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Lindsay Partin
230 Plays9 months ago
This week on the Mothers of All Crime Podcast the discussion is on the case of Lindsay Partin. Some view her as a victim of police coercion. Others see her as a cold blooded killer. There is no in between for this babysitter sitting in prison. For a few moments Lindsay was alone with little Hannah and she ended up with a massive brain bleed. Her trial, conviction and appeals have brought up many questions. Is it possible that anyone else could have been responsible? Was Hannah injured prior to arriving? Why would Lindsay's story to police change so many times?
Listener discretion is advised.
May contain explicit language and unfounded accusations.
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Transcript
Introduction to Case of Lindsay Parton
00:00:24
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the Mothers of All Crime. This is a podcast where we deep dive into mothers involved in infamous crimes and scandals. I'm Monica and this is Crystal.
Hannah's Early Challenges
00:00:58
Speaker
This week on The Mother of All Crimes, we're talking about Lindsay Parton. Yes, and a very sad baby story yet again. I know, I know. Hannah Wesch is the baby in question. She's only three years old at the time of this incident. um And unfortunately, there's not that much to say because her life was cut very short. And she didn't get to accomplish all the things that I'm sure she would have if this had not happened. But basically Hannah Wesch was born to um
00:01:36
Speaker
to Jason, Wesch, and Adrienne Latham in 2015. And she had a super sad start too because she was born addicted to heroin and had a long hard experience in the NICU. She wasn't actually expected to survive, but she did.
Jason's Custody Struggles
00:01:58
Speaker
And she ended up in her dad's full custody. Yeah. Well, the reason that it got led to full custody was the mother was arrested for selling and trafficking heroin as well as using heroin. And I think everyone kind of can make the assumption obviously mom was using if she was born addicted, but it was so much more than just that. Like she was deep in this life and it's hard for a father to gain full custody, but when you're
00:02:31
Speaker
mother is in prison and it's a pretty easy flip over. um yeah But it did seem like he was kind of overwhelmed with the situation and it I couldn't find too much about the history of like their life prior, ah but it definitely seemed he just went He just didn't, like, A, was it prepared, B, didn't know what to do, like, the the man seemed to just... he has another He was another child from another relationship, but he had more of a ah typical dad schedule with that, where he would just see her for, like, weekends and visits and stuff. But when Hannah was born and her mother went to prison, he all of a sudden had to care.
00:03:17
Speaker
for an infant full time by himself and he didn't have like the financial means or like the family set up to support him.
Parental Oversight Concerns
00:03:24
Speaker
He ended up couch surfing a lot and also sleeping in his car and having the baby stay at different relatives houses but there wouldn't be room for him too so he was literally just like living out of his car for a lot of her infancy and early months. Yeah and this is where I start just to kind of struggle because you have situations where, which we've talked about in the past of like you have a foster parent or a guardian that's put in place who makes one tiny minuscule decision that normal parents don't have any second guess on like dropping hit their kid off to sleep somewhere else and
00:04:13
Speaker
they lose custody altogether, but they're good people. And in this case, you have a father leaving his kids at random relatives, unsupervised, and the court doesn't think anything of it because, well, you're a biological father and you have full custody right now because mom can't, like there's nothing looking into it. And I feel like that just, it's bizarre to me. He wasn't under investigation because the cases against adrian
00:04:44
Speaker
Adrienne were over. She was in prison and she lost full custody and so her rights worked. I think her rights were totally terminated from what I could find. So i agree there is no there is no case. So there is nobody he's not being assessed the way that a foster parent would be or even someone in a custody battle would perhaps be supervised or held to some sort of standard. He had no competition. His competition was the state. So if he could just stay off the radar No one's looking. Yeah, and that's where we've been so hard on like CBS and CY, like all the different acronyms, depending on what state you're in.
Lindsay Becomes Hannah's Babysitter
00:05:24
Speaker
um But I think this is one area they could improve, where you have a parental figure, one of the two ends up in prison, you should probably check in on that baby. Like, just once in a while, at least for like a period of time. Like, but at least I think so.
00:05:43
Speaker
Yeah, I think so too. I think that he was not prepared for this baby. I'm sure he didn't have to prove to anyone that he was prepared to have her just him being like a free man. That was the only requirement was that he was physically standing there when the baby needed someone to take it home. So I agree. I think there should have been help put into place for him. I think that he should have been
00:06:12
Speaker
maybe investigated as well just because I'm not like accusing him of anything specifically but I don't know what his dynamic was like with Adrian and I don't know if he also had substance abuse issues and maybe I mean you are not the company you keep and sometimes people are you know people don't know who they're in relationships with or you're broken up and you find out that she's moving a lot of weight in heroin, but I just feel like it was not a good environment. This poor kid had like the worst start, the worst, worst start and then- She had a really hard start for sure. I mean, she was addicted to drugs. She was homeless. She had no stability and didn't get to bond with her mother. It's very sad. It's horrible, the circumstances that she started in.
00:07:03
Speaker
Yeah, before we move on, my last thing with dad before anything happens is I, it is my opinion, I have nothing to back this up. He was fully aware of mom's behavior. And if he was involved or not, that's the question. But when you're moving heroin at a high enough rate, your partner is typically, you're either aware and you're just choosing not to acknowledge. or you're involved. Very few circumstances. Are you going to have someone who's 100% completely unaware? And that's typically smaller, in my opinion. I just feel like he was the one that didn't get caught. That is possible. That's definitely possible. And I think that Jason went on to show us that he will overlook things at a minimum. um
00:07:58
Speaker
So a foreshadow. ah Yeah, I just I think that he didn't have a lot of stability. He wasn't probably the person that Hannah needed when she was at such a vulnerable point and children are pretty much always at a vulnerable point, but especially Hannah and everything that she had already been through and overcome. i Yeah, I
Babysitting Dynamics and Concerns
00:08:23
Speaker
yeah agree. he probably He probably knew, I don't know if they were still together at the time of Hannah's birth, but I don't think that was a new behavior. Yeah. So after he kind of couch surfed and all that, he did land in Ohio and did end up finding a home that the two of them moved into when Hannah was about two. Well, yeah, because he first he first got a job and
00:08:50
Speaker
At that job, he met TJ, who is the partner of Lindsey Parton. And through TJ and through this job, he found a house that was available next door to Lindsey and TJ. And him and Hannah moved into that house. And that was the first time that they'd had any stable living situation, financial financial situation. um because he had a job where he would work like 12 hours a day. Well, he was in construction. Working an eight to 12 hour day in construction is not super abnormal, sure at least from what I know people who would do it. But it's a long day to be leaving such a small child. And Lindsay started babysitting for them.
00:09:44
Speaker
and they would he would drop her off at 8 a.m. and come back really whenever he got off ship, which could range depending on what job he was on. Yes, and he was getting a pretty um good rate, I feel like, as far as babysitters go, because this is in 2018, and he was giving her $30 a day to watch her sometimes dropping her off before 7 a.m. I saw as high as 35, depending on what kind of article you read. But like you said, yeah, you have people charging $25 an hour. but She's doing 30 to 35 bucks a day. That's wild. It also seems like Jason was behind on a lot of those payments.
00:10:31
Speaker
um Lindsay was watching her own two daughters as well as another friend of TJ's daughter. So she had four little kids that she was watching all day, every day by herself. Her garage was basically turned into a daycare. That's what it looked like. Yeah. Like little slides and toys everywhere. Oh, and these kids were all under the age of four too. Like these weren't, like you had one that could like help out the rest of them. Like these are little kids. Like who need little constant attention.
00:11:03
Speaker
And it's not that she was just even caring for Hannah through work hours. She was also, she was bathing her. She was feeding her dinner. She was taking her to dance classes. She was with this child all day, Monday to Thursday. The only day that she was not there was Friday, um where she, Heather, I mean, I'm sorry, Hannah would go to a different babysitter on Fridays. Yeah, which I think is good because at least like Yeah, at least there was like one day a week that she had a little bit of a break, thank goodness.
Signs of Abuse
00:11:36
Speaker
um But again, those are long hours. And she also, like you said, had her kids, but she had a couple other things she was doing. So she was being a bookkeeper for her father who was like a business owner. She sold Mary Kay on the side, which shout out, I love Mary Kay. Bad example of a consultant.
00:11:58
Speaker
Uh, but it seemed like she kind of had a little bit of side, side hustles here and there.
00:12:07
Speaker
Yes. And it's good to have side hustles and bring in money. And she did have an associates degree in childhood development education. So she was, you know, putting that to use and she was running a home daycare that can be really profitable. Good side money.
00:12:26
Speaker
yeah yeah and like but again if she was charging a normal rate she'd be making bank yeah she would be but i'm not sure um I'm not sure what it was like in that area. It seemed very rural, very like underdeveloped. I'm not sure like how close the daycare would have been. Obviously, this was like a very convenient solution for Jason because he would just pop next door. He would drive a lot of the time, but it was literally the house next door, and it would take him two minutes to get there in the morning.
00:13:05
Speaker
Oh yeah. And I mean, when you have a friend slash coworker who's like, Hey, my girl babysits, she's got a degree in preschool education. She already has, she's a mom. Like you have someone who's like, I don't want to say like proposing it, but you have someone supporting this idea and you're already overwhelmed. It's very easy to be like, Oh, she seems trustworthy. Then I'll just go with her. rather than the unknown, like of the random daycare center. You know what I mean? It just seems like it's an easy kind of support. Right. And Jason did not have family support. He didn't have a partner. He didn't have relatives willing to drop whatever they were doing to care for Hannah full time. So, and he didn't have unlimited financial resources. This was the best financial position they'd been in, but it still wasn't great. So I think that
00:14:04
Speaker
for Jason, this was like a no brainer solution. Yeah. And so this went on for about eight months. um Same thing every day. Every every little kid loves a schedule. And anyone who argues with me, I challenge you to that argument. They woke up, they dropped them off. And she knew exactly where she was going. And From an outside perspective, it seemed kind of like they were on the right track on turning things around and moving positive. And he was maintaining his job. They had this home. like It seemed from the outside perspective at the beginning that nothing was going wrong. Yeah, it was the best that it had ever been, for sure. um Up until about March 2018, things started to get a little bit weird.
00:15:01
Speaker
things started to get a little bit, like Hannah was coming home. She was saying kind of weird things. She told some relatives that she didn't like her babysitter. I saw something where she told her grandfather that she didn't like her babysitter. She has an older sister who had met, she had mentioned to, that Lindsay basically was mean to her. um And then she started having little bruises and those were noticed by a few different people. Yeah, so she started popping up with marks on her face, her neck, body, arms, all in early March of 2028, 2020, 2018. So used to it. um And I do find it peculiar that the grandfather had
00:15:52
Speaker
kind of started chiming in. And this grandfather was mom's dad, so absent parents' father. And he wasn't really in her life, but then he later claims that he had like weekly phone calls with Hannah, which I thought was kind of weird, that when it came out that Hannah started being hurt, or there were suspicions of being hurt, he would say oh he would find the bruises and then Hannah would tell him it's the babysitter so all of a sudden now grandpa is involved but yet not watching her not offering to watch her okay yeah yeah my three-year-old is telling me that he she's getting hurt why am i allowing my granddaughter to go back i would be like i'll take her then like
00:16:43
Speaker
Yeah, I did think I did see the thing about the phone calls and I thought that was very odd. What are you talking to a three year old on the phone about every week also, I just find that kind of hard to believe like maybe you talked to Jason on the phone about her, maybe you'd like, I don't know, FaceTime her or something. It's 2018. Like you can FaceTime. Yeah, I just don't think you're gonna make like a phone call to a toddler. Right. And then not like there were comments of saying that he would see them. So he clearly was close enough that he would visit or they would visit him or like all of a sudden he started being involved. So it is kind of strange to me that he didn't start making all these efforts until later on.
Police Investigation into Injuries
00:17:27
Speaker
But I think that's hindsight as well. I think it's a lot of hindsight. I also think
00:17:34
Speaker
I mean, everybody wants to be right in the aftermath and everybody wants to be on the right side of history. So it's hard, it's hard when an incident it happens and public opinion has already taken place. And then everyone starts putting in their two cents. It's hard to know what came first and what the influence was of these different, it changes what a tragedy happens. It changes your perspective on things that have happened in the past. Yeah and I think it like you that's a good point because you have a toddler who at this point in their life that's when they start learning what the difference is between a truth and a lie. It's a difference between like
00:18:19
Speaker
how much they can get, ah they're testing boundaries and seeing people's reactions and they're a little mischievous. Like there were stories that Hannah would be quote, misbehaving, but she was just doing like unattended toddler things like playing with ketchup where she wasn't supposed to be. well Like it's all kind of little things that are very very age appropriate obviously probably not desired by any babysitter but I don't think she was out of character and little kids fall they get bruises and bumps and scrapes and also very normal so every once in a while you see kind of little marks here and there right I don't think
00:19:03
Speaker
For sure. In the moment, you're not going to think anything of it other than, all right, well she fell and bumped her head. Right. A three-year-old that is active, that's playing, that's with other kids all the time, they're going to have bumps and scrapes and bruises and that's very expected. And again, I agree with you, I didn't hear anything about Hannah's behavior that seemed out of the realm of normal for three year olds, it seemed all very developmentally appropriate. It seems like she was pretty advanced, even after everything that she had overcome, like her speech was very good. She she didn't have
00:19:43
Speaker
behavioral issues that have ever been proven to me. Maybe she was a bit mischievous, but that's just being a toddler. Right. They're gonna... Honestly, I feel like most toddlers, that's when they're gonna test their boundary. They're gonna see what they can get away with. Like, how else are you gonna learn? They're just trying to learn. For sure. They're exploring the world around them. And they should be safe to do that. um There was an in incident on March 7th, 2018, where Lindsay says that Hannah fell and fell on some concrete.
00:20:19
Speaker
and got a very big bruise on March 7, 2018. And that's when she made a Google search for how to make a bruise look better, which will be significant later. um So she did have that injury. She told Jason about it. That was all fairly normal, I feel. I agree. I think um she later, much later on, did admit that she told Jason that she thought they Hannah got a concussion and maybe it was important for them to seek medical attention. Apparently Jason told her that he would and that never happened. um It would be interesting to I wish again we could be a fly on the wall to see if that conversation actually happened because it didn't come out until some of her
00:21:12
Speaker
appeals. But if that is the case, that's really interesting that if she did have a natural bump and bruise and Lindsay was concerned that dad just kind of brushed it off.
00:21:27
Speaker
Yes, it's so hard because everybody's a flip-flopper and the stories change so much. um I feel like the only thing that we know for sure that happened is that Hannah had an injury on March 7th and developed a large bruise and Lindsay made that Google search and Jason was aware of it. But we don't actually know the circumstances of what really happened. She says, Lindsay says, that Hannah fell. But we don't really know what happened there. We don't really know the extent that was communicated to Jason. We don't know what, you know, we don't know how she was acting in the interim. We just will not know. Right. And it's just, again, she starts claiming that Hannah starts behaving differently a couple days before the big incident, where just
00:22:23
Speaker
She claims a dad would tell her it was allergies and just to give her Tylenol. Again, there's no way to prove one way or another.
Hannah's Hospitalization and Investigation
00:22:31
Speaker
um But all of a sudden, then it all kind of came tumbling down. Yes. And I also want to just, because this is another example of people whose stories change later on, because just taking us to March 7, 2018, Jason picked up Hannah from Lindsay's house. Lindsay explained about the injury and whatever. And originally,
00:22:59
Speaker
Jason would tell the police that he just took Hannah to get milk and then they went home, but he actually ended up hanging out with his friend Chris um and being with Chris that evening and that didn't come out until about two days before legal proceedings started. um which Chris was actually staying with them too. He wasn't just hanging out at the house. He like was extended and it came up that the police actually kind of noticed it because there was no milk in the fridge from his apparent trip to Walmart. Like you're gonna lie at least lie about something that's already in her house. It seemed like a weird omission for sure.
00:23:46
Speaker
claim to be As I say, did we ever find out what Chris's relationship was? I personally couldn't find it. I only saw that he was like ah a friend, but I don't know a lot of information about him. I wonder if Chris is a drug dealer and that's why he's like, oh no, my friend, who also like, you know, I feel like he's just around a lot of drugs historically. so and Yeah. ah Random Chris, the friend Chris is around Hannah the whole night prior. So all of March 7, 2018, Hannah is with Jason and Chris. There's nobody else around. It's just them. Overnight and then at 652 a.m. on March 8, 2018, Jason texted Lindsay getting ready to head over. And
00:24:43
Speaker
He, it takes him a couple of minutes to get to Lindsay's house, and they chit chat. He leaves, he gets in his car, he drives away. At 7am, Lindsay called Jason. He didn't answer. At 701am, Jason called back, and Lindsay told him that Hannah had collapsed. And he came right back to the house. He was only about 30 seconds away. So he came right back in and he told Lindsay to call 911. Hannah was barely conscious. Her eyes were open, but they weren't really focused on anything. She was breathing oddly, very shallow. They were describing it as almost like a sniffing kind of breath. It was not a normal breathing pattern. And she was clearly
00:25:33
Speaker
something had happened and she was clearly unwell. um So Lindsay ended up staying on the phone with 911 for 13 minutes. And it was just her be not reiterating she didn't know what was going on. She didn't know what happened. They needed immediate assistance and which It is traumatic. Like regardless of what end you're on, if you just see this little baby just coll collapse or you're coming back and you're seeing your daughter in that state, that's terrifying. So obviously per the police show up, paramedic, like she gets rushed to the hospital and Hannah
00:26:17
Speaker
I don't, I couldn't find a specific timeline. Maybe you did. Um, but obviously started going into medical attention. It was coma. She had multiple surgeries. Did you find a specific timeline?
00:26:43
Speaker
So I do have a timeline of her injury leading to her. So she was injured somehow. She had suffered a brain injury. Ultimately this was discovered via CAT scan in the hospital. um She was put on a ventilator. She was completely unconscious and she ended up passing away 10 days after. So March 18th.
Contradictions in Lindsay's Statements
00:27:10
Speaker
2018 she was declared brain dead and pulled off life support but she never regained consciousness in that time and through the medical exams and ultimately the autopsy I mean she had a major hemorrhage in her brain behind both of her eyes she had multiple contusions abrasions bruising all over her scalp on her chest she had a lot of catastrophic injuries but the one that ultimately killed her was her brain bleed
00:27:41
Speaker
crime, which led to the coma, which then led to the full brain dead moment. Yeah, decision. Exactly. Exactly. So obviously, as she's in the hospital, Lindsay is being spoken to by police. Because yes, this is a very strange situation where a like little kids just don't collapse for no reason. They might collapse to the ground, have a temper tantrum, but they don't collapse and need immediate hospital attention. and our At this point, nobody knows if they're even gonna live. So she is sitting with police for about an hour and a half until they allowed her to leave at that point. And she went to the hospital to actually see Hannah and was denied access.
00:28:33
Speaker
which I think is kind of interesting. Yeah, I did think that was interesting. i
00:28:42
Speaker
it's It's hard to say um what the motivation for that would be, but Lindsay did spend every day with this child. And she was being told by police that Hannah is gravely injured at this point. um and Jason is with her at the hospital and she may have just been very concerned and She went to see how things were going. You could also say that maybe she was appraising the situation um to see how Bad things really were all perspective Yeah, and but she actually talked to Dad during this time and he told her that Hannah had an aneurysm. She was gonna be totally fine blah blah blah
00:29:29
Speaker
And then Lindsay was arrested the next day. Yes. Well Lindsay, did you watch any of her interrogations because I i don't know if interrogation is the right word, but I watched a lot of her police interviews and she was acting kind of weird in all of her interviews and her story was very inconsistent and It changed about seven times throughout the course of her interviews. And she was properly Mirandized. She did not ask for an attorney. She made a couple of weird comments about, oh, maybe I should have gotten an attorney. But she didn't ask for one. She talked to the cops for hours and hours and hours and just kept giving more information about herself and more information in these contradictory stories. the results yeah That's where she was saying some very not nice things about Jason.
00:30:20
Speaker
um Yeah. I watched bits and pieces of it. Um, and I will say I have, I have mixed feelings because part of me is no one in a sane mind is going to go into a police room with officers who are under suspicion and going to behave normally there. Every single one of them is going to be weird. and ah The only like recordings I've seen that I was like they seem way too normal are that of like serial killers where they're just really calm because they feel it's a whole that's a whole different avenue but it didn't shock me on her behavior what started to rub me the wrong way was the different stories and the different versions of everything because like you said she was probably Miranda's she actually denied an attorney twice
00:31:19
Speaker
Um, so she did make those comments that maybe she get an attorney, but it's also not invoking your right. You have to say certain verbiage and there were verbiage of her denying that right. So the officers did exactly what they should do is they continue those conversations. Um, I do think there was a lot of intensity to it where I think is going to come up later during her appeals that we'll talk about of the duration of it and the intensity of some of it. But I don't think it was abnormal. I think it was very standard by the book on the officer's part.
00:32:00
Speaker
Yeah, I mean you could argue different things about the way they handled the police investigation. There was a point where the detectives told Lindsay that they had pulled the plug and that Hannah was deceased and that actually wasn't true at the time. Hannah was still very much alive when they told her that, but that is not illegal and you can use that as a tactic. um And if you truly did not injure Hannah, her surviving or not surviving shouldn't change your story. Because if your story is the truth, then it's it's very hard to argue that that is some sort of
00:32:38
Speaker
unethical manipulation, I think. I think that's, they're well within their rights. And she also did things that made herself seem suspicious. There was a point where she was left alone in the interview room. And she said out loud where she's being recorded, I'm going to prison for the rest of my life.
00:32:59
Speaker
and Which, is mean it's not it's a weird thing to say for sure, particularly innocent or guilty. It's a weird thing to say out loud. Yeah. But I also can imagine if you're staying in that room trying to like put yourself in her situation and you're feeling that no one is believing you and all this stuff, you even if you are innocent, that feeling of like, I'm somehow going to get blamed. Because I feel like if you just take it from a more simplistic approach, think about like a kid and their sibling and something breaks that in their house, like that instant feeling of, I'm going to get in trouble, even though I didn't break it. Like you got to wonder if it's just that simple, regardless of the situation, she was in my care, I'm going to be held responsible.
00:33:56
Speaker
For sure, that's a way to interpret it, for sure. I think that it's possible. I think that Lindsay was definitely freaking
Lindsay's Trial and Charges
00:34:04
Speaker
out. And from she it to me, it seemed like she thought if she could just explain enough, then nobody would get in trouble for this. And then it was just like some sort of misunderstanding. But that's also just, i I feel like, to me, it's her being manipulative. And it didn't feel very genuine. yeah what i started kind of feeling icky about is when she started kind of going on the defensive like you said she started kind of bringing up Jason a lot more and that's where i started to question things because it felt like if i'm going down i'm bringing everybody with me kind of vibes like and don't get me wrong some of the stuff she was saying about Jason rightfully so like you you the
00:34:57
Speaker
truly feel about that way you should bring up some of these things. But the timing of it was just peculiar. Yes. Well, I feel like it's really important to say that Lindsay initially said that Hannah was totally fine. And then she just collapsed out of nowhere, um that she was walking, talking, everything. And then it progressed into she tripped, or I was holding her, and we fell together. or And it got more and more and more aggressive, and it kind of was
00:35:31
Speaker
in line with what the police were saying too, where it's like the cop, the doctors are telling us that this type of brain injury, she would have been unresponsive almost immediately. Like this is an extreme traumatic brain injury. She would not have been asking for a donut. She wouldn't have been asking for her dad. She wouldn't have asked to lay on the couch. She would have been unable to speak, unable to walk. her behavior would have dramatically changed almost immediately. So, and Hannah was only with Lindsay for about
00:36:07
Speaker
five minutes alone, less than that probably. So the cops are telling Lindsay, either you killed Hannah or her dad did. And that's when Hannah starts, I mean, when Lindsay starts kind of throwing Jason under the bus, it seemed to me anyway. It's like, oh, well, it had to be one of us. And listen, in like, yeah reading different as the case kind of starts, when you have different medical opinions, both of them became very plausible, I feel depending on what expert you listen to. And that's what's so dangerous about paid experts is you for the right price, you could find an expert that's going to say pretty much anything. So that's where like it's hard. been fleshed out
00:36:59
Speaker
But these weren't fleshed out expert opinions at this point. This is happening in real time. And this child was being examined prior to the autopsy, they didn't have as much information. But as she was getting more testing done, they're seeing the extent of these injuries. So they're coming at Lindsay with the updates. And some of the updates were not truthful, but the fact that Lindsay would adapt her story to fit the facts yeah makes me know that she knew initially that what she was telling was not true because if Jason did something because I feel like the possibilities in this case are essentially that Jason horrifically injured Hannah and then immediately dropped her off and then
00:37:49
Speaker
Hannah collapsed and then the this is all just being put on Lindsay. You could also say the same thing about Chris potentially maybe, like maybe he did something to Hannah immediately before Jason took her and dropped her off. The only other possibility is that Lindsay injured her. So it's a, cause it's a very, very tight timeline. There is running oh there's no wiggle room. Five minutes, very tight. Yeah. And that's why I think it's so hard it means because it's so tight and there were two of them within such a close period of time. Exactly. It's right. So she did end up getting charged with six different counts, um, with murder, with involuntary manslaughter and four counts of endangering the welfare of a child. And
00:38:48
Speaker
The trial was grueling. Jason testified. Lindsey testified. A lot of witnesses spoke on both sides. it There was medical testimony. Obviously, the autopsy was a big finding. We've already discussed that, the brain bleed. But there are other injuries consistent with a child that had possibly been abused in the weeks leading up and not just necessarily that day. um but the finding was definitely murder. That's why it was ruled. And Lindsay's defense was kind of confusing to me of what they were trying to argue. I think that what they were trying to argue was that it was Jason, but they didn't seem to have a lot of things backing that up. It felt like a lot of grasping at straws.
00:39:44
Speaker
Yeah, I think and Lindsay could have never done this, which is crazy. Okay. Yeah. And they don't necessarily feel like they were I don't think they came in with a whole strategy per se. all Their entire goal in my perspective is just to cause reasonable doubt. They don't need to prove that Lindsay's in innocent. They just need to have one, because this was a jury trial, which is her right to. They just had to have one juror believe that there's a possibility it was Jason. And I think that's what they were kind of trying to do. Not trying to prove her innocent, just trying to cause that doubt.
Defense Raises Doubts About Jason
00:40:22
Speaker
Because all they need is one.
00:40:26
Speaker
Right. Well, they didn't get it because she was no victim. She got life possibility of parole in 18 years. okay And I, I found it interesting though. Yeah, I thought it interesting that she was charged with both murder and involuntary manslaughter. Um, I don't, it, it's such a interesting combination because you don't typically hear both of them being charged, a lot of times one or the other. And in Ohio, I think the reason that they did that is because of the endangering of child laws where the you could kind of bring in that involuntary involuntary manslaughter. Because by definition, it's when someone commits manslaughter, which is killing someone.
00:41:24
Speaker
while committing another misdemeanor or felony, which is that child endangerment. So they could just pile on one more crime in addition to the murder charge, which obviously is the death of another human being. Yes. Um, I think that
00:41:48
Speaker
the involuntary manslaughter was the charge the way I interpreted it was even if that wasn't the intent it was still like a consequence of physical discipline I think was like and that she was in Lindsay's care and Lindsay had a duty to be protecting her and instead was not protecting her. So I think that it was just like whether or not she meant to kill her, it still was her fault. And it was all happening during the process of abusing a child and endangering their welfare. So I think they just wanted to slap over as many charges as they could, give her more time.
00:42:27
Speaker
Yeah. I wonder though, like if they originally put it on there as like a backup and then actually just ended up getting them both. Like, because if you have a jury trial, you have a jury trial. But they didn't get the murder. You know, I could see that. It's like a concern because again, you never know what a jury is. Juries are hard. And yeah all you need is like one person to flip or one person to be sympathetic towards whatever the situation is. And you're out. So I think maybe having both of them was like a safety net of, because environmental order is 11 years, like right there, you have the felony, there's some time. Right.
00:43:11
Speaker
i think that Lindsay's like the sympathy that you could possibly have is that she was having marital problems um which caused her a lot of stress. She was overwhelmed with four small children in her home and she had recently had a miscarriage and that's pretty much it because otherwise there's really no there's nothing that would have, that did make the jury feel sympathetic. They did not feel sympathetic. And the interviews were shown during the trial. And I think that her story changing so many times and of course her ultimately admitting to shaking and throwing and hurting this child, like she did admit to all of those things. So I think the jury did not feel a lot of sympathy or empathy for her.
00:44:10
Speaker
And she has tried to appeal, and it was denied. But there's a still a campaign, like Lindsay Parton is innocent. There's Facebook groups. Oh, it's huge. There's been multiple. Yeah. Well, I don't get what they think happened. I haven't seen anybody really explain like what happened. so what i nobody really is explaining what happened that i could find either but they are claiming that she it wasn't her i think without directly saying it they're trying they think it was jason um because everything i see is people character witnessing of that she's just not the person who would have done this from the day after she signed the confession which she did do
00:45:05
Speaker
Uh, she's been maintaining her innocence that it was a, she'd signed it under pressure. She was just telling them what they wanted to hear. So it would be over. She just wanted everything to stop and go back to her kids. Like she, from the day after really kind of dug her heels in saying that she was innocent. Um, and that's, I think there are a lot of things basically is what she says. Right. Yet there's, and I think you the most recent one, physical evidence right. Yeah. And that's looking at her appeal. So like in September of 2020, she had an appeal to overturn her conviction and it was police coercion, um ineffective counsel, and claiming that the prosecutors didn't disclose certain facts, which ultimately ended up being denied because of those medical injuries that came out.
00:46:03
Speaker
her new attorneys were trying to show like, hey, Jason should be considered. And the judge was like, well, looking at the medical, I don't care where Jason was. it the The timing just doesn't end up from what their opinion was for the facts of the case.
00:46:22
Speaker
Yes. It really, it just blows my mind how briefly this child was actually there that morning. to be being to being in the car with your dad at 6.52 a.m. to being having someone calling 911 at 7.02 and this horrific injury has already happened in the interim. I mean, yeah there's there's just no, excuse you could say that you're overwhelmed, but why did you even accept her into the home that morning at all if that's what you were gonna immediately do to her?
00:47:02
Speaker
But I think that's where everyone has so many questions. Like the timing just doesn't make sense. Like you, it basically is arguing that you took this little kid, the minute that dad drove away, you just like chucked her out the ground. Like there's, I think people are having a hard time of you, you hear stories of like something happening in like a slow brain bleed or like after years of abuse, you become more tolerant of certain things that, what might hurt one kid who's, but if they're used to it for three years, it might not hurt them anymore. So like I think people are struggling with the idea that it would, would it be such a small period of time? How did it happen?
00:47:46
Speaker
I know. And that's what makes me think that the injury the day before was also not by accident and was, I feel like she had escalating rage towards Hannah, but it was very quick. the escalation. It was like over a couple of weeks, I guess. And then those couple of days, it went from five to 60. I mean, I don't know if Hannah said something that just really triggered her or if Jason said something that morning and he just hasn't brought that up or admitted to it. They made it seem like they had a very normal conversation. He might not even know what he said to set her off.
00:48:27
Speaker
But I feel like something happened the day before that morning that just put her in this blind rage to attack this 32-pound child in that way. Right. And during some of her investigations and interviews and interrogations, she did admit that she had smacked her on the side of the head, that she would poke her aggressively, she'd squeeze the center of her body. um And that she actually believed it was okay to strike a toddler because it was important for discipline. And it was her interpretation that Jason supported those disciplinary actions. So that's where it starts getting gray again.
00:49:25
Speaker
Right. I mean, she did say that specifically, that Jason had like given her permission to physically discipline Hannah, um which I'm just going to get on my little soapbox, which i don't I don't actually care if anybody doesn't agree with this or is offended by it. But i I think this is a really good reason to just never hit your kids, because the gray and the line of what is too far is terrifying and things do escalate and things do not remain the same. And I think that a lot of people start out using this physical punishments, physical discipline. I think the people who are raised that way think that it is a good form of discipline. Maybe some people are able to use it where they never take it too far and it's only used constructively. But I think for someone who
00:50:22
Speaker
is used to using physical discipline, is feeling resentful of this child that is not even their child, resentful of that child's dad not making his payments, resentful of the miscarriage that she had, resentful of the marital problems that she's having. And it just, I already hit this kid, I already feel like I'm allowed to hit her. So it's like, what's the difference if I really hurt her this time? And I think that, It's just a dangerous, it can escalate way too much. And I think that it got really out of control. And I think she'd been flying off the handle and something inevitably terrible was gonna happen to one of those kids.
Motivations and Case Dynamics Discussion
00:51:06
Speaker
And I think Hannah especially, I mean, she even said it during one of her interviews that she hates Hannah's mom for,
00:51:16
Speaker
being a loser, being on drugs, not appreciating her child when she's trying so hard to have a baby and she's having a miscarriage. And I mean, it's it's crazy to blame Hannah for that situation. But I think that people project their anger and their rage on to people who they can actually inflict suffering on. And she had complete control. She had complete power over Hannah. Yeah. And I do want to put in here as well that I again there's no documentation of this I have a feeling that he being Jason did actually say this it it is my belief because if you dig enough there are pictures of this little girl earlier before Lindsay ever even met her covered her bruises and cuts and like out of character
00:52:16
Speaker
injuries for a normal kid. So I totally believe that he probably did fully support it and probably also was doing some kind of punishments regardless of if they think it's constructive or not. There clearly is documentation that it was getting worse and worse and worse. And when you have such a small human, granted Wendy's 411, she's not a massive person, but compared to a three-year-old, you're a full-grown human. Yeah. Even though me at five-ten will probably pat you on the head. like Sure. I think it it it's hard to understand your strength when you're upset, let alone when you're facing a little kid. Yes, definitely. I i did
00:53:09
Speaker
i did um see about those pictures with the previous bruises and I know that Lindsay was trying to use that as grounds for an appeal as well, but it's it's just the massive brain injury that she had. The idea that Jason could have abused her in the morning and dropped her off at Lindsay's and then Lindsay just ended up confessing to the whole thing. I mean it it really doesn't hold water for me. And it didn't for the jury and it didn't for the appellate court. I know I personally don't think Jason did it, but I definitely think his actions may have led it to being so easy. I don't know if I find it really hard to believe that she did all this violence in such a short period of time. I think that
00:54:09
Speaker
Jason probably did abuse her and she already was kind of not okay. And then Lindsay struck her one way that just kind of ruptured everything. Like it just, I was trying to think on how all this could happen so quickly. And that's the only rational thing for me where Hannah was already injured, but because of one that one more hit that just took it too far. It just everything kind of connected together. And that's what caused such a devastating end.
00:54:51
Speaker
I mean, like I can't think of any other way. I guess it's possible that she had other injuries and it just contributed. um And I think that Lindsay Like you said, she's a very tiny person and she's used to being powerless and kind of trodden over in situations. And I think that she snapped and she maybe compounded injuries, maybe maybe had Hannah had had other brain bleeds before. And this was just, she was even more vulnerable to something that's catastrophic happening. It's possible.
00:55:31
Speaker
I just think that with the timeline and the ultimate injury that it had to be Lindsay. Oh, ultimate the ultimate strike, I think it had to have been for sure. um But I have a theory on why she had so much anger towards Jason. Are you ready for my theory? Okay. so I'm ready. TJ, Timothy Smith, um who is Lindsay's long-term boyfriend for people who forgot who that was. He is a sex offender. And, oh, I, yeah I've missed that somehow. yes And during her time, he was charged for a second time with two counts of rape, four counts of gross sexual misconduct against a 10 year old little girl.
00:56:30
Speaker
And he is friends with Jason and he had had issues with little girls in the past. And I believe, this is my theory on why all of a sudden the rage came out is I bet Timothy, TJ, was involved with these things and Jason had some kind of contributing factor, either he knew and he was helping cover it up, either he was helping him with drugs, he was, whatever the case was, I think Jason knew about it. And I bet Lindsey found out and blamed, she's like, I can't go after Jason, but I can go after, that like, I'm gonna take my anger out on this little girl because I can't take my anger out on him.
00:57:28
Speaker
And this man is the father of my children and supporting us because she made, what, 15 grand a year. She needed his money. He needed to keep proof over that family's head. I think exactly Jason New helped TJ cover it up because he ended up, while she was in trial, also going to trial and being sentenced to prison and on the sex offender level three list now. I think yeah that was her her breaking moment. She found out about that. That's my theory.
00:58:01
Speaker
And just took it out on Hannah. Could be. Could be. I mean, I definitely don't think Hannah did anything that could have possibly ignored that kind of rage, but I think i could see her being like... Yeah, it kept getting worse, right? If she was like, I want daddy want my daddy, you know? Right? And her just getting mad about that. And her get learning more and more about her boyfriend's fascination with young girls and underage girls. He had already been charged with rape in the past back in 2008. Like, I bet she just every time Hannah brought something up, more and more information was coming out. And that's where her anger went. That's my theory.
00:58:50
Speaker
Yeah, I could see that.
00:58:54
Speaker
Not that that's an excuse. Do you have any final thoughts? I feel like that was a really good final thought. I think it's interesting. I basically feel like
00:59:10
Speaker
Lindsay was taking her anger out on all the wrong people and I feel really terrible for her daughters and for Hannah and For the other child that had been in her care. I feel like it I mean the other kids I've said that Lindsay didn't do anything to them But just to be in that kind of environment and have something so terrible happen It had to be very traumatic for everybody and obviously Lindsay's kids don't have their mother and their father o like just talk about being born into the worst circumstances again.
00:59:49
Speaker
Yeah, I think both families, both families have really devastating situations. And I hope that none of these, none of Lindsay's kids are being hurt either sexually or physically, mentally But you got to wonder if this is what's happening to someone in her care, what's happening in her own home. um And it's devastating that this little girl is never going to make it to anything other than the newsstands.
01:00:27
Speaker
oh Sad one for sure. I mean they're all they're all sad. and They're all very true. It's just like depressing to think of children being born into terrible circumstances and then things actually getting worse after that. um But that's the case for all the kids in this. Yep. Well, you had my last thought. Do you have any last thoughts as well?
01:00:53
Speaker
No, I don't think so. I just think that anger management would have been a lot better. And that would have been probably the way to be handling this. um And also if someone's overwhelmed, they should say that and not be a martyr and try to take everything on to seem like they have it all together. If that's not the case, I feel like there was a a level of wanting to keep up appearances and being like a perfect mom, perfect wife. And that's, that was obviously bullshit. It would have been better to just be honest.
01:01:27
Speaker
Yeah, I agree. Well, that's another sad one for the books. um And I think that's all we call the next mother. Till the next mother. I think so.