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Goodpain Podcast Season 02, Episode No. 008: Bill O'Melia – Grief as a Father, Sharing Grief as Men
210 Plays3 months ago
We return to the topic of grief as our starting point and shared story, however, this discussion goes beyond that. In it we sit down with Bill O'Melia, who was thrust into role as an advocate following the passing of his son, Drennan in 2010. Bil and his wife, Melissa, with their two surviving sons were upheld by a sudden community that rose up around them. And a couple years later, Bill found himself using his family's story on stage.
This year, Bill & Melissa came to the decision with their board to suspend operations for Drennen's Dreams Foundation. We discuss the journey toward that decision here and the emotions and experience that came along with it. Bill is also involved in supporting the Families United to Prevent Drowning organization, a union of families focused on "No more drowning."
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Transcript
Redefining Success
00:00:00
Speaker
My measure of success, some people measure it differently and and financial success is one aspect, but to me, more important aspect of whether a person is successful or not is, did you make your world around you a better place by you being there?
00:00:20
Speaker
Were you a giver or you a taker?
Introducing Good Pain Podcast
00:00:24
Speaker
I'm Jeremy. And I'm Tyler. Welcome to Good Pain, where we talk about life's true intensities without pretending they're easy solve. What if the things we're told to fix, optimize, or get over are actually where the real wisdom lives?
00:00:37
Speaker
Each week we gather for the kind of honest conversations you desire to be a part of more often about the relentless demands, the unexpected grief, the quiet victories, and everything in between. Because maybe, just maybe, the answer isn't to limit the hard stuff, it's to find the good in it. Welcome to the conversation.
Guest Introduction: Bill Emilia
00:01:06
Speaker
Before we get started, I want to give a fair content warning that we will not be going into exceptional detail, but we do share some minor details about loss, grief, and healing.
00:01:17
Speaker
We're talking to Bill Emilia about him and his family story. Bill and I met in 2015 when Tiffany and i moved back to Colorado from Texas, and we were introduced by a mutual friend, a coworker at the time for me, and it's an introduction that I cannot be more grateful for. I am not going to beat around the bush any further than to say that this is one of my favorite episodes that we have done.
00:01:43
Speaker
Bill tells his story incredibly well. It is captivating. It is moving. And I do not need to give any more details other than to say that please listen to the full hour-long conversation that he and I had here. I find it incredibly enriching. And if you know of anybody, any men in particular, who are dealing with grief or carrying things for which they cannot speak about it, forward them this episode and encourage them to reach out to us. Visit the website. Our contact information is there.
00:02:17
Speaker
And this is an important topic for both Bill and I. And we are excited to share it with you.
Bill's Early Experiences with Family Illness
00:02:26
Speaker
For myself personally, my journey started a long time before. My dad got sick when I was four and um he had a malignant brain tumor. So he'd have he'd come home sometimes and have some pretty incredibly violent seizures and I'd be the only one in the house with them. and kind of moved furniture out of the way and then talked to him when he came to And i just, he couldn't work anymore. And I just, his faith was so incredibly strong. He never lost faith, even through all the things he was going to. And it was it was kind of incredible role model. And my mom also went back to work in her 40s to support a family of five.
00:03:07
Speaker
So just kind of watching those two and the strength that they was, In some ways, I think it kind of, you know, it it never really prepared me for what was going to happen with Drennan, but I think it gave me some some of the tools that were necessary for myself to start to get through that after I lost my son Drennan to a fatal drowning incident.
Grieving the Loss of a Child
00:03:30
Speaker
When it first happened, when Drennan first drowned, my wife and I were incredibly raw. um We were mired in our grief. I mean, some days it was a struggle just to get out of bed. you You felt like you wanted to just stay under the covers and have the world go by. And I remember working at that time, and I'd go into the office, and I'd turn on my computer, and I'd inevitably find myself looking for pictures that somebody had posted of Drennan that I had never seen before. And then um we had gone through, you know, i I searched for answers as to what caused my son to drown, and they never never really came.
00:04:10
Speaker
um We went through a civil trial, and I had some aha moments, you know, that... debt started to put things into perspective for me that it wasn't necessarily what caused Drennan to go under that was important. It was the fact that he wasn't seen. And I could start to lay those things to rest. And we went through a civil trial. It ended in in October 2013.
00:04:32
Speaker
two thousand and thirteen And some of the stuff that we learned through that kind of empowered me to begin to speak about what happened.
Therapeutic Sharing and Public Speaking
00:04:39
Speaker
And um I was invited in May of 2014 to share Drennan's story with some lifeguards from the Highlands Ranch Community Association.
00:04:49
Speaker
And there were about 250 to 300 of them in there. And they were, you know, young people, probably 15 19, most of them. and i was kind of scared. I was like, what am I going to say to all these young people to hold their interest? And I'm i'm typically a person that has to put my thoughts down in front of me and see them. And as I first started doing that, um I looked at what I had written. i was like, you you're coming off as a really angry individual. Who is your target audience and what do you want that message to be? And I pushed the computer away from me and I'm like, Brandon, you got to help me with this. And I don't know how folks feel on this stuff, but it was like I heard a little voice inside my head that said, dad just tell them what happened. I'll take care of the rest. And so I stood up there that evening and there's news media there and TV crews and stuff. And I just told Drennan's story. Something special happened.
00:05:45
Speaker
You know, those young people didn't look down at their phones. They didn't talk to their friends. um They gave me a standing ovation, and then they asked some really insightful questions because it's one of the things that sets apart what we do when talking to different groups is I open it up to questions for them where they can ask me anything they want to know about what happened or what's going on in our life personally. And I think that's kind of a unique thing when you hear other speakers. So that started to set me on this journey where I could share Drennan's story to help others, really. And at the same time, it was therapeutic for me, too, because I was getting to tell a group of perfect strangers for a brief period of time how wonderful my son was and is.
00:06:30
Speaker
And, um you know, it was, it was in the way, in some forms of form of therapy for me as well.
Coping Mechanisms and Vulnerability
00:06:39
Speaker
I knew this conversation was coming.
00:06:41
Speaker
Um, there was an aspect of me bracing for it. I think I still get surprised by the pain. Um, You and i when i when we moved back here, you and I were were still, i think, when we moved back to here, we were five years in.
00:06:55
Speaker
And what surprised me was you were also five years in because Claire's accident was on May 30th, 2010. Drennan's was a week later, I think, if we're right in June. you June 6th, 2010, yeah. And I think what you just said, that that aspect of therapy, wow, we're doing this thing that is this classically advocating and sharing the story at the same time that it's evolving. like the i didn't Looking back now at some of the things we did early in that stage and seeing the various aspects of working to wrap arms around this at the same time, having big questions that were still persisting despite
00:07:34
Speaker
the therapy. And for you, what was what was it like learning how to sit with this pain at the same time knowing that there are ways that maybe were perpetuating that might I might look back and say was a part of the process but also had some unhealthy aspects to it and that's running right alongside this very public outward expression of honoring Drennan and keeping assigning meaning some in some ways to it?
00:08:04
Speaker
Initially, when it happened, we did some pretty intensive therapy with counselors and stuff, and and it helped us. it it kinda i mean I remember I pulled a lot of information from those things, and it helped our boys too. But through counseling, they caution you, especially going through grief, about overuse of alcohol or narcotics or you know, getting obsessed in in certain areas. And I and i had, i for a while there, I drank way too much for a couple years there. I was trying to drink my son back to life, and that did not work. It led to greater problems, it led staying in funks longer, um and So when I started, and and keep in mind, it was a few years before I ever started speaking about Drennan from June of 2010 until May of 2014 when I finally started speaking to groups about him. So it took a while for us to come to that place. There's some people that can do it immediately. um
00:09:06
Speaker
We weren't one of them. Mm-hmm. And, ah you know, when it first happened
Emotional Resilience and Fatherhood
00:09:11
Speaker
with Drennan, you know, i drank too much, but I also was obsessed with trying to find out what happened.
00:09:18
Speaker
I couldn't save my boy that night when it happened. And all I could do, i felt afterwards as a father, um, was to look for answers on behalf of my son and on behalf of my family. And i don't know that I ever fully got the answers I was searching for, but I came to a realization along the way that I got enough of an, I got enough of the answers that I could, I could put myself back together and I could move on and I could find other ways to channel that. Um, you know, it, it,
00:09:54
Speaker
It's been surprising as we go. And each day, know, each time I do this, and I've been doing it for 13 years now, speaking to different groups, there's always something. There's always something out there that's new or different, or somebody asks you a question that you hadn't heard before, and it's like, hmm. And it starts to put a new perspective on this whole journey of grief, as a father um so it's it's um it's interesting but yeah did i mean i'm guilty i'm guilty i did a lot of the things that they tell you stay away from and don't do yeah you you talked about this search for answer or answers where does that come from what what's what's the hope that's attached the answer presenting itself for you
00:10:39
Speaker
So, you know, as ah as a father, you know, and i I came to fatherhood just, you know, through inheriting, being ah being a dad, you know, having children, and it and it came to me.
00:10:51
Speaker
And, ah you know, you learn, your' your you're taught different things in life as as a man, as a father, you know, that you're you the one that's... that takes care everything. You're the strong one in the household. that At least that's the way I was brought up back in the 60s and 70s and stuff. And so when I was searching for answers, I i i couldn't fix what had happened.
00:11:15
Speaker
So I was searching for those answers on behalf of my son and on behalf of my family so I could give them, try to give them some peace. I was hoping trying to fix the problem, I guess you'd say. And, um you know, that's, it's, in some ways, i I'm glad I went through it, but at the same time, I didn't, i I got answers to some things, but I didn't fix the problem that I was setting out to fix, you know.
Encouraging Emotional Expression in Men
00:11:41
Speaker
um I guess in some ways, a byproduct of that would be that I, I,
00:11:46
Speaker
hope that I have shown my other two boys, Quinn and Sean, um what it means to be a strong man, strong in in in your soul and your perspective and and so and the fact that you can show emotion, you can talk about things that are hard topics, you can work through them, you can You know, you can wear your heart on your sleeve. You don't have to compartmentalize every damn thing as a man. You just don't have to. it's and It's hard because there's so much incentives that are oftentimes propped up to say, this is how we have to show up.
00:12:26
Speaker
yeah And there was something that for me, even because of the severity of what had happened, almost gave a license that because nobody else could imagine that, that whatever, however I showed up was like, people almost said, well, yeah, of course. Like, yeah, it's this almost perverse incentive that says that the depth of the pain and suffering was sufficient for people to finally give license to say, you could wear your emotions on your sleeve. Well, of course you could. But then I see others who come up and feel that they can't give themselves that permission. And I hear for you that setting that model that says, that's bullshit.
00:13:07
Speaker
we We know there's things that communicate that message, but why do we believe it I think that what what are the what are the things for you that you have found in interacting with other people that you've been able to actually give them the permission to connect with the part of themselves that says you you can let yourself fall apart some.
00:13:29
Speaker
and And guess what? The world doesn't stop. It doesn't fall down. How how have how has your story, how has Drennan's story created that invitation for others, men in particular, to maybe wake up or at least kind of say like, oh, I i can let go of this bullshit?
00:13:45
Speaker
Yeah. um You know, it it it started early on when it when we first left the hospital room that night. there's There's no real playbook about how you tell your other children those tough, have those tough conversations with them.
00:14:02
Speaker
And then over the years, you know, just through Sharon Drennan's story, ah and I share it because, you know, one, it it helps me go through what I've gone through. But even more importantly and than that, I try to make sure that no other family goes through what we went through. We don't need another Bill O'Meally out there. The world doesn't.
00:14:25
Speaker
doesn't need that, you know. if it happens, hopefully somebody can learn something from what I'm talking about and take that and feel empowered to to talk about it. But um along the way, as I started talking to folks, i i I went into the inner city of Denver one time and and did a presentation down there. and It was pretty crowded house that day. And there was some big, huge buff guys all tatted up standing at the back of the room. And I got done with my presentation. I opened it up for her questions and I got questions from the crowd. But as as I started to walk out, i i there's all these guys at the back of the room. it's to some
00:15:11
Speaker
It looked somewhat like a gauntlet that I was about to walk through. And I remember the first guy in line said, hey, man, um I don't know how you did that. He said, can I give you a hug? And he's got tears rolling. And i said, yeah, i'm I'm finding that I am a hugger and and hugs are good, you know. So I gave him a hug and then I...
00:15:31
Speaker
you know, the next guy in line. And some of the folks along the way be like, hey, I just lost my brother six months ago or a cousin or close friend. and And how do you do that? And I said, well, you know, um i said it it's some folks, and it not to judge any, some folks it's really difficult for, but I personally find it therapeutic and i find it enabling and it for me it keeps my son's life and legacy alive when I share his story with other people.
00:16:06
Speaker
And as a byproduct of talking to lifeguards or stuff, I've encountered a lot of men. And one of the byproducts of that is, I think, by sharing Drennan's story so openly and opening things up for questions that it it it lets men know that it's okay. It is o okay for you and even should be encouraged for you to talk about your loved one or what you're going through, no matter what that may be in life.
00:16:35
Speaker
It doesn't mean that you're weak. It's the exact opposite. You know, it means that you've achieved some kind of inner strength with yourself that you feel that you can try to help others to let them know. Because, you know, it's folly to compartmentalize that and keep it inside to the point where you're suffering from alcoholism or drug addiction or you start having suicidal thoughts.
00:17:02
Speaker
or anger issues where you're lashing out violently at loved ones or someone out in the general public. There's so many better ways to deal with that. And I think um opening up and sharing of yourself. and And if it bothers you to open up and share of yourself because you feel it's um a sign of weakness, then open up and share of yourself as a sign of strength to help others.
00:17:29
Speaker
you know whatever that whatever that is but talk about what it is that you're going through man it's i i tried to car compartmentalize it those first couple years and i was on a bad bad path yeah yeah i i think what you just said in talking to men in similar ways well what we were discussing previously about that being the strong one being the one that provides stability and structure I found that that itself becomes a significant burden that oftentimes we're told the compartmentalization and the tools that we use to just hold things together is what is most championed. And and inherent within that, I've seen a number of men that when they look out and they have opened up or they have that the the people that are among them, the circle that they have, whether that's a
00:18:23
Speaker
a wife, whether that's a significant other, whether that's a friend, that that those people wilt almost under the weight of of the pain or suffering that they are
The Power of Story Sharing
00:18:34
Speaker
carrying. And so it it just it's this disappointment then that says, okay, I'm just going to continue holding this on my own because it's almost too much if I if i lay it out for other people.
00:18:46
Speaker
And i and and i that has that has been a light even on my experience and what I hear from you is is that there is something about having a man speak in public about something, an event or an experience that is almost so unconscionable and can't even be imagined.
00:19:05
Speaker
In the minds of of other men who are carrying these things, it almost creates this invitation that says, if I can stand up here and talk about this thing that you can't hear, I'm strong enough to hear your pain.
00:19:17
Speaker
right I'm strong enough for you to so to say it. I'm strong enough for you to break down in front of me and I can hold that space. and And that has been one of the ways that for me, it took a long time to transform that. It took a long time for me to, I look back on some of the things and in in efforts to connect with those who were were experiencing some heavy things, I'd get people who would come up and and and say, you know, what I'm experiencing is nothing compared to what you experience. And that comparative aspect comes out and saying that, let's let's set that aside. Let's set the comparison aside. But then looking back and also finding that drawing, sharing the story or trying to connect with people when they were sharing their pain, I found ways that I was even transmitting some of the pain that sometimes trying to connect and say, well, that, you know, I understand what you're going through and here's what how it landed for me.
00:20:11
Speaker
That sometimes that would they weren't able to hear some of the things that I was carrying. They can hear the story. They can identify with that. And what I learned by others coming up and talking to me was how to not even take my pain and put it on them, but understand.
00:20:28
Speaker
But to actually do the thing that was very cathartic to me, which was de-centering at times for me and the story, which at times was heavy. There were times, there's bad days and good days. yeah But to to potentially it be a bad day and actually to cultivate listening to what they are carrying and to even give some relief for saying like, I don't I don't need to center my story at this point. I can i can serve. I can listen. I can hold that space for this person falling to pieces. And without me needing to interject my components of the story there. And and and that took a long time. Sometimes it's there's this concept of trauma bonding that people sometimes use. And and and I was guilty of that to to some degree. Which is saying like, yeah, we we we share we share a connection here because we're comparing on on our respective trauma as opposed to serving in a way that says, i i want to connect with you in a way that creates the space for you to actually share your story. and use my story as a means for maybe just being the catalyst that allows you to open up.
00:21:34
Speaker
and and And Claire's story, my story did its job. And now can I now can i actually do that service work of holding space for that other person in front of me? and And that sometimes I centered my pain. So I'm on a group, an operations committee for a group called Families United to Prevent Drowning. And it's a collective around the country of of ah organizations like ours And when somebody reaches out to us, it's r um policy for a family member to connect with that person the first time before we start sending them any forms or any things like that to join our group. And we tell them, you know, our motto is we don't want any more people, but if something happens, we will lovingly accept you. Mm-hmm. And found through doing that, through reaching out to these people for the first time before an admin person reaches out to them, that it's really important to listen to what they have to say because they're usually a lot newer and a lot rar in their journey than we are. And I don't ever really um go into my story until I've heard their story. and let them ask me about what what happened in our situation.
00:22:54
Speaker
ah tried I try to be so a good listener. I mean, ah through the years I've encountered people out there that are truly guardian angels that have this incredible ability to listen to you and listen and ask you the questions that free you up to say that. that's you know As a contractor, that's not really one of my...
00:23:15
Speaker
strong suits, but I have gotten better at it over the years. And i think when you when you listen to folks, it's important and it starts to bring out that um response. And one one of the things I want to touch on, because I don't know if any of your guests ah over the course of this series have touched on it or will touch on it,
00:23:35
Speaker
But throughout this process, especially early on, we'd encounter family or friends or you know mostly friends that were really uncomfortable with what we were going through. And um there was some distance put in in between us and some people we don't interact with anymore over the time. And that's That's a them thing. That's not an us thing. You know, it's there. We can't unwind what happened to us, you know, um and we're not going to be silent. We don't talk about it all the time. Like, we're not overbearing about it, but we're not also not going to act like it never happened to us. And some folks will drift off
00:24:21
Speaker
from you, but there's other people that are going to come into your life that, you know, now some of the people that I'm i'm closest with are are people that have come into our life after this has happened. So it's going to happen. It's something you really can't control.
00:24:37
Speaker
but I just, you know, I think it's important that people out there understand this, that, you know, there will be folks that will be uncomfortable with your situation. And don't waste your energy on trying to change their mind. Just be you.
00:24:50
Speaker
Be the strongest person that you can be. And you'll be surprised about how things fall into place for you. over That sounds like a position that has evolved over time. Correct.
00:25:02
Speaker
How was that as people, as you came to the realization that there are some people that they're currently or presently not equipped with sitting in proximity to what has happened to us? Yeah, it was painful at first, you know, and and they talked about it through some of the grief counseling and and one-on-one therapy that we'd gone through early on. And they so they said that it may happen. yeah It doesn't make it less painful at the time when these folks, you know, I don't know if they felt that their children were going to get the death gene from
00:25:36
Speaker
being in close proximity to us or whatever the comfort may be. And it in it hurt, you know, but then you start thinking about it afterwards and you're like, well, let's look at how close we really were, you know. And when you start to dissect it, it's like, it's easy to have friends when everything is going good. A real friend is when they're there when you're going through hard times, you know, that's when you really need people. And And so, you know, you just kind of weed it out. I don't, you know, depending on the audience, if somebody asks me, how many sons do you have? how many children do you have? if i If I think it's really superficial, I don't get into it. But if they they're asking me and I think it's sincere and it's from the heart, I'll tell them I have three, you know, or just one of them lives in heaven.
00:26:23
Speaker
Yep. You know, and then if they want to ask me further about it, I'll tell them. And if they seem uncomfortable, that's where it ends.
Family Healing and Genuine Connections
00:26:29
Speaker
Yeah. that That's a that's something that's been clear for me is that, that desire to be known and, and that, that in interacting with people that even that example of, of being asked a question that is almost, you know, that run a mill, run of the mill question that we ask when we meet somebody new or we're kind of checking the box of these things. and Yeah. and understanding kind of what are the points of interconnection that we possibly could connect on. And coming to that, you know very honest, authentic knowing that part of that expression that that I don't ever want to let go of is that honoring of Claire, the honoring of Drennan and saying like, this is, it it have no reason to believe that that that that's ever going to go away.
00:27:12
Speaker
right And and if if if I want to be known, then this degree of intensity is part and parcel. with it And and having developing that sense of awareness that there are some people that are capable of being hit with that degree of intensity, that that degree of, sometimes I'll describe it as a sucker punch, um that that people don't see coming. You and I both know is is that the we can be very practiced in being the walking wounded. that i mean, nobody is aware. And... And when you've worked through things, you you get to a point where nobody would suspect that the degree of of trauma, pain, of suffering that we have endured. But what that turns back on for me is also being surprised by then your story of these men coming up and sharing despite everything that says that that broadcasts.
00:28:07
Speaker
We are large, capable, tattooed, burly guys that are in the process of of being touched and showing up after listening to your story in a way that is, in some ways, deeply in conflict with everything they're putting forward. And in that there's a there's a deep yearning for just being seen and being known. And one of the things I think that is one of the most grievous things about what we what I've experienced, what Tiffany has experienced with Claire is is saying that it is now my job for you to know who she is, who she was. And it grieves us that you cannot know that on your own. Yeah. how It just seems very humane to interact with each other in the way that we start to acknowledge more that we want to be we want to be known and seen regardless of the intensities that we endure. And that particularly as men, that we feel that that drive to say, you figure out your intensity for yourself. And how has that influenced?
00:29:12
Speaker
changed your relationship with the people around you. You mentioned your kids and how you do that. How did that change other relationships, the ones that didn't distance from you?
00:29:24
Speaker
With my boys and with my family, before I embarked on on the process of sharing Brennan's story with the public, we sat down and we had conversations about it.
00:29:36
Speaker
you know And we said, okay, going to be okay. okay with this? You know, if there's something that I'm talking about that you don't want me to talk about, let me know. um But i I did that beforehand so that they could have comfort with it. And it also opened the door for them to tell me if I was touching on subjects that they didn't want me talking about.
00:30:01
Speaker
Because once I started, I was kind of an open book about um But i think I think that it's put them at ease. they They suffered through some tragedy going through high school with a rash of suicides at their high school. And I would like to think that me being open about it and being a somewhat of a role model for them, I hope, that it also empowered them to open up and talk about it as they went through that as well, because they were pretty young when when we lost Drennan. And also with other folks that i we encounter, I think that it, you know, like we we previously talked about it, being open about it, opening things up to questions, it it sets it up that, you know, this is this is authentic. I'm not walking into a room and lecturing folks about whatever. Mm-hmm.
00:30:55
Speaker
you know, I'm opening it up. Ask me, you know, ask me, I'll tell you. If you don't ask me, I won't tell you. Sometimes I'll throw in a throwaway question just to see if I can get the crowd a little bit fired up. But, um,
00:31:09
Speaker
You know, and and I think along the way, it it opens up that dialogue. It starts to let people know. It lets them know that you're authentic and what you're talking about and puts them at ease to some degree as well. um At the end of the day, man, I'm just a dad that's trying to find my way through this, that's trying to do the best for my family, trying to help myself little self-help along the way um and that's what it kind of boils down to i'm a dad that's trying to do the best by my family part of that you've mentioned is the establishment of the foundation and the activities you were doing to tell his story to share his story to honor drennan to honor your family and recently you guys made a decision regarding that we did walk me through that
00:31:58
Speaker
So, you know, like I said, Drennan drowned in June
Winding Down Drennan's Foundation
00:32:04
Speaker
6, 2010. We did some of the stuff I think you were involved in. We did some stuff initially on that wasn't related to drowning prevention and water safety. We built a youth center at our church called the D-Zone, Drennan-O-Million Youth Center. The D-Zone is more affectionately known to the youth.
00:32:22
Speaker
We sponsored kids to do youth, a underprivileged youth to participate in sports. We sent kids to Washington, D.C., like Drennan got to go to with his classmates. um ah And we so we gave money to Children's Hospital here in Colorado for grief counseling for the families of the Aurora Theater shooting victims. And then we migrated over in 2014 to um drowning prevention and water safety. And when we did that, we went full bore into it. And one year pre-COVID, I think I spoke at 50 locations around the country. and
00:33:00
Speaker
And over the time, I've sat on quite a few boards, quite a few committees, U.S. National Water Safety Action Plan. and some other things, and we went really hard. And um most of our board has been people from the community that have been with us for the whole 13 years at Drennan Streams has been in effect. And we have decided, we decided an early of 2025 to sunset the foundation at the end of this year. So at the end of December this year, we are sunsetting the foundation.
00:33:34
Speaker
And when I talk about the foundation of that, we've done some good work over the years. I'd like to think that we we've raised awareness around drowning prevention water safety, both locally in the state of Colorado and on the national level. And when I talk about sunsetting the foundation, basically that's the financial mechanism that supported some of the work we do.
00:33:57
Speaker
We're no longer going to raise funds. The foundation portion of it is closing. Melissa and I will more than likely always continue to support organizations that are still working in that space. And i i would am still willing to talk to different organizations around the country. all you know They'll just have to reimburse us for our travel expenses. But I think it's it's something that i feel compelled to do. And I think Drennan's story such that it can reach out to those aquatics professionals around the country. And it's something that continues to need to be shared. but we needed a break, you know, we needed a break. Um, few years ago, we kind of got into where funds dipped in the foundation and it felt wrong to shut it down at that time. It almost would have felt like another loss to some degree. um right now we've done some really good stuff. We built five, I'm finishing up the last three life jacket loaner stations for this year out at Chatfield reservoir where we've had a lot of, um, at Chatfield State Park where we've had a lot of paddleboard drownings over the past few years, people not wearing life jackets. So, you know, we built five of these things, two at Lake Pueblo and one down at, and the three out at Chatfield just in this calendar year. And then we built two prior to that. And to us, it feels like we're leaving on a high note versus leaving on a low note. I don't ever want to feel like I'm the last person left there having to turn off the lights. You know, i can still, I'm Melissa and I are looking towards retirement here in the next few years. And, um, if after taking a year or two into retirement, I feel the urge to immerse myself back in that world again, full bore, then that's something I'll come back to. I've given myself permission to, to do it or, or to not do it, you know?
00:35:46
Speaker
um But like I say, I think ah I'm willing to keep continuing to talk to people and stuff, provided that timeframes work out and things like that. but It was a decision that we came to. it wasn't it wasn't It was a tough decision, but I think at this point in time, it's the right decision.
00:36:05
Speaker
no What was the most tough aspects about it as you will reflect? Well, to some degree, from my perspective, because I'm out on the road talking to folks so much, I think the thing, one, you never want people to forget about your child. That's that's one of the things that I don't want people to forget that my son existed. You know, that's that's probably first and foremost. But also that, you know, I struggle. to i don't, um are people going to think that I'm turning my back on the drowning prevention water safety world, which is is not the case. You know, we were in at full bore for for somebody that has a full-time job and runs a construction company. it was I mean, i did I like to think I did all that I could given the time frame that I had to work in.
00:36:56
Speaker
arena. um But you know, i I'm okay with it now. And we had been talking about it for a couple of years, so this isn't something that just popped up overnight. We had been talking about it and when was that right time and it's like, okay, we're kind of on a high note right here.
00:37:12
Speaker
i think i think this is a good time versus having to eat all that if we were at a low point. Yeah. Yeah, there's there's something, i mean and this is me a little bit guessing at it, is is that particularly that those board members that have been but involved for such a long time that came around and stuck through it and and erected this structure that really is a memorial that is a living, breathing memorial.
Maintaining Legacy and Community Impact
00:37:40
Speaker
Yeah.
00:37:40
Speaker
yeah And there's something that switches also where it's not even the questions of honoring Drennan, which as you've just said, like this, that spirit is not going anywhere.
00:37:52
Speaker
It's, it is, it is going to continue. It will be alive. But those relationships that were built, those people that came along, I mean, for me, those are the people that it feels like, am I letting you down? like You've rallied around and you held us up during feast and famine. And and what what is what does this now mean for you? i think that's the hard part with the story when we bring it and other people start carrying it. It's it's ours to protect, but it's also now others are inputting in on it and they have a they have a perspective and they have their own reasons for it. And how how how did you manage that? And what were the conversations like with those who had been along for the ride Yeah. You know, um they're all they're all getting older too. Really old looking at retirement themselves.
00:38:41
Speaker
But, um you know, we did some good stuff and I think i think we we talked about it and and we're pretty proud of the work that we have have done to this point. I think that um I always ask myself, you know, have we done stuff that Drennan could be proud of? about. Did we honor his legacy? um You know, ah for the folks out there that might not know, we, several years back, we filmed a piece for the American Red Cross as part of their curriculum for lifeguards and lifeguard managers, and they all see it, and it's called Not On Your Watch. We filmed it down in Fort Myers, Florida, two cycles ago. So it's been in two editions of their curriculum now. I think we're going into the third one. And each one of those curriculums is a five-year slot. And, you know, that he'll live on through that as long as they continue to carry it. And his story is out there now, you know, in Colorado and nationally and, you you know, people, it's out there, it's well known. I mean, that American Red Cross piece is seen by 326,000 people every single year, and then they in turn show it to their staff over and over. um So it'll it'll live on. And i I think as we approached this, we looked at it, we kind of weighed, what have we done?
00:40:01
Speaker
where what you know what can we what can we continue to do? Where are we at? Where are we all at at a given point in time in our lives? and you know, do we need the funds anymore like we did when we were initially trying to grow it? and And we all sat down and talked about it and came to the conclusion that it was it was the right thing to do at this point in time. So now if I get bored in retirement, you know, if I get, then, you know, I'll fire things back up again to some degree, not the foundation, but I can ramp up my time and my space in that arena. So
00:40:40
Speaker
And I'll do it, you know, I'll give myself permission to do it or not do it. Yeah. One thing that we oftentimes comes up on our episodes is, is movie references just because of how they capture certain aspects. And as, as you were describing that, um, what spontaneously came into my head is movie saving private Ryan and, and two scenes in that, um, Tom Hanks as he's just sacrificed himself and his last dying breath says like,
00:41:10
Speaker
earn this and then the very last scene um where uh private ryan now in old age is visiting his his headstone and and and and essentially still pleading to that carrying of the memory and saying like this is asking this question of did i did i do enough am i a good man am i a good man am i worthy and and i think reconciling that that That doesn't ever go away. We may cultivate wisdom around it for for what that looks like and the ways of measuring that. But I think that sense of, am I honoring with the time and the decisions that I'm making that that were granted to me that were taken away from somebody else?
00:41:51
Speaker
And that that's what I hear is that within your foundation, it was, have we
Reflecting on Success and Community Support
00:41:56
Speaker
honored? Yes, that's correct. Yeah. and And we felt we have. And you know, along those lines where you say, where Matt Damon's asking him, his wife, am am I a good man um at the end of the movie?
00:42:09
Speaker
You know, I tell Quinn and Sean, um and it's something that I hold myself to, is my measure of success, some people measure it differently. And and financial success is is one aspect, but to me, more important aspect of whether a person is successful or not is, did you make your world around you a better place by you being there?
00:42:37
Speaker
Were you a giver are you a taker? Did you give back to society? Did you give back where you could? um and I like to think that I've succeeded in that area that I've i've given. i you know I'll ask my wife one of these days and see what she says.
00:43:03
Speaker
She'll tell me probably some days I am a good man and other days she'll hit me with a frying pan.
00:43:10
Speaker
Yeah, but but you know and that's that's my personal measure of success, and i try to impart that on my boys. Did you make the world a better place around you for you being there? Did you give back to society? Were you giver or were you taker? Did you suck all the energy from those around you?
00:43:29
Speaker
Is there a question that I should have asked that I haven't that that you feel needs there's an answer inside of you that needs to come out? You know, one of the things I think, as we were just now talking about that, one of the things that um I think about to the time right around when we lost Drennan, and my wife and I, you know, every parent thinks that their child is special. And we knew Drennan was special to a degree. um You know, I'd pick him...
00:44:03
Speaker
like youth group. I used to be an assistant youth leader and I'd go around and pick up all of his friends that were football players that had no connection to our our church and he'd make me, we'd have to leave an hour early so I could go pick up all his friends that he'd take with him. And then when when he passed away, um there were over 1,300 people at his funeral. And my wife and I are like, okay, we knew he had connected with the community, but we didn't know to what degree he had connected to the community.
00:44:38
Speaker
and afterwards um after the services were over we had a reception at at one of our friends house one of our neighbors and then um the pool called us and said they were doing a ah little get together up there and it was kind of it's scary to go up there to some degree i mean the place you know it was just scary for us to go to that venue And we went up there and they had the swim team had put it together and there were a bunch little candles floating on the water and there was a group around and they were honoring Drennan.
00:45:21
Speaker
And then people started jumping into the water, you know, going off the diving boards and just kind of celebrating his life. And my neighbor who hosted the reception at his house afterwards, um he wrote...
00:45:35
Speaker
um
00:45:39
Speaker
paragraph and shared it with our community and he shared it with some others about basically how our community was Mayberry. Basically how, you know, this is a slice of Americana, how a community had come together after such a tragic event.
00:45:59
Speaker
and closed ranks and circled around us. And at that point in time, I think there were 30, we live on a circular block, so it's off of a street.
00:46:11
Speaker
And I think at that point in time, there were like 32 kids that lived on our block. And I just remember some of them were pretty young, but some of them were older and getting close to going off, you know, they're in high school or getting close to going off to college. And I thought,
00:46:29
Speaker
How important is that, that out of this tragic event, you can take something good and show how a community comes together to support somebody that has lost something, something so dear to them?
00:46:46
Speaker
And that's a lesson that can't be taught in a school. That's a life lesson. And when you watch an older, you know, the older...
00:46:57
Speaker
generation of your parents and stuff come together and rally around folks that's what america's about that's americana where we come together and um the article i'll have to dig it up i'll send it to you one of these days but it was it was really really
00:47:19
Speaker
from the heart, it was very thoughtful, and it totally grasped our community at that
Closing Thoughts and Gratitude
00:47:27
Speaker
point in time. And I think it's it was, you know, all these things together helped us get through that very dark, hard place to get through.
00:47:41
Speaker
And um i think it's there's a lesson there for that generation to grasp onto and learn from. And hopefully we've done that. we'll be ah we'll probably be gone before we know whether they did or didn't.
00:47:56
Speaker
Thank you for sitting with us in this conversation, for bringing your own story, your own questions, and your own hard-won wisdom to what we're building together. If you want to keep this going, subscribe to Good Pain on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, where you can also leave us a review that helps others find their way to these conversations.
00:48:14
Speaker
And for weekly doses of conversations that go beyond quick fixes or surface level advice, subscribe to our Kindling newsletter at goodpainco.com. Good Pain is recorded in Colorado on Arapaho, Ute, and Cheyenne ancestral lands.
00:48:31
Speaker
And let's remember, we are not alone in this. Our struggle is not our shame. Whatever we are carrying today, we don't have to carry it alone. We will see you next time.