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S2.E1 - Slow-Burn Romance
203 Plays1 year ago
Well paced and satisfying or drawn out and boring. Hear all about how Melissa approached the slow burn romance in her brand new novel, 'My Love Life and the Apocalypse'.
- Naomi Gibson, author of Every Line of You, Game Over Girl
- Melissa Welliver, author of The Undying Tower, My Love Life and the Apocalypse
- Jamie Greenwood, creator & host of the Write and Wrong Podcast
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Transcript
Introduction to Tropes Discussion
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome back to the chosen ones and other tropes where I ask two published authors about their favourite tropes and the ones that make them want to cry. Um, you know the Hunger Games? And now... I do know the Hunger Games. I've heard about it. Yeah, you do know them, yeah. Essentially what the does need to do to him is not parenting, it's child abuse. Yeah. Yeah, beautiful. Man's playing a G-nanny as well. Might be familiar to you.
00:00:26
Speaker
It's not as fun though, is it? It's tragic, isn't it? It's too depressing. But it isn't Neville. It's just not. It's never going to be him. She shouldn't have done that. I'm trying to make Neville happen.
00:00:41
Speaker
This was, this was a tricky one for me. And we were talking about this just before you came on Melissa, because I don't read that much romance as in like dedicated romance. I read a lot of books where there is a romance plot involved, but not dedicated romance. So I didn't feel so qualified, but I will, I mean, I've watched enough.
00:01:00
Speaker
television, which this is featured in extensively, to be familiar with it. But I'll have a go at describing it.
Exploring Slow Burn Romance
00:01:08
Speaker
So I think it's very simple, as far as I can tell. Slow Burn Romance is, as you'd expect, where two characters gradually fall in love, navigating various obstacles that might test them whilst ultimately bringing them together in the end. Does that sound about right? I think so, yeah. So the main takeaway for me
00:01:27
Speaker
was that with a romantic arc like this, it's all about earning the romance, the conclusion where they actually get together, the moment where they finally get together, um, took its time and you know, it's carefully built up to. So as I'm feeling very under qualified, I'm going to throw the mic over to somebody far more qualified than myself as her brand new book, my love life in the apocalypse out April 13th features a slow burn romance.
00:01:52
Speaker
Yeah, it does. Melissa, where are you on this trope? As someone who has used this trope, whose book is coming out with this trope, where are you on this trope? Well, this is where I just like destroy that intro because I don't sound like an expert anymore, but I had the exact same thing where I thought I knew what it was and then thought about it really hard. I was talking to my partner before coming on and he asked me because he doesn't read a lot of fiction, he certainly doesn't read YA where it's like quite popular or fancy. And so, yeah, so what exactly do you mean by that? And I was like,
00:02:20
Speaker
So I was struggling a little bit, but I found I was in two camps and it definitely is a split between YA and Adol and also TV. Maybe there's a third split. So on television, if you have a slow burn, the problem is that it depends how many seasons of the show you have.
00:02:39
Speaker
how often you have to break up the characters. So they might get up together at the end of season one, but then it's renewed for like seven more seasons. Like the Vampire Diaries, my favorite. Or like something we were talking about New Girl, I don't know if anyone remembers New Girl, but they had an on and get off again between Jess and Nick and they would get together and then just randomly have an argument to split them up because you can't have two characters being happy for too long, so it was really tricky. So I don't know if it works in television. And then in books,
00:03:07
Speaker
I think in YA, I really like it in YA. So I've got it in, yeah, my love life in the apocalypse as a slow burn. There are some romantic elements along the way, but mostly like they're sort of kept apart for various reasons until the very end when they really like discover each other and then hopefully fingers crossed to get together, but I don't want to spoil anything. And it's not exactly what you might think it is. And then in adult books, slow burn can mean something entirely different because of how much time passes. So the first one that came to me was One Day by David Nichols. Yes, David Nichols.
00:03:37
Speaker
And that was like a huge about, what, five, 10 years ago? Like everyone was reading it and it was a big film. I remember the film had Anne Hathaway, I think. And it's the plot of people who haven't read it is that over 20 years, these two people that meet at uni have one day every year that they basically bump into each other or meet up. And so that is a 20 year slow burn romance.
Realism in Slow Burn Romances
00:03:59
Speaker
And that blows in the other side of the room, hands out the water, like, how long does my love life in the apocalypse take place over maybe a couple of weeks? So I was like, oh, it's very different because my partner was like, well, really? I suppose when you're a teenager, two weeks might seem like a long time. But if you're an adult, I was like, yes, interesting. That's true. That's very true. So I was kind of fiddling about a bit with like what it means. But as far as if I like it, I think I do like it because it does annoy me when people get together and I know immediately they have to split up like in a TV show.
00:04:29
Speaker
Yeah.
00:04:30
Speaker
Like Ross and Rachel. Yes. Ross and Rachel. Classic. Yeah. That adult, um, where it can go on for a long time. That's it. They kind of do that and love Rosie as well. And as you guys have seen, yes, they do. Yeah. Yeah. And then it's, except with that one, it's not that it's like they're seeing each other one day every year is that it's, uh, every time they kind of reconnect, it's not the right time for one of them. And then eventually it is like 30 years later or something.
00:04:59
Speaker
Exactly. It's like a serendipity type scenario. It seems like it should be perfect timing, but it's not for whatever reason. One of them's married, one of them's in relation, one of them's had a child, one of them wants to go away and do something. Yeah, that is the ultimate slow burn, those types of books. But conversely, we kind of established what a slow burn is. What's like
00:05:22
Speaker
not a slow burn. Because in my mind, the kind of books that I read, the romances is a subplot, a secondary plot. I read a lot of sci-fi fantasy. And slow burn is like so par for the course almost because it's like, that's going to last the entire book and it's going to go through. So it's almost like the default for me. So I don't really engage with the fact that it's like, oh, this is a slow burn romance. To me, I'm like, oh, this is just a classic romance subplot. So what's the opposite of slow burn?
00:05:51
Speaker
Hmm. That's a good question. Because I've seen insta-love thrown around. Yeah. Insta-love. Absolutely. I think that's it. It's like you instantly know you're attracted to someone. Whereas I think with the slow burn, it's more of a slow buy-in to the fact that these characters might be right for each other. But I think the fact, I do think that this is a trope that can get wrapped up in others as well.
00:06:17
Speaker
and could kind of be disguised. So you might have an enemies to lovers, like Pride and Prejudice, for example. But actually, if you look at it, that is a slow burn, because like you were just saying, Melva, that takes place over like a few months. And then by the end of it, they've realised that actually they're good for each other, even if they are kind of enemies. So I think it gets wrapped up into other tropes, and it sort of hides itself. Like,
00:06:41
Speaker
And there's another one as well, Friends to Lovers, I think is probably a slow burn romance. Yeah, I think it has to be. I guess it has to be, right? By definition. Yeah, exactly, you know. So I think, I don't know, yeah, the opposite of it
Slow Burn vs Insta-Love
00:06:55
Speaker
is definitely insta-love for me. Twilight.
00:06:58
Speaker
The opposite of everything. Twilight is ridiculous. It's like, I think I saw a TikTok the other day and someone said that from start to finish in Twilight, only like less than two years pass. It might even be less than 18 months. I saw that. And in that time, you know, she meets it. They're not even together for six months in the middle because he goes off to Rio or whatever he's doing to find himself. I don't know where it's worth whatever you're doing, but the best bit when he leaves.
00:07:23
Speaker
Yeah that's like that is like definition of not slow burn. Yeah so she meets him in like June of 2004 and by like September 2006 she's married and has a kid it's unreal. And dead. Good times. And dead yeah.
00:07:39
Speaker
Oh yeah, because you can track it based on her school year, right? And when she graduates. Yeah, and they're really specific about it. Her birthday's in September, like I know that, I remember. When's Charlie's birthday? I feel like he's a summer baby. I feel like he's a this star sign.
00:08:05
Speaker
I tell you what though, you mentioned TV tropes and I think it actually does work and you're totally right about, they'll write, and this isn't just the romance arc, they'll do this with other arcs as well in a television series when they don't know, you can tell when they don't know if they're being renewed or not when you're watching it. Yeah, absolutely, create more questions. Lost, looking your way.
00:08:27
Speaker
But I think with those, and obviously slow is relative, right? So if we say, you know, one book is, let's equate one book to one series of a show. So in, I think in New Girl, Nick and Jess don't get together until season two. So if we put that in book terms, it's a whole book where they don't get together.
00:08:50
Speaker
And then it's only in the second book that they do get together. And then shows like Castle, it's like a few seasons before they get together, obviously friends, like the mentalist Lucifer. I realized there's a huge trend of this with the trope that this is another trope. It's TV detectives who team up with a civilian, like genius kind of person. And they always end up falling in love.
00:09:14
Speaker
They cast all of them. Cast all the mentalist Lucifer. The first three I thought of, I was like, yep, check, check, check. That's what makes people mad about X-Files, right? Because they don't have to. Oh, I know. They did get together, didn't they?
00:09:31
Speaker
Oh, do they lay? Is it not like a one night thing? Maybe, which is another trope. I have a question. So if it's a slow burn romance, does that mean it has to be a clean romance? So I was thinking this, but in terms of like adult books and YA, obviously. And then I thought to myself, like, um, so partridge pages who are really good Instagram.
00:09:57
Speaker
They put up a reel talking about, um, clean romances. I was tagged in because it had my love life and the apocalypse in it. Um, which I thought was interesting. Um, because obviously it is fairly clean, uh, my book and it is a slow burn.
00:10:14
Speaker
But does it have to be, like, I don't know if you can really include Spice if it's so good. Are they complete opposites? Do they exclude each other? Well, you think by the time that they get together, it's probably at the climax of the book. Yeah, you're kind of a sex scene at the end. Exactly. It would be, it just wouldn't fit, right? Yeah. Totally out of sync with the rest of the beats of the book. So I think you're probably right that
00:10:40
Speaker
Yeah. Unless the point when they get together is when they have sex. And then for us, it's probably not going to be clean. Or it can work in the more niche category of movies, which is the friends with benefits to lovers.
00:10:57
Speaker
like no strings attached. And I think literally it was called Friends with Benefits, that one movie. Obviously that can work because the idea is that they're trying to keep it casual, but then I don't think that's really slow burn. That's like, let's delude ourselves into thinking we're one thing when we're not.
00:11:15
Speaker
Yeah. Cause you're being given, isn't the whole thing with slow burn is that as well as the characters like dancing around each other, like you are also being kept at arm's length. And that's what people love about it, right? Or hate about it. It's like, come on, just kiss already. Or like, we love it. We love that they're about to kiss.
Challenges in Writing Slow Burn
00:11:33
Speaker
And then someone walks in the room and you're like, ugh.
00:11:35
Speaker
I don't know, I really like it, but I can understand why it would be really annoying. So this is my thing with it, right? So I also really like it, but at the same time I'm very impatient and I don't think I have the self-discipline to write one.
00:11:48
Speaker
because I can't prolong two characters not getting together. But as well, though, when I'm reading them, sometimes if I get really impatient, I will flip forward to the point where they get together just to see if they definitely do, because I'm just too impatient as a reader. And I just have to... And spoiler alert, I do read the back page of most books before I get to it. Oh my gosh. Kick off the fuck off.
00:12:18
Speaker
But yeah, but at the same time, right, the slow burn is probably the most reflective of real life romances, I think. Because... Definitely the UK. Yeah, okay. What does that say about it?
00:12:38
Speaker
So yeah, I think it's probably quite reflective. And I think in that sense, it's a popular trope because it gives people hope. Do you know what I mean? Oh, I see what you mean. They see these characters individually and they root for them individually. And then they're like, they're rooting for them to come together because they see that they have chemistry and they see that they work together. And as a reader, you want that to happen.
00:12:58
Speaker
I think that's why it works because in real life, that's friends to lovers, slow burn. That's probably how most people get together, I would say. I think that's why it works. It's realistic, right? It's relatable in that way. Yeah, absolutely relatable. That's the word. Thanks. I would argue, and spoilers for Naomi's first book, Every Line of You,
00:13:22
Speaker
Lydia doesn't get together, you know, they don't get together until later on in the book. And I know that there are various restrictions which prohibit that from happening. But it is, I mean, in theory, it is slow burn romance. Yeah, I think so too. But the point with that is that the rest of the plot is kind of breakneck. And yeah, yeah, you probably need that sort of slow bit in it. So I think
00:13:50
Speaker
If you get a slow plot with a slow burn romance, it's too slow. Okay. So, so on from that, then my question is this because almost, I think I'll go on to another question off this, but do you guys think that all, every time that there's a slow burn romance, does it need to have an element of will they, won't they? I think so because that drives tension. Yeah, same. Yeah.
00:14:18
Speaker
Yeah, same. I think that's what's good about Naomi's first book is one thing that can annoy me with slow burn because I'm not massively sold on it. I enjoy it, but it's not my favorite thing. And I think one of the things that annoys me is the reasons you put in the way. So these are all tropes on their own, but things like bad communication is the reason they're not together. So in La Rosie,
00:14:40
Speaker
It's literally just because the entire reason they're not together, if anyone's
Role of Miscommunication in Slow Burn
00:14:45
Speaker
not seen it, this episode of the first five minutes, not even a spoiler, is that Rosie and her best friend, who I cannot remember the name of, they kiss. And then the next day she can't remember because she was really drunk and threw up everywhere. It was her 18th birthday. They went out and stuff.
00:14:58
Speaker
So the next day she's mortified because she was thrown up everywhere and doesn't remember anything. So she says to him, who's her best friend from childhood, oh, can we just forget last night I'm mortified? And he takes that as, oh, she didn't want to kiss me. And that changes the entire trajectory of their lives. And it annoys me because I hate miscommunication. Whereas I think in Naomi's, I quite enjoyed it because there are parts where
00:15:18
Speaker
Henry so guys have read it like henry is inside lydia's brain basically speaking to her cuz he's an ai chicken arm and stuff and like they want to be together but there are literally obstacles in their way it's not so it's not a miscommunication it's not secret they are actually working towards trying to be together like get him a body and like that's what they're doing so i don't do quite well near me because i don't know me.
00:15:40
Speaker
where I do get cross with some of the reasons given for them not getting together. That is something that annoys me about slow-burn romance when there's a really rubbish reason given. If we have slow-burn romance on one extreme and we have insta-love on the other extreme, you're more of a medium heat. Leave it to similar, because it makes sauteed romance.
00:16:00
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, as long as it makes sense. And as long as like, basically, I'm just very, very specific. Like as long as the tropes I do not like, I'm not there to make it slow burn, then it's fine. Because I'm very picky. But yeah, on the whole, I like it. And I don't like insta-love. But yeah, like if I was, if it was scale one to ten and like ten is slow burn, I'm like, I'm like a 5.56 away from insta-love. But I think that's why my love life in the apocalypse does it so well, though, because
00:16:29
Speaker
He's literally on his own. He's the last guy on earth, really. And then this girl just crash lands. It's like she was picked for him, you know, and you want them to get together. And it's like it's really it's nice. And because the rest of the book is about like discovering why they're the only people left, you know, that kind of keeps you intrigued. And you're quite happy for this romance to be building in the background. So for me,
00:16:54
Speaker
If there's something interesting going on in the A plot, I'm quite happy to have a slow burn romance in the B plot, but I can't have a slow main plot and a slow burn B plot. Ah, yeah, that's true actually, because it is sci-fi and post-apocalyptic, so there's a lot going on. Yeah, absolutely. Like why? You know, you've got to go and figure that out. There's a lot going on.
00:17:14
Speaker
So, so, so we're, we're all kind of like, yes, there needs to be at least some element of, well, they weren't there. It can't be a foregone conclusion because you need tension somewhere. Otherwise it's like, yeah, get on with it. You know, if we already know you're all getting together, just get on with it. So my next question is.
00:17:31
Speaker
And this is as someone, as I mentioned before, who doesn't read that much sort of like pure romance. The romance I'll engage with is usually intertwined with other plots. But do we think that a slow burn romance could exist as the solo main plot of a story?
00:17:53
Speaker
See, I think that would be too... I think it can, obviously, you can write anything, but I think it would be too slow. The whole point of writing. But yeah, it would be too slow for me, I think.
00:18:06
Speaker
Yeah. No, I agree. You can argue that both Lavrosian one day, technically that is the main A-plot, isn't it? Especially one day where literally you're just checking in with them when they're together on that one day each year, or when they're at least thinking about each other on that one day each year. Sometimes they cheat it a little bit, it's like they're writing each other a letter or something.
00:18:25
Speaker
So that is essentially the entire plot. And I must admit that's a will they won't name without like spoiling the end. It doesn't end how you think it will. And I did find it quite depressing. Like one of those books where I was like, oh, at the end, like, oh, no. Don't want to do spoiler, but it wasn't like the most uplifting ending I've ever read. So I was like, eh.
00:18:46
Speaker
and i don't know after all that i think if it's a slow burn romance yeah you need something else going on and then you don't have like a really happy ending that's really satisfying and it has to be all happy it just has to be satisfying if to answer questions then it can be really dark i think this that's such a good point because the slow burn i think is is
00:19:05
Speaker
more of a promise than most romances like that's very true it because it's that will they won't they and then you know that they will and then to take them apart after that it just would be such a like what's the point in the book yeah yeah so maybe you can't maybe I think they have to stay together if you're gonna do it yeah yeah
00:19:27
Speaker
Yeah, if they didn't get together at the end of Love Rosie, it would be like, well, yeah, what, what was this all for? Yeah. This is just so depressing.
00:19:40
Speaker
But I guess interestingly, both those examples where it's like the main plot, both of those use, extensively use like big time jumps and it's not, you're not watching it even close to real time. Obviously a lot of movies and books and things will take place over a couple of weeks, couple of months, but those ones are happening over literal years. So it's maybe that's the cheat code to make it work. It's like you really need it to be, you need it to be super slow burning basically. You would need to stretch that timeline out.
00:20:10
Speaker
What's interesting as well is when I was thinking of the defining this, like at the start when I was kind of trying to explain it, I sort of felt that in some ways slow burn romance and
00:20:25
Speaker
Pinterest all here. I'm not someone who reads a lot of romance. I'm not so like well versed in all the different ranges of that kind of stuff.
Slow Burn as Character Arcs
00:20:33
Speaker
But it does seem like it has one it's it's basically a character arc that takes its time really earns the conclusion. And
00:20:42
Speaker
In my mind, it's like, it's almost like writing any character arc. This one just happens to be romance flavored. Do you know what I mean? It's in the, you know, as long as it's, if it's well thought out, it makes sense. The struggles come at the right times. They don't like break the characters. And then it kind of concludes. Well, that is in many ways just describing writing a good character or a good arc or a good adventure.
00:21:08
Speaker
Yeah, and I think with it, my favorite way of doing it is with a B-plot. So most YA has a B-plot of romance, and most of the time because of the nature of YA, again, talking about if you can put in spicy scenes or not, and if that's a bit weird in team fiction, then obviously Slow Burn lends itself more. I was thinking about the Hunger Games. We talk about Hunger Games a lot.
00:21:30
Speaker
Because obviously it's full of tropes, that's why I love it. And obviously it's a trilogy. And then if you've got a series and you're doing a slow burn romance, obviously in the first one, romance is hinted at. But to be fair, she doesn't really, apart from that one like fake kiss with Peter, they're not really following up on that romance storyline, are they? She's kind of like, listen, I'm trying to stay alive. Can all the boys just back off? Yeah, that's so true.
00:21:53
Speaker
And it's very different. Whereas obviously then they really pick it up in books two and three. And I'm always interested like, did she always write them as a trilogy? I don't know. I don't know about like her book deal or anything, Suzanne Collins, but did she know it was going to be like that? And then thinking about things like we obviously talk about Harry Potter a lot and was, and obviously he gets together with Ginny in the most spicy romance of all time. And so it's like, is that because I'm from a field very slow, but also kind of fast because it just appears out of my way.
00:22:23
Speaker
So thinking of TV series and you don't know whether they're going to get renewed, if you have a series of books and you know you're going to write three or whatever, how's that work with Sloburn? I think YA, it almost always has to be Sloburn, especially if you're writing sci-fi fantasy because there's something else going on and it can be part of the coming of age story, the first love story like Jamie was talking about with the characters, learning about themselves and each other. One I thought was done really, really well. Have you guys seen The Mountain Between Us?
00:22:54
Speaker
No, it's got Kate Winslet and intro Selba and it is coming out. Yeah. So these, this, so he's a surgeon. She's a photographer, I believe. And they basically need to take a plane somewhere. So they chart at this really little rickety thing. And obviously it crashes. They were on this mountain, the pilot dies and it's just them and the pilot's dog. And, um, it's a slow bone romance and the, the A plot is obviously that they have to survive.
00:23:19
Speaker
And it's like this wilderness, there's loads of snow. She breaks her leg. She almost drowns because she's a bit... Yeah, he just helps, basically. She just can't help but not drown, can she, Kate Winston? Oh, I know. Yeah, it's like in every movie. Hello.
00:23:34
Speaker
So but it's just really beautiful how they come together and she's like engaged I think to somebody else but because they're trapped on this this mountain it's like it's all about survival and it's just the two of them against the
Survival Settings in Slow Burn
00:23:45
Speaker
world. Former bonding. Yeah exactly and that's it and they're just like they have to help each other they have to and it's just obvious that they're gonna come together and when they do it's absolutely perfect and it's like you just forgive her for cheating on her fiance because it's just so perfect.
00:24:02
Speaker
It's like the only acceptable time if it's great. That's how perfect it is. It's brilliant. That does sound good, to be fair. Yeah, I like that. Well, it sounds like that earned it. At least in your eyes, they 100% earned their romance to the point where you were like... Exactly. Yeah. You don't mind. You don't mind. They're only gay. It's not even marriage yet. They have a dog now. Come on. Exactly. They're dog parents.
00:24:30
Speaker
Sort of to round this off in a more sort of... The conclusion for me anyway is that...
00:24:37
Speaker
It's kind of a default. The stories that I experienced the most almost always have a romantic subplot in some way, shape or form. And it's almost always slow burn because just like you guys said, when there's a higher stakes thing going on, the romance can afford to be slow. And you want something that's kind of just ticking over in the background that's kind of adding a bit of tension, adding a bit of intrigue and character development.
00:25:04
Speaker
as well as like whatever you know the world's under threat or something la dee da dee da like that um so and i agree also with what you said melissa about sometimes it can annoy you when a romance is so slow like glacially slow that it's like get on with it um what i think
00:25:25
Speaker
For the most part, this is a big like, it's a big kind of like green tick for me where I'm like, yeah, this is, if you pulling off a good slow burn romance is just good writing and good characters. I think the only caveat I would say, this isn't really a caveat. This is more like,
00:25:43
Speaker
This isn't me saying this is the only way to do romance well. I think there's so many different situations where it's like you can do a very quick romance and it can work. There's a lot of stories where the main bulk of the story isn't necessarily about the courtship phase. So that sometimes is sort of like flashed through in the first chapter or the first couple of chapters because they want to do the story in the sort of relationship phase.
00:26:09
Speaker
Yeah, for me, for me, I think it's just it's just it's it doesn't really feel like a trope. It feels more like a narrative choice. And, you know, if you do it, if you're a good if you've written it well, if the characters are well thought out, if it fits nicely into the universe, it's just going to work and it's going to be intriguing and it's going to draw people to the characters. It's going to draw people to the story. There's not that many pitfalls with it. I mean, if you write it badly,
00:26:35
Speaker
it'll be boring, people won't be invested in the romance, and it'll just feel like filler. But that's really the same as any subplot. It doesn't feel toxic like some other stuff we've seen before. No, that's so true, yeah. Yeah, like I can't really think of a toxic slope apart from if it's miscommunication. But apart from that, which just makes me angry, it isn't necessarily toxic. I think if they don't end up together after all that, that's toxic for me. That will lead you to poison me, apart from that. Yeah.
00:27:05
Speaker
It is difficult to reconcile if it's been like a real slow burn and then there's not likely ever after. Exactly. Yeah. And you're like, well, what was, what was this? Well, what are we here for?
00:27:17
Speaker
Yeah. There is something about promise of a story and even if you give it a twist, like you can give it a twist at the end, but that you still have to at least get the moment of passion or something. They don't even have to necessarily be together together. There has to at least be some sort of conclusion. It can't just be like that they grow apart. Yeah. Because you are being promising something. But then that's not, that's still slobber, no? Because you've grown apart by the end of it because surely. Yes, but maybe they have to get together in order for it to be a slobber. That's a really good point.
00:27:48
Speaker
What's the movie with Ryan Gosling and Emma Stone about jazz?
Examining La La Land's Slow Burn Ending
00:27:54
Speaker
Oh yeah, the notebook. La La Land. No, not the notebook. That's Rachel McAdams. No, not La La Land. Sorry. La La Land. Have you guys seen it? Yeah. That's kind of a slow burn and you go through their courtship and then their actual relationship and then the conclusion is, spoiler, not happily ever after, but it kind of works.
00:28:19
Speaker
It doesn't work Jamie. It's rubbish. That's how I felt. You're like, why are we here? That's how I felt at the end of the movie. He's depressed. She's up with this guy who we don't know. Who's he? Who the hell is this? And he's saying at his piano, playing his songs. It's terrible.
00:28:44
Speaker
Okay, okay. The thing that I took from it was that it's sad that they couldn't be together, but they both wanted to pursue their dreams and they never could have done that together. So they had the happy nod at the end where they were like, we obviously loved each other, but it never would have worked kind of thing.
00:29:07
Speaker
Yeah, it's terrible. It's really, really terrible. I'm not. It just feels like a fake out because I feel like there was no hints that that was coming. And then the last 10 minutes are like, lol, flash forward. They're not together. Here's some strangers. It would have been so much more uplifting if they had come together.
00:29:24
Speaker
Didn't even have to be like that. They could just keep arguing and be together. That's fine. That's fine. Yeah. Have a weird marriage. That's fine. So long as you're married. Okay. We're here for the toxic marriages, guys. Stay together. We do like toxic. Maybe that's fine now. Season two all about toxicity. Okay. Yeah. We'll do a whole season on toxicity. Yeah. That's good. That would make me happier. I have a few things to say. I'll be honest.
00:29:53
Speaker
Well, on that note... Thanks for putting up with our nonsense for another episode. To stay tuned to everything we're up to, you can follow the podcast on all socials at The Chosen Tropes. Follow Melissa at Melova, Naomi at Naomi G. Rites and Jamie at Jamie X Greenwood. Don't forget to check out Naomi and Melissa's books as well as the Right and Wrong podcast. Thanks again and we'll see you on the next trope.