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Open Mic #35: Nate of BG Photography
9 Plays2 months ago
In this episode of "Open Mic" The MVP interviews Nate who is a wrestling photographer and podcaster. Nate discusses his journey into wrestling photography with his company Backward Glances Photography, experiences at indie shows, and interactions with wrestlers. He shares his photography techniques and the importance of capturing wrestling's essence. The conversation covers the evolution of wrestling, the significance of indie wrestling, and supportive communities. Nate also highlights his podcast, "New England Wrestlecast which focuses on the vibrant wrestling scene in the New England area. Join us as we explore the intersection of wrestling, photography, and content creation, and get a glimpse into the minds of those who bring the world of indie wrestling to life.
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Transcript
Introduction to 'Open Mic with the MVP Marco'
00:00:36
Speaker
Welcome, everyone, to another episode of Open Mic with the MVP Marco. I am, of course, your host, the MVP Marco. That is until Sheena, aka Chick Foley, decides to remove me from this show. No, I'm joking. Hopefully she would never do that. But anyway...
00:00:47
Speaker
Who the hell told you tonight was open mic night?
00:00:54
Speaker
Yeah, I got another great episode for you, another great guest. But before we get to that guest, I always shout out the Pod Foundation. That's the reason why I'm here.
Exploring the Pod Foundation's Diverse Content
00:01:04
Speaker
They're the greatest minds in professional wrestling and beyond. I shouldn't just limit us to professional wrestling. We do a ton of other different content and things like that.
00:01:15
Speaker
As you know, it is obviously the Chick Foley show, which I'm a part of, that Sheena, Seth, as well as Jordan, that rounds out the crew.
Shows Under the Pod Foundation
00:01:25
Speaker
We also have Nick, Extra Cooler, and Matt as well. The Extra Cooler show, definitely check them out. They cover almost like the nostalgia.
00:01:35
Speaker
side of wrestling. Uh, they go back in the day and kind of relive those glory days of, uh, you know, the golden era, the new generation, all that type of stuff. So definitely check out the extra cooler show, uh, to round that out, not really rounded out, but the turnbuckle Tavern, um, they're the war curses of the, uh, of the pod foundation.
00:01:55
Speaker
They literally have every type of show, including a, you know, a W show. They have an indie specific show. They have TNA, they cover movies. They do a lot of
Marco's Involvement in 'Raw Down'
00:02:05
Speaker
things. I am actually on the WWE show. Um, it's called the raw down every Tuesday at nine o'clock on Patreon live myself and J bone.
00:02:15
Speaker
Who also is a part of the pod foundation? He has coming down the aisle his own podcast definitely check that out He's he does like a week-to-week thing where he covers more up-to-date things And yeah, definitely check that out and check us out every Tuesday at 9 on patreon Turbuckle Tavern
00:02:32
Speaker
So let's get to our
Guest Introduction: Nate the Photographer
00:02:33
Speaker
guests. So my guests this time around, met him very briefly at a chaotic wrestling show in Everett here in Massachusetts. Very cool guy, kind of got talking, you know, I think he's a, you know, he's a photographer.
00:02:50
Speaker
Definitely check out his work at Backward Glances Photography, but his Instagram name is bgphotography. Definitely check that out. Very cool shots. We'll definitely talk about his style of photography and where he started and where he gets that style from.
00:03:06
Speaker
Um, he also has a podcast that's coming out new england wrestle cast definitely check that out I know I will um instead of it seems like it's definitely going to be More specific in the region in our area in the new england area.
Challenges of Outdoor Wrestling Photography
00:03:20
Speaker
So we'll get more information from him when he hops on Um, let me bring him on right now. His name is nate Nate. How are you doing?
00:03:27
Speaker
Hello. Hello. Thank you so much for having me. I am doing well. How are you? I'm doing fine. Like I said, I kind of spoke about it a little bit. We met each other briefly at the chaotic show. Albania for it was a lot of fun. Yeah. Amazing show. It was great. It was a perfect weather.
00:03:45
Speaker
Perfect crowd. Um, what I love about those shows is, you know, seeing like, especially like when the, when the outdoor show, um, the one before that was indoors, but the outdoors one's a great cause it's at a brewery. So you obviously have your wrestling crowd around the ring, but then as the night goes on.
00:04:04
Speaker
the matches go on you start to see like the whole like area just fill up with people like it's it's amazing like how like does that does it ever like you know capture your your eye when you're you're obviously your photographer you it's got a guy for detail does that ever like kind of shock you when you like you know you you do what you're thinking then you turn around you just see like a mass of people just sitting there watching the show
00:04:27
Speaker
So it definitely does.
Capturing the Action: Indoor vs Outdoor Shows
00:04:30
Speaker
So there's a lot of things about outdoor shows and brewery shows, right? And obviously, that particular owl mania event brought all that together. Yeah. So for outdoor shows, it's as the photographer, it, you're always adjusting settings, right? And that is
00:04:50
Speaker
That is a blessing and a curse because you need to be more experienced, especially if you are shooting in manual, which in my personal opinion, if you're doing professional photography, you should be. But it's constantly adjusting settings.
00:05:10
Speaker
And you definitely notice it because, one, you have to. And two, it changes the aesthetic of the match. They can utilize different things as the sun starts going down, especially when you start getting that sunset. It really changes the atmosphere. As far as people in the bar show, one thing about indie wrestling, and I've worked with multiple companies that do bar shows, Chaotic Wrestling down there in Massachusetts, I've worked with NAWA up here in Maine.
00:05:39
Speaker
And they they love bar shows because the crowd is.
00:05:45
Speaker
rowdy and indie wrestling crowds are always really good anyway. Like one thing you hear critiqued a lot when it comes to your televised events, your AW, your WWE stuff like that is people hate it when there's a quiet crowd and you know, and the wrestlers don't like it either because the louder you are, the more energy it gives them and they play off of each other and bar crowds are always loud.
00:06:10
Speaker
Yeah. And most of the time with bar crowds, they're not like wrestling marks, right? They're not high, hard wrestling fans. They're, they're like, Oh, we're at the bar. We're having some drinks. Oh, there's, there's dudes beating each other up. Like let's go watch.
00:06:28
Speaker
they can make you don't need like a Canadian destroyer or like a Spanish fly to like wow them because for them it's not those big moves it's just the action so they can have a little bit more fun with it the wrestlers can have more fun with it and ultimately it becomes just it's
00:06:50
Speaker
It's a different feel, but it's a welcome feel. Yeah. I absolutely loved it, man. And editing those photos was so fun because, you know, the so I have four and I'm sure we'll talk about this when we get more into the photography, but I have four presets that I custom made for my company. And so that way I kind of have a look and an image, a motif for my style and working those into the sky as it got a little bit deeper color and then a little bit darker,
00:07:20
Speaker
later on, it was such a fun thing to edit. I love doing them and it's...
00:07:28
Speaker
It's interesting because unlike doing an indoor show where OK, like they kill the house lights, they have their stage lights, I've adjusted my settings. I know what the first photo is going to look like. I know what the last photo is going to look like. Yeah. And so with the outdoor show and I'm adjusting settings on the fly as the lights are changing, it's a little bit more fun of an editing process because I can tweak stuff a little bit more so I can have a little bit more fun with it. And it's just it's fun to do.
00:07:58
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. Like I said, you have some amazing obviously when you go through your Instagram and you go through like all your portfolio pretty much. I mean, the page is pretty much a portfolio for the work you've done. You have definitely some amazing, I mean, they're pretty much all amazing shots. Like you said, lighting definitely matters in a lot of these. Do you ever, like you said, do you ever try to adjust
00:08:22
Speaker
or try to adapt to what's going on in the ring or the people in the ring or is that too, is that too like manual?
Adapting to Lighting and Wrestler Entrances
00:08:30
Speaker
Like do you have a say like, oh, this person's coming out. I gotta get, I gotta get this type of shot. I gotta get this type of angle. Is that, is that how you work or is it just like? 100% man. So if I get really nerdy about photography, like how much are you going to know? Like, do you know camera settings and stuff or?
00:08:46
Speaker
I mean, I so here I was going to bring this up. It's very long time ago, but I worked. OK. When I worked at Best Buy, I did work at the digital camera section. Sure. As we sold, obviously sold SLRs and all that stuff. Yeah. So my knowledge is old, old stuff. I mean, a lot of it's.
00:09:02
Speaker
The the terms are still pretty simple and they're all about the same. So, OK, so when I'm shooting wrestling, I shoot at one one thousandth of a second shutter speed and which is incredibly fast. I have a really nice camera, which I'm thankful for. And it helps me capture these great shots. And usually my ISO is sitting around 10 to 16000, depending on the the brightness and lighting of the area.
00:09:32
Speaker
Yeah, those are action shots. And that is how I get my like I stop motion on a dime, like to be flying through the air. And that picture is going to look crisp as though they're sitting still. So that's kind of my sweet spot. F stop 2.8, one 1000 shutter speed, and then like that 10 to 16,000 ISO.
00:09:52
Speaker
So the reason I bring that up is to address the question you asked me. So during intros, I have to adjust for that very similarly to the way that I would adjust for that outdoor show. They drop lights for intros. They don't use the big lights that will light up the whole ring. Every wrestler has their different color settings. And the more I do it, the more I learn who has what color settings. And so usually I will drop my shutter speed down to 1 over 500.
00:10:18
Speaker
because, you know, they're not moving so fast. So I don't need that fast shutter speed to not get blur. And then because if I crank that ISO too much, it's just going to be a washed out snowy pitcher and it's not worth it. So I'll drop that shutter speed and then I'll capture those slower moments during the intros. Yeah. So things like that things.
00:10:39
Speaker
With intros, if it's a wrestler just standing in the ring doing a promo, I'll keep that shutter speed lower. That way I can afford to have that ISO a little bit lower and capture a crisper shot. There are some things you sacrifice when you're running low light, high speed, and high ISO, even with all of the amazing AI cleanup features that Adobe has given us now. You still do lose some of it. So I try to bring back from that
00:11:09
Speaker
as much as I can.
Nate's Passion for Wrestling and Photography
00:11:12
Speaker
But yeah, I mean, you're always on the fly and that's...
00:11:16
Speaker
Part of that is, it's experience, it's skill, it's know-how, it's knowledge, it's knowing how to work your camera. It's also the functionality of the camera. So I mentioned three settings, the shutter speed, the f-stop and the ISO. I love my camera because I don't have to ever go into my menu. I have a wheel on my camera for each of those three settings.
00:11:41
Speaker
So I mean, I'll hold my camera with one hand and all three of them are reachable by my either my index finger or my thumb. So I can adjust my settings literally as I'm holding my camera taking shots.
00:11:54
Speaker
And Canon did a great job with the placement of the dials on this camera. Shout out to Canon. And to be able to work my camera with one hand either, you know, sometimes like, like I'll grab the ring post and lean to the side and take that shot because I get a cool angle.
00:12:14
Speaker
And it's super nice. The camera works great. And, you know, if I look and I look at my viewfinder and I'm like, oh, it's a little dark, like I can just dial that ISO up a couple notches and keep taking shots. And then it just it's again, but it's all experience. It's experience. It's knowing what you're looking for. It's knowing where the angle is going to be. There's a big part of it that's having an eye for it. And then obviously knowing wrestling helps to like
00:12:44
Speaker
you can watch them do their moves and watch them do the setup. Um, we're not, I probably should have asked you this before pre-show, but we're not worried about breaking kayfabe here, right? Like we all know wrestling is scripted, right?
00:12:58
Speaker
So as you watch them and you get to know a certain wrestler's move set, you can tell when a move is being set up. And if you know the move set well enough, you know, OK, they're facing this way. But I know that when that move executes, they're going to be facing this way. So somebody who doesn't know what they're watching or doesn't pay attention to those details might wonder why I'm running to the other side of the ring.
00:13:26
Speaker
But that's because I'm prepping for the shot coming in 10 seconds, not the one I'm getting right now. And again, a lot of that is how many times have I watched them perform? How many times have I seen them set this move up? And most of the time, because it's choreographed in such a way that it's theater, it's art, it's even a dance in some way. Yeah.
00:13:51
Speaker
So usually the timing for most moves is just about the same every time because their opponents also have to know what to expect. So if you're watching them prep for it and you're paying attention to those little details, it gives you the opportunity to be in the right place at the right time. Yeah. As opposed to something like a UFC or something like that, where it's, you know, actual combative fighting. Yeah. Like they're not
00:14:18
Speaker
they aren't setting it up in such that way because it's a different game, right? But it's all about that experience, man. There's nothing that makes it easier than having the time at ringside and paying attention and knowing what you're looking for.
00:14:34
Speaker
Oh, yeah, definitely.
Photography Techniques and Anticipating Moves
00:14:35
Speaker
I was going to I was actually, as you were talking, I was actually thinking about, like you said, you have to, you know, when they're in the ring, they have the time that moves. And for the most for the most part, like you said, MMA really, you can't. I mean, if you're the you kind of have to watch what they do, like you have to like you have to see their shoulders, how their shoulders are going to move, how they're, you know, how they're right. You really you can kind of anticipate what they do. But you're really you don't know what they can. They can show it. Well, I mean,
00:15:02
Speaker
I'm sure it's like any sport, right? Like, I mean, like I don't watch much outside of wrestling. Like wrestling is the only quote unquote sport that I really like. And, you know, but if you've got somebody who's a football guru, you know what I mean? You're going to be able to look at a way that the offensive line is lined up on the line of scrimmage and we'll be able to guess what type of play they're running.
00:15:29
Speaker
You know what I mean? So it's certainly not unique to wrestling, but football in some ways, and some people would argue that it's in all ways, is also very choreographed. Like the defense and the offense aren't choreographed together, but the plays in that playbook, they're choreographed.
00:15:51
Speaker
They are, you know, you, you know, whether you have a reverse or whether you're you're running out or a handoff or I don't know football that well, but, you know, all those things. So if you are photographing football or if you are just doing football analysis, again, you can look at the players on the field and be like, OK, they're doing this.
00:16:11
Speaker
Or at least that's what I think they're going to. That's most likely what they're going to do. Yep. And again, same idea with wrestling. I'll give you an example. Paris van Dale relatively recently added a new move to her moveset. She does a split stunner and it was a brand new moveset and handful of events ago. I had never seen her do it before. And then she did it. And the first three times she did it, I was behind her.
00:16:39
Speaker
And I mean, it wasn't a bad shot. It looked cool. But like I didn't get the because I love capturing the facial expressions because it really tells the story and shows the emotion. And it was behind. And it's funny because I had.
00:16:53
Speaker
I had messages on Instagram and I was like, one of these days I'm going to be in the right spot for that damn move. And the very next event, I was right there right in front and I caught, and again, you can see it on my Instagram. You've probably seen it. The most amazing shot of her like midair full split, like emotion on her face, getting ready to give that stunner.
00:17:15
Speaker
And it's again, it's learning the move. It's learning the setup. That's okay. She just did this or he just did this so I know what's coming next. Yeah. And I know where to stand. And it definitely adds to the photos because you're able to capture that emotion. You're able to capture the feeling. And then the shots look cooler.
00:17:38
Speaker
Well, yeah, yeah, definitely. You actually kind of brought me to my next question. Sure. How much how much goes into actually, you know, working with the the wrestlers on the show? Like, do you do you do you have like, you know, not every single one, obviously, you're not going to be able to speak to every single one, but there's certain ones that you have conversations with on how, you know, they want to be photographed, essentially, or is that more of like a after effect if they're doing like a photo shoot or something like that? Do you have any talks before?
00:18:07
Speaker
They they hit the ring at all. Or is it not really? They're pretty busy. It shows. Yeah. And, you know, I try and get set up and, you know, I got to make sure that all my all my batteries are charging and stuff like that. Also.
00:18:25
Speaker
There are some that will come to me and tell me like maybe one thing here or one thing there. Yeah. But I try to make it organic as much as I can. The one thing I will do is I will when I show up, no matter which promotion I go to, I show up, I talk to the promoter and I'm like, all right, because I have like I take a lot of photos.
00:18:49
Speaker
And I work for four to fives, different companies, and there's a sixth one that occasionally comes in now and then when they're local. And so, I mean, I have a backlog, man. It's a lot of photos. I do 15 to 35-ish thousand photos per event. And so, you know, that takes some time to get through, obviously.
00:19:14
Speaker
So when I show up at an event, I'll go to the promoter and I will talk to them and I'll be like, okay, what are shots that you need right away? Because you're paying me to be here. You're paying me to do this work. I want to get you something quick that you can use to promote what happens tonight.
00:19:31
Speaker
Yeah. And they'll give me a rundown like, you know, so and so is going to win this and this person is going to come out and this and that. And I'll get a list of three to five or six things that, OK, these are the shots I want tomorrow. Yeah. And that. I'll use this to segue a little bit. That is typically all I know.
00:19:52
Speaker
And that's by choice. And the reason is, is because I am I'm crew. I'm the photographer, but I'm also a 30 plus year wrestling fan. Yeah.
Nostalgia in Wrestling: WrestleMania IX and Beyond
00:20:04
Speaker
So I still want to be able to like be that little kid that loves wrestling at the side of the ring. You know what I mean? So I don't I don't look at the match card results. I don't know who's going to win. I'm sure you've probably heard
00:20:18
Speaker
When it comes to WWE, like Michael Cole doesn't look at the results ahead of time. And Ricochet's girlfriend, what's her name? The ring announcer. Samantha, Samantha. Yes, yes, Samantha. She doesn't either. She doesn't know because they want that surprise because they're still wrestling fans at heart. Yeah. You know, so sometimes I need to know. Right. Because like if a promoter comes up to me and says, hey,
00:20:45
Speaker
He's winning the belt tonight. Make sure you get a good shot. OK, I know who's going to win the belt. Right. But if I can avoid knowing the results, I try to because I want the emotion like I still want to have that fun because there is that part of me that is still that little kid that loves wrestling. Yeah. And.
00:21:08
Speaker
It's funny because, and I, I warn you, man, I can talk a lot. Also, you know, podcaster, I changed it like crazy, but I, so by all means it's your show cut me off, but, uh, I was having a conversation with aid and aggro and, uh, Queen Ariel at the last chaotic show. And I was talking about how, cause I am like, I turned 40 this year. So, and a lot of the wrestlers are early twenties, right? So I'm twice as old as some of these people. And.
00:21:38
Speaker
I was telling them how, so my first ever wrestling event, and I think this was one of your questions, so maybe we'll just lead into this. My first ever wrestling event was WrestleMania nine, the Toga party. Oh yeah. It was on my ninth birthday and I was, it was WrestleMania nine. So I have literally grown up with WrestleMania. And you know, when you're a little kid and you're watching wrestling,
00:22:04
Speaker
These men and women, obviously back then, mostly men, but these men and women, they look like gods in the ring. They're live action comic book characters. They're larger than life, right?
00:22:20
Speaker
That is one interesting thing once you are backstage and especially once you're older than all of them. Yeah, yeah. Some of them look like kids. Right. And but the thing that I love and actually Aiden Agar said that he loves the fact that I still have I'm still able to have this passion, even being like kind of see you watch how the sausage is made. Right.
00:22:46
Speaker
But still being able to fully enjoy it because I was telling him how I hang out with you guys, I chat with you guys, I get to know you guys and in the locker room, it's person to person. But when I'm out there and I'm knelt down with my camera and I'm taking photos, I'm instantly transported back to being that little kid watching wrestling. And even though I'm older and bigger than some of these guys and I'm twice their age,
00:23:15
Speaker
Like in that moment, I'm still like that little kid watching these live action superheroes. And even with all those other details that come around, they once again become larger than life and every match is still very magical.
00:23:31
Speaker
And I absolutely love that, man. And it's one of the reasons I do what I do. It's one of the reasons why I make sure that that passion and that magic is portrayed through my photography. Because, you know, not only do I want to display these amazing athletes and what they do, but I want people who look at my photos to be able to feel my passion through my photos. And I like to think I do that pretty well.
00:23:55
Speaker
Yeah, no, definitely. I was going to say, like, you know, as you as you're speaking about, you know, WrestleMania nine and remembering, like, you know, how they're kind of like these guys are like real life, like superheroes.
Iconic Wrestling Characters and Their Appeal
00:24:06
Speaker
Not I mean, nowadays, you know, they don't have like the they're not as flashy. Obviously, you have like Seth Rollins and that type of stuff. Sure.
00:24:15
Speaker
But back then, I still mark out when I see if I throw on Peacock or something like that. And I just recently watched Macho Man versus Ultimate Warrior at SummerSlam. And it's- Oh, yeah.
00:24:30
Speaker
also warriors like he's he's still one of my favorite i mean just the look he looked he was a superhero like he looked like a superhero the face paint you know the the physique of a superhero you know the the colors and you have tassels all over his oh yeah and his legs stuff like that like that was my guy like that like he obviously you know liked hoko again you know love macho man that was he's he's my first favorite
00:24:53
Speaker
Oh, yeah, like soon as also warrior like hit his music hits and he comes like speeding down the ring and he's lifting people up and like it's you know, as a kid, you're just like this. How does it get any better? Oh, for sure, man. So so like I said, my my first event that I watched live was nine. I definitely have obviously gone back over the years. Speaking of Macho Man, I think one of my favorite matches was probably the WrestleMania match with him and Ric Flair.
00:25:19
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Where where Flair got so bloody that it dyed his hair red. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's probably one of my favorite Macho Man matches. But no, you know, talking about the larger than life thing, one thing that we saw a lot in the 80s and it kind of started to die off a little in the 90s was the the fantastical supernatural characters. Right. Yes.
00:25:41
Speaker
And, you know, and one thing I'm super happy about that is gone, is that not every one of them has a job anymore. Yeah, it was a repo man and a trash man and an IRS. I love Erwin R. Scheister. But like, yeah, when they have like all the right, yes, the profession drivers. Oh, my God. Bob, spark plug Holly.
00:26:08
Speaker
But I do love the fantastical characters. I like that they are, they're more special now, right? Like I have, I think you can maybe kind of see it, but that's Bray Wyatt's moth.
00:26:20
Speaker
Yes, on my chest. I don't know if whoever watches the video. Yeah, but I've got his death moth, his death moth tattooed across my chest. I did that after he passed away. And my absolute favorite man, because he very well could have been the next undertake. Oh, yeah. You know, and he was incredible on the mic. He had such a presence. The Wyatt family was probably, in my opinion, one of the best things they've done in the last decade. Oh, yeah.
00:26:49
Speaker
And I feel like those characters are more special when they aren't every single character. And, you know, and we have a little bit of that in indie, you know, thinking of a character like that, not so much supernatural, but kind of that same mysterious motif. We have that with Mortar.
00:27:12
Speaker
Yes, I was about to actually say border. Yeah. Yeah. Like he he does. He does the lights out. He comes out. He's kind of that dark character. And we definitely have a little bit of that, that mystique and that mystery and.
00:27:29
Speaker
you know, what is this person's origin, right? What is this character's origin? And I love that in that character. But for the most part, you know, and again, everybody else is they're out there, they're competitors, they're there, they're participating in a sport. And, you know, so and again, so it makes that character more special when it's kind of a unique thing to them or one or two of them.
00:27:51
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I was going to say that like, that's one of the, he's, he's one of the, you know, the guys that I always looked out for. Cause he's always a guy, like for me, that was always a guy that I remember going to these shows. Like once I seen his name on there, I'm like, Oh, all right. I know it's going to be a good match. Like his name sticks out his presence. Like his, like the way he looks, uh, sticks out as well. Um, he almost got kind of like, has that like old school, like larger than life.
00:28:21
Speaker
kind of very much so very much stuff like that so I uh I appreciate like I said it's uh it's it's it's a lost art I think too in wrestling like you you like you kind of said there's not really many like you know you know mystical creatures and stuff like that uh with like with under not with not with undertaker but with like the Wyatt family and uh when they would you know when he passed away and that like you know
00:28:45
Speaker
They weren't doing it anymore.
Impact of Bray Wyatt's Characters
00:28:47
Speaker
In WWE, more specifically, you could kind of feel it. You could feel like there was no... Obviously, we love wrestling, we love watching the in-ring stuff, but growing up in the 80s and the 90s, we were always accustomed to that either one or two supernatural character that kind of took me out of the actual wrestling spot of it. And when he did pass away, I mean, for me, I felt it. I felt like,
00:29:14
Speaker
like WWE, they need, it was missing. Like they, like they need that supernatural character. Like obviously Alexa Bliss isn't there. So she's not, you know, doing her gimmick anymore. So that was gone. So like, well, at least you've got the white six. So yeah, exactly. So like,
00:29:30
Speaker
Yeah, it was like, it was basically like they, you know, there was no more, it was straight wrestling, like straight straight angles, you know, promos in the ring, that type of stuff. It, they didn't have that, you know, like that mystique of that mysticism to it. So, you know, they, they, you know, they brought it back with, you know, the bow Dallas and the, the Wyatt six and about.
00:29:50
Speaker
I'm excited that they brought my my son loves it. He. Oh, yeah. Right. When he sees like Chad Gable in the ring, he like perks up automatically because he knows he knows they're coming out to do the lights. We actually went to the Monday night. We're the last time they were here in Boston. It was like a couple of months ago.
00:30:08
Speaker
Yeah, it was relatively recent. Yeah. Yeah. We were there and he obviously, you know, lights go out. So we got to see it in person. Yeah. He's freaking out. He's like, Oh my God. Oh, and he's like looking all around and obviously they are surrounded and stuff like that. But that's what, you know, as a kid, I'm glad he's getting to experience that because we got to see it a lot more. We were younger, but he gets to see it now and he's going to be accustomed to that when he gets like older, hopefully continues with it. But.
Personal Wrestling Memories and Family Involvement
00:30:35
Speaker
Right. It's funny you mentioned that, right? Because talking about that mystique and like, like even something as simple as the lights going out, right? Yeah. I remember.
00:30:43
Speaker
I was really young and they had a house show here in Portland. And so we went to the house show, because Maine is small, so we don't get televised. I mean, we had a Monday Night Raw up here once. And I was there and Stone Cold was there, like it was during the attitude era, so it was a great time for it to be here. But I went to a house show and the Undertaker was there, but they didn't kill the lights.
00:31:09
Speaker
because it's just a house show. And I remember like, man, like I was bummed. I was like, cause I was waiting for that. Like the whole arena goes dark and, uh, but they don't bother with the bells and whistles with house shows. Or at least they didn't back then. Uh, but, uh, and so definitely as a kid, because
00:31:29
Speaker
You know, you think about you take a kid to go see a Marvel movie, right? And when you've got Cap and he's, you know, bouncing his shield like a pinball machine or or, you know, all these other characters doing these crazy things. And again, to them, that's what they see when they watch wrestling, because, you know, they don't like we're not we're not jaded. We're just older. Right. Like, you know, and
00:31:57
Speaker
And they don't have that knowledge. So for them, and unfortunately, it's why so many kids get hurt when they try and emulate what they see.
00:32:09
Speaker
It's it's magic to them, you know, when they see these things. And there's something like my kids, like about half of them really enjoy it. You know, my daughter, we have an IWTV subscription and my daughter always watches the indie stuff. Yeah.
00:32:29
Speaker
My middle boy absolutely loves it. He's kind of locally famous here in Maine from limitless wrestling. When when Aiden Agro turned on Danger Kid back in December, January, earlier this year, late last year, you know, my boy went to give him a high five and Agro flipped him off. Oh,
00:32:56
Speaker
And like I caught an awesome photo of it. It was, it was on, um, it was on IWTV. And that really, like, that was a choice he made, but it really solidified the heel turn, right? Like you flipped off a child. So that solidified that heel turn.
00:33:19
Speaker
And I'm good friends with Randy Carver, the owner of Limitless, and I took the picture, I added it up, did my thing to it, and sent it to him, and he loved it, and he shared it all over social media.
00:33:33
Speaker
that picture of my boy getting flipped off became like an aggro shared it everywhere because obviously he wanted to enforce his heel turn. Yeah. And then the next, the next limitless event when it was aggro versus DK, we custom made my boy a t-shirt that had the F from the get the F out. Yeah. And it said F aggro.
00:33:54
Speaker
Yeah. And and he was sitting front row and Agro Shaw the shirt and was in character giving him crap. And my boy gave him the double middle finger, which again was also live on IW TV. That's great. So, you know, when people find especially like when when the wrestlers who were aware of that and they find out that that was my son, they're like, oh, my God, that was your kid. Like, that's so cool. Like, that was such an awesome moment. And
00:34:21
Speaker
So yeah, they've grown up with I've got pictures of my kids. I mean, my daughter who is 13 and five seven. I yeah, I have pictures of her when she was like four feet tall with a Shramero. And then I have a picture of her now and she's taller than a Shramero.
00:34:44
Speaker
Um, and, uh, like, so they've all grown up with it, you know, and, and that was, again, that's why my boy tried to give Agro a high five because, you know, he, he was seven at the, uh, yeah, just turned a very young seven. I'm just turned seven. So, you know, getting the understanding of face heel heel turn, like what just happened, like that he's, he loves wrestling, but he's not quite there yet. Um, but I have pictures of Agro and DK, um,
00:35:14
Speaker
that were also just to be clear, I do want to make sure I acknowledge I'm aware that DK is Amber now. And that's amazing. Super proud of her. Fully respect that. I'm only referring to her as DK because that was the character when it happened.
00:35:32
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I want people to know what I'm talking about. But I want to make sure everyone knows I am not trying to be disrespectful in any way whatsoever. But I have pictures of Agro and DK with all of my kids. And again, same idea. It's as they were growing up. They're different ages and it's watching them grow up with wrestling. And MSP was my jam. And like, again, I don't know. There's a video version of this that goes out, too. Right. So like, yes, there's OK. So on the inside of my bicep here,
00:36:00
Speaker
is a custom drawn MSP tattoo. Oh, that's awesome. Yeah. So, um, a, uh, a limitless wrestling regular Jamie, the sign guy custom drew this for me. Um, this was about a couple of months above, yeah, about five or six months before COVID, uh, custom drew it for me. I went and got it tattooed. And, uh, no, man, MSP is
00:36:22
Speaker
fucking awesome, man. They're great. And, um, Agro in his solo career is doing awesome so far. Um, it's just, it's, but yeah, but back to the point, um, the kids all grow up with it, man. They love it. And
00:36:37
Speaker
It's, it's so much fun, man. It's such a great thing. It just brings so many people together. Sure. There's, there's versions of wrestling that like, you know, maybe if you're, if you're going to go watch a Nick gauge match, you know, maybe don't bring your seven year old. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You know, um, you know, or, or like, you know, going back to like old school ECW where like Paul Heyman was shouting about big Dick Dudley.
00:37:01
Speaker
Yeah. You know, maybe maybe keep them away from some of that stuff. But yeah, it's it's such a cool thing to be able to sit down like with a family that loves wrestling. You know, my wife loves it too. And she comes to shows as often as she can. And speaking of Mortar Mortar is hands down her favorite wrestler.
00:37:25
Speaker
It's cool to be able to share this thing that I've loved for over 30 years with my wife and my kids and have them love it, hopefully as much as I do. They pretend to just to make me happy.
00:37:38
Speaker
like i said i like uh you know obviously with chaotic you can definitely bring you know obviously you have children to welcome like you see kids all over the place and uh they're there isn't tuned with it as as the adults and stuff like that so it's really awesome
Busy Schedule and Potential Wrestling Training
00:37:52
Speaker
and uh you did mention that you you know you do other you know organizations they seem like you know rad pro
00:37:59
Speaker
Uh, which is actually, um, Acefield retro. Yep. As well. Yeah. He's a, he's, he's, he's part of the, uh, turnbuckle Tavern. You know, he does an awesome dude. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, I've had him on his show before I interviewed him. He's, he's a really awesome guy. Um, and he said, you know, he, I asked him questions about, you know, him being an announcer and all that stuff. And would he ever get like involved?
00:38:21
Speaker
in like an angle. So I ask you, have they have you ever done that or has it been? Have they asked you to get involved in anything or? So they've never directly asked me to get involved. There is so to be a ring announcer, to be a commentator, to be a ref, you to do all of those things for the most part. It's my understanding. And I might be not fully correct here, but it's my understanding that you still need to go to the wrestling school.
00:38:50
Speaker
There are still things you have to learn, right? Obviously, as the photographer, I don't need that. So really, really quick, I'll make this long story short. So I have lost close to 100 pounds in the last 18 months. At 40 years old, I'm in the best shape of my life. And I bring that up because I have thought all summer about going to any PWA and training.
00:39:19
Speaker
uh because i'm not getting any younger yeah and it's something i always wanted to do um so and i my parents always said no and then i was a heavyset guy for a long time yeah and and obviously when you see wrestlers on tv like they're they're fucking supermen sorry i don't know can we swear on here yeah all right um
00:39:37
Speaker
So like that is obviously discouraging. And then so I just never got around to it. And I was talking about it and thinking about it. And actually, I spoke with Adam Booker, who owns Eastern Wrestling Alliance in Maine, one of the companies that I shoot for. And I was talking to him about man, if I if I go through the training and I get trained,
00:39:59
Speaker
wouldn't it be cool to have an angle where like I'm doing photos but I have a dummy camera and like one of the wrestlers bumps into me and breaks my camera and then I jump in the ring and take him down like you know like because it would shock everybody because everyone knows me as the photographer yeah um
00:40:17
Speaker
So that was something that I kind of thought up, but ultimately what happened was, you know, between my full-time job, my shoot job, and then the wife and the kids and all the photography and videography that I do, and all the editing and everything else, plus trying to have some sort of non-work life outside of that, like I'm a huge gamer, and I love all my other stuff there.
00:40:43
Speaker
And plus going to the gym. I already go to the gym three or four days a week. So if I had to add a wrestling training that was one to three days a week and also an hour and a half from my house, ultimately what it came down to was, I don't know the time. And if something ever happened to me in the ring, I have a good job. I'm lucky to have a great job with great benefits. But if I hurt myself outside of the job, they wouldn't cover that and I'd be screwed.
00:41:10
Speaker
What I am doing, um, is in about two weeks, uh, any PWA does this awesome thing. It's the wrestling fantasy camp and go down and you're there for like five to six hours and you go in, you get in the ring, you take a couple of bumps. It kind of gives you a taste of what training to be a wrestler is like. Yeah.
00:41:30
Speaker
that I am doing. Because I want to at least try it once. But no, I mean, it would be a lot of fun. There's been a couple little things here and there like occasionally, if I don't want to give away too, too many secrets here, because I don't want to get in trouble.
00:41:51
Speaker
But if something needs to be communicated to me, a wrestler might come up to me and grab my shirt. And it will look like they're hollering at me, but they're telling me what they need to tell me.
00:42:05
Speaker
something like that. Or like, if I'm in the way, not like in like a get like get out of the way, but like, I don't want you to get hurt move. Yeah, sometimes like, you know, if they can tell me they'll verbally say something to me. Or like, they'll like nudge me or they'll like they'll act like but you know, they obviously want to be respectful of me and obviously respectful of my gear. Yeah. So it's always very much like, like,
00:42:34
Speaker
you know, push me, but you're not really going to push me, but I know what wrestling is. So I know to react. Yeah. You know what I mean? Um, so that's the closest I've ever gotten ever gotten to being involved. Um, and just kind of like, you know, you're there on the sideline. Yeah. Yeah. Normally. Yeah. Like you said, normally they'll like, tell you to move. I think like it wasn't the last, there was the Alabama, there was Alabama three we were at. That was the one that was indoors. Yep. Yeah. That was the, that was my very first event with chaotic.
00:43:02
Speaker
Oh, really? Oh, yes. Yeah. I think it was like I figured it was it was Mortar. Mortar and Danny Miles. The one with the one with the bottle shot at the end. Yeah, there was that. And then they like near the end. I was I was sitting near the entrance and they did like a spot where they went over the guardrail. Yes. But we were sitting. We were like literally in the way. So he like walked. He like he walks over. He just goes like this to us like.
00:43:25
Speaker
Right. Like move out of the way. We we all do to like get up and move out of the way. That's professional. I will say that I was at a while ago. WrestleMania. What's WrestleMania was.
00:43:38
Speaker
The second one that was in New York. Uh, no, actually it was, it was Roxina. It was either 2013, I think. Yeah. I think it was 2013. We went to it long ago. I'm so old. Yeah. It was a PWS pro wrestling syndicate. They usually do during the, that week and they do like a, it's called the supercard PWA supercard. So it's like a two day event. They'll do like a Saturday show.
00:44:01
Speaker
And then that you know, wrestlemania sunday they'll do like one of the actors get out. They did it Actually, no, it was friday saturday and then sunday would be wrestlemania. So we went to the saturday show the end shows. Uh, uh, it was
00:44:13
Speaker
It was new Jack's retirement match. Okay. New Jack. Yeah. I mean, he, I don't think he retired after that, but supposedly retirement match. It was him. Wrestlers are like old rock bands, man. They have like 11 retirement tours. Yeah. First I was scared because I thought, because we did, they did a signing at the beginning and uh, I thought he was going to ask me to do something in the match. Cause uh, we were, I was, I did my gut. I got a picture with him and stuff and we'll stand up to each other. And he's like, the guy's like really like top hat, like really nice suit. Like you look like,
00:44:43
Speaker
They look like new jacket for us. So I finished taking the picture. He's like, he's like, hey, he's like, he's like, he's like, do you work? Do you like, do you do this? I'm like, oh, no, no. Cause I, you know, I was like kind of muscular back then and stuff like that. And he's like, he's like, oh, you work. Do you do that? I'm like, I'm like, Oh no. And he's like, Oh, all right. So I thought he was going to be like, Hey, do you want to do a spot? And if I match it out, which I would have been like, yeah, no, I'm not doing that. But anyway, he's fighting neck, neck row butcher. Um,
00:45:08
Speaker
That was the main event. And he, yeah, he didn't warn us that he was going over the guardrails. We were sitting in the first row there. Obviously they're fighting in the ring. They're, you know, light tubes, staples, all that stuff, blood all over the place. He, he proceeds to bring, you know, they're fighting in front of me. It's like me, my, my, uh, friend, my friends, uh,
00:45:29
Speaker
girlfriend and then someone else she's a she's not a really photographer she had her then she had an icon camera so you take some really good shots and uh he comes over to us he throws freaking necro butcher right over like didn't tell anyone to move just like literally threw him over the guardrail everyone like the literally the front row you just see stand up and just like run to the back
00:45:49
Speaker
Well, I mean, also New Jack's old school, right? Oh, yeah. So so he comes from that era of kayfabe. Yeah. No, it's like he didn't warn anyone. We just everyone. Right. Man, there was blood all over the place. But we couldn't sit down because blood all over the chairs. Classic chair. So like like their blood was all over and stuff like that. I think I kind of think he did it on purpose because he was going to ask me anyway. He's probably going to say, hey, we're going to do something in front of you. Do you mind doing something? But he was probably just like, you know what?
00:46:17
Speaker
I'm just going to let this, I'm just going to go in front of these people and just do it anyway. But yeah, that was a difference. Like border was just like, Hey, move guys. Uh, new Jack was like, no, just throw neck or butcher on our laps and like continue on with the match. But, um, actually you kind of brought up something before I went into my spiel. Um,
00:46:37
Speaker
family, like, you know, like you said, work, you know, you're, you know, kayfabe versus shoot life.
Balancing Personal Life and Photography Career
00:46:42
Speaker
Like, how do you, how do you, how do you balance that? Like, what is your, is there a balance that's important to each other? Like, how does there's, there's one way I balance everything that I do and it's my wife.
00:46:56
Speaker
Um, seriously, like, uh, and she's actually like outside of my soundproofing so she can probably hear me talk about her. Uh, but, um, yeah, no, she is, she's great, man. I, uh, I would not be able to do this. Um, you know, like I work.
00:47:14
Speaker
full time for the Postal Service. I work Sunday through Thursday. And like this Thursday is an example coming up. Like I work eight to 430 and then I have to go straight from work down to Malden for the chaotic show. I'm not even going to get to come home. It's going to end. And so I'm going to leave for work at 715 in the morning on Thursday and not be home till almost one in the morning. You know, and between the two of us, we have six kids.
00:47:44
Speaker
Um, so I have four that are mine. She's got two that are hers. Um, and at any given time, there's four to six kids in this house. And, uh, you know, she, she's super supportive, man. Um, you know, whether it's me being gone for 12 hours for a back to back or, uh, or like when I did that rad pro EWA.
00:48:06
Speaker
Um, I was in Ambsbury for Rad Pro at about three o'clock that afternoon and I wasn't home from EWA. Uh, actually I got home really late because, uh, one of my cameramen for EWA was in a car accident on the way home. He's, he's okay. Um, but he was right behind me and got rear ended. So I pulled over to the side of the road to make sure he was okay. Uh, I didn't get home to almost two in the morning, um, that night. So no, man, she, she carries this house on her shoulders and, um,
00:48:36
Speaker
You know, I'll be down here editing, you know, I'll be down here because I do, like I said, I do photography for five or six different companies, depending. I also, I am the videography producer for EWA. So not only do I have the photos, but I have three different cameras that I'm working with and I edit and I do multicam videos and I do the matches, I do their promos, I do all their YouTube ads and all their TikTok and Instagram real ads.
00:49:04
Speaker
So, thankfully, EWA is only like once every six weeks. I love Adam Booker. Adam Booker actually gave me my start.
00:49:17
Speaker
which I'll go into a little bit after I finish answering your question here. But, but yeah, it's, you know, I can sit down here, you know, she'll, she'll make dinner and let me know when dinner's done. She'll bring me down coffee. She'll bring me down, you know, my zero sugar Dr. Pepper, which is addicting as all hell. You know, and
00:49:41
Speaker
I mean, I couldn't do it without her, man. I couldn't not without neglecting the kids, you know, or neglecting other responsibilities. You know, I would have time to maybe shoot for one or two companies. And thanks to her that I even got this. So, you know, so that I think that answers the question, man. And that's not me being sappy or me saying that because she's in earshot. 100% is thanks to her.
00:50:06
Speaker
I couldn't do without her and that segues into I wouldn't have this without her and the reason I say that is because
00:50:15
Speaker
I, as a fan from the crowd from about 2016 to 2018, did some photos for Limitless. Love Limitless, wrapping them on my shirt here. And, you know, Randy liked my photos. It's how I
Path to Wrestling Photography Success
00:50:29
Speaker
became friends with Randy. I was podcasting back then as well. He was a guest on my show. And the wrestlers, like, they also liked my shots. Like, I didn't have my nice, fancy, expensive camera. I didn't have the know-how. But I did what I could, but I had, and they enjoyed my shots.
00:50:45
Speaker
Um, so since then, um, I have been through a couple of divorces, uh, and just life being crazy and everything else. And you lose stuff, you lose hard drives, you know, computers fail fast forward to after COVID and, uh, and going into 2022, um,
00:51:09
Speaker
No, 2023. Yeah, 2023. So I meet my wife and we start dating, whatever. She's a high school teacher and she lived up north and I live in Portland. And so she's like, I'm going to get a job at a school that's closer to home because she ended up moving in with me. And so she ended up getting a job at the same school that Adam Booker teaches at.
00:51:34
Speaker
Oh, wow. And at the time it was a big secret, but he was resurrecting the Eastern Wrestling Alliance.
00:51:43
Speaker
And so she's like, Hey, I work with this like old wrestler guy, Adam Booker. Like, dude, I was like, Holy shit. You work with Adam Booker. Like I used to go to Stevens Avenue here in Portland and watch him wrestle. Yeah. Like over 20 years ago. Um, and so she's like, yeah, he's starting EWA back up, but shh, like it's a secret. Don't tell anybody. Yeah. Does he need a photographer? I will do it for free. Um, so he ended up adding me on Facebook.
00:52:13
Speaker
And I messaged him and I sent him some of my old limitless shots, which were super low res and looked like shit and whatever. And I was like, I can do this. I will do it for you for free. If you take me on my word, I promise you, you will like the product. And he said, okay, come do it. And my first event was their first event, which was EWA Homecoming, which was November of last year.
00:52:39
Speaker
And instantly, everybody fell in love with my work. I was very, very fortunate and very humbled by how much everyone just was blown away by my photos. I did the next event for them in February. It was actually two events back to back. We did a hockey show or we did a wrestling show after the hockey at the Civic Center here or cost insurance arena, whatever. And then there was another EWA show the next night.
00:53:04
Speaker
Um, and then it just, it kind of happened, man. Like I don't know how, um, but it just kind of happened. Like, uh, I ended up getting contacted by chase Del Monte of chaotic. And he was like, Hey, I'd like you to photograph for me. Um, so I actually reached out to Adam and I was like, man, I was like, I don't know. Cause Adam and chase go way back and
00:53:30
Speaker
I was like, man, I don't know if you put in a good word for me, but I appreciate it. And he was like, I didn't say anything. He's like, Chase came to me and was like, who's your photographer? And he's like, your work speaks for itself. And then it just blew up within a couple of months. It was EWA, limitless, rad pro, chaotic. I was shooting for NAWA here in Maine for a little while, you know, and then
00:53:58
Speaker
I mentioned another company, Big Time Wrestling, which occasionally will do shows in Massachusetts. I shoot for them as well. And it just kind of blew up out of nowhere, man. And now, at least once a week, I'm traveling somewhere for a wrestling show. It's very rare that I have a full weekend off. Jeez.
00:54:17
Speaker
That's insane. I was actually going to be the next question. How'd you like hook up with it? Right, right place, right time, man. Right place, right time. I got really lucky. And, you know, it got to the point, like, you know, we talked about mortar. So I'll give him a shout out here. He is an awesome dude, man. Super friendly, super supportive of my work.
00:54:41
Speaker
And that first chaotic show, I did Allemania 3. I had photographed Mortar at EWA a couple times at that point. And I had done a BTW show, if I'm getting my order right. But
00:55:01
Speaker
Danny Miles was there and it was my first time meeting Danny Miles and I was at my table setting up my gear and Mortar was there and Danny was there and he introduced us and Mortar looked at Danny he goes, if you want photos in the New England area, this is the guy to get.
00:55:18
Speaker
And like things like that, like it's just, and that's what it was, man. Word of mouth, like I had, and now they see me, like they know I'm going to be there, but like before I became a regular face, it was that like, whenever I showed up, they would always be like, they're like, oh, awesome. Like you're photographing tonight. I know you're going to make me look good.
00:55:38
Speaker
Yeah. So and that's just it just spread like wildfire, man. That's what you need. I mean, definitely. I mean, work speaks for herself. Like I definitely said, like, you know, I think I catch myself always going to your page, just checking out, you know, what new what new pictures you put up and stuff like that just to see what, you know, what's going on. Obviously, I still see pictures, you know, popping up from the from Alameda for. Right. Pretty nice. And it kind of like I said, kind of brings me back to like, holy crap.
00:56:06
Speaker
This guy's like amazing at these like it's like that, especially like the nighttime shots are really awesome. And I said, I'll be doing the same thing at this upcoming show. I'll definitely check out those shots and stuff like that. Yeah, I just started putting up the pictures for in deep water. Yeah, the rad pro show, the rad pro shots from unstoppable juggernaut are about to start going up. And I've still got three or after Thursday, I'll have four events that I'm still working on. Like it's always it's a
00:56:36
Speaker
The workload keeps getting smaller as it keeps growing.
00:56:41
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Another another question for you would be, obviously, you know, you kind of said, you know, you kind of, you know, busy pretty much like from, you know, front to back and to end.
Hobbies Beyond Wrestling: Gaming and Music
00:56:54
Speaker
Right. Is there do you have any other like hobbies and stuff like that that you? Yeah, I'm a gamer. You said gaming and stuff like that. Yeah. Besides gaming, is there like, do you do you have any time for like movies? I mean, yeah, like music, that type of thing.
00:57:10
Speaker
I mean, I love a little bit of everything, you know, and I know that's a really easy, boring answer. No gaming is gaming is definitely my other passion. You know, actually, this year is the 20th year of World of Warcraft and my 30th year playing MMOs. I've been playing MMOs. I started with Ultima online in 1994. Wow. So that's been a huge portion of my life.
00:57:41
Speaker
I wouldn't say that I'm a movie buff. I definitely enjoy movies. I have a few favorites, but I'm not one of those people. I'm not going to have a giant DVD Blu-ray collection. I don't have movie posters or stuff like that. Same with music. I love music, man. Life without music would be so empty. I have my favorite band of all time, Avenged Sevenfold.
00:58:10
Speaker
I have the A7X tattooed on the back of my neck. I have seen them live 27 times. I've driven as far as the MetLife Stadium in Jersey to see them live. I love everything, man. I love country music. I love rock. I love metal.
00:58:35
Speaker
When I'm editing, when I'm working, when I'm driving, it's either music or a podcast that is in. So there's definitely other things that I enjoy and that I love. As far as passions, I'm really big into D&D. I love tabletop gaming.
00:58:56
Speaker
And now I just sound boring. What else do I do?
Fitness and Comedy Interests
00:59:00
Speaker
Exercising, man. I love to cycle. I'm big into cycling. I love trail riding. I like mountain biking. I'm really big into fitness these days, going to the gym, you know, working out and challenging myself in that way and pushing myself a little bit harder. And that just becomes another addiction. You know, it's one of those things, but
00:59:22
Speaker
I try to enjoy most of what I can. Yeah. You know, I like I love stand up comedy. Stand up comedy is a big thing I enjoy. So any favorites? Who's who's your go to guy now? Or I say nowadays, nowadays is a little bit harder. I'm not too up on current. I just kind of know what TikTok and Netflix show me. OK.
00:59:49
Speaker
I think as far as active comedians at the moment, Anthony Jeselnik. Okay. Hands down. You know, as far as of all time, George Carlin.
01:00:02
Speaker
Oh my God. I mean, you can't I have my favorites. So I have two memorial tattoos on me. I have the Bray Wyatt one that I showed you earlier and I have a George Carlin one on the back of my leg. Oh, really? So on the back of my cap, it says George Carlin R.I.P. And then it's the seven dirty words you can't say on TV tattoo down the back of my leg.
01:00:21
Speaker
Yeah, Carlin man. I was 11 12 years old. I got the URL diseased album from my mom for Christmas.
01:00:33
Speaker
And for anyone that's not familiar, he starts off, he opens up the crowd. Cheers. He's like, how's everybody doing? And everyone cheers and hollers. He's like, good. Well, fuck you. Yeah. And he's like, I just want to make you feel at home. Yeah. And dude, man, I would give almost anything for him to be alive and well and to have political commentary on what the hell is going on these days.
Comedy's Influence and Evolution
01:01:00
Speaker
There's a few people, like you can definitely, you know, me and my wife, we actually, oh my God, not even maybe like last year on Amazon, they have like, they have a, I'm not sure if they're so up, but they had a, they pretty, I think they had pretty much all of his standups on there. And we watched, was it URL diseased? I think it was, was that the one where he talks about
01:01:20
Speaker
uh with you know people everywhere basically nowadays everyone's like washing their hands and you know or is that germs germs yes yeah that was your world disease yeah like we were talking about like he talks about like what's going to happen when a super virus comes along and no one's prepared for it it's like we just looked at each other we're like holy crap that actually did dude dude the craziest i don't want to go off on a tangent here but the craziest george carlin story and not a lot of people know this
01:01:48
Speaker
He recorded an album on September 9th and 10th in New York City in 2001.
01:01:57
Speaker
He was at a comedy club or a venue in New York and he recorded on the 9th and 10th of 2001, September. So we all know what that date is. He recorded an album and you can look this up. This is 100% factual. The album was going to be titled, I Kinda Like It When A Lot of People Die.
01:02:23
Speaker
Oh, geez. And look what happened a day later. Yeah. So that is the album that got scrapped. They ended up re-releasing it later. I want to say like 2016. It is released now. I think it was around 2016. But that was the album that got scrapped and then he recorded complaints and grievances.
01:02:46
Speaker
Oh, yeah. And and a lot of the material is the same. Like, even if you listen to complaints and grievances, he talks about starting with everything that happened on 9-11. Yeah. And then he goes, all right. He goes, now I want to get to the show that I was going to do before all this happened. Yeah. So a lot of what's on that album is from complaints and grievances or vice versa. But yeah, I read that and I was like, like, I got chills when I read that the first time.
01:03:16
Speaker
That's crazy. Because I was like, man, could you imagine, you know, like, if you release that, like right out. Oh, my God. If it released the day before, as opposed to recorded the day before. Insane. Yeah, his commentary. Like, like I said, you can watch pretty much like not like all of his standups, but like when he starts like in the 90s and stuff like that, early 90s. Yeah. Like, you know, the country and all that stuff like literally all that stuff is like
01:03:41
Speaker
Oh, it still holds true. It stays current. He did kind of get dirty old man a little bit towards the end. Yeah, he did. Yeah, he definitely did. You know, he got a little bit. I mean, he was always vulgar, but he got a little bit more like.
01:03:55
Speaker
Like really vulgar. Yeah. But no, Carlin, man. And since we're talking about Stephen Lynch was another big guy that I loved, the singing comedian. Yeah. I am very much into shock comedy. I like listening to stuff where it's like like Tim Minchin. Yeah, he was. Yeah, I love Tim Minchin. Like it's just I like stuff that is a little bit edgy, is a little bit.
01:04:21
Speaker
It's going to make people be like, wait, what are they just saying? Yeah, I was talking to my wife about that with like, you know, because back in the day we, you know, I read the reason why we started like talking to each other because you know, we're like chatting back and forth.
01:04:33
Speaker
And I forget I was I forget how this came up and we were talking about like Opie and Anthony. Oh, yeah. She's like, oh, I listen to Opie Anthony. That's how I was like, holy crap. I was like a woman that was just Opie Anthony. That's right. Definitely has to have a good sense of humor. Stephen, when was on Opie and Anthony? Yeah, no, he was on there. And the obviously all those comments, Bill Burr,
01:04:52
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Louis C.K. Rich Voss, Jim Norton, like all those. But another person I wish was still alive today was Patrice O'Neill. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because, you know, even even Joe Rogan says, you know, if he like is a lot of people, oh, what do you think he'd be right now? And Joe was like probably the number one podcast.
01:05:11
Speaker
And like in the entire world, he was like, I wouldn't be where I am. Like if Patrice O'Neill was alive today doing podcast, he was like, I'd be like not even close to him as far as like contact. Cause he, he was, he was another like guy that probably, you know, I would say like, they really wouldn't be able to exist nowadays. Cause it was like the way they think, like George common, the way he thinks, Oh, the way he thought was like, like
01:05:34
Speaker
It was almost like it went over most people's heads because it sounded like reaching at some point. I think Carlin. Yeah, if Carlin was still around, Carlin could do it. Right. Like he would be he would be like Eminem. You can't cancel him. Oh, yeah. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. He's already like grandfathered and right. But there would but there will never be a new Carlin.
01:05:53
Speaker
Oh, yeah, no, it's it's too. And, you know, there's something to be said for language being more respectful and stuff like that. And and I certainly don't want to go down this direction. But like, but there's something to be said for that, regardless of what side you fall on.
01:06:09
Speaker
Yeah, but because of the nature of comedy, comedy has taken one of the biggest hits from modern culture. And you hear you really have to like they they were always walking a thin line. And that line has just gotten thinner.
01:06:27
Speaker
Oh, yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? Like it's and again, for better or worse, depending on where you stand. And I'm not here to give an opinion on that one way or the other. But so and I think.
01:06:40
Speaker
The way that that language and culture and everything is changing, I think we're still, especially as older people are still learning and adjusting. And like, there's part of us that are like, well, we're setting our own ways. And then there's part of us that are like, okay, how can we, how can we maintain our identity?
01:06:57
Speaker
Yes. But maybe do things a little bit like I'm a 90s kid, man. Everything they tell me that I can't say, I was shouting into a headset on Xbox Live. Oh, yeah, exactly. Yeah. So it's just it's one of those things, man, you grow up and you you mature a little bit or you try to. You hopefully do. At least you pretend to.
01:07:20
Speaker
And I'm sure there's some shit I said on a podcast 10 years ago that I'm glad is not out there anymore. But the world was very different 10 years ago.
01:07:39
Speaker
I have a lot of women on the show, too, that I interview. And I'll ask about women's wrestling and where they're at and that type of stuff. And to me, when I'm having those conversations, I don't want to come off as, if I give my suggestion on women's wrestling, I'm the man. I know what's right, what's wrong. Right, right, right. You know what a man's playing, women's wrestling, but yeah. But that's in my own mind thinking that. Like, oh my god, am I saying they should be doing this and not this type of thing? So that's why I kind of like, you know,
01:08:08
Speaker
Chuck up the the question and let them write that type of stuff. So I always I like I said, I'm from that era from the late 80s. All right. Oh, yeah. We are from the bronze panties matches. Yeah. Oh, yeah. It's a very different world.
01:08:23
Speaker
I'm so happy for the women that are in wrestling and how much different of a culture it is for them.
Women's Wrestling Progression
01:08:35
Speaker
And now they're allowed to be out there and be athletes and put on that show and be as regarded as being as talented as their male counterparts.
01:08:45
Speaker
And that's awesome for them, man. Um, you know, and there's so many amazing women is even like in just my local or our local indie scene, you know, you've got Paris van Dale, you've got, uh, Shannon Lavangie, who's unfortunately on the shelf at the moment due to an injury. Um, you've got Caroline who's awesome. You've got Libya. You've got, I shouldn't have started naming names because now I'm going to forget names. Um, so we know how it's coming up. Like Becca is another one, right?
01:09:15
Speaker
Becca. Yeah. And again, exactly. I'm going to Ashley Vox, you know, Megan Bain, like she's not local. She's towards the world. But like, yeah. And anyone who I didn't mention, I apologize. I just on the spot. But like so many talented women wrestlers and, you know, in Indies and AW, like you get those intergender matches and they're really able to put themselves on display and show what they're capable of doing.
01:09:40
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. Like I said, I mean, I have two daughters, you know, they're not super into wrestling. You know, they pick and choose who they, you know, they like, they're kind of in and out of it. But, you know, as a, you know, as a father, you know, and, you know, watching them watch wrestling and get to see, like you said, these, you know, these strong women be on TV and, you know, performing at, you know, at a level that, I mean, obviously I couldn't do, but even, even a higher level than most men,
01:10:08
Speaker
in the ring, like one of these, and them being able to see it, you know, and being able to like, you know, mimic, you know, their, their strength. And obviously my wife's as well, like having that at home as well as seeing that on TV and stuff like that. It, it definitely, you know, it definitely, you know, makes me happy that, you know, they're not having to sit down and watch
01:10:29
Speaker
you know, mud wrestling or, uh, yeah, definitely. I mean, it was entertaining and the attitude era was there for a purpose and it was very nineties. Um, but I'm glad that it's not the thing anymore. Yeah. Oh yeah. We were like, I think me and my wife was, I was watching like some, I figured what pay-per-view was like one of the attitude error pay-per-views and they were like, obviously, you know,
01:10:50
Speaker
put women through tables and free. Right. Oh, my goodness. Yeah. I'm going to a table. Yeah, she may young. That's the most famous one there, too, is a. But yeah, my wife was just like, could you believe me? Like we used to watch. Can I can I have like two minutes? Oh, yeah, definitely. All right. But yeah, no, may young and going through the table and like, man, it was a.
01:11:18
Speaker
It was definitely a different time for us. Oh, yeah, definitely. It was like we're just watching it going. We can't believe we actually actually left the stuff on TV at the time. Oh, my God. And then like the edge and Lita, like the sex in the middle of the ring. Yeah, that's that was the yeah. Like that type of stuff. I'm like, geez, that was the beginning of the end of. Yeah, you could never do that. No, I do. No, you certainly.
01:11:46
Speaker
Even now, people think the move to Netflix for WWE gives them a gateway to do this. I don't even think you'll see it on there at all. Obviously, it's Netflix and you do what you want, but they still have people that they might not have sponsors as in commercials, but they will have sponsors throughout the show.
01:12:04
Speaker
But it's a lot bigger as a company as it was back in the late 90s, early 2000s. Oh, for sure. Also, to go back to what we were talking about earlier, watching it with our kids and our kids growing up with it.
01:12:23
Speaker
I think there's something to be said for the content being a little bit edgier, as long as it's respectfully edgy. But they can't go full Attitude Era again. We're not going to get Attitude Era 2.0. No, definitely not. Which is good, right? Because a lot of things that people don't realize is you go back and you look at the Attitude Era, and it was entertaining as all hell.
01:12:50
Speaker
But the wrestling sucked. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it was. Yeah, it was literally just like it wasn't really good wrestling. I mean, there was a few, you know, guys and gals I try to put on wrestling matches, but right. I did it a brawl or. Yeah.
Evolution of Wrestling Styles
01:13:04
Speaker
It was always interference, always. And again, it was entertaining.
01:13:09
Speaker
But it you didn't get that. And I'm sure someone's going to disagree with me. And that's fine because it's all a matter of opinion and taste. But you didn't get that technical wrestling that you have now. Oh, you know, you never and you you had your standouts like obviously Mysterio comes from that era. Yeah. A certain high flyer who did a headbutt that I won't mention.
01:13:31
Speaker
Yeah, he's also really talented neighbor. But but fuck that guy. Like there were some, you know, and then as you get into the end of the attitude era going into the aggression era. Yeah. You know, the hardies and edging Christian and stuff like that. And they were really a big part of that transition. And that is when
01:13:56
Speaker
That is when the wrestling got technical. Yeah. And that is when it got like, like there was, it was a lot more like the rock and Austin and all like iconic. No one works the mic like the rock does. But he, you know, everyone wants to give Cena shit for being like five move guy. Yeah. And same with Lesnar. But how many moves did the rock do? And he's accredited as being best wrestlers of all time. Yeah.
01:14:25
Speaker
You know, he he wiggled his foot when he kicked. Yeah. He did the people's elbow. He did the rock bottom and he like did the come get me. Yeah. And other than that, pretty generic wrestling moves. It was the way he presented them.
01:14:41
Speaker
Yeah, you know yeah It's the same with it's the same with gaming man, it's like people will love their game and then hate on other games Not realizing that those other games are basically the same as their game But it's just because they have the passion for that game. They don't see that
01:15:01
Speaker
They see past the flaws because they want to love that, but they expose those flaws
Wrestling as a Buffet of Styles
01:15:07
Speaker
and everything. And it's the same idea. People love The Rock and hate Cena, and it's like, but a lot of the criticism you give to Cena is also true for The Rock.
01:15:14
Speaker
Oh yeah, exactly. Like you said, you pick and choose what you hate and love. That's how it pretty much goes. That's, I mean, one of the great quotes I love from, I always, I think I say this like literally every episode when we talk about wrestling, is Eric Bischoff said, you know, wrestling should be, wrestling's a buffet.
01:15:35
Speaker
Right. You should be able to go in, pick and choose what you like to eat and not force anyone else to like what you eat. Right. Take your plate up. You pick what you like. You go sit down at your table and you enjoy, you enjoy your meal and let someone else do the same thing. They might not pick the same foods you're picking or the same type of wrestling. We should say different styles, but they're going to enjoy their own version of wrestling, what they like. They might like the theatrical side of it. You might like the technical side. You might like the.
01:16:03
Speaker
I don't know the, you know, you might like the very, very technical side, like, yeah, like the ZSJs of the, you know, like I said, uh, recently, I thought, what, what, what was it? Uh, wrestle dream. They had that match. I figured which one it was with pay-per-view, but you know, uh, Brian Danielson and Zach Zaber Jr. I thought though that match was, I thought it was the best match on the card. Other people would be like, what the hell are you talking about?
01:16:28
Speaker
But that was a very technical, like wrestling that type of match, but I thought it was the best one in the car. Cause I've, you know, as a, as a, as an American watching wrestling, I'm not very, I'm not used to seeing that type of thing. Unless you watch like new Japan.
01:16:45
Speaker
you know, in WXW and, you know, rev pro, that type of stuff. Like if you're into that, you'll see it, but you don't see that type of like bat wrestling every day. Like, you know, like, you know, punches, kicks, elbows and stuff. They're like, you know, wrist locks, leg locks. They're on the mat. Most of the most of the match are like, you know, joint manipulation, doing all this stuff. And I was fascinated by it. I like I love it. Most people would say that's boring as shit. They would they do not want to watch any of that. And they those would be the same people that watch MMA.
01:17:14
Speaker
For sure. Yeah. They get on the ground and do that. But that's also a match within itself. That's almost that's also a fight. It's a fight for a submission. It's and it's a fight to defend from that submission. So like most people like, oh, that's you'll hear it. If you were watching like this is boring. That's kind of like, you know, guys almost had a guillotine choke, like already pretty much getting ready to lose his life. And you have fans yelling about how boring it is. Right. If you know, I think to the science, it's good.
01:17:43
Speaker
I think Bischoff's quote definitely sums it up and it's a buffet. And there's a quote in video games. So. And it's a video game or a game made for everybody is made for nobody.
01:17:59
Speaker
And I like that. And I've been saying it a lot lately. I'm a big Dark Souls fan. Yeah. I love my Dark Soul. I don't know if you're a gamer at all, but like Dark Souls, Dark Souls, Elden Ring, Bloodborne, stuff like that. And they are known for being incredibly difficult.
01:18:16
Speaker
Oh, yeah. They are unforgiving. They don't have difficulty settings. Like there is no easy story mode like there is in a lot of games these days. You get what you get and you play it the way the developers intended. Yes. And that doesn't sit well with some people. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And so that's and that's really where that quote comes from is is that and it's again, it's a game made for everyone is made for no one.
Appreciating Diverse Wrestling Forms
01:18:42
Speaker
And
01:18:43
Speaker
Gaming is for everyone, but not every game is for everyone. Because once you water it down enough to where it's so generic and bland that everybody can enjoy it, then we all have our individual passions that are specific.
01:19:03
Speaker
And if you water a game down so much to where it's not going to upset anybody, then it's also not going to make anybody excited. It's just going to be generic. And my wife and some of the kids love Stardew Valley. They love their farming, Sim. I can't stand it.
01:19:25
Speaker
But I don't want Stardew Valley to change. I don't want Stardew Valley to be cut. I don't want it to become something for me because there are plenty of games for me. It's for them. So we all love this umbrella that is gaming while accepting the fact that there are some games that are for us and some games that aren't. And it's the same idea with wrestling. Wrestling is for everyone.
01:19:54
Speaker
Yeah, each individual match, you may not like a slow map match. You may not like the high flyers. You see a lot of old school wrestling fans who will give people like Ricochet and Matt Seidel and stuff. Shit. Oh, yeah, they're just stuntmen. Yeah. You know, and but.
01:20:11
Speaker
That is a specific type of wrestling for a specific type of fan. Yeah. And not every match needs to be for you. Yeah. And because you need a broader appeal. And I think that that quote, you know, it aligns with Bischoff's quote where it's a buffet. Yeah. And I think it's very important. You have to have variety because you don't want whether you're a fan of high flying, whether you're a fan of submission matches or Matt wrestling. Yeah. If every match is that way, it's going to wind up all looking the same.
01:20:40
Speaker
Oh, yeah, exactly. That would be boring as hell, whether you like it or not. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's true. But even my son, he's way into like Minecraft. He loves Minecraft. I don't see the appeal in it at all whatsoever. But he you know, he talks to me all day about like, you know, everything like, yo, I like that. It's a you know, because, you know, with with Minecraft, it's
01:21:02
Speaker
it's a code it's a code game essentially like yeah like if you ever uh look at it you can there's actually like a back door to that game where you can actually oh yeah oh and like actually you can because we used to do uh workshops uh i used to work for a place that did workshops and they you know they would set up all the computers and they would run minecraft but they would have
01:21:24
Speaker
the kids like create their own Minecraft like via code. It's a very easy way to like get into coding. But most people don't know that. So that game is even more boring than what it to be anyway, because it's like, oh my god, it's a coding game. Right. He loves it. He loves like every aspect of it.
01:21:42
Speaker
he likes he likes to play like action games who like i started like he loves the lego all the lego games i started getting some because he started playing them for some reason they're just fun to play um right yeah like like the the game uh that i'm getting into now is uh you know uh black myth oh yeah i looked at that if it wasn't for the war within launching tomorrow i probably would have picked it up but
01:22:04
Speaker
I was I was afraid it was gonna be like Dark Souls like really hard but it's like it's it's it's made it's it they're not as crazy because actually brings me back to Ninja Gaiden oh yeah yeah that first came out the creator was like a lot of people were very upset that they couldn't beat the game and the creator was like that's
01:22:25
Speaker
That's not the point. That's the way I intended it. Right. I created the game. Exactly. I'm not sure if he's still alive or not, but that dude like legit looks like like a guy from The Matrix, like all wears off like he's like a rock, like like a complete rock star, like shades, leather, nice, long black, like he's just like a lot of people like even be like I couldn't get past the first boss, like the first boss on that game was hard.
01:22:50
Speaker
Like imagine the next bosses after that. They were all hard back then, man. I think one of the one of the hardest games I think of all time was probably like ghosts and goblins. Oh, yeah. So I mean, we could talk for hours, more hours about that. But yeah, it's just it's you know, it's one of those things, man. And a lot of the stuff that we talked about tonight can be covered by that, like.
01:23:16
Speaker
I think if there's anything to take away, it's that people need to do better at saying this isn't for me, but I accept that it's there for people.
01:23:25
Speaker
this is for me and I'm going to enjoy it. Like even to bring that to wrestling, AW, man, AW is such a hard pill to swallow for me because I got to tell you, I don't like it. Yeah. A lot of people. I don't like it, man. And it's hard for me because there are so many amazingly talented people there. And I won't give any spoilers for anyone that hasn't watched it yet, but there were two big people that just showed up at their event in London.
01:23:54
Speaker
Um, and, uh, that guy, not the legend, but the younger dude that showed up in the UK today or in London or whatever, whatever. I photographed him at a limitless show. Like he was at my very first limitless show fighting Matt Seidel or Evan Bourne. Um, and, you know, MJF who's a huge name at AWW. MJF was the very first ever limitless wrestling champion.
01:24:23
Speaker
And I photographed him, you know, Chris Stadtlander.
01:24:30
Speaker
Dan Housen, who's back on the indie scenes now, you know, going into WWE Christian Casanova is Carmelo Hayes. Yeah. And like, you know, he was the one that was wrestling champion and I photographed him and I met him. But so many of those people are in a W and I tried, I tried, I tried. And but the thing is, is it's a different it's a different type of show.
01:24:57
Speaker
Yeah. And, and that's perfectly okay. And I love that it's there for the people who enjoy it. Yep.
Thriving Indie Wrestling Scene
01:25:05
Speaker
And, but there are so many hardcore fan boys out there who are man, like, like AW is the best WWE needs to go away or vice versa. It's like, why do either of them need to go away? Like watch what you like. Let other people watch what they like.
01:25:19
Speaker
Yeah. And just let it be because that's the thing. You know, back to that quote, it's a buffet. Yeah. And we are so fortunate as wrestling fans that wrestling is back on the rise. Oh, yeah. Now it is. Yeah, of course.
01:25:35
Speaker
Indie wrestling is massive, you know, and thanks to things like IW TV and Twitch, you know, indie wrestling is everywhere. Yeah. And going to WWE is still a little bit more restrictive with their contracts. But a lot of the AEW guys and girls, they can be an AEW and still do the indie circuit. And like, that's so great for fans. Yeah. But just take it in and love what you love and just, you know, let that other stuff be there for the people that enjoy it.
01:26:07
Speaker
As wrestling fans, as content creators, we have such a boon of things to view and look at and enjoy and use to create our own stuff to distribute for people. It's an awesome time, man. The world's been pretty crazy for the last five years. It's nice to have these things that are fantastical and over the top.
01:26:35
Speaker
the people who make them are filled with passion and then we can turn around and make stuff that we're passionate about. And I mean, I don't know.
01:26:44
Speaker
It's not so bad every once in a while. Yeah, no, it isn't. Like I said, nowadays you should be as a wrestling fan. You should be like, there should be no complaints, right? Like there's literally, I mean, we kind of beat this, you know, dead horse, but it's like, there's literally no, there's literally every, like you, there's, there's something for you. Like, if WWE doesn't have something cool, go to AW. If they don't have something,
01:27:09
Speaker
You watch TNA. They don't have something. GCW. Yeah. Or you go to the Indies if they have none of those. Right. Like bigger promotions don't have anything. Go to your local like watch your local wrestlers. Right. And support local wrestling, man. And I don't even I don't even say that as somebody who gets paid by local wrestling. I say there's a fan, man. Support local wrestling. Definitely. They are the stars of tomorrow. You know, and it's just it's so good, man. It's intimate. It's personal. It's great.
01:27:38
Speaker
When you go to a WWE show or an AW show or whatever, and somebody looks in your direction, that's a cool feeling, sure. But when you're in an indie show, they look at you. You know what I mean? You are there.
01:27:57
Speaker
I'll share one more quick experience. I know we're going a little long on time here, but I was at a chaotic show and it was Danny Miles versus Trigger the OG for the title match. And there is this really awesome guy. He's a regular. He's at every chaotic show. I believe it's his son that he's there with. And he was, you know,
01:28:21
Speaker
harassing Danny miles like you're supposed to do to the heel. Yes. And Danny reacted because Danny is great at interacting with fans. Yeah. And he was given Danny shit and Danny took trigger and put him up because this guy was front row.
01:28:37
Speaker
and he put him up against the barricade and slapped the shit out of his chest like over and over and over and over. And then he looked at the guy and pointed at him and he goes, this is your fault.
01:28:54
Speaker
And like, that's such a cool thing, you know? And that right there is 100% exclusive to indie wrestling. Yeah, exactly. That's never going to happen in AEW. It's never going to happen in WWE. That is an indie wrestling spotlight.
01:29:12
Speaker
Yeah. And that is a credit to Danny and Triga for thinking on the fly. And hey, this fan's interacting with us. Let's give him a moment that him and everybody else will remember. Let's make him part of this moment.
01:29:28
Speaker
And that is exclusive to indie wrestling. That's 100 percent. Yeah. And it's it's it's such a great thing. If you live anywhere, it doesn't even matter. Like, you know, we're both New England dudes, you know, but there are amazing indie promotions all over the country and I'm sure all over the world.
01:29:48
Speaker
You know, if you are a wrestling fan and you've never been to an indie show, you owe it to yourself to go. I mean, tickets are usually like 15 to 30 bucks. They're super cheap.
01:30:01
Speaker
It'll be the most fun you've ever had as far as wrestling is concerned. It's such a rush. A lot of them don't do barricades. You're right there in the action. And I can't talk it up enough. And again, it's not just trying to promote a business that I work for. It's as a wrestling fan, as an indie fan. If you are a wrestling fan and you've never been to an indie show, you owe it to yourself to go.
01:30:27
Speaker
Oh yeah, definitely. I had, I had my interaction at Alameda for, um, I think it was the opening match. I figured, uh, who was it? It was the, uh, what was his name? The deke, it was at the deep Deacon. No, it wasn't Deacon. It was like the, the.
01:30:45
Speaker
the guy that he wanted everyone to praise him if I can. Oh, yeah. The miraculous Milo Mira. Yes. I love him, man. Yeah. So he walks out of like, you know, I'm like, I stand up and I'm like, I did like that. You know, he's like, yeah, better pray for me. He's like, you better praise me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I was the only one that did it.
01:31:03
Speaker
Milo, Milo Mira is awesome, man. So he I don't know if I don't know how long you've been watching Chaotic, but he used to be in a tag team and it was God's greatest creation. That's that's where I. Yeah. OK. Yeah. And it was him. And I forget what name.
01:31:27
Speaker
He went by Armani Chaos, but I forget the GGC name, but he was Brother Steven. And again, there was, I apologize to him, I forget what his character name was in the GGC. But, because they broke up very shortly after I started shooting for Chaotic. And then he turned, so Brother Steven, Milo Mira, turned on him and went,
01:31:56
Speaker
into singles competition and has Jariel as his valet, his manager, his pastor. And man,
01:32:07
Speaker
When he went through that transition of rebirth as the miraculous Milo Mira, he has done so much with that character. And another big shout out to him, another wrestler who's incredibly supportive of my work, always happy to see him, super friendly dude, and amazingly talented in the ring.
01:32:30
Speaker
Yeah. And but yeah, no, Milo Mira is awesome, man. You're going to enjoy it. He's he's in the fatal four way for the New England championship this Thursday. Yeah. Again, I don't look at results, so I don't know what's going to happen. So as somebody who works on the inside, I don't want to say like anything that might imply that I know what's going to happen because I don't I don't want to know. Yeah. But as a fan of Milo Mira, I hope he wins.
01:32:58
Speaker
Um, I mean, everybody in that match is incredibly talented. Uh, I believe it's TJ Crawford, Milo Mira, trigger the OG and Aaron Rourke. Um, and I love Aaron Rourke as well. Uh, but you know, with the rise that he's been on since his, since his singles competitor or a single competition run, um, I would love to see Milo Mira take it. Yeah, definitely.
01:33:24
Speaker
Oh man, yeah, I can't wait. It's gonna be a good, uh, it's gonna be a good show. Like I said, I'll be, I'll be there. It'll be my son. He'll be a first ever chaotic show. So hopefully you enjoy. It'll be a lot of fun and we'll have to get a selfie together and put it up to promote the podcast. Oh yeah, definitely. That'd be great. That'd be awesome.
01:33:42
Speaker
Um, but uh last question for you before we go ahead. Um, I always ask this at the end What do you what do you see as far as you know, the future of your brand? I like you said you started the podcast you started photography is there is there going to be more to come from uh His uh his his endless set of skills, right? Uh, man, that's that's a bit much. I appreciate that but um You know
01:34:12
Speaker
One day at a time, man. I'm going to give you the Bill Belichick answer. Yeah. You know, we're just focused on the next game. Yeah. No. Yeah.
01:34:24
Speaker
I love content creation and I love creative processes. I love creative works. I love, you know, taking, you know, like I said a little bit earlier, like I love taking and taking in something that people are passionate about. Yeah.
01:34:48
Speaker
and then developing my own passion from that and then creating something else that somebody else might be able to be passionate about, you know, with wrestling.
01:34:59
Speaker
Uh, for those that don't know, when it comes to indie wrestling, there's not a lot of money in indie wrestling. Um, so the people that are in there putting their wellbeing on the line multiple times a week, sometimes multiple times a day for your entertainment are doing it because they love it. Yep. They're not doing it because they love the paycheck. They're doing it because they love it. There is passion there. Um, and
01:35:27
Speaker
for the everyone that works around them, very similar can be said. I'm thankful for what I do. I'm thankful for the financial backing that I get for what I do. But at the end of the day, I do it because I love it.
01:35:44
Speaker
And if I can inspire anyone with my photography, that's a win. Whether I inspire them to come, whether I inspire them to come watch wrestling or I inspire them to become photographers themselves. That's a win for me. Yeah.
01:36:02
Speaker
And this is a long-winded version of an answer to your question. So now with podcasting. So I don't know if anyone, I've told some people I'm gonna be on this show. So hopefully some of them tune in.
01:36:16
Speaker
If there happens to be anybody who listens, who ever heard any of my old podcasts, thank you and hello. I ran my own podcast network for about eight years. We did wrestling, we did movies, we did an interview podcast and it was a lot of fun. And unfortunately life and divorce and COVID and just everything went crazy.
01:36:39
Speaker
And again, I loved creating. I was very fortunate to do a live podcast in Anaheim, California at Blizzcon for the 10-year World of Warcraft anniversary. Now we're on 20 years. I got to do a live podcast, the podcaster that inspired me, Scott Johnson, owner of the Frog Pants Network, who did the largest, longest running World of Warcraft podcast of all time called The Instance.
01:37:08
Speaker
he was my inspiration to podcasting and he used to do before COVID, used to do a yearly convention in Utah called NerdTacular. And I got to do a live podcast episode there, which was really cool. So it was only a matter of time before I got back into podcasting. And I was like, I'm bigger, I'm more deeply involved in wrestling than I've ever been.
01:37:35
Speaker
I have the opportunity. I have the hardware. I have, well, I don't have the time, but we'll pretend I do. And I have the networking. I have the connections. So let's do this, right? And so I workshop some ideas. I talked about it with my wife. I'm like, all right, what is a time slot that I can do that won't disrupt our family any further?
01:37:58
Speaker
Uh, and it works out perfect, right? Monday nights, because so I can talk about the events that just happened. I can give previews for the events coming up the next weekend. Uh, and, uh, it, so it worked. We were able to fit it into our schedule. Um, there's a lot of ideas, man. Like I said, I do videography for EWA as well. Um, you know, and so I'm videography producer and editor for them. Uh,
01:38:26
Speaker
I could, I could sit here for an hour, man, and list off things I'd love to do, you know, in, as far as wrestling and content creation, um, as far as maybe a hint of what's to come. I mean, it's just, it's already announced obviously the podcast beyond that.
01:38:44
Speaker
I mean, I gotta at least let that idea simmer for a little bit before I try and throw something else on there, but you never know, man. Follow me everywhere. Follow me on social media. I'm on threads. I can shit post a little bit on threads, so maybe don't follow me there.
01:39:00
Speaker
Uh, follow me on Instagram. Uh, you know, and, uh, I'm sure you're going to ask me this beforehand, but it does kind of, or before we end, but it does kind of tie into the question of what's next. Um, you know, follow, uh, um, tenacious warden on Instagram, uh, backward glances photography for the micro photography stuff, new England, wrestle cast for the podcast that's coming up in less than two weeks. Um,
01:39:27
Speaker
And who knows what I might announce, man? I'm very much a throw something at the wall, see if it sticks. If people like it, I'll make it work. Same with the photography. That's what I told my wife. I was like, I'm going to give it a year. If it's not profitable in a year, I'm going to stop doing it. Because at the end of the day, I do have my wife and we have six kids. And we do have to run our life. We have financial responsibility at home.
01:39:55
Speaker
Ultimately, I can't do anything that's going to cost us too much money. Yeah, exactly. But thankfully, it only took photography about three months for it to become a net gain. I'm very thankful for that and I appreciate the opportunities that everybody's given me.
01:40:14
Speaker
So, who knows, man, whether it's gaming or wrestling, probably wrestling, there might be something, man. But there's always some little ideas festering in here. I think content creators, we're always thinking about what can we do next? What's our next big thing? But for now, all of my
01:40:37
Speaker
extra time is going into getting that podcast up and running and making sure that that's a success. I miss being behind the mic. Ben, this is my
01:40:50
Speaker
second time in three weeks, guesting on a podcast. Uh, and, um, it's so fun to be on a mic, man. I love the talk. I'm sure you can tell. Um, and I love to talk about things I'm passionate about. I love to share that passion with other people. Yeah. Um, so it's, it is, man. It is. It's, it's, it's a good excuse to hang out with friends and to make, and to make new friends, but also it's, it's a good way to, to maybe,
01:41:19
Speaker
open somebody's eyes to something that they might not have been aware of or give them a different perspective or, you know, and it just it helps spread. I mean, you can't say spread like a virus anymore because of fucking Covid. Yeah, yeah.
01:41:35
Speaker
It helps spread this love. And, you know, if people find my show and support me, then they're also going to find wrestling and support that. If people, you know, find your show and support you, then they're going to, you know, support all the things that, you know, the network that you record under. And it becomes very much handshaking.
Networking and Future Content Creation
01:41:58
Speaker
You know, you help me, I help you, we help them. And ultimately, it makes this little network, metaphorically and literally that we're involved in, it makes a little bit stronger and a little bit bigger, which allows more people to be exposed to it, which again, it's a chain reaction.
01:42:18
Speaker
And, you know, if, if, and that's all, and whatever little bubbles may come out of that and ideas. And, uh, you know, I'm always workshopping stuff with, with the promoters of like, Hey, maybe we can try this next show. Hey, maybe we can do a photo booth and do like, like professionally done photos with fans at shows. And there's always these little things that are popping in my head of, Hey, what about this? Or what about that? Or how can we do this? And.
01:42:44
Speaker
And I think that that's for all content creators, man, everyone that has that creative mindset of what can I do next? You're always putting ideas out there, right? Yeah. So to answer your question, I have no idea. But I hope it's something fun. And I hope it's something that people like.
01:43:06
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. You know, I'm super excited for my new podcast. I'm excited to be behind the mic every week. Again, I'm excited to get people on. Uh, and, uh, it's, it's another venture, man. It's another venture of excitement and passion and fun that I hope opens more people's eyes to this lovely little thing that we call indie wrestling.
01:43:26
Speaker
Oh, yeah, definitely. And well, like I said, we'll pretty much we'll just we'll end it there. Like you said, you already kind of gave all your plugs and stuff like that. Well,
01:43:36
Speaker
You were amazing. Like I said, you're very, I always, like I said, I created this show because I always am invested in the people that I follow on social media. And I'm always curious as to why they started, how they do, what they do, what they do, what their process looks like and all that stuff.
01:43:57
Speaker
Um, you pretty much hit every, every, uh, you know, topic that I could think of as far as, as far as that, that person is, but definitely would look forward to, you know, speaking again at some point for sure, man. I'll have to have you on my show. Yeah.
01:44:13
Speaker
Yeah, that'd be awesome. If I can interrupt you for one moment, I know you're doing the closeout. The one thing I did mention all my stuff, so that's fine. I talked myself up a little bit. I would be a horrible person if I did not give a shout out to the people that kind of put me where I am right now with what I do. Obviously, I shouted my wife out. My wife is amazing. But
01:44:38
Speaker
Adam Booker of Eastern Wrestling Alliance, Maine. As I mentioned earlier, given my shot, Chase Del Monte, Scott from Rad Pro Wrestling, Randy Carver from Limitless Wrestling. And I'm not going to bother listing names of wrestlers, but every single one of them that
01:44:55
Speaker
gets excited when I show up to an event that buys my work off of me for their own to then turn around and sell. Anyone that contributes to my business, endlessly thankful, man. So I want to make sure I give them a mention. As a
01:45:16
Speaker
as a creator who creates something that somebody else is going to turn around and sell, like this is the first time doing that venture for me. Like usually it's, hey, thanks for, you know, you're thanking your fans, right? And it's thanks for consuming my content and giving me your hard earned money. And that's awesome. And as content creators, we appreciate that. But now like, of course they're fans of my work, at least I hope they are, but they are also clients.
01:45:43
Speaker
So, you know, and they are working really hard for their money. So and they turn around and give some of that to me. And for documenting what they're doing. So I would be totally amiss if I did not
01:45:59
Speaker
You take the time to shout them out. So a huge thank you to all of them, to every single one of them that comes up to me and shakes my hand, says hi, welcomes me as part of the crew, as part of the wrestling family. As this 30 plus year wrestling nerd, you know, it means the world to me to be able to be this close to an industry that I've loved for so long. So I had to make sure I got that out. Otherwise I would be an asshole.
01:46:23
Speaker
Well, yeah, definitely. No, that's definitely shadow. Like I said, I always try to like that's what I do at the beginning of the show. I shout out all the people that are right. And I've kind of, you know, started me into into doing this. And like I said, it's it's you can't I always say you can't do it alone. You think you can. But you always need a you always need like to collaborate somewhere and to make some connections along the way. There is no such thing as a self-made man.
01:46:51
Speaker
Oh, yeah, definitely woman. No, yeah, yeah. Either or. Yeah. No, there's no you definitely you definitely had some help along the way or you still have that help. You still have a team around you. That's that's helping you out. But that's a that's a you know, that's another discussion for another day. Oh, yeah. Yeah. No, I feel I feel like, you know, we were talking pre show about how long the episode's going to be. And yeah, now
01:47:15
Speaker
I think you probably have a better understanding of when I said I did a five and a half hour podcast. Yeah. You know, like, I think we maybe got to like half of the questions you had planned. Oh, yeah. No, I mean, I think we I think we had pretty much covered a lot of it. But I think the question was like a half hour answer. Yeah, I was watching. I was like, I was like, as you were talking about, like,
01:47:39
Speaker
looking at the questions like, oh, he answered that, answered that. So pretty much like hit everything. So like I said, you, uh, I said you hit every mark, you do what you're supposed to do. And I appreciate that. I try, man. I like it when podcasting is more conversational, uh, than checklist.
01:47:55
Speaker
That's, that's what I, that's what I, that's what I go through. Like I said, I just, I give that to the, to the guests. I'm given, I'm given my sauce right now or my, my process. I give that to the guests to think about as it before, you know, we actually have the conversation, but I'm not, I'm not, you know.
01:48:09
Speaker
got to like go, what about this? And what about that? I'm going to shoot up the question, you're going to answer it. And then you're probably going to answer another question within that question. Right. Well, that's the, yeah, that's the beauty of having a podcaster on his guest, right? Yeah. Like I've got that list of questions on my other monitor to my left here. So I can look over.
01:48:30
Speaker
And, you know, if I see that, like, I've got I've got my clock, I've got the questions. And if I see that, like, maybe an answer is getting a little long. Yeah, I can I can segue it into the next question. So and that's just it's just it's time and know how it's same with photography, man. It's skill. It's it's knowing the game. And and yeah, we're kind of giving a little of that how this option just made for podcasts.
01:48:58
Speaker
But it's one of those things where when it feels organic and it's just a natural conversation that flows, not only is it better for the listener, because it does feel more like two friends having a conversation, but it's also more fun for us.
01:49:17
Speaker
Yeah, no, definitely. Yeah. Like I said, it's that's what that's the main the main sauce of this show is just, you know, like I said, given what I can as far as questions, but then like I said, it's the first time I met you before, but for sure. Most part, it's like I've already I'd never meet anyone like beforehand. It's right when we're doing the interview, it's it's either going to be a good show or it's going to be a bad show. But I think I've had a bad one. I think they've pretty much all been very conversational and it's kind of like breaking the ice at the beginning. And then, you know,
01:49:45
Speaker
And we're talking wrestling. So like, and we're all wrestling fans. It was an easy kind of, I've done a few that weren't wrestling oriented. There is a different type of deal, but I, you know, I was knowledgeable enough to talk in that realm. So I was able to take a conversation, but they said, I want to give away all the.
01:50:04
Speaker
No, no, no, no, for sure, man, for sure. And we can we can tangent off another one and make this go another 45 minutes. I know, right. Jeez. Yeah, we have to. Yeah, we're we're at almost like you said, two hour time. Yeah, we're at an hour time with it at first, but now we're going. I think that's about what we expected. Yeah, exactly. But yeah, definitely. Like I said, it's great having you on. Hope to have you on again at some point.
01:50:27
Speaker
I appreciate it, man. Thanks for having me. It's been a lot of fun. This was good, man. I had a great time tonight, and I look forward to coming on again and hanging out some more.
01:50:37
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. And, uh, thank you everyone for listening. If you, if you're still listening, hopefully, um, if it, if not, uh, listen to the next show. Um, if you, if you, you know, if you fell asleep or something like that, we bored you to death, you know, just bring it back. What? Listen to it over again. And I know I'm joking, but yeah, I know. Thanks to everyone for listening. Whoever, you know, if it's a one person listening, 10 people, you know, 20 people, it doesn't matter. As long as you're listening, I'm happy about it. And we'll talk to you soon. Later.