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Kristel Candelario
404 Plays10 months ago
This week on the Mothers of All Crime Podcast we return to our regularly scheduled dose of morbid mother behavior analysis. We review the case of Kristel Candelario (she is not one of the hosts). This Kristel came to public attention after neglecting her adorable 16 month old daughter, Jailyn, to death. She left her baby in a 2x3 foot playpen for at least 10 days. Unsurprisingly when Jailyn's mom returned from a dream vacation she found a lifeless corpse. The extreme horror of Jailyn's decomposition and obvious signs of starvation did not deter this monster from trying to evade consequences. Kristel repeatedly lied to paramedics and the police about the circumstances. Her lies were uncovered quickly and thankfully this evil woman is behind bars for life.
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May contain explicit language and unfounded accusations.
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Transcript
Introduction to Mothers of All Crime Podcast
00:00:23
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the Mothers of All Crime. This is a podcast where we deep dive into mothers involved in infamous crimes and scandals. I'm Monica and this is Crystal.
00:00:36
Speaker
Welcome back to the Mothers of All Crime. This week we have a very upsetting topic. Our mother of the week is Crystal Candelario. It's not me guys. I was going to say you have one thing in common with her. I promise sort I am not a killer yet. No, but your mother can spell also. So that was a ah gift. um Because hers is C it's K R I S T L E L, which I've not seen crystal spelled that way with her. I have seen it spelled that way before. um It's definitely one of the more unique ways of spelling it. But
00:01:19
Speaker
I am not the biggest fan of that spelling. I think it's strange. Yeah. And I'm not partial at all. No. No. Definitely not. um I mean, it's still readable as crystal, I guess. ah Yeah. It's definitely not the way I would spell it. Yeah, and people don't even spell my name correctly, let alone this one. She was definitely not one of the kids that got those monogram key chains that I always looked for and never found my name on it. She probably had an even harder time.
00:01:54
Speaker
I feel like your name is the right way to spell it though. And so that there should be more key chains. You would think I was that little kid that if I saw it, I don't care what it was, I wanted it because my name was spelled right for like the longest time because it never was a thing. Yeah, well, you know, my husband has never had something like that in his life. That's true. His is you have to customize his. Yeah, his mom, his mom has customized some and like, just, you know, written some extra letters taken off some letters very nicely done, but they're never just available like all of us can be named Monica and have this option. Okay. Yeah, I mean, it's not a super common name, although where I currently work, there are several people named Monica. So
00:02:41
Speaker
But that's new for me. I don't usually, like my at my elementary school, my middle school, my high school, I was the only Monica that I knew. um In college, I knew another Monica, but yeah, it's not a very common name. I'd agree with that. I don't think I really knew any Monicas until I met you. And if I did meet a Monica, I'm sorry. ah Well, they just hailed in comparison, clearly. They were not. Met me. I broke the mold. All right. Well, Ms. Crystal is from Ohio. Tell me about why we're going to talk about her today.
The Viral Incident of Crystal Candelario
00:03:20
Speaker
So she was super viral on TikTok, which is where I saw this story because in the summer of 2023, between June 6 and June 16, 2023, she left her 16 month old child.
00:03:39
Speaker
alone in a playpen while she was on vacation. And when she returned, the child had passed away. And it blew up on the news. People were absolutely horrified. There is very disturbing audio um that was caught on neighbor ring cameras, which we will not play on this episode. So no one needs to worry about that. um But it definitely caught national and international attention just because of the level of cruelty and neglect, which I don't think that people expect from anyone, but definitely not a mother. And it was just like the ultimate betrayal and act of evil.
00:04:26
Speaker
and um Yeah, the judge who went over the case actually even kind of touched on the fact that you would never expect a mother from society to do something like this. yeah His actual words were, a bond between a mother and child is one of the most purest and sacred bonds between human beings. And this is what she did basically through her child. She also, I think is important to mention, she's 32. She's not this 16 year old child raising a child. Not that that makes it excusable, but at that point in your life, in your 30s, you recognize what age a child is able to do anything on their own. Like get a glass of water by themselves, maybe stay an hour or walk home from school to stay a night by themselves.
00:05:19
Speaker
not a 16 month old. No one in their right mind is leaving an infant by
Neglect and Misaligned Priorities
00:05:25
Speaker
themselves. I think that's just one of the big things for me was her age and the importance of a trip with her man friend um was more important. I mean, I'm definitely not here to slut shame anyone, but it was a huge misalignment of priorities. Like that is such a Such a small way to say something so horrible, but it just, I mean, I think the mental health stuff, I was clearly the only defense, but I also want to say something that I didn't realize until we started looking into this case for the podcast is that she has another child who was seven years old when this incident happened. So you have raised a child from zero to seven. So you know, the stages of development and the levels of autonomy
00:06:15
Speaker
that take place between zero and seven. And Jalen was only 16 months old. So as an experienced mother in her 30s, there's no way that you think that this is in any way acceptable, doable, not going to have some sort of horrific outcome. I mean, it beggars belief. Absolutely. And you did mention that she was gone for about, I think it was 10 days if my math is right. And there's video camera footage of her leaving her home two days before that and not bringing her child. So her baby was again left alone. We don't know where she went during that period. I wish i couldn't find anything on it. So yeah clearly this is a pattern of her leaving her children unattended.
00:07:10
Speaker
So you have to wonder how often she had done this for a day, two days, three days at a time with both children. um And there was, quote, no issues. So she didn't see the problem and then extending it a little longer, extending it a little longer. And she took this big romantic vacation. She went to Puerto Rico there. If you Google her name, one of the first pictures that comes up is this beautiful picture of her standing on a beach with the water behind her, like a great vacation photo. And then the next photo is her mug shot. like
00:07:49
Speaker
I know. most Those are like the pictures. Right. Because the internet really wants you to see like this is what she was doing while her baby was fighting to stay alive by themselves. Yeah. Yeah. And I saw some interviews of her neighbors that said that it was a regular occurrence that children were being left alone unattended in her home and that they could regularly hear kids crying. And that makes me not blame the neighbors necessarily, but is is that not something that would necessary necessitate a welfare call? like Is there no sense of accountability for these other adults that are aware that a very not safe situation is clearly taking place? Yeah. And that's what's so complicated with things like this because you have something called the standby effect where you just assume someone else is going to make that phone call.
00:08:46
Speaker
Oh, someone had to have called the police by now because anyone who decides to go look up that ring cam footage on their own, you're going to hear blood curdling screams from an infant that is heard from the neighbor's house on their ring camera. So that is a very, very, very loud scream and nobody did anything. And I completely agree with you where I can imagine hearing that regularly as an individual and not calling the police, but there is a lot of instances where there's really horrific moments happening that someone goes to themselves. Oh my God, someone had to have already called. There's no way. I don't need to. Yeah, definitely. I think there's also like a fear of CPS, a fear of the police, a fear of getting involved.
00:09:40
Speaker
um I mean, none of that is. a really good justification for not stepping up and helping this child that was clearly in distress, or even knocking on the door at the house, like, is everything okay in here? I mean, they could clearly see her car is not in the driveway. But I mean, that doesn't mean that there's not someone else staying at the house with the kids, like anything can be happening. But she also could have, like the mother could have come home and hit her head and was dead on the kitchen floor. And then the same thing would have happened where that child would have been just left alone. Like there clearly was no level of noise that could have happened in that home that someone was willing to like check on them. And it's, I don't know, it's very disturbing. It is. And it's one of those moments where you have, that's going to haunt you from people who worked on this case. um yeah You have the detectives, the attorneys,
00:10:41
Speaker
And a lot of people involved who all of them are saying that the facts of this case are going to haunt them for a long time just because of the pure innocence of the victim. um So like you mentioned, this baby was left alone in a pack and play. Originally had a couple bottles of milk, but other than that, which is not enough to last them one day, let alone 10. She had no food, no water, no protection. She was found covered in her own feces because again, at 16 months old, they're not getting up and really moving much. um Yeah. And it was actually determined, and I think this part is the one that broke my heart the most, which is saying something for a case like this. This baby fought like no one else. And it was actually determined that she had died merely
00:11:37
Speaker
very, very soon before Krystal had returned. So she lasted probably eight days fighting for her life and so could have totally had it one phone call and by anybody. This baby girl would have been alive.
00:11:58
Speaker
Yeah, I definitely want to talk about the circumstances in which um Crystal coming home from this great vacation, and Puerto Rico is a beautiful place to take a vacation. Oh, sure. She went to Detroit first, and then she went to Puerto Rico. My understanding is she had a boyfriend in Michigan, and then she went to Puerto Rico with a different boyfriend. Again, not here to slut shame, but that is what was mentioned during the trial.
Attempting to Cover Up Neglect
00:12:22
Speaker
Um, but when she did come home from the trip, she found Jalen had passed away in a state in a disgusting filthy playpen, um, in extremely soiled clothes. And she made a hysterical 911 call, which was horrible to listen to. And she sounds genuinely devastated. But in that period of genuine devastation, she managed to
00:12:53
Speaker
clean off and redress her deceased child. And proceeded to lie to paramedics and lie to the police and say that, oh, you know, she wasn't feeling well the last few days and she was refusing to eat. And, you know, she just didn't want to take a bottle. So I i should have taken her to a doctor. I didn't realize it was this serious. Like she had a lot of different explanations. And she was even trying to say that she was only in Michigan. Like she didn't mention anything about Puerto Rico. And she said that she was in Michigan to do Ubering. And then she couldn't provide any information about where she was staying or how long she was gone. Like her story just wasn't holding up at all. um But it's just highly, highly disturbing to me that she had the presence of mind to redress her.
00:13:50
Speaker
Yeah. And I think that's where it comes down. Like there's something in her subconscious that knew it was wrong and she needed to protect herself because on that phone call, she was saying that things verbiage, like my baby is dying when she is fully aware that her child is in her hands dead, not struggling, not fighting dead. So from the minute she got home, she went into, I need to protect myself mode. At least that was my thought where right I have to make it seem like this is spontaneous. And I don't know what happened. How do I cover my tracks? You know, it really reminded me a lot of Shonda Bonderarck and how she pretended that her son was on a hunger strike and that she was so shocked at how thin he was and how gaunt he was. And it's like,
00:14:47
Speaker
You have been systematically torturing this kid. And it's very similar here. You know exactly what happened. And this was very predictable and preventable. And yeah, I got to agree with you. I completely agree. And I think we've talked about a lot of mothers thus far that have gone into a protection mode for themselves. um We have a lot of parents or caretakers that their reaction was to quote, fix everything up or how to help themselves. Marissa is the one that came to mind for me where I'm going to put them in a clean set of the clothes, bundle them all up and pass them off because clearly they're fine because I don't want to admit that they aren't.
00:15:44
Speaker
Exactly. because they know and had refused to think about, because I feel like to even have any kind of an enjoyable trip, she had to completely block out what she knew was going on at home. Like she had to just put that out of her mind. And so I do think she was quite shocked when she got home, but not, but she shouldn't have been. Like it should have been exactly what she expected. But she just had to block it out. And I think that that's the mental health struggles I feel conflicted about. I think that that I mean, her that was really the only defense that came up because there was no defense and she did plead guilty to everything ultimately. But they were saying that she had been having issues with depression, and she was not taking medication. And after she started taking medication, she was like a whole new person.
00:16:43
Speaker
But I have some skepticism with that as well because I just feel like that's convenient and manipulative in a certain way. Like that's great I guess if she just needed antidepressants and she's suddenly a whole new person and she's doing so much better now but I find that kind of hard to believe given her circumstances and I think that she wants to keep support from her family and the people that she still has in her life. So she had to provide some sort of explanation.
Family Claims and Medication Excuses
00:17:19
Speaker
And that's pretty much all she could come up with. Yeah, and I will say I did find some comments made by her parents that came out um saying that mental again, mental health had been a struggle for her for a while. um When they spoke about it, they didn't
00:17:38
Speaker
mention any diagnosis or in specific, but they did say she had stopped taking medication for whatever mental health she was dealing with. And when she would ever stop that medication, her ability to make sound decisions became impaired. And she basically was completely irrational and did a lot of things she shouldn't have during those periods. And her family was saying things like they weren't aware that the baby was by themselves. and that's where I also have a hard time but this is just my personal history with my family of if I'm going on a 10-day vacation even like to the state next door like my family's aware just because I personally have a pretty good relationship with my family and I know a lot of people don't have that where they go on international vacations
00:18:30
Speaker
not that Puerto Rico is international, but and don't share things like that. But it's also hard for me to be like, hey, you have a grandchild, you're just going to go two weeks without even realizing they're not okay. Like I struggle with that one, particularly if they're saying that they know enough about her when she takes medication and when she does it. So things just help weave with me. The parents are a big question mark to me because My understanding is that they were watching her other child, Amaya. Right. So where do you think the toddler is? Yeah. Cause my first instinct was sometimes parents do need a break and it's easy to like take care of the little one where they don't need like as much
00:19:22
Speaker
attention sometimes where they like take naps and they kind of lay there versus a seven year old like energetic wants to do stuff needs more stimulation. Sometimes I'm sure you need a break. We're like, hey, you're right on the road. Can you take the older one lie, take a break and kind of recoup but for 10 days 12 days. Yeah, exactly. And also seems weird. There were other interviews that I saw from her neighbors that had said that Crystal was constantly pushing her kids off on anybody she could, and she was always asking people to watch them, and she had burned a lot of bridges, excessively asking for favors where she would leave her kids for long stretches of time. But in my mind, if the parents know, if the parents slash grandparents know that she is mentally unstable, they know that she is
00:20:20
Speaker
traveling a lot that she's always pushing her kids off on other people and they have one of her kids. I feel like they have some sort of level of, unless she just totally lied to them about where Jalen was. It's like, did you not even ask? And it's not like her father's watching her. Yeah. And that's where I have a hard time personally, because I go with At what point though, is it not their responsibility? Because yes, they should be aware and be like curious, but they can't be held responsible because like it's not their kids and how their child chooses to raise their child in the eyes of the like, they have no legal right to go and take that kid. Like that's where I have a hard time of from a moral standpoint. Absolutely. They should have been at that door. I don't understand how they wouldn't be.
00:21:18
Speaker
But then from a like other side of, if you don't have a good relationship, you're older, you didn't choose to have these children, but now you're responsible for this seven year old for extended periods of time on and a regular basis. That's exhausting. like i mean You have that tough situation. Yeah, maybe they're like, oh, we can't handle both kids. like You can find someone to watch Jalen, right? And she's like, sure. ah I mean, I don't know. Cause I see there's this, um, she's on YouTube and Tik TOK. She's this like, uh, she's a judge that does child support cases and she's fantastic and I'm blanking on her name right now, but there are so many cases that come in front of her that are grandparents suing their children for child support because they're taking care of their grandkids.
00:22:16
Speaker
And almost every single time they go, I didn't ask for these, I raised my kids. I didn't ask for more kids that I'm now responsible for. And I have a feeling her parents, and this is speculation, her parents are in that same situation where they have a seven year old in their house, they never asked to have, and they don't necessarily want the second one. But at what point should you have stepped in. And I'm sure now they're sitting there just horrified with the situation because firm like they came out and ended up saying that the baby had lost seven pounds in two months when they were from the doctor's appointment that they went to, to when she was found. And that's a lot of weight to lose for such a small, when you're supposed to be gaining weight at that age,
00:23:14
Speaker
losing weight, seven pounds in two months. It's an extreme weight loss for a 16 month old. um It just feels like did something happen that you go from taking a child to a pediatrician appointment to two months later, you have starved and neglected them to death. Like I just feel it's such a disconnect. And Crystal had been pretty high functioning and she worked as a substitute teacher and she had managed to keep custody of her seven-year-old. And I just, it's shocking to me how quickly this seems to have just completely unraveled.
00:24:01
Speaker
So before we get into speculations on how that happened, because I have a couple theories.
Sentencing and Prison Repercussions
00:24:09
Speaker
They are crazy theories that I can't believe are going to come out of my mouth, but theories nonetheless. I do think we should mention that the court case, like you said, she didn't end up pleading guilty. She was charged with one count of aggravated murder and one count of child neglect, ultimately being sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole for one count and eight years for the second. And the eight years is to run concurrent with her life sentence as well.
00:24:39
Speaker
So she's not getting out, which I'm happy about because me too a lot of people hear life in prison and they think that actually means life. And that's actually not true. Life in prison, if you have the option, ability for parole, they're out in 25, 35 years. And she's 30. That means she's out in her sixties to me. I, until I started studying criminal justice, I also was in that boat of life meant life. Like you're on this earth, you're in prison, but that's not the case. And there's a lot of people that have done really horrific things that get out and reenter our communities. And she was not given that possibility. So she actually will be in life for the rest of her life behind bars. Thank goodness.
00:25:37
Speaker
Thank goodness. Nobody deserves it more. Oh, yeah. Her parents did plead for mercy with her sentencing, which which I think is just the instinct of being a parent. Like they're grieving this baby. Now they have to grieve. They're basically their daughter as well. um Yeah. But I will say she's going to have a hard time in prison. When you were sentenced, there are Criminals are criminals, but there are still inside there are rules and people who have victimized children do not do well. um There are people that have murdered multiple people and they will kind of get looked at as like the top dogs. But the minute that they find out that, oh, you victimized a child, your life is going to be a living hell.
00:26:34
Speaker
As it should be, in my opinion, you deserve everything you get if you victimize a little baby who can't even defend themselves.
00:26:44
Speaker
And it was super viral online. So, and a lot of prisons have access to the internet, like they can get TikTok, Instagram, whatever. So they know, like she's recognizable. Oh, and people talk, like don't get me wrong. yeah Like there are ways that prisoners find out about people's charges, if it is from the prisoners themselves, if it's from media, like you said, if it's from the guards, ah they find out if it's if it's a child, one way or another, just a matter of time.
00:27:22
Speaker
By a little comfort. I know, right? Like, don't get me wrong, I don't want hard to come to anybody. But you know, there's blind spots that maybe be her for people like that. Yeah. yeah
00:27:35
Speaker
So what do you think her mindset was on how she could justify to herself on going, she basically it was 12 days in my opinion because she had those two days gone, she returned for like a hot minute and then she went on vacation for 10 days. So in my brain that's 12 in reality. So If that's the case, because I wasn't sure if she actually left for the full two days or if she'd been in and out for those two days. I wasn't, I wasn't sure, but let's say the things I found the camera footage that I found basically saw her leaving and there was nothing of her until she came back two days later. So my personal theory, um, wait, you want me to say,
00:28:27
Speaker
her mindset or her. Yeah. Like, how do you think what happened? Because it's the same though. a little bit of fo Yeah. Like, how do you think she got to that point? So what I think Mike, like my best guess is that she had been gradually leaving Jalen alone for longer and longer periods of time. And nothing that bad had happened. So she thought she could push it. And she pushed it really, really far. I think it was just like, she'll be fine. She'll be fine. And then she just was on her fuck-cation, drinking Mojito's, doing whatever. And she was just on purpose, not thinking about her kid at all. And I think maybe she was a little surprised when she saw like the state of decomposition that she was in when she got home. But if she'd been leaving her regularly for four or five days,
00:29:27
Speaker
maybe she thought 10 wouldn't be that bad. I mean, the medical examiner said that she probably died between June 9th and June 13th, and she left on the for the trip on June 6th. So she did survive for three, four, five, six days. And if she had come back in six days, she may have found her alive and no one would ever know this happened. And I wonder if maybe previously she had left her for six days. here
00:29:59
Speaker
So that's kind of what I think. I completely agree. I think that she definitely had been doing that for a while. We know she did it for two. I guarantee that was not the first time. ah I also think that she got in her head that she had taken so many people over time of Hey, will you go check in on them? Hey, will you go do this? That someone probably would have just stopped by and done it and like scooped her out. I think it was a combination. Cause you have, like we've touched on, she had burned so many bridges. I wonder if she had been telling people about this trip and like her neighbors maybe and just assumed, well someone will call my parents or they'll stop by or
00:30:53
Speaker
if i If they don't, she'll be fine. She's been home for five days by herself before and it wasn't a big deal. I think it just got a little too far. And I also wonder to get it out of her head if while they were in Puerto Rico, there was drugs involved or obviously a lot of drinking and her like romantic trip, her mind is on something else. But if this was also kind of coerced of I know a lot of people in those types of relationships that they plan to come home on Friday and then change their flight to like Tuesday. Because if your employment is a substitute teacher and an Uber driver, you can kind of do that whenever you want.
00:31:45
Speaker
So sure she might've initially been like, oh, I'll just go for like three or four days. And then she's there having the time of her life. All right. I'll change my date and not thought, Hey, I have a baby at home by herself. Totally. And I think that she pushed it further for sure than she was planning to, because she did go to Detroit for two days before she went to Puerto Rico. She's in Puerto Rico for like eight days. So maybe she thought. Like, oh, you know, it's only eight days. Like, she has a couple bottles of milk. You know, she's in her playpen. What can really happen? And I mean, to you and I, that's absolutely insane. But like, if you've already been leaving her for five or six days prior, then maybe it doesn't seem that insane. And then she was like, well, I need to go to Detroit. I need to see him and she'll be fine. She'll be fine. I do think it's really interesting and super sad if she kind of thought
00:32:44
Speaker
that one of her neighbors would go check on her or that her parents would show up. I wonder if her parents had keys to her house and she thought that they would like just go over on a whim and see if the baby was there and needed help. I mean, that's devastating to think about. It's possible. Yeah. Cause I mean, she did seem really, really surprised when she came home and found her like that. Yeah and that's why I like because my instinct just reading like the headlines was this was her way of getting rid of the baby without doing it like physically herself and then you listen to the recordings and like the tapes and things and she did generally sound just horrified and
Crystal's Justification and Lack of Backup Plan
00:33:36
Speaker
well if not she's an amazing actress if not
00:33:40
Speaker
She may be an amazing actress. She may be super mentally unwell, but she also maybe didn't realize the graphic gruesomeness she would come back to even if the baby had passed away. Like maybe she thought she'd just be able to play it off the way she did ultimately try to and just be like, oh, well, you know, she wasn't really eating and she's been sick. And when she came home and saw this state that the baby was in, I mean, I would imagine that even if you killed her on purpose, that would still be horrifying to see and deal with and smell. And it's just every part of that experience would be so horrifying that you would maybe sound panicked on the song. Maybe, I don't know. Yeah. I don't know. Because it's, it just is really shocking still, even after doing this for as many episodes and listening to some really horrid cases.
00:34:40
Speaker
I think part of it is just because how innocent the baby is. They're so little. And my I guess my mindset is like, she put her in the pack and play of like, well, she's not near sharp object. She's not near the step. She's safe in the pack and play. She can't get anywhere. You know, but i her so home by herself is not okay. But in her twisted mind, if she's in the pack and play, she's fine. It sounds like she created a dog. Like, that is a much closer equivalent. Like, that's not what a pack and play is. So like, that's not what a crib is supposed to be used for. You're not actually still supposed to leave. That's a really good comparison. I think that's probably maybe what she was thinking of. It's like, confined, so she's fine. Yeah, and it is safer for a dog to I mean, it's a there's different ways different schools of thought on that. But
00:35:40
Speaker
we can find our dog to a crate when he's home alone because he's less anxious and he doesn't get into things that could possibly harm him. And we also have cameras where we can watch him while we work. And so he's always being supervised, but also we would never ever leave him for days. I mean, it's right. You guys leave for like what? but a work day and you come home and he's fine. But if you were going even overnight, you're like, Hey, someone come check in on my dog. But this woman doesn't think that for her child. Yeah, I mean, I we just went on vacation and I left him with my brother because he's gonna watch him. like He's gonna take care of him. He's gonna feed him and walk him. And it's just like he needs things every single day.
00:36:32
Speaker
Just, I mean, he needs less things than Jaylen did, but he still needs food and water and interaction and exercise. And it's so cruel because it's not even just like the food deprivation that child experienced. It's the terror and the but people testifying at the trial. Oh, it was so gutting because they were talking about um separation anxiety windows. And how you know babies go through stages of development and they have certain windows where they have extreme separation anxiety. And Jalen was smack dab in the middle of that window. Like a child needs their mother all of the time at that age. it is It was torture. And I find it kind of ironic that the father had not been in the picture at all.
00:37:28
Speaker
And the reasons that I could find him for that was that he was abusive while she was pregnant and she didn't want Jalen to be exposed to him. It's really ironic. Did we have like proof that he was abusive or because we don't have to say this. The other thing is there's a lot of absence fathers and let's go with some statistics here of the area that she was in. It was in the Cleveland area. There's a lot of absentee fathers, unfortunately, and it could have been a really violent relationship. He could have been into drugs, alcohol. There's a lot of reasons, but it also could have just been someone, one of the many boyfriends she had, because even now she has more than one. right She happened to get knocked up. They didn't want a baby and they peaced out.
00:38:26
Speaker
Well, he never even met Jalen because he lives in Ecuador. And so he's not in the country. She met him on Facebook. They went to the Dominican Republic on a vacation who knows where Amaya was. And bad so they had sex, they conceived Jalen, and then they were trying to do long distance. And then she has claimed that he was physically abusive to her during a trip that she took to see him while she was pregnant. And so they weren't involved. I guess she would still FaceTime him sometimes with the daily, but I mean, it had to be a better situation for her to be with her father than her mother. Like it, it's almost inconceivable to me that he could have possibly been worse. So it's like if, I mean, maybe he didn't want her, but if he had any semblance of wanting her, that's probably where she should have been.
00:39:17
Speaker
the And it's hard to have some sympathy for a deadbeat dad. But I do think like the international situation of it makes it very complicated. And it does. yeah But it also makes it very easy to accuse him of being abusive when he can't defend himself too. That's very true. And he found out online that she died, which is had to be, I mean, the series of horrifying realizations that he had to make. Because I
00:39:48
Speaker
I'm sure he did not know that was going on because they they weren't together. So he probably didn't know anything. And I mean, it's the worst possible outcome. And it's had to be so distressing for him and his family. And I just think that there are so many people that could have given this child a good home. I mean, maybe not her father. I don't know anything about him. But someone, like if you do not want your child, there are options. Like you can literally leave a child at a fire station. You can bring it to a hospital. you She still could have put her up for adoption. Like there are so many things. She could have called CPS herself and relinquished her rights. No one's going to force you to keep her. Yeah. And I think it sounds like
00:40:38
Speaker
she was just overwhelmed maybe with two. One was enough and then like the second one kind of being obviously unplanned made it difficult for her. But like you said, there's so many options. In Alabama right now, there's actually a movement happening of inputting safe haven baby boxes in all of the fire stations. And it's all over TikTok right now by this one woman who's really driving it for this exact reason of, listen, Some people don't want to be parents. Some people change their mind. Some people just realize they can't take care of their kid. Or some kids people just don't want them. like yeah And all of those are valid if that's your opinion. That's fine. But do it in a way that is still protecting the kid. Because it's not their fault you changed your mind. ah Go to the fire station. Hand them over. Because if you call CBS and you give up your kid, they're now going to look into you with your other child.
00:41:35
Speaker
I don't know how it works if you drop them off. If you want to keep one. Right.
00:41:43
Speaker
Which I mean but you can't imagine being like, I want this one. Even in places where they didn't have the boxes though, I mean, I don't know if she knew this, but it was already still a law that you could relinquish your child at a fire station or a hospital without involving CPS. Like you can anonymously just do it. She would have had to probably do it as a newborn though. But I don't know what the point was of her raising and nurturing this child to whatever extent she did for 16 months. And I mean, everyone that knew them said that she was well fed. She was clean. She was clothed. She was developmentally normal. Her doctor's appointments were all normal. It's a lot of effort. It's a lot of money. It's a lot of time. For what? Like it just...
00:42:34
Speaker
I mean, thank goodness it's very incomprehensible. Yeah, I can't even imagine.
00:42:44
Speaker
But I mean, hi I feel bad for the father because there's one part of this case that just isn't really much known about. And this is a everyday kind of case in the world of true crime. and It kind of shows the public that there is a lot of things when it comes to criminal cases that don't get brought in, that don't get brought up because it's determined to irrelevant. And you and I love talking about stuff like this, so we want to know all this information. But at the end of the day, in a case like this, the father's international baby daddy, his presence doesn't matter. He wasn't involved. And she wasn't going to go ship her kid into a different country to go on vacation. It's not reality.
00:43:33
Speaker
So it's, I want to be like, well, why wasn't the father involved? He should have like stepped in. But then you remember he's in a different country. He could, for all we know, he could have been asking constantly, Hey, if you don't want her, I'll take her, send it to me, leave her here, bring her to me, blah, blah, blah. And she was like, no, I don't need you. There's so much here. We don't know. And it's just the reality of having a normal person on trial. I did want to double check though, just for Ohio what the law is for safe havens. And in 2001 safe haven laws were enacted in Ohio, but the child does have to be under 38 days old. That's when there's no questions asked. So and it was it was way past that point, but I think that would have been a very good option for her to consider.
00:44:29
Speaker
in the super early days of Jaylen's life. If it's too much, if you don't want to be involved with the father, if you can't take care of her, you're mentally unwell, you want to go on a vacation for 10 days and you don't have a baby's like, I just think that so much of this situation was predictable and preventable in a way that's completely inexcusable. And she should have much, much, much, much earlier. realized that she didn't have the capacity to deal with this.
00:45:05
Speaker
Yeah, it is interesting where there's that cutoff line, which I think would be really something that the state should kind of look into where there are a lot of situations where people end up with children that they didn't plan for and after a while it becomes too much or they can't handle it either emotionally, financially, whatever the case is. I feel like that first 30 days, like that's a really short period when your emotions are all kind of all over the place. And it's all new to make that kind of like life altering decision. I feel like that's not very fair. Yeah, I think maybe three months or six months would be
00:45:54
Speaker
I mean, what are they going to do though? If you put a baby that's three months in a safe haven box, or you leave it at a fire station, like they're not going to take it, or there's going to be an investigation. I just wonder what actually happens if you try with the older kids. I don't know. Yeah. I would assume i mean the police would probably be involved and they figure out whose kid it actually is. Yeah, I guess that doesn't, that would just be abandonment then. Right. And that's another type of neglect where you're still going to go to prison for that. Hmm. I mean, for moms who are truly in crisis, there needs to be some sort of options. Option for sure. Without like causing you to fear of like the
00:46:45
Speaker
never being able to have your kit. It's because, for example, Crystal had two kids. Clearly the second one, this is us speculating, assuming she has a soul, the second one became too much and she just couldn't handle it anymore. But she knew she could handle the first one. There should be some kind of option where you can go and be like, hey, I need resources to help me with daycare. or employment or whatever it is, without the risk of them taking your children completely, you having the courts involved in your life, like there has to be some kind of social service implemented to help these moms who generally want the help. Because it's also probably people, which also might be Crystal, who doesn't want that help and just wants it to go away. like Yeah, I don't know that Crystal would access those resources if they had been available, but
00:47:42
Speaker
I do think there should be, I don't know. Like I feel like emergency temporary respite care through foster care is a great idea in theory. Um, but I don't, I think that Crystal knew though, that she didn't have like good justifications for why she needed help because she wasn't needing help for going to work for she didn't she needed She wanted to go on vacation for 10 days. Like the state is not gonna help you with a luxury like that. And I think that Crystal was not accepting of her reality um and was just in complete denial of her responsibilities and obligations and what's really important. And i I don't know if they're, I think in general, it would be really good for those resources to be in place, but I don't think k Crystal would have accessed them if they existed. And I don't think she would have qualified for them because she wasn't actually in some sort of emergency situation. It was just like, I feel like going away. Right. And I and i don't know what steps she took to try to get childcare for Jalen. It doesn't seem like anyone's coming forward to say, you know, she begged me for to watch Jalen this time. It's all stuff in the past.
00:49:08
Speaker
So I feel like this was her plan A, as upsetting as that is. Yeah. And I feel like if you burn enough of those bridges, people are going to stop answering your calls too. Like, why am I going to keep helping you if all you do is dump your kid on me? Yeah. And you know, she's not paying them. Like, she's just like, here, watch them. Thanks. Bye. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I don't think she was being very grateful. I don't think she was communicating well. She would leave that the children way longer than she was supposed to. And I think that she didn't really care how anybody else felt. And it was just her world. And it's just like a very narcissistic attitude. Yeah. Oh, absolutely.
00:49:57
Speaker
so Well, i clearly, I know. I was going to say clearly we treat our pets better than she treats her children. Yes. I think the last thing I want to put out is what the lead detective on the case said at sentencing because I thought it was really powerful. He, I don't remember the name of the poems, but when you like take out a word and then you say a sentence for each word, he spelled out Jaylen's name. and said, J is for justice that will be received today. A is for an angel wing she earned on that dreadful day. I is for incredible a reputation, build up for suspense, for a death that clearly makes no sense. L is for a lack of love,
00:50:49
Speaker
well alone for 11 days, Y is for young life that was taken away, N is for new eternal life Jalen gained on that day. No child should ever have to die that way." And I just thought, A, beautifully written, but also it was so powerful for a sentencing hearing where during sentencing, that's when the offenders are getting the time they're going to serve in prison. And I think that was really powerful for the judge from a detective specifically showing that this is more than just a dead human being. This was something that was completely preventable and uncalled for. So I just thought it was really powerful and very nicely worded by the the police department.
00:51:47
Speaker
I definitely agree. And as upsetting as I'm sure it was for everyone, it is sort of nice how moved all of the people that worked on this case clearly were. The detectives, the judge, the lawyers, even the defense attorney. Everyone was deeply, deeply moved by Jalen's life and the loss of her and the horrible circumstances that she endured. And I just
00:52:16
Speaker
I guess it's sort of, it's, I don't know, it's meaningful that there were so many people advocating for her in death. It would have been better, obviously, if anyone had known that she needed these advocates in life, but at least her murderer did not get away with this. And there was a lot of people who were very impassioned and very dedicated to seeking justice and making sure she is locked up forever.
00:52:50
Speaker
um So I think a lot of people put a lot of hard work into this case, and I'm sure it was gutting for them to do that. Yeah, absolutely. Well, that was my last thought. Was that yours or do you have another one? i think these are I think these are my last thoughts. I'm going to be doing a lot of thinking, though, about safe haven laws and how they can be improved. Um, I just, it's, it's an interesting topic and I think that it'll come up in future episodes that we do, especially talking about in Banticide because safe haven boxes are such a good alternative to that. Um, so I, I think that ah this will come up again, but otherwise I think I'm good. Yeah. Well, thank you for talking about my evil twin with me. She she stole your name.
00:53:46
Speaker
I know, even though she knows of me, but clearly she ruined it. I know. And her birthday is September 11th, which I also thought was very dark. Like that's super random and it doesn't matter, but I just thought that was very dark. That is just adds to the sadness. Like that birthday just always is a bummer. So yeah, stood out to me.
00:54:13
Speaker
Until the next, well, absolutely horrible mother. Yes, until the next one. Thanks for listening with us. Bye.