Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Episode 164: Curses, Hexes, & Cleanses
336 Plays17 hours ago
Welcome back, Witches! This week, we’re getting real about curses, hexes, and cleanses—what they are, what they aren’t, and some realities about them. 🕯️🧿 Whether you’re curse-curious or just trying to figure out if that weird vibe is something you picked up or something thrown your way, we’ve got you. We’re talking signs, superstitions, spiritual hygiene, and when it’s time to break out the salt. 🧂✨ So get in, Loser—grab your broom and some Florida Water, because we’re diving into the messy, magical world of energy work and protection. 🖤🌪️🌿
We would be forever thankful if you left our podcast a 5-Star review. If you really loved the show and want more Get in Loser content, check out our Supercast & Buy Me a Coffee links below. You can also find us on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram @GetinWitches, on TikTok @weredoingwitchcraft, or email us at weredoingwitchcraft@gmail.com. You can support our show through our links below.
Supercast: https://getinloserweredoingwitchcraft.supercast.com
Buy Me a Coffee: https://www.buymeacoffee.com/getinwitches
Music by Karl Casey @ White Bat Audio- The Witch
References:
Honestly… just a general google search for some very basic information… and then our very own brains!
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Witchcraft and the Occult
00:00:00
Speaker
Do you feel drawn to learn more about witchcraft and the occult but feel lost on where to start? Then welcome to Get In Loser, We're Doing Witchcraft, a podcast all about what it means to be a witch and where to get started on your journey.
00:00:11
Speaker
Join us as we navigate through various witchy topics and share what we've learned about
Curses and Cleansing Traditions
00:00:15
Speaker
the craft. So get in witches for a conversation all about curses, hexes, and the traditions used to remove them, like egg cleansings.
00:00:43
Speaker
Oh my gosh.
Emotional Impact of Movies
00:00:44
Speaker
So yesterday, my was like, oh the girls really want to go watch the Lilo and Stitch movie at the movie theater. And I already knew because I cannot – I don't even know what it is about the movie. I'm not even that big of a fan of Lilo and Stitch, okay? And I know that like for some of you listening, you're probably like, oh my God, don't like Lilo and Stitch. But I feel like it came out at a weird time when we were like either adults or almost adults already. So like I wasn't like – you know, that attached to it.
00:01:12
Speaker
You know what I mean? it Whereas if I had grown up with Lilo and Stitch, I would have loved it more. But every time I watch that fucking movie, even if it's animated, it makes me cry. you Tell me why. I was crying through this whole goddamn movie.
00:01:26
Speaker
and was so embarrassing. Even all that weren't even sad. It's not even a sad part. And I'm like, like, she's dancing for Stitch and like singing this hula song.
00:01:37
Speaker
And I just started sobbing. my God. That movie was sad. Really loved that movie when it came out, but we definitely were adults.
00:01:49
Speaker
like Yeah. We were like young adults when that one came out. home I didn't think it was going to affect me that much, but – But here you are sobbing in the movie theater. Yeah. It was so embarrassing. I'm just like, oh my God. This is awful. And Emily's like, you cried? And like, shut up.
00:02:10
Speaker
It was sad. Okay. Oh my God. She's like, how could you even like, even if you thought you were going to cry, like just looking at Stitch, like well how could you cry looking at that face? It's like fake, like, you know, cause it's like animated or whatever. And I'm like, but he was so cute.
00:02:27
Speaker
Yeah. its the sentiment i yeah That sad. It was worse than the fucking animated film because of how Like it was really good though. They did a really good job. And I am not a fan of any of the Disney live action remakes. I think they all kind of suck.
00:02:44
Speaker
But that one was actually pretty good one. Yeah. but I didn't even know that they were making it and we had like turned the TV on one day and there was like an ad for it on our – don't even know what we have right now. Is it a fire stick? Who fucking knows?
00:02:58
Speaker
Whatever's plugged into our TV for all of our shit. ah Because we live in Europe and we can't use the like smart TV functions. We have to have the fucking fire stick with a V in to be able to watch anything.
00:03:10
Speaker
But ah yeah, it was like an ad at the top. And i was like, they're doing a live action of that. And Anthony was like, that's a live action I would actually watch. Yeah, it was really good. as ah i thought I was just like um like, I went into it being like, I have a feeling this is going to make me sad and it's probably going be that good. So it's going a waste of time.
00:03:28
Speaker
left I'm going to cry for nothing. Yeah. Being like, that movie was so good. It was cute. It was really cute. And the actors did such a good job. Like every single one, even though like the little girl actress, like I don't know. Like she is just – she's tiny as hell and she did a really good job too. Aw.
00:03:47
Speaker
We'll definitely have to watch it home. Yeah. At home. At home. Can't be sobbing in movie theater. that when you do Yeah. No one sees it. It's really sad. But it's like that – you know that Hawaiian song where it's like – I don't even know words. I'm probably just going to make it up where it's like something about – it's like the song that they dance to when they're like doing – like sometimes they'll dance to when they're doing the hula whatever. But it's like Until We Meet Again or something like that is in the lyrics.
00:04:12
Speaker
I don't know why. Yeah. That makes me cry every time I hear it. It's awful. Mike's just like, are you about to start your period?
00:04:24
Speaker
so No. No. Mind your business. Mind your business. Oh my God. But then even like later on last night after my like second nap of the day, i woke up like three fourths of the way through. Avery was watching The Wild Robot. Have you heard of that movie? I've heard of it, not watched it.
00:04:45
Speaker
I hadn't read it or anything like that. I know Avery was reading it for class and they watched the movie at school, but I did not expect it to be fucking sad. And I woke up like three-fourths of the way through. I had no clue what movie was on.
00:04:59
Speaker
And literally, I'm crying. Like, what's happening? What's with all these emotional cartoons? you Right? Like, come on. Like...
00:05:11
Speaker
Why are we crying about this? This is too sad. And I'm just like, I was sitting there watching it thinking to myself, man, I wonder if Avery – I forgot to ask her this, but I wanted to ask her like, did she cry at school when she watched this? Because yeah as a teacher or a student, there wouldn't have been no dry eyeballs in my class because I would have been crying. I just know.
Books and Reading Habits
00:05:31
Speaker
so i read this book that I think you should read. Oh, say yes. I know it has a second book and I haven't started it yet because I just finished It's called The House of Bane and Blood.
00:05:47
Speaker
The House of – I've heard of that. Okay, hold on. Let me add it to – Probably telling you because I've been reading it for forever and I finally finished it because I just haven't had time to like sit and read and every time I try I fall asleep because it's like late at night and I'm tired and I've been doing all kinds of shit.
00:06:02
Speaker
But it is so fucking good. it's like It has like a Peaky Blinders vibe to it. Oh, I love that. There's like an heiress and she owns like the train, which is like like a big deal to like own this train because like everybody needs to use it to be able to like move their products and make money.
00:06:28
Speaker
And then there's like – An arranged marriage, enemies to lovers, like enemy families. It's perfect. Like perfect. And it's like a touch her and die kind of situation too.
00:06:40
Speaker
i absolutely love the love interest, Nikolai. Oh. Yeah. And there's like magic. There's like – what ah They call them bleeders. They're like a blend of vampire werewolf, like a hybrid.
00:07:00
Speaker
Yeah. ble like it's There's so many cool elements. And I feel like here lately, fantasy has been very like cut and paste.
00:07:10
Speaker
Like every story is the same, just different characters with one different element. And this was so different from anything I've been reading in fantasy right now that I just absolutely loved it.
00:07:21
Speaker
I cannot wait. I added it on Libby. I placed a hold on it. So hopefully I'll get it soon. There's two books, I think. I have the first two. If there's more, I don't have them. but And i don't know if it's like a duology or if it's a series.
00:07:38
Speaker
I have not looked that far, but 10 out of 10. Recommend. I will definitely be Reading that. yeah i This weekend, and i remember I remember years ago you told me you liked this book, The Bridge Kingdom. Bridge Kingdom. told you. then you remember that? I was still living in England when you said, oh, you should read this book. It's good. Okay.
00:08:02
Speaker
Let me look. Because it if it was me, I forgot it. That does not bode well. Well, I forget a lot of books, even ones that I love.
00:08:14
Speaker
I don't think this was me. I haven't read it. Well, somebody told me it was really good. I saw somebody selling, I guess it's a trilogy or at least it's a trilogy as of now. I think there's might be more books or whatever, but somebody was selling that series and I was like, i'm going to go ahead and I'm going to buy that.
00:08:32
Speaker
It has a really pretty me cover. It does have a pretty color – not color, cover. It does have a pretty cover. I mean, it's got pretty colors on the cover too. Yeah, it has pretty colors on the cover. Yeah. Huh.
00:08:43
Speaker
Yeah, I'll have to back because I thought it was you. But yeah, so I have that. I haven't obviously read at all because um i have been –
00:08:57
Speaker
1,000% like 10 toes deep in the book that we're reading Book Club. Did you see what I – like I sent you a thing.
00:09:08
Speaker
Yes, but you're like – I told you not to read because it's like a snippet from the next book. Yeah. And she decided to make it a trilogy. So it's going to end after the next book, which makes me really sad.
00:09:22
Speaker
– i'm Equal part sad, but then also happy too, because I don't know if my heart can handle 10 fucking books of this. I mean- She's like seven or eight originally. yeah So my heart's a little sad because I love this world.
00:09:39
Speaker
Right. However, will say, I will say, need a happy ending for our girl Alex needs a fucking break. And we need to see what that D does.
00:09:53
Speaker
need to see. yeah That erect penis. That's there all the time. but okay Have you read any of her other books?
00:10:07
Speaker
Outside of the familiar? No, but
Understanding Curses, Hexes, and Jinxes
00:10:12
Speaker
ah she has a new book that's coming out this summer, right? June 10th, I think is when it's supposed to release.
00:10:19
Speaker
I can't remember. i know V.E. Schwab does. so maybe it's V.E. Schwab. I get them confused, honestly. I don't know. It might be V.E. Schwab.
00:10:31
Speaker
But there's a book coming out this summer on June 10th, and the cover looks amazing, and it sounds amazing, and I want to read it. um So I'm waiting to buy that book.
00:10:42
Speaker
It might maybe be V.E. Schwab because she has the one coming out, Barry Arbons in the Midnight in the Midnight Soil. That's her. so it's like a sapphic vampire. i cannot wait for that book. I know.
00:10:56
Speaker
i preordered that immediately when she announced it, and now i'm just like slowly waiting. I refuse to pre-order anything ever again because of how long it takes to get here. What the last one that out from Rebecca Yaros?
00:11:10
Speaker
Was it Storm? Yeah. Yeah. though um what was the last one that came out from rebecca yaros was a onix storm yeah With that one, it said that it shipped even before yours had shipped and I still got mine way after yours. Like to the point where i ended up buying it off of somebody who bought it from the States and already read it.
00:11:33
Speaker
Yeah. Like that's how long it took to get here. So now I have two copies of Onyx Storm if anybody would like a copy because what am going to do with the second one? I have two copies of both of the first two because I have the special editions that I like pre-ordered and then I have um ah what Acrylopress editions with painted edges and like overlays and stuff.
00:11:59
Speaker
And I'm like, well, they're different. I need both of them. Right. um Mine are – pick one over the other. my two Onyx Storms are exactly the same. Like it's the same edges and everything.
00:12:11
Speaker
Oh, man. I'm just like, okay, well, you know. But I'm hoping like so if I am in not Japan whenever that book is released, hopefully I can buy in a bookstore.
00:12:23
Speaker
Yeah. I will say i'm real that um for Supercast people that follow along with Book Club, you know, we're reading Hellbent, which is the second book by Leigh Bardugo.
00:12:37
Speaker
The third book is not going to be out until next year. So we're going to have a long break. From Alex Stern. and And Arlington Darlington. And Arlington Darlington.
00:12:52
Speaker
nothing
00:12:56
Speaker
So. I don't want to end. I know. I'm really sad that it's just going to be a trilogy because she really built up being like, I think I want to make this a longer series at the talk that I went to with her. And i was like super excited because I loved that first book.
00:13:15
Speaker
And now like now I know that we're getting a book next year and it's like closing the chapter on this like wonderful world that you don't see a lot. like We're seeing it more now.
00:13:29
Speaker
This is more like a gothic kind of dark academia and that's becoming popular again. So we're getting that more now. But when the first book came out, it wasn't really that popular.
00:13:42
Speaker
and I just absolutely love anything that's like dark academia or like the gothic horror stuff like that is top tier in my book.
00:13:54
Speaker
And now we're getting more, but like, I don't know. More poorly written. Yeah. hate to say that, but you know, it's just some people shouldn't probably shouldn't be authors. I don't know how to say it.
00:14:05
Speaker
Yeah. When it's so easy, like And not shitting on anyone that does this, like self-publishing is so easy now. So it's like everyone's an author. And then like with AI, like ChatGPT, everyone's like, oh, let me just write something shitty, have ChatGPT fix it, and then publish it for people to buy. Yeah.
00:14:27
Speaker
It's really sad. Sad times. But, you know, we'll get through it. Yeah, we'll get there. Yeah. But this isn't a book podcast, even though we have had a request for a book episodes, which might come in the future. yes Drumming fingertips together.
00:14:49
Speaker
and We could talk for hours about this topic. Yes. We did get an email with a request to talk about mundane books and to explain who um Daddy Reese is. Yeah.
00:15:03
Speaker
Yeah. We can do that. you can absolutely do that. We can definitely do that. It could be like a bonus episode or something. Yeah. But we're not doing that today. no, no, no. no What are we talking about today?
00:15:16
Speaker
What are we talking about today? We we are talking about – Jesus, I still don't know. I scrolled up to see because I've already forgotten. I still can't tell.
00:15:27
Speaker
Oh, we are – how could I forget? Like, it's not like we didn't just talk about this or research it or, you know, whatever. I don't know, but I am cracking up. yeah I have no idea. I'm just here.
00:15:39
Speaker
I'm just here. We're talking about curses, hexes, and some things that remove them like egg cleanses and other methods, some of our favorite methods to kind of protect our spaces. So this is this is a little bit different from some of the other episodes that we have done. We've had a few conversational episodes um and this is going to be one of them. So if it sounds a little bit different, it's because we did not – write up our notes as a script as we usually do and some of these episodes.
00:16:15
Speaker
No. just kind of to start us off, in today's episode, we're exploring practices and beliefs around curses, hexes, and cleanses, and we're not encouraging or dismissing any one path.
00:16:29
Speaker
Before we dive in, we want to acknowledge that many of the practices that we are going to discuss, like egg cleanses, curses, and hexes do have deep roots in specific cultural and spiritual traditions.
00:16:42
Speaker
And our goal in this episode isn't to like mock or discredit or appropriate these practices, but to have a respectful and curious conversation about their meaning, um about their use, their perceived validity.
00:16:57
Speaker
We're speaking from our own perspectives. And as always, we encourage listeners to do their own research and to approach these topics with cultural sensitivity and an open mind. So just a you know, really kick it off.
00:17:11
Speaker
We're going a little heavy. maybe Yeah, maybe. Maybe. Yeah. Maybe. It's – feel like it's just in general a heavy topic, right? Yeah.
00:17:24
Speaker
And you know we'll talk about it a bit more. I saw we both kind of approached it this way when coming up with um a list of things that we wanted to talk about where – like talking about like some of the implications that um our culture has and are like even just being active on social media, how that kind of ties into some of these topics.
00:17:46
Speaker
So when I feel like it's also this topic in particular has probably been debated for as long as it's been practiced, like what are the ethical um things surrounding it?
00:18:02
Speaker
ah So i I don't know. I feel like I was telling Sam before this, I kind of did very minor research because this isn't something that I practice. So I wanted to kind of have like my footing when we came in and talked about this.
00:18:18
Speaker
So i don't know. Like, I feel like there's so many, like, you see people that are like, who gives a fuck? Like, If someone wronged you, wrong them back. And then you see people that are like, um that is absolutely horrible and you should never do that.
00:18:33
Speaker
And so I'm trying to come in like, I don't practice this. i I don't shit on people that do either. And then like people that don't, it doesn't make you better for like not practicing it. Like everybody's practice is very personal and very different.
00:18:52
Speaker
And – went in and kind of looked up like different cultural practices because some cultures do practice this and it's like ingrained in their practice. And that's not for us to like go in and say, um you shouldn't do that.
00:19:06
Speaker
Like, so that's kind of how I was approaching this episode. Yeah. But to get us – oh, sorry. Oh, no, no. Go ahead. Go ahead. I was just going to be like here, here. I agree with you.
00:19:20
Speaker
So to get us started, what I wanted to do is kind of give like a little definition to some of these ah like words that we're going to be using today. So a curse is a verbal, written, or magical intention meant to bring misfortune or harm, and it's often meant to be long-term.
00:19:37
Speaker
Yeah, they often tend to be like deeply rooted and generational or systemic. So taking place over you know over time and affecting many different systems in your life.
00:19:53
Speaker
And then hex typically refers to a spell cast to cause harm or misfortune, often tied to folk magic. So the term hex originates from the Pennsylvania Dutch word.
00:20:05
Speaker
I don't know if it's just hex or hexi, but it's hex with an E at the end. um And I like trying to look that up. It was said both ways. So it could be hex. It could be hexi. Not really sure.
00:20:18
Speaker
um And that word just means to practice witchcraft. And the way I like differentiate between the two is that hexes are usually more targeted or short term. So like magically giving someone bad luck after they've wronged you. So like oftentimes if whatever you see is kind of going a little bit down the rabbit hole already, but whenever you kind of see those TikTok posts of like how to tell if you've been cursed, it's probably not they're probably not talking about the right thing.
00:20:49
Speaker
thing in Yeah. that post anyway they're probably talking about a hex as opposed to a curse but who knows a lot of times what i've seen especially because of pop culture which again this is something that we have like noted to maybe talk about later Things are used interchangeably when they're not an interchangeable word. They have different meanings.
00:21:12
Speaker
And that's why i was like, I want to kind of like set the definition for these at the beginning. Like this is where we need to start. This is what they are. and then the last one that I have is a jinx.
00:21:24
Speaker
So these are typically more casual or like it's more of a superstitious term. It's often used to describe bad luck believed to result from a spoken word or a small act.
00:21:37
Speaker
Like you jinxed it. Yeah. um I also put in there too, like as far as like what I think of when I think of the word jinx is like more minor and spontaneous.
00:21:48
Speaker
And like the example of like you jinxed it, like it' speaking like ill about something or speaking negative about something, it's like you jinxed your chance for whatever because you spoke negatively about it out loud. Yeah. It's the example that I usually go to for that one.
00:22:04
Speaker
let me move my chair because it's going to loud up there. was like really close. was like – Just sitting on the computer basically. Yeah. I was like – But I didn't want to move my chair like because it's like – with that in mind – so that in mind We're going to talk about some practices, but I kind of – I put this one first because i feel like this one we see a lot today because of social media. We see it on TikTok. We see it on Instagram.
00:22:34
Speaker
But egg cleanses, which are also known as limpias, – um So this is a spiritual cleansing practice using a raw egg to like, quote unquote, absorb negative energy or spiritual residue.
00:22:48
Speaker
It's often rolled over the body and then they crack it open into water for divination or for analysis. Limpia is Spanish for cleanse, and it's practiced in many Latin American cultures, particularly within Mexican and Central American folk healing traditions, often by curanderas, which are folk healers.
00:23:10
Speaker
It's used for spiritual cleansing, removing the evil eye, or lifting heavy energy. Yeah, I've seen egg cleanses be talked about as like a form of – well, it's like an energetic sponge and so like a form of spiritual diagnosis, diagnosing and cleansing to kind of soak up what ah energetically negative energy could be attached to you.
00:23:34
Speaker
And so there's many different ways to interpret them. I've never done an egg cleanse before just because it's outside of my culture. And I see things like online where it's like, this isn't a closed practice. You should totally you like can totally do this and other things where it's like, actually it's not. And honestly, for me, i either way, like – I would just rather eat and an egg as opposed to like wasting it in a glass. I'm not saying that people who do egg cleanses are – you're being wasteful. I'm not saying that. i'm just saying for personally, i would rather use the egg in a different method and maybe do different method for cleansing.
00:24:09
Speaker
But they say that like there can be different signs like bubbles, meaning something specific, blood spikes, Which hopefully you're not getting blood spikes in your egg. um Kind of gross.
00:24:21
Speaker
Yeah. But I know what happens sometimes. Yeah. With eggs. And then – or even having like cloudy yolks can each mean like different types of spiritual interference. But I mean, just in regards to cleansing in general, it's often more so about realignment than actually removing external harm. And we're going to get into that in a little bit when we talk a little bit more about some things. But like at the end of the day, I feel like too, when it comes to just cleansing in general, it doesn't matter.
00:24:50
Speaker
i feel like the practice that you do as long as the intention is there. So going through some of the practices across different cultures, just because I found this interesting, I did a very, very brief just what ah what types of practices do they do.
00:25:07
Speaker
And I've kind of broke it down by region. So we're just going to kind of go back and forth through these. So starting in Africa and and African traditions, I'm In West African traditions like Yoruba or Ifa, there's the Ahe, which is a spiritual power, and this can be used for good or ill.
00:25:27
Speaker
Harmful workings often involve invoking orishas or spirits for justice or revenge, and concepts like crossed conditions or being jinxed may involve curses or spiritual interferences sent through objects or offerings.
00:25:43
Speaker
As for Haitian voodoo, this is often misrepresented in pop culture, and I'm sure we can all think of different movies and whatnot that have misrepresented Haitian voodoo a lot.
00:25:54
Speaker
But curses do exist in this and this belief system, and they're more often associated with the puen, which are magical points or objects charged with intention.
00:26:07
Speaker
and And Haitian voodoo, practitioners may use wanga. Mm-hmm. May use wanga or packets Congo, um which are spiritual bundles for baneful or protective magic.
00:26:21
Speaker
In hoodoo or conjure, which is an African-American folk magic, cursing might involve things like laying tricks. So this was called – or this was considered like placing items like goofer dust, coffin nails, or powders where a person would walk.
00:26:39
Speaker
um And then it's very justice-based cursing. It's often rooted in survival and empowerment, especially when like there's conditions of oppression. Ooh, that's – so historically tied to. like And you can see the need for it based on historically colonialism worked.
00:27:01
Speaker
Yep. So that's incredibly interesting. Yeah. In Latin America, the practice of curanderismo, which is usually found in Mexico and Central America – uses egg cleanses like Tiffany ah mentioned earlier, limpias.
Cultural Perspectives on Curses
00:27:17
Speaker
And they may be used to remove mal de ojo, which is the evil eye or curses. And brujeria or witchcraft may involve baneful workings, especially in love or jealousy conflicts.
00:27:31
Speaker
um And then there's also santeria or lukumi. Though primarily a spiritual and religious practice, witchcraft-like acts can be performed outside the sanctioned rituals.
00:27:45
Speaker
Ebo offerings or sacrifices may be made to remove or send spiritual force, sometimes for defense or justice. And looking at Mediterranean and Middle Eastern traditions and Greek and Italian folk magic, the evil eye, which is mati in Greek or malachio in Italian, is a common belief.
00:28:06
Speaker
And a glare of envy can cause misfortune, sickness, or bad luck. And they use protective charms like the blue evil eyes, red ribbons, or cornicello, and unbinding rituals are often used to break these curses.
00:28:21
Speaker
Also, when I put Cornicello, all I could think of was – what is it called? The book series. I know exactly what you're talking about. Kingdom of the Wicked. Kingdom of the Wicked. Because she he has a Cornicello and that's all I could think of when I was writing that. I was like, aww.
00:28:38
Speaker
Yeah. So sweet. We love her. um In Middle Eastern traditions, like Arabic cultures, they have hasad, which is envy, and ayin, which is the evil eye.
00:28:51
Speaker
And they're considered spiritually and socially dangerous. In Quranic verses or talismans may be used for protection. Objects like mirrors, amulets, or irons can also deflect harm.
00:29:04
Speaker
In South Asia and specifically in India, Drishti or the evil eye can be cast accidentally or intentionally often on babies, which is so sad. i know.
00:29:17
Speaker
Brides or successful people. Like I could understand if like, okay, you are really jealous of somebody who is marrying this guy that you love or like somebody stole – I mean, not I'm not them. I'm saying you should do it.
00:29:30
Speaker
you know what I mean? Or like somebody is like super successful and you have nothing or somebody wronged you and they become super successful. But babies, what did the fucking babies do? So a lot of like, again, i did very, very brief, but like what I was reading was that it was like, if you saw the baby and the baby was just like so beautiful and it was just like you – it's unintentional. You were just like, oh my god, like that baby is so beautiful. You could accidentally like curse it.
00:30:04
Speaker
Oh my gosh. That's terrible. That is terrible. I know. I was like, wow. I don't like that. um So cleansing rituals involve burning red chilies, limes, or mustard seeds and circling them around the affected person.
00:30:21
Speaker
And also tantric practices in certain lineages may include cursing or baneful rites, but they're complex, often requiring deep spiritual commitment. And then moving to Southeast Asia and specifically to the Philippines here, and um they have folculars.
00:30:40
Speaker
This one I could not find a um pronunciation for, so I'm probably going to Butcher it. Abularios. So there's the Usag, which are disturbances caused by strangers, and these can cause discomfort or illness in children.
00:30:58
Speaker
um Curses or hexes might be placed using Coulomb, which is sorcery, and it's often via dolls, written words, or manipulated objects.
00:31:10
Speaker
And countermagic includes talas, which was diagnostic divination, and cleansing with herbs, eggs, or smoke. That is so interesting to hear. um And especially just because because of colonialization, there is obviously in influx of Catholicism and like, you know, how they always say like Filipinos, they do things like 120%. And so even like their like Catholic, like Easter celebrations and stuff, like people literally will be crucified.
00:31:45
Speaker
But to know that like some of these folk magic traditions still live on that is so interesting. Like I really want to research a bit more about that. and Yeah. Yeah.
00:31:59
Speaker
And in Eastern European or Slavic traditions, so this would include Russia, Poland, and Ukraine, there's a belief in the Yurok, which is the evil eye and it's widespread.
00:32:12
Speaker
Curses can be cast through looks, speech, or magical workings. And protection involves red threads, prayers, or salt. The babki, which are also folk healers,
00:32:22
Speaker
might use spit, herbs, or incantations to remove a curse. Just imagine like – you know like when you're a kid and like your grandparents like lick their thumb and like wipe stuff off your face? That's what I was imagining like when I read that.
00:32:36
Speaker
That reminded me too of – I know this is like a bit different, but like in that scene in My Big Fat Greek Wedding where like everybody was like spitting on them. Yeah. But like it's a sign of like good fortune or good luck or something to that effect. Like that kind of reminds me of that.
00:32:50
Speaker
Yeah. And then the last one we're going to talk about here is Japan. So with Onmyodo and folk beliefs, there's the Tatari, which is a divine or spiritual retribution that can be brought on by offending spirits, ancestors, or kami.
00:33:08
Speaker
Ushi no Koku Mari, which is a cursing ritual done at the hour of the ox, involves nailing a straw effigy to a tree at a shrine.
00:33:19
Speaker
And they they use protective talismans like theofua the the Omomori, and these are widely used to ward off bad energy or spirits.
00:33:31
Speaker
And so with all of these... There's obviously some commonalities. You probably picked up on that as we were going through all of them. Many of these practices involve intentional energy direction, whether it's via object, words, or actions.
00:33:47
Speaker
um They have a spiritual cause for misfortune. and there's protective countermeasures like charms, prayers, cleansings, talismans. And while the terms differ, curse, hex, evil eye, jinx, they often describe the same fear that unseen forces can harm us.
The Power of Belief and Suggestion
00:34:07
Speaker
So outside of looking at some of these like historical and like cultural practices, I think that it's important to also look at the elephant in the room here of like the power of belief and suggestion.
00:34:22
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. so like with the power of belief and suggestion, there's like the self-fulfilling prophecy. There's the nocebo effect, which is so funny to me.
00:34:36
Speaker
And I love that you ended up looking this up because I looked it up because I was like, am I dumb? Because my brain was like, is this supposed to be placebo? No, it's not. Yeah. yeah But it's very similar. alert It's the first time I heard that word and and I was just like, okay, what is this? so It's so similar and I loved it. And if you can hear the bells, there is a funeral happening at the cemetery across the street right now.
00:34:59
Speaker
Yeah. So the bells are ringing. Rest in peace. Specifically, whenever we were discussing the cultural stuff related to in India and how like even just you can unintentionally cause – a curse or a hex to be placed on a baby or a bride or somebody that is in a more powerful position than you because of this belief, which can cause harm, which is essentially what nocebo is, right?
00:35:28
Speaker
And whenever I was looking up, because I was like okay, well, just exactly what is this and how can we describe it as far as, you know, outside of just that example, I found an example of something called bone pointing, which I'd never heard of before. Have you ever heard of this?
00:35:45
Speaker
I have not. I thought it was a great example of how belief can manifest real physical results. And so – Bone pointing is a ritual curse used in some Aboriginal Australian cultures. And so a shaman or an elder would point a bone at someone as a death curse.
00:36:03
Speaker
The victim, yeah, which is just like came straight to death. Maybe did maybe we we have steps before death. but Yeah. Escalated really quickly here and I need to understand why. Yeah.
00:36:17
Speaker
But the victim, because they had this strong belief and the power of the curse, they would become so psychologically distressed that they would fall ill or even die regardless of any proof of physical harm.
00:36:31
Speaker
They like stress themselves to death literally. Yeah. And i that's a perfect example of the nocebo and how a belief can cause harm.
00:36:43
Speaker
Because that is a huge, huge thing. like in yeah We see this all the time and this is something that we talk about before and we've said this before on the podcast. And you see this if you're if you're wanting to even just change your reality in just day-to-day of like you know the whole lucky girl syndrome or whatever that is that you see online, self-cursing and negative self-talk.
00:37:06
Speaker
can create these energy loops where you are just stuck in this cycle of like you you think that nothing ever good happens for you or like you never are lucky or whatever.
00:37:17
Speaker
You keep saying that, you'll start seeing all of that and it will keep happening as a cycle. Yeah. I mean, that's – we talk about the power of like spoken word so much on the podcast, like how, you know, when you're setting intentions and things, like how saying it out loud can give it so much more weight.
00:37:36
Speaker
And so like I feel like this kind of falls into that same line. If you're like, okay, I have this curse and like it's – it's actually going to happen. Like I believe that I am cursed. I believe that I'm going to die or I'm going to lose things or I'm going to – whatever the you know belief is, like you're putting that out.
00:37:57
Speaker
And so like that's what you're getting back. Yeah. Like that's kind of how I was like – when I started looking into this, I was like – I mean it makes so much sense, like the power of belief and the power of suggestion.
00:38:09
Speaker
If that's like your mindset – that's what's going to happen because you're going to be stuck in this loop of like, well, I'm cursed. So nothing good is going to happen or I'm going to die. And you're going to just keep like stressing and stressing and stressing until like eventually it does happen. And I think the reality that we have to kind of look at there is like, we all die eventually. Right.
00:38:31
Speaker
And just because like somebody says like, I curse you and you're going to die. If you have a heart attack tomorrow, they could have never said that. And you were going to have a heart attack tomorrow anyway. So like, I don't know.
00:38:42
Speaker
i It's so interesting, like this thought process on things. he Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Yeah. It's definitely ah our minds and our beliefs do have power and weight to them.
00:38:57
Speaker
But also at the same time, like – And we'll get into this a little bit later when we start talking about the effects of like how social media and like how curses and hexes have been monetized now in this digital age.
00:39:12
Speaker
it It goes back to this sense of, is this an external trauma that you are that is happening to you? Or is this something internal that you are projecting and trying to find cause where there's not cause on the outside?
00:39:29
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. It's like, it's one of those things. I feel like. There's no black and white in this. And that's why I wanted to start the episode off the way I did where I was like, hey, whatever you practice is what you practice. Like there's a lot of gray area when it comes to witchcraft and magic and especially in topics like this.
00:39:47
Speaker
So like i don't – there was not a way – this had to be a conversational episode because there wasn't a way to research it in the way that we wanted to talk about it. The next point I have that i thought would be important to cover would be like – the psychological and emotional catharsis through ritual.
00:40:05
Speaker
And I feel like this could be tied a lot to the practices like the egg cleansings, whether it's a mental or whether it's actually working, like either way it's working, right? So like there's something to that, like going through the the ritual of a cleansing like that, that Whether, you know, like you just feel relieved or you actually feel like whatever it was that was like weighing you down is like God now.
00:40:33
Speaker
There's something to that. Yeah, I agree. And I think – As somebody who has done – I've never like hexed somebody or cursed anybody, but I have done like workings to get somebody to like leave me alone. The ritual itself is energy, right? So you are putting your energy and your belief and whatever into this particular ritual.
00:40:57
Speaker
And then additionally, it helps you to reclaim your power back. And so even if you're just – you know Doing all this work and it literally at the end of the day does nothing, even if none of this is real.
00:41:11
Speaker
The fact that you believe it is and the fact that you have this sense of power come back to you, i think is just as important as if um it's real or not, however you look at it.
00:41:24
Speaker
Yeah. And just like expanding on that, like the placebo versus the spiritual experience. So does it matter if it like quote unquote works, if it is helping? And again, just going back to egg cleanses, because that's kind of the one that we initially were like, oh, we'll include this. And like, if you could see our little topics list, like it literally was like curses, hexes, and egg cleanses with a question mark. So yeah. Yeah.
00:41:51
Speaker
With the egg cleanses, for example, they may offer genuine psychological relief and energetic reset, but that doesn't like prove that there was a curse that existed. it just proves that ritual does have impact.
00:42:04
Speaker
And again, not like shitting people that do curses. Like i don't do them. Like I don't know like the steps that to do that or like the energies that go into that are probably pretty fucking heavy.
00:42:19
Speaker
So I'm not going to say like, oh, curses don't exist. But i there is a huge like placebo and psychological effect to a lot of these that I feel like is important to also talk about. Yeah. And I think also additionally, if you are practicing and you believe in – you have – there's a place in your practice for curses and hexes, I should say. Yeah. Yeah.
00:42:44
Speaker
The amount of, I think, emotion that also has to go in that sort of a ritual or that sort of a working, I think, can be incredibly therapeutic. Regardless of how you look at it or regardless of if you think it is ethical to practice in that specific way, it can be, as you were saying, like incredibly cathartic to have that release of like you're taking all of this these emotions that are – whether that be anger, sadness, resentment, whatever, and putting it into something and releasing it.
00:43:14
Speaker
yeah That in and of itself, even whenever you come to like trauma working and therapy is an important step in healing. Yeah.
00:43:27
Speaker
when I was putting these topics down, my brain was like, so can someone like quote unquote curse you Like if you don't believe in cursing or like if you don't believe that, that it does anything.
00:43:42
Speaker
Yeah. I, um, I definitely remember like as a child, so growing up in, um, Growing up in a household where i was raised pagan, my stepmom practice a lot of very – I wouldn't even necessarily call them unsavory things because it just depends on how you believe in what your culture is. But she dabbled in a lot of things that I don't think culturally she should have been dabbling in because of the culture she was from and some of the things that she was –
00:44:17
Speaker
some of the workings that she did, i do not think that she should have been engaging with because they were closed practices. And I've seen how – because and in the way that she was working them as well, it's it was a situation of it was only used for her own gain and her own good and what she wanted.
00:44:38
Speaker
and I see where she's at now. And it's just – it's kind of sad if you think about it. but Yeah. Yeah. Also, it's kind of like you had a brain. You were an adult. You should have done your research.
00:44:49
Speaker
And it's something that we talk to everybody about all the time. Yes. But one of the things that I remember specifically when I read that bullet point, I was just like, oh, my God, this brings me back to childhood because I found workings in – um her drawer and they were like voodoo dolls of me and my other siblings, her children. and Which is wild. Which is wild.
00:45:17
Speaker
And she was just like, well, if you don't believe in it, it doesn't work. like And so it makes me wonder like how much of – because if you think about it, like and if you think about it like energetic wise, like if I don't believe in this sort of stuff, does that mean that it's not true?
00:45:37
Speaker
Right. And I don't think that's necessarily correct. But also, I guess if you don't, if you look at it as in like a, if you never would have ever believed magic ever existed, you never even would have thought that anybody would be a practitioner. So therefore, you would never even think that anyone could ever curse you.
00:46:01
Speaker
Yeah. If something – if you had a bad string of luck, you never would assume that it was a curse. Yeah. what would you do instead? My thought on it was more along the like – like that power of belief, right? So if I don't believe in it, then does it work?
00:46:19
Speaker
Yeah. Like whether you believe in it and it might be working like to try, but if I'm like I don't believe in it and like I'm not putting it out there, I'm not putting it in my mind – And so is it that like nocebo effect? Is it like not, you know, i don't, I don't know.
00:46:38
Speaker
Yeah, that is an interesting take on it too because I feel like as well, say ah if kind of going back to the whole TikTok stuff that we're going to – I keep saying we're going to get to, we're going to get to. We will get there.
00:46:51
Speaker
But like say if you're going through a string of bad luck or string of whatever and you can't figure out what's going on with you and then you see a TikTok that is just like, oh, well, maybe you've been cursed, but you've never believed in that before. Yeah. And you never like believed that this could – ever be a thing.
00:47:06
Speaker
Yeah. And then you do a working, but you're only – like your heart is halfway in it because you don't really believe that it's real. I don't think it would work. Yeah. Because I feel like your intention has to be there. You have to fully believe in the working that you're doing for it to work. Like I don't think that anything – like whenever we talk about – and we've said this – like we've talked about this before on the podcast where we talked about how in – when Depending on where you're getting your research from, you will see practitioners talk about how like – It's like – I don't even know. it's It kind of reminds me of going back to that fire and brimstone with Christianity where it's just like you have to be so careful because if you're if you don't do this the proper way with the proper reverence, then you are going to bring more harm than good into your life.
00:47:56
Speaker
Well, but is that is that true or is that just trying is that just patriarchy coming into play to try and reinforce the situation? Because I don't believe that. I think if your heart's not in it, it's just not going to work.
00:48:09
Speaker
But you're not going like rain down hellfire onto your house or something. No. And it's like, like we say all the time, like everybody's practice is different. And like the way I practice is going to feel, you know, wrong to some people.
00:48:23
Speaker
The way Sam practice might not work for me. Like everybody has a different way of doing things. And A different you know mindset, different intentions. And so it's very individualistic. So your practice is your practice. And if you're not following something step by step by step by step, doesn't mean that you're going to like – in the world.
00:48:47
Speaker
Yeah. it's not It's not the end of the world to do something wrong or to make a misstep or to change something to fit your practice better. if Sam wrote a spell and said, here, here's a spell that I do for this thing and I'm like trying it and it's not like really meshing with me, it's the intentions and like the vibe, the energies are not going to fit for me And it's not going to be like productive.
00:49:16
Speaker
Yeah. So I don't know. Again, it's one of those like this is such a gray area topic that there – I don't feel like there's like right or wrongs. So I – feel like there's a lot of a lot of ways these could be answered. Yeah, I think so too. And like you said, I think it would it would change practitioner to practitioner. You might have some practitioners who firmly believe that like regardless of your belief in your spell, it's still going to work.
00:49:47
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Because it's a curse and there's just so much power tied to a curse. And you're going to find practitioners who don't agree with that. And at the same token, when you're talking about like, can you be the victim of a curse if you've not opened the door for them energetically?
00:50:03
Speaker
There's going to be some practitioners who think, yeah, because if i'm though if I believe in this working and I'm the one who cursed you, regardless of if you energetically open the door for me or not.
00:50:14
Speaker
it's still going to work because it's my curse. Whereas if I just have never heard of witchcraft or magic outside of on the TV and I don't believe that any of this stuff is real, can I be cursed if I don't believe in magic?
00:50:29
Speaker
Like yeah who know who knows? Who knows? Who knows? yeah These are the ah like them the make you think topics. Yeah. So I think this kind of brings us to a point like is protection or cleansing more about shielding your own energy?
Energy Maintenance and Cleansing Rituals
00:50:44
Speaker
in magical traditions, intent and energy are everything. So even if someone doesn't believe, energy can still be projected. But there is this belief that without personal belief or susceptibility, most like quote unquote curses don't stick because they rely on fear, reaction, and openness to suggestion. in him Yeah, I agree. Yeah.
00:51:08
Speaker
And I think As well, there needs to be a conversation had about energy hygiene versus superstition. So how do we tell the difference between being cautious and being obsessive and paranoid? Because it's two very, very different ends of the same spectrum where like if you – believe constantly that you're being cursed, what are you doing, first all, with your life? I mean, is you going to handle it?
00:51:42
Speaker
Yeah. And then like looking at energetic hygiene, even if curses aren't like say quote unquote real, um bad vibes can affect our mental and emotional state. And I think that's why this is so important to talk about because like, again, if you're constantly like,
00:51:59
Speaker
hyper-focused on this thing, this bad negative thing, you're bringing that bad negative energy to you. And you're like, essentially, you could be like manifesting it yourself.
00:52:11
Speaker
Yeah. You could be cursing yourself. Literally, yeah. Just based on your anxieties that you're pushing out into the universe. And not saying that When I say anxiety is pushing out to the universe, feelings of anxieties, I'm not saying yeah if you've been diagnosed with anxiety and you're working with a therapist to heal that.
00:52:32
Speaker
I'm not saying that. I'm saying like these negative self-talk, these negative beliefs, these worst case scenarios that you're constantly thinking about. By projecting those out in the universe constantly without being like, wait a second, let me take a step back.
00:52:45
Speaker
Is this a rational thought? You're going to draw more negative things to you. It's just a fact of life. And everybody, I feel like, knows that. But i feel like sometimes it's hard to really, when it's happening to us, step outside of that and think what is real, what's not. Yeah. Yeah.
00:53:06
Speaker
Because I think with a lot of us who are going through difficult times in our life, we don't always realize that you know there's a different perspective and a different way that we can look at the situation. And so I think also it kind of goes back to this question of at the end of the day, are you cursed or are you projecting your own anxieties into a situation?
00:53:32
Speaker
And it could be that. It could be that. And then at the same time, it's like, how do you know when you need to cleanse because someone is cursing you or hexing you or actively trying to make your day worse versus just having a bad day?
00:53:51
Speaker
Yeah. Like that synchronicity versus the causation. like just because bad things are happening, like regardless of how often or how many bad things, like after a curse, that doesn't mean that one caused the other They can be completely unrelated. But again, like how do you know? Yeah.
00:54:13
Speaker
And – This kind of – I love how we can tie so much stuff back into like mental health and science and stuff because it reminds me as well of like something that we learn in like master resiliency training when it comes to the ATC model.
00:54:32
Speaker
And so like there's an action that drives a thought that then in turn – um we have a consequence because of it, regardless of whether the consequence be good or bad. And so like the action could be somebody cutting you off in traffic.
00:54:47
Speaker
and then you get to – you stop at a red light because of that. And then like you um go and you buy a coffee and then the coffee spills on you. And then so you get to work late and then you're having this terrible day. Does that mean you've been cursed or does that mean that like the person who cut you off in traffic was having – like just got a really bad phone call or they're having the worst day of their life and they didn't realize they were cutting you off? And then – you just happen to you know miss the stoplight because you left five minutes later than you usually leave. And then, you know what I mean? like So it's just like taking those thoughts and deciding whether, okay, is this just the human experience of I'm having a couple of things happen to me that through this specific lens, I'm viewing them as
00:55:35
Speaker
this is terrible. This is the worst I've ever had. This is a case of the Mondays. Or is it just, you know what? I had a couple of things happen to me this morning that weren't ideal, but like does that ruin my entire day?
00:55:48
Speaker
i think that for me, especially like when things like that start happening, and again, it goes back to like that mindset, right? So like- someone cuts me off or there's traffic or i hit every red light on the way there, instead of being like, oh my God, like this is the worst day on the planet. Like somebody's got something out for me or whatever. My brain goes immediately into the universe is trying to prevent me from being somewhere at a specific time, whether it's an accident, ah you know, like, so I'm always like, that's my mindset when those things happen.
00:56:22
Speaker
And again, that goes just back to like that, Is it like what you're believing, your power of belief or your mindset, your thought process on it? that Because like if say those things happen and I'm like, man, the universe really wants to slow me down today, i look at it as a positive and then I don't have a – like I don't go on to have a bad day. Whereas like if your mindset is – This guy cut me off.
00:56:47
Speaker
I hit every red light. spilled my coffee on me. This is the worst day ever. And then your day continues to be bad. Like, are you creating that bad day? I think so. And then what happens if you open up your phone and the first video you see is, have you been cursed? Here the signs. Yeah.
00:57:04
Speaker
Yeah. and then And then you're like, I'm cursed. I'm cursed. Yeah. and so And then the next one's like, here's an egg cleansing. but Yeah. yeah Yeah.
00:57:16
Speaker
And so some days I feel like you're just going to have a day where things happen. Whether you view them as good or bad and is all dependent on how you inherently view your world and what your outlook is.
00:57:32
Speaker
But I would say like, you know As far as it goes to like cleansing and stuff, we have to also kind of think about what does it mean to feel energetically dirty?
00:57:43
Speaker
like So what does that mean? Because that is what I would say would be that next step of like, am I having a bad day or do I need to go ahead and cleanse?
00:57:54
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Because you know for me, and I know this is like different for a lot of people, but for me, so I'm a big proponent of maintaining a cleanse space.
00:58:07
Speaker
So it's not like ah when something negative happens to me, like i'm going to go ahead and cleanse. It's every week I do little things to make sure that my home and my space and my person are cleansed.
00:58:21
Speaker
Yeah. I'm the same. ah yeah yeah And it's more like for me, it's preventative essentially. Like keeping that – like the clean energy, the like just clearing out the negative and, you know, putting like little things up to like protect or ward or whatever. Like it's just a way to keep things calm and – peaceful and not energetically like negative or bad or crazy feeling or anything like that.
00:58:58
Speaker
Yeah, I agree. Yeah. And so like some of the things that I do as well is I use – so I have incense holders throughout my entire house, upstairs, downstairs, and in our stairway because I have a altar dedicated to Hekate and my um stairs are on my um landing of my stairs.
00:59:19
Speaker
Yeah. So I will light incense. at least once a week and use that as like a smoke cleansing, cleansing out the space. um And then I also wash my doors with, and the floors as well, but like doors and the windows by the doors with Florida water. um And i that's something that I do to keep my home and my space cleansed because especially if you have people coming in and out of your home, whether that be, you know we have cleaners or like a neighbor visiting,
00:59:53
Speaker
We are energy and we leave energy where we go. And it's just a good practice, especially if you are an energy worker and you're somebody who practices magic, to keep your space like in harmony and to it cleansed.
01:00:10
Speaker
What are some things you do? Yeah. Incense is a big one and we use it frequently. Like i I live across from a cemetery and you know, you know, we've had some kind of crazy stuff happen.
01:00:26
Speaker
Yeah. um So i we use incense like almost daily and I feel like I don't know. For me, it works. So I love that. um i you know We talk about it all the time, but I'm a big proponent of opening my windows and clearing out the stagnant. um i do I don't use Florida water mostly because I just never remember to like buy it.
01:00:50
Speaker
And I have looked up making it and it's like – so many things. So i use herbal washes on my doors. Um, I haven't done it in a while, but I also used, I used to like pretty regularly do like our front porch, like clean it and put protective sigils under my doormat. Um,
01:01:14
Speaker
put them on my doors and windows with the herbal wash. Like I do stuff like that. I do salt in my doorway. i don't know. I have a bunch of like little things. who i want to be more of a clean my porch off type of person.
01:01:31
Speaker
um I'm at, okay, like I'll wash the doors in the entryway of the home. Yeah. I always have every intention to do the front porch and then I get out there and I'm like, ugh.
01:01:44
Speaker
I really don't want to do this. And then I don't, but I need to be more of, I need to make that more of a priority because I know that that's still an extension of your home.
01:01:55
Speaker
Yeah. Well, and for us, like in the States, I will say it was more difficult. My front porch was huge. Like I had a giant front porch. And so I used to have to like pressure wash it and I would wipe down um all the site. We had a, you know, in Illinois, all the houses are siding. So I would like wipe down all of the siding on our porch area and like put um essential oils um and we had because we had a huge porch we had the space to have a little table um out by our front door and I had like a little protection bowl out there our porch here is very small um there's not room to like put a bunch of stuff on it like like a little table that I could put a salt bowl on or anything but
01:02:41
Speaker
it's ah It's a much smaller space. It's easier to clean. I've just been lazy. Yeah. Ours is really small. And the weather here is just unpredictable. So wouldn't a salt bowl outside here um because it wouldn't be covered. But we do have plants and we have shisa, um which are Okinawan-specific plants.
01:03:02
Speaker
um They're like these – think they're like dog deities that protect your home. So we have those. That's cute. I should probably cleanse them though every so often.
01:03:14
Speaker
But yeah. I do have like plants too. Like I have rosemary and lavender and – ah Honestly, we have a lot of different herbs out front. We have a whole like stone wall that has little like planters built into it. And so right now it's like sage and holy basil and thyme and lemon thyme and rosemary and lavender. And we have the rosemary and lavender.
01:03:38
Speaker
So we don't use our front door a lot. um we use so We have ah like a door that goes out to our front patio that's separate from our front door. And it comes out of our living room. So there's like stairs that go up to the patio. And on each side, we have a lavender and a rosemary.
01:03:54
Speaker
i love that. Yeah. Yeah. So little things. but Yeah. Yeah. And I think the next point that i feel is very important to this episode is like looking at those ethical points.
Ethics in Magical Practices
01:04:11
Speaker
um Again, this is a very gray area. And it's going to be very different depending on every single person's beliefs, their practices, like their intentions.
01:04:22
Speaker
And there's no right or wrong answer. But something to think about, like, especially if this is something that's a new to you, or if it's something that like you kind of are on the fence with, I think you need to look at the question of is cursing ever justified for you?
01:04:40
Speaker
Like, what does that mean for you? And I feel like for me, probably not. Like people piss me off and like people do really shitty things. But for me, it's like that's them.
01:04:52
Speaker
Their karma will come back for them at some point. And for me, I just kind of go on like, you know, protecting myself, my home, my space and like my energy because – I don't know. That's just how I am as a person, I guess. I don't really know like the answer to why that is for me. But like for me, that that's my thought process on it.
01:05:16
Speaker
But that doesn't mean that I feel like if someone's cursing someone that they're a shitty person, like it's very different for everybody. Yeah, I agree. I think too that You need to do what speaks to you and what feels good in in your heart and in your workings. like Because at the end of the day, like i like we said, like magic is energy. this is Your intentions are your energies manifested and into like an actionable thing.
01:05:46
Speaker
Yeah. whenever you think about magic and because it is so personable, the way I look at it is if you are being inauthentic to yourself and you're just doing something because you think this is how it should be done and this is what you should do, it's never going to work because you're being inauthentic.
01:06:06
Speaker
And so I think like for me, whereas – I feel the same where it's like I don't think that for me and the magic that I practice – There's not really a space for cursing for me.
01:06:19
Speaker
Yeah. I will protect my energy though. And if somebody is correct really like has their fucking foot on my throat or, you know, will not leave me alone, I will put you in the freezer.
01:06:32
Speaker
I will do those sort of workings. Yeah. to keep you to leave me alone, to keep your energy over there away from me. I think that's like the next point though is like the ethics of baneful magic. Baneful doesn't necessarily mean like cursing and hexing, but it is like a heavier type of magic.
01:06:51
Speaker
If you guys haven't figured out this far into our podcast, Sam and I are not like all love and light people. And like – have spoke on that before. i don't feel I feel like love and light can be a little – where everything has to be like love and light can be a little like toxic in these spaces because not everything is happy and sunshine and rainbows. And like I'm not saying you should be a shitty person, but sometimes things like baneful magic are necessary.
01:07:19
Speaker
Yeah. Sometimes a freezer spell is necessary. I know both of us have been there, so – Yeah. Not in the freezer, but. No. Or maybe. not I mean, maybe. Maybe. I don't know.
01:07:33
Speaker
But like, I think it's very, it's, this is how I believe. I feel like for me too, it's perfectly justified and for me to protect my space and my family and my home.
01:07:45
Speaker
um And if that includes taking the energy that you're giving me and giving it back to you. yeah And that's what I'm doing. ye But that's for us though. Yeah.
01:07:57
Speaker
It might not be for everyone and that's okay. And then is it more empowering to curse or is it more empowering to protect and release?
01:08:09
Speaker
Ooh, that's a really good question. That is a really good question. I'm going to say that while I pose the question, I don't feel like there's a right or wrong here. Yeah. Because I can see it both ways because yeah like, especially if we're looking at it as you know As I mentioned earlier with it's a form of in and of itself, the a curse can be a form of release and protection and reclaiming that power that was taken from you.
01:08:38
Speaker
I think it depends. It depends on the working. It depends on the situation. Yep. And I feel like this section in particular, like when you're looking at the ethical points of it you have to decide for yourself.
01:08:53
Speaker
Like whatever I say, that's for me and my beliefs and my intentions and my practice. What Sam says, same thing. You have to look at like how you want to practice, how you want to use your energies, what is right and wrong for you.
01:09:11
Speaker
And that's not going to be the same for everyone. Yep. So. And then we finally made it to pop culture, social media, and witchcraft, which we have been saying since the beginning of this episode, we're going to get to it. Yeah.
Witchcraft in Social Media and Pop Culture
01:09:26
Speaker
We're here. We're here finally. We're here now.
01:09:28
Speaker
We're here. This has been a journey. It has. So. When we look at it, like there are so many, and we've talked about this before, but so many like TikTok, um Instagram, just witchcraft trends in general.
01:09:46
Speaker
I put witchcraft and trends, LOL.
01:09:52
Speaker
You could tell I was doing two things. um Just in general. And we've talked about like, is this a good thing? Is this a bad thing? And like, how to tell you know if it's a genuine practitioner versus somebody who's just trying to get likes and views and stuff like that. yeah And I think this is like – it just continues to be an important topic because this is such a big part of our lives now. Like TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, like all of those things are things that everybody uses daily.
01:10:23
Speaker
And so like there's going to be a level of exposure to these things. And you have to be able to like – Look at it from like an unbiased perspective maybe. Like, you know, if somebody is saying, oh, this video is reaching you because you're cursed.
01:10:43
Speaker
Like, is it or is it just because it's on your For You page? Right. Because you like witchcraft and you look up like witchy topics. Mm-hmm. So I don't know where I was going to go with that.
01:10:56
Speaker
No, I think, yeah, just – In general, yeah. it's I think there's this – while some things can be a sign and like sure, like look into um different synchronicities if if you believe that.
01:11:12
Speaker
Not everything is a sign. Not everything is – and you have to look at it too in the lens of, okay, well, what is this person getting from me watching their video?
01:11:28
Speaker
Mm-hmm. um Something else that we've we kind of briefly touched on this earlier, but there's a lot of like misunderstandings or like even just like completely misportrayals from pop culture in the way that they portray different types of magic, especially when we're talking about practices like whoooo voodoo, voodoo.
01:11:49
Speaker
Tarot is one that like we've talked about this before where it's like in a movie they turn over the death card and it's like – you're going to die. And it's like, yeah, what that means.
01:12:00
Speaker
And then um things like Santeria, Brujeria, like, and it's especially seen in those practices because they are from different cultures. And unfortunately, that is the world that we live in where it's like, oh, you know, hoodoo or voodoo is primarily from like,
01:12:18
Speaker
African or African American cultures. And so it's bad. Santeria is from like Hispanic cultures. Obviously, it's bad, you know. And so you have to be able to kind of like really...
01:12:32
Speaker
take yourself out of that mindset, if that is your mindset, and do some research and understand, like, the necessity of some of those practices, um the, like, the deep roots in the culture of those practices.
01:12:49
Speaker
And, you know, they come from a different place, a different time. And so the practices are going to be different. And just because they are different from your practice doesn't make them wrong. So...
01:13:01
Speaker
And a lot of, you know, that's partially why i wanted to kind of go regionally through some of those because it's a topic that we have talked about on the podcast before where it's like, you know, just because it's from a different culture, it is like portrayed as bad.
01:13:19
Speaker
And cursing, hexing, jinxing, whatever is. isn't necessarily bad, but there are a lot of them come from different cultures. A lot of those practices do, and they they're rooted in different things. And so it's, and it's important to like understand that ah something else to consider is like cleanses as rituals of control.
01:13:38
Speaker
So in times of uncertainty, a ritual can give us back the sense of agency. it can really give us back like our power, um, it can, whether it's like a placebo effect type thing, a as long as it's like helping you, it's important, you know? Yeah. so yeah.
01:13:59
Speaker
And like to go into that as well, we see a lot that like cleansing, it gives us back that agency and that power, right? Because when we and externalize internal pain, instead of looking inward, when we feel feelings of anxiety or depression, or maybe we feel burned out at work, it's much more easier to think, okay, maybe somebody hexed me, then maybe I'm carrying unresolved emotional wounds or systemic stress.
01:14:28
Speaker
And so like, if we are using a ritual as a way to kind of deal with that, like while it can give us back that sense of power, I think we also need to take a step back and think, okay, is this, should I, like, what is the root cause here? Like,
01:14:45
Speaker
Do I need to actually go talk to a therapist about my feelings? Or is this a situation where I have actually been cursed? And social media makes it so much worse. It makes it worse.
01:14:58
Speaker
And then the last piece that we're going to talk about, because we've taken you guys on like almost an hour and a half journey at this point.
01:15:09
Speaker
And of course, after editing, it'll probably be, you know, an hour and 10 minutes, but it's a very long episode. But- The ethics of fear marketing. So selling things like quote unquote curse removal services can be manipulative and they can be predatory if fear is exploited.
01:15:28
Speaker
And that goes back to that. If you're seeing this, then you've been cursed or this is a sign for you. And it's like, it's different when it's like, oh, if you're seeing this, here's the thing, like that collective tarot thing that we've talked about before.
01:15:42
Speaker
yeah And it'll go into that and there's nothing more. But some of these are so predatory in the way that they're like, if you're seeing this, you've been cursed and it's a sign and you need to buy my curse removal a class or, you know, like pay me money and I'll do this for you. Like, no. Mm-hmm.
01:16:01
Speaker
Don't do that, please. Don't do it. Yeah. Because it's just like with anything in our capitalistic society, strong emotions sell. So while sex sells, fear also sells. And especially fear that feels personal and ex an unexplainable.
01:16:16
Speaker
This makes the idea that you've been cursed a marketable problem. And here we have this practitioner, quote unquote, who can solve who can solve this for you. Yeah. Yeah.
01:16:27
Speaker
Curse removal services are terrible. What are their credentials? Exactly. Oh, they're an energy worker. What does that mean? Yeah. Yeah. Because we're all energy workers. Us being as humans in general, we are all energy workers. Mm-hmm.
01:16:44
Speaker
So like these services that prey on vulnerable people who are often struggling emotionally or spiritually have lost all respect for me because you're taking somebody who might be experiencing the worst times of their life and it goes back to like – because it's always the same people who are just like they demonize Christianity. They demonize other religions for taking advantage of people. You're doing the same thing. Literally the same thing.
01:17:10
Speaker
yu When this person, what they need is a therapist, you are selling them something that may not do anything to help them. Correct.
01:17:21
Speaker
And it's it's awful. like It's just disgusting. It's honestly really gross.
Ethics of Curse Removal Services
01:17:27
Speaker
Yeah. With social media as well, I think that this is also important to cover because you see this a lot, especially in our society, that is a very –
01:17:38
Speaker
I'm not saying that we don't have any problems, but we the problems that we have and as a Western society – are not that big a deal in the grand scheme of things.
01:17:49
Speaker
Right. Whenever other cultures are dealing with things much worse and other places in the world are dealing with such with more harmful things and they're not sure if they're even going to get a next meal. Right.
01:18:00
Speaker
But with social media, this is popularized trauma glamorization where people use trauma language and cursing as quote unquote aesthetic hardship and we see this a lot and we see this trauma talk a lot for people who, a do not work in this sort of a setting and have no business using those words, but B, they're glamorizing it as in like, well, I'm going through a hardship too.
01:18:28
Speaker
yeah And both of those things are terrible. And because of this, and we see this like On social media a lot where cursing becomes over-attributed and every misfortune is considered suspicious.
01:18:41
Speaker
And so, of course, there's got to be ah a fix, an easy, quick fix to this. And it's like, no, sometimes you don't need that. Sometimes you need to just take a step back and yeah think about where that thought came from.
01:18:56
Speaker
Cleansing that becomes compulsive instead of grounding is not good. And you can end up constantly removing bad energy without thinking like, am I doing this to myself? Am I constantly in this state of perpetual like cleansing because I'm constantly thinking I'm being cursed and that there's um spiritual attacks on me? yeah Maybe it's just your bad energy.
01:19:19
Speaker
It's just a never-ending loop that you're eventually just like stuck and doing this over and over and over. It's like that episode of Supernatural where they're like – they wake up every day and it's Tuesday because they're trapped in this like – it's like a demon that has like trapped them in the same day every day in the same place doing the same thing. It's like Groundhog Day. Yeah. Essentially, it was like an episode like that and it was really funny until they figure it out and then they get out of it. But like – It's just like you continually put yourself there and you can't see anything else because you're like, oh, here we are again. Here we are again. and then you're like cleansing and then thinking it again and then like putting yourself back into it
01:20:00
Speaker
just becomes like you're stuck there. You're not going to energetically move past it and you're not going to be able to, um you know, like really do anything else because you're focused so hard on this one thing that maybe if you take a step back and you're like, um am I the one that's like putting this in place because I'm thinking it or I'm just thinking about it so much that I can't get past it.
01:20:23
Speaker
Yeah. If you feel that way, take a step back. Take a step back. Look at the big picture. Look at like – What's leading up to this feeling? Why are you feeling this way? And then maybe at that point, you'll be able to Break the cycle.
01:20:38
Speaker
but Right. yeah Yeah. Practicing that discernment, I think there's a perfect place to leave off on this episode because if you are in a space where you're feeling thoughts of anxiety or burnout, sadness, grief, whatever that is, anger, and you don't know why, or you don't understand why your life keeps falling down this path, instead of thinking about all of these external factors that are preying onto your body and preying onto you and constantly trying to keep you down and woe is me and why is it just always me?
01:21:07
Speaker
Practice discernment. Figure out like, okay, what is actually happening here and talk to somebody about it. Do not go on TikTok and pay somebody to do a curse breaking spell for you.
01:21:20
Speaker
Shift the focus from am I cursed to what am I carrying that needs to be released, healed, or reclaimed and go from there. That was a journey. That was a journey.
01:21:31
Speaker
We've reached the end of this train. Yeah. it's ah It's a thick boy episode. So you're welcome and we're sorry at the same time. Also my back hurts. We lucky we love you all.
Conclusion and Social Media Wrap-up
01:21:56
Speaker
That's a wrap on this episode of Get In Loser, We're Doing Witchcraft. We hope you had as much fun as we did. If you loved this episode, we'd be eternally grateful if you left us a five-star review wherever you listen to your podcasts.
01:22:08
Speaker
It helps more witches, seekers, and magical misfits find our show. Want even more Get In Loser content? Join our Supercast coven. As a member, you'll get early access to episodes, a monthly newsletter, exclusive printable shadow work and grimoire pages, access to our witchy book club, promo codes for merch, and so much more.
01:22:26
Speaker
Just check the show notes for the link or search Get In Loser We're Doing Witchcraft on Supercast. You can also find us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram at GetInWitches or email us at We'reDoingWitchcraft at gmail.com.
01:22:38
Speaker
Join us next week as we get all tied up in knotwork and court magic. Until next time, stay magical, stay curious, and as always, blessed be witches.