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83: YES Moments - Saying Yes To Working For A Nonprofit (Part 1)
182 Plays2 years ago
In Episodes 75 and 76, Jill Devine talked to Andy Wiggins and Todd Larkin. They are the Co-Founders of Hearts & Hope for Uganda. Hearts & Hope is a St. Louis-area 501c3 nonprofit focused on transforming poor villages in Uganda through clean water, health & wellness, education, and small business development. Since its founding in 2011, Hearts & Hope has established 8 schools which provide education to over 2,000 children!
Sara Owens is the Program Leader and Kelly Turntine is in charge of Marketing & Business Development at Hearts & Hope. In this week’s episode, Jill invited Sara and Kelly to come on the podcast to discuss the YES moment(s) that led to leaving their corporate jobs to pursue a career in the nonprofit sector.
Episode 75: A Mission To Create Hope and Transform Lives in Uganda (Part 1)
Episode 76: A Mission To Create Hope and Transform Lives in Uganda (Part 2)
Normal Goes A Long Way Website: https://www.normalgoesalongway.com/
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Normal Goes A Long Way is brought to you by Messiah St. Charles: https://messiahstcharles.org/
Two Kids and A Career: https://www.jilldevine.com/podcast
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Transcript
Introduction to Jill Devine's Podcast
00:00:00
Speaker
The following podcast is a Jill Devine Media production. Christianity has become known for judgy people, strange words, ancient stories, confusing rules, and a members-only mindset. This is why I stayed away from the church for so long, but it's not supposed to be that way. I'm Jill Devine, a former radio personality with three tattoos, a love for a good tequila, and who's never read the entire Bible.
00:00:24
Speaker
Yet, here I am hosting a podcast about faith. The Normal Goes Along Way podcast is your home for real conversations with real people using real language about how faith and real life intersect. Welcome to the conversation.
Hope and Transformation in Uganda
00:00:38
Speaker
Not too long ago, I had Andy Wiggins and Todd Larkin on for episodes 75 and 76, a mission to create hope and transform lives in Uganda. And Andy and Todd have
00:00:54
Speaker
really become these individuals who are just, I don't know, we just, I'm so glad I've gotten to know them. And the two women that are with me now probably agree that they are so happy that they have gotten to know them. But the whole background into what we're going to talk about today, I would really encourage you to go back to episodes 75 and 76 and get a background because we're going to talk about hearts and hope.
Meet Sarah and Kelly from Hearts and Hope
00:01:19
Speaker
Todd and Andy are the founders of Hearts and Hope and I have learned about Hearts and Hope through our church in St. Charles, which is a suburb outside of St. Louis, but our church is Messiah St. Charles. And so I have become more involved with Hearts and Hope and want to learn even more. And so the women in front of me, Sarah and Kelly,
00:01:42
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the podcast. So let's I guess just start first of all, what is your role at Hearts and Hope? So this is Sarah speaking and I am the program manager or leader at Hearts and Hope for Uganda. That means that I work with all of our overall programs that happen in Uganda. So our child sponsorship program.
00:02:07
Speaker
as well as any of our projects. So any clean water wells, any school construction projects. I work with our staff and then I also work with our partners to coordinate any projects and programs that are happening.
00:02:21
Speaker
Okay, and Kelly, what do you do? I guess my official title is the U.S. Business Development. I don't even know it. I do marketing, fundraising, and I lead the mission trips to Uganda.
00:02:40
Speaker
And yeah, basically trip coordination, fundraising, marketing, business development. Okay.
Kelly's Journey from Nursing to Non-Profit
00:02:47
Speaker
I think with this season of this podcast, we were talking about Yes Moments and originally they were designed
00:02:57
Speaker
When I realized I was sitting in a message on a Sunday morning and one of the pastors said something, I was like, yes, yes, that really got to me. And everybody has yes moments all over. So I realized I had pigeonholed myself by just limiting it to Sunday. So then I started talking about
00:03:17
Speaker
outside experiences. And in thinking about and what I know little about both of you and thinking about what the conversations were with Andy and Todd, I thought, okay, these two ladies have yes moments and we're going to go.
00:03:37
Speaker
clearly you did not start your careers at heart and hope, correct? Hearts and hope, correct? True. Okay. So when you go to a nonprofit, when you choose to make the jump to a nonprofit, that in itself is scary, but it has to be because of yes moments. So Kelly, let's start with what you did before hearts and hope.
00:04:01
Speaker
Before I worked in the nonprofit world, I worked in the medical world and I was a registered nurse in cardiac telemetry. I see you step down type of settings. And you're not using any of that currently? No.
00:04:20
Speaker
And you don't hear that very often, especially in the medical world. Yeah, my resume flipped drastically from like, I know nursing to nothing to do with nursing. Okay, so let's talk about that because that clearly had to be a yes moment for you to turn from that to where you are now.
00:04:38
Speaker
Yeah, I think just Uganda in general was always a yes in my heart that was waiting to come alive. Nursing was always something that I was good at and I liked taking care of people, but I never, I guess I never found passion in doing that. Like I loved what I did, but it didn't feel like my forever thing. And so when I discovered Hearts and Hope, Andy Wiggins came and talked at my sister's school that she,
00:05:08
Speaker
taught Spanish at and she came back and told me hey, I know you want to get involved helping kids in Africa and Told me about hearts and hope and so I started sponsoring with them and still doing nursing and then and then it just clicked how much I wanted to go and meet meet the child I sponsor and how build like an actual relationship with them and so I think my ultimate yes moment was when
00:05:36
Speaker
I signed up to go on my first mission trip in 2016, and then my life had drastically changed after that. And when it comes to working for Hearts and Hope, Uganda was something that just was always calling me back to itself, I guess. And when I heard that Hearts and Hope was hiring, I was about to go to Uganda and work for the summer there, not with Hearts and Hope, but just on my own.
00:06:03
Speaker
I remember some voice inside of me saying, if you don't apply for this job just because you doubt yourself, you're only a nurse or you're just a nurse, someone else is going to get that job and you're going to regret it every day of your life. You know you're meant for this job. You know that Uganda is in your heart, so go for it. And so at the airport going to Uganda, I applied for the hearts and health position and yeah, I got it when I got back, so.
00:06:26
Speaker
I'm so glad and I'm sure so many other people are glad that you listen to that voice because most of the time we don't. Okay, wait. I got to go back though because something that you said, your sister said that you had been thinking of helping kids in Africa. What is that? Like, there's clearly something that has been in your mind, in your heart. How did that all start?
00:06:53
Speaker
it was it was always there I always felt like I was even like as a child I felt like I was undeserving of how many blessings I have of like material blessings particularly and just like living in the US and I just always had like a sense of like guilt or a sense of like
00:07:13
Speaker
wanting to do something to help, anything that I could do. And it may, I sound like such a saint, but I swear I'm not. And like, as of just growing up, my mom would take us to North City and we would volunteer for, again, I'm not a saint, but we'd volunteer for certain food pantries and I'd interact with the poverty in St. Louis. And as a child meeting other fellow children,
00:07:38
Speaker
And you know in high school I remember volunteering and just really having a place particularly for children who are vulnerable and innocent and have no choice in the poverty that they were born into. And then Uganda was introduced to me through
00:07:52
Speaker
the documentary Invisible Children, which was popular when I was in high school. And so I watched that and that was about the war in northern Uganda with the child soldiers and all that horrible stuff. But that was when Uganda got into my heart. And once I was out of school and was able to support myself, I knew I had the means now to
00:08:15
Speaker
to help someone else, but I wanted to do it and know that my money was going, was going to that child. And so my sister said, like, oh, you know, we gave them dum dums and a pink soccer ball and they showed us pictures of the kids with the dum dums and the pink soccer balls. And so I was like, OK, that's good enough for me. I'm going to I'm going to start sponsoring. And yeah, then you got to never. It was just always there to want to help. As a parent to two little girls,
00:08:43
Speaker
I struggle a lot.
00:08:46
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when they take for granted and I understand they're very young and Andy and Todd and I talked about this too like you cannot go on a mission trip and come back and expect your kids to fully understand and say you don't know how well you have it that was one conversation we had but I'm you know I want my kids to know that and see that like I want them to know and
00:09:16
Speaker
I don't know when you were just talking about what you experienced like I don't know do I need to be better at my job as a mother and expose them to certain things I don't know like I that is very interesting that what you said about growing up.
Teaching Children Gratitude and Awareness of Global Poverty
00:09:33
Speaker
I think what my mom did well was she was involved with other groups that did a lot of like just service work. And it's easy for everyone to want to take their kids, no matter how old they are to a place like Uganda and show them like the actual look, this is what this is what the majority of other children in the world have to deal with every day, which obviously that's impossible. But I think Uganda can be found everywhere.
00:10:00
Speaker
I think it is important to not expose, but I guess introduce, especially children who are more privileged. That's like a better word for that. Or children who just, I guess are much more blessed, fit with material things. Having them see that even really close to where you live, there are children who
00:10:20
Speaker
They don't have food every day, or they don't have clothes, they don't take baths every day, and just showing them that that exists and this is what we can do to help, so that can extend in your backyard to all over the world. Something I think that's tricky about that is
00:10:39
Speaker
Something that I've struggled with as I've been exposed to poverty is the guilt that comes with it. And when you talk about these kids that are growing up with so much and look at these guys that don't have anything, I think there's also a struggle to not accidentally say that something's wrong with you for having so much and that or that's something that you need to feel sorry for people who don't have. Yeah, I guess instilling gratitude for what they do and having them understand why it's so important to be grateful for all of these things.
00:11:10
Speaker
And I guess the importance of prayer as well, like prayer for these children who don't have the best living situations and praying for their futures and also just acknowledging and appreciating what we do have is equally important.
00:11:24
Speaker
And maybe even that worth isn't attached to, you know, that your children don't have worth because of what they have, but that the kids who don't have things don't have less worth because of what they don't have. Like I think that I had a very similar situation with my parents being very active in the community and always bringing their kids into that. And my mom was really good at taking us places and saying, oh, we're volunteering here. You're coming with us. You're part of this. My dad was really good at living that out.
00:11:53
Speaker
day to day just with every person he would meet. So, you know, we'd be driving along and he'd see someone on the road and be like, oh, let's stop and see how they're doing. Like if they need a ride or he was a little, he was a little radical in his, uh, just like Sarah is. Yeah. Both of you and I have had multiple random people in our cars at times where you're just like, well, they seemed like they could have survived. Um, but he, you know, he would constantly be finding somebody who needs a little
00:12:17
Speaker
helping hand or oh look at this little lady who needs her groceries in or you know just showing that we all have something to give even to the people who look like us and have the same things as us and I think that's really a valuable lesson is not just oh they're poor so they need us or oh there you need to be exposed to this but recognizing you have worth because of who God has made you and they have worth because of who God has made them and how can you be benefiting the people you interact with no matter what they look like or where they
Sarah's Formative Years of Service
00:12:46
Speaker
are
00:12:46
Speaker
So you both have these childhood memories. Do you think you could identify maybe the age of when that kind of hit you? Yeah, I have a specific memory. I had to have been like eight, eight or nine. And I remember we were volunteering at the Missionaries of Charity, which is the Mother Teresa's convent or order of nuns, I guess. And they have a place in North City or they did at the time in
00:13:16
Speaker
We were delivering peaches because they had peach trees. And so we took peaches, put them in bags, and then we were delivering them to different houses that needed food. And I remember walking in with a bag of peaches to this girl who was my age. And I remember thinking that like, oh wow, like her apartment, she lived with her grandma, her apartment was so messy. Like I just remember thinking, does anyone ever clean? And like,
00:13:44
Speaker
the girl looked at me and we were like playing Barbies and I remember her Barbie was like its hair was all crazy and it looked really old and I just remember really vividly identifying like whoa this girl lives in a very different situation and then she I gave her a peach and she was like what is this I don't like I don't know what this is and I was like you don't know what a peach is you've never had a peach and just so many things like clicked with me that day of like
00:14:07
Speaker
Why do I live where I live? I eat peaches all the time and this girl has to live here with her grandma who was very sick. So that was when it hit me of something's not right in the world. It was early and I've had that ever since. I want to do something to help. I want everyone to know what a peach is. Oh, yes. Everyone to know what a peach is. Okay, Sarah, what about you?
00:14:35
Speaker
So I have a few things that come to mind and I'm not sure, you know, I'll just leave. Well, there's this tapestry of life, right? Where you're like, was it this? Was it this? And I'd say that there was definitely.
00:14:46
Speaker
When I was really young, I do remember probably being around 10 or so. And actually, my mom was really good about reading stories to us or exposing us to different things as well. So she would read us about different martyrs in different countries or different missionaries. We heard about videos on different people going to different countries. So I actually remember being probably about the age of
00:15:10
Speaker
10 and feeling like I had this dream where God was calling me to be a missionary and that He wanted me to go and help people. And I only remember I just didn't want to go to Africa. That was the only rule that I had. Really? Yeah, that was the only one because I found out from what I was listening to that you had to live in a hut and you'd probably get speared to death at some point.
00:15:29
Speaker
Oh, that was my association. That's what you heard. That was my association. That doesn't happen where we go. At least not. That was South New York. It turns out a lot of the stories she was sharing with us were very early-day missionaries. Okay, okay. As a child, though, you don't know my context.
00:15:48
Speaker
And so I do remember being like, well, as long as it's not half for now. But then it wasn't, I don't think I really, I think before that it was just this sense of compassion that they were really great at showing for all living creatures, whether it's animals or people. But when I was probably 14 or 15, I started working at a summer camp for inner city children. And the kids would tell about how they had to sleep with pipes underneath their beds in case somebody were to come in.
00:16:17
Speaker
or about you know the gun violence that their families had faced and I think like those sort of early experiences were huge wake-up calls to me in terms of this life that I had could never even imagine and here these children are not so much younger than I was myself and they literally didn't know if they could be sleep through the night peacefully and so that was just recognizing that just already put something in your mind that says
00:16:45
Speaker
okay here are some people I'm learning to love and care for like you know they're spending all summer with them and their lives are so fraught with vulnerabilities and danger and just insecurities and lack of presence of parental guidelines and education all around the board and so you recognize that disparity and you also recognize the way that you are actively contributing beneficially to their life and that honestly is
00:17:11
Speaker
I think I learned at a young age how fulfilling that is to be, to use your time and energy to pour into people and see the fruit that's born from that. I think that was something I learned really early on, like you love and you get loved back and it's just beautiful. It's not always like that, but recognizing that there's this place that you can plug into and it's not just, you know, you playing video games or you just
00:17:38
Speaker
playing with your friends or whatever, it's actually for a purpose. I think that was an early core lesson for me. Well, you both have this similar situation where it was meeting kids your own age. And I am just like thinking about that with my girls, like, oh, what would that be like if they are in a room with someone their own age completely different?
00:18:08
Speaker
lifestyle. That's what clicked. All right.
Sarah's Unconventional Path to Service
00:18:13
Speaker
We have not gotten to your yes moment, Sarah. This is what we do. I just go all over the place here. So before joining Heart and Hope, what did you do? So that's a complicated one for me because I, for instance, I went through a three year period where I didn't stay anywhere longer than three months.
00:18:36
Speaker
for three years until seven months in Mexico. And a lot of that was back and forth and back and forth going to missional things and all sorts. I have a bit of a history. Are you an adventure free spirit? No, something like that. You could say that. An escapist. An intentional liver. How about that? Okay. I like that. Intentional liver. So I think I found
00:19:03
Speaker
Really early on that I really disconnected from traditional conventional Lifestyles in terms of oh, it's expected that you like your worth comes from a piece of paper in a room and memorizing the answers long enough to take a test and then I learned that I I'm not like I can do well at school, but I don't I
00:19:26
Speaker
I when I had been having these experiences elsewhere in these other countries or in my own backyard, it felt really meaningless to me to be in a class like to spend time in a classroom at that particular when I was young. And especially with like the generic subjects that you're like,
00:19:42
Speaker
I can even use this information. I definitely don't retain it that well. And so I did not take like a traditional path to my life. It was kind of like a God what's next situation. And so I actually joined Youth with a Mission, which is a missional organization for young adults and they do some
00:20:05
Speaker
Several months of training called the discipleship training program and then they do three three or so months of field work where you get to Utilize what you have experienced and learned and so in my case we went to Haiti after the 2010 earthquake and we're working with like her like that earthquake survivors and It was when they were still like pulling people out of rubble like it was very fresh we all lived like in a tent together at like a special needs orphanage and
00:20:34
Speaker
it was a really chaotic environment and it was heartbreaking and horrifying and you did things that you felt good about and you did things that you felt horrible about because of how they were done and but either way it was one of those things like going back to the states was just almost impossible for me because you come from seeing this absolute joy within suffering and then you come back and like I remember going to the mall and being like
00:21:04
Speaker
like this, these are just stores where you just spend money to change your clothes so that you look better. Like this is just like aesthetically, you want to make yourself look better to other humans so that you can have another pair of shoes or another t shirt or and then even go into the movies and like I just paid
00:21:21
Speaker
money to watch fake lives happen in front of me. Like everything felt like a culture shock to me. Like I would go to my bed, which was a twin size bed at the time. I was like, I could fit like 10 kids in this bed. So it was just like, it took me a long time not to feel, and that goes back to the guilt thing, right? Like I had a really hard time having anything at that point because I just came from maybe these amazing people who had nothing and looking at my life in the States and I'm like,
00:21:51
Speaker
have so much, and I can't even deal with having this much. And it felt like so, I had so much guilt about it, and it took me a long time to recognize that, just like they can't help where they were born, I can't help where I was born, and that I will be around resources. I was like, even if I give up everything I have, somebody's gonna be like, oh, you gave up your phone, I have an extra phone. Oh, you don't have a, I live in abundance. Like the people around me have abundance, and there's a source of generosity here in the States too.
00:22:21
Speaker
And so I recognize that I actually can't have nothing in my current surroundings and that's not what I've been born into or need, but I do have a responsibility to use my money and resources wisely. And so recognizing that I heard a quote that every dollar you spend is a vote towards the kind of world you want to live in and just things like that, like recognizing like
00:22:43
Speaker
having resources, I need to be responsible for how I use those resources. And like you can't see stuff like that and then walk away and live a normal, like your normal life. Like you just, there's just that, you know, knowledge equals responsibility. And so I felt that really strongly at a young age and that kind of ruined a lot of things for me. Like it took me a long time.
00:23:05
Speaker
to feel okay just doing, like, spending money on socializing and stuff like that. Which I know, I did walk in here with a five dollar latte. So, you know what, I will say that there's been some areas where you do recognize, like, okay, well, do I need that every day? No, but is it okay to have everyone's well? Probably. Right. But, so from there, I just,
Sarah's Role and Fulfillment at Hearts and Hope
00:23:31
Speaker
I lived in Amsterdam and Mexico and Los Angeles and New York and Greece and just doing so I my yes moments have happened moment to moment to moment year to year to year and it's been I'm sure we could do a whole slew of yes moments with you Sarah
00:23:52
Speaker
And so I've had a lot of very normal jobs in between just working retail or I'd basically come back to St. Louis, work, save up, and then go and do these things. And especially when I was working in Greece with refugees, I did recognize I want to have the skill sets to do this well, and that there is a way to do this poorly and a way to do this in a way that actually benefits people. And so I did go back to school at that point. I had been kind of dabbling with school when I was in St. Louis,
00:24:21
Speaker
So I went back to school and I got my bachelor's degree in social work. I was thinking I would continue that up to the master's level, but I happened to see a job. It was very hard to help for Uganda, like right after I graduated. So it was the first job I applied to.
00:24:36
Speaker
I got it. Spoiler alert. And how long has it been? Almost five years. Five years. No three month thing. Five years. That's a big commitment. Oh yeah, yes. Oh yeah. But that hasn't stopped her from talking about the next thing every single month. Excuse me, Kelly. Just saying it's been five years. But that's the beauty of this particular job is something I've struggled with is that disconnect. Coming back to St. Louis where you're so separate.
00:25:06
Speaker
From everything you've experienced and then going to this field and experiencing and connecting with a people group and a demographic and a passion that you then can't take home with you. And that's what makes Heart and Hope for Uganda unique and beautiful to me.
00:25:21
Speaker
is that I still get to go and be amongst a different culture and a different, like beautiful, like beautiful people who are working towards something and struggling towards something and be part of that mission yet also go back to my very own hometown and still have that same connection and interaction and not have to have those be different worlds but one world and that is something I've never had and so I love it.
00:25:45
Speaker
I want to say that obviously the listener cannot see you two right now. They will on our social media accounts, but these two women are young. Like you two, I don't know your ages. You don't have to say, but I know you're young. I can just tell.
00:26:07
Speaker
Dang, it's just like, you're doing what some people wait to do after they've lived, quote unquote, their life, and then they get into this. And so that in itself is inspiring. I think now is a great time to hit pause on this conversation and then come back and hear the rest of the yes moments that Kelly and Sarah have for us in episode 84.