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Harley Quinn S4 E7-10
808 Plays1 year ago
The fourth season of DC's Harley Quinn on Max has come to an end and Zuhair and J Scotty are back to give the thoughts on the final 4 episodes and the season as a whole.
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Transcript
Introduction to Harley Quinn Season 4
00:00:01
Speaker
On another exciting episode of the Animation Deliberation podcast, the tones may be Snyder, but oh my god is it still colorful as ever. Harley Quinn, season 4, episodes 7 through 10, right after these ads, we have no control over.
00:00:13
Speaker
Sing along if you know the words. One, two, three, it's time for animation deliberation. A conversation and a celebration of our favorite action animated series, yeah. Yeah, welcome back to another episode of Animation Deliberation, the podcast where we take action animation and cartoon seriously, but not too seriously. We're your hosts, I'm Zuhara Lee. And my name's Jay Scottie St. Clair.
Reflections on Harley Quinn's Character Development
00:00:37
Speaker
Harley Quinn has concluded. We are covering four episodes to wrap things up. It has definitely been fun. It's just good old Harley Quinn, good old, oh my God, did they really just say that? Good old DC fandom. How you feeling about it? Yeah, we did it. Another season in the books. It's kind of crazy to like think about the fact that this was the fourth season. The show doesn't feel like it's been going on for that long and four seasons isn't like, you know,
00:01:05
Speaker
crazy crazy or anything like that but uh reflecting back on it and like thinking about this season it's like you know i think every season has had like 10 to 12 episodes i i think there was a little bit of a difference in the earlier seasons they might have had a couple or more but that's been you know very fertile ground to see especially like our our two main characters of harley and ivy like really undergo some character development and change as
00:01:31
Speaker
who they are and their motivations. And it's allowed some of our side players to kind of come and go and weave in and out of the tapestry that is the story of Harley Quinn. But I don't know if this was my favorite season, but I did thoroughly enjoy it as I always do this show. How about
Season's Narrative Style and Time Travel Elements
00:01:48
Speaker
you? What are your impressions?
00:01:49
Speaker
The first season is just so hard to top because it was just so unique and something we never expected or even knew that we needed. Right. So to have such a high bar, like it is an entertaining show. And I remember when we were covering season three, like I had points of like, man, I got to watch this again this week. Like, what are we even going to talk about? Like, that's not even that good. We have to record on it.
00:02:11
Speaker
And that's why I like that we split it off into chunks because watching them to like three, four episode increments made it a lot more fun because the episodes do connect really well. And you do get to ride a little bit momentum. And then it's like, if there's one episode that's kind of like weaker than others, it's still like the average of it is still relatively good. Right.
00:02:30
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I'm like, I'm like, well, for the most part, but there are points where it's like, you know, it's abovewhelmed on the comedy aspect. And the storytelling is really unique, too. So yeah, I mean, the fact I've made it very clear how much I've been hating time travel and multiverse stuff, but the fact that they made it really entertaining to wrap up the season was like, All right, good on you. Yeah, yeah. And I definitely agree with the point that you made about like, I think I prefer consuming the show and like,
00:02:57
Speaker
If I can watch you know two three episode chunks I think that's the way I kind of like to do it instead of like watching every episode week to week like I don't get me wrong I thoroughly enjoy the show and always look forward to but it's never like the top of my playlist like I have to see the new episode of Harley Quinn like right now but without getting too spoiler I think what you mentioned about the episodes like feeding into each other like
00:03:18
Speaker
played really well with this back half of the season, especially thinking about episode seven, it was really focused on Harley and Ivy and then the subsequent episode, episode eight, we basically got to see what all the other side characters were doing and Harley and Ivy really took a backseat in that episode, which is something like thinking back on the history of the show, it's pretty rare for them to not feature at least Harley pretty heavily. Yeah, I absolutely love
00:03:45
Speaker
Nora and Bane as individuals. So the fact that that whole episode was dedicated to the two of them made me so happy. Yeah. Yeah. No, I'm right there with you
Spoiler Alert: Diving into Episode Details
00:03:54
Speaker
too. Nora was definitely a standout for me and Bane is always a delight. But I feel like we're kind of like, you know, dancing around the spoilers at this point. So do you just want to get into it?
00:04:05
Speaker
Yeah, let's just hit this news real quick and dive on in. Cool. All right. So real quick news segment here because we haven't done it in so long. I just wanted to put it out there for fans of Archer. The final season is currently airing on FX on Hulu. And that's a show I have been watching every week. I'm up to date on it, really enjoying it. And if you're a fan of Archer as well, send in some feedback. I will cover it in some capacity, probably like a
00:04:33
Speaker
You know season review or maybe a series review because it is the final season of like a show that's been running 2009 I think it's pretty crazy. Yeah Does Jay watch that one? Jason so I'm not sure I'll check in
Miyazaki's New Film and Filmmaking Journey
00:04:48
Speaker
with him though. I think it would be up his alley if he doesn't Yeah, I'd be cool to have him back on definitely definitely good call another calling you out Jay Another news a trailer was released for the boy and the hero which is also an errand
00:05:03
Speaker
Oh, excuse me. The trailer was released for The Boy and The Heron, which will also apparently not be Miyazaki's final film, despite previous claims. Not surprised by that whatsoever. It was released in Japan already. There were just like no trailers, no promo art, just go into the movie. You're lucky you guys get the name. And of course, like I'm over here jealous. I said, I refuse to watch the trailer. It's been hard avoiding the images.
00:05:28
Speaker
Yeah, because I want as much of that experience as possible because it's just so much fun going to a movie blind But yeah, i'm not surprised by that one bit that man's going to be drawing until he dies and for sure We're here for it. It's quality content and we never turned that down Yeah, I remember when we first started talking about this this movie and the fact that it was going to be his final film and the You know the just the novel approach of like having no marketing campaign whatsoever in japan I feel like this is one instance where i'm really jealous of japanese audiences because
00:05:58
Speaker
they got to go in without that marketing campaign at all. And I too have not watched the trailer much like you, but I have seen some images and I think I saw like maybe three seconds of footage and immediately clicked off, but it was enough to say, damn, I really wish I would have gone into this completely blind. But then the other part of it too is like those audiences also got to go into it. And it's not the first time because I think when the wind rises came out at that point in time, people were speculating it was going to be his final film then.
00:06:24
Speaker
and then fast forward, here we are. But we don't get that same, you know, kind of excitement of going into this movie with the possibility that this might be the final time we get to go see a Miyazaki, at least a new Miyazaki film in theaters for the first time. So that can't be too upset about that because I always look forward to more work from the man, but still looking forward to The Boy and the Heron and got to just avoid those spoilers.
00:06:51
Speaker
So I just realized that this movie comes out the week before I come to LA for vacation. Oh, yeah. Nice. I'm going to do a second viewing together. Yeah. When is that again?
00:07:04
Speaker
December 17th is the day of the game, so that general weekend. Okay. And the movie comes out on the 8th. Okay, awesome. Plenty of time to coordinate, yeah? Yeah, we can do some in-person podcasting on that one. We'll do a live review, or yeah, live in-person recording for the review or something. That'd be sweet. Oh, we've never done one before because I wasn't there when you guys did Bad Batch. I hadn't reached Nashville yet. That's right. Oh, that'd be fun. Yeah.
Episode 7: Time Travel and Relationship Dynamics
00:07:30
Speaker
But for now, back to Harley Quinn.
00:07:33
Speaker
Back to Harley Quinn indeed. So we are covering the back half of season four with episodes seven through 10, starting with episode seven with a wonderful title here, the most culturally impactful film franchise of all time. Love that.
00:07:50
Speaker
After investigating the Joker's whereabouts on the night of Nightwing's murder, Batgirl finds proof that he is lying about being his killer and exposes him. Meanwhile, Harley tries to talk to Ivy about her mental problems, but she is busy stealing the Legion of Superheroes' Time Sphere. Frustrated, Harley uses the Time Sphere so that they can visit their future selves for advice, only to arrive at an apocalyptic Gotham in the year 2048.
00:08:13
Speaker
A group of survivors explained to them that a mysterious force caused Gotham's destruction in 2024, killing many residents, including Harley and Ivy, and led to an adult Robin taking over the city.
00:08:25
Speaker
Harley and Ivy meet their future daughter named after Nateri, but she sells them out to Robin, revealing that they were bad parents and a bad couple due to their lack of communication, which makes Harley and Ivy reevaluate their relationship. One of King Short's adult children helped them escape and urges them to change this future before sending them back to their time. However, they arrive at the present six days after the apocalypse has already started.
00:08:51
Speaker
this episode was something else. The way that it started off too with Harley and Gordon's lap, I was like, there's got to be a joke coming. There's no way a joke is coming. Something's got to be going on. Oh, okay. They may have to go and edit. I totally forgot that. Like I said, I've been watching this in clunk. I forgot about that major cliffhanger of her finding another version of herself. To come back to this,
00:09:15
Speaker
you know, two weeks later for me and, you know, seeing that expression and the craziness. And I was just like, it's a great way to start it off. And then as soon as I went back in time, I was like, no, not this. But it was entertaining. I enjoyed it. Yeah, it was a good time. And it was it felt like a little bit of a bottle episode.
00:09:32
Speaker
just kind of letting them have this one-off adventure and see what their possible future would look like and see what their daughter looks like, which, you know, was fun. But I think the highlight of the episode for me was just I always one of the things I love the most about this show is when it takes.
00:09:47
Speaker
like the gas out of like especially like super self-important characters. So seeing Damien's future is like this man child. The second he gets up to try and be heroic, he's like, oh, pins and needles and like just falls on the floor. It was pretty good.
00:10:04
Speaker
That was great. And then all the wordplay when they were beating up their kid, where it's like, you're grounded as she like, pauses her. I was like, this is, this is silly. I love it. Yeah.
Episode 8: Bane's Personal Growth and Chaos in Gotham
00:10:18
Speaker
Yeah. And they think they're such good moms despite being absent and causing the apocalypse to just like... Yeah. They're like recording her at like the meeting table and everything like, aw, baby. King Shark's kid was awesome though.
00:10:33
Speaker
Oh yeah, not Baby Shark, King Baby. Yeah. All right, anything else that really stuck out to you with that episode? Nothing really. All these episodes have had really good build ups to the neck, so getting back and it's stopping on that point, seeing like, what happened?
00:10:58
Speaker
It was a good cliffhanger. I'm sure the weekly watchers enjoyed it. Yeah. Yeah. And I think like kind of looking back and at this season as a whole, I think the purpose of this episode or kind of what it like, like I said, it was a little bit of a bottle episode in terms of like them being in this alternate future. But in terms of the dynamic between Harley and Ivy, this really felt like the first step to them kind of being on the same page and on the same footing in terms of like,
00:11:26
Speaker
Harley really had been trying to get that one-on-one time with Ivy, and this is what it took. It took a misadventure like this, but at the end, they had that realization that no, we're stronger together, and the boundaries that we set up to try and protect ourselves have been
00:11:42
Speaker
alienating us more than anything. So it's just always nice as crude and funny and not serious the show can be. It always does have something poignant to say about relationships, I feel like. Yeah. And I was curious what the direction of the relationship was going to be like, because it seemed like it was heading down a breakup path and what it would take to mend that. I thought it was something that was going to last the rest of the season, but it was cool that they were able to tie it up through this.
00:12:07
Speaker
Yeah, which is, I agree with you. I think it's a credit to the writers too, because many shows with a similar relationship, the easy way out for them I feel like is just like, oh, yeah, just write a breakup story on and off again. They'll get back together just because that's the only thing we can think of to create.
00:12:25
Speaker
drama where like, you know, relationships are usually much more like multifaceted. So pay them writers. That's right. That's right. All right. Moving on to season four episode eight.
00:12:40
Speaker
Bane travels to Italy to prove himself to Nora by fixing Ivy's broken pasta maker, but learns that the model is discontinued. In desperation, he seeks out an elderly Italian woman who teaches him how to make pasta with his own hands and helps him overcome his insecurity. In return, he gets her tickets to Clayface's show as she is a big fan. Meanwhile, Luke plans to thicken the ozone layer, but when the laser he used on the moon proves to be too short to reach Earth's atmosphere, he decides to avail volcano's powers.
00:13:09
Speaker
Disgusted, Nora refuses to let this happen, so Luther traps her volcano, King Shark, and Cap'n Cold inside the Legion of Doom's headquarters. When he attempts to gas the building to force them out, they create an explosion to escape. However, the heat magnifies the atmosphere enough that Luther can use his laser and block the sun.
00:13:29
Speaker
Consequently, Gotham society crumbles into chaos in six days, surprise, surprise. When Harley and Ivy return from the future, the time sphere gets destroyed and they realize that Luther's goal was to render Superman powerless. Oh my god, Bane calling himself a toilet was so funny.
00:13:48
Speaker
Guys, I know Banjo is toilet or bathroom in Spanish. That's one of those like similar, you know, that same like rude language or whatever. And he's just laughing, not even knowing what's funny. Right, right, right, right.
00:14:04
Speaker
Yeah I know this episode was a lot of fun a little bit of a bottle episode as well except for like the B story with Nora and Volcana you know at the Legion of Doom with Lex Luthor but I really loved the Bane story here because I think one of the things about this season that I kind of alluded to is like
00:14:21
Speaker
I felt like King Shark was kind of more of a background player. Clayface was almost entirely absent from the season. But Bane, he had a few moments to shine, but I feel like this was his biggest chance to shine since the Valentine's Day special a lot earlier this year. February?
00:14:43
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. When Valentine's Day is, obviously. But no, this was like Bane's Eat, Pray, Love. And it was just great. And the show has fully invested on what started off as just a throwaway joke about mama macaronis. And now we get the full backstory of mama macaronis was mama macaronis. And then they changed the name at Ellis Island and everything like that.
00:15:13
Speaker
I love Bain's reactions to everything.
00:15:19
Speaker
I'm the pasta maker. Mama macaroni. Mama macaroni. I have everything I want from you and I don't need you anymore, so I'm going to leave now. No, you will be my heir. He just blows up the first facility, too, right after Norik. What is the explosion guy, Bane? I'm supposed to learn names now. Oh, right. Splooty. Explosions guy.
00:15:43
Speaker
Yeah, I don't think anybody ever uses the word explosion. It's always explode or explosions. Explode. Yeah. Youngins. Yeah, yeah. And then, yeah, so he like, you know, invest all this time and energy to become the pasta maker himself. And when he finally gets there, Nora is just like, oh, I had pasta for lunch. But if you break open this window, it's like, who am I to question the winds of my Nora?
00:16:12
Speaker
And she's not even faced by the fact that there's like a picture of her like plastered inside the suitcase, like on top of the pasta, just like, and whatever, just do what I want. Yeah, yeah. But, you know, thinking about the character of Nora and the journey she's been on, like,
00:16:33
Speaker
It was kind of funny talking about Archer at the top of the episode. Have you ever watched Archer? I've like watched episodes here and there. Okay, so there's a character that's voiced by
00:16:45
Speaker
I just had her name on the tip of my tongue. Judy Greer, she voices Cheryl. Oh, is that with her? Yeah, yeah, but she's just like a total agent of chaos. And I was like, I actually need to look it up because I was wondering, I was like, is she also doing the voice of Nora? But no, it's Rachel Dratch doing the voice of Nora and she's just doing, Rachel Dratch, you may know, I know she was on Saturday Night Live, but I think I first recognized her from,
00:17:11
Speaker
Mad TV, she had a stint on Mad TV that I saw her on first. Oh yeah, definitely. Anyway, yeah. Yeah, she does just such a great job of just being this agent of chaos, but this was the first time I felt like we saw some agency and actual capability from her because she was really protecting Volcana from Lex and was actually showed how smart and capable she is with just being like,
00:17:33
Speaker
It's a Sunday. Who the hell works on a Sunday? She's not nice about it, but she still is protective. I like that. Oh, she was in Spiderverse. Sorry. Yeah, she was in Spiderverse. She was the counselor, yeah.
00:17:49
Speaker
No, her dynamic with Captain Cold too. I find myself like Captain Cold has always been in the background of the show, but this season he had some moments to shine. I really like Captain Cold and not to be too on the nose, but this version of him is cool. This is a cool Leonard Snart. Yeah. Yeah. What'd she say? I can't wait to get my tongue stuck on Apopsicle. Yeah.
00:18:14
Speaker
Just like she just really wanted to be in the mood and then just kept setting it off and kept getting frustrated. It's so funny. There was two bits of dialogue. I can't remember the line. The first one was along the lines of like how many people worked on Sundays and just kind of like the work-personal relationship balance. And I'm drawing a blank on the other one now.
00:18:39
Speaker
And of course, I remember the popsicle one perfectly. Yeah. But yeah, she is an absolute delight. I love how much she was defending volcano how much she was just like, she just hates hates hates Lex and oh, it was if I'm going to be in charge for something, then we're going out with the bang type of thing.
00:19:02
Speaker
Oh, right. I don't remember the exact dialogue, but just the way that she delivered it as she was like, screw the fuck, boys. Screw all of this. Like we're taking charge right now.
00:19:12
Speaker
Yeah, it's just the delivery and the presentation. Oh, yeah. It's just perfect. Yeah, I don't know if it's the exact line, but I remember when like she was like going back and forth on the intercom with Lex and she was like, Ivy's not here. So I'm appointing myself as like next in charge, just kind of being that, you know, badass boss bitch attitude part of the language. She was she brought that energy. She's so great. I love it.
00:19:39
Speaker
It was nice to have, you know, King Shark be given something to do too. I often forget that his, you know, his background and his specialty is tech. Yeah. And he was getting bored of just being the IT guy, so he just wanted to do villain things. Yeah. And then that's where, you know, you give Nora the opportunity to be the agent of chaos again with the, uh, what they call it. It's not just in big and, but it was like in big, in bigulate or something like that. It's like, Oh no, my hands have been in big elated. How can I hack with my hands like this?
00:20:07
Speaker
No coordination with my big hands. I love the fact that they teased at the beginning of the episode, the time sphere got destroyed by the Molotov, and then you get to the end of the episode and you find out exactly how. He's like, I was aiming for that diaper store I've been afraid to go into, but these hands have no precision.
00:20:32
Speaker
I love Ron Funches as King Shark. He's so great. So wonderful. Just the way that he walked in as soon as he was triggered, just bit that dude into pieces. Oh, right. Yeah. And the bromance that he and Captain Cold had, where Captain Cold's rubbing his shoulder and Nora's like, hey, that's supposed to be my sensual shoulder rub. Just like, I got to make sure my guy is comfortable here. I'm learning so much.
00:20:59
Speaker
They didn't even know I was like beating the shit out of people and like has to constantly like wipe the blood off of her. I like that the animators actually like took that detail into account. Oh, yeah. Because they kept it on the shirt, but they kept like wiping it off her face. I was like, that's, that's good. That's really good for what's like, essentially such a clean basic design that we just love. Yeah, gotta appreciate the continuity and attention to detail with the animation there.
00:21:23
Speaker
Cool. All right. Uh, anything else to say about, uh, Il Bufune? Yeah, I was just wondering if they were going to do something stupid, like move the moon to get the laser to reach, but I'm glad they actually had like a proper solution for it. Oh, right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Despite their best efforts, Lex got what you
Episode 9: Dark Twists and Character Surprises
00:21:44
Speaker
wanted. And I can't remember if it was this episode, the episode prior or one of the upcoming episodes, but just thinking about Lex, I want to say it was this episode and I'm
00:21:53
Speaker
forgetting the context entirely, but he basically says like, I'm the boss, baby. And he's like, don't misquote me. I said, I'm the boss, comma, baby. I thought that was just, it was, that was great. It was the next one when I was giving him shit for coming up with this plan to take out Superman, which I didn't know. That's right. So I thought that was really impressive. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. That's right. It was like right where this one picked off. Cause it's like the ramifications of everything. So yeah.
00:22:19
Speaker
Okay. Well, that sounds like as good a segue as any to me. We'll go ahead and start talking about that episode. Episode nine, potato-based cloning incident. Harley and Ivy discover that Harley has a clone unknowingly created by Gordon with the Legion of Doom's cloning device. Being more of a rule follower, she suggests Ivy uses her LexCorp board membership to vote Luther out so that they can legally turn off his ozone laser.
00:22:43
Speaker
To secure the last vote, Ivy organizes a golf tournament to sway an influential board member but accidentally kills him. Nonetheless, his wife boasts against Luther because Harley had previously saved her life, allowing Ivy to shut down Luther's machine. Meanwhile, Cologne Harley reveals she witnessed Harley killing Nightwing during one of her sleepwalking episodes, which Psycho confirms by entering Harley's memory, though she asks the Flash to turn back time five minutes to prevent him from knowing it.
00:23:07
Speaker
Clone Harley intends to arrest Harley as she did with other people, who she considered criminals for even minor mistakes, leading Harley to fight and destroy her clone. Ashamed of her actions and realizing her failure as a hero, Harley announces to Batgirl that she is quitting the Bat Family before the Joker shoots Batgirl.
00:23:23
Speaker
I'm glad we had that conversation on the last episode clarifying that that microwave was some sort of cloning advice. Because when this came up, I was like, oh, that was a good speed that they planted. We saw the clone. It even clicked to me. Where did this one come from? What's going on? But then as soon as they bounced back, I was like, clever. That was very well done.
00:23:45
Speaker
Yeah, I love how they like subverted expectations too, because I remember when we were talking about, I was like, is it a fight club situation? And she's like talking to herself in the mirror again, we have the sleepwalking element, we have like the clone threat out there. And it turns out, yes, all of the above are true. So like, you're simultaneously right and wrong at the same time. And like, yeah, I'll be honest, I didn't see
00:24:07
Speaker
it going the way that it completely went there. But it was interesting reading that synopsis back because I guess in retrospect, I kind of appreciate just how much that episode did, which I know is fitting as the penultimate episode of the season. A lot of times it does most of the heavy lifting in terms of laying the groundwork for the finale. But
00:24:27
Speaker
I feel like, you know, Barbara taking the bullet from the jokers, like that's pretty huge. And like, that's been a moment that's, you know, in recent years in comic book history and whatnot. Like that is a, like, you know, a landmark moment. Like people know about that moment. And, you know, I guess I'm kind of surprised that the show didn't really play it for jokes as much as I thought it would be. It still felt like a pretty somber and intense and serious moment, especially for this show. Yeah. We got,
00:24:57
Speaker
We got full Mark Hamill Joker out of this. I know it's wrong, but the way that they hit the lightning and the laugh and the delivery of the lines and stuff, it was genuine. I think that's what I texted you. I was like, hey, are we doing episodes today? Because I actually want to watch it right now. Oh, sure. Yeah, but the intensity of that just absolutely shot up at the end of that. It was no jokes. I forgot for a moment that we were watching this comedy and not a serious DC
00:25:25
Speaker
depiction because that was very, very well done. Yeah. Yeah. And it's just like, you know, credit to the show that it can vacillate between like a tone like that. And then earlier in the episode, we get to see the board member Clegg get killed not once grotesquely and hilariously, but twice. First time taking a shot to the head. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:25:54
Speaker
And, uh, I loved how the show had the call out to succession. Have you watched succession? Okay. Okay. So, uh, I had just recently finished up the fourth season, which was the final season. So just all the allusions to succession and, you know, uh, Ivy saying to Harley, like, I can't, what'd she say? Oh yeah. She's like be Logan to his kindle ass. Like if you know, it's just like, uh, what'd she say? She said you started watching succession.
00:26:25
Speaker
I got something along those lines because I was I had Wolverine in my head when she said I was like They didn't make a Marvel reference did they? Oh, yeah. Yeah. No, they're talking about Logan Roy who was played by Brian Cox who? Did appear in x2 Oh General Stryker, so he does with another Logan and I said all comes together. Oh
00:26:44
Speaker
That's right. The clone being yeeted off the roof and turning into a giant pile of mashed potatoes had me dying, especially when it was like, kids, mashed potato day. Yeah, yeah, that was pretty great. And Barbara, like, consoling her, it's not technically murder. It's like, yeah, you know what, you're right. It's no worse than cooking.
00:27:11
Speaker
Yeah, I love that Damien Wayne is on this team and they're worried about Harley's kill count. Oh, right. Yeah. Because he had a huge count as a six-year-old. For sure, for sure. And yeah, at the mention of Damien Wayne backpedaling a little bit, but I did want to give some shout outs to Jacob Tremblay, who voices Damien Wayne in the show. And he also did the voice of the older version of himself as well.
00:27:39
Speaker
did a pretty good job differentiating his voice enough, because I know he's still a pretty young, pretty young guy. The flashback of Harley killing Nightwing was so creepy. Oh, yeah. Because he was like, where my bracelet? Here's the friendship base that I made it just for you. And just that, it's that, it's that horror like,
00:28:01
Speaker
you know, innocent little girl tone thing that's really possessed by a pet eating demon is like, I did not like it one day. Yeah. Yeah. She definitely delivered on like the, the creep factor. They're like, I'm a good guy. I'm a good guy. And it's like, Oh, your bracelet looks so cute on you. Creepy. Just gives herself a high five with his dead hand. Like,
00:28:28
Speaker
Yeah, I did love the flashes, like how easily amused he is. Like when Marley wants to pitch him on going back in time, she's just like, psycho hates doing ads. We can go back in time five minutes and make him do it again. He's like, I love it. It's so good.
00:28:45
Speaker
Yeah, I like how much they're throwing in the Justice League. We didn't talk about Wonder Woman because it wasn't really that big of an appearance, but it's fun seeing them in these little tidbits. Oh yeah, I definitely agree. It's really nice to get those little vignettes sometimes again.
Season Finale: Teaming Up Against Lex Luthor
00:29:03
Speaker
It's not that uncommon to say, and hopefully I don't get too much flack for this, but again and again, it seems like this animated side of things just does such a better job of giving us those moments of our heroes working in tandem in unison. I did love that we got the follow-up from the last episode with Bane. The only reason he got out of his situation with Mama Nakaroni is that he agreed to get
00:29:27
Speaker
her front seats at Clay Face's show, but he had to agree to headbutt Poison Ivy on live TV, so that all came to fruition during the golf tournament there. That was pretty good. I'm so aggressive. Is it Luther's hair? Oh, yeah, yeah. It looks so bad. Yeah.
00:29:48
Speaker
Yes. Like wearing the hat, you can just see the strands coming out. Right, yeah. It's worth noting you see the progression over, I think it's the course of three episodes you see when it's barely there and looks terrible, and then it starts to fill in a little bit more, and then by the time we get to the final episode, he's rocking the Superman do. Yeah, speaking of final, are you ready for it? Yeah, let's knock it out. All right, season four, episode 10, Killers Block.
00:30:12
Speaker
Harley questions her moral compass when she cannot bring herself to kill the Joker for paralyzing Batgirl. She later joins Ivy on the moon for Luther's birthday party where Ivy plans to kill Luther, but they learn that he captured a weakened Superman and obtained his powers. Unable to defeat him and realizing his business partners are not interested in making a change, Ivy quits her job and teams up with Harley to destroy their businesses.
00:30:35
Speaker
With Batgirl's computer skills, they hack the Ozone layer and blow up Lovecorp, Wayne Enterprises, Veronica Kale's company, and the Legion of Doom, while Steppenwolf sends Luther and Apocalypse as a punishment. Harley also saves Superman before the moon cracks, having finally accepted both her good and bad qualities. Three days later, Superman regaining his powers and the moon restored. Bruce is released from prison and becomes Batman again, while Harley and Ivy form a new team with Barbara and Catwoman called the Gotham City Sirens.
00:31:03
Speaker
Having discovered that Nightwing's grave had been robbed, they decided to investigate the case, unaware that Talia took the corpse and resurrected Nightwing in a Lazarus pit.
Dedication to Arleen Sorkin
00:31:13
Speaker
Note the episode was dedicated to Arlene Sorkin, the original voice and inspiration for Harley Quinn, who died during the season's run. We called it on that Lazarus pit. Yeah. There's no way they're just going to kill him off, especially with all the jokes that they have for him. Right. Yeah. There was, you know,
00:31:31
Speaker
I didn't really think for a moment that his death was going to be permanent, but I didn't mention it when we were talking about all the time travel shenanigans, but I did have a thought that that might be one of the ways that they undo that death. I just figured with Talia being there so prominently, it had to be blandly. That's obviously the better call because that's what it ended up being.
00:31:52
Speaker
Uh, but yeah, he's, it's kind of like the pet cemetery. He's back, but he's not quite right. Yeah. Where the fuck is Harley Quinn? He might not be the same as your friend was. Right. Right. There was no way that they were going to kill him and kill Barbara. Like.
00:32:15
Speaker
episodes after each other. And then Bruce and Alfred being in jail. So I like that it's all rectified. We got our Oracle story, the whole birds of prey. It's like, we're not even birds. Where the fuck did you even come up with that? Yeah, that was a great call out. Yeah. And then Alfred giving up his toilet line enterprise to go back to jail to be with Bruce. I love that. And he's got my own ride. I'll see you at home.
00:32:43
Speaker
I love that so much. I created a fortune 500 company just so I could get transferred to this prison. Poor Alfred. Then he was just DJing in the prison. He just had like a call that he had to make just right. He could have walked out whenever he wanted. He decided that now was the time via a scholarship provided by the Wayne Fund.
00:33:09
Speaker
Yeah, this episode is very similar to how season one wrapped up. How so? Refresh my memory. Big debacle. Gotham goes to shit and then Joker is like ruling it because remember like every part of Gotham was like ruled by another
00:33:27
Speaker
Oh, the factions. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Kind of like it was up to like Bruce Wayne to like try to like dial it back and everything. So it's very similar to where it's like, okay, God's gone to shit. And now Bruce Wayne has to like come back to dial everything back.
00:33:42
Speaker
Yeah, okay. I see where you're coming from. Yeah, it's cool though. Good comparison. Yeah, no, I liked this finale pretty well and I thought it gave some satisfying conclusions to a lot of the threads we had going on throughout the season. I think the show, throughout the course of the show, Lex has become less and less likable. The fact that he basically became the antithesis to Ivy, so him getting his just desserts and being banished to Apocalypse was pretty satisfying.
00:34:12
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, obviously we have the Nightwing Thread. We have the Gotham City Sirens, so it's going to be nice to have Catwoman back into the fold. And then, yeah, it's kind of like what I talked about earlier in terms of
00:34:26
Speaker
Ivy and Harley kind of being back on the same page. It's like they're, they're, you know, unified as being part of the Gotham city sirens now, but it's like, I'll be really interested to see in season five, like, what does that look like? Because you've got, you know, basically players from all different corners, like, you know, Barbara as Oracle now, she's always been good.
00:34:44
Speaker
Ivy has been, you know, a little bit more on the side of socially conscious evil, but still evil. Harley's walked both lines and it's like we have that, you know, discovery that she's not in the middle per se, she's on the outside. And that's what makes her great. I love that whole interaction between them. I thought that was really sweet and really endearing.
00:35:00
Speaker
And then, you know, Catwoman who's like generally just kind of out for herself. So it's going to be, I'm pretty excited for season five, kind of like leaving that thread out there. And then obviously, you know, getting Batman back, he was barely in this season, but you know, I love Dietrich Bader as Batman and the show's interpretation of Batman. So having him back in the fold, I think there's, you know, a lot to look forward to here.
00:35:21
Speaker
Yeah, seeing, based off that point, seeing Batman whipped was one of the more cringier things for me because they did it so much. But yeah, in terms of the relationships that you were just mentioning, I'm wondering how much Catwoman's involvement is going to be her controlling Bruce. Oh, yeah, getting him to do stuff for them. And then on
00:35:39
Speaker
Ivy's end of things, I'm wondering how much the natural disasters are going to be involved? Because are they going to be part of Lex's group? Are they going to be part of the rebuild? Or do they still look up to their mentor for stuff like that? Like, is Nora still going to be a part of it? It's interesting to see where all these loose threads are going to be retangled. Right. Now, I'm glad you've mentioned the natural disasters, because I really do like them as giving Ivy a little bit of something else to do in terms of having these minties.
00:36:09
Speaker
I kind of liked how of all Canada, especially in these, these last few episodes here, she kind of came to the forefront as the standout of the, of the natural disasters. And I really liked her. I was trying to look up the voice actress because I wanted to give her a credit. Okay. It's genie Toronto who I don't know, but I think she, she's doing a really good job of like bringing that like youthful energy. And I noticed that like Nora kept calling her nerd for one, one reason or another. And it's like, I just, I don't really get nerd vibes from her, but the fact that she's like so,
00:36:38
Speaker
gung-ho and enthusiastic about what she's doing. I think that makes her a pretty likable and impressionable character. But yeah, I'm looking back at Jeannie Toronto just to, you know, give her some credit for, you know, fans of any of these properties. Fairy Tail Zero, Leila McCall and Code Geass. What else here? Dragon Ball Z, Dragon Ball Fighter Z. Rather she was Android 21. Looks like, yeah, those are kind of the standouts for me.
00:37:09
Speaker
Yeah, because she's the geology freak in wanting to get all the volcanoes to erupt at the same time. That's where the nerdy part comes from. Yeah, sure, sure. So yeah, those are great characters. I like to throw back to Lex's suit and like those original colors. Yeah, good. And just so it's like, I appreciated that. And then they added on the jokes of like having his powers and his hair. Yeah.
00:37:37
Speaker
And then of course I just wanted Los Pollos Remontos the whole time. But I was watching these Lex heavy episodes. Yeah, that's actually a good call out too because like I there were a few times like I found myself like as I was watching these episodes and like you know how heavily
00:37:54
Speaker
Lex featured and kind of him having these emotional highs and lows. I was like, man, Giancarlo Esposito, I know he's a wonderful performer, but he's really giving his all to this animated show and this character. I know he's not elderly per se, but he's up there in his age, but he's not letting him hold him back at all. He's all in. It shows in the performance. I've seen him in a comedy setting was community.
00:38:22
Speaker
Oh, that's right. That episode. He was a serious character in a funny show, but this is him just throwing loads of funny dialogue. Right, right. I started thinking of the boys, but the same thing. He's not providing any of the comedy in the boys. His character is very serious. Yeah. Yeah. He was a great actor. So on the voice department, it's cool seeing this level of range. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I agree.
00:38:49
Speaker
Steppenwolf being under Ivy's thumb was really cool. Cause they're just so tight from that conference. Right. Right. And I'm trying to remember where did we leave off with the joker? Cause I know Harley basically had him like leashed up the entire episode. I was trying to recall what he showed up in this episode at all. Well, he was just on the leash. Like she was like, Oh no, that was the episode prior, huh? Yeah. Cause that was when she was beating up his wife and kids.
00:39:18
Speaker
Right. Right. Right. Right. Oh yeah. So maybe he wasn't in this episode. Oh well. They fold really well together. Like I feel like 10 stands out more than the other three, but the last three came together very well. It had to be this episode that she was, uh, towing, towing joke around because she didn't find it was the beginning. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I guess they just wrapped it up like before the opening credits came in.
00:39:45
Speaker
Well, I remember when they were on the moon, like she was definitely walking around with him on the leash.
00:39:52
Speaker
Yeah, and he was sniffing and identifying the fact that he was at Lexa's party just based on smells and everything. Oh, I remember. He was in a box and got sent to Gordon when he was on security, opened a box and that was a sign that he's the one that shot Barbara. That's right. I'm glad you were able to pull that. That would have bothered me, yes.
00:40:16
Speaker
Yeah, Gordon had the great bit earlier on about what he would do to the man that did that to his daughter He's like I'd use these little tuna cans to beat him to a pulp and make a a soup piece out of that a pulp for a Broth, it's like that. I'll learn how to make a brew or something like that Yeah, tuna cans with your name on it Yeah, yeah good time space was like beat to shit and everything like the card looked like it was written in crown and
00:40:47
Speaker
Glad we got there. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, I mean, that's another season of Harley Quinn in the books. The show, like I kind of said at the top, it continues to be one that I look forward to. It may not absolutely knock my socks off and it may not
00:41:07
Speaker
the absolute game changer it was when it first came out because it was, you know, so tonally different from so much of what we've seen. And it kind of like, you know, its shtick was the fact that it was kind of irreverent to so many of these characters. But, uh, you know, I'm, I'm still having a hell of a lot of fun with it. Yeah. It was one of the, one of the DC universe originals when they tried making their own streaming platform.
00:41:34
Speaker
worked out well. I'm glad it's part of HBO now, or part of Max. It's still some stupid name. But yeah, it's an entertaining show. Again, I like watching it in chunks more than on its own. But it's, without fail, they give me a good laugh. And I'm very impressed with how they did the storytelling this season. I think last season was just kind of like a low for me, and now they're just like trending upwards again.
00:42:01
Speaker
It happens. There's only so much you can do with so, so much. So keep it to the short 10 episodes, you know, keep it hard, arc heavy, have just kind of like the big storyline to lead up to. And I think they can keep making good content for time to come.
00:42:21
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I mean, I kind of wonder how long the show can go on for. But like kind of like what I mentioned with like being pretty satisfied with this finale, I feel like they did enough to set up for at least another season. But even with like Harley and Ivy's relationship, it's like we talked about them seeing their future daughters. So like now that puts the whole thought and conversation on the table. Do they want to be parents? When do they want to be parents? When are they going to start having that conversation? Because they've been together for a while now.
00:42:52
Speaker
How are they going to be parents? Those were all the questions. Who's the sperm donor? Any final thoughts on Harley Quinn season four of the show as a whole? They were fun chunks. I'm sure there's going to be another special here and there throughout the next year.
00:43:18
Speaker
We like our peanut butter. Chunky. Oh God. I think it's actually crunchy. Was it chunky chocolate chips from chips away? I don't know. I feel like there's something there.
00:43:34
Speaker
The expression on your face tells me you just need to wrap it up. All right. Let the people know what else you have going on creatively or professionally. My episode with Peeves Gap Fest came out. That's going to be a recurring thing. Nice.
00:43:54
Speaker
Watching the harry potter movies comparing it to the books and talking about what they want to see out of the new mac series That's coming out. So as someone who only watched the movies I got to share my perspective on like reading the books for the first time And you know spotted the differences what worked what didn't work how the movie helped me as a non-reader You know get through the book for the first time uh, so the fun conversation I gave some insight on like
00:44:20
Speaker
Basically, I was a producer. I was just writing the script of like how I want the show to go based off of this, which is what they've been doing. So check that out. Football season is back. So 323 with Reed Murphy every week. There was one episode where I was ridiculously sleep deprived and the things that came out of my mouth were just so off the rails. And every week we just have crazy games and make our game picks and it's just laughter after laughter. So
00:44:46
Speaker
It's always a good time over there, and as always, check out the Stranded Panda shows. Very good, yeah. For me, I will just likewise just plug Stranded Panda, check out all the shows over there, specifically Multiverse News. I usually contribute to that, but this week we had a special guest.
00:45:08
Speaker
Chris, I cannot remember his last name, but I know he goes by Foz and he's a cosplayer. So check out the episode that he appeared on and go check out his cosplay there. But yeah, great to be here talking about a great show. And thank you all so much for listening. Keep tuning in. That's T-O-O-N-I-N. And as always, stay well.
00:45:31
Speaker
Thank you for listening to the Animation Deliberation Podcast, a proud member of the Strandepanda Network. If you would like to contact us, you can email animationdeliberationpodcast at gmail.com or follow us on Twitter at animationdelib1. For this and other great shows, you can visit Strandepanda.com or join the great community that is the Strandepanda Chat Facebook group at facebook.com slash groups slash spchat. Tune in next time and remember, stay well.