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Episode 158: Magical Creatures pt. 1
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Welcome back, Witches! 🔮 This week, we’re kicking off a brand new series on Magical Creatures—starting with two legendary beings that rise with fire and storm: the Phoenix and the Thunderbird. In Part 1, we’re diving into the mythology, symbolism, and magical significance of these awe-inspiring creatures. From themes of rebirth and resilience to power and protection, their stories span cultures and centuries—and still spark wonder today. ⚡🔥. So get in loser, grab your tea, light a candle for curiosity, and let’s soar into the myth and magic of the skies. 🌕🕯️🪄
We would be forever thankful if you left our podcast a 5-Star review. If you really loved the show and want more Get in Loser content, check out our Supercast & Buy Me a Coffee links below. You can also find us on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram @GetinWitches, on TikTok @weredoingwitchcraft, or email us at weredoingwitchcraft@gmail.com. You can support our show through our links below.
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Music by Karl Casey @ White Bat Audio- The Witch
References:
- Kapach, Avi. Creature: Phoenix. (2023) Mythopedia. https://mythopedia.com/topics/phoenix
- Ryan, Mitch. All About the Mythical Phoenix: Bird of Fire & Eternal Life. (2024) How Stuff Works. https://people.howstuffworks.com/phoenix-bird.htm
- Shumaker, Heather. The Phoenix Through the Ages. (2008) Swarthmore College Bulletin. https://www.swarthmore.edu/bulletin/archive/wp/october-2008_the-phoenix-through-the-ages.html
- The Alchemist. Phoenix, the Magical Powers of the Bird of Fire. (2012). https://www.magicalrecipesonline.com/2012/04/phoenix-the-immortal-a-universal-sacred-spirit.html
- Mythology Worldwide (2024). The Power of the Thunderbird: Stories and Symbolism of a Legendary Creature. Mythology Worldwide. https://mythologyworldwide.com/the-power-of-the-thunderbird-stories-and-symbolism-of-a-legendary-creature/
- Dani Rhys (2020). Native American Thunderbird: Significance and Symbolism. Symbol Sage. https://symbolsage.com/thunderbird-meaning-symbolism/
- Justin Brown (n.d.). The Thunderbird in Native American Folklore: Mythology, Meaning and Modern Interpretations. History Defined. https://www.historydefined.net/thunderbird/
- Jade Hassenplug (2023). The Thunderbird in Native American Culture. Owlcation. https://owlcation.com/humanities/The-Thunderbird-in-Native-American-Culture
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to the Podcast
00:00:00
Speaker
Do you feel drawn to learn more about witchcraft and the occult but feel lost on where to start? Then welcome to Get In Loser Where You're Doing Witchcraft, a podcast all about what it means to be a witch and where to get started on your journey.
00:00:12
Speaker
Join us as we navigate through various witchy topics and share what we've learned about
Empress Tattoo and Piercings Discussion
00:00:16
Speaker
the craft. So get in witches as we learn about the thunderbirds and the females in the magical creatures that we see.
00:00:54
Speaker
I got some piercings and a new tattoo. I forgot about that. Yeah. It's healing up so well. Like literally whenever, um, I'll have to, i mean, cause this is a witchy tattoo. So maybe I'll take a picture of it and I'll put it on our Instagram for our
Tattoo Healing and Artist Praise
00:01:10
Speaker
listeners. But like I got the Empress tattoo and the lady that I went to, i just blown away by her skill and the fact that she i like We had a pre-meeting um before the tattoo like a month ago where we just kind of sat down.
00:01:29
Speaker
i talked to her about the symbolism, what the card meant to me, and the specific symbols I wanted, but gave her complete just... Freedom and like creative freedom to do whatever she wanted with it.
00:01:42
Speaker
What she did with blown away. Blown away. It's so beautiful. Oh my God. And the way she does tattoos, they don't bleed.
00:01:53
Speaker
So I don't have to cover it. And it doesn't even look swollen. Here, I'll show you. Mine like i life doesn't, I don't really bleed though. The one that I did was my ditch, my crow.
00:02:06
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. That's like in my elbow like crease. Which that would. Yeah. But look. It doesn't even look like I just got this done. It looks so good. And I'm just like wow. Like.
00:02:18
Speaker
I don't know. Like the skill. And I'm a bleeder. Like. I mean at least whenever I got my piercings. The lady was like. Jesus Christ. You're still fucking bleeding. Like. And I'm just like. Just bring it on Bring it on That's okay. Just keep it going.
00:02:33
Speaker
um But yeah. Like. I don't know. I just think. that whatever, like the skill that she has, don't know, like it is just unmatched, unmatched from the other tattoos I've gotten is what I mean. But um it was, it's glorious.
00:02:50
Speaker
feel like with Tessa, like, Mine heals so like quickly. And you know how like a lot of times tattoos will peel? Yeah. Like I don't peel at all. And i I wasn't sure because Anthony was like, well, you have really good skin. So that's probably why he got his and he was like, it's not peeling. And I'm like, I told you.
00:03:11
Speaker
She's magic. I feel like that's a sign of a really good tattoo artist. Yeah. Yeah, because the one I got on my chest didn't peel either. And I was really nervous about that one because yeah when I got it, it was October in Okinawa, but October in Okinawa is still hot as fucking balls. Like it is very hot here still and very humid. but And so I was just like, oh, this is going to be awful because I can't just not wear a bra. I have to work.
00:03:36
Speaker
But, like, also how am I going to keep this, like, from getting sweaty and, like, it's probably going to peel really bad and, like, it's probably going to be gross. No. Healed like a charm. Yeah. It has to be skill, like you're saying.
00:03:49
Speaker
Like, I've gotten a lot of tattoos in the past and, like, I've had, like, a few that bled. A lot of them swell horribly. Yeah. Like, really bad. I look ridiculous. Like, when I got the sleeve done, like – My upper arm was just huge when I got my poppies and my dagger.
00:04:09
Speaker
It looked so ridiculous because, too, like, this arm was all normal size and this one was, like, pfft. Yeah, and it was, like, you can feel it, like, pfft. Yeah, and when it was summer, so I'm in, like, t-shirts and tank tops and I looked so ridiculous. It was very obvious that it was swollen.
Piercing Experiences and Aftercare
00:04:23
Speaker
But, like, since we've been here and I've been going to Tessa, like, everything's bent there's no like swelling and like it'll get like red obviously I'm being like stabbed with a needle over and over again you know but like even that goes away quickly um I know with like this one like everything was so hot like it just felt hot to the touch and I don't get that with these but yeah same that's how like Like with my – the other tattoos I've gotten here, even like with some of the smaller ones that I had like previously like back in the States, they would always peel. And the one on my ankle, I keep looking at it like I'm going to probably get that covered because it's like – I can't remember what it the term for it is where it kind of like the ink kind of bleeds. It blows out. it blew Yeah, it blew out a little bit. And I'm like, well, this is a shitty tattoo.
00:05:14
Speaker
Yeah, that's my fault. Yeah, I need to like get that one, I think, covered at some point. But like with this, just no no bleeding, no peeling.
00:05:27
Speaker
it It literally looks – If I didn't touch it and feel that it's like not healed, I would not think that it's not healed. And like by probably tomorrow when I can start putting lotion on it, it's probably going to feel 100%. Yeah.
00:05:43
Speaker
one hundred percent so I'm excited. i love it. She's beautiful. it is. It's so pretty. When you sent the pictures, I was like, oh my God. Yeah. When she showed me the drawing, almost started crying because it blew my mind. Like it was so much more than what I could have imagined her drawing. And I was just like, wow, this is stunning.
00:06:03
Speaker
Yeah. so I am excited. it is beautiful. And then you got some piercings. I did. yeah I got my double holes and then I got the conch and that motherfucker hurt.
00:06:18
Speaker
Is that the middle piece or the one that goes down? it's um It's, yeah, it's the middle the middle one yeah right here well where I can put a a hoop in it eventually within six months to a year. oh yeah That one just looks painful.
00:06:36
Speaker
Right. Well, and I almost like chickened out because I went with my friend and she did it first, but she like, she did a Helix piercing too. And she was like, Oh my God, that hurt really bad. And I'm like, Oh no And then, um, I should have gone first, honestly, is what should have happened.
00:06:54
Speaker
So then i did it and I was just like, at Because she did my double holes, of which I've had pierced before. And my friend was like, oh, yeah, the double holes didn't even hurt. I was like, goddamn, this hurts.
00:07:05
Speaker
And she was like, well, you've had them done before. And the scar tissue makes it hurt worse. And I was like, fuck me. I should have gone first. but like when So by the time she got to the conch, I was like, oh, God.
00:07:18
Speaker
oh God. And it hurt like a motherfucker. And it's so tender. Every time like I go to clean it. And then I have to sleep with like a neck pillow and like put my ear in the hole of the neck pillow. yeah Yeah. It's like thick, hard cartilage. Yeah.
00:07:36
Speaker
I'm like, I had to feel it. Yeah. and And she told me she was like, well, you know, your ear is actually thinner. The cartilage is thinner than other people. So it won't hurt that bad.
00:07:49
Speaker
I was like, what the fuck?
Welcome to New Subscriber
00:07:53
Speaker
And I was bleeding all over the goddamn place. I got blood all over my shirt. It was. It's. Yeah. But you know what? In six months when I'm rocking this hoop in my ear, going to be worth it. It's going to be worth it.
00:08:09
Speaker
Oh, man.
00:08:14
Speaker
So we got a new super cow subscriber. Yes, we sure did. Welcome to the team, Catherine. We're so happy to have Yes.
Introduction to Magical Creatures
00:08:25
Speaker
And whenever you're listening to this, this will be like much later than when we're recording it, but we're recording it the week that you subscribed. so We try to be ahead of ourselves a little bit here. but were Sometimes we're like recording the week we are releasing the episode, which is stressful, but you know. me There's been a couple of times where we're like,
00:08:47
Speaker
Two days before and we're like, ugh. Yeah, and then a mad dash to go ahead and edit it. It's terrible. But but we are so happy you're here. And you know we hope you love our little community we've created. And um you can always interact with us too on our Ask Me Anything and send us messages.
00:09:07
Speaker
We're here for all of it. Yes. But we are not talking about tattoos, piercing, and supercast today. We're not. No, we're not. What are we talking about?
00:09:19
Speaker
We're talking about some magical creatures. We are being Hagrid. Welcome to class.
Thunderbirds in Mythology
00:09:24
Speaker
Yes. This is care of magical creatures. Hope you guys are ready. Yeah, absolutely. And I will say, you remember a couple weeks ago whenever we um covered ancient sabbats and yours was really short and mine was like incredibly long.
00:09:43
Speaker
Yeah. It's like reverse this time. I was like, these notes are forever. Yeah. where that was doing by yeah Whenever I realized, cause at first out i opened your notes and I was like, damn, she's got a lot of notes.
00:09:57
Speaker
And then I saw the creature you were covering and I was like, well, I mean, that tracks. so yeah and She decided she was going to go all in today. Yes. Yes. We are learning all the things, but also we don't really know.
00:10:12
Speaker
Oh, I'm excited. my favorite about episodes like this where I'm like, or it could be this, or it could be that, or it could be this, or maybe even that over there. Who knows? Right. That's ah kind of how mine is a little bit as well, just because of the mythology and lore surrounding it. So um I guess I will start first with the Thunderbirds um and we'll we'll just go from there because this was super interesting.
00:10:38
Speaker
I have always wanted to learn more about them because we hear, i mean, just, we've probably all heard of the Thunderbirds before and whether that you know be in association with the military, that's how I When I think about the Thunderbirds, I always think of that just because of our military affiliation.
00:10:55
Speaker
culture. Yeah, pop culture, like in books and cartoons, sports teams, like which – Can we stop doing that, guys? Let's let be respectful. but They're like, no.
00:11:08
Speaker
Yeah, no. No. We're not going to – Yeah. We're American, don't you know? Disrespect your surroundings. Yeah. But with that, so – I doubt many of us really understand much about the mythology surrounding this legendary creature.
00:11:25
Speaker
The Thunderbird is a prominent mythological creature seen throughout many indigenous North American cultures. Its earliest recorded evidence goes back to about 800 CE to about 1600 CE around the Mississippi region or what would be Mississippi today.
00:11:41
Speaker
and it's most commonly depicted as a massive bird with outstretched wings that span the sky. whose flapping wings can create thunder and whose eyes or beak can produce lightning.
00:11:53
Speaker
So I like how, you know, and in some instances, this kind of goes back to what you were saying where it's like, it could be this or it could be this. so like in some sources, it's like its eyes create the the lightning and then others, it's the beak.
00:12:05
Speaker
So who knows? It could be both. maybe maybe it's Maybe it's both. I don't know. The Thunderbird appears in stories and spiritual practices of diverse tribes from the north or from the Pacific Northwest coast and the Great Plains to the Great Lakes region.
00:12:20
Speaker
While the legends vary from nation to nation, the themes associated with the Thunderbird remain largely consistent throughout. It is a supernatural being of great power, deeply tied to the natural world and spiritual realms, and it's often seen as a protector, an enforcer of justice, and a bringer of balance.
00:12:40
Speaker
So getting into a little bit of the mythology, the Thunderbird plays a major role in and many indigenous cosmologies and creation stories. And in some traditions, Thunderbirds were present at the birth of the earth and helped shape the landscape and the sky.
00:12:55
Speaker
They are often seen as agents of change, beings that bring rain, winds, and storms, not as a punishment, but as a life-sustaining force. And so some examples of some of the mythology within different nations, in the Pacific Northwest, tribes such as the Kwak-Kwakw and Haida view the Thunderbird as a guardian spirit.
00:13:18
Speaker
It's often carved atop totem poles, watching over communities, and marking lineages of power and prestige. In some stories, the Thunderbird battles killer whales and in others, sea serpents, symbolizing the duality and struggle between the sky and the sea or spiritual and material forces.
00:13:38
Speaker
In the Great Lakes region, particularly in the Ojibwe and Menominee tribes, the Thunderbird is associated with moral order and divine retribution. It's said that the Thunderbird keeps balance by punishing those who break sacred laws or engage in destructive behavior, and in some stories, it even carries souls to the spirit world.
00:13:58
Speaker
One common theme across many nations is the Thunderbird's conflict with the underwater panther or Mishapeshu, which is a serpent or a panther-like being that lives in deep water.
00:14:10
Speaker
This cosmic battle between sky and water forces can represent the eternal struggle between good and evil and chaos and order, or change and stability. In agricultural societies, the Thunderbird's ability to bring rain made it especially important, and rituals, dances, and offerings would be made to honor the Thunderbird and request favorable weather for planting and harvesting seasons.
00:14:34
Speaker
So looking a little bit at the symbolism here, the main symbolism of the Thunderbird is that of power, strength, and resilience. It embodies the spirit of the warrior and the leader, often appearing in tribal crests, artwork, and regalia as a marker of honor, protection, and transformation. And in many indigenous communities, they see the Thunderbird as not just a mythical being, but as a spiritual ally, one that can bring renewal, healing, and insight.
00:15:04
Speaker
It is a messenger between the physical and spiritual worlds, and its presence in dreams or visions is considered to be deeply meaningful. Thunderbird imagery can also be tied to cycles of change, so things like seasonal shifts, personal growth, or societal upheaval, and the storms it brings may seem destructive, but they often clear the way for new life.
00:15:26
Speaker
And this is something that we see a lot in different themes related to mythological, um not just creatures, but even just like the lore with different deities as well. So I thought that tying into that, like, because when I'm reading about the Thunderbird, while it is a mythical or magical creature, like it reminds me so much of some of the deities that we've also covered on this podcast.
00:15:48
Speaker
yeah And so I just thought that the symbolism and lore was so in so similar and um I thought it was really cool. In that sense, the Thunderbird doesn't just symbolize raw power, but it also represents the power of transformation itself.
00:16:03
Speaker
And so looking into some tribal specific traditions, um there are a few that I'm going to list out here. This isn't um ah exhaustive list of the Thunderbird in the different nations um in indigenous cultures in North America, but it's just a few of the most notable ones.
00:16:23
Speaker
The Thunderbird is widespread in indigenous lore and its characteristics and so and stories can shift based on the region and the tribe. In the Ojibwe tribe, Okay.
00:16:38
Speaker
they are said to arrive in the spring and leave in the fall marking seasonal change the thunderbirds are said to protect people from underwater spirits and punish those who break moral laws as i mentioned earlier and some stories say they are shapeshifters that can take on human form.
00:16:54
Speaker
Speaking of shapeshifters, let's talk about the Shawnee tribe because they feared Thunderbirds as shapeshifters who would appear in the form of little boys to interact with people, which fucking terrifying. That would not be my friend. I don't know about that.
00:17:08
Speaker
Um, but apparently they believe that the only way to identify Thunderbirds were their ability to speak backwards, which is even more terrifying. If I were to see a little boy speaking backwards, I'm sorry. Um, thank you, Thunderbird. I appreciate you, but not today.
00:17:25
Speaker
In the Menominee tribe in Wisconsin, Thunderbirds were described as dwelling on a great mountain that floats in the Western sky. It's a sacred being that helps humans by driving away evil and bringing in storms to help with crops.
00:17:40
Speaker
The Thunderbirds are also said to watch over the world from above, ensuring that humans stay in balance with the earth. And in the Kwakiwak tribe in the Pacific Northwest coast, the Thunderbirds are often shown gripping a whale with its talons and totemic art.
00:17:56
Speaker
And this is an act that symbolizes its immense strength and cosmic battle with sea creatures. The Thunderbird also plays a role in initiation ceremonies, and they appear in dances and ah on masks worn by spiritual leaders and warriors.
00:18:12
Speaker
In the Sioux tribes, which would include like the Lakota, the Dakota, and the Nakota, in those traditions, the Thunderbird is a powerful spiritual force and part of a group of other elemental beings that control different aspects of nature.
00:18:26
Speaker
It is also associated with the direction west and with the power of thunder and lightning. The Thunderbird is invoked during the Sundance and is considered a messenger of the Great Spirit. And lastly, in the Algonquian tribes, this is one of the largest groups in pre-America colonization.
00:18:44
Speaker
They believe that the world was controlled by two powerful magical creatures, the Thunderbird, and who reigned over the Upper World, and the Underwater Panther that I mentioned earlier, Mishapeshu that ruled the underworld.
00:18:56
Speaker
The Algonquian people depicted the Thunderbird with the letter X. So if you see, I remember seeing this in, um even in just like American history in some of the cave drawings, like they would have like the letter X and then with the little, like at the ends of the X, it would it would kind of be like little triangles that would point down and that's supposed to represent the Thunderbird.
00:19:19
Speaker
In modern culture, we see Thunderbirds used um as we mentioned earlier, but So for the military in the U.S. s Air Force, they have an elite famous flying squadron named the Thunderbirds.
00:19:31
Speaker
And the name was chosen to honor the indigenous American symbol of power, speed and protection. And the name ties back to the idea of force and respect for the sky.
00:19:42
Speaker
Also, we see the Thunderbird in cars as well, um most notably the Ford Thunderbird that was released in the nineteen fifty s And also in literary works as well. So J.K. Rowling in her Fantastic Beasts novel, um aka, you know, She Who Must Not Be Named, um we do not like to talk about her on this podcast, um i adapted the Thunderbird into a magical creature inspired by the North American indigenous myths. And from what I heard, because I've not read too much into the lore that she created, quote unquote, related to North America
00:20:18
Speaker
and that magical school that she created. But from what I remember reading is she did not do a very good job of it and it is very stereotypical. um So I would not look to that for a really good representation of the Thunderbird in books or in fantasy is what I should say. But all in all though, it's important to remember that while the Thunderbird has become popular in modern cultures today, its roots are sacred for many indigenous people.
00:20:48
Speaker
It's not just a creature of legend, but a living part of their spiritual worldview, seen in beadwork, murals, tattoos, power regalia, and as a symbol of indigenous strength, identity, and cultural survival.
00:21:03
Speaker
Additionally, it's important to learn and share these stories with respect so we can deepen our understanding of different traditions and make sure that we are honoring them with the reverence they deserve. And lastly, I just want to say too, like with a lot of the like deities and creatures that we talk about this podcast, we always have a section where we discuss like how you can honor them, how you can work with them.
00:21:24
Speaker
I did not include that in the section because this is a indigenous closed practice magical creature.
Respecting Indigenous Cultures
00:21:31
Speaker
So clearly we're we're not part of any cultures that honor the Thunderbird. So we're not going to list any ways that you can work with a Thunderbird in your own magic.
00:21:41
Speaker
um Because it is a close practice. so Yeah. But that is a Thunderbirds. Isn't that interesting? I liked that. Yeah. so much of like... the Thunderbirds being in pop culture or in just like modern like culture I guess so it's really interesting to see like what they actually are where they actually come from right yeah like what we see in like books and comics and tv shows and because it's not at all like I mean there are some themes that I could have guessed before researching but looking into like the history and stuff I thought
00:22:15
Speaker
It is so much more different than what I thought it was going
Exploration of the Phoenix
00:22:18
Speaker
to be. And yeah I love it. All right. So moving in to the Phoenix, which is what I'm talking about today.
00:22:25
Speaker
This was so fun to research because it sent me down so many rabbit holes. So I'm sorry if this is really long, but you're welcome also. The phoenix is a mythological creature with roots in Egyptian mythology.
00:22:39
Speaker
It's often described as a majestic bird, similar in size and shape to an eagle, but with stunning red and gold feathers. Sometimes it's even said to be covered in flames, though in other versions the fire is more of a magical ability rather than part of its appearance.
00:22:55
Speaker
While Egypt is where the Phoenix has its strongest mythological roots, it's not the only place the legend shows up. So versions of the Phoenix story can also be found in ancient Arabia, Ethiopia, ah Phoenicia, Assyria, and even as far as the Far East and India.
00:23:13
Speaker
One of the more detailed descriptions comes from Pliny the Elder, who wrote that the phoenix was about the size of an eagle. He described it as having brilliant golden feathers around its neck, deep purple across most of its body, and a tail shaded in blue with long rose-colored feathers mixed in.
00:23:32
Speaker
Its throat was said to be crusted and its head crowned with a tuft of feathers. it's So like definitely not your average bird. I will note that the size of the phoenix varied from source to source, but the majority shared that it was roughly the size of an eagle, though some sources noted it being much larger, ranging anywhere from twice the size to the size of an ostrich.
00:23:55
Speaker
At the core of its story, the phoenix lives for 500 years. When its time comes, it returns to the altar of the sun in the Egyptian city of Heliopolis. It sets itself ablaze. And then here's the iconic part. It's reborn from its own ashes.
00:24:11
Speaker
Of course, like most ancient myths, there are a bunch of variations to this tale, and we'll dive into those in just a bit. But the biggest takeaway here is this. Since ancient times, the phoenix has been a powerful symbol of death and rebirth.
00:24:25
Speaker
And despite how old the myth is, it's one that sticks around. It still resonates with people today. One thing I found super interesting during the research was the etymology of the word Phoenix.
00:24:37
Speaker
So it turns out that scholars haven't been able to pin down exactly what it means or even like when it first appeared in history. What they do know is that the word is like really, really old.
00:24:48
Speaker
um Like we're talking like Greek Bronze Age old and we're talking somewhere between like 1600 to 1100 BCE. But as far as like the actual meaning, that's still up for debate. There's several interpretations of what it could mean.
00:25:04
Speaker
And here's just a few of the most popular ones. So it could just mean palm tree. It could mean reddish purple. It could just mean Phoenician or shining bird or reddish purple bird or palm tree bird or Phoenician bird or even just griffin, which I thought that was really funny because I'm like, that's an entirely different creature.
00:25:24
Speaker
Right. But yeah. So those are the most popular, like what they think it could mean, but who really knows? And sticking with the etymology for a moment, Some scholars actually think the word phoenix might have come from its Egyptian name binu, which means to shine, and honestly, I think that fits pretty beautifully with the whole imagery of fire, the sun, and rebirth. and Just a few extra background pieces.
00:25:51
Speaker
Like, one curious detail about the phoenix is that it doesn't reproduce sexually, which of course has led to a lot of speculation about its gender, apparently, or even like whether it has one at all.
00:26:04
Speaker
Ancient writers were pretty vague on the subject and most just kind of left this question unanswered. But there was one account where the Phoenix apparently proved its identity to the priest of Heliopolis by, get this, showing them its genitalia, but the priest didn't tell anyone, right?
00:26:24
Speaker
So just the priest knew if it was like a dude or a chick. Oh, no cool. Yeah, yeah. Which like, okay, but like, even then the story doesn't say whether it was male or female. So I guess like, that's just part of its mystery. Like it just stays, it stays a secret.
00:26:42
Speaker
like pretty much everything else without the phoenix, its diet is also wrapped in mystery. Some sources claimed it didn't need to eat at all, or at least no one ever saw it eating.
00:26:53
Speaker
Others believed it survived solely on aromatic plants and spices like frankincense. And there are also stories that say the phoenix was nourished by the heat of the sun or even by the wind itself.
00:27:06
Speaker
And in one version, it gets extra mystical saying that the young phoenixes were fed miraculous dew drops from heaven, but they stopped eating altogether once they reached maturity.
00:27:17
Speaker
So basically its entire existence is like magical and elusive. and it's like this fiery rebirth, but we don't know what it eats. We don't know a guy or a girl. We we have no idea.
00:27:29
Speaker
and then um one of the phoenix's most iconic traits was is it's takes like it's insanely long lifespan. The most common versions of the story say that it lives for 500 years, but of course not everyone agreed on that.
00:27:43
Speaker
Roman historian Tacitus mentioned that some sources believe the phoenix lived for 1,461 years. um and then in my own research I came across all kinds of numbers.
00:27:57
Speaker
Some say like 540 years. Others went as high as 7,006 years. And then get this. One source talking about Hesiod's Phoenix claimed that it lived for 29,160 years.
00:28:10
Speaker
So like everything else about this mystical bird, like there's no exact number. it's just, we don't know. Could be anywhere from like 500 to like almost 30,000 years.
00:28:22
Speaker
Right. I know in between. Yeah. Or all of it in between. Who knows? All of it. It lives for all these years. And then depending on the source, many believe that there's only one singular phoenix.
00:28:34
Speaker
So, you know, like... We talk about like dragons. It's like this idea that there's all these different dragons and different breeds of dragons. You talk about unicorns and it's like there's there's multiple unicorns.
00:28:46
Speaker
With the phoenix, the idea is that there's only one. Like there's no other phoenix. And so this is just like a singular bird locked into this eternal cycle of life and death. And when you think about it, that's kind of sad.
00:28:58
Speaker
It's like... I mean, everything else has others of its kind to share like life's journey with, but the Phoenix is always playing solo. So there are a few sources, though, that suggest there might be more than one Phoenix, but the catch is that they're so rare their paths would probably never cross.
00:29:15
Speaker
So still like pretty sad. It's out there on his own. The Phoenix's life cycle at its core is pretty simple. It lives out its incredibly long life, however long that actually is. Again, we don't know.
00:29:28
Speaker
And then when its time is up, it dies and it's immediately reborn from its own ashes. But of course, mythology is never that straightforward. So naturally, there's a few different takes on how exactly the whole death and rebirth thing plays out.
00:29:43
Speaker
So here's just a couple of variations. The first version goes like this. When the phoenix feels its end is near, it builds a nest out of aromatic plants and spices. So think like myrrh, frankincense, and other fragrant herbs.
00:29:57
Speaker
It settles in and then both the bird and the nest go up in flames. From the ashes, a new phoenix rises like reborn. And some sources add that this whole ritual only ever happens in Egypt, which ties back to its its deep roots in Egyptian mythology.
00:30:13
Speaker
In another version of the story, the phoenix doesn't go out in a blaze at all. Instead, this old bird just simply lays down in a nest it's built and it dies peacefully, eventually decomposing.
00:30:26
Speaker
Then from what's left behind, a new phoenix is born, but not as a full grown bird. It actually starts out as a worm. So I was a little confused there. Gross.
00:30:36
Speaker
So it comes back as a worm. And all I could think about was like, if it's like dead and decafosing, it's a maggot. Right. I was very grossed out by this one. So once it's like grown strong enough, this young Phoenix then gathers the remains of its predecessor and carries them to Heliopolis in Egypt, placing them on the altar of the sun god. Right.
00:30:59
Speaker
Other sources, taking more stripped down approach. So in these versions, when the phoenix's time comes, it simply just bursts into flames. No nest, no ritual, no altar, just basically spontaneous combustion wherever it happens to be.
00:31:15
Speaker
Then, as always, it's reborn from its own ashes Interestingly, many of these sources also agree on one thing. If someone or something tries to kill the phoenix, it doesn't matter. Like it still just rises again, reborn as a brand new phoenix.
00:31:32
Speaker
So like you literally can't keep it down. You can't kill it. He just comes back every time. When we look at symbolism of the Phoenix, because of its incredibly long lifespan, the Phoenix becomes associated with the concept of the great year, which is a kind of cosmic cycle that symbolized the renewal of the world and the beginning of a new era.
00:31:54
Speaker
According to tradition, the appearance or rebirth of the phoenix marked the end of one great year and the start of the next. And just like with the phoenix's age, no one could quite agree on like how long a great year actually was.
00:32:09
Speaker
it wasn't your typical like 365 day calendar year. Some saw it as hundreds, others thousands of like like years long. And basically, it's another mystery wrapped in Phoenix lore.
00:32:21
Speaker
Some of the obvious symbols are the most obvious symbol, I think, is the death and rebirth. This is basically the heart and soul of the Phoenix. This powerful symbolism was deeply woven into Greek and Egyptian beliefs and mythology.
00:32:35
Speaker
To them, the Phoenix wasn't just a mythical creature. was a natural symbol of creation and renewal, with its life cycle constantly renewed through resurrection from its own ashes after death.
00:32:47
Speaker
And of course, no surprise here, because they always take things. Early Christians also adopted the phoenix as a symbol. For them, it represented the immortal soul or even the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Like, cue eye roll.
00:33:02
Speaker
The phoenix isn't just a myth. It's all over pop culture too, so you can spot it in books, comics, films, art, video games, pretty much everywhere else.
00:33:14
Speaker
Famous authors like C.S. Lewis, J.K. Rowling, ah Neil Gaiman, Terry Pratchett have all woven the phoenix into their stories. Even the band Queen gave a nod to the phoenix by featuring it at the top of their logo.
00:33:28
Speaker
And it doesn't stop there. The word phoenix pops up in songs, album titles, music videos, and even in opera. And the phoenix was also a sacred symbol of the god Apollo and his cult.
00:33:40
Speaker
In this version of the lore, there's only one phoenix, and it's a male. And the story goes that the phoenix willingly sacrifices himself, only to be reborn from his own ashes as a symbol of bravery and renewal.
00:33:53
Speaker
It's a powerful image of self-sacrifice and rebirth tied directly to the divine. In alchemy... The phoenix symbolizes the global resurrection of life, and it represents the best possible outcome of a process.
00:34:10
Speaker
It's closely associated with the color red, which in alchemy signifies transformation and rebirth. The phoenix also holds significant meaning for many hermetic orders like the Masons, the Freemasons, and the Rosicrucians, who use it as a symbol for spiritual renewal and enlightenment.
00:34:30
Speaker
In witchcraft, I was reading that the Phoenix can be invoked for a variety of purposes, including protection, especially from fire or evil entities, jinx breaking, banishing, and uncrossing, working with fire magic, gaining awareness of past incarnations, attracting fame and success, enhancing vitality and beauty, empowering your faith, and overcoming difficulties and rising from your ashes.
00:35:00
Speaker
Wow. It's the Phoenix. I love how we both referenced the same author. Yeah. And then we're like, ew. Ew.
00:35:12
Speaker
Ew. But yeah, like for most of our episodes, anytime we pick like
Mythical Connections and Future Episodes
00:35:16
Speaker
different topics to cover, like we said it before, there's always something that kind of connects them, which is interesting. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:35:24
Speaker
This is, you know, the first of many episodes probably on not probably, like obviously on magical creatures. And
Conclusion and Community Invitation
00:35:33
Speaker
i think this was a great way to kick it off.
00:35:35
Speaker
I think so too.
00:35:50
Speaker
That's a wrap on this episode of Get In Loser, We're Doing Witchcraft. We hope you've had as much fun as we did. If you love this episode, we'd be eternally grateful if you left us a five-star review wherever you listen to your podcasts.
00:36:02
Speaker
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00:36:20
Speaker
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00:36:33
Speaker
Join us next week as we discuss alchemy in witchcraft. Until next time, stay magical, stay curious, and as always, blessed be witches.