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Everything, Everywhere, All At Once - That IS Punk
5 Plays5 hours ago
This is the only movie you ever need to see about the multiverse. Seriously, everyone please stop trying, this movie perfected the genre. Come with us on a cosmic journey through time and place where nothing matters, so everything is possible. Just bring the essentials: your fanny pack, some googly eyes, and your best space-queen-cult leader-bagel outfit. Let's unlock our unused potential
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt6710474/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_6_tt_8_nm_0_in_0_q_every
https://web.archive.org/web/20230310214154/https://www.vogue.com/article/everything-everywhere-all-at-once-costume-designer-academy-awards
https://www.wnyc.org/story/big-picture-designing-costumes-everything-everywhere-all-once/
https://newsletter.oscars.org/news/post/shirley-kurata-everything-everywhere-all-at-once-costume-design-interview
Music: Cassette Deck by Basketcase
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Transcript
Introduction and Movie Excitement
00:00:00
Speaker
I'm Melinda. I'm Ariel. This is Hot Set, the movie podcast about costume design.
00:00:22
Speaker
Hello and welcome back to another episode of Hot Set. We are continuing on our journey through the color palette in every color you can imagine. ah Today we're here with an episode about the movie Everything Everywhere All at Once, which came out in 2022.
00:00:42
Speaker
who made by the pair ah delightfully referred to as the Daniels and starring the just absolutely incandescent Michelle Yeoh, Ki-Hai Kwan, Stephanie shu Jamie Lee Curtis, James Hong.
00:01:05
Speaker
I mean, absolutely Stellar cast, everybody just on their A-game. ah This movie was, as soon as I heard about it, I knew that I needed to see it and that I was going to be um absolutely in
Plot and Themes Exploration
00:01:25
Speaker
love with it.
00:01:25
Speaker
I didn't see it for a little while because I personally, when it came out in 2022, I was still a little nervous about go into the movies because of like COVID concerns. So yeah. Right. I mean, it just, that was part of 2022 and um I wish that I had seen it on the big screen. i did wait until it was available to watch at home, but I was like counting down the days until this movie was available to watch because I was so excited about it. And honestly,
00:01:57
Speaker
it really For me, it really lived up to all the hype. I thought it was the best movie that came out that year. i was so happy when it was like just running through the awards season, like picking up awards for everybody involved.
00:02:13
Speaker
um Yeah, I was trying to think of how to explain the plot of this movie, which I don't think is actually physically possible.
00:02:24
Speaker
But I love that what you could say about the movie is that the movie is about Evelyn, the co-owner with her husband of a laundromat, attempting to sort out a tax audit that While at the same time trying to prepare for a Lunar New Year party at the laundromat and navigate kind of a tricky situation with her daughter and her father where her daughter wants girlfriend.
Performance and Awards Discussion
00:03:01
Speaker
girlfriend to be introduced to her grandfather. And ah Evelyn is ah not so sure that that's going to go over well and is sort of grappling with how to...
00:03:17
Speaker
keep everything moving forward but at the same time she's also very disconnected emotionally from everyone and everything and everywhere and all at once ah yeah tell tell me ariel did you see this movie in the theater i didn't because we were also very very yeah we don't need to be around other people and we're also just like that anyway. And so I'm also very reticent to see movies that are about mother daughter relationships. um And that's really, really, really deeply at the heart. Like there's all the relationships in Evelyn's life, but like the major antagonist is her daughter, like this version of her daughter.
00:04:02
Speaker
and um and so it's like, I kind of held back on that. Cause I was like, i I think I kind of want to like wait until I can read up on it a little bit and like prepare myself because i definitely made the mistake years and years and years ago of seeing Brave in the theaters and then being like, Oh, met them wow. grave like oh no Yeah, that one wrecked my life.
00:04:27
Speaker
And so this, it was like, okay, I think I'm ready to watch it. And like, I want to watch it. And so I
Costume Design Insights
00:04:34
Speaker
did. And I did not see it on the big screen. I'm okay with that.
00:04:38
Speaker
But like, I would have loved it on the big screen for sure, because there's so much happening. And like, I, I, I think that this is such a great movie. Like, I think it deserved all the hype. I think it deserved all the awards. I think that Stephanie, she was rubbed.
00:04:55
Speaker
Rubbed. i agree. Yeah. I like all love to Jamie Lee Curtis because they were nominated in the same category. So only one of them, you know, one, one character, Deirdre, Bo Beardra
00:05:09
Speaker
yeah was excellent, excellently executed, all those things. But like, I felt like people got a little bit, on the whole thing of Jamie Lee Curtis, like not wearing supporting garments and then going like, Oh my God, that's crazy. You know, like, and then being like, that's amazing that you were able to act with a regular human body.
00:05:28
Speaker
Okay. But Stephanie Shue, just like her performance is incredible. Like heart rending performance. It's incredible. And like, so whatever. Fine. You know, whatever I mean, i do feel like that was sort of I do think that sometimes these award shows will kind of, if they missed a previous opportunity to like award somebody rightfully, sometimes they'll like kind of make it up to them later in their career. And it's sort of like not quite the right time, but they do recognize that this person deserves like a major award. And so it's like, they find a reason to give it to them now, but yeah,
00:06:13
Speaker
And I think Jamie Lee Curtis is one of those people. Like she is an amazing actress, has had an amazing career. i do think that Stephanie Hsu deserved the Oscar for this performance in this particular film Yeah.
00:06:27
Speaker
And it's like the Academy Awards are their own thing where the older I get, the less interested I am, et cetera, et cetera, cetera. Like it's, it's so much of that. um But like Stephanie Hsu also got to wear some of the best my god costumes in the whole worlds all of the worlds yeah and like um her costumes i feel like are the reason that we are doing this movie 100 like her and there's this massive montage like not to stay jumping but to jump very quickly towards the end of the movie yeah there's this massive montage where
00:07:04
Speaker
we get kind of to the all at once situation where um Evelyn or Evelyn like is kind of like all of her eyes are opening in every single universe. And so we see every different, like so many different versions of Evelyn, including like animated statues, pinatas, the rocks, like, but it's like this quick bng bang, bang, bang, bang. And so it's like for, for all of those, I feel like Michelle Yeoh had to like sit and,
00:07:33
Speaker
like have at least waist up costumes and some makeup you know like all these different things yeah and like some were done digitally and some were done 2d but i just the the use of costume in this is is a very fun um example of what you can do with costume and make a big massive impact yeah yeah I know. It's just like, wow. like yeah Mind explosion. like
00:08:03
Speaker
this This movie, to me, like no one ever needs to make another multiverse movie again after this movie. This movie showed the...
00:08:16
Speaker
That can be visually in the most incredible way. And everything else, I think, pales in comparison to what you can
Multiverse and Costume Challenges
00:08:25
Speaker
do. i think, yeah, because like multiverse has definitely been like a style thing. Like, thanks, Marvel, for a hot minute.
00:08:32
Speaker
And we're all, I think, very burned out on it. Yeah. And like multiverse of madness, that Doctor Strange movie was such a Oh, no, thank you from me. And part of that is because they ruined ah character. The Scarlet Witch, like overall character arc. Ruined.
00:08:54
Speaker
Which genuine was wild to me because WandaVision is like the best thing that Marvel has ever made. that show is phenomenal and like so well done and so well executed that like to then hand it over i was like, was like, dream.
00:09:13
Speaker
trust a man just like destroy like, you know, this beautiful character development and this like depth that was given to a female character way to go. And so having this version of a multiverse, I was like, yeah, I'm going to say it again.
00:09:31
Speaker
i was a little bit, sure because it's written by two, two fellas. And it's yeah like, for me too, like, you know, it's a a female character at the main, her daughter is like the main attack, one of the main antagonists and secondary antagonists is also a woman. And then, um, to like write about the complexity of mother daughter relationship.
00:09:54
Speaker
I was like, okay. And it's like, you guys killed it. He killed it. Yeah. It was, it was a beautiful story. And we're talking about costume wise, the work yeah of Shirley Kurata. I'm,
00:10:08
Speaker
Again, with all pronunciations, apologize. I think that's right. I think that's right. i think um She... Holy cow. Wow.
00:10:19
Speaker
Yeah. And I... Okay, so there are two articles that I read, like, in my... deep research period. Yes. During the movie. um One of them is a Vogue article that was scroll, scroll, scroll, go scroll written by Lea Garcia Furtado. They came out March 10th in 2023. And so that's accessible on the way back machine because there's just a stupid paywall now and F that business.
00:10:49
Speaker
And then the other ah thing that I read is actually the transcript of a radio interview um with Shirley Curata and Alison Stewart for WNYC. And in both, I feel like our costume designer got to talk about some of the process. yeah And thank God, I love these opportunities so actually be able to look at, like you said, a quote from the designer. I just like, you know, analysis is great.
00:11:19
Speaker
yeah a love analysis but i want to hear it from the designer's mouth first and like in i think the the wnyc uh interview but actually talk about that where um the interviewer is like so how do you feel about all these people who've like talked about this and like you know the podcasts and all these people who've like really really analyzed it and she's like you know what?
00:11:43
Speaker
think it's pretty fun because some of it is like, yeah. And then some of it's like, never thought of that, but that's cool that you see it. yeah And like, I just, I just really enjoyed that. And in the WNYC.org radio interview, um Shirley Carada gets the opportunity to talk about what she was presented with in the script.
00:12:06
Speaker
And it sounds pretty nuts. So like in anything that you read, did you, did you read her talk about the script? Um, I did a little bit. I also read a short article that was, because you sent me the Vogue one, which I am very thankful for.
00:12:18
Speaker
and there was also um an article on the um the like Academy website that was like ah an interview, short interview that was done like two days before the Academy Awards where she was nominated.
00:12:34
Speaker
And it is like a short interview, but she did kind of talk about a little bit, I think, about what it's like to read the script for a movie like this. and it sounds crazy. was great. There's like, okay, so from the WNYC interview, um so Allison Stewart asks um about...
00:13:00
Speaker
the bagel outfit that stephanie shu is wearing yes where it's all right are all white sorry and um the hairstyle that's in the shape of a bagel all that and she's asking shirley curata to like walk us through the the look and so shirley says yes i think in the script all it said was that she looked like a celestial empress yeah I had to just figure out what that could be. And I wanted to tie in a little bit of maybe cult leader meets queen, space queen, a little bit futuristic, but also maybe a little bit tying historical references.
00:13:35
Speaker
I thought a ruff, the white ruff that she's wearing would be a cool historical tie in. I'm using fabrics that were a little bit more futuristic, like vinyls. And she goes on to describe more. But like, there's, there's a great part in this interview where she talks some more about the script. And i mean, I could scroll down, but I'm not gonna find it right now. yeah But she talks about how there were points where it was like, what is this?
00:14:02
Speaker
And it's not necessarily like from her, but being like, this is so open, you know, or like, this is just like, okay, here she's supposed to be like a judge or here she's supposed to be this thing or that thing or this thing. And so they had to narrow down like, okay, tell me like,
00:14:25
Speaker
which what's your touchstone? Like what, which yeah ones are the ones that we need to see? And like, what does that need to look like so that she could at least refine all of these, like many, many, many, many different iterations of this one character and be like, okay, which ones do we actually need to see screen? Like fully.
00:14:42
Speaker
And it's just like building it out like that is pretty crazy. And then in one of these, oh yeah. She said that she only had six weeks to prep this movie. Yeah. six weeks. She mentioned in one thing that I read, all she said specifically was a short prep time. So I was like, what is that? what but mean She talked about how she didn't have time to have things made. It had to be pulled and repurposed and like cobbled together and borrowed. and like i mean Fortunately, you know she has such a long history in the fashion industry that I'm sure she...
00:15:24
Speaker
has an absolutely insane amount of knowledge and connections too to know where to go and what to to so where to start. But honestly, like that kind of design, i really enjoy doing where I'm like pulling things and putting things together.
00:15:44
Speaker
i find that really creative rather than like me and a blank piece of paper and a pencil. like I really enjoy that three-dimensional design you know, here's a rack of stuff. What can we do with it? Yeah, it's two different types of sculpting. When think of being able to have the budget and to be able to have the time to build everything that you're imagining, that's one awesome version of being able to design in production. That's super awesome.
00:16:11
Speaker
Because then you get to like really think about The world, the textiles, like design of different cultures, all those things like that's chef kiss. Love that. I hope for every costumer and costume designer that they get the opportunity to work on projects like that and and like it. you right and The other version is the.
00:16:30
Speaker
Kind of a little bit chicken with your head cut off running around yeah because like, especially depending on how many hands you have and IMDB, it looks like there were 22 people listed in the costume wardrobe department. So that's more than just two pairs of hands, which is pretty rad.
00:16:46
Speaker
Thank God. and yeah And I hope that they were able to help in the chicken with no head running around circumstances because yeah, like i have, we've definitely done that style.
00:16:58
Speaker
in theater, but like there's, there's a different way of thinking when it comes to those things yeah um where you have to approach it very differently because yeah, you can't manufacture what's in your head. So you have to go for the nearest thing or get yourself excited for something that's like in a, in a general world of something yeah and then refine it to what you want. And like, I wonder how this crew,
00:17:28
Speaker
like putting these things together, how they were all working on that. Cause sometimes that could look like the designer going, okay, I have an idea of what I want this bagel scene to look like. I want it to be kind of culty. I want it to be kind of space, like clean room.
00:17:42
Speaker
yeah i want it to look like cool hair. i want all these different things. And I want pearls. I want vinyl. I want a little bit of like shiny, like Queen Elizabeth. Like I want something regal from this point of view and then hand like a quick sketch to a person and go yeah can you go find stuff yeah for that bring me a rack bring me a rack and then we'll we'll refine further from there and like throw out some stuff and then that person keeps refining while the designer is doing that same thing yeah like all the other things yeah i wonder how that worked because i mean like stephanie shoot like
00:18:21
Speaker
Jobu, just Topaki, had like kind of K-pop-y
Emotional Depth and Symbolism
00:18:29
Speaker
anime. Totally, yeah. wre Like Mexican wrestler, Elvis. Elvis, like preppy golfer. Yeah, preppy golfer.
00:18:38
Speaker
This sort of like futuristic black Like pleather thing for like one minute was on screen. Just incredible stuff. And then this theres like a high fashion teddy bear situation. Oh my god. I want that jacket so much. And then like right before like where Evelyn is pulling Jobu out of the the bagel, that look is kind of like Raggedy am if you will, where it's a clowny doll and like all these colors. Yeah.
00:19:09
Speaker
And like the, the makeup in this movie. Oh my God. oh the makeup is so good. The hair is so good. There's one scene where Jobu has these like braids and it spells out Jobu across her forehead. Yeah.
00:19:24
Speaker
Oh my God. i mean, the bagel hair, the like the bagel hair. just incredible. And like, so <unk> that's just like a, we're jumping around for like a hot second. We'll, we'll reel it back to the beginning in a minute.
00:19:36
Speaker
Can we, can we even like, no, I mean like, should we, do we need to? don't think we can. Cause I think it's important too. Okay. All Like we've already hit that like Joe Boutapaki is this like out of universe character, right? yeah Because like she has this enlightenment, she has this awareness and That no matter what, in all of these different universes, everything's just shit. like that that's her great like that's it's like that That's her perspective. And so it's like the she's never able to get the peace that she's looking for in any single universe. And like Evelyn in every universe thinks that Joe Butapaki is trying to kill her and maybe she started out that way.
00:20:14
Speaker
But then she's realizing that she kind of wants her mom, Evelyn, go through this with her. With her instead of alone. That she wants her mom to be like, yeah, you're right.
00:20:26
Speaker
Everything is shit. And that's why I am the way that I am. And that's why you're the way you are And the one Evelyn that like fixes it is the one that we're following throughout this movie because she actually listens to her husband, Waymond.
00:20:43
Speaker
Waymond. Waymond. And he's like, stop being violent and stop hurting each other and like just talk to each other and like – The only way to like get through the chaos of life is to be kind to each other. kind to each other and to love each other. And like, he's just such a sweet kick.
00:21:02
Speaker
Oh my God. How dare you. I don't know I see him in anything. When he starts, like i I had, you know, I'd seen the movie once before, so I, you know, knew what was coming.
00:21:15
Speaker
But when he starts that speech, I was just like, I am a mess right now. Because that is so it beautiful. And it's like, in bowl and it's also, I watched this after Kei Haekwon winning for this movie. And giving his like, super heartfelt, genuine speech where he was like, my career just kind of...
00:21:35
Speaker
just died for a really long time because nobody was interested in telling any any of these stories and now he he gets to be forefront and show all these different things that he can do and like not have to be a stereotype or any of the things like he gets to have this like challenging movie career and remind people that he's an amazing actor to like you are yeah you are and like You know, the the beauty of like the multiverse in the movie is that we get to see like 50 different versions of all of these characters also. So it's like, in addition to just getting to show that he's an amazing actor, he can show that he can do anything. Everything.
00:22:17
Speaker
Everything. Everything. Everywhere. it's like we know because we've seen michelle yo for a very long yeah we know but like and that's not to take away from her absolute oh no no no yet we know when we're seeing michelle ye and something We're going to be good. yo And it's going to be amazing. Jamie Lee Curtis has been in a lot of different things. Scream Queen beginnings to like all sorts of stuff. So we know yeah that like she'll be grand.
00:22:44
Speaker
Stephanie Hsu, I was like, I am going to follow your career forever. Because like, she's did you watch the marvelous mrs mazel saw a like some of the first season then i think i saw like a scene with her in there yeah not enough to like her character later in the series is amazing i love her character so much she's great i mean she just is such a strong actress and like i saw her in a different movie afterwards that i can't remember the name of
00:23:16
Speaker
um It's like an ensemble movie. And I really enjoyed her. um But this was this is such a great project. yeah She's one of those people where are like, she's just getting started. like Her career is out in front of her right now. Way to kill it with this one. yeah And so, okay.
00:23:33
Speaker
Costumes. but yeah Let's go back to the very beginning. um Okay, so everything. Part one, basically, yes is where we're establishing the world. And the world is the most...
00:23:45
Speaker
humdrum world where Waymond is super sweet and like but but he's also hurt we're seeing that he's very hurt and he's trying to get Evelyn's attention and Evelyn is just bing bang bong and like all over the place she's like sleepwalking at the same time like like a furious little bee where it's like everything is happening all at once. And it's like, she's kind of let life push her to that because it's like, she has said, well, life is going to do this anyway. So I guess I just have to like roll with it instead of like, I can take a minute and I can look my husband in his eyes and I can have a conversation.
00:24:27
Speaker
i can take a minute. I can look my daughter in her eyes and have a conversation. and She just everything but she shouldn't, necessarily be prioritizing as what's being prioritized because she's like can feel it just happening all at one time.
00:24:40
Speaker
Yeah, it kind of feels like she's existing in this mode of just like we're going from like one immediate need or crisis to the next without actually living.
00:24:52
Speaker
Yeah, living and like engaging with the people in her life emotionally as opposed to just like Here's this thing. i need that. You go over there. You do this. This is bothering me. i need you to leave. Like, she's just doing that. Yeah, it's like all of these disappointments have mixed up with these expectations that she had or expectations that were put on her of how she should be. And so she's just autopiloting through all these things.
00:25:19
Speaker
And it's... Pretty amazing to look at a movie where the clothing that your characters are wearing is so everyday. Yeah.
00:25:30
Speaker
That like, it doesn't stand out by being like fake every day. Right. It's every day that you recognize. And these are our illustrious costume designer talks about.
00:25:41
Speaker
Yeah. fittings for Keha Kwan and Michelle Yeoh. And I loved reading this part in either one of the articles because I think she mentioned a little bit in both.
00:25:51
Speaker
I love it when you get to hear the designers talk about the actual collaboration that happens in the room where it's not a dominant process. It's true collaboration where she had picked up all these clothes from Chinatown for Michelle Yeoh.
00:26:04
Speaker
So like she was dressing her like like a Chinese grandma, you know, with like yeah practical, comfortable clothes that are affordable. And places that she would really access That she would actually have access to and that she would actually shop.
00:26:17
Speaker
And like, would maybe have a relationship with those shop owners. And like, um it was great to hear for both of those actors fittings that both of them basically said a version of like, this is nothing that I would wear, but it's so perfect for this character.
00:26:34
Speaker
Yes. And like, cause Kay Haquan, when he got his fanny pack was like, Oh my God, it's like a dad. He, I mean, he has, like, dad sneakers, cargo khaki pants, the, the like, slightly too large, like, pullover. It's also, like, feel like there's a tendency in movies when you have, like, everyday people that there is still a level of, like...
00:27:00
Speaker
quality and fitting that makes stuff that's supposed to look every day just look that much nicer. yeah it'll make it look elevated. They did not do that here. Kei Haquan's shirt, Weyman's shirt is ill-fitting. It's too big.
00:27:15
Speaker
And it's all of their clothes are kind of purpose-driven. There's no personality about It's just what's affordable, what's yeah what can last for a super long time, and what doesn't hurt my eyeballs that I might hate forever. What's comfortable. what Yeah. then I don't think about it. It's not a part of my day to think yeah about my clothing. not a part of my day to think about how I express myself. And so like it's also his his shirt's like unbuttoned. So yeah it's like a little bit extra loose.
00:27:45
Speaker
And it's just like it just nails it. And it's like that perfect like cotton poly blend knit that you get for t-shirts where they're like kind of hard because they're like thick and it's just like not elegant and that is what is so perfect about it and I was so happy to read her talking about shopping in the real places that the
Budget and Authenticity in Costumes
00:28:10
Speaker
characters would shop because you know that level of care and detail in costume design that should be like, it's something maybe people don't think about, but like, you know, it's, it's great to hear someone talking about it openly because it's something that we just do. Like we, and we know to do that. And she knows to do that, obviously. I mean, it's incredible, but people might not necessarily know that that's part of it What you said about like having every day, know, air quote, clothes that are actually higher end. Yeah.
00:28:43
Speaker
Because they're like a linen blend or or linen. And then they're like tailored to fit the actor. Those are things that are kind of hard for me because it's like, I struggle with that because it means that someone maybe not the designer, maybe not the actor, maybe a producer, maybe the actor, maybe the designer, couldn't let go of the image of the performer yeah to elevate the character character. And it's like, okay, but your character owns a laundromat, yeah is middle-aged, and is deeply unhappy
00:29:19
Speaker
And in debt, clearly. They are being audited by the IRS right now. Struggling. His shoes are from Costco. That is the reality. And it's like, then go buy that shit at Costco. There's like a disconnect that happens when you take those things. And then you're like, but we need to take in like these, these like, you know, fisheye darts at the back to to like highlight your waist.
00:29:42
Speaker
Would that character do that? Or is the actor doing that? Yeah. Because like. Yeah.
00:29:49
Speaker
a lot because it's like let let ye go go yeah the perform the role photo shoot of you yeah let' let's perform the role and whoever that comes down to is like it's ok to let that go we know that that actor can handle that role and we know that that designer can design that role. Like, yeah it's okay. Let's, let's let it happen.
00:30:10
Speaker
And I just loved that it happened in here. Cause like Evelyn also has like, you know, the, the chain for glasses, I think. And like the beads like match her shirts. Like she has like a It seems like kind of like a comfortable color palette where it's like, it's an autopilot color palette where it's like, I can just go to Costco or can go to Chinatown and I can just buy things that are in these colors. Yeah.
00:30:29
Speaker
But okay. So we've got them. And then also my favorite part, Mayman's outfit. It's the... The little tiny stuffy that's attached to his. The key chain.
00:30:41
Speaker
The key chain that's attached to his thing. Wow. Like straight from a vending machine. like But it's so sweet. know. Is it like a pink pig? Yeah, it's some little pig.
00:30:52
Speaker
adorable little thing and it's just like these tiny details exist even though there were only like six weeks oh she also said um our designer that the budget she had was the budget that exists for one mar but marvel like superhero outfit is what she had for the whole film the the budget for the entire movie was like 14 million dollars and yeah Like that is something, especially this award season that I was thinking about a lot that like you don't need to spend a hundred million dollars to make a movie good. If you can don't on a great movie and you can spend a hundred million dollars, like ah congratulations to you. That's wonderful. But it won't make your movie better. Yeah. If the story is not good. Another thing. Thank you, Marvel, for really hammering that home.
00:31:42
Speaker
and I mean, like, I like a lot of Marvel movies. Oh, so But yeah, it's not a slam dunk just because you spent. It's not slam dunk. And there are quite a few things where they just lean in on the money, but it's like, okay, but you're rushing your visual artists. You're rushing all of these people who cannot produce good quality.
00:32:04
Speaker
Like it's a fax machine, just real narrow like that's not doable. Yeah. And so this, like the visuals are all amazing. And the design for the limited budget, the limited time is amazing because there are tiny little details that that don't get left behind, like the little pig his fanny pack. And like Jamie Lee Curtis, Deidre, outfit is amazing.
00:32:30
Speaker
her outfit Because like, yeah, but I mentioned before I saw the movie, I kept hearing people just like louding Jamie Lee Curtis for not wearing supporting garments like she was wearing a bra.
00:32:42
Speaker
Yeah. Then like undergarments, but she wasn't wearing like Spanx to shape her body. Right. Shapewear. She was just wearing undergarments and clothes the way that you would normally wear.
00:32:53
Speaker
Yes, a real person. Yes, person going to work. And so we could see Jamie Lee Curtis as Jamie Lee Curtis is like just as a a woman who is an older woman.
00:33:04
Speaker
And what I love, I loved that. I really did. Because like, there was so much reality throughout this, like certain like, haircuts that are not flattering or whatever like yeah um but her character is basically this like monochrome in yellows like beige and yellows it looks like she hasn't bought new clothes since 1978 yeah and like her her wrist brace matches her Oh, that disgusting, like, ecru, tan, yeah color, wrist brace. And then she's got, like, gray pants and, like, she's got red fingernails and kind of, like, a reddish-orange frame on her glasses. Mm-hmm. So to me, it was kind of like, and again, this is all just me talking. This might not be the actual design intent, but I kind of love the red nail polish because frequently when you see people wearing red nail polish or red lipstick, at least in my experience, it's kind of like I'm being daring. Like this is me pushing me on. want you to notice.
00:34:08
Speaker
Yeah. I want you to notice these things. And it's like her hands, we see so much because she's like constantly in the paperwork. She's also like breaking people's necks. like, punching through doors and like ah trying to murder people. left Right.
00:34:22
Speaker
and Typical day at your local IRS field office. office And so it's like, she's got blood on her hands, you know, a little bit. And it's like a little, like a ah foreshadowing that yeah it's going to get nasty. And then it's also like,
00:34:37
Speaker
She also turns out to be a very sensitive person who can be empathetic and has like a heart, but it's also a hurt heart. And so I just like love these little things. And then she has this like this beaded necklace thing that is an eyeglass holder because it has like a a ju ring. Yeah, a ring that she can like slide her glasses through.
00:34:57
Speaker
And I'm just like, okay, these two women um this like situation with like, i don't know. They're not so different at the end. After all. and um But just like the little accessories that travel throughout this movie are fantastic. because it's just like, it's not just big visual, it's little tiny details.
00:35:17
Speaker
And I think I read that that particular inspirational look of Jamie Lee Curtis, that they found photographs of like real IRS people and that that...
00:35:30
Speaker
look was developed from a photograph of a real woman who worked in that industry. And you can tell, you can really tell. It feels right. Like it feels right for if you've been in a DMV, if you've been in any kind of government building, it just feels like when somebody has like a budget and they don't necessarily like express themselves to like earth shaking fascial, but they also want to have like a little bit ah their identity shows through. But sometimes that's like, well, I have to follow the rules of like matching or whatever. Right. Or like they've decided, you know, like in 1978, she decided this looks good on me. And that happens with people. Like that was, I was joking about that um yesterday. Cause I need to buy a dress for an event coming up where I don't really have anything that fits like the, um,
00:36:23
Speaker
parameters. And I was like, ah you know, not to like tease the audience, but you and I were in JCPenney the other day. And I was like, I saw a couple dresses where I was like, I kind of like that.
00:36:34
Speaker
And then was like, Oh, no, I'm a woman in her late 30s. And the dresses at JCPenney look cute to me now. And that's what's happening. and that's just how it is sometimes like, You know, like you you still like the stuff that looked good on you when you were younger. And people stick with those styles sometimes. Like as they get older, they just stay with the things that they were comfortable Because you find something that's comfortable. And it's like, why shake that up?
00:36:58
Speaker
And she very much feels like a character that is that. And it's it's pretty phenomenal. And okay. Then we see, like, of course, we've seen other characters here and there.
00:37:10
Speaker
But like, we see our first... jobu to paki like entrance and we see her in this like wonderful plaid like cape oh my god with a matching visor and we don't see her face she looked like she stepped off the set of the traders like alan coming in the traders like that was that look it was like Scottish plaid explosion.
00:37:40
Speaker
But like we see that look for 25 seconds and then we never see it again. And that's one of many of Jovo's looks that we only see for a flash, just to establish that she has this ability to flash and change herself. She's like a shapeshifter. Yeah.
00:37:56
Speaker
And like she's in it. And then she basically kills Evelyn, who is now in this giant baby costume with a Oh my God. I forgot about the costume.
00:38:07
Speaker
She looks like baby Huey, like this old like cartoon. And she's just got blood all over her face and Jo Boo stands up. So like when she goes down, she's in the plaid. And when she stands up, she's dressed kind of like a Korean ajima.
00:38:21
Speaker
Like it's like middle-aged lady, but like, you know, a Chinese grandma, like with the florals and with another visor and then the gray hair wig and And it's so like, it's so crisp and so perfect. Yes. It's just like, she is, she's all these different ideas. And, and so it's like, it just happens so quick. And I just like, love it so much.
00:38:44
Speaker
And then she, God, there's so much that like, I'm inevitably going to kind of jump around. Cause God, I don't, I think you have to like, this movie is not the most linear. and and also from one of the, from the Vogue article,
00:38:59
Speaker
There was a question that I referred to and now I found it.
Humor, Reality, and Climax
00:39:04
Speaker
But the interviewer asks, so let's get into the movie. What was your approach when you started working on it? Because it's easy to sort of see the sections now that the movie's finished, but how did you conceive of it before it actually existed?
00:39:15
Speaker
yeah And the response that Shirley gave... Sorry to be so familiar. the shirley gave My friend Shirley. You know, the script was so hard to break down because, you know, in one scene it would be Evelyn is a courthouse judge. Then she's a scarecrow. Then she's a blah, blah, blah.
00:39:31
Speaker
Usually a script is broken down like day one is pages one through 20. So there were a lot of conversations and questions and we decided to do everything by universes. Yeah. So there's the tax universe, the hot dog universe, movie star universe.
00:39:46
Speaker
And within each world, there was an outfit. And then there were also Jobu's changes in the IRS offices. And that wasn't scripted when she would change. They just mentioned, well, since she has the freedom to do it, why don't you go ahead and make some looks and we'll pick some scenes where we think is a good place to have her change. So the looks that Shirley went with beyond the plaid to the, the like grandma was then to Elvis.
00:40:15
Speaker
Yes. Like ah hair a tailored Elvis suit. And each look has makeup to go with it. And those first two hair. Yeah. And like those first two, we see the hair. We don't see makeup because her face is cast in shadow.
00:40:28
Speaker
And when she's dressed as a grandma, she might have a mask on. I think she does have a mask like a face mask. And yeah this was apparently being filmed before COVID required face masks. But it's just like thing. Yeah, it's just a thing in Asia. to Yeah.
00:40:43
Speaker
You know, people feel sick, they put on a mask. If there's like allergies, put on a mask. And so it was kind of like a, oh, remember when it was just, you know. A courtesy. And not politicized. Oh my god.
00:40:55
Speaker
it was just, yeah, science. Look at that. And so, yeah, she goes from the grandma to the Elvis tailored for days. The king himself. The king herself. We go to kind of like a luchador. Does she have like lightning makeup? she had Yeah, she has like and ah she has lightning bolt earrings also. It's like a turquoise and silver.
00:41:20
Speaker
Oh, Outfit. It's so good. And we bear it. Like, we don't see, ah like, we don't get, like, a big wide shot of that outfit, I don't think. She's crouching. Like, I don't think we really see her standing in it.
00:41:31
Speaker
And I think that the answer for that, I read this in one of the interviews as well, was that they only had one Elvis suit, and those are very expensive. And so... they had to bring it down for Stephanie's shoe fit. And so they couldn't have one for when she gets shot and gets like, you know, blood all over it.
00:41:50
Speaker
So she had to change the shot part to an outfit that she could have multiples of for cheap. So I think that's where the wrestling outfit came from. And that was so affirming to read because it's something that we have mentioned in previous episodes talking about having multiples for stunt performers, for action, for like different things that your costume can do.
00:42:14
Speaker
And to have her break it break it down so clearly was so affirming to be like, yes, you can't do it if you just have one. You can't have someone get shot on film if you only have the one costume. Yeah.
00:42:28
Speaker
And then from the WNYC interview, um Shirley also said that they told me to create costumes that people would want to dress up for Halloween as. I mean, i like, I, any of them, any of the of them. So it's like that gave her further, ah for like a larger doorway to step through because it's like, I can justify this because of common sense. I can't ruin this white Elvis suit that we had to tailor.
00:42:54
Speaker
Now I can do luchador. It's like a high fashion wrestler. And then, We can like add that in so that will budget and Halloween costume, whatever it is that your request is. I can hit both things.
00:43:10
Speaker
Right. And then, oh my God, she go to, oh, after that, golf it's the golf. And so it's interesting where, because there's also in one of the interviews, Shirley mentioning that she inputs some stereotypes of like certain things. And so it's like, I think the grandma is kind of like a stereotype. And then the golf one of like a super high achieving yeah athlete.
00:43:32
Speaker
And like, she looks like a pro golfer. Yeah. Yeah. She looks like a junior pro. A junior pro. Like she looks a little bit, to me anyway, like she looks a little younger than her actual character age. Yeah, and I think because we had seen her in like this stark white, well, with all the sequins, and then the like turquoise, and then we're in soft pink.
00:43:54
Speaker
Yeah. Like it's little girl colors. yeah And she's also trying to portray herself as being like, no, it's okay. Don't be scared.
00:44:04
Speaker
Oh, it's so, so menacing. there's some, there's always something, I think you see it so much in like the horror genre that people love to have like an innocent looking girl who is then going to just kill you. Yeah. Like rip your head off. Like they love to do it.
00:44:22
Speaker
Little golf doll. yeah um Then we kind of like, start to jump into the movie star universe. And with this, we see Michelle yoh as Michelle Yeoh. Yeah. There's like footage of her signing out. Archival footage of her on red carpets. And she's like wearing these gorgeous gowns, got her hair hair done really well. And in the movie, she's wearing this like, is it like kind of gold champagne? like a Yeah. Rose gold. Ball gown. And for that, um basically, Shirley asked Michelle Yeoh,
00:44:57
Speaker
you know you've done this before yeah whose stuff do you feel comfortable wearing and who do you think we should call and she said i think one of the designers that has made dresses for her before for award seasons etc yeah and so they called them up and they offered a few dresses and they chose this dress like they got to beautiful use this one and it's like it's just she's like a cloud of just like champagne with like tulle and like it's just lovely And when she comes back, like, so she's Michelle Yeoh starts kind of jumping through the universes like mentally.
00:45:32
Speaker
And when she comes back to the one that we think of as like the real world, when she looks at Waymond and says that she went to this universe where they're not together and she was so happy. yeah Oh, my God. That was brutal. It's just like.
00:45:51
Speaker
she Michelle Yeoh, chef kiss, well done. because like And to the writers, the Daniels, and to all of the designers, this character is, like you said, so divorced from her life that she's basically been treating the people that she loves the most.
00:46:09
Speaker
As if they're NPCs. Yeah. That are like disappointing her. Yeah. And so like Waymond has made his whole life about trying to make her happy and trying to make her feel secure.
00:46:24
Speaker
And she can only see the disappointments and the things that didn't reach what she wanted. yeah And so... For her at this point in her development, I think that she can't see him.
00:46:37
Speaker
No, she's not really talking to him She's not talking to him. She's talking at him about this experience that she's having. And she's also speaking in English. And her character is kind of like she's speaking fluent English, but there are some things that aren't quite like landing. Like she's just not quite as comfortable conveying things in English. And that's like a conversation she and her daughter have. Right.
00:47:01
Speaker
about like pronouns. Right. But she keeps calling Becky, he, her, and she's like, in Chinese, it's just plus one But it also felt like, a you know, like even as she's like explaining herself, she's like brushing away the effects that it has on the other person yeah and how it lands. Everything she does, she just is kind of just, it's it's like she's just mowing everybody down. and that one was so cruel.
00:47:28
Speaker
And that's why the movie universe it's such like a, it's kind of like a calm space with all the other alternate. Like there's there's a rock universe where they're just boulders.
00:47:39
Speaker
There's like ah universe where Jobu and Evelyn are just pinatas. There's one where they're hand drawn and like, there's all these different things. There's like an anime version, there's all sorts of stuff.
00:47:50
Speaker
But in the movie universe, it's very quiet because it's just a con like, there's, There's an award show like or a premiere where she's yeah watching this film. That she's in. It's like her premiere. And then we see like different parts of it, including like the end credits.
00:48:08
Speaker
And then at the end, she's out because she sees Waymond. And in this world, they did not leave China and go to the US s together. They did not immigrate together. Yeah. And they didn't have a child. And so she says to him in that alleyway, kind of the same way where she says to Waymond in the tax universe, we didn't get married. And I was so happy in the movie universe. She says to that Waymond, we did get married and we did have a daughter.
00:48:37
Speaker
and ah like, this is what the bad life was like. And she's still not fully at a place where she's seeing the beauty of that life. Right. Right. But she is kind of like,
00:48:49
Speaker
nostalgic for it a little bit because yeah i mean she kisses she kisses him and she's like yeah you're you're a part of me and he says to her you broke my heart again yeah but in that like if i would have loved to do laundry and taxes with you oh my god and it's like okay yeah And in this one, oh my God. And he's so like, he's so handsome and dashing and he's in a tuxedo and he's so smooth. In the tax universe. Yeah. He has the shirt tucked into his khakis and like all that stuff. He's got the hair that's like brushed over. He's got bangs that are brushed over. His hair is not styled. It's just loose.
00:49:29
Speaker
yeah And in this one, his hair is brushed back, like styled back. He's wearing a handsome suit. He's got a cigarette that he's holding. And it's actually kind of a reference to a, um, a different director. Like this is a reference to a specific director and his style.
00:49:45
Speaker
And so it's like, K-Hai Kwan is like holding his cigarette. Like, yeah everything's very beautifully composed and posed. It's film, this one. And he's just like so handsome. And in this universe, they're the same age, but they're not acting like their life is over.
00:50:04
Speaker
And in the tax universe, Evelyn is acting like life is over. And in this one, she's this glamorous movie star. And he's this person who- like a successful businessman. Yeah. And he he's like handsome and takes care of himself and he can afford, you know, these these grand things. And it's just like kind of a quiet beat, but it's one where- I feel like that's one of the universes where she does a lot of working out.
00:50:30
Speaker
Yeah. There's room to think there. Like people are not, people are not attacking her. yeah Like, okay. Then there's the other universe, which is the hot dog universe.
00:50:43
Speaker
Yeah. This one just got me when I watched it the first time because who in their right mind would be expecting a universe in which everybody's hands are hot dogs? Everybody's got hot dog fingers.
00:50:55
Speaker
And they're like floppy. They're so floppy. It is disgusting to look at. It's horrific. And there's a movie that um Evelyn is like is playing in the laundromat in the tax universe.
00:51:07
Speaker
And this movie, they refilmed the same scene with the actors. I think so. And it's just like a beautiful, romantic kind of like... Musical scene. Musical. A dance. And I recognized the actress that's in that. I know her. She's from GLOW. Okay. That's cool. She plays one of the wrestlers in GLOW. love that. she was also in another show. I think she was in Crazy Ex-Girlfriend. Oh, nice.
00:51:31
Speaker
That's a great. In this scene... They start having this like musical denouement. And then they start like sucking on each other's hot dog fingers. And there's like mustard and ketchup all over.
00:51:45
Speaker
It's horrific. And there's a color palette to this universe. And the color palette, did you read about this as well? Not why it happened. I just, everything was just so beautiful. The color palette is hot dog colors. So it's like he soft pinks and tans and these like light browns. And to me, I also received it as the 1980s as my family lived it.
00:52:10
Speaker
Okay, the pastel dream, the sponge ball treatment. The pastel of those pinks, the soft corals, like that kind of stuff. There's a lot of like chiffon blouses that are very soft. Silky with like ties.
00:52:24
Speaker
i was like, what why is everything else the same? Like, are people trying to interact with a smartphone when you have hot dog fingers? Like, why would that be...
00:52:35
Speaker
And like large smartphones. And they're using their toes for all using their feet. There's like even a bit where Jamie Lee Curtis is like playing the piano. And her foot has the same brace that her hand has in the Jax universe.
00:52:48
Speaker
Oh my god. Like carpal tunnel is really coming for Jamie Lee Curtis. And like there's a scene... and where're We're watching kind of the dissolution of because they're together in this universe. Oh, yeah. And Deirdre.
00:53:02
Speaker
And like, they're just trying to take care of Evelyn in the same way that Waymond kind of is. But like, Evelyn is just doing Evelyn and Evelyn is like dropping into this universe going what the actual fuck?
00:53:16
Speaker
I'm like, why do I have hot dogs for fingers? And like, oh, my enemy is now like my lover. And there's a scene. just like candlelit. it's supposed to be like romantic.
00:53:27
Speaker
And Evelyn's like.
00:53:33
Speaker
oh And that is something, just like the way that, like, this movie is so funny. And i think that that is something that is just so missing from a lot of movies that try to do the multiverse thing. Yes.
00:53:48
Speaker
These filmmakers understand that if anything is possible, then the most ridiculous things are out there somewhere. Yeah. And beyond that, the reality, because you always have to have, like, no matter what you're doing, there has to be some kind of core of reality to, like, ping with your audience, right?
00:54:07
Speaker
And the reality is, even in the darkest darkest fucking moments of your life. There's a reason why there's something called gallows humor is because it's a human thing.
00:54:19
Speaker
to be able to look outside the window of like wherever you are and it could still be sunny outside. There are still people laughing no matter what's happening to you or something really terrible is happening to you and then something funny happens yeah and everybody around you and you acknowledge that's crazy. That's funny.
00:54:42
Speaker
And it's like, it doesn't guarantee that it happens all the time, but all things can exist at one time. yeah and sometimes that's an unfortunate truth.
Costume Design and Character Complexity
00:54:50
Speaker
And this movie is not afraid to to deal with that because like, this is Evelyn being like rocketed into all these universes that it's not her consciousness that belongs in those universes. She's just skipping through each one of her that exists yeah and So like, to hop into one and not care that you're like destroying a relationship with someone that that Evelyn loves is like, yeah, it's pretty funny to drop in and be like, oh, my God.
00:55:21
Speaker
And like there's this whole thread of like in order to be able to travel around like through the universes, you have to do something so unexpected and out of character. snorting a fly. Disgusting.
00:55:36
Speaker
Or the but scene with the with those trophies and the two guys. I mean the butt plugs. The butt plug scene. I didn't want to say it. Thank you for saying it. That's okay. I'm here for you.
00:55:48
Speaker
To write that into your movie is so perfect because... it's It's such a wonderful way to immediately tell us that like you can have fun here. Yeah. And it's also like the double-edged sword of like it's telling us you can have fun here. And it's also shaking that character up so much because all of this ludicrousness exists with the balance of like you have to save all of these universes. Yeah.
00:56:19
Speaker
Like it's down to you. oh my God. And I love at the very beginning to skip around when, when alpha Waymond shows up and she's like, why me? And he's like, cause you're the most pathetic Evelyn in all of the universes.
00:56:36
Speaker
You have never lived up to your potential in anything that you have attempted to do And so therefore you have the most potential of anyone because you've never achieved anything was just like,
00:56:48
Speaker
Wow. Okay. Way to hit me where it hurts. like thankss Yeah. And it's like all of that unused potential is an untapped resource and we're going to use it. And then she like fights it, fights it, fights it.
00:57:00
Speaker
And then she's like, wait, don't take that away from me. Like, this is my chance. Like I, I need this. I need to try And i just love that the whole time this woman is wearing this like super floral old lady outfit, this like comfy vest yeah And just like sensible shoes.
00:57:20
Speaker
And it's all like in these like comfortable colors for her. yeah Like purples and dark blues. And like I love that we're seeing her aside from like blips in other universes wearing other clothes. But in the text universe we're we're almost always seeing her this one way.
00:57:37
Speaker
and then like. Later on in the movie, the movie has been like in the in the Taxi Universe timeline, they're going to have a Lunar New Year party where they're inviting all of their customers to the laundromat.
00:57:48
Speaker
Yeah. And because it's Lunar New Year, a lot of people are wearing red. And yeah so she's got this red outfit and she has this sweater that says punk. Oh god. And that was one that Shirley bought in Chinatown for like 30 bucks. And I was like, I can see it in the store, like in a plastic package, in like a stack of sweaters.
00:58:09
Speaker
And there's like one torso mannequin with one like colorway. And she like, I can picture her yeah buying that. And I like, and Shirley, the designer talks about how there's so many, you know, outfits where it's like, you can buy them in Chinatown. You can buy them in other places where, yeah.
00:58:25
Speaker
it's something that has gone through lack of translation. So it might feel out of context. And you're like, what does that even mean? And so why does this sweater say punk? But she was like, I love it. And she loved that, like, because her parents,
00:58:41
Speaker
were immigrants and so she's like to be an immigrant to leave with like nothing and to start somewhere with nothing and to build a life as well as this scene where evelyn has like had enough and is like giving in to the hopelessness yeah and picks up a bat with googly eyes and just like smashes out the window in her own laundromat and smashes up some of the machines She's like, that's punk as hell.
00:59:04
Speaker
And it's also punk to be an immigrant, to have this like, um no soft place to land and still throw yourself at life and be like, I'm going I'm going to come out the other side.
00:59:19
Speaker
yeah And so I just kind of love that because it's like, that's kind of what Evelyn, it's a perspective that's, like knit into this sweater that Evelyn has lost or has never seen, which is that she's got a backbone. She has a spirit and she's punk as hell. like She can own that. And I just like love that. Yeah, she's just like wearing this.
00:59:41
Speaker
And it's also like, it's kind of funny because, you know, there was this huge trend in like the late 90s of wearing shirts that had like Chinese characters on them, like graphic t shirts with Chinese characters on them that was really popular here. I had some of them, no idea what they said.
01:00:03
Speaker
Absolutely no idea. now Never, never. And like, didn't have Google Translate. There was no way to figure it out unless you knew someone bowl that knew Chinese and they could probably be like, people that is like, probably they said absolute nonsense. Yeah, it's like some people, some people had...
01:00:21
Speaker
so many people had tattoos oh my god characters from different languages and they're like this means like honor or strength and meanwhile their tattoo artist could like read it and was like no there was you remember like maybe a maybe like almost 10 years ago at this point ariana grande got a tattoo on her hand uh ah Was it Chinese?
01:00:48
Speaker
Or was it? I don't remember. I just remember that there was one. there Yeah, she got some characters. Where she she did not know the language. She did not. Yeah, she she got someone. Whoever designed it for her was not a native speaker.
01:01:01
Speaker
Did not understand context. And I don't remember. i think the tattoo was supposed to say... seven rings or it was related to her single seven rings when that came out but what it actually said in context was barbecue
01:01:24
Speaker
and that's one of those moments where you need you need to consult some people like you need to check in you have the money to but like you could hire someone who's a translator for like one hour of their time easy Please.
01:01:41
Speaker
I think she has since gotten it removed or covered. I'm sure she has because unless she's embraced it, she'd probably let it go. But that's
01:01:54
Speaker
I feel like the equivalent would be like if you were trying to like abbreviate something, you know, like some phrase, you wanted to abbreviate it and you wanted the abbreviation to be in English, but you didn't know.
01:02:07
Speaker
And like the words, like you had like a three word phrase that started with the letters like B and Q and you got like B, B, Q and tattooed on you like you'd be like oh my god this is for that phrase that was so meaningful to me and anyone and it's like i think it's funny in any language it's because it's it's we're all doing the same thing which is not bother to translate it we're just like oh there's a romance in the fact that like it's from somewhere else but it's just so funny the dumb things that things can say and you're like why
01:02:43
Speaker
Nobody did you a solid and tried to go. So jumping to other hilarious, like I think. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Balancing the hilariousness with the deep cutting sadness. Right.
01:02:57
Speaker
There's a point. um Jobu has like leapt out of joy, but joy is wearing the golf outfit. And Waymond, like Alpha Waymond, has jumped out of Waymond.
01:03:11
Speaker
Evelyn is just kind of like left with a dad of hers that's from a different universe who's trying to kill Joy. yeah and then like Waymond and Joy are like, did you have a stroke? Are you like out of your mind?
01:03:26
Speaker
And she's like, no, no, no. It's like this movie. And she's trying to describe Ratatouille. Yeah. And... She keeps mixing up the rat with raccoon. Raccoon.
01:03:40
Speaker
Raccoony. Raccoony. I think.
01:03:46
Speaker
That's like magnificent because at first we're just hearing it from her. Yeah. This and honest wild version. And honestly, her comparison makes sense that like they're being controlled. Like that the comparison that like you're being controlled by someone else. somebody else and you don't know it. Perfect sense. it's It's perfect. And it's a great way to describe this.
01:04:04
Speaker
And yet it's so funny. And then we actually see it. We actually see this as a different... Yeah, to go to the Raka Kuni universe. where She is like a ah chef at like um like a Benihana type of restaurant. And so she's wearing this chef outfit. It looks maybe more high end. It looks yeah very nice in there.
01:04:26
Speaker
And then there's another younger chef who like their manager keeps saying you should be as good as him. And he's like flair as he's cooking. And he looks like he has like a raccoon tail coming out of his chef's hat.
01:04:39
Speaker
And so it's like, okay, that's a hint. But it also feels like maybe this chef just has some sort of fashion sense going on here.
Conclusion and Bollywood Preview
01:04:48
Speaker
And then nope, we find out that it's straight up a raccoon just pulling his hair, <unk>s telling him how to cook.
01:04:54
Speaker
And then we get cut with the sadness of like, is it her who calls um Animal Control? i think so. Animal Control comes and takes the raccoon away. And then like throughout the the movie entire, she regrets and she changes her mind. And she's like, why should I take that away from you?
01:05:14
Speaker
yeah and she... She rides him like a raccoon to make him run. And then I think they switch. Yeah, he like he like falls and he's like, I can't do it. They're trying to chase like the animal control truck. yeah And then she's like, you know what?
01:05:29
Speaker
it's time. I can carry you. It's beautiful. It's beautiful. And they like release the raccoon and the happiness comes back. And it's just like all this. so it's like... but Just seeing this character as so many different wild versions of herself is pretty fantastic.
01:05:48
Speaker
And yet none of them ever come to the level of Jobu. Mm-hmm.
01:05:55
Speaker
Because everybody else is pretty like there's like a kind of a cap on their presentation. Yeah. So that Jobu can like really express. And yeah, she's like such a great representation. All these different iterations, all these different outfits are such a representation for at the end when there's this like conversation happening, the one that we've been working towards the whole movie between joy and Evelyn and Evelyn's like, you're a mess.
01:06:27
Speaker
Like she calls her a mess yeah quite a few times. And like, at first when we're seeing her call her a mess, Evelyn is talking to her own father and saying like, I'm accepting my child.
01:06:38
Speaker
m You did not accept me. How could you let me go? I'm not going to let my daughter go. and everybody that we see, Well, not everybody, but most of the people in the laundromat are wearing red.
01:06:51
Speaker
Yeah, everyone's dressed. And anybody who isn't wearing red is like Becky, Joy's girlfriend, isn't wearing red. Yeah, she's wearing like blue and gold. yeah And Joy's wearing pink, which is interesting. Well, she's wearing pink and then she has a shirt underneath that stripes and it's all colors. Yeah. So it's just such a lovely...
01:07:12
Speaker
moment where it's kind of like Joy being Jobu in the moment where she is not conforming. She's wearing all of these different things. And it's a visual little comment on like, yeah, she's she's marching to the beat of her own drum.
01:07:29
Speaker
She doesn't follow. like the way that you follow. Yeah. Or she still feels like she's like, am I actually at the party? am I just in the laundromat? Am I here?
01:07:41
Speaker
I just in the room? It just kind of shows like all these different things about how she doesn't feel like she belongs. Yeah. And so like, there's like a dipping her toe in cause there's like the pink, but it's not fully, you know, it's not red. It's not in there.
01:07:58
Speaker
And then like the last time that we see Jo Boo is in her like what I call like Raggedy Ann thing where it's like kind of yeah clownish where it's all these different colors and all these different chunky bits attached to each other. Even though it's it kind of feels like it's the culmination of all the things that we've seen her in. Even though I don't think it technically the actual pieces, but it feels like they're disparate pieces.
01:08:21
Speaker
yeah And so it's the messiest we've seen Jo Boo. Yeah. And it's very like avant-garde fashion if it was on a runway. And like her makeup is kind of like, it feels a little bit like 2D, like on a 3D person where it's like just things that are like slightly misplaced. It's a little bit Picasso going on. And like, i love it. It's such a cool thing, but it's such also ah representation of like,
01:08:46
Speaker
She's a mess. Yeah. She's a mess. And she's trying to go into the bagel. to The everything bagel. everything bagel. to To stop the mess.
01:08:56
Speaker
And to like. and But also to kind of like to die. yes And so like stopping the mess is is dying. yeah Is finding the the quiet. And that means ending everything. yeah And so like she's her messiest at that point. And so like Jobu has this whole journey of being these very tight fashion things and like anime like villain with like hearts on her cheeks. It's always very cool and like very um very statementy. Controlled. Yeah.
01:09:27
Speaker
And this one is not. This one is mess a bunch of different things and it's messy. And it's like right before that is the super bright like teddy bear jacket. and with her hair spelling out her name and just like, she kind of looks, she also has a ah mic.
01:09:42
Speaker
So she's a little bit like a like a K-pop star. K-pop star. Yeah. It's just like, there's just all these things happening that all lead her to look,
01:09:54
Speaker
like where the character is headed, which is the messiest part of her at the story, at the end of the story where she's ready to like end her relationship with her mom. She's ready to end her existence as Jobu.
01:10:07
Speaker
And then her mom is like, No, you are a mess. yeah And that's that's just what it is. so am I. That's life. That's life. and And at the same time, of course, like Evelyn's not just being this like prophet here. Right. She's admitting.
01:10:22
Speaker
It's a very human moment. very human moment where she is not just taking victory. She's actually admitting that she is fucked up. And like, I think that that's like so stinking beautiful. And in the background, it's in the parking lot when the two of them are having this moment.
01:10:35
Speaker
I do love that we see Waymond come out and be like, hey, don't talk to her like that. And then Joy's like, no, let her finish. yeah So that they can have this right conversation for real. Like he's not, um like you you get the sense that he's tried to play like referee between the two of them.
01:10:52
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Because his whole style with like these speeches that he's given is like, talk to each other, love each other, but they're, they're cut from the same cloth where they're louder and fightier and they're taking his advice and they're talking it out, but they're going to talk it out.
01:11:12
Speaker
Yeah. They're going to say the ugly things first. Yeah. And so it's like, I just, the, the juxtaposition of all these different visual representations is so good yeah and like i mean know we talked about but want go back to it go back to it go back to in the bagel cathedral yeah in all white like i just pearls pearl makeup the white makeup the yeah Yeah, the big old hair, sleeves. The sleeves, shoulder. Yeah. The rough is like this beautiful like organza or something. like very light and so crispy. Yeah, and that one is like...
01:11:56
Speaker
I want to know if that one had a little bit more made, you know, because it's like there's like a beaded pearl collar and then the rough and then like the dangly bits. There was, I i don't remember which article it was in, but um but Shirley said that...
01:12:13
Speaker
That one was the one one that they had a lot of time because she said they filmed it near the end of the entire shoot and that she was able to have multiple fittings with Stephanie's shoe and refine that look. So I don't know if they did actually make anything. yeah i think maybe she said they made like maybe they just made like a belt or something, but they were able, I think, to really look at it again and again throughout the course of filming and make choices. Because that one is such an important costume because we return to it over and over again. Because that is, that's where, you know, that's one of the places where she is like, so certain that she's going to jump into this everything bagel and die.
01:12:55
Speaker
You know, she's convincing, trying to convince Evelyn, this is it. We're going to do it. And like I put everything in it so that we can just go in there, wrap it up. Yep. And it's like just this moment where Jobu is the most like a cult leader because she is like, it's almost like she's the leader of like a resistance kind of because there's all these like little henchmen.
01:13:17
Speaker
They have like them have like the bagel like painted on them and it's It really feels like we jumped into full-on sci-fi space opera.
01:13:28
Speaker
yeah It's phenomenal. like It's just such a great moment. And then to jump away from the bagels on the foreheads. the googly eyes the googly oh my god the googly eyes so like we see them a lot there throughout because like they're in the very first scene we come in there's a laundry bag that ends up being a laundry bag that evelyn needs to come back upstairs and get and it has giant googly eyes on it we find out that she's been getting pissed at wayman for putting googly eyes on things and like he's trying to do it
01:14:01
Speaker
It's just a little way to lighthearted. like yeah Can we have a little fun? like When she picks up the baseball bat later to smash, it's got googly on it. and that when she's When they're in like the rock universe and they're talking silently, like Evelyn turns around in her i and eyes.
01:14:21
Speaker
I love that moment so much because I feel like Jobu's character is this like nihilist, death cult, nothing matters so we shouldn't bother. And I feel like the only way to counter that is, as Wayman does, which is nothing matters so we should have fun.
01:14:40
Speaker
yeah it's it's a little bit like a mime or a clown turning around and being like, well... We can look that black hole in the face and be like, okay, you're there.
01:14:50
Speaker
Put some googly eyes on it. Put some googly eyes on it. And it's just like, I love this theme because she like, Evelyn also has a googly eye, like where third eye is. ahra And like, she just like really comes together in that moment.
01:15:06
Speaker
And I just, the choices in this, do not feel like they're very often design, especially when it's anything that borders fantasy or sci-fi very often here in the West, we see things that are solely influenced by Western fashion or that are influenced by European fashion, right? Which is in the West.
01:15:28
Speaker
And so this does not feel limited to that, even though these are clothes that we recognize and that we could go out and buy today yeah or could see on a runway like in New York. yeah But like- we're not global It's more global. It's more global and it's not following these rules that we're used you know like Yes, there are historical like hints like the the rough and like the collar that Jobu has, but it feels like this is breaking rules and it feels like the costume designer, Shirley, is... Shirley, would like to say your whole name, Shirley Karada.
01:16:04
Speaker
She has such a great background to lead her to do this with all the music videos and like her other works that she's done fashion, the time that she spent in high fashion, where she can just break these rules in ways that we're not really expecting by like slapping googly eyes on things or having this fanny pack with this key chain and have it kind of like almost reppro represent like Wayman's heart because at the very end, he's like, I got to the bathroom too when they go back to the tax office after receiving an extension and um evelyn is like oh i can hold your bag for you yeah and he like takes it off like oh so delicately and it's like it's like she offers to hold his heart and it's like how sweet is that and i hate fanny packs dude i've eaten them my whole freaking life And my husband can attest to it. And it's a joke that he'll bring up all the time because he used to have a fanny pack so that he could keep his asthma inhaler in it.
01:17:03
Speaker
And I'm like, yes, I understand the utility, but I don't love that it's in front. It should be in back. Like there are hiker fanny packs that I'm like, yeah, those are great utility belts. I love it. But like... He actually just can't get behind.
01:17:15
Speaker
Put him on the side. Put him on the back. He does wear his just off-center. He wears slightly off-center, which I appreciate very much. But I just love this thing. And then the designer also said that this was one of the first things she was able to buy.
01:17:30
Speaker
and it was one of the cheapest things she was able to buy. and it looks like it. and then in the best appropriate way, it looks like one of the cheapest things that she bought. It's just like this old leather many pack. And I just... There's...
01:17:42
Speaker
I don't know that I'm saying exactly what I mean to say, but I hope that I am that I just love that this just kind of breaks what immediate expectations are for fantastical storytelling or fantastical visuals.
01:17:54
Speaker
yeah Because we just have this very like, it's kind of the same thing when whenever we have elves or like high fantasy stuff, why is everybody always speaking with a British accent? And why is everything always look like medieval paintings? Yes. It's always medieval. It's always castles. It's always the same expectation for fantasy background.
01:18:11
Speaker
Yeah. And this doesn't have that. it It bucks that. Like, yes, we do see a hint of a cathedral. We see hints of little things, but everything all put together breaks down. that mold And so it's like such an experience to watch this and to see that in this very small period of time, this designer and these costumers were able to create things that are so grounded, but so wild. Mm hmm.
01:18:38
Speaker
And don't feel like they're pulling from other things. Yeah. That makes sense. Like as you're watching the movie, you have no idea what the next outfit that Jobu is going to wear. You, you cannot, you cannot predict it. You have no idea. And that is like the chaos that she brings to the movie that is just like you don't know where this movie is going next and visually that is a huge part of it like it could take you literally anywhere and obviously like we can only spit so much into a movie yeah but like it's just the kind of movie that you watch and
01:19:20
Speaker
get like re-energized to do your own art by watching. This, this design has so many things in it. has the cool high fashion stuff and knowing that it was short term, small budget, not able to build anything.
01:19:36
Speaker
it's a challenge that you would want to be able to do anywhere remotely as well yeah as this designer did. And it's also ah challenge to do so much to ground it in real life, but make it feel so connected to these characters and so supportive of these characters. Like,
01:19:59
Speaker
this is just such a great example of what costume design can be without having to be like my always example, Lord of the Rings. You know, there's always a place for the ones where you can build everything from scratch, but this is such a great example of like, what a cool job to have been a part of and to have done. And I can only hope that this team had a great time working on it because like, I really hope so. Like it's just so yeah,
01:20:25
Speaker
well We haven't covered everything. we haven't covered everywhere. We haven't covered all at once. But I think that it's probably time to wrap it up, unfortunately. i think we've said what our hearts needed to say.
01:20:38
Speaker
I think so. And if anyone wants to hear us talk about it for like six more hours, they probably could get in contact with us. Yeah. ah Well, thanks for listening this far. And if you haven't watched it, recommend. Like, definitely take a look. Yeah, please. It's worth it.
01:20:54
Speaker
Yeah, it is definitely worth it. It's worth the hype. right, please join us with our next episode, which is going to be jumping into Bollywood with one of... um I can't even remember what year it came out, but at least the past like 15, 20 years classic, which is Om Shanti Om, which stars Topeka Patakone, or I'm so sorry. I don't know how to say her last name, Patakone, and Shah Rukh Khan. it's just this like...
01:21:20
Speaker
It was the first Bollywood I've ever seen m movie. And it's so fantastic. It's also long heads up warning. And it's it's long for a good reason. It's got so much packed into it.
01:21:34
Speaker
So high recommend. Hope you watch before we talk about it. um I'm very excited for Melinda because this is, I think, your first Bollywood movie. Yeah. Yeah, I've seen like clips and I've seen scenes. I don't know that I've ever seen an entire Bollywood movie from beginning to end, which I'm really glad that that's about to change. yeah. All right.
01:21:57
Speaker
So episode, Om Shanti Om. Hope you get a chance to watch it and then we'll talk about it. We'll be here. Thanks for listening. Bye. Bye.