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8: My Husband’s Perspective
197 Plays3 years ago
When your spouse deals with the physical and emotional effects of anxiety, what is the best way to support them? What helps? What makes things worse?
In this episode, Laura interviews her husband, Justin Fleetwood about what it was like for him during her season of intense anxiety and depression. Justin opens up about his frustrations and what he learned about being the primary support person during this time.
If you are the loved one of someone with anxiety, this is a must-listen episode!
To learn more about the products Laura mentions in this episode, visit podcast sponsor, Cindy Jenks, an ambassador with QSciences at myqwellness.com or email her questions at [email protected].
Seeking The Still Website: Seekingthestill.com
Seeking The Still Instagram: Instagram.com/seekingthestill
Seeking The Still Facebook: Facebook.com/seekthestill
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Transcript
Introduction & Podcast Purpose
00:00:01
Speaker
Seeking the Still is produced by Jill Devine Media. Season two of the Seeking the Still podcast is brought to you by Q Sciences with Cindy Jenks. Welcome to the Seeking the Still podcast with me, your host, Laura Fleetwood.
00:00:22
Speaker
In this safe space, we come together to seek the still amid chaotic lives. To get honest about what overwhelms us, to become connected to one another and to the divine, to step into who we were created to be. Always real, never perfect, and forever on your side.
Laura's Personal Journey with Anxiety
00:00:46
Speaker
Welcome to the second season of Seeking the Still with me, your host, Laura Fleetwood. If you listened in to season one, I shared my story of going through a burnout and breakdown and receiving a diagnosis of generalized anxiety disorder. And most of that story was from my perspective. Since then, I've received several comments and questions from people who are loved ones of those who struggle with anxiety, stress, and overwhelm.
00:01:14
Speaker
And I thought it would be interesting to interview the people in my life who were kind of watching from the outside, looking in during that season and see what they were feeling, see what questions they had, what advice they would have for others who are supporting loved ones who are dealing with anxiety.
Justin's Perspective on Marriage & Anxiety
00:01:34
Speaker
So we are starting in this first episode with my husband, Justin. We have been married almost 20 years and he probably got the brunt of the stress and the overwhelm from this season in our life. And we've talked about it a little bit, but I've never sat down and just asked him openly some of these questions. So I'm going to be learning right alongside you and we will get started.
00:02:03
Speaker
So first of all, this is a total truth zone. So I have not given Justin these questions ahead of time and I am asking him to be brutally honest and to not hold back because I want to serve you guys and let him share his true feelings and his true experience during that time. So my first question, Justin, is when did you first realize that something was really different, that something was going on?
00:02:33
Speaker
I guess the first time that I really realized that there was an issue was, I guess it was really pretty close to the time where you hit rock bottom. You started just distancing yourself and you always needed a little bit of space and that was fine, but it got to be more and more and it just seemed that you were disengaged.
00:02:56
Speaker
from just the family in general, you would come home from work and you would just want to go and sit outside or you would want to go on a walk, which wasn't all that out of the norm until that was all you wanted to do. So it really, not that it was a total shock,
00:03:13
Speaker
when you really hit the depth of it, but it did catch me a little bit off guard only because I guess maybe I should have seen it coming as you started to distance yourself more and more there leading up to the real throws of the depression and the anxiety.
Family Dynamics & Finding Balance
00:03:32
Speaker
So how would you describe me pre-breakdown and then how would you describe me post-breakdown? So like the Laura you married and then let's say the Laura who was going through the darkness and now the Laura today.
00:03:51
Speaker
Well, the lore that I married was, you know, we were always on the go. We always seem to be doing something. I mean, I know a lot of people now think of us as kind of homebodies and we don't do a lot of that anymore. And, you know, part of that is just age. I think part of it is what we've gone through as well. But in our early days, you know, we were always out, we were on the go when we were dating, even when we were early married, we would travel, we would go out, we would just, we're constantly busy. And then that basically stopped.
00:04:17
Speaker
I mean, and it was almost, you know, a brunt, you know, brutal just at one point we're on the go and then on the next point we stopped because even after we had the girls, you know, we still stayed busy. We stayed involved. We were in groups. We were taking the girls places. We ourselves were involved in groups.
00:04:34
Speaker
And then, like I said, when you were going through the anxiety, you know, when it was really bad, all of that just stopped. There were days, you know, you would go days or even weeks maybe without leaving the house. And so that kind of tied us down as well. Whereas, you know, just trying to...
00:04:51
Speaker
keep things running. And just because you didn't feel like going out, a lot of times we we wouldn't because most of the time when we did stuff, it was as a family, there wasn't really a whole lot of time where just I would go out and do things or you would go out and do things. And now I think we've really found the balance in that, you know, we still we're doing more together as a family, we do still, you know, respect and have that personal space and we're able to do our own things. And I believe you need, you know, you need some of that, you're able to go out and
00:05:21
Speaker
meet with friends and, you know, have conversations with them, with other people who maybe had a similar experience that you've had, but you can't really talk to me about that as a, you know, a first person, hey, what have you gone through? So, you know, I think it really brought a lot of balance to our family life and that, you know, in the beginning, maybe we were kind of on the go and then, you know, there for a while we were doing basically nothing. And now I think we found that good
00:05:47
Speaker
balance of, we still like to be homebodies, but now that's just who we are as opposed to it being forced upon us.
00:05:53
Speaker
Yeah, that's interesting. I hadn't thought of it that way, but that really corresponds well to just more awareness about how to take care of myself and to recognize when I'm spending a lot of energy or when I'm under a lot of stress and then being able to balance that. But yeah, I can definitely see where I did become a hermit there for a long time and that impacted you and the girls as well.
00:06:21
Speaker
So what was the biggest struggle for you personally seeing me in that helpless state and going through the process of getting help and therapy and medication and just learning how to live in a healthy way instead of being so driven by stress and worry? What was that like for you personally?
00:06:48
Speaker
So the biggest impact for me was just seeing you in that much pain and specifically when you weren't understanding what's going on. And both of us being the, let's just address the root of the problem, let's fix it. And we couldn't do that. It was absolutely out of our own control. So my first reaction is that it was
00:07:10
Speaker
really painful for me to see the pain in what you were going through, what you were experiencing. And then the second part of that, very much related, is just by nature, I'm a fixer. If there's an issue, let's address it, let's eliminate it. And this was not something and still is not anything that I can really address. There's not, you know, we can't just focus on one thing and say, go eliminate this problem and move on. And that really caused a lot of stress. And I think it probably worsened
00:07:37
Speaker
Um, the situation for you early on, because I was at that time, I think I was focused on the wrong thing. I was focused on, well, let's just fix it and go. Whereas you were really concerned with getting to the root of the problem. And so those two were, you know, they were not congruent in what we were trying to address. So it wasn't until you literally came to me and said, look, you can't fix this. That it dawned on me. Oh, yeah, you're exactly right. It's out of my control. So let's focus on you and how we can help you to get better.
00:08:04
Speaker
Yeah. Is there a moment in particular that stands out to you and your memory as being particularly hard or frustrating or difficult, like something that happened or something that you experienced? You know, early on the frustration for me was just wanting to spend time with you and you being so distant. You needed that space and I just couldn't understand why.
00:08:27
Speaker
Like you know i kinda mentioned it earlier before when you would come home you would go at the time we had a swing under the porch and you might go and just sit out there and swing for hours and then you would go for a walk and you would be gone for another hour. So that was really difficult the probably the hardest decision that i had to make was the day that you were laying in bed and we're trying to figure out what to do and finally just made the decision.
00:08:50
Speaker
you're going to the hospital. You didn't want to go. And this is one of those where, you know, for better or for worse, I was bigger, I could make it happen. And luckily, we didn't get to that point, you know, I was able to convince you, but it took some time. But that was difficult because that was really then accepting the fact that there is truly an issue that is out of our control and we need professional help.
00:09:10
Speaker
Yeah, I remember those days of sitting on the swing and now thinking of it from your perspective, it probably did seem like I was just trying to get away from everyone in the family. But actually what I was doing during those hours out on the swing is I was like trying to keep my anxiety down to a point where it wasn't causing like the debilitating physical symptoms.
00:09:39
Speaker
So in my mind, I was protecting you guys and I was protecting myself by doing something that I knew just would calm me. But I can see where, you know, to you, it was probably like, gosh, she doesn't even want to be around us or she can't handle us or something like that. So it's just interesting the two different sides of that coin.
00:10:01
Speaker
There are some people listening right now who are going through that difficult time that you were just talking about determining whether or not to seek professional help for their anxiety or their depression. And you mentioned kind of having to make that decision for me. What were some of the symptoms or some of the things that you were seeing in me that made you know it was time for us to get more help?
00:10:29
Speaker
It really started when you were just withdrawing more and more. We talked about sitting on the swing and going for the walks, but then that devolved into you not leaving the bedroom for an entire day. You might come down just to grab something to eat. We might get a high. You would go back to bed. I think it was after a couple of those.
00:10:52
Speaker
you know, as you were really struggling mightily with it, you know, just at times sobbing, saying, I can't figure out, I just want to be better. What's going on with me? You know, I just kind of hit the breaking point of it was killing me to see you like that. And I knew it was even worse for you being the one going through it firsthand. And so it was just to the point where when when you basically, for lack of a better term, became completely incapacitated, that I decided something needed to change.
00:11:19
Speaker
And I remember that day, I remember being in bed and you coming in and sitting on the bed. I'd like for you to paint a picture of what exactly we did. Do you remember? Like we got the insurance card out and you want to kind of walk the listeners through that so they know what steps we took.
00:11:39
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. So yeah, you're exactly right. As we were sitting there talking, finally, I think, or actually, I think you had actually mentioned, maybe I need to go see somebody and that to me would be, you know, if it if it gets to that point where the person who is experiencing the anxiety
00:11:57
Speaker
even thinks that there is a need for professional help. Get professional help. I would actually say if you can identify that before you get to that point of, you know, just complete, no return, I need some help on this, it would be better to do it that way. But yeah, so we, as soon as you mentioned, maybe I need to go to a hospital. Yeah, the first thing I did was pulled out the insurance card and
00:12:19
Speaker
Looked and sure enough on the back, it had, you know, some mental health number to call. And so I called them and just said, you know, where can we go? They gave us a couple options. We chose one and that's where we went. But like I said, it wasn't until you actually brought it up, hey, I think I need help.
00:12:36
Speaker
that it dawned on me, well, yeah, you know, this is really out of our control. But again, I would say if the person who is experiencing this even starts to hint at the need or the desire, you know, maybe it's not even a need, maybe they're like, man, I think I might want some, you know, help or why is this happening? I would say just act on that and try to get ahead of it so that maybe you can cut it off before you really get into the depths.
00:13:00
Speaker
And I think it's important to say how helpful it was that you made the call because when you're that stressed out and you have that much anxiety, even the idea of having to call somebody, it sounds strange, but is overwhelming. And to call and ask, who should I go to? And all of that is just more than you can fathom doing. So I think for loved ones, being able to make those phone calls,
00:13:27
Speaker
and set up the appointment and you know just manage the schedule of treatment is a huge help to the person who is struggling because the other thing is once you start therapy and once you start the medication it brings up like a whole host of other things because now you're like dealing with the past and the pain and the feelings and all of that and that is emotionally exhausting.
Role of Q Sciences & Supplements
00:13:52
Speaker
So anything
00:13:52
Speaker
Something practical that you can do as a loved one to take away some of the added pressure of scheduling and calling and following up on prescriptions and getting refills and all of that is just a small thing that can make a really big difference.
00:14:11
Speaker
We're going to take a break for a moment because I want to tell you about this season's sponsor, Q Sciences with Cindy Jenks. It's a supplement that I have started taking and Cindy is a childhood friend of mine. We were best of friends in junior high. After she listened to season one, she contacted me and said, Hey, I struggle with anxiety too. I am a former nurse. I now have a psychiatry degree and I've started
00:14:39
Speaker
taking these natural supplements, specifically formulated for people who have mental health struggles. Would you like to try them? And I know Cindy, I trust her. And so I said, sure. So I started taking the, um, it's called Q-Core and it's supplements that you take in the morning and in the evening. They have replaced now my multivitamin, my probiotic and my anti-inflammatory supplements.
00:15:08
Speaker
And Justin, you can weigh in on this, but I take a lot of supplements. Our counter is filled with bottles. So the fact that this company has been able to replace everything that I was using before has been really, really neat.
00:15:23
Speaker
And I've seen the biggest results, especially when it comes to one of my biggest symptoms of stress, which is brain fog. So if you haven't experienced brain fog, it's like you're living underwater and it's hard to think. And when you're used to thinking really fast, that's a struggle. And it's kind of like you're just, yeah, you're living underwater. Since I've started taking these
00:15:47
Speaker
these Q-Core supplements in the morning and the evening. I've had so much more energy and my brain fog is all but gone except for the one week when I ran out. So I'm thrilled to be able to just bring your attention to the company Q Sciences and specifically to Cindy Jenks. She is an ambassador for the company and is a wealth of knowledge when it comes to all their products. And through season two, I'm going to be sharing all of the products I take.
00:16:15
Speaker
They're all natural, all formulated by a naturopath, and I have a huge trust in naturopaths. They also offer supplements that have CBD in them and hemp oil, which are huge for people who are struggling with anxieties. So I look forward to sharing more about those products in the future. But right now, I want to invite you to check out myqwellness.com. That is Cindy's site where you can view all the products you can order from there or
00:16:42
Speaker
You can email Cindy your questions at Cindy at myqwellness.com. So myqwellness.com or Cindy at myqwellness.com. These are products that I pay for, I believe in, I trust and have made a huge difference in my life.
00:17:00
Speaker
Okay, Justin, we are going to now get into the total truth
Managing Responsibilities & Early Signs
00:17:05
Speaker
zone. I would like for you to share with the listeners a moment when you just had had enough, like when you kind of reached your breaking point with all of this. And I know there were many because you had taken on the role of mom, of chauffeur, you know, a lot of the things that I had been
00:17:27
Speaker
especially with the kids, like shuttling them to and fro, making doctor's appointments, all of those things that were kind of on my plate. You had to take over doing everything, all the cooking, all the cleaning. My parents came and lived with us for a time when you were traveling, but when you were home, most everything fell on your shoulders. And I know that that got overwhelming. So share a little bit what that felt like and how you got through that season of basically being a single dad.
00:17:54
Speaker
Yeah, you're exactly right. Literally, it went from feeling like I had two kids to feeling like I had three kids, and you became the most dependent of the three kids that I had. Yeah, you're right. It turned into not only was I working, and as you said, at the time traveling, luckily, I was able to get out of that pretty quickly.
00:18:11
Speaker
Yeah, just to be home and I'll admit there were days where when I left the office, I really didn't wanna come straight home. I almost wanted to go sit somewhere and just do nothing because I knew when I got home, it's not like there was a lot of overt stress, but there was always some palpable feeling in the air that everyone seemed to be kind of walking on eggshells all the time because I was, myself personally, I was afraid of doing something that might trigger
00:18:40
Speaker
you to you know just need to recoil even more so that to me was probably the hardest part of the whole thing was understanding that you know maybe some of the things that i did could make it worse but you can't really live in that moment you know you can't live that way you have to understand that
00:18:58
Speaker
life has to go on, you have kids that need to be supported and cared for, and even you, you needed to be supported and cared for as well. The hardest part for me was in the very beginning when, because it all came kind of crashing down and you're right, my mom, your mom, your dad, they were great support in this.
00:19:15
Speaker
And they need their time too, right? And at some point, we as a family unit need to be able to understand that, well, this is our life together. And this is now, you know, anxiety is now part of our family life. So we need to be able to deal with it. So it was really just those early days of coming home and like you said, having to do now all the laundry, all the cooking, all the cleaning, helping with the homework.
00:19:40
Speaker
And a lot of times it was making sure you're getting up and you're eating and you're doing the things that you needed to do as well. So I don't know that I could point to like a specific event that happened. It was just kind of that it built over time. And it wasn't until we really started talking about it and addressing it that that pressure started to relieve itself.
00:20:00
Speaker
Yeah, that was a tough transition for all of us because I never thought that I struggled with anxiety and I certainly hadn't like ever had an episode like this where I was just completely knocked off my feet by the physical and the emotional
00:20:15
Speaker
So it was a new thing for us. And I'm curious, looking back on the early years of knowing me and knowing what you now realize about me, do you see any signs or symptoms of the pre-breakdown, Laura, that maybe now you could recognize as anxiety or as something that could have led to what happened?
00:20:42
Speaker
This is actually the question I was waiting for you to ask me. Yeah. You are such a driven person and you just want to take on more and more and you have so many fantastic ideas flying through your head and all of them are achievable and let's just go. And because you're a high performer at work and outside of work and other groups, people will come to you, you know, hey, we need to get something done. Let's go talk to Laura. She has the ability. She, you know, has a great mind for this type of thing. So that was one of the hardest things for me to do.
00:21:12
Speaker
was, you know, pre-breakdown, I was, I'll call myself an enabler. Anything you wanted to do, let's do it. I'll support you in any way possible. And then we went through the anxiety. So coming out of the other side, I can tell when you're really feeling good because the ideas start flowing again. And then you're like, I want to take on this and I want to do this and I want to do that. And so now maybe I'm sure you've noticed.
00:21:34
Speaker
one of my first questions to you when you start talking that way is what goes because you're already running at capacity you're always running at capacity and if you take on that one more thing i'm afraid that's gonna be the trigger that send you back on the whole so i'm all for you taking on a new role with this new you know women's organization that's fantastic and
00:21:53
Speaker
you know, you want to support them, but something else has to go. So just making sure that I'm helping you, and I'm sure you get frustrated with that at times, but that I'm helping you find that balance and understand, you know, hey, we're on the precipice of pushing yourself a little too hard.
00:22:08
Speaker
That's a really important thing to know about the high achievers in your life. The people that you think have it all together and can run at full capacity, you know, 100% of the time is that eventually your body can't keep up with that anymore.
00:22:25
Speaker
So it's not always the people that you think struggle with anxiety. It's often the people who you would never guess because they are such perfectionists and high achievers and able to just go, go, go, go until they can't.
00:22:42
Speaker
So I like to just remind people to watch for those in your life, those children who strive for straight A's all the time and those coworkers who are always earning the bonuses and working overtime and going the extra mile. That's all awesome, but it comes with a cost and it's important to just be aware that those high achievers are often most at risk for anxiety disorders.
00:23:08
Speaker
My question for you now, Justin, is what advice would you give to parents or spouses of people who are struggling with anxiety after what you've learned, after what you've gone through, knowing that everybody's case is different, but overall, what advice do you give them?
Advice on Love & Communication
00:23:29
Speaker
Number one is just make sure they know that they are both loved and supported.
00:23:33
Speaker
Because in those times, they can feel like there's just nothing, right? They're not fully understanding what they're going through. Maybe they feel like it's something internal and that there's something wrong with them, and just make sure that they know.
00:23:51
Speaker
unconditionally, the support is there. Unconditionally, the love is there. Anything that they want, you're willing to do. But also, let them know and make sure that they understand that if there are things that you are not willing to do or not willing to allow them to do, that there's a reason. And make sure you have that open communication. Talk about it. So again, I'm just thinking, number one for me is the unconditional love and support.
00:24:15
Speaker
and then just be willing to have those open conversations. I think that's one of the best things that came out of this was the number of nights that you and I just sat either on the bed or on the couch and just talked. I mean, we had never really done that at that time, we'll say 15 years that we had been together of just sit down, no devices, no TV, no kids, no nothing, and just talk about what was going on in our lives and what we were feeling.
00:24:44
Speaker
We were both so wrapped up and, you know, always on the go. So that forced us to slow down a little bit. But just number one is be there. Just be there. So at some point I remember going to you and saying, you know, when I get in that anxious state and I have that look in my eye and I'm saying, what if it's back? What if it doesn't go away this time?
00:25:04
Speaker
I just need you to tell me over and over and over again that I'm going to be okay. Like just keep reminding me that you love me and it's going to be okay. And we're going to get through this together because when you're in that panicked state, you feel like it's never going to be okay again. That life is just spiraling out of control. And to just have someone say the words, you're going to be okay. And I'm going to walk with you through this oftentimes is exactly
00:25:34
Speaker
exactly what you need to hear. So is there anything else that you've learned throughout this process that you think might be helpful to those who are currently struggling? Yeah, so I would say as the primary support person, one of the things that I've learned, and this gets back to me being the type of person who just wants to fix things and remove obstacles, is one of the questions that I've tried to completely remove from my vocabulary is just the standard, how are you doing?
00:26:03
Speaker
That so often solicited a response from you of, you know, either just a look or you're just, I don't want to talk about it. Um, so instead of doing that, just, you know, maybe it's a walk up first, give a hug, see what kind of a reaction you get. Um, because if you may not as a support person, you may not understand what they're going through in that exact moment.
00:26:26
Speaker
And it can absolutely change day to day, hour to hour, how they're feeling. So instead of the, you know, how are you doing? Because if they're not feeling well, they don't want to talk about it. A lot of times for me, it was just walk up and give you a hug. And I could gauge based on your response to my hug, how that conversation would go. You know, if you were responsive and would hug me back, you're having a pretty good day. If you there were times where you literally just stood there, and I could have been hugging you, I could have been hugging a
00:26:53
Speaker
a coat stand, I could have been hugging any inanimate object. I knew better than to ask the question because I had an idea of what that answer would be. Yeah. I think a question that might be better than how are you doing is, and it's not even a question, but just an I love you or I'm so glad that you're my wife or just an affirmation because oftentimes you don't have words to describe how you're doing when you're struggling in that kind of
Hope & Strengthened Family Bonds
00:27:21
Speaker
way.
00:27:21
Speaker
I think the biggest thing that I want to end with is the reminder to everyone that there is hope. So even when you're in that dark place, there is hope on the other side. And Justin, I'm just curious if now you can speak to that and just let's end on some, you've talked a little bit about some of the things we've learned through the process, but how is our relationship, our marriage, our family better now in some ways?
00:27:51
Speaker
than it was before because of what we've gone through. Number one for me would be just the open communication that we have. And specifically, you know, between you and I, but also the communication that we have with the girls, you know, we're very much proponents of if there's an issue, let's talk through it. Let's understand what's going on. Don't let it sit and fester and build. So I
00:28:12
Speaker
I think just shining the light on that and giving us the understanding and the knowledge of how to communicate and to just to have those open conversations has been one of the biggest benefits that has come from this time in our lives.
00:28:27
Speaker
I totally agree. And next week I'll be talking to my daughters, Audrey and Anna, about what it was like for them to see mom go through this and some of the things that they have learned.
Preview & Resources
00:28:39
Speaker
And so I'm really looking forward to that. But Justin, thank you for sharing your insight and your perspective. I think it's really helpful for people to hear from the loved one, from the caregiver, and to know that
00:28:53
Speaker
It's okay to not know all the right words, that the words aren't really what matters. It's the being there and the actions and just knowing that you're loved and that you have that reminder that everything is going to be okay in God's timing.
00:29:08
Speaker
So I want to leave you with a reminder that there are all kinds of free resources on seekingthestill.com, both for people who struggle with stress, overwhelm, anxiety, and for the caregivers. And this season, there is a new way for you to get those resources. You can subscribe for free. It's a free subscription where you get access to
00:29:32
Speaker
meditations and the twirl videos and other resources. All you have to do is go to seekingthestill.com, find the subscribe section and enter your name and email, and that will give you access to log in anytime you need those resources. So I invite you to do that. I'm excited to continue the conversation with my daughters next week. And as has been our tradition here, I'd love to leave you with a quote.
00:30:00
Speaker
I saw that God never began to love us. We have always been in God's foreknowledge, known and loved from without beginning. We were made for love, Jillian of Norwich. Be still.