Transcript
Speaker: Hey moms, it's Laura Olinger.
Speaker: Welcome to the Positively Healthy Mom podcast.
Speaker: Because there's no manual for the hardest job in the world.
Speaker: Hey everyone, today I'm so excited to bring to you Jessica Spear.
Speaker: She is an author of many books that have to do with social, emotional, learning, feelings, everything that teenagers and preteens, tweens go through.
Speaker: And so Jessica, can you tell us a little bit about your books?
Speaker: Sure, sure.
Speaker: And thank you for having me, Laura.
Speaker: My name is Jessica Spear.
Speaker: And for the last 10 years, I've been really honing in on writing helpful guides for the preteen and the early teen years.
Speaker: As you said, you know, sometimes this can be a tricky time socially and definitely emotionally as kids are going through changes.
Speaker: So my first book, I've got a background in social sciences.
Speaker: My first book grew out of a friendship program that I ran in schools for girls.
Speaker: The long title of the book is called BFF or NRF.
Speaker: NRF stands for Not Really Friends.
Speaker: Happy Friendships.
Speaker: Then I wanted to do another book that's really focused on relationships, especially in the middle school years for all genders.
Speaker: So my second book is called Middle School Safety Goggles Advised.
Speaker: And then...
Speaker: My latest book, which came out last summer, is called The Phone Book.
Speaker: Stay safe, be smart, and make the world better with a powerful device in your hand.
Speaker: Because as we know, especially in the preteen, teen years, a lot of this is shifting online.
Speaker: So I wanted to really talk about that and help kids become more aware about digital safety and digital citizenship and communicating online.
Speaker: So that's the information that went into my third book.
Speaker: So these books are written for preteens and early teens.
Speaker: They're interactive.
Speaker: So they're filled with quizzes and stories and quotes from kids.
Speaker: Just ways to try to keep it engaging and fun as kids work through this.
Speaker: That's so awesome.
Speaker: And so what is the overall message?
Speaker: Or maybe each of your books has a different message, but what's the overall message you're trying to convey?
Speaker: You know, and they all go into different things, but I think the overarching method is to...
Speaker: to give kids a little more confidence in these areas.
Speaker: We might notice as parents of preteens, early teens, there's a big confidence dip sometimes.
Speaker: And so this helps them maybe tap back into some of that confidence, let them know that they're not alone, that a lot of other kids are experiencing some challenges in these areas too, and just some high level insights.
Speaker: In fact, my first
Speaker: book has nine friendship truths, I call them.
Speaker: And there are these things that we learn over the course of our lives about friendship.
Speaker: But what I found when I was running my friendship program is it's helpful for kids to know some of these insights earlier on.
Speaker: In fact, if the earlier they knew them, the less likely they were to think, hey, there's something wrong with me.
Speaker: This is actually sometimes just what happens in relationships.
Speaker: So yeah, so...
Speaker: a combination of all those things in all those books in some varying form.
Speaker: And I think it's so awesome that you write to your audience and let them know that, you know, it's not them that, you know, this is just something that's normal that we're all kind of going through at that time, kind of some insecurity, some self doubt.
Speaker: And so a lot of times what teenagers and tweens do is they look to others for, um,
Speaker: the opinion that they have of themselves.
Speaker: So it's kind of like if the other people think that they're okay, then they must be okay.
Speaker: And if the other people don't think they're okay, they must not be okay.
Speaker: And so they're kind of like looking for that feedback.
Speaker: And so unfortunately, a lot of times they don't get that feedback.
Speaker: And then they start to have that self-doubt and that insecurity.
Speaker: And do you have any stories that you could share of either...
Speaker: The people that you talk about in your book are real life people that you know that kind of had to overcome those negative messages that they were getting from those outside sources and learn how to speak more kindly to themselves.
Speaker: Yeah, and that's a great question.
Speaker: And one thing that inspired me to write this book was, you know, spending time with groups of young preteens who are feeling like they're having a hard time in their friendships.
Speaker: It was so interesting to watch.
Speaker: A group would come together and we'd work together for a couple of weeks and work on some skills and it'd be fun and there'd be games.
Speaker: But one of the most powerful parts was them looking around the room and seeing, oh, it's not just me.
Speaker: Wow, that person's here too.
Speaker: Whoa.
Speaker: So I think we tend to, especially in the preteen, teen years, we look, like you said, we're looking so much
Speaker: what's happening in our peers, but it's not telling the whole story about what's really going on with everybody.
Speaker: So I could see a sense of relief in the room all the time by kids just noticing, oh, it's not just me.
Speaker: So that's in my book.
Speaker: I include many, many quotes and stories from real kids because it's so important for kids to know that they're not alone in this.
Speaker: It might look like everybody has these awesome close friends, but there's a lot more that we're not seeing that's happening with all these kids.
Speaker: Totally, totally.
Speaker: So what is some of your best advice that you give to the people that you work with?
Speaker: Let me share some of the friendship truths, which I share in my first book, which is the BFF or NRF Not Really Friends, a guide to happy friendship.
Speaker: So some of the friendship truths that I found resonated a lot with kids are one.
Speaker: friendships have different phases and change over time.
Speaker: And just knowing that, it makes those inevitable friendship changes just a little less uncomfortable.
Speaker: I mean, friendship changes are always uncomfortable.
Speaker: But when we look at the research, it is so common.
Speaker: It's especially common in the preteen years, especially around middle school.
Speaker: You know, kids are
Speaker: their interests are changing, they're meeting new kids, they might be changing schools.
Speaker: There's a lot of group dynamics.
Speaker: So it's really common
Speaker: for friendships to change.
Speaker: In fact, it's a minority of kids that sail through their school years with the same group of friends.
Speaker: You know, the majority, there's a lot of changes there, but that can feel hard.
Speaker: It's not easy.
Speaker: So just kids knowing.
Speaker: Friendships have different phases and change over time.
Speaker: It's great to know that.
Speaker: You know, stay open to that.
Speaker: Stay open to changes.
Speaker: We'd never know the end of the story, you know, now that I've got high school kids myself.
Speaker: I can see kids reconnecting, you know, kids that maybe went separate ways.
Speaker: Now they're reconnecting in other ways.
Speaker: So it's keeping kids' minds open to that.
Speaker: One other friendship truth is,
Speaker: that everyone develops friendship skills at a different pace.
Speaker: And I like to talk about friendship in terms of skills.
Speaker: In fact, my books have quizzes in that.
Speaker: In addition to like, how healthy is my friendship?
Speaker: There's a quiz is, how are my friendship skills?
Speaker: And anybody who takes that quiz, whether you're, you know, seven to 70,
Speaker: there's going to be some parts of that quiz are like, oh, yeah, I still could grow in this area, you know, because there's there's a lot of skills that go into friendship and all we can really control, you know, is ourself and and just being aware of, hey, maybe because I'm like this, it might be contributing to this conflict that I'm having with my friend.
Speaker: So knowing that friendship's a two way street and
Speaker: We all have different skills and we're all developing these skills at a different pace.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: So I love that point about, you know, not necessarily blaming others for the things that they're doing in the friendship, but more kind of like looking inside yourself with taking that quiz and really understanding kind of how you might be contributing to the problem or kind of like where your strengths are, maybe where your weaknesses are, how can you improve as a friend?
Speaker: Because after all, that's all we can really do is control what we do with ourselves.
Speaker: Is that kind of like what the purpose is of that?
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: Because you're right.
Speaker: That's all we can really control is ourselves and our kids too.
Speaker: But in some ways, we do have some other ways that we can control tricky situations.
Speaker: And I don't think it's ever too early to help kids start to...
Speaker: figure out how to set some boundaries.
Speaker: So one other friendship truth I'll share is, you know, we teach others how we want to be treated by speaking up.
Speaker: And this can be really hard.
Speaker: I found, especially working with a lot of girls, this is a tough one, you know, so especially because friendships, you know, early friendships tend to feel pretty fragile.
Speaker: And so what I found is girls are afraid to speak up.
Speaker: because they're afraid what might happen.
Speaker: Will they lose the friendship?
Speaker: Will their friend get mad?
Speaker: So speaking up is a real challenge and it's a skill that takes practice.
Speaker: So I do encourage girls to begin to practice and we work through I statements.
Speaker: So instead of saying, you never let me go first, they would say,
Speaker: I feel like I'm not getting the chance to go first.
Speaker: Can I go first next time?
Speaker: So starting with the I and kids immediately get that, you know, we do role plays and practice that.
Speaker: They know what it feels like to have a finger pointed and say you versus someone saying, hey, I feel I'm feeling left out.
Speaker: So just starting to teach these basic communication skills.
Speaker: And, you know, for a lot of kids, it might take a lot of time and practice before they can begin to speak up.
Speaker: But, you know, I think that's a great role.
Speaker: for parents and caregivers is to, you know, gently keep encouraging them and supporting them to do that.
Speaker: And we can model that ourselves in gentle ways.
Speaker: I do feel like, you know, we can teach our kids how to speak up in a way that is kind and respectful, and then they're more likely to be heard.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I actually helped a client with that the other day.
Speaker: She said she feels like in conversation with her friends that they we kind of had to get a percentage.
Speaker: We are as coaches, we're always measuring things.
Speaker: And so she said, I feel like my friends talk all the time and I don't get a chance to talk.
Speaker: And I said, well, is it like 90 10 is 80 20?
Speaker: What's it like?
Speaker: And it turned out it was actually just 60 40 where they talk 60 percent of the time she speaks 40 percent.
Speaker: And I said, well, how could you get that closer to 50 50?
Speaker: And she wasn't sure.
Speaker: So I kind of helped her come up with exactly what you just said, like the I statements, like, I don't feel like I'm getting time to share my thoughts and feelings.
Speaker: I don't, you know, I'm not feeling heard.
Speaker: I, you know, starting with the I and really kind of getting that confidence up to really speak her truth and speak how she was feeling to the friends.
Speaker: And then they can, you know, respond the way they would like to, and hopefully a healthy way and work it out and maybe get closer to that 50-50.
Speaker: So kind of getting that concrete,
Speaker: you know, goal in mind instead of just feeling this feeling of, oh, I don't get to talk enough, but more like putting some action to it.
Speaker: So I love that your books really address that as well.
Speaker: I would love to move over to your newest book about cell phones and technology and social media.
Speaker: That is something that I spend a lot of time on in my work.
Speaker: And so I would love to hear what your thoughts are about it.
Speaker: How are you addressing this in your book?
Speaker: Hmm.
Speaker: Well, the book is written for eight to 12 year olds because that's actually kind of the average age where kids are starting to get smartphones.
Speaker: So last I checked, a most recent study I looked at was maybe somewhere between an 11 and 12 is when kids are getting smartphones.
Speaker: And, you know, kids have connected devices very early on.
Speaker: But it's a little different when they have the smartphone and they're out of the home,
Speaker: maybe more able to get apps on their own.
Speaker: So I wanted to put a book out there that really helps them, first of all, be safe, but also think about how they are as digital citizens and also how these technologies work.
Speaker: In fact, the first chapter is
Speaker: why tech companies want you staring at your screen.
Speaker: So I think for all of us, you know, from age eight to, you know, however old, it's important for us to know that a lot of platforms and social media are based on, you know, collecting data and advertising.
Speaker: So we just need to know that.
Speaker: So in that chapter, I talk about that and persuasive design.
Speaker: So the strategies that technology used to keep us coming back to them, you know,
Speaker: tagging and notifications and levels and tokens.
Speaker: So I wanted to help kids be really informed consumers of technology.
Speaker: And what I found, again, working with preteens and teens is kids hate to be duped.
Speaker: So they love it when they have a little information like, oh, okay, I see how this works.
Speaker: So I want to be a little more
Speaker: control in their hands, realizing, you know, they're up against a real challenge here.
Speaker: We have some of the best designers and engineers of these beautiful products that, I mean, I love technology.
Speaker: I'm not against technology, but I do think they're so beautifully designed, you know, and so for the young brain, the developing brain, it can be hard for them
Speaker: to really put some boundaries and some awareness in place to keep, to keep their use in check.
Speaker: And then also how to stay safe online.
Speaker: So I've got chapters on, you know, digital safety and privacy and cyber bullying and cyber drama.
Speaker: So I think,
Speaker: The more information that we put in kids' hands, you know, the better off they're going to be.
Speaker: And I always encourage, you know, parents can.
Speaker: This book is a great book to go through with your child before you get them that device.
Speaker: You know, so it kind of talks about all those things that we as parents want them to know.
Speaker: So it's a great starting point for conversations and to put maybe a family tech agreement in place, you know, so that as they launch into their device, they
Speaker: the family feels really ready for that.
Speaker: I love that.
Speaker: I'm actually going to refer your book.
Speaker: Yeah, I'm giving a talk to our school board here in my school district about cell phones being used in school, and they're asking me to kind of address the issue.
Speaker: And I would love to just use you as a general reference for parents who are kind of just getting started in that age where they're giving their kids phones and they don't know exactly how to, you know, monitor it or stay safe.
Speaker: So you would be an amazing reference for that.
Speaker: And so
Speaker: The last topic I really want to get to is what you talked about, bullying and cyberbullying.
Speaker: So that is also a topic that I work with on with teenagers and parents and tweens as well.
Speaker: And so what is your guidance on that?
Speaker: What do your books talk about?
Speaker: Oh, and I'd love to hear your thoughts on that too.
Speaker: But
Speaker: First of all, I want to make sure that kids and parents and families understand really what cyberbullying is versus digital drama, which is very common.
Speaker: Digital drama is basically some of the mean stuff that we see happen in life, especially in kids and teens.
Speaker: shifted online.
Speaker: So maybe kids going at each other, you know, there's some mean comments, some snide remarks.
Speaker: That usually it's kind of a situation that then it goes away.
Speaker: Now, how that differs from cyberbullying is cyberbullying feels very directed at one person.
Speaker: So a group might be really targeting a group or another group, and it's really constant.
Speaker: You know, it keeps happening over and over again, and it's pretty cruel.
Speaker: you know, sometimes it's, sometimes we can't even see what's going on.
Speaker: There, there's a lot, there's some apps out there that are anonymous, which I highly encourage you families to avoid anonymous apps.
Speaker: They're, they're not safe places for kids to be, or it's happening in DMs, you know, on social media.
Speaker: So it's, it's privately, they're privately said.
Speaker: So it might not be very apparent that kids are getting targeted, but so it's really essential for parents to
Speaker: Talk to their kids if they ever feel like they are getting targeted.
Speaker: You repeated mean messages over and over to let them know that this is a situation, you know, that they need to come to you and let you know about that and to work that through together.
Speaker: And let them know that sometimes kids are afraid to come to their parents because they think they might overreact.
Speaker: So make sure you're letting them know that you're going to address this in a way that feels safe and comfortable for them.
Speaker: But nobody deserves to be treated that way.
Speaker: So if it crosses that line and just from digital drama into this is really directed at one person and it's pretty aggressive and mean and harassing, that needs to stop.
Speaker: And intervention is what I found is normally happens there.
Speaker: It doesn't solve itself on its own.
Speaker: We need some adult intervention there.
Speaker: Yes, yes, I completely agree.
Speaker: And so with what you said about adults' reactions, I know that that's a topic that you are very passionate about, how parents are responding when kids come to them with any type of friend problem or social-emotional need, difficulty that they're having.
Speaker: So what is your advice to parents about how they respond to anything?
Speaker: And this, I found, is a practice for parents and even for me personally.
Speaker: So it's very easy to
Speaker: as parents, when our kids come to us with something that they're struggling with or something that's really hard for us to almost get triggered by that.
Speaker: So us to get very mad or very sad or just pounce on that situation.
Speaker: And when we get to the preteen and the teen years,
Speaker: that's not helpful.
Speaker: So what we've done there is our kids are already feeling emotional.
Speaker: They've told us something and now we've kind of gone off on our own emotional roller coaster and they see that as ungrounded.
Speaker: So that to them doesn't feel like a safe space to go.
Speaker: What is most helpful for them is if we, even as creepy or as weird as what they're telling us sounds, we take a deep breath
Speaker: We ground ourselves and the first thing out of our mouth is, I'm so glad you told me this.
Speaker: You know, tell me more.
Speaker: So it's just so calm, so grounded.
Speaker: And step one is just to listen, you know, not to react, just to listen, to get a good understanding and help them feel heard in this situation.
Speaker: Because it's a true gift for the person across from you to really hear you.
Speaker: So instead of them reacting and going off on their own emotional roller coaster or their own problem solving, just being truly heard is healing in itself.
Speaker: So we've already started the process of helping our child get more settled if we can respond in that way.
Speaker: But it's hard, you know, because we as parents hate to see our kids struggle.
Speaker: And sometimes it does trigger something really big inside of us.
Speaker: So as best as we can settle ourselves, you know, listen.
Speaker: be calm and figure out the best way to work through that.
Speaker: But if we can consistently respond in that way, they'll keep coming back to us.
Speaker: You know, they'll feel like, okay, this is not going to send my mom, you know, off the roof.
Speaker: I can go to her and talk to her about this.
Speaker: So we're kind of creating a safe space for them to come to us when things do start to get real challenging or serious.
Speaker: Yes, I love that.
Speaker: And I completely agree.
Speaker: In fact, that's why I have a parenting course on my website called Cracking the Parent Code.
Speaker: And the first module is self-awareness.
Speaker: The second one is emotional regulation.
Speaker: And the third one is communication.
Speaker: And I have eight modules total, but those first three kind of address that where
Speaker: We're regulating ourselves emotionally.
Speaker: We're being self-aware of kind of like what we're putting out there.
Speaker: And then we're communicating effectively by being really good listeners, by validating their feelings.
Speaker: And so the reason why I feel like that is also so important to make the listeners kind of really understand that point
Speaker: is when you react because you have a trigger, then the problem is that your child is then holding, you know, their own emotional problem that they came to in the first place.
Speaker: But then they're also kind of having to manage your emotions.
Speaker: They're kind of either having to calm you down or reassure you.
Speaker: So then it's giving them two jobs.
Speaker: First, they're dealing with their own emotions, and then they're having to, you know, react or respond to your emotions.
Speaker: And it's just too much.
Speaker: And so that's why as the adult, you
Speaker: As the parent, our job is then to kind of, like you said, kind of emotionally regulate, put our emotions to the side, whatever we are feeling in that moment, which a lot of times is incredibly justifiable.
Speaker: Like if somebody else's kid does something pretty mean to our kid, we're going to react.
Speaker: We're going to be triggered.
Speaker: We're going to be protective.
Speaker: We're going to be tiger mamas.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And we're going to be like, oh, my gosh, that kid has no right to say that to whatever it is.
Speaker: but that doesn't matter in that moment, right?
Speaker: We have to put that to the side and really tend to our kids' feelings.
Speaker: So just kind of be thankful that they are open to sharing because it does get hard.
Speaker: The older they get, the more likely they are to shut down when they're more into the teenage years.
Speaker: They're not gonna come with you.
Speaker: And so you always wanna have that door that feels open to them where they know it's not about you and your freak outs and your emotions, but that it's about them and their emotions.
Speaker: So how does that resonate with you?
Speaker: Oh, I completely agree 100%.
Speaker: And I know a lot of parents look back and think, oops, you know, I did not do this well.
Speaker: And, you know, and all of us have moments where we didn't do this well.
Speaker: So let me just put this out there for all the parents is.
Speaker: We've all kind of messed this up at times and it's okay.
Speaker: You know, at any point in our parenting journey, we can change our path and change our reactions and kind of repair what had happened in the past.
Speaker: So, so if you're listening to this and thinking, oops, oh no, you are not alone.
Speaker: I also, you know, it took me a while to get, you know, a handle on this myself.
Speaker: So, so we are all learning our, so give yourself grace and
Speaker: you know, you can start at any time.
Speaker: And sometimes when I feel like I really haven't done this well with my kids, I'll circle back and be like, you know what?
Speaker: I, when you, when this happened, I realized I did this and I am so sorry.
Speaker: What I wish I'd done instead was this, you know, so I'm acknowledging, you know, with my child that I didn't handle this as I would have.
Speaker: And, and I acknowledge that and I'm sorry about this.
Speaker: This is what I want to do next time.
Speaker: And, and that's, that's a repair that can help that situation.
Speaker: And,
Speaker: and help you propel yourself into the new way that you want to respond in the future.
Speaker: I think that's amazing.
Speaker: I love that word repair.
Speaker: And I think that's such an important example that we can set for our kids.
Speaker: And it could even be the same day, right?
Speaker: If you kind of like blew up earlier, you can go back to them later and say, oh, I'm so sorry about how I responded earlier.
Speaker: I was, you know, a little bit overwhelmed by what you shared, but I'm ready to listen now.
Speaker: So it could be the same day, it could be a year later, it could be, I'm in my late 40s and my mom recently said something to me that she was kind of taking some ownership and responsibility about something she had done when I was younger.
Speaker: And I was like, okay, even now it feels good, like just to come back and have that repair and that acknowledgement that maybe it wasn't handled the best possible way.
Speaker: So I think that you're right, it's for all of us, we all do it, we all fall into that trap and that it's never too late to go back and make that repair and make those amends.
Speaker: So
Speaker: I think that's great.
Speaker: Is there anything else that we haven't covered that you'd like to share?
Speaker: You know, one thing that might be helpful is I think it's talking about earlier, sometimes we just jump in and react.
Speaker: What I found is helpful is if we
Speaker: As we are helping our kids, you know, develop their own friendship skills, their own relationship skills, you know, we kind of keep a real high level look at this.
Speaker: So if we like pull back from the school playground or the school lunchroom, you know, we're looking down from above at these young people.
Speaker: We've got kids that come from very different homes.
Speaker: You know, we've got some neurotypical kids.
Speaker: We've got neurodiverse kids.
Speaker: We've got kids with all different personalities and skill levels.
Speaker: So it is not surprising that there's social struggles and strife.
Speaker: So I like to look at this as like, this is a training ground, you know, so all we can control is ourselves and do the best we can, know that we're gonna mess up sometimes.
Speaker: And as we are helping our kids navigate this, you know, try not to label and put other kids in boxes.
Speaker: You know, they're all kids.
Speaker: They're all dealing with their own stuff that we don't know about.
Speaker: So just helping our kids see that big picture too, that it's normal to have conflict with other people and we're all doing the best we can.
Speaker: There are things we can do.
Speaker: There's skills that we can develop in ourselves to try to improve these situations, to try to maybe set some boundaries or solve some conflict in healthy ways or speak up.
Speaker: There's things we can do, but it is perfectly normal to have social struggles and strife.
Speaker: That's kind of part of being a human.
Speaker: So I like to tell that to parents because I think it's easy for parents to get into the nitty gritty of the conflict instead of kind of pulling back, realizing, you know, our role in this is to try to guide our kids in the best way they can so they can develop those skills.
Speaker: I think that's such a great point.
Speaker: And it made me think of the question is, how do you help parents find a healthy middle ground?
Speaker: So what I mean by that is some parents, you know, they're so, you know, the minute one thing goes wrong in the lunchroom or the minute something happens, they're kind of freaking out, you know, reaching out to the guidance counselor or
Speaker: calling the teachers or trying to make it, you know, fix it.
Speaker: And then there's this other extreme appearance that I see that they're all about, oh, their kids will tough it out.
Speaker: They'll figure it out.
Speaker: They're resilient.
Speaker: They'll, right.
Speaker: And so it's like, how do you find like a healthy middle ground where we're guiding and supporting our kids and we're there for them, but we're not intervening every single second, every single problem that happens.
Speaker: That's such a great point because you see both ends of that spectrum.
Speaker: So one is, I think, you know,
Speaker: being generally interested in your kid's life is great.
Speaker: You know, they want to know that you care and that you're validating their experiences.
Speaker: You know, so that takes care of that one end that's like, ah, they're on their own, you know, but just showing interest, asking questions, not getting involved, but just asking questions, showing interest, validating those tough emotions when they're having them.
Speaker: Then on the other side of the spectrum, you know, what I like to share is one of my favorite lessons that I learned is don't dig for pain.
Speaker: You know, so, so kids tend to heal and move on from things much faster than we do as adults.
Speaker: So say our kid has a really tough day with, with a kid.
Speaker: And then the next day we keep asking about it.
Speaker: We keep asking about it and they're, they've long healed from this, but we keep, well, how was so-and-so today?
Speaker: Well, what happened?
Speaker: You know, so we are the ones actually still digging for this.
Speaker: They have moved on.
Speaker: So that's, you know, something I encourage parents to do is
Speaker: don't dig for pain anymore.
Speaker: Like if you had a chance to talk through and validate the emotions of a tough situation, let that go unless, you know, your child brings it up again, you know, so let them take the lead there.
Speaker: We don't have to dig, but we can be there as a sounding board and interested and curious and supportive and empathic.
Speaker: So hopefully that helps to build that healthy balance.
Speaker: That's perfect.
Speaker: I love that.
Speaker: And so tell us your books one more time, and I'm going to go ahead and link them to the episode so that way parents can find them.
Speaker: And can you tell us the titles one more time?
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: And these, they're all mouthfuls.
Speaker: I apparently like long titles.
Speaker: So the first one is BFF or NRF, which is not really friends.
Speaker: Girls Guide to Happy Friendships.
Speaker: The second one is called Middle School Safety Goggles Advised.
Speaker: That one obviously is really geared towards the middle school years.
Speaker: And then the third one,
Speaker: It's called the phone book.
Speaker: And they are available anywhere books are sold.
Speaker: So you can get them, you know, at target.com or Amazon, or, you know, even your local bookstore can get them in stock.
Speaker: Awesome.
Speaker: Well, Jessica, thank you so much for taking the time today.
Speaker: I've enjoyed our conversation so much.
Speaker: And I just know that the moms out there will definitely be taking your advice and hopefully buying your books and running with it.
Speaker: So thank you again.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: Thank you for having me, Laura.
Speaker: It was great to chat with you.
Speaker: Yes, absolutely.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Thanks.
Speaker: Thank you for listening to the Positively Healthy Mom podcast because there's no manual for the hardest job in the world.
Speaker: Don't forget to subscribe and share with your friends.
