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108: And Then They Disappeared
15 Plays1 year ago
We've decided to feature more missing persons and unsolved cases on the pod, to help highlight and bring attention to more cases that could be solved someday. There's unfortunately too many to choose from.
Kelsey brings us the tale of Diane Augat, who went missing quite quietly in 1998. Strange clues and traces of her are the only things that have ever been found, and theories include foul play.
Alanna covered the disappearance of Keith Reinhard, and the mysterious circumstances surrounding his last hike. He was not the only man to never return from Pendleton Mountain, and certainly not the first to go missing in a deeply wooded or National Park area. Could some of these deaths and disappearances be connected?
If you have any info on Diane's disappearance, you can call Crime Stoppers of Tampa Bay at 1-800-873-TIPS. If you have any info on the disappearance of Ketih Reinhard, you can submit a tip on the Unsolved website: https://unsolved.com/gallery/keith-reinhard/
Darkcast Promo of the week! And Then they Were Gone Podcast (what could be more fitting??)
https://www.andthentheyweregone.com/
https://linktr.ee/castlesandcryptids?utm_source=linktree_admin_share
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Transcript
Podcast Introduction and Episode Confusion
00:00:21
Speaker
Um, you are listening to Castles and Cryptids, where the castles are haunted and the cryptids are cryptic as fuck. And I'm Alanna.
00:00:29
Speaker
I'm Kelsey. And I'm pretty sure this is episode 108 because I had to double check. We had to change our numbers. So I got confused too. I was trying to fix the website. I was like, oh, I had all these, all our episodes pre-done. And then it was like, oh shit. It was like relinking sources and changing episode names. It was like, fuck sakes.
00:00:57
Speaker
We split it again. Yeah. No, it's true. And sometimes I ask you before we start, because I'm like, what episode are we on? I should know this before we go on air. And we're on? No. With the real radio station. No. Yeah, yeah, apparently this has ended up at 108 because
Technical Mishaps and Phone Storage Issues
00:01:22
Speaker
we had things that happened and we hope you liked them because we had like a bonus episode one week and then by the next week it was like are we gonna get the episode out in time right because we were doing our patreon one and it was during that one that your mic decided to crap out so anyway it was a whole yeah and not so much crap out is fall apart
00:01:48
Speaker
I knocked it off the table and somehow broke the USB-C side of the cable that plugs in because the mic is heavy and it was falling and it caught on the cable and it must have
00:02:05
Speaker
I don't know, it just broke off the metal part that actually plugs into the mic and then all the little pieces that would make up what plugs into the mic, all these little fibery looking metallic pieces and all these layers just broke apart and spread across my carpet and I was like, well, that's not good. Nope. Yeah. And then it was hard to find one because the
00:02:30
Speaker
The outside of the mic is weird, it has to plug in really deep and the...
00:02:36
Speaker
plastic part of most of the cables is too big it won't fit inside because it's so little just yes when you're like this almost fit like my phone charger or whatever but it's just like i have three i have three usb c cables and i even had micro usb cables none of them well the micro wouldn't one would have worked anyway but none of them like none of them worked yeah those ones are like the
00:03:06
Speaker
Um, I guess the standard like Android looking ones, they use it for like Kindle and like my headphone chargers, the same one and stuff like that. Yes. Cause I think I was telling you my headphone charger matches my phone. So I keep that little short one at work, but it's just like the shortest little cord. Yeah. It's probably like the one that looks almost like an HDMI cable where it's like the, is it hexagon? Not hexagon.
00:03:36
Speaker
I don't know, they're kind of rounded, like a rounded rectangle. Which does remind me of some gif I saw where it was like, it was about Android users and iPhone users, which is why I made me think of it. It was like this cartoon with a big brain, like Android users. Oh, I can download, or what was it? I could listen to anything I want without downloading it.
00:04:02
Speaker
Uh, and also plugging the headphone jack and then it was like iPhone users like trying to put a square peg in like a round hole. I tell y'all, I mean, when I bought my phone, uh, it was the first one I had had since getting rid of like having iPhone for probably almost six or seven years. And it didn't have the,
00:04:31
Speaker
Yeah, it didn't have the storage I wanted on the Samsung one. So when I was buying my phone, I bought an external little chip that you could put into my phone that has storage. So I can take this chip out and I could put stuff on it and put it back on my phone.
00:04:51
Speaker
I think I got one that was like 50 gigabytes just so I could put almost all of my music on it so that the rest of my like 30 some gigabytes that are my phone now I am like 80 gigabytes right and yeah so it's where like iPhone you can't do that you can't plug an external like storage thing into it god forbid
00:05:13
Speaker
Like an external hard drive sort of? Yeah, it's almost like a little card, like a little memory card, but it like fits. It's in my phone. Gotcha. Yeah. And like iPhone doesn't do that. It just you buy it with the storage you want. And like Samsung was nice. At least I could like add this storage to it.
00:05:33
Speaker
iPhones like you get what you get and you don't get upset. And you don't get a charger. No modifications. No, I've never had an iPhone, but don't know that I ever will. I have to say they're a lot more user friendly. They are great for that part. Yeah, I think I had three or four different iPhones in a row. And then, yeah.
00:06:01
Speaker
You said, I know. Well, all the new iPhones, when it came to me wanting to get my phone, none of them had the headphone jack anymore. And they were getting bigger and bigger. And I didn't want that. And I wanted the headphone jack. So I ended up going to Samsung. And then Samsung got rid of a lot of their headphone jacks now too. So now we just have a phone that's like six years old, but it's still chugging along. It works just as good as the day I bought it. So.
00:06:29
Speaker
See how long it works till it dies. That's not something I even use anymore because I've had the wireless earbuds for a couple years now. I don't really, but the music app I have, for some reason it keeps glitching out and every time it refreshes the ad that's supposed to be playing on screen, it pauses my music.
00:06:54
Speaker
And then sometimes it doesn't come on until I like tap the phone back awake, like if it went asleep. And then it like resumes the music and it's been doing it for like six months. So I like never listened to music on my phone anymore. Cause it's just really annoying. Yeah. I hate anything that unnecessarily stops it. And my phone has been just like glitching so much lately. Yeah. I'm like, am I using a CD player that's skipping as I walk around? Cause this.
00:07:22
Speaker
everything I use lately. It didn't matter if it was like Spotify or YouTube or whatever. I was like, it's clearly my phone because everything is like freezing and like doing the red circle of death. Yeah, it's been a little bit better. I restarted it. Who knows? Yeah, I ended up just downloading like the new episodes of crimes and consequences. And then I listened. I listened to that when I cut the grass or
00:07:51
Speaker
Well, this is what made me laugh about the game. It was something like implying that like you have to download every, you know, episode to listen to something or whatever. When things say that, I'm like, that's insane. Nobody could do that. That's so much space. You have to go in and be careful. That would be annoying. Yeah. Yeah. Any who's it. We digress. You didn't come here for tech recommendations. Tech wreckies. Maybe you did.
00:08:20
Speaker
You never know. I heard on a podcast today, you can get Discovery Plus with an email. And I was like, well, maybe that's some free trial shit, but I like a good tip like that. Yeah. Love a hot
Post-WWII Punishments: The 'Ugly Carnival'
00:08:32
Speaker
tip. Maybe someone's been having the same technological woes as we have. We don't know. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm sure Kelsey is going to kick us off, but I can start you with a,
00:08:50
Speaker
weird fact or? Sure. I was like, maybe I should call this a, you know, how you see on the internet, like TIL, like today I learned sometimes. It's often on Reddit. But yeah, I was like, this is my segment, because it's always like, today I heard about, um,
00:09:10
Speaker
This, I was listening to one of the podcasts on our network, shout out. Um, so maybe we'll include their little promo, but, uh, it was on ODFM pod. And they had talked about something that was called Ugly Carnival. And I was like, well, never heard that. Ugly Carnival. I'm intrigued. What's that? Well, the context was, uh,
00:09:39
Speaker
God, from what I can remember, they were talking about post World War Two or whatever. And they're like, this person had their head shaved for
00:09:56
Speaker
I don't know, they're they're associating with a German officer or whatever, because, you know, there's like a lot of the SS officers and stuff in World War Two. Yeah. Had babies with people in different countries and stuff like that. War bastards. I don't know. It was like something along those lines. And then they were like, oh, this person was like, had her head shaved after the war because they like.
00:10:23
Speaker
amongst all the DJ celebrations decided they should shame people that have did anything to do with anything or whatever. So I guess that's what it was. When I pulled up on the Guardian dot com, they show a picture of a woman's head being shaved. This is just reminding me super hard of Game of Thrones and Cersei and her walk of shame. Oh, yeah. Shame.
00:10:52
Speaker
Shame. Shame. This article said, as we mark the 65th anniversary of the D-Day landings, Antony Beevor describes a dark side to the liberation parties, the brutal head shaving and beating of women accused of collaboration. So it doesn't seem great. It's not one of those two people kissing after the war is over. It's more like,
00:11:22
Speaker
Let's fucking revilify anyone we can find. Wow. I don't know. That's what it makes me think of because it's just like to, you know, to bring shame on anyone who may have had contact with the Nazis and stuff like that. And it was like, well, dude,
00:11:48
Speaker
There's a lot going on then. We're still prosecuting people for war crimes. Yeah, exactly. And trying to. Really weird practice though. I don't know. I didn't really look into it other than that, but weird. Yeah, I never heard of that, but it kind of makes sense. People always... I guess when there is a dominant power or something like that going on,
00:12:15
Speaker
that ends up being negative, the people that were associated or had kids or were in relations with them or anything. It's typically looked down on, but... Maybe the other people were trying to distance themselves so much from being any kind of supporter that they're like, let's just do what we can to vilify this person. Yeah, focus on these specific people.
00:12:41
Speaker
Yeah, the way people will kind of quote unquote virtue signal being like, I'm a good person. I would never do that. Cause I stand with these people or I do this and I do that. It's like, you shouldn't have to sit here and say you stand with like gay people or whatever. It should just be a given. I don't know. But anyway, we don't want that one to get too unfun, but
00:13:11
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, it's about to get real on fun. I feel like this will be a really depressing episode because... Yeah. Honestly, I don't know. It can be. I don't know how some podcasts can only cover disappearances.
The Mysterious Case of Diane Augat
00:13:23
Speaker
It would be hard. I couldn't. I'd be so sad. Yeah. That's fascinating. They are, but I don't like unsolved cases, really. Yeah.
00:13:37
Speaker
We like it all wrapped up in a neat little package. Yeah, they aren't my favorite. But this one, I didn't remember any hearing ever any of these details about it, but or even this person's name.
00:13:54
Speaker
But when I first was trying to find a case, I saw a picture of her and it was like, I have seen that picture like dozens of times. And I was like, I don't know the case, but I know this picture, which is kind of why I got interested in me. Like, why do I know this picture? And kind of thing never really figured out where I possibly could have heard this from, but I definitely have seen this picture so many times. And probably a lot of our listeners will have too.
00:14:24
Speaker
So the case, when you went into it, you weren't as familiar with just the picture? No familiarity with any of it. Didn't know how I would have ever seen this picture. Weird. Yeah, wouldn't have ever looked at it and been like, she's a missing person. Nothing. No recognition at all. But I just knew the picture. It was weird. Yeah, I can see that. Sometimes you just see your face and you're like, they look familiar. I've seen them before or whatever. Yeah.
00:14:54
Speaker
And this one is fairly popular as well. It's been covered many, many times, especially on YouTube. It's pretty insane how many different podcasts and YouTubers have covered this case because a bunch of stuff came up when I was looking it up and it was all people that had already covered it.
00:15:16
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, really? Okay. Yeah. And I think that's just because it's very bizarre. There's a lot going on. So this is the disappearance of Diane Augat. I think it's how you would say your name. I didn't listen to anything else. So sorry if that's wrong, but I'm going to be calling her Diane. Oh, darn pronunciations. Yeah, I get you. I am not sure that that does sound familiar. Interesting.
00:15:44
Speaker
She was born Diane Louise Young, born on February 21, 1958 to parents James and Mildred Young. I love the name Mildred. It's so cute. It is very old-timey. I love it. It's so nice. The family at that time was living in New York, but they later relocated to Tampa, Florida.
00:16:14
Speaker
And... Go on Mildred. I'm just kidding. By the late 1970s, Diane had gotten married to a man named Frederick Augat. And I don't know exactly when they got married because at this time she would have been at most like 19. She got married maybe. Yeah.
00:16:42
Speaker
and she became a stay-at-home wife and ended up taking care of the couple's three kids. There was two daughters and a son, and Diane and the family were known to keep a really neat house. It was really orderly, and people described that she was living a picture-perfect life. From the outside. Yeah. Whoever it is.
00:17:13
Speaker
Right. The family really enjoyed camping and going fishing, and they actually spent many weekends outdoors. Aww, I like that. Yeah, just doing stuff. Denise, whose Diane's sister later recalls, quote, she had $100 pocketbooks, she was pretty, and there could be a thousand people in the room, and you'd still notice her.
00:17:38
Speaker
Oh, okay. Yeah. That goes beyond your smile, lights up a room. Yeah, like had money. She was okay. Yeah, I think she was probably a really great person. Yeah, and she it could have been the picture perfect family. But this all kind of changes in the late eight, not 1890s, well, 1980s.
00:18:07
Speaker
Yeah, I didn't even type it. I just started saying it wrong. After a brief period of bizarre behavior, Diane, who is now in her early 20s, was diagnosed with manic depressive disorder or known more commonly today as bipolar disorder.
00:18:32
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, really? Are those considered the same? Okay. Yeah. Um. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense because the period of depression and then like. Yeah.
00:18:49
Speaker
Yeah, so that really changed her behavior. Now she can be a very, very different person. She began taking these medications to treat this mental illness and things were going okay for a while. Over some time Diane ended up kind of stopping her medication and during these periods her mental health would decline once again.
00:19:15
Speaker
she would kind of start taking her medications, but she never really stayed on them for very long, it seems. Maybe she didn't like the way they made her feel or something. Yeah, which I think can be really common. Yeah, I've heard people say, you know what, this helped with my ADHD or anxiety or whatever, or even from
00:19:38
Speaker
my partner, he said that he's been on pills before that just made him feel numb like kind of like a zombie and I just always thought that doesn't sound great. I mean, if you already kind of have managed to deal with it in your life, like maybe sometimes it is easier with
00:19:53
Speaker
without something that makes you feel that way. But I have no idea. So by 1988, this kind of comes out of left field. I don't really have any more information about this. The one source said that the state, by 1988, had charged Diane with child abuse.
00:20:17
Speaker
And this charge happened after she was alleged to have sought after excessive amount of unneeded treatment for one of her children. Kind of what is now known as Munchausen by proxy. Kind of like that kind of situation going on. Just like trying to get excessive medical care.
00:20:40
Speaker
right when someone's not really sick but either you possibly they're sick somehow in your mind yeah trying to make them believe they're sick
00:20:50
Speaker
I don't have more information about that. It said ultimately she was acquitted of these charges, but the state kept pursuing the case against her in believing that these charges were still true and later ended up being that the children were completely removed from her custody.
00:21:13
Speaker
Uh, in 1991 with Diane's continued poor behavior and like problems with her mental health and then this happening with her kids, her and Frederick, uh, ended up divorcing and he got sole custody of their children. So now they're basically out of the picture. I don't know anything more about that really. Okay. Yeah.
00:21:39
Speaker
That's good for a true crime case. I want them to be far away. This ends up greatly affecting Diane's mental health. She's really upset over her divorce and then losing her three kids. I'm sure that was devastating for her. That's your whole family, your whole life. Over the next several years, her life was spent in and out of different jails as well as different mental health facilities.
00:22:10
Speaker
Okay. Her brother-in-law, Al Finkelstein. Finkelstein. I didn't even pay attention to what his last name was until just now. Finkelstein. That's a common one too, yeah. Yeah, Steenstein. Is it? Yeah. I was like, Finkel. I feel like the person has to tell you if it's Steen or Stein sometimes. Yeah. Because like, Ben Stein, he had a show. Anyway, it was a whole thing. Yeah.
00:22:42
Speaker
Her brother-in-law would later recount to reporters in the Tampa area, quote, she's constantly talking to herself. You can tell right away that she's ill.
00:22:52
Speaker
That was his quote. And then Diane's mother was also quoted saying, she hangs out with whoever will be her friend. She's sick. You can't deal with her when she's as manic as she is. She gets in your face and doesn't shut up. So she can be like quite a different person. Hmm. Interesting. It's hard to know exactly what they mean by some of that. You know, it's kind of like it's going to like
00:23:23
Speaker
gets you're like, okay. Yeah. What does that mean?
00:23:28
Speaker
The cops have like a few things just based on their interactions of her. They're quoted as kind of later on. So being out on her own, Diane developed unfortunately a pretty severe drinking problem as well as began doing drugs. And both of these things caused her bipolar disorder symptoms to get way, way worse. And she's not taking medication.
00:23:58
Speaker
I could see that for sure. So she was involuntarily committed to different mental health facilities at least 32 times, either for posing a danger to herself or others. Oh my goodness. So they can't necessarily hold her on those ones, I would imagine.
00:24:23
Speaker
I don't know how long they can do. I think if it's like posing a danger to yourself or others maybe it's like 30 days but because she was being involuntarily committed so I think those are typically longer than like 24 hours but I'm I don't really know right yeah she was in and out a lot though mm-hmm
00:24:50
Speaker
Her last time being involuntarily committed was in 1998 when she was released into her family's care that spring. I don't know how long she'd been in there for. And her mother Mildred said that she never should have been released and that quote, she deeply needed institutionalized care.
00:25:13
Speaker
So they were, I'm sure, really, really concerned about her safety and everything. They thought she needed some more care, but she was released into their care. So at this point, she's staying at her one sister. She has one sister, Denise, and at this point, she's living at her sister, Deborah's house. Okay, that could be...
00:25:42
Speaker
So tough because if someone does require an intense amount of care, that's very, very expensive to have 24 hour care.
00:25:56
Speaker
I think they just mean with like psychologists and everything like that. Like she is functional. But like sometimes it seems, yeah, yeah, you're right. It probably wouldn't be 24 hour care. Like she's not necessarily going to debilitating physical disability or whatever. But it's just like sometimes there's just not enough money in these things.
00:26:17
Speaker
Yeah. Pat and I were just watching a thing. I was like, oh, this book I just read is like on Netflix now. I don't know if I told you, because I had Tony Collette in it from hereditary. It was really good. It was this Netflix mini series called Pieces of Her is what it's called, Pieces of Her. Yeah. And it's called that because the daughter doesn't know the mom very well.
00:26:45
Speaker
They get into the premise, they're having lunch or whatever. And then this kid comes in with a gun and then the mom reacts in a way that's like, no, like you don't want to hurt my daughter. Like she just is like very calm with it. And then like, you know, in a way and like basically takes the, what do you say? It takes the killer out of commission.
00:27:08
Speaker
and stuff and then her you know it's all like oh what did you do in your past her daughter's all like this is you know everyone's like what the hell she was so crazy just like super calm and like dealing with this and um it like anyway there ends up being like a subplot where
00:27:27
Speaker
these people are trying to get revenge because someone wasn't able to get the care they needed in the mental health facility like 24 seven and then like this guy like mini spoiler kills his family because he doesn't have the mental health resources he needs or yeah they're like you owned this group home and you kicked him out and you guys are just
00:27:54
Speaker
assholes who want to collect the benefits, whether someone's getting the treatment they need or not, and blah, blah, blah. It's a really good series and the writer, I would really recommend her. Her name's Karen Slaughter. Yeah, it is. But anyway, Scandinavian writer, very, very good books. Totally would recommend. Yeah, you should watch the Netflix series. It was very good. Yeah, I'll have to give it a watch.
00:28:21
Speaker
Yeah, it just made me think about in a way. Oh, okay. So that brings us to this on April 10th, which is Good Friday, 1998, 40 year old Diane is leaving her sister Deborah's house in Hudson, Florida. She's basically just walked out the front door. She's kind of walking down. I don't know if it's like a
00:28:48
Speaker
Like cul-de-sac or like suburban neighborhood if she they talk about highways a little bit in this So I don't know exactly where she's walking at this point
00:29:00
Speaker
But she had been out of that mental health facility for just about two weeks and during this time she had just been staying with her sister Deborah. And while Diane had actually a home in Odessa, so she has a house in Odessa, but she's staying at her sister Deborah's house because they thought it would be best for her to stay with family to kind of help her get back on her feet.
00:29:26
Speaker
after she was released. Yeah, so she has this house. She's not staying there though. She's in Hudson, Florida with her sister. That morning Diane's sister had left for a doctor's appointment. A little while later, I'm not sure how long, Diane walked, just left the house around 11 a.m. and she was later seen at the Halof Tavern on Little Road and State Road 52.
00:29:57
Speaker
Uh, Diane stayed there until she was kicked out. Uh, the mother Mildred. Yeah. Mother Mildred later told the Tampa Bay Times, quote, the bartender cut her off because she was walking in circles. Oh my God. Okay. Yeah. To my knowledge.
00:30:21
Speaker
Well yeah, to my knowledge that was the last time anyone saw her except for the one who took her. So she was like alone? Yeah, she was just like walking down the highway after leaving the bar. Diane's family reported her missing the next day, April 11th.
00:30:43
Speaker
They waited this kind of 40 or 24-ish hours because she had a history of disappearing and it was normally only for a day or two.
00:30:54
Speaker
However, this time, they thought the days were starting to pile up and they were passing by and no one had seen her. Normally you'd hear, even if they hadn't seen her, they'd be like, they're at the bar, she went to this store. The police arrested her, she's at the hospital. They would get phone calls telling them where she was, even if she
00:31:20
Speaker
So they aren't getting any of those calls so they call and report her missing. Yeah, they knew something was wrong. Yeah. By this point they had called local hospitals. Police had not also not gotten any calls about her as I kind of just said.
00:31:37
Speaker
This is where it gets really weird. Her last contact with her family was reported to be Wednesday, April 15th, but some sources say it was, would this be Monday, April 13th? One or the other. I tend to believe it's the 15th. This is five days after leaving her sisters when she called the mom Mildred.
00:32:07
Speaker
No one was home when the call was placed and ended up being sent to voicemail where Diane ended up leaving a voicemail for the mother Mildred. So 59 year old Mildred heard her daughter's voice saying, help, help, help, let me out. Which this is like, like breaks my heart.
00:32:33
Speaker
Mildred said that Diane sounded tense and alarmed and Mildred recognized her daughter's voice immediately even though she wasn't really leaving a proper voicemail. It was just this. No, maybe she had just gotten a phone in desperation and was only able to do whatever she could. That's fucking scary.
00:32:57
Speaker
Yeah. After this, after Diane spoke, there was a sort of scuffling sound like someone was trying to pull her phone away from her while she was still talking. And then she says, Hey, give me that before the call just disconnects. Like that's it. Oh my god. That's a frickin horror movie plot.
00:33:18
Speaker
Right? Yeah, that's what I thought. This voicemail obviously immediately troubled the family. It's seen that Diane was in serious trouble and obviously in need of help. Mildred did try to call back the number that had left that voicemail. The name Starlight showed up as the caller ID.
00:33:46
Speaker
They said at this time it was kind of indicating that that was a business name. Because I don't think at that time caller IDs really showed up for like personal phones. Like home phones. Maybe just the number. I don't know. I can't remember. But this shows like Starlight in like the caller ID. Is this Starlight room a thing? I feel like that sounds like a business. Yeah, I'll get to it. Like a club or something. Okay.
00:34:14
Speaker
So she's calling all these phone calls go unanswered. Somebody a couple years ago now researched back then and it says later investigations revealed that only one business in town with that name, a strip club called Starlight Lounge, that's now known as Teasers.
00:34:38
Speaker
That makes sense. That's the only one that maybe would have shown up with the caller ID Starlight, but confirmation of this connection isn't known. Oh, okay. Because yeah, it sounds like a strip club. Yeah. Going to the same day that this phone call happened, or I believe the phone call happened, April 15th, some sources say the 13th.
00:35:04
Speaker
But the reason why I think it's the 15th is because if it's the 15th, this would take place on that same day and could be kind of part of what that maybe altercation that was taking place during the voicemail is. Oh, right. Okay. Explain what she was talking about. Yeah.
00:35:30
Speaker
Because April 15th, the tip, like little tip of a human finger is found along U.S. Route 19 near... Yeah. I thought you meant a tip like information. I was not prepared for that. Sorry. Not that the tip of a finger really needs a trigger warning. I listened to lots of true crime, but I was just like not prepared for it to be that.
00:36:01
Speaker
It was found along US Route 19 near New York Avenue around 4pm by a woman that was walking to work who thought it was a toy or a prop. They always do. Well it had to have been at least big enough for her to recognize it as something.
00:36:22
Speaker
Yeah, they say it's like just the first knuckle. So it's like the full fingernail and like everything's like he would be able to tell what it is. That would make more sense. I wouldn't notice if it if it was like smaller than a pencil eraser or just like when you slice off just the skin off the end or whatever. Yeah, I think the one says, yeah, just above the top knuckle, the one thing he says. So basically the fingernail.
00:36:50
Speaker
Yeah, that would still fucking hurt. Yeah. So she was walking. She thought it was this toy or a prop. She ends up going to her boyfriend and tells him about it later that day. The next day he goes and like tries to find it along the side of the highway. Oh, pick it up.
00:37:10
Speaker
No. He ends up locating it, figures out it's painted with a bright red nail polish, and he determines it to be a real finger, not a toy or a prop. And he contacts the Pasco County Sheriff's Office, who arrives on the scene.
00:37:29
Speaker
Um, at this time police attempt, they didn't know like whose it was. They attempted to determine whose finger it was. And because Diane had been arrested in the past when they ran the fingerprint, uh, on the finger, it came up with her file. Oh, good. Yeah. Uh, they, one source said it was possibly her right middle fingertip cut off just above the top knuckle.
00:37:57
Speaker
And a few sources said that there was maybe two fingers that were found, but I'm not too sure on that one, so at least one was found. It's still amazing that something so small would have led them to information. It's crazy. Yeah, right. It's not much to go on. Sorry. Some of the police believed it was accidentally severed, maybe by a car door.
00:38:25
Speaker
uh however sorry no that would crush your finger yeah you'd have to pretty hit it pretty hard for it to actually sever you slammed your finger in a door before you know it doesn't just like take it off usually yeah
00:38:41
Speaker
Obviously with this finger being found and it being paired with possibly taking place on the same day as this troubling voicemail that was left, this darker cause seems likely. Police end up searching the area where the finger was found, trying to look for more evidence. There was even a helicopter that scanned the area from above, however no other traces of Diane were found.
00:39:07
Speaker
Police, along with friends and family, they try and continue searching for Diane. They are checking her favourite hangouts over the next several weeks, probably still following up with like hospitals, but nothing's turning up where she might be. And police told reporters, quote, she apparently did not have a vehicle, so she either hitchhiked or got rides from friends. End quote.
00:39:36
Speaker
yeah um diane was described as overly trusting when not on her medication which led investigators to believe that she might have somewhat willingly gone with someone even if she didn't necessarily know them saying quote when diane did not take her medication correctly her personality would change and during these bouts she was known to hang out with a pretty rough crowd end quote
00:40:04
Speaker
Interesting. I don't know. They didn't say anything about who she was like known to be hanging out with. Right. I'm just interesting how they describe it as trusting. I don't know. I'm like sometimes I can want to believe the best in everybody, but it doesn't mean I'm trusting or like because I still have my true prime brain on in the back. You know.
00:40:30
Speaker
Okay, so maybe she got a little naive when she wasn't on her meds. We don't know, okay. Yeah. At this time Mildred was hoping for the best, but it had been a few weeks, so she had begun preparing for the worst. She was quoted as saying, quote, she's in trouble, big trouble.
00:40:53
Speaker
This kind of threw me for a loop because then she says they're probably torturing her. I hope that she's still alive and that they haven't killed her yet, which is kind of something. I don't know. I found that a little weird. It's hard to know how you might phrase something if your child was missing, so I can't really fault her, but I guess
00:41:20
Speaker
she just wants to believe overall that she's still alive. That would be my, yeah, based on that. But yeah, that's, I don't want to think of my kid being tortured. Like, right? Yeah. Almost worse. You know, it's, oh, that's rough. That's tough. Yeah.
00:41:42
Speaker
So another weird thing that happens is a few days later after like the finger, the phone call, April 18th, as the story of Diane August's disappearance was spreading through the Tampa area, something was suddenly discovered at a convenience store that Diane regularly went to. Now this convenience store
00:42:07
Speaker
is not in the city that she disappeared in. It's about 25 miles away in Odessa, Florida, where Odessa is where Diane's house is. So this is a separate city. So this is discovered.
00:42:24
Speaker
by Convenience Store Manager Patricia Splendorio? Oh my god, fun. It's like SBL Splendorio. Could they be Italian? Oh, how splendid.
00:42:44
Speaker
Uh, she discovers a bag of neatly folded clothing inside their outdoor freezer. Uh, she immediately recognized the clothing. Yeah. So like there may be a deep freeze that's outside of there. I have one in my garage, but maybe it's outside of the garage. I don't know what people do in Florida or whatever.
00:43:15
Speaker
She immediately recognized the clothing in the bag as Diane's and she reaches out to Diane's sister Deborah who then takes a look at the clothing. She also recognizes the clothing says it's Diane's because she had given her some of it like specific items in there like she had bought and given to Diane. So they contact the police and they're like we found this. It's like again it's not in the same city and it's like
00:43:41
Speaker
At least, what, eight days from when anybody's seen her? Okay. Yeah. Police believe the clothing was put there by the people Diane had been allowing to stay at her home while she was away at her sister's in Tampa.
00:44:07
Speaker
Yeah, I'd say more squatters. They don't sound great. They were described as juveniles in the papers. The group had been staying at her house. They were throwing these wild parties while Diane was gone. It said that they later began taking items out of her house without her consent.
00:44:30
Speaker
So maybe they were selling off her stuff in the house while she was trying to get treatment and then while she's staying with her sister. So not great. Damn. Yeah, but if we already knew she was associating with desperate type of people, she probably should have known better, but that sucks. I'm not trying to blame.
00:44:56
Speaker
and it is impossible they said for them to figure out whether the clothes were put in the outdoor or when the clothes were put in the outdoor freezer as staff said that they hadn't looked inside it in about three weeks and at this time Diane had been yeah the staff at the convenience store where it was found oh i'm sorry i thought that was at her house no i got confused for a second just in the same city right yeah okay
00:45:25
Speaker
So they said that they hadn't checked this freezer in about three weeks, and because Diane had been only missing for eight days, they didn't know if it was related to her disappearance. Because it could have happened even before her disappearance, they could have just put it there. And then just happened to be found after. And then they said because it was also in a totally different city, 25 miles away. It might not be related at all, but it is always mentioned in the case.
00:45:54
Speaker
Um, so over the next several weeks, police received dozens of tips from potential witnesses that believed they had seen Diane on, uh, just after her disappearance, April 11th, between three and 4pm. Uh, a witness said that she- The computer screen just shook. I know, Gordo got up and was shaking. I'm sorry. You couldn't hold it in.
00:46:23
Speaker
Between 3 and 4 p.m., she was said to be walking down New York Avenue, which is the... I think that's a highway. That's where her finger was found. And another witness said that they saw her on April 15th, which may have been the day of the phone call, where she was said to be at a golf inn, where she may have been eating lunch, but none of these sightings were ever really confirmed.
00:46:51
Speaker
by like police, like saying it was actually her or anything. And with no other information or possible sightings to work off of, Diane's disappearance began to fade from the headlines just a few weeks after. And the case really remains stagnant over the next several years, unfortunately. Damn.
00:47:13
Speaker
November 2000, Diane's family kind of tried to drum up media attention and tried to get Diane's story back into headlines. They were talking openly about her history with mental illness. They talked about her losing custody of her children, her divorce, and that she had kind of distanced herself from her family.
00:47:36
Speaker
And officials stated that they were continuing to investigate and that this was an ongoing case. They weren't treating it as if it was a cold case yet, but they didn't have anything to work with, I'd say, on a daily basis. So Diane's family were still fearing the worst. At this point, investigators had interviewed more than 100 people related to her disappearance. Wow. Yeah.
00:48:07
Speaker
November 25, 2000, so this is about two years after, over two years from her disappearance, another strange thing happens. One day, just one day after an article was published about Diane's case in the Tampa Bay Times, another discovery was made at a convenience store that Diane and her family often went to.
00:48:33
Speaker
Terry Wilson, Diane's brother's girlfriend, walked into a circle cave that was along Highway 19 near a neighborhood that Diane visited often. Inside the convenience store, Terry found a bag of random, like kind of, I'll say, like beauty objects. And on the baggie was the name Diane written on like black sharpie on the bag. And she just finds this on the counter in the convenience store.
00:49:03
Speaker
on the counter. It's so weird. Yeah, on the lottery ticket counters. So those are typically fairly small, but they're kind of like off to the side maybe a little bit. Yeah. It's not like the main counter, but somebody had obviously just left it there, like within at least an hour. Yeah, it would still get noticed by the end of the day. Yeah. Yeah. So Terry believed that the baggy may have something to do with her boyfriend's missing sister.
00:49:30
Speaker
So she took the baggie to his family, who then informed the police. The clear plastic baggie contained items that Diane presumably would have been using at the time of her disappearance. It had black eyeliner, the taboo perfume, I guess she liked. It had bright pink lipstick and generic brand toothpaste.
00:49:57
Speaker
It was confirmed that this toothpaste was actually the same kind that was issued by the mental health facility that Diane had checked out of just two weeks before going missing. And the bag was also similar to the kind that was kept by patients there like with their name and it's clear so like you can't hide anything in the clear baggie and they wrote their names on it. And Diane's family firmly believed that this was hers.
00:50:24
Speaker
This baggy renewed the investigation and investigators because it was suddenly left by somebody randomly over two years after Diane's last sighting, which is like really weird. Police announced that they would be reviewing the security tape from the store in the hopes of catching who had left it on the counter.
00:50:44
Speaker
Unfortunately, nothing is believed to have come from this lead as the tape had, I read on one thing, possibly already been recorded over by the time they found out. The only thing this really did was help the belief that Diane or someone who knew what happened to Diane was still kind of in the general area.
00:51:08
Speaker
But unfortunately, police were never ever able to really confirm if this was her baggie. Just like they couldn't confirm when the clothes were left either. Geez, that sucks. But I would imagine there wouldn't be much DNA or fingerprints on it at that time. Yeah, I have no idea.
00:51:29
Speaker
Yeah. Months after Diane's case was once again in the press, or sorry, months later, Diane's case was once again in the press as another strange true crime case began making headlines. This one kind of brings us off track, but it ties in because. I'm ready for the detour. Right? Around 4am, Wednesday, June 27, 2001, a pair of men wearing ski masks.
00:51:59
Speaker
I think like the balaclava type mask. Sure. Okay. Yeah, I like the whole face. Yeah. Yeah, the cliche ones. They barged into the office of Coral Sands Motel in Hudson, Florida, just off US-19.
00:52:14
Speaker
It was described as a cheap motel often used by those who had nowhere else to go. And these two men barged into the office located in like a trailer. They were wielding firearms and hotel manager Rose Casper ended up being hit in the face. Her boyfriend and team. Her? Yeah, right? Yeah, Rose Casper. Yeah, yeah, that's awesome.
00:52:42
Speaker
Her boyfriend and co-manager Gary Evers, who was in the back room, came out front when he heard what was going on. And when he did, the two men basically just like fled. And as soon as they saw him. Rose and Gary, they actually lived in this trailer slash office.
00:53:03
Speaker
Um, the motel and they believe they knew who the men were. So later that night, cause this takes place at, yeah, four or five around four and five PM or four AM. Sorry. So it's like a few hours later, like almost 12 hours later that night, Gary, who is the co-owner of the motel invites 26 year old Todd cameras, a man with a history of burglary and criminal acts invites him to the trailer.
00:53:34
Speaker
Because he believes that Todd is involved. So Gary was mad that Todd may have been the one who repeatedly hit Rosa. Yeah, Rose. It's supposed to say? Oh, right. Yes. So Gary suddenly pulls out a 9mm pistol and asks Todd if he was involved.
00:53:56
Speaker
Yeah, not great. Okay. Todd's going a little vigilante there. Right? 100%. Todd's response. Sorry, but were you involved? You got a gun to me? What am I going to say? Like, probably I'm gonna just say no. Wow. The response is unknown because Gary immediately opened fire and emptied two entire magazines into 26 year old Todd's body.
00:54:25
Speaker
Then why even ask? That's horrible. The next day, June 29th, 52-year-old Gary was now in police custody. He was charged with first-degree murder. Weirdly, he had pretty much no prior criminal history other than pulling a gun on a man in 1999.
00:54:45
Speaker
Um, one source had the details that this was for attempting to, the man had, he had pulled the gun on the man for attempting to sleep with a stripper. Whoever's new was dating another man at the time. So he was like trying to protect his boy. Like, yeah. Okay. Yeah. My body's dating a stripper and now this guy's trying to sleep with her. I'm going to pull a gun on him. I don't know.
00:55:11
Speaker
But assuming she's at work, isn't that what all her customers are going to be trying to do? Right. Yeah. That's crazy. OK. It said, but in that case, no charges had been filed despite police having been called out to the motel. So nothing ever came about with that one. In court, it was revealed that Todd actually had nothing to do with the attempted robbery at the motel. He had only accepted Gary's invite to try and clear his own name.
00:55:41
Speaker
And the real perpetrators were Edwin Humphrey and Robert Hay, who at the time were known to have committed a string of similar robberies that same week. Probably like schemas and guns and they're just like breaking into small businesses and like small towns or some shit. It's like calm down.
00:56:03
Speaker
Yeah, it said that Humphrey had actually ended up shooting Hay, his co-friend, I don't know. Co-conspirator? Yeah, and I put that I presumed Hay was dead, because it didn't really say. It just said that he had shot him in an attempt to try and cover up their involvement in the robberies, and that Humphrey was given a life sentence. And I was like, but what about Hay? But I don't know. I assume Hay died. It didn't really say.
00:56:34
Speaker
But because Gary, the hotel co-manager, ended up shooting and killing for Todd, who wasn't even involved in the end, Gary was later sentenced to life in prison in April of 2004. And another weird coincidence, it was the same day this story was breaking into the press and getting reported to the press.
00:56:58
Speaker
that Diane's family decides to release a statement to the press, not through the police, but through the press themselves, that Gary Robert Evers, the man who had just been convicted of shooting, like he was the hotel guy he had just been convicted of shooting Todd, had been one of the investigators' main suspects in Diane's case three years earlier.
00:57:29
Speaker
Which is weird, and now he's just shot a guy at his motel. So this motel... Also, do we believe them? Yeah, I don't really know. It said that the motel he co-managed and lived in the office of was one of Diane's last known locations. She was known to go there.
00:57:52
Speaker
It was also a short distance away from where she was last seen alive. I think they mean that like highway area. And it was also close to the location where the baggie was found just seven months earlier from when this shooting took place. Okay, so it's all in the same area. Yeah, well, investigators did not want to reveal any details about their investigation into Gary directly.
00:58:17
Speaker
He remains the only publicly named suspect in the case, and any knowledge he may have had about Diane's possible disappearance or even death is lost because, unfortunately, Gary died in May of 2012 while serving out his life sentence.
00:58:36
Speaker
That was gorgeous. What? The gorges are just like. No, I was too busy worrying about my own throat gurgle noises. Sounds like oh, it's over there. Yeah.
00:58:55
Speaker
Yeah. So although her family fears the worst, Diane is considered a missing person. And the case has not ever been considered to be a homicide, though investigators do admit that it is unlikely that she would be found alive after this many years. They do continue to search in hopes of bringing the family some sort of closure. Okay, because they don't know for sure that there was any foul play or anything.
00:59:22
Speaker
Yeah, I do have some other stuff because when I was looking it up, one of the people or one of the sources I found had some other stuff that I thought was kind of interesting. It was from unresolved.me. This was a kind of history of the case written up by Michael Whelan or Whelan.
00:59:49
Speaker
And he went in saying that there was actually a bunch of women who matched Diane's general description who went missing in the area between 1995 and 2002. Like Diane, they were last seen in bars or restaurants in the Tampa area and they share a number of similarities.
01:00:15
Speaker
I'm just going to run through them because he had a little bit on them. It was interesting. There was 37-year-old Kathy A. Struckoff, who was killed in 1995. She had been last seen at a bar in the company of a man that was named John, if that's ever their name. He was never identified.
01:00:42
Speaker
Then 36 year old Kimberly Langwa Wilson was found dead in a ditch in 1999. 34 year old Rhonda Ann Brown went missing in 2000. She was last seen walking between her house and a bar when she disappeared. 33 year old Kathleen Marie
01:01:11
Speaker
Wanda Ha Sega. Wanda Ha Sega disappeared. She disappeared in 2002. She was last seen walking from her house, possibly on her way to a bar to celebrate her birthday. Oh, so sad. She disappeared and failed to cash a check that was mailed to her a few days later for about five hundred dollars. Oh, yes, she did. Yeah.
01:01:41
Speaker
All of these women were similar ages around the same height and weight as Diane. Most also with a history of alcoholism and substance abuse all went missing in the same general area over a seven-year period in towns with relatively small populations at the time. It's just so easy for something to befall you.
01:02:07
Speaker
you know, even even if you do just drink lightly or whatever or something like stuff can you can get a little bit of knee braided and then you're just that much more vulnerable and yeah, just sucks. Not fair. Yeah, continuing from unresolved me did have because there was two different kind of like write ups about like,
01:02:32
Speaker
kind of like summaries of what happened. So this first one said that unfortunately there was no activity or there has been close to no activity in Diane's case in nearly two decades with her disappearance remaining just as unsolved today as it was back in 1998. Oh, somehow that that one sentence is so hard, just as unsolved. Like, the poor people working on it.
01:03:00
Speaker
They said 40-year-old Diane Augett was last seen April 1998. She was last known to be staying with her sister along Hudson's Cobblestone Drive but would reportedly be seen in the surrounding area over the next few days. She had a history of mental illness and substance abuse and was last known to and was known to be incredibly trusting when not on medication. For that reason it is believed that she may have willingly been
01:03:24
Speaker
in the company of people that intended to do her harm, and that was made evident by the discovery of one of her fingers just days after she was reported missing. While rumors have persisted around sightings of Diane in the Tampa area from time to time, there has been no confirmed sighting of her since the second week of April 1998. If she is still alive, she would be approximately 62 years old.
01:03:49
Speaker
and likely still suffering from bipolar disorder, which requires medication in her case to treat. She is Caucasian. She stood about five foot four at the time of her disappearance and weighed about 130 pounds. She had dark strawberry blonde hair, which has likely, they said, grade, like with age, presumably being 62. You would think.
01:04:15
Speaker
It did say that there was a $3,000 reward that still exists for information leading to her current whereabouts and anyone with information is asked to reach out to Crime Stoppers in the Tampa Bay area or submit a tip online.
01:04:31
Speaker
Um, I did want to mention cause one of my sources had a little bit more like of her character description of kind of like what she looked like and identifying features. So I just wanted to run through that. Um, this was from, is it like supposed to be international missing? I don't know. It's int-missing.fandom.uk. It's like a sub category of like Wikipedia.
01:04:58
Speaker
But they said her characteristics were long, wavy, dark blonde hair. Blue eyes, her ears are pierced. Her fingernails were painted a kind of coral color at the time of her disappearance. She had unspecified tattoos on her back and right shoulder. She had a scar on her abdomen. She's missing her appendix. She had an orthopedic plate.
01:05:26
Speaker
I don't know what that means. Horsopedic. Yeah. Isn't that foot? That's what I thought. I don't know. The plate makes me think like your head. So foot head? Right. Or like, um, wait, wait. I have no idea. What is it called when you, oh, you go to the orthodontist. Could it have been that kind of plate? Oh, because that was my other thought that it sounds like teeth. Yeah, it must be.
01:05:55
Speaker
teeth or foot. We don't know. No. Just kidding. It's always so sad to hear the descriptions though, because you're like, you know, the last thing they were wearing or whatever, you're like, you're only gonna find them still wearing that if you find them like dead, you know? Yeah. Yeah, it sucks.
01:06:15
Speaker
it has a bit more her right middle finger as I said it cut off this one says just below the knuckle the other one said like just above I'm not too sure because they determined that was her fingertip
01:06:28
Speaker
Yeah, for the, they had her fingerprint on it and it matches like her past records, so they know it's hers. And this was severed shortly after her disappearance. Another one of her fingers might also have been cut off, as I kind of said, some sources said they found two of them and that one of them was lost or something along the way. I don't know, it was fucking weird. It could be, could be just rumor, yeah.
01:06:53
Speaker
Yeah, she suffered from bipolar disorder. She has a history of drug and alcohol use. This one I also wanted to mention because it said she had a list of aliases that she was known to use. Diana Louise Auget, Ginny L. Auget, Madonna Auget, Ginny
01:07:18
Speaker
Uh, Diana Young, Diana Laura Oggett, Diana Young Oggett, Denise Oggett, and Jackie L. This one says Yoggett. Just combining both of her, like maiden and married last name. Oh, Young and Oggett. Yoggett. Yeah.
01:07:41
Speaker
Like those couple names you get, like Benifer. Yeah. For clothing, it said she was last seen wearing a white tank top, blue shorts, and white sneakers.
01:07:53
Speaker
Yeah, but that's all I have. This one, even now looking at the picture, the one that I had seen so many times before is the one that's in color, it's all blue with the background. Oh, I don't look at the pictures. It's number one. It'll be the first one that comes up. I have seen this picture dozens of times and have no idea because I did not know this case before I started looking it up.
01:08:20
Speaker
I don't know why I would have seen this picture so many times, but yeah. Okay. Sorry, the number one, she's in a jean vest. Yeah, that's the one. I have seen this picture so many times before, I don't know why. I don't think that I have. And that was part of the reason I clicked into it. I was like, hi, why do I know this picture? And then none of it is familiar.
01:08:50
Speaker
yeah in your subconscious from yeah when you're something your parents were watching about it or something wait probably not i was like is that even the right timeline did this wait i totally forgot what you said if it was 1998 yeah 98 okay well no you would have been what one three okay it was three
01:09:15
Speaker
But what some of those things that I sometimes I'll be like, oh, I've heard about that. But like, it kind of happened before your time. And you're like, well, I guess I just heard about it from my family talking about it or from the news. Yeah. Yeah. Popular culture. Yeah. This one has so much going on, like her going missing, then weird voicemail, then her fingertip, then the clothing, then that baggie. Like what is going on? There's something like someone's
01:09:44
Speaker
I would like to think it was her maybe trying to fake her own disappearance, but you know, somebody knows something and is trying to misdirect or cover it up. Yeah, I yeah, this is one of the ones I think definitely would want to follow up on and I really do hope they find out what happened because
01:10:08
Speaker
Yeah this one really kind of like broke my heart like the voicemail and it's just so sad like she's asking for help and then saying like hey give me that and then like the call gets disconnected and
01:10:19
Speaker
her fingertips, like some people just disappear and you find nothing but her like and then almost two and a half years later the weird baggie like on the counter at the lottery station like they know it's gonna be found within a few minutes yeah her poor parents and stuff must have just been like you think you're gonna find something and then nothing again or it's just someone taunting you
01:10:43
Speaker
Yeah, the ones that have several clues sometimes can be just so frustrating and intriguing and you're like, is it something more sinister? Is it something more simple? Like, no way. Yeah, I really hope they can get closure on this one and figure out what happened because it just. Do you have theories? Like, I'm just trying to formulate, but I'm like.
01:11:11
Speaker
I definitely think like because they say she was so trusting even the police say she was so trusting and she wasn't hanging out with the best of people I feel like she maybe got in somebody's car because she was just like walking and whether she knew them or not and then it kind of went sideways and sure like something happened that way but that's could be like all I really have
01:11:40
Speaker
Yeah. I thought they could do something, but then. Or she was like hitchhiking or something. Yeah. They're not too sure. Scary. Very scary. That's why I'm like, this episode is going to be so sad because this one, yeah, this one really got me when I was typing it up. I was like, what?
01:12:01
Speaker
kind of read the overview and I was like they found like so many weird things like any of those would be weird to find in any case and it was like an all of them are in one one the more clues you find you would think you could like why are there all these clues if you can't add it up to something if you can't use it to crack the case like yeah almost like someone wants you to crack it you know like they're just leaving bread crumbs or something yeah
01:12:30
Speaker
Yeah, that's bizarre. That's probably gonna stick with me. Like, what the fuck? Yeah, right? Yeah, so weird. Like, I love hate those kind of stories, and I'm sure, and I hate to say that because it's just like, I know anyone who's a parent of someone who's disappeared, missing. Like, you don't just get to be like, oh, that sucks because, you know, this case isn't all wrapped up. It's like, that's your life. Like, you just don't have any answers.
01:12:59
Speaker
But yeah, they're like, they're fascinating and sad and intriguing all at the same time. Yeah, I find them that way. I'm glad we don't do only disappeared cases, though. If I had to do this every week, I would be a different type of person. Well, I just was listening to the one on our network today that's called and then they were gone.
01:13:28
Speaker
And so I think that's mostly what they do, is disappearance cases, right? Yeah, that would break my heart too often. Yeah, like I said, they fascinate me, but it's tough. I don't know if I could, yeah, to cover them every week. Ooh, that'd be tough. Yeah. We will take a break and we'll come back for another disappearance. We have to leave the place.
01:14:02
Speaker
Hello, I'm Kona Gallagher. And I'm Ethan Flick. We're the husband and wife team behind the True Crime podcast, and then they were gone. We're a weekly show that covers unsolved missing persons cases. These are cases that you, the listener, can have an impact on. Some of the people you may have heard of, like Kristen Smart or Braceless Pisa, but we also bring you missing people of color and other cases that haven't gotten the mainstream attention that they deserve. You can find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Good Pods, or your favorite podcast app.
01:14:33
Speaker
Where's Gordo? Laying beside me, but we had a brief interlude of him deciding randomly. He wanted to try chewing on the cord for the mic and for my laptop and then the headphone cord and that was mad when I was taking away. He did little grabby hands and then he started trying to bite me and now he's calmed down I think. Neil is still like flick, flick, flick, flick, like annoyed.
01:15:02
Speaker
He's like, she won't let me eat the cords. That literally reminds me of a weird cartoon short. And if I can find it, I will send it to you because the cat chews on the cord and then it screams like a man like, oh, but it electrocutes it.
01:15:19
Speaker
And that's not the weirdest part of the video because this couple are playing Scrabble and she takes her eyes out and she shakes them around. He goes you're shaking your eyes here and you're shaking your eyes there. Why don't you go join some chicken private role band? We watched it a lot. I don't know why. That's so weird. It had like the cat came back and other weird shorts on it. But like that was one of the weirdest ones. Weird. It's creepy.
01:15:47
Speaker
I tell ya. Now Gordo's just laying up. He's got little bunny arms. Oh yes! That does, yes. Like when, um, what that one author does describe Cats like that a lot, where the Shadowhunter, Clarissa, or whatever her name is, Claire.
01:16:11
Speaker
She's like, and then the cat laid there like a dead bug. You're like, yeah, that is that's a good description to I call it bunny arms and then go boing, boing, boing. Yeah, sometimes he does he does it and then to like, start hopping, you know, I kind of do the back arch and they like kind of jump like that. And I'm like, what are you a bunny?
01:16:31
Speaker
He's not doing that, he's galloping around the house like a horse. Oh my god. I love a good gallop. It's like, okay, zoomie time. Yeah, because he's got such heavy, like he's got some weight, so it's like, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, you talking about you. Heavy boy.
01:16:58
Speaker
not as heavy as my boy yeah he weighs as much as my kid yeah you got a a big dog and i got a big old cat yeah a rag doll yeah i think i was like she always tells me what the kind is i said i was thinking to myself the other day and i always forget the exact name
01:17:26
Speaker
Yeah, he's part rag doll. It might have been one. Oh, because they're always looking for for baby Friday pets on live left larceny. I may have tagged you and that would be like, yes. Yeah. I think I might have seen that. Yeah. Well, because I know like, yeah, if I don't tag you, you're not going to see it on our Instagram necessarily. Yeah.
01:17:57
Speaker
I've taken a few pictures lately he's decided he wants to sit like a person on the couch when he's sleeping and it was honestly it was very cute he's kind of sitting I don't know you know when they're sitting and their stomachs kind of like squished out and they're like sitting up
01:18:15
Speaker
kind of, but he was asleep and his head was kind of going like this. Now all of a sudden he just kind of like curled and fell onto his side on the couch and then like snuggled in. And they sit like a bear sits with their fat tummy out and just kind of like doing that. And he was like dead asleep. And then he just kind of like goes to his side and then like curls up even cuter. And I was like, if I had caught that on video, that whole thing is so cute.
01:18:45
Speaker
for like 10 minutes. It looks so funny right now. Yeah. I think it's so cute. It's cute, especially the hyper ones, pets and or children because my kid never napped. So like to see her sleep, I'm like. But anyway. Yeah. All right. Well, I have one that
01:19:15
Speaker
You could go to the original Unsolved Mysteries and just watch an episode there too, if you want. Okay. I haven't seen the Unsolved Mysteries episode.
01:19:30
Speaker
okay is that that um the one that used to air on tv that they did like back in the 80s yeah and then there's like a new season on netflix and stuff i've watched the new seasons yeah okay um yeah okay cool yeah yeah this one would have been featured on like the original nice but strangely enough as i was researching it
01:19:57
Speaker
I'm ashamed to admit, still like what two days ago, still just working on it and typing it up and literally just typed up the last of it today, of course. But put on YouTube on the big TV, like, whatever. I'm just like doing my thing and he's going to put on whatever and we're not discussing it. And then he puts on Mr. Bon on YouTube.
01:20:20
Speaker
And I was like, oh yeah, I watched one of his videos earlier today. I said, I saw the title of this one, but I didn't click on it. Cause I was like, eh, it was called like, this place will drive you mad. And I was like, ooh, dramatic. Sometimes you have dramatic titles that don't, you know, always pan out to be as dramatic as they might sound, of course.
01:20:42
Speaker
So I had ignored that one. And then he puts it on. I was like, I think this is about the case that I'm researching. Like write the fuck down. Oh, weird. Yeah, he just covered it. Anyway. Wow. Shout out to Mr. Ballen. Yes. Mr. B-A-L-L-E-N or whatever.
01:21:03
Speaker
Oh, not that he needs our shut up thing. He's like, I just exploded on TikTok. And I'm like, you're a really good storyteller. I'm glad for people. Really, I am. But yeah, he just featured it. It's so funny. Yeah, it's strange how that happens sometimes.
01:21:29
Speaker
I'll be like looking up a case and then it'll be like, oh, this person like just covered that or like two weeks after you cover something. Like even some of the cases you've done, like pretty close after like it'll be like a Bailey Sarian video or something. And like, what the fuck?
01:21:51
Speaker
Like, it's so weird. Oh, you have no idea. I think it's even more so because I listen to so many podcasts at work and stuff that I'll be like, oh, yeah, this is a known case in the podcast community. Listening to something. Anyway. It's cute. Yeah. I know, I think. Hopefully I don't sound like I forget to think I know everything because I don't. This one's unsolved, of course. OK.
01:22:21
Speaker
Yes. Um, I had this one, uh, I was looking up cases to cover and then, you know, you know, looking at a shortlist and writing down names. And then the name struck out as familiar. And I was like, I think I had heard this covered once and I realized I have, and it was on, uh, drinking the Kool-Aid pods. So I have shouted them out once or twice. Cause yeah, sometimes I do really good mysterious mystery ones that just stick with me. So yeah.
01:22:51
Speaker
Credit where credits do. Although I'm not that they're going to listen to my stupid little pod, but no, they're not that big. They've been on with pods. We've done promos with them stuff. I shouldn't say that, but I don't know what I'm going to say. No, it doesn't. OK, so this one is about a man named Keith Reinhard. OK.
01:23:21
Speaker
doesn't ring any bells, but I'm terrible with names. So sometimes I remember cases, but I don't know who they were. I could be terrible with the pronunciation. I didn't. Yeah. Like the only thing I ended up listening to was the Mr. Boland by accident. Okay. Also side note, we hate in my house how Americans sometimes just say on accident. And I'm like, I don't know where it comes from, but maybe it's just a bastardization of people saying it's an accident.
01:23:51
Speaker
Like as in you had an accident and then maybe people just started saying on accident, but it's just, it's very grammatically incorrect. Why Americans? Why? I, you know what? I was actually thinking about this cause we did talk about it before and the, probably I could think of was we say by accident, but then you say on purpose. On purpose, yes.
01:24:21
Speaker
On purposefully. Like doing something by accident. So if you say you do it by accident and on purpose, maybe Americans think the opposite of on purpose is on accident. Because you wouldn't say identally. Maybe we should all just say accidentally. Because you wouldn't say like by purpose.
01:24:43
Speaker
like that's not safe. But that's the only thing I could think of is because you say like I did it on purpose. So then they say on accident because it's like the opposite. That's the only that's what I came up with. That was my I mean, clearly without googling like why why Americans why?
01:25:05
Speaker
No, no, no, I've heard, I've heard other podcasters say, yeah, I speak American. And then the other one was like, wait, you speak American. They're like, okay, yeah, it is different than the English though. And I'm like, okay, fair enough. It's colloquial, colloquial English or whatever. It's not, it's not the Queen's English. The Queen's, that's right. Or the King's English as it were. I never did watch the King's speech.
01:25:34
Speaker
And therefore shall. I'm like, henceforth and therefore shall. Shant. Shant. Thoust. I read online recently somebody was like, let's bring back thoust. I was like, why? Oh my God. The ones that end in S.T. Wouldn't thoust. Whatever, Shakespeare?
01:25:59
Speaker
Sometimes, the one guy we make a little bit of fun of at my house that plays the D&D on the Critical Role because he's very like, I'm dramatic. Of course, they pick him for any ads where he has to like hold the skull and do the whole Hamlet because he's that kind of actor. Oh, my God. I'm sorry. We're going to cut this and put it on our special Patreon. No.
01:26:30
Speaker
That you shall not! I decree! Says Lady Alana. Yeah! She is a lady. I am but a peasant in your presence. Having too much fun, I'm almost crying. I know! Alright, we have fun here.
01:27:00
Speaker
Um, Oh yeah. So you're gonna laugh if some of this sounds like it's from an unsolved mysteries episode. Cause I got some of it from the unsolved mysteries. Oh, perfect. Yeah, I've used them. Yeah. I didn't think they were going to have a lot of info, but then they kind of did. So I was like, Oh, it's pretty good. Well,
01:27:22
Speaker
To be fair, I think maybe I was comparing it to something like the criminal minds. Wiki has come up before searching a true crime case, but they like loosely base.
01:27:31
Speaker
Yeah, you don't want to use that for anything accurate. But quite a few of their episodes, I'll be like watching it. I'll be like, Oh, yeah, that's that case. Like, I know that case. And then I'm watching like, basically a dramatized version of it kind of like play out and they have like different characters involved. And you're like, but no, like the gist of this case is like, yeah. Yes, that sounds like me listening to a podcast and being like, Oh, yeah, I've heard this one before.
01:28:00
Speaker
Yeah. Okay, so yes, Keith Reinhard, just as a refresher. Yes, thank you. I have the description as per the Unsolved Mysteries. He's 6'2", 210 pounds.
01:28:20
Speaker
Caucasian male, gray hair, blue eyes, last seen wearing blue jeans and flannel t-shirt. And I couldn't not hear all of it in the narrator's voice for us. I've only seen a few of their episodes, so he doesn't stand out. Yeah, I guess. Yeah, the only famous ones I can think of now is how they sometimes they talk about the History Channel guy and he narrates all the ancient aliens. Yeah.
01:28:51
Speaker
Um, so, okay. So he grew up in like Chicago area. Um, apparently he was in a suburb called Algonquin and I was like, Ooh, I know that name. That's yeah. I've heard. I feel like it's an East native tribe because there's an Algonquin motel in St. Andrews, New Brunswick. Yeah. I think they're on the East coast.
01:29:20
Speaker
because he was in Chicago and he worked as a sports reporter for like 23 years at the Chicago Daily Herald. Nice. Yeah. Like he's your Ray Romano for anyone that watch Everybody Loves Raymond as I did once I was basically married with children. You know.
01:29:42
Speaker
I was like, now I get this show a little bit, except for the overbearing mother-in-law part, because Pat doesn't really talk to his mom. But that's fine. You know, honestly, that's fine. I never watched Everybody Loves Raymond. So I think, yeah, I think it's one of those ones like I didn't find funny until I, you know.
01:30:06
Speaker
been married, married with a child or, you know what I mean? Like had those kind of, some of those kind of situational humor that you're really going to relate to kind of thing. But I don't know any who's it. Keith was married and had three adult children named Sven, Kai and Tiffany. So this took me a little while to figure out. I do too.
01:30:32
Speaker
Um, but for some reason I got confused when I heard about a son that was named Sven. And then I heard that his other son named Kai said something. And then I thought that maybe they didn't know what the son's name was. And it just didn't occur to me that he had two sons because it was from two different articles. Oh, like I'm just really dumb. I guess. No, it was, it was a little confusing. Yeah.
01:31:00
Speaker
I literally wrote at one point, like he had two kids and I was like, no, that's not true. But yeah, he apparently had three, three kids that he, uh, was close to. Um,
Introducing Keith Reinhardt's Sabbatical
01:31:14
Speaker
and I did like the unsolved mysteries description. I could hear it in the narrator's voice, you know, just all serious. Like for 23 years, Keith Reinhardt worked as a sports reporter for a suburban Chicago newspaper.
01:31:28
Speaker
In 1988, at the age of 48, he grew long hair and a beard. In June, he began a three-month sabbatical in Silver Plume, Colorado, a small town with a population of 130. Side note, 204 as of 2021. Oh, God, that's so small. Sorry. I thought you were going to follow it up with thousand or something. Nope. Jesus. Okay.
01:31:57
Speaker
No, I added that because I was like, what is it now? And that's not part of the quote. Yeah, the like, we'll get to it, but it's basically a ghost town. Yeah, it's real small. Sorry. Yes. It seems to be in June.
01:32:24
Speaker
Sorry, I probably said that. In June, he began a three month sabbatical in Silver Plume, Colorado. Yes, a small town with a population of 130. It is, or that was as of that time. Mine was around the same as yours. Okay, yeah, I said 1988. How could I forget the year of my birth? But yeah, nowadays, it's still not that much bigger.
01:32:54
Speaker
Yeah. And they said it is located in the steep, majestic Colorado Rockies. Lovely. Lovely. We know the Rockies. We know her. His goals were to get in shape by mountain climbing and perhaps even overcome his fear of heights and begin writing that novel that he always wanted to, I guess. Okay. That's pretty cool. I mean...
01:33:24
Speaker
Yeah, he's like, what am I doing with my life? Maybe I don't want to do this anymore. I can totally see it, especially after these last few years of the pandemic. Yeah, I was just gonna say that's what I did. I was like, what am I doing with my life? I'm not happy here. Quit. Like it's too short to not be happy. Yeah, I'll tell you that much. Totally different job or don't make as much. But you know what? It's enough because I have
01:33:53
Speaker
I have more time and energy to like focus on the things I actually like into then being like so like mentally exhausted, you just want them like, go to sleep, come home from work and then wake up and go to work the next day. I feel the same just having gone from the Department of Travel to different department of registries, because that one, planning people's trips, it's their livelihood, it's their
01:34:21
Speaker
Yeah, cash flow, thousands of dollars. Oh yeah, they'll spend that kind of money on things other than like vehicles, which you would understand from insurance. Anyway. Yeah, so I can feel that just being like, okay, I need a break from this and just kind of deciding that you need to take a look.
01:34:47
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know how I could have done a podcast if I was still doing travel, because it just was so... I wouldn't have insurance. Yeah. Yeah. And that's why I get it when, yeah, other people still in travel or doing just jobs that take the fuck all out of you. And I'm like, I'm glad I don't do something that's like that anymore necessarily. Yeah. 100%. Yeah. Still a job. A little more chill.
01:35:16
Speaker
Yeah. Excuse me. So they said that. What did I say? His goals were to get in shape by mountain climbing, overcome his fear of heights and begin writing a novel. Yeah. OK. During his sabbatical, he wanted to try running an antique store geared towards summer tourists. End quote. Cute.
01:35:46
Speaker
of it. So cute. It is. It seems like goals. Apparently, his wife Carolyn, he has a wife named Carolyn. She was not overly fond of this idea. But to be fair, it's because he wanted to go first without her and check it out. So
01:36:12
Speaker
Oh, I can see why she would be apprehensive. So he's going to be gone for a couple of months, maybe. Yeah, everything I read said that for his actual job, he put in a lead like three months, like that he was going to come back. Yeah. Within. OK. That's kind of the latest. So. But yeah, I totally understood her apprehension.
01:36:42
Speaker
Apparently, Keith was sick and tired of his city life. He just wanted to go slower. He was almost turning 50 and all this stuff. This kind of had something to do with it in his mind, too. He had his childhood best friend named Ted, who lived in Silver Plume.
01:37:05
Speaker
That's presumably why he chose to go there. Not just random place, 150 people. He wants to go slower and I was like, yeah, the slowest you could go. Wait, why doesn't he move to that place that's constantly on fire in the States? Oh no, he doesn't want to go there? Oh, okay.
01:37:26
Speaker
Mine fire,
Silver Plume's Ghostly History
01:37:28
Speaker
whatever it was they accidentally did. Oops, we'll just blow up our garbage and then oops, this mine fire is just now never ending and this place is called hell. I think it's Centralia, Illinois. But don't quote me. Yeah, I heard about that. I didn't remember where it was, but yeah.
01:37:51
Speaker
I literally think I get confused about the name of that place and just where podcasters are from or like, did they mention that because they were talking about it because they were from that place? Oh, geez.
01:38:05
Speaker
I geography is hard. I I try. Okay, so yes. Yes, Keith was tired of the city life. His childhood friend. Yes, I said that he owned a cafe in the area. And actually this town
01:38:25
Speaker
this very small town, Silver Plume. Obviously, I wondered about the name. As it turns out, it was founded in 1864 and was originally meant to be a gold camp, but then they found a lot of silver ore instead. Silver plumes of silver. Silver and gold. Silver, no gold. No.
01:38:50
Speaker
And apparently when the quote, devastating economic depression hit the US, the government switched from a silver gold standard to an all gold one, which sent the value of silver plummeting and ruined silver plume. Silver plummet. Yes, yes.
01:39:12
Speaker
um so now they rely heavily on tourism and the town is now often referred to as a semi ghost town or a living ghost town okay didn't know that was a thing it's interesting me neither makes sense though when you hear how many people live there yeah you're like okay so there's no um social services i guess
01:39:36
Speaker
yeah it's probably no walmart you're right probably starbucks i never had to drive to get to a walmart i complained that i grew up in a small town but it was still a capital city we still had like mcdonald's we just didn't have a lot like pat was from like such a small town in bc that he like i thought they had to like drive to get to other places i can't remember now
01:40:05
Speaker
Yeah, the city my best friend loves and she is in a small, small place in Ontario and you have to drive. I think she said like three hours if you want to go see a movie in a movie theater. I'm like, no. Ontario maybe? It must be because Southern Ontario is we're like Toronto and Ottawa and Kingston and all that.
01:40:34
Speaker
kind of northwest it's like oh my gosh okay wow it's just like what the heck i can't live like this yeah you have to go across like the town highway to get to the walmart or the tim hortons i was like no
01:40:56
Speaker
No, I've never quite had that, but we have like New Brunswick, uh, even though I mostly grew up in the capital of Frederton, like it's still a small city compared to here. Edmonton here is like three times the size. So I don't know. I just feel like we had to go to Moncton if we wanted to get any of the other
01:41:18
Speaker
fast food chains that we didn't have like, yeah, what the fuck burger cake, I don't know the weird ones and then like, it's like, oh my god. Other people aren't so deprived. Just kidding. Right? How deprived are we? Yes.
01:41:35
Speaker
Privileged white bitches. All right. Yes, it's a living ghost town. So fun. And also a darkly fun fact that I first heard about when it came up on the Mr. Ballin YouTube episode was that in the history of the town, a man named Clifford Griffin was the co-owner of the 730 Mine. Kind of sounds like 739.
01:42:06
Speaker
but so like obviously it had some money or shares in the mining operation and he killed himself on top of the silver plume mountain oh shit yeah it's a little dark a little bit of a dark history a creepy detail he apparently
01:42:27
Speaker
Yeah, even creepier. Went up, dug his grave, played himself out on his own violin, and then shot himself so that he fell into the grave. Holy crap. Okay, never heard that before. Was that like the best legend? I'm like, is that true?
01:42:44
Speaker
but there's like this little monument there should be a picture I actually so the picture of the monument came up in the research and then other pictures showed to me that it seems to be on the edge of a cliff which makes it even more dramatic but yeah there's a picture like almost like an outline of this Clifford guy like sitting on a cliff and then now there's this little monument now where apparently he killed himself it's like
01:43:14
Speaker
okay oh i see it yeah yeah that's a steep cliff yeah the first couple pictures of the monument i didn't realize it was right on the edge of the cliff but then those pictures they're supposed to be of him i guess where he looks to be sitting on a cliff so i'm like oh okay i guess i should have anyway it's a little bit
01:43:41
Speaker
of a creepy history, I guess. And then the story is just, yeah, very mysterious the whole way through. So, um, okay, so Keith wants to move to the town of Silver Plume and his friend Ted is living there, his childhood friend that grew up across the street from him, like,
01:44:03
Speaker
Nice. I mean, who do you trust more than someone you grew up with across the street from you? Like, I don't know, because I had that best friend. Yeah. I'm like, I would still trust you with my life. Ted, his friend said that Keith had been both excited and apprehensive about turning 50. But like, sure, why not? We all get older. Right?
01:44:30
Speaker
Exactly. His son Sven, who incidentally was the only son I thought he had for quite some time, said that he seemed to want to do the things he really enjoyed in life before he got too much older and really couldn't do them, whether he lost his mobility or whatever. And the antique store that Keith
01:44:56
Speaker
either took over or started because I don't think there were any stores there he just you know yeah it was a bookstore and then okay well we'll get to it but it was a bookstore now it's an antique store um it sat on main street across from Ted's cafe and just like when they were kids when his friend was across the street Keith's store was
01:45:20
Speaker
over across the street and in a big building that at one point had housed a bookstore. There's a picture of it in the drive because it's a building that looks like it could maybe hold two small stores. When I looked at it, it seems old Western storefront. Very Western.
01:45:46
Speaker
Yeah. Little house on the prairie. Yeah. This is your store here. And like with the wooden boards. It's so cute. I love it. So it has not been updated. It's not going to have an Apple store in there. Yeah. Yeah. You can. Yeah. It's a small building, but it could probably host like whole two stores. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, even the, it looks like it could have a false friend. Yeah. It does look very old, right? So cute.
01:46:17
Speaker
um so yeah the uh man that had rented out the space there earlier had a bookstore uh like and like Keith they had both kind of moved to the town just to relocate to get away from it all for a bit and Keith found that they had other similarities that he was drawn to
01:46:44
Speaker
It's one thing said that their birth dates were one day apart. And you know, I love birthdays, but for the life of me, I could not verify when Tom's birthday was. There's just not a lot. Yeah, I could find about him. So I'll take that with a grain of salt, I guess. I did find out that Tom was apparently a former high school art teacher and retired US Army Special Forces veteran.
01:47:12
Speaker
because wow I could have loved that I was like huh people can be very too much like two different things because like totally art school teacher special forces yeah it's the so-called left brain right brain whatever yeah totally and like pat my partner obviously was in the army and then like when I met him I was like
01:47:38
Speaker
okay you're like a DJ but it's also like oh but you're in the army okay so you're like artistic but you're also like good at math all right yeah it's very interesting sorry um yeah former high school art teacher
01:48:02
Speaker
So Tom had been living there in Silver Plume with his dog Gus, a black Labrador. There's a picture of Tom and Gus, I think, on the dog. Okay, I thought he was just standing weird, but in the one picture, I think his dog is at the bookstore, the dog's like in front of him.
01:48:22
Speaker
I believe so, yes. Okay. I thought it was just his pants and then his hands, his arms went weird. No, it's like, oh, is that a dog? Like kind of jumping up at him? It is. What is he doing? Yeah, it's so weird. Okay. Cute. I do have an uncle that went by Gus for a while, but now he goes by AJ. But that's just because his full name is like Augustus James. So I was like, oh, Gus.
01:48:50
Speaker
And also he often has big dogs, like this dog Gus. And Tom and Gus, they were inseparable. They played fetch all the time. Many of the townsfolk observed them playing fetch and they noticed that instead of throwing a ball, Tom would throw a severed doll's head. Okay, don't know why. That's different.
01:49:20
Speaker
It's just a deep, it's a creepy detail that stuck with me. Yeah. And I believe that the bookstore that he owned was called Charing Cross, like the British Tube Station. And I thought that I maybe read that wrong, but then there was a picture that looked like you had the British Tube Station sign. Yeah. So I was like, maybe not.
01:49:45
Speaker
How I know is that, oh, I don't know if I told my mom, yeah, but she took us to London when I was like 16. So like fucking 20 years ago now. And like, I got a little key chain that said the mind the gap, which is what they say when you, it's like the recording. So you don't fall into the subway, mind the gap, please mind the gap. And I like lost my little key chain that said that I must, I don't know.
01:50:12
Speaker
I ended up with I think because Pat gave me a carabiner because I had a few different car keys and whatnot. And then we attach it to the other keys. But then somehow those two keys got separated. And I thought, oh, no, maybe I lost my parking lot at work, but I never did find it. So technically, yeah, I lost the key chain that's in the gap and my house keys. And that kind of sucked because I still have to replace them.
01:50:38
Speaker
oh but my car keys stayed so that that was good honestly that could have been worse
01:50:50
Speaker
Yeah, that's really expensive. If it's like any of the keyless entry ones, it could be like hundreds of dollars to replace or house keys. It could be like eight bucks or whatever. That's what Pat has. And I did drive his car today with the remote start, but yeah, mine has a key key. But yeah, it's like, I do not want to lose that shit.
01:51:15
Speaker
Okay, sorry. Tom was generally pretty shy and he kept mostly to himself, but he was also very well liked even in his new town in Silver Plume, Colorado. And one day on September 7th, 1987, he closed up shop for the day and left with his dog Gus. He went for a hike and he just never returned.
01:51:42
Speaker
At first concerns were just not raised because it was well known that he had been planning on heading on kind of a Euro tour a little You know trip to Europe or whatever for a few weeks as one does when we live in America. Yeah I mean Europe is cool
01:52:06
Speaker
Yeah. And Keith, once he found out about the disappearance of Tom, especially because they'd occupied the same retail space, he was really very intrigued by this mystery. And some might say he became quite obsessed. For
01:52:23
Speaker
For one thing, like, yeah, he was looking for a plot for his latest novel and some say he had writer's block when he first got to Silver Plume, but now they are like, okay. He's like, I know what I'm gonna write about. It's a disappearance. You know, it's the story. Yeah, okay. So he made this character, his main character, he called Guy Gypsum.
01:52:50
Speaker
And he was the a mashup of himself and Tom. I called it the middle-aged newly minted mountain man. A mashup of him and Tom. Apparently Keith's daughter Tiffany said that he was totally immersed in the story and almost living it.
01:53:11
Speaker
So he's a Christian Bale getting into the role. I don't know. So method writing. Exactly. That's the word. I think very much so. And by July of 1988, so specifically July 31st, 1988, after it's been 10 months since Tom's been missing,
01:53:41
Speaker
They finally found a shred of evidence. These two hunters were exploring and get this Republican mountain. No, we don't like to get political, but it's a funny name. And this is apparently only a mile and a half outside of Silver Plume. So it's very close. Yeah. And they did find skeletal remains of a human and a dog.
01:54:12
Speaker
Aww. Yeah, so I believe there's a picture even of the hikers, but there will be, there's actually a picture available of the skeletal remains. So I put it on the drive, but it's, you know, yeah. I don't know if I'm going to put it on our social media. Bones can be a little rough. Oh, I think I see it. Yeah.
01:54:40
Speaker
They're very recognizably bones of a human next to a canine, I think. Aww, his dog! Their heads are so close together. They looked very close together. Aww. And a lot of people said he just loved his dog, so...
01:55:04
Speaker
yeah when when theories of suicide and stuff come up for him i'm just like i don't believe it but that's yeah that seems a little weird if you just said he's gonna go like hiking around or backpacking around europe yeah yes he said he had planned a trip although no one could find
01:55:28
Speaker
I know nothing said they could find plane tickets that had been bought, but I was also like, well, considering the time it was, you didn't necessarily have to have a specific ticket bought for where you wanted to go when at that time in the 80s. You could show up to the airport and pay and get your ticket at the airport. Yeah, you could just be like, I want to fly here when, and they would barely even look at your bags or whatever. Yeah, it was different.
01:55:57
Speaker
Yeah, it sucks. And strangely, okay, so there was an old decrepit revolver that lay nearby them. There is a picture of the revolver that looks like it was falling apart. I saw it and you can see it in the skeleton to that picture too. Oh, because it's close enough to the. Yeah, it's like basically sitting like on his chest.
01:56:28
Speaker
I can see it in the picture. It is like sitting right on his chest. And the funny thing is like it was found to be registered to him. Oh, it seems he had bought it four days before this or before he went missing, I guess I should say. This is when he was found. But which was weird, right?
01:56:57
Speaker
yeah that's a little strange but also and i'm probably have it later but i'm sure that i'm pretty sure they didn't match the bullet that was in his skull to his own revolver so it's still oh okay considered like unsolved i think yeah this one's very mysterious which is
01:57:23
Speaker
Why when I, you know, when you're jotting down lists of things, when you're trying to, you know, there's a list. Oh, here's some disappearances. And they have like, they have like a paragraph or two max on each one. You're like, okay, I'm trying to decide which one might be good enough for like, at least a four or five page story. And then like, I was like, Oh, I think I've heard this one. And, Oh yeah, I like ones that have just mysterious,
01:57:50
Speaker
Kind of almost cryptic details, I guess. Yeah. And this one is a little weird. So lost connection, reconnected. Sorry, I saw Zencaster say something. So I was just like, don't even. Yeah, it seems fine. Yeah, yeah. It just said lost connection for a second. But then it said reconnected. So I think we're good. OK.
01:58:20
Speaker
the revolver lay nearby. Sadly, the coroner's office and the Clear Creek County Sheriff's Department, that's a mouthful, they declared it a suicide. So that was ruled a suicide, I think, unfortunately, because I don't know.
01:58:43
Speaker
That seems a little too easy. But yeah, there's lack of evidence, though, I suppose. Keith attended a small memorial that was held for Tom, like not only because it was such a small kind of tight knit community, but because at this point he felt like he knew Tom in a way.
01:59:05
Speaker
So, it said from a quote, on August 3rd, Keith attended a memorial service for Tom Young. Just before the service, he spoke to an old friend back in Chicago on the phone about his chances of becoming the new Bulls writer at his old paper. Despite the promotion of a former colleague who he intensely disliked, it seems Keith was considering returning back to his old job.
01:59:34
Speaker
I mean, that to me wasn't unlikely because everything I read so that he was on like a three-month sabbatical from his job. It wasn't like he quit for good. Yeah. So it said, one week later, Keith closed up shop on August 7th, 1988. There it is again. And set out around 2.30 PM.
02:00:00
Speaker
After telling several residents that he planned to summit the Pendleton Mountain, he took off. Many thought that he was just joking because he kind of had that fear of heights and although he did hike, it just seemed out of character. He wanted to hike.
02:00:21
Speaker
Yeah, it's I'm not too sure. It seemed like people thought he was kidding. And they said that Ted, his friend that owned the cafe, said he came to him just before he set out. Ted was like, I definitely thought he was kidding because he was like, I'm going out on the mountain. And if I don't come back soon, just call on the rescue. And then he said goodbye and he left. OK. Yeah, I guess that's where I was like, what? Like, you don't go hike.
02:00:52
Speaker
Yeah, probably. I don't think anybody should ever really hike by themselves. You know, I'm sure looking back, I bet people that know what happened to him wish they had done it differently. Yeah. Yeah. Because it doesn't seem like something that he was prepped to do if he was serious to do it. Yeah. Um.
02:01:17
Speaker
He was last seen walking towards the mountain around 4.30 p.m., dressed lightly in jeans and a flannel shirt. It's always flannel, I wrote.
02:01:31
Speaker
probably just from having seen it come up my cases and being like oh my god like obviously and you're in the northern states or in Canada like who are you Canadian fucking flannel I literally wrote its letter Kenny
02:01:51
Speaker
They're the best representation. Like Wayne's always wearing like a straight, you know, blue and black or red and black, like Canadian buffalo plaid flannel. I did not learn the word buffalo plaid till I started listening to Americans, the podcasts that love us. Thank you. And that's why we drink.
02:02:15
Speaker
Also, there was a letterkitty episode that just came out for May 2 for, and I told you Pat always knows when there's a new episode. He found it. And he was it. Y'all call it Memorial Day in America.
02:02:35
Speaker
So apparently, I guess this hike is at least maybe like four to six hours. That was my memory. I didn't double check that, but it was pretty long. Yeah, and also something you shouldn't start in the late afternoon. Yeah.
02:02:56
Speaker
So Keith did not return that night and the next day Ted grew concerned. He had in fact just promised himself he would be the first to call if Keith really did go up and not come back, especially after that kind of
02:03:09
Speaker
premonition thing. Yeah, like call the rescue team. So helicopters was sent up that next day, I guess, to search the mountain. And a team of search and rescue is assembled, including 125 people and 12 dogs. That's almost everybody that lived there.
02:03:36
Speaker
True, were they just all from there? It's like 150 people and you just said 125 people. I know, that's true. Well, especially because it said at the time of this disappearance, I think the town was like 130. Okay, so there's only five people that didn't join the search. They had to man the phones or the gas station or police, I don't know.
02:04:04
Speaker
Yeah. Because I'm not sure. Yeah. So I'm like, wait, are they all part of the official search and rescue team? Because I know my dad's always been on a search and rescue team for his area. It's like, you know, the municipal area. You'd only do basically around your city. And OK. Yeah, it's still a lot. It can still be a lot to cover. I don't know. This sounded like a nightmare, though.
02:04:34
Speaker
The apparent lead of the rescue search and rescue team said that it was an eagle in a haystack and that quote, this haystack is 3000 vertical feet of 60 degree slope, end quote. Yeah, I mean, it's the mountains. You don't know where he. Like, walk and if there's no trails, Mark, like it's just free for all. It's true.
02:05:04
Speaker
And I will say it makes me think of the ones where they get lost in national parks, especially the weird ones where they just seem to disappear out of thin air. Like not that you can't get lost in a big park, but that, you know, people will be like right with their whole party. And then one person, sometimes a child just like say wanders off and they're just like disappears. Like, yeah, those cases fascinate and, you know, depress me, I guess, but.
02:05:35
Speaker
Um, this, uh, research that I came across was like, the Colorado Alpine Rescue Teams had a reputation of finding their man. So they had so far apparently located every single person they had ever searched for, but they were not able to find Keith. Okay. I know. I was like, oh, wow. Um.
02:05:58
Speaker
the police searched his home. They found a newspaper clipping next to his computer about Tom Young's body being found, as everyone knew it had been at this point. He had just attended the memorial, but obviously it was consuming his mind. In his computer, they had the portions of his unfinished novel, and most articles like to quote this portion that
02:06:28
Speaker
Okay, so remember the main character's name was Guy Gypsum. Yeah, so made up. It is with the writings. Okay, so it said Guy Gypsum changed into some hiking boots and donned a heavy flannel shirt. I wrote the flannel cult. No, not the flannel.
02:06:52
Speaker
He understood Tom now and his motivation. Guy closed the door, then walked off towards the lush, shadowless Colorado forest above." End quote. Most things like to quote that as being, yes, it's so poetic. And he was researching his character that's the basis of him. And this other guy just walked off into the forest like maybe that's what he did. And honestly, I don't know.
02:07:23
Speaker
You know, it is poetic sounding, but there's more to it, though. I'll give you all the facts. Keith had also been seen at a party at the KEP building, so where his friend's cafe was.
02:07:38
Speaker
off of those many buildings in town, I don't think. That's my understanding. So this was the night before he disappeared. Apparently, he had been speaking at length to a woman, Agretta or Gretchen. People observed him doing so. Police later found this person and interviewed her, but no good information came of it to lead to his
02:08:07
Speaker
you know, discovery, I guess. Um, but at that party, which was a little bit concerning, was that he was overheard telling people that Tom's death was no suicide. So it would imply that he knew something. Yeah. Yeah. I almost didn't see that. And then I'm typing my stuff up and I'm like, Oh, wait,
02:08:35
Speaker
Where did I read that? That's pretty interesting. Yeah. I mean, it can happen when you get so, I guess, so obsessed or like consumed by something you refuse to, to like believe that that's how it ended or something sometimes not necessarily even that you think it's like that it's wrong because sometimes it is 100% right. And people just absolutely flat out refuse.
02:09:04
Speaker
to believe that that's what happened. Yeah. But yeah. Oh, yeah. So one thing I read said that I think Keith usually carried a camera, but that he didn't the day he was missing. But I don't know if that was significant.
02:09:27
Speaker
And then I had, my next bullet point said tragically a third man to which I wrote to myself, call back third band syndrome factor. It's an interesting phenomenon. Go listen to last episode, right? That was last episode. Like, I feel like that's the last one we recorded, but we're off our normal schedule.
02:09:54
Speaker
Yeah, and we're ahead. So like, because we were an episode ahead, we got confused about which episode was next. And then... I did! I didn't catch it for like...
02:10:08
Speaker
I read it and then I didn't clue in until I started editing that episode. I was like, wait, didn't I just read that our next episode is disappearances? And I was like, but it's not because I'm editing this one and we haven't even recorded disappearances. I'm like, what's going on? It's true. The more ahead you get, I think the more confused sometimes I feel. Yeah.
02:10:31
Speaker
Anyway. I don't know. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so if you saw that and then it changed, that's why. Yeah, I don't even remember what we said in the episode recording. What we said was next. Hopefully it was right. Wait, what? Yeah. Oh, yeah. We've been, we've been winging it. No, no, I'm just kidding. But yeah, we had to change because it's like, wait, and then we did the aliens one. I was like, uh. Yeah.
02:11:01
Speaker
We switch it up, you guys, but we come at you every week, so I'm sure you appreciate it. Okay, sorry. What did I say? So, oh yeah, I'll just go back. Tragically, a third man in this instance was lost when one of the search planes actually crashed and the pilot of it died.
02:11:27
Speaker
Oh geez. So like, yeah, I mean the other two were lost, figuratively, but this guy actually physically died in the pursuit of finding these men, which is very unfortunate. He was the pilot of the plane. Yeah, his name was Terry Ledens. I believe also the copilot got injured, but
02:11:48
Speaker
Oh my gosh, sometimes it just, I'm like, what are these cases where like planes go missing and then other ones go after them and they all go missing and
02:11:58
Speaker
you know this one that's like one person died and then someone gets obsessed with it and then he dies and then you know it's just like are we just watching a pattern you're like it's weird yeah um the actual unsolved mysteries episode i believe first aired uh about keith on january 31st 1990 and apparently they had like quite a few tips but
02:12:26
Speaker
nothing really like salt um but it's been featured a few places uh also on something called lost in the wild and then there was a documentary made that uh was started in 2014 called the dark side of the mountain and is available now on some of those streaming apps none of the ones that i have but oh damn
02:12:52
Speaker
I was like, was it Hulu? Some of the ones I had not heard of, but you know, so it's kind of scarce, but it's out there. They have like a website. I almost went back to them because I was like, oh, yeah, they had some like pictures of how, you know, big the mountain was and stuff. But yeah, if you can watch it, I probably would. It seems interesting.
02:13:19
Speaker
Also, it linked me at one point to how one of his sons, again, I thought he only had one son, but was involved in the documentary project, at least in the 30-year anniversary, and he could be seen on the top of the mountain as part of the film crew. Okay, see that picture? Yes, that one there was a picture of, and I was like, I'm putting it on!
02:13:46
Speaker
He looks quite happy that he made it to this mountain even though, you know, it's about his dad dying there. So I'm like, at least the kid, your kids are doing all right. Interestingly, I think yours had a, oh my God, not a weird tip, like the weird, the finger, but a tidbit, a clue.
02:14:11
Speaker
Um, this one had an April 1998 Unsolved Mysteries episode that aired about a case where a man was being called Pat Brown, but he had suffered amnesia. So that wasn't his real name. And people thought at first that he might be Keith actually, because they were like, okay, so he doesn't know who he is. And then he was found in Cheyenne, Wyoming. So it wasn't
02:14:41
Speaker
That far? It's still a mid floor mess. Wait, where were we at first? No, I'm confused. Colorado? Yeah, it's not that far. Wyoming, Colorado? It's all West Coast. That'd be a long walk, though. A walk? Yes, you're right, you're right, right.
02:15:03
Speaker
Um, but yeah, definitely attracted people's attention and they thought it might be Keith, but it turns out he was actually a man named Carl Broadnick of Indiana. So it was not Keith and he was not Pat Brown either. He was Carl Broadnick. So sadly, Keith's son Sven, Sven died of carbon monoxide poisoning in 2001 without ever knowing what happened to his dad.
02:15:32
Speaker
Yeah, sounds like he died pretty young and also damn carbon monoxide you don't think people always go from that. It can happen. I think it's most often in garages and stuff people that have their car running in the winter here.
02:15:54
Speaker
And then they don't have their garage door open and it can build up in there. And then it can, you know, you know, like hear about it from it and suicide it like, yeah, at least on TV, they seem to depict suicides happening that way. And then, okay. Well, there is that one that's technically a true crime case that they've covered several times on like mini series. Um,
02:16:21
Speaker
They're the young teenage boy and girl from America and like they're both depressed, but she kind of eggs him on to suicide. And then because he, he like killed himself through carbon monoxide poisoning from his truck. And she kept saying, do it. You can do it. That they're like, try to prosecute her as well.
02:16:45
Speaker
yeah I feel like I feel like I couldn't get away from it being advertised on my TV recently or not that long ago oh yeah I had heard of that before no it's like oh god no I'm trying to remember the names I can't cook no
02:17:05
Speaker
complicated though like there's definitely some nuance to it that's for sure we're not gonna get into it on this one that's for sure but so since Keith's been missing he's been since declared legally dead not that surprising okay yeah but then you know there's still the theories which includes suicide could
02:17:32
Speaker
Again, we're talking with two people, but could Tom have killed himself and his dog? I mean, they were both found shot in the head. Of course it is possible, but I wonder why and then why would Keith take his own life? And also then say that there wasn't a suicide and he had family that he was close to. So I feel like neither of them were suicide, but we haven't found Keith's body ever, right?
02:18:02
Speaker
Yeah. Then there's foul play, which Tom's gun... I may have said this Tom's gun was never confirmed to be the gun that the bullet came from that actually killed him. So although it was up there with him, it doesn't mean that someone didn't shoot him with their gun and run off. Yeah, it's stuff like it's a wooded area and he was found by hunters. So presumably there's other hunters in the area with guns.
02:18:32
Speaker
Oh easily. That's not too far-fetched to say he could have likely been shot by somebody else.
02:18:40
Speaker
yeah and this is the time it's just pre-internet and stuff where we we don't have everything that we almost almost take for granted sometimes now that can track you and stuff like that which can sometimes be a good thing yeah um but yeah we don't know if something to do with
02:19:02
Speaker
I don't think I said this. They had both rented that same space, you know, whether it was the bookstore, the antique store, it was in that building. So the theories arise that maybe they had seen something that they just weren't supposed to, although maybe it's a long shot. I was like, but what a body was it drugs? Like what would have been?
02:19:27
Speaker
Rumors of a serial killer also ran rampant, I guess, at this time. And one article said that the Lieutenant Stephen Gramillian was asked if there was a serial killer in Silver Plume. He believed it was possible. Quote, I mean, we have found a couple of skulls up in Silver Plume in the last few years. And when pressed for more information, he was unable to provide details due to it being an active investigation.
02:19:56
Speaker
He did state, however, that they tested the remains and none of the skulls were Keith's. The area seems to have claimed multiple lives over the years." End quote. So people are missing there. Yeah. I don't know. Like I said, I barely knew how many sons he had. This one was about, quote, Keith's...
02:20:22
Speaker
Keith's son, Kai Reinhard, believes his father disappeared due to foul play. In an interview with Rick Selinger, he said, I think my dad stumbled across something and he just knew too much. When asked if he thinks the mystery of his father's disappearance will be solved, Kai replied, yes, if somebody that knows something comes forward. Yeah.
02:20:47
Speaker
yeah it's it's very much up to speculation like why did they both take off so suddenly and why did heath make such a big deal of where he was going the day he disappeared yeah he told a bunch of people so many people and they were like okay keith like you're you're kind of afraid of heights and like why would you go up there alone so i just that was a weird impression yeah
02:21:16
Speaker
It's like somebody going out of their way to be like. Yeah. Make sure you're knowing that you're going up here or whatever. Yeah. Weird. Unless he never went up there at all. It is weird because my next thing is about how the timing is so significant.
02:21:43
Speaker
Again, other people might have pointed this out. I am so smart, but no, because right after like Tom's actual skeleton was found is basically when Keith goes missing. So it, it, it's very close together. Um, uh, this is a, another quote author, Mike Eclas E C C L E S wrote a book about the possibility of nuclear dumping in the silver plume area.
02:22:11
Speaker
That fall, my auto mechanic Roger Holman told me that on several occasions during the early morning hours, he had seen large trucks driving up the Dead End Road by his house. He said that the trucks were carrying nuclear waste from the Rocky Flats nuclear weapons plant 30 miles away, waste which was being dumped in the shaft of the supposedly abandoned mine. I did keep my mouth shut except for the
02:22:36
Speaker
for telling two acquaintances, fellow freelance writers, Sarah Lady and Silver Plume bookstore owner and political activist, Tom Young. So could that be what he knew maybe that there was dumping? Yeah. That came up at least once or twice in my research. It was interesting. You know, I love a good possible conspiracy theory.
02:23:04
Speaker
But it's hard to say. Yeah, I can see that. Like, because that is a place. Yeah. And it would be a significant health hazard. I'm sure it would affect like groundwater for that to be dumped down a mine shaft. So. I don't love these whole mine shafts, which seem to be used as body catchers, at least in some of the books I've read. Creepy.
02:23:31
Speaker
Another theory is that he wanted a completely new life that Keith wanted a whole new start and left of his own accord basically. I mean, people said he had always wanted to go to West Virginia, meet a mountain mama or a moth man. No, but just because he wanted to check out West Virginia, I hate to editorialize, but it doesn't seem to me that that would be a reason to like ditches kids.
02:24:01
Speaker
Well, yeah, and say, I want to move away from my wife for three months and try it out first and blah, blah, blah. Yeah. It's just like, what? Don't you want to get laid while you're out there? I don't know. Another theory is misadventure. Just could Keith have fallen down one of these mine shafts or something else where we just haven't been able to find his body yet? And I'm like, yeah, maybe it could be. Yeah. I mean, those.
02:24:29
Speaker
park rangers and whatnot so they found everybody but it seems to be rough terrain so yeah and then finally there was a 2021 update where Keith Reinhardt's wallet was found by two hikers on Pendleton Mountain they were actually shooting footage for a college film project at the time
02:24:55
Speaker
But now they have pivoted to make a documentary about the case and the discovery of the evidence. Okay. So they found his wallet up there now. They found his wallet. Like 40 years later. Holy crap. 2021. So yeah. At least 30 years. That's insane. No, you're right. It's closer to 40. Yeah. Holy shit. Okay. Yeah. Cause with Tom, they found his remains earlier.
02:25:24
Speaker
And like that search and rescue service in the parks was like, we don't usually lose a man that we can't find. Okay. So on that, I will end it with the, what I thought was a nice quote from the plaque that now lies in the Rockies, I guess near Silver Plume about Keith. So.
02:25:50
Speaker
Not just the, what was the other guy? Griffin Glifford, the mine owner. But now this plaque is for Keith and it reads, oh God, I want to wander. I want to wander till I die. With the mountains as my living room, my only roof is the sky. Aw, that's cute. That's what he wrote. That was one of Keith's
02:26:18
Speaker
like Keith wrote that. So that's where they put it on his little monument. And I thought that was really nice. I like that. That's nice. Yeah, me too. Yeah. You know, I'm not much for a platitude, but I like that one. Roof is the sky. Hell yeah. I love nature bound poetry. Makes you feel like connected to the earth. Yeah.
02:26:43
Speaker
Oh, it's another one. Now I need to know what happens with this one, just like mine. We be setting up fucking Google alerts and all that stuff. I did click on the Reddit thread at one point, but then but then I was deep into typing out what I needed to that I had already written down. So yes, but I don't mind that. To be honest, I had been listening to
02:27:11
Speaker
Oh, I knew what I heard about recently. Creeps and crimes. And they had read a couple of theories on the one case that they were talking about where it was like, this is from Reddit. And I was like, you know what? Sometimes people do have good little notes that they add into it, but depends, right? Yeah, especially if somebody is from the area where it happened and it's like, hey, I lived there.
02:27:40
Speaker
um something like that if they have an angle like totally so nice people have an insight they're like a better thing yeah yeah i heard one like okay well i don't know what happened in this case but they were like in my case which was similar blah blah blah blah blah and then we were like okay all right yeah yeah it was pretty interesting so maybe maybe they'll find something else then if they just found his wallet
02:28:08
Speaker
Yeah, I writing up the theories for this one was like, honestly, I really have a hard time, you know, marrying to a theory sometimes I've just got me. Yeah, this one was a weird one. Gosh. Oh, yeah, because there's two people. And so you're like, I definitely don't think it was just like,
02:28:36
Speaker
suicide slash disappearance. That seems the straightforward answer. It's like, they must be connected, right? But then it's like, is our brains just, we want to connect things like this, you know? Yeah, I don't know. It's very confusing. What do you guys think? Tell us. Let us know in the freaking Spotify notes. I've been commenting on tons of shit because now the Spotify has the
02:29:05
Speaker
message, whatever it is, comment feature. You ever listen to an episode and you're like, I have something to say right now. Yeah. As long as it's nice, you're like, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop. I've been doing that. Yeah, because you can do that on Spotify now. Two each episode. Crazy cases. So, yeah, if anybody has more information or a theory, I would be very interested to hear.
02:29:35
Speaker
Because this was... right? This was crazy. Oh my god. I know I would love to hear like a similar case or anything. Oh my god. Honestly, I want to hear any stories most of the time. I'm like, what? Doesn't have to be necessarily true cra- like, what? You got scared one time? That's awesome. I love hearing these stories. Yeah, they're so interesting.
02:30:03
Speaker
Hopefully everybody- What? I was just going to say hopefully everybody enjoyed this week's episode. True that. I was going to ask you what the next week's episode is about because I was like, this is not my job. I never know. I picked it because I wanted to talk about dragons.
02:30:27
Speaker
I feel like there's so much about dragons and yeah. I concur. Yeah, we're taking, as far as I understand, like two different directions or two different kind of like countries and histories about like dragons and stuff. So yeah, I think it'll be a long episode. My notes are really long.
02:30:54
Speaker
I had to finish them early because I'm on vacation for most of next week. So I had to be ready for us to record. So yeah, it's I want to hear about another one. Yeah. All right. Well, I'll fill in the gaps. Whatever. I forget exactly what details you were doing at the moment, but I will. I will do something on the other side and maybe a little bit shorter. Who knows?
02:31:24
Speaker
But yeah, you'll have to come back and find out. You will. Do it. You know you want to. Catch you next week. Keep it cryptic!
02:31:38
Speaker
This has been Castles Encrypteds. You can listen to our podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Anchor, Breaker, Pocketcast, and our YouTube channel. Please rate, review, and subscribe wherever you listen. Follow us on Instagram, Facebook, and Reddit. On our website, you can listen to all of our episodes as well as view pictures for each of our segments.
02:32:01
Speaker
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02:32:19
Speaker
Do you have a spooky ghost story, a creepy cryptid sighting, or a thrilling true crime tale you would like to share and have us include in a future episode? Send us your listener story by social media or by email. Please include the name that you would like mentioned. Our music is by Cobia Fair. Our logo and artwork is by Antonio Garcia. Thanks for listening!
02:32:42
Speaker
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