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Animation Deliberation Young Justice Season 1 Part 2 (Ep 3-9)
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We breakdown and discuss Episodes 3-9 of season one of Young Justice in part 2 of our coverage!
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Transcript
Exploring Mississippi's Outdoor Adventures
00:00:00
Speaker
You're invited to take a vacation from everybody else's vacation to a place where you can explore cypress swamps and magical gardens and see a 65-foot waterfall that once powered an old mill that you can walk through today or just float along the cool rushing waters of an old-fashioned swimming hole. See the places and plan your journey at visitmississippi.org slash outdoor adventure. Mississippi Wanderers Welcome.
Introduction to the Hosts and Animation Deliberation
00:00:30
Speaker
On this episode of the Animation Deliberation podcast, Jay Scottie St. Clair and Zuhair Ali reunite to cover Young Justice season one, part two, episodes three through nine.
Origins and Quality of Young Justice
00:00:40
Speaker
Stay tuned for that and more after these ads we don't have any input over and don't necessarily reflect the views of the host or the network.
00:00:50
Speaker
One, two, three, it's time for animation, deliberation, a conversation and a celebration of our favorite animated action series. Yeah. Whoo. Whoo. All right. All right. Welcome back to the animation deliberation podcast, the podcast where we take action animation and cartoons seriously, but not ourselves, at least not too seriously. Uh, I am Jay Scottie, St. Clair, and joining me is Zuhair Ali. How you doing, Zuhair?
00:01:19
Speaker
doing very well. How about you? I'm doing great. I'm doing great, man.
Character Development in Young Justice
00:01:23
Speaker
I'm definitely excited to discuss this next part of Young Justice with you just to give a little behind the scenes. Part of the reason this podcast was even created is because you and I were discussing the series and you encouraged me to go back and revisit the series.
00:01:39
Speaker
And if I wasn't already on board with the first two episodes right out the gate, the trajectory that we're certainly on right now and the momentum and really getting to know these characters, it's some of the best stuff in the entire DC animated universe, I would say. So definitely looking forward to getting into it. Yeah, there's a lot of stuff that goes on, a lot of stuff to get into, and I'm glad that you're so on board with it.
Episode Breakdown and Core Team Dynamics
00:02:05
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Well, thanks for recommending it. So before we dive too deep into the nitty gritty of the episode, I figured it would be a good opportunity just to kind of discuss the...
00:02:17
Speaker
arc that these particular sets of episodes take, some of the story beats, and then we can kind of get into the specifics about the characters and their development. And then I'll give you the opportunity. You provided a pretty comprehensive breakdown of how we should tackle these episodes, and you had a purpose when you did that. So that'll be a good opportunity for you to kind of clue us in what you were thinking when you decided the order that we would break that down. So how does that sound?
00:02:47
Speaker
Yeah bud, let's
Formation and Training of Young Justice Team
00:02:48
Speaker
do it. Cool, cool. So picking up off of, you know, the introduction where we saw the formation of the team and whatnot, we left things off where they're at the cave, they're at Mount Justice, and we've got this team. We've got Kid Flash, we've got Robin, and we've got Aqualad. They just rescued Superboy from Cadmus. And now Ms. Martian, AKA McGann, has joined the team.
00:03:14
Speaker
and they're being supervised by Red Tornado with Black Canary acting as their trainer and Batman giving them missions.
Coming-of-Age Themes and New Members
00:03:24
Speaker
So really kind of speaking to the arc we see here, it's really, we saw Kid Flash, Aquaman, or Aqualad, Robin and Superboy all learned to work together as a team as they escaped Cadmus. This is really all about getting those additional members of the team
00:03:44
Speaker
them finding their place and finding where they fit in with the team. As much as it is an action series, one of the reasons that they do, or one of the things that really differentiates it from a lot of the stuff in the DC universe is the fact that we are focusing on such a young set of characters. In that regard, it is very much a coming of age story as well, which I really appreciate because it really helps to endear us to these characters.
00:04:13
Speaker
So we get the addition of the Gan and some of her growing pains and becoming part of the team is definitely a through line there. But we also get introduced to the character of Artemis, who is basically Green Arrow's new protege. So definitely her learning to become a part of the team and earning the team's trust as well as her earning the team's trust and
Leadership and Team Dynamics in Young Justice
00:04:38
Speaker
We find that she has some secrets, so earning the team's trust is definitely a major through line for that character. Other than that...
00:04:47
Speaker
we do find that Aqualad is established as the leader of the group. They continue the battle against a very mysterious organization that seems to be loosely connected by these somewhat random missions. We get introduced to the Cobra Venom, the character of Bane. He's long been associated with the Venom that basically enhances his strength and whatnot. We find out that he's actually partnered with a
00:05:17
Speaker
a cult-like group, or actually, I guess he's not so much partnered with them as he's in a bit of opposition with them, but they are basically modifying the venom for nefarious purposes, which is part of a larger scheme. But, you know, moving on from there, yeah, I guess in terms of like, you know, this particular episode, arc three through nine,
00:05:43
Speaker
It really is all about the team coming together and really getting the introduction of Miss Martian as well as Artemis. So as far as I'm concerned, I think this is a good opportunity to actually dive into all the characters and speak to their particular growth and arcs within this arc. But like I mentioned, Zuhar, if you want to hop in and kind of
00:06:07
Speaker
You know, anything that you think I didn't highlight on or, you know, if you want to provide a little context of why you thought breaking up the episodes the way you did, please go for it.
00:06:17
Speaker
Yeah, I think you got a good idea of most of the stuff that I was thinking. One of the primary reasons I broke it up the way that I did is that every character that's in the intro has been introduced at this point. So we have the core team of Aqualad, Robin, Kid Flash, Megane,
00:06:39
Speaker
AKA Miss Martian and Artemis with Speedy now being Red Arrow and what I like to call like the subcontractor of the Justice League because he's not directly working with the team but he does keep in touch with them and ask for their help from time to time. Another big theme of these episodes is definitely the position of leadership in team building.
00:07:04
Speaker
There is a lot of Robin assuming that he's the leader because he's worked with Batman and Batman's what seems to be the leader of the Justice League. Superman may be the face of it, but Batman's definitely who bosses everyone around.
00:07:20
Speaker
in this series, certainly. Yeah. So there's a lot of conflict of them establishing the roles and understanding like who's capable of what understanding how they work together and understanding how to fill in that role of leadership and their positions on the team.
Robin's Leadership Journey
00:07:36
Speaker
Sure. There's also a lot of character development on how they relate to each other. You see a lot of how they interact with their mentors. Yeah. And get an expansion of
00:07:51
Speaker
I'm not gonna poke too much at this, but there are characters that make minor appearances for a second that actually end up being like a key part of the story next season. Okay.
00:08:02
Speaker
So I probably wouldn't have like realized on our first watch, but now it's more of like, wow, they showed a lot of people in such a short amount of time. So leadership and character development was definitely the overall theme of this story arc. And of course we have to like wrap it up on a big fight scene too. Like you can't just like have that and that move on to something. So I think it like racked up in a, in a good big experience that these guys had to deal with.
00:08:28
Speaker
Yeah, I would agree and I like the fact that you refer to the way that they pepper in these little details that that pay off later because and you know in some of my favorite TV shows be it animated or live-action that's that's one of the the best approaches to storytelling you can take where you're entertained with each episode each episode has a
00:08:52
Speaker
a close, a beginning, a middle, and an end. And you're not left unsatisfied anyway in terms of the story that you get each episode. But there's obviously an overarching story, a bigger plot at play that they do a good job of keeping you invested in without revealing too much. So that's definitely something I've appreciated just within this arc.
00:09:13
Speaker
All right, well, I guess that's a good opportunity to just go ahead and dive into the individual characters. So you went ahead and brought up Robin and his struggle with leadership.
Robin and Kid Flash's Relationship
00:09:22
Speaker
That was definitely something that stood out to me, the fact that he has to come to terms with the fact that he may be the most well qualified to lead, but he is not quite ready. Did you have any other big takeaways from Robin in terms of his arc in this set of episodes? So the episode
00:09:44
Speaker
Is it episode four? Yeah, episode four is the first mission. Yeah, that's the first mission that they have by Batman. The first big mission that they have to go on together. First off, just because it's such a minor thing, I love the way the stealth suits look. Everybody's got their own version of that. You just press the button, it just goes in incognito mode. Yeah, I love that too.
00:10:07
Speaker
But this was a big episode that covered the reason of why I split the arcs and showing that position of leadership. I put in my notes that the communication between the team at this point was just godawful.
00:10:23
Speaker
Because they were trying to come up with the plan and Robin disappears. And this is like, where did he go? Oh, he's just off doing his own thing. And everyone's frustrated because the tactician of the team is like always slipping off. And he makes lines like how, like, how come you guys didn't follow my lead? It's like, we didn't even notice you left. Right. Which says a lot to his talent and skillset of being able to disappear.
00:10:47
Speaker
Um, but his lack of talent of being able to communicate verbally on what the team needs to be doing. Yeah. Sorry. I was going to say, I can't remember which character, but somebody makes the, the remark that, yeah, you know how to communicate with Batman, but you don't know how to communicate with this team.
00:11:04
Speaker
Yeah, I was actually gonna, that was what I had written down too, is that Aqualad mentioned that since the line of specifically is, Robin's experience has an unspoken language with Batman. Because in another episode he mentions that Robin's been working with Batman since he was nine. So it's like he dove right into it. So between the age of nine to now being 13, which the ages were finally established in this age too, he's 13, Kid Flash is 15. Right.
00:11:33
Speaker
So this 13 year old freshman like He's he's grown with it like part of his puberty was being Robin and being Batman like it really is Like in his blood at this point. Mm-hmm
00:11:48
Speaker
Uh, so he has that understanding of like, when I do something you follow, there's always like a tracking of what your teammate is doing, but that's something that the other folks aren't used to because they're more out in the open because they have powers because they're so relying on their powers. They don't need to be stealthy and have like the element of surprise because they can just run in and cause chaos. Sure.
00:12:14
Speaker
And it's also showing the lack of development with their powers too, because Kid Flash, he's been doing this for a while, but he slips a lot.
Kid Flash's Character Exploration
00:12:22
Speaker
I think his weakness is just mud. He trips over himself, he slips on the mud a lot, he runs into things too often. It's almost like Flash in the Justice League movie too.
00:12:35
Speaker
uh young with his powers in the show like he's always running into walls yeah yeah uh so that shows like the lack of experience and when they say recon only like they really should have stuck with recon only should have could have would have but
00:12:49
Speaker
Megan has this issue of, can I use my powers now? Can I use my powers now? Can I use my powers now? It's like she has this great mental ability in getting in people's heads, but she's confused on when she's supposed to do it. It's like, do I have your permission to do it? Because we have people like Bane.
00:13:08
Speaker
hmm who like Batman's been dealing with for a while now robin's dealt with on multiple occasions like they're not going to hesitate to take you out when they need to yeah so you don't have the time to make those decisions it's just act um and yeah at the end of it
Doctor Fate Episode and Kid Flash's Beliefs
00:13:28
Speaker
I think Robin was just so dead set because that's what his mentor did, but it was a big move within the span of an episode for him to be mature enough to decide, I'm not ready for this. Aquaman, you should take the helm because, does that say Aquaman? Aqualad, you should take the helm. I did the same thing. And Aqualad acknowledges that it's like, hey, this is just going to be a temporary thing just until we get this thing figured out.
00:13:57
Speaker
Right. So you mentioned two characters that I think I would argue that Robin probably has the strongest relationships with at this point in time. And it's fitting because they're his original teammates in terms of young justice. But you've got, you know, the person that he decides to pass the mantle of leadership onto in Aqualad.
00:14:20
Speaker
But then I also really appreciate his relationship with Kid Flash and Wally because you did mention we get the ages established. So Robin is 13 and Kid Flash is 15, making them, at this point in time, the youngest members of the team. So it's kind of interesting that while they are the youngest, they're almost the most experienced in terms of their tenor as sidekicks. But one of the things I loved about their relationship is
00:14:47
Speaker
Kid Flash is such a source of comic relief here, and there's this great joke. Robin, one of the things we talked about offline is I had a little bit of difficulty relating to Robin initially just because he was kind of, you know, always had the answer, never really seemed unsure of himself at all.
00:15:08
Speaker
But one of the things that has really endeared me to the character is his comedy. I really like his penchant for jokes that deal with prefixes. We got the Wellm joke from the pilot, but one of the jokes that continued into this one was the whole disaster and aster. He has that moment with Superboy where he's like,
00:15:31
Speaker
If a disaster is when everything goes wrong, is an aster when everything goes right? And then it finally gets paid off at the end where, you know, Superboy is filled with so much angst, but he actually has this moment where he can laugh with Robin. But going back to his relationship with Kid Flash, one of my favorite jokes that kind of emerged early on is Robin has this tendency to throw Kid Flash under the bus and Wally responds with, dude,
00:16:02
Speaker
Other than that, just kind of moving on to Kid Flash here, I would say beyond the comic relief, and I guess still tied into the comic relief, his crush on McGann is definitely one of the hallmarks of his character at this point in time. We do get introduced to the character of Artemis.
00:16:22
Speaker
So he, uh, in their fight with a mezzo, he is saved by a green arrow and everyone assumes that it is a speedy that has come to the rescue. But we find out later on that it was in fact, green arrow's new protege, Artemis. And Kid Flash has a lot of friction with her because he wanted, you know, speedy Roy Harper to join the team.
Superboy's Challenges and Identity Issues
00:16:46
Speaker
But Roy Harper will not do that because he is operating on his own. And at this point in time, he still kind of sees this group as a group of kids, a club. He doesn't feel like being babysat. From there, I would say. Yeah, they were not happy with her being Speedy's replacement, quote unquote. Right, right. And I think when she's initially introduced, she introduces herself, and Ollie does it as well, that she is his niece.
00:17:16
Speaker
But we find that not to be the case pretty early on after the fact. By the way, I just looked it up. Apparently Ms. Martian is 48 years old, but with human biological equivalent of 16. Holy cow. I'm glad you looked that up. That's really interesting. I thought she was in her 80s. I couldn't remember what was bothering me.
00:17:39
Speaker
48. She doesn't look a day over 16. But with Kid Flash, I would say the episode that really stuck out to me was episode 7, Denial, where it's a very Doctor Fate-heavy episode, and it's a really fun episode. But Wally kind of gets put into a position where you don't normally see a speedster.
00:18:07
Speaker
The speedsters of the DC universe have very much been rooted in science. The speed force is a measurable field. And Wally gets confronted with, does he believe in things that require faith and fate? And he actually gets a brief tenure as Dr. Fate.
00:18:26
Speaker
But another part of his character that ties into Dr. Fate is he gets to keep that helmet, and he's got a collection of souvenirs. And I really love that as the season's going on, we get to see more and more of these souvenirs just kind of collecting on this little shelf. Oh, yeah. Did you have any other things you want to bring up about Wally West's Kid Flash?
00:18:48
Speaker
Yeah, more on what you were saying about the Flash family being on the science end of things. I think this is the first episode that really pushes that. You see Kid Flash come up with solutions to things here and there, but this was the full expression of how much he dwells in the science.
00:19:07
Speaker
Even with the point of him saying that I replicated Barry Allen's formula or his accident that gave him the powers like he was actually smart enough to realize what the components of that accident were and like replicated to himself like figured it out as a 15 year old Yeah, that's that's a great point because with the The fact that he's often tied into the jokes in the comic relief. He is kind of played
00:19:37
Speaker
as a little bit of a... Well, he's played as a 15-year-old. He has played as a 15-year-old, but yeah, that's a great point that you bring up. He was able to recreate the exact conditions, and that's kind of what makes him so stalwart and resolute in his beliefs in science.
00:19:56
Speaker
So yeah, that's a good point. It seems like a good opportunity to move on to McGann because part of the reason Wally West did have to come to terms with his belief in science versus magic is because in the beginning of that episode, part of his crush on McGann is that he's willing to pretty much say or do anything that will impress her,
Miss Martian's Leadership and Psychic Battle
00:20:18
Speaker
including pretending and believing in magic.
00:20:20
Speaker
Seems like a good opportunity to kind of move on to McGann to me. You just mentioned the fact that she is biologically Martian wise she's 48 years old, but we see her as a 16 year old and
00:20:34
Speaker
That is very, it's critical to her character because especially in the initial episodes, she is all about trying to fit in on earth. She wants to be a part of this team. She wants to be accepted. She's really, really, I don't want to say naive. She's inexperienced, but very well-meaning and very powerful as we see with her telepathy. You know, other,
00:21:03
Speaker
I would say her strongest relationship out of anyone on the team is with Superboy, which is interesting because he's initially the most resilient to having any relationship with anybody else. But I really enjoyed her arc and watching her struggle, not knowing when to use her telepathy and kind of getting the entire team being subject to their frustration and
00:21:32
Speaker
and aggravation understandably so. Really cool to see her, I was in the battle with Mr. Twister who was kind of a knock off of red tornado and they were even convinced that he was red tornado at one point in time.
Introduction of Lesser-Known DC Characters
00:21:48
Speaker
It was really cool to get to see her use her brains. She basically tricked Mr. Twister into thinking that she was red tornado.
00:21:55
Speaker
And that was, that was all her idea. She basically had to get the whole team on board and communicate with them telepathically. Even though earlier in that episode, they were like, nah, you don't do that. What did you think about McGann's journey and did you have any, any big takeaways?
00:22:14
Speaker
My favorite thing about the trick shot in that episode is when they found the guy in Twister and she just picked up a rock and crushed him and Robin flipped out. He's like, I don't know how you do things on Mars. We do not kill here. It's like, well, I didn't kill anybody. He lifts up the rock and you see the angel and she's just like, she's so content. Like I'm figuring this out. I learned something today. Look at my progress, guys.
00:22:39
Speaker
She has been an Earth fangirl for so long and now she's like, it really is like a meet your heroes type of thing where she has the opportunity to be on Earth and like to have that opportunity to actually be acknowledged and be supportive and stuff like that is a big deal to her. Like, yeah, she might not be the first person that you send into a situation, but she's a great asset and a great support character when it comes to communications, transportation,
00:23:05
Speaker
She's the person that can hop between the other members and actually provide what they need within that situation. As you're discussing the role that she plays on the team, I'm reminded that she actually does have a pretty significant story beat in the final episode of the arc that we're discussing here, which is bereft, where we find the entire team in the desert with amnesia.
00:23:31
Speaker
The episode basically takes, she is the protagonist of this episode, she is the first one to be able to get her memories back, and it's kind of her mission of recruiting the rest of the team and getting them all on board. And she ultimately has this great psychic battle with Mr. Simon, which was a character I wasn't super familiar with, but definitely cool to see.
Team Growth During Amnesia Episode
00:23:54
Speaker
That's a good opportunity to just kind of say, that's one thing I really appreciate about the series. I was familiar with characters like Dr. Ivo, Amazo, Red Tornado. I can only imagine if a kid growing up watching this for the first time, if they only had a very brief or surface exposure to DC, this has done an incredible job of introducing lesser known DC characters and motivating you to learn more about them.
00:24:24
Speaker
Most definitely. There's some that on this rewatch, I'm not gonna lie, I don't bother remembering their name because they just, they aren't that prevalent. But Simon is definitely one that comes back a few times and is very problematic for the team. So that episode was really cool to watch again. And one of the things that I was really observant on was
00:24:44
Speaker
This episode took the opportunity to show what these members are capable of doing individually with a lack of resources. Yeah, that's an excellent point.
00:24:58
Speaker
So Robin was probably the first one to go, okay, hold up. Let me evaluate. Where am I? How did I end up here? What's the mission? What's going on? Let me, let me get this. Like he was the first one to just kind of like snap out of it and like collect himself and get himself together. That's fair.
00:25:17
Speaker
while the others were like in a state of panic like yeah superboy actually wasn't even born at this point so he didn't have a mind to bounce back on miss martian was wildly confused kid flash was basically in a state of panic and then like it was when he was in front of artemis that it was like oh hey yeah i'm
Aqualad's Leadership and Atlantis Visit
00:25:37
Speaker
uh
00:25:37
Speaker
I'm here to help out. I'm a superhero. Artemis's line of like, oh, this is my dad probably like setting me up. He probably wants me to kill you or something. I'm just like, I need to know more about your family like now. Right. Right. Who's your dad? Why is he like that? Who's your daddy? Tell me about your daddy. No, that's an excellent point. That is
00:26:04
Speaker
And I think it kind of goes back to speaking to why you chose to break these episodes up the way you did. As I mentioned at the top of the episode, my main takeaway from this arc is that it's all about the formation of the greater team outside of that core that we saw built in the pilot episode and them learning to work together. So it is a great opportunity or a great example, as you put that, as functional as a team they are, they are very capable
00:26:33
Speaker
of operating individually and it was kind of cool to see that showcased after spending so much time with them as a team. But there were a couple of opportunities earlier in the season to spend a little one-on-one time with some characters.
00:26:50
Speaker
I'd say Superboy got kind of his own episode in some regards in schooled when they faced Amazo. It was his journey learning to come to terms with the fact that just because he is the clone of Superman and
Superman and Superboy's Complex Relationship
00:27:08
Speaker
he has the same, well not the exact same power set as Superman, but he's just as capable as Superman. Him learning that
00:27:16
Speaker
he needs to learn something in terms of being tactical and being part of a team. And then also Aqualad kind of got his own episode where he was feeling a little homesick and we actually get a whole episode devoted to him going back to Atlanta, or Atlantis, and it's funny I say Atlanta, that's my hometown. He a dojo boy. Going back to Atlanta, back to Atlantis, and kind of deciding does he want to be,
00:27:42
Speaker
in the world of Atlantis or does he want to exist in the surface world and continue to be a part of Young Justice? Which would you like to go for? Do you want to tackle Superboy or Aqualad, our leader first?
00:27:54
Speaker
I have a few things to say about Aqua, but let's stick with Superboy because one of my favorite things about the Amazo episode was that, especially with how early the episode was, that was a great way of showing what the Justice League was capable of without having to show them.
00:28:15
Speaker
Yeah, that's because it starts off with the news report of them taking like what four or five hours to like all like come together and take a mezzo down but when a mezzo gets put back together and has to deal with the league like they're saying access Martian Manhunter, access Superman, access Flash and you see how those heroes use those powers. Right.
00:28:38
Speaker
And it was a way of showing like, this is how the Justice League would go against the team at this point if they had to fight him, fight them today. So it was cool seeing which powers, which powers and what skill sets are part of their mentors, what kind of stuff they had to deal with. Sure. It's what I said last episode. My favorite thing about this is I don't like
00:29:05
Speaker
I don't like the heroes where the story doesn't operate without them being there because them showing up they just automatically win type of strength. I like to think that Superman, Aquaman, Wonder Woman, Shazam, and Captain Adam are right all about around the same strength level.
00:29:28
Speaker
But when it's like Superman is way up here and then anybody else with super strength just like drops way below.
00:29:38
Speaker
I don't like that level of fluctuation within power levels. And Young Justice doesn't do that. Like, it was. You're invited to explore cypress swamps and magical gardens and float along the rushing waters of an old-fashioned swimming hole. Plan your journey at visitmississippi.org slash outdoor adventure. Mississippi. Wanderers welcome.
00:30:01
Speaker
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00:30:30
Speaker
It wasn't like everybody fought Amazo and Superman showed up, so then it's all over.
Superman's Mentorship Dilemma
00:30:35
Speaker
Right. Like, Superman relies on the League. He works with the people. He has to actually, like, he has to work with them. He's not invincible and he actually takes a beating from time to time.
00:30:47
Speaker
To stay on the topic of Superboy, one of the most awesome scenes in the show is the fact that they start off one episode of Superman saving the bridge that was collapsing and Superboy is coming in to help out and like almost messes him up.
00:31:09
Speaker
Superboy, despite showing how powerful he is, was struggling just to get something as simple as a school bus. Superman actually had to help out with that. But Superman wasn't just like, oh, I showed up. Let me just hold this bridge up with one finger. You see him actually needing to focus and use his abilities and use his strength and actually line up on what he's going with. Just something as simple as Superboy jumping on really threw him off.
00:31:36
Speaker
So seeing the parallels between these characters and how these younger heroes actually have the ability to get up to their mentors, it's a possibility and they show that very early how prominent their skill sets are at this point. Sure, sure.
00:31:57
Speaker
But I do like the fact that even outside of this episode with Canary training Superboy, there are a couple of times later on that we see individual members of the team kind of training against each other. And it's kind of funny that in multiple scenarios, we see one victor come out over another where you might expect it going the other way. And that just goes to speak.
00:32:22
Speaker
how the league works so well together. And you know, Batman has those contingencies. He could technically take out any member of the league if he needed to. You kind of believe that every single member of Young Justice, if push came to shove, they would be able to neutralize the other if they needed to. So that's something I've appreciated seeing along the way. Yeah, so you bring up the fact that we do get a little, we haven't seen very much of Superman.
00:32:51
Speaker
That's one thing about this series. We spent a lot of time, well, not a lot of time, but out of the members of the league, we've gotten a fair amount of time with Batman. And one of the things that he, you can tell he has a vested interest in Superboy. Oh, yes. It's going back to the pilot, it's kind of like Batman and Superboy's standoff where Superboy says, hey, this is happening. You can either get on board or get out of the way.
Batman's Role as Mentor and Father Figure
00:33:23
Speaker
So, Batman has this one-on-one moment with Superman where he's like, hey, we need to talk. And Superman kind of shrugs it off or whatever.
00:33:34
Speaker
It was one of my favorite scenes in the entire series, really, because they go to this diner, Batman's like, or actually Batman as Bruce Wayne, because Bruce Wayne witnessed the whole debacle on the bridge. He gets Superman to appear as Clark Kent at this diner, and I love the fact that Superman orders apple pie, the most American dessert you can get where Batman gets the devil's food.
00:34:03
Speaker
But it's a pretty brief conversation, but it's still interesting. I'll take this pie to go. Exactly. It's still interesting to see how Superman is usually played as so altruistic. This version of Superman, he is rightfully distraught by the presence of Superboy. But you would think any other version of Superman would want to step in and foster a relationship with him, help him learn his power set.
00:34:31
Speaker
but this Superman does not seem willing to do that at all. So we haven't got a ton of payoff other than that, that we got in this episode that Superman is clearly uncomfortable with it. But I'll be looking forward to seeing, seeing where that relationship comes to a head. And this is a Batman that as I mentioned last episode, he has a very commanding presence. There there's even a line where,
00:34:59
Speaker
superboy goes like oh you're gonna put us on a mission like this just keep us busy blah blah blah and Batman just goes do you have something better to do in that tone of presence like room just goes pin drop silence Robin even says at some point like oh yeah like getting Batman to show emotions that's that's a that's a good one
00:35:19
Speaker
And there's plenty of times where he just needs to say one line and everybody just kind of bows their necks and listens to what he has to say. Batman's not somebody you mess with even though he's human. But there's a very wholesome part of one of the episodes. It's the Atlantis episode where you see everybody with their families. Oh yeah.
00:35:46
Speaker
And Robin is really upset by the fact that Batman wanted to talk to Aqualad one on one because he was the leader. And he was training and, side note, watching Robin train and the fact that he can actually punch through a wall as a normal human is pretty amazing. As a 13 year old human.
00:36:06
Speaker
But Batman actually calls him out with the basketball and he was like high end coordination training. But you see, you see him in father mode, like caring father mode.
Aqualad's Tactical Leadership
00:36:16
Speaker
Him and Alfred just kind of like he needs attention right now.
00:36:19
Speaker
Yeah. Nobody else ever sees it that way, but as an audience, you get to like witness like, Oh man, like he actually cares about these people. So he has this level of caring for super boy too. And he wants to make sure that he has that father like presence from Superman because he sees how Robin responds to it. Yeah. No, I'm really glad you brought that because that was an excellent, excellent moment. I mean, Batman and Robin go together, you know,
00:36:50
Speaker
like peanut butter and jelly, they're a classic American icon. But so often we see it from the perspective where Batman is our focal, the one that we're focusing on primarily and Robin's a little bit second fiddle. It is really interesting to see where we focus on Robin.
00:37:12
Speaker
He does have that need for a father figure. He doesn't see Batman just as his trainer or the person that's providing him with the skillset and everything like that. He actually is capable, and it just goes to show that, again, he is still a 13-year-old boy. He's capable of jealousy when he sees Aqualad getting that one-on-one time. But I would say that's a pretty good opportunity to go ahead and move on to our leader of Young Justice, Mr. Kolaram Aqualad.
00:37:42
Speaker
And through discussing the rest of the characters, I think we've already kind of hit on some of the major beats for him. Obviously, he's a little more resilient of a leader. It's not his idea to lead. He just happens to be the most capable and qualified leader, so he's happy to step up into that role with the
00:38:09
Speaker
to say basically with the approval of the team. It's not his idea. It's the team's idea. And he serves that role pretty well. We mentioned, you know, the episode where he goes back to Atlantis. He's having a little bit of a hard time, you know, coming to terms with the dichotomy of his life. You know, he has a home in Atlantis, but he also has a home in the surface world and a family here in the surface world that he's growing closer to.
00:38:38
Speaker
I might be getting a little confused on arcs here. Does he learn about the mole in this set of episodes? I believe he does. I think it's episode... It was the episode after. I thought it was Infiltrator. Oh, no, no, you're right. It is the episode after. Yeah, because I looked that up beforehand because I didn't want to mention it. Oh, okay. No reason. Yeah, I guess really other than him becoming leader, I would say one of my favorite episodes is when
00:39:08
Speaker
Artemis really first had her first mission with the team and they go up against Cheshire. She uses these poison darts that he just takes right into the arm and we find out he has an immunity to jellyfish toxins. I just thought that was a really cool moment. It was cool to see him as a tactical leader pull that trick
00:39:31
Speaker
on Cheshire where, you know, she thinks she has this doctor isolated and who is it? It's actually McGann, but that it wasn't McGann's idea this time. It was actually Aqualad's idea. So pretty cool to see him showcase his leadership qualities and his mind for tactics as well. Did you have any other big takeaways?
00:39:54
Speaker
You were asking last week about kind of like his anatomy and power set and whatnot. And that's something that they definitely addressed a lot throughout these episodes. In the Wally West, Dr. Fate episode, they mentioned when they were trying to find like, oh, like there's no such thing as magic, there's science to everything. That's when they mentioned the whole like bioelectric thing. So it is right.
00:40:17
Speaker
Inexplainable magic, but that's also when Aqualad mentions that there is a whole school just for magic in Atlantis that people are required to take.
00:40:32
Speaker
Uh, so we got an idea of like where his powers come from. It's something that's taught. It's not something that he's necessarily born with and he's pretty dang good at it.
Family Interactions and Personal Bonds
00:40:40
Speaker
Um, I don't know if I noticed it in the first two episodes, but definitely afterwards you see that he has like, um, I guess like webs between his fingers. Oh yeah. So it's very like, like flipper type material. Pretty cool. Just a little details like that. I really need to see.
00:41:00
Speaker
and there was another one oh oh when the when the battle happens in atlantis and mira steps up and she's protecting everybody and putting the bow kicking ass to be honest queen mira was
00:41:15
Speaker
awesome in that yeah especially when she brought up the octopus and she was like protecting the kids and like hitting the other people and throwing them around i was like oh my god that was so wild to watch i love that scene so much like i'm watching i was like is there an octopus i feel i remember an octopus there's the octopus
00:41:34
Speaker
But when Mira is fully accessing her powers, you see the glow on her skin. There's like textures and stuff that come up. So that makes me believe that the light is relevant to what type of magic they're using.
00:41:53
Speaker
And because Aqualad has it go down his arm, I feel like he just got tattoos that kind of like match what his... Like I feel like the tattoos were just a personal choice of his because that's where the lines go in relation to the magic that he uses. Yeah, I don't really have a lot of context to offer outside of that. I just me kind of...
00:42:17
Speaker
theorizing off the top of my head. I wonder if like maybe because they are tattoos, maybe they use the ink of like a squid or something like that. And maybe it helps with the conducting of the, uh, the electricity. Just an idea. Just an idea. That, that little artist with the octopus head that was doing the, I guess a very Roman like artwork. It was really cool hearing the history of the relationship between a counter on
00:42:48
Speaker
I'm forgetting his best friend's name. You got Garth. Garth, yeah. Yes. Party on Garth. Garth and Cawdron caught the attention of Aquaman, and it was because of their assistance, because there were already warriors at that point that were capable of providing assistance, is how Aquaman defeated Prince Orm and became the king of the land. So that little, they do a really good job at giving these quick history lets, even with Dr. Fate, like they gave a quick recap
00:43:17
Speaker
And in that recap of the Just Like Society, they showed Jay Garrick Flash, who showed up at Kid Flash's dinner table. Little things like that.
Artemis's Background and Tensions
00:43:28
Speaker
This was actually the episode where they showed everybody with their families, and it was so wholesome. Yeah, we got to see Kid Flash with his family. This is the first time we got introduced to Artemis' mom, who was in a wheelchair.
00:43:45
Speaker
So refresh my memory. That's our high standard of education. Correct, correct. So this would have seen Superboy and McGann at Mount Justice because that is their home. What happens to them in this episode? I'm sorry, I'm a little foggy, but I feel like this is kind of maybe the first inclinations of a romantic
00:44:09
Speaker
relationship between them, they kind of have a cooking at home incident, if I'm remembering correctly, is that right? Yeah, Red Tornado walked in on them, quote unquote, making dinner. That's right. Yeah. But we did just mention Artemis, and she is the final member to join the team. And again, kind of similarly to Aquaman, you know, discussing all the other characters we've certainly made
00:44:38
Speaker
plenty of references to her, but just to kind of tie it all back together. She is the new protege to Ali, Green Arrow, in the absence of Roy Harper, Speedy, who's now going by Red Arrow. And right out of the gate, we find that she's hiding something. Not only is she not Green Arrow's niece, but
00:45:03
Speaker
Her first mission out the gate, she kind of has, I mentioned she has the most friction with Kid Flash, but she has a little bit of friction with everybody at one point in time. I remember when Superboy's walking away when it's McGann and her watching the perimeter, she's like, hmm, that boy. And McGann immediately gets a little infuriated. You embarrassed him.
00:45:25
Speaker
Everyone can hear you. Oh, I know But the high school drama really doesn't like it Doesn't matter what age you are like the high school drama doesn't get old in this. It's just always so funny to watch Oh, yeah, cuz there was that's uh It's actually the same episode because it's Cheshire Attacking, you know the the nano the nanotech doctor Mm-hmm
00:45:51
Speaker
So all members of the Young Justice team are there with that doctor, and she's like having to listen to this entire telepathic conversation. I liked how Ms. Martian earlier was also like, oh, I've always wanted a sister. I mean, I have 12 on Mars, but a human sister. Yeah, yeah.
00:46:12
Speaker
But it's funny, she's given so much flak throughout the episode, but she ends up earning a lot of goodwill. But at the end, she kind of has to... It kind of gets undone in the fact that we know that she has some kind of relationship to Cheshire. Cheshire knows something about her past, has something over her that she could reveal to the team. So unfortunately, she has to let her go.
00:46:39
Speaker
And that does result in her getting a little bit of ire from the
Red Arrow's Protective Stance
00:46:42
Speaker
rest of the team. But Aquilad had kind of a funny moment. The first time I heard the line, I didn't know how to take it. He was like, and the doctor's safe and no part thanks to you. But then he kind of smiles afterwards. The way he says it, you're like, oh, wow, that's kind of harsh, dude. But then he gives that kind of soft smile where it's like, yeah, you're part of the team. We've all made mistakes.
00:47:06
Speaker
was they did no part thanks to you? I remember hearing that line and I had to pause and say it out loud three or four times because it just didn't sound right. And then when I said it, I was like, oh, that's what he, I gotta say that one line was just some kind of bad writing. Like they could have worded that out. Oh, okay, all right. But it definitely did give me pause, so. Yeah, when I said it again, I was like, okay, I see what they meant to say. They didn't do a good job at that. Yeah.
00:47:37
Speaker
With any TV show, nothing's going to be perfect. I, for one, I take the Kevin Smith kind of stance where if there are things that I don't like as much, I just tend to kind of not focus on them. But it is worth bringing up if you had any kind of issues outside of that. Was there anything that kind of, you know, was a bit of a thorn in your side or you thought there were continuity issues or anything like that? I didn't really have anything.
00:48:06
Speaker
No, it's one of the reasons I appreciate the show so much is that everything that shows up and happens becomes a factor later on. Sometimes you don't even realize it until a rewatch. It's probably like my fifth or sixth time watching this season again. Oh wow.
00:48:22
Speaker
Yeah, I really like the show. I also like the ending of that episode where Red Arrow kind of approaches Artemis in the hallway or in the alley. Very aggressively, like, I know you're not Oliver's niece. I know you're hiding something and I got my eyes on you type of thing. Like, you know, he cares about the team, wants to be a part of it, but he's just like on his moral pedestal of like, I'm right and I'm going to prove it by doing my own thing.
Trivia on Superboy's Voice Actor
00:48:52
Speaker
Yeah, we kind of mentioned he still referred to them as kids and whatnot, but I think what he specifically says is, don't hurt my friends. So it's pretty cool to see that he actually does regard them as friends, even though he's been a little high and mighty and had a bit of a superiority complex.
00:49:11
Speaker
But I mean, he also shows that he deserves it because his whole interaction of saving this doctor from the League of Shadows of all things, which I'm going to point out, I like League of Shadows more than League of Assassins.
00:49:25
Speaker
It just has more mystery in the name, you know? Yeah, I agree. I know it's more, they changed the name for kids and this and that, but it sounds a lot cooler. I'm always gonna call it League of Shadows, I don't care what people say. Well, it's funny that you bring up Assassins, because there's just one thing I wanted to bring up, Superboy.
00:49:44
Speaker
is voiced by Nolan North, who is a veteran voice actor. He's had a lot of roles within the video game community. But I kept, I was like, I recognize Superboy's voice. Where have I heard this voice before? And then it just hit me. Nolan North is doing the same voice he did for Desmond Miles in the Assassin's Creed games. Have you played any of those? Yeah. Interesting. Go back and listen to Superboy. He is Desmond Miles. Huh. Yeah.
00:50:14
Speaker
But anyway, with Superboy still hot on the mind, one of the things that stuck out to me, or just a funny line that he had, was the whole I hate monkeys thing. Very consistent line. Yeah, he's just so full of angst. I love it. And then also with the monkeys.
00:50:38
Speaker
with the robotic flying monkeys when McGann had like six arms come out of her and she was like swatting them one by one the truck driver freaks out she's like what then Wally yells and she yells and has the whole arm coming out of her head yeah yeah that was hilarious it's like bruh this isn't Mars this is normal shit to see on a regular basis yeah the shock factor right now yeah yeah well
00:51:08
Speaker
You bring up Megan or McGann and that's that's one thing I'll kind of go back to so I totally understand why They choose to have her when I go by Megan rather than McGann and whatnot, but it's just kind of Weird for me. I guess it just kind of goes to show that the show did come out About ten years ago now, so I feel like if the show were to come out nowadays people are so on board with you know
00:51:38
Speaker
the weird and wonderful of the comics and whatnot. We wouldn't really need to have that convention. I mean, again, I understand the fact that she's a teenage girl trying to fit in. So it is very, it's appropriate in that regard, but it just kind of makes me wonder, um, as the series go on, as the series progresses, will she continue to embrace this Megan or will we see more
Miss Martian's Cultural Adjustment
00:51:59
Speaker
of Megan? I hope we see more of Megan. Yeah.
00:52:05
Speaker
I mean, as an immigrant, I kind of feel that where it's like you come in and people don't want to take the time to learn your name because it's so different. So they just like come up with something for you. Yeah. Interesting perspective there. Yeah.
00:52:18
Speaker
And because she's such, like I said, she's such a fangirl of earth that that's something that she's just kind of suffering or just kind of like, no one's really gonna know what Megan is from my understanding. So maybe I should switch it up so it's easier for people to say it's like, I'm sorry that you have to do that. Hello, Megan. She's still really, really endearing. I love how altruistic and well-meaning she is. It's a nice balance to some of the more, well, obviously, Aqualad is very stoic
00:52:47
Speaker
and straight-laced. Robin's not without his snide remarks and his penchant for humor. Superboy is totally angsty. That's his thing. He's full of primal. It's funny that he hates monkeys because that's definitely how I would describe him at this point in time is just primal.
00:53:17
Speaker
Wally is definitely the goofball of the bunch.
Character Dynamics Summary
00:53:24
Speaker
And then we've got Artemis here who is still a little bit of a mystery. Did you have any other big takeaways for this particular episode arc that you wanted to get into?
00:53:39
Speaker
It's it's what I was saying before that we backtracked Red arrow in his experience with the League of Shadows like if you're If you have DC knowledge like you know that the league isn't something that you mess with it's not something you typically get out alive It's always the instant reference to Ra's al Ghul So for him to be able to break into one of their fortresses and save this doctor who
00:54:09
Speaker
oh my god that doctor was a bitch like she had to complain about everything like oh they couldn't send in the actual league i wasn't good enough for them they had to send the boy to come get it such of course you know he loved that line right but man seeing him being able to like hold his own and actually get out of there okay and then report straight to the team and then the
00:54:31
Speaker
Robin was so excited. Like, oh, we're gonna take on the League of Shadows. It's gonna be such a big deal. I was like, oh, no, I did all this already. As, as braggy as it is, it justifies him and his position on I deserve to be part of the Justice League. I deserve to be able to work with them. I'm not a sidekick and doing stuff like this proves that I'm not a sidekick. Yeah, like he's he's he's earned the right to be the asshole that he was.
00:55:02
Speaker
in the first two episodes. I won't disagree with that. I've kind of made mention of it, but I really do think that he, in his limited screen time, he's had some of the most dynamic action sequences and best use of the bow and the trick arrows that I've seen in any iteration of the green arrow or archer family.
Voice Acting Praise in Young Justice
00:55:27
Speaker
Yeah.
00:55:29
Speaker
One other takeaway from me, I always kinda, I just mentioned Nolan North and his great job as Superboy, but I always like to give a little bit of a shout out to some of the behind the scenes people that really stand out to me. So we did mention in episode three, we have a character called Mr. Twister, who is very much an evil version of Red Tornado.
00:55:52
Speaker
And this voice actor, I just have to give him some credit because he chewed the scenery so, so well. I loved the way he delivered his lines. He is a gentleman by the name of John Delancey. So he does a great job. It's almost right there being over the top and a little bit too much, but you can just tell he's relishing and being a bad guy and eating up every scene. So I really hope
00:56:21
Speaker
That's a character that we can see return, if not just this voice actor. If he's able to lend his talents in the future, I'll definitely keep an eye out for him.
Episode Wrap-Up and Social Media Sharing
00:56:31
Speaker
Something I've been wondering about, but I haven't quite looked up with, is if the if the the Ciri of the cave is the same voice actress as Artemis. Because it kind of sounds like her whenever they introduce somebody from the Zeta tubes. Hmm. I do not know off the top of my head, but
00:56:48
Speaker
I do, I can't think of the voice actress's name completely off the top of my head. I can actually look it up. I know her first name is Stephanie. Yeah, so Stephanie Lamelan does the voice of Artemis, but that's the only role she's credited with. Let me just double check. Yeah.
00:57:20
Speaker
I believe, yeah, I believe Stephanie Lemelin only voices Artemis. Okay. Oh, no, you are, you are right. She also voices the Justice League computer. Took me a second to get there. Nice. Good catch. That's an excellent catch, dude. Yeah. That's awesome. But, you know, I, we're, we're just kind of mentioning those ones in particular, but I, I,
00:57:45
Speaker
I would say the voice acting all around has been really solid. I don't think there's a weak link amongst anybody. There might be the occasional line of dialogue that makes me give pause, but more often than not, I really appreciate the intelligence of the dialogue as well as, you know, the intelligence of the show. It works for kids and adults, especially for people.
00:58:13
Speaker
Well, I think that's going to wrap it up for, I think that's going to wrap it up for young justice season one, part two, episodes three through nine for the animation deliberation podcast. My name is J Scotty St. Clair. You can find me on Twitter at J Scott for real on Instagram at J Scotty for real. Both reels are R double E L rather than R E L R E A L and that's a number four. Uh,
00:58:44
Speaker
You know, stay tuned to the Animation Deliberation podcast. We're going to have a lot of good stuff coming out here. We are a part of the Stranded Panda Network. It's a home to, it's home to a family of podcasts, including the MCU podcast, the Star Trek universe podcast, and the Star Wars universe podcast.
00:59:04
Speaker
Zuhair, did you have anything you want to plug? I'm still pretty bad at keeping up with my socials, but if you do ever want to check out my work, check out Z Ali Photography on Instagram. Z Ali Photography. I like it. Alright, thanks guys for tuning in. We will definitely look forward to the next entry. Be well. Stay well.
00:59:29
Speaker
one two three get ready for animation deliberation a conversation and a celebration of our favorite animation of our favorite of our favorite action animated series yeah
00:59:47
Speaker
There's a highway that stretches across the 93 days of summer, where worship isn't offered to the sun, but to the smoking tire, the S-curve, and the spin turn. And if you ride it, make sure you do it in a Dodge Charger, Challenger, or Durango. Because on this highway, the lines being blurred are the ones between drivers and demons. Welcome to Highway 93. Dodge is a registered trademark.
01:00:17
Speaker
There's a highway that stretches across the 93 days of summer, where worship isn't offered to the sun, but to the smoking tire, the S-curve, and the spin turn. And if you ride it, make sure you do it in a Dodge Charger, Challenger, or Durango. Because on this highway, the lines being blurred are the ones between drivers and demons. Welcome to Highway 93. Dodge is a registered trademark.