the the whole economy, it it feels like is. built around African-Americans and and they're it's not like a rundown. Affluent, affluent. Affluent, yeah, it's not a fucking rundown area. So you you can envision that and that's great.
00:24:29
Speaker
And there should be more cities like that given the population of our country. And that's actually more fun to be around. And I was saying like the difference between in Chicago, we were just hanging out, walking around the lake and you just see obviously a lot more ah black people.
00:24:47
Speaker
They're like saying what's up. They're like, yo, they're like nice. There's something to do with something about Colorado where maybe because there just aren't as many, there's just more suspicion. And like a lack of trust of the white, the white.
00:25:01
Speaker
Yeah. why didnt They don't feel as comfortable and in the environment and and that's weird for me too, because I'm always like going out of my way as the majority to like nod my head and be like, what's up? And sometimes people just ignore me.
00:25:15
Speaker
And I'm like, come on, man, I'm i'm not one of them, dude. and I don't drive a truck, bro, not racist. But like that you you feel it's a better vibe. It's a better vibe. I think it's a stronger community in a place like Chicago.
00:25:29
Speaker
Right. Like the hope shines through. Yeah, it definitely felt it there. I'm hoping Denver gets a little bit more of that. The problem is the way Denver developed was just a mad rush in the last 20 of Californians coming in and raising the prices.
00:25:47
Speaker
That's what's why this like all this is very settled in. like um like like You go to Europe and it feels like everything's settled in over centuries a little bit, but like St. Louis is old, so you see these every you know like the grown up. Everything's grown up. And so you have these little pockets that are so cool and it just feels like very mature.
00:26:06
Speaker
and It's pretty sweet. But I mean, the place where I'm going, I have the advantage that I used to, we used to do some shows at this place and some people still know me from that and I know them or they're like old friends.
00:26:20
Speaker
But it's it's very, ah yeah, dude, what's up? Give you a hug. And you might know them a little bit, but not like, they're not my best friends or anything. But I find these guys that I've been talking to, most of these guys are are black dudes, middle-aged black dudes that are what this place does my buddy's bar that cigar bar it creates
Social Spaces and Community Engagement
00:26:40
Speaker
like the the vibe is exactly what you're trying to create those discussion groups or what we're trying to create on this show where it's just dudes have a place to go shoot the and talk yep and i'm finding the conversations are getting are way outside the range of just what we normally talk about as dudes that that uh sports and and bullshit
00:27:00
Speaker
And it's been like, I've made a few jokes, because that's that's what I do, where it'd be like, that was on my bag I remember you were hosting that show, where you and I'll be like, yeah, I used to be in my prime. Or I had a prime, or back in my day, when you know and they'd be like, are you still your prime, baby?
00:27:14
Speaker
You all good, Matt? Things are coming your way. And I'm like, man, i told I told this guy, I think his name's Clayton, I was like, dude, can you send me a text every morning? like I need you to talk to me every morning. Because my white friend Lance disagrees. yes as He's just talking about how, yeah.
00:27:27
Speaker
No, he's just like, I ain't cheap, but I'll do it. And I was like, it was it the whole thing was like, dude, this is the best. this guy This guy's just being himself, but like the whole the whole game, the whole inspiration.
00:27:39
Speaker
but it But it was, I'm like, it's not just the race thing. Like I'm having all these great conversations, but like there's something about sitting there smoking a cigar. Some people are drinking, some aren't, but sitting outside in a public area,
00:27:52
Speaker
that's like, that's pretty sweet. And so I think, and you can only get that a lot of times in like sort of established city neighborhoods and stuff. And that's like, I mean, there's an ice cream shop down the street that's pumping that's probably doing the same thing.
00:28:07
Speaker
But I think we lost, this is nothing new, but we lost some of that with been the sprawling suburbs. And so there's like, besides all social media and Gen Z have the hard time communicating, you don't have those like community places where you just sit there and shoot the shit with strangers or people you know.
00:28:24
Speaker
And that's what's so impressive to me. Like St. Louis has that. And i don't know if people realize that that that vibe is like ah alive and well here. And that place in particular, my buddy's bar.
00:28:35
Speaker
I'm not getting paid to say that. He's not our first sponsor. oh well. Are you at a place you go hang out? not I was just come bitching the other day. I don't want to go hang with people that look and sound like me down in downtown Littleton, Colorado.
00:28:50
Speaker
Khaki shorts and shit. Yeah, because yeah I'm of the same frame of mind that the differences are what are most interesting and allow for a richer community. And that ain't liberal, bro. I just think that that's more fun.
00:29:04
Speaker
But yeah, I was just bitching like I gotta get back to Denver even. And that's not even that diverse, but at least there's crazy people running around and people acting foolish, which is entertaining. that's good too. I know I'm wrong. I like the the freedom of being white really allows you to push the envelope to not you know, like we accept white craziness, especially like some of those Western, like Portland, for example. Like, yeah you know, and all that's good too.
00:29:29
Speaker
Yeah. Like, there's there's But there's a little bit like we're we're too much about acceptance now. Like, on the like words it's too much about accepting all this shit. It's more like, why don't you just accept, like, having a conversation with somebody? We're, like, pushing the envelope. but Oh, we got everything. We got let them be weird and fun. And it's like, hey, what if there was a place, like, where you just sat down talked to somebody? It's like a concept that's gone.
00:29:55
Speaker
It's like, I can fucking wear a tutu. Or what, you know, like I can dress however I want and be crazy. and But like, there's not many people are like, I'm gonna just sit down with five people on the sidewalk and just start talking to them. Yeah, it's a surface level of attention getting as as opposed to like, you know, any sort of rich communication that ah that might help your life or might help your perspective.
00:30:18
Speaker
Yeah, that's a lot of what's happening. And I'm guilty of it as well, just kind of going back to Yahoo Finance. But I did, by the way, join a group ah financial independence people and my wife and I went this weekend.
00:30:33
Speaker
It was great. Now I got people hitting me up, hey man, we should play music together. But they're all sort of like, weirdos in of themselves fringe financial nerd people that do weird stuff so i thought that was fun can we get can we get them on i don't know if you're there yet in a relationship to them just first time real first time gotta gotta ease in but yeah there aren't as you know there aren't hangouts there are hangouts like but we got to do a group right that's ah like you got to join a group you can't just go somewhere and that's like that's how we do it now
00:31:04
Speaker
yeah there are Yeah, there are hangouts, but people are suspicious. And then they're oftentimes they're organized around the wrong thing. like ah Again, I don't want to be at a bar boozing.
00:31:15
Speaker
If I can find a way to hang out and support the bar without fucking having to have six drinks, that's cool. And I don't want to hang with drunk people too either for for very long, maybe the first buzz.
00:31:27
Speaker
So it's all a preference thing, I think. i could Yeah, I could be... overly excited, but like, that's the nicest thing. It is a bar, but there's, I think too, but- I think it's the cigars, like it makes people slow down though. Cause you're not pounding Jager shots where you're smoking a cigar. So you're just kind of sitting there. So so you're in bar, but people aren't getting fucked up.
00:31:47
Speaker
So the conversations are less boozy. Someone relaxed about it. Yeah. Yeah, maybe. ah you're You also could be vibing cause you're in a different spot. I know I thought Chicago was the greatest thing on the planet just because I was in a vacation vibe or a little bit of a travel vibe.
00:32:03
Speaker
And a little bit of nostalgia for me. Yeah, but Chicago really is. I mean, Chicago is like a bigger St. Louis, so it has that vibe too. i mean it's probably a Midwest thing. Chicago is a pretty amazing city. I never had ah had a bad time there, except when I did an audition for a show that they went really bad. But that wasn't Chicago's fault. Those two casting bitches from L.A.
00:32:24
Speaker
A lack of talent, maybe. I don't know. Yeah, it was bad. But no, I mean, the I don't know. Like, there's cool places and I mean, I love where I lived off ah on Colfax, like down in Cheeseman Park, Wash Park, my brother lives. there's cool places.
00:32:41
Speaker
That place is a spot, dude. Yeah. That apartment you used to have. Oh, that was, yeah, I know. it's probably worth $8 billion dollars now or something like that. It's a nice spot. It didn't go up too much more.
00:32:52
Speaker
Like, it it definitely went up a lot, but it's not like it quadrupled just because there's barriers, right? Parking and... We sold it for $325,000. Yeah. Two-bedroom apartment. Well, I'm pretty sure it's not $1.3 million or something like that. Probably $6,000, but um But so even then, like, I mean, i was we were drinking back then, we and were always going out with friends, so we were always in, like, a bar drinking, you know,
00:33:14
Speaker
like with eight or nine friends, but I still can't think of a place. It's just like, let I'm going to go there and hang out. And I'll know that if I want to, if I want to sort of be social, like I can just sit there and talk to people that I didn't bring by myself or anything.
00:33:28
Speaker
I can't think of a place like that in Denver. Also, I haven't lived in Denver since 2006. So it's kind of hard. It's like me saying, I can't think of a place in Billings, Montana, right? It's because I've never been there. Well, it's interesting, dude, because you're kind of hitting a lot of the New York Times stories. they just You're just like a year or two late. um Yeah, there there was something about a year ago about the home away from home is disappearing fast in America with people moving online.
00:33:54
Speaker
Like Archie Bonkers Bar. Yeah, there just aren't places to go consistently and make friends and express yourself. I don't know where that would be for me. and sp I would hate if you laid it out what you just said and I was sitting in my apartment in Costa Rica I would be like I'm not going I would I would immediately be like fuck that dude I want to go talk to bunch idiots and so the even the action and the idea it is is not it sounds appalling to me and so the only thing that's getting me there is like oh this is kind of nice and outside having aar a cigar and then I'm like
00:34:28
Speaker
in these conversations where normally I'd be like, I'm gonna wanna fucking talk to these people. It's like the something that I don't ever wanna do. so Yeah, you don't, but I think as you age, you just start doing it.
00:34:40
Speaker
You know how it is. You see old people. Old people comment on the dumbest shit. Oh, that looks like a heavy bag. Yeah, they're truly free to make bizarre comments, right? Oh, I'm glad I'm not carrying that bag.
00:34:52
Speaker
Yeah, we went shopping to sixth place, and then they're like, oh, you went there? Ooh, and it just goes on and and you're like, Jesus. Yeah. Because we're too impatient trying to get our stuff done, and then when you're younger, it's more of a...
00:35:06
Speaker
it's like a showboat thing that you do to get attention. And then you end up meeting people cause you're acting crazy. I mean, I was king of that too bad. I can't still do that, but, um, ah you Well, you wouldn't ever do any of this crap. not Like when you're younger, you have all these all these, the infrastructure around you to be social, whether it's school or sports. or Yeah.
00:35:26
Speaker
But now the U.S., it seems like no one will do that unless they're in ah like a club. like um but got It's like a church group or whatever you've fucked up. What? Christian Science Finance Group, whatever you call it.
00:35:38
Speaker
Yeah. What is it? for Financial Freedom? so Financial, yeah, basically. Yeah. Yeah. Like it's it's hard. You wouldn't just go down the corner and sit there outside and be like, hey, how's your how's your finance? I don't know like we feel more comfortable. if There's like a shell around there or like an idea who you're dealing with.
00:35:57
Speaker
something like that. I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about. Yeah, it's all right. do like smoking cigars with, and I, and I've been finding myself in these conversations where I'm like, well, this is very easy. And this would probably, this would take the, this would take the place of therapy for like a 2 million people.
00:36:12
Speaker
If they had a place, they could just go sit outside and shoot the shit for a couple minutes, you know? it It's legit. It is legit. But instead, we're replacing it, and we've had episodes about this with self-help shit from the intranet.
00:36:27
Speaker
Shit like supplements, books, idiots who do YouTube shows that tell you how to live your life. We replace it with that, and that's a lonely endeavor, man. And I'll...
00:36:39
Speaker
um'm I'm looking for different communities because I can feel what's coming. And it begs the question like, why would we go to these perfect, near perfect environments of college campuses?
00:36:51
Speaker
where you have a gazillion activities. You have essentially co-housing around all sorts of people you can meet and hang with and experience. You can get off the beaten path if you want to, but we go from that to- Better bodies.
00:37:06
Speaker
Yeah, better bodies, more fun. We go to hibernating in a fucking single family home, spread out as far as we possibly can. Now, why would we logically move from this great environment to this environment that I think, I won't go as far as say is killing us, but it's definitely dragging us down in this country.
00:37:26
Speaker
Right. We don't know get back to it without a, I mean, it's like, but that that's been going on since... I mean, you could tie it back to cars and roads and the infrastructure moving out of city. Like people were sitting on, it's like in movies and shit, but people sitting on the, the stairway into their apartment building, hanging out in the street, like talking, watching their kids play, you know, and then everyone was like needed more space. They even want my, my own space, my own space, my own space.
00:37:54
Speaker
And, and people just keep getting more isolated because that, so yeah. And um' I don't know if I could argue that that's a bad thing necessarily, because I'm sure if I had my kids and family and I've, and I've, you know, whatever 18 floor apartment and and we're all packed into some apartment like and not like, I'm sure it's nicer to live in a house by itself, but I don't know.
00:38:17
Speaker
I don't know either, but it's just, it's like the other thing about it's called attention to me. Cause there's, You have all these different types of people, but everybody, this sounds real ridiculous, but everyone has the same shit. So I'm in these conversations and hearing about the same problems good things happening, no matter where the person's background or race. Cause there's, you know, there's like med students from fucking China.
00:38:40
Speaker
India and other parts of US and you're like, you're in the conversation with that person and the chef who grew up in North St. Louis and we all have the same problems. And so that's like a bonding thing, you know?
00:38:56
Speaker
Yeah, you just can't find environments to nurture those discussions and relationships. so You got to kill yourself. You gotta smoke cigars. You got to fucking take years out of your life to do it, man. Yeah, I was going to say, dude, you got to be careful, bro. Come on.
00:39:08
Speaker
Cigars bad for you. like Yeah, the smoke's bad, definitely. Okay. Yeah, the smoke is bad. Even though you're not inhaling, you're inhaling it through just in the air because it is it does stick.
00:39:19
Speaker
But, like, what was I going to say before you try interrupt, boy? Yeah. What was going say, boy? Goddamn, it's a podcast so I can edit.
00:39:30
Speaker
the the the Why are you thinking? People are like, what's your podcast about? Because people are like, why are why you why you're not doing stand-up anymore? No, you should do a podcast. and I have one.
00:39:43
Speaker
And they're just like, yeah. And I'm like, yeah. And I'm like, it's just this. Like what we just did like to that person. I'm like, it's just like you and I, we just had this conversation. Tom, it's just that. We're just recording it.
00:39:56
Speaker
They're like, all right. They're like, ah I'll check that out, man. Can I check that out? POS? Yep. Like, piece of shit? Yep. Yeah. and Well, i think what's and I think what makes me a piece of shit in this discussion is that i know I know what I probably need, and yet I continue to like succumb to the barriers and obstacles. so And I know I like the city better.
00:40:28
Speaker
It's not some idealistic liberal thing. like It's just there's a... There's a different vibe. As long as I have access to an escape route exercise wise, which in Denver you inevitably do.
00:40:40
Speaker
I was just in there a lot yesterday and I'm like, dude, fuck. This is way better. Way think, dude, that's the solution for people like you and me and other people that are fit. It's just like I'm
Self-Awareness and Lifestyle Choices
00:40:50
Speaker
going to sweat out any any desire for for anything anything. It's like I'm just going to sweat it out.
00:40:55
Speaker
You know? and Maybe. Exercise my way out of wanting to communicate with anyone. Yeah, well, but but I don't think anymore that even in the city that those environments, with maybe there's a few exceptions, you're coming into your buddy's bar where you've had some people who knew you and maybe you already have some connections there's just a vibe. But I don't think that they're they're just like sitting there waiting for you just because you're in the city.
00:41:19
Speaker
And that's that's kind of sad. No, yeah, but it's just a weird situation. It's just a weird, I mean, there are places like every once while, I run to a place where it just, everything feels easier. And so it's just a weird place where like, there's no, like, cause normally if you go sit down in a restaurant, unless you're weird, you're not going around saying hi to everybody.
00:41:39
Speaker
you might be like, well, you're not like, Hey, what's going on, man? And that, that'll happen there. How are you coming from? You know, something like that. Mm hmm. And that's nice.
00:41:51
Speaker
It's nice. I just don't see I don't see that anywhere. Well, I'm a piece of shit because I've I'm over here. I'm you know what? We're 45 minutes in this. I've been carrying on about the same thing. And the second I get back on the plane and go home, I'll be like,
00:42:05
Speaker
avoiding all all social, any social interaction like and by any means necessary besides people that I want to hang out with. like We belong to like an athletic club down there and it is like a social seat. people A lot of people just go there and hang out. you see it's actually You see a lot of really old men, they're probably hanging out with same 15 dudes they've been hanging out their whole life, but it gives them a little purpose most likely. They go to this club, it's almost like a adult daycare.
00:42:30
Speaker
They fuck around and play pool with their friends and have a couple drinks and talk about soccer. and And ah I just like, I was fucking guys, but I'm like, that's probably wonderful because you don't, you don't see that quite as much up here.
00:42:43
Speaker
I think unless you like belong to country club maybe or something, but like, you don't see that. We we put our old folks in a home or, and maybe they, maybe they get it there, but like,
00:42:54
Speaker
Yeah. Well, you should override that feeling maybe every now and then. And let me ask you a question that came up in No, can't because I'm piece of shit. Yeah, it's true. You have to stay that way. ah The question that came up in some conversations I had with some people this weekend, would you consider with a guy like me and some other friends and maybe some of my friends moving to a common area where...
00:43:18
Speaker
you're around people like that you vibe with or that you can have a common desire to help each other hang and do stuff would you consider that now let's just take away the money equation and my kids moved to Alabama all that's just take it away would you consider that as an idea that would be so amazing and weird if my kids were both like we're going to Bama dad um Yeah, I think that would be awesome.
00:43:45
Speaker
Yeah, I agree. I agree. But and like there's yeah it it seems like an uphill task to get it like first of all, find find people that you really know you can see day in and day out.
00:43:55
Speaker
It's not going to you're not going to. Well, you wouldn't have to see them every day. you just have to have a place. But would it be like a commune? Like you buy a five-acre property and we all build on it? Or it'd just be like, like hey, we're we're all going to this cool kind of this neighborhood that we know is cool. like Yeah, like a neighborhood.
00:44:10
Speaker
i don't Or whatever. I don't really know. It does seem... That happens. Costa Rica. like You'll see yeah four or five friends will move down the same area together. Yeah. It doesn't seem as feasible as it sounds just because it's so funny to hear what people attach themselves to.
00:44:27
Speaker
I need to move where my kids go on the off chance that they want me there and that yeah they they might have kids like, or I need to do this or I need to do that. Or I really like my house in the garden that I've created.
00:44:39
Speaker
It's like, really? Oh, yeah. ah god You know how you know happy the kids would be to be like, oh, you got a bunch of people that can take care of you and you I don't have to deal with your ass. So your kids would be like. great well that but like yeah but what we attach ourselves to is so funny yeah i i hear weird shit like that all like people like no i can't do that Trying to get out of that, I mean, at a minimum, it's just, if you if you just start, if you lay out why I can't do something and then you're like, you can you can write off like four or five of them or you're just like, that's insane that I even think that's a barrier.
00:45:12
Speaker
You know, like you go, oh can I can't, I can start a new garden. Everything would be fine. If we move downtown, we'll have to pay for parking. Parking's always tight down there.
00:45:23
Speaker
Yeah. Why do you need a car? Yeah, so I think this is what a challenge for anyone listening the show is that stop being a piece of shit. If you're not in the city a city center right now having a conversation with a stranger, quit what you're doing.
00:45:41
Speaker
You're a piece of shit. And get there, yeah. Go buy a cigar. find Find a person of a different race. and fucking just just see what they're up to.
00:45:52
Speaker
Otherwise, you fucking suck. Stop listening our shit. Why
00:46:01
Speaker
don't you go get me one of them P's, boy?
00:46:06
Speaker
I want one of them O's.
00:46:11
Speaker
Now go get one of them S's. What's that spell? Poss. It doesn't stand for anything.
00:46:21
Speaker
P.O.S. P.O.S. P.O.S. P.O.S. P.O. P.O